# Hillary Clinton



## MrsB

Hillary Clinton to Announce 2016 Run for President on Sunday. The former secretary of state, senator and first lady is to announce that she will indeed seek the Democratic nomination for president.

I'm so pleased that she has decided to run again. We need strong women in the White House in a more crucial and central position. After a few seasons of Scandal viewing, I've come to the conclusion that there maybe just too much underhanded shenanigans going on in the good ole boys club. Hillary is no pushover and the best candidate that has come along in a long time. I'm assuming that Obama endorses her.


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## GroodleMom

MrsB said:


> Hillary Clinton to Announce 2016 Run for President on Sunday. The former secretary of state, senator and first lady is to announce that she will indeed seek the Democratic nomination for president.
> 
> I'm so pleased that she has decided to run again. We need strong women in the White House in a more crucial and central position. After a few seasons of Scandal viewing, I've come to the conclusion that there maybe just too much underhanded shenanigans going on in the good ole boys club. Hillary is no pushover and the best candidate that has come along in a long time. I'm assuming that Obama endorses her.


Elizabeth Warren is a better choice: Strong, brilliant and without all the baggage.


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## Toby's Mom

Excessive Baggage. Wish we had someone with a clean slate.


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## senior gal

We are one of the few countries that has never had a female
president or Vice president. Just read an article." The world's most powerful woman" German Chancellor Angela Merkel
in This Week March 27th issue Reprinted from MacClean's.I vote for a woman regardless of party. We are better at finding solutions than the average man. War is not our thing. We value children,education, peace,health etc. So Hillary will get my vote.


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## MrsB

Elizabeth will likely work with Hillary in some capacity but I think that Hillary knows the ins and outs of the office a lot better as a former first lady and has probably befriended (or outmaneuvered) some of the lawmakers who have become constant roadblocks in getting certain humanitarian bills legislated. I hope voters will get registered for this election in record numbers, no matter who they choose to vote for.


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## crispie

Toby's Mom said:


> Excessive Baggage. Wish we had someone with a clean slate.


Agreed


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## cathy47

This person cannot make up her mind how can she make decisions that are needed for this country. One min. she was next she wasn't.. not impressed. :thumbdown:


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## jbandsma

GroodleMom said:


> Elizabeth Warren is a better choice: Strong, brilliant and without all the baggage.


And, as such, can do much more good where she is.


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## cathy47

Toby's Mom said:


> Excessive Baggage. Wish we had someone with a clean slate.


 :thumbup:


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## Irish knitter

I do not want to start a fight but I have lost all respect for Hillary after she said "who cares" after the death of our ambassador. I just finished 13 hours in Benghazi and they stated if she had moved right in the beginning none of them would have died and it WAS a terrorist attack and the whitehouse knew about it but kept their mouths shut.

Also...I have read what the whitehouse secret service said about her being "flying off the handle" at a moments notice; being B-tchy; in control and a all around pain in the a--.

All of this infornmation comes from reliable sources. They guy who wrote 13 hours in Benghazi was a survivor and just stated the facts. The secret service remarks I ran accross when I was looking up Caroline/John Kennedy's detail. They "tell all". Like the Bush twins were the worst to protect as they would run red lights to get rid of their agents and call "Daddy" when their agents caught up with them. The easiest to protect was Amy Carter.....her worst thing was roller skating in the whitehouse...

As I said before.....I am not trying to start an argument. Maybe we should be careful....

I will have to look to see where I got my whitehouse information.

Just think about the last Clinton whitehouse.....Bill was a front while Hillary ran it. We will be no better off than we are now. 
I am terrified if she wins....
I do not like to get into politics but we are all doomed if she wins.......I want a woman in the whitehouse.....BUT the right woman and it is NOT hillary!!!


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## susanmos2000

Irish knitter said:


> I do not want to start a fight but I have lost all respect for Hillary after she said "who cares" after the death of our ambassador. I just finished 13 hours in Benghazi and they stated if she had moved right in the beginning none of them would have died and it WAS a terrorist attack and the whitehouse knew about it but kept their mouths shut.
> 
> Also...I have read what the whitehouse secret service said about her being "flying off the handle" at a moments notice; being B-tchy; in control and a all around pain in the a--.
> 
> All of this inforn=mation comes from reliable sources. They guy who wrote 13 hours in Benghazi was a survivor and just stated the facts. The secret service remarks I ran accross when I was looking up Caroline/John Kennedy's detail. They "tell all". Like the Bush twins were the worst to protect as they would run red lights to get rid of their agents and call "Daddy" when their agents caught up with them. The easiest to protect was Amy Carter.....her worst thing was roller skating in the whitehouse...
> 
> As I said before.....I am not trying to start an argument. Maybe we should be careful....


If Hillary had a tendency to be b*tchy and hot-headed we'll certainly see it in the coming months. I'd forgotten how brutal such campaigns are--Ted "Sign Me Up Cruz" is holding up fairly well under the pressure, but Rand Paul appears to be coming apart at the seams. I'll be curious to see how Clinton withstands the scrutiny. All politicians are subject to some political flak, of course, but running for President ramps it up to the nth degree.


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## galaxycraft

No Way Jose! :thumbdown: She has not proven to be a leader. :thumbdown: 
From the first lady to the present.


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## Knitter from Nebraska

Strong women will always be called bit#hes. That's OK. Sometimes we need to be bit#hes to get the job done. I say, we should own it. It doesn't matter what they call us. We're better at multi tasking and better at solving problems. We're more peace seeking. 

That said, Hillary Clinton is NOT the right woman for the job. She's in the pocket of corporate big wigs.


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## susanmos2000

Knitter from Nebraska said:


> Strong women will always be called bit#hes. That's OK. Sometimes we need to be bit#hes to get the job done. I say, we should own it. It doesn't matter what they call us. We're better at multi tasking and better at solving problems. We're more peace seeking.
> 
> That said, Hillary Clinton is NOT the right woman for the job. She's in the pocket of corporate big wigs.


Have to agree with you, Nebraska. But, unfortunately, so are they all.


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## soloweygirl

Hillary will have to answer questions this time around and not side step them or slough them off as she has in the past. 

I agree with you galaxycraft, "she has not proven to be a leader".


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## theyarnlady

your kidding Right Hillary carries so much baggage that there are not enough suit case left to carry.

Because she is a women you would vote for her. Then you must not know what she has accomplish. I would say not much and adds more to the list with the phone gate.

But am sure after the statement we need a women in the White House more of them will vote for her . Just to have a women in the White House. Where is the logic in that. There are other women in politc. who would be a better choice then this women.


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## susanmos2000

In my opinion the only real candidates are Jeb Bush and Hillary Clinton (assuming, of course, that both decide to run)--the rest are just feather weights. Clinton and Bush are wily, experienced, and have the full backing of their respective political machines. The Democrats will produce some strawman for Hillary to knock down in the Primaries. And the Republicans? Lots of wispy, insubstantial characters (Cruz, Paul, Walker) there only too happy to rip the stuffing out of each other while Bush warms up in the bullpen.


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## Neeterbug

From what I have heard...I'm not too sure she would be the right one for the job!!!


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## Katsch

:thumbdown:


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## senior gal

I said "Any woman" is better.I know some fine Republican
woman, but those guys do not want them.Actually from what I read, all women in Congress get along very well.
When I heard Rand Paul shutting woman reporters up,I know he
is not going to make it.


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## galaxycraft

NRoberts said:


> Hillary was front and center helping to cover up all of Bill's shenanigans. It was she who created the Bimbo Eruption team in the basement of the governor's mansion in Arkansas with Betsy Wright in charge.
> 
> Then there was her brilliant cattle futures trading that turned $1000 into $100,000 in less than one year.
> 
> Or her questionable billing and involvement in Whitewater and Castle Grande.
> 
> Now, her State Dept. emails have been erased.
> 
> Scandals? Are you serious?


Her head buried in the sand for a couple of months after 911 before making a public announcement of ANY type.
It was HER initial idea to "fine" folks for not enrolling in the Government controlled (Universal) health care (Yes before O even went into office).


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## susanmos2000

senior gal said:


> I said "Any woman" is better.I know some fine Republican
> woman, but those guys do not want them.Actually from what I read, all women in Congress get along very well.
> When I heard Rand Paul shutting woman reporters up,I know he
> is not going to make it.


I agree. That condescending smirk and 'manspeak' doesn't appear to be going over well, not even with Republican women. And this guy is a physician? I doubt he's practicing now, but gosh! the thought of being one of his former patients makes me sick to my stomach.


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## theyarnlady

done. Deleted as should not have said anything more about it.


She is not the person any should want to see in the white house.

Make sure you check into ever candidates records and what they plan to do to help this country.

I mean everyone of them. Be an inform voter.


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## CarolfromTX

So what, exactly, has she accomplished in her illustrious career? What successes can she point to? Being a woman and being married to an ex-president are hardly qualifications to be the leader of the free world. Did you know she got kicked off the Watergate committee staff for ethics violations? I wouldn't trust her to tell the truth about anything EVER. Not about servers or emails or Benghazi or Vince Foster or where that "foundation" of hers gets it's money.


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## ute4kp

MrsB said:


> Hillary Clinton to Announce 2016 Run for President on Sunday. The former secretary of state, senator and first lady is to announce that she will indeed seek the Democratic nomination for president.
> 
> I'm so pleased that she has decided to run again. We need strong women in the White House in a more crucial and central position. After a few seasons of Scandal viewing, I've come to the conclusion that there maybe just too much underhanded shenanigans going on in the good ole boys club. Hillary is no pushover and the best candidate that has come along in a long time. I'm assuming that Obama endorses her.


She was my senator for 8 years.
Excellent!! 
:thumbup:


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## desertgirl

I like her.


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## NanaMc

Katsch said:


> :thumbdown:


 :thumbdown: Bad for America.


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## mojave

I like Hillary Clinton and Elizabeth Warren because they are b*tch*s. As with these two ladies, my life since high school has been spent in male dominated classes and jobs. Through experience I learned being called a b*tch means the name-caller got the message I will not be bullied.
Now if the Republicans could field a qualified female who does not shoot herself in the foot with foolish accusations in the manner of Sarah Palin and Michelle Bachman, I would consider voting for her.


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## Bunbun

Irish knitter said:


> I do not want to start a fight but I have lost all respect for Hillary after she said "who cares" after the death of our ambassador. I just finished 13 hours in Benghazi and they stated if she had moved right in the beginning none of them would have died and it WAS a terrorist attack and the whitehouse knew about it but kept their mouths shut.
> 
> Also...I have read what the whitehouse secret service said about her being "flying off the handle" at a moments notice; being B-tchy; in control and a all around pain in the a--.
> 
> All of this infornmation comes from reliable sources. They guy who wrote 13 hours in Benghazi was a survivor and just stated the facts. The secret service remarks I ran accross when I was looking up Caroline/John Kennedy's detail. They "tell all". Like the Bush twins were the worst to protect as they would run red lights to get rid of their agents and call "Daddy" when their agents caught up with them. The easiest to protect was Amy Carter.....her worst thing was roller skating in the whitehouse...
> 
> As I said before.....I am not trying to start an argument. Maybe we should be careful....
> 
> I will have to look to see where I got my whitehouse information.
> 
> Just think about the last Clinton whitehouse.....Bill was a front while Hillary ran it. We will be no better off than we are now.
> I am terrified if she wins....
> I do not like to get into politics but we are all doomed if she wins.......I want a woman in the whitehouse.....BUT the right woman and it is NOT hillary!!!


If people think what we have now is bad, she would be worse. Warren is a consummate liar as people in Ma. can tell you. To have a woman just to have a woman is a poor excuse. I agree, It should NOT be Hillary.


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## WindingRoad

soloweygirl said:


> Hillary will have to answer questions this time around and not side step them or slough them off as she has in the past.
> 
> I agree with you galaxycraft, "she has not proven to be a leader".


She's been second string for a long time I don't see that changing anytime soon.


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## hildy3

Toby's Mom said:


> Excessive Baggage. Wish we had someone with a clean slate.


When is the last time we had a male President with no baggage?


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## CarolfromTX

So to sum up Mrs. Clinton's achievements:
1. She's a woman and
2. She's a bi**h.

Great. What a resume! Anyone care to add to that exhaustive list of her good points? Anyone? **crickets**


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## galaxycraft

CarolfromTX said:


> So to sum up Mrs. Clinton's achievements:
> 1. She's a woman and
> 2. She's a bi**h.
> 
> Great. What a resume! Anyone care to add to that exhaustive list of her good points? Anyone? **crickets**


She is semi-conscious. :shock: :mrgreen:


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## knitpresentgifts

CarolfromTX said:


> So to sum up Mrs. Clinton's achievements:
> 1. She's a woman and
> 2. She's a bi**h.
> 
> Great. What a resume! Anyone care to add to that exhaustive list of her good points? Anyone? **crickets**


3. She's a felon - just not convicted yet.
4. She has a good botox cosmetician


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## Knitter from Nebraska

mojave said:


> I like Hillary Clinton and Elizabeth Warren because they are b*tch*s. As with these two ladies, my life since high school has been spent in male dominated classes and jobs. Through experience I learned being called a b*tch means the name-caller got the message I will not be bullied.
> Now if the Republicans could field a qualified female who does not shoot herself in the foot with foolish accusations in the manner of Sarah Palin and Michelle Bachman, I would consider voting for her.


 :thumbup:


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## knitpresentgifts

mojave said:


> I like Hillary Clinton and Elizabeth Warren because they are b*tch*s. As with these two ladies, my life since high school has been spent in male dominated classes and jobs. Through experience I learned being called a b*tch means the name-caller got the message I will not be bullied.
> Now if the Republicans could field a qualified female who does not shoot herself in the foot with foolish accusations in the manner of Sarah Palin and Michelle Bachman, I would consider voting for her.


Oh, that's nice - vote for a woman because she's a B. What a ridiculous reason to vote for someone for any elected office.

How about using your head and not putting a felon or lying criminal in the office of the White House? How about knowing something about the person's character, integrity, intelligence, experience and visions instead of discussing her ring size and hair color or who she can push around.

If you cannot rise above men and show you're their equal, don't force your inabilities onto the American population just because you seek revenge.

I'm voting for the person to serve the country, not putting my needs above everyone else's.


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## knitpresentgifts

galaxycraft said:


> She is semi-conscious. :shock: :mrgreen:


 :XD: Ya, but I think she's better because she ditched the glasses.

What do you bet they show up again when she has to testify before the Select Committees because of all the scandals she's embroiled in?


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## nmgram

Let's have a real choice this time. Elizabeth Warren and Ted Cruz. Both are clear on their political principles and give the voters a true choice as to where they want the country to head. We don't need Jeb Bush or Hillary Clinton. Progressive and progressive light. These two dynasties have held the highest office or served in the administration for the entire lives of many of the younger adults in this country. The country doesn't need a royal class to lead us.


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## jinkers

We need "Strong" anything in the White House. By the way, Hillary has been involved in quite a few "shenanigans" herself...


MrsB said:


> Hillary Clinton to Announce 2016 Run for President on Sunday. The former secretary of state, senator and first lady is to announce that she will indeed seek the Democratic nomination for president.
> 
> I'm so pleased that she has decided to run again. We need strong women in the White House in a more crucial and central position. After a few seasons of Scandal viewing, I've come to the conclusion that there maybe just too much underhanded shenanigans going on in the good ole boys club. Hillary is no pushover and the best candidate that has come along in a long time. I'm assuming that Obama endorses her.


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## blessedinMO

galaxycraft said:


> No Way Jose! :thumbdown: She has not proven to be a leader. :thumbdown:
> From the first lady to the present.


 :thumbup:


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## lovethelake

soloweygirl said:


> Hillary will have to answer questions this time around and not side step them or slough them off as she has in the past.
> 
> I agree with you galaxycraft, "she has not proven to be a leader".


I find it offensive that women are going vote for her just because of her gender. Is she the right person? I also find it offensive that women can even support her. During the bimbo eruptions I had turned on the TV to see the weather forecast while my daughter was eating her cereal. Then all of a sudden the cigar story came on. My daughter asked about it, and I was aghast and she was too young for the real answer. But was I thought was even worse is that Hillary stayed to him. If she had forgiven him but left him I would have respected her. But she stayed with him for his political connections so she could get the jobs she wanted. So what lesson has she taught our daughters? That if you stay with an adulterous husband that is convicted of perjury because that is the only way to make it in politics, it is okay. What????? If she is that good, then should have been able to be successful without Bill and his money.

I have yet had an answer to my question. Can you name 5 accomplishments that Hillary has done on her own and how do they make her qualified to be president? I can't think of one, honestly.


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## knitpresentgifts

WindingRoad said:


> She's been second string for a long time I don't see that changing anytime soon.


I was in a very nice gift shop in China while on vacation. We were told the pearl necklace I bought was exactly like the one Bill Clinton had just purchased earlier as he was in the same store only hours earlier. (His purchase wasn't meant for Hill.)

We were also told Hill and Bill do not talk to one another and are not in each other's presence unless the cameras are on them.

I have first hand knowledge that they reserve different floors of the same hotel or stay in different hotels completely when traveling on 'couple' official visits with barely any communication between them. I don't have to tell you the calls made to the valets from each team. :-D

I've shaken Bill's hand and it's extremely soft - the skin I mean. :-D


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## knitpresentgifts

nmgram said:


> Let's have a real choice this time. Elizabeth Warren and Ted Cruz. Both are clear on their political principles and give the voters a true choice as to where they want the country to head. We don't need Jeb Bush or Hillary Clinton. Progressive and progressive light. These two dynasties have held the highest office or served in the administration for the entire lives of many of the younger adults in this country. The country doesn't need a royal class to lead us.


I could live with that choice. :thumbup:


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## WindingRoad

CarolfromTX said:


> So to sum up Mrs. Clinton's achievements:
> 1. She's a woman and
> 2. She's a bi**h.
> 
> Great. What a resume! Anyone care to add to that exhaustive list of her good points? Anyone? **crickets**


Maybe I should run. LOL


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## WindingRoad

knitpresentgifts said:


> I could live with that choice. :thumbup:


Except for the fact that Lizzy has no desire or need to run.


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## knitpresentgifts

WindingRoad said:


> Maybe I should run. LOL


 :thumbup:


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## knitpresentgifts

WindingRoad said:


> Except for the fact that Lizzy has no desire or need to run.


I bet the DNC is really pressuring Warren to run. Obama cannot stand Hillary and Warren is better suited and the only one I can think of to protect his legacy.

Lizzy is farther left than O!


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## WindingRoad

knitpresentgifts said:


> I bet the DNC is really pressuring Warren to run. Obama cannot stand Hillary and Warren is better suited and the only one I can think of to protect his legacy.
> 
> Lizzy is farther left than O!


Lizzy is an old woman. Might as well vote for Hairy Reed.


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## Irish knitter

CarolfromTX said:


> So to sum up Mrs. Clinton's achievements:
> 1. She's a woman and
> 2. She's a bi**h.
> 
> Great. What a resume! Anyone care to add to that exhaustive list of her good points? Anyone? **crickets**


She's good at getting people killed.
She can lie like the best of them and get away with it.
She really does "not care".


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## nmgram

WindingRoad said:


> Lizzy is an old woman. Might as well vote for Hairy Reed.


Elizabeth Warren. 65
Hillary Clinton. 67
Harry Reed. 75


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## WindingRoad

nmgram said:


> Elizabeth Warren. 65
> Hillary Clinton. 67
> Harry Reed. 75


Did I ever say Hill was young? And Lizzy looks older than Hairy. She thinks money grows on trees I guess.


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## Country Bumpkins

knitpresentgifts said:


> Oh, that's nice - vote for a woman because she's a B. What a ridiculous reason to vote for someone for any elected office.
> 
> How about using your head and not putting a felon or lying criminal in the office of the White House? How about knowing something about the person's character, integrity, intelligence, experience and visions instead of discussing her ring size and hair color or who she can push around.
> 
> If you cannot rise above men and show you're their equal, don't force your inabilities onto the American population just because you seek revenge.
> 
> I'm voting for the person to serve the country, not putting my needs above everyone else's.


 :thumbup:


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## susanmos2000

CarolfromTX said:


> So to sum up Mrs. Clinton's achievements:
> 1. She's a woman and
> 2. She's a bi**h.
> 
> Great. What a resume! Anyone care to add to that exhaustive list of her good points? Anyone? **crickets**


3. She can play hardball with the Big Boys. I for one thought she handled the flap over her private email account like a champ. Using a private account was well within the law until late 2014, so labeling her a "felon" is simply nonsense. And I'm pleased that, after turning the relevant emails, she erased the rest and saved the taxpayers from funding another Benghazi circus. The Senate Judiciary Committee AKA Barnum & Bailey has demanded that she turn over her server, but good luck with that. They'd have to launch a huge legal battle to get that server, and what would they actually gain if they got their mitts on it? She erased everything--and not simply by hitting the delete button tens of thousand of times. Those messages are gone forever.


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## Lukelucy

MrsB said:


> Hillary Clinton to Announce 2016 Run for President on Sunday. The former secretary of state, senator and first lady is to announce that she will indeed seek the Democratic nomination for president.
> 
> I'm so pleased that she has decided to run again. We need strong women in the White House in a more crucial and central position. After a few seasons of Scandal viewing, I've come to the conclusion that there maybe just too much underhanded shenanigans going on in the good ole boys club. Hillary is no pushover and the best candidate that has come along in a long time. I'm assuming that Obama endorses her.


Hillary IS a god ole boy. Do not be fooled.


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## Bunbun

plus someone needs to take her aside and do a "What NOT to wear" on her and that hair. She does NOT look like someone I would want representing my country. She's trying to look like she's a teenager. YUK!


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## Lukelucy

Bunbun said:


> plus someone needs to take her aside and do a "What NOT to wear" on her and that hair. She does NOT look like someone I would want representing my country. She's trying to look like she's a teenager. YUK!


 :thumbup:


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## theyarnlady

lovethelake said:


> I find it offensive that women are going vote for her just because of her gender. Is she the right person? I also find it offensive that women can even support her. During the bimbo eruptions I had turned on the TV to see the weather forecast while my daughter was eating her cereal. Then all of a sudden the cigar story came on. My daughter asked about it, and I was aghast and she was too young for the real answer. But was I thought was even worse is that Hillary stayed to him. If she had forgiven him but left him I would have respected her. But she stayed with him for his political connections so she could get the jobs she wanted. So what lesson has she taught our daughters? That if you stay with an adulterous husband that is convicted of perjury because that is the only way to make it in politics, it is okay. What????? If she is that good, then should have been able to be successful without Bill and his money.
> 
> I have yet had an answer to my question. Can you name 5 accomplishments that Hillary has done on her own and how do they make her qualified to be president? I can't think of one, honestly.


Well you do know that you will never hear anything as she has nothing that she has accomplish. Well anything good and helpful to this country.


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## BrattyPatty

Irish knitter said:


> I do not want to start a fight but I have lost all respect for Hillary after she said "who cares" after the death of our ambassador. I just finished 13 hours in Benghazi and they stated if she had moved right in the beginning none of them would have died and it WAS a terrorist attack and the whitehouse knew about it but kept their mouths shut.
> 
> Also...I have read what the whitehouse secret service said about her being "flying off the handle" at a moments notice; being B-tchy; in control and a all around pain in the a--.
> 
> All of this infornmation comes from reliable sources. They guy who wrote 13 hours in Benghazi was a survivor and just stated the facts. The secret service remarks I ran accross when I was looking up Caroline/John Kennedy's detail. They "tell all". Like the Bush twins were the worst to protect as they would run red lights to get rid of their agents and call "Daddy" when their agents caught up with them. The easiest to protect was Amy Carter.....her worst thing was roller skating in the whitehouse...
> 
> As I said before.....I am not trying to start an argument. Maybe we should be careful....
> 
> I will have to look to see where I got my whitehouse information.
> 
> Just think about the last Clinton whitehouse.....Bill was a front while Hillary ran it. We will be no better off than we are now.
> I am terrified if she wins....
> I do not like to get into politics but we are all doomed if she wins.......I want a woman in the whitehouse.....BUT the right woman and it is NOT hillary!!!


SHE NEVER said "who cares"! Go back and read a transcript.


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## Country Bumpkins

susanmos2000 said:


> 3. She can play hardball with the Big Boys. I for one thought she handled the flap over her private email account like a champ. Using a private account was well within the law until late 2014, so labeling her a "felon" is simply nonsense. And I'm pleased that, after turning the relevant emails, she erased the rest and saved the taxpayers from funding another Benghazi circus. The Senate Judiciary Committee AKA Barnum & Bailey has demanded that she turn over her server, but good luck with that. They'd have to launch a huge legal battle to get that server, and what would they actually gain if they got their mitts on it? She erased everything--and not simply by hitting the delete button tens of thousand of times. Those messages are gone forever.


You are happy she did all of that? 
:shock: :thumbdown:


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## Gerslay

Please people...we don't want another Clinton or another Bush in the White House!

We've had a Bush in the upper echelons of government since 1971 when Geo H Bush became a member of the Texas House of Reps and since 1979 when Bill Clinton became AG in Arkansas. That's 44 and 36 years respectively. If either one of them wins the presidency we'll have one family dynasty in power for over half a century and the other for slightly less then half a century!

What are we...North Korea?


