# Our President



## pattibe (Feb 2, 2012)

I love this picture of President Obama. He is such a gentleman.


----------



## Glindajo (Nov 19, 2014)

I love it,too!


----------



## cottonginniestudio (Nov 25, 2011)

beautiful :0


----------



## leoanne (Feb 7, 2011)

ditto


----------



## hilltopper (Jul 16, 2014)

Yes, a very graceful picture.


----------



## alwaysforyou (Dec 6, 2011)

I hadn't seen that picture, but I've always admired how much they seem to love and respect each other and their children. Great picture! Lynn


----------



## BJP (Oct 1, 2013)

However, he has also stated that our country is no longer a Christian country!


----------



## lila ladue (Jan 13, 2011)

There are other pictures of him too. Not saluting the American flag, not placing his correct hand over his heart during our nationa anthem, bowing to Muslims. I could go on an on but don't want to make this a political discussion, GET INFORMED.


----------



## Connie W (Aug 3, 2011)

It's a lovely picture. I too admire their family values.


----------



## hilltopper (Jul 16, 2014)

Well, that has little to do with the photograph posted.


----------



## begarcia44 (Jan 29, 2012)

What does being informed have to do with someone saying they like a picture? The OP is saying she likes the picture not making a political statement.


----------



## bane (Nov 27, 2012)

begarcia44 said:


> What does being informed have to do with someone saying they like a picture? The OP is saying she likes the picture not making a political statement.


Exactly , I'm not American, but I think it's a lovely photo of a happy couple. :thumbup:


----------



## hilltopper (Jul 16, 2014)

Puzzling to me. If someone has a different religion - or different politics - from ours that should not keep us from acknowledging they are wearing a pretty dress!


----------



## ZaaZaa3 (Mar 12, 2012)

I thought this was a knitting/crochet forum not a political venue. We all have thoughts on OP but my are not appropriate for a knitting forum. Let's stick to the items at hand not political statements!


----------



## Mercygirl76 (Dec 30, 2012)

Beautiful picture.


----------



## begarcia44 (Jan 29, 2012)

Totally agree! I guess someone got up on the wrong side of the bed this morning. lol


----------



## mickey's mom (Sep 21, 2013)

Lovely picture!


----------



## pattibe (Feb 2, 2012)

lila ladue said:


> There are other pictures of him too. Not saluting the American flag, not placing his correct hand over his heart during our nationa anthem, bowing to Muslims. I could go on an on but don't want to make this a political discussion, GET INFORMED.


I am informed. If you dont want to make this political than don't. It is a beautiful picture of our American President. Check Bush's record before you speak and show some respect!


----------



## pattibe (Feb 2, 2012)

hilltopper said:


> Puzzling to me. If someone has a different religion - or different politics - from ours that should not keep us from acknowledging they are wearing a pretty dress!


EXACTLY. Why can't people show a little respect for the President. I know why, but I am NOT going to make this political. It s just a beautiful picture...as is this one


----------



## hilltopper (Jul 16, 2014)

pattibe - another very pretty photo! Thanks for sharing.


----------



## Sine (Jun 12, 2011)

These are photos from the White House photographer Pete Souza. He was also the official White House photographer for President Reagan during his second term, and he was the official photographer for President Reagan's funeral.
Pete Souza has an amazing eye for photography.


----------



## hilltopper (Jul 16, 2014)

And thank you for that information Sine. I certainly agree about Pete Souza's eye. Probably both of them.


----------



## nevadalynn (Apr 27, 2011)

BJP said:


> However, he has also stated that our country is no longer a Christian country!


 I knew someone would do this!


----------



## pattibe (Feb 2, 2012)

Ya know, I was just posting a beauiful picture of our President and First Lady. I did not mean to make this a political or religious forum. I should have added "hate mongers need not reply."


----------



## Cindy S (Oct 20, 2013)

:thumbup: :thumbup: :thumbup: :thumbup: :thumbup: :thumbup:


----------



## Punkin51 (Sep 3, 2012)

They are very nice pictures, all of them. The subject is pictures, not politics....right?


----------



## pattibe (Feb 2, 2012)

Punkin51 said:


> They are very nice pictures, all of them. The subject is pictures, not politics....right?


Absolutely!


----------



## PaKnitter (Mar 7, 2011)

Beautiful photos and your cat is pretty to.


----------



## PaKnitter (Mar 7, 2011)

Duplicate post... trying to cut, copy and paste on tablet.


----------



## rosebud527 (Jun 20, 2014)

I love our President-he is smart and he is humble-wish we could have him for eight more years. A classy guy!


----------



## April4164 (Apr 21, 2014)

.


----------



## Meyow (May 2, 2013)

pattibe said:


> Ya know, I was just posting a beauiful picture of our President and First Lady. I did not mean to make this a political or religious forum. I should have added "hate mongers need not reply."


 :thumbup: :thumbup: :thumbup: :thumbup: :thumbup: :thumbup:


----------



## Meyow (May 2, 2013)

lila ladue said:


> There are other pictures of him too. Not saluting the American flag, not placing his correct hand over his heart during our nationa anthem, bowing to Muslims. I could go on an on but don't want to make this a political discussion, GET INFORMED.


Yet, you ARE trying to make it political. :thumbdown:


----------



## Llavaia (Oct 14, 2013)

It is a beautiful picture..our first lady sure does wear clothes well..and this is not about politics it is about a good looking couple and a really sweet picture c


----------



## Cindy S (Oct 20, 2013)

lila ladue said:


> There are other pictures of him too. Not saluting the American flag, not placing his correct hand over his heart during our nationa anthem, bowing to Muslims. I could go on an on but don't want to make this a political discussion, GET INFORMED.


Geesh!!! Get a grip, you are the one turning it into a political discussion. On the President's worst intellectual day, he would leave you in the dust in a hot minute.


----------



## Llavaia (Oct 14, 2013)

pattibe said:


> I am informed. If you dont want to make this political than don't. It is a beautiful picture of our American President. Check Bush's record before you speak and show some respect!


Yet you did make it political...


----------



## pattibe (Feb 2, 2012)

Cindy S said:


> Geesh!!! Get a grip, you are the one turning it into a political discussion. On the President's worst intellectual day, he would leave you in the dust in a hot minute.


OMG....if this was FB,I would give you a geat Big Like....well said!


----------



## pattibe (Feb 2, 2012)

Llavaia said:


> Yet you did make it political...


It was a beautiful picture of the President and First Lady. Just unwatch the post if you can't say anything nice!


----------



## raedean (Apr 25, 2011)

they are beautiful people.that is an elegant photo.


----------



## Meyow (May 2, 2013)

Cindy S said:


> Geesh!!! Get a grip, you are the one turning it into a political discussion. On the President's worst intellectual day, he would leave you in the dust in a hot minute.


Precisely.


----------



## Designer1234 (Aug 9, 2011)

lila ladue said:


> There are other pictures of him too. Not saluting the American flag, not placing his correct hand over his heart during our nationa anthem, bowing to Muslims. I could go on an on but don't want to make this a political discussion, GET INFORMED.


needless to say, we knew there would be a group who find it impossible to say anything good about him. He is a good father, a good husband and if he had ever been given a chance he would have accomplisted much more. When huge road blocks are placed in his way before he even was elected it is pretty hard to deal with it. I feel sad for him as he can't answer back to the nasty dreadful things said about him.

I don't know if he would have been a good President if the opposition had tried to help with some of his plans instead of making sure that everything that could possibly done to stop every action they could - he was never given a chance. I think he did very well considering the attacks to his wife, children and every thing he tried to do. jmo. He seems to be a graceful, fine man in my opinion- I don't think he did too badly looking at it as a Canadian who is very interested in the US Political system.


----------



## ute4kp (Nov 6, 2012)

Very nice photos!


----------



## SQM (Jun 22, 2012)

(Who has to show up to make this an official political thread?)

Obama is very photogenic - I think that is a job requirement.

Great pics.


----------



## pattibe (Feb 2, 2012)

Designer1234 said:


> needless to say, we knew there would be a group who find it impossible to say anything good about him. He is a good father, a good husband and if he had ever been given a chance he would have accomplisted much more. When huge road blocks are placed in his way before he even was elected it is pretty hard to deal with it. I feel sad for him as he can't answer back to the nasty dreadful things said about him.
> 
> I don't know if he would have been a good President if the opposition had tried to help with some of his plans instead of making sure that everything that could possibly done to stop every action they could - he was never given a chance. I think he did very well considering the attacks to his wife, children and every thing he tried to do. jmo. He seems to be a graceful, fine man in my opinion- I don't think he did too badly looking at it as a Canadian who is very interested in the US Political system.


Very well said!


----------



## Cindy S (Oct 20, 2013)

MaryChan said:


> Handsome couple. ... and I bet that irks the heck out of some.


You got that right!! :shock: :shock: :shock:


----------



## Llavaia (Oct 14, 2013)

pattibe said:


> It was a beautiful picture of the President and First Lady. Just unwatch the post if you can't say anything nice!


Go back and read the posts .. I did say something nice you are the one who mentioned Bush..


----------



## hilltopper (Jul 16, 2014)

Thank you Designer 1234 - those were nice things you said about the president of this country. While, this being the country it is, people are free to dislike the president. And I am sure they must be patriots. Still, I worry that rude things said about the President of the United States must please our enemies and encourage them, and that would be a terrible shame.


----------



## Meyow (May 2, 2013)

hilltopper said:


> Thank you Designer 1234 - those were nice things you said about the president of this country. While, this being the country it is, people are free to dislike the president. And I am sure they must be patriots. Still, I worry that rude things said about the President of the United States must please our enemies and encourage them, and that would be a terrible shame.


Well said!


----------



## fortunate1 (Dec 13, 2014)

Wow! Love the pictures, the hallway and 
christmas decorations, breathtaking. Very gracious, elegant, man and family. Thank you


----------



## PaKnitter (Mar 7, 2011)

Designer1234 said:


> needless to say, we knew there would be a group who find it impossible to say anything good about him. He is a good father, a good husband and if he had ever been given a chance he would have accomplisted much more. When huge road blocks are placed in his way before he even was elected it is pretty hard to deal with it. I feel sad for him as he can't answer back to the nasty dreadful things said about him.
> 
> I don't know if he would have been a good President if the opposition had tried to help with some of his plans instead of making sure that everything that could possibly done to stop every action they could - he was never given a chance. I think he did very well considering the attacks to his wife, children and every thing he tried to do. jmo. He seems to be a graceful, fine man in my opinion- I don't think he did too badly looking at it as a Canadian who is very interested in the US Political system.


 :thumbup: :thumbup: :thumbup:

I don't know how the man gets up and faces each day.


----------



## rosebud527 (Jun 20, 2014)

Nothing wrong with that-we must accept everyone's religion or lack thereof.


----------



## Cindy S (Oct 20, 2013)

rosebud527 said:


> Nothing wrong with that-we must accept everyone's religion or lack thereof.


 :thumbup: :thumbup: :thumbup: :thumbup: :thumbup: :thumbup:


----------



## Designer1234 (Aug 9, 2011)

hilltopper said:


> Thank you Designer 1234 - those were nice things you said about the president of this country. While, this being the country it is, people are free to dislike the president. And I am sure they must be patriots. Still, I worry that rude things said about the President of the United States must please our enemies and encourage them, and that would be a terrible shame.


I agree - the world is watching and reading the posts and following the news including Fox. It is sad in my opinion. I have always liked Americans and I especially like the grace and love shared by that family. I Feel sorry for him. I am not talking about his politics I am talking about him as a person. 
What other President has been treated the same way that he has. Nothing is ever acknowledged by those who dislike and even hate him. He is ridiculed and his family has been ridiculed. I Think it is very very sad and I will always admire how he has acted - not returning the insults but respecting his Position as the President. I just happen to think they might get a surprise. Others in the world admire him. NOt all but many many people and countries. He is Grace under fire -- he comes across as kind and patient. His family is wonderfully close and loving.


----------



## LizAnne (Nov 25, 2011)

I agree with Designer1234 completely. President Obama is a gentleman and his wife is a true lady. Their girls set a wonderful example as first children. There have been many pictures of them that are wonderful. It's embarassing to me how he has been treated. Other countries admire and respect him.


----------



## WindingRoad (May 7, 2013)

pattibe said:


> EXACTLY. Why can't people show a little respect for the President. I know why, but I am NOT going to make this political. It s just a beautiful picture...as is this one


The garland certainly is beautiful.


----------



## sumpleby (Aug 3, 2013)

Great pictures--the one with the Xmas trees is spectacular.


----------



## mac.worrall (Jun 24, 2011)

rosebud527 said:


> I love our President-he is smart and he is humble-wish we could have him for eight more years. A classy guy!


I wish we had him here
:thumbup: :thumbup: :thumbup:


----------



## bundyanne07 (Aug 24, 2014)

I think it's a lovely photo of a loving couple.


----------



## kiwiannie (Jul 30, 2011)

Beautiful photo,thanks for posting.


----------



## RitaM13 (Jul 12, 2012)

One word:



B-A-R-F


----------



## Kitchenergal (Nov 13, 2013)

BeverleyBee said:


> Exactly , I'm not American, but I think it's a lovely photo of a happy couple. :thumbup:


 :thumbup:


----------



## mikebkk (Oct 6, 2012)

I hadn't seen this one before. Lovely photo, and thanks for sharing it.


----------



## rujam (Aug 19, 2011)

He certainly is a gentleman.


----------



## lil rayma (Mar 29, 2012)

The pictures are beautiful. Thank you for posting them.


----------



## Helen Hawkins (Jul 1, 2011)

LizAnne said:


> I agree with Designer1234 completely. President Obama is a gentleman and his wife is a true lady. Their girls set a wonderful example as first children. There have been many pictures of them that are wonderful. It's embarassing to me how he has been treated. Other countries admire and respect him.


Sure do!!!!!!


----------



## flohel (Jan 24, 2011)

I love it too


----------



## flohel (Jan 24, 2011)

I agree with Connie


----------



## flohel (Jan 24, 2011)

I agree with Connie


----------



## Valkyrie (Feb 26, 2011)

It is a great picture. However, I believe he is like most husbands and needed a reminder from his wife that it is very difficult to walk stairs, and just across the floor in high heels with a very long dress! :lol:


----------



## Aunty M (Jul 7, 2014)

Nice pic of a handsome couple.


----------



## flohel (Jan 24, 2011)

Re Hilltopper I agree. I also notice that the most hateful comments come from self proclaimed Christians.


----------



## flitri (Jun 13, 2011)

I think that all of the Photos are beautiful especially the first one.


----------



## Knitter forever (Dec 11, 2011)

Zaazaa3 I agree with you.


----------



## der_fisherman (Jul 26, 2014)

BJP said:


> However, he has also stated that our country is no longer a Christian country!


Many would say that he is correct today......Muslim President sort of gives it away maybe?

Blame the voters, not the man!!

Regards

Andy


----------



## Frandelia (May 24, 2011)

flohel said:
 

> Re Hilltopper I agree. I also notice that the most hateful comments come from self proclaimed Christians.


Ditto!


----------



## Esmee (Apr 29, 2013)

Interesting that the negative comments come from people in hiding &#9786;&#65039;


----------



## Windmill Knitter (Mar 31, 2012)

hilltopper said:


> Puzzling to me. If someone has a different religion - or different politics - from ours that should not keep us from acknowledging they are wearing a pretty dress!


Well said!


----------



## PittyPat (Jul 2, 2011)

I'm not in hiding....I am an amateur photographer and I think both photos are really nice. The lighting is great in both. The photo with the Christmas trees was probably a photo op and well done. 
I will not comment on my opinion of the President on this site. 

By the way, the First Lady's gown is lovely.


----------



## lbart (Jan 8, 2014)

I admire the President and first family. Classy is the word that comes to mind. The photos are lovely. IF I were the first lady, I would have a very difficult time keeping my composure when my husband endures such personal attacks. So many people say malicious things about the man-when they should just stick to discussing political differences. Name calling only makes the one doing the calling look bad!


----------



## Jeannie2009 (Mar 8, 2013)

Beautiful pic. Thank you for sharing. His respect and love for his family is also special.


----------



## gwennieh68 (Sep 4, 2013)

Lila ladue. If you didn't want to make it a political discussion, why did you say the things that you did? It's a beautiful picture. You didn't need to comment at all if you didn't like the picture!


----------



## Tokyoal (Mar 19, 2014)

My favorite is the picture of President Obama with the Girl Scouts wearing a tiara. I can just hear the giggling from the girls. So cute!


----------



## fran-e (Nov 26, 2011)

guess you missed the header on this section.. it says..
General Chit-Chat (non-knitting talk)
so, yeah, we can talk about anything in this section..
and i love the pix also, but then, i like Him..


----------



## damemary (Mar 14, 2012)

BJP said:


> However, he has also stated that our country is no longer a Christian country!


 :thumbdown: :thumbdown: :thumbdown: Nothing to do with the topic.


----------



## damemary (Mar 14, 2012)

lila ladue said:


> There are other pictures of him too. Not saluting the American flag, not placing his correct hand over his heart during our nationa anthem, bowing to Muslims. I could go on an on but don't want to make this a political discussion, GET INFORMED.


 :thumbdown: :thumbdown: :thumbdown: :thumbdown:


----------



## chrisjac (Oct 25, 2011)

Since day one, the hatred for this President showed its ugly head. The lack of respect is embarrassing. Thank you for the lovely pictures. Scat rats!


----------



## damemary (Mar 14, 2012)

begarcia44 said:


> What does being informed have to do with someone saying they like a picture? The OP is saying she likes the picture not making a political statement.


 :thumbup: :thumbup: :thumbup: :thumbup: :hunf:


----------



## damemary (Mar 14, 2012)

hilltopper said:


> Puzzling to me. If someone has a different religion - or different politics - from ours that should not keep us from acknowledging they are wearing a pretty dress!


 :thumbup: :thumbup: :thumbup: :thumbup: :thumbup:


----------



## vsheehan (Oct 22, 2014)

:thumbup: :thumbup: :thumbup:


----------



## ElyseKnox (Sep 16, 2011)

"Let's stick to the items at hand not political statements!"

This SECTION is open to subjects beyond knitting and crocheting. Each of us is free to post our thoughts and comments AND each of us is allowed to respond with the thoughts and comments that come from the original post.

The original post was more than just a pix. She commented on BHO being a 'gentleman.' That is an opinion. The final sentence (quoted above) is also an opinion. Unless the rules of the forum are changed all of us are free to post ANY comment that meets the agreed upon rules. Those who don't like 'politics' can stay away from those threads.



ZaaZaa3 said:


> I thought this was a knitting/crochet forum not a political venue. We all have thoughts on OP but my are not appropriate for a knitting forum. Let's stick to the items at hand not political statements!


----------



## Sunnya (Jul 19, 2013)

Lovely pictures of lovely couple!!


----------



## ElyseKnox (Sep 16, 2011)

'hate mongers need not reply'

Hmm, who is going to determine what is 'hateful?' Cannot each of us express our own perspective? After all, this is a forum, a discussion, a back and forth of opinions.

BTW, to some, even a beautiful photo that includes one is strongly opposed to becomes something else entirely.



pattibe said:


> Ya know, I was just posting a beauiful picture of our President and First Lady. I did not mean to make this a political or religious forum. I should have added "hate mongers need not reply."


----------



## ElyseKnox (Sep 16, 2011)

The topic is what we make it with our comments. A photo of the Obamas is inherently political and when people respond, they are going to respond based on their politics and opinion of him AND what he has done while in office--from both sides.



damemary said:


> :thumbdown: :thumbdown: :thumbdown: Nothing to do with the topic.


----------



## Champlain (Mar 8, 2014)

Whatever happened to respect, kindness, and happiness in the U.S.? We seem to snipe at each other every chance we get. The person who inserted the picture only meant to show how a husband can be kind to his wife. There was no political statement made. A couple of "grinches" made it a political thing. Lighten up !!


----------



## Morningdancer (Jun 20, 2011)

Very good picture of our president and first lady. Remarkable. :thumbup: :thumbup: :thumbup: :thumbup:


----------



## bonib (Jan 18, 2012)

This has nothing to do with knitting----HELLO!!!!&#128545;


----------



## MindyT (Apr 29, 2011)

Love that photo!
The whole evening is etched in my memory.


----------



## ginnyinnr (May 20, 2012)

Sunnya said:


> Lovely pictures of lovely couple!!


How do you know they are a happy couple? We have no idea how many takes of that pose were taken before the photographers were happy. And there is no way you can read into the photo, if this is about the photo, that they are happy, that he has family values etc. I suggest quitting the subject. 
Whats next, pictures of Hillary Clinton and Bill Clinton?


----------



## MindyT (Apr 29, 2011)

bonib said:


> This has nothing to do with knitting----HELLO!!!!😡


Under General Chit Chat may we not speak on other topics than knitting?!
Seems I read jokes here and questions about many topics other than knitting.
Hummmmmm


----------



## ElyseKnox (Sep 16, 2011)

This is the general section--the comments do not need to be about knitting.



bonib said:


> This has nothing to do with knitting----HELLO!!!!😡


----------



## lins (Jan 8, 2013)

lila ladue said:


> There are other pictures of him too. Not saluting the American flag, not placing his correct hand over his heart during our nationa anthem, bowing to Muslims. I could go on an on but don't want to make this a political discussion, GET INFORMED.


OMG....he's not perfect???

It's a beautiful picture and you took a shot to sour it but you soured yourself.


----------



## Pishi (Jul 15, 2013)

Designer1234 said:


> needless to say, we knew there would be a group who find it impossible to say anything good about him. He is a good father, a good husband and if he had ever been given a chance he would have accomplisted much more. When huge road blocks are placed in his way before he even was elected it is pretty hard to deal with it. I feel sad for him as he can't answer back to the nasty dreadful things said about him.
> 
> I don't know if he would have been a good President if the opposition had tried to help with some of his plans instead of making sure that everything that could possibly done to stop every action they could - he was never given a chance. I think he did very well considering the attacks to his wife, children and every thing he tried to do. jmo. He seems to be a graceful, fine man in my opinion- I don't think he did too badly looking at it as a Canadian who is very interested in the US Political system.


Couldn't agree more! Very well said.

:thumbup: :thumbup: :thumbup:


----------



## lins (Jan 8, 2013)

ginnyinnr said:


> How do you know they are a happy couple? We have no idea how many takes of that pose were taken before the photographers were happy. And there is no way you can read into the photo, if this is about the photo, that they are happy, that he has family values etc. I suggest quitting the subject.
> Whats next, pictures of Hillary Clinton and Bill Clinton?


Yup...they were at a formal affair by the looks of it. She must have come down those stairs what, 10 or 20 times to get that picture?
REALLY!!!


----------



## missyern (Jan 23, 2011)

Champlain stated my feeling exactly. I feel we should have respect for our President regardless of our childish hatefulness.


----------



## raqeth (Dec 23, 2011)

Wonderful picture!!! Thank you for sharing.


----------



## lins (Jan 8, 2013)

Sunnya said:


> Lovely pictures of lovely couple!!


 :thumbup: :thumbup: :thumbup:


----------



## Hazel Blumberg - McKee (Sep 9, 2011)

beautiful picture of our president!

hazel


----------



## Peanut Tinker (Oct 10, 2012)

Designer1234 said:


> needless to say, we knew there would be a group who find it impossible to say anything good about him. He is a good father, a good husband and if he had ever been given a chance he would have accomplisted much more. When huge road blocks are placed in his way before he even was elected it is pretty hard to deal with it. I feel sad for him as he can't answer back to the nasty dreadful things said about him.
> 
> I don't know if he would have been a good President if the opposition had tried to help with some of his plans instead of making sure that everything that could possibly done to stop every action they could - he was never given a chance. I think he did very well considering the attacks to his wife, children and every thing he tried to do. jmo. He seems to be a graceful, fine man in my opinion- I don't think he did too badly looking at it as a Canadian who is very interested in the US Political system.


Ditto from a fellow Canadian!


----------



## ElyseKnox (Sep 16, 2011)

It is not "childish hatefulness" to be politically opposed to an officeholder. A picture that includes a world known politician is inherently political and there will be people who will like/approve of that person and others who do not. If comments of those who approve are allowed, then those from the other side are to be allowed as well.

You say:" I feel we should have respect for our President..."
that is your opinion. Mine is that the OFFICE is always to be respected but the person only based on the actions taken while holding the office.

Just as many here feel that BHO's predecessor did not do a good job, there at many who now feel that BHO has done just as poorly if not more so.

If one group is allowed to speak glowingly of BHO then those whose feelings are 180 degrees opposite are no more hateful for posting those comments than were the original approving ones hateful.



missyern said:


> Champlain stated my feeling exactly. I feel we should have respect for our President regardless of our childish hatefulness.


----------



## LynneA (Oct 2, 2011)

Might we please keep politics out of this forum? It's a lovely picture; thanks for sharing it. I do not agree that this picture is "inheritently political.


----------



## bellestarr12 (Mar 26, 2011)

The picture is beautiful, and it certainly seems the relationship between the President and First Lady is, too.


----------



## bellestarr12 (Mar 26, 2011)

pattibe said:


> Ya know, I was just posting a beauiful picture of our President and First Lady. I did not mean to make this a political or religious forum. I should have added "hate mongers need not reply."


Amen! Love the koala and Obama's smile :thumbup:


----------



## Hazel Blumberg - McKee (Sep 9, 2011)

LynneA said:


> Might we please keep politics out of this forum? It's a lovely picture; thanks for sharing it. I do not agree that this picture is "inheritently political.


THANK YOU !!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!

Hazel


----------



## pattibe (Feb 2, 2012)

der_fisherman said:


> Many would say that he is correct today......Muslim President sort of gives it away maybe?
> 
> Blame the voters, not the man!!
> 
> ...


Oh come on. He is NOT a Muslim. But if he was, what is wrong with that. Whatever happened to Freedom of Religon in this country?


----------



## pattibe (Feb 2, 2012)

Thanks to all the sane people who still respect the office of President.


----------



## Hazel Blumberg - McKee (Sep 9, 2011)

chrisjac said:


> Since day one, the hatred for this President showed its ugly head. The lack of respect is embarrassing. Thank you for the lovely pictures. Scat rats!


I had the grim feeling that, when I saw the title of this discussion, it would erupt into something virulent. I was, I admit, disgusted to read garbage about the president being a Muslim (and so WHAT if he were a Muslim, anyway? what about freedom of religion?). There're probably nasty comments by so-called "birthers," too, but I stopped reading the comments, so I guess I won't find out.

I couldn't agree more with Chrisjac: the hatred for President Obama in this country has been appalling and embarrassing. It's, I'm guessing, mostly racial hatred. Disgusting. We obviously haven't come very far, have we?

Hazel


----------



## Mitsue39 (Apr 3, 2012)

That was not a political discussion- just a nice comment about a man being a gentleman!! Everything does not have to be political!!


----------



## dagmargrubaugh (May 10, 2011)

RitaM13 said:


> One word:
> 
> B-A-R-F


This is your 4th post in 2 1/2 years?
Maybe you could share something positive in the upcoming 2 1/2 years?

:thumbdown:


----------



## MartiG (Jan 21, 2012)

alwaysforyou said:


> I hadn't seen that picture, but I've always admired how much they seem to love and respect each other and their children. Great picture! Lynn


I agree. He is a good role model for husbands and fathers. Thanks for posting this lovely picture with your positive, credit where credit is due, comment 😊


----------



## cullenbe (Jul 3, 2011)

Let there be Peace on earth and let it begin with me.


----------



## mcguire (Feb 21, 2011)

Yes a very pretty picture. I heard that she was going to leave him before he started to 'run' for president, but they talked her out of it. Will not surprise me that after they leave the 'white house' she leaves him.


----------



## Ann DeGray (May 11, 2011)

bonib said:


> This has nothing to do with knitting----HELLO!!!!😡


HELLO!!!! :-( right back atcha! This topic was posted under Chit Chat (non knitting subjects).

Have a nice day.


----------



## knitnanny (Feb 28, 2012)

And he's pretty hot too!!!


----------



## dagmargrubaugh (May 10, 2011)

mcguire said:


> Yes a very pretty picture. I heard that she was going to leave him before he started to 'run' for president, but they talked her out of it. Will not surprise me that after they leave the 'white house' she leaves him.


Source please!
Who are they?


----------



## ann seal (Jan 30, 2014)

ZaaZaa3 said:


> I thought this was a knitting/crochet forum not a political venue. We all have thoughts on OP but my are not appropriate for a knitting forum. Let's stick to the items at hand not political statements!


 :thumbup: :thumbup: :thumbup:


----------



## Tokyoal (Mar 19, 2014)

To Mcguire - you "heard" Michelle was going to leave him? I have heard that he is gay, a Muslim, born in Kenya, etc., etc., etc. You really need to vet what you read. Not everything on the internet or Fox "News" is the truth.


----------



## MzBarnz (Aug 15, 2011)

Let's try to keep this UN-political. Whether you like the president or not, the purpose of showing us the picture is a man helping his wife down the stairs. It is a beautiful picture, so let's keep it at that, OK?


----------



## dagmargrubaugh (May 10, 2011)

MzBarnz said:


> Let's try to keep this UN-political. Whether you like the president or not, the purpose of showing us the picture is a man helping his wife down the stairs. It is a beautiful picture, so let's keep it at that, OK?


 :thumbup: :thumbup: :thumbup:


----------



## TapestryArtist (Sep 4, 2013)

lila ladue said:


> There are other pictures of him too. Not saluting the American flag, not placing his correct hand over his heart during our nationa anthem, bowing to Muslims. I could go on an on but don't want to make this a political discussion, GET INFORMED.


Then don't make it your agenda to point out your politics. The man is beautiful, graceful, and has balls the size of grapefruit!


----------



## dagmargrubaugh (May 10, 2011)

Tokyoal said:


> To Mcguire - you "heard" Michelle was going to leave him? I have heard that he is gay, a Muslim, born in Kenya, etc., etc., etc. You really need to vet what you read. Not everything on the internet or Fox "News" is the truth.


----------



## dagmargrubaugh (May 10, 2011)

TapestryArtist said:


> Then don't make it your agenda to point out your politics. The man is beautiful, graceful, and has balls the size of grapefruit!


I agree with the first two statements. However, I have no proof of the third.

:lol:


----------



## SQM (Jun 22, 2012)

flohel said:


> Re Hilltopper I agree. I also notice that the most hateful comments come from self proclaimed Christians.


And the German.


----------



## Ann DeGray (May 11, 2011)

dagmargrubaugh said:


> I agree with the first two statements. However, I have no proof of the third.
> 
> :lol:


Let's ask McGuire, she seems to know everything else about him.


----------



## pattibe (Feb 2, 2012)

Tokyoal said:


> My favorite is the picture of President Obama with the Girl Scouts wearing a tiara. I can just hear the giggling from the girls. So cute!


And now, by popular demand and for your viewing pleasure, i give you our President in a tiara.


----------



## mlsolcz (Feb 16, 2012)

:thumbup: :thumbup: :thumbup:


----------



## mlsolcz (Feb 16, 2012)

:thumbup: :thumbup:


----------



## demitybaughman (Oct 31, 2014)

BJP said:


> However, he has also stated that our country is no longer a Christian country!


The best part about the USA is our freedom and that includes our right to choose what religion in which to believe.


----------



## mlsolcz (Feb 16, 2012)

ZaaZaa3 said:


> I thought this was a knitting/crochet forum not a political venue. We all have thoughts on OP but my are not appropriate for a knitting forum. Let's stick to the items at hand not political statements!


Well said!


----------



## mlsolcz (Feb 16, 2012)

pattibe said:


> Ya know, I was just posting a beauiful picture of our President and First Lady. I did not mean to make this a political or religious forum. I should have added "hate mongers need not reply."


 :thumbup: :thumbup: :thumbup: :thumbup: :thumbup: :thumbup: :thumbup:


----------



## mlsolcz (Feb 16, 2012)

Designer1234 said:


> needless to say, we knew there would be a group who find it impossible to say anything good about him. He is a good father, a good husband and if he had ever been given a chance he would have accomplisted much more. When huge road blocks are placed in his way before he even was elected it is pretty hard to deal with it. I feel sad for him as he can't answer back to the nasty dreadful things said about him.
> 
> I don't know if he would have been a good President if the opposition had tried to help with some of his plans instead of making sure that everything that could possibly done to stop every action they could - he was never given a chance. I think he did very well considering the attacks to his wife, children and every thing he tried to do. jmo. He seems to be a graceful, fine man in my opinion- I don't think he did too badly looking at it as a Canadian who is very interested in the US Political system.


 :thumbup:


----------



## ann seal (Jan 30, 2014)

MzBarnz said:


> Let's try to keep this UN-political. Whether you like the president or not, the purpose of showing us the picture is a man helping his wife down the stairs. It is a beautiful picture, so let's keep it at that, OK?


 :thumbup: :thumbup: :thumbup:


----------



## bellestarr12 (Mar 26, 2011)

mcguire said:


> Yes a very pretty picture. I heard that she was going to leave him before he started to 'run' for president, but they talked her out of it. Will not surprise me that after they leave the 'white house' she leaves him.


As Edmond O'Brien cackles in "The Wild Bunch," "They? Who the hell is 'they'?"

Some people just seem to delight in passing on negativity, don't they?


----------



## TapestryArtist (Sep 4, 2013)




----------



## knitismything (Dec 4, 2011)

Beautiful, thank for sharing. :thumbup: :thumbup: :thumbup:


----------



## mlsolcz (Feb 16, 2012)

LizAnne said:


> I agree with Designer1234 completely. President Obama is a gentleman and his wife is a true lady. Their girls set a wonderful example as first children. There have been many pictures of them that are wonderful. It's embarassing to me how he has been treated. Other countries admire and respect him.


There will always be hateful people because they are insecure and it makes them feel better to belittle someone else. It's just sad!


----------



## mlsolcz (Feb 16, 2012)

That comment is totally inappropriate and immature.


----------



## demitybaughman (Oct 31, 2014)

Esmee said:


> Interesting that the negative comments come from people in hiding ☺


Ha! I noticed that, too!


----------



## mlsolcz (Feb 16, 2012)

Esmee said:


> Interesting that the negative comments come from people in hiding ☺


 :thumbup:


----------



## demitybaughman (Oct 31, 2014)

ginnyinnr said:


> How do you know they are a happy couple? We have no idea how many takes of that pose were taken before the photographers were happy. And there is no way you can read into the photo, if this is about the photo, that they are happy, that he has family values etc. I suggest quitting the subject.
> Whats next, pictures of Hillary Clinton and Bill Clinton?


I hope so!


----------



## ann seal (Jan 30, 2014)

bellestarr12 said:


> As Edmond O'Brien cackles in "The Wild Bunch," "They? Who the hell is 'they'?"
> 
> Some people just seem to delight in passing on negativity, don't they?


 :thumbup: :thumbup: :thumbup:


----------



## mlsolcz (Feb 16, 2012)

Champlain said:


> Whatever happened to respect, kindness, and happiness in the U.S.? We seem to snipe at each other every chance we get. The person who inserted the picture only meant to show how a husband can be kind to his wife. There was no political statement made. A couple of "grinches" made it a political thing. Lighten up !!


And when someone types BARF as a comment it is time to end the conversation as it has sunk to a childish level.


----------



## demitybaughman (Oct 31, 2014)

cullenbe said:


> Let there be Peace on earth and let it begin with me.


 :thumbup: :thumbup: :thumbup:


----------



## painthoss (Jul 10, 2012)

RitaM13 wrote:
One word:

B-A-R-F


dagmargrubaugh said:


> This is your 4th post in 2 1/2 years?
> Maybe you could share something positive in the upcoming 2 1/2 years?
> 
> :thumbdown:


You mean when she's 9?


----------



## demitybaughman (Oct 31, 2014)

Here's an idea: KP should have a meeting place for 'Politics' and then we can keep political opinions out of our 'general chit-chat'.


----------



## Celt Knitter (Jul 13, 2011)

You have made it political :thumbdown: :thumbdown: :thumbdown: 
Get educated! It's a good cure for small, mean-minded, intolerant people who cannot look at a picture on its own merits without dumping a load political garbage on to it.
How much do you love your country by denigrating your president on an international forum :?: :?: :?:


lila ladue said:


> There are other pictures of him too. Not saluting the American flag, not placing his correct hand over his heart during our nationa anthem, bowing to Muslims. I could go on an on but don't want to make this a political discussion, GET INFORMED.


----------



## ilmacheryl (Feb 3, 2013)

:thumbup: :thumbup: :thumbup:
And, if Christianity were our official national religion, the USA would be a "Christian" nation. Yes, currently, most citizens are Christian, but this country was founded as a secular nation - you know, the part about "separation of Church & state". I, for one, don't want any branch of ANY religion running the country. And, for the record, I am Christian.


----------



## lins (Jan 8, 2013)

:thumbup: :thumbup: :thumbup:


----------



## LadyBug 2014 (Nov 28, 2014)

lila ladue said:


> There are other pictures of him too. Not saluting the American flag, not placing his correct hand over his heart during our nationa anthem, bowing to Muslims. I could go on an on but don't want to make this a political discussion, GET INFORMED.


Oh Please----we know where you're coming from. Let's keep this about crafts and keep the negative out of it. I, personally think he's a wonderful man.


----------



## LadyBug 2014 (Nov 28, 2014)

BJP said:


> However, he has also stated that our country is no longer a Christian country!


That;s anew one-----it's also stupid.


----------



## dagmargrubaugh (May 10, 2011)

SQM said:


> And the German.


Ja!

:lol:


----------



## LadyBug 2014 (Nov 28, 2014)

ditto ditto ditto ditto


mlsolcz said:


> :thumbup:


----------



## dagmargrubaugh (May 10, 2011)

painthoss said:


> RitaM13 wrote:
> One word:
> 
> B-A-R-F
> ...


 :evil:


----------



## Munchn (Mar 3, 2013)

Amen to this. Besides, most men will behave like a gentleman in a tux.


lila ladue said:


> There are other pictures of him too. Not saluting the American flag, not placing his correct hand over his heart during our nationa anthem, bowing to Muslims. I could go on an on but don't want to make this a political discussion, GET INFORMED.


----------



## Ann DeGray (May 11, 2011)

demitybaughman said:


> Here's an idea: KP should have a meeting place for 'Politics' and then we can keep political opinions out of our 'general chit-chat'.


There is such a meeting place. Click on the first page of the Newsletter where all topics are listed. You will see "Progressive Women's Forum".

They get by with lots of nasty remarks and name calling there. If that's your thing you'll be happy there.


----------



## Chemchic (Dec 16, 2012)

and one of the great Presidents!


----------



## loriznet (Oct 21, 2014)

Thanks for the lovely photo -- had not seen this one.


----------



## grace59 (Jan 17, 2012)

Thats interesting. I'm open to being informed and feel you have the right to post your thoughts.


lila ladue said:


> There are other pictures of him too. Not saluting the American flag, not placing his correct hand over his heart during our nationa anthem, bowing to Muslims. I could go on an on but don't want to make this a political discussion, GET INFORMED.


----------



## Celt Knitter (Jul 13, 2011)

If you are a Christian, I am sure you KNOW this quote from the Bible:
Ephesians 4:29-31
Let no unwholesome word proceed from your mouth, but only such a word as is good for edification according to the need of the moment, so that it will give grace to those who hear. Do not grieve the Holy Spirit of God, by whom you were sealed for the day of redemption. Let all bitterness and wrath and anger and clamor and slander be put away from you, along with all malice.

It good advice, no matter your religious or political persuasion.
TShame it is not part of the public discourse in the USA!


lila ladue said:


> There are other pictures of him too. Not saluting the American flag, not placing his correct hand over his heart during our nationa anthem, bowing to Muslims. I could go on an on but don't want to make this a political discussion, GET INFORMED.


----------



## Crzywymyn (Dec 18, 2013)

A very handsome couple!


----------



## DebHow78 (Nov 11, 2014)

I agree that it's best not to bring politics into the Forum, even on the Other Topics section. Even with a photo of the President, praising him. (Personally, I am so appalled by his lack of leadership I can not abide to see a picture of him. I didn't know what it was about when I clicked on it. If I'd known it was a picture I wouldn't have.)

Political discussions always seem to bring on attacks and don't bring out the best in us. Pretty pictures are fine, but pretty ones of political figures are apt to cause problems. Whether liberal or conservatives.

We have all come together as a sort of family on this Forum because of our common love of knitting and crocheting. I'd hate to see it ruined with bad feelings because of politics.


----------



## yorkie1 (Sep 5, 2011)

HEMMMMMMMM!1 We must remember this category is the Chit Chat section. We can post about anything we want.


----------



## ElyseKnox (Sep 16, 2011)

Listing the actions of a politician is not the same thing as speaking with bitterness and wrath. It is a little unclear whom you think needs this reminder but I see a plenty of barbed comments against those who are not pleased with the actions of the current resident of our White House.



Celt Knitter said:


> If you are a Christian, I am sure you KNOW this quote from the Bible:
> Ephesians 4:29-31
> Let no unwholesome word proceed from your mouth, but only such a word as is good for edification according to the need of the moment, so that it will give grace to those who hear. Do not grieve the Holy Spirit of God, by whom you were sealed for the day of redemption. Let all bitterness and wrath and anger and clamor and slander be put away from you, along with all malice.
> 
> ...


----------



## hushpuppy (Apr 30, 2011)

Then why entitle it a picture of president and mrs Obama, just call it a lovely picture of an adoring couple and leave politics out of it altogether. Because I agree with Lila ladu. Won't state my personal feelings because this is not the forum to do so. Enough said


----------



## ginnyinnr (May 20, 2012)

hushpuppy said:


> Then why entitle it a picture of president and mrs Obama, just call it a lovely picture of an adoring couple and leave politics out of it altogether. Because I agree with Lila ladu. Won't state my personal feelings because this is not the forum to do so. Enough said


adoring is an adjective you really can't determine from a posed picture. They may not be adoring, there are some indications that might not be a good adjective here.


----------



## grace59 (Jan 17, 2012)

Wow the post you are going after did not have an unwholesome, bitter, anger, or wrath element. I came from a religious house that used the Bible as a cover to judge others and use verses out of context for their own benefit. The Bible (if you beleive in it) should not be used to make someone look bad.Posters for or against the photo are free to their opinion.


Celt Knitter said:


> If you are a Christian, I am sure you KNOW this quote from the Bible:
> Ephesians 4:29-31
> Let no unwholesome word proceed from your mouth, but only such a word as is good for edification according to the need of the moment, so that it will give grace to those who hear. Do not grieve the Holy Spirit of God, by whom you were sealed for the day of redemption. Let all bitterness and wrath and anger and clamor and slander be put away from you, along with all malice.
> 
> ...


----------



## DebHow78 (Nov 11, 2014)

ElyseKnox said:


> Listing the actions of a politician is not the same thing as speaking with bitterness and wrath. It is a little unclear whom you think needs this reminder but I see a plenty of barbed comments against those who are not pleased with the actions of the current resident of our White House.


 :thumbup: :thumbup:


----------



## Windmill Knitter (Mar 31, 2012)

pattibe said:


> And now, by popular demand and for your viewing pleasure, i give you our President in a tiara.


Love this photo and our President!


----------



## bellestarr12 (Mar 26, 2011)

pattibe said:


> And now, by popular demand and for your viewing pleasure, i give you our President in a tiara.


Love it, everyone and everything in it - the girls, the President, the tiaras, the smiles :thumbup: :thumbup: :thumbup: :thumbup: :thumbup:


----------



## NJG (Dec 2, 2011)

lila ladue said:


> There are other pictures of him too. Not saluting the American flag, not placing his correct hand over his heart during our nationa anthem, bowing to Muslims. I could go on an on but don't want to make this a political discussion, GET INFORMED.


So do you also want to discuss pictures of republican presidents? Tone down the hate just a little, please.


----------



## nitnana (Feb 3, 2013)

Hadn't seen that picture - very lovely. Haven't seen them together much lately - since the man vaulted over the fence & got into The White House. Wonder if Secret Service is trying to keep them apart, as much as possible. Death threats, maybe?? Hope we hear as much criticism of a Republican president (in the past or future) as we have of this Democratic one. God Bless America! :thumbup:


----------



## ElyseKnox (Sep 16, 2011)

It seems that for those who approve of BHO the word 'hate' is a popular word to hurl at those whose political opinions are the opposite. Requesting 'less hate' is still accusing the other of hate.



NJG said:


> So do you also want to discuss pictures of republican presidents? Tone down the hate just a little, please.


----------



## NJG (Dec 2, 2011)

ZaaZaa3 said:


> I thought this was a knitting/crochet forum not a political venue. We all have thoughts on OP but my are not appropriate for a knitting forum. Let's stick to the items at hand not political statements!


You have no right to tell others what to do.


----------



## NJG (Dec 2, 2011)

Cindy S said:


> Geesh!!! Get a grip, you are the one turning it into a political discussion. On the President's worst intellectual day, he would leave you in the dust in a hot minute.


 :thumbup: :thumbup: :thumbup: :thumbup: :thumbup:


----------



## cookiequeen (Jun 15, 2011)

DebHow78 said:


> I agree that it's best not to bring politics into the Forum, even on the Other Topics section. Even with a photo of the President, praising him. (Personally, I am so appalled by his lack of leadership I can not abide to see a picture of him. I didn't know what it was about when I clicked on it. If I'd known it was a picture I wouldn't have.)
> 
> Political discussions always seem to bring on attacks and don't bring out the best in us. Pretty pictures are fine, but pretty ones of political figures are apt to cause problems. Whether liberal or conservatives.
> 
> We have all come together as a sort of family on this Forum because of our common love of knitting and crocheting. I'd hate to see it ruined with bad feelings because of politics.


The heading was "Our President." If you are so full of hatred for him but want to come to the forum as a sort of "family" why in God's name did you click on it? Did you want to vent some of your hate?


----------



## Juice (Jul 15, 2011)

Oh go listen to Fox News!!! Right down your alley...


----------



## Dusti (Jan 23, 2012)

"MY" president died on April 15, 1865.


----------



## Dusti (Jan 23, 2012)

double clicked...my bad.


----------



## ginnyinnr (May 20, 2012)

Juice said:


> Oh go listen to Fox News!!! Right down your alley...


Every night!


----------



## NJG (Dec 2, 2011)

Designer1234 said:


> I agree - the world is watching and reading the posts and following the news including Fox. It is sad in my opinion. I have always liked Americans and I especially like the grace and love shared by that family. I Feel sorry for him. I am not talking about his politics I am talking about him as a person.
> What other President has been treated the same way that he has. Nothing is ever acknowledged by those who dislike and even hate him. He is ridiculed and his family has been ridiculed. I Think it is very very sad and I will always admire how he has acted - not returning the insults but respecting his Position as the President. I just happen to think they might get a surprise. Others in the world admire him. NOt all but many many people and countries. He is Grace under fire -- he comes across as kind and patient. His family is wonderfully close and loving.


 :thumbup: :thumbup: :thumbup: :thumbup:


----------



## Celt Knitter (Jul 13, 2011)

It seems pretty angry and bitter to me to make such comments about a picture of a man giving a hand to his wife. I know only too well what you mean about the Bible as a cloak. In the world today, most of the wars are fought by perpetrators claiming they are operating under the guidance of their respective holy books. My point is that if you imply, as the poster did, that you are of a particular religious persuasion, you cannot pick and choose the bits that suit you and one of the things I learned a long time ago from Christian religious instruction was that one should not speak ill of others......the sin of calumny and detraction. The people who are shouting the loudest against this president mostly do use religion as a basis of their criticism.


grace59 said:


> Wow the post you are going after did not have an unwholesome, bitter, anger, or wrath element. I came from a religious house that used the Bible as a cover to judge others and use verses out of context for their own benefit. The Bible (if you beleive in it) should not be used to make someone look bad.Posters for or against the photo are free to their opinion.


----------



## NJG (Dec 2, 2011)

flohel said:


> Re Hilltopper I agree. I also notice that the most hateful comments come from self proclaimed Christians.


I agree. They should be careful of what they say. Their words do not back up their so called Christian beliefs. Makes you wonder, doesn't it?


----------



## cheryl ridgway (Jan 31, 2013)

DebHow78 said:


> I agree that it's best not to bring politics into the Forum, even on the Other Topics section. Even with a photo of the President, praising him. (Personally, I am so appalled by his lack of leadership I can not abide to see a picture of him. I didn't know what it was about when I clicked on it. If I'd known it was a picture I wouldn't have.)
> 
> Political discussions always seem to bring on attacks and don't bring out the best in us. Pretty pictures are fine, but pretty ones of political figures are apt to cause problems. Whether liberal or conservatives.
> 
> Yes, its so very troubling that people can no longer disagree politically without demonizing the other side. In the "old days" republican and democratic politicians would argue and disagree while in session, but could go out afterwards with each other and have a beer. How have we deteriorated so badly that if you are very conservative or very progressive, you think of the other as "evil"? The art of compromise and discourse seems to be lost, but I hope not forever. I do see hope in our young people, as they seem more willing to listen to new points of view. Let's hope that us "older folks" can learn from them and disagree with each other without vitriol.


