# Warning pattern site



## sue1616 (Jun 21, 2012)

Would like to warn fellow knitters about a website call “ickythecat”. I found this site while browsing for patterns it has vintage patterns to buy as PDF downloads . I was excited to find a pattern I’ve wanted for sometime so ordered as well as several others first problem you can only order 7 so had to cull my list. So I ordered, paid for, I then received a few emails directing me to the download, this link did not work. I checked the site again and noticed that they send out test emails first. Couldn’t see the sense but waited. Next thing they refunded my money. No reason given as I was not getting the original couldn’t be out of stock. I’ve sent an email asking for a reason why they don’t want to sell to me still awaiting an answer. So just warning people that you probably won’t get your order so don’t bother. Yes I did receive a refund but oh I wanted that pattern.


----------



## laceluvr (Feb 16, 2012)

What is the name of the pattern you really wanted?


----------



## knit4ES (Aug 24, 2015)

https://www.ripoffreport.com/reports/ickythecat/dursley-england-gloucestershire-gl11-4nd/ickythecat-ickycat-they-stole-70-of-my-copyrighted-items-on-etsy-dursley-england-glouce-1434333


----------



## kponsw (Feb 7, 2013)

knit4ES said:


> https://www.ripoffreport.com/reports/ickythecat/dursley-england-gloucestershire-gl11-4nd/ickythecat-ickycat-they-stole-70-of-my-copyrighted-items-on-etsy-dursley-england-glouce-1434333


 :sm06: :sm06: :sm06:


----------



## JennieG (Jul 17, 2011)

And at least one (I didn't look through all 10,000-plus) pdf is a copyright violation. I saw a set of Barbie crochet patterns with a Leisure Arts book in it. Since LA started in the late 1960s or 70s, that can't be over 70 years old!


----------



## In Memory of Scottybear (Sep 20, 2011)

Thanks for the warning.


----------



## Nanamel14 (Aug 4, 2016)

Thanks for the warning, glad you got a refund


----------



## run4fittness (May 22, 2011)

Goodness, thanks for the warning.


----------



## GrumpyGramma (Oct 20, 2014)

I'm glad they didn't get your money. Maybe we can help you find the pattern you really wanted. Pattern name and designer's name would be a good start.


----------



## Magna84 (Jun 26, 2013)

Glad you got your money back. Sounds a bit fishy to me. Check your credit card or bank acct for the next while, you never know.


----------



## peppered (May 16, 2014)

What about the Etsy site? Is it same owner?


----------



## 78149 (Nov 26, 2012)

I purchased a PDF pattern from here and received it without any problems. I don't know what you are looking for, but she has a good selection

www.thevintageknittinglady.co.uk


----------



## lindyloo2 (May 26, 2012)

What vintage one did you really want x


----------



## pamgillies1 (Aug 6, 2011)

What pattern are you lookig for?


----------



## Butterfly 55 (Oct 7, 2015)

I also have bought from them with out any bother I like downloaded patterns because I can use the knitting companion app I didn't know that the pdf was copy right case


----------



## Mevbb (Sep 5, 2011)

I have ordered from ickythecat many times on Etsy without a problem. 
https://www.etsy.com/shop/ickythecat


----------



## JennyG12 (Jan 24, 2016)

sue1616 said:


> Would like to warn fellow knitters about a website call "ickythecat". I found this site while browsing for patterns it has vintage patterns to buy as PDF downloads . I was excited to find a pattern I've wanted for sometime so ordered as well as several others first problem you can only order 7 so had to cull my list. So I ordered, paid for, I then received a few emails directing me to the download, this link did not work. I checked the site again and noticed that they send out test emails first. Couldn't see the sense but waited. Next thing they refunded my money. No reason given as I was not getting the original couldn't be out of stock. I've sent an email asking for a reason why they don't want to sell to me still awaiting an answer. So just warning people that you probably won't get your order so don't bother. Yes I did receive a refund but oh I wanted that pattern.


I have not read through all the replies yet, but yes avoid that site owner. She is a known copyright infringer and sells illegal copies. The copyright holders are catching up to her, so maybe that is why the unfullfilled order.


----------



## JennyG12 (Jan 24, 2016)

knit4ES said:


> https://www.ripoffreport.com/reports/ickythecat/dursley-england-gloucestershire-gl11-4nd/ickythecat-ickycat-they-stole-70-of-my-copyrighted-items-on-etsy-dursley-england-glouce-1434333


Yes this is the ripoff scammer.


----------



## JennyG12 (Jan 24, 2016)

travellin said:


> I purchased a PDF pattern from here and received it without any problems. I don't know what you are looking for, but she has a good selection
> 
> www.thevintageknittinglady.co.uk


Yes, that site is very trustworthy. )


----------



## ptspraker (Apr 13, 2012)

I was really surprised when you said you got your money back. Thanks for the warning.