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## Wombatnomore

susanmos2000 said:


> If Hillary had a tendency to be b*tchy and hot-headed we'll certainly see it in the coming months. I'd forgotten how brutal such campaigns are--Ted "Sign Me Up Cruz" is holding up fairly well under the pressure, but Rand Paul appears to be coming apart at the seams. I'll be curious to see how Clinton withstands the scrutiny. All politicians are subject to some political flak, of course, but running for President ramps it up to the nth degree.


There's a fair bit of press here in Australia about Mrs. Clinton's 'announcement' for the presidency which is to be released some time today. It's been reported that she will be strongly focused on the economic situation for the middle class. It was also reported that instead of a campaign rally for the presidential candidacy, Mrs. Clinton will hold a series of meetings with private citizens.


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## BrattyPatty

knitpresentgifts said:


> 3. She's a felon - just not convicted yet.
> 4. She has a good botox cosmetician


Nobody is a felon without being tried and convicted. Open a book and learn something.
You of all people should not talk about anyone's looks.


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## Wombatnomore

susanmos2000 said:


> In my opinion the only real candidates are Jeb Bush and Hillary Clinton (assuming, of course, that both decide to run)--the rest are just feather weights. Clinton and Bush are wily, experienced, and have the full backing of their respective political machines. The Democrats will produce some strawman for Hillary to knock down in the Primaries. And the Republicans? Lots of wispy, insubstantial characters (Cruz, Paul, Walker) there only too happy to rip the stuffing out of each other while Bush warms up in the bullpen.


I heard on the news there is concern that Hillary won't have a tough enough rival and therefore her capabilities will not be thoroughly tested.


----------



## BrattyPatty

theyarnlady said:


> Well you do know that you will never hear anything as she has nothing that she has accomplish. Well anything good and helpful to this country.


Can you tell me what any republican who is now running for the presidency has done for the good of the country?


----------



## theyarnlady

Here are a few more accomplishment of Mrs. Clinton

Oct.2002 Voted for Authoriztion for military forces against Iraq.

2000 embargo against Cuba.


2003 (now this one should interest those on the left) opposed Same Sex Marriage.


----------



## susanmos2000

Country Bumpkins said:


> You are happy she did all of that?
> :shock: :thumbdown:


Frankly CB, after those 47 Republicans wrote that treasonous letter to Iran I lost confidence in their understanding of "fair play" and "the spirit of law". They play down and dirty, and the only way to beat them is to match them move for move.


----------



## theyarnlady

BrattyPatty said:


> Can you tell me what any republican who is now running for the presidency has done for the good of the country?


----------



## BrattyPatty

susanmos2000 said:


> Frankly CB, after those 47 Republicans wrote that treasonous letter to Iran I lost confidence in their understanding of "fair play" and "the spirit of law". They play down and dirty, and the only way to beat them is to match them move for move.


 :thumbup: :thumbup: :thumbup: :thumbup: :thumbup:


----------



## BrattyPatty

theyarnlady said:


>


I'll take that as a NO


----------



## Wombatnomore

susanmos2000 said:


> 3. She can play hardball with the Big Boys. I for one thought she handled the flap over her private email account like a champ. Using a private account was well within the law until late 2014, so labeling her a "felon" is simply nonsense. And I'm pleased that, after turning the relevant emails, she erased the rest and saved the taxpayers from funding another Benghazi circus. The Senate Judiciary Committee AKA Barnum & Bailey has demanded that she turn over her server, but good luck with that. They'd have to launch a huge legal battle to get that server, and what would they actually gain if they got their mitts on it? She erased everything--and not simply by hitting the delete button tens of thousand of times. Those messages are gone forever.


I'm assuming that any computer communications made in the State Department all end up on it's main server and that said communications could be retrieved regardless?


----------



## susanmos2000

Gerslay said:


> Please people...we don't want another Clinton or another Bush in the White House!
> 
> We've had a Bush in the upper echelons of government since 1971 when Geo H Bush became a member of the Texas House of Reps and since 1979 when Bill Clinton became AG in Arkansas. That's 44 and 36 years respectively. If either one of them wins the presidency we'll have one family dynasty in power for over half a century and the other for slightly less then half a century!
> 
> What are we...North Korea?


Point well taken, Gerslay. But who the heck is available in the Republican pool even remotely qualified except Jeb? I'm no fan of the Bush family, but I'd certainly vote for him over Cruz, Paul, and the rest of those jokers. They simply aren't Presidential timber.


----------



## nmgram

WindingRoad said:


> Did I ever say Hill was young? And Lizzy looks older than Hairy. She thinks money grows on trees I guess.


Just stating facts. Make of them what you will.


----------



## BrattyPatty

Gerslay said:


> Please people...we don't want another Clinton or another Bush in the White House!
> 
> We've had a Bush in the upper echelons of government since 1971 when Geo H Bush became a member of the Texas House of Reps and since 1979 when Bill Clinton became AG in Arkansas. That's 44 and 36 years respectively. If either one of them wins the presidency we'll have one family dynasty in power for over half a century and the other for slightly less then half a century!
> 
> What are we...North Korea?


I agree with you Gerslay. Not only will we have a dynasty, but more than likely another war.


----------



## susanmos2000

Wombatnomore said:


> I'm assuming that any computer communications made in the State Department all end up on it's main server and that said communications could be retrieved regardless?


Of course--but there were tens of thousands of emails that stayed strictly within private channels. Hillary turned over those she deemed "relevant" and erased (no, not strong enough--_obliterated_) the rest, so there's no way to know if her definition of "relevant" matches that of the Senate Judiciary Committee's.


----------



## Pocahontas

Bunbun said:


> If people think what we have now is bad, she would be worse. Warren is a consummate liar as people in Ma. can tell you. To have a woman just to have a woman is a poor excuse. I agree, It should NOT be Hillary.


 :thumbup: :thumbup: And many people voted for our current president for the sole reason that he is black.
Our country is in a mess and only by the grace of God will we regain any strength and respect.


----------



## SQM

I agree with Gers. Too many Bushes and Clintons. Wish some other candidates would have the cajones to run against both. Remember - I trash Monarchies and both are owned by their respective political machines. Hills is too belligerent for my taste and Bush would be a Daddy's boy. The other Rep. candidates are not worth even talking about. I may stay home Nov, '16 and give neither any legitimacy. I have spent many years ignoring other worthless presidents.


----------



## BrattyPatty

Wombatnomore said:


> I'm assuming that any computer communications made in the State Department all end up on it's main server and that said communications could be retrieved regardless?


She used a private server, Wombat. Yes, any communications between her and the state department could be retrieved from the SD server. That's all that she is legally required to present.


----------



## BrattyPatty

SQM said:


> I agree with Gers. Too many Bushes and Clintons. Wish some other candidates would have the cajones to run against both. Remember - I trash Monarchies and both are owned by their respective political machines. Hills is too belligerent for my taste and Bush would be a Daddy's boy. The other Rep. candidates are not worth even talking about. I may stay home Nov, '16 and give neither any legitimacy. I have spent many years ignoring other worthless presidents.


There has only been 1 Clinton in the WH so far, SQ. Hang on, there will be more candidates in the race.


----------



## theyarnlady

SQM said:


> I agree with Gers. Too many Bushes and Clintons. Wish some other candidates would have the cajones to run against both. Remember - I trash Monarchies and both are owned by their respective political machines. Hills is too belligerent for my taste and Bush would be a Daddy's boy. The other Rep. candidates are not worth even talking about. I may stay home Nov, '16 and give neither any legitimacy. I have spent many years ignoring other worthless presidents.


I may have to join you. :thumbup:


----------



## Country Bumpkins

theyarnlady said:


> I may have to join you. :thumbup:


Me 3.


----------



## CarolfromTX

Wombatnomore said:


> I'm assuming that any computer communications made in the State Department all end up on it's main server and that said communications could be retrieved regardless?


Sure, if all concerned are on the up and up. But it's politics, so I ask you, what are the odds?! Mrs. Clinton and the libs will do everything in their power to bury those emails.


----------



## BrattyPatty

lovethelake said:


> I find it offensive that women are going vote for her just because of her gender. Is she the right person? I also find it offensive that women can even support her. During the bimbo eruptions I had turned on the TV to see the weather forecast while my daughter was eating her cereal. Then all of a sudden the cigar story came on. My daughter asked about it, and I was aghast and she was too young for the real answer. But was I thought was even worse is that Hillary stayed to him. If she had forgiven him but left him I would have respected her. But she stayed with him for his political connections so she could get the jobs she wanted. So what lesson has she taught our daughters? That if you stay with an adulterous husband that is convicted of perjury because that is the only way to make it in politics, it is okay. What????? If she is that good, then should have been able to be successful without Bill and his money.
> 
> I have yet had an answer to my question. Can you name 5 accomplishments that Hillary has done on her own and how do they make her qualified to be president? I can't think of one, honestly.


You can blame the media for playing the cigar bit. It is past history and should remain in the past. 
She would show our daughters how to be strong and forgiving when times are tough. She didn't need Bill's money. She had enough of her own.


----------



## susanmos2000

SQM said:


> I agree with Gers. Too many Bushes and Clintons. Wish some other candidates would have the cajones to run against both. Remember - I trash Monarchies and both are owned by their respective political machines. Hills is too belligerent for my taste and Bush would be a Daddy's boy. The other Rep. candidates are not worth even talking about. I may stay home Nov, '16 and give neither any legitimacy. I have spent many years ignoring other worthless presidents.


How about write-in candidates? Huey, Dewey, and Louie? :-D


----------



## Gerslay

susanmos2000 said:


> Point well taken, Gerslay. But who the heck is available in the Republican pool even remotely qualified except Jeb? I'm no fan of the Bush family, but I'd certainly vote for him over Cruz, Paul, and the rest of those jokers. They simply aren't Presidential timber.


Quite frankly, if you're right and only Jeb is qualified and that for the Dems there will only be Hillary then I probably won't vote at all...unless there's a third party independent that needs a vote to be eligible for matching funds. I've been politically active for over 50 years and if this is what its come to, if this is the best that we can do, then I just don't care anymore.


----------



## BrattyPatty

CarolfromTX said:


> Sure, if all concerned are on the up and up. But it's politics, so I ask you, what are the odds?! Mrs. Clinton and the libs will do everything in their power to bury those emails.


If she turns over her server it will open up a whole new can of worms as far as privacy laws go. If they can take hers, who's to stop them from taking yours or mine?


----------



## susanmos2000

CarolfromTX said:


> Sure, if all concerned are on the up and up. But it's politics, so I ask you, what are the odds?! Mrs. Clinton and the libs will do everything in their power to bury those emails.


Yes, and the Republicans will spend equal time twisting and distorting those they can get their hands on. Remember the so-called "smoking gun" emails of Benghazi that had Republican fingerprints all over them?


----------



## BrattyPatty

Gerslay said:


> Quite frankly, if you're right and only Jeb is qualified and that for the Dems there will only be Hillary then I probably won't vote at all...unless there's a third party independent that needs a vote to be eligible for matching funds. I've been politically active for over 50 years and if this is what its come to, if this is the best that we can do, then I just don't care anymore.


In the times that we are living in, not too many are chomping at the bit to run for the office.


----------



## BrattyPatty

susanmos2000 said:


> Have to agree with you, Nebraska. But, unfortunately, so are they all.


People are looking for perfection in a presidential candidate. The media will have each candidate stripped down before the election, all the skeletons in the colsets will be exposed. Stories will be fabricated, too. People will be angry that their candidate is not perfect. Or that they don't have a spotless background.
Let me remind you of something. There was only one perfect person that ever walked the earth and we hung him on a cross.


----------



## SQM

BrattyPatty said:


> In the times that we are living in, not too many are chomping at the bit to run for the office.


Exactly. Since Nixon, the Media have free rein in the private lives of Presidents. Who could stand the scrutiny?


----------



## theyarnlady

BrattyPatty said:


> People are looking for perfection in a presidential candidate. The media will have each candidate stripped down before the election, all the skeletons in the colsets will be exposed. Stories will be fabricated, too. People will be angry that their candidate is not perfect. Or that they don't have a spotless background.
> Let me remind you of something. There was only one perfect person that ever walked the earth and we hung him on a cross.


 :thumbup:


----------



## Irish knitter

BrattyPatty said:


> SHE NEVER said "who cares"! Go back and read a transcript.


She did...it was on the news......when she was questioned about Bengazi and whether they could have been saved with her phone call she stated:

"who cares; they are dead now.....get over it"


----------



## susanmos2000

BrattyPatty said:


> In the times that we are living in, not too many are chomping at the bit to run for the office.


Yes, that doesn't surprise me. I've certainly been chortling over Rand Paul's missteps (wagging his finger in journalists' faces, losing his cool, sweeping out without a word before an interview is over), but there's something sad about it too. He put a lot of time and effort into his campaign and truly believes everything he can turn the nation around, but it's just not working out as he expected. There are lots of good people out there who probably could make a difference, but they'll never get a chance--if they even stretch their necks out the Washington wood chipper will swallow them whole and reduce them to splinters.


----------



## susanmos2000

Irish knitter said:


> She did...it was on the news......when she was questioned about Bengazi and whether they could have been saved with her phone call she stated:
> 
> "who cares; they are dead now.....get over it"


Not quite. Here are the remark(s) in context:

Johnson: No, again, we were misled that there were supposedly protests and that something sprang out of that -- an assault sprang out of that -- and that was easily ascertained that that was not the fact, and the American people could have known that within days and they didnt know that.

Clinton: With all due respect, the fact is we had four dead Americans. Was it because of a protest or was it because of guys out for a walk one night who decided that theyd they go kill some Americans? What difference at this point does it make? It is our job to figure out what happened and do everything we can to prevent it from ever happening again, Senator.


----------



## BrattyPatty

Irish knitter said:


> She did...it was on the news......when she was questioned about Bengazi and whether they could have been saved with her phone call she stated:
> 
> In all fairness read the transcript. You will see how far off you really are
> 
> http://www.politifact.com/truth-o-meter/article/2013/may/08/context-hillary-clintons-what-difference-does-it-m/


----------



## theyarnlady

susanmos2000 said:


> Yes, that doesn't surprise me. I've certainly been chortling over Rand Paul's missteps (wagging his finger in journalists' faces, losing his cool, sweeping out without a word before an interview is over), but there's something sad about it too. He put a lot of time and effort into his campaign and truly believes everything he can turn the nation around, but it's just not working out as he expected. There are lots of good people out there who probably could make a difference, but they'll never get a chance--if they even stretch their necks out the Washington wood chipper will swallow them whole and reduce them to splinters.


Plus they would have to have millions just to run for office. There are good ones out there but they can't afford to run.


----------



## theyarnlady

susanmos2000 said:


> Yes, that doesn't surprise me. I've certainly been chortling over Rand Paul's missteps (wagging his finger in journalists' faces, losing his cool, sweeping out without a word before an interview is over), but there's something sad about it too. He put a lot of time and effort into his campaign and truly believes everything he can turn the nation around, but it's just not working out as he expected. There are lots of good people out there who probably could make a difference, but they'll never get a chance--if they even stretch their necks out the Washington wood chipper will swallow them whole and reduce them to splinters.


Plus they would have to have millions just to run for office. There are good ones out there but they can't afford to run.


----------



## theyarnlady

BrattyPatty said:


> Watch the video again. She never sad who cares or get over it. Lies don't get too far these days.
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> removed the s now they will be able to read it


----------



## Country Bumpkins

susanmos2000 said:


> Not quite. Here's are remark(s) in context:
> 
> Johnson: No, again, we were misled that there were supposedly protests and that something sprang out of that -- an assault sprang out of that -- and that was easily ascertained that that was not the fact, and the American people could have known that within days and they didnt know that.
> 
> Clinton: With all due respect, the fact is we had four dead Americans. Was it because of a protest or was it because of guys out for a walk one night who decided that theyd they go kill some Americans? What difference at this point does it make? It is our job to figure out what happened and do everything we can to prevent it from ever happening again, Senator.


And you see what has become of it. Nothing. I know there were families that thought a lot of difference was made that day.


----------



## susanmos2000

Country Bumpkins said:


> And you see what has become of it. Nothing. I know there were families that thought a lot of difference was made that day.


And that was Hillary's point as well--the why's and wherefores of the murders paled beside the fact that four good men were now dead.


----------



## susanmos2000

theyarnlady said:


> Plus they would have to have millions just to run for office. There are good ones out there but they can't afford to run.


So true. They don't have the money, don't have the time while trying to eke out a living, don't have the spit and polish of the DC regulars. Let's face it, even Honest Abe (or rather, his clone) wouldn't make it out of the starting gate.


----------



## BrattyPatty

theyarnlady said:


> removed the s now they will be able to read it


Thank you, yarnie


----------



## BrattyPatty

Country Bumpkins said:


> And you see what has become of it. Nothing. I know there were families that thought a lot of difference was made that day.


They are not alone in that CB. All of the deaths at embassies during the Bush Admin never even made it to a hearing. All of those families probably had no answers that would bring back their sons and daughters, moms or dads either.


----------



## WindingRoad

susanmos2000 said:


> 3. She can play hardball with the Big Boys. I for one thought she handled the flap over her private email account like a champ. Using a private account was well within the law until late 2014, so labeling her a "felon" is simply nonsense. And I'm pleased that, after turning the relevant emails, she erased the rest and saved the taxpayers from funding another Benghazi circus. The Senate Judiciary Committee AKA Barnum & Bailey has demanded that she turn over her server, but good luck with that. They'd have to launch a huge legal battle to get that server, and what would they actually gain if they got their mitts on it? She erased everything--and not simply by hitting the delete button tens of thousand of times. Those messages are gone forever.


Guess you conveniently forgot about White Water.


----------



## WindingRoad

Lukelucy said:


> Hillary IS a god ole boy. Do not be fooled.


Maybe in more ways than one.


----------



## BrattyPatty

WindingRoad said:


> Guess you conveniently forgot about White Water.


What ever became of Whitewater, Windingroad? What was the legal end to it?


----------



## WindingRoad

Wombatnomore said:


> There's a fair bit of press here in Australia about Mrs. Clinton's 'announcement' for the presidency which is to be released some time today. It's been reported that she will be strongly focused on the economic situation for the middle class. It was also reported that instead of a campaign rally for the presidential candidacy, Mrs. Clinton will hold a series of meetings with private citizens.


And she got those ideas from Elizabeth Warren. Clinton/ Warren. The new ipecac.

http://money.cnn.com/2015/04/10/news/economy/elizabeth-warren-2016-race/index.html


----------



## WindingRoad

Wombatnomore said:


> I'm assuming that any computer communications made in the State Department all end up on it's main server and that said communications could be retrieved regardless?


I guess you don't know the meaning of ass u me.


----------



## WindingRoad

BrattyPatty said:


> Thank you, yarnie


When did we start reading You Tube videos?


----------



## knitpresentgifts

Pocahontas said:


> :thumbup: :thumbup: And many people voted for our current president for the sole reason that he is black.
> Our country is in a mess and only by the grace of God will we regain any strength and respect.


The very definition of a racist: taking action for or against someone solely because of his race.

Amen!


----------



## WindingRoad

BrattyPatty said:


> What ever became of Whitewater, Windingroad? What was the legal end to it?


Same as most other good ole boy results. If a bear sh*ts in the woods does it still smell?


----------



## BrattyPatty

From Wikipedia, the free encyclopedia

The Whitewater controversy (also known as the Whitewater scandal, or simply Whitewater) began with investigations into the real estate investments of Bill and Hillary Clinton and their associates, Jim and Susan McDougal, in the Whitewater Development Corporation, a failed business venture in the 1970s and 1980s.

A March 1992 New York Times article published during the U.S. presidential campaign reported that the Clintonsthen governor and first lady of Arkansashad invested and lost money in the Whitewater Development Corporation.[1] The article stimulated the interest of L. Jean Lewis, a Resolution Trust Corporation investigator who was looking into the failure of Madison Guaranty Savings and Loan, owned by McDougal. She looked for connections between the savings and loan company and the Clintons, and on September 2, 1992, she submitted a criminal referral to the FBI naming Bill and Hillary Clinton as witnesses in the Madison Guaranty case. Little Rock U.S. Attorney Charles A. Banks and the FBI determined that the referral lacked merit, but she continued to pursue it. From 1992 to 1994, Lewis issued several additional referrals against the Clintons and repeatedly called the U.S. Attorney's Office in Little Rock and the Justice Department regarding the case.[2] Her referrals eventually became public knowledge, and she testified before the Senate Whitewater Committee in 1994.

David Hale, the source of criminal allegations against the Clintons, claimed in November 1993 that as governor of Arkansas, Clinton had pressured him into providing an illegal $300,000 loan to Susan McDougal, the Clintons' partner in the Whitewater land deal.[3] Clinton supporters regarded Hale's allegations as questionable, as Hale had not mentioned Clinton in reference to this loan during the original FBI investigation of Madison Guaranty in 1989; only after coming under indictment for this in 1993 did Hale make allegations against the Clintons.[4]

A U.S. Securities and Exchange Commission investigation did result in convictions against the McDougals for their role in the Whitewater project, but the Clintons themselves were never prosecuted, as three separate inquiries found insufficient evidence linking them with the criminal conduct of others related to the land deal.[5] Bill Clinton's successor as governor, Jim Guy Tucker, was also convicted and served time in prison for his role in the fraud. Susan McDougal later served 18 months in prison for contempt of court for refusing to answer any questions relating to Whitewater, and was granted a pardon by President Clinton just before leaving office.

The term Whitewater is also sometimes used to include other controversies from the Bill Clinton administration, especially those such as Travelgate, Filegate, and the circumstances surrounding Vince Foster's death, that were investigated by the Whitewater independent counsel.[6]


----------



## WindingRoad

BrattyPatty said:


> From Wikipedia, the free encyclopedia
> 
> The Whitewater controversy (also known as the Whitewater scandal, or simply Whitewater) began with investigations into the real estate investments of Bill and Hillary Clinton and their associates, Jim and Susan McDougal, in the Whitewater Development Corporation, a failed business venture in the 1970s and 1980s.
> 
> A March 1992 New York Times article published during the U.S. presidential campaign reported that the Clintonsthen governor and first lady of Arkansashad invested and lost money in the Whitewater Development Corporation.[1] The article stimulated the interest of L. Jean Lewis, a Resolution Trust Corporation investigator who was looking into the failure of Madison Guaranty Savings and Loan, owned by McDougal. She looked for connections between the savings and loan company and the Clintons, and on September 2, 1992, she submitted a criminal referral to the FBI naming Bill and Hillary Clinton as witnesses in the Madison Guaranty case. Little Rock U.S. Attorney Charles A. Banks and the FBI determined that the referral lacked merit, but she continued to pursue it. From 1992 to 1994, Lewis issued several additional referrals against the Clintons and repeatedly called the U.S. Attorney's Office in Little Rock and the Justice Department regarding the case.[2] Her referrals eventually became public knowledge, and she testified before the Senate Whitewater Committee in 1994.
> 
> David Hale, the source of criminal allegations against the Clintons, claimed in November 1993 that as governor of Arkansas, Clinton had pressured him into providing an illegal $300,000 loan to Susan McDougal, the Clintons' partner in the Whitewater land deal.[3] Clinton supporters regarded Hale's allegations as questionable, as Hale had not mentioned Clinton in reference to this loan during the original FBI investigation of Madison Guaranty in 1989; only after coming under indictment for this in 1993 did Hale make allegations against the Clintons.[4]
> 
> A U.S. Securities and Exchange Commission investigation did result in convictions against the McDougals for their role in the Whitewater project, but the Clintons themselves were never prosecuted, as three separate inquiries found insufficient evidence linking them with the criminal conduct of others related to the land deal.[5] Bill Clinton's successor as governor, Jim Guy Tucker, was also convicted and served time in prison for his role in the fraud. Susan McDougal later served 18 months in prison for contempt of court for refusing to answer any questions relating to Whitewater, and was granted a pardon by President Clinton just before leaving office.
> 
> The term Whitewater is also sometimes used to include other controversies from the Bill Clinton administration, especially those such as Travelgate, Filegate, and the circumstances surrounding Vince Foster's death, that were investigated by the Whitewater independent counsel.[6]


Guess you've never heard of favors. Too bad.


----------



## BrattyPatty

BrattyPatty said:


> Irish knitter said:
> 
> 
> 
> She did...it was on the news......when she was questioned about Bengazi and whether they could have been saved with her phone call she stated:
> 
> In all fairness read the transcript. You will see how far off you really are
> 
> http://www.politifact.com/truth-o-meter/article/2013/may/08/context-hillary-clintons-what-difference-does-it-m/
> 
> 
> 
> Des this look like a youtube video to you, Windingroad? It doesn't to me.
Click to expand...


----------



## knitpresentgifts

Wombatnomore said:


> There's a fair bit of press here in Australia about Mrs. Clinton's 'announcement' for the presidency which is to be released some time today. It's been reported that she will be strongly focused on the economic situation for the middle class. It was also reported that instead of a campaign rally for the presidential candidacy, Mrs. Clinton will hold a series of meetings with private citizens.


Hillary is beholden to foreign governments, Wall Street, the Clinton Foundation (funded by illegal contributions from foreign countries and citizens) and the top 1% of Democrats for her support. She couldn't care less about the economy or the middle class or Americans not in her elite circle.