----------



## trish2222 (May 13, 2012)

I didn't look at this topic when I first saw it because I assumed it was political. Now I've learnt it's not ( supposed to be) I'm glad I looked at it. The pictures are so good, beautifully shot and now I really want to hug a koala! The whole family is extremely photogenic.


----------



## MarilynKnits (Aug 30, 2011)

BJP said:


> However, he has also stated that our country is no longer a Christian country!


As well it should not. There are many of us who are not Christians and who are entitled to all the rights and privileges of any American. There are Muslims, Hindus, Jews, Sikhs, Atheists, among others. Why should one religion take precedence over any other?

Religion is and should be a private and personal matter and be divorced from the governance of the country.


----------



## ElyseKnox (Sep 16, 2011)

Why do you have to evoke the name of the Eternal One?

And how would one know what was going to be posted before opening it?

Why is it tht comments that do not match yours get labelled as 'hate?'



cookiequeen said:


> The heading was "Our President." If you are so full of hatred for him but want to come to the forum as a sort of "family" why in God's name did you click on it? Did you want to vent some of your hate?


----------



## Nussa (Jul 7, 2011)

You must have taken a wrong turn somewhere. This is a photo of President and Mrs. Obama. And the subject is about a man being respectful and a gentleman to his wife, and I find it to be sweet. I'm sure you meant to go to the "Obama Bashing" forum. Just by posting what you did, which had nothing to do with the picture, turned it into a nasty political post. Shame...... 



lila ladue said:


> There are other pictures of him too. Not saluting the American flag, not placing his correct hand over his heart during our nationa anthem, bowing to Muslims. I could go on an on but don't want to make this a political discussion, GET INFORMED.


----------



## NJG (Dec 2, 2011)

Hazel Blumberg - McKee said:


> I had the grim feeling that, when I saw the title of this discussion, it would erupt into something virulent. I was, I admit, disgusted to read garbage about the president being a Muslim (and so WHAT if he were a Muslim, anyway? what about freedom of religion?). There're probably nasty comments by so-called "birthers," too, but I stopped reading the comments, so I guess I won't find out.
> 
> I couldn't agree more with Chrisjac: the hatred for President Obama in this country has been appalling and embarrassing. It's, I'm guessing, mostly racial hatred. Disgusting. We obviously haven't come very far, have we?
> 
> Hazel


No, I am sorry to say,we have not come very far. I was pretty naive in thinking we had. After President Obama was elected and the republicans had their meeting on inauguration day to say they would not allow him to accomplish anything, I was shocked. They always deny racial hatred, but they have never treated any other president so terribly. Wonder what they will do to a woman in the white house. Probably won't be good.


----------



## Lostie (May 2, 2013)

trish2222 said:


> I didn't look at this topic when I first saw it because I assumed it was political. Now I've learnt it's not ( supposed to be) I'm glad I looked at it. The pictures are so good, beautifully shot and now I really want to hug a koala! The whole family is extremely photogenic.


 :thumbup: :thumbup:


----------



## NJG (Dec 2, 2011)

mcguire said:


> Yes a very pretty picture. I heard that she was going to leave him before he started to 'run' for president, but they talked her out of it. Will not surprise me that after they leave the 'white house' she leaves him.


You just passed on a rumor that you have no proof of and I bet you are wrong.


----------



## cookiequeen (Jun 15, 2011)

ElyseKnox said:


> Why do you have to evoke the name of the Eternal One?
> 
> And how would one know what was going to be posted before opening it?
> 
> Why is it tht comments that do not match yours get labelled as 'hate?'


If someone cannot "abide to look at him" what do you think is the feeling coming from the poster? If someone disagrees with policy, that is one thing;if s/he cannot abide to look at him, that's something else. If I couldn't stand to look at the president, I wouldn't click on a topic entitled "our president."
I am not looking for any comments that do or don't "match" mine.


----------



## Dori Sage (Feb 7, 2011)

BJP said:


> However, he has also stated that our country is no longer a Christian country!


So I haven't read 14 pages, and I hope no one takes offense, but this country is not and never was a "Christian" country. Church and state are separate. This country is a democracy and everyone is free to follow their choice of religion or no religion at all.


----------



## gordon000 (Jul 17, 2011)

Very lovely PICTURES!, Indeed!!


----------



## NJG (Dec 2, 2011)

DebHow78 said:


> I agree that it's best not to bring politics into the Forum, even on the Other Topics section. Even with a photo of the President, praising him. (Personally, I am so appalled by his lack of leadership I can not abide to see a picture of him. I didn't know what it was about when I clicked on it. If I'd known it was a picture I wouldn't have.)
> 
> Political discussions always seem to bring on attacks and don't bring out the best in us. Pretty pictures are fine, but pretty ones of political figures are apt to cause problems. Whether liberal or conservatives.
> 
> We have all come together as a sort of family on this Forum because of our common love of knitting and crocheting. I'd hate to see it ruined with bad feelings because of politics.


But you just couldn't resist making your comments political, doing exactly what you are criticizing others for. You said: [Personally, I am so appalled by his lack of leadership I can not abide to see a picture of him.] Common complaints of others like you are complaints about his policies and his leadership, but when asked for specifics, it is just more talking points. You claim not wanting to talk politics, but just can't help yourself I guess. What do you mean by lack of leadership?


----------



## Windmill Knitter (Mar 31, 2012)

Dori Sage said:


> So I haven't read 14 pages, and I hope no one takes offense, but this country is not and never was a "Christian" country. Church and state are separate. This country is a democracy and everyone is free to follow their choice of religion or no religion at all.


Well said.


----------



## Aubreys gramma (Dec 26, 2014)

Hmmm, appearances can be so deceiving.


----------



## ginnyinnr (May 20, 2012)

Aubreys gramma said:


> Hmmm, appearances can be so deceiving.


That is so true. See how many trips are made by the president, alone.


----------



## NJG (Dec 2, 2011)

ElyseKnox said:


> It seems that for those who approve of BHO the word 'hate' is a popular word to hurl at those whose political opinions are the opposite. Requesting 'less hate' is still accusing the other of hate.


It is hate. I have read many many comments from those on the right and they say "I hate him." There are lots of comments about his leadership and his policies, but when I ask about specifics, there don't answer. That is just pure hate. They don't know why [supposedly] they hate him, they just do.


----------



## NJG (Dec 2, 2011)

MarilynKnits said:


> As well it should not. There are many of us who are not Christians and who are entitled to all the rights and privileges of any American. There are Muslims, Hindus, Jews, Sikhs, Atheists, among others. Why should one religion take precedence over any other?
> 
> Religion is and should be a private and personal matter and be divorced from the governance of the country.


Well said.


----------



## ElyseKnox (Sep 16, 2011)

I saw no comments HERE on this KP site where anyone expressed hate or used the word about BHO--only used against those who are not particularly pleased with his actions for the past 6+ years.

Please do not attribute to KP posters the words and actions of others who are not posting here.



NJG said:


> It is hate. I have read many many comments from those on the right and they say "I hate him." There are lots of comments about his leadership and his policies, but when I ask about specifics, there don't answer. That is just pure hate. They don't don't know why [supposedly] they hate him, they just do.


----------



## MarilynKnits (Aug 30, 2011)

RitaM13 said:


> One word:
> 
> B-A-R-F


How - - mature? NOT!


----------



## SAMkewel (Mar 5, 2011)

BJP said:


> However, he has also stated that our country is no longer a Christian country!


I hate to start WW III here, but if you read all that the founding fathers had to say, this country never was a Christian country. I have no idea how this idea became so entrenched. Current statistics show that Christians have become a minority in the US. I'm not passing judgment one way or the other, just stating the facts.


----------



## raedean (Apr 25, 2011)

i am not for President Obama cause i feel he has let the middle class suffer so.
i am not for him for alot of reasons but-i can say i think they are an attractive couple and family.


----------



## SAMkewel (Mar 5, 2011)

ZaaZaa3 said:


> I thought this was a knitting/crochet forum not a political venue. We all have thoughts on OP but my are not appropriate for a knitting forum. Let's stick to the items at hand not political statements!


If you look at the heading of this particular section of the forum, you will see that it is "General Chit-Chat (non-knitting talk)". Perhaps you could just skip this section and then you won't be upset. Politics, religion, or any other subject are fair game here.


----------



## SAMkewel (Mar 5, 2011)

hilltopper said:


> And thank you for that information Sine. I certainly agree about Pete Souza's eye. Probably both of them.


;~D!


----------



## Carmela51 (Jan 12, 2013)

WOW! How sad!!!


----------



## SAMkewel (Mar 5, 2011)

pattibe said:


> It was a beautiful picture of the President and First Lady. Just unwatch the post if you can't say anything nice!


I continue to be amazed at the amount of hatred aimed at this president given that he has done far less than many other presidents to bring it about. There must be another reason???


----------



## SAMkewel (Mar 5, 2011)

Designer1234 said:


> needless to say, we knew there would be a group who find it impossible to say anything good about him. He is a good father, a good husband and if he had ever been given a chance he would have accomplisted much more. When huge road blocks are placed in his way before he even was elected it is pretty hard to deal with it. I feel sad for him as he can't answer back to the nasty dreadful things said about him.
> 
> I don't know if he would have been a good President if the opposition had tried to help with some of his plans instead of making sure that everything that could possibly done to stop every action they could - he was never given a chance. I think he did very well considering the attacks to his wife, children and every thing he tried to do. jmo. He seems to be a graceful, fine man in my opinion- I don't think he did too badly looking at it as a Canadian who is very interested in the US Political system.


Thank you, Designer1234.


----------



## DebHow78 (Nov 11, 2014)

NJG said:


> But you just couldn't resist making your comments political, doing exactly what you are criticizing others for. You said: [Personally, I am so appalled by his lack of leadership I can not abide to see a picture of him.] Common complaints of others like you are complaints about his policies and his leadership, but when asked for specifics, it is just more talking points. You claim not wanting to talk politics, but just can't help yourself I guess. What do you mean by lack of leadership?


Do you REALLY want me to be specific? Because if I do, I will be called a hater. I don't hate him. However I DO hate what he has done to our country.

Here is a beautiful picture. It won't cause hate and divisiveness. It was taken from my brothers Gazebo he is building as an anniversary present for his wife. They are missionaries in the Marshall Islands. Isn't it beautiful there?


----------



## Carmela51 (Jan 12, 2013)

WOW, how sad that some sought to politicize the photo. We don't have to agree the person in the presidential position (American affords us that benefit), but who afforded us the right to be disrespectful. And some talk about the children/youth of America. How sad!


----------



## SAMkewel (Mar 5, 2011)

hilltopper said:


> Thank you Designer 1234 - those were nice things you said about the president of this country. While, this being the country it is, people are free to dislike the president. And I am sure they must be patriots. Still, I worry that rude things said about the President of the United States must please our enemies and encourage them, and that would be a terrible shame.


I cannot find any rational reason for the hatred aimed at this president. It goes beyond dislike. I can't remember any other president being spoken of and picked at like this one. How "unAmerican."


----------



## SAMkewel (Mar 5, 2011)

flohel said:


> Re Hilltopper I agree. I also notice that the most hateful comments come from self proclaimed Christians.


Isn't that almost always the way! Then they wonder why so many are leaving the "flock!"


----------



## SAMkewel (Mar 5, 2011)

der_fisherman said:


> Many would say that he is correct today......Muslim President sort of gives it away maybe?
> 
> Blame the voters, not the man!!
> 
> ...


You are misinformed.


----------



## DebHow78 (Nov 11, 2014)

NJG said:


> But you just couldn't resist making your comments political, doing exactly what you are criticizing others for. You said: [Personally, I am so appalled by his lack of leadership I can not abide to see a picture of him.] Common complaints of others like you are complaints about his policies and his leadership, but when asked for specifics, it is just more talking points. You claim not wanting to talk politics, but just can't help yourself I guess. What do you mean by lack of leadership?


Do you REALLY want me to be specie? Because I have valid points but will be called a hater. I don't hate him. God loves him as much as He loves me. What I hate is what he has done to our wonderful country.

Here is a pretty picture, since we are sharing them. It won't cause discord. It's taken from the gazebo my brother is building for an anniversary present for his wife. They have been missionaries to the Marshall Islands for over 30 years. I think the scene is beautiful. The homes aren't very pretty there, but the views are.


----------



## alwaysforyou (Dec 6, 2011)

"Yes, its so very troubling that people can no longer disagree politically without demonizing the other side. In the "old days" republican and democratic politicians would argue and disagree while in session, but could go out afterwards with each other and have a beer. How have we deteriorated so badly that if you are very conservative or very progressive, you think of the other as "evil"? The art of compromise and discourse seems to be lost, but I hope not forever. I do see hope in our young people, as they seem more willing to listen to new points of view. Let's hope that us "older folks" can learn from them and disagree with each other without vitriol.[/quote]"

This is such an important point, well stated and on target, that is bears repeating! I remember when discussions or debates were respectful, no matter the degree of disagreement. How have we so lost the art of communicating respectfully???? I worry that this shift dims what should be our united conviction that the U.S. is, in fact, United. Well said, Cheryl :thumbup: :thumbup: Lynn


----------



## NJG (Dec 2, 2011)

DebHow78 said:


> Do you REALLY want me to be specific? Because if I do, I will be called a hater. I don't hate him. However I DO hate what he has done to our country.
> 
> Here is a beautiful picture. It won't cause hate and divisiveness. It was taken from my brothers Gazebo he is building as an anniversary present for his wife. They are missionaries in the Marshall Islands. Isn't it beautiful there?


Yes I really want you to be specific. What has he done to our country?


----------



## SAMkewel (Mar 5, 2011)

pattibe said:


> Oh come on. He is NOT a Muslim. But if he was, what is wrong with that. Whatever happened to Freedom of Religon in this country?


It seems to have been ruled out of order by evangelical Christians, I know not why. Perhaps they feel threatened whenever someone is not exactly like everyone else? That's my best guess.


----------



## DebHow78 (Nov 11, 2014)

NJG said:


> Yes I really want you to be specific. What has he done to our country?


Do you want me to post it here or message you?


----------



## shadypineslady (Jan 28, 2014)

This is exactly why I love this forum. Every day I look and sometimes I find a heated discussion over US politics going on. What I learned early on, is that if I let it, some of my buttons can be pushed. What I have learned lately, is that the button pushing reaction thing can be a choice for me, and I'm choosing to read some of this thread, chuckle a little over how upset some can get, realize that I can't change anything, and move on to another thread, in case there's more to be learned.

Tally Ho, and carry on, ladies.


----------



## SAMkewel (Mar 5, 2011)

dagmargrubaugh said:


> I agree with the first two statements. However, I have no proof of the third.
> 
> :lol:


I will accept as proof the fact that he is still in office without having cut and run or having returned in kind the attitudes of many.


----------



## henhouse2011 (Feb 20, 2011)

lila ladue said:


> There are other pictures of him too. Not saluting the American flag, not placing his correct hand over his heart during our nationa anthem, bowing to Muslims. I could go on an on but don't want to make this a political discussion, GET INFORMED.[/quote
> 
> Google it if you want to be INFORMED. There are plenty of pictures of him and his family with his hand over his heart.
> Read pewforum.org for percentages of reigions in this country


----------



## SAMkewel (Mar 5, 2011)

Ann DeGray said:


> There is such a meeting place. Click on the first page of the Newsletter where all topics are listed. You will see "Progressive Women's Forum".
> 
> They get by with lots of nasty remarks and name calling there. If that's your thing you'll be happy there.


Geez, I have to take issue with this. I'm a progressive, I do not go to, nor have I ever gone to that forum, I do not call anyone names, and I grew up a long time ago. I understand heated statements, but Geez.


----------



## NJG (Dec 2, 2011)

DebHow78 said:


> Do you want me to post it here or message you?


Post it here.


----------



## SAMkewel (Mar 5, 2011)

DebHow78 said:


> I agree that it's best not to bring politics into the Forum, even on the Other Topics section. Even with a photo of the President, praising him. (Personally, I am so appalled by his lack of leadership I can not abide to see a picture of him. I didn't know what it was about when I clicked on it. If I'd known it was a picture I wouldn't have.)
> 
> Political discussions always seem to bring on attacks and don't bring out the best in us. Pretty pictures are fine, but pretty ones of political figures are apt to cause problems. Whether liberal or conservatives.
> 
> We have all come together as a sort of family on this Forum because of our common love of knitting and crocheting. I'd hate to see it ruined with bad feelings because of politics.


And yet you take the opportunity to state your own political opinion here. Hmmmm. That does not compute.


----------



## SAMkewel (Mar 5, 2011)

ElyseKnox said:


> It seems that for those who approve of BHO the word 'hate' is a popular word to hurl at those whose political opinions are the opposite. Requesting 'less hate' is still accusing the other of hate.


I'm curious about what you call the primary feeling behind your words about President Obama.....


----------



## CORNFLOWER (Aug 5, 2011)

I agree with you Lila, yes this is a knitting forum~~~


----------



## pattibe (Feb 2, 2012)

NJG said:


> Post it here.


OMG, please DO NOT post it here. All I did was post a picture of the President. If you clicked on it and were offended, I am sorry. All you had to do was click out of it!!!!! No one needs to hear your political diatribe. Start a new post if you wish and present your views. I for one am not interested.


----------



## dagmargrubaugh (May 10, 2011)

SAMkewel said:


> I will accept as proof the fact that he is still in office without having cut and run or having returned in kind the attitudes of many.


Yes, you are right. It does take someone with intestinal fortitude (or other body parts) to not respond in kind.
Thanks SAMkewel

:wink:


----------



## dagmargrubaugh (May 10, 2011)

pattibe said:


> OMG, please DO NOT post it here. All I did was post a picture of the President. If you clicked on it and were offended, I am sorry. All you had to do was click out of it!!!!! No one needs to hear your political diatribe. Start a new post if you wish and present your views. I for one am not interested.


Neither am I!


----------



## SAMkewel (Mar 5, 2011)

Dori Sage said:


> So I haven't read 14 pages, and I hope no one takes offense, but this country is not and never was a "Christian" country. Church and state are separate. This country is a democracy and everyone is free to follow their choice of religion or no religion at all.


I, sadly, have read 14 pages, the majority of which are not Christian by any stretch of the imagination, nor are they representative of any particular religion. I'm not certain this country is a democracy, either. I do, however, agree with your general statements :~). It's good to see you.


----------



## ginnyinnr (May 20, 2012)

pattibe said:


> OMG, please DO NOT post it here. All I did was post a picture of the President. If you clicked on it and were offended, I am sorry. All you had to do was click out of it!!!!! No one needs to hear your political diatribe. Start a new post if you wish and present your views.  I for one am not interested.


Anything about Obama, even a rehearsed photo such as was posted for publicity, causes deep feelings.


----------



## SAMkewel (Mar 5, 2011)

ginnyinnr said:


> That is so true. See how many trips are made by the president, alone.


You might want to compare these to trips made by other presidents, alone.


----------



## justinjared (May 31, 2012)

pattibe said:


> I love this picture of President Obama. He is such a gentleman.


 I am so proud and happy to see a positive comment about the president and his wife!!!! I am of African descent in Canada since the American revolution. we have too few rolemodels for our children. I am so proud of Obama and my kids ans grandkids are as well. I thank you.


----------



## justinjared (May 31, 2012)

I agree with you. lets leave politics out and comment on photo


----------



## SAMkewel (Mar 5, 2011)

DebHow78 said:


> Do you REALLY want me to be specific? Because if I do, I will be called a hater. I don't hate him. However I DO hate what he has done to our country.
> 
> Here is a beautiful picture. It won't cause hate and divisiveness. It was taken from my brothers Gazebo he is building as an anniversary present for his wife. They are missionaries in the Marshall Islands. Isn't it beautiful there?


Would you please explain what he has done to our country, bearing in mind that the opposing political party vowed to, and succeeded at, being obstructionists from day one of his terms in office?


----------



## pattibe (Feb 2, 2012)

justinjared said:


> I am so proud and happy to see a positive comment about the president and his wife!!!! I am of African descent in Canada since the American revolution. we have too few rolemodels for our children. I am so proud of Obama and my kids ans grandkids are as well. I thank you.


THANK YOU!


----------



## justinjared (May 31, 2012)

SAMkewel said:


> Would you please explain what he has done to our country, bearing in mind that the opposing political party vowed to, and succeeded at, being obstructionists from day one of his terms in office?


 the kper who posted photo was talking about the man not his political views. from what we hear in Canada he doesn't get much support from the senate. is any leader perfect? was Bush? is my Canadian prime minister perfect? they are men trying to do a difficult job in difficult times!


----------



## lins (Jan 8, 2013)

pattibe said:


> And now, by popular demand and for your viewing pleasure, i give you our President in a tiara.


I bet he has worn a few before and has had endless tea partys with his girls because I think he is probably an awesome dad.
This picture really has to make one smile.


----------



## DebHow78 (Nov 11, 2014)

NJG said:


> Post it here


Others don't want it here. I come to this forum for enjoyment and relaxation. I will message my points to you; however, so you don't think there is no substance to my opinion.


----------



## lins (Jan 8, 2013)

ginnyinnr said:


> Every night!


It shows.


----------



## painthoss (Jul 10, 2012)

To DebHOW
http://www.senate.gov/reference/Legislation/Vetoes/vetoCounts.htm

One point of yours completely refuted.

How many others can bear the light of day?


----------



## SwampCatNana (Dec 27, 2012)

:thumbup:


----------



## lins (Jan 8, 2013)

DebHow78 said:


> Lack of leadership. Let's see: he did nothing to help the people in Benghazi when they asked for help and were murdered. He has opened the borders for ANYONE to come in, including terrorists, gang members, drug dealers, people with contagious diseases. The job of the President is to protect the citizens. He's called for release of MANY prisoners, some of which are rapists and murderers. The military have a 15% approval rating of our president for a reason - he has taken away so much from them, including letting terrorists go free which so many were maimed for life of died in capturing - only for them to be let free. Cut their pay, cut back on funding so they don't have what they need. Banned them from praying or reading a Bible. While our country has been in crisis, he has been on the golf course. Golfing and taking vacations far more than ANY president in history. He has run up our deficit far more than anyone in history, also. Under his "leadership" schools and cities are banning the American flag - because it might offend a Muslim. Well, this is AMERICA. WE SHOULD BE ABLE TO PROUDLY WAVE OUR FLAG. Under this administration we have seen racism grow to something we haven't seen in my lifetime. He has publicly criticized our law enforcement, stirring people up against them, instead of supporting them. If he doesn't like how congress votes on a subject he just gets out his pen and makes his executive privilege, which the Supreme Court has said that once or twice was illegal. A dictator acts on their own, a President acts on the bequest of the Senate, Congress and people. Obamacare - while it was supposed to be established so that EVERYONE could have insurance, the prices have skyrocketed so that many I know have lost their insurance - people with cancer and diseases that NEED it - and then they have to pay to NOT have it. I have a terminal disease, myself, and can not afford several of my medications and have to choose between healthcare and food and housing.
> 
> I am only posting this because you asked me to, after insinuating I couldn't back up my fault of Obama's leadership.
> 
> To be fair, why don't you share what he has done that you like.


I was going to read your whole post but after the first sentence I decided not to bother because...you are stuck on an old Fox News recording. Their needle is dull and they skip the facts.
How many Congress/Senate investigations have been done? What did they find? How would the President have been able to send anyone at that time?
Go read the findings of the investigations into this matter.


----------



## pattibe (Feb 2, 2012)

lins said:


> I was going to read your whole post but after the first sentence I decided not to bother because...you are stuck on an old Fox News recording. Their needle is dull and they skip the facts.
> How many Congress/Senate investigations have been done? What did they find? How would the President have been able to send anyone at that time?
> Go read the findings of the investigations into this matter.


Oh, you are so right about Fox. It is NOT news. We haven't had objective news coverage since Walter Chronkite. Also referring to the first line of that rant. We are a Nation of immigrants....we or our ancestors all came from somewhere else and then stole the land fair and square from the Native Americans and (yes) the Mexicans who were here long before we were.


----------



## DebHow78 (Nov 11, 2014)

I tried to delete my explanation after seeing how many people didn't want it posted, but apparently it still posted.

I'm going to leave this thread now. No one is going to change anyone else's mind. And it is just upsetting. I have a terminal disease and knit to relax and because I can't do many other things. I come to this forum to learn and get new ideas. In the past I have enjoyed the forum and it never made me feel anything but happy. I wish I'd never opened this thread. I didn't know if it was a cartoon or a poem or what. I was curious.

But people get vicious and mean. They call names and personally attack people who don't think like them. I was asked to explain what I meant and I did, but I'm now leaving this thread and won't be back to it, so if you continue addressing me I won't see it. We all have opinions on all sorts of things in life. It's what makes us all individuals and interesting. But religion & politics are very touchy subjects. I don't need this in my life right now.

I'm going to KNIT!


----------



## desertgirl (Jan 26, 2013)

chrisjac said:


> Since day one, the hatred for this President showed its ugly head. The lack of respect is embarrassing. Thank you for the lovely pictures. Scat rats!


I loved the pictures!


----------



## ginnyinnr (May 20, 2012)

desertgirl said:


> I loved the pictures!


I dislike the whole issue, pictures convey a terrible message for me, discussion, whatever. I'm out.


----------



## Ontario Silk (Feb 16, 2014)

begarcia44 said:


> What does being informed have to do with someone saying they like a picture? The OP is saying she likes the picture not making a political statement.


 :thumbup: :thumbup: :thumbup: The OP was stating that he is a gentleman. My hubby still opens doors for me and opens my side of the car and helps me in and then closes the door.( even in the freezing, blowing,icy cold weather.) He always seats me at the table even if it is just the two of us here at home alone. He always guides me gently by the elbow or the small of my back. He even takes off my shoes and boots when we come in the house and holds my jacket or sweater for me to put on or off. And hangs it up for me. He always stands if he is seated when I come to sit with him in the living room and waits for me to sit first. In a restaurant he even puts my napkin on my lap. His mother and father raised him to be a gentleman. He has taught this to our 5 boys. Their wives are thrilled that they are treated with love and care like they are made of spun sugar. I guess that Gentilemen are a dying breed. Sigh such a shame.... Never to late to teach good manners. My hubby is only 63 and I am 52 so we are not ancient. LOL our oldest son is 35 and our youngest is 24.


----------



## seemyart (May 31, 2013)

since I have nothing nice to say about our president, I will say nothing


----------



## SQM (Jun 22, 2012)

Ontario Silk said:


> :thumbup: :thumbup: :thumbup: The OP was stating that he is a gentleman. My hubby still opens doors for me and opens my side of the car and helps me in and then closes the door.( even in the freezing, blowing,icy cold weather.) He always seats me at the table even if it is just the two of us here at home alone. He always guides me gently by the elbow or the small of my back. He even takes off my shoes and boots when we come in the house and holds my jacket or sweater for me to put on or off. And hangs it up for me. He always stands if he is seated when I come to sit with him in the living room and waits for me to sit first. In a restaurant he even puts my napkin on my lap. His mother and father raised him to be a gentleman. He has taught this to our 5 boys. Their wives are thrilled that they are treated with love and care like they are made of spun sugar. I guess that Gentilemen are a dying breed. Sigh such a shame.... Never to late to teach good manners. My hubby is only 63 and I am 52 so we are not ancient. LOL our oldest son is 35 and our youngest is 24.


Does your husband have a brother? It is fine that he is gentile.


----------



## MarilynKnits (Aug 30, 2011)

Ontario Silk said:


> :thumbup: :thumbup: :thumbup: The OP was stating that he is a gentleman. My hubby still opens doors for me and opens my side of the car and helps me in and then closes the door.( even in the freezing, blowing,icy cold weather.) He always seats me at the table even if it is just the two of us here at home alone. He always guides me gently by the elbow or the small of my back. He even takes off my shoes and boots when we come in the house and holds my jacket or sweater for me to put on or off. And hangs it up for me. He always stands if he is seated when I come to sit with him in the living room and waits for me to sit first. In a restaurant he even puts my napkin on my lap. His mother and father raised him to be a gentleman. He has taught this to our 5 boys. Their wives are thrilled that they are treated with love and care like they are made of spun sugar. I guess that Gentilemen are a dying breed. Sigh such a shame.... Never to late to teach good manners. My hubby is only 63 and I am 52 so we are not ancient. LOL our oldest son is 35 and our youngest is 24.


How beautiful. You are genteel and civilized people with excellent priorities. Thank you both for rearing your sons to carry on your classy traditions.


----------



## SAMkewel (Mar 5, 2011)

seemyart said:


> since I have nothing nice to say about our president, I will say nothing


But you didn't say nothing, you said you have nothing nice to say about our president. Sadly, that seems to be the case with many on the far right, and it seems to me to be double-talk. How can you have it both ways and not recognize what you are doing?


----------



## kittykatzmom (Mar 1, 2011)

Good photo - op. Obama loves the camera!


----------



## lins (Jan 8, 2013)

pattibe said:


> Oh, you are so right about Fox. It is NOT news. We haven't had objective news coverage since Walter Chronkite. Also referring to the first line of that rant. We are a Nation of immigrants....we or our ancestors all came from somewhere else and then stole the land fair and square from the Native Americans and (yes) the Mexicans who were here long before we were.


 :thumbup:


----------



## kittykatzmom (Mar 1, 2011)

We are a nation of immigrants who came here to WORK and not just sponge off the taxpayers like the immigrants of today.


----------



## cspaen34 (Jan 28, 2011)

hilltopper said:


> Puzzling to me. If someone has a different religion - or different politics - from ours that should not keep us from acknowledging they are wearing a pretty dress!


:thumbup: :thumbup: Unfortunately lots of hatred here on forum that is best to just ignore. It is a beautiful picture of the First Couple, and a lovely gesture. She wears the gorgeous gown so well! I had not seen this photo, thanks for post.


----------



## ElyseKnox (Sep 16, 2011)

Why do you need to take the name of The Eternal in vain--twice. Could you not make yourself clear without doing so?



SAMkewel said:


> Geez, I have to take issue with this. I'm a progressive, I do not go to, nor have I ever gone to that forum, I do not call anyone names, and I grew up a long time ago. I understand heated statements, but Geez.


----------



## lins (Jan 8, 2013)

seemyart said:


> since I have nothing nice to say about our president, I will say nothing


 :thumbdown:


----------



## Dori Sage (Feb 7, 2011)

SAMkewel said:


> I, sadly, have read 14 pages, the majority of which are not Christian by any stretch of the imagination, nor are they representative of any particular religion. I'm not certain this country is a democracy, either. I do, however, agree with your general statements :~). It's good to see you.


Yes and thanks for the correction. I meant that we are a secular country. Not wanting to start another war, we have become not a democracy, but an oligarchy.


----------



## ElyseKnox (Sep 16, 2011)

Why is it people can agree with Obama but not disagree. I thought civilized public discussion was what helped to make our country great.

to which this reply is posted:


lins said:


> :thumbdown:


seemyart wrote:
since I have nothing nice to say about our president, I will say nothing


----------



## kittykatzmom (Mar 1, 2011)

Everyone has their own opinion. I will say this Obama is the WORST excuse for a president that America has ever had. His whole family is so disrespectful to the position that they hold. Michelle is the ugliest first lady I have ever seen. Some days you just can't fix ugly and this is one of those days!


----------



## kittykatzmom (Mar 1, 2011)

As far as I am concerned the USA has been without a president since the Bush's left the White House. We have half black trash in there right now.


----------



## SQM (Jun 22, 2012)

kittykatzmom said:


> As far as I am concerned the USA has been without a president since the Bush's left the White House. We have half black trash in there right now.


You are disgusting.

List all the other people you dislike.

"Katz"??? German???? Hmmm!


----------



## train (Nov 6, 2011)

I like the Pope, and I'm not catholic!


----------



## pattibe (Feb 2, 2012)

train said:


> I like the Pope, and I'm not catholic!


I do too. He is totally cool and I too am not Catholic.


----------



## cbethea (Oct 21, 2013)

pattibe said:


> I love this picture of President Obama. He is such a gentleman.


They are a lovely couple and loving parents. But be prepared for the haters -they'll surely have lots to say.


----------



## MarilynKnits (Aug 30, 2011)

kittykatzmom said:


> Everyone has their own opinion. I will say this Obama is the WORST excuse for a president that America has ever had. His whole family is so disrespectful to the position that they hold. Michelle is the ugliest first lady I have ever seen. Some days you just can't fix ugly and this is one of those days!


What a disagreeable comment. Fine to disagree with the president's performance in office. At least he does not surround himself with the sorts of thugs who lie to start wars or break into private property.

His wife is a charming, well groomed, good looking woman whose First Lady project is to promote the health of young people through nutrition education. Beats redecorating the White House or buying new mega-buck expensive dishes for the place.

And the first daughters are cute young girls who show respect and affection for their parents and keep a low profile. I strongly doubt either one will ever be caught boozing it up.

The rancor some people show for this family smells so bone deep of rage that people of color have achieved their status. Some people do not realize how racially prejudiced they appear to many of us. The hatred and ugliness directed at the First Family sounds worst than that directed against the Nicholas and Alexandra or Louis and Marie Antoinette who were apparently deserving of the displeasure of their subjects. Some of the comments seem truly deranged.


----------



## bane (Nov 27, 2012)

kittykatzmom said:


> Everyone has their own opinion. I will say this Obama is the WORST excuse for a president that America has ever had. His whole family is so disrespectful to the position that they hold. Michelle is the ugliest first lady I have ever seen. Some days you just can't fix ugly and this is one of those days!


I'm not American, so I'm not in any position to criticise Obama , which I wouldn't do anyway. But I really dislike your comment ' Michelle is ugly ' !! That is so very rude and judgmental, and uncalled for. :thumbdown:


----------



## MarilynKnits (Aug 30, 2011)

kittykatzmom said:


> As far as I am concerned the USA has been without a president since the Bush's left the White House. We have half black trash in there right now.


Racist!


----------



## kittykatzmom (Mar 1, 2011)

Obama is the one who disgusting! He hates America and could have cared less that police officers are being killed. HE IS NOT my president. Sorry you and so many others are so mislead, but it is people like you who voted for Obama and contributed to the mess our country is in today. All of you will have to hang your heads in shame when we no longer have a free America.


----------



## bane (Nov 27, 2012)

kittykatzmom said:


> As far as I am concerned the USA has been without a president since the Bush's left the White House. We have half black trash in there right now.


This is a shocking thing to say and post. Shame on you. :thumbdown: :thumbdown: :thumbdown:


----------



## raedean (Apr 25, 2011)

i myself have black grandchildren and hispanic grand children.i want the world to go well for their future.i was eager for an African-American president to be in office.
only he lost me.i did not vote for him cause of what i heard 
Reverend Wright curse America and President Obama had gone to his church for 20 yrs and he (Reverend Wright )was Obama's godfather to his children.
that is why i did not vote for him
but i have had hope.
actually u have to not believe half of what u read or see in the news...about anyone.
Obama will in the future probably go down as one of the best presidents cause thats how it is.
i think what hurts us is any President who is in office for more than one term.everyone pretty much is sick of them by the second term.
i am praying for Ben Carson to get in next...


----------



## Designer1234 (Aug 9, 2011)

MarilynKnits said:


> Racist!


one has finally admitted the truth instead of saying it has nothing to do with race. Sickening.


----------



## Cru (May 18, 2013)

Don't understand why the term 'racist' comes up, knowing how fair his Mother and her family were. Don't understand why he is called 'African' when he is only about 12% African.


----------



## fibermcgivver (Dec 18, 2012)

A lovely picture! I also love the pic of Bush ! and wife Barbara on the occasion of their anniversary! Love always makes for a beautiful photo op!


----------



## MarilynKnits (Aug 30, 2011)

kittykatzmom said:


> Obama is the one who disgusting! He hates America and could have cared less that police officers are being killed. HE IS NOT my president. Sorry you and so many others are so mislead, but it is people like you who voted for Obama and contributed to the mess our country is in today. All of you will have to hang your heads in shame when we no longer have a free America.


You display a level of ignorance and hatred that is difficult to exceed.


----------



## fibermcgivver (Dec 18, 2012)

Wow, haters gonna hate! I'm going to a knitting luncheon on Sunday with two liberals and 4 rabid Republicans; I love them anyway, even though they can put enough hate in the room to give me a migraine....


----------



## flitri (Jun 13, 2011)

MarilynKnits said:


> You display a level of ignorance and hatred that is difficult to exceed.


 :thumbup: :thumbup: :thumbup: 
I agree with you, Kittykatzmom has certainly come out with all claws sharpened, she lives up to her name. I deplore Racism.


----------



## TapestryArtist (Sep 4, 2013)

kittykatzmom said:


> Everyone has their own opinion. I will say this Obama is the WORST excuse for a president that America has ever had. His whole family is so disrespectful to the position that they hold. Michelle is the ugliest first lady I have ever seen. Some days you just can't fix ugly and this is one of those days!


Like you'd actually know. It's YOUR ugly that's showing. You like being mean, don't you?


----------



## rdmjazzy (Apr 20, 2011)

Looks like kittykatzmom is here to speak for the"birthers" and Republicans and the "south will rise again" racists.


----------



## MarilynKnits (Aug 30, 2011)

Cru said:


> Don't understand why the term 'racist' comes up, knowing how fair his Mother and her family were. Don't understand why he is called 'African' when he is only about 12% African.


The whole concept of hyphenated American escapes me. Are there African-French? African-Canadians? Portuguese-Brazilians? If we are citizens of the United States we are Americans. I am third generation, with one set of grandparents coming from Belarus and the other set Lithuania. I do not consider myself Belorussian-American or Lithuanian-American. My four grandparents were thrilled to be naturalized citizens and full fledged Americans. The only way I would be hyphenated is if I had dual citizenship, with the country where I spent the majority of my time coming first.


----------



## rocky1991 (May 8, 2011)

BJP said:


> However, he has also stated that our country is no longer a Christian country!


We have never been a Christian country.


----------



## rocky1991 (May 8, 2011)

lila ladue said:


> There are other pictures of him too. Not saluting the American flag, not placing his correct hand over his heart during our nationa anthem, bowing to Muslims. I could go on an on but don't want to make this a political discussion, GET INFORMED.


You first!


----------



## pattibe (Feb 2, 2012)

MarilynKnits said:


> The whole concept of hyphenated American escapes me. Are there African-French? African-Canadians? Portuguese-Brazilians? If we are citizens of the United States we are Americans. I am third generation, with one set of grandparents coming from Belarus and the other set Lithuania. I do not consider myself Belorussian-American or Lithuanian-American. My four grandparents were thrilled to be naturalized citizens and full fledged Americans. The only way I would be hyphenated is if I had dual citizenship, with the country where I spent the majority of my time coming first.


That is such a good point. You are absolutely spot on. We are all Americans....period!


----------



## rocky1991 (May 8, 2011)

pattibe said:


> That is such a good point. You are absolutely spot on. We are all Americans....period!


It's amazing how a picture could cause such hate and discontent. I am stunned.


----------



## rujam (Aug 19, 2011)

kittykatzmom said:


> As far as I am concerned the USA has been without a president since the Bush's left the White House. We have half black trash in there right now.


Not a very nice comment.


----------



## diana999 (Mar 24, 2011)

well your all going to hate me for this but he has to be or michelle will belt him hahahahaha


----------



## rocky1991 (May 8, 2011)

kittykatzmom said:


> As far as I am concerned the USA has been without a president since the Bush's left the White House. We have half black trash in there right now.


Oh dear.....no racism in this quote. remember when you point a finger, you have four pointing right back at you. Are you white trash?


----------



## MarilynKnits (Aug 30, 2011)

fibermcgivver said:


> A lovely picture! I also love the pic of Bush ! and wife Barbara on the occasion of their anniversary! Love always makes for a beautiful photo op!


ABC World News honored the senior Bush 70th wedding anniversary with a lovely image of them this evening. And a lovely tribute to Barbara from George. Although I am not a fan of either one politically, I admire them as a couple and their loving devotion to each other.


----------



## lins (Jan 8, 2013)

ElyseKnox said:


> Why is it people can agree with Obama but not disagree. I thought civilized public discussion was what helped to make our country great.
> 
> to which this reply is posted:
> 
> ...


You weren't disagreeing or agreeing about anything, you were just throwing in a cheap shot.


----------



## ute4kp (Nov 6, 2012)

This is for the people complaining about Obama's pictures. Your ignorance is showing. All presidents have a presidential photographer.

http://www.pbs.org/program/presidents-photographer/

I just noticed in the Koala pic that Putin was photobombing in the background. Hehehe.


----------



## rocky1991 (May 8, 2011)

kittykatzmom said:


> Good photo - op. Obama loves the camera!


Wow you are truly ugly.


----------



## rocky1991 (May 8, 2011)

kittykatzmom said:


> We are a nation of immigrants who came here to WORK and not just sponge off the taxpayers like the immigrants of today.


BS


----------



## collectordolls (Oct 27, 2013)

TapestryArtist said:


> Then don't make it your agenda to point out your politics. The man is beautiful, graceful, and has balls the size of grapefruit!


How do you know how big his grapefruits are. LOL


----------



## SAMkewel (Mar 5, 2011)

kittykatzmom said:


> We are a nation of immigrants who came here to WORK and not just sponge off the taxpayers like the immigrants of today.


Actually we are a nation of immigrants who originally stole this country from the Native Americans and Mexicans who lived here at the time we arrived. As a child, my small town was inundated with Mexican migrant farm workers who did the work, the hard way, that no Americans would deign to do. I don't know any of these immigrant spongers you speak of, and I worked as an ADC, Food Stamp, Medicaid worker before my retirement. I suspect these spongers are a figment of someone's imagination working overtime.


----------



## MarilynKnits (Aug 30, 2011)

diana999 said:


> well your all going to hate me for this but he has to be or michelle will belt him hahahahaha


Maybe Mr. Obama has the same philosophy of how to have a happy marriage as my sweetie. He tells people that the mantra of a happily married man is "Yes, Dear". Of course, he says it goes both ways, especially when each one follows the Golden Rule. It has worked for 57 years for us.


----------



## pattibe (Feb 2, 2012)

rocky1991 said:


> It's amazing how a picture could cause such hate and discontent. I am stunned.


You???? I am shocked and truly saddened that there is still so much ignorance in this country, rooted in racism and prejudice. Mr. Lincoln must be rolling over in his grave. It was just a picture of two beautiful people...a man elegantly helping his wife down a stair...just as my husband would do. Who would have thought the venom this post would bring out in some (not many) but some. I thought it would be fun to share such a lovely moment, but I guess I was wrong!


----------



## Jeanie L (Sep 27, 2011)

gordon000 said:


> Very lovely PICTURES!, Indeed!!


I agree!!


----------



## rocky1991 (May 8, 2011)

pattibe said:


> You???? I am shocked and truly saddened that there is still so much ignorance in this country, rooted in racism and prejudice. Mr. Lincoln must be rolling over in his grave. It was just a picture of two beautiful people...a man elegantly helping his wife down a stair...just as my husband would do. Who would have thought the venom this post would bring out in some (not many) but some. I thought it would be fun to share such a lovely moment, but I guess I was wrong!


I enjoyed it!


----------



## pattibe (Feb 2, 2012)

rocky1991 said:


> I enjoyed it!


Good...thank you.


----------



## ThaisFindsafeather (Nov 15, 2012)

pattibe said:


> Good...thank you.


Me too!


----------



## collectordolls (Oct 27, 2013)

nitnana said:


> Hadn't seen that picture - very lovely. Haven't seen them together much lately - since the man vaulted over the fence & got into The White House. Wonder if Secret Service is trying to keep them apart, as much as possible. Death threats, maybe?? Hope we hear as much criticism of a Republican president (in the past or future) as we have of this Democratic one. God Bless America! :thumbup:


First off I agree God Bless America and are you really going to tell me that you never heard any criticism about President Bush. The Democrates made a laughing stock out of him and no one said anything about disrespecting the office of the President. Also how come if anyone says anything bad against President Obama it is considered racism but how can that be he is white as well as black but for some reason everyone forgets about that. But back to the picture it really is a lovely picture of the First Couple


----------



## Ann DeGray (May 11, 2011)

SAMkewel said:


> Geez, I have to take issue with this. I'm a progressive, I do not go to, nor have I ever gone to that forum, I do not call anyone names, and I grew up a long time ago. I understand heated statements, but Geez.


If you have not gone to that forum you really don't know how nasty some of the forum members can get. I have only clicked on it twice but I was appalled at what was said.

Please do click on it and then get back to us and tell us if that's what you call "progressive". I don't think it is.


----------



## lins (Jan 8, 2013)

kittykatzmom said:


> Everyone has their own opinion. I will say this Obama is the WORST excuse for a president that America has ever had. His whole family is so disrespectful to the position that they hold. Michelle is the ugliest first lady I have ever seen. Some days you just can't fix ugly and this is one of those days!


Ugly words!!! Talking about peoples looks...ugly words. You must be gorgeous and perfect to be able to say such nasty, nasty things. But people like you are really unattractive, so I doubt it.


----------



## jaa520 (Apr 16, 2013)

Totally with Lins


----------



## Nussa (Jul 7, 2011)

justinjared said:


> I am so proud and happy to see a positive comment about the president and his wife!!!! I am of African descent in Canada since the American revolution. we have too few rolemodels for our children. I am so proud of Obama and my kids ans grandkids are as well. I thank you.


 :thumbup: :thumbup: :thumbup:


----------



## cookiequeen (Jun 15, 2011)

MarilynKnits said:


> What a disagreeable comment. Fine to disagree with the president's performance in office. At least he does not surround himself with the sorts of thugs who lie to start wars or break into private property.
> 
> His wife is a charming, well groomed, good looking woman whose First Lady project is to promote the health of young people through nutrition education. Beats redecorating the White House or buying new mega-buck expensive dishes for the place.
> 
> ...


 :thumbup: :thumbup: :thumbup: :thumbup: :thumbup:


----------



## Ann DeGray (May 11, 2011)

kittykatzmom said:


> Everyone has their own opinion. I will say this Obama is the WORST excuse for a president that America has ever had. His whole family is so disrespectful to the position that they hold. Michelle is the ugliest first lady I have ever seen. Some days you just can't fix ugly and this is one of those days!


Beauty on the outside is only skin deep.

UGLY, on the inside, goes clear to the bone.


----------



## Nussa (Jul 7, 2011)

You neglected to add that this is in "Your HUMBLE Opinion" 
And In MHO, you seem to be a bitter unhappy person. I wish you happiness in the new year.... GBY.



kittykatzmom said:


> Everyone has their own opinion. I will say this Obama is the WORST excuse for a president that America has ever had. His whole family is so disrespectful to the position that they hold. Michelle is the ugliest first lady I have ever seen. Some days you just can't fix ugly and this is one of those days!


----------



## pattibe (Feb 2, 2012)

Nussa said:


> You neglected to add that this is in "Your HUMBLE Opinion"
> And In MHO, you seem to be a bitter unhappy person. I wish you happiness in the new year.... GBY.


 :thumbup: IMHO


----------



## grandmatimestwo (Mar 30, 2011)

Lovely photo.


----------



## NJG (Dec 2, 2011)

Ann DeGray said:


> If you have not gone to that forum you really don't know how nasty some of the forum members can get. I have only clicked on it twice but I was appalled at what was said.
> 
> Please do click on it and then get back to us and tell us if that's what you call "progressive". I don't think it is.


Don't forget the conservative forum of denim and pearls. You need to see what all those Christians have to say.


----------



## Ontario Silk (Feb 16, 2014)

SQM said:


> Does your husband have a brother? It is fine that he is gentile.


Sorry he is the only son in a large family of girls.LOL


----------



## dagmargrubaugh (May 10, 2011)

ThaisFindsafeather said:


> Me too!


So did I.


----------



## Dori Sage (Feb 7, 2011)

SQM said:


> You are disgusting.
> 
> List all the other people you dislike.
> 
> "Katz"??? German???? Hmmm!


kittykatzmom wrote:
As far as I am concerned the USA has been without a president since the Bush's left the White House. We have half black trash in there right now.

And there you have it folks. Racism right in our face. Would they be trash if they weren't black?


----------



## Heartseas (Aug 30, 2011)

kittykatzmom said:


> As far as I am concerned the USA has been without a president since the Bush's left the White House. We have half black trash in there right now.


Well..... I am not American but I have read nearly all of these posts and this one is the worst. No matter what your politics there is no need to post racist remarks. One thing i hate is racism. I think the photographs are lovely


----------



## cspaen34 (Jan 28, 2011)

pattibe said:


> You???? I am shocked and truly saddened that there is still so much ignorance in this country, rooted in racism and prejudice. Mr. Lincoln must be rolling over in his grave. It was just a picture of two beautiful people...a man elegantly helping his wife down a stair...just as my husband would do. Who would have thought the venom this post would bring out in some (not many) but some. I thought it would be fun to share such a lovely moment, but I guess I was wrong!