----------



## Celt Knitter (Jul 13, 2011)

Some airline companies do a test run on credit cards. It is usually only about $1.00 and it is then refunded when there is no problem with the bank, which should ask you to verify it. I think they do that so that they know you have the funds. I have also had test emails for some sites. I'm not sure what is going on with your company. It is on Etsy, Twitter and Pinterest and it has its own website. I did see a site called RIPOFF which mentioned the name but I couldn't access that from the UK. However, there is a warning on their web site that they are being scammed: https://www.ickycat.co.uk/


sue1616 said:


> Would like to warn fellow knitters about a website call "ickythecat". I found this site while browsing for patterns it has vintage patterns to buy as PDF downloads . I was excited to find a pattern I've wanted for sometime so ordered as well as several others first problem you can only order 7 so had to cull my list. So I ordered, paid for, I then received a few emails directing me to the download, this link did not work. I checked the site again and noticed that they send out test emails first. Couldn't see the sense but waited. Next thing they refunded my money. No reason given as I was not getting the original couldn't be out of stock. I've sent an email asking for a reason why they don't want to sell to me still awaiting an answer. So just warning people that you probably won't get your order so don't bother. Yes I did receive a refund but oh I wanted that pattern.


----------



## Cathy B (May 15, 2014)

knit4ES said:


> https://www.ripoffreport.com/reports/ickythecat/dursley-england-gloucestershire-gl11-4nd/ickythecat-ickycat-they-stole-70-of-my-copyrighted-items-on-etsy-dursley-england-glouce-1434333


That's was my first thought, they were caught infringing on copyrights and needed to take down their site. Consider yourself lucky they refunded your money. You have to be careful when purchasing "copies" of vintage patterns. Unless the pattern is in the public domain (over 70 years old) you can not sell copies and even then, to be legal, you must own the original copy in order to share copies. There are many online digital libraries that legitimately offer vintage patterns for free. Some that come to mind are Google Books, Antiques Pattern Library, Project Gutenberg, Internet Archive, Southampton University, there are a few more I frequent but I can't remember off the top of my head. I know that Antiques Pattern Library has had problems with people stealing their digital versions and selling copies on etsy and ebay. They have now added an annoying watermark to their patterns so that it is easier to catch the thieves. So be wary of vintage for sale, If the patterns are truly out of copyright you should be able to find them for free in one of the online libraries.


----------



## eerichar (Dec 1, 2011)

Just Curious as to how someone can copyright the pattern that are from McCalls? Are they the original artist, designer from 70 years ago?


----------



## eerichar (Dec 1, 2011)

That ickycat site looks like a major operation with over 10,000 patterns.


----------



## pinkwitch (Mar 24, 2012)

Sadly one of many, many sellers on Etsy doing this. There are several internet sources where they can acquire the patterns & proceed to sell them. There are many international blogs which post entire pattern books, even newly published ones. The only one who can stop them on Etsy is the original copyright holder (and if the company is out of business like Brunswick yarns, that's not happening).

The first lines of the shop description on Etsy is rather weird: 
"We treat our customers with respect and ickythecat expects the same in return. We reserve the right to refuse service and communications to individuals who send discourteous, threatening or harassing emails. We reserve the right to cancel orders."

If that's the first thing they want to say about their shop & I was arriving at their shop not knowing their history, I would be wondering what was going on.


----------



## Cathy B (May 15, 2014)

eerichar said:


> Just Curious as to how someone can copyright the pattern that are from McCalls? Are they the original artist, designer from 70 years ago?


I'm assuming you are asking about patterns in McCall's magazine and not dress patterns.
It's a little confusing but I'll try to explain to the best of my knowledge based on correspondence with the Antiques Patterns Library.

Copyright expires after 70 years and the pattern moves into the public domain. Once the copyright expires anyone owning an original copy can reproduce the pattern. If they are selling copies or digital copies, they hold the copyright to the digital work they produced. So say Sally purchased a vintage pattern book at the local antique store, she makes digital scans and sells them on Etsy. It is her scans that are protected. Jane buys a copy of Sally's scan of the pattern. Since the pattern is out of copyright, Jane decides to makes a copy of the scan and starts to sell it on Ebay. Jane is in violation of copyright because she is selling Sally's intellectual property (i.e copies of the scans). More than one person can be selling or distributing the pattern, but they each must own an original copy. 
Does that answer your question?
By the way the 70 year rule does not always mean that an item is in the public domain. There can be cases when the copyright was renewed, sold to a new owner, or willed to family or foundations. So research needs to be done to determine if the pattern is in the public domain prior to reproducing the pattern from your original.