----------



## Montana Gramma

BrattyPatty said:


> Irish knitter said:
> 
> 
> 
> She did...it was on the news......when she was questioned about Bengazi and whether they could have been saved with her phone call she stated:
> 
> In all fairness read the transcript. You will see how far off you really are
> 
> http://www.politifact.com/truth-o-meter/article/2013/may/08/context-hillary-clintons-what-difference-does-it-m/
> 
> 
> 
> Her body language and tone of voice said it all to me. I cannot vote as am a Canadian but I pay enough taxes to have and state an opinion.
Click to expand...


----------



## BrattyPatty

knitpresentgifts said:


> Hillary is beholden to foreign governments, Wall Street and the top 1% of Democrats for her support. She couldn't care less about the economy or the middle class or Americans not in her elite circle.


You have no idea whatsoever of what you are talking about. What else is new?


----------



## WindingRoad

BrattyPatty said:


> Thank you, yarnie


So what does this signify. Hard to keep up sometimes isn't it.


----------



## WindingRoad

theyarnlady said:


> removed the s now they will be able to read it


Thank you for removing the s for this YOU TUBE VIDEO. Now Bratty Patty can READ it.


----------



## BrattyPatty

WindingRoad said:


> So what does this signify. Hard to keep up sometimes isn't it.


You are becoming more incoherent by the post.


----------



## WindingRoad

BrattyPatty said:


> You are becoming more incoherent by the post.


Trying to figure out what you mean can cause much worse symptoms. Yarnie removed the s from a YOU TUBE video.


----------



## BrattyPatty

WindingRoad said:


> So what does this signify. Hard to keep up sometimes isn't it.


Maybe for you


----------



## BrattyPatty

WindingRoad said:


> Trying to figure out what you mean can cause much worse symptoms. Yarnie removed the s from a YOU TUBE video.


Yes she did. So?


----------



## WindingRoad

BrattyPatty said:


> Yes she did. So?


So now you can read it. Knock your self out. No wonder you're so well informed (sic).


----------



## susanmos2000

Montana Gramma said:


> Her body language and tone of voice said it all to me. I cannot vote as am a Canadian but I pay enough taxes to have and state an opinion.


Your free to state your opinions, Montana Gramma, but of course I'm free to disagree with them. And I believe that trying to interpret someone's body language and tone with any degree of accuracy is dicey, at best. Thousands of African-Americans lost their lives during the era of segregation because their body language and tone was interpreted as "uppity" and "arrogant".


----------



## knitpresentgifts

Wombatnomore said:


> I'm assuming that any computer communications made in the State Department all end up on it's main server and that said communications could be retrieved regardless?


Hillary didn't send any communications within the State Dept according to her.

Hillary kept a private server in her home, broke the laws that state all govt e-mails be regularly passed over the the govt (the owner of those communications) and once exciting her job as Sec of State, to sign a statement that she turned over all such communications and govt property. Hillary did none of those things.

Hillary broke more laws because she told Congressional members under penalties of perjury that she had turned over all e-mails subpoenaed by the Congress (more than one subpoena). At the time of her testimony, she had not turned over ANY e-mails. The State Dept is also complicit in breaking the law, as they, too, did not retrieve all Hillary's communications or have her sign a statement while she was SEC and upon her departure.

Hillary had staff members fired for not following the very laws she instituted and refused to follow herself.

Hilllary used her personal assistant, Huma Abedin, to send the majority of her communications and also used her private server for all Huma's e-mail in/out. Again, against all the laws because both Hill's and Huma's e-mails are the property of the govt, not them. None of Huma's e-mails were ever archived or turned over the the Dept or Congress to date.

Hill only turned over those e-mails 'she' determined were not personal. Another law broken. The law states the State Dept determines what is personal vs. public/govt property, not the employee. The law explicitly states that the SEC follows the same laws as staff members.

Hill turned over the e-mails two years after not complying with multiple subpoenas while stating under oath she complied.

Finally, Hillary destroyed govt property (govt e-mails) which is a felony. Hillary said she never e-mailed anything that was classified to anyone in the State Dept. Impossible as the SOS HAS to answer to the President and did communicate with the President and even her schedule and his are classified. Another law broken and another lie told.

It would be impossible to subpoena anyone or everyone in the State Dept that Hillary e-mailed to retrieve that copy on the Govt Server especially because Hill didn't sent to anyone according to her claims.

She should be toast but loyal Dems and idiots will vote for her simply because she is a woman, a Dem or because they are low information voters who don't give a darn.


----------



## WindingRoad

susanmos2000 said:


> Your free to state your opinions, Montana Gramma, but of course I'm free to disagree with them. And I believe that trying to interpret someone's body language and tone with any degree of accuracy is dicey, at best. Thousands of African-Americans lost their lives during the era of segregation because their body language and tone was interpreted as "uppity" and "arrogant".


Yeah I've always thought when people are yelling at me that they like me. Have I been wrong all these years?


----------



## BrattyPatty

susanmos2000 said:


> Your free to state your opinions, Montana Gramma, but of course I'm free to disagree with them. And I believe that trying to interpret someone's body language and tone with any degree of accuracy is dicey, at best. Thousands of African-Americans lost their lives during the era of segregation because their body language and tone was interpreted as "uppity" and "arrogant".


If one was to put themselves in Hillary's shoes that day, they may feel differently about her response. The committee was more concerned about talking points than they were about the victims.


----------



## WindingRoad

BrattyPatty said:


> If one was to put themselves in Hillary's shoes that day, they may feel differently about her response. The committee was more concerned about talking points than they were about the victims.


Oh yes now it's gonna be sympathy vote. That's will probably work. Feel sorry for Hill. Not today.


----------



## BrattyPatty

knitpresentgifts said:


> Hillary didn't send any communications within the State Dept according to her.
> 
> Hillary kept a private server in her home, broke the laws that state all govt e-mails be regularly passed over the the govt (the owner of those communications) and once exciting her job as Sec of State, to sign that she turned over all such communications. Hillary did none of those things.
> 
> Hillary broke more laws because she told Congressional members under penalties of perjury that she had turned over all e-mails subpoenaed by the Congress in more than one subpoena. The State Dept is also complicit in breaking the law, as they, too, did not retrieve all Hillary's communications while she was SEC and upon her departure.
> 
> Hilllary used her personal assistant, Huma Abedin, to send the majority of her communications and also used her private server for all Huma's e-mail in/out. Again, against all the laws because both Hill's and Huma's e-mails are the property of the govt, not them.
> 
> Hill only turned over those e-mails 'she' determined were not personal. Another law broken. The law states the State Dept determines what is personal vs. public/govt property.
> 
> Hill turned over the e-mails two years after not complaining with multiple subpoenas while stating under oath she complied.
> 
> Finally, Hillary destroyed public property (govt e-mails) which is a felony. Hillary said she never e-mailed anything that was classified to anyone in the State Dept. Impossible as the SOS HAS to answer to the President and even her schedule and his are classified. Another law broken and another lie under oath.
> 
> It would be impossible to subpoena anyone in the State Dept that Hillary e-mailed to retrieve that copy on the Govt Server especially because Hill didn't sent to anyone according to her claims.
> 
> She is toast but loyal Dems and idiots will vote for her simply because she is a woman, a Dem or because they have ill-informed.


I guess all of this speculation is your way of building up the Cruz clown?


----------



## WindingRoad

BrattyPatty said:


> I guess all of this speculation is your way of building up the Cruz clown?


----------



## BrattyPatty

WindingRoad said:


> Oh yes now it's gonna be sympathy vote. That's will probably work. Feel sorry for Hill. Not today.


OH winding road you really do crack me up! :XD: :XD: :XD: Did you forget to add your comments to your last post? :XD: :XD: :XD: :XD: :XD:


----------



## WindingRoad

BrattyPatty said:


> I guess all of this speculation is your way of building up the Cruz clown?


That's about your level. Guessing.


----------



## WindingRoad

BrattyPatty said:


> OH winding road you really do crack me up! :XD: :XD: :XD:


And not tomorrow either.


----------



## BrattyPatty

WindingRoad said:


> That's about your level. Guessing.


word


----------



## WindingRoad

BrattyPatty said:


> word


Yeah talk is cheap.


----------



## BrattyPatty

WindingRoad said:


> And not tomorrow either.


Isy our head bobbing toward the table now, Windy??? :XD: :XD: :XD: :XD: Don't knock yourself out!! :XD: :XD: :XD: :XD: :XD:


----------



## knitpresentgifts

Country Bumpkins said:


> And you see what has become of it. Nothing. I know there were families that thought a lot of difference was made that day.


Remember how Hilllary lied to the family members (when receiving the caskets in the hangar) of those who died in Benghazi?


----------



## WindingRoad

BrattyPatty said:


> Isy our head bobbing toward the table now, Windy??? :XD: :XD: :XD: :XD: Don't knock yourself out!! :XD: :XD: :XD: :XD: :XD:


Not at all. I'm an insomniac.


----------



## knitpresentgifts

WindingRoad said:


> I guess you don't know the meaning of ass u me.


She doesn't know or understand much about American politics and civics.


----------



## Cheeky Blighter

knitpresentgifts said:


> Hillary didn't send any communications within the State Dept according to her.
> 
> Hillary kept a private server in her home, broke the laws that state all govt e-mails be regularly passed over the the govt (the owner of those communications) and once exciting her job as Sec of State, to sign that she turned over all such communications. Hillary did none of those things.
> 
> Hillary broke more laws because she told Congressional members under penalties of perjury that she had turned over all e-mails subpoenaed by the Congress in more than one subpoena. The State Dept is also complicit in breaking the law, as they, too, did not retrieve all Hillary's communications while she was SEC and upon her departure.
> 
> Hilllary used her personal assistant, Huma Abedin, to send the majority of her communications and also used her private server for all Huma's e-mail in/out. Again, against all the laws because both Hill's and Huma's e-mails are the property of the govt, not them.
> 
> Hill only turned over those e-mails 'she' determined were not personal. Another law broken. The law states the State Dept determines what is personal vs. public/govt property.
> 
> Hill turned over the e-mails two years after not complaining with multiple subpoenas while stating under oath she complied.
> 
> Finally, Hillary destroyed public property (govt e-mails) which is a felony. Hillary said she never e-mailed anything that was classified to anyone in the State Dept. Impossible as the SOS HAS to answer to the President and even her schedule and his are classified. Another law broken and another lie under oath.
> 
> It would be impossible to subpoena anyone in the State Dept that Hillary e-mailed to retrieve that copy on the Govt Server especially because Hill didn't sent to anyone according to her claims.
> 
> She is toast but loyal Dems and idiots will vote for her simply because she is a woman, a Dem or because they have ill-informed.


So why didn't the Republicans do something about it? Impotent? Why would anyone vote for any GOP candidate when none of them can stop the juggernaut that is Hillary. You might as well admit defeat and take your marbles and go home.
According to you and Windyroad she has already bought the election.


----------



## BrattyPatty

Cheeky Blighter said:


> So why didn't the Republicans do something about it? Impotent? Why would anyone vote for any GOP candidate when none of them can stop the juggernaut that is Hillary. You might as well admit defeat and take your marbles and go home.
> According to you and Windyroad she has already bought the election.


Because she knows nothing of politics or civics, Cheeky. It's time for that balloon to take off.


----------



## knitpresentgifts

WindingRoad said:


> So now you can read it. Knock your self out. No wonder you're so well informed (sic).


She cannot communicate unless she makes personal attacks.

She cannot handle the truth either. Beware.


----------



## BrattyPatty

WindingRoad said:


> Not at all. I'm an insomniac.


Okay, that explains it then.


----------



## Cheeky Blighter

BrattyPatty said:


> Isy our head bobbing toward the table now, Windy??? :XD: :XD: :XD: :XD: Don't knock yourself out!! :XD: :XD: :XD: :XD: :XD:


 :thumbup: :XD: :XD: :XD: :XD: :XD:


----------



## BrattyPatty

knitpresentgifts said:


> She cannot communicate unless she makes personal attacks.
> 
> She cannot handle the truth either. Beware.


I have no problem with the truth when I hear it and it never comes from your mouth.


----------



## Cheeky Blighter

BrattyPatty said:


> Okay, that explains it then.


I wonder why she is so ornery?


----------



## Country Bumpkins

Montana Gramma said:


> Her body language and tone of voice said it all to me. I cannot vote as am a Canadian but I pay enough taxes to have and state an opinion.


Yes.


----------



## Country Bumpkins

susanmos2000 said:


> Your free to state your opinions, Montana Gramma, but of course I'm free to disagree with them. And I believe that trying to interpret someone's body language and tone with any degree of accuracy is dicey, at best. Thousands of African-Americans lost their lives during the era of segregation because their body language and tone was interpreted as "uppity" and "arrogant".


why do you always bring up race?


----------



## BrattyPatty

[quote knitpresentsgifts]

She cannot communicate unless she makes personal attacks.

She cannot handle the truth either. Beware.



BrattyPatty said:


> Yep, you described yourself to the tee again, kpg.
> 
> I have no problem with the truth when I hear it and it never comes from your mouth.


----------



## WindingRoad

Did you have something meaningful to mention?


----------



## knitpresentgifts

WindingRoad said:


> Did you have something meaningful to mention?


She's got nothing, so the personal attacks begin and will be constant. Yawn.


----------



## WindingRoad

knitpresentgifts said:


> She's got nothing, so the personal attacks begin and will be constant. Yawn.


I can run with the big dogs. I rarely stay on the porch. But notice the insomniac line works. LOL


----------



## mojave

knitpresentgifts said:


> She cannot communicate unless she makes personal attacks.


You have the same problem. We read the rude comments you made about our advisor. She did not attack you or your politics.

Mojave's graduate students


----------



## BrattyPatty

mojave said:


> You have the same problem. We read the rude comments you made about our advisor. She did not attack you or your politics.
> 
> Mojave's graduate students


 :thumbup: :thumbup: :thumbup:


----------



## Cheeky Blighter

WindingRoad said:


> Did you have something meaningful to mention?


Do you or are you just out here to p__s and moan? The GOP has no one who can beat Hillary and you know it. She scares all the big men in the Rep lineup.


----------



## WindingRoad

Cheeky Blighter said:


> Do you or are you just out here to p__s and moan? The GOP has no one who can beat Hillary and you know it. She scares all the big men in the Rep lineup.


Ask me if I care. I see the posse is being assembled. Too bad you need so much reinforcement.


----------



## WindingRoad

Cheeky Blighter said:


> Do you or are you just out here to p__s and moan? The GOP has no one who can beat Hillary and you know it. She scares all the big men in the Rep lineup.


I rarely PMG. BTW that's the correct version.


----------



## theyarnlady

WindingRoad said:


> Thank you for removing the s for this YOU TUBE VIDEO. Now Bratty Patty can READ it.


 :thumbup: glad to be of help.


----------



## knitpresentgifts

WindingRoad said:


> I can run with the big dogs. I rarely stay on the porch. But notice the insomniac line works. LOL


Good luck - I have zero interest. I don't suffer fools. :-D


----------



## Cheeky Blighter

knitpresentgifts said:


> She's got nothing, so the personal attacks begin and will be constant. Yawn.


If you are so bored what are you doing out here? You have nothing to add to the conversation. If you did you should have said it by now. The GOP has nada! No experience, no brains and no backbone. Hillary can blow them all out of the water.


----------



## BrattyPatty

knitpresentgifts said:


> Good luck - I have zero interest. I don't suffer fools. :-D


That's because she needs to keep her title as the Main Fool.


----------



## Cheeky Blighter

WindingRoad said:


> Ask me if I care. I see the posse is being assembled. Too bad you need so much reinforcement.


We do very well on our own. Sorry you feel so inadequate. That is your problem not mine.


----------



## knitpresentgifts

mojave said:


> You have the same problem. We read the rude comments you made about our advisor. She did not attack you or your politics.
> 
> Mojave's graduate students


I did no such thing. Hit the books and stop being played. Open your minds, engage your brains, become aware and think for yourselves.

btw; read all the comments, and yes, lies, your advisor has posted. I certainly hope you are not males, as your advisor is seeking revenge over you.


----------



## BrattyPatty

knitpresentgifts said:


> I did no such thing. Hit the books and stop being played. Use your minds and brains, become aware and think for yourselves.
> 
> btw; read all the comments, and yes, lies, your advisor has written.


Funny how everybody except for this kpg lies. Not her! (sarcasm)
If the truth kicked her in the arse, she 'd call it a liar.


----------



## Cheeky Blighter

BrattyPatty said:


> That's because she needs to keep her title as the Main Fool.


Are they gone yet, Patty? Did you check out any of those names I mentioned?


----------



## WindingRoad

BrattyPatty said:


> That's because she needs to keep her title as the Main Fool.


You left off the e. And it's a pretty simple spelling.


----------



## BrattyPatty

Cheeky Blighter said:


> Are they gone yet, Patty? Did you check out any of those names I mentioned?


I'm getting on it, Cheeky!


----------



## WindingRoad

knitpresentgifts said:


> Good luck - I have zero interest. I don't suffer fools. :-D


The secretary at work told me a good one the other day.

If a**holes could fly this would be an airport. LOL


----------



## Cheeky Blighter

BrattyPatty said:


> Funny how everybody except for this kpg lies. Not her! (sarcasm)
> If the truth kicked her in the arse, she 'd call it a liar.


She isn't even making any sense. She bought into her own hype and believes it.


----------



## BrattyPatty

WindingRoad said:


> You left off the e. And it's a pretty simple spelling.


What in hell are you yapping about now? Nevermind, it isn't worth my time.


----------



## BrattyPatty

WindingRoad said:


> The secretary at work told me a good one the other day.
> 
> If a**holes could fly this would be an airport. LOL


And you would be the pilot.


----------



## WindingRoad

BrattyPatty said:


> What in hell are you yapping about now? Nevermind, it isn't worth my time.


And you still don't get it. OMG


----------



## Cheeky Blighter

BrattyPatty said:


> I'm getting on it, Cheeky!


Good, PM me would you, please. :thumbup:


----------



## WindingRoad

BrattyPatty said:


> And you would be the pilot.


Damn straight. You don't think we are gonna let you fly do you?


----------



## BrattyPatty

I'm out of here for now, Cheeky. Catch you in another thread.


----------



## WindingRoad

BrattyPatty said:


> I'm out of here for now, Cheeky. Catch you in another thread.


BUH BYE. Sorry you can't run with the big dogs. Stay on the porch.


----------



## Cheeky Blighter

WindingRoad said:


> And you still don't get it. OMG


What is your problem? Why can't you be civil or at least make some sense? Are you feeling ill or is it your usual personality?


----------



## Cheeky Blighter

BrattyPatty said:


> I'm out of here for now, Cheeky. Catch you in another thread.


Sounds like a plan!


----------



## mojave

knitpresentgifts said:


> I did no such thing. Hit the books and stop being played. Open your minds, engage your brains, become aware and think for yourselves.
> 
> btw; read all the comments, and yes, lies, your advisor has written. I certainly hope you are not males, as your advisor is seeking revenge over you.


2 females and 1 male. No complaints from us about Mojave. She insures we have the opportunities we need to develop as scientists. She is available when we ask for guidance in our research projects and she offers constructive advice when she sees we need it. When we mess up she doesn't rip us a new one like some of the advisors do.


----------



## BrattyPatty

WindingRoad said:


> Damn straight. You don't think we are gonna let you fly do you?


Well of course not! You said it was for a$$holes. You and kpg can keep the whole plane for yourselves.


----------



## theyarnlady

mojave said:


> 2 females and 1 male. No complaints from us about Mojave. She insures we have the opportunities we need to develop as scientists. She is available when we ask for guidance in our research projects and she offers constructive advice when she sees we need it. When we mess up she doesn't rip us a new one like some of the advisors do.


Am I missing something here do you always talk to yourself ?

Mojave is posting about Mojave? I must be tired How can Mojave complain about no complaints from us about mojave???

:?: :?:


----------



## susanmos2000

theyarnlady said:


> Am I missing something here do you always talk to yourself ?
> 
> Mojave is posting about Mojave? I must be tired How can Mojave complain about no complaints from us about mojave???
> 
> :?: :?:


Those are her graduate students, Yarnlady. Apparently they enjoy following the KP political threads.
:thumbup:


----------



## Country Bumpkins

theyarnlady said:


> Am I missing something here do you always talk to yourself ?
> 
> Mojave is posting about Mojave? I must be tired How can Mojave complain about no complaints from us about mojave???
> 
> :?: :?:


Very strange indeed. I was puzzled myself.


----------



## mojave

Have you ever attend grad school? Lots of stress. Mojave teaches her grads to knit or crochet if we want to learn. She allows us to use her account to read and sometimes comment. Its interesting to read the differing viewpoints


----------



## BrattyPatty

dp


----------



## galaxycraft

BrattyPatty said:


> disgusting


Please delete the quote -- Admin took care of the troll.


----------



## susanmos2000

galaxycraft said:


> Please delete the quote -- Admin took care of the troll.


I saw that--they were really on the ball this time.


----------



## BrattyPatty

galaxycraft said:


> Please delete the quote -- Admin took care of the troll.


p


----------



## BrattyPatty

galaxycraft said:


> Please delete the quote -- Admin took care of the troll.


Thanks galaxycraft it's done


----------



## galaxycraft

:thumbup:


----------



## WindingRoad

BrattyPatty said:


> Well of course not! You said it was for a$$holes. You and kpg can keep the whole plane for yourselves.


We already have didn't you get the memo?


----------



## WindingRoad

mojave said:


> Have you ever attend grad school? Lots of stress. Mojave teaches her grads to knit or crochet if we want to learn. She allows us to use her account to read and sometimes comment. Its interesting to read the differing viewpoints


I believe that might be against the rules here. Have you checked it out?


----------



## WindingRoad

susanmos2000 said:


> Those are her graduate students, Yarnlady. Apparently they enjoy following the KP political threads.
> :thumbup:


Isn't it against the rules here to use someone else account?


----------



## BrattyPatty

WindingRoad said:


> Isn't it against the rules here to use someone else account?


It's not listed . If it's okay with Mojave then why not?


----------



## mojave

WindingRoad said:


> Isn't it against the rules here to use someone else account?


This is Mojave. I'll check it out Winding. Thank you for expressing your concern.
We are working late tonight trying to wrap up some sample processing. My students were reading (and apparently commenting) while we were waiting on the centrifuging to finish.


----------



## raedean

she is a horrible woman.what more can i say? no thank u.


----------



## WindingRoad

mojave said:


> This is Mojave. I'll check it out Winding. Thank you for expressing your concern.
> We are working late tonight trying to wrap up some sample processing. My students were reading (and apparently commenting) while we were waiting on the centrifuging to finish.


No need for anyone to get into trouble.


----------



## mojave

WindingRoad said:


> No need for anyone to get into trouble.


I went back through the pages and read their comments. They are not in trouble with me. Nice to know they appreciate my efforts on their behalf.


----------



## SQM

susanmos2000 said:


> Those are her graduate students, Yarnlady. Apparently they enjoy following the KP political threads.
> :thumbup:


Why would young graduate students have any interest in what women of a certain age have to say about politics? Better use of your time to study.


----------



## ute4kp

mojave said:


> I went back through the pages and read their comments. They are not in trouble with me. Nice to know they appreciate my efforts on their behalf.


I missed the exact details. But anyone can read KP without having to login. Maybe you're puter is setup to be always logged in...so....but why don't they join KP?


----------



## SQM

ute4kp said:


> I missed the exact details. But anyone can read KP without having to login. Maybe you're puter is setup to be always logged in...so....but why don't they join KP?


Squirrels and sloths are in their nests now. Why are we still up?


----------



## mojave

No, not always logged in. Our lab computers are turned off when we leave. We were working tonight trying to get the backlog of plant samples processed before we leave for the summer field season. I had my laptop open to KP and my grads were reading while we were waiting on the centrifuges to finish a separation process. I was working on grading essays. 
You might be surprised at the wide range of things these 3 young adults read. They are among the best grads I've had the pleasure of training.


----------



## SQM

Keep up the good work Kids. What are you looking for?


----------



## mojave

SQM said:


> Keep up the good work Kids. What are you looking for?


Sorry, SQM. The "Kids" are gone until Monday morning. Do you want me to leave them a message? 
If you are wondering why they read the politically oriented threads, perhaps I can answer that thanks to many discussions with them. They can read what the media puts out and what is available at the politically oriented websites. The opinions expressed on KP reflect the spectrum from far right to far left, the views of people from many backgrounds, educational levels, different professions. The "Kids" are still figuring out who they are, what ethical values they should incorporate into their self-definition. KP is a window into the world beyond grad school. They spend so much time immersed in our narrow discipline, the KP window does in some ways serve as a touchstone to a larger reality.


----------



## Montana Gramma

susanmos2000 said:


> Your free to state your opinions, Montana Gramma, but of course I'm free to disagree with them. And I believe that trying to interpret someone's body language and tone with any degree of accuracy is dicey, at best. Thousands of African-Americans lost their lives during the era of segregation because their body language and tone was interpreted as "uppity" and "arrogant".


I think the people that killed them were just using that as an excuse to carry out their warped sense of self and cruel nature. I doubt African-Americans really showed those symptoms, just nasties looking for an excuse to play a superiority card that existed in their minds.


----------



## kiwiannie

I agree with you 100% she will be a brilliant president. :thumbup: :thumbup:


----------



## jasgold

We need a woman president, just not Hillary.