No, you were not wrong. It is a beautiful picture and the play of light on the subjects is fantastic photography...it displays great emotion. As for the ugly comments originating from the southern part of my state, it is so sad for someone to be so full of hate.


----------



## lins (Jan 8, 2013)

Dori Sage said:


> kittykatzmom wrote:
> As far as I am concerned the USA has been without a president since the Bush's left the White House. We have half black trash in there right now.
> 
> And there you have it folks. Racism right in our face. Would they be trash if they weren't black?


Very sad. Very sad indeed.


----------



## lins (Jan 8, 2013)

Ann DeGray said:


> Beauty on the outside is only skin deep.
> 
> UGLY, on the inside, goes clear to the bone.


 :thumbup: :thumbup: :thumbup:


----------



## pattibe (Feb 2, 2012)

cspaen34 said:


> No, you were not wrong. It is a beautiful picture and the play of light on the subjects is fantastic photography...it displays great emotion. As for the ugly comments originating from the southern part of my state, it is so sad for someone to be so full of hate.


 :thumbup: :thumbup: :thumbup: :thumbup: :thumbup:


----------



## alfief (Nov 11, 2014)

Heartseas said:


> Well..... I am not American but I have read nearly all of these posts and this one is the worst. No matter what your politics there is no need to post racist remarks. One thing i hate is racism. I think the photographs are lovely


Right there with you Heartsease. I cant believe some of these comments!


----------



## alwaysforyou (Dec 6, 2011)

pattibe said:


> You???? I am shocked and truly saddened that there is still so much ignorance in this country, rooted in racism and prejudice. Mr. Lincoln must be rolling over in his grave. It was just a picture of two beautiful people...a man elegantly helping his wife down a stair...just as my husband would do. Who would have thought the venom this post would bring out in some (not many) but some. I thought it would be fun to share such a lovely moment, but I guess I was wrong!


Pattibe, I'm glad you posted, and I enjoyed seeing the pictures. For the most part, there are more ...many more nice, positive, kind and thoughtful people on this forum. The few folks who fail to hold off on their negativity and hatefulness also have me shaking my head. Having a different opinion doesn't need to digress to name calling and finger pointing. There is always the option of stepping out of the conversation or just ignoring a topic if someone doesn't have a constructive or nice thing to say. Lynn


----------



## pattibe (Feb 2, 2012)

alwaysforyou said:


> Pattibe, I'm glad you posted, and I enjoyed seeing the pictures. For the most part, there are more ...many more nice, positive, kind and thoughtful people on this forum. The few folks who fail to hold off on their negativity and hatefulness also have me shaking my head. Having a different opinion doesn't need to digress to name calling and finger pointing. There is always the option of stepping out of the conversation or just ignoring a topic if someone doesn't have a constructive or nice thing to say. Lynn


Lynn, you are so right.


----------



## dagmargrubaugh (May 10, 2011)

KennethMurrey said:


> Well, in some ways it brings to light just how unreasonable and baseless much of their criticism is of Obama.
> 
> It's why their criticism of him in other matters can not be taken seriously because if they see such a beautiful picture and all they can see is ugly .... you can be sure that's how they "reason" when they're considering his political decisions.
> 
> ...


Well said.


----------



## rocky1991 (May 8, 2011)

collectordolls said:


> First off I agree God Bless America and are you really going to tell me that you never heard any criticism about President Bush. The Democrates made a laughing stock out of him and no one said anything about disrespecting the office of the President. Also how come if anyone says anything bad against President Obama it is considered racism but how can that be he is white as well as black but for some reason everyone forgets about that. But back to the picture it really is a lovely picture of the First Couple


I suppose it's what and why they are saying it. Criticize his policies with good reason and maybe people will listen. Give suggestions for improvement, but this carte blanche of negativity is wearing. To say that he hates this country without proof is valueless. To say that he is the cause of all our problems is ridiculous. Our economy is improving, unemployment is coming back, albeit slowly, corporations are richer than ever, the rich are richer, the middle class suffers because of the corporate policies, but on the whole life is better than 6 years ago. However, we shall all now se what the new Congress has in store for all of us. I feel lots of negativity. I hope I am wrong.


----------



## suzhuz (Jan 16, 2013)

Love the picture. Haven't seen it before. Admire our president as well.


----------



## Alcyone (May 23, 2012)

Thanks pattibe! Beautiful photos of a beautiful couple who happen to be the First Lady and President of the USA.
I've read all the replies that were positive, and tried to avoid all the hateful comments.I am disgusted with the Obama haters.


----------



## bellestarr12 (Mar 26, 2011)

Dori Sage said:


> So I haven't read 14 pages, and I hope no one takes offense, but this country is not and never was a "Christian" country. Church and state are separate. This country is a democracy and everyone is free to follow their choice of religion or no religion at all.


Amen!


----------



## pattibe (Feb 2, 2012)

KennethMurrey said:


> Well, in some ways it brings to light just how unreasonable and baseless much of their criticism is of Obama.
> 
> It's why their criticism of him in other matters can not be taken seriously because if they see such a beautiful picture and all they can see is ugly .... you can be sure that's how they "reason" when they're considering his political decisions.
> 
> ...


Kenneth: I absolutely LOVE your Avatar!!!!!


----------



## pattibe (Feb 2, 2012)

Alcyone said:


> Thanks pattibe! Beautiful photos of a beautiful couple who happen to be the First Lady and President of the USA.
> I've read all the replies that were positive, and tried to avoid all the hateful comments.I am disgusted with the Obama haters.


Thank you. Positive people make positive comments. Thank you for yours!


----------



## bellestarr12 (Mar 26, 2011)

train said:


> I like the Pope, and I'm not catholic!


Me too!


----------



## bellestarr12 (Mar 26, 2011)

kittykatzmom said:


> As far as I am concerned the USA has been without a president since the Bush's left the White House. We have half black trash in there right now.


You should be ashamed of yourself - but I know you won't be. Such ignorance and racism are disgraceful, and explain why so many people in other countries have such low opinions of Americans. Fortunately, President Obama has, at least to some extent, repaired our reputation.


----------



## lins (Jan 8, 2013)

bellestarr12 said:


> Me too!


Me too!! :thumbup:


----------



## Damama (Oct 2, 2011)

I love it too!


----------



## Damama (Oct 2, 2011)

hilltopper said:


> pattibe - another very pretty photo! Thanks for sharing.


 :thumbup: :thumbup: :thumbup:


----------



## Damama (Oct 2, 2011)

Designer1234 said:


> needless to say, we knew there would be a group who find it impossible to say anything good about him. He is a good father, a good husband and if he had ever been given a chance he would have accomplisted much more. When huge road blocks are placed in his way before he even was elected it is pretty hard to deal with it. I feel sad for him as he can't answer back to the nasty dreadful things said about him.
> 
> I don't know if he would have been a good President if the opposition had tried to help with some of his plans instead of making sure that everything that could possibly done to stop every action they could - he was never given a chance. I think he did very well considering the attacks to his wife, children and every thing he tried to do. jmo. He seems to be a graceful, fine man in my opinion- I don't think he did too badly looking at it as a Canadian who is very interested in the US Political system.


Thank you


----------



## Damama (Oct 2, 2011)

Designer1234 said:


> I agree - the world is watching and reading the posts and following the news including Fox. It is sad in my opinion. I have always liked Americans and I especially like the grace and love shared by that family. I Feel sorry for him. I am not talking about his politics I am talking about him as a person.
> What other President has been treated the same way that he has. Nothing is ever acknowledged by those who dislike and even hate him. He is ridiculed and his family has been ridiculed. I Think it is very very sad and I will always admire how he has acted - not returning the insults but respecting his Position as the President. I just happen to think they might get a surprise. Others in the world admire him. NOt all but many many people and countries. He is Grace under fire -- he comes across as kind and patient. His family is wonderfully close and loving.


 :thumbup: :thumbup: :thumbup:


----------



## Damama (Oct 2, 2011)

LizAnne said:


> I agree with Designer1234 completely. President Obama is a gentleman and his wife is a true lady. Their girls set a wonderful example as first children. There have been many pictures of them that are wonderful. It's embarassing to me how he has been treated. Other countries admire and respect him.


 :thumbup:


----------



## ELareau (Nov 4, 2012)

When I clicked on the subject, and saw the pic (which I liked), I immediately wondered how long it would take this thread to deteriorate into an "I hate Obama" thread. No surprise that I didn't even get half way down the first page.

I'm certainly not going to read 24 more pages of raving right-wingers.


----------



## alifletcher (Jun 8, 2012)

Love it too. Thank you for sharing


----------



## alifletcher (Jun 8, 2012)

You need to get informed !


----------



## Nussa (Jul 7, 2011)

You are so right, and isn't that an ugly truth? And the scary thing is these are the same kind of people who want to run our country with their racist, and self righteous attitudes. They seem to be completely devoid of any common sense. Heaven help us all.... JMHO!



KennethMurrey said:


> Well, in some ways it brings to light just how unreasonable and baseless much of their criticism is of Obama.
> 
> It's why their criticism of him in other matters can not be taken seriously because if they see such a beautiful picture and all they can see is ugly .... you can be sure that's how they "reason" when they're considering his political decisions.
> 
> ...


----------



## alifletcher (Jun 8, 2012)

I like that. He is Grace under Fire !


----------



## Charlotte80 (Jan 24, 2011)

For the people who object tothis statment it is in General Chit-Chat where things other than knitting or other crafts can be discussed.


----------



## Knitted by Nan (Aug 3, 2013)

:thumbup: :thumbup: :thumbup: :thumbup: Thank you for posting. It is really great to see someone posting something positive about your President. Many of us here in Oz have a great deal of respect for this man.


----------



## Knitted by Nan (Aug 3, 2013)

hilltopper said:


> Well, that has little to do with the photograph posted.


 :thumbup: I agree.


----------



## Knitted by Nan (Aug 3, 2013)

:thumbup:


----------



## Knitted by Nan (Aug 3, 2013)

pattibe said:


> Ya know, I was just posting a beauiful picture of our President and First Lady. I did not mean to make this a political or religious forum. I should have added "hate mongers need not reply."


Even us Aussies are happy to have their photo taken with your President. :thumbup:


----------



## Knitted by Nan (Aug 3, 2013)

Designer1234 said:


> needless to say, we knew there would be a group who find it impossible to say anything good about him. He is a good father, a good husband and if he had ever been given a chance he would have accomplisted much more. When huge road blocks are placed in his way before he even was elected it is pretty hard to deal with it. I feel sad for him as he can't answer back to the nasty dreadful things said about him.
> 
> I don't know if he would have been a good President if the opposition had tried to help with some of his plans instead of making sure that everything that could possibly done to stop every action they could - he was never given a chance. I think he did very well considering the attacks to his wife, children and every thing he tried to do. jmo. He seems to be a graceful, fine man in my opinion- I don't think he did too badly looking at it as a Canadian who is very interested in the US Political system.


 :thumbup:


----------



## Knitted by Nan (Aug 3, 2013)

Designer1234 said:


> I agree - the world is watching and reading the posts and following the news including Fox. It is sad in my opinion. I have always liked Americans and I especially like the grace and love shared by that family. I Feel sorry for him. I am not talking about his politics I am talking about him as a person.
> What other President has been treated the same way that he has. Nothing is ever acknowledged by those who dislike and even hate him. He is ridiculed and his family has been ridiculed. I Think it is very very sad and I will always admire how he has acted - not returning the insults but respecting his Position as the President. I just happen to think they might get a surprise. Others in the world admire him. NOt all but many many people and countries. He is Grace under fire -- he comes across as kind and patient. His family is wonderfully close and loving.


A lot of Aussies love him. :thumbup:


----------



## Xay-Zays.auntie (Aug 26, 2013)

Thank you all for posting so many lovely pictures.. the first one looks like a fairy tale


----------



## Knitted by Nan (Aug 3, 2013)

RitaM13 said:


> One word:
> 
> B-A-R-F


 :thumbdown: :thumbdown:


----------



## Knitted by Nan (Aug 3, 2013)

bonib said:


> This has nothing to do with knitting----HELLO!!!!😡


Yes, hello to you also. This thread is called 'general chit-chatt, non knitting talk', I wonder what that means then???? :thumbdown: :thumbdown: :thumbdown:


----------



## Knitted by Nan (Aug 3, 2013)

ginnyinnr said:


> How do you know they are a happy couple? We have no idea how many takes of that pose were taken before the photographers were happy. And there is no way you can read into the photo, if this is about the photo, that they are happy, that he has family values etc. I suggest quitting the subject.
> Whats next, pictures of Hillary Clinton and Bill Clinton?


 :thumbdown:


----------



## SAMkewel (Mar 5, 2011)

Ann DeGray said:


> If you have not gone to that forum you really don't know how nasty some of the forum members can get. I have only clicked on it twice but I was appalled at what was said.
> 
> Please do click on it and then get back to us and tell us if that's what you call "progressive". I don't think it is.


Ann, I really don't want to click on it. My point wasn't that all progressives are nice people, only that not all progressives use appalling language. No doubt some of us are more extreme than others. I've been on a good number of political discussions on this forum, and there are always some on both sides, conservative and progressive, that get carried away. I don't think that name calling and nasty language prove anyone's point and do just the opposite if their point is to convince anyone of anything, so I'll take your word for it that it gets nasty. I'll pass. Life can be nasty enough without seeking out something I know I won't like on either side of the fence.


----------



## Knitted by Nan (Aug 3, 2013)

Hazel Blumberg - McKee said:


> THANK YOU !!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!
> 
> Hazel


The rules were altered some time ago and political discussions are allowed.


----------



## SAMkewel (Mar 5, 2011)

ELareau said:


> When I clicked on the subject, and saw the pic (which I liked), I immediately wondered how long it would take this thread to deteriorate into an "I hate Obama" thread. No surprise that I didn't even get half way down the first page.
> 
> I'm certainly not going to read 24 more pages of raving right-wingers.


Some of us are left-wingers, but I try not to rave ;~D. I enjoyed the pictures, too, and admire anyone who can remain positive and in control in face of what Barack Obama has had to endure. I don't know how he does it.


----------



## Knitted by Nan (Aug 3, 2013)

Tokyoal said:


> To Mcguire - you "heard" Michelle was going to leave him? I have heard that he is gay, a Muslim, born in Kenya, etc., etc., etc. You really need to vet what you read. Not everything on the internet or Fox "News" is the truth.


There is even a web site that will tell you that Michelle is actually a Michael, yes a guy. It will walk you through, from the angle of her jaw, the width of her shoulders, the shape of her hands. No it does not show the crown jewels. There is also a site that is supposed to show the President marrying a guy. No matter what idea you want to push there will be a site out there, complete with physical, biological, medical, ethical, etc proof. So it is not 'buyer beware' but 'reader beware'. Not everything you read on the net is accurate or even correct.


----------



## grandmann (Feb 4, 2011)

alwaysforyou said:


> I hadn't seen that picture, but I've always admired how much they seem to love and respect each other and their children. Great picture! Lynn


 :thumbup: :thumbup: :thumbup:


----------



## Knitted by Nan (Aug 3, 2013)

TapestryArtist said:


> Then don't make it your agenda to point out your politics. The man is beautiful, graceful, and has balls the size of grapefruit!


And you know this fact from carrying out in depth research, you have actually seen that he 'has balls the size of grapefruit!'??????? And exactly what has this fact to do with him being elected as the President of the USA - twice?


----------



## judeanne (Mar 6, 2011)

Yes, Elyse. Well stated and I agree.


----------



## Knitted by Nan (Aug 3, 2013)

SQM said:


> And the German.


I must have missed that post, my computer seems to have put a lockout on posts from some people. :XD:


----------



## Knitted by Nan (Aug 3, 2013)

pattibe said:


> And now, by popular demand and for your viewing pleasure, i give you our President in a tiara.


 :thumbup: :thumbup:


----------



## Marly (Dec 5, 2012)

SAMkewel said:


> If you look at the heading of this particular section of the forum, you will see that it is "General Chit-Chat (non-knitting talk)". Perhaps you could just skip this section and then you won't be upset. Politics, religion, or any other subject are fair game here.


I think the pictures are lovely. 3 things you should never discuss is religion, politics and sex. As a Canadian I am happy the Americans are our neighbours. Any President of the U.S. has a tough road ahead of them, not an easy task to do and have everyones approval, we have the same problems here in Canada, you can't please everyone. Marly


----------



## sudik (Dec 7, 2013)

You can't fix ugly seems to be a reference to yourself.


----------



## sudik (Dec 7, 2013)

kittykatzmom said:


> As far as I am concerned the USA has been without a president since the Bush's left the White House. We have half black trash in there right now.


You are truly a hateful person. I feel sorry for you.


----------



## Knitted by Nan (Aug 3, 2013)

kittykatzmom said:


> Everyone has their own opinion. I will say this Obama is the WORST excuse for a president that America has ever had. His whole family is so disrespectful to the position that they hold. Michelle is the ugliest first lady I have ever seen. Some days you just can't fix ugly and this is one of those days!


 :thumbdown: :thumbdown: :thumbdown: :thumbdown: :thumbdown: :thumbdown:


----------



## Nussa (Jul 7, 2011)

sudik said:


> You are truly a hateful person. I feel sorry for you.


 :thumbup:


----------



## Marly (Dec 5, 2012)

kittykatzmom said:


> Obama is the one who disgusting! He hates America and could have cared less that police officers are being killed. HE IS NOT my president. Sorry you and so many others are so mislead, but it is people like you who voted for Obama and contributed to the mess our country is in today. All of you will have to hang your heads in shame when we no longer have a free America.


Police officers are being killed because all Americans can carry guns and if I were a police officer I would shoot to kill before I got shot first. Marly


----------



## Knitted by Nan (Aug 3, 2013)

kittykatzmom said:


> As far as I am concerned the USA has been without a president since the Bush's left the White House. We have half black trash in there right now.


This is a very nasty racial slur. I think this remark should be reported to authorities. You are lucky you do not live in Australia because if you did then the remark would be considered a racial slur and your comments would be reported to the Australian Human Rights Commission. Do you not have a Racial Discrimination Act in the USA?


----------



## Knitted by Nan (Aug 3, 2013)

MarilynKnits said:


> You display a level of ignorance and hatred that is difficult to exceed.


Has anyone reported this poster for making racial slurs?


----------



## rujam (Aug 19, 2011)

EveMCooke said:


> Has anyone reported this poster for making racial slurs?


Yes


----------



## Knitted by Nan (Aug 3, 2013)

ute4kp said:


> This is for the people complaining about Obama's pictures. Your ignorance is showing. All presidents have a presidential photographer.
> 
> http://www.pbs.org/program/presidents-photographer/
> 
> I just noticed in the Koala pic that Putin was photobombing in the background. Hehehe.


Nah, he is just waiting in line to have his photo taken with one of our 'drop bears'. Shh, I don't think anyone warned him that the Koalas have a nasty habit of piddling on people who hold them. One famous international politician experienced that some years ago, I cannot remember who it was though.


----------



## Wombatnomore (Dec 9, 2013)

pattibe said:


> I love this picture of President Obama. He is such a gentleman.


That he is. It's a lovely picture.


----------



## Wombatnomore (Dec 9, 2013)

pattibe said:


> EXACTLY. Why can't people show a little respect for the President. I know why, but I am NOT going to make this political. It s just a beautiful picture...as is this one


Where are you getting those gorgeous pictures from?


----------



## anjoda (Mar 9, 2013)

What particular "lack" in his leadership are you appalled at:

1. His initial bailout of the U.S. economy that has since rebounded so that the DOW which was at 7,000 when he took office is not over 17,000.
2. That his rescue of the auto industry saved thousands of jobs, the loans and interest have all been fully repaid, and we now have a thriving industry.
3. That his health care program has allowed thousands of young people to stay on their parents plan, extended health care to thousands so that they will no longer suffer financial ruin, so that many thousands will no longer be thrown off their plan because of pre-existing condition. Medicade is expanded so that children can see a doctor & get their shots.
4. The unemployment rate has gone down not to the 6% that Romney promised but to 5.8%.
5. Putin & Russia are both in a downward spiral, and not a shot has been fired. 
6. Immigration is finally being dealt with, even if the Republicans wont.
7. The failed policies of 50 years towards Cuba are being re-examined.

I could keep going, but I really would like to know which one of these you think "appalled" you.

This president is a genius. I too am a Canadian living in the U.S. and think that the Americans are lucky to have him in the White House.
Jean


----------



## Wombatnomore (Dec 9, 2013)

hilltopper said:


> And thank you for that information Sine. I certainly agree about Pete Souza's eye. Probably both of them.


 :XD: :XD: :XD:


----------



## Wombatnomore (Dec 9, 2013)

pattibe said:


> Ya know, I was just posting a beauiful picture of our President and First Lady. I did not mean to make this a political or religious forum. I should have added "hate mongers need not reply."


President Obama with Koala - Australian connection!


----------



## pattibe (Feb 2, 2012)

EveMCooke said:


> Has anyone reported this poster for making racial slurs?


I did


----------



## sudik (Dec 7, 2013)

anjoda said:


> What particular "lack" in his leadership are you appalled at:
> 
> 1. His initial bailout of the U.S. economy that has since rebounded so that the DOW which was at 7,000 when he took office is not over 17,000.
> 2. That his rescue of the auto industry saved thousands of jobs, the loans and interest have all been fully repaid, and we now have a thriving industry.
> ...


 :thumbup: :thumbup: :thumbup: :thumbup: :thumbup: :thumbup: :thumbup: :thumbup: :thumbup:


----------



## Nussa (Jul 7, 2011)

anjoda said:


> What particular "lack" in his leadership are you appalled at:
> 
> 1. His initial bailout of the U.S. economy that has since rebounded so that the DOW which was at 7,000 when he took office is not over 17,000.
> 2. That his rescue of the auto industry saved thousands of jobs, the loans and interest have all been fully repaid, and we now have a thriving industry.
> ...


 :thumbup: :thumbup: :thumbup: :thumbup: :thumbup:


----------



## Nussa (Jul 7, 2011)

pattibe said:


> I did


 :thumbup: :thumbup: :thumbup: :thumbup: :thumbup: :thumbup: :thumbup: :thumbup: :thumbup: :thumbup:


----------



## ute4kp (Nov 6, 2012)

joeysomma said:


> You are so wrong!. Me thinks you need to go back to school and study the documents, Federalist Papers, written by the Founding Fathers. You will find the Christian Heritage of the Founding Fathers is all over those documents. There was no separation of church and state until the middle of the 20th century, when a very liberal Supreme Court took a letter written by Thomas Jefferson to the Danbury Baptists and stated there should be a "wall of separation." Jefferson was referring to the government should stay out of the church and not the church should stay out of government. There is nothing about the separation in the Constitution. Then we are *NOT* a Democracy. We are a Constitutional Republic. You need to be thankful that we are not a Democracy.
> 
> I'm sad to say that since the Liberals have taken control of the government,, and control of the schools, the true history of our nation is no longer being taught. You will need to go back to text books printed before the 1950's to read what our children and grandchildren should learn about the founding of our nation. The early schools were founded for the purpose of learning to read, so people could read the Bible. The Ivy League schools had seminaries. As late as 1949, Texas published textbooks to study the Bible in the "Public Schools." When Prayer and the Bible were removed from public schools, the quality of education started to go downhill and it is still falling.
> 
> We are no longer* free* to follow our religion. If we were, no one would be forced to bake a gay wedding cake or be sued. Or to print T-shirts for a gay pride parade, take pictures of a gay wedding, or drive a fire truck in a gay parade, or to pay for health insurance that includes abortion. We would not have to fear the PC police, that what we say might offend someone. We would not have to fight to save a war memorial that has been in place for 60 years because the cross on the memorial has offended someone. Or remove a picture in a school with two children with their hands together in front of a flag; because someone thinks they are praying. And that is offensive.


Too many half thruths.


----------



## PaKnitter (Mar 7, 2011)

pattibe said:


> I did


A long time ago Admn. told me the members can say anything in chit-chat. I strongly disagree with freedom of speech trumping name calling. 
It is the reason I am not overly involved in the forum anymore. 
And I find Admn. to be partly responsible for the few who can't behave.

Pattibe...your cat is beautiful. I have one who is similar. Her name is Sweet Sassy. Her previous owner had to give her away and we were third in line asking for her. Being strangers and the other two a co-worker and a friend of a friend I had little hope she would be our's to love but it happened.


----------



## emuears (Oct 13, 2012)

He was game cuddling the Koala, they can be a bit nasty and look at those claws LOL


----------



## PaKnitter (Mar 7, 2011)

emuears said:


> He was game cuddling the Koala, they can be a bit nasty and look at those claws LOL


Kind of like some of the KP members...looks sweet but watch out for the claws and nastiness.


----------



## MarilynKnits (Aug 30, 2011)

NJG said:


> Don't forget the conservative forum of denim and pearls. You need to see what all those Christians have to say.


Just don't eat anything with cream cheese first. Hard to hold down food after reading some of the comments. I was curious and looked many many weeks ago and decided never to go back. Don't know whether some of the folks there are still as nasty on denim and pearls, but when they visit LOLL there are a couple who are so miserably unpleasant they poison the air around them. It is a free country where we are all able to speak our minds, and it is a revelation as to how dark and venomous some minds are.


----------



## Wombatnomore (Dec 9, 2013)

ElyseKnox said:


> The topic is what we make it with our comments. A photo of the Obamas is inherently political and when people respond, they are going to respond based on their politics and opinion of him AND what he has done while in office--from both sides.


They're beautiful photos of a high profile couple for crying out loud! Are you unable to appreciate beauty for beauty's sake?


----------



## Wombatnomore (Dec 9, 2013)

bonib said:


> This has nothing to do with knitting----HELLO!!!!😡


Then go to the Main section. HELLO!!!


----------



## Wombatnomore (Dec 9, 2013)

pattibe said:


> And now, by popular demand and for your viewing pleasure, i give you our President in a tiara.


He is a good looking rooster!


----------



## MarilynKnits (Aug 30, 2011)

Xay-Zays.auntie said:


> Thank you all for posting so many lovely pictures.. the first one looks like a fairy tale


And the one with the Brownie Scouts and the tiaras is absolutely adorable. You can tell this man is a wonderful daddy to his own little girls, and the genuine happiness on the faces of the children bespeaks the goodness of the man which children recognize.


----------



## MarilynKnits (Aug 30, 2011)

anjoda said:


> What particular "lack" in his leadership are you appalled at:
> 
> 1. His initial bailout of the U.S. economy that has since rebounded so that the DOW which was at 7,000 when he took office is not over 17,000.
> 2. That his rescue of the auto industry saved thousands of jobs, the loans and interest have all been fully repaid, and we now have a thriving industry.
> ...


You will probably not hear back from the Obama bashers. They are doubtless in hospital after suffering apoplectic seizures. They really have no ammunition to respond to factual information in kind.


----------



## vokland (Oct 25, 2014)

Again a reminder to readers, this part of the forum is for NON-KNITTING remarks, etc. so the picture of our President is perfectly legal. Also, it is not political because he is not running for office. Thanks.


----------



## MarilynKnits (Aug 30, 2011)

joeysomma said:


> You are so wrong!. Me thinks you need to go back to school and study the documents, Federalist Papers, written by the Founding Fathers. You will find the Christian Heritage of the Founding Fathers is all over those documents. There was no separation of church and state until the middle of the 20th century, when a very liberal Supreme Court took a letter written by Thomas Jefferson to the Danbury Baptists and stated there should be a "wall of separation." Jefferson was referring to the government should stay out of the church and not the church should stay out of government. There is nothing about the separation in the Constitution. Then we are *NOT* a Democracy. We are a Constitutional Republic. You need to be thankful that we are not a Democracy.
> 
> I'm sad to say that since the Liberals have taken control of the government,, and control of the schools, the true history of our nation is no longer being taught. You will need to go back to text books printed before the 1950's to read what our children and grandchildren should learn about the founding of our nation. The early schools were founded for the purpose of learning to read, so people could read the Bible. The Ivy League schools had seminaries. As late as 1949, Texas published textbooks to study the Bible in the "Public Schools." When Prayer and the Bible were removed from public schools, the quality of education started to go downhill and it is still falling.
> 
> We are no longer* free* to follow our religion. If we were, no one would be forced to bake a gay wedding cake or be sued. Or to print T-shirts for a gay pride parade, take pictures of a gay wedding, or drive a fire truck in a gay parade, or to pay for health insurance that includes abortion. We would not have to fear the PC police, that what we say might offend someone. We would not have to fight to save a war memorial that has been in place for 60 years because the cross on the memorial has offended someone. Or remove a picture in a school with two children with their hands together in front of a flag; because someone thinks they are praying. And that is offensive.


Conversely, from your comments, you would suppress the rights of people who do not practice your choice of Christianity to practice their faith? You would force your version of Christianity upon all the people? What would you do to gay, bi, or transgender people? What would you do to Jews, Muslims, Sikhs, Hindus, Atheists, et al.? Would you invoke your version of the Inquisition?

You who claim to love Jesus, how can you? He was a practicing Jew! He preached love and understanding, not the hatred you and some of your friends espouse.

It was Saul and Simon, his associates, who started the movement to deify him and became Paul and Peter. It would be interesting to know their real agenda and their real attitude toward him.


----------



## susanmos2000 (May 10, 2011)

joeysomma said:


> You are so wrong!. Me thinks you need to go back to school and study the documents, Federalist Papers, written by the Founding Fathers. You will find the Christian Heritage of the Founding Fathers is all over those documents. There was no separation of church and state until the middle of the 20th century, when a very liberal Supreme Court took a letter written by Thomas Jefferson to the Danbury Baptists and stated there should be a "wall of separation." Jefferson was referring to the government should stay out of the church and not the church should stay out of government. There is nothing about the separation in the Constitution. Then we are *NOT* a Democracy. We are a Constitutional Republic. You need to be thankful that we are not a Democracy.
> 
> I'm sad to say that since the Liberals have taken control of the government,, and control of the schools, the true history of our nation is no longer being taught. You will need to go back to text books printed before the 1950's to read what our children and grandchildren should learn about the founding of our nation. The early schools were founded for the purpose of learning to read, so people could read the Bible. The Ivy League schools had seminaries. As late as 1949, Texas published textbooks to study the Bible in the "Public Schools." When Prayer and the Bible were removed from public schools, the quality of education started to go downhill and it is still falling.


Ah yes, pre-50s America, the Golden Age...when Southern schoolchildren would study the Bible each morning and then attend a lynching in the afternoon. I fail to see how Bible study (the Christian Protestant Bible, of course) had any positive effect on national life. Then, as now, Christ's teachings on love and compassion went in one ear and out the other.


----------



## alifletcher (Jun 8, 2012)

kittykatzmon, you are a bigot and a racist. Its people like you that prevent this country from moving forward. Remember what goes around comes around !


----------



## ElyseKnox (Sep 16, 2011)

While this comment may not be 'respectful', the only slur that I can see is not racial--it is the word 'trash.' BHO claims black blood so why is it a slur to concur with him?



EveMCooke said:


> Has anyone reported this poster for making racial slurs?


----------



## misellen (Mar 8, 2013)

SAMkewel said:


> I continue to be amazed at the amount of hatred aimed at this president given that he has done far less than many other presidents to bring it about. There must be another reason???


And to find the "other reason" you have only to look at him. The hatred has little to do with his politics.


----------



## misellen (Mar 8, 2013)

NJG said:


> Yes I really want you to be specific. What has he done to our country?


 :thumbup: me too


----------



## misellen (Mar 8, 2013)

pattibe said:


> You???? I am shocked and truly saddened that there is still so much ignorance in this country, rooted in racism and prejudice. Mr. Lincoln must be rolling over in his grave. It was just a picture of two beautiful people...a man elegantly helping his wife down a stair...just as my husband would do. Who would have thought the venom this post would bring out in some (not many) but some. I thought it would be fun to share such a lovely moment, but I guess I was wrong!


You were not wrong. It is a beautiful, elegant picture. I am happy to see some gracious elegance brought to the white house.


----------



## misellen (Mar 8, 2013)

anjoda said:


> What particular "lack" in his leadership are you appalled at:
> 
> 1. His initial bailout of the U.S. economy that has since rebounded so that the DOW which was at 7,000 when he took office is not over 17,000.
> 2. That his rescue of the auto industry saved thousands of jobs, the loans and interest have all been fully repaid, and we now have a thriving industry.
> ...


 :thumbup: :thumbup: :thumbup: :thumbup: :thumbup:


----------



## bellestarr12 (Mar 26, 2011)

anjoda said:


> What particular "lack" in his leadership are you appalled at:
> 
> 1. His initial bailout of the U.S. economy that has since rebounded so that the DOW which was at 7,000 when he took office is not over 17,000.
> 2. That his rescue of the auto industry saved thousands of jobs, the loans and interest have all been fully repaid, and we now have a thriving industry.
> ...


Thank you! and this American agrees with you 100%!


----------



## GranmaD (Jul 29, 2012)

He has earned every derogatory remark written and spoken about him. Benghazi, Solendra (sp?), executive actions that are contrary to what the Constitution grants the President, raising the national debt to the trillion dollar mark, releasing 5 terrorists in return for a deserter, secretly reinstating relations with a terrorist nation (Cuba) and I could go on and on. But why bother. I seem to be addressing some very low information members of KP. For heaven's sake. Don't you people read the news or if you do don't you understand what you are reading!!!!


----------



## bellestarr12 (Mar 26, 2011)

GranmaD said:


> He has earned every derogatory remark written and spoken about him. Benghazi, Solendra (sp?), executive actions that are contrary to what the Constitution grants the President, raising the national debt to the trillion dollar mark, releasing 5 terrorists in return for a deserter, secretly reinstating relations with a terrorist nation (Cuba) and I could go on and on. But why bother. I seem to be addressing some very low information members of KP. For heaven's sake. Don't you people read the news or if you do don't you understand what you are reading!!!!


Actually, most of us are quite well-informed - but we don't get our news and/or interpretation thereof from FOX and its ilk, i.e., we know how to consider the source.


----------



## GranmaD (Jul 29, 2012)

From your posts I would say most of you don't read anything of importance but take everything at face value that the leftists write without reading all sides of an issue. This President, if you can call him that without throwing up, has done more to harm this country than all previous Presidents combined. Just one action is enough to make one vomit i.e. to release 5 very dangerous terrorists who are hell bent on destroying us, for one deserter who isn't worth his salt, should be enough to start articles of impeachment.


----------



## NJG (Dec 2, 2011)

Dori Sage said:


> kittykatzmom wrote:
> As far as I am concerned the USA has been without a president since the Bush's left the White House. We have half black trash in there right now.
> 
> And there you have it folks. Racism right in our face. Would they be trash if they weren't black?


And then when this kind of talk goes on in Washington and we wonder why we have problems. Oh Washington doesn't have the guts to say it to our face, so it is kept behind closed doors by the republicans, or they find a clever way to say it so it doesn't make them look so bad. Like right now, Paul Ryan wants to use something called "dynamic scoring" when calculating their tax cuts which just counts hypothetical growth as additional revenue. See then they can tell us how lucky we are that those at the top are getting all those tax cuts. This is becoming more of an oligarchy all the time. If you are not a millionaire this is not good for you so wake up America.


----------



## kathimc (Jan 10, 2013)

Excuse me while I go throw up!!!!!!!!!!!!


----------



## kathimc (Jan 10, 2013)

joeysomma said:


> You are so wrong!. Me thinks you need to go back to school and study the documents, Federalist Papers, written by the Founding Fathers. You will find the Christian Heritage of the Founding Fathers is all over those documents. There was no separation of church and state until the middle of the 20th century, when a very liberal Supreme Court took a letter written by Thomas Jefferson to the Danbury Baptists and stated there should be a "wall of separation." Jefferson was referring to the government should stay out of the church and not the church should stay out of government. There is nothing about the separation in the Constitution. Then we are *NOT* a Democracy. We are a Constitutional Republic. You need to be thankful that we are not a Democracy.
> 
> I'm sad to say that since the Liberals have taken control of the government,, and control of the schools, the true history of our nation is no longer being taught. You will need to go back to text books printed before the 1950's to read what our children and grandchildren should learn about the founding of our nation. The early schools were founded for the purpose of learning to read, so people could read the Bible. The Ivy League schools had seminaries. As late as 1949, Texas published textbooks to study the Bible in the "Public Schools." When Prayer and the Bible were removed from public schools, the quality of education started to go downhill and it is still falling.
> 
> We are no longer* free* to follow our religion. If we were, no one would be forced to bake a gay wedding cake or be sued. Or to print T-shirts for a gay pride parade, take pictures of a gay wedding, or drive a fire truck in a gay parade, or to pay for health insurance that includes abortion. We would not have to fear the PC police, that what we say might offend someone. We would not have to fight to save a war memorial that has been in place for 60 years because the cross on the memorial has offended someone. Or remove a picture in a school with two children with their hands together in front of a flag; because someone thinks they are praying. And that is offensive.


 :thumbup: :thumbup: :thumbup: :thumbup: :thumbup:


----------



## kathimc (Jan 10, 2013)




----------



## misellen (Mar 8, 2013)

GranmaD said:


> He has earned every derogatory remark written and spoken about him. Benghazi, Solendra (sp?), executive actions that are contrary to what the Constitution grants the President, raising the national debt to the trillion dollar mark, releasing 5 terrorists in return for a deserter, secretly reinstating relations with a terrorist nation (Cuba) and I could go on and on. But why bother. I seem to be addressing some very low information members of KP. For heaven's sake. Don't you people read the news or if you do don't you understand what you are reading!!!!


We don't follow 'Fox News?' if that is what you mean.


----------



## jaa520 (Apr 16, 2013)

Nothing to do with race. Worst president of the USA ever. Be glad when he is out of there.


----------



## kathimc (Jan 10, 2013)

A List of Obamas Constitutional Violations

Posted on March 27, 2013	by Truth Seeker 


> Updated 01/04/15 I was a constitutional law professor, which means unlike the current president I actually respect the Constitution. Barrack Hussein Obama. Obama took the Presidential Oath, swearing to .. preserve, protect and defend the Constitution of the United States but has:
&#9726;Used Executive Action in direct opposition to the law, and unilaterally changes the law for at least five million illegal aliens; Article 1 Section 1, ALL Legislative power held by Congress; he shall take Care that the Laws be faithfully executed, Article II Section 3; Article I Section 8
&#9726;Directed IRS to change ACA Law ( Section 36B ) and establish Federal Exchanges. Article. I. Section. 1; Article II, Section 3.
&#9726;Violated statute on Material Support of Terrorism by returning top terrorists back to terrorist organizations. Article II Section 3; Dereliction of Duty Article II Section 4
&#9726;Violated Appropriations Act (DOD Section 8111)  GAO report; Article II Section 3
&#9726;Ignored law that requires Congress be notified prior to any detainees being moved from Guantanamo. he shall take Care that the Laws be faithfully executed, Article II Section 3
&#9726;Appointed 24+ Federal agency czars without advice and consent of the Senate; Violation of Article II Section 2
&#9726;Used Executive Privilege in regards to Fast & Furious gun running scandal. When Government misconduct is the concern Executive privilege is negated.
&#9726;23 Executive Orders on gun control  infringement of the 2nd Amendment
&#9726;Exposed identity and methods of operation of a Navy SEALs team  Illegal for a President to reveal classified military secrets. Article II Section 3
&#9726;2 Executive actions mandating private health information on patients be turned over to NICS  Violation of HIPPA law.
&#9726;Executive Order bypassing Congress on immigration  Article 1 Section 1, ALL Legislative power held by Congress; Article II Section 3; Article I Section 8
&#9726; Unilaterally issued new exemptions to immigration restrictions law that bars certain asylum-seekers and refugees who provided limited material support to t
errorists.  Article 1 Section 1; Article I Section 8 Congress shall have the Power..to establish an uniform Rule of Naturalization.

&#9726;Issued directive instructing ICE to NOT enforce immigration laws in certain cases. Article 1 Section 1, ALL Legislative power held by Congress; he shall take Care that the Laws be faithfully executed, Article II Section 3; Article I Section 8
&#9726;Release of convicted illegal aliens ordered in direct opposition to law-Article II Section 3
&#9726;Expanded executive action for amnesty to illegal immigrant relatives of DREAM Act beneficiaries. Article 1 Section 1, ALL Legislative power held by Congress; he shall take Care that the Laws be faithfully executed, Article II Section 3; Article I Section 8
&#9726;Executive action directing DHS that almost all immigration offenses were unenforceable absent a separate criminal conviction. Article 1 Section 1, ALL Legislative power held by Congress; he shall take Care that the Laws be faithfully executed, Article II Section 3; Article I Section 8
&#9726;Ignoring Law (2006 Secure Fence Act) he shall take Care that the Laws be faithfully executed, Article II Section 3
&#9726;Used DOJ to ignore section 8 of the Voting Rights Act.  he shall take Care that the Laws be faithfully executed, Article II Section 3
&#9726;Used DOJ to prevent Arizona and Alabama from enforcing immigration laws.  10th Amendment
&#9726;Information memorandum telling states that they can waive the work requirement for welfare recipients, thereby altering the 1996 welfare reform law.  Article 1 Section 1, ALL Legislative power held by Congress.
&#9726;Used NLRB to dictate to a business where they can do business. (Boeing Dreamliner Plant). No Constitutional authority to do so.
&#9726;NDAA  Section 1021. Due process Rights negated. Violation of 3rd, 4th, 5th, 6th, and 7th Amendments.
&#9726;Executive Order 13603 NDRP  Government can seize anything
&#9726;Executive Order 13524  Gives INTERPOL jurisdiction on American soil beyond law enforcement agencies, including the FBI.
&#9726;Executive Order 13636 Infrastructure Cybersecurity  Bypassing Congress Article 1 Section 1, ALL Legislative power held by Congress
&#9726;Attempt to tax political contributions  1st Amendment
&#9726;DOMA Law  Obama directed DOJ to ignore the Constitution and separation of powers and not enforce the law.  he shall take Care that the Laws be faithfully executed, Article II Section 3
&#9726;Dodd-Frank  Due process and separation of powers. Consumer Financial Protection Bureau writing and interpreting law. Article. I. Section. 1
&#9726;Drone strikes on American Citizens  5th Amendment Due process Rights negated
&#9726;Bypassed Congress and gave EPA power to advance Cap-n-Trade
&#9726;Attempt for Graphic tobacco warnings (under appeal)  1st Amendment
&#9726;Four Exec. appointments  Senate was NOT in recess (Court has ruled unconstitutional yet the appointees still remain)
&#9726;Obama took Chairmanship of UN Security Council  Violation of Section 9.
&#9726;ACA (Obamacare) mandate  SCOTUS rewrote legislation and made it a tax because there is no Constitutional authority for Congress to force Americans to engage in commerce. SCOTUS has no authority to Legislate or lay taxes. Article I Section 1 & 8.
&#9726;Contraceptive, abortifacients mandate violation of First Ammendment
&#9726;Healthcare waivers  No president has dispensing powers
&#9726;Refuses to acknowledge states 10th Amendment rights to nullify Obamacare
&#9726;Going after states (AZ lawsuit) for upholding Federal law (immigration) -10th Amendment.
&#9726;Chrysler Bailout -TARP  violated creditors rights and bankruptcy law, as well as Takings and Due Process Clauses  5th Amendment (G.W. Bush also illegally used TARP funds for bailouts)
&#9726;The Independent Payment Advisory Board (appointees by the president). Any decisions by IPAB will instantly become law starting in 2014  Separation of Powers, Article 1 Section 1.
&#9726;Congress did not approve Obamas war in Libya. Article I, Section 8, First illegal war U.S. has engaged in. Impeachable under Article II, Section 4; War Powers Act  Article II Section 3.
&#9726;Obama falsely claims UN can usurp Congressional war powers.
&#9726;Obama has acted outside the constitutional power given him  this in itself is unconstitutional.
&#9726;Bribery of Senator Ben Nelson and Senator Mary Landrey. (Cornhusker Kickback and Louisiana Purchase) Article II, Section 4.
&#9726;With the approval of Obama, the NSA and the FBI are tapping directly into the servers of 9 internet companies to gain access to emails, video/audio, photos, documents, etc. This program is code named PRISM. NSA also collecting data on all phone calls in U.S.  Violation of 4th Amendment.
&#9726;Directed signing of U.N. Firearms treaty  2nd Amendment.
&#9726;The Senate/Obama immigration bill (approved by both) raises revenue  Section 7. All Bills for raising Revenue shall originate in the House of Representatives
&#9726;Obama altered law  (A president has no authority to alter law) Delayed upholding the Employer Mandate Law (ACA) until 2015  Individual Mandate will be enforced. A President does not have that authority  Article. I. Section. 1. All legislative Powers herein granted shall be vested in a Congress of the United States; The president shall take care that the laws be faithfully executed -Article II, Section 3; Equal Protection Clause -14th Amendment.
&#9726;Obama altered law  ACA Medicare cuts delayed until 2015. Article. I. Section. 1; Article II, Section 3.
&#9726;Obama altered law  Enforcement of eligibility requirements for ACA delayed until 2015. Article. I. Section. 1; Article II, Section 3.
&#9726;Obama wavered ACA Income Verification Article. I. Section. 1; Article II, Section 3.
&#9726;Obama altered law  Delayed ACA caps on out of pocket expenses until 2015. (when implemented premiums will skyrocket) Article. I. Section. 1; Article II, Section 3.
&#9726;Obama ignored judicial order to fulfill legal obligation regarding Yucca Mountain waste. Article II, Section 3
&#9726;Waived Federal provision that prevents U.S. From arming terrorist groups  Article I. Section 1; Impeachable under Article III, Section 3.
&#9726;Directed State Department HS to ignore law barring entry to U.S. those giving political or charitable aid to known terrorist groups. Article. I. Section. 1; Article II, Section 3.
&#9726;Obama shelves part of the ACA Law for Insurers, extending the life of non-qualifying (according to ACA) plans until Jan. 1, 2015. Article. I. Section. 1; Article II, Section 3. Violation of the Take Care Clause, Separation of Powers.
&#9726;Obama waved ACA individual mandate for those that lost their insurance. Article. I. Section. 1; Article II, Section 3. Violation of the Take Care Clause, Separation of Powers.
&#9726;Obama alters ACA law and exempts companies employing between 50-100 full-time workers from business mandate until 2016. Article. I. Section. 1; Article II, Section 3.
&#9726;In total, Obama has unilaterally altered ACA 24 times. Article. I. Section. 1; Article II, Section 3. Violation of the Take Care Clause, Separation of Powers.

A Constitutional law professor (even their students) should know better. The TRUTH is Obama was not a Constitutional law professor: under no circumstances would an offer to Obama be tenured. The thought that the law school could have made a tenure offer to a person with no academic writing was out of the question. Former University of Chicago Law School Dean Richard Epstein.

Clearly Obama has not respected or protected the Constitution. Obama has broken his oath to preserve, protect, and defend the Constitution of the United States. Article II, Section 1. 

Note: Executive Orders/Actions by the president were not designed for, nor do they give a president the authority to use as, a means to override or alter legislation or any other Constitutional violation. Executive Orders cannot defy Congressional intent.


----------



## NJG (Dec 2, 2011)

Alcyone said:


> Thanks pattibe! Beautiful photos of a beautiful couple who happen to be the First Lady and President of the USA.
> I've read all the replies that were positive, and tried to avoid all the hateful comments.I am disgusted with the Obama haters.


Most people are disgusted with them, but I think it is important to know that they are among us. We have too many of the racist deniers who don't believe there are people like kittykatzmom out there, but I'm afraid there are many more like her and I find that very sad.


----------



## kathimc (Jan 10, 2013)

pattibe said:


> I love this picture of President Obama. He is such a gentleman.


A List of Obamas Constitutional Violations

Posted on March 27, 2013	by Truth Seeker

> Updated 01/04/15 I was a constitutional law professor, which means unlike the current president I actually respect the Constitution. Barrack Hussein Obama. Obama took the Presidential Oath, swearing to .. preserve, protect and defend the Constitution of the United States but has:
◾Used Executive Action in direct opposition to the law, and unilaterally changes the law for at least five million illegal aliens; Article 1 Section 1, ALL Legislative power held by Congress; he shall take Care that the Laws be faithfully executed, Article II Section 3; Article I Section 8
◾Directed IRS to change ACA Law ( Section 36B ) and establish Federal Exchanges. Article. I. Section. 1; Article II, Section 3.
◾Violated statute on Material Support of Terrorism by returning top terrorists back to terrorist organizations. Article II Section 3; Dereliction of Duty Article II Section 4
◾Violated Appropriations Act (DOD Section 8111)  GAO report; Article II Section 3
◾Ignored law that requires Congress be notified prior to any detainees being moved from Guantanamo. he shall take Care that the Laws be faithfully executed, Article II Section 3
◾Appointed 24+ Federal agency czars without advice and consent of the Senate; Violation of Article II Section 2
◾Used Executive Privilege in regards to Fast & Furious gun running scandal. When Government misconduct is the concern Executive privilege is negated.
◾23 Executive Orders on gun control  infringement of the 2nd Amendment
◾Exposed identity and methods of operation of a Navy SEALs team  Illegal for a President to reveal classified military secrets. Article II Section 3
◾2 Executive actions mandating private health information on patients be turned over to NICS  Violation of HIPPA law.
◾Executive Order bypassing Congress on immigration  Article 1 Section 1, ALL Legislative power held by Congress; Article II Section 3; Article I Section 8
◾ Unilaterally issued new exemptions to immigration restrictions law that bars certain asylum-seekers and refugees who provided limited material support to t
errorists.  Article 1 Section 1; Article I Section 8 Congress shall have the Power..to establish an uniform Rule of Naturalization.