----------



## eneira12 (Dec 18, 2013)

Thanks


----------



## JennyG12 (Jan 24, 2016)

Cathy B said:


> I'm assuming you are asking about patterns in McCall's magazine and not dress patterns.
> It's a little confusing but I'll try to explain to the best of my knowledge based on correspondence with the Antiques Patterns Library.
> 
> Copyright expires after 70 years and the pattern moves into the public domain. Once the copyright expires anyone owning an original copy can reproduce the pattern. If they are selling copies or digital copies, they hold the copyright to the digital work they produced. So say Sally purchased a vintage pattern book at the local antique store, she makes digital scans and sells them on Etsy. It is her scans that are protected. Jane buys a copy of Sally's scan of the pattern. Since the pattern is out of copyright, Jane decides to makes a copy of the scan and starts to sell it on Ebay. Jane is in violation of copyright because she is selling Sally's intellectual property (i.e copies of the scans). More than one person can be selling or distributing the pattern, but they each must own an original copy.
> ...


Actually it is now 95 years with workings in the pipeline to make it 100 years.

Example:
1950 - created
+28 - years - 1st filing protection
___
1978
+47 - more years added to the initial term - 1976 copyright act
___
2025
+20 - more years added to the prior commulated term - 1998 copyright extension
___
2045

Nothing had to be done by the copyright holder for these extensions.. it was automatic across the board.
Also keep in mind. yes, the heirs can renew for as long as they want. Nothing is 'assumed' in the copyright arena.


----------



## BobzMum (Nov 10, 2012)

Thanks for the warning.
I hate it when people think it's OK to sell the work of others, regardless of copyright or the loss of money to the designers.
I just had a look in the knitted toys (pdf) and there are patterns that are only available in books, and others from designers who have their own sites to sell their work.


----------



## Cathy B (May 15, 2014)

JennyG12 said:


> Actually it is now 95 years with workings in the pipeline to make it 100 years.
> 
> Example:
> 1950 - created
> ...


Good to know. You don't list your location, so is this new US law or UK?


----------



## JennyG12 (Jan 24, 2016)

Cathy B said:


> Good to know. You don't list your location, so is this new US law or UK?


USA law as I went by your location.
But the UK laws are not far away from the USA laws.
For the lay-person from both countries, to help in understanding, duration of rights (at present time) is 70 years *after the death* of the designer/publisher in the UK. This is still on the books as a part of the law.
The changes are occuring to try and standardize the USA, a more level across the board duration of rights. Hence the works to establish an easier and fair to authors for protection -- 100 years from the time of publication gives a good time-frame in alignment with the 70 years after death clause (in the UK) and the 95 years in the USA, and yet can still be reached. A standard of time across the board instead of a case by case scenerio. But again subject to heirs renewals. Copyright laws go through changes frequently.

Theoretically, for an example -- under the 70 years after death:
An author can publish a work at age say, 20 years old. And the author later dies at age 86.
So that work that was published at age 20 had 66 years of protection, then add another 70 years to that would equal a total of 136 years of protection. Subject to heirs renewals.


----------



## theyoung (Aug 18, 2019)

I tried to by pdf Patterns from this company but my money was returned because I didn’t pay the postage what’s that about. I tried to reply to email but it bounced back. The web site I used yesterday was blocked. I tried contacting through Etsy asking for an invoice for the patterns l wanted but was told I couldn’t use etsy to contact them. I then asked how I could get in touch. The reply I got was very threatening I was told never to buy from them again under any user name if I did I would be reported to Etsy.


----------



## KatVilla (Sep 7, 2019)

I ran into a confounding bit of trouble with ickythecat on Etsy and did a google search to see if anyone else has had a negative experience with this seller. This is how I found this thread.

On September 6, 2019, I bought a few pdf patterns that were on sale from ickythecat on Etsy. They only cost $1 or $2 each. Still, some of them were barely legible - such as blurry filet crochet graphs - and one of them was just an oversized doily folded in half to form a shawl. You couldn't tell this from the photo advertising the pattern. I wanted to warn future potential buyers about these patterns, so I commented on each of the patterns. I was not caustic or mean; I simply reviewed the pattern as an experienced crocheter. Before I was finished, I received this Etsy notification:

"Formal Notice from ickythecat® :

We wish to inform you that your custom [sic] is no longer welcome.

Do not purchase original, manual or printed patterns at any time or under any other username from this shop. Do not contact this shop again."

I just shrugged my shoulders at this weird message and thought about how this is okay, since I do not intend to ever pay money to this person again for bad crochet patterns that were obviously copied from old crochet magazines, but not enhanced in any way for better use.

Moments later, I received further notification that this seller is suddenly following me on Etsy. Wow! My first follower! A minute later, I got a second notification that another person was also following me on Etsy. Now, I am beginning to wonder if I am being stalked and if I should let Etsy admin know about this odd development?

Anyway, this person, ickythecat, seems to be hostile and unbalanced. Please be warned.


----------