----------



## pierrette

Irish knitter said:


> I do not want to start a fight but I have lost all respect for Hillary after she said "who cares" after the death of our ambassador. I just finished 13 hours in Benghazi and they stated if she had moved right in the beginning none of them would have died and it WAS a terrorist attack and the whitehouse knew about it but kept their mouths shut.
> 
> Also...I have read what the whitehouse secret service said about her being "flying off the handle" at a moments notice; being B-tchy; in control and a all around pain in the a--.
> 
> All of this infornmation comes from reliable sources. They guy who wrote 13 hours in Benghazi was a survivor and just stated the facts. The secret service remarks I ran accross when I was looking up Caroline/John Kennedy's detail. They "tell all". Like the Bush twins were the worst to protect as they would run red lights to get rid of their agents and call "Daddy" when their agents caught up with them. The easiest to protect was Amy Carter.....her worst thing was roller skating in the whitehouse...
> 
> As I said before.....I am not trying to start an argument. Maybe we should be careful....
> 
> I will have to look to see where I got my whitehouse information.
> 
> Just think about the last Clinton whitehouse.....Bill was a front while Hillary ran it. We will be no better off than we are now.
> I am terrified if she wins....
> I do not like to get into politics but we are all doomed if she wins.......I want a woman in the whitehouse.....BUT the right woman and it is NOT hillary!!!


I agree with you 100%!


----------



## pierrette

raedean said:


> she is a horrible woman.what more can i say? no thank u.


YES!!!!!


----------



## Gram47

Wow, 14 pages already. Let's look at what Hillary has actually accomplished. Just because she is female, imho, is no reason to give her a vote. We should vote sensibly.


----------



## Munchn

I'd like to mention her poor handling of Bengazi. I am glad though that we live in the USA where we can mention our differences of opinions.


----------



## cherylthompson

Irish knitter said:


> I do not want to start a fight but I have lost all respect for Hillary after she said "who cares" after the death of our ambassador. I just finished 13 hours in Benghazi and they stated if she had moved right in the beginning none of them would have died and it WAS a terrorist attack and the whitehouse knew about it but kept their mouths shut.
> 
> Also...I have read what the whitehouse secret service said about her being "flying off the handle" at a moments notice; being B-tchy; in control and a all around pain in the a--.
> 
> All of this infornmation comes from reliable sources. They guy who wrote 13 hours in Benghazi was a survivor and just stated the facts. The secret service remarks I ran accross when I was looking up Caroline/John Kennedy's detail. They "tell all". Like the Bush twins were the worst to protect as they would run red lights to get rid of their agents and call "Daddy" when their agents caught up with them. The easiest to protect was Amy Carter.....her worst thing was roller skating in the whitehouse...
> 
> As I said before.....I am not trying to start an argument. Maybe we should be careful....
> 
> I will have to look to see where I got my whitehouse information.
> 
> Just think about the last Clinton whitehouse.....Bill was a front while Hillary ran it. We will be no better off than we are now.
> I am terrified if she wins....
> I do not like to get into politics but we are all doomed if she wins.......I want a woman in the whitehouse.....BUT the right woman and it is NOT hillary!!!


I agree!


----------



## cherylthompson

Gram47 said:


> Wow, 14 pages already. Let's look at what Hillary has actually accomplished. Just because she is female, imho, is no reason to give her a vote. We should vote sensibly.


 :thumbup:


----------



## Munchn

I agree with this response.


cherylthompson said:


> I agree!


 :thumbup:


----------



## Munchn

Benghazi. Benghazi. Benghazi. She did not act in a timely manner and four men died. :thumbdown:


----------



## peacegoddess

The magazine The Atlantic has some interesting and informative articles about Hillary Clinton. 
I will not vote for her as I believe she is a centrist Just like Obama.


----------



## scottishlass

.


----------



## tatesgirl

Bunbun said:


> plus someone needs to take her aside and do a "What NOT to wear" on her and that hair. She does NOT look like someone I would want representing my country. She's trying to look like she's a teenager. YUK!


Right after her "fall" and hospitalization, I thought she had a double. My sister disagreed, saying she had been admitted to have a secret "make-over" of liposuction of her big belly and hips plus a face-lift, BOTH of which have returned and THAT's why she wears longer and longer tunic/jackets/coats - to disguise her health problems.

You can't rid yourself of a swollen belly that accompanies a heart condition. Frankly, I don't think hers comes only from living on a rich diet. I now think she likely has a heart condition and is unhealthy.

That's not the least of it! Do you really want an old woman who frequently resorts to winding her hair up into A PONYTAIL in the world's highest position? Let's get serious!


----------



## Pexuk

We need the iron lady, Margaret Thatcher.


----------



## Cardelo

galaxycraft said:


> No Way Jose! :thumbdown: She has not proven to be a leader. :thumbdown:
> From the first lady to the present.


 :thumbup: :thumbup: :thumbup: :thumbup: :thumbup: :thumbup: :thumbup: :thumbup: :thumbup: :thumbup:


----------



## marylin

A women with a backbone would be great.
Now if Hillary could only find hers !!


----------



## lovethelake

mojave said:


> No, not always logged in. Our lab computers are turned off when we leave. We were working tonight trying to get the backlog of plant samples processed before we leave for the summer field season. I had my laptop open to KP and my grads were reading while we were waiting on the centrifuges to finish a separation process. I was working on grading essays.
> You might be surprised at the wide range of things these 3 young adults read. They are among the best grads I've had the pleasure of training.


Are they dogs that need to be trained? I thought graduate students were there to learn and think on their own, not to be trained to drool when they hear the bell.


----------



## Kathie

Gerslay said:


> Please people...we don't want another Clinton or another Bush in the White House!
> 
> We've had a Bush in the upper echelons of government since 1971 when Geo H Bush became a member of the Texas House of Reps and since 1979 when Bill Clinton became AG in Arkansas. That's 44 and 36 years respectively. If either one of them wins the presidency we'll have one family dynasty in power for over half a century and the other for slightly less then half a century!
> 
> What are we...North Korea?


 :thumbup: :thumbup:


----------



## jasgold

Shouldn't a female reporter be able to handle a Rand Paul. I mean they are interviewers, just like men.


----------



## jasgold

:thumbup:


----------



## justinevalla

Men have made a mess of this world....we need more women in politics!


----------



## jasgold

:thumbup:


----------



## Jedmo

I agree with you Irish Knitter, she is a strong person but not ready for the White House, I don't like her.


----------



## jasgold

:thumbup:


----------



## Madison7

I would love to see a woman president too. However, don't think Hillary is the right choice. She has too much baggage and things to answer to this time around. If one is voting for her just because she is a woman, has not done their homework. PLEASE vote responsively.


----------



## Madison7

I would love to see a woman president too. However, don't think Hillary is the right choice. She has too much baggage and things to answer to this time around. If one is voting for her just because she is a woman, has not done their homework. PLEASE vote responsively.


----------



## gmomgil

I agree. I know some woman would vote for Hillary just because she's a woman. The heck with what she stands for. I do not want to see her in the White House for any reason. Scares the heck out of me.


----------



## tamarque

Problem with Hilary is the same problem we had with B. Clinton and Obama. None of them have white male ruling class status. Hilary is Republican light which means little. We need to a complete redoing of the electoral politics to create meaningful change. Hilary, like Obama will support populace social issues like birth control and gay marriage. But like the others will not be able to withstand the power of the ruling 1% with its militaristic, genocidal agenda. 

Personally, I can't stand Hilary but she will play with the boys. Elizabeth is a better choice but we have already seen her back off principled positions on larger political issues which are the real ones that control our lives. She will take on Wall Street on behalf of the consumer which Hilary will not. 

On Benghazi: Global Research did an expose last year I think on the behind-the-scenes maneuvering. Unfortunately, allowing Benghazi to occur is business as usual for the ruling elite. Killing, or allowing to be killed, people who will blow the covers is not news in politics. So this is a non-issue for me because they all do it. Don't think I support this; I just don't see this as a unique event to separate her from the rest of the pack.


----------



## NanaFran

Elizabeth Warren??? Are you serious???


----------



## justinevalla

Sorry, will vote for Hillary! Strong woman. She has a lot of experience, and was the power behind Bill, if you read the books about her life. Will not vote Republican.


----------



## Madison7

I too would like to see a woman president, however, Hillary is certainly not the one. Way too much baggage, and lots of questions to be answered this time around. Not very honest in my estimation.


----------



## dotcarp2000

I, for one, will not respond to political views in KP. We all have to deal with all of the unwanted TV ads for months at a time.


----------



## Madison7

Hillary is not the answer just because she is a woman. She has too much baggage and lots of answering to this time around. Not very honest in my estimation.


----------



## Teriwm

I'd love to see a woman in the Oval Office but I'm starting to question if Hillary is the right woman right now.

She seems bound and determined not to be sharing how she's going to deal with all the disasters we are facing in both foreign and domestic policy right now. I want to vote for Someone who has Solutions to problems like ISIS, Israel and Israelis safety, health care (which is currently a disaster waiting to blow up) LGBT equal rights and protection, a woman's right to govern her own goddamned body. The list goes on and on...


----------



## SharonM

Hillary? Once upon a time I thought she might be a good choice, but no more. Even though I realize the media blows things out of proportion, she get really bad press and her actions seem to confirm it. Now... Elizabeth Warren? There's a strong, honest and level headed woman. I'd vote for her in a heartbeat.


----------



## Esmee

I Think Elizabeth Warren will be an influencer this election. She's so smart and ethical!


----------



## pierrette

Pexuk said:


> We need the iron lady, Margaret Thatcher.


Yes and yes again!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!


----------



## pierrette

gmomgil said:


> I agree. I know some woman would vote for Hillary just because she's a woman. The heck with what she stands for. I do not want to see her in the White House for any reason. Scares the heck out of me.


Me too!!!


----------



## SharonM

gmomgil said:


> I agree. I know some woman would vote for Hillary just because she's a woman. The heck with what she stands for. I do not want to see her in the White House for any reason. Scares the heck out of me.


Those are the same people who voted for Obama just because he's black. And you see where that's gotten us! They both terrify me!!!


----------



## Senjia

That will never happen. I don't think there is one honest politician out there.


----------



## Kathie

SharonM said:


> Those are the same people who voted for Obama just because he's black. And you see where that's gotten us! They both terrify me!!!


I agree. I know some woman would vote for Hillary just because she's a woman. The heck with what she stands for. I do not want to see her in the White House for any reason. Scares the heck out of me.

Both of those responses are quotes from our members.

I wish we had a completely different cast of characters to choose from but we have to remember that there are people out there who wouldn't vote for either of these people because they are either black or a woman. That is no better.


----------



## GroodleMom

crispie said:


> Agreed


Elizabeth Warren! She is VERY popular, brilliant and no baggage.


----------



## GroodleMom

SharonM said:


> Hillary? Once upon a time I thought she might be a good choice, but no more. Even though I realize the media blows things out of proportion, she get really bad press and her actions seem to confirm it. Now... Elizabeth Warren? There's a strong, honest and level headed woman. I'd vote for her in a heartbeat.


There is a petition to draft Elizabeth Warren on the internet.


----------



## LadyBug 2014

There is an old saying "stay away from politics and religion" I agree with it.


----------



## Carole Jeanne

Hilarious. 17pp and counting and it's only 7:45am here. 

Hillary and bill believe they live under a different set of laws than the rest of us. She can do whatever she wants--like use Bill's servers and dump emails because they've been requested or may come under subpoena courtesy of Congressional committee work investigating Benghazi or other events. 

How can anyone seriously think she can be trusted with the presidency.


----------



## cc1945

I have mixed feelings. While I think that a strong woman leader should be president, I wish Mrs. Clinton would enjoy retirement. She has too much baggage on her.


----------



## mreckel

Forget about gender and race. Concentrate on who is best qualified for the job. We need someone who is truly concerned about what is best for our country and its people and will cut wasteful spending.


----------



## sandyridge

I am horrified to think that Hillary Clinton might be our next president. She has been proven over and over to be a liar dating back to her Arkansas days. She has been involved in so many shady dealings such as Whitewater,the mysterious disappearances of people she had issue with,the Benghazi fiasco, carpetbagging to New York to gain a senate seat and her most recent email scandal. She joked at press conferance about that a few days ago---changing my hair style and changing email servers. I don't think that was a joking matter and why delete the entire account if there was not something to hide? How can anyone excuse her tirade before the senate committee where with clenched fists she screamed "what does it matter?" I should think it mattered greatly to the families of the victims. Would she say that if something so devastating and avoidable happened to her daughter? I think Hillary revealed her entire attitude with that that callous remark in a fit of anger and frustration. I do not even believe that Hillary's endeavor to be president is base don her patriotism or desire to serve her country. I believe she just wants to go down in history as the first woman president to continue to feed her ego. It has only been a few months since she declared she had no desire to run for office and it was time now to relax and be a grandma. She is so unstable with her antics I would shudder to think she was in charge of our nation.


----------



## Gerslay

*Oh Hill No! Clintons Stale Presidential Plan Wrong For Nation*

http://nypost.com/2015/04/11/oh-hill-no-clintons-presidential-plan-is-growing-stale/


----------



## Carly

Amen to Elizabeth Warren. Hillary botched her job as Secretary of State; why put her in a more crucial post.


----------



## scottishlass

mreckel said:


> Forget about gender and race. Concentrate on who is best qualified for the job. We need someone who is truly concerned about what is best for our country and its people and will cut wasteful spending.


 :thumbup: :thumbup:


----------



## sandyridge

Gerslay said:


> *Oh Hill No! Clintons Stale Presidential Plan Wrong For Nation*
> 
> http://nypost.com/2015/04/11/oh-hill-no-clintons-presidential-plan-is-growing-stale/


Excellent article---right on target and should have been even more scathing as there was much more that could have been included.


----------



## gmomgil

I definitely agree.


----------



## loravaughn

Being from Arkansas, working in state government under the Clinton governorship, I would not vote for her if she was the only candidate running. Any person, male or female, republican, democrat or independent that can make the statement "what difference does it make?" about our four men killed in Benghazi has no business being the leader of our country. Be cautious and listen closely this next 18 months to what she says and how she says it, how she maintains her cool under pressure. She can be as crooked as the mafia in order to get her way.


----------



## GLOKO

With the CLINTONS, Corruption never ends !!!


----------



## flohel

Hillary or Elizabeth Warren. I have noticed in the past seems the better person for the job gets the most hate from the other side. If anyone out there is naive to think big business is not behind most candidates wake up. The supreme court made sure of that.


----------



## flohel

When Bill Clinton left office the country was in the best shape financially in decades.His personal life is none of my business. That is up to his family to deal with.


----------



## Jean Keith

Toby's Mom said:


> Excessive Baggage. Wish we had someone with a clean slate.


If you're looking for someone with a clean slate you are going to have a real difficult time. Elect a 3rd grader. In partisan politics the other side will fabricate something and the media will run it in a loop 24/7.


----------



## jjordan52

I won't vote for her. Nope.


----------



## sandyridge

flohel said:


> When Bill Clinton left office the country was in the best shape financially in decades.His personal life is none of my business. That is up to his family to deal with.


Minus the White House china and linens they stole. Also don't forget Hillary declared they were totally broke when they left the White House. How could one even say that with a straight face and a clear conscience?


----------



## whitetail

Besides her poor political career, the idea of someone voting for her because she's a woman is so sad, it's like those that voted for Obama because they wanted a black person in the white house. She will just continue Obama's mess. Truly hope there are people out there that are more concerned about political issues and our country's security than woman's issues.


----------



## cathy47

galaxycraft said:


> No Way Jose! :thumbdown: She has not proven to be a leader. :thumbdown:
> From the first lady to the present.


 :thumbup: :thumbup: :thumbup: :thumbup: agree


----------



## scottishlass

My only question If she is the right person now Why did she lose your vote last time.???
It's not enough to vote for someone "just because she is a woman" you need to pick the correct person to run our country regardless of gender.


----------



## SiberAngel

If we vote based on personality, gender, race, etc., we are cheating ourselves out of a leader that can truly lead this country. Above all, we must understand that regardless of whom we elect, they are, first and foremost, politicians. Filter out the ones who are blowing smoke up your a$$ and promising things that are not within the scope of accomplishment without being a detriment to everyone else concerned; try not to vote based on one particular agenda, rather vote based on the greater good for this country. Remember the basic principles this country was founded upon. Is your proposed leader in sync with those principles? If not, then why expect tomatoes when you are planting lilies? To have a female president just because we've never had one, doesn't make good sense, unless she meets certain criteria and although I think Hilary Clinton has weathered many a storm, she is too much of a politician with her self interests and is generally not fit to run this country.


----------



## cathy47

flohel said:


> When Bill Clinton left office the country was in the best shape financially in decades.His personal life is none of my business. That is up to his family to deal with.


he is not the one running for office. Its his wife. Don't base anything about him on her she has to prove herself not him.


----------



## skwise

galaxycraft said:


> No Way Jose! :thumbdown: She has not proven to be a leader. :thumbdown:
> From the first lady to the present.


Agreed and well said


----------



## mjs

GroodleMom said:


> Elizabeth Warren is a better choice: Strong, brilliant and without all the baggage.


But we really need her in the Senate.


----------



## susanmos2000

Montana Gramma said:


> I think the people that killed them were just using that as an excuse to carry out their warped sense of self and cruel nature. I doubt African-Americans really showed those symptoms, just nasties looking for an excuse to play a superiority card that existed in their minds.


That's just the point, Montana Gramma. Those who try to interpret another's body language will inevitably find what they expect to.


----------



## Pat lamb

If Hillary gets elected does that make "BILL" first men ? Brother! God help us all. :thumbdown: :thumbdown: :thumbdown:


----------



## Linda6885

I am afraid that 'baggage' will hurt HC chances. But i do like her.


----------



## LEE1313

Won't get my vote !!!!


----------



## frannie di

MrsB said:


> Hillary Clinton to Announce 2016 Run for President on Sunday. The former secretary of state, senator and first lady is to announce that she will indeed seek the Democratic nomination for president.
> 
> I'm so pleased that she has decided to run again. We need strong women in the White House in a more crucial and central position. After a few seasons of Scandal viewing, I've come to the conclusion that there maybe just too much underhanded shenanigans going on in the good ole boys club. Hillary is no pushover and the best candidate that has come along in a long time. I'm assuming that Obama endorses her.


 :thumbup: :thumbup: :thumbup: :thumbup: :thumbup: :thumbup:


----------



## sandyridge

I have been reading this thread with great interest and I am pleased to see that so many women are thinking clearly regarding Hillary's reputation and past poor performances. I sincerely hope more will do the same and not just jump on the Elect a Woman bandwagon.Mrs. B certainly stirred up a hornet's nest and I think it is healthy to start people really evaluating the choices and what they stand for in reality, not rhetoric.


----------



## nmgram

SiberAngel said:


> If we vote based on personality, gender, race, etc., we are cheating ourselves out of a leader that can truly lead this country. Above all, we must understand that regardless of whom we elect, they are, first and foremost, politicians. Filter out the ones who are blowing smoke up your a$$ and promising things that are not within the scope of accomplishment without being a detriment to everyone else concerned; try not to vote based on one particular agenda, rather vote based on the greater good for this country. Remember the basic principles this country was founded upon. Is your proposed leader in sync with those principles? If not, then why expect tomatoes when you are planting lilies? To have a female president just because we've never had one, doesn't make good sense, unless she meets certain criteria and although I think Hilary Clinton has weathered many a storm, she is too much of a politician with her self interests and is generally not fit to run this country.


Awarded the best post of the discussion.


----------



## jayne6666

this is great.
you can tell who watches FOX (not the) news, by their quoting of catch line phrases that this network uses to achieve the "say it over and over and over until they believe it!" results.


----------



## sandyridge

jayne6666 said:


> this is great.
> you can tell who watches FOX (not the) news, by their quoting of catch line phrases that this network uses to achieve the "say it over and over and over until they believe it!" results.


Not sure which entries you are referring to, but I try to be open minded without adhering to any of the mainstream media comments, but the facts regarding Hillary's reputation and past performances do speak for themselves and her messages are self damning.


----------



## susanmos2000

cathy47 said:


> he is not the one running for office. Its his wife. Don't base anything about him on her she has to prove herself not him.


You're right, but viewing the Clintons as anything but a two for one deal is virtually impossible. And I believe it's something the Republicans don't quite know how to deal with. Touting the notion that a vote for Hillary is in reality a vote for Bill could backfire big time--many Americans would see that as a plus.

This one included, I'm afraid. If Bill Clinton was eligible for a third term I'd vote for him in a heartbeat. That treacherous, do-nothing Congress needs to be put down with a firm hand, and Bill would be just the man for the job.


----------



## RosieC

GroodleMom said:


> Elizabeth Warren is a better choice: Strong, brilliant and without all the baggage.


I am hoping Elizabeth Warren will run. Hillary will never get my vote.


----------



## ilmacheryl

I would like her better if her husband hadn't already been president. I don't like this trend of family members running for the same office. No, she isn't "related" to Bill. Yes, she is a member of the family. I don't like family dynasties. We shouldn't have dynasties in this country. It smacks too much of aristocracy. I do wish Elizabeth Warren would run, but she is probably too smart to want the job. I almost feel that if someone actually wants that horrible job, they shouldn't have it


----------



## fisherwoman

Go Hillary!

You and Bubba are a breath of fresh air


----------



## Artbarn

theyarnlady said:


> your kidding Right Hillary carries so much baggage that there are not enough suit case left to carry.
> 
> Because she is a women you would vote for her. Then you must not know what she has accomplish. I would say not much and adds more to the list with the phone gate.
> 
> But am sure after the statement we need a women in the White House more of them will vote for her . Just to have a women in the White House. Where is the logic in that. There are other women in politc. who would be a better choice then this women.


I so agree with you. Why do we need a woman in the White House? It seems to me that we really need is PERSON in the White House who can fix our economy and who excels at foreign policy.

Hillary Clinton has no accomplishments to speak of. I've heard multiple interviews with people who support her. Whenever they're asked about her accomplishments, they have no answer. She certainly has no successes as Secretary of State. Our foreign policy is a mess.

She has done everything possible to prevent us from learning the truth about Benghazi and she says it's not important: "What difference does it make?" She deliberately kept all of the email, when she was Secretary of State, on a private server, even though she knew that was not allowed. Now she says she has deleted all the emails from that server--emails that belong to the US government and were supposed to be saved for historical purposes. As far as I'm concerned, when she did these things she disqualified herself from running for President.

And don't get me started on that hypocrite, Elizabeth Warren.

This country needs the right PERSON to be our next President, no matter if it's a woman or a man.

I want history to record that our first woman President was a huge success.


----------



## whitetail

Same can be said for those that watch ABC, NBC and CBS


----------



## Donalda

I agree 100% with you Irish Knitter. She scares me to death. Firstly, what has she actually accomplished, other than wiping her "private" server clean? Secondly, electing her President simply because she's a woman, is extremely dangerous. This county elected our first "black" president because of race and look at where this country is now. So, like you, I will probably get hate responses, but so be it. My thumb is down on Hilary Clinton. :thumbdown: :thumbdown: :thumbdown:


----------



## Pexuk

It doesn't matter who gets into the White House, they'll have no real say in anything, it's the old boy network, I think House of cards, both the British version and the USA version is too near the bone to be dismissed as just soap opera, money and power go hand in hand, who ever heard of a real honest politician? It would be wonderful to have a fresh start and to right all wrongs but it ain't gonna happen!


----------



## lkb850

I am sorry that you feel that way jayne6666. I can't say this has been a civil discussion, but the one thing that can be drawn from this thread is that we need to think about for whom we vote. Voting race or gender has been and would be a disaster. People who have absolutely NO idea about leadership is what has gotten us into the mess we are in as a country. That has nothing to do with Fox news. If the media would have done their job in the first place, we would have been able to make a much more informed decision. It will be the same this go-round. Perhaps we should all be informed about who is running the news, rather than worrying about talking points. Having a shiver up one's leg is hardly a reason to vote for anyone. And I don't believe that came from Fox news.


----------



## Artbarn

susanmos2000 said:


> 3. She can play hardball with the Big Boys. I for one thought she handled the flap over her private email account like a champ. Using a private account was well within the law until late 2014, so labeling her a "felon" is simply nonsense. And I'm pleased that, after turning the relevant emails, she erased the rest and saved the taxpayers from funding another Benghazi circus. The Senate Judiciary Committee AKA Barnum & Bailey has demanded that she turn over her server, but good luck with that. They'd have to launch a huge legal battle to get that server, and what would they actually gain if they got their mitts on it? She erased everything--and not simply by hitting the delete button tens of thousand of times. Those messages are gone forever.


And just how do you know that she turned over all the relevant emails?


----------



## Gerrie Pennock

I think that Hillary has too many hidden agendas. Too many problems in her political closet.


----------



## 8536

agree! No to Hillary


----------



## fisherwoman

Go Hillary!

You and Bubba are a breath of fresh air!


----------



## kemu

We 'don't need another Clinton nor another Bush, more of the same.
This country is becoming a 'third' world nation due to those in power now.
This includes Elizabeth Warren. Many don't know much about her except that she talks the talk. 
We need 'new' blood. Someone who stands up for the people, produces jobs, and 
gets people off the dole so we can be a strong nation again.