◾Issued directive instructing ICE to NOT enforce immigration laws in certain cases. Article 1 Section 1, ALL Legislative power held by Congress; he shall take Care that the Laws be faithfully executed, Article II Section 3; Article I Section 8
◾Release of convicted illegal aliens ordered in direct opposition to law-Article II Section 3
◾Expanded executive action for amnesty to illegal immigrant relatives of DREAM Act beneficiaries. Article 1 Section 1, ALL Legislative power held by Congress; he shall take Care that the Laws be faithfully executed, Article II Section 3; Article I Section 8
◾Executive action directing DHS that almost all immigration offenses were unenforceable absent a separate criminal conviction. Article 1 Section 1, ALL Legislative power held by Congress; he shall take Care that the Laws be faithfully executed, Article II Section 3; Article I Section 8
◾Ignoring Law (2006 Secure Fence Act) he shall take Care that the Laws be faithfully executed, Article II Section 3
◾Used DOJ to ignore section 8 of the Voting Rights Act.  he shall take Care that the Laws be faithfully executed, Article II Section 3
◾Used DOJ to prevent Arizona and Alabama from enforcing immigration laws.  10th Amendment
◾Information memorandum telling states that they can waive the work requirement for welfare recipients, thereby altering the 1996 welfare reform law.  Article 1 Section 1, ALL Legislative power held by Congress.
◾Used NLRB to dictate to a business where they can do business. (Boeing Dreamliner Plant). No Constitutional authority to do so.
◾NDAA  Section 1021. Due process Rights negated. Violation of 3rd, 4th, 5th, 6th, and 7th Amendments.
◾Executive Order 13603 NDRP  Government can seize anything
◾Executive Order 13524  Gives INTERPOL jurisdiction on American soil beyond law enforcement agencies, including the FBI.
◾Executive Order 13636 Infrastructure Cybersecurity  Bypassing Congress Article 1 Section 1, ALL Legislative power held by Congress
◾Attempt to tax political contributions  1st Amendment
◾DOMA Law  Obama directed DOJ to ignore the Constitution and separation of powers and not enforce the law.  he shall take Care that the Laws be faithfully executed, Article II Section 3
◾Dodd-Frank  Due process and separation of powers. Consumer Financial Protection Bureau writing and interpreting law. Article. I. Section. 1
◾Drone strikes on American Citizens  5th Amendment Due process Rights negated
◾Bypassed Congress and gave EPA power to advance Cap-n-Trade
◾Attempt for Graphic tobacco warnings (under appeal)  1st Amendment
◾Four Exec. appointments  Senate was NOT in recess (Court has ruled unconstitutional yet the appointees still remain)
◾Obama took Chairmanship of UN Security Council  Violation of Section 9.
◾ACA (Obamacare) mandate  SCOTUS rewrote legislation and made it a tax because there is no Constitutional authority for Congress to force Americans to engage in commerce. SCOTUS has no authority to Legislate or lay taxes. Article I Section 1 & 8.
◾Contraceptive, abortifacients mandate violation of First Ammendment
◾Healthcare waivers  No president has dispensing powers
◾Refuses to acknowledge states 10th Amendment rights to nullify Obamacare
◾Going after states (AZ lawsuit) for upholding Federal law (immigration) -10th Amendment.
◾Chrysler Bailout -TARP  violated creditors rights and bankruptcy law, as well as Takings and Due Process Clauses  5th Amendment (G.W. Bush also illegally used TARP funds for bailouts)
◾The Independent Payment Advisory Board (appointees by the president). Any decisions by IPAB will instantly become law starting in 2014  Separation of Powers, Article 1 Section 1.
◾Congress did not approve Obamas war in Libya. Article I, Section 8, First illegal war U.S. has engaged in. Impeachable under Article II, Section 4; War Powers Act  Article II Section 3.
◾Obama falsely claims UN can usurp Congressional war powers.
◾Obama has acted outside the constitutional power given him  this in itself is unconstitutional.
◾Bribery of Senator Ben Nelson and Senator Mary Landrey. (Cornhusker Kickback and Louisiana Purchase) Article II, Section 4.
◾With the approval of Obama, the NSA and the FBI are tapping directly into the servers of 9 internet companies to gain access to emails, video/audio, photos, documents, etc. This program is code named PRISM. NSA also collecting data on all phone calls in U.S.  Violation of 4th Amendment.
◾Directed signing of U.N. Firearms treaty  2nd Amendment.
◾The Senate/Obama immigration bill (approved by both) raises revenue  Section 7. All Bills for raising Revenue shall originate in the House of Representatives
◾Obama altered law  (A president has no authority to alter law) Delayed upholding the Employer Mandate Law (ACA) until 2015  Individual Mandate will be enforced. A President does not have that authority  Article. I. Section. 1. All legislative Powers herein granted shall be vested in a Congress of the United States; The president shall take care that the laws be faithfully executed -Article II, Section 3; Equal Protection Clause -14th Amendment.
◾Obama altered law  ACA Medicare cuts delayed until 2015. Article. I. Section. 1; Article II, Section 3.
◾Obama altered law  Enforcement of eligibility requirements for ACA delayed until 2015. Article. I. Section. 1; Article II, Section 3.
◾Obama wavered ACA Income Verification Article. I. Section. 1; Article II, Section 3.
◾Obama altered law  Delayed ACA caps on out of pocket expenses until 2015. (when implemented premiums will skyrocket) Article. I. Section. 1; Article II, Section 3.
◾Obama ignored judicial order to fulfill legal obligation regarding Yucca Mountain waste. Article II, Section 3
◾Waived Federal provision that prevents U.S. From arming terrorist groups  Article I. Section 1; Impeachable under Article III, Section 3.
◾Directed State Department HS to ignore law barring entry to U.S. those giving political or charitable aid to known terrorist groups. Article. I. Section. 1; Article II, Section 3.
◾Obama shelves part of the ACA Law for Insurers, extending the life of non-qualifying (according to ACA) plans until Jan. 1, 2015. Article. I. Section. 1; Article II, Section 3. Violation of the Take Care Clause, Separation of Powers.
◾Obama waved ACA individual mandate for those that lost their insurance. Article. I. Section. 1; Article II, Section 3. Violation of the Take Care Clause, Separation of Powers.
◾Obama alters ACA law and exempts companies employing between 50-100 full-time workers from business mandate until 2016. Article. I. Section. 1; Article II, Section 3.
◾In total, Obama has unilaterally altered ACA 24 times. Article. I. Section. 1; Article II, Section 3. Violation of the Take Care Clause, Separation of Powers.

A Constitutional law professor (even their students) should know better. The TRUTH is Obama was not a Constitutional law professor: under no circumstances would an offer to Obama be tenured. The thought that the law school could have made a tenure offer to a person with no academic writing was out of the question. Former University of Chicago Law School Dean Richard Epstein.

Clearly Obama has not respected or protected the Constitution. Obama has broken his oath to preserve, protect, and defend the Constitution of the United States. Article II, Section 1.

Note: Executive Orders/Actions by the president were not designed for, nor do they give a president the authority to use as, a means to override or alter legislation or any other Constitutional violation. Executive Orders cannot defy Congressional intent.

NO MENTION OF THE COLOR OF HIS SKIN!!


----------



## ummirain (Feb 1, 2013)

Well said and appreciated.
Thank you.


----------



## ute4kp (Nov 6, 2012)

GranmaD said:


> From your posts I would say most of you don't read anything of importance but take everything at face value that the leftists write without reading all sides of an issue. This President, if you can call him that without throwing up, has done more to harm this country than all previous Presidents combined. Just one action is enough to make one vomit i.e. to release 5 very dangerous terrorists who are hell bent on destroying us, for one deserter who isn't worth his salt, should be enough to start articles of impeachment.


Yadda yadda yadda foxy-upchuck.


----------



## ute4kp (Nov 6, 2012)

kathimc said:


> Excuse me while I go throw up!!!!!!!!!!!!


Sorry you're bulemic.


----------



## grandmann (Feb 4, 2011)

kathimc said:


> http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=gvuulZPbfBg


]http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=gvuulZPbfBg[/quote]

I'm afraid to say I have hands of a Man but I know I'm a woman and so does my husband. My children know it too.

The film didn't show a Adams Apple which is a sure thing of being a Man.


----------



## justinjared (May 31, 2012)

Cru said:


> Don't understand why the term 'racist' comes up, knowing how fair his Mother and her family were. Don't understand why he is called 'African' when he is only about 12% African.


 I guess you never heard of ;the one drop ' rule created by caucasions!!!!!1


----------



## justinjared (May 31, 2012)

Designer1234 said:


> one has finally admitted the truth instead of saying it has nothing to do with race. Sickening.


we are not perfect but Canadians are tolerant and I am glad of your true comment! thank you


----------



## ummirain (Feb 1, 2013)

Jewish folks immigrated to the U S.A .
I believe a few Buddhists may have,some Hindus, atheists.
They grew our crops, built our railways,opened businesses and our minds and hearts.
Perhaps you would be happier in Rome?
Or somewhere homogenous where everyone believes as you.


----------



## ummirain (Feb 1, 2013)

You have made it a political discussion.
The man is multi tasking constantly.
I like to see your every slip up.
This President 's health care saved my son-in-law's life.


----------



## ummirain (Feb 1, 2013)

The heading is non knitting related.
You have the option of skipping it.
Political and religious discussions are philosophical exercises and I like using my mind


----------



## susanmos2000 (May 10, 2011)

joeysomma said:


> The lack of Bible Study (morals to be exact) has had a negative effect on national life.


Once again you miss my point, Joey. Americans once took Bible study very seriously indeed, but that did nothing to prevent such horrors as Jim Crow. You speak of declining morals, but nothing is more immoral and unChristian than the blatant segregation and out and out murder (lynchings) of the pre-50s era.


----------



## NJG (Dec 2, 2011)

misellen said:


> :thumbup: me too


She did send me a pm and it was all talking points and her personal opinion and some right out lies, things that republicans know are not true, but they keep repeating them anyway. I read nothing with valid proof of anything. And of course she had to mention Benghazi as all the millions spent on investigation doesn't seem to be enough. He plays too much golf and she thinks she can't wave her flag enough. Oh and don't forget executive orders and the fact that he has banned the military from praying and reading the bible. Oh and I can't forget that he is a dictator, and that many of her friends have lost their insurance because of all those premiums that have skyrocketed. We have heard it all before, haven't we. Same old, same old.


----------



## ummirain (Feb 1, 2013)

If Romney had made it we would have bombed Syria, made unwanted children add to the sorrows of the world, kept gays from serving in the military.and my son-in-law would have died due to no health care. 
Seriously.
I honor President Obama, you know, the guy awarded the Nobel Peace Prize ?
How are your accomplishment going? 
Are you ready for Hillary?


----------



## NJG (Dec 2, 2011)

joeysomma said:


> The lack of Bible Study (morals to be exact) has had a negative effect on national life.


I believe the attitude and morals of some of those on the right have had a negative effect on national life. The idea that you think you have the right to criticize others because they don't believe as you do and they don't read the bible as much as you do, and they are not as moral as you are. You definitely are not the kind of Christian that God would admire.


----------



## cookiequeen (Jun 15, 2011)

joeysomma said:


> You are so wrong!. Me thinks you need to go back to school and study the documents, Federalist Papers, written by the Founding Fathers. You will find the Christian Heritage of the Founding Fathers is all over those documents. There was no separation of church and state until the middle of the 20th century, when a very liberal Supreme Court took a letter written by Thomas Jefferson to the Danbury Baptists and stated there should be a "wall of separation." Jefferson was referring to the government should stay out of the church and not the church should stay out of government. There is nothing about the separation in the Constitution. Then we are *NOT* a Democracy. We are a Constitutional Republic. You need to be thankful that we are not a Democracy.
> 
> I'm sad to say that since the Liberals have taken control of the government,, and control of the schools, the true history of our nation is no longer being taught. You will need to go back to text books printed before the 1950's to read what our children and grandchildren should learn about the founding of our nation. The early schools were founded for the purpose of learning to read, so people could read the Bible. The Ivy League schools had seminaries. As late as 1949, Texas published textbooks to study the Bible in the "Public Schools." When Prayer and the Bible were removed from public schools, the quality of education started to go downhill and it is still falling.
> 
> We are no longer* free* to follow our religion. If we were, no one would be forced to bake a gay wedding cake or be sued. Or to print T-shirts for a gay pride parade, take pictures of a gay wedding, or drive a fire truck in a gay parade, or to pay for health insurance that includes abortion. We would not have to fear the PC police, that what we say might offend someone. We would not have to fight to save a war memorial that has been in place for 60 years because the cross on the memorial has offended someone. Or remove a picture in a school with two children with their hands together in front of a flag; because someone thinks they are praying. And that is offensive.


RUBBISH! This is full of lies and opinion.


----------



## NJG (Dec 2, 2011)

kathimc said:


> https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=gvuulZPbfBg


OMG, OMG, OMG you are the sickest person if you believe crap like this.


----------



## cookiequeen (Jun 15, 2011)

joeysomma said:


> The lack of Bible Study (morals to be exact) has had a negative effect on national life.


So all people who study the Bible are upright, moral beings?
Nobody is preventing anyone from continuing to study the Bible, are they? You can study the Bible anywhere you want to. You just can't force others to do it.


----------



## ummirain (Feb 1, 2013)

Bush the oil man left us a mess after
Clinton worked hard to get us in the black,financially.
No weapons of destruction in Iraq.
Sat frozen in place during 9/11.
A true embarrassment,and has serious father issues.
My President is kind, patient, intelligent, compassionate, loyal to his family, humorous,elegant,and really cares about America. 
He has overcome racists and haters all of his life and is stronger for doing so.


----------



## cookiequeen (Jun 15, 2011)

ummirain said:


> Bush the oil man left us a mess.
> Clinton worked hard to get us in the black,financially.
> No weapons of destruction in Iraq.
> Sat frozen in place during 9/11.
> ...


 :thumbup: :thumbup: :thumbup:


----------



## Designer1234 (Aug 9, 2011)

kathimc said:


> NO MENTION OF THE COLOR OF HIS SKIN!!


No, it is never mentioned but it is a huge boulder in the attitude towards the President. Never admitted unless by accident , but always there.


----------



## Designer1234 (Aug 9, 2011)

kathimc said:


> A List of Obamas Constitutional Violations
> 
> Posted on March 27, 2013	by Truth Seeker
> .


=========================
Most of these are one sided, right wing propoganda. Nothing he can do will cause any far right Republican to admit he has don't anything right. 
This was copied from a right wing group who doesn't care what is the truth. And has an agenda - and who have never posted a positive thing about the President.

This was not the idea for this thread. The OP posted a picture of a young, gracious couple who love each other, have excellent morals and have had to deal with the most dreadful attacks against them which he cannot defend against because he is the President. He has continued to try to meet some middle ground but has been stopped or fought about every thing he has tried to do.

I admire his personal integrity and the way he has handled himself against unbelievable lies and unkindness.

Any way, once again the pictures are great and I applaud the Original poster for showing them. That was what this thread was about until the haters joined in. Just keep your mind open. The world is watching what is happening here. I understand that he is greatly admired in many parts of the world for his class and decency. I notice his hair has gone white. He shows his love for his family at all times. They are a unit and should be admired.


----------



## lila ladue (Jan 13, 2011)

Many black people in the US criticize Obama, Thomas Sowell for one a noted professor at Stanford University. Its the people who are defending Obama that bring up the racist argument. There ae good and bad in all colors, but it seems that the accusation of racism is the first line of defense.


----------



## misellen (Mar 8, 2013)

NJG said:


> She did send me a pm and it was all talking points and her personal opinion and some right out lies, things that republicans know are not true, but they keep repeating them anyway. I read nothing with valid proof of anything. And of course she had to mention Benghazi as all the millions spent on investigation doesn't seem to be enough. He plays too much golf and she thinks she can't wave her flag enough. Oh and don't forget executive orders and the fact that he has banned the military from praying and reading the bible. Oh and I can't forget that he is a dictator, and that many of her friends have lost their insurance because of all those premiums that have skyrocketed. We have heard it all before, haven't we. Same old, same old.


And on and on it goes.


----------



## MarilynKnits (Aug 30, 2011)

GranmaD said:


> From your posts I would say most of you don't read anything of importance but take everything at face value that the leftists write without reading all sides of an issue. This President, if you can call him that without throwing up, has done more to harm this country than all previous Presidents combined. Just one action is enough to make one vomit i.e. to release 5 very dangerous terrorists who are hell bent on destroying us, for one deserter who isn't worth his salt, should be enough to start articles of impeachment.


Wow! And you, of course, receive the news from a neutral source that documents its findings and presents only the truth without any slant. No uber conservative rants. No personal attacks, just analysis of the situation. And that makes you an enlightened consumer of the news and an appropriate person to critique other people's news choices.


----------



## pattibe (Feb 2, 2012)

bellestarr12 said:


> Actually, most of us are quite well-informed - but we don't get our news and/or interpretation thereof from FOX and its ilk, i.e., we know how to consider the source.


Like the 13 American Embassys that were attacked under Bush...no one bothers to mention those!


----------



## rocky1991 (May 8, 2011)

joeysomma said:


> The lack of Bible Study (morals to be exact) has had a negative effect on national life.


How about the education of the home variety.? Is it not the parent's responsibility to teach their children morality, as a teacher I do not want to teach morality in school. The place to do that is in the home, church, synagogue, mosque etc. I think most of our "morality" problems begin in the home not the schoolroom.


----------



## pattibe (Feb 2, 2012)

susanmos2000 said:


> Once again you miss my point, Joey. Americans once took Bible study very seriously indeed, but that did nothing to prevent such horrors as Jim Crow. You speak of declining morals, but nothing is more immoral and unChristian than the blatant segregation and out and out murder (lynchings) of the pre-50s era.


Not to mention the Spanish Inqisition


----------



## rocky1991 (May 8, 2011)

GranmaD said:


> He has earned every derogatory remark written and spoken about him. Benghazi, Solendra (sp?), executive actions that are contrary to what the Constitution grants the President, raising the national debt to the trillion dollar mark, releasing 5 terrorists in return for a deserter, secretly reinstating relations with a terrorist nation (Cuba) and I could go on and on. But why bother. I seem to be addressing some very low information members of KP. For heaven's sake. Don't you people read the news or if you do don't you understand what you are reading!!!!


 Please tell us about Benghazi? What do you know that umpteen congressional investigations do not? How about the FINAL report? The one that said The White House was not guilty of anything? The Republicans were not so excited about releasing the report, so I guess you just missed reading about it. Try looking it up!


----------



## pattibe (Feb 2, 2012)

ummirain said:


> Bush the oil man left us a mess after
> Clinton worked hard to get us in the black,financially.
> No weapons of destruction in Iraq.
> Sat frozen in place during 9/11.
> ...


My sister went to Occidental College with "Barry" Obama as he was known back then. She said he was just one of the all around nice guys. Who knew??? Dang, wish she had gotten his autograph.


----------



## jaa520 (Apr 16, 2013)

The people that brought up racist, are truly the racist here. As usual.


----------



## pattibe (Feb 2, 2012)

MarilynKnits said:


> Wow! And you, of course, receive the news from a neutral source that documents its findings and presents only the truth without any slant. No uber conservative rants. No personal attacks, just analysis of the situation. And that makes you an enlightened consumer of the news and an appropriate person to critique other people's news choices.


Marilyn: You are one smart cookie! Wish I'd said that!


----------



## rocky1991 (May 8, 2011)

kathimc said:


> https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=gvuulZPbfBg


You believe this? Our education system is a failure.


----------



## rocky1991 (May 8, 2011)

kathimc said:


> A List of Obamas Constitutional Violations
> 
> Posted on March 27, 2013	by Truth Seeker
> 
> ...


Great example of cut and paste, however total lack of fact checking.


----------



## MarilynKnits (Aug 30, 2011)

rocky1991 said:


> How about the education of the home variety.? Is it not the parent's responsibility to teach their children morality, as a teacher I do not want to teach morality in school. The place to do that is in the home, church, synagogue, mosque etc. I think most of our "morality" problems begin in the home not the schoolroom.


As a former teacher and the wife of a retired teacher, I endorse your comment wholeheartedly. If morality, kindness, empathy, those positives that make us productive members of a diverse society are not taught in the home the home is deficient. The school can reinforce these virtues by example, but it is not the role of the school to teach morality.

We live in a society with odd priorities. There are more laws to protect the rights of domestic pet animals than of children.


----------



## SAMkewel (Mar 5, 2011)

joeysomma said:


> You are so wrong!. Me thinks you need to go back to school and study the documents, Federalist Papers, written by the Founding Fathers. You will find the Christian Heritage of the Founding Fathers is all over those documents. There was no separation of church and state until the middle of the 20th century, when a very liberal Supreme Court took a letter written by Thomas Jefferson to the Danbury Baptists and stated there should be a "wall of separation." Jefferson was referring to the government should stay out of the church and not the church should stay out of government. There is nothing about the separation in the Constitution. Then we are *NOT* a Democracy. We are a Constitutional Republic. You need to be thankful that we are not a Democracy.
> 
> I'm sad to say that since the Liberals have taken control of the government,, and control of the schools, the true history of our nation is no longer being taught. You will need to go back to text books printed before the 1950's to read what our children and grandchildren should learn about the founding of our nation. The early schools were founded for the purpose of learning to read, so people could read the Bible. The Ivy League schools had seminaries. As late as 1949, Texas published textbooks to study the Bible in the "Public Schools." When Prayer and the Bible were removed from public schools, the quality of education started to go downhill and it is still falling.
> 
> We are no longer* free* to follow our religion. If we were, no one would be forced to bake a gay wedding cake or be sued. Or to print T-shirts for a gay pride parade, take pictures of a gay wedding, or drive a fire truck in a gay parade, or to pay for health insurance that includes abortion. We would not have to fear the PC police, that what we say might offend someone. We would not have to fight to save a war memorial that has been in place for 60 years because the cross on the memorial has offended someone. Or remove a picture in a school with two children with their hands together in front of a flag; because someone thinks they are praying. And that is offensive.


And you apparently don't read your Bible. Where DID you find your bigoted God?


----------



## SAMkewel (Mar 5, 2011)

Wombatnomore said:


> They're beautiful photos of a high profile couple for crying out loud! Are you unable to appreciate beauty for beauty's sake?


Obviously you hit it right on the head. When folks are full of hatred, they can't see/think about anything else, eh?


----------



## MarilynKnits (Aug 30, 2011)

Wow, pattibe, whoda thunk that by your kindness in sharing that artistic picture of two graceful and gracious people you would have brought the cockroaches streaming. Ever thought of starting a business as an exterminator? 

I knew we had some extremist radicals in this world, but the level of rancor and ugliness some have shown makes me think of Madame DeFarge! Another fellow knitter who gave us all a bad name.


----------



## knitismything (Dec 4, 2011)

train said:


> I like the Pope, and I'm not catholic!


Me too! :thumbup: :thumbup: :thumbup:


----------



## SAMkewel (Mar 5, 2011)

misellen said:


> And to find the "other reason" you have only to look at him. The hatred has little to do with his politics.


That was my point; thank you for making it clearer for those who have little understanding of the reality of these issues ;~).


----------



## NJG (Dec 2, 2011)

rocky1991 said:


> Please tell us about Benghazi? What do you know that umpteen congressional investigations do not? How about the FINAL report? The one that said The White House was not guilty of anything? The Republicans were not so excited about releasing the report, so I guess you just missed reading about it. Try looking it up!


I think that was the one released in a Friday night news dump. so it would go quietly and no one would hear about it.


----------



## NJG (Dec 2, 2011)

rocky1991 said:


> Great example of cut and paste, however total lack of fact checking.


Don't you know, they never fact check. If it is something bad about the president, they will believe it. They are very gullible that way.


----------



## alifletcher (Jun 8, 2012)

Half white trash is not a racial slur come on !


----------



## alifletcher (Jun 8, 2012)

You appreciate the grace and beauty in this lovely picture. The hate and anger comes from within from the people who disparage him. Feel sorry for them and their ugly ignorance !


----------



## pattibe (Feb 2, 2012)

MarilynKnits said:


> Wow, pattibe, whoda thunk that by your kindness in sharing that artistic picture of two graceful and gracious people you would have brought the cockroaches streaming. Ever thought of starting a business as an exterminator?
> 
> I knew we had some extremist radicals in this world, but the level of rancor and ugliness some have shown makes me think of Madame DeFarge! Another fellow knitter who gave us all a bad name.


In my wildest dreams, I never would have thunk it. Farthest thing from my mind that that beautiful picture would elicit so much hate and venom. Think I'll stick to my knitting.


----------



## bldgmom (Sep 2, 2011)

lila ladue said:


> There are other pictures of him too. Not saluting the American flag, not placing his correct hand over his heart during our nationa anthem, bowing to Muslims. I could go on an on but don't want to make this a political discussion, GET INFORMED.


You're absolutely right! And this phony never passes up a photo op!


----------



## kathimc (Jan 10, 2013)

This all started with a photo-shoot of the Obama's. That's what it was... a photo-shoot. Everything about this guy is a sham... including his illustrious university years, his birth, his entire background is a fallacy. No records of him ever doing ANYTHING!!! until he was fed to the American media and American people by the thugs running the state of Illinois and the city of Chicago.


----------



## kathimc (Jan 10, 2013)

pattibe said:


> In my wildest dreams, I never would have thunk it. Farthest thing from my mind that that beautiful picture would elicit so much hate and venom. Think I'll stick to my knitting.


It is not a beautiful picture.. it is a "make-believe" picture.. just like our President.


----------



## alifletcher (Jun 8, 2012)

Lilla ladue and Patibe., You obviously base your limited education on The Inquirer and Fox Entertainment


----------



## pattibe (Feb 2, 2012)

alifletcher said:


> Lilla ladue and Patibe., You obviously base your limited education on The Inquirer and Fox Entertainment


????? I have never ever watched Fox and you have no idea what my level of education is. So why would you even say such a thing?


----------



## MarilynKnits (Aug 30, 2011)

pattibe said:


> ????? I have never ever watched Fox and you have no idea what my level of education is. So why would you even say such a thing?


She may be a member of the If You Don't Have Something Worth Saying Say It Anyway club.


----------



## pattibe (Feb 2, 2012)

MarilynKnits said:


> She may be a member of the If You Don't Have Something Worth Saying Say It Anyway club.


Yeah, and I've never read the Inqirer either....but I do admit to being a fan of Bill Maher. Now watch the hate mail come pouring in!


----------



## NJG (Dec 2, 2011)

pattibe said:


> Yeah, and I've never read the Inqirer either....but I do admit to being a fan of Bill Maher. Now watch the hate mail come pouring in!


I love Bill Maher too and he will be back on Friday night. Yay


----------



## NJG (Dec 2, 2011)

pattibe said:


> In my wildest dreams, I never would have thunk it. Farthest thing from my mind that that beautiful picture would elicit so much hate and venom. Think I'll stick to my knitting.


It sure did bring out peoples true colors, didn't it?


----------



## rocky1991 (May 8, 2011)

pattibe said:


> ????? I have never ever watched Fox and you have no idea what my level of education is. So why would you even say such a thing?


Perhaps it is because of you less than intelligent comment?


----------



## NJG (Dec 2, 2011)

Just in case some of you missed it the republicans in the house passed a new rule about social security. If anyone reading this receives social security disability, you could be receiving a 20% cut in benefits starting in 2016 and you have the republicans to thank for it.


----------



## pattibe (Feb 2, 2012)

rocky1991 said:


> Perhaps it is because of you less than intelligent comment?


And which one would that be???


----------



## grandmann (Feb 4, 2011)

pattibe said:


> In my wildest dreams, I never would have thunk it. Farthest thing from my mind that that beautiful picture would elicit so much hate and venom. Think I'll stick to my knitting.


32 pages of it, what's wrong with these people. Our country is ran by a Democratic society. It takes the majority of the vote for a person to become President. When George W. Busch was in office if we dare say anything bad about him the answer would be where is your patriotism. Now since its on the other foot, its has been nothing but bashing on this poor man & his family. I must admit Our President stood up what he thought was right without getting mad, he always handle himself like a gentleman.

I live in WI am I happy that Governor Walker is our Governor, not exactly. Do I bash him or do I give him the respect that he is holding the office, Yes. Maybe my vote will make a difference next time around. I will continue on voting for the man I think is right for the job.

Let the Vote count and accept it until changes can be made. In the meantime accept it and work for the country and its people.


----------



## lins (Jan 8, 2013)

kathimc said:


> It is not a beautiful picture.. it is a "make-believe" picture.. just like our President.


It's a beautiful picture of real life president with his beautiful wife that is a reamrkable First Lady and you should be so grateful to have him.

Do you follow along, or are you dragged down with bullshit? 
What was the state of America when Obama took office? 
Where was it headed then, where is it now? 
You should be doubly thankful that he is there, right now, to stop the Republicans from doing it all over again.

Find a news source that's real? Don't follow along with your hateful, uninformed bigoted bashurs, it's just so shameful.


----------



## lins (Jan 8, 2013)

pattibe said:


> Yeah, and I've never read the Inqirer either....but I do admit to being a fan of Bill Maher. Now watch the hate mail come pouring in!


Nothing wrong with Bill Maher. He says it like it is.


----------



## lins (Jan 8, 2013)

kathimc said:


> This all started with a photo-shoot of the Obama's. That's what it was... a photo-shoot. Everything about this guy is a sham... including his illustrious university years, his birth, his entire background is a fallacy. No records of him ever doing ANYTHING!!! until he was fed to the American media and American people by the thugs running the state of Illinois and the city of Chicago.


If you honestly think the picture was a photo shoot....you are delusional. 
It was a dinner with real guests. Look at the whole picture.

On the other hand...too bad they didn't photo shoot this one.


----------



## Kitchenergal (Nov 13, 2013)

Oh, my goodness. Thirty three pages of "right fighting". No one's going to win this, ladies. It's not worth giving yourselves high blood pressure. Life's too short.


----------



## MarilynKnits (Aug 30, 2011)

grandmann said:


> 32 pages of it, what's wrong with these people. Our country is ran by a Democratic society. It takes the majority of the vote for a person to become President. When George W. Busch was in office if we dare say anything bad about him the answer would be where is your patriotism. Now since its on the other foot, its has been nothing but bashing on this poor man & his family. I must admit Our President stood up what he thought was right without getting mad, he always handle himself like a gentleman.
> 
> I live in WI am I happy that Governor Walker is our Governor, not exactly. Do I bash him or do I give him the respect that he is holding the office, Yes. Maybe my vote will make a difference next time around. I will continue on voting for the man I think is right for the job.
> 
> Let the Vote count and accept it until changes can be made. In the meantime accept it and work for the country and its people.


A most sensible position well stated.


----------



## NJG (Dec 2, 2011)

Kitchenergal said:


> Oh, my goodness. Thirty three pages of "right fighting". No one's going to win this, ladies. It's not worth giving yourselves high blood pressure. Life's too short.


I don't think anyone ever believes that someone will win. It is just an opportunity to express opinions and we really get to see peoples true colors. Hopefully we get more understanding of how people really feel and when someone tries to say racism is over in the US, we can say oh, no it isn't, you haven't read what I did.


----------



## Nussa (Jul 7, 2011)

bellestarr12 said:


> Actually, most of us are quite well-informed - but we don't get our news and/or interpretation thereof from FOX and its ilk, i.e., we know how to consider the source.


 :thumbup:


----------



## Nussa (Jul 7, 2011)

You're misguided attitude, and others who think as you do makes me want to wretch. You only see one side......and you don't really want to read the other side because it differs from the hateful political views you choose to believe. 
Fox had removed it's programing from Dish network, which I subscribe to, due to price disputes, and frankly I couldn't be happier, and haven't missed them a bit. I never watched them anyway. Their misguided information must be what you and others like you choose to believe. I suggest you all get Dish network and you may see the light of truth.



GranmaD said:


> From your posts I would say most of you don't read anything of importance but take everything at face value that the leftists write without reading all sides of an issue. This President, if you can call him that without throwing up, has done more to harm this country than all previous Presidents combined. Just one action is enough to make one vomit i.e. to release 5 very dangerous terrorists who are hell bent on destroying us, for one deserter who isn't worth his salt, should be enough to start articles of impeachment.


----------



## GranmaD (Jul 29, 2012)

It is no wonder this country is in so much trouble. Too many like you whose brains are fried and have never grown beyond the ability to utter childlike nonsense and certainly can't understand intelligent adult words and sentences, but can only utter idiotic noises such as in your post, then idiots such as Ovomit will continue to be elected and the intelligent citizens, and yes they still exist which leaves you out, will suffer from your low information brainless actions.


----------



## NJG (Dec 2, 2011)

You think Fox news doesn't lie. Here is the perfect example. Watch the little video and you can see for yourself. What it says is true. At some point the people should see a doughnut with sprinkles and remember the threat and say they didn't get rid of them, Fox lied. But they are so into the next big conspiracy theory, that they have forgotten all about the sprinkles. But they haven't forgotten to pass the lie on as the truth, because Fox said!!!!

http://www.dailykos.com/story/2015/01/01/1355083/-Obama-To-Disband-the-Marine-Corps?detail=email


----------



## lins (Jan 8, 2013)

GranmaD said:


> It is no wonder this country is in so much trouble. Too many like you whose brains are fried and have never grown beyond the ability to utter childlike nonsense and certainly can't understand intelligent adult words and sentences, but can only utter idiotic noises such as in your post, then idiots such as Ovomit will continue to be elected and the intelligent citizens, and yes they still exist which leaves you out, will suffer from your low information brainless actions.


Ovomit?


----------



## painthoss (Jul 10, 2012)

Grammar check, anyone?


GranmaD said:


> It is no wonder this country is in so much trouble. Too many like you whose brains are fried and have never grown beyond the ability to utter childlike nonsense and certainly can't understand intelligent adult words and sentences, but can only utter idiotic noises such as in your post, then idiots such as Ovomit will continue to be elected and the intelligent citizens, and yes they still exist which leaves you out, will suffer from your low information brainless actions.


----------



## mojave (Oct 14, 2011)

GranmaD said:


> From your posts I would say most of you don't read anything of importance but take everything at face value that the leftists write without reading all sides of an issue. This President, if you can call him that without throwing up, has done more to harm this country than all previous Presidents combined. Just one action is enough to make one vomit i.e. to release 5 very dangerous terrorists who are hell bent on destroying us, for one deserter who isn't worth his salt, should be enough to start articles of impeachment.


*We do not leave our people behind*

I am a veteran, served both as enlisted and as an officer. We do not leave wounded behind. We try to carry out our deceased comrades. Failing that, we try to recover the bodies of our comrades - sometimes decades later. We try to bring the deserters home. Sometimes it is for punishment and also because we know fear can lead a soldier to make poor choices. Combat is adrenaline, fighting to stay alive, blood, death, grief, uncertainty what you are doing is right. It takes an emotional toll that can lead to poor choices. 
I repeat We do not leave our people behind


----------



## MarilynKnits (Aug 30, 2011)

GranmaD said:


> It is no wonder this country is in so much trouble. Too many like you whose brains are fried and have never grown beyond the ability to utter childlike nonsense and certainly can't understand intelligent adult words and sentences, but can only utter idiotic noises such as in your post, then idiots such as Ovomit will continue to be elected and the intelligent citizens, and yes they still exist which leaves you out, will suffer from your low information brainless actions.


Tell us what you really think. If you call it thinking. You are sucking in the crap that sources like Fox News feeds you and regurgitating it without it going past what passes for a brain. Sometimes I think the whole Fox news business is the plot of an anti American organization trying to divide the country and bring us down. And relying on people who don't take the time to check facts and have that hard seed of hatred in their souls.


----------



## ute4kp (Nov 6, 2012)

alifletcher said:


> Half white trash is not a racial slur come on !


It most certainly is.


----------



## ute4kp (Nov 6, 2012)

bldgmom said:


> You're absolutely right! And this phony never passes up a photo op!


All presidents have official photographers that follow them around.


----------



## ute4kp (Nov 6, 2012)

kathimc said:


> This all started with a photo-shoot of the Obama's. That's what it was... a photo-shoot. Everything about this guy is a sham... including his illustrious university years, his birth, his entire background is a fallacy. No records of him ever doing ANYTHING!!! until he was fed to the American media and American people by the thugs running the state of Illinois and the city of Chicago.


Ho hum. More foxy sham talk.


----------



## MarilynKnits (Aug 30, 2011)

mojave said:


> *We do not leave our people behind*
> 
> I am a veteran, served both as enlisted and as an officer. We do not leave wounded behind. We try to carry out our deceased comrades. Failing that, we try to recover the bodies of our comrades - sometimes decades later. We try to bring the deserters home. Sometimes it is for punishment and also because we know fear can lead a soldier to make poor choices. Combat is adrenaline, fighting to stay alive, blood, death, grief, uncertainty what you are doing is right. It takes an emotional toll that can lead to poor choices.
> I repeat We do not leave our people behind


My adored and precious late father in law served as a medic in France in WWI and said the medics risked their lives and safety to bring out all ALL the wounded and the dead.

That has continued to be the policy of our military. Of course there are those who want to believe lies that put our country in a bad light, don't confuse them with facts.


----------



## GranmaD (Jul 29, 2012)

I have never seen or heard anyone with his/her head so deeply buried in he sand. The media tells you nothing, only that which will further their leftist agenda. Wake up!


----------



## ElyseKnox (Sep 16, 2011)

Granma, I applaud you for speaking up. Unfortunately, you won't find very many supporters here no matter how well you might document your comments. The preponderance of posts are from people who see BHO in a very positive light and there is a noticeable group among them who will label ANY non-pro comment as 'hateful' or 'racially motivated' or with some other equally dismissive term--even when the comment is solely an opposite opinion and is not in the least what they claim. Their actions say that they believe that only their comments are 'right.'



GranmaD said:


> He has earned every derogatory remark written and spoken about him. Benghazi, Solendra (sp?), executive actions that are contrary to what the Constitution grants the President, raising the national debt to the trillion dollar mark, releasing 5 terrorists in return for a deserter, secretly reinstating relations with a terrorist nation (Cuba) and I could go on and on. But why bother. I seem to be addressing some very low information members of KP. For heaven's sake. Don't you people read the news or if you do don't you understand what you are reading!!!!


----------



## anjoda (Mar 9, 2013)

MarilynKnits said:


> You will probably not hear back from the Obama bashers. They are doubtless in hospital after suffering apoplectic seizures. They really have no ammunition to respond to factual information in kind.


MarilynKnits,
You are so right. Nothing like laying out the facts for them to see. I'm glad you noticed that the "appalled" kPer never replied.
Jean


----------



## mh1953 (Aug 14, 2014)

flohel said:


> Re Hilltopper I agree. I also notice that the most hateful comments come from self proclaimed Christians.


I am a Christian and I haven't said a word about the photo. Just saying....


----------



## GranmaD (Jul 29, 2012)

Thank you! No sense in continuing this topic. These people have their heads buried too deep in their knitting to see and understand what is going on In our government.


----------



## NJG (Dec 2, 2011)

bldgmom said:


> You're absolutely right! And this phony never passes up a photo op!


Oh, you mean like Bush on the aircraft carrier in the jump suit when he said mission accomplished and the war went on for what, 10 more years? Talk about a photo op. He really went for for it here. Top gun duds and all. Now this is a real phony.


----------



## rocky1991 (May 8, 2011)

NJG said:


> Just in case some of you missed it the republicans in the house passed a new rule about social security. If anyone reading this receives social security disability, you could be receiving a 20% cut in benefits starting in 2016 and you have the republicans to thank for it.


My husband has SSI, can't tell you how happy we are with the Republicans! That is a lot of many they are taking away.


----------



## rocky1991 (May 8, 2011)

rocky1991 said:


> Perhaps it is because of you less than intelligent comment?


to pattibe...........that was meant for someone else, so sorry you received it.


----------



## NJG (Dec 2, 2011)

Mitch McConnell who has blamed the president for everything, for the last 6 years, now says it is the republicans who have turned the economy around. What?


----------



## ElyseKnox (Sep 16, 2011)

Thanks for your post, but I won't hold my breath that most posters will even acknowledge them--other than maybe calling you either racist or a hater--or both.



kathimc said:


> A List of Obamas Constitutional Violations
> 
> Posted on March 27, 2013	by Truth Seeker
> 
> ...


----------



## NJG (Dec 2, 2011)

rocky1991 said:


> My husband has SSI, can't tell you how happy we are with the Republicans! That is a lot of many they are taking away.


And you know it is only the beginning. They will start with this and move on to the the rest of us. They want to get rid of ss and medicare. They are trying to make sure they get the presidency back in 2016 and then with complete control we will be done and life as we know it will be over. I wonder how many of the republicans that voted this last November, voted for this?


----------



## NJG (Dec 2, 2011)

ElyseKnox said:


> Thanks for your post, but I won't hold my breath that most posters will even acknowledge them--other than maybe calling you either racist or a hater--or both.


No most of us won't waste our time reading them as there has been no fact checking done and it came from a right wing blog.


----------



## lins (Jan 8, 2013)

rocky1991 said:


> My husband has SSI, can't tell you how happy we are with the Republicans! That is a lot of many they are taking away.


Yes, the Republicans will be taking away a lot more...hang on to your bank balance.


----------



## misellen (Mar 8, 2013)

lins said:


> Yes, the Republicans will be taking away a lot more...hang on to your bank balance.


NO you had better get out of the bank and bury it in the back yard.


----------



## Dori Sage (Feb 7, 2011)

It is so unfortunate that so many Repugnatins vote against their own interest. Do they really believe in "trickle down economy" after all this time? Do they really believe that the "job creators" are in fact creating jobs?

Get your heads out of your - you know where.


----------



## lins (Jan 8, 2013)

misellen said:


> NO you had better get out of the bank and bury it in the back yard.


True enough!!!


----------



## NJG (Dec 2, 2011)

Dori Sage said:


> It is so unfortunate that so many Repugnatins vote against their own interest. Do they really believe in "trickle down economy" after all this time? Do they really believe that the "job creators" are in fact creating jobs?
> 
> Get your heads out of your - you know where.


But you notice when we discuss things like this, they don't comment. When you ask questions about income inequality and is it good for the country, no comment. Mention getting rid of SS and Medicare and no comment. Do they just sit on their butts and think it won't happen? I don't understand.


----------



## lins (Jan 8, 2013)

NJG said:


> But you notice when we discuss things like this, they don't comment. When you ask questions about income inequality and is it good for the country, no comment. Mention getting rid of SS and Medicare and no comment. Do they just sit on their butts and think it won't happen? I don't understand.


I don't think they know what they are talking about. I think they listen to their friends or husbands and parrot it out there. When they spout off and then get challenged they have no clue what to say so they hide or say something like Michelle Obama is ugly. Who does that sort of thing? I often wonder if their kids hear stuff like that. I sure hope not. Is that how bullys are born? Who knows.

Then there's the woman on the news that was asked if she liked Obama Care. Hate it, will destroy us all she said. So what do you think of the Affordable Care Act, she was asked. Love it, she said.

...just plain stupid, lazy and ignorant.


----------



## MarilynKnits (Aug 30, 2011)

lins said:


> I don't think they know what they are talking about. I think they listen to their friends or husbands and parrot it out there. When they spout off and then get challenged they have no clue what to say so they hide or say something like Michelle Obama is ugly. Who does that sort of thing? I often wonder if their kids hear stuff like that. I sure hope not. Is that how bullys are born? Who knows.
> 
> Then there's the woman on the news that was asked if she liked Obama Care. Hate it, will destroy us all she said. So what do you think of the Affordable Care Act, she was asked. Love it, she said.
> 
> ...just plain stupid, lazy and ignorant.


Remember the songs in South Pacific? One about having to be Carefully Taught (to hate) and the other, "Gonna Wash that Brain Right Outta my Head" which seems to apply here (apologies to Rodgers and Hammerstein).


----------



## pattibe (Feb 2, 2012)

rocky1991 said:


> to pattibe...........that was meant for someone else, so sorry you received it.


 :thumbup:


----------



## kiwi girl (Jun 19, 2012)

It is a beautiful photo. I do not agree with his politics but this photo has nothing to do with politics, it is a photo of a husband respecting and loving his wife and I will say again it is a beautiful photo.


----------



## SAMkewel (Mar 5, 2011)

ute4kp said:


> It most certainly is.


I agree. Color isn't mentioned unless there is racial intent; why would it be?


----------



## rocky1991 (May 8, 2011)

NJG said:


> Mitch McConnell who has blamed the president for everything, for the last 6 years, now says it is the republicans who have turned the economy around. What?


Aren't the republicans wonderful??


----------



## grandmann (Feb 4, 2011)

rocky1991 said:


> Aren't the republicans wonderful??


I feel sorry for them they don't know any better.


----------



## MarilynKnits (Aug 30, 2011)

grandmann said:


> I feel sorry for them they don't know any better.


Oh, I am sure they know better. But in their arrogance they think if they tell large enough lies often enough they can fool the rest of us. Just because their blind sycophants believe whatever they are fed doesn't mean everybody is a fool.


----------



## lins (Jan 8, 2013)

kiwi girl said:


> It is a beautiful photo. I do not agree with his politics but this photo has nothing to do with politics, it is a photo of a husband respecting and loving his wife and I will say again it is a beautiful photo.


 :thumbup:


----------



## lins (Jan 8, 2013)

MarilynKnits said:


> Remember the songs in South Pacific? One about having to be Carefully Taught (to hate) and the other, "Gonna Wash that Brain Right Outta my Head" which seems to apply here (apologies to Rodgers and Hammerstein).


 :thumbup:


----------



## rocky1991 (May 8, 2011)

grandmann said:


> I feel sorry for them they don't know any better.


I really don't feel sorry for them, because they want to destroy the America we know. they are already beginning with a very vulnerable group, the disabled. Imagine cutting 20% from people who really need it? and do you think they will actually stop there?


----------



## lins (Jan 8, 2013)

Aubade said:


> Thank you. Obama and the First family are a great source of pride for this country, despite the haters who hated him the moment they saw the color of his skin or heard the ethnic sound of his full name.
> 
> Some criticism is legit in the sense that they just have ideological differences.
> 
> But the truth is the hatred of him goes beyond political disagreement. It IS rooted in racism much of the time. The picture of an elegant _black_ couple irks them to no end and it is the only thing that can explain the irrationality of their hateful response to a self-evidently beautiful picture o our Commander in Chief and the First Lady.


2015 already and yet racism is still front and centre. I sometimes think it's getting worse these past years but then again the bigots didn't really have a public target. So sad.


----------



## grandmann (Feb 4, 2011)

People who you would never think would be Republicans they are and there is no way anyone will change their minds. People who would benefit from the Democrats vote against their own self interest. Sometimes I just don't understand these people. 

Some of their reasons they voted the way they did because their parents were Republicans and that's the way they are going to vote. Sometimes it gets to be a religious issue they listen to what their Church tells them. Republicans will bring up the abortion issue every time there is a election but once in office, will they do anything about it. I knew people who didn't vote at all because they were torn apart by religious beliefs and what they thought would benefit the country.


----------



## Knitted by Nan (Aug 3, 2013)

kathimc said:


> It is not a beautiful picture.. it is a "make-believe" picture.. just like our President.


Hey, I just discovered some more pictures you might like to see. They are so sweet I just knew you would like everyone to share them. Are these make believe pictures too.

One of those guys, the one not wearing the cultural head dress looks familiar, perhaps you can tell us his name, please?????????


----------



## Nussa (Jul 7, 2011)

And aren't you lucky that you live in America. A country that does allow you to spew everything that comes into your childish fried brain. I have found that people who act and speak as you do, have lost all control of in your life. And can't help thinking and acting as you do. And for that, those of us who don't live on hatred feel sorry for you. I personally don't take anything you say seriously because I feel you really believe what you are saying, even if it is wrong and extremely childish. Remember the old saying, Sticks & stones. If other peoples words and ideas bother you, than you have a lot of growing up to do. Good luck to you, because you really are going to need it. 


GranmaD said:


> It is no wonder this country is in so much trouble. Too many like you whose brains are fried and have never grown beyond the ability to utter childlike nonsense and certainly can't understand intelligent adult words and sentences, but can only utter idiotic noises such as in your post, then idiots such as Ovomit will continue to be elected and the intelligent citizens, and yes they still exist which leaves you out, will suffer from your low information brainless actions.


----------



## Knitted by Nan (Aug 3, 2013)

grandmann said:


> 32 pages of it, what's wrong with these people. Our country is ran by a Democratic society. It takes the majority of the vote for a person to become President. When George W. Busch was in office if we dare say anything bad about him the answer would be where is your patriotism. Now since its on the other foot, its has been nothing but bashing on this poor man & his family. I must admit Our President stood up what he thought was right without getting mad, he always handle himself like a gentleman.
> 
> I live in WI am I happy that Governor Walker is our Governor, not exactly. Do I bash him or do I give him the respect that he is holding the office, Yes. Maybe my vote will make a difference next time around. I will continue on voting for the man I think is right for the job.
> 
> Let the Vote count and accept it until changes can be made. In the meantime accept it and work for the country and its people.


 :thumbup: from an Aussie who is watching this thread and shaking her head. Your last sentence says it all. If you do not like the President, who was elected twice, then use your power at the ballot box and vote at the next election. As you do not have compulsory voting in the USA I wonder how many of those people who dislike President Obama so intensely actually voted in 2012 and 2008.


----------



## rujam (Aug 19, 2011)

EveMCooke said:


> :thumbup: from an Aussie who is watching this thread and shaking her head. Your last sentence says it all. If you do not like the President, who was elected twice, then use your power at the ballot box and vote at the next election. As you do not have compulsory voting in the USA I wonder how many of those people who dislike President Obama so intensely actually voted in 2012 and 2008.


I agree with you. We have a state election at the end of the month and as I have only lived up here since Aug. 2014 I don't know the candidates. I met one at the Senior Citizens' Christmas party and he was very personable but then most of them are.


----------



## Knitted by Nan (Aug 3, 2013)

GranmaD said:


> It is no wonder this country is in so much trouble. Too many like you whose brains are fried and have never grown beyond the ability to utter childlike nonsense and certainly can't understand intelligent adult words and sentences, but can only utter idiotic noises such as in your post, then idiots such as Ovomit will continue to be elected and the intelligent citizens, and yes they still exist which leaves you out, will suffer from your low information brainless actions.


And you have, "grown beyond the ability to utter childlike nonsense and can understand intelligent adult words and sentences"? Honestly, Your statement "then idiots such as Ovomit" would perhaps suggest otherwise.

Name calling such as this is not necessary. Do you ever stop to think people outside the USA read this forum? Do you think your comment post a good picture of the citizens of the USA?


----------



## Knitted by Nan (Aug 3, 2013)

lins said:


> Ovomit?


Yes, and from someone who accuses others of


> whose brains are fried and have never grown beyond the ability to utter childlike nonsense and certainly can't understand intelligent adult words and sentences, but can only utter idiotic noises such as in your post,


. It is so refreshing to read such intelligent comments from such a mature and well educated poster. Now where is that sarcasm emoticon?


----------



## Knitted by Nan (Aug 3, 2013)

NJG said:


> Oh, you mean like Bush on the aircraft carrier in the jump suit when he said mission accomplished and the war went on for what, 10 more years? Talk about a photo op. He really went for for it here. Top gun duds and all. Now this is a real phony.


Oh dear me, now you have shattered my illusion. You mean that President Bush did not fly that aeroplane on combat missions? I am sure he was the 'top gun' on all the combat missions he flew on.


----------



## Knitted by Nan (Aug 3, 2013)

lins said:


> Yes, the Republicans will be taking away a lot more...hang on to your bank balance.


Better still, keep your surplus cash hidden in an old soc under the mattress. It might be safer there, no greedy hands from the right reaching out to grab it.


----------



## Knitted by Nan (Aug 3, 2013)

misellen said:


> NO you had better get out of the bank and bury it in the back yard.


 :thumbup: :thumbup: great minds think alike.


----------



## lins (Jan 8, 2013)

EveMCooke said:


> Better still, keep your surplus cash hidden in an old soc under the mattress. It might be safer there, no greedy hands from the right reaching out to grab it.


 :thumbup:


----------



## Knitted by Nan (Aug 3, 2013)

EveMCooke said:


> Hey, I just discovered some more pictures you might like to see. They are so sweet I just knew you would like everyone to share them. Are these make believe pictures too.
> 
> One of those guys, the one not wearing the cultural head dress looks familiar, perhaps you can tell us his name, please?????????


Just found another one of interest . Someone, somewhere posted a picture of Joe Biden kissing a young girl and the comments were "yuck, horrible, keep him away from little girls," ets. Well the recipient of Bush's hand around the neck or the recipient of his kiss do not look overjoyed either.


----------



## SQM (Jun 22, 2012)

EveMCooke said:


> Just found another one of interest . Someone, somewhere posted a picture of Joe Biden kissing a young girl and the comments were "yuck, horrible, keep him away from little girls," ets. Well the recipient of Bush's hand around the neck or the recipient of his kiss do not look overjoyed either.


And don't forget Bush's laying of hands on Angela Merkel. I loved how she cringed.


----------



## burgher (Feb 9, 2013)

ZaaZaa3 said:


> I thought this was a knitting/crochet forum not a political venue. We all have thoughts on OP but my are not appropriate for a knitting forum. Let's stick to the items at hand not political statements!


This is a non knitting forum. It's chit chat.


----------



## SQM (Jun 22, 2012)

joeysomma said:


> Jim Crow laws were written and enforced by the liberal Democrats. Not Christian conservatives.


Weren't they dixiecrats? I don't think they were liberal. I do think they were Southern Racists.


----------



## rocky1991 (May 8, 2011)

joeysomma said:


> Jim Crow laws were written and enforced by the liberal Democrats. Not Christian conservatives.


I suppose the roles have been revered, now the conservative republicans are bringing back Jim Crow along with other failed policies. Tell us about Gov Brownbeck and his experiment in lowering taxes to the point where his state is in the hole for 240 million. His trickle down theory has not worked and is now counting on Obama's Medicaid expansion to help pay for his budget failures. He might even have to raise taxes just like Ron Reagan.


----------



## burgher (Feb 9, 2013)

This is getting funny. Religion and Politics. Two arguments that can't be won.


----------



## SQM (Jun 22, 2012)

joeysomma said:


> They were Southern, Racist, and Liberal Democrats, like Robert Byrd. Members of the KKK who were Democrats.
> 
> There was a Democratic President and a Democratic controlled congress for most of those years. So why didn't they do something about it. Woodrow Wilson, a Democrat, was one who started the separate but equal. You know; black drinking fountains, and white drinking fountains; black bathrooms, and white bathrooms; blacks sat at the back of the bus, and whites at the front; blacks had to use the back door, and whites at the front. etc.


Okay. But things switched around in the '60s with the Republicans becoming more conservative and the Dems becoming more liberal. All the rats of the pre-Civil Rights Era were Dems but that was 50 years ago.


----------



## Jeannne (Jan 25, 2013)

So sorry to be coming to this thread after 36 pages. 

I must recommend the book: "The Argument Culture Moving from Debate to Dialogue" by Deborah Tannen. I've only read the first 16 pages just today, but already I know that the author is speaking with authority on why we don't have an exchange of ideas today, only argument. All issues are seen as one side against the other. These posts are a perfect example of the premise of the book.

My thanks to those who have taken the time to call out those who parrot what they hear or read without ever using any little bit of critical thinking to examine what is fact and what is opinion.


----------



## bellestarr12 (Mar 26, 2011)

SAMkewel said:


> And you apparently don't read your Bible. Where DID you find your bigoted God?


Exactly. As this goes on - and on and on and on - certain posts, like those by kittykatzmom, kathimc, etc. make me think of a certain famous historic quotation:

If you tell a lie big enough and keep repeating it, people will eventually come to believe it. The lie can be maintained only for such time as the State can shield the people from the political, economic and/or military consequences of the lie. It thus becomes vitally important for the State to use all of its powers to repress dissent, for the truth is the mortal enemy of the lie, and thus by extension, the truth is the greatest enemy of the State. - Joseph Goebbels

For "the State," in this historical moment, we can substitute the party currently in control of both houses of Congress, or rather the moneyed interests in control of those politicians, who don't care one bit about you or me, or even the FOX News-watchers who are so happy to swallow their lies and the greed, bigotry (including religious bigotry), and racism that are behind them.


----------



## SAMkewel (Mar 5, 2011)

grandmann said:


> People who you would never think would be Republicans they are and there is no way anyone will change their minds. People who would benefit from the Democrats vote against their own self interest. Sometimes I just don't understand these people.
> 
> Some of their reasons they voted the way they did because their parents were Republicans and that's the way they are going to vote. Sometimes it gets to be a religious issue they listen to what their Church tells them. Republicans will bring up the abortion issue every time there is a election but once in office, will they do anything about it. I knew people who didn't vote at all because they were torn apart by religious beliefs and what they thought would benefit the country.


My childhood family on both sides were confirmed Republicans for generations. So far as I know, a cousin on my mother's side and I are the only Democrats. As I think back, I remember being on the streets of a nearby city when the announcement of the death of FDR was announced via a PA system, and my mother said, "Good, I'm glad he's dead." I was shocked, I would have been six years old. When I asked her why she would say such a thing she said it was because he was a horrible man. When I asked what he did that was horrible, I got slapped in the mouth. That was always what she did when she had no answer, and that was the last time I ever asked a question out loud until after I left home at 17. By the time I was eight, I realized she was only parroting what she heard my father's parents say. After that realization, I did my own research; I still do at 76. My point is that so far as I could tell, none of them ever did any real thinking about much of anything, it was all passed down from one generation to the next and never questioned. That has always seemed bizarre to me, but I think it's still going on in many areas of the US.


----------



## Jeannne (Jan 25, 2013)

joeysomma said:


> I asked this question more than 12 hours ago. You have several posts since then. I guess you do not have an answer. Since you cannot tell what is half truth, they must all be true.


No, joeysomma, your logic is flawed. Just because someone has not pointed out the half truths does not mean that "they must all be true". It could mean that it is not worth the time to analyze your information, especially if it is coming from a biased source. And from reading your previous replies I doubt that your mind is open to any kind of considerations that just maybe you might be wrong.


----------



## Nussa (Jul 7, 2011)

Matthew 7:1 Judge not lest ye be judged. You wouldn't want to be accused of being UN-christian now would you???


joeysomma said:


> That is because the Liberal Democrats were the ones responsible for the segregation, lynching of the pre-50's. Not the Christian Conservative. So I guess you are right. The Liberal Democrats were very unChristian.


----------



## susanmos2000 (May 10, 2011)

joeysomma said:


> Jim Crow laws were written and enforced by the liberal Democrats. Not Christian conservatives.


Whether that's true or not is entirely beside the point. In the pre-50s era virtually all Southern school children--liberals, Christian conservatives, Dixiecrats, what have you--were subjected to mandatory Bible study and Christian prayer. As far as shaping moral values goes, the end result--545 lynchings in Mississippi between 1882 and 1930--showed such efforts to be a complete failure.


----------



## SQM (Jun 22, 2012)

joeysomma said:


> It is the parent's responsibility to teach morals. Which they could do if the public school was not teaching immorality. Immorality like the homosexual * life-style* is as acceptable as heterosexual; two parents of the same sex is the same as a mother and a father; having sex with various partners as teenagers is acceptable; having an abortion without the parents knowledge is acceptable. Smoking, drinking, and doing drugs is something everyone does.


Gee - you are no fun. A Debbie Downer.


----------



## SAMkewel (Mar 5, 2011)

joeysomma said:


> My God is a just God. He calls sin, sin. And unless you accept the fact that you are a sinner, as I am. And ask Jesus to forgive your sins, as I have. You will never see the Kingdom of God. There will never be a second chance once you are dead. Jesus said: I am the Way, the Truth, and the Life, no one comes to the Father but by me. John 14:6.


If you read your Bible, how is it that you don't know the New Testament is the New Covenant between man and God and that the model of appropriate Christian behavior is that of Jesus Christ, not the blood, guts, money seeking, and sins in the Old Testament , and some in the New, that so many "Christians" continue to model. Nowhere did Christ tell anyone to rip off the poor, cast them into the streets to rot, fail to forgive over and over again, encourage anyone to force public prayer (in fact, the message was to pray in your closet where God alone could hear and see). I think many conservatives should be called "Godists" so that they would have to stop hiding behind what they call "Christianity." Nowhere in the Bible does Christ behave like most of the "Christians" of today. And in order to avoid confusion, real Christians should become "Jesus Followers," so as not to be mistaken for ripoff artists like televangelists, and preachers and congregations who love to make a big show of their holier than thou piousness as they go about looking down on everyone who doesn't bow to their will. I could go on and on, but I won't because you won't get it. Read your Bible. The New Testament part. The Old Testament makes a great history book of who supposedly begat whom, and of how sinful mankind can be, like that matters. Try living love instead of hatred. Towards everyone, not just your clones. You're more interested in ancient laws, outward compliance, and being judgmental than you are in caring about anyone. Go ahead and tell me I'm going to hell if I'm not like you, because I sincerely doubt a loving God would tolerate such a state of being. I've been through enough hell here on earth that it doesn't scare me in the least, if that's your intent, and it surely hasn't been at the hands of the disadvantaged, the LGBT communities, the poor, those who have had abortions, etc., etc. Do you begin to get an idea as to why I have no use for formal "religion" or Bible thumpers? Because so many of them have no love for others, only for appearances and the opportunities to put down anyone who isn't exactly like them, in the name of God.


----------



## SQM (Jun 22, 2012)

SAMkewel said:


> If you read your Bible, how is it that you don't know the New Testament is the New Covenant between man and God and that the model of appropriate Christian behavior is that of Jesus Christ, not the blood, guts, money seeking, and sins in the Old Testament , and some in the New, that so many "Christians" continue to model. Nowhere did Christ tell anyone to rip off the poor, cast them into the streets to rot, fail to forgive over and over again, encourage anyone to force public prayer (in fact, the message was to pray in your closet where God alone could hear and see). I think many conservatives should be called "Godists" so that they would have to stop hiding behind what they call "Christianity." Nowhere in the Bible does Christ behave like most of the "Christians" of today. And in order to avoid confusion, real Christians should become "Jesus Followers," so as not to be mistaken for ripoff artists like televangelists, and preachers and congregations who love to make a big show of their holier than thou piousness as they go about looking down on everyone who doesn't bow to their will. I could go on and on, but I won't because you won't get it. Read your Bible. The New Testament part. The Old Testament makes a great history book of who supposedly begat whom, and of how sinful mankind can be, like that matters. Try living love instead of hatred. Towards everyone, not just your clones. You're more interested in ancient laws, outward compliance, and being judgmental than you are in caring about anyone. Go ahead and tell me I'm going to hell if I'm not like you, because I sincerely doubt a loving God would tolerate such a state of being. I've been through enough hell here on earth that it doesn't scare me in the least, if that's your intent, and it surely hasn't been at the hands of the disadvantaged, the LGBT communities, the poor, those who have had abortions, etc., etc. Do you begin to get an idea as to why I have no use for formal "religion" or Bible thumpers? Because so many of them have no love for others, only for appearances and the opportunities to put down anyone who isn't exactly like them, in the name of God.


Excuse me but what does "money-seeking" imply in the Hebrew Bible? Remember that Jesus would only have been familiar with the "money-seeking" Hebrew Bible and the idea of love is a Jewish concept that carried over to the Christian Bible.


----------



## susanmos2000 (May 10, 2011)

joeysomma said:


> That is about 12 a year, So only one group of KKK can do that in a year. So how many people were actually involved in the lynching?


I'm not sure--why don't you start counting?


----------



## SQM (Jun 22, 2012)

joeysomma said:


> Study the history of our country after the Civil War until World War II. Compare how the Minorities were treated by the ones in power. As the Democrats took more and more power in the government, until both houses and the presidency were controlled by Democrats. The bad treatment of minorities increased. It did not change until the Republicans regained control in the 50's, then JFK, and LBJ was forced to continue.
> 
> I am not being judgmental. Just stating history.


What did Eisenhower do for minorities during his terms?


----------



## cookiequeen (Jun 15, 2011)

joeysomma said:


> It is the parent's responsibility to teach morals. Which they could do if the public school was not teaching immorality. Immorality like the homosexual * life-style* is as acceptable as heterosexual; two parents of the same sex is the same as a mother and a father; having sex with various partners as teenagers is acceptable; having an abortion without the parents knowledge is acceptable. Smoking, drinking, and doing drugs is something everyone does.


Boy, those schools in Wisconsin must be dens of iniquity!


----------



## Dori Sage (Feb 7, 2011)

bellestarr12 said:


> Exactly. As this goes on - and on and on and on - certain posts, like those by kittykatzmom, kathimc, etc. make me think of a certain famous historic quotation:
> 
> If you tell a lie big enough and keep repeating it, people will eventually come to believe it. The lie can be maintained only for such time as the State can shield the people from the political, economic and/or military consequences of the lie. It thus becomes vitally important for the State to use all of its powers to repress dissent, for the truth is the mortal enemy of the lie, and thus by extension, the truth is the greatest enemy of the State. - Joseph Goebbels
> 
> For "the State," in this historical moment, we can substitute the party currently in control of both houses of Congress, or rather the moneyed interests in control of those politicians, who don't care one bit about you or me, or even the FOX News-watchers who are so happy to swallow their lies and the greed, bigotry (including religious bigotry), and racism that are behind them.


And here folks is another quotation: Guess who the author of this one is

"I WILL PROVIDE A CAUSE FOR THE WAR WHETHER TRUE OR NOT IS IRRELEVANT FOR PROPAGANDA PURPOSES."

Adolph Hitler
It is inscribed on the walls in Auschwitz.


----------



## SGMMontgomery (Mar 23, 2014)

Wow...what a strange conversation.

I would jump in on the discussion, but I think that 90% of the posters on this thread have no understanding of how to debate a subject without making it personal. 

So I will address this: Just because I don't agree with you does not mean you are right and I am wrong. It doesn't make me a hate-monger or a racist or negative or whatever name-calling you sling at me. A person really can dislike someone based on the differences in their politics, ethical, and moral beliefs...regardless of their sex, sexual preference, color, religion, etc. But it seems that many of you here believe that if a person dislikes our current president...they do so because he's black. I propose that its that type of thinking that promotes racism by shoving in places where it is not warranted. For those posters who are thinking that way...I encourage them to explore the possibility that this president is not some sort of demi-god and that he (like all presidents) has made some moves that other citizens do not agree with and therefore do not like him...based on those moves. 

FYI...for those trying to have an intellectual and factual discussion...I suggest you give it up. Looks like you are wasting your time. It seems that when faced with logical questions...most of these posters respond with emotion vs facts and logic. You cannot have a productive discussion based on emotion...you can only have an emotional discussion which is basically useless...unless everyone has the same emotional response to the subject. Logic and facts, on the other hand, being used by both participants will bring about understanding and many times compromise...if not agreement.

But...not happening here.


----------



## sumpleby (Aug 3, 2013)

The Dixiecrats were as far from liberal as it is possible to get. In fact, IIRC, they quickly switched to Republican when the real liberals began pushing through civil rights.


----------



## damemary (Mar 14, 2012)

I'm very proud that Barack Obama is our President. The picture is lovely. He's a true gentleman and gives a fine impression to those able to see. His family shows discipline and values also. That must be very difficult when you're in the limelight 24/7.


----------



## SAMkewel (Mar 5, 2011)

SQM said:


> Excuse me but what does "money-seeking" imply in the Hebrew Bible? Remember that Jesus would only have been familiar with the "money-seeking" Hebrew Bible and the idea of love is a Jewish concept that carried over to the Christian Bible.


I don't know Hebrew, only American English and a smattering of a couple of other languages. I don't understand what your point is since I have no Jewish religious education, and have not had enough exposure to those who have had. Those with Jewish ethnicity I've known happened to be atheists so I don't know whether they had knowledge of Jewish religion or simply were not exposed either. Those kinds of discussions didn't take place in my experience 60 years ago, or even 30 years ago . This was true for me in the western and northwestern US and in the midwest. Other regions may have been different, and if so I wish I had been there.


----------



## SAMkewel (Mar 5, 2011)

Dori Sage said:


> And here folks is another quotation: Guess who the author of this one is
> 
> "I WILL PROVIDE A CAUSE FOR THE WAR WHETHER TRUE OR NOT IS IRRELEVANT FOR PROPAGANDA PURPOSES."
> 
> ...


----------



## meetoo (Nov 20, 2011)

Designer1234 said:


> needless to say, we knew there would be a group who find it impossible to say anything good about him. He is a good father, a good husband and if he had ever been given a chance he would have accomplisted much more. When huge road blocks are placed in his way before he even was elected it is pretty hard to deal with it. I feel sad for him as he can't answer back to the nasty dreadful things said about him.
> 
> I don't know if he would have been a good President if the opposition had tried to help with some of his plans instead of making sure that everything that could possibly done to stop every action they could - he was never given a chance. I think he did very well considering the attacks to his wife, children and every thing he tried to do. jmo. He seems to be a graceful, fine man in my opinion- I don't think he did too badly looking at it as a Canadian who is very interested in the US Political system.


I too, am Canadian, and agree with you. Many make comments about what a fine looking couple they are, and that is so true. I remember when they danced at the first inauguration (sp?!) there eyes never left each others...oh so romantic! there is a quote I've heard many times: "you can please some of the people some of the time and some of the people never"....I've heard many versions of this quote... and it always applies. We don't always agree with our Prime Minister or the members of Parliament, but they were elected to do a job, and we do get to vote them out in the next election...... now back to knitting.!!!!


----------



## meetoo (Nov 20, 2011)

SGMMontgomery said:


> Wow...what a strange conversation.
> 
> I would jump in on the discussion, but I think that 90% of the posters on this thread have no understanding of how to debate a subject without making it personal.
> 
> ...


well said.


----------



## damemary (Mar 14, 2012)

Viva Canadians!



meetoo said:


> I too, am Canadian, and agree with you. Many make comments about what a fine looking couple they are, and that is so true. I remember when they danced at the first inauguration (sp?!) there eyes never left each others...oh so romantic! there is a quote I've heard many times: "you can please some of the people some of the time and some of the people never"....I've heard many versions of this quote... and it always applies. We don't always agree with our Prime Minister or the members of Parliament, but they were elected to do a job, and we do get to vote them out in the next election...... now back to knitting.!!!!


----------



## Lisa Wells (Sep 12, 2014)

Yes. It is a pretty picture. But things are not always as they seem. And because of this, the picture may bring up some negative emotions. Sad, but true.


----------



## emuears (Oct 13, 2012)

I


grandmann said:


> 32 pages of it, what's wrong with these people. Our country is ran by a Democratic society. It takes the majority of the vote for a person to become President. When George W. Busch was in office if we dare say anything bad about him the answer would be where is your patriotism. Now since its on the other foot, its has been nothing but bashing on this poor man & his family. I must admit Our President stood up what he thought was right without getting mad, he always handle himself like a gentleman.
> 
> I live in WI am I happy that Governor Walker is our Governor, not exactly. Do I bash him or do I give him the respect that he is holding the office, Yes. Maybe my vote will make a difference next time around. I will continue on voting for the man I think is right for the job.
> 
> Let the Vote count and accept it until changes can be made. In the meantime accept it and work for the country and its people.


I don't understand the hate mail that this picture has caused, it is after all just a photo. Your comment holds a lot of merit and I applaude you. I agree while you may not like the man for whatever reason surely you respect the position he holds. I came from a family of staunch labour men but I vote for who I choose, the one that I think will be better in the job. I like to think that I have never been a follower and look at all situations with an open mind.


----------



## flitri (Jun 13, 2011)

Aren't we lucky that in Australia and America we have the freedom to vote for our Politicians. If you don't like the Prime minister or the President then you can vote against them at the next polling day. You don't have to respect the person holding the position but respect the position that the person is holding. 
I don't agree with our Prime ministers politics but I wouldn't go slandering him as some have the American President here on this forum.


emuears said:


> I
> 
> I don't understand the hate mail that this picture has caused, it is after all just a photo. Your comment holds a lot of merit and I applaude you. I agree while you may not like the man for whatever reason surely you respect the position he holds. I came from a family of staunch labour men but I vote for who I choose, the one that I think will be better in the job. I like to think that I have never been a follower and look at all situations with an open mind.


----------



## Kitchenergal (Nov 13, 2013)

meetoo said:


> I too, am Canadian, and agree with you. Many make comments about what a fine looking couple they are, and that is so true. I remember when they danced at the first inauguration (sp?!) there eyes never left each others...oh so romantic! there is a quote I've heard many times: "you can please some of the people some of the time and some of the people never"....I've heard many versions of this quote... and it always applies. We don't always agree with our Prime Minister or the members of Parliament, but they were elected to do a job, and we do get to vote them out in the next election...... now back to knitting.!!!!


 :thumbup: :thumbup: :thumbup: :thumbup:


----------



## MarilynKnits (Aug 30, 2011)

EveMCooke said:


> And you have, "grown beyond the ability to utter childlike nonsense and can understand intelligent adult words and sentences"? Honestly, Your statement "then idiots such as Ovomit" would perhaps suggest otherwise.
> 
> Name calling such as this is not necessary. Do you ever stop to think people outside the USA read this forum? Do you think your comment post a good picture of the citizens of the USA?


It presents a picture of the stupidity and thoughtlessness the majority of us (remember, it was the majority who elected Mr. Obama twice; he did not rely on fiddly stuff in Florida and a court decision) have to sweep aside in the hopes that our other elected officials will follow their mandate to work for the good of the public.


----------



## MarilynKnits (Aug 30, 2011)

EveMCooke said:


> Oh dear me, now you have shattered my illusion. You mean that President Bush did not fly that aeroplane on combat missions? I am sure he was the 'top gun' on all the combat missions he flew on.


As genuinely so as Tom Cruise?


----------



## Knitted by Nan (Aug 3, 2013)

MarilynKnits said:


> As genuinely so as Tom Cruise?


I saw the film so I know that Tom Cruise was flying the plane. Of course he was top gun. :XD: :XD: :XD: You are not going to tell me that it was all an illusion. I am crying now as you are shattering my dreams.


----------



## MarilynKnits (Aug 30, 2011)

EveMCooke said:


> I saw the film so I know that Tom Cruise was flying the plane. Of course he was top gun. :XD: :XD: :XD: You are not going to tell me that it was all an illusion. I am crying now as you are shattering my dreams.


And William Shatner was taking the Enterprise into outer space.


----------



## misellen (Mar 8, 2013)

burgher said:


> This is getting funny. Religion and Politics. Two arguments that can't be won.


This has been funny starting with the first nasty remark. Some people do like to show their ignorance.


----------



## misellen (Mar 8, 2013)

It really is past time to shut this foolishness down. Bye Y'all.


----------



## Knitted by Nan (Aug 3, 2013)

MarilynKnits said:


> And William Shatner was taking the Enterprise into outer space.


Now funny you should mention that because I was having an in depth discussion on this very topic with several of my friends last night. Little Red Riding Hood said it was just a myth but I am inclined to agree with the tooth fairy that it is all true. The tooth fairy said that Rumpelstiltskin, her second cousin by her third marriage, was a crew member on the Enterprise so I think she should know what she is talking about. She has photos to prove it.


----------



## lins (Jan 8, 2013)

MarilynKnits said:


> And William Shatner was taking the Enterprise into outer space.


Lol!


----------



## bellestarr12 (Mar 26, 2011)

EveMCooke said:


> Now funny you should mention that because I was having an in depth discussion on this very topic with several of my friends last night. Little Red Riding Hood said it was just a myth but I am inclined to agree with the tooth fairy that it is all true. The tooth fairy said that Rumpelstiltskin, her second cousin by her third marriage, was a crew member on the Enterprise so I think she should know what she is talking about. She has photos to prove it.


 :thumbup: :thumbup: :thumbup: :thumbup: :thumbup:


----------



## grandmann (Feb 4, 2011)

damemary said:


> I'm very proud that Barack Obama is our President. The picture is lovely. He's a true gentleman and gives a fine impression to those able to see. His family shows discipline and values also. That must be very difficult when you're in the limelight 24/7.


 :thumbup: :thumbup: :thumbup:


----------



## grandmann (Feb 4, 2011)

cookiequeen said:


> Boy, those schools in Wisconsin must be dens of iniquity!


This is only a minority...you can't blame schools for changes in society. Ann from WI


----------



## meetoo (Nov 20, 2011)

bellestarr12 said:


> :thumbup: :thumbup: :thumbup: :thumbup: :thumbup:


----------



## meetoo (Nov 20, 2011)

how did we get from the first posting of a beautiful picture of The President and First Lady to homosexuals/heterosexuals lifestyles?!!! Enough already!!!!!


----------



## PaKnitter (Mar 7, 2011)

meetoo said:


> how did we get from the first posting of a beautiful picture of The President and First Lady to homosexuals/heterosexuals lifestyles?!!! Enough already!!!!!


Because there are a lot of crazy people with pointy sticks in their hands?


----------



## Dakota Sun (May 25, 2011)

All I can say is that I have no respect for any president who will not salute the flag and our military. Back to knitting and crocheting.


----------



## rocky1991 (May 8, 2011)

bellestarr12 said:


> Exactly. As this goes on - and on and on and on - certain posts, like those by kittykatzmom, kathimc, etc. make me think of a certain famous historic quotation:
> 
> If you tell a lie big enough and keep repeating it, people will eventually come to believe it. The lie can be maintained only for such time as the State can shield the people from the political, economic and/or military consequences of the lie. It thus becomes vitally important for the State to use all of its powers to repress dissent, for the truth is the mortal enemy of the lie, and thus by extension, the truth is the greatest enemy of the State. - Joseph Goebbels
> 
> For "the State," in this historical moment, we can substitute the party currently in control of both houses of Congress, or rather the moneyed interests in control of those politicians, who don't care one bit about you or me, or even the FOX News-watchers who are so happy to swallow their lies and the greed, bigotry (including religious bigotry), and racism that are behind them.


Thank you for posting. It won't do any good, but those of us who "think" and try to ferret out the "truth" we appreciate your post.


----------



## rocky1991 (May 8, 2011)

joeysomma said:


> That is because the Liberal Democrats were the ones responsible for the segregation, lynching of the pre-50's. Not the Christian Conservative. So I guess you are right. The Liberal Democrats were very unChristian.


Times change, people change only you don't change!


----------



## grandmann (Feb 4, 2011)

joeysomma said:


> Not a minority????? What do you think is the purpose of Common Core? It is *NOT* to improve the student's knowledge of Math and Science. Why do you think Planned Parenthood is coming into the schools to teach sex-ed?
> 
> I guess it is not the school building. It is the liberal college professors that are turning out liberal teachers to teach in the public schools. Then it is the Federal government that has taken control of the schools away from the local people.


What part of WI are you coming from, I'm from the Green Bay area.


----------



## damemary (Mar 14, 2012)

Intermezzo said:


> Anyone one that thinks that homosexuality is merely a lifestyle is by default saying that they have 'chosen' their heterosexual lifestyle.
> 
> It's quite brave of you to come out of the closet to let us know you chose heterosexuality_ when what you REALLY want to do is munch on rugs._


 :XD: :XD: :XD: :XD: :XD: :XD: :XD: I laughed out loud. NOW I understand.


----------



## rocky1991 (May 8, 2011)

joeysomma said:


> It is the parent's responsibility to teach morals. Which they could do if the public school was not teaching immorality. Immorality like the homosexual * life-style* is as acceptable as heterosexual; two parents of the same sex is the same as a mother and a father; having sex with various partners as teenagers is acceptable; having an abortion without the parents knowledge is acceptable. Smoking, drinking, and doing drugs is something everyone does.


Your ideas are too ridiculous to answer.


----------



## rocky1991 (May 8, 2011)

joeysomma said:


> Where is this happening? What specific laws have they brought back to restrict minorities? I am not familiar with Brownbeck.


What about the new laws being proposed in many states that are pro discrimination? Look Brownbeck up, a true Republican, lowered all corporate taxes, and low and behold his state is not growing, jobs are not being created and he has a major deficit. He is actually using Medicaid expansion money to help fill the budget gap. thank you ACA! and Obama!


----------



## damemary (Mar 14, 2012)

This tells us something, but I'm tired of the same old same old.

Good to see you rocky.



rocky1991 said:


> Times change, people change only you don't change!


----------



## damemary (Mar 14, 2012)

Or too convoluted to get a start on.



rocky1991 said:


> Your ideas are too ridiculous to answer.


----------



## damemary (Mar 14, 2012)

Melissa Allington said:


> And no one with any sense can respect someone who's actually deluded enough to believe that Obama will not salute the flag and our military.
> 
> Again, this is another demonstration of how the "criticisms" of Obama are steeped in willful disinformation and lies and therefore are not about HONEST disagreement. People INVENT reasons to criticize because they are trying to hide their REAL reasons for not respecting him.
> 
> Thanks for demonstrating once again that the "criticisms" about Obama are often completely irrational and are based upon something much more hateful and personal.


 :thumbup: :thumbup: :thumbup: :thumbup: But it is truly shameful.


----------



## rocky1991 (May 8, 2011)

joeysomma said:


> Not a minority????? What do you think is the purpose of Common Core? It is *NOT* to improve the student's knowledge of Math and Science. Why do you think Planned Parenthood is coming into the schools to teach sex-ed?
> 
> I guess it is not the school building. It is the liberal college professors that are turning out liberal teachers to teach in the public schools. Then it is the Federal government that has taken control of the schools away from the local people.


Reality get in your way Joey?


----------



## rocky1991 (May 8, 2011)

damemary said:


> This tells us something, but I'm tired of the same old same old.
> 
> Good to see you rocky.


Hi Dame, Why do we bother? Nothing gets through. It is difficult to refute lies told over and over and are believed by ignorant people.


----------



## damemary (Mar 14, 2012)

Interesting train of thought. Thanks for the distraction from the same old.



Intermezzo said:


> Because they're trying to distract from their bigotry of Obama, by changing the subject to their own latent homosexuality.
> 
> It's the usual shell game of bigotry they play.


----------



## damemary (Mar 14, 2012)

rocky1991 said:


> Reality get in your way Joey?


Each and every time, but she just stumbles over it and trudges on.


----------



## damemary (Mar 14, 2012)

It makes me feel better to answer lies and not let them stand as truth. U2?



rocky1991 said:


> Hi Dame, Why do we bother? Nothing gets through. It is difficult to refute lies told over and over and are believed by ignorant people.


----------



## damemary (Mar 14, 2012)

And Charlton Heston parted the Red Sea just before he became spokesperson for NRA.



MarilynKnits said:


> And William Shatner was taking the Enterprise into outer space.


----------



## damemary (Mar 14, 2012)

Who you going to believe, Ghostbusters? Some people grow out of fairy tales and others prefer to cling to what they hear.

Of course, photos cinch the deal.



EveMCooke said:


> Now funny you should mention that because I was having an in depth discussion on this very topic with several of my friends last night. Little Red Riding Hood said it was just a myth but I am inclined to agree with the tooth fairy that it is all true. The tooth fairy said that Rumpelstiltskin, her second cousin by her third marriage, was a crew member on the Enterprise so I think she should know what she is talking about. She has photos to prove it.


----------



## damemary (Mar 14, 2012)

Melissa Allington said:


> And no one with any sense can respect someone who's actually deluded enough to believe that Obama will not salute the flag and our military.
> 
> Again, this is another demonstration of how the "criticisms" of Obama are steeped in willful disinformation and lies and therefore are not about HONEST disagreement. People INVENT reasons to criticize because they are trying to hide their REAL reasons for not respecting him.
> 
> Thanks for demonstrating once again that the "criticisms" about Obama are often completely irrational and are based upon something much more hateful and personal.


So shameful to admit. History will judge President Obama well, and the criticism will be seen as racism. IMHO


----------



## Knitted by Nan (Aug 3, 2013)

Intermezzo said:


> There are are no "ex homosexuals". That's a myth.
> 
> There are homosexuals who abstaining from sex, just like there are heterosexuals that abstain. That doesn't change their sexuality.
> 
> ...


 What really makes me more than cross is when these people judge and condemn a person solely because they are homosexual. They do not judge a person by their character, their good deeds or charitable works; no they are judged and condemned solely on their choice of sexual partners. Whether a person is homo, hetero, bi, transgender, or whatever, is immaterial; it is how the person interacts with other people, how they live and interact in the community that counts. What happens in a person's bedroom is private and of no concern to anyone but the people involved. Saying this I do not include pedophiles and others who would engage in sexual slavery or rape.


----------



## bellestarr12 (Mar 26, 2011)

rocky1991 said:


> Thank you for posting. It won't do any good, but those of us who "think" and try to ferret out the "truth" we appreciate your post.


You're welcome. And I know it won't do any good, but . . . sometimes I just can't help myself! :roll:


----------



## bellestarr12 (Mar 26, 2011)

damemary said:


> So shameful to admit. History will judge President Obama well, and the criticism will be seen as racism. IMHO


I agree.


----------



## Poor Purl (Apr 14, 2011)

joeysomma said:


> Then why are there so many ex-homosexuals? Why are the homosexuals so afraid, that they have passed a law in California that a therapist cannot try to tell someone under 18 that being a homosexual may not be the right way to go ? Why would a school expel a student from a program because she would not counsel a homosexual, because she could not in good faith, help him keep his homosexual life style?
> 
> I know they have found something unusual in the autopsies of homosexuals. But they have only found it after they have died. They cannot determine if it is because they were born that way or if it was because they were practicing homosexuals. But then there is the question, if anyone has even searched for it in heterosexuals.
> 
> And it is a * life-style *. I wonder why anyone would want to subject themselves to diseases and reduce the years their life.


That's exactly how you know it wasn't done by choice. Nobody decides one day "Hey, I want all my classmates to make fun of me and call me names, and when I get older I want to spend a lot of time in hidden places so nobody knows what I do there. And most of all, I would love the chance to come down with a fatal disease."


----------



## Poor Purl (Apr 14, 2011)

Dakota Sun said:


> All I can say is that I have no respect for any president who will not salute the flag and our military. Back to knitting and crocheting.


The fact that you just told the same lie three times doesn't make it the truth.


----------



## Designer1234 (Aug 9, 2011)

EveMCooke said:


> What really makes me more than cross is when these people judge and condemn a person solely because they are homosexual. They do not judge a person by their character, their good deeds or charitable works; no they are judged and condemned solely on their choice of sexual partners. Whether a person is homo, hetero, bi, transgender, or whatever, is immaterial; it is how the person interacts with other people, how they live and interact in the community that counts. What happens in a person's bedroom is private and of no concern to anyone but the people involved. Saying this I do not include pedophiles and others who would engage in sexual slavery or rape.


Once again, as usual, I agree with your thoughts. People are people -- there are good people and those who are not good people. Their personal life is not important -- it is how they treat others, how they help others, what kind of life and attitude they have - whether they follow the - "Do unto others as ye would have them do unto you " which if everyone would try to follow would change the world.- It is whether you are a moral , decent, kind person.
:thumbup: :thumbup:


----------



## Punkin51 (Sep 3, 2012)

Designer1234 said:


> Once again, as usual, I agree with your thoughts. People are people -- there are good people and those who are not good people. Their personal life is not important -- it is how they treat others, how they help others, what kind of life and attitude they have - whether they follow the - "Do unto others as ye would have them do unto you " which if everyone would try to follow would change the world.- It is whether you are a moral , decent, kind person.
> :thumbup: :thumbup:


Totally agree :thumbup: :thumbup: :thumbup:


----------



## grandmann (Feb 4, 2011)

Designer1234 said:


> Once again, as usual, I agree with your thoughts. People are people -- there are good people and those who are not good people. Their personal life is not important -- it is how they treat others, how they help others, what kind of life and attitude they have - whether they follow the - "Do unto others as ye would have them do unto you " which if everyone would try to follow would change the world.- It is whether you are a moral , decent, kind person.
> :thumbup: :thumbup:


I agree with your statement:
Our New Pope Francis that is one of his qualities of accepting people on who they are and not making judgments. Who are we to Judge.


----------



## meetoo (Nov 20, 2011)

Punkin51 said:


> Totally agree :thumbup: :thumbup: :thumbup:


 :thumbup: :thumbup:


----------



## meetoo (Nov 20, 2011)

grandmann said:


> Our New Pope Francis that is one of his qualities of accepting people on who they are and not making judgments. Who are we to Judge.


 :thumbup: :thumbup: :thumbup:


----------



## damemary (Mar 14, 2012)

IMHO "Why so many ex-homosexuals?" Joey has said many myths, but this is the most fractured fairy (excuse pun) tale yet.



Intermezzo said:


> There are are no "ex homosexuals". That's a myth.
> 
> There are homosexuals who abstaining from sex, just like there are heterosexuals that abstain. That doesn't change their sexuality.
> 
> ...


----------



## damemary (Mar 14, 2012)

EveMCooke said:


> What really makes me more than cross is when these people judge and condemn a person solely because they are homosexual. They do not judge a person by their character, their good deeds or charitable works; no they are judged and condemned solely on their choice of sexual partners. Whether a person is homo, hetero, bi, transgender, or whatever, is immaterial; it is how the person interacts with other people, how they live and interact in the community that counts. What happens in a person's bedroom is private and of no concern to anyone but the people involved. Saying this I do not include pedophiles and others who would engage in sexual slavery or rape.


 :thumbup: :thumbup: :thumbup: :thumbup: :thumbup: :thumbup: :thumbup: :thumbup: :thumbup:

I guess it may be pertinent if one is thinking of having sex with the person. Could so many be considering this that they assume someone's sexuality is their concern?


----------



## NJG (Dec 2, 2011)

rocky1991 said:


> I really don't feel sorry for them, because they want to destroy the America we know. they are already beginning with a very vulnerable group, the disabled. Imagine cutting 20% from people who really need it? and do you think they will actually stop there?


No, that is the problem. They have something to hold hostage in order to get more of what they want. Who knows where this will end. I think this was just a rules change that they voted on in the house and it goes into effect. How much more damage can they do this same way? And to think that people voted for them so they could do this. :?:


----------



## SAMkewel (Mar 5, 2011)

joeysomma said:


> It is the parent's responsibility to teach morals. Which they could do if the public school was not teaching immorality. Immorality like the homosexual * life-style* is as acceptable as heterosexual; two parents of the same sex is the same as a mother and a father; having sex with various partners as teenagers is acceptable; having an abortion without the parents knowledge is acceptable. Smoking, drinking, and doing drugs is something everyone does.


If you aren't winning by hating one thing, you begin hating another? If you are as well informed about your politics as you are about homosexuality, you're in trouble. It is SO obvious that you have not had a gay child, gay grandchildren (not progeny of the gay child), gay and bisexual stepgrandchildren (some with the same grandfather as the father of said gay child, some not by blood), plus exposure to and relationships with a large number of their friends. After you have those experiences, you may become somewhat qualified to know something about homosexuality and/or bisexuality, but at the moment you are parroting either things you heard at church or from other people who aren't qualified to know the reality of it. You paint everything with a black paintbrush without any real knowledge. Wow. Fear of the unknown?


----------



## NJG (Dec 2, 2011)

EveMCooke said:


> Hey, I just discovered some more pictures you might like to see. They are so sweet I just knew you would like everyone to share them. Are these make believe pictures too.
> 
> One of those guys, the one not wearing the cultural head dress looks familiar, perhaps you can tell us his name, please?????????


Oh how sweet is that, holding hands and kissing. And then the repubs have the guts to complain because Obama does something they don't like. Lets keep these pictures in mind for the next time they complain.


----------



## NJG (Dec 2, 2011)

EveMCooke said:


> Oh dear me, now you have shattered my illusion. You mean that President Bush did not fly that aeroplane on combat missions? I am sure he was the 'top gun' on all the combat missions he flew on.


What, flew combat missions, oh no, not him. His Daddy fixed it so his baby wouldn't have to do that. You know, when you have connections, you are special.


----------



## NJG (Dec 2, 2011)

joeysomma said:


> They were Southern, Racist, and Liberal Democrats, like Robert Byrd. Members of the KKK who were Democrats.
> 
> There was a Democratic President and a Democratic controlled congress for most of those years. So why didn't they do something about it. Woodrow Wilson, a Democrat, was one who started the separate but equal. You know; black drinking fountains, and white drinking fountains; black bathrooms, and white bathrooms; blacks sat at the back of the bus, and whites at the front; blacks had to use the back door, and whites at the front. etc.


And it is the republicans of TODAY that want it that way again. Louisiana almost elected David Duke to congress and as governor. Don't go patting yourself on the back too much, at least the democrats are willing to admit mistakes and make changes.


----------



## NJG (Dec 2, 2011)

joeysomma said:


> That is because the Liberal Democrats were the ones responsible for the segregation, lynching of the pre-50's. Not the Christian Conservative. So I guess you are right. The Liberal Democrats were very unChristian.


And today the republicans claim to be Christian, but their actions prove them wrong.


----------



## SAMkewel (Mar 5, 2011)

damemary said:


> IMHO "Why so many ex-homosexuals?" Joey has said many myths, but this is the most fractured fairy (excuse pun) tale yet.


I know a gay man in a "straight marriage." I'd call it a disaster for both, but especially for her; fortunately there are no children involved. I wouldn't advise a straight marrying a gay person because there is almost always rampant cheating involved. He figures that because she knew he was gay before they married, she should have known it would be that way and therefore he is blameless. What???

I also know some gay men who have worked hard and succeeded at avoiding straight marriages, much to their credit. Some women can be very predatory and persuasive.


----------



## NJG (Dec 2, 2011)

SAMkewel said:


> My childhood family on both sides were confirmed Republicans for generations. So far as I know, a cousin on my mother's side and I are the only Democrats. As I think back, I remember being on the streets of a nearby city when the announcement of the death of FDR was announced via a PA system, and my mother said, "Good, I'm glad he's dead." I was shocked, I would have been six years old. When I asked her why she would say such a thing she said it was because he was a horrible man. When I asked what he did that was horrible, I got slapped in the mouth. That was always what she did when she had no answer, and that was the last time I ever asked a question out loud until after I left home at 17. By the time I was eight, I realized she was only parroting what she heard my father's parents say. After that realization, I did my own research; I still do at 76. My point is that so far as I could tell, none of them ever did any real thinking about much of anything, it was all passed down from one generation to the next and never questioned. That has always seemed bizarre to me, but I think it's still going on in many areas of the US.


And it still goes on now. When I ask about the income inequality and how they think that affects the country, no answer. The republicans trying to gut ss, no answer. They have republican talking points for most things, but not much original thought. I just read a study, I think done by a Maryland College, that said those that watch Fox news were the least informed, which we always knew, but nice to see someone else figure it out too.


----------



## SAMkewel (Mar 5, 2011)

NJG said:


> No, that is the problem. They have something to hold hostage in order to get more of what they want. Who knows where this will end. I think this was just a rules change that they voted on in the house and it goes into effect. How much more damage can they do this same way? And to think that people voted for them so they could do this. :?:


The latest count shows that had we elected by popular vote rather than the stacked electoral college system we now have, the Democrats would have won with 2.5 million more votes than Republicans had in the most recent elections. Don't fault the people, fault the system.


----------



## NJG (Dec 2, 2011)

joeysomma said:


> It is the parent's responsibility to teach morals. Which they could do if the public school was not teaching immorality. Immorality like the homosexual * life-style* is as acceptable as heterosexual; two parents of the same sex is the same as a mother and a father; having sex with various partners as teenagers is acceptable; having an abortion without the parents knowledge is acceptable. Smoking, drinking, and doing drugs is something everyone does.


Teaching your child that it is ok to discriminate against others is different than being accepting of others lifestyle choices. If the school my child was attending said smoking drinking and drugs were ok, I would be at the next school board meeting. But if the school accepted the child that was doing drugs and tried to help him/her, then the school is doing what is right. If the school makes a gay student feel less important and allows bullying, then I would be at the school board meeting, but if the school protects the gay student and helps them to feel wanted and important, then they are doing the right thing. You should just stay away from all public schools. They don't need your bigoted input.


----------



## SAMkewel (Mar 5, 2011)

NJG said:


> Teaching your child that it is ok to discriminate against others is different than being accepting of others lifestyle choices. If the school my child was attending said smoking drinking and drugs were ok, I would be at the next school board meeting. But if the school accepted the child that was doing drugs and tried to help him/her, then the school is doing what is right. If the school makes a gay student feel less important and allows bullying, then I would be at the school board meeting, but if the school protects the gay student and helps them to feel wanted and important, then they are doing the right thing. You should just stay away from all public schools. They don't need your bigoted input.


I'm with you!


----------



## Huckleberry (May 27, 2013)

Thank you. Beautiful to observe such fine manners.


----------



## NJG (Dec 2, 2011)

Intermezzo said:


> Exactly what "subject" here was not being discussed properly? The subject was merely a pretty picture.
> 
> Sorry Sweetie but the conservatives here having a hissy fit and even leaving the board over a beautiful picture doesn't bode well for your theory that people _merely_ disagree with his political beliefs. There's OBVIOUSLY something more personal to it than that.
> 
> This thread basically proved that the criticism is NOT based in reason or legitimate judgement,or even just pure partisanship. It was just a visceral reaction that could ONLY come from the kind of personal ire that comes from bigotry and prejudice.