----------



## mimester70

Hilary Clinton does not impress me at all. She and Bill were involved in so many shady deals, they were always out for themselves.
Shows me that neither one of them had, or has any scruples at any time in their political careers.


----------



## susanmos2000

Artbarn said:


> And just how do you know that she turned over all the relevant emails?


I/we don't know for sure--no choice but to take her word for it.


----------



## Pexuk

I was still living in England when Maggie Thatcher came to power, she started off well, but when unpopular taxes were introduced she soon had to "turn". Like the poll tax, people showed their disapproval and that was abolished double quick.it was the male politicians who brought her down, she had to be more like them and that didn't work. It was a sad day when she left office.


----------



## Artbarn

susanmos2000 said:


> Frankly CB, after those 47 Republicans wrote that treasonous letter to Iran I lost confidence in their understanding of "fair play" and "the spirit of law". They play down and dirty, and the only way to beat them is to match them move for move.


I agree that the letter should not have been sent directly to Iran. It should have been an open letter to the American people--because we needed to know what's been happening.

Fair play? The security of this country is not a game.


----------



## tamarque

NanaFran said:


> Elizabeth Warren??? Are you serious???


What is your criticism of EW? Not being snotty --just want to know your what your opinion is based on.


----------



## chinalake66

Too much scandal associated with Hillary - from her days in Arkansas to her more recent escapades with destroying emails after they had been requested by Congress. She clearly shows a lack of respect for Congress and, by extension, the American people. Elizabeth Warren (sometimes referred to around here as "chief spreading bull," does not have the experience to do the job. Rushing a woman into office just to have a woman in office is just as wrong as putting in a black for the color of his skin, or a Hispanic for his cultural background. Let's find someone - male or female, any ethnicity - who has good solid ideas for restoring this country to greatness and protecting its citizens, and who has the knowledge and skills to back it up....Not another windbag, please!


----------



## tamarque

pierrette said:


> Yes and yes again!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!


And being 'strong' is not being good for the public or the concepts of democracy. Thatcher was a nasty fascist, working with the 1% to destroy social programs that have been the backbone of the lives of the people. She supported militarism, fascistic control, and worked to destroy the national economy. Such strength is dangerous and needs to be avoided.


----------



## susanmos2000

Artbarn said:


> I agree that the letter should not have been sent directly to Iran. It should have been an open letter to the American people--because we needed to know what's been happening.
> 
> Fair play? The security of this country is not a game.


Tell that to the Republicans. Their determination to destroy "that man" in the White House is wrecking this country. They so hate him they'll happily align themselves with dyed-in-the-wool "baddies" like Putin to achieve their goal. The Republican traitors should be loaded on a plane, flown to their Forever Home, and dumped in the middle of Red Square.


----------



## stitchntime

Artbarn said:


> I so agree with you. Why do we need a woman in the White House? It seems to me that we really need is PERSON in the White House who can fix our economy and who excels at foreign policy.
> 
> Hillary Clinton has no accomplishments to speak of. I've heard multiple interviews with people who support her. Whenever they're asked about her accomplishments, they have no answer. She certainly has no successes as Secretary of State. Our foreign policy is a mess.
> 
> She has done everything possible to prevent us from learning the truth about Benghazi and she says it's not important: "What difference does it make?" She deliberately kept all of the email, when she was Secretary of State, on a private server, even though she knew that was not allowed. Now she says she has deleted all the emails from that server--emails that belong to the US government and were supposed to be saved for historical purposes. As far as I'm concerned, when she did these things she disqualified herself from running for President.
> 
> And don't get me started on that hypocrite, Elizabeth Warren.
> 
> This country needs the right PERSON to be our next President, no matter if it's a woman or a man.
> 
> I want history to record that our first woman President was a huge success.


Well said--Hillary has no positive accomplishments to show for a long career in politics. We need a strong President who wants to reduce government and support freedom.


----------



## tamarque

SharonM said:


> Those are the same people who voted for Obama just because he's black. And you see where that's gotten us! They both terrify me!!!


This is an uninformed opinion. Obama is only as powerful as the people behind and next to him. I dont like a lot of what he has supported, however, the GOP would have been even worse. They make no bones about their hatred for the American people. Their racism and sexism are not even veiled due to their incredible arrogance. But no president has the power alone to make changes. The office is a figure head position unless that person is part of the 1% oligarchy.

So we have a major dilemma with a 2 party system that prevents real alternatives getting elected. We get someone from the 1% and there are no mysteries about what they support which is clearly not the people, or we get someone who will promote some social programs and social justice (minimally) but will not confront the 1% on their hegemonic goals of controlling the world.

Thus, Obama is not a monolithic individual as no one is in his role. And not to recognize this is clearly uninformed.


----------



## tamarque

scottishlass said:


> :thumbup: :thumbup:


so who is your choice?


----------



## sandyridge

tamarque said:


> This is an uninformed opinion. Obama is only as powerful as the people behind and next to him. I dont like a lot of what he has supported, however, the GOP would have been even worse. They make no bones about their hatred for the American people. Their racism and sexism are not even veiled due to their incredible arrogance. But no president has the power alone to make changes. The office is a figure head position unless that person is part of the 1% oligarchy.
> 
> So we have a major dilemma with a 2 party system that prevents real alternatives getting elected. We get someone from the 1% and there are no mysteries about what they support which is clearly not the people, or we get someone who will promote some social programs and social justice (minimally) but will not confront the 1% on their hegemonic goals of controlling the world.
> 
> Thus, Obama is not a monolithic individual as no one is in his role. And not to recognize this is clearly uninformed.


Obama has fueled racism more than any president I recall. So many comments that have demeaned the police and supported black perpetrators and protesters are not appropriate from the head of the nation ie: Trevor Martin could have been my son


----------



## tamarque

whitetail said:


> Besides her poor political career, the idea of someone voting for her because she's a woman is so sad, it's like those that voted for Obama because they wanted a black person in the white house. She will just continue Obama's mess. Truly hope there are people out there that are more concerned about political issues and our country's security than woman's issues.


People voted for Obama because they saw the illegitimacy of the Bush/Cheney cabal. Many Repubs did this and it wasn't because he was Black. You might look at all those who didn't vote for him, or even vote because he was Black. Racsism is flamingly alive in this country.


----------



## tamarque

scottishlass said:


> My only question If she is the right person now Why did she lose your vote last time.???
> It's not enough to vote for someone "just because she is a woman" you need to pick the correct person to run our country regardless of gender.


Your poster comments are exactly the problem. Why don't people know what they want in a leader? Why are people so unclear about their own belief systems and ideology. I find these poster comments frightening because they reflect so much sad truth.


----------



## Silverfox70

Women are vicious I have worked in management with women and men would work with men anytime women always have their claws out who need is connlisa rice misspelled


----------



## Donalda

I disagree with you. The reason a first term senator from Chicago (of all places) who had NO - absolutely NO experience in even running a shoe shine stand was elected by whites and blacks simply because "it was time for a black man to be president. The whole country and the world is now in chaos.


----------



## tamarque

SiberAngel said:


> If we vote based on personality, gender, race, etc., we are cheating ourselves out of a leader that can truly lead this country. Above all, we must understand that regardless of whom we elect, they are, first and foremost, politicians. Filter out the ones who are blowing smoke up your a$$ and promising things that are not within the scope of accomplishment without being a detriment to everyone else concerned; try not to vote based on one particular agenda, rather vote based on the greater good for this country. Remember the basic principles this country was founded upon. Is your proposed leader in sync with those principles? If not, then why expect tomatoes when you are planting lilies? To have a female president just because we've never had one, doesn't make good sense, unless she meets certain criteria and although I think Hilary Clinton has weathered many a storm, she is too much of a politician with her self interests and is generally not fit to run this country.


FYI, Hilary was raised in a very right wing GOP family. Her so-called liberalism is reduced to some very safe, simple feminist issues. Her foray into the health care issue, under B. Clinton, was a disaster because she had no balls to fight for Single Payer. She caved because her principles are formed by the upper crust identity with the oligarchy of the country.


----------



## tamarque

Artbarn said:


> I so agree with you. Why do we need a woman in the White House? It seems to me that we really need is PERSON in the White House who can fix our economy and who excels at foreign policy.
> 
> Hillary Clinton has no accomplishments to speak of. I've heard multiple interviews with people who support her. Whenever they're asked about her accomplishments, they have no answer. She certainly has no successes as Secretary of State. Our foreign policy is a mess.
> 
> She has done everything possible to prevent us from learning the truth about Benghazi and she says it's not important: "What difference does it make?" She deliberately kept all of the email, when she was Secretary of State, on a private server, even though she knew that was not allowed. Now she says she has deleted all the emails from that server--emails that belong to the US government and were supposed to be saved for historical purposes. As far as I'm concerned, when she did these things she disqualified herself from running for President.
> 
> And don't get me started on that hypocrite, Elizabeth Warren.
> 
> This country needs the right PERSON to be our next President, no matter if it's a woman or a man.
> 
> I want history to record that our first woman President was a huge success.


You can dislike Hilary all you want, but please be correct about your facts. First, ALL her emails were not on a private account. There were a relative few which proved to be mainly personal posts about private issues. Most of her emails were on public servers. So lets be clear here.

I also doubt our first woman president will be a success for the people. She will never be allowed to be, just like Obama has been struggling against the blatant racism of the GOP which committed itself to destroying any of his efforts. He has been unable to push many things forward. And the Dems, who often of no more than Repubs in disguise, have not been helpful.


----------



## slapshotma

I feel with the state that this world is in let alone the country.... We should have the best PERSON ... Now is not the time to elect someone just because we have never had a woman before. Things are so bad EVERYWHERE! We need some one who will look out for the American people and our freedoms!


----------



## Donalda

Sounds to me like your Kool-Aid has been spiked. How do you know (underline know) Clinton's emails were all private? Because MSNBC told you so?


----------



## Donalda

Sounds to me like your Kool-Aid has been spiked. How do you know (underline know) Clinton's emails were all private? Because MSNBC told you so?


----------



## Artbarn

SharonM said:


> Hillary? Once upon a time I thought she might be a good choice, but no more. Even though I realize the media blows things out of proportion, she get really bad press and her actions seem to confirm it. Now... Elizabeth Warren? There's a strong, honest and level headed woman. I'd vote for her in a heartbeat.


Honest? She claimed to be an American Indian in order to get a job teaching at Harvard Law School, but she has never been able to provide proof of that heritage.


----------



## kjdancin

I have never posted anything here before but feel the need to at least say something in regards to this subject. Just because she is a woman is not a reason to vote for her. Women who vote solely on the fact the Clinton is a woman and its time for a woman president is doing a disservice to women and to the country. We are in enough trouble with the people in power right now...this will make it worse if it continues. People need to vote on the issues and how the candidates have done in the past. Sorry but Hilary (just because she is a woman) is not right for the country.


----------



## Donalda

ToKJ: I wish KP had a "like" button.


----------



## scottishlass

tamarque said:


> Your poster comments are exactly the problem. Why don't people know what they want in a leader? Why are people so unclear about their own belief systems and ideology. I find these poster comments frightening because they reflect so much sad truth.


But you did not answer the question as to why she is the right choice NOW but not last time .


----------



## susanmos2000

Artbarn said:


> Honest? She claimed to be an American Indian in order to get a job teaching at Harvard Law School, but she has never been able to provide proof of that heritage.


Makes about as much sense as Jeb Bush claiming to be Hispanic back in 2009.


----------



## pierrette

jayne6666 said:


> this is great.
> you can tell who watches FOX (not the) news, by their quoting of catch line phrases that this network uses to achieve the "say it over and over and over until they believe it!" results.


please...do you really believe what you just said? :?: :?: :?:


----------



## tamarque

lkb850 said:


> I am sorry that you feel that way jayne6666. I can't say this has been a civil discussion, but the one thing that can be drawn from this thread is that we need to think about for whom we vote. Voting race or gender has been and would be a disaster. People who have absolutely NO idea about leadership is what has gotten us into the mess we are in as a country. That has nothing to do with Fox news. If the media would have done their job in the first place, we would have been able to make a much more informed decision. It will be the same this go-round. Perhaps we should all be informed about who is running the news, rather than worrying about talking points. Having a shiver up one's leg is hardly a reason to vote for anyone. And I don't believe that came from Fox news.


Ah, but the Mass Media has done its job terrifically well. Do you know that the mass media in the US is owned by only 6 individuals/corporations? How much independence do you think remains with this oligarchical control by members of the 1%. Fox News is about the worst in is propaganda role and polls have consistently showed that those who get their news from Fox are the most ignorant of the issues. However, CNN is not that much better. The most informed people are those who get their news from independent sources which means spending some time looking for people who not connected to these mega-media institutions.

Why do you think independent journalists are killed at such high numbers? Why do you think the US has been censoring news and attacking whistleblowers at increasing levels? The worst thing about Julian Assange was that his revelations embarrassed the country. Ed Snowden, too. His crime is that he exposed the level of govt invasiveness into the lives of private people and other governments. One of the latest spy scandals is Israel's spying on the US. The problem was not the spying but the use of it to embarrass Obama as part of that country's efforts for control American foreign policy. Getting real and meaningful information needs to be a solid goal of people and it requires some extra effort if people are to be informed in a meaningful way.


----------



## SQM

mojave said:


> Sorry, SQM. The "Kids" are gone until Monday morning. Do you want me to leave them a message?
> If you are wondering why they read the politically oriented threads, perhaps I can answer that thanks to many discussions with them. They can read what the media puts out and what is available at the politically oriented websites. The opinions expressed on KP reflect the spectrum from far right to far left, the views of people from many backgrounds, educational levels, different professions. The "Kids" are still figuring out who they are, what ethical values they should incorporate into their self-definition. KP is a window into the world beyond grad school. They spend so much time immersed in our narrow discipline, the KP window does in some ways serve as a touchstone to a larger reality.


Watching older women sling it out is going to expand their worldview? Maybe KP should institute pay-for-view.


----------



## cc1945

Great point, tamaraque.


----------



## diane43

What we need is strong republican candidate .I still don't
Trust the Clinton's.


----------



## susanmos2000

Donalda said:


> Sounds to me like your Kool-Aid has been spiked. How do you know (underline know) Clinton's emails were all private? Because MSNBC told you so?


No, because Hillary (and her attorney) said that they were. I'll take her word any day over that of the Republican traitors in Congress.


----------



## Madelyn

Too bad for us!


----------



## tamarque

Donalda said:


> I agree 100% with you Irish Knitter. She scares me to death. Firstly, what has she actually accomplished, other than wiping her "private" server clean? Secondly, electing her President simply because she's a woman, is extremely dangerous. This county elected our first "black" president because of race and look at where this country is now. So, like you, I will probably get hate responses, but so be it. My thumb is down on Hilary Clinton. :thumbdown: :thumbdown: :thumbdown:


Obama was not elected because he is Black. He was elected, twice, because the GOP was infinitely worse. Look at their practices and positions. To take a stand that their goal for the duration of Obama's presidency was to destroy it is very scary to me. This is what you think is better leadership?

When deciding on who to vote for, it is not just the individual but what support is behind them on one hand. OTH, it is what the opposition is about. So, many would vote for Hilary because the GOP is much worse. Do you want leadership that supports a theocracy? Do you want leadership that wants to push labor laws into the trash bin of history completely? How many of you benefitted from the 8 hour work day? Paid vacations? Social Security? Medicare? Medicaid? Public school education? etc. Personally I know on which side of the divide I sit. And that is what I vote for--a particular side of the divide on various issues, not just an individual.


----------



## kjdancin

:thumbdown: :thumbdown: :thumbdown: Continue with Obamacare, common core, deal with Iran, Christian persecution in the Middle East, and on and on and on


----------



## tamarque

scottishlass said:


> But you did not answer the question as to why she is the right choice NOW but not last time .


My comments have answered that question. I dont like Hilary. Never did. However, I would vote for her in the face of the GOP/Tea Party theocratic, war mongering, anti-women, anti-public education, etc candidates. I find her a scary person and have always said this. But I find the other side even more scary


----------



## silkandwool

Toby's Mom wrote:
Excessive Baggage. Wish we had someone with a clean slate.

I TOTTALY agree. I don't think she would make a good president. There are other women just as qualified and would be a better choice.


Just because she is a woman is not a reason to vote for her. Women who vote solely on the fact the Clinton is a woman and its time for a woman president is doing a disservice to women and to the country.


----------



## subtlewitch

Bernie Sanders said that he will run if he gets the required financing. I think that Bill Maher will give Bernie the million dollars that he offered Warren.


----------



## Cheryl Jaeger

crispie said:


> Agreed


What has she done for the good of the country may I ask?
She doesn't even bake cookies.

;-)


----------



## Donalda

tamarque: We will just have to agree to disagree.


----------



## Cheryl Jaeger

Toby's Mom said:


> Excessive Baggage. Wish we had someone with a clean slate.


Agree !!!


----------



## SQM

tamarque said:


> Ah, but the Mass Media has done its job terrifically well. Do you know that the mass media in the US is owned by only 6 individuals/corporations? How much independence do you think remains with this oligarchical control by members of the 1%. Fox News is about the worst in is propaganda role and polls have consistently showed that those who get their news from Fox are the most ignorant of the issues. However, CNN is not that much better. The most informed people are those who get their news from independent sources which means spending some time looking for people who not connected to these mega-media institutions.
> 
> Why do you think independent journalists are killed at such high numbers? Why do you think the US has been censoring news and attacking whistleblowers at increasing levels? The worst thing about Julian Assange was that his revelations embarrassed the country. Ed Snowden, too. His crime is that he exposed the level of govt invasiveness into the lives of private people and other governments. One of the latest spy scandals is Israel's spying on the US. The problem was not the spying but the use of it to embarrass Obama as part of that country's efforts for control American foreign policy. Getting real and meaningful information needs to be a solid goal of people and it requires some extra effort if people are to be informed in a meaningful way.


Oh Tamarque again on Israel. All countries spy on each other constantly. Stick to your mitred squares.


----------



## Aubreys gramma

I think it is time to pick the best leader for the office. It doesn't matter the race or the gender, if we decide that it is time for a woman then we are blinded to any other candidate. If the best person happens to be female, so be it but gender is not a qualification. 

And speaking of qualifications, what has Hillary done? What are her accomplishments after years in the public eye. Nothing! She stayed with Bill. Not hardly a reason to vote for her for President.


----------



## Indian2

Why would we want someone who can't handle 2 cell phones to run our country?


----------



## Donalda

Indian2: What a PERFECT reply. :thumbup: :thumbup: :thumbup:


----------



## sahoo

Wish we never had Thatcher


----------



## dianejohnson

Not voting is the ultimate in stupidity. 

The candidates all have flaws. Be thankful there are still some who will run for office.

Please vote. Vote for the person who you believe will promote and preserve the basic rights of all of us the best. Try harder to make an educated choice. The people we elect are put there to represent the entire country, not their personal interests or those of their rich pals. Vote for those who most likely will damage the country and our children's futures the least. Try to use your common sense. Not voting only shows disrespect for Our Country and all that has been sacrificed to keep it free.

Off-topic note: Stevie Ray Vaughan will be inducted into the Rock and Roll Hall of Fame on April 18, 2015. It's about time.


----------



## Artbarn

jayne6666 said:


> this is great.
> you can tell who watches FOX (not the) news, by their quoting of catch line phrases that this network uses to achieve the "say it over and over and over until they believe it!" results.


I watch Fox News. I also watch my local (left-leaning) news, used to watch Brian Williams (and we all know now that he reported his version of the news). I also read my local newspaper (very-far left), the New York Daily News (left-leaning) and the New York Post (right-leaning.) After I put together everything I've learned I make my own decisions on what to believe.

Of all these sources of news, the only one that consistently seeks out both liberals and conservatives to debate the important issues, is Fox News. Yes, there are some opinion shows, like Hannity, that are far-right, but even Hannity has debates with liberals. Shepard Smith leans left. I can't figure out what Chris Wallace's or Howard Kurtz' politics are because they don't inject their political opinions at all.

I believe that most people who criticize Fox News either have never watched it or only saw small portions and have judged the entire network on that.


----------



## mojave

lovethelake said:


> Are they dogs that need to be trained? I thought graduate students were there to learn and think on their own, not to be trained to drool when they hear the bell.


Your comments are meant to be insulting. They actually demonstrate your unfamiliarity with life in a university lab where there are graduate students.

Yes, trained in how to use scientific equipment. The monkey see, monkey push nearest button approach is disastrous when executed in a lab filled with high tech equipment. It requires most people at least six months to become full competent with all the equipment.

Yes, trained in how to design a rigorous experiment, how to collect data and samples, how to analyze the data using statistical software.

Yes, trained in how speak, stand, and present their research at a science conference. Trained in how to compose a high quality slide presentation. Too much information on one slide or cluttered graphs kill a presentation.

Yes, trained in how to write a journal article likely to be accepted for publication. Training in how to handle the criticism inherent in the peer review process.


----------



## Artbarn

susanmos2000 said:


> I/we don't know for sure--no choice but to take her word for it.


Exactly. You are taking the word of a liar.

Why do you think she kept all of her email on her own private server? She says she didn't want to deal with two devices. Oops, there are videos that prove she had more than one device. She said she needed it to email with Bill. Oops. Bill says he doesn't do email.


----------



## Pexuk

when the Labour Government in England is in power they give everything away and bankrupt the country.Maggie Thatcher being a Tory tried to build up businesses, she herself came from working class and tried to "unnanny" the country, help was there for people who needed it, but she encouraged house building and ownership. If you left it to Labour there would still be nothing but council houses and reliance on the State. The Falkland population wanted to stay under British rule so they had to be protected she reluctantly went to war but it was short and sharp. Maggie Thatcher was a great lady, another Boudicca !!
I am proud to be British.


----------



## WindingRoad

tamarque said:


> Obama was not elected because he is Black. He was elected, twice, because the GOP was infinitely worse. Look at their practices and positions. To take a stand that their goal for the duration of Obama's presidency was to destroy it is very scary to me. This is what you think is better leadership?
> 
> When deciding on who to vote for, it is not just the individual but what support is behind them on one hand. OTH, it is what the opposition is about. So, many would vote for Hilary because the GOP is much worse. Do you want leadership that supports a theocracy? Do you want leadership that wants to push labor laws into the trash bin of history completely? How many of you benefitted from the 8 hour work day? Paid vacations? Social Security? Medicare? Medicaid? Public school education? etc. Personally I know on which side of the divide I sit. And that is what I vote for--a particular side of the divide on various issues, not just an individual.


Can you explain the recent uptick in Republican support? I didn't think so.


----------



## Artbarn

susanmos2000 said:


> Tell that to the Republicans. Their determination to destroy "that man" in the White House is wrecking this country. They so hate him they'll happily align themselves with dyed-in-the-wool "baddies" like Putin to achieve their goal. The Republican traitors should be loaded on a plane, flown to their Forever Home, and dumped in the middle of Red Square.


Nonsense. They are trying to stop "that man" from overriding the Constitution. He is the one who is wrecking this country.

They simply exposed what a bad thing it would be if we make a deal with Iran. In fact, recent events are proving that they are right.


----------



## WindingRoad

Pexuk said:


> when the Labour Government in England is in power they give everything away and bankrupt the country.Maggie Thatcher being a Tory tried to build up businesses, she herself came from working class and tried to "unnanny" the country, help was there for people who needed it, but she encouraged house building and ownership. If you left it to Labour there would still be nothing but council houses and reliance on the State. The Falkland population wanted to stay under British rule so they had to be protected she reluctantly went to war but it was short and sharp. Maggie Thatcher was a great lady, another Boudicca !!
> I am proud to be British.


Unfortunately the liberal give give give with no return policies take a long time to show that they don't ultimately work in the long run. At first they seem to be the answer to woes but they are not. Money does not grow on trees. Yes a government can print all they want up to a point and then they will fall off the cliff. Because it doesn't happen quickly people believe it will never happen. It does. And your and other European countries are starting to see that. Wish America could see the forest for the trees. Of course, everyone wants others to be secure and cared for but you've got to be able to afford it and at some point we can't.


----------



## Irish knitter

fisherwoman said:


> Go Hillary!
> 
> You and Bubba are a breath of fresh air


You are kidding aren't you????!!!


----------



## momeee

galaxycraft said:


> No Way Jose! :thumbdown: She has not proven to be a leader. :thumbdown:
> From the first lady to the present.


I agree, galaxycraft. Too many sandals. As much as I'd like a competent, honest woman as prez, I could not vote for Killary based on her past performance.

We need to have full knowledge about any candidate's past, including associations, decisions, beliefs, loyalties etc., and who is fronting the money...the puppet master? It is 19 months before the election...we have ample time to fully vet all candidates and elect the one who will work for the betterment and security of the USA and its citizens.


----------



## momeee

Artbarn said:


> Nonsense. They are trying to stop "that man" from overriding the Constitution. He is the one who is wrecking this country.
> 
> They simply exposed what a bad thing it would be if we make a deal with Iran. In fact, recent events are proving that they are right.


 :thumbup: :thumbup: :thumbup: :thumbup: :thumbup:


----------



## WindingRoad

momeee said:


> I agree, galaxycraft. Too many sandals. As much as I'd like a competent, honest woman as prez, I could not vote for Killary based on her past performance.
> 
> We need to have full knowledge about any candidate's past, including associations, decisions, beliefs, loyalties etc., and who is fronting the money...the puppet master? It is 19 months before the election...we have ample time to fully vet all candidates and elect the one who will work for the betterment and security of the USA and its citizens.