 :thumbup: :thumbup: :thumbup: :thumbup:


----------



## Huckleberry (May 27, 2013)

lila ladue said:


> There are other pictures of him too. Not saluting the American flag, not placing his correct hand over his heart during our nationa anthem, bowing to Muslims. I could go on an on but don't want to make this a political discussion, GET INFORMED.


lila ladue
having a bad day? This informed individual does not believe in conspiracies.


----------



## Huckleberry (May 27, 2013)

joeysomma said:


> Then why are there so many ex-homosexuals? Why are the homosexuals so afraid, that they have passed a law in California that a therapist cannot try to tell someone under 18 that being a homosexual may not be the right way to go ? Why would a school expel a student from a program because she would not counsel a homosexual, because she could not in good faith, help him keep his homosexual life style?
> 
> I know they have found something unusual in the autopsies of homosexuals. But they have only found it after they have died. They cannot determine if it is because they were born that way or if it was because they were practicing homosexuals. But then there is the question, if anyone has even searched for it in heterosexuals.
> 
> And it is a * life-style *. I wonder why anyone would want to subject themselves to diseases and reduce the years their life.


joeysomma
hello Madam Sourpuss. I feel for you. Never having a pleasant day must be agonizing.


----------



## misellen (Mar 8, 2013)

PaKnitter said:


> Because there are a lot of crazy people with pointy sticks in their hands?


And sawdust in their heads.


----------



## damemary (Mar 14, 2012)

misellen said:


> And sawdust in their heads.


 :XD: :XD: :XD: :XD: :XD:


----------



## NJG (Dec 2, 2011)

lila ladue wrote:
There are other pictures of him too. Not saluting the American flag, not placing his correct hand over his heart during our nationa anthem, bowing to Muslims. I could go on an on but don't want to make this a political discussion, GET INFORMED.

And there are also pictures of Bush 1 & 2 and Clinton not saluting the flag so what is your point. There is a picture of W with his hand over his stomach. What kind of salute is that? You are grasping at straws. I remember when everyone was outraged because President Obama had his feet up on his desk and oh how awful and disrespectful that was. And then, there is a picture of George W with his feet up on the desk, no problem. Must be because one persons feet are black, right lila ladue?


----------



## SAMkewel (Mar 5, 2011)

Poor Purl said:


> That's exactly how you know it wasn't done by choice. Nobody decides one day "Hey, I want all my classmates to make fun of me and call me names, and when I get older I want to spend a lot of time in hidden places so nobody knows what I do there. And most of all, I would love the chance to come down with a fatal disease."


I don't know about you, but I would love to hear the details of the so-called homosexual "life-style." And so would my LGBT friends, relatives, and acquaintances. We've been trying to figure out what it might be for years and years now, but none of us know the answers.

In addition to what you said above, I'm sure all the suicides in the LGBT community were caused by the fear of becoming heterosexual, NOT. Most people don't commit suicide over things that can be changed by a few simple sessions of brainwashing and coercion.


----------



## pattibe (Feb 2, 2012)

NJG said:


> lila ladue wrote:
> There are other pictures of him too. Not saluting the American flag, not placing his correct hand over his heart during our nationa anthem, bowing to Muslims. I could go on an on but don't want to make this a political discussion, GET INFORMED.
> 
> And there are also pictures of Bush 1 & 2 and Clinton not saluting the flag so what is your point. There is a picture of W with his hand over his stomach. What kind of salute is that? You are grasping at straws. I remember when everyone was outraged because President Obama had his feet up on his desk and oh how awful and disrespectful that was. And then, there is a picture of George W with his feet up on the desk, no problem. Must be because one persons feet are black, right lila ladue?


I wasn't going to answer this any more, BUT you are so Right! They are so quick to criticize President Obama for exactly what every other president has done, but that's okay. What is hysterical is, the Republican party is for Big Business and the rich....they could not give a rat's you know what for these people. How could any woman be a Republican and look herself in the mirror everyday. I think of Nixon, that crook, saluting as he got on the plane to leave office in abject shame. Saluting means NOTHING.


----------



## Cheeky Blighter (Nov 20, 2011)

NJG said:


> lila ladue wrote:
> There are other pictures of him too. Not saluting the American flag, not placing his correct hand over his heart during our nationa anthem, bowing to Muslims. I could go on an on but don't want to make this a political discussion, GET INFORMED.
> 
> And there are also pictures of Bush 1 & 2 and Clinton not saluting the flag so what is your point. There is a picture of W with his hand over his stomach. What kind of salute is that? You are grasping at straws. I remember when everyone was outraged because President Obama had his feet up on his desk and oh how awful and disrespectful that was. And then, there is a picture of George W with his feet up on the desk, no problem. Must be because one persons feet are black, right lila ladue?


 :XD: :XD: :XD: :XD: :XD: :XD: :XD: :XD: :XD: :XD: :XD:


----------



## Nussa (Jul 7, 2011)

It's called bisexual, not ex-homosexual.

And I'm appalled to think that at one time you were a teacher, and very likely spewing the hatred you feel for others to your students. How absolutely disgusting you are.... 
And as for you being a teacher, I don't think I've ever come across one as ignorant as you. :thumbdown: MGHY!



joeysomma said:


> Then why are there so many ex-homosexuals? Why are the homosexuals so afraid, that they have passed a law in California that a therapist cannot try to tell someone under 18 that being a homosexual may not be the right way to go ? Why would a school expel a student from a program because she would not counsel a homosexual, because she could not in good faith, help him keep his homosexual life style?
> 
> I know they have found something unusual in the autopsies of homosexuals. But they have only found it after they have died. They cannot determine if it is because they were born that way or if it was because they were practicing homosexuals. But then there is the question, if anyone has even searched for it in heterosexuals.
> 
> And it is a * life-style *. I wonder why anyone would want to subject themselves to diseases and reduce the years their life.


----------



## Cheeky Blighter (Nov 20, 2011)

pattibe said:


> I wasn't going to answer this any more, BUT you are so Right! They are so quick to criticize President Obama for exactly what the every other president has done, but that's okay. What is hysterical is, the Republican party is for Big Business and the rich....they could not give a rat's you know what for these people. How could any woman be a Republican and look herself in the mirror everyday. I think of Nixon, that crook, saluting as he got on the plane to leave office in abject shame. Saluting means NOTHING.


 :thumbup: :thumbup: :thumbup: :thumbup: :thumbup: :thumbup: :thumbup: :thumbup: :thumbup: :thumbup:


----------



## Cheeky Blighter (Nov 20, 2011)

Nussa said:


> It's called bisexual, not ex-homosexual.
> 
> And I'm appalled to think that at one time you were a teacher, and very likely spewing the hatred you feel for others to your students. How absolutely disgusting you are....
> And as for you being a teacher, I don't think I've ever come across one as ignorant as you. :thumbdown: MGHY!


 :thumbup: :thumbup: :thumbup: :thumbup: :thumbup: :thumbup: :thumbup: :thumbup: :thumbup: :thumbup:


----------



## NJG (Dec 2, 2011)

SAMkewel said:


> The latest count shows that had we elected by popular vote rather than the stacked electoral college system we now have, the Democrats would have won with 2.5 million more votes than Republicans had in the most recent elections. Don't fault the people, fault the system.


The recent elections we won by republicans because of gerrymandering and the fact that democrats didn't vote. The electoral college comes into play again in 2016. Some states have passed a law that all electoral votes would go to the person who wins the popular vote, but some were trying to change the rules to split the electoral votes of Democratic states while retaining winner-take-all in Republican states, to keep democratic candidates from having an electoral majority. Under that plan, Obama would have lost the last election in spite of winning nearly 5 million more votes. Democrats do vote in presidential elections, so I have great hope for that in 2016, unless the republicans start trying to change the rules again right before the election. I don't trust them. The republicans do cheat every chance they get, such as Christie holding a special election to fill a senate seat so all those democrats wouldn't vote when he was on the ballot.


----------



## NJG (Dec 2, 2011)

pattibe said:


> I wasn't going to answer this any more, BUT you are so Right! They are so quick to criticize President Obama for exactly what the every other president has done, but that's okay. What is hysterical is, the Republican party is for Big Business and the rich....they could not give a rat's you know what for these people. How could any woman be a Republican and look herself in the mirror everyday. I think of Nixon, that crook, saluting as he got on the plane to leave office in abject shame. Saluting means NOTHING.


Very good point. Bush and Cheney saluted the 4486 soldiers they sent to Iraq to die, bless their hearts.


----------



## MarilynKnits (Aug 30, 2011)

joeysomma said:


> Then why are there so many ex-homosexuals? Why are the homosexuals so afraid, that they have passed a law in California that a therapist cannot try to tell someone under 18 that being a homosexual may not be the right way to go ? Why would a school expel a student from a program because she would not counsel a homosexual, because she could not in good faith, help him keep his homosexual life style?
> 
> I know they have found something unusual in the autopsies of homosexuals. But they have only found it after they have died. They cannot determine if it is because they were born that way or if it was because they were practicing homosexuals. But then there is the question, if anyone has even searched for it in heterosexuals.
> 
> And it is a * life-style *. I wonder why anyone would want to subject themselves to diseases and reduce the years their life.


Statistics on the percentage of people who said they were homosexual who changed their sexual orientation? And name the source of the statistics.

i live in the real world among a hugely diverse group of people, and homosexuality is not a "choice" like the color of your hair or whether to eat Chinese or sushi tonight. It is part of the fiber of who the person is.

And the homosexual people I know personally are all normal people with nice or not so nice personalities, interests I share like knitting and reading mysteries, and don't have a Scarlet H on their breasts.

The people for whom I feel the most compassion are the transgender people. My friend's son, who had been her daughter originally, was in terrible despair. His parents accepted who he is and have supported him emotionally with love and giving him his space to plan a future. His dad told me he would rather have a live obnoxious teen aged son than a moody daughter who committed suicide because of her unhappiness.

When you know people as people, you like them or not on their merits and actions. Judging them on whom they love is as shallow criterion as deciding you will never have anything to do with hazel eyed people because their eye color is an aberration.


----------



## MarilynKnits (Aug 30, 2011)

EveMCooke said:


> What really makes me more than cross is when these people judge and condemn a person solely because they are homosexual. They do not judge a person by their character, their good deeds or charitable works; no they are judged and condemned solely on their choice of sexual partners. Whether a person is homo, hetero, bi, transgender, or whatever, is immaterial; it is how the person interacts with other people, how they live and interact in the community that counts. What happens in a person's bedroom is private and of no concern to anyone but the people involved. Saying this I do not include pedophiles and others who would engage in sexual slavery or rape.


Classy lady with a classy perspective as always. Thanks, Eve


----------



## MarilynKnits (Aug 30, 2011)

NJG said:


> The recent elections we won by republicans because of gerrymandering and the fact that democrats didn't vote. The electoral college comes into play again in 2016. Some states have passed a law that all electoral votes would go to the person who wins the popular vote, but some were trying to change the rules to split the electoral votes of Democratic states while retaining winner-take-all in Republican states, to keep democratic candidates from having an electoral majority. Under that plan, Obama would have lost the last election in spite of winning nearly 5 million more votes. Democrats do vote in presidential elections, so I have great hope for that in 2016, unless the republicans start trying to change the rules again right before the election. I don't trust them. The republicans do cheat every chance they get, such as Christie holding a special election to fill a senate seat so all those democrats wouldn't vote when he was on the ballot.


And Christie spending millions to protect his ego when there are still people suffering from the effects of Hurricane Sandy who need the funds to rebuild homes.


----------



## SAMkewel (Mar 5, 2011)

NJG said:


> The recent elections we won by republicans because of gerrymandering and the fact that democrats didn't vote. The electoral college comes into play again in 2016. Some states have passed a law that all electoral votes would go to the person who wins the popular vote, but some were trying to change the rules to split the electoral votes of Democratic states while retaining winner-take-all in Republican states, to keep democratic candidates from having an electoral majority. Under that plan, Obama would have lost the last election in spite of winning nearly 5 million more votes. Democrats do vote in presidential elections, so I have great hope for that in 2016, unless the republicans start trying to change the rules again right before the election. I don't trust them. The republicans do cheat every chance they get, such as Christie holding a special election to fill a senate seat so all those democrats wouldn't vote when he was on the ballot.


Apparently, by the numbers, more than enough Democrats DID vote. It was the Electoral College than didn't follow through in representing their states' wishes.


----------



## SAMkewel (Mar 5, 2011)

MarilynKnits said:


> And Christie spending millions to protect his ego when there are still people suffering from the effects of Hurricane Sandy who need the funds to rebuild homes.


I'm not sure his ego is all he is feeding. Where is all that money going?


----------



## SAMkewel (Mar 5, 2011)

MarilynKnits said:


> Statistics on the percentage of people who said they were homosexual who changed their sexual orientation? And name the source of the statistics.
> 
> i live in the real world among a hugely diverse group of people, and homosexuality is not a "choice" like the color of your hair or whether to eat Chinese or sushi tonight. It is part of the fiber of who the person is.
> 
> ...


I have hazel eyes; I didn't know that they were considered an aberration. I was always told that my eyes are blue (which they really aren't), but our local Secretary of State Office Manager changed it on my drivers license without a word. I'm good with that.....

I'm also good with most people of most persuasions as long as they aren't judgmental, hypocritical, prejudiced, bigoted, or dangerous to any segment of the population, young or old. ;~D!


----------



## alwaysforyou (Dec 6, 2011)

EveMCooke said:


> What really makes me more than cross is when these people judge and condemn a person solely because they are homosexual. They do not judge a person by their character, their good deeds or charitable works; no they are judged and condemned solely on their choice of sexual partners. Whether a person is homo, hetero, bi, transgender, or whatever, is immaterial; it is how the person interacts with other people, how they live and interact in the community that counts. What happens in a person's bedroom is private and of no concern to anyone but the people involved. Saying this I do not include pedophiles and others who would engage in sexual slavery or rape.


Eve, You are a Darlin'!! I so wish that more people worldwide shared in this philosophy...Wouldn't that be a wonderful place in which to live, thrive, respect and honor each other??
The venom in this thread shows how so very far that we still have to go, right?? sincerely, respectfully, Lynn


----------



## SQM (Jun 22, 2012)

SAMkewel said:


> If you aren't winning by hating one thing, you begin hating another? If you are as well informed about your politics as you are about homosexuality, you're in trouble. It is SO obvious that you have not had a gay child, gay grandchildren (not progeny of the gay child), gay and bisexual stepgrandchildren (some with the same grandfather as the father of said gay child, some not by blood), plus exposure to and relationships with a large number of their friends. After you have those experiences, you may become somewhat qualified to know something about homosexuality and/or bisexuality, but at the moment you are parroting either things you heard at church or from other people who aren't qualified to know the reality of it. You paint everything with a black paintbrush without any real knowledge. Wow. Fear of the unknown?


Mrs. Somma is from rural Wisconsin - not a very cosmopolite area. I assume all the cows in her pasture are straight.


----------



## NJG (Dec 2, 2011)

SQM said:


> Mrs. Somma is from rural Wisconsin - not a very cosmopolite area. I assume all the cows in her pasture are straight.


Of course they are, or she would banish them to the back 40.


----------



## Nussa (Jul 7, 2011)

NJG said:


> The recent elections we won by republicans because of gerrymandering and the fact that democrats didn't vote. The electoral college comes into play again in 2016. Some states have passed a law that all electoral votes would go to the person who wins the popular vote, but some were trying to change the rules to split the electoral votes of Democratic states while retaining winner-take-all in Republican states, to keep democratic candidates from having an electoral majority. Under that plan, Obama would have lost the last election in spite of winning nearly 5 million more votes. Democrats do vote in presidential elections, so I have great hope for that in 2016, unless the republicans start trying to change the rules again right before the election. I don't trust them. The republicans do cheat every chance they get, such as Christie holding a special election to fill a senate seat so all those democrats wouldn't vote when he was on the ballot.


 :thumbup: :thumbup: :thumbup: :thumbup: :thumbup: :thumbup: :thumbup: :thumbup: :thumbup: :thumbup:


----------



## Nussa (Jul 7, 2011)

Well put. :thumbup:



MarilynKnits said:


> Statistics on the percentage of people who said they were homosexual who changed their sexual orientation? And name the source of the statistics.
> 
> i live in the real world among a hugely diverse group of people, and homosexuality is not a "choice" like the color of your hair or whether to eat Chinese or sushi tonight. It is part of the fiber of who the person is.
> 
> ...


----------



## Ann DeGray (May 11, 2011)

joeysomma said:


> Then why are there so many ex-homosexuals? Why are the homosexuals so afraid, that they have passed a law in California that a therapist cannot try to tell someone under 18 that being a homosexual may not be the right way to go ? Why would a school expel a student from a program because she would not counsel a homosexual, because she could not in good faith, help him keep his homosexual life style?
> 
> I know they have found something unusual in the autopsies of homosexuals. But they have only found it after they have died. They cannot determine if it is because they were born that way or if it was because they were practicing homosexuals. But then there is the question, if anyone has even searched for it in heterosexuals.
> 
> And it is a * life-style *. I wonder why anyone would want to subject themselves to diseases and reduce the years their life.


OMG. There are no words to express what I am thinking. God help us all.


----------



## pattibe (Feb 2, 2012)

Ann DeGray said:


> OMG. There bare no words to express what I am thinking but God help us all.


Ann...do not despair....in the immortal words of Forrest Gump, 'stupid is as stupid does.' Like a heterosexual person has never gotten an STD. Oh wait...if I'm not mistaken, I think that's what Winston Churchill's father died of! An equal opportnity killer before the days of penicillin.


----------



## Ann DeGray (May 11, 2011)

SAMkewel said:


> If you aren't winning by hating one thing, you begin hating another? If you are as well informed about your politics as you are about homosexuality, you're in trouble. It is SO obvious that you have not had a gay child, gay grandchildren (not progeny of the gay child), gay and bisexual stepgrandchildren (some with the same grandfather as the father of said gay child, some not by blood), plus exposure to and relationships with a large number of their friends. After you have those experiences, you may become somewhat qualified to know something about homosexuality and/or bisexuality, but at the moment you are parroting either things you heard at church or from other people who aren't qualified to know the reality of it. You paint everything with a black paintbrush without any real knowledge. Wow. Fear of the unknown?


*This was not meant to be a reply to SAMkewel but rather a reply to joeysomma. Sorry about the confusion*

I am the mother of a gay son and I wish that for just five minutes all homosexuals would turn purple. Five minutes. That's all the time it would take for you to look around and see that there are people in your own family, social circle, school and church who are (gasp) GAY! Your uncle, your sister, your pastor (yes, there ARE gays in the church), your neighbor.........one out of every 8 people (or 10, if you are more comfortable with that statistic) is gay.

Do the math, sweetheart. And then think how hard it would be to hate someone you already love.

The hatred you are spewing is appalling. I feel sorry for you. That, my dear, is called 'compassion'. You may not understand the meaning of the word..


----------



## SQM (Jun 22, 2012)

Ann DeGray said:


> I am the mother of a gay son and I wish that for just five minutes all homosexuals would turn purple. Five minutes. That's all the time it would take for you to look around and see that there are people in your own family, social circle, school and church who are (gasp) GAY! Your uncle, your sister, your pastor (yes, there ARE gays in the church), your neighbor.........one out of every 8 people (or 10, if you are more comfortable with that statistic) is gay.
> 
> Do the math, sweetheart. And then think how hard it would be to hate someone you already love.
> 
> The hatred you are spewing is appalling. I feel sorry for you. That, my dear, is called 'compassion'. You may not understand the meaning of the word..


Can't help lovin' Ms. DeGray.


----------



## Huckleberry (May 27, 2013)

ZaaZaa3 said:


> I thought this was a knitting/crochet forum not a political venue. We all have thoughts on OP but my are not appropriate for a knitting forum. Let's stick to the items at hand not political statements!


ZaaZaa3
you must have missed that non-knitting chit chat takes place in this forum. No-one makes you participate, it is strictly voluntary. Make use of "Unwatch" and you won't be bothered.


----------



## SQM (Jun 22, 2012)

Huckleberry said:


> ZaaZaa3
> you must have missed that non-knitting chit chat takes place in this forum. No-one makes you participate, it is strictly voluntary. Make use of "Unwatch" and you won't be bothered.


Hi Huckle,

What is your avatar? Did you make it?


----------



## Huckleberry (May 27, 2013)

Ann DeGray said:


> I am the mother of a gay son and I wish that for just five minutes all homosexuals would turn purple. Five minutes. That's all the time it would take for you to look around and see that there are people in your own family, social circle, school and church who are (gasp) GAY! Your uncle, your sister, your pastor (yes, there ARE gays in the church), your neighbor.........one out of every 8 people (or 10, if you are more comfortable with that statistic) is gay.
> 
> Do the math, sweetheart. And then think how hard it would be to hate someone you already love.
> 
> The hatred you are spewing is appalling. I feel sorry for you. That, my dear, is called 'compassion'. You may not understand the meaning of the word..


AnnDeGray
A special Hug from Huck.


----------



## Huckleberry (May 27, 2013)

SQM said:


> Hi Huckle,
> 
> What is your avatar? Did you make it?


SQM
The chair I made, this Monkey not but made one just like it for my little neighbor Munchkin. My monkey keeps scratching his head about the bigotry, racism and hatred spewed here.


----------



## Huckleberry (May 27, 2013)

NJG said:


> The recent elections we won by republicans because of gerrymandering and the fact that democrats didn't vote. The electoral college comes into play again in 2016. Some states have passed a law that all electoral votes would go to the person who wins the popular vote, but some were trying to change the rules to split the electoral votes of Democratic states while retaining winner-take-all in Republican states, to keep democratic candidates from having an electoral majority. Under that plan, Obama would have lost the last election in spite of winning nearly 5 million more votes. Democrats do vote in presidential elections, so I have great hope for that in 2016, unless the republicans start trying to change the rules again right before the election. I don't trust them. The republicans do cheat every chance they get, such as Christie holding a special election to fill a senate seat so all those democrats wouldn't vote when he was on the ballot.


NJG
sad but oh so true.


----------



## Ann DeGray (May 11, 2011)

SAMkewel said:


> I know a gay man in a "straight marriage." I'd call it a disaster for both, but especially for her; fortunately there are no children involved. I wouldn't advise a straight marrying a gay person because there is almost always rampant cheating involved. He figures that because she knew he was gay before they married, she should have known it would be that way and therefore he is blameless. What???
> 
> I also know some gay men who have worked hard and succeeded at avoiding straight marriages, much to their credit. Some women can be very predatory and persuasive.


A very dear gay friend of mine was married three times He tried very hard to exist as a heterosexual man. He has two sons with each wife. He finally had to admit to himself that he was pretending to be what he *simply could not be*.

The three women hated him, his six sons would have nothing to do with him and Richard felt he had failed everyone, including himself.

Richard died a few years ago. All six of his sons attended the memorial and heard many people speak of the kind, generous, talented man they had known. The sons were glad they had come but very sad to see what they had missed by rejecting him all those years.

Seven lives were damaged....and for what? If that isn't sad, I don't know what is.


----------



## pattibe (Feb 2, 2012)

Ann DeGray said:


> I am the mother of a gay son and I wish that for just five minutes all homosexuals would turn purple. Five minutes. That's all the time it would take for you to look around and see that there are people in your own family, social circle, school and church who are (gasp) GAY! Your uncle, your sister, your pastor (yes, there ARE gays in the church), your neighbor.........one out of every 8 people (or 10, if you are more comfortable with that statistic) is gay.
> 
> Do the math, sweetheart. And then think how hard it would be to hate someone you already love.
> 
> The hatred you are spewing is appalling. I feel sorry for you. That, my dear, is called 'compassion'. You may not understand the meaning of the word..


This is totally off The Photo, but I have to say that before I got remarried, I lived in an apartment next to a house owned by two gay men in a committed relationship. Their house was beautiful as were their gardens. Two of the nicest people you would ever want to meet...teachers. My son (who was 15 or so at the time) used to go to their house a lot for either help with homework, or just have a man to talk to. I never thought a thing about it. They were just two wonderful neighbors. BTW my son is now married with two kids in college.


----------



## rocky1991 (May 8, 2011)

damemary said:


> It makes me feel better to answer lies and not let them stand as truth. U2?


Does it matter with them? They still believe the lies, I know that you are right in trying to point out lies, but ramming one's head into a wall over and over again is futile. I just can't imagine passing on such fallacies. I can only wish them a homosexual in each and every family. To actually experience how to love unconditionally. I had a wonderful "daughter" in my life as well as a wonderful example for my three daughters. We all loved Marco and one daughter even named her son after him. He is so missed.


----------



## MarilynKnits (Aug 30, 2011)

rocky1991 said:


> Does it matter with them? They still believe the lies, I know that you are right in trying to point out lies, but ramming one's head into a wall over and over again is futile. I just can't imagine passing on such fallacies. I can only wish them a homosexual in each and every family.


But I wouldn't wish any of them with their disgusting attitude on a homosexual.


----------



## rocky1991 (May 8, 2011)

damemary said:


> So shameful to admit. History will judge President Obama well, and the criticism will be seen as racism. IMHO


I agree.


----------



## Bettytut (Jan 17, 2014)

Beautiful pictures. He is one of those men who has a smile says it all. When happy photos are taken his whole face lights up. When dealing with sadness his whole face crys The president is like the head of the family. Like all families, you can guide your family, yet there is always some that will not agree. Like all families words and actions sometime get in the way of making the family grow stronger. Like a photo album, we can all enjoy the beautiful pictures or pick it apart. I choose to agree that the pictures are beautiful. Thank you for sharing.


----------



## Ann DeGray (May 11, 2011)

pattibe said:


> This is totally off The Photo, but I have to say that before I got remarried, I lived in an apartment next to a house owned by two gay men in a committed relationship. Their house was beautiful as were their gardens. Two of the nicest people you would ever want to meet...teachers. My son (who was 15 or so at the time) used to go to their house a lot for either help with homework, or just have a man to talk to. I never thought a thing about it. They were just two wonderful neighbors. BTW my son is now married with two kids in college.


Which just goes to prove that gay is not "catching". Although I suppose there are people who would be in favor of a vaccine to prevent homosexuality.

Work on that, people!


----------



## Ann DeGray (May 11, 2011)

rocky1991 said:


> Does it matter with them? They still believe the lies, I know that you are right in trying to point out lies, but ramming one's head into a wall over and over again is futile. I just can't imagine passing on such fallacies. I can only wish them a homosexual in each and every family.


And they may already have one if there is one he or she may not ever dare come out of the closet.....and that is sad...and wrong... on so many levels.


----------



## rocky1991 (May 8, 2011)

Ann DeGray said:


> *This was not meant to be a reply to SAMkewel but rather a reply to joeysomma. Sorry about the confusion*
> 
> I am the mother of a gay son and I wish that for just five minutes all homosexuals would turn purple. Five minutes. That's all the time it would take for you to look around and see that there are people in your own family, social circle, school and church who are (gasp) GAY! Your uncle, your sister, your pastor (yes, there ARE gays in the church), your neighbor.........one out of every 8 people (or 10, if you are more comfortable with that statistic) is gay.
> 
> ...


Great post!


----------



## rocky1991 (May 8, 2011)

MarilynKnits said:


> But I wouldn't wish any of them with their disgusting attitude on a homosexual.


I know, these people who espouse Christianity, are the least likely to practice it. They know nothing of compassion or unconditional love.


----------



## pattibe (Feb 2, 2012)

Ann DeGray said:


> Which just goes to prove that gay is not "catching". Although I suppose there are people who would be in favor of a vaccine to prevent homosexuality.
> 
> Work on that, people!


I could not have asked for better neighbors!


----------



## SAMkewel (Mar 5, 2011)

Ann DeGray said:


> OMG. There are no words to express what I am thinking. God help us all.


I'm guessing it's still illegal to do autopsies on the living...beyond that, words fail me, too.


----------



## SAMkewel (Mar 5, 2011)

rocky1991 said:


> I know, these people who espouse Christianity, are the least likely to practice it. They know nothing of compassion or unconditional love.


Perhaps it's a screen they hide behind? As in, how dare you question me, I'm a Christian, with a capital K. I think I'm starting to lose it here.

When my gay son died it was (and is) a terrible loss. What was even worse is that I was banned from the groups of LGBT folks I had spent so much time with, personally and professionally, because I was no longer qualified by way of having a gay family member and I so missed the good times we had. Now that I again have LGBT family members, the groups, especially those with AIDS, have disbanded in my area, probably because most of the members are deceased now. I can't say I blamed them because I saw over and over how many of them were rejected by not only the world at large, but by their own families. Trust is difficult to win in those situations, even after several years of work and play. I'm certain those families were also Kristians.....

As I expected, my question about exactly what the homosexual life style is went unanswered, no doubt for total lack of knowledge of the fact that it is as varied as anyone else's. Who knew?


----------



## Poor Purl (Apr 14, 2011)

NJG said:


> Of course they are, or she would banish them to the back 40.


You ought to see those parties on the back 40.:twisted:

Oh, never mind. It's all bull.


----------



## Poor Purl (Apr 14, 2011)

Ann DeGray said:


> *This was not meant to be a reply to SAMkewel but rather a reply to joeysomma. Sorry about the confusion*
> 
> I am the mother of a gay son and I wish that for just five minutes all homosexuals would turn purple. Five minutes. That's all the time it would take for you to look around and see that there are people in your own family, social circle, school and church who are (gasp) GAY! Your uncle, your sister, your pastor (yes, there ARE gays in the church), your neighbor.........one out of every 8 people (or 10, if you are more comfortable with that statistic) is gay.
> 
> ...


Thank you for saying this so eloquently and also so clearly. How those beliefs keep hanging on in the face of very different experience is beyond me.


----------



## rocky1991 (May 8, 2011)

SAMkewel said:


> Perhaps it's a screen they hide behind? As in, how dare you question me, I'm a Christian, with a capital K. I think I'm starting to lose it here.
> 
> When my gay son died it was (and is) a terrible loss. What was even worse is that I was banned from the groups of LGBT folks I had spent so much time with, personally and professionally, because I was no longer qualified by way of having a gay family member and I so missed the good times we had. Now that I again have LGBT family members, the groups, especially those with AIDS, have disbanded in my area, probably because most of the members are deceased now. I can't say I blamed them because I saw over and over how many of them were rejected by not only the world at large, but by their own families. Trust is difficult to win in those situations, even after several years of work and play. I'm certain those families were also Kristians.....
> 
> As I expected, my question about exactly what the homosexual life style is went unanswered, no doubt for total lack of knowledge of the fact that it is as varied as anyone else's. Who knew?


I am so sorry for your loss.


----------



## Candykayro (Sep 6, 2011)

I


----------



## damemary (Mar 14, 2012)

Well put. Excellent perspective.



Ann DeGray said:


> *This was not meant to be a reply to SAMkewel but rather a reply to joeysomma. Sorry about the confusion*
> 
> I am the mother of a gay son and I wish that for just five minutes all homosexuals would turn purple. Five minutes. That's all the time it would take for you to look around and see that there are people in your own family, social circle, school and church who are (gasp) GAY! Your uncle, your sister, your pastor (yes, there ARE gays in the church), your neighbor.........one out of every 8 people (or 10, if you are more comfortable with that statistic) is gay.
> 
> ...


----------



## damemary (Mar 14, 2012)

Huckleberry said:


> ZaaZaa3
> you must have missed that non-knitting chit chat takes place in this forum. No-one makes you participate, it is strictly voluntary. Make use of "Unwatch" and you won't be bothered.


And I won't be bothered either.


----------



## damemary (Mar 14, 2012)

Tragic. Time ignored is gone forever. No appeal.



Ann DeGray said:


> A very dear gay friend of mine was married three times He tried very hard to exist as a heterosexual man. He has two sons with each wife. He finally had to admit to himself that he was pretending to be what he *simply could not be*.
> 
> The three women hated him, his six sons would have nothing to do with him and Richard felt he had failed everyone, including himself.
> 
> ...


----------



## damemary (Mar 14, 2012)

Thereby proving another common myth. Gays do not abuse or recruit children. Pedophiles are a separate group.



pattibe said:


> This is totally off The Photo, but I have to say that before I got remarried, I lived in an apartment next to a house owned by two gay men in a committed relationship. Their house was beautiful as were their gardens. Two of the nicest people you would ever want to meet...teachers. My son (who was 15 or so at the time) used to go to their house a lot for either help with homework, or just have a man to talk to. I never thought a thing about it. They were just two wonderful neighbors. BTW my son is now married with two kids in college.


----------



## NJG (Dec 2, 2011)

joeysomma said:


> Then why are there so many ex-homosexuals? Why are the homosexuals so afraid, that they have passed a law in California that a therapist cannot try to tell someone under 18 that being a homosexual may not be the right way to go ? Why would a school expel a student from a program because she would not counsel a homosexual, because she could not in good faith, help him keep his homosexual life style?
> 
> I know they have found something unusual in the autopsies of homosexuals. But they have only found it after they have died. They cannot determine if it is because they were born that way or if it was because they were practicing homosexuals. But then there is the question, if anyone has even searched for it in heterosexuals.
> 
> And it is a * life-style *. I wonder why anyone would want to subject themselves to diseases and reduce the years their life.


I had decided to not respond to your garbage anymore, but had to go back to this one last time. You said: Why are the homosexuals so afraid, that they have passed a law in California that a therapist cannot try to tell someone under 18 that being a homosexual may not be the right way to go ?

I don't know if is ignorance or you are so completely out of touch with reality that you said such a thing. The reason for the law is to protect the children from parents like you, from anyone who believes that there is something wrong with the child because they say they are gay. They put the child into therapy and continue to make the child believe that they are not ok the way they are and there is something wrong with them. Every state should have that law. Every child should be told they are ok just the way they are and there is nothing I would change about you. As a so called Christian, you should want that child to believe God created you and you are perfect. Even if it is your child, you should not be able to put them in therapy and make them believe there is something wrong with them. And you are a teacher!!!!!!!!!!!! I hope you are not teaching anymore.


----------



## NJG (Dec 2, 2011)

Poor Purl said:


> You ought to see those parties on the back 40.:twisted:
> 
> Oh, never mind. It's all bull.


Oh you are so funny, you make me laugh out loud.


----------



## bellestarr12 (Mar 26, 2011)

SAMkewel said:


> Perhaps it's a screen they hide behind? As in, how dare you question me, I'm a Christian, with a capital K. I think I'm starting to lose it here.
> 
> When my gay son died it was (and is) a terrible loss. What was even worse is that I was banned from the groups of LGBT folks I had spent so much time with, personally and professionally, because I was no longer qualified by way of having a gay family member and I so missed the good times we had. Now that I again have LGBT family members, the groups, especially those with AIDS, have disbanded in my area, probably because most of the members are deceased now. I can't say I blamed them because I saw over and over how many of them were rejected by not only the world at large, but by their own families. Trust is difficult to win in those situations, even after several years of work and play. I'm certain those families were also Kristians.....
> 
> As I expected, my question about exactly what the homosexual life style is went unanswered, no doubt for total lack of knowledge of the fact that it is as varied as anyone else's. Who knew?


I am so sorry for your loss, Sam. I can't help wondering how those who rejected their children manage to live with themselves afterwards - I'm not very convinced that our most vociferous hatemongers here on KP really feel secure about the rhetoric they spew, or why would they need to make so much noise about it? "Methinks the lad[ies] [sic] doth protest too much."


----------



## NJG (Dec 2, 2011)

joeysomma said:


> You are right God help us all. God is allowing our country to wallow in its sin for a season. Then will come the judgment.
> 
> In Genesis 19, Sodom and Gomorrah describes God's wrath on homosexuality.
> 
> ...


You say you can hate the sin, but still love the sinner, but that person knows the truth. Don't think for one minute that you have them fooled into believing that.


----------



## NJG (Dec 2, 2011)

Ann DeGray said:


> *This was not meant to be a reply to SAMkewel but rather a reply to joeysomma. Sorry about the confusion*
> 
> I am the mother of a gay son and I wish that for just five minutes all homosexuals would turn purple. Five minutes. That's all the time it would take for you to look around and see that there are people in your own family, social circle, school and church who are (gasp) GAY! Your uncle, your sister, your pastor (yes, there ARE gays in the church), your neighbor.........one out of every 8 people (or 10, if you are more comfortable with that statistic) is gay.
> 
> ...


Besides the fact that someone close to her may be listening to her spew her hatred, all the time thinking, she is talking about me, she feels that way about me. I hope it isn't a child.


----------



## cookiequeen (Jun 15, 2011)

joeysomma said:


> Yes, I have close family members that are homosexual. I can hate the sin but still love the sinner. And I do love them as members of my family.
> 
> Then other than telling you what God has to say about Homosexuality, I can do no more. You can tear me down all you want, since if God is for me, who can be against me. Whatever you say will not change God's word.


(Part of Joey's quote deleted)
Gee, Joey, you're beginning to feel like an old friend.
It must be very difficult for you to love that gay relative while hating what s/he is doing with his/her partner. How can you separate that? You have stated your position on this subject over and over again. I want you to know that there are moral, and/or church-going gay people of all faiths who love God, love their families, and love their partners. They do good works, are active in their communities, and contribute to society. They are loving parents, sons, daughters, priests, ministers, elders, bishops, teachers, rabbis, police officers, military men---all sorts of people. They differ from you in sexual orientation---that's all. (Well, maybe that's not all, but I hope you "get" what I'm trying to say.) Please try to think of gay people and people who accept their gayness as "regular" people and not the embodiment of Satan. Honestly, we're just a bunch of plain ol' people, and I am not trying to "tear you down." Just trying to give you another perspective. Not everyone interprets God's word in the same way.


----------



## Cheeky Blighter (Nov 20, 2011)

ProxTrot said:


> Agreed that person more than knows it, they can FEEL the personal hate.
> 
> We can all feel it here too. Does what JS is spewing sound like it's just about the 'act' alone? Her hate is much too visceral for anyone with any common sense to believe it's not about hating the "sinner" too.
> 
> JoeyS, you ARE a hater, and the only ones that don't understand that about you are either dumb or fellow haters themselves trying to justify their OWN sin of hateful judgement.


Agreed, you are right on. joey is only fooling herself and nobody else. You don't say to someone "I Love you but..." It's either "I love you." or "I don't love you." Love is unconditional.


----------



## BrattyPatty (May 2, 2011)

joeysomma said:


> Then why are there so many ex-homosexuals? Why are the homosexuals so afraid, that they have passed a law in California that a therapist cannot try to tell someone under 18 that being a homosexual may not be the right way to go ? Why would a school expel a student from a program because she would not counsel a homosexual, because she could not in good faith, help him keep his homosexual life style?
> 
> I know they have found something unusual in the autopsies of homosexuals. But they have only found it after they have died. They cannot determine if it is because they were born that way or if it was because they were practicing homosexuals. But then there is the question, if anyone has even searched for it in heterosexuals.
> 
> And it is a * life-style *. I wonder why anyone would want to subject themselves to diseases and reduce the years their life.


Okay folks, here you have it! They have found 'something' in autopsies of homosexuals "only after they have died".

How many autopsies are performed on *living* homosexuals, or anyone who is alive for that matter?
:XD: :XD: :XD: :XD: :XD: :XD: :XD: :XD: :XD: :XD: :XD: :XD:
Seriously, joey, are you embarrassed yet?


----------



## BrattyPatty (May 2, 2011)

Cheeky Blighter said:


> Agreed, you are right on. joey is only fooling herself and nobody else. You don't say to someone "I Love you but..." It's either "I love you." or "I don't love you." Love is unconditional.


 :thumbup: :thumbup: :thumbup:


----------



## SAMkewel (Mar 5, 2011)

damemary said:


> Thereby proving another common myth. Gays do not abuse or recruit children. Pedophiles are a separate group.


Statically, it is extremely rare for homosexuals to be pedophiles. That's a heterosexual activity; they certainly have more than their share of abominable behavior.


----------



## SAMkewel (Mar 5, 2011)

NJG said:


> I had decided to not respond to your garbage anymore, but had to go back to this one last time. You said: Why are the homosexuals so afraid, that they have passed a law in California that a therapist cannot try to tell someone under 18 that being a homosexual may not be the right way to go ?
> 
> I don't know if is ignorance or you are so completely out of touch with reality that you said such a thing. The reason for the law is to protect the children from parents like you, from anyone who believes that there is something wrong with the child because they say they are gay. They put the child into therapy and continue to make the child believe that they are not ok the way they are and there is something wrong with them. Every state should have that law. Every child should be told they are ok just the way they are and there is nothing I would change about you. As a so called Christian, you should want that child to believe God created you and you are perfect. Even if it is your child, you should not be able to put them in therapy and make them believe there is something wrong with them. And you are a teacher!!!!!!!!!!!! I hope you are not teaching anymore.


Furthermore, reputable therapists do not believe that LGBT people are in need of therapy or change because of being LGBT alone. If they are suicidal because of what they have suffered because of the abusive behavior of others toward them, then a therapist would be of great value. My husband and I suspected our son had been born gay from the time he was three months old and therefor raised him to feel accepted and loved at home and to handle the bullying of others. He was fortunate in that he was not the only gay child in his school classes. He was the kindest, most caring person I've ever met, and no amount of hatred ever changed that in him or in his partner. I'm sorry I can't say the same about the particular Christians he and I had to deal with throughout his lifetime.


----------



## SQM (Jun 22, 2012)

SAMkewel said:


> Furthermore, reputable therapists do not believe that LGBT people are in need of therapy or change because of being LGBT alone. If they are suicidal because of what they have suffered because of the abusive behavior of others toward them, then a therapist would be of great value. My husband and I suspected our son had been born gay from the time he was three months old and therefor raised him to feel accepted and loved at home and to handle the bullying of others. He was fortunate in that he was not the only gay child in his school classes. He was the kindest, most caring person I've ever met, and no amount of hatred ever changed that in him or in his partner. I'm sorry I can't say the same about the particular Christians he and I had to deal with throughout his lifetime.


Your kid sounds like the kind of person I would have loved to have met. Lucky you!


----------



## rujam (Aug 19, 2011)

I just cannot believe that a photo of Barack Obama and his lovely lady could cause some, at times, vitriolic arguments and mud slinging.


----------



## SQM (Jun 22, 2012)

rujam said:


> I just cannot believe that a photo of Barack Obama and his lovely lady could cause some, at times, vitriolic arguments and mud slinging.


After 4861 posts, you should believe anything.


----------



## SAMkewel (Mar 5, 2011)

SQM said:


> Your kid sounds like the kind of person I would have loved to have met. Lucky you!


Thank you; I think I was lucky, too.


----------



## SAMkewel (Mar 5, 2011)

bellestarr12 said:


> I am so sorry for your loss, Sam. I can't help wondering how those who rejected their children manage to live with themselves afterwards - I'm not very convinced that our most vociferous hatemongers here on KP really feel secure about the rhetoric they spew, or why would they need to make so much noise about it? "Methinks the lad[ies] [sic] doth protest too much."


Thank you. I agree with your comments.


----------



## SAMkewel (Mar 5, 2011)

Cheeky Blighter said:


> Agreed, you are right on. joey is only fooling herself and nobody else. You don't say to someone "I Love you but..." It's either "I love you." or "I don't love you." Love is unconditional.


It sounds more like, "I'd love you if only you weren't who you are," to me. She doesn't seem to understand that it's just as unreasonable as if that person said the same thing to her--you know, change who you are and everything will be okay. It just doesn't work that way.


----------



## SAMkewel (Mar 5, 2011)

joeysomma said:


> You are right God help us all. God is allowing our country to wallow in its sin for a season. Then will come the judgment.
> 
> In Genesis 19, Sodom and Gomorrah describes God's wrath on homosexuality.
> 
> ...


I'll bet you still think unwed pregnant women should be stoned to death, too. How would that sit with being opposed to abortion?


----------



## Knitted by Nan (Aug 3, 2013)

BrattyPatty said:


> Okay folks, here you have it! They have found 'something' in autopsies of homosexuals "only after they have died".
> 
> How many autopsies are performed on *living* homosexuals, or anyone who is alive for that matter?
> :XD: :XD: :XD: :XD: :XD: :XD: :XD: :XD: :XD: :XD: :XD: :XD:
> Seriously, joey, are you embarrassed yet?


I think she is harking back to a report that was published in the UK sometime in the early 1970s. The researchers stated that they had found certain hormonal or chemical imbalances in the brains of deceased homosexuals and postulated that this chemical or hormonal imbalance was due to a dietary deficiency of the mother when she was pregnant and carrying the child who was homosexual. I cannot remember the report or the study but a net search may turn it up. I remember the report caused a lot of mirth with the gay crowd in Perth at the time. Comments such as "see my mother did make me a homosexual after all, it is all her fault she did not eat the correct diet when she was pregnant" were bandied about. Unfortunately none of the crowd were willing to undergo an autopsy whilst they were still alive in order to determine whether their brains were deficient in any hormones or chemicals.


----------



## Knitted by Nan (Aug 3, 2013)

SAMkewel said:


> Statically, it is extremely rare for homosexuals to be pedophiles. That's a heterosexual activity; they certainly have more than their share of abominable behavior.


Unfortunately we have had a few very horrible cases in Australia in recent years. Some of these pedophiles have actually murdered their victims. That poor boy who disappeared a few days before Christmas about ten year ago springs to mind. Yes, his murderer has been arrested and incarcerated at Her Majesties Pleasure, allowing for some closure for the parents. People protesting against the pedophiloes being allowed to live in the community when they were released from prison were protesting against the fact that they were pedophiles, not because they also happened to be homosexual.


----------



## Huckleberry (May 27, 2013)

cookiequeen said:


> (Part of Joey's quote deleted)
> Gee, Joey, you're beginning to feel like an old friend.
> It must be very difficult for you to love that gay relative while hating what s/he is doing with his/her partner. How can you separate that? You have stated your position on this subject over and over again. I want you to know that there are moral, and/or church-going gay people of all faiths who love God, love their families, and love their partners. They do good works, are active in their communities, and contribute to society. They are loving parents, sons, daughters, priests, ministers, elders, bishops, teachers, rabbis, police officers, military men---all sorts of people. They differ from you in sexual orientation---that's all. (Well, maybe that's not all, but I hope you "get" what I'm trying to say.) Please try to think of gay people and people who accept their gayness as "regular" people and not the embodiment of Satan. Honestly, we're just a bunch of plain ol' people, and I am not trying to "tear you down." Just trying to give you another perspective. Not everyone interprets God's word in the same way.


cookiequeen
so well stated. Thank you.


----------



## Huckleberry (May 27, 2013)

rujam said:


> I just cannot believe that a photo of Barack Obama and his lovely lady could cause some, at times, vitriolic arguments and mud slinging.


rujam
some people's hate of others is so deep that they will never shed it. They believe that tearing others down will elevate them. Usually they are failures at anything they undertake.


----------



## Huckleberry (May 27, 2013)

MarilynKnits said:


> And Christie spending millions to protect his ego when there are still people suffering from the effects of Hurricane Sandy who need the funds to rebuild homes.


MarilynKnits
looks like the Fed is not finished with Christie. Sounds like Christie runs over everyone with a freight train to destroy them and keep himself in place. I call that bullying. Certainly not material for President or any other official position in my book. I see that as a Mafia style governing.


----------



## rujam (Aug 19, 2011)

EveMCooke said:


> I think she is harking back to a report that was published in the UK sometime in the early 1970s. The researchers stated that they had found certain hormonal or chemical imbalances in the brains of deceased homosexuals and postulated that this chemical or hormonal imbalance was due to a dietary deficiency of the mother when she was pregnant and carrying the child who was homosexual. I cannot remember the report or the study but a net search may turn it up. I remember the report caused a lot of mirth with the gay crowd in Perth at the time. Comments such as "see my mother did make me a homosexual after all, it is all her fault she did not eat the correct diet when she was pregnant" were bandied about. Unfortunately none of the crowd were willing to undergo an autopsy whilst they were still alive in order to determine whether their brains were deficient in any hormones or chemicals.


I have a gay son and he is the best son a mother could have. He said he didn't choose to be gay.


----------



## laceandbits (Jun 23, 2011)

ZaaZaa3 said:


> I thought this was a knitting/crochet forum not a political venue. We all have thoughts on OP but my are not appropriate for a knitting forum. Let's stick to the items at hand not political statements!


If you want to stick with knitting, why read the Chat posts. Not logical.


----------



## Knitted by Nan (Aug 3, 2013)

rujam said:


> I have a gay son and he is the best son a mother could have. He said he didn't choose to be gay.


My brother is gay, my niece is gay, my best friend from the 60s was gay, my second husband was bi, I knew and still know a lot of gays, bis, etc and all apart from my second husbands were great. Second husband was a ***** but not because he was bi but because he wanted to be the one who issued the orders, at all times.


----------



## damemary (Mar 14, 2012)

rujam said:


> I have a gay son and he is the best son a mother could have. He said he didn't choose to be gay.


You are fortunate to have each other. Your comments touch me.


----------



## MarilynKnits (Aug 30, 2011)

SAMkewel said:


> - - - - -As I expected, my question about exactly what the homosexual life style is went unanswered, no doubt for total lack of knowledge of the fact that it is as varied as anyone else's. Who knew?


From what I have seen over the many years I have had non hetero friends, their "lifestyle" was pretty much the same as anybody else's. Except that they had to maintain a higher level of personal privacy than most of the "straight" community.

Go to work, grocery shop, do laundry, cook, eat out occasionally, see movies, watch TV, spend time with friends, stay away from toxic family members, attend a house of worship if one was so moved, you know, people activities.

I am strictly hetero, long married, and not attracted in a romantic bent toward other women. But my private life is my private life with details shared only with my partner, in this case my husband of 57 years. And I have toxic family members I avoid as much as I possibly can.

Honest love is hard enough to find, as many disappointed divorced people and unhappily married people know. When you find your life's companion, your soul mate, it is your personal safe zone and nobody has the right to pass judgement.


----------



## MarilynKnits (Aug 30, 2011)

joeysomma said:


> You are right God help us all. God is allowing our country to wallow in its sin for a season. Then will come the judgment.
> 
> In Genesis 19, Sodom and Gomorrah describes God's wrath on homosexuality.
> 
> ...


If there is a hereafter each of us will find out G-d's opinion of us. Some of us may be very surprised, and not in a good way.


----------



## PaKnitter (Mar 7, 2011)

MarilynKnits said:


> From what I have seen over the many years I have had non hetero friends, their "lifestyle" was pretty much the same as anybody else's. Except that they had to maintain a higher level of personal privacy than most of the "straight" community.
> 
> Go to work, grocery shop, do laundry, cook, eat out occasionally, see movies, watch TV, spend time with friends, stay away from toxic family members, attend a house of worship if one was so moved, you know, people activities.
> 
> ...


As much as I think this has gotten way off topic from the orginial post I do agree with this post 100%. 
I am more concern with babies having babies and playing house with their boyfriends.


----------



## Wombatnomore (Dec 9, 2013)

MarilynKnits said:


> Statistics on the percentage of people who said they were homosexual who changed their sexual orientation? And name the source of the statistics.
> 
> i live in the real world among a hugely diverse group of people, and homosexuality is not a "choice" like the color of your hair or whether to eat Chinese or sushi tonight. It is part of the fiber of who the person is.
> 
> ...


Go Marilyn! Speaking of one classy lady!


----------



## Designer1234 (Aug 9, 2011)

MarilynKnits said:


> From what I have seen over the many years I have had non hetero friends, their "lifestyle" was pretty much the same as anybody else's. Except that they had to maintain a higher level of personal privacy than most of the "straight" community.
> 
> Go to work, grocery shop, do laundry, cook, eat out occasionally, see movies, watch TV, spend time with friends, stay away from toxic family members, attend a house of worship if one was so moved, you know, people activities.
> 
> ...


 :thumbup: :thumbup: :thumbup:


----------



## damemary (Mar 14, 2012)

Lovely. True love and trust must be valued in whatever form it takes.



MarilynKnits said:


> From what I have seen over the many years I have had non hetero friends, their "lifestyle" was pretty much the same as anybody else's. Except that they had to maintain a higher level of personal privacy than most of the "straight" community.
> 
> Go to work, grocery shop, do laundry, cook, eat out occasionally, see movies, watch TV, spend time with friends, stay away from toxic family members, attend a house of worship if one was so moved, you know, people activities.
> 
> ...


----------



## Ann DeGray (May 11, 2011)

SAMkewel said:


> Perhaps it's a screen they hide behind? As in, how dare you question me, I'm a Christian, with a capital K. I think I'm starting to lose it here.
> 
> When my gay son died it was (and is) a terrible loss. What was even worse is that I was banned from the groups of LGBT folks I had spent so much time with, personally and professionally, because I was no longer qualified by way of having a gay family member and I so missed the good times we had. Now that I again have LGBT family members, the groups, especially those with AIDS, have disbanded in my area, probably because most of the members are deceased now. I can't say I blamed them because I saw over and over how many of them were rejected by not only the world at large, but by their own families. Trust is difficult to win in those situations, even after several years of work and play. I'm certain those families were also Kristians.....
> 
> As I expected, my question about exactly what the homosexual life style is went unanswered, no doubt for total lack of knowledge of the fact that it is as varied as anyone else's. Who knew?


Yeah, some like to cook, some don't, some climb mountains, some don't, some are truck drivers, some aren't, some like classical, some like rock, some are nice, some are nasty......just like straight people.


----------



## Ann DeGray (May 11, 2011)

joeysomma said:


> You are right God help us all. God is allowing our country to wallow in its sin for a season. Then will come the judgment.
> 
> In Genesis 19, Sodom and Gomorrah describes God's wrath on homosexuality.
> 
> ...


Now if we're gonna use the First Testament let's go to Leviticus. *ALL* of Leviticus. Leviticus is always such a favorite. But, I repeat, let's look at *ALL*of Leviticus.

I don't have my Bible in front of me but men are not supposed to cut their hair, you know, woman should all cleanse themselves in the river once a month because they are unclean, there's something about when a man dies his brother is supposed to marry the widow, I think.

My all-time favorite is the one about it being a sin to pierce the skin. That wouldn't mean that we should just stick to clip on earrings, ya know. It would mean that all surgery would be sinful. Who is there among us who has not had surgery? My tonsils, my broken wrist, the angioplasty on the renal artery to my left kidney.....and OMG, Both of my artificial hips! How can you bear to even look at me, Levi?

The Bible isn't like a Chinese menu. You can't select one from column A, one from column B and one from column C.

The First Testament is a book of hate, brutality and murder. A book for men, written by men.

The Second Testament is a book of love. God's love. Christ's love. Forgiveness. Loving thy neighbor as one's self.

And judgment? That's God's job, not ours. I'm so glad it is not up to me. I bet even God must get tired of it sometimes.


----------



## Ann DeGray (May 11, 2011)

SAMkewel said:


> Furthermore, reputable therapists do not believe that LGBT people are in need of therapy or change because of being LGBT alone. If they are suicidal because of what they have suffered because of the abusive behavior of others toward them, then a therapist would be of great value. My husband and I suspected our son had been born gay from the time he was three months old and therefor raised him to feel accepted and loved at home and to handle the bullying of others. He was fortunate in that he was not the only gay child in his school classes. He was the kindest, most caring person I've ever met, and no amount of hatred ever changed that in him or in his partner. I'm sorry I can't say the same about the particular Christians he and I had to deal with throughout his lifetime.


My son tells me that the first question a gay person asks another gay person is, "Does your family know?" Then, "How did they handle it?" Many of his friends go "home" only when there's been a death in the family, some not even then. That doesn't sound like they are feeling much "love for the sinner". Many of them were physically beaten by family members when they came out.
My son and his friends are members of the Los Angeles Gay Men's Chorus. At Christmas they sing at nursing homes and visit with the elderly. During the year they work at food banks and homeless shelters. I guess you'd say they are doing God's work on earth for the less fortunate. Strange, isn't it, since they are all so evil......


----------



## damemary (Mar 14, 2012)

Very well put. Thank you.



Ann DeGray said:


> Now if we're gonna use the First Testament let's go to Leviticus. *ALL* of Leviticus. Leviticus is always such a favorite. But, I repeat, let's look at *ALL*of Leviticus.
> 
> I don't have my Bible in front of me but men are not supposed to cut their hair, you know, woman should all cleanse themselves in the river once a month because they are unclean, there's something about when a man dies his brother is supposed to marry the widow, I think.
> 
> ...


----------



## damemary (Mar 14, 2012)

I suppose, in a way, their experiences have taught them compassion and empathy, fine things to have.



Ann DeGray said:


> My son tells me that the first question a gay person asks another gay person is, "Does your family know?" Then, "How did they handle it?" Many of his friends go "home" only when there's been a death in the family, some not even then. That doesn't sound like they are feeling much "love for the sinner". Many of them were physically beaten by family members when they came out.
> My son and his friends are members of the Los Angeles Gay Men's Chorus. At Christmas they sing at nursing homes and visit with the elderly. During the year they work at food banks and homeless shelters. I guess you'd say they are doing God's work on earth for the less fortunate. Strange, isn't it, since they are all so evil......


----------



## Ann DeGray (May 11, 2011)

joeysomma said:


> I can see you do not understand what is written in the Bible. The rules and rituals in the "Old Testament" were for the Israelites to do until Jesus came to be the Savior. Once Jesus died on the cross and rose again, all of the rules and rituals were fulfilled. The only remaining one is for the individual to acknowledge that they are a sinner and accept Jesus Christ as their personal Savior.
> 
> Homosexuality was an abomination in the "Old Testament" and it is still an abomination in the "New Testament." That will never change.
> 
> I am not judging, just stating what is in the Bible.


What did Jesus say about homosexuality?


----------



## Knitted by Nan (Aug 3, 2013)

Ann DeGray said:


> My son tells me that the first question a gay person asks another gay person is, "Does your family know?" Then, "How did they handle it?" Many of his friends go "home" only when there's been a death in the family, some not even then. That doesn't sound like they are feeling much "love for the sinner". Many of them were physically beaten by family members when they came out.
> My son and his friends are members of the Los Angeles Gay Men's Chorus. At Christmas they sing at nursing homes and visit with the elderly. During the year they work at food banks and homeless shelters. I guess you'd say they are doing God's work on earth for the less fortunate. Strange, isn't it, since they are all so evil......


Your son and his friends sound like fine, upstanding young men. I can see why you are proud of your son. Tell him you love him and that he is important to you. Give him a hug.


----------



## SQM (Jun 22, 2012)

Ann DeGray said:


> Now if we're gonna use the First Testament let's go to Leviticus. *ALL* of Leviticus. Leviticus is always such a favorite. But, I repeat, let's look at *ALL*of Leviticus.
> 
> I don't have my Bible in front of me but men are not supposed to cut their hair, you know, woman should all cleanse themselves in the river once a month because they are unclean, there's something about when a man dies his brother is supposed to marry the widow, I think.
> 
> ...


The "First Testament" has the Song of Songs which is hardly about hate, etc. The Second Testament may be a book of love but what about Revelations? And certainly the readers of the Second Testament have proven over the millennia to be full of church-sponsored hate, brutality and murder. The piercing of the skin refers to tattoos. Speak kindly of the first testament as that was Jesus's prayer book. I still love you , Mrs. DeGray, but you must not accept the anti-Jewish bible propaganda you were raised with.


----------



## rocky1991 (May 8, 2011)

rujam said:


> I just cannot believe that a photo of Barack Obama and his lovely lady could cause some, at times, vitriolic arguments and mud slinging.


No need for pictures, just mention his name. The hate comes pouring out.


----------



## rocky1991 (May 8, 2011)

joeysomma said:


> I can see you do not understand what is written in the Bible. The rules and rituals in the "Old Testament" were for the Israelites to do until Jesus came to be the Savior. Once Jesus died on the cross and rose again, all of the rules and rituals were fulfilled. The only remaining one is for the individual to acknowledge that they are a sinner and accept Jesus Christ as their personal Savior.
> 
> Homosexuality was an abomination in the "Old Testament" and it is still an abomination in the "New Testament." That will never change.
> 
> I am not judging, just stating what is in the Bible.


How cruel and unforgiving is you bible an your G-d. I feel sorry for someone who lives with such anger and hatred, I hope you G-d forgives you because I find you intensely arrogant in your judgements.


----------



## bellestarr12 (Mar 26, 2011)

joeysomma said:


> Then other than telling you what God has to say about Homosexuality, I can do no more. You can tear me down all you want, since if God is for me, who can be against me. Whatever you say will not change God's word.


joeysomma, I wasn't going to weigh in on this thread any more but . . . first of all, what you quote isn't what God said, it's what men said who believed, perhaps correctly but also perhaps not, that they were inspired by God. You must not be familiar with the history of the Bible, its many and varied translations and the choices, often politically motivated, that determined which "books" got into the "approved" Testaments, or the dates of the actual "books" (Genesis isn't the oldest, nor were the first books written by Moses) and the relation many of them bear to much earlier Mesopotamian texts.

Yes, I know, right about now you're probably covering your ears and closing your eyes and saying very loudly "I can't hear you!" My daughter used to do that when she was 4 or 5.

It's nice you believe God is for you - the God you believe in is not someone I would want to have on my side.

The first openly gay person I ever met was a friend of a friend who told me about coming out to his dad, who didn't take it at all well. The son just said, "Dad, it's about love. You know, there just isn't enough love in the world, so I don't think we should reject or devalue it when we're lucky enough to find it." I will never forget that wise, kind, and wonderful young man - and I'm pretty sure God - a God I would be willing to respect and believe in - is for him.


----------



## SAMkewel (Mar 5, 2011)

rujam said:


> I have a gay son and he is the best son a mother could have. He said he didn't choose to be gay.


I know how that can be; my gay son and his partner will always remain closest to my heart. Of course he didn't choose to be gay. I think my son was nine or ten when he began asking repeatedly why some men prefer women and others prefer men. We had many discussions about that in which I was at least neutral and often pro-gay because I had some casual experience with gay men (one in a nearby city who was my aunt's favorite hairdresser, and his partner--those kinds of situations) and had never had an issue with them. Strangely, after my son left home and went to work in Detroit, I got a letter from him telling me I didn't need to be afraid of gay men because they wouldn't hurt me. I think the letter was really to himself because he still was not admitting or accepting that he was gay. That took another few years.


----------



## SAMkewel (Mar 5, 2011)

SmokeScreen said:


> There's nothing there that precludes loving homosexual relationships.
> 
> That is talking about heterosexuals becoming so lustful they go against _their own _natures. It's not about love, but lust
> 
> ...


Ah, thank you!! There are some of us who understand it correctly instead of reading it through the eyes of prejudice and looking around for someone else to hang our misunderstandings upon.


----------



## MaidInBedlam (Jul 24, 2012)

MarilynKnits said:


> If there is a hereafter each of us will find out G-d's opinion of us. Some of us may be very surprised, and not in a good way.


Joey's complete and literal belief in everything in the Bible isn't any different than the complete and literal belief the Jihadist have in the Koran. The only difference is that Joey isn't a terrorist, she's just verbally and emotionally abusive around here.


----------



## MaidInBedlam (Jul 24, 2012)

PaKnitter said:


> As much as I think this has gotten way off topic from the orginial post I do agree with this post 100%.
> I am more concern with babies having babies and playing house with their boyfriends.


:thumbup: :thumbup: There are far more important things to consider than how an LGBT person makes coffee...


----------



## MaidInBedlam (Jul 24, 2012)

joeysomma said:


> Gods Wrath on Unrighteousness Romans 1:18-32 (NKJV)
> 
> _18 For the wrath of God is revealed from heaven against all ungodliness and unrighteousness of men, who suppress the truth in unrighteousness, 19 because what may be known of God is manifest in them, for God has shown it to them. 20 For since the creation of the world His invisible attributes are clearly seen, being understood by the things that are made, even His eternal power and Godhead, so that they are without excuse, 21 because, although they knew God, they did not glorify Him as God, nor were thankful, but became futile in their thoughts, and their foolish hearts were darkened. 22 Professing to be wise, they became fools, 23 and changed the glory of the incorruptible God into an image made like corruptible manand birds and four-footed animals and creeping things.
> 
> ...


So, how many of those folks "who, knowing the righteous judgment of God, that those who practice such things are deserving of death, not only do the same but also approve of those who practice them" have you killed? Shouldn't Christians be giving God a helping hand?


----------



## alwaysforyou (Dec 6, 2011)

"Honest love is hard enough to find, as many disappointed divorced people and unhappily married people know. When you find your life's companion, your soul mate, it is your personal safe zone and nobody has the right to pass judgement."

This is so true and beautifully phrased (personal safe zone)...and it all goes back to the original post of a picture President Obama and his lovely wife seem to epitomize this concept perfectly. Now how about some tea and cookies to get all the rest of this nasty taste out of our mouths  Lynn


----------



## Mercygirl76 (Dec 30, 2012)

Dakota Sun said:


> All I can say is that I have no respect for any president who will not salute the flag and our military. Back to knitting and crocheting.


A huge deal has been made about this. There is a picture of BOH standing next to some military officers who are saluting and he is not. HE IS THE COMMANDER IN CHIEF. They are supposed to salute him. BTW, he isn't the only President who hasn't saluted the military. There are pictures of other a Presidents who haven't saluted the flag, either. Do you hate them?

I also hazard to guess he hasn't been photographed flipping the bird, either.

Many of these photos taken of leaders are totally out of context.

I don't believe a huge deal was made out of Bush's lazy salute to the flag and the flip of the bird probably was directed at some obnoxious photographer. Who knows? Why can't BOH be accorded the same benefit of the doubt? I think the racial hatred still runs deep in many areas of this country but is just camoflaged by the attempt at political correctness.


----------



## Ann DeGray (May 11, 2011)

joeysomma said:


> You are right God help us all. God is allowing our country to wallow in its sin for a season. Then will come the judgment.
> 
> In Genesis 19, Sodom and Gomorrah describes God's wrath on homosexuality.
> 
> ...


I was taught that God created us all. Would God create 10% of His creations to be despised, reviled against and hated? Can I see God standing with His arms around a new born baby, saying, "I love you as I love *all* my creations. But do not expect anyone else to love you for I have damned you forever. You shall be feared, hated and reviled by all of my other beautiful creations because I choose this is the life I chose for you."

Would your God do that? The God I know and love would not.

I have often heard people say that it does not matter what we believe; we all worship the same God.

Apparently not.


----------



## Mercygirl76 (Dec 30, 2012)

Ann DeGray said:


> I was taught that God created us all. Would God create 10% of His creations to be despised, reviled against and hated? Can I see God standing with His arms around a new born baby, saying, "I love you as I love *all* my creations. But do not expect anyone else to love you for I have damned you forever. You shall be feared, hated and reviled by all of my other beautiful creations because I choose this is the life I chose for you."
> 
> Would your God do that? The God I know and love would not.
> 
> ...


 :thumbup: :thumbup: :thumbup:


----------



## MaidInBedlam (Jul 24, 2012)

pattibe said:


> I love this picture of President Obama. He is such a gentleman.


I'm starting to worry about our President. How much more weight can he lose before he leaves office? Of course, these are terrible times and our President inherited a huge amount of garbage from his predecessor. Like some Presidents before him, the job seems to be taking a terrible toll on him. And through it all he's remained a gentleman. I don't always agree with what he does, but that doesn't mean I lose my respect for him.


----------



## Ann DeGray (May 11, 2011)

joeysomma said:


> All I am doing is telling you what is in the Bible. I believe it. You can choose to not believe. But then when you reach the gates of heaven, you will not enter. God is a God of Love, He wants all to reside with him in heaven, but there is no sin in Heaven. The only way a sinner can get to Heaven is to accept Jesus Christ as their personal Savior. Then our sin is covered by the blood shed by Jesus on the cross. Much the same way the blood of the lamb in the Old Testament was a symbol of Jesus' shed blood.
> 
> John 14:6 (NKJV)
> 
> ...


----------



## grandmann (Feb 4, 2011)

MaidInBedlam said:


> I'm starting to worry about our President. How much more weight can he lose before he leaves office? Of course, these are terrible times and our President inherited a huge amount of garbage from his predecessor. Like some Presidents before him, the job seems to be taking a terrible toll on him. And through it all he's remained a gentleman. I don't always agree with what he does, but that doesn't mean I lose my respect for him.


2016 hopefully the right person gets in and don't destroy what this President accomplished. Our economy is a lot better compare to what President Obama inherited.


----------



## MaidInBedlam (Jul 24, 2012)

grandmann said:


> 2016 hopefully the right person gets in and don't destroy what this President accomplished. Our economy is a lot better compare to what President Obama inherited.


I hope the right person gets into office, too, and that President Obama's accomplishments won't be shredded. Our economy seems to be in pretty good shape. Look at how high the stock market is now'


----------



## NJG (Dec 2, 2011)

Huckleberry said:


> MarilynKnits
> looks like the Fed is not finished with Christie. Sounds like Christie runs over everyone with a freight train to destroy them and keep himself in place. I call that bullying. Certainly not material for President or any other official position in my book. I see that as a Mafia style governing.


That describes him perfectly. Can't you just see him as president loosing his temper and using his smart mouth against anyone who asks a question he doesn't like. He is a bully. There might also be people who would be kind of afraid of him and therefor not ask an important question.


----------



## NJG (Dec 2, 2011)

scoutstitches said:


> I think the best response I have heard to the "homosexual choice" is "when did you choose to be heterosexual?"


I like that response too. :thumbup: :thumbup: :thumbup: :thumbup:


----------



## NJG (Dec 2, 2011)

I attended school, from kindergarten on with a girl who had a sex change operation later in life as an adult. If there ever was a case of being born in the wrong body, it was her. There was never anything feminine about her. We had to wear skirts and dresses in those years and she never looked feminine and always looked uncomfortable. She played football with the boys rather than do anything the girls did. She left school early, got married, had a child and moved out of state. She later came back after a divorce and her ex got custody of their child. It was then she had the operation. I have not seen him in years and years, so I hope his life has been good.


----------



## Nussa (Jul 7, 2011)

You hit the nail on the head with this woman... :thumbup:



SmokeScreen said:


> I see you're talking to yourself.
> 
> No mam, it is you that distorts the Bible into something hateful and judgmental. Jesus wants us to do the opposite, love and let Our Father do the judging. In the meantime, we are to care for out brothers and sisters in humanity and proselytize by being a living example of Christ's Love ... not by pontificating and play God Himself .... which, IMO is a mortal sin and ultimate blaspheme.
> 
> ...


----------



## NJG (Dec 2, 2011)

PaKnitter said:


> As much as I think this has gotten way off topic from the orginial post I do agree with this post 100%.
> I am more concern with babies having babies and playing house with their boyfriends.


I agree and with domestic violence. Too many young girls are brainwashed to believe that when they get beat, they deserve it. A niece of mine was with a guy for 7 years. They had a daughter and was planning a wedding, till she found out he was cheating. She kicked him out, and his response was that among his friends, when they found themselves in the same position, their woman stood with them. WTF was my response and hers too, luckily, so he is gone.


----------



## SQM (Jun 22, 2012)

joeysomma said:


> All I am doing is telling you what is in the Bible. I believe it. You can choose to not believe. But then when you reach the gates of heaven, you will not enter. God is a God of Love, He wants all to reside with him in heaven, but there is no sin in Heaven. The only way a sinner can get to Heaven is to accept Jesus Christ as their personal Savior. Then our sin is covered by the blood shed by Jesus on the cross. Much the same way the blood of the lamb in the Old Testament was a symbol of Jesus' shed blood.
> 
> John 14:6 (NKJV)
> 6_ Jesus said to him, I am the way, the truth, and the life. No one comes to the Father except through Me._
> ...


The blood of the lamb had nada to do with Jesus. But with the Bible being literature, I guess one can deconstruct it anyway one wants.


----------



## MaidInBedlam (Jul 24, 2012)

NJG said:


> That describes him perfectly. Can't you just see him as president loosing his temper and using his smart mouth against anyone who asks a question he doesn't like. He is a bully. There might also be people who would be kind of afraid of him and therefor not ask an important question.


I'm thinking Jeb Bush is going to end up as the Republican candidate in 2016.


----------



## MaidInBedlam (Jul 24, 2012)

SQM said:


> The blood of the lamb had nada to do with Jesus. But with the Bible being literature, I guess one can deconstruct it anyway one wants.


but check John 1:29 and 1:36. Jesus is the Lamb of God.


----------



## bellestarr12 (Mar 26, 2011)

MaidInBedlam said:


> I hope the right person gets into office, too, and that President Obama's accomplishments won't be shredded. Our economy seems to be in pretty good shape. Look at how high the stock market is now'


 :thumbup: :thumbup: :thumbup:


----------



## NJG (Dec 2, 2011)

MaidInBedlam said:


> I hope the right person gets into office, too, and that President Obama's accomplishments won't be shredded. Our economy seems to be in pretty good shape. Look at how high the stock market is now'


Yes and now McConnell is taking credit for how things are going in the US. Just the anticipation of this republican control of congress has made the economy get better, according to McConnell.


----------



## NJG (Dec 2, 2011)

Fox news has stuck their foot in it once again. While discussing the attack in France: 

"That's my question about these guys because if we know they were speaking unaccented French and they had, you know, ski masks on, do we even know what color they were?," Bream asked. "What the tone of their skin was," she tried to clarify  as if that were less racist. "I mean what if they didn't look like typical bad guys?"

So what does a typical bad guy look like?


----------



## Goldrobin (Apr 18, 2014)

henhouse2011 said:


> lila ladue said:
> 
> 
> > There are other pictures of him too. Not saluting the American flag, not placing his correct hand over his heart during our nationa anthem, bowing to Muslims. I could go on an on but don't want to make this a political discussion, GET INFORMED.[/quote
> ...


----------



## SQM (Jun 22, 2012)

MaidInBedlam said:


> but check John 1:29 and 1:36. Jesus is the Lamb of God.


You are my expert but I must point out that the paschal blood predated Jesus and he was certainly not in the minds of the Jewish writers of the Hebrew Bible.


----------



## MarilynKnits (Aug 30, 2011)

Ann DeGray said:


> My son tells me that the first question a gay person asks another gay person is, "Does your family know?" Then, "How did they handle it?" Many of his friends go "home" only when there's been a death in the family, some not even then. That doesn't sound like they are feeling much "love for the sinner". Many of them were physically beaten by family members when they came out.
> My son and his friends are members of the Los Angeles Gay Men's Chorus. At Christmas they sing at nursing homes and visit with the elderly. During the year they work at food banks and homeless shelters. I guess you'd say they are doing God's work on earth for the less fortunate. Strange, isn't it, since they are all so evil......


I guess we will just love bad boys. These folks sound like loving and giving people. Not like the sourpusses who would condemn them. I can imagine who is really going to Heaven and who to Hell if there is an afterlife. They love joyful voices in Heaven, I would imagine.


----------



## grandmann (Feb 4, 2011)

MaidInBedlam said:


> I'm thinking Jeb Bush is going to end up as the Republican candidate in 2016.


Mike Huckabee is another one who want to try out for the office. We will see how far he goes. I don't think Jeb Bush will make either. I guess we just have to wait and see. I know who I might vote for though.


----------



## MaidInBedlam (Jul 24, 2012)

SQM said:


> You are my expert but I must point out that the paschal blood predated Jesus and he was certainly not in the minds of the Jewish writers of the Hebrew Bible.


Maybe making Jesus the Lamb of God whose blood washes our sins away is related to the paschal blood to help prove to Jews that He is indeed the long-awaited Messiah. God knows, all sorts of things have been rolled into the Bible to lure people into Christianity. Along with every thing else the Bible is, it's a pretty big sales pitch, too,


----------



## SQM (Jun 22, 2012)

MaidInBedlam said:


> Maybe making Jesus the Lamb of God whose blood washes our sins away is related to the paschal blood to help prove to Jews that He is indeed the long-awaited Messiah. God knows, all sorts of things have been rolled into the Bible to lure people into Christianity. Along with every thing else the Bible is, it's a pretty big sales pitch, too,


Exactly and we are not buying.

The Jihadists were killed and let them go to Mrs. Somma's hell.


----------



## damemary (Mar 14, 2012)

And the Tea Party faction of the GOP would be livid. If Jeb manages to get around that, it's going to cost him a lot.



MaidInBedlam said:


> I'm thinking Jeb Bush is going to end up as the Republican candidate in 2016.


----------



## damemary (Mar 14, 2012)

Isn't that a riot? People are laughing to his face.



NJG said:


> Yes and now McConnell is taking credit for how things are going in the US. Just the anticipation of this republican control of congress has made the economy get better, according to McConnell.


----------



## damemary (Mar 14, 2012)

NJG said:


> Yes and now McConnell is taking credit for how things are going in the US. Just the anticipation of this republican control of congress has made the economy get better, according to McConnell.


David McCabe at The Hill wrote up some funny stuff on Wednesday. Apparently, Senate Majority Leader Mitch McConnell (R-KY) gave an explanation for the wave of very good economic headlines flooding mainstream and social media these past few weeks. Like the weenie that he is, McConnell spouts:

After so many years of sluggish growth, were finally starting to see some economic data that can provide a glimmer of hope; the 'uptick' appears to 'coincide' with the biggest political change of the Obama Administrations long tenure in Washington: the 'expectation' of a new Republican Congress.

The 'expectation?' No way. He did not say that. (WAY, my friend. Way.)

Normally, I want to hurl my laptop, like a frisbee, across the room every time I think of McConnell being reelected. Or I close my eyes, hold my hands over my ears, and sing, "LaLaLaLa" when he's on the news. But this made me laugh, and apparently it struck the funny bones of two Democrats who opted to take some good cracks at McConnell's ridiculousness.

Mo Elleithee, the Democratic National Committee Communications Director, responded with:

That Mitch McConnell is one funny guy!"

He likes to remind people all the time that hes not a scientist. Now we know hes not a mathematician or an economist either."

McCabe also reports White House Senior Adviser Dan Pfeiffer came back with a quote attributed to the basketball player Stacey King. In a historic game where King scored one point to Michael Jordan's 69 points, King said:

I'll always remember this as the night that Michael Jordan and I combined for 70 points.

excerpted from Daily Kos 1/9/2015


----------



## damemary (Mar 14, 2012)

Airhead tries to talk again.



NJG said:


> Fox news has stuck their foot in it once again. While discussing the attack in France:
> 
> "That's my question about these guys because if we know they were speaking unaccented French and they had, you know, ski masks on, do we even know what color they were?," Bream asked. "What the tone of their skin was," she tried to clarify  as if that were less racist. "I mean what if they didn't look like typical bad guys?"
> 
> So what does a typical bad guy look like?


----------



## NJG (Dec 2, 2011)

grandmann said:


> Mike Huckabee is another one who want to try out for the office. We will see how far he goes. I don't think Jeb Bush will make either. I guess we just have to wait and see. I know who I might vote for though.


I think we might have another another group of circus acts from the right like we had in 2012. Since the republicans have kind of divided into republicans and tea party republicans, I think it will be hard to find one that will satisfy them all. Also, there are so many skeletons in so many closets, just past things believed and said, that they can't get away from the crap from the past anymore.


----------



## sumpleby (Aug 3, 2013)

joeysomma said:


> Gods Wrath on Unrighteousness Romans 1:18-32 (NKJV)
> 
> _18 For the wrath of God is revealed from heaven against all ungodliness and unrighteousness of men, who suppress the truth in unrighteousness, 19 because what may be known of God is manifest in them, for God has shown it to them. 20 For since the creation of the world His invisible attributes are clearly seen, being understood by the things that are made, even His eternal power and Godhead, so that they are without excuse, 21 because, although they knew God, they did not glorify Him as God, nor were thankful, but became futile in their thoughts, and their foolish hearts were darkened. 22 Professing to be wise, they became fools, 23 and changed the glory of the incorruptible God into an image made like corruptible manand birds and four-footed animals and creeping things.
> 
> ...


*Romans* is an epistle from the aposlte Paul to believers, not what Jesus said. So, asking that question again, what did _Jesus_ say about it?


----------



## sumpleby (Aug 3, 2013)

NJG said:


> Fox news has stuck their foot in it once again. While discussing the attack in France:
> 
> "That's my question about these guys because if we know they were speaking unaccented French and they had, you know, ski masks on, do we even know what color they were?," Bream asked. "What the tone of their skin was," she tried to clarify  as if that were less racist. "I mean what if they didn't look like typical bad guys?"
> 
> So what does a typical bad guy look like?


Yep, that's Faux News: according to them, non-white skin color = "typical bad guys."


----------



## Mercygirl76 (Dec 30, 2012)

Goldrobin said:


> Or, go to Snopes.com and look it up. You will be surprised at how many lies there are out there and where they started.


That's my point. There are plenty of other pictures of him saluting. So many pictures of any president are snapped that you don't know if he was caught putting his hand up or down or not at all. This is true for Obama pics, too.


----------



## BrattyPatty (May 2, 2011)

This is one of my favorites


----------



## Poor Purl (Apr 14, 2011)

SAMkewel said:


> Furthermore, reputable therapists do not believe that LGBT people are in need of therapy or change because of being LGBT alone. If they are suicidal because of what they have suffered because of the abusive behavior of others toward them, then a therapist would be of great value. My husband and I suspected our son had been born gay from the time he was three months old and therefor raised him to feel accepted and loved at home and to handle the bullying of others. He was fortunate in that he was not the only gay child in his school classes. He was the kindest, most caring person I've ever met, and no amount of hatred ever changed that in him or in his partner. I'm sorry I can't say the same about the particular Christians he and I had to deal with throughout his lifetime.


You seem to have been wonderful parents. At least his brief life wasn't spent in misery thinking he was unloved. I am very, very sorry for your loss.


----------



## Poor Purl (Apr 14, 2011)

NJG said:


> Fox news has stuck their foot in it once again. While discussing the attack in France:
> 
> "That's my question about these guys because if we know they were speaking unaccented French and they had, you know, ski masks on, do we even know what color they were?," Bream asked. "What the tone of their skin was," she tried to clarify  as if that were less racist. "I mean what if they didn't look like typical bad guys?"
> 
> So what does a typical bad guy look like?


Like a typical good guy.


----------



## RosieC (Feb 14, 2012)

hilltopper said:


> pattibe - another very pretty photo! Thanks for sharing.


 :thumbup: that is an absolutely lovely photo !


----------



## Poor Purl (Apr 14, 2011)

SQM said:


> You are my expert but I must point out that the paschal blood predated Jesus and he was certainly not in the minds of the Jewish writers of the Hebrew Bible.


True. But the believers seem to think that the entire Hebrew Bible exists to predict the coming of Jesus, and they'll use every subterfuge to prove it. (I don't include Maid; of course the New Testament refers to him as the Lamb of God - it's a new testament.)


----------



## damemary (Mar 14, 2012)

sumpleby said:


> Yep, that's Faux News: according to them, non-white skin color = "typical bad guys."


It works in Ferguson MO. and many other areas.


----------



## SAMkewel (Mar 5, 2011)

damemary said:


> David McCabe at The Hill wrote up some funny stuff on Wednesday. Apparently, Senate Majority Leader Mitch McConnell (R-KY) gave an explanation for the wave of very good economic headlines flooding mainstream and social media these past few weeks. Like the weenie that he is, McConnell spouts:
> 
> After so many years of sluggish growth, were finally starting to see some economic data that can provide a glimmer of hope; the 'uptick' appears to 'coincide' with the biggest political change of the Obama Administrations long tenure in Washington: the 'expectation' of a new Republican Congress.
> 
> ...


Did you laugh at this as hard as I did? It makes me wonder what kind of "reality" some people live in. There have been several other reports on this same story today; I don't think anyone was fooled.


----------



## SAMkewel (Mar 5, 2011)

Poor Purl said:


> You seem to have been wonderful parents. At least his brief life wasn't spent in misery thinking he was unloved. I am very, very sorry for your loss.


Thank you.


----------



## cookiequeen (Jun 15, 2011)

MaidInBedlam said:


> I'm thinking Jeb Bush is going to end up as the Republican candidate in 2016.


I think so, too.


----------



## SAMkewel (Mar 5, 2011)

joeysomma said:


> I can see you do not understand what is written in the Bible. The rules and rituals in the "Old Testament" were for the Israelites to do until Jesus came to be the Savior. Once Jesus died on the cross and rose again, all of the rules and rituals were fulfilled. The only remaining one is for the individual to acknowledge that they are a sinner and accept Jesus Christ as their personal Savior.
> 
> Homosexuality was an abomination in the "Old Testament" and it is still an abomination in the "New Testament." That will never change.
> 
> I am not judging, just stating what is in the Bible.


It has been a source of endless wonderment how two people can read the same words and get entirely different meanings. And so it has always been. I have never thought of the Bible as an absolute, literal law book as you do. At the same time, I don't know how you can read all of Leviticus, for instance, and pick and choose which laws you honor and which laws you don't, so in that one book, you don't accept all the laws, only some that justify your own behavior and thinking. How do you manage that? Doesn't some little bell go off somewhere in your mind that tells you how inconsistent that is and make you either question the book or yourself? I realize you think you are trying to "save" us, but your message is missing the mark for many.


----------



## SAMkewel (Mar 5, 2011)

Ann DeGray said:


> Yeah, some like to cook, some don't, some climb mountains, some don't, some are truck drivers, some aren't, some like classical, some like rock, some are nice, some are nasty......just like straight people.


Shocking, isn't it?

I've seen a post of yours quoted but cannot find the original. I just thought you'd be interested to know that my son and his partner were members of the San Francisco Gay Men's Chorus, just as your son and his friends are members of the Los Angeles Gay Men's Chorus. I hope you get to see a performance. I have CD's but no videos. As far as my choice of where to live in CA, I have lived in or near both cities and prefer LA :~). And here I am in cold, damp Michigan!


----------



## Poor Purl (Apr 14, 2011)

Ann DeGray said:


> Now if we're gonna use the First Testament let's go to Leviticus. *ALL* of Leviticus. Leviticus is always such a favorite. But, I repeat, let's look at *ALL*of Leviticus.
> 
> I don't have my Bible in front of me but men are not supposed to cut their hair, you know, woman should all cleanse themselves in the river once a month because they are unclean, there's something about when a man dies his brother is supposed to marry the widow, I think.
> 
> ...


As one for whom the Hebrew Bible is the _only_ Bible, I have to disagree with your description of it (what you call the First Testament). There is "hate, brutality and murder" because human beings deal with such issues. There is also love, kindness, generosity, and protecting your loved ones. The Hebrew Bible is written about and for human beings; the Second Testament is written about and for godlike beings.

Leviticus, the same book you seem to think is so laughable, contains the following (Lev. 19:18): "Thou shalt not avenge, nor bear any grudge against the children of thy people, but thou shalt love thy neighbour as thyself" (King James Bible). This was written more than 500 years before Jesus.

As for the various restrictions you find so amusing, note that there are many Jewish doctors, including surgeons, and many of them are observant, yet manage to do the work they were trained to do.

I'm sure you weren't aware that your dismissal of the Hebrew Bible can be hurtful to some of the members here; I suspect that you don't really understand the laws or how they were carried out in practice. There were, and still are, courts to deal with these issues, and, for example, although certain behaviors were to be punished by stoning, in actual fact there was not a single case of stoning because the courts could always find a way out of it (you may have noticed that there are a lot of Jewish lawyers, too  ).


----------



## Poor Purl (Apr 14, 2011)

bellestarr12 said:


> joeysomma, I wasn't going to weigh in on this thread any more but . . . first of all, what you quote isn't what God said, it's what men said who believed, perhaps correctly but also perhaps not, that they were inspired by God. You must not be familiar with the history of the Bible, its many and varied translations and the choices, often politically motivated, that determined which "books" got into the "approved" Testaments, or the dates of the actual "books" (Genesis isn't the oldest, nor were the first books written by Moses) and the relation many of them bear to much earlier Mesopotamian texts.
> 
> Yes, I know, right about now you're probably covering your ears and closing your eyes and saying very loudly "I can't hear you!" My daughter used to do that when she was 4 or 5.
> 
> ...


 :thumbup: :thumbup: :thumbup:


----------



## Poor Purl (Apr 14, 2011)

MaidInBedlam said:


> Maybe making Jesus the Lamb of God whose blood washes our sins away is related to the paschal blood to help prove to Jews that He is indeed the long-awaited Messiah. God knows, all sorts of things have been rolled into the Bible to lure people into Christianity. Along with every thing else the Bible is, it's a pretty big sales pitch, too,


 :thumbup: :thumbup: :thumbup:


----------



## SAMkewel (Mar 5, 2011)

Poor Purl said:


> As one for whom the Hebrew Bible is the _only_ Bible, I have to disagree with your description of it (what you call the First Testament). There is "hate, brutality and murder" because human beings deal with such issues. There is also love, kindness, generosity, and protecting your loved ones. The Hebrew Bible is written about and for human beings; the Second Testament is written about and for godlike beings.
> 
> Leviticus, the same book you seem to think is so laughable, contains the following (Lev. 19:18): "Thou shalt not avenge, nor bear any grudge against the children of thy people, but thou shalt love thy neighbour as thyself" (King James Bible). This was written more than 500 years before Jesus.
> 
> ...


I don't find anything laughable about the Hebrew Bible, as you refer to (I had not heard it called that before because my life has been such that I've never been exposed to the Jewish religion in any depth, which I consider a disadvantage). My arguments when it comes to the Hebrew Bible is with many of those who call themselves Christians who think they can have things both ways, while they make exceptions apparently randomly. Actually I have problems with many organized religions in one way or another, which, no doubt, says something about me as well as about organized religion. Since I grew up attending a Christian protestant church and it was the only source of any kind of guidance I had growing up, it still colors my orientation at times without my realizing it. I truly don't find anything laughable about the Hebrew Bible in itself, only about how many Christians take things out of context from it and try to use them to prove points that back up what they want all of us to believe. Upon the tiniest bit of reflection, I find that not laughable, either.....


----------



## SAMkewel (Mar 5, 2011)

Poor Purl said:


> :thumbup: :thumbup: :thumbup:


Don't you love Paul Krugman?


----------



## SQM (Jun 22, 2012)

Poor Purl said:


> As one for whom the Hebrew Bible is the _only_ Bible, I have to disagree with your description of it (what you call the First Testament). There is "hate, brutality and murder" because human beings deal with such issues. There is also love, kindness, generosity, and protecting your loved ones. The Hebrew Bible is written about and for human beings; the Second Testament is written about and for godlike beings.
> 
> Leviticus, the same book you seem to think is so laughable, contains the following (Lev. 19:18): "Thou shalt not avenge, nor bear any grudge against the children of thy people, but thou shalt love thy neighbour as thyself" (King James Bible). This was written more than 500 years before Jesus.
> 
> ...


I am kvelling over your brilliance. (Hope CQ sees the word.)


----------



## dribla (Nov 14, 2011)

Plus he is good looking

Di


----------



## Poor Purl (Apr 14, 2011)

SAMkewel said:


> I don't find anything laughable about the Hebrew Bible, as you refer to (I had not heard it called that before because my life has been such that I've never been exposed to the Jewish religion in any depth, which I consider a disadvantage). My arguments when it comes to the Hebrew Bible is with many of those who call themselves Christians who think they can have things both ways, while they make exceptions apparently randomly. Actually I have problems with many organized religions in one way or another, which, no doubt, says something about me as well as about organized religion. Since I grew up attending a Christian protestant church and it was the only source of any kind of guidance I had growing up, it still colors my orientation at times without my realizing it. I truly don't find anything laughable about the Hebrew Bible in itself, only about how many Christians take things out of context from it and try to use them to prove points that back up what they want all of us to believe. Upon the tiniest bit of reflection, I find that not laughable, either.....


Frankly, even Jews find some things laughable about the Bible. My message was specifically meant for Anne DeGrey, who not only laughed at some parts but made it sounds like a very negative document.

Of course your Christian upbringing colors your view of things. And with Jews numbering less than 2% of the US population, mostly concentrated in a few, mainly urban areas, we're pretty much under the radar to most people.

I was very touched by what you told us about your son, which gave me a good idea of how sensitive you must be to the needs of others. I think you come across as a very fine person.


----------



## Poor Purl (Apr 14, 2011)

SAMkewel said:


> Don't you love Paul Krugman?


Absolutely.


----------



## Poor Purl (Apr 14, 2011)

SQM said:


> I am kvelling over your brilliance. (Hope CQ sees the word.)


Thank you. I live to make you kvell.


----------



## damemary (Mar 14, 2012)

I guess I'll stick my neck our and tell what I think about the Bible. 

I grew up as a Roman Catholic. We studied much more of the Baltimore catechism than the Bible. The priest explained the Gospels during Mass and we were taught Latin. Catholics also see no battle with science or evolution.

As an adult I have met many fine, admirable people with wise and generous souls. Protestants, agnostics, Muslim, atheists, Jews, Hindu. You name it. I am thankful to have met and learned from them all. I am grateful for them all. I am accepting of the entire family of man, but organized religion is not for me.

I try to remind myself that those who are critical of others' faith are broken souls with no real faith. But it's still hard to hear, for example, of family choosing religious teaching over a child worthy of love and acceptance.


----------



## damemary (Mar 14, 2012)

My Grandmother, a very wise woman, believed that personal exposure to anyone was necessary to understand and accept everyone. We are limited in this way, but it can give you an open mind leading you to heaven.



SAMkewel said:


> I don't find anything laughable about the Hebrew Bible, as you refer to (I had not heard it called that before because my life has been such that I've never been exposed to the Jewish religion in any depth, which I consider a disadvantage). My arguments when it comes to the Hebrew Bible is with many of those who call themselves Christians who think they can have things both ways, while they make exceptions apparently randomly. Actually I have problems with many organized religions in one way or another, which, no doubt, says something about me as well as about organized religion. Since I grew up attending a Christian protestant church and it was the only source of any kind of guidance I had growing up, it still colors my orientation at times without my realizing it. I truly don't find anything laughable about the Hebrew Bible in itself, only about how many Christians take things out of context from it and try to use them to prove points that back up what they want all of us to believe. Upon the tiniest bit of reflection, I find that not laughable, either.....


----------



## damemary (Mar 14, 2012)

Poor Purl said:


> Thank you. I live to make you kvell.


 :XD: :XD: :XD:


----------



## cookiequeen (Jun 15, 2011)

damemary said:


> I guess I'll stick my neck our and tell what I think about the Bible.
> 
> I grew up as a Roman Catholic. We studied much more of the Baltimore catechism than the Bible. The priest explained the Gospels during Mass and we were taught Latin. Catholics also see no battle with science or evolution.
> 
> ...


 :thumbup: :thumbup: :thumbup:


----------



## cookiequeen (Jun 15, 2011)

SQM said:


> I am kvelling over your brilliance. (Hope CQ sees the word.)


Thank you. Got it!


----------



## Ann DeGray (May 11, 2011)

SAMkewel said:


> Shocking, isn't it?
> 
> I've seen a post of yours quoted but cannot find the original. I just thought you'd be interested to know that my son and his partner were members of the San Francisco Gay Men's Chorus, just as your son and his friends are members of the Los Angeles Gay Men's Chorus. I hope you get to see a performance. I have CD's but no videos. As far as my choice of where to live in CA, I have lived in or near both cities and prefer LA :~). And here I am in cold, damp Michigan!


We have not had the pleasure of attending one of the Los Angeles Gay Men's Chorus concerts but a few years ago we were visiting Steve for Thanksgiving and we attended one of their rehearsals. When the chorus of 200 voices began the beauty of the sound was astounding. After about 30 minutes the director took a break to make some announcements. When he asked if there were any visitors Steve jumped up and yelled, "My parents are here!" He was about 45 years old at the time but the pride and excitement in his voice sounded like he was about seven. During the break and after the rehearsal almost every one of the men came up to us to introduce themselves and to say how much they appreciated us coming to hear them.

One very small man (I am five foot nothing and I was taller than he and much heavier) was wearing a Los Angeles Police Academy tee shirt, one of several I saw singers wearing. I asked about it and he told me his story: Five years earlier he had been beaten with an aluminum baseball bat and left for dead. (Must have been a very brave man or group of men who tackled such a tiny human being). The police we called but no one came, he said. But yet, he was pleased to say that the relations between the gays and the police had improved and now the chorus often sang for the police academy and were given their tee shirt from the academy.

Slowly, yes, very slowly, there is acceptance. We can take comfort in that, SAM.

When Steve got his Master's degree from UCLA our family (my older son, DIL, 2 GDs, DH and I) flew to L.A. for the ceremony. Steve had arranged dinner at a wonderful restaurant for us along with his circle of friends. He wanted his Omaha family to meet his Los Angeles family. It was a wonderful occasion and one we will always remember.

By The way, The Los Angeles Gay Men's Chorus was invited to take part in "The Simpson's" 25th anniversary show a few months ago. It was held in The Hollywood Bowl (2 shows, 17,000 in the audience for each). The creators, writers and those who do the voice overs. Hosted by Hank Azaria. The chorus did 4 numbers written for them for the show. Very clever lyrics, very enthusiastically received.

As I said, SAM. Slowly, but it's encouraging.


----------



## Ann DeGray (May 11, 2011)

Poor Purl said:


> As one for whom the Hebrew Bible is the _only_ Bible, I have to disagree with your description of it (what you call the First Testament). There is "hate, brutality and murder" because human beings deal with such issues. There is also love, kindness, generosity, and protecting your loved ones. The Hebrew Bible is written about and for human beings; the Second Testament is written about and for godlike beings.
> 
> Leviticus, the same book you seem to think is so laughable, contains the following (Lev. 19:18): "Thou shalt not avenge, nor bear any grudge against the children of thy people, but thou shalt love thy neighbour as thyself" (King James Bible). This was written more than 500 years before Jesus.
> 
> ...