When you find that person could you let us know who it is? Not IF.... WHEN.....


----------



## Hazel Blumberg - McKee

Toby's Mom said:


> Excessive Baggage. Wish we had someone with a clean slate.


I try not to read political (or religious) postings, but I was really curious about what people had to say about Hillary Clinton. And I have to agree totally with Toby's Mom. I wish we had someone else on the Democratic side who's running for President.

Hazel


----------



## baerski

Irish knitter said:


> I do not want to start a fight but I have lost all respect for Hillary after she said "who cares" after the death of our ambassador. I just finished 13 hours in Benghazi and they stated if she had moved right in the beginning none of them would have died and it WAS a terrorist attack and the whitehouse knew about it but kept their mouths shut.
> 
> Also...I have read what the whitehouse secret service said about her being "flying off the handle" at a moments notice; being B-tchy; in control and a all around pain in the a--.
> 
> All of this infornmation comes from reliable sources. They guy who wrote 13 hours in Benghazi was a survivor and just stated the facts. The secret service remarks I ran accross when I was looking up Caroline/John Kennedy's detail. They "tell all". Like the Bush twins were the worst to protect as they would run red lights to get rid of their agents and call "Daddy" when their agents caught up with them. The easiest to protect was Amy Carter.....her worst thing was roller skating in the whitehouse...
> 
> As I said before.....I am not trying to start an argument. Maybe we should be careful....
> 
> I will have to look to see where I got my whitehouse information.
> 
> Just think about the last Clinton whitehouse.....Bill was a front while Hillary ran it. We will be no better off than we are now.
> I am terrified if she wins....
> I do not like to get into politics but we are all doomed if she wins.......I want a woman in the whitehouse.....BUT the right woman and it is NOT hillary!!!


I whole totally agree and there are many more issues that need to be looked at before the Democrats of our country nominate her as a their candidate.


----------



## Artbarn

tamarque said:


> This is an uninformed opinion. Obama is only as powerful as the people behind and next to him. I dont like a lot of what he has supported, however, the GOP would have been even worse. They make no bones about their hatred for the American people. Their racism and sexism are not even veiled due to their incredible arrogance. But no president has the power alone to make changes. The office is a figure head position unless that person is part of the 1% oligarchy.
> 
> So we have a major dilemma with a 2 party system that prevents real alternatives getting elected. We get someone from the 1% and there are no mysteries about what they support which is clearly not the people, or we get someone who will promote some social programs and social justice (minimally) but will not confront the 1% on their hegemonic goals of controlling the world.
> 
> Thus, Obama is not a monolithic individual as no one is in his role. And not to recognize this is clearly uninformed.


No President SHOULD have the power alone to make changes. That's why we have our Constitution and the system of checks and balances: the Executive Branch (President), the Legislative Branch (Congress), and the Judicial Branch (Supreme Court.). Obama has made a joke of our Constitution with his Executive Actions. He IS making changes all by himself.

Honestly, I consider myself an Independent rather than a Republican, but I definitely stopped being a Democrat over 30 years ago. I think you should re-read what you have said about Republicans hating the American public, being racist and sexist. Wow.

And as far as the 1% oligarchy--do some research on how Harry Reid became a millionaire after he was elected. He is the rule, not the exception for career politicians.


----------



## dianejohnson

tamarque said:


> And that is what I vote for--a particular side of the divide on various issues, not just an individual.


i like how you express yourself, tamarque. thank you for your comments.

Off-topic note: Stevie Ray Vaughan will be inducted into the Rock and Roll Hall of Fame on April 18, 2015. It's about time.


----------



## SQM

http://theweek.com/speedreads/549286/snl-mocks-hillary-campaign-announcement-buckle-america-cause-clintons-are-back


----------



## mcguire

Toby's Mom said:


> Excessive Baggage. Wish we had someone with a clean slate.


I voted for her hubby the first time, not the second and no dem.
since. She has lied too many times. Maybe they all do, but when she said "what difference does it make" when those men died I lost all the good she had. She needs to say again, how they were broke when they left the WH. They get so much money when they give a speech. We had enough of the Clintons.


----------



## Senjia

sandyridge said:


> I am horrified to think that Hillary Clinton might be our next president. She has been proven over and over to be a liar dating back to her Arkansas days. She has been involved in so many shady dealings such as Whitewater,the mysterious disappearances of people she had issue with,the Benghazi fiasco, carpetbagging to New York to gain a senate seat and her most recent email scandal. She joked at press conferance about that a few days ago---changing my hair style and changing email servers. I don't think that was a joking matter and why delete the entire account if there was not something to hide? How can anyone excuse her tirade before the senate committee where with clenched fists she screamed "what does it matter?" I should think it mattered greatly to the families of the victims. Would she say that if something so devastating and avoidable happened to her daughter? I think Hillary revealed her entire attitude with that that callous remark in a fit of anger and frustration. I do not even believe that Hillary's endeavor to be president is base don her patriotism or desire to serve her country. I believe she just wants to go down in history as the first woman president to continue to feed her ego. It has only been a few months since she declared she had no desire to run for office and it was time now to relax and be a grandma. She is so unstable with her antics I would shudder to think she was in charge of our nation.


I'm with you--she is scary and there really isn't anyone out there who is qualified. I'm not a fan of Warren and will leave it at that.


----------



## krestiekrew

Irish knitter said:


> I do not want to start a fight but I have lost all respect for Hillary after she said "who cares" after the death of our ambassador. I just finished 13 hours in Benghazi and they stated if she had moved right in the beginning none of them would have died and it WAS a terrorist attack and the whitehouse knew about it but kept their mouths shut.


 :thumbup: :thumbup: :thumbup: that "who cares" also did it for me.


----------



## Janci

All of this feed-back does my heart good! I will go on record to say that the idea of Hillary running our country sickens me...but I AM happy to see that so many of our friends here on KP are showing some interest and concern on this subject! I have yet to read all of the comments...25 pages so far and counting! But, you can bet I fully intend to keep up with this. So many people seem to stick to the "politics and religion are two subjects that should not be discussed" idea and of all the things that matter to us human beings, these are the two that really do need to be hashed out and examined before we can make intelligent and meaningful choices! Thanks, ALL of you for making my day! :thumbup: :thumbup: :thumbup: :thumbup: :thumbup: :thumbup: :thumbup: :thumbup: :thumbup: :thumbup:


----------



## Yarn bulldog

What I want to know . What really happened to Vince Foster? I don't trust her at all. If she is elected President we will go to hell in a hand basket. She has blood on her hands and will not take responsibilities for her actions. If we want a transparent government she is not the person for the job.

Ted Cruz will put women back in the Dark Ages re women's health issues. Sorry if this offends people. But I speak my mind. I don't know who I'll vote for. The lesser of the two evils?


----------



## Bea 465

She's been dishonest since Whitewater. I don't trust that lying, conniving woman and wouldn't vote for her. I find it astonishing that people will vote for her just because she's a Democrat and a woman. Like they voted for Obama because he was part black. There were several books written by secret service agents that weren't at all flattering which indicates to me that they wrote the true.


----------



## knitpresentgifts

Artbarn said:


> Honest? She claimed to be an American Indian in order to get a job teaching at Harvard Law School, but she has never been able to provide proof of that heritage.


Elizabeth Warren did more than lie about her heritage.

Read about how she illegally used her atty daughter and the Mass taxpayers' $ in an attempt to get residents registered for welfare and as a Democrat (Warren's political party).

Here's just one article, I'm certain there would be many on a search:

http://legalinsurrection.com/2012/08/elizabeth-warren-daughter-secretly-behind-effort-by-mass-to-register-500k-welfare-recipients/


----------



## carriemae

Never voted for a dumorat in my life I'm 67 and won't start now. Won't vote for jeb bush either I'll vote for the liberatian


----------



## Donalda

I'm with you all the way Artbarn :thumbup: :thumbup:


----------



## knitpresentgifts

Artbarn said:


> Exactly. You are taking the word of a liar.
> 
> Why do you think she kept all of her email on her own private server? She says she didn't want to deal with two devices. Oops, there are videos that prove she had more than one device. She said she needed it to email with Bill. Oops. Bill says he doesn't do email.


Rumor has it Hillary can barely type; hence why she filters all her e-mails to and through Huma who does the writing for Hill. Also why Huma's communications run through ONLY Hill's personal server. Since when do staff members (Hill's) get to also break several federal laws? Oops. It's the Clintons, what was I thinking?


----------



## RosieC

susanmos2000 said:


> I/we don't know for sure--no choice but to take her word for it.


Take her word for it ? Remember "it depends on what your definition of "is" is" ? Take her word for it ? Seriously. We are talking about politicians. Let's be real.


----------



## Janci

chinalake66 said:


> Too much scandal associated with Hillary - from her days in Arkansas to her more recent escapades with destroying emails after they had been requested by Congress. She clearly shows a lack of respect for Congress and, by extension, the American people. Elizabeth Warren (sometimes referred to around here as "chief spreading bull," does not have the experience to do the job. Rushing a woman into office just to have a woman in office is just as wrong as putting in a black for the color of his skin, or a Hispanic for his cultural background. Let's find someone - male or female, any ethnicity - who has good solid ideas for restoring this country to greatness and protecting its citizens, and who has the knowledge and skills to back it up....Not another windbag, please!


 :thumbup: :thumbup: :thumbup:


----------



## knitpresentgifts

mojave said:


> Your comments are meant to be insulting. They actually demonstrate your unfamiliarity with life in a university lab where there are graduate students.
> 
> Yes, trained in how to use scientific equipment. The monkey see, monkey push nearest button approach is disastrous when executed in a lab filled with high tech equipment. It requires most people at least six months to become full competent with all the equipment.
> 
> Yes, trained in how to design a rigorous experiment, how to collect data and samples, how to analyze the data using statistical software.
> 
> Yes, trained in how speak, stand, and present their research at a science conference. Trained in how to compose a high quality slide presentation. Too much information on one slide or cluttered graphs kill a presentation.
> 
> Yes, trained in how to write a journal article likely to be accepted for publication. Training in how to handle the criticism inherent in the peer review process.


I have a few questions. Why did you tell us you're a professor and couldn't mention the specific university where you teach for the safety of your students but yet, you allow your students to open source and post using your KP user ID. Also, why did your students call you their advisor rather than professor?

Just curious ...


----------



## yorkie1

Irish knitter said:


> I do not want to start a fight but I have lost all respect for Hillary after she said "who cares" after the death of our ambassador. I just finished 13 hours in Benghazi and they stated if she had moved right in the beginning none of them would have died and it WAS a terrorist attack and the whitehouse knew about it but kept their mouths shut.
> 
> Also...I have read what the whitehouse secret service said about her being "flying off the handle" at a moments notice; being B-tchy; in control and a all around pain in the a--.
> 
> All of this infornmation comes from reliable sources. They guy who wrote 13 hours in Benghazi was a survivor and just stated the facts. The secret service remarks I ran accross when I was looking up Caroline/John Kennedy's detail. They "tell all". Like the Bush twins were the worst to protect as they would run red lights to get rid of their agents and call "Daddy" when their agents caught up with them. The easiest to protect was Amy Carter.....her worst thing was roller skating in the whitehouse...
> 
> As I said before.....I am not trying to start an argument. Maybe we should be careful....
> 
> I will have to look to see where I got my whitehouse information.
> 
> Just think about the last Clinton whitehouse.....Bill was a front while Hillary ran it. We will be no better off than we are now.
> I am terrified if she wins....
> I do not like to get into politics but we are all doomed if she wins.......I want a woman in the whitehouse.....BUT the right woman and it is NOT hillary!!!


 :thumbup: :thumbup: :thumbup: :thumbup: 
Exactly!!! I have no respect for that woman. She is a liar among numerous other things. 
I liked her at first when Bill was president, but as soon as the scandal started about him and how Hillary has done since, heaven forbid if she gets president. You think we have problems now, just you wait!!!
Yes I would like to see a woman president, but NOT her.


----------



## DGreen

tatesgirl said:


> Right after her "fall" and hospitalization, I thought she had a double. My sister disagreed, saying she had been admitted to have a secret "make-over" of liposuction of her big belly and hips plus a face-lift, BOTH of which have returned and THAT's why she wears longer and longer tunic/jackets/coats - to disguise her health problems.
> 
> You can't rid yourself of a swollen belly that accompanies a heart condition. Frankly, I don't think hers comes only from living on a rich diet. I now think she likely has a heart condition and is unhealthy.
> 
> That's not the least of it! Do you really want an old woman who frequently resorts to winding her hair up into A PONYTAIL in the world's highest position? Let's get serious!


You evidently have bought into the idea that a woman's worth is directly related to her appearance and nothing else. Regardless of anyone's opinion of Hillary Clinton, her appearance must never, ever be the criteria for evaluating her qualifications.

If those comments represent the depth of your political savvy, please do the country a favor and refrain from voting in any election.


----------



## normagirl

God Bless you for the sensible soul you are,to vote simply on the basis of gender is sheer madness.i can wait for the right woman for President no matter how long it takes.it won't ever be Hillary based on past performance,ethics, honesty,temperament,accomplishments(lack of).i could go on and on but whats the point if you are even considering Hillary knowing where her morals stand it would be pointless. and don't forget you Dems started this


----------



## Dorsey

Not the right woman for the job!!!!!!!


----------



## carrottop71

GroodleMom said:


> Elizabeth Warren is a better choice: Strong, brilliant and without all the baggage.


As much as I like Hillary Clinton, I have to agree.


----------



## knitpresentgifts

Artbarn said:


> No President SHOULD have the power alone to make changes. That's why we have our Constitution and the system of checks and balances: the Executive Branch (President), the Legislative Branch (Congress), and the Judicial Branch (Supreme Court.). Obama has made a joke of our Constitution with his Executive Actions. He IS making changes all by himself.
> 
> Honestly, I consider myself an Independent rather than a Republican, but I definitely stopped being a Democrat over 30 years ago. I think you should re-read what you have said about Republicans hating the American public, being racist and sexist. Wow.
> 
> And as far as the 1% oligarchy--do some research on how Harry Reid became a millionaire after he was elected. He is the rule, not the exception for career politicians.


Spot on! :thumbup:


----------



## DGreen

LadyBug 2014 said:


> There is an old saying "stay away from politics and religion" I agree with it.


Then stay away.


----------



## knitpresentgifts

Indian2 said:


> Why would we want someone who can't handle 2 cell phones to run our country?


Ha! You reduced all the talk to one sentence that says it all.

(didn't even have to mention the lie involved) :-D

Reminds me of Hill's political ad the first time around about who would answer the ringing phone at 3:00 AM.


----------



## jansews

Definitely agree with Irish Knitter. She treats people very badly and shows no respect to the Secret Service among many others. Wouldn't want her in the White House.


----------



## not enough yarn

My husbands uncle likes her for president I do not. He said we need a women in the White House and my response was ya someone needs to clean the bathrooms. I feel like she was wanting this when Bill was president as any woman with morels would have divorced him. I feel she had the motives to be doing just what she is. If she would have divorced him she most likely not be in the political jobs she has.


----------



## GR. Gram

Subject: Fwd: : For the most part people do not change.

For the most part people do not change. In case you did not know or remember here is a character insight from history:
We all remember the Watergate incident, don't we?
Somebody lied and got their goose cooked.
That's what happens to liers, lol.if they get caught.

In Case Y'all Forgot!!!!
http://2.bp.blogspot.com/-J01Rxjrmros/U6HjXiWIzBI/AAAAAAAAA0c/w27kxuF-qYg/s1600/HillaryFired.jpg 
Should you pass this on? My recommendation is that you do it now..
or you can wait until she is the PRESIDENT!!

>>>>>>>>>>>>>> Check this out on SNOOPS! 
The smartest woman on earth is a lier ?

"What diffrence does it make?"
Who cares?
Are Americans really as dumb as the author of ''Obama care'' said WE ARE?


----------



## normagirl

nice one


----------



## Irish knitter

kemu said:


> We 'don't need another Clinton nor another Bush, more of the same.
> This country is becoming a 'third' world nation due to those in power now.
> This includes Elizabeth Warren. Many don't know much about her except that she talks the talk.
> We need 'new' blood. Someone who stands up for the people, produces jobs, and
> gets people off the dole so we can be a strong nation again.


Does anyone know if Elizabeth Dole is still alive????


----------



## normagirl

nice one


----------



## SAMkewel

GroodleMom said:


> Elizabeth Warren is a better choice: Strong, brilliant and without all the baggage.


I truly don't believe Elizabeth Warren wants to run, though I wish she did.


----------



## ics

galaxycraft said:


> No Way Jose! :thumbdown: She has not proven to be a leader. :thumbdown:
> From the first lady to the present.


I agree completely. :thumbdown: :thumbdown: :thumbdown:


----------



## ics

galaxycraft said:


> No Way Jose! :thumbdown: She has not proven to be a leader. :thumbdown:
> From the first lady to the present.


I agree completely. :thumbdown: :thumbdown: :thumbdown:


----------



## soloweygirl

CarolfromTX said:


> So to sum up Mrs. Clinton's achievements:
> 1. She's a woman and
> 2. She's a bi**h.
> 
> Great. What a resume! Anyone care to add to that exhaustive list of her good points? Anyone? **crickets**


She's happy to be a grandmother.


----------



## Wombatnomore

BrattyPatty said:


> If she turns over her server it will open up a whole new can of worms as far as privacy laws go. If they can take hers, who's to stop them from taking yours or mine?


Unfortunately, they're already doing that here in Australia (or should I say, when the 'metadata law' is passed)!


----------



## Bebekka

I wouldn't vote for Hillary if she were the last and only candidate running.

The Democrats and Republicans have ruined our once great country by putting corporations and the top 1% before We, the People. Our elections have become who can raise the most millions and get bribes (funding) from corporations, lobbyists and AIPAC to do their bidding.

She was on the Board of Directors of WalMart, which you know, I hope, that when someone applies for a WalMart job, they get an application for Food Stamps because although the Walton Family are one of the most wealthy in our country, they don't pay a living wage -- but we taxpayers are paying for their food stamps while the Waltons rack in the wealth by you buying cheap, outsourced products as our fellow citizens lose their jobs, their homes, and their security because they are unemployed.

Check this out and vote your values, not party lines when we are all getting screwed:
http://www.prisonplanet.com/this-is-how-hillary-does-business-an-oil-company-human-rights-abuses-in-colombia-and-the-clinton-foundation.html


----------



## GR. Gram

http://2.bp.blogspot.com/-J01Rxjrmros/U6HjXiWIzBI/AAAAAAAAA0c/w27kxuF-qYg/s1600/HillaryFired.jpg

Hay you Hillary lovers, here is some history for you. at 84, I jolly well remember this. If she was all this then, well, you know what they say about leopards ! ? % * ? ? ?>


----------



## onegrannygoose

GroodleMom said:


> Elizabeth Warren is a better choice: Strong, brilliant and without all the baggage.


The problem with Elizabeth Warren is that she can't win and she can't be Hillary's running mate because so many people ( men) will not vote for a 2 woman ticket.

I think Elizabeth Warren would be great in the job,.but I don't think she can at this time win.


----------



## GR. Gram

http://2.bp.blogspot.com/-J01Rxjrmros/U6HjXiWIzBI/AAAAAAAAA0c/w27kxuF-qYg/s1600/HillaryFired.jpg

Hay you Hillary lovers, here is some history for you. at 84, I jolly well remember this. If she was all this then, well, you know what they say about leopards ! ? % * ? ? ?>


----------



## momeee

justinevalla said:


> Sorry, will vote for Hillary! Strong woman. She has a lot of experience, and was the power behind Bill, if you read the books about her life. Will not vote Republican.


IMO she prostituted her dignity and morality by 'standing' behind her man...turning a blind eye over many years...she knew she was better off as the Wronged Mrs. Clinton, rather than the EX-Mrs. Clinton. 
She again showed a lack of self-respect by conceding to Obama, and becoming his powerless mouthpiece as Secretary of State...where Obama ultimately threw her under the bus. Her desire for power at any price is too concerning to want her as president.


----------



## mojave

knitpresentgifts said:


> I have a few questions. Why did you tell us you're a professor and couldn't mention the specific university where you teach for the safety of your students but yet, you allow your students to open source and post using your KP user ID. Also, why did your students call you their advisor rather than professor?
> 
> Just curious ...


The university has received threats from a variety of extremists and one of the security recommendations was to not reveal which university we work at when online in forums. There was a bomb threat because one of the galleries had art work by a Jewish artist, threats because some of the labs use animals in research (fruit flies), stupid, racist stuff. 
The grads won't be posting again in this account. 
They call me their advisor because they are in my lab. My job title is professor. They were admitted to the university graduate program because I agreed to guide/advise their development as scientists. I am also financially responsible for them. No grant money, no grad students. If one of them moved to a different lab, that professor would become his/her advisor.


----------



## knitpresentgifts

momeee said:


> IMO she prostituted her dignity and morality by 'standing' behind her man...turning a blind eye over many years...she knew she was better off as the Wronged Mrs. Clinton, rather than the EX-Mrs. Clinton.
> She again showed a lack of self-respect by conceding to Obama, and becoming his powerless mouthpiece as Secretary of State...where Obama ultimately threw her under the bus. Her desire for power at any price is too concerning to want her as president.


Hill claims she fights for women and their rights while at the same time accepting $ (translation; illegal bribes) from foreign countries like Saudi Arabia and China who honor few women's rights. Hillary is a felon and a fraud and I cannot think of many women who are a poorer choice for our next President.


----------



## Artbarn

tamarque said:


> People voted for Obama because they saw the illegitimacy of the Bush/Cheney cabal. Many Repubs did this and it wasn't because he was Black. You might look at all those who didn't vote for him, or even vote because he was Black. Racsism is flamingly alive in this country.


I didn't vote for him because I did my research. I saw exactly what his history was, what his experience was (or lack of it), how he avoided voting on so many important issues while in the Illinois legislature as well as the US Senate--he voted "present." I saw what kind of President he would be and he has proven me to be correct.

When he won the election, I said, "Well, the silver lining is that the 
American people have elected a black man as President." I thought that at least he would improve race relations. Instead, I see the opposite.


----------



## Montana Gramma

susanmos2000 said:


> That's just the point, Montana Gramma. Those who try to interpret another's body language will inevitably find what they expect to.


Not necessarily so, African - Americans were in a no win situation no matter who interpreted what, Mrs. Clinton has no fear of reprisal and raised closed hands and chin up with a loud voice tell me there is something there, major frustration at the least when calm was needed. People that read body language for a living, ie. border guards for one, are very good at it, seldom do they not find an underlying trait of lies or deceit no matter how small the circumstance. Cautionary thought discretion is the least that should be attributed to her behavior, IMO. Personally I think she should enjoy her Grandmotherhood, I wonder about her health. Falls on the head are sometimes accumulative and residual and who would she pick for a vice-pres. to follow? I often wonder if people ever vote with that thought in mind?


----------



## soloweygirl

lovethelake said:


> I find it offensive that women are going vote for her just because of her gender. Is she the right person? I also find it offensive that women can even support her. During the bimbo eruptions I had turned on the TV to see the weather forecast while my daughter was eating her cereal. Then all of a sudden the cigar story came on. My daughter asked about it, and I was aghast and she was too young for the real answer. But was I thought was even worse is that Hillary stayed to him. If she had forgiven him but left him I would have respected her. But she stayed with him for his political connections so she could get the jobs she wanted. So what lesson has she taught our daughters? That if you stay with an adulterous husband that is convicted of perjury because that is the only way to make it in politics, it is okay. What????? If she is that good, then should have been able to be successful without Bill and his money.
> 
> I have yet had an answer to my question. Can you name 5 accomplishments that Hillary has done on her own and how do they make her qualified to be president? I can't think of one, honestly.


People voted for Obama only because of the color of his skin. So why not have those same low info voters vote for Hillary just because she is a woman.

I'm glad you are not holding your breath waiting for an answer to Hillary's 5 accomplishments. You still won't have an answer by Nov. 2016.


----------



## skkp

MrsB said:


> Hillary Clinton to Announce 2016 Run for President on Sunday. The former secretary of state, senator and first lady is to announce that she will indeed seek the Democratic nomination for president.
> 
> I'm so pleased that she has decided to run again. We need strong women in the White House in a more crucial and central position. After a few seasons of Scandal viewing, I've come to the conclusion that there maybe just too much underhanded shenanigans going on in the good ole boys club. Hillary is no pushover and the best candidate that has come along in a long time. I'm assuming that Obama endorses her.


Well let's see - she kept a husband that screwed around on her all their lives together. He gets oral sex from an employee in the oval office (anyone in corporate America would have been fired) and she stays with him of course, now we are led to believe she clocked him with a book and brought blood (if a man did that we would be screaming ABUSER!!) and she is accepting money for the Clinton Foundation from Saudi Arabia and Brunei which give women little if no rights and don't even give them justice if they are raped. Not to mention the fact of her emails off the state department server (again any employee who did that in a corporation would have been fired).

Yep she is a great choice.


----------



## momeee

GroodleMom said:


> Elizabeth Warren! She is VERY popular, brilliant and no baggage.


She does have baggage - lots of it - dig a little deeper.