I'm so sorry I offended you. I do not find the book of Leviticus amusing and I do understand why those laws were so important. What I meant to get across was the point that one cannot pick and choose which of those laws apply; observe them all if you are using Leviticus to prove a point, not just those who serve your purpose at the moment.

Please forgive me. It was not my intent to "dismiss" the Hebrew Bible or its teachings. In my effort to make a point it may have seemed like that and I am sorry that it came across like that.


----------



## Jeannne (Jan 25, 2013)

This thread, started with a lovely, and seemingly innocuous photo, careened to the right, veered to the left, endured many big bumps, and and has evolved into a warm, sincere, and hopefully far-reaching discussion for those who have stuck it out. The topic now has nothing to do with "My President", but everything to do with a thoughtful exchange of differences, showing that we can get along! My heart is warm.


----------



## bellestarr12 (Mar 26, 2011)

Jeannne said:


> This thread, started with a lovely, and seemingly innocuous photo, careened to the right, veered to the left, endured many big bumps, and and has evolved into a warm, sincere, and hopefully far-reaching discussion for those who have stuck it out. The topic now has nothing to do with "My President", but everything to do with a thoughtful exchange of differences, showing that we can get along! My heart is warm.


Bless you for focusing on the positive! And I agree that this thread has introduced us to many thoughtful, intelligent, and compassionate people.


----------



## damemary (Mar 14, 2012)

I agree. To me, this is what open dialog and discussion is meant to encourage. Bravo all and special thanks for the skillful guidance. You know who you are.



Jeannne said:


> This thread, started with a lovely, and seemingly innocuous photo, careened to the right, veered to the left, endured many big bumps, and and has evolved into a warm, sincere, and hopefully far-reaching discussion for those who have stuck it out. The topic now has nothing to do with "My President", but everything to do with a thoughtful exchange of differences, showing that we can get along! My heart is warm.


----------



## SAMkewel (Mar 5, 2011)

Poor Purl said:


> Frankly, even Jews find some things laughable about the Bible. My message was specifically meant for Anne DeGrey, who not only laughed at some parts but made it sounds like a very negative document.
> 
> Of course your Christian upbringing colors your view of things. And with Jews numbering less than 2% of the US population, mostly concentrated in a few, mainly urban areas, we're pretty much under the radar to most people.
> 
> I was very touched by what you told us about your son, which gave me a good idea of how sensitive you must be to the needs of others. I think you come across as a very fine person.


I wasn't thinking your comments were aimed at me in particular. I just wanted you to know how I feel. All things Jewish have always had a special appeal to me but I have been thwarted by lack of first-hand exposure, especially to the religion. Regarding any Bible/Holy Book, however laughable some parts of them seem to anyone, they still contain representation of the deepest feelings of human beings so I try to respect that. Religion and politics have that in common; that's what makes them such explosive issues I think.

The small city in which I live is somewhat cosmopolitan due to the influence of its being the headquarters of The Dow Chemical Company and Dow Corning Corporation. That brings people from many countries worldwide as well as nationwide--it's most redeeming quality to me. We do now have a Reformed Jewish Synagog, and well as a newly established Mosque. Almost every other Christian and non-Christian religion is also represented along with a couple I would call cults. I'm all for diversity but not fond of extremists of any ilk :~).

I'm enjoying your posts, along with several other newly-discovered posters on these kinds of issues. I thank you for them and also regard you as a fine person.


----------



## Poor Purl (Apr 14, 2011)

Ann DeGray said:


> I'm so sorry I offended you. I do not find the book of Leviticus amusing and I do understand why those laws were so important. What I meant to get across was the point that one cannot pick and choose which of those laws apply; observe them all if you are using Leviticus to prove a point, not just those who serve your purpose at the moment.
> 
> Please forgive me. It was not my intent to "dismiss" the Hebrew Bible or its teachings. In my effort to make a point it may have seemed like that and I am sorry that it came across like that.


No need to ask forgiveness. I agree with you about the tendency to pick and choose: abolish homosexuality but allow the eating of pork.

You brought up one requirement that I've always found to be humorous. If a man dies childless, his brother is required to marry the widow to keep the blood line going. But there's a way out. If the brother doesn't want to do this, in public the widow rips his shoe off his foot, spits in his face, and says something like "This guy doesn't want to build his brother's house."

I think this may be how shoe-throwing got to be a big thing in the Middle East.


----------



## SAMkewel (Mar 5, 2011)

Jeannne said:


> This thread, started with a lovely, and seemingly innocuous photo, careened to the right, veered to the left, endured many big bumps, and and has evolved into a warm, sincere, and hopefully far-reaching discussion for those who have stuck it out. The topic now has nothing to do with "My President", but everything to do with a thoughtful exchange of differences, showing that we can get along! My heart is warm.


I think you're right; it gives me a much better understanding of those who have served on battlefields together. Bonds are definitely formed between those with a common cause, whichever side one is on.


----------



## SQM (Jun 22, 2012)

Poor Purl said:


> No need to ask forgiveness. I agree with you about the tendency to pick and choose: abolish homosexuality but allow the eating of pork.
> 
> You brought up one requirement that I've always found to be humorous. If a man dies childless, his brother is required to marry the widow to keep the blood line going. But there's a way out. If the brother doesn't want to do this, in public the widow rips his shoe off his foot, spits in his face, and says something like "This guy doesn't want to build his brother's house."
> 
> I think this may be how shoe-throwing got to be a big thing in the Middle East.


Oy! Again such a scholar!

Actually someone we both know, mother died when she was small and her dad married the sister. It worked out great - the aunt/mom already loved the kids and they all grew up quite wonderfully and loving to the aunt/mom.


----------



## Ann DeGray (May 11, 2011)

Poor Purl said:


> No need to ask forgiveness. I agree with you about the tendency to pick and choose: abolish homosexuality but allow the eating of pork.
> 
> You brought up one requirement that I've always found to be humorous. If a man dies childless, his brother is required to marry the widow to keep the blood line going. But there's a way out. If the brother doesn't want to do this, in public the widow rips his shoe off his foot, spits in his face, and says something like "This guy doesn't want to build his brother's house."
> 
> I think this may be how shoe-throwing got to be a big thing in the Middle East.


That's new one on me! I always wondered what was done if the brother was already married. But removing his shoe? Not so easy unless it's fastened with Velcro. And spitting in his face? Ewwwww. A simple "mazel tov, but this guy's a jerk" would be more polite....and certainly more sanitary, wouldn't it?

And, human nature being what it is, I suppose it's easier for some to turn his back on a fellow human being than it is to turn his back on that stuffed pork chop.


----------



## Ann DeGray (May 11, 2011)

SQM said:


> Oy! Again such a scholar!
> 
> Actually someone we both know, mother died when she was small and her dad married the sister. It worked out great - the aunt/mom already loved the kids and they all grew up quite wonderfully and loving to the aunt/mom.


That's a nice story. My first father-in-law married his late wife's younger sister. That would have been a nice story, too.....except for the fact that an affair between the man and his wife's younger sister had been going on for years and long before the death of his wife. The kids all knew it so they always resented their aunt.


----------



## Poor Purl (Apr 14, 2011)

SQM said:


> Oy! Again such a scholar!
> 
> Actually someone we both know, mother died when she was small and her dad married the sister. It worked out great - the aunt/mom already loved the kids and they all grew up quite wonderfully and loving to the aunt/mom.


What a great story. I saw an Israeli movie with the same plot a year or two ago.


----------



## SQM (Jun 22, 2012)

Poor Purl said:


> What a great story. I saw an Israeli movie with the same plot a year or two ago.


I am begging everyone 'cause I dont want to go on main. I want to make mittens but the pattern is for medium and I want small. Do I go up or down with the needle size?


----------



## SAMkewel (Mar 5, 2011)

SQM said:


> I am begging everyone 'cause I dont want to go on main. I want to make mittens but the pattern is for medium and I want small. Do I go up or down with the needle size?


Smaller needles make smaller stitches--good way to remember ;~D.


----------



## pattibe (Feb 2, 2012)

SQM said:


> I am begging everyone 'cause I dont want to go on main. I want to make mittens but the pattern is for medium and I want small. Do I go up or down with the needle size?


Down...smaller needles


----------



## SQM (Jun 22, 2012)

thanks Knitters of the World


----------



## Cheeky Blighter (Nov 20, 2011)

SQM said:


> I am begging everyone 'cause I dont want to go on main. I want to make mittens but the pattern is for medium and I want small. Do I go up or down with the needle size?


Smaller needles would tighten up your work and make the mittens a little smaller but you really should cast on fewer stitches when you begin. Are you knitting in the round or flat and sewing up your mitts?


----------



## flitri (Jun 13, 2011)

My Grandfathers first wife died and he married her younger sister, (no affair going on there). In those days it was just brought in by the Church of England that a man could marry his wife's sibling, before that it was illegal for such a union. My Grandparents still sought permission from the Bishop and in those days the Bishop for Australia was in Calcutta. My Grandfather had 2 children to his first wife and 9 to his second wife(my Grandmother), of the 2 from his first marriage the oldest one lived with my Grandparents and was brought up with the rest of the family, the youngest (A boy) was brought up by his maternal grandparents ( My grandparents tried on several occasions to get him but the old people wanted to keep him, that was sad as he didn't really know his full sister and his other family or father that well.
This all took place over 100 years ago here in Australia


----------



## SQM (Jun 22, 2012)

Cheeky Blighter said:


> Smaller needles would tighten up your work and make the mittens a little smaller but you really should cast on fewer stitches when you begin. Are you knitting in the round or flat and sewing up your mitts?


Hi Cheeks - knitting flat Lionbrand #30166


----------



## pattibe (Feb 2, 2012)

Cheeky Blighter said:


> Smaller needles would tighten up your work and make the mittens a little smaller but you really should cast on fewer stitches when you begin. Are you knitting in the round or flat and sewing up your mitts?


Thinner yarn would also be advisable.


----------



## SQM (Jun 22, 2012)

pattibe said:


> Thinner yarn would also be advisable.


Why?


----------



## Poor Purl (Apr 14, 2011)

Ann DeGray said:


> That's new one on me! I always wondered what was done if the brother was already married. But removing his shoe? Not so easy unless it's fastened with Velcro. And spitting in his face? Ewwwww. A simple "mazel tov, but this guy's a jerk" would be more polite....and certainly more sanitary, wouldn't it?
> 
> And, human nature being what it is, I suppose it's easier for some to turn his back on a fellow human being than it is to turn his back on that stuffed pork chop.


In biblical times men could have more than one wife, so his being married wouldn't be an obstacle. According to wikipedia, this type of marriage (man marries brother's widow), called _levirate marriage_, was common in many parts of the world, especially in clannish societies. (Are we bored yet?)

Since the man was most likely wearing sandals, it was easy for the woman to take one off him. The spitting I don't want to think about. And I love your closing sentence.


----------



## pattibe (Feb 2, 2012)

SQM said:


> Why?


Smaller needles and thinner yarn will make them smaller....if the pattern calls for DK for example, try going down to sport - make a swatch or two and see what you get.

I made a childs sweater into a teen size by using larger needles and worsted weight rather than fingering weight yarn. You just need to play with it a little.


----------



## SQM (Jun 22, 2012)

pattibe said:


> Smaller needles and thinner yarn will make them smaller....if the pattern calls for DK for example, try going down to sport - make a swatch or two and see what you get.
> 
> I made a childs sweater into a teen size by using larger needles and worsted weight rather than fingering weight yarn. You just need to play with it a little.


Thanks Pattibeeeeeee. I will make the mittens shorter and that should work but I like how your mind works. That is how I know you are not really KPG.


----------



## Poor Purl (Apr 14, 2011)

SAMkewel said:


> I wasn't thinking your comments were aimed at me in particular. I just wanted you to know how I feel. All things Jewish have always had a special appeal to me but I have been thwarted by lack of first-hand exposure, especially to the religion. Regarding any Bible/Holy Book, however laughable some parts of them seem to anyone, they still contain representation of the deepest feelings of human beings so I try to respect that. Religion and politics have that in common; that's what makes them such explosive issues I think.
> 
> The small city in which I live is somewhat cosmopolitan due to the influence of its being the headquarters of The Dow Chemical Company and Dow Corning Corporation. That brings people from many countries worldwide as well as nationwide--it's most redeeming quality to me. We do now have a Reformed Jewish Synagog, and well as a newly established Mosque. Almost every other Christian and non-Christian religion is also represented along with a couple I would call cults. I'm all for diversity but not fond of extremists of any ilk :~).
> 
> I'm enjoying your posts, along with several other newly-discovered posters on these kinds of issues. I thank you for them and also regard you as a fine person.


Thank you for saying such nice things. I've been reading your posts for a while and thinking of you as a kindred spirit. I'm glad we got to meet.


----------



## Poor Purl (Apr 14, 2011)

SQM said:


> I am begging everyone 'cause I dont want to go on main. I want to make mittens but the pattern is for medium and I want small. Do I go up or down with the needle size?


Down with needle size, down with yarn size, and as Cheeky said, down with number of stitches. But why not get another pattern, one that comes in the size you want? What's special about the one you have?


----------



## SQM (Jun 22, 2012)

My hands are like a kid's and this is a simple pattern. I will adjust the length which is the problem. Plus I had the yarn in my stash and it is a quick knit which is important since I am without mittens and it is now too cold for me to go bare-hand at my age.


----------



## pattibe (Feb 2, 2012)

SQM said:


> Thanks Pattibeeeeeee. I will make the mittens shorter and that should work but I like how your mind works. That is how I know you are not really KPG.


Good luck. Burr - cold there, aye? Not so much in Long Beach.


----------



## SQM (Jun 22, 2012)

pattibe said:


> Good luck. Burr - cold there, aye? Not so much in Long Beach.


20 degrees F. I am sticking my tongue out at you. How warm is it there?


----------



## pattibe (Feb 2, 2012)

SQM said:


> 20 degrees F. I am sticking my tongue out at you. How warm is it there?


It was 83 on Wednesday, but today it is cold and rainy...about 62 during the day...it will be much colder at night. Probably drop down to the 40's


----------



## bellestarr12 (Mar 26, 2011)

SQM said:


> Oy! Again such a scholar!
> 
> Actually someone we both know, mother died when she was small and her dad married the sister. It worked out great - the aunt/mom already loved the kids and they all grew up quite wonderfully and loving to the aunt/mom.


This was not at all uncommon on the American frontier, when a man would need a wife to raise the children he already had, especially if his first wife died in childbirth. That's also the premise of the (quite good) Israeli movie someone else cited, "Fill the Void."


----------



## Poor Purl (Apr 14, 2011)

bellestarr12 said:


> This was not at all uncommon on the American frontier, when a man would need a wife to raise the children he already had, especially if his first wife died in childbirth. That's also the premise of the (quite good) Israeli movie someone else cited, "Fill the Void."


That was the one I saw. Thank you.


----------



## Wombatnomore (Dec 9, 2013)

dribla said:


> Plus he is good looking
> 
> Di


An extremely handsome man! Lucky Michelle.


----------



## Wombatnomore (Dec 9, 2013)

Poor Purl said:


> Frankly, even Jews find some things laughable about the Bible. My message was specifically meant for Anne DeGrey, who not only laughed at some parts but made it sounds like a very negative document.
> 
> Of course your Christian upbringing colors your view of things. And with Jews numbering less than 2% of the US population, mostly concentrated in a few, mainly urban areas, we're pretty much under the radar to most people.
> 
> I was very touched by what you told us about your son, which gave me a good idea of how sensitive you must be to the needs of others. I think you come across as a very fine person.


One of the best.


----------



## Wombatnomore (Dec 9, 2013)

Ann DeGray said:


> We have not had the pleasure of attending one of the Los Angeles Gay Men's Chorus concerts but a few years ago we were visiting Steve for Thanksgiving and we attended one of their rehearsals. When the chorus of 200 voices began the beauty of the sound was astounding. After about 30 minutes the director took a break to make some announcements. When he asked if there were any visitors Steve jumped up and yelled, "My parents are here!" He was about 45 years old at the time but the pride and excitement in his voice sounded like he was about seven. During the break and after the rehearsal almost every one of the men came up to us to introduce themselves and to say how much they appreciated us coming to hear them.
> 
> One very small man (I am five foot nothing and I was taller than he and much heavier) was wearing a Los Angeles Police Academy tee shirt, one of several I saw singers wearing. I asked about it and he told me his story: Five years earlier he had been beaten with an aluminum baseball bat and left for dead. (Must have been a very brave man or group of men who tackled such a tiny human being). The police we called but no one came, he said. But yet, he was pleased to say that the relations between the gays and the police had improved and now the chorus often sang for the police academy and were given their tee shirt from the academy.
> 
> ...


Thank goodness for parents such as yourselves!


----------



## Wombatnomore (Dec 9, 2013)

Jeannne said:


> This thread, started with a lovely, and seemingly innocuous photo, careened to the right, veered to the left, endured many big bumps, and and has evolved into a warm, sincere, and hopefully far-reaching discussion for those who have stuck it out. The topic now has nothing to do with "My President", but everything to do with a thoughtful exchange of differences, showing that we can get along! My heart is warm.


What a lovely thing to say!


----------



## Wombatnomore (Dec 9, 2013)

SQM said:


> My hands are like a kid's and this is a simple pattern. I will adjust the length which is the problem. Plus I had the yarn in my stash and it is a quick knit which is important since I am without mittens and it is now too cold for me to go bare-hand at my age.


Post a photo when finished?


----------



## 56170 (Mar 2, 2012)

Great picture of the President and first lady.


----------



## damemary (Mar 14, 2012)

You're a good judge of character.



SAMkewel said:


> I wasn't thinking your comments were aimed at me in particular. I just wanted you to know how I feel. All things Jewish have always had a special appeal to me but I have been thwarted by lack of first-hand exposure, especially to the religion. Regarding any Bible/Holy Book, however laughable some parts of them seem to anyone, they still contain representation of the deepest feelings of human beings so I try to respect that. Religion and politics have that in common; that's what makes them such explosive issues I think.
> 
> The small city in which I live is somewhat cosmopolitan due to the influence of its being the headquarters of The Dow Chemical Company and Dow Corning Corporation. That brings people from many countries worldwide as well as nationwide--it's most redeeming quality to me. We do now have a Reformed Jewish Synagog, and well as a newly established Mosque. Almost every other Christian and non-Christian religion is also represented along with a couple I would call cults. I'm all for diversity but not fond of extremists of any ilk :~).
> 
> I'm enjoying your posts, along with several other newly-discovered posters on these kinds of issues. I thank you for them and also regard you as a fine person.


----------



## damemary (Mar 14, 2012)

Poor Purl said:


> No need to ask forgiveness. I agree with you about the tendency to pick and choose: abolish homosexuality but allow the eating of pork.
> 
> You brought up one requirement that I've always found to be humorous. If a man dies childless, his brother is required to marry the widow to keep the blood line going. But there's a way out. If the brother doesn't want to do this, in public the widow rips his shoe off his foot, spits in his face, and says something like "This guy doesn't want to build his brother's house."
> 
> I think this may be how shoe-throwing got to be a big thing in the Middle East.


 :XD: :XD: :XD: Maybe I'm not supposed to laugh, but the image strikes me funny.


----------



## damemary (Mar 14, 2012)

Down I think. Let's vote just to be sure. If it's my project, I'll go with my first thought, but I hesitate when it's someone else's project.



SQM said:


> I am begging everyone 'cause I dont want to go on main. I want to make mittens but the pattern is for medium and I want small. Do I go up or down with the needle size?


----------



## SQM (Jun 22, 2012)

damemary said:


> Down I think. Let's vote just to be sure. If it's my project, I'll go with my first thought, but I hesitate when it's someone else's project.


Boing! That is the right answer and with shortening the pattern by a couple of rows, it is a perfect fit. You are always right.


----------



## Knitted by Nan (Aug 3, 2013)

flitri said:


> My Grandfathers first wife died and he married her younger sister, (no affair going on there). In those days it was just brought in by the Church of England that a man could marry his wife's sibling, before that it was illegal for such a union. My Grandparents still sought permission from the Bishop and in those days the Bishop for Australia was in Calcutta. My Grandfather had 2 children to his first wife and 9 to his second wife(my Grandmother), of the 2 from his first marriage the oldest one lived with my Grandparents and was brought up with the rest of the family, the youngest (A boy) was brought up by his maternal grandparents ( My grandparents tried on several occasions to get him but the old people wanted to keep him, that was sad as he didn't really know his full sister and his other family or father that well.
> This all took place over 100 years ago here in Australia


I cannot speak for today because I became an 'enlightened' catholic when I left school. An 'enlightened Catholic' in Australia is someone who was Baptised Catholic but no longer practices Catholicism and does not call themselves a Catholic. Please do not take offence at this term as it is not meant to cause offence to anyone. It is a term used by some former Catholics in Australia. But, to get back to my post. It was not permitted for a man to marry his dead brother's wife. When my uncle was killed in 1946 his brother supported his wife and child. My uncle was only 32 when he was killed and his wife was in her early 20s. They became very close and my cousin looked upon her uncle as a father. But the church stepped in a told them it would be a 'mortal sin' if they married, and they were not to consider forming any type of relationship. Unfortunately, the church held a lot more power in those days so they did not marry. My aunty did not remarry and my uncle never married, but they remained extremely close all their life.


----------



## Knitted by Nan (Aug 3, 2013)

SQM said:


> Thanks Pattibeeeeeee. I will make the mittens shorter and that should work but I like how your mind works. That is how I know you are not really KPG.


Tutt tutt, please now you are being *********. I know you meant that statement in the nicest possible way but it could be upsetting to some people. TIC :XD: :XD: :XD:


----------



## Knitted by Nan (Aug 3, 2013)

SQM said:


> My hands are like a kid's and this is a simple pattern. I will adjust the length which is the problem. Plus I had the yarn in my stash and it is a quick knit which is important since I am without mittens and it is now too cold for me to go bare-hand at my age.


Have you searched the net or Ravelry for teenagers or childrens mittens using the wool you have? JAS


----------



## Poor Purl (Apr 14, 2011)

damemary said:


> :XD: :XD: :XD: Maybe I'm not supposed to laugh, but the image strikes me funny.


I tried to make it funny, so please laugh. Remember the guy who threw a shoe at G. W. Bush?


----------



## SAMkewel (Mar 5, 2011)

Poor Purl said:


> I tried to make it funny, so please laugh. Remember the guy who threw a shoe at G. W. Bush?


:~DDD!


----------



## damemary (Mar 14, 2012)

You have to be Nikita at UN to get away with it. Woman from AZ tossed a sneaker at Hillary. Come to think of it, I don't know what happened to her. Why shoes?



Poor Purl said:


> I tried to make it funny, so please laugh. Remember the guy who threw a shoe at G. W. Bush?


----------



## Knitted by Nan (Aug 3, 2013)

damemary said:


> You have to be Nikita at UN to get away with it. Woman from AZ tossed a sneaker at Hillary. Come to think of it, I don't know what happened to her. Why shoes?


Sorry for the cut and paste job here but it is nearly 9.00 pm and the temperature is still above 25C, 77F, it is too darned hot to think.

Shoe throwing  its an Arab thing
by Crikey
Crikey Clarifier
What was the significance of an Iraqi journalist throwing his shoes at President Bush?

We asked Middle East expert and ARC post doctoral fellow at Melbourne University Benjamin MacQueen:
US President George W Bush came in for some rather harsh treatment yesterday by being pelted with the shoes of Iraqi journalist Muntazer al-Zaidi of Al-Baghdadia television who also labelled the President a dog.
So what is the significance of this, despite the obvious reticence anyone would have by being hit by a shoe? There are two elements that make the shoe, and hitting someone with a shoe, a particularly significant statement in Arab and Middle Eastern culture. The first has its basis in religion and the second in cultural custom, although the two are inter-related.
Not limited to just Arab Muslim culture, but Middle Eastern religious culture generally (Jewish, Christian and Muslim), reference to someone or assault of someone with a shoe carries symbolic value in terms of Old Testament tradition. For instance, Psalms 60:10 (Moab is my washpot, over Edom will I cast out my shoe) reveals that assault with a shoe is a traditional defamatory gesture for ones enemies (Moab and Edom were both enemies of Judah).
In more strictly cultural terms, the shoe is representative of the foot, the lowest part of the human body. It is a sign of respect in Arab culture (and, many other cultures) that one does not show the sole of ones foot or shoe to another. To do so can be taken as a sign that you consider that person of being beneath you. This is analogous to the practice in many cultures of leaving your shoes outside before entering a home or religious/sacred place.
The insult of the shoe can also be seen through some rather creative forms of verbal insult. For instance, whether at a football game, driving through the streets of Beirut or Cairo, or in the rather entertaining television debates on regional satellite TV, using phrases such as inta kundara (you are a shoe) or ibn al-kundara (son of a shoe) sit at the high end of insults, and are not to be taken lightly (i.e. dont say it unless you really mean it, and are ready for a reaction).

http://www.crikey.com.au/2008/12/15/crikey-clarifier-shoe-throwing-its-an-arab-thing/

Throwing shoes at someone or hitting them with a shoe is not limited to Islam. It is supposed to be an insult in many Middle Eastern and Asian countries regardless of religion. It is cultural. The sole of the shoe is considered to be dirty because you step on many items during the course of the day. That is why you see many Asians and Middle Easterners leave the shoe outside while entering a place of worship or someone's home.

http://answers.yahoo.com/question/index?qid=20081214123537AARNqHG


----------



## Ann DeGray (May 11, 2011)

SQM said:


> I am begging everyone 'cause I dont want to go on main. I want to make mittens but the pattern is for medium and I want small. Do I go up or down with the needle size?


Down. Does the pattern give you more than one size? Dies it give a medium and a large? If so, use the difference in number of stitches between those two sizes ands decrease accordingly to get the smaller size.


----------



## Ann DeGray (May 11, 2011)

Poor Purl said:



> In biblical times men could have more than one wife, so his being married wouldn't be an obstacle. According to wikipedia, this type of marriage (man marries brother's widow), called _levirate marriage_, was common in many parts of the world, especially in clannish societies. (Are we bored yet?)
> 
> Since the man was most likely wearing sandals, it was easy for the woman to take one off him. The spitting I don't want to think about. And I love your closing sentence.


This is so interesting....and I am not bored yet!

And as for my last sentence, I am reminded of the story about the rabbi and the priest who were comparing the restrictions put upon them by their faiths. The priest had to remain celibate. The rabbi could not eat pork. "So what's the problem?" asked the rabbi. "It's much easier to give up pork!"


----------



## Ann DeGray (May 11, 2011)

Poor Purl said:


> I tried to make it funny, so please laugh. Remember the guy who threw a shoe at G. W. Bush?


And let's not forget the Russian leader,Nikita Khruschev who took off his shoe and banged it on the table.
Quick, Purl (our scholar) what law was he following?


----------



## Ann DeGray (May 11, 2011)

damemary said:


> You have to be Nikita at UN to get away with it. Woman from AZ tossed a sneaker at Hillary. Come to think of it, I don't know what happened to her. Why shoes?


Does it have something to do with shoes being the lowest of the low? That would make hats the highest ranked wearing apparel. And we have the expression, "Hat's off" as a sign of respect.

I take my hat off to you, Purl and I wouldn't be surprised if you know how *that* originated!


----------



## tjb2 (Apr 24, 2011)

I am with you politics and religion should stay away from a knitting forum, we here to talk about knitting/crochet, anything else NO politics please.
Thank goodness NO one can bring a gun in here!


----------



## MarilynKnits (Aug 30, 2011)

tjb2 said:


> I am with you politics and religion should stay away from a knitting forum, we here to talk about knitting/crochet, anything else NO politics please.
> Thank goodness NO one can bring a gun in here!


As many others have stated numerous times, this is the general chit chat area. Non knitting topics. People who want to confine their visits to KP to knitting, crochet, and other handicraft related topics should not visit general chit chat.

Most of the topics on general chit chat are obviously not knitting or crochet related. If the topic appears in the upcoming topics (all sections), the section designation will appear on the upper left corner of the page when you open it. If you see general chit chat, just say oops and leave without comment so you will not receive updates. Easy peasy.

There are many of us who love our knitting but have widely diverse other interests and like to discuss and debate what is going on in our world. I like to see what other people think about controversial topics. I am fortunate that I have found like minded friends, some warm and brilliant people I would never have met elsewhere. I am amazed that I have encountered bitter enemies whose vitriol and single mindedness shock me. Discussions on general chit chat have made me more aware of the social and political dynamics in my home country and around the world.

And nobody, to my knowledge, has threatened personal violence as you seem to infer with your gun remark.


----------



## pattibe (Feb 2, 2012)

And nobody, to my knowledge, has threatened personal violence as you seem to infer with your gun remark.[/quote]

Absolutely...that was totally uncalled for!!


----------



## grandmann (Feb 4, 2011)

Poor Purl said:


> I tried to make it funny, so please laugh. Remember the guy who threw a shoe at G. W. Bush?


I do, that was in Iraq, I believe.


----------



## grandmann (Feb 4, 2011)

damemary said:


> You have to be Nikita at UN to get away with it. Woman from AZ tossed a sneaker at Hillary. Come to think of it, I don't know what happened to her. Why shoes?


By accident I hit Hillary on the head with a poster that I wanted her to sign. The secret service was right on me. Hillary took my poster signed and graciously return it to me. I don't think I will ever forget that moment.


----------



## grandmann (Feb 4, 2011)

pattibe said:


> And nobody, to my knowledge, has threatened personal violence as you seem to infer with your gun remark.


Absolutely...that was totally uncalled for!![/quote]

I don't know about that, I got threaten one time by a member. She even put it out on the main forum that she shot someone and wasn't afraid to do it again. Admin. was going to ban both of us off KP at first. In the end the Admin. left me stay and the other member got kicked off.


----------



## Poor Purl (Apr 14, 2011)

Ann DeGray said:


> This is so interesting....and I am not bored yet!
> 
> And as for my last sentence, I am reminded of the story about the rabbi and the priest who were comparing the restrictions put upon them by their faiths. The priest had to remain celibate. The rabbi could not eat pork. "So what's the problem?" asked the rabbi. "It's much easier to give up pork!"


That's one I've never heard.

:XD: :XD: :XD:


----------



## Poor Purl (Apr 14, 2011)

Ann DeGray said:


> And let's not forget the Russian leader,Nikita Khruschev who took off his shoe and banged it on the table.
> Quick, Purl (our scholar) what law was he following?


No idea. Was it a written law or a law of nature? (I'm not much of a scholar, am I?)


----------



## pattibe (Feb 2, 2012)

grandmann said:


> I don't know about that, I got threaten one time by a member. She even put it out on the main forum that she shot someone and wasn't afraid to do it again. Admin. was going to ban both of us off KP at first. In the end the Admin. left me stay and the other member got kicked off.


Wow, Grandmann. I am so sorry to hear that....how scary for you. She truly needed to be kicked off.


----------



## Poor Purl (Apr 14, 2011)

Ann DeGray said:


> Does it have something to do with shoes being the lowest of the low? That would make hats the highest ranked wearing apparel. And we have the expression, "Hat's off" as a sign of respect.
> 
> I take my hat off to you, Purl and I wouldn't be surprised if you know how *that* originated!


Please, the only thing I know is how to look things up. This one is giving me trouble. I pass. Your turn.


----------



## NJG (Dec 2, 2011)

tjb2 said:


> I am with you politics and religion should stay away from a knitting forum, we here to talk about knitting/crochet, anything else NO politics please.
> Thank goodness NO one can bring a gun in here!


So then why are you commenting on this forum and trying to control what others choose to do? No one is forcing you to read this.


----------



## MarilynKnits (Aug 30, 2011)

pattibe said:


> Wow, Grandmann. I am so sorry to hear that....how scary for you. She truly needed to be kicked off.


And maybe reported to her local police by Admin for making terrorist threats.


----------



## SQM (Jun 22, 2012)

MarilynKnits said:


> And maybe reported to her local police by Admin for making terrorist threats.


Tres Vrai.


----------



## SAMkewel (Mar 5, 2011)

MarilynKnits said:


> As many others have stated numerous times, this is the general chit chat area. Non knitting topics. People who want to confine their visits to KP to knitting, crochet, and other handicraft related topics should not visit general chit chat.
> 
> Most of the topics on general chit chat are obviously not knitting or crochet related. If the topic appears in the upcoming topics (all sections), the section designation will appear on the upper left corner of the page when you open it. If you see general chit chat, just say oops and leave without comment so you will not receive updates. Easy peasy.
> 
> ...


I'm with you, MarilynKnits. I still think it's a shame that folks don't read the rules of the forum before they pass judgment, and those rules do change from time to time. When the forum first began, politics and religion were banned, but ownership changed and so did the rules (I'm not complaining). While I understand that some do not care for the kind of honest exchange that takes place here, some of us find more than we bargained for, and I think that's a GOOD thing :~D! I grew up in a family that had its head in the sand for generations. How refreshing this change of pace is! I think it inspires growth and understandings that are not possible without open exchange. If I can grow and change at 76, I'm not going to worry about those who choose not to, and they need not worry about us. Everyone makes their own choices.


----------



## SAMkewel (Mar 5, 2011)

Poor Purl said:


> Please, the only thing I know is how to look things up. This one is giving me trouble. I pass. Your turn.


;~DD!


----------



## bellestarr12 (Mar 26, 2011)

EveMCooke said:


> Sorry for the cut and paste job here but it is nearly 9.00 pm and the temperature is still above 25C, 77F, it is too darned hot to think.
> 
> Shoe throwing  its an Arab thing
> by Crikey
> ...


Very interesting, and logical! Of course, as one of my anthropology professors impressed upon us, nothing humans do is truly illogical, if we take the time to find out about it, even if it seems so in light of our own cultural conditioning. Thanks for posting.


----------



## Ann DeGray (May 11, 2011)

Poor Purl said:


> Please, the only thing I know is how to look things up. This one is giving me trouble. I pass. Your turn.


I am amazed atr what I have learned in the past 24 hours! Eve M Cook posted a very informative reply regarding the shoe throwing thing but I don't know how to quote her without getting the reply *to* her made by Belle Starr 12 instead so you're just gonna have to look for it, I guess. Sorry.

Regarding hats, I guess removing one's hat has always been a sign of respect. Except ball caps, which are apparently permanently attached to the head, even while eating. Some men do remove them while eating by placing them on the table.

The above information seems to apply to cowboy hats as well.


----------



## Poor Purl (Apr 14, 2011)

grandmann said:


> I don't know about that, I got threaten one time by a member. She even put it out on the main forum that she shot someone and wasn't afraid to do it again. Admin. was going to ban both of us off KP at first. In the end the Admin. left me stay and the other member got kicked off.


Grandmann, you have the most wonderful stories. What could you have said that would make someone want to shoot you? That you don't like garter stitch?


----------



## Poor Purl (Apr 14, 2011)

Ann DeGray said:


> I am amazed atr what I have learned in the past 24 hours! Eve M Cook posted a very informative reply regarding the shoe throwing thing but I don't know how to quote her without getting the reply *to* her made by Belle Starr 12 instead so you're just gonna have to look for it, I guess. Sorry.
> 
> Regarding hats, I guess removing one's hat has always been a sign of respect. Except ball caps, which are apparently permanently attached to the head, even while eating. Some men do remove them while eating by placing them on the table.
> 
> The above information seems to apply to cowboy hats as well.


I did see EveMCooke's message. Now, she is a researcher _par excellence_.

Did the fashion of wearing baseball caps backwards develop so that guys could eat ice cream cones while wearing them? That always struck me as a very stupid way to wear a hat. The peak is supposed to keep the sun out of your eyes, not your neck.


----------



## tinnnk (Dec 26, 2014)

The topic is our President. And yes she is the Mother of our Country at this time......and she's beautiful. They compliment each other.


----------



## tinnnk (Dec 26, 2014)

The topic is our President. And yes she is the Mother of our Country at this time......and she's beautiful. They compliment each other.


----------



## Wombatnomore (Dec 9, 2013)

Poor Purl said:


> Grandmann, you have the most wonderful stories. What could you have said that would make someone want to shoot you? That you don't like garter stitch?


 :XD: :XD: :XD: That's all it would take on this site given the angst among some.


----------



## grandmann (Feb 4, 2011)

MarilynKnits said:


> And maybe reported to her local police by Admin for making terrorist threats.


I came pretty close to doing this, calling the local police if Admin. weren't going to do it anything about it. Lot of this was done on Private messages. Every time I got a private message from her I made a copy and sent it to Admin. It all started about when members leave their "location" blank. I made a comment even though she doesn't post in "location" where she is from everybody knows because she said numerous times where she lived. Then shortly later she made a comment on the open forum about killing someone. Admin. left her go. Admin. was going to leave me go because I was going to call the local police. Admin. didn't want me causing trouble. I'm glad every thing got settle and I was able to stay on KP. Maybe I shouldn't be saying this now. We need to be careful because you never know who you might be talking to.

It would take me awhile to find the thread this happen maybe a couple years ago.


----------



## BrattyPatty (May 2, 2011)

grandmann said:


> I came pretty close to doing this, calling the local police if Admin. weren't going to do it anything about it. Lot of this was done on Private messages. Every time I got a private message from her I made a copy and sent it to Admin. It all started about when members leave their "location" blank. I made a comment even though she doesn't post in "location" where she is from everybody knows because she said numerous times where she lived. Then shortly later she made a comment on the open forum about killing someone. Admin. left her go. Admin. was going to leave me go because I was going to call the local police. Admin. didn't want me causing trouble. I'm glad every thing got settle and I was able to stay on KP. Maybe I shouldn't be saying this now. We need to be careful because you never know who you might be talking to.
> 
> It would take me awhile to find the thread this happen maybe a couple years ago.


That is incredible! Not in a good way. You did the right thing., Grandmann.


----------



## Nussa (Jul 7, 2011)

I think I remember reading that thread. I don't remember exactly what it was about. But I know it got extremely nasty. And a lot of people were called a lot of nasty things. It seemed to go on forever.



grandmann said:


> I came pretty close to doing this, calling the local police if Admin. weren't going to do it anything about it. Lot of this was done on Private messages. Every time I got a private message from her I made a copy and sent it to Admin. It all started about when members leave their "location" blank. I made a comment even though she doesn't post in "location" where she is from everybody knows because she said numerous times where she lived. Then shortly later she made a comment on the open forum about killing someone. Admin. left her go. Admin. was going to leave me go because I was going to call the local police. Admin. didn't want me causing trouble. I'm glad every thing got settle and I was able to stay on KP. Maybe I shouldn't be saying this now. We need to be careful because you never know who you might be talking to.
> 
> It would take me awhile to find the thread this happen maybe a couple years ago.


----------



## Xay-Zays.auntie (Aug 26, 2013)

Poor Purl said:


> I did see EveMCooke's message. Now, she is a researcher _par excellence_.
> 
> Did the fashion of wearing baseball caps backwards develop so that guys could eat ice cream cones while wearing them? That always struck me as a very stupid way to wear a hat. The peak is supposed to keep the sun out of your eyes, not your neck.


The guys that I knew who wore them that way did so to keep them from flying off while they were riding motorcycles. I have worn them that way from time to time.


----------



## Ann DeGray (May 11, 2011)

Poor Purl said:


> I did see EveMCooke's message. Now, she is a researcher _par excellence_.
> 
> Did the fashion of wearing baseball caps backwards develop so that guys could eat ice cream cones while wearing them? That always struck me as a very stupid way to wear a hat. The peak is supposed to keep the sun out of your eyes, not your neck.


You could tell yourself that they cannot be as dumb as they look.
But you would be wrong.


----------



## bellestarr12 (Mar 26, 2011)

Xay-Zays.auntie said:


> The guys that I knew who wore them that way did so to keep them from flying off while they were riding motorcycles. I have worn them that way from time to time.


So they didn't wear helmets, then? My 15-year-old grandson wears his that way just for the cool factor. When I was teaching at UA my colleagues and I joked about the "hat boys" - but it was true that they tended to sit at the back of the room looking stoned and to communicate mostly in grunts :roll:


----------



## damemary (Mar 14, 2012)

bellestarr12 said:


> So they didn't wear helmets, then? My 15-year-old grandson wears his that way just for the cool factor. When I was teaching at UA my colleagues and I joked about the "hat boys" - but it was true that they tended to sit at the back of the room looking stoned and to communicate mostly in grunts :roll:


 :XD: :XD: :XD: :XD: :XD: And it doesn't matter what the rest of the world thinks until they have to leave academia...or never do. (I think of the 'cool' grey-haired Republican bikers in Scottsdale.)


----------



## Oma and 6 (Aug 30, 2013)

This was in the general chit-chat forum. Well placed, and thank you for the photo. Didn't see anything political about this at all.


----------



## Poor Purl (Apr 14, 2011)

Xay-Zays.auntie said:


> The guys that I knew who wore them that way did so to keep them from flying off while they were riding motorcycles. I have worn them that way from time to time.


That makes sense. Did they wear baseball caps over their helmets? :wink: :wink:


----------



## Poor Purl (Apr 14, 2011)

Ann DeGray said:


> You could tell yourself that they cannot be as dumb as they look.
> But you would be wrong.


Very funny.

:XD: :XD: :XD:


----------



## Poor Purl (Apr 14, 2011)

Oma and 6 said:


> This was in the general chit-chat forum. Well placed, and thank you for the photo. Didn't see anything political about this at all.
> 
> Being an Agnostic,an Insomniac & a Dyslexic, I lay awake all night long wondering if there really is a Dog.


A wonderful old joke - I still laugh when I hear it.

But you have to realize that any mention of President Obama that doesn't call him names is a signal to the anti's to complain. It turns political even if it wasn't meant to.


----------



## gjc1212 (Nov 7, 2013)

Amen!!!


----------



## MarilynKnits (Aug 30, 2011)

grandmann said:


> I came pretty close to doing this, calling the local police if Admin. weren't going to do it anything about it. Lot of this was done on Private messages. Every time I got a private message from her I made a copy and sent it to Admin. It all started about when members leave their "location" blank. I made a comment even though she doesn't post in "location" where she is from everybody knows because she said numerous times where she lived. Then shortly later she made a comment on the open forum about killing someone. Admin. left her go. Admin. was going to leave me go because I was going to call the local police. Admin. didn't want me causing trouble. I'm glad every thing got settle and I was able to stay on KP. Maybe I shouldn't be saying this now. We need to be careful because you never know who you might be talking to.
> 
> It would take me awhile to find the thread this happen maybe a couple years ago.


I find it appalling that any people in authority would take action against a person because they "cause trouble" when they take steps to protect themselves against what appears to be a real threat to their safety. Take action against the bully, the terrorist, not the object of the bully's or the terrorists' threats!

Periodically you read in the paper about a whistle blower who has been fired because of being a troublemaker. I guess it is easier for those in charge to ignore bad behavior than to move their glutes to do the right thing. Think of Erin Brockovich and others like her who risk their lives and financial security to do the right thing.


----------



## MarilynKnits (Aug 30, 2011)

Ann DeGray said:


> You could tell yourself that they cannot be as dumb as they look.
> But you would be wrong.


And even dumber looking are the ones who wear the brim sideways. At least they can pretend the brim in back protects them from becoming red necks.


----------



## NJG (Dec 2, 2011)

MarilynKnits said:


> I find it appalling that any people in authority would take action against a person because they "cause trouble" when they take steps to protect themselves against what appears to be a real threat to their safety. Take action against the bully, the terrorist, not the object of the bully's or the terrorists' threats!
> 
> Periodically you read in the paper about a whistle blower who has been fired because of being a troublemaker. I guess it is easier for those in charge to ignore bad behavior than to move their glutes to do the right thing. Think of Erin Brockovich and others like her who risk their lives and financial security to do the right thing.


And those in charge know what is right and wrong, but have decided they like the wrong better and don't want things to change so the wrong person gets screwed and the bad crap continues. Happened at work all the time.


----------



## NJG (Dec 2, 2011)

MarilynKnits said:


> And even dumber looking are the ones who wear the brim sideways. At least they can pretend the brim in back protects them from becoming red necks.


And how about the cap big enough to go over the tops of the ears and when they don't break the bill. Looks silly to me, but they must think it looks cool.


----------



## bellestarr12 (Mar 26, 2011)

damemary said:


> :XD: :XD: :XD: :XD: :XD: And it doesn't matter what the rest of the world thinks until they have to leave academia...or never do. (I think of the 'cool' grey-haired Republican bikers in Scottsdale.)


Oh yeah. They bad! :roll:


----------



## Xay-Zays.auntie (Aug 26, 2013)

bellestarr12 said:


> So they didn't wear helmets, then? My 15-year-old grandson wears his that way just for the cool factor. When I was teaching at UA my colleagues and I joked about the "hat boys" - but it was true that they tended to sit at the back of the room looking stoned and to communicate mostly in grunts :roll:





Poor Purl said:


> That makes sense. Did they wear baseball caps over their helmets? :wink: :wink:


Ohio doesn't have a helmet law, so some did and some didn't. Of those that did wear helmets, some wore the ballcap under. I tried it once, and found if completely uncomfortable.

Edit:
Please don't yell at me, I wore a helmet when I rode. I have no control over the choices of others


----------



## damemary (Mar 14, 2012)

MarilynKnits said:


> I find it appalling that any people in authority would take action against a person because they "cause trouble" when they take steps to protect themselves against what appears to be a real threat to their safety. Take action against the bully, the terrorist, not the object of the bully's or the terrorists' threats!
> 
> Periodically you read in the paper about a whistle blower who has been fired because of being a troublemaker. I guess it is easier for those in charge to ignore bad behavior than to move their glutes to do the right thing. Think of Erin Brockovich and others like her who risk their lives and financial security to do the right thing.


 :thumbup: :thumbup: :thumbup: :thumbup: :thumbup: :thumbup: :thumbup: :thumbup: :thumbup: :thumbup: :thumbup: :thumbup: :thumbup:


----------



## damemary (Mar 14, 2012)

bellestarr12 said:


> Oh yeah. They bad! :roll:


No. They *bald* except for the stringy pony tail.


----------



## Poor Purl (Apr 14, 2011)

damemary said:


> No. They *bald* except for the stringy pony tail.


 :XD: :XD: :XD: :XD:


----------



## Ann DeGray (May 11, 2011)

damemary said:


> No. They *bald* except for the stringy pony tail.


Good one! And why do some men grow long beards *and* a pony tail and *never* remove their caps? We *know* they're bald. *Really* bald.


----------



## damemary (Mar 14, 2012)

Ann DeGray said:


> Good one! And why do some men grow long beards *and* a pony tail and *never* remove their caps? We *know* they're bald. *Really* bald.


 :XD: :XD: :XD:


----------



## bellestarr12 (Mar 26, 2011)

Xay-Zays.auntie said:


> Ohio doesn't have a helmet law, so some did and some didn't. Of those that did wear helmets, some wore the ballcap under. I tried it once, and found if completely uncomfortable.
> 
> Edit:
> Please don't yell at me, I wore a helmet when I rode. I have no control over the choices of others


I should think a baseball cap under a helmet would be very uncomfortable, and I would never yell at you, really! - or at the fools who ride without helmets, because they wouldn't listen. But I've seen the results of a couple of accidents when people didn't. They never got a chance to reconsider.


----------



## bellestarr12 (Mar 26, 2011)

damemary said:


> No. They *bald* except for the stringy pony tail.


 :thumbup: :thumbup: :thumbup:


----------



## Xay-Zays.auntie (Aug 26, 2013)

bellestarr12 said:


> I should think a baseball cap under a helmet would be very uncomfortable, and I would never yell at you, really! - or at the fools who ride without helmets, because they wouldn't listen. But I've seen the results of a couple of accidents when people didn't. They never got a chance to reconsider.


Thank you for not yelling. 
I have a cousin who barely survived a motorcycle accident.

* edit*
I had typed what I recalled of the story, but looked up some links instead. If you are interested:
http://www.army.mil/article/19094/motorcycle-rally-promotes-safety/

http://www.wistv.com/story/9557805/injured-in-accident-ft-jackson-soldier-going-home

He just shared on FB a few weeks ago that he and his wife are expecting their 3rd child, which the doctors told them would never happen.


----------



## bellestarr12 (Mar 26, 2011)

Xay-Zays.auntie said:


> Thank you for not yelling.
> I have a cousin who barely survived a motorcycle accident.
> 
> * edit*
> ...


Wow! What a miracle - and without the helmet it wouldn't have happened. God bless him and his family. Thanks for sharing.


----------



## NJG (Dec 2, 2011)

Xay-Zays.auntie said:


> Thank you for not yelling.
> I have a cousin who barely survived a motorcycle accident.
> 
> * edit*
> ...


I have a niece who survived also. She was wearing a helmet, so the brain survived pretty good. Most of her damage was in her back. She has had a lot of surgeries, has great belief in her Drs and will have more surgeries. She can walk and has less pain than she use to have so seeing improvement all the time.


----------