----------



## Wombatnomore

knitpresentgifts said:


> She doesn't know or understand much about American politics and civics.


At least I'm interested in what's going on outside of my own country.


----------



## theyarnlady

onegrannygoose said:


> The problem with Elizabeth Warren is that she can't win and she can't be Hillary's running mate because so many people ( men) will not vote for a 2 woman ticket.
> 
> I think Elizabeth Warren would be great in the job,.but I don't think she can at this time win.


I would ask you please to read all you can about her words and deeds. If you are one who desides to vote for someone because their name is mention that is. But if you are an informed voter then that is what you want go for it. I would want you to read the fact of what she has said and what she has really done.


----------



## skkp

GR. Gram said:


> http://2.bp.blogspot.com/-J01Rxjrmros/U6HjXiWIzBI/AAAAAAAAA0c/w27kxuF-qYg/s1600/HillaryFired.jpg
> 
> Hay you Hillary lovers, here is some history for you. at 84, I jolly well remember this. If she was all this then, well, you know what they say about leopards ! ? % * ? ? ?>


I read about this about two years ago. I followed the Watergate hearings non-stop (the summer I was 14). This is truly chilling -- the Clintons are really immoral and unethical -- and I am a registered Democrat.


----------



## ics

GR. Gram said:


> http://2.bp.blogspot.com/-J01Rxjrmros/U6HjXiWIzBI/AAAAAAAAA0c/w27kxuF-qYg/s1600/HillaryFired.jpg
> 
> Hay you Hillary lovers, here is some history for you. at 84, I jolly well remember this. If she was all this then, well, you know what they say about leopards ! ? % * ? ? ?>


Good point.


----------



## GR. Gram

You dear one are not in a gov. office, so who wants your E's. SHE is OUR employee, but she acts as if she is our BOSS. Check out the site IN my last E and OPEN your eyes AND LET THE SUN SHINE IN. ARE WE AS DUMB AS THE AUTHOR OF OBAMA CARE SAID WE WERE..YES, BUT ONLY SOME OF US, NOT ALL. The Democratic party is not the party of our FATHERS, IT HAs been kidnapped BY THE LOW LIFE PROGRESSIVES, AND THOSE WHO HAVE NOT KEPT UP WITH WHAT POLITICIANS ARE DOING ARE WAY, WAY OUT OF THE INFORMATION LOOP. GOTTA KEEP THOSE PRETTY EYES OPEN AND LOOKING AT ALL SIDES OF THE ISSUES, GET EDUCATED ON THE Politicians before you make your X's..if not INFORMEDSTAY OUT OF THE VOTING BOOTH !!!!


----------



## Montana Gramma

Pexuk said:


> when the Labour Government in England is in power they give everything away and bankrupt the country.Maggie Thatcher being a Tory tried to build up businesses, she herself came from working class and tried to "unnanny" the country, help was there for people who needed it, but she encouraged house building and ownership. If you left it to Labour there would still be nothing but council houses and reliance on the State. The Falkland population wanted to stay under British rule so they had to be protected she reluctantly went to war but it was short and sharp. Maggie Thatcher was a great lady, another Boudicca !!
> I am proud to be British.


And she lasted through the vilification, that working class Lady had class! Too many people vote for the person that gives the biggest handouts and scream like banshees when the well is dry.


----------



## Artbarn

tamarque said:


> You can dislike Hilary all you want, but please be correct about your facts. First, ALL her emails were not on a private account. There were a relative few which proved to be mainly personal posts about private issues. Most of her emails were on public servers. So lets be clear here.
> 
> I also doubt our first woman president will be a success for the people. She will never be allowed to be, just like Obama has been struggling against the blatant racism of the GOP which committed itself to destroying any of his efforts. He has been unable to push many things forward. And the Dems, who often of no more than Repubs in disguise, have not been helpful.


Again, you're believing what Hillary Clinton says now. If not, what are your sources? I'm basing my statements on what I heard her say: that she put all of her emails on her private server because she didn't want to use two devices. I saw the video. That's about as clear as it gets.

There will always be some racists, but to paint the majority of conservatives with that brush is ridiculous. I for one, resent it. Obama has brought on his own problems. He had a Democrat majority in Congress for two years and did nothing.

He squandered much of his Presidency on passing a healthcare law that is hurting more people than it helps. He should have been focused on fixing the economy. Instead he is proud of the job growth that has happened on his watch--job growth in minimum wage and part-time jobs. That is why there is so much commotion now about raising the minimum wage. This man needs to go back to school and learn Economics--and he needs to take his staff with him.


----------



## soloweygirl

susanmos2000 said:


> Of course--but there were tens of thousands of emails that stayed strictly within private channels. Hillary turned over those she deemed "relevant" and erased (no, not strong enough--_obliterated_) the rest, so there's no way to know if her definition of "relevant" matches that of the Senate Judiciary Committee's.


Therin lies the problem. Hillary turned over what SHE deemed as relevant. No one else had a chance to see the emails. That's Hillary's problem - She's arrogant and thinks she is above everyone. That she didn't need to follow protocol and let the proper departments take care of the emails. All she was was ONE cog in the wheel of government.


----------



## GR. Gram

I WAS A DEMOCRAT ALSO TILL I WAS 45, THEN I DID THE WINSTON CHURCHILL HE SAID ''IF YOU ARE NOT A LIBERAL AT 20 YOU HAVE NOT HEART.BUT..IF YOU ARE NOT A CONSECRATIVE BY 40, YOU HAVE NO BRAINS.'' Yes it takes growing up to the reality of the world. but then some people never grow, only just side wise and tall.Through the election of B<O< I have lost 5 people who I always thought of a super smart good friends, They could not discuss B.O. in any way or manner, they loved him so much, so blindly, to call me naMES INSTEAD OF DISCUSSING THE ISSUES. THAT TELLS ME THEY DO NOT KNOW THE ISSUES AND THEREFORE CANNOT DISCUSS THEM. DEMS HAVE A HARD TIME IN DISCUSSIONS.


----------



## soloweygirl

BrattyPatty said:


> If she turns over her server it will open up a whole new can of worms as far as privacy laws go. If they can take hers, who's to stop them from taking yours or mine?


You have not or will never hold such a position as Secretary of State. Your emails would have no importance. Hillary was obligated to turn over her emails, not just the ones she chose to turn over.


----------



## Artbarn

susanmos2000 said:


> Makes about as much sense as Jeb Bush claiming to be Hispanic back in 2009.


Yes, he checked the wrong box on a voter form, a mistake. it was inconsequential because it gained him nothing. He admits the mistake. By the way, his wife is Hispanic.

Elizabeth Warren sticks to her claim that she is American Indian.


----------



## Artbarn

tamarque said:


> Ah, but the Mass Media has done its job terrifically well. Do you know that the mass media in the US is owned by only 6 individuals/corporations? How much independence do you think remains with this oligarchical control by members of the 1%. Fox News is about the worst in is propaganda role and polls have consistently showed that those who get their news from Fox are the most ignorant of the issues. However, CNN is not that much better. The most informed people are those who get their news from independent sources which means spending some time looking for people who not connected to these mega-media institutions.
> 
> Why do you think independent journalists are killed at such high numbers? Why do you think the US has been censoring news and attacking whistleblowers at increasing levels? The worst thing about Julian Assange was that his revelations embarrassed the country. Ed Snowden, too. His crime is that he exposed the level of govt invasiveness into the lives of private people and other governments. One of the latest spy scandals is Israel's spying on the US. The problem was not the spying but the use of it to embarrass Obama as part of that country's efforts for control American foreign policy. Getting real and meaningful information needs to be a solid goal of people and it requires some extra effort if people are to be informed in a meaningful way.


Well, you've left me speechless on this rant.


----------



## momeee

Artbarn said:


> I watch Fox News. I also watch my local (left-leaning) news, used to watch Brian Williams (and we all know now that he reported his version of the news). I also read my local newspaper (very-far left), the New York Daily News (left-leaning) and the New York Post (right-leaning.) After I put together everything I've learned I make my own decisions on what to believe.
> 
> Of all these sources of news, the only one that consistently seeks out both liberals and conservatives to debate the important issues, is Fox News. Yes, there are some opinion shows, like Hannity, that are far-right, but even Hannity has debates with liberals. Shepard Smith leans left. I can't figure out what Chris Wallace's or Howard Kurtz' politics are because they don't inject their political opinions at all.
> 
> I believe that most people who criticize Fox News either have never watched it or only saw small portions and have judged the entire network on that.


Great response. One cannot rely on any one news source- especially in this time.
:thumbup:


----------



## Sbrumm

I agree 100% with Irish knitter.


----------



## soloweygirl

susanmos2000 said:


> And that was Hillary's point as well--the why's and wherefores of the murders paled beside the fact that four good men were now dead.


Then why lie about it for months and blame it on a stupid video? Why not just come clean in the beginning and say it was a terrorist attack. That we were caught with our pants down which resulted in a terribly tragedy? That would have been far more acceptable to the American people than the administration's coverup campaign.


----------



## GR. Gram

DO YOU KNOW WHY WE HAVE A SHORTAGE OF DR.S NOW ?YES THANK GOOD OLD Hillary. REMEMBER WHEN SHE HID OUT IN THE WH, HAD A SPECIAL ROOM SET UP, AND WAS IN THE PROCESS OF DOING ..''HILLARY HEAlTH CARE''? CHECK OUT SNOOPS.SSO MANY YOUNG PEOPLE KNEW THEY WOULD NOT MAKE MONEY AFTER YEARS OF STUDY SO THEY CHANGED THEIR MAJORS.AND DITCH MED. SCHOOL, SO 20 YEARS LAter what have you gotNO DOC's..thank you smartest lady in the worldlolshe should have kept her eyes on Billy boy and may be Monica's blue dress would not be in the SmithsoniaN , SAW IT MYSELF..THERE IT ISKIND OF PRETTYLOL


----------



## Artbarn

momeee said:


> I agree, galaxycraft. Too many sandals. As much as I'd like a competent, honest woman as prez, I could not vote for Killary based on her past performance.
> 
> We need to have full knowledge about any candidate's past, including associations, decisions, beliefs, loyalties etc., and who is fronting the money...the puppet master? It is 19 months before the election...we have ample time to fully vet all candidates and elect the one who will work for the betterment and security of the USA and its citizens.


So true. It's very sad that we have so many voters who believe what some movie star tells them, or what they hear from one news source. Those voters don't know what it means to vet a candidate. They are the reason that we are saddled with a President who has done nothing to fix our economy and has done everything to alienate our allies.


----------



## babesy

Mrs. B ---

I you are tired of scandals, get ready for hearing about more and more of them, almost as many as we have now (no, I take that back, that is not possible, but there will be many things that she has to answer for).


----------



## soloweygirl

knitpresentgifts said:


> Hillary is beholden to foreign governments, Wall Street, the Clinton Foundation (funded by illegal contributions from foreign countries and citizens) and the top 1% of Democrats for her support. She couldn't care less about the economy or the middle class or Americans not in her elite circle.


One of Hillary's platforms is going to be the economy and the middle class, with Hillary doing the "get togethers" with middle class families so she can show her concern for their plight and how reachable she is. I have no doubt they will be able to relate to her troubles about being dead broke after leaving the WH and not being able to get mortgages on their homes. I know I spent a few sleepless nights after I heard of her money problems.


----------



## Janci

Irish knitter said:


> Does anyone know if Elizabeth Dole is still alive????


Apparently she is still alive. I Googled her and the info is still speaking of her in the present tense.


----------



## Artbarn

knitpresentgifts said:


> Elizabeth Warren did more than lie about her heritage.
> 
> Read about how she illegally used her atty daughter and the Mass taxpayers' $ in an attempt to get residents registered for welfare and as a Democrat (Warren's political party).
> 
> Here's just one article, I'm certain there would be many on a search:
> 
> http://legalinsurrection.com/2012/08/elizabeth-warren-daughter-secretly-behind-effort-by-mass-to-register-500k-welfare-recipients/


I'm glad you brought that up. I had forgotten all about it.


----------



## Shdy990

The problem in this country - we don't care if everything goes to hell as long as we do something historic like a black president and now a woman. I think they should be voted for based on the good they have done, not anything else.


----------



## jacquelinesue

The last thing I intend is to offend anyone but I MUST comment on the posted subject. The closer elections get to ballot or decision time the more intense the comments become. This is a forum for creative people to share and get help with hand crafted items - I do not think it is the right place to begin airing political views; there are many other easily accessed options available for those kind of opinions. This is such a wonderful forum for sharing ideas, assistance and making new friends. Lets keep it that way by avoiding subjects that are contentious at best and often can get downright ugly and mean.


----------



## soloweygirl

BrattyPatty said:


> If one was to put themselves in Hillary's shoes that day, they may feel differently about her response. The committee was more concerned about talking points than they were about the victims.


Hillary was never concerned about the victims. She wouldn't have lied to their families has she been concerned.


----------



## Irish knitter

Artbarn said:


> Honest? She claimed to be an American Indian in order to get a job teaching at Harvard Law School, but she has never been able to provide proof of that heritage.


Really????? Are you pulling my leg????!!!!


----------



## theyarnlady

Artbarn said:


> So true. It's very sad that we have so many voters who believe what some movie star tells them, or what they hear from one news source. Those voters don't know what it means to vet a candidate. They are the reason that we are saddled with a President who has done nothing to fix our economy and has done everything to alienate our allies.


So agree with you. Maybe this time around they will really check out all the candidates and their records. After 8 years of dragging this country into the mess we have. Would think they would want to make a more informed choice.


----------



## GR. Gram

IT IS A BREATH OF FRESH AIR TO SEE AND HEAR FROM SO MANY
informed women, I had a super Civic's teacher, shed taught us well in 8th grade. don't know what they teach now, seems from the way people act aNDVOTE , IT'S NEXT TO NOTHING, ! JUST MAKE YOUR BIG X..THATS WHY B.O. WANTS ALL THE Illegals here to keep voting for DEMS and the freebies, on the money from my pocket. HE could have made a name for himself in a positive way, but he chose to serve the devil himself, instead. :twisted:


----------



## ute4kp

jayne6666 said:


> this is great.
> you can tell who watches FOX (not the) news, by their quoting of catch line phrases that this network uses to achieve the "say it over and over and over until they believe it!" results.


Exactly what I noticed.


----------



## theyarnlady

soloweygirl said:


> One of Hillary's platforms is going to be the economy and the middle class, with Hillary doing the "get togethers" with middle class families so she can show her concern for their plight and how reachable she is. I have no doubt they will be able to relate to her troubles about being dead broke after leaving the WH and not being able to get mortgages on their homes. I know I spent a few sleepless nights after I heard of her money problems.


 :XD: :XD: :XD: I should be so dead broke.


----------



## soloweygirl

Cheeky Blighter said:


> What is your problem? Why can't you be civil or at least make some sense? Are you feeling ill or is it your usual personality?


 :XD: :XD: :XD: :XD: :XD: :XD: That's a good one Cheeky. You asking someone to be civil. Thanks for the laugh.


----------



## ute4kp

ilmacheryl said:


> I would like her better if her husband hadn't already been president. I don't like this trend of family members running for the same office. No, she isn't "related" to Bill. Yes, she is a member of the family. I don't like family dynasties. We shouldn't have dynasties in this country. It smacks too much of aristocracy. I do wish Elizabeth Warren would run, but she is probably too smart to want the job. I almost feel that if someone actually wants that horrible job, they shouldn't have it


The 2nd president and the 6th president. Trendy.


----------



## theyarnlady

ute4kp said:


> Exactly what I noticed.


why is it when so many disagree with you and others it is all Foxs new. Well I have news for you I do not see it as a Fox news thing. I see it as women on here who seem to be informed .

Also I do not see any of them as being racist as am sure that will be the next one that the Left will bring up.

Have you every watch C Span ,well if not maybe you should. Then you will see what is really going on in goverment. Not just news cast, newspapers, ect. You may even learn something.


----------



## knitpresentgifts

soloweygirl said:


> One of Hillary's platforms is going to be the economy and the middle class, with Hillary doing the "get togethers" with middle class families so she can show her concern for their plight and how reachable she is. I have no doubt they will be able to relate to her troubles about being dead broke after leaving the WH and not being able to get mortgages on their homes. I know I spent a few sleepless nights after I heard of her money problems.


If Hillary who commands $200,000-500,000 per speech cannot mange her $ in addition to her salary and other assets and profits from insider trading, why should any American believe she can manage the entire USA economy and to the benefit of anyone?

Anyone that votes for Hillary isn't too bright or informed IMO.


----------



## soloweygirl

mojave said:


> 2 females and 1 male. No complaints from us about Mojave. She insures we have the opportunities we need to develop as scientists. She is available when we ask for guidance in our research projects and she offers constructive advice when she sees we need it. When we mess up she doesn't rip us a new one like some of the advisors do.


Resistance is futile. As long as we are one with the collective, all is well. Ah the blessings of higher education.


----------



## soloweygirl

mojave said:


> Have you ever attend grad school? Lots of stress. Mojave teaches her grads to knit or crochet if we want to learn. She allows us to use her account to read and sometimes comment. Its interesting to read the differing viewpoints


Does this mean you are not independent enough to get your own account? Does this mojave do everything for you? Tell you what to study, how to study, when to study? It all sounds like a one way street - Mojave's Way.


----------



## GR. Gram

If you do not talk politicshow do you learn what the other person is thinking? ? ? or how they form their opinions of a candadate ?
I find Dems to be very defensive and CANNOT explain why they are voting like they do.and they get very upset if you ask questions. Are you like that? Can you hold a conversation on politics without loosing you temper, if not then it's time to ask yourself why not.


----------



## GR. Gram

If you do not talk politicshow do you learn what the other person is thinking? ? ? or how they form their opinions of a candadate ?
I find Dems to be very defensive and CANNOT explain why they are voting like they do.and they get very upset if you ask questions. Are you like that? Can you hold a conversation on politics without loosing you temper, if not then it's time to ask yourself why not.


----------



## mojave

If you want a relatively unbiased, detailed source of news, add Al Jezeera America to your media list. The TV news channel and the website are equally good for domestic and international news. Word of warning - not all the articles are pro-America but they do a good job of explaining why.


----------



## onegrannygoose

Artbarn said:


> I didn't vote for him because I did my research. I saw exactly what his history was, what his experience was (or lack of it), how he avoided voting on so many important issues while in the Illinois legislature as well as the US Senate--he voted "present." I saw what kind of President he would be and he has proven me to be correct.
> 
> When he won the election, I said, "Well, the silver lining is that the
> American people have elected a black man as President." I thought that at least he would improve race relations. Instead, I see the opposite.


Your research is flawed.


----------



## theyarnlady

soloweygirl said:


> Resistance is futile. As long as we are one with the collective, all is well. Ah the blessings of higher education.


On thing brothers me about the Mojove group, how is it that one mentions she is showing them how to knit in her classes, but others proclaim she is a professor. What is it a knitting teacher or a professor?


----------



## Moe C

According to MY rules of posting, no one should post who hasn't read every single page of the thread. I'm breaking my rule, probably mssing some juicy stuff, but I just can't get through 30 pages.

The Merlin Project boys (look it up) said, in 2014, that Hillary would not run, or would not get the nomination. They are uncannily accurate with their computer programme. Her timetrak spikes are non-existent for 2015-16-17:ergo, no presidency. Unless....for some reason, she or her parents lied about her date of birth.


----------



## soloweygirl

jasgold said:


> Shouldn't a female reporter be able to handle a Rand Paul. I mean they are interviewers, just like men.


They should and they certainly don't need any of their male counterparts defending them. They just got their kickers twisted because Rand Paul called the media on their behavior. They are the ones with the thin skin.


----------



## momeee

knitpresentgifts said:


> If Hillary who commands $200,000-500,000 per speech cannot mange her $ in addition to her salary and other assets and profits from insider trading, why should any American believe she can manage the entire USA economy and to the benefit of anyone?
> 
> Anyone that votes for Hillary isn't too bright or informed IMO.


Isn't that the truth? 
A poor, smart, educated, moral person cannot aspire to higher office. Unfortunately, unless someone has megabucks or can get financial backing to run (then s/he is beholden to the one who holds the purse strings) the field is already limited and skewed. Then there are those who are in politics and 'feather their nests' to become wealthy...


----------



## knitpresentgifts

Artbarn said:


> I'm glad you brought that up. I had forgotten all about it.


Well, there's more but I don't want to push it. :-D


----------



## susanmos2000

soloweygirl said:


> Then why lie about it for months and blame it on a stupid video? Why not just come clean in the beginning and say it was a terrorist attack. That we were caught with our pants down which resulted in a terribly tragedy? That would have been far more acceptable to the American people than the administration's coverup
> 
> In this day and age, labeling an attack "terrorist" is no small matter. It's a judgement that can and will have serious repercussions for the victims, the perpetrators, and the country in which the attack took place. Not all attacks that result in a loss of life are terrorist. Not all terrorist attacks result in a loss of life. It's far better to weigh the evidence than hurl that label like a stick of dynamite.


----------



## NYBev

I refuse to vote for someone just bec they are or are not a woman or bec they are or are not of a particular race or ethnic group. They have to prove to me they could do the job. And I do pay attention.


----------



## Dorsey

GR. Gram said:


> DO YOU KNOW WHY WE HAVE A SHORTAGE OF DR.S NOW ?YES THANK GOOD OLD Hillary. REMEMBER WHEN SHE HID OUT IN THE WH, HAD A SPECIAL ROOM SET UP, AND WAS IN THE PROCESS OF DOING ..''HILLARY HEAlTH CARE''? CHECK OUT SNOOPS.SSO MANY YOUNG PEOPLE KNEW THEY WOULD NOT MAKE MONEY AFTER YEARS OF STUDY SO THEY CHANGED THEIR MAJORS.AND DITCH MED. SCHOOL, SO 20 YEARS LAter what have you gotNO DOC's..thank you smartest lady in the worldlolshe should have kept her eyes on Billy boy and may be Monica's blue dress would not be in the SmithsoniaN , SAW IT MYSELF..THERE IT ISKIND OF PRETTYLOL


Dear Lord, who would want to see that slut's dress??? In the Smithsonian? Why? Not the kind of history I want to see there.
Yes, people on Medicare are finding it difficult to find doctors - I myself have had to change drs. many times in the past 10-15 years. They keep leaving. We had a family doctor for over 25 years, when he retired, it then became medic hopscotch, we both went from one to another as they moved, quit or got promoted. I am so tired of trying to find another new - female - doctor. I have a new one now, had one visit, she seems OK. There is no time to develop trust in each dr. - about the time you feel like to get to know and like and trust this person, off she goes.

Dot


----------



## DebHow78

Irish knitter said:


> I do not want to start a fight but I have lost all respect for Hillary after she said "who cares" after the death of our ambassador. I just finished 13 hours in Benghazi and they stated if she had moved right in the beginning none of them would have died and it WAS a terrorist attack and the whitehouse knew about it but kept their mouths shut.
> 
> Also...I have read what the whitehouse secret service said about her being "flying off the handle" at a moments notice; being B-tchy; in control and a all around pain in the a--.
> 
> All of this infornmation comes from reliable sources. They guy who wrote 13 hours in Benghazi was a survivor and just stated the facts. The secret service remarks I ran accross when I was looking up Caroline/John Kennedy's detail. They "tell all". Like the Bush twins were the worst to protect as they would run red lights to get rid of their agents and call "Daddy" when their agents caught up with them. The easiest to protect was Amy Carter.....her worst thing was roller skating in the whitehouse...
> 
> As I said before.....I am not trying to start an argument. Maybe we should be careful....
> 
> I will have to look to see where I got my whitehouse information.
> 
> Just think about the last Clinton whitehouse.....Bill was a front while Hillary ran it. We will be no better off than we are now.
> I am terrified if she wins....
> I do not like to get into politics but we are all doomed if she wins.......I want a woman in the whitehouse.....BUT the right woman and it is NOT hillary!!!


 :thumbup: :thumbup:


----------



## DebHow78

NYBev said:


> I refuse to vote for someone just bec they are or are not a woman or bec they are or are not of a particular race or ethnic group. They have to prove to me they could do the job. And I do pay attention.


 :thumbup: :thumbup:


----------



## knitpresentgifts

theyarnlady said:


> On thing brothers me about the Mojove group, how is it that one mentions she is showing them how to knit in her classes, but others proclaim she is a professor. What is it a knitting teacher or a professor?


She claims she served in the military too, and yet doesn't understand or speak knowledgeably about things I've seen her discuss about the military. Interesting that grad students read a knitting website in a university science lab during their 'spare' class time and cannot write a proper sentence but can log on and use another's user name.

Wonder what they are learning other than a Liberal viewpoint.

On second thought, I'm glad they read our threads, they will hear some excellent and informed and contrary points of view to their advisor, professor, or babysitter, whatever she is to them.


----------



## susanmos2000

Dorsey said:


> Dear Lord, who would want to see that slut's dress??? In the Smithsonian? Why? Not the kind of history I want to see


I agree.

(Hope they sent it to the dry cleaners first  )


----------



## DebHow78

knitpresentgifts said:


> If Hillary who commands $200,000-500,000 per speech cannot mange her $ in addition to her salary and other assets and profits from insider trading, why should any American believe she can manage the entire USA economy and to the benefit of anyone?
> 
> Anyone that votes for Hillary isn't too bright or informed IMO.


 :thumbup: :thumbup:


----------



## SwampCatNana

GroodleMom said:


> Elizabeth Warren is a better choice: Strong, brilliant and without all the baggage.


 :thumbup: :thumbup: :thumbup: :thumbup: :thumbup: :thumbup: :thumbup: :thumbup: :thumbup: :thumbup: :thumbup: :thumbup: :thumbup: :thumbup: :thumbup: :thumbup: :thumbup: :thumbup: :thumbup: :thumbup:


----------



## ute4kp

GR. Gram said:


> You dear one are not in a gov. office, so who wants your E's. SHE is OUR employee, but she acts as if she is our BOSS. Check out the site IN my last E and OPEN your eyes AND LET THE SUN SHINE IN. ARE WE AS DUMB AS THE AUTHOR OF OBAMA CARE SAID WE WERE..YES, BUT ONLY SOME OF US, NOT ALL. The Democratic party is not the party of our FATHERS, IT HAs been kidnapped BY THE LOW LIFE PROGRESSIVES, AND THOSE WHO HAVE NOT KEPT UP WITH WHAT POLITICIANS ARE DOING ARE WAY, WAY OUT OF THE INFORMATION LOOP. GOTTA KEEP THOSE PRETTY EYES OPEN AND LOOKING AT ALL SIDES OF THE ISSUES, GET EDUCATED ON THE Politicians before you make your X's..if not INFORMEDSTAY OUT OF THE VOTING BOOTH !!!!


http://www.knittingparadise.com/t-1-1.html#4
All caps. Read the rules.


----------



## soloweygirl

sandyridge said:


> I am horrified to think that Hillary Clinton might be our next president. She has been proven over and over to be a liar dating back to her Arkansas days. She has been involved in so many shady dealings such as Whitewater,the mysterious disappearances of people she had issue with,the Benghazi fiasco, carpetbagging to New York to gain a senate seat and her most recent email scandal. She joked at press conferance about that a few days ago---changing my hair style and changing email servers. I don't think that was a joking matter and why delete the entire account if there was not something to hide? How can anyone excuse her tirade before the senate committee where with clenched fists she screamed "what does it matter?" I should think it mattered greatly to the families of the victims. Would she say that if something so devastating and avoidable happened to her daughter? I think Hillary revealed her entire attitude with that that callous remark in a fit of anger and frustration. I do not even believe that Hillary's endeavor to be president is base don her patriotism or desire to serve her country. I believe she just wants to go down in history as the first woman president to continue to feed her ego. It has only been a few months since she declared she had no desire to run for office and it was time now to relax and be a grandma. She is so unstable with her antics I would shudder to think she was in charge of our nation.


Very well said.


----------



## mojave

soloweygirl said:


> Does this mean you are not independent enough to get your own account? Does this mojave do everything for you? Tell you what to study, how to study, when to study? It all sounds like a one way street - Mojave's Way.


I do have major influence on what classes they take, what research they do. Why would I accept a grad who wants to do research in medieval French literature? My ignorance in that area is huge.
If a graduate student wants to do research on the genetics of zebra fish, that student has no place in my lab. We don't do research in that area and do not have the facilities to support such research. All my graduate students do research related in some way to my research. It is the same in every university lab around the world. Grads do research in an area related to their advisor's research because the advisor has the equipment, experience and network of other scientists to support the grad's research. 
Please if you feel the need to insult me or my graduate students, at least take some time to know what you are talking about.


----------



## DebHow78

GR. Gram said:


> If you do not talk politicshow do you learn what the other person is thinking? ? ? or how they form their opinions of a candadate ?
> I find Dems to be very defensive and CANNOT explain why they are voting like they do.and they get very upset if you ask questions. Are you like that? Can you hold a conversation on politics without loosing you temper, if not then it's time to ask yourself why not.


 :thumbup: :thumbup:


----------



## alifletcher

There will always be controversy surrounding a Presidential candidate. Anyone who does now want Hilliary or Elizabeth Warren, need to convince me there is a more viable candidate.


----------



## knitpresentgifts

mojave said:


> If you want a relatively unbiased, detailed source of news, add Al Jezeera America to your media list. The TV news channel and the website are equally good for domestic and international news. Word of warning - not all the articles are pro-America but they do a good job of explaining why.


Your recommendation is to be expected seeing you claim to be a scientist and believe in global warming. I wonder if you know Al Gore, not only developed the internet, but also used to believe in and tried to sell the 'global warming' hoax to the world. Good ole Al was a prior owner of Al Jezeera and sold it for a princely sum. I think that was right around the time the renowned world scientists admitted they had forced and faked all their studies, results and thesis on global warming as demanded by their masters.

"Unbiased"? Really mojave?


----------



## DebHow78

Shdy990 said:


> The problem in this country - we don't care if everything goes to hell as long as we do something historic like a black president and now a woman. I think they should be voted for based on the good they have done, not anything else.


 :thumbup: :thumbup:


----------



## Cheryl Jaeger

GR. Gram said:


> If you do not talk politicshow do you learn what the other person is thinking? ? ? or how they form their opinions of a candadate ?
> I find Dems to be very defensive and CANNOT explain why they are voting like they do.and they get very upset if you ask questions. Are you like that? Can you hold a conversation on politics without loosing you temper, if not then it's time to ask yourself why not.


I find it very important to learn why or how others form their opinions. I will listen and try to make the best decisions possible with what I believe to be honest thought out answers. I also take into consideration prior to listening to any ones take on an issue is how they live their own lives. Do they stand on their convictions or do they just talk to cause turmoil, or for self gain? 
I also look at their track record of accomplishments. By this I mean what good have they done in the world. 
For this I would not vote for Hilary Clinton. Simple as that.


----------



## GR. Gram

DebHow78 said:


> :thumbup: :thumbup:


----------



## lenexa36

God help us


----------



## DebHow78

GR. Gram said:


> IT IS A BREATH OF FRESH AIR TO SEE AND HEAR FROM SO MANY
> informed women, I had a super Civic's teacher, shed taught us well in 8th grade. don't know what they teach now, seems from the way people act aNDVOTE , IT'S NEXT TO NOTHING, ! JUST MAKE YOUR BIG X..THATS WHY B.O. WANTS ALL THE Illegals here to keep voting for DEMS and the freebies, on the money from my pocket. HE could have made a name for himself in a positive way, but he chose to serve the devil himself, instead. :twisted:


Amen!


----------



## sandj

How can she be president if her husband was a former president? It must not matter if she was a First Lady?


----------



## knitpresentgifts

momeee said:


> Isn't that the truth?
> A poor, smart, educated, moral person cannot aspire to higher office. Unfortunately, unless someone has megabucks or can get financial backing to run (then s/he is beholden to the one who holds the purse strings) the field is already limited and skewed. Then there are those who are in politics and 'feather their nests' to become wealthy...


Agreed. It isn't right, nor correct, but the truth.


----------



## mojave

Yarn lady

You got it wrong somewhere. I teach biology and ecology classes. I teach my graduate students to knit or crochet in a non-class setting, if they want to learn. These young adults spend at least 3 years with me if they are earning a PhD. In a good advisor-grad relationship, a lifelong friendship develops. Maybe it is one of those things one must personally experience in order to understand.

At this point I will not further deviate from the topic of the thread. Talk to graduate science students and advisors, if you are acquainted with such, to learn how the system works.


----------



## Isa53

Surely this is a joke. I'm so hoping once Obama is out someone worthy will come in and she does not qualify.


----------



## Lauri54

I don't think she is the right person for the position at all. I agree Elizabeth Warren might be the better choice, but have been saying for the last two years Hillary will get elected just because most want to make history again and elect the first woman president.


----------



## sandj

Isa53 said:


> Surely this is a joke. I'm so hoping once Obama is out someone worthy will come in and she does not qualify.


Let's hope.


----------



## alifletcher

And who do you suggest ????


----------



## theyarnlady

mojave said:


> Yarn lady
> 
> You got it wrong somewhere. I teach biology and ecology classes. I teach my graduate students to knit or crochet in a non-class setting, if they want to learn. These young adults spend at least 3 years with me if they are earning a PhD. In a good advisor-grad relationship, a lifelong friendship develops. Maybe it is one of those things one must personally experience in order to understand.
> 
> At this point I will not further deviate from the topic of the thread. Talk to graduate science students and advisors, if you are acquainted with such, to learn how the system works.


As someone else has mention how can you then be in military service and not understand anything about military. you seem to have to many jobs . What one should I learn? you seem to be all over the place.


----------



## olcagran

Her e-mail scandal while she was secretary of state is another example of her dishonesty and deviousness. I have a hard time thinking of one accomplishment she made during her time in any office...lackluster.


----------



## Country Bumpkins

susanmos2000 said:


> I/we don't know for sure--no choice but to take her word for it.


 :lol:


----------



## WindingRoad

olcagran said:


> Her e-mail scandal while she was secretary of state is another example of her dishonesty and deviousness. I have a hard time thinking of one accomplishment she made during her time in any office...lackluster.


I don't like the fact that she thinks she's above the laws.


----------



## bigtimeyarnie

cathy47 said:


> This person cannot make up her mind how can she make decisions that are needed for this country. One min. she was next she wasn't.. not impressed. :thumbdown:


I SO agree with you. 
:thumbdown: :thumbdown: ( for Hillary, not you!!!)


----------



## soloweygirl

Donalda said:


> I agree 100% with you Irish Knitter. She scares me to death. Firstly, what has she actually accomplished, other than wiping her "private" server clean? Secondly, electing her President simply because she's a woman, is extremely dangerous. This county elected our first "black" president because of race and look at where this country is now. So, like you, I will probably get hate responses, but so be it. My thumb is down on Hilary Clinton. :thumbdown: :thumbdown: :thumbdown:


Obama was brought out into prime time way before he and his handlers were ready. His debut was in response to the reaction that Sarah Palin received. Palin had an excellent introductory speech and it scared the Democrats so much that they pulled in Obama. They knew Hillary couldn't hold a candle to Palin in a popularity contest. Apparently Obama could and won.

I will also get a lot of hate responses to this, but it's true. Hillary lost her bid in 2008 because she was not going to get the popular vote against Palin. Palin's package was much more appealing than Hillary's ever would be. Really, who starts off with a 50 point lead in the polls and loses it in a few weeks?


----------



## mojave

theyarnlady said:


> As someone else has mention how can you then be in military service and not understand anything about military. you seem to have to many jobs . What one should I learn? you seem to be all over the place.


Okay, one more posting to answer you and kpg 
I was military, received my discharges years ago. I took college courses while on active duty and earned my PhD after leaving the military. Have you only had one job your entire life? If yes, I hope you found it fulfilling. It would be sad to think circumstances prevented you from meeting your full potential.

Quoting kpg: _On second thought, I'm glad they read our threads, they will hear some excellent and informed and contrary points of view to their advisor, professor, or babysitter, whatever she is to them._
Now you are starting to get it. I guide future scientists, not create robots. By grace and convention of the university system, my job title is 'professor'. By grace and convention of the university system, my relationship to my graduate students is titled 'advisor'.


----------



## Artbarn

Irish knitter said:


> Really????? Are you pulling my leg????!!!!


Not pulling your leg, Irish Knitter. There was an article on April 27, 2012 in the Boston Herald. Here is the link, but it says the rest of the article is archived and I don't have time to figure out how to find it (or if I have to pay to read it). 
http://www.bostonherald.com/news_opinion/us_politics/2012/04/harvard_trips_roots_elizabeth_warren%E2%80%99s_family_tree

However, I did find a quote in the America Spectator from the Boston Herald article:

"On April 27, 2012, the Boston Herald reported that clearly-white Elizabeth Warren had identified herself as a Native American when applying to teach at Harvard Law School, and that Harvard later cited her presence on staff as evidence of its faculty's diversity. When it first went to print, the Warren campaign was shellshocked. The Herald wrote that "campaign aides last night scrambled but failed to produce documents proving her family's lineage." A video showed Warren and her staffers frantically running out the back door of a campaign event to avoid the press. A week later, Warren finally told reporters that she knew of her supposed 1/32nd Cherokee roots because her "papaw" had "high cheekbones, like all of the Indians do."
Read more at http://spectator.org/articles/34482/never-having-say-youre-sorry


----------



## soloweygirl

Artbarn said:


> And just how do you know that she turned over all the relevant emails?


Because Hillary said she did. :XD: :XD: :XD: :XD:


----------



## sumpleby

soloweygirl said:


> Obama was brought out into prime time way before he and his handlers were ready. His debut was in response to the reaction that Sarah Palin received. Palin had an excellent introductory speech and it scared the Democrats so much that they pulled in Obama. They knew Hillary couldn't hold a candle to Palin in a popularity contest. Apparently Obama could and won.
> 
> I will also get a lot of hate responses to this, but it's true. Hillary lost her bid in 2008 because she was not going to get the popular vote against Palin. Palin's package was much more appealing than Hillary's ever would be. Really, who starts off with a 50 point lead in the polls and loses it in a few weeks?


Trust me, this is not a "hate response," but ROFLMAO. Absolutely no one was "frightened by Palin." The woman is an idiot and showed it at every turn. People WERE frightened by the idea of her being one step away from being POTUS if something should happen to McCain.


----------



## Artbarn

Artbarn wrote:
I didn't vote for him because I did my research. I saw exactly what his history was, what his experience was (or lack of it), how he avoided voting on so many important issues while in the Illinois legislature as well as the US Senate--he voted "present." I saw what kind of President he would be and he has proven me to be correct.

When he won the election, I said, "Well, the silver lining is that the 
American people have elected a black man as President." I thought that at least he would improve race relations. Instead, I see the opposite.



onegrannygoose said:


> Your research is flawed.


Really. Prove it. He was raised by communists and associated with radicals when he was growing up. He voted "present" numerous times in the Illinois legislature and the U.S. Senate to avoid taking a stand.


----------



## WindingRoad

sumpleby said:


> Trust me, this is not a "hate response," but ROFLMAO. Absolutely no one was "frightened by Palin." The woman is an idiot and showed it at every turn. People WERE frightened by the idea of her being one step away from being POTUS if something should happen to McCain.


Yes they were. They were frightened that she might actually CHANGE Washington. That won't happen in our life time without armed conflict.


----------



## ramram0003

galaxycraft said:


> No Way Jose! :thumbdown: She has not proven to be a leader. :thumbdown:
> From the first lady to the present.


Agree.


----------



## pierrette

Artbarn....&#128582;&#128582;&#128582;&#128582;&#128582;&#128582;!!! They are clapping for you.


----------



## sumpleby

WindingRoad said:


> Yes they were. They were frightened that she might actually CHANGE Washington. That won't happen in our life time without armed conflict.


Yes, she would have changed it. By dumbing it down to the lowest denominator. As for armed conflict--we have enough of that. More than enough. Enough to know that it is NOT the answer to our problems.


----------



## Artbarn

susanmos2000 said:


> soloweygirl said:
> 
> 
> 
> Then why lie about it for months and blame it on a stupid video? Why not just come clean in the beginning and say it was a terrorist attack. That we were caught with our pants down which resulted in a terribly tragedy? That would have been far more acceptable to the American people than the administration's coverup
> 
> In this day and age, labeling an attack "terrorist" is no small matter. It's a judgement that can and will have serious repercussions for the victims, the perpetrators, and the country in which the attack took place. Not all attacks that result in a loss of life are terrorist. Not all terrorist attacks result in a loss of life. It's far better to weigh the evidence than hurl that label like a stick of dynamite.
> 
> 
> 
> It has been proven over and over again that this administration knew immediately that Benghazi was a terrorist attack. They lied because they were afraid that it would cause Obama to lose the election--after all, he was telling us all that the terrorists were defeated.
Click to expand...


----------



## Irish knitter

Artbarn said:


> I didn't vote for him because I did my research. I saw exactly what his history was, what his experience was (or lack of it), how he avoided voting on so many important issues while in the Illinois legislature as well as the US Senate--he voted "present." I saw what kind of President he would be and he has proven me to be correct.
> 
> When he won the election, I said, "Well, the silver lining is that the
> American people have elected a black man as President." I thought that at least he would improve race relations. Instead, I see the opposite.


But he is only one half black....


----------



## sumpleby

Just watched the Hillary Clinton announcement video. Very low key, but highlighting the common people. I'm in two minds about it. On the one hand I think it is a bit too low key. On the other, I like its inclusiveness.


----------



## sandj

Can someone(s) tell me why Hillary would be a good president instead of everyone saying she would be the worst? Tell us why she should run for president? Thanks.


----------



## sumpleby

Artbarn said:


> It has been proven over and over again that this administration knew immediately that Benghazi was a terrorist attack. They lied because they were afraid that it would cause Obama to lose the election--after all, he was telling us all that the terrorists were defeated.


No they didn't, and said it wasn't. In any case, after ad nauseum hearings the Republicans THEMSELVES said that there was no wrong done by her or the administration.


----------



## WindingRoad

sumpleby said:


> Yes, she would have changed it. By dumbing it down to the lowest denominator. As for armed conflict--we have enough of that. More than enough. Enough to know that it is NOT the answer to our problems.


Somehow I think dumbing down Washington happened a long time ago. Probably Palin wasn't even a glimmer in her dad's eye when it happened. Oh I think it would. NO one in Washington would stay around to defend it.


----------



## WindingRoad

sumpleby said:


> No they didn't, and said it wasn't. In any case, after ad nauseum hearings the Republicans THEMSELVES said that there was no wrong done by her or the administration.


They are wrong.


----------



## onegrannygoose

Artbarn said:


> Artbarn wrote:
> I didn't vote for him because I did my research. I saw exactly what his history was, what his experience was (or lack of it), how he avoided voting on so many important issues while in the Illinois legislature as well as the US Senate--he voted "present." I saw what kind of President he would be and he has proven me to be correct.
> 
> When he won the election, I said, "Well, the silver lining is that the
> American people have elected a black man as President." I thought that at least he would improve race relations. Instead, I see the opposite.
> 
> Really. Prove it. He was raised by communists and associated with radicals when he was growing up. He voted "present" numerous times in the Illinois legislature and the U.S. Senate to avoid taking a stand.


I don't have to prove that your research is flawed. If you think FOX news is really news that automatically shows you that your research is slanted. You say that you read all of the opposite views however your responses prove that you don't.

If Obama is so bad why is the economy in the best shape it has been since before the Bush years?

Why is job growth continuing to climb month after month ? Why is unemployment down to 5% ?

Why is the stock market higher than ever before?

If you can explain all these things away I will listen to what you have to say.


----------



## ragdoll03

galaxycraft said:


> No Way Jose! :thumbdown: She has not proven to be a leader. :thumbdown:
> From the first lady to the present.


100% agreed!


----------



## Artbarn

pierrette said:


> Artbarn....🙆🙆🙆🙆🙆🙆!!! They are clapping for you.


  I'm a political junkie and I just have to speak up!


----------



## WindingRoad

onegrannygoose said:


> I don't have to prove that your research is flawed. If you think FOX news is really news that automatically shows you that your research is slanted. You say that you read all of the opposite views however your responses prove that you don't.
> 
> If Obama is so bad why is the economy in the best shape it has been since before the Bush years?
> 
> Why is job growth continuing to climb month after month ? Why is unemployment down to 5% ?
> 
> Why is the stock market higher than ever before?
> 
> If you can explain all these things away I will listen to what you have to say.


Because the government says so. And I believe (cough cough) them Tell me this why does the government revise their stats from the last two months so often? Can't get it right the first time?


----------



## Artbarn

sumpleby said:


> No they didn't, and said it wasn't. In any case, after ad nauseum hearings the Republicans THEMSELVES said that there was no wrong done by her or the administration.


Please enlighten me with your source.


----------



## WindingRoad

Artbarn said:


> Please enlighten me with your source.


Ignoring pleas of help isn't wrong. Didn't you know that?


----------



## sumpleby

Artbarn said:


> Please enlighten me with your source.


One among many other news reports from last November:

http://www.washingtonpost.com/world...49a070-71dd-11e4-ad12-3734c461eab6_story.html

House panel finds no intelligence failure in Benghazi attacks

An investigation by the Republican-led House Intelligence Committee has concluded that the CIA and U.S. military responded appropriately to the attacks on U.S. facilities in Benghazi, Libya, in 2012, dismissing allegations that the Obama administration blocked rescue attempts during the assault or sought to mislead the public afterward.

After a two-year probe that involved the review of thousands of pages of classified documents, the panel determined that the attack could not be blamed on an intelligence failure, and that CIA security operatives ably and bravely assisted State Department officials who were overwhelmed at a nearby but separate diplomatic compound.

The committee also found no evidence that there was either a stand down order or a denial of available air support, rejecting claims that have fed persistent conspiracy theories that the U.S. military was prevented from rescuing U.S. personnel from a night-time assault that killed U.S. Ambassador Christopher Stevens and three other Americans


----------



## Artbarn

onegrannygoose said:


> I don't have to prove that your research is flawed. If you think FOX news is really news that automatically shows you that your research is slanted. You say that you read all of the opposite views however your responses prove that you don't.
> 
> If Obama is so bad why is the economy in the best shape it has been since before the Bush years?
> 
> Why is job growth continuing to climb month after month ? Why is unemployment down to 5% ?
> 
> Why is the stock market higher than ever before?
> 
> If you can explain all these things away I will listen to what you have to say.


Who said I got any of this from Fox News? How can you say that I don't learn from a variety of sources? Again, I say prove it. You can't.

The unemployment rate is based on how many people have jobs. Unfortunately, too many of those jobs are part-time and minimum-wage jobs. You can't raise a family on those kinds of jobs. I have to leave now, but will come back later with more details.

I don't follow the stock market, so I can't answer that question.


----------



## susanmos2000

sumpleby said:


> Yes, she would have changed it. By dumbing it down to the lowest denominator. As for armed conflict--we have enough of that. More than enough. Enough to know that it is NOT the answer to our problems.


Agree, Sumpleby. My husband and his family lived through prolonged civil war (the breakup of Yugoslavia/Milosevic/ethnic cleansing), and hearing of their experiences has, literally, given me nightmares. My FIL still feels the need to arm himself when he leaves his home village. We don't want that here.


----------



## DGreen

sandj said:


> How can she be president if her husband was a former president? It must not matter if she was a First Lady?


What on earth do those facts have to do with anything?

Hillary is not Bill. First Lady is not an elected office.


----------



## peacegoddess

sandj said:


> How can she be president if her husband was a former president? It must not matter if she was a First Lady?


Are you for real with this comment? Being a president's spouse does not exempt one from being president in the future.


----------



## susanmos2000

Artbarn said:


> It has been proven over and over again that this administration knew immediately that Benghazi was a terrorist attack. They lied because they were afraid that it would cause Obama to lose the election--after all, he was telling us all that the terrorists were defeated.


If the Obama administration did in fact "know immediately" that Benghazi was a terrorist attack then they arrived at that conclusion by faulty reasoning. The situation in the Middle East is so complicated that snap judgements can never be made with any degree of accuracy.


----------



## WindingRoad

susanmos2000 said:


> If the Obama administration did in fact "know immediately" that Benghazi was a terrorist attack then they arrived at that conclusion by faulty reasoning. The situation in the Middle East is so complicated that snap judgements can never be made with any degree of accuracy.


That's correct up to a point. We should always wait to see if someone dies before we try to stop them from dying. Then in hindsight we can say we didn't want to jump to conclusions in such a volatile part of the world. Yep typical government think......


----------



## doglady

I would like to see a woman as president, but I would want one with honor and that precludes any politicians. I am a democrat and my husband is a republican and as tell him "It's either my thieves in office or your thieves in office, but they are ALL thieves and criminals everyone of them!!! "


----------



## justinjared

congrats to her. I am Canadian bit I think she will make a good strong president. I would vote for her!


----------



## soloweygirl

knitpresentgifts said:


> If Hillary who commands $200,000-500,000 per speech cannot mange her $ in addition to her salary and other assets and profits from insider trading, why should any American believe she can manage the entire USA economy and to the benefit of anyone?
> 
> Anyone that votes for Hillary isn't too bright or informed IMO.


So true. Especially since all of her "accomplishments" are right out there, hiding from no one.


----------



## soloweygirl

theyarnlady said:


> On thing brothers me about the Mojove group, how is it that one mentions she is showing them how to knit in her classes, but others proclaim she is a professor. What is it a knitting teacher or a professor?


Perhaps the Knitting Professor? It would make a good TV show.


----------



## mreckel

It is still very early. The best candidate may not even be heard from yet. We all need to keep our minds open and truly listen to what each one says in addition to being sure they are trustworthy. It is critical for or nation and our national security.


----------



## Hudsmouse

I agree with Irish Knitter! Benghazi DOES matter! Just ask the families who lost their loved ones, unnecessarily. Clintons have demonstrated cover ups from the beginning, and she thinks she is the exception to the rules. New blood needed on both sides, would be nice to be excited about elections for a change. Would love to see a woman in, but we need someone level headed to represent us and not in the pockets.


----------



## Isuel

There were lots of shenaanigans, ghosts and other issues going on in the Virgin Queen's reign and it is considered the Golden Age.


----------



## babesy

Or how Warren made money on foreclosed homes - those poor folks she was claiming to help.

Folks, Dems may SAY they are here to help the little people, but look behind the curtain. There is always a way to line their pockets, some honest, some not.

WAKE UP AMEERICA!

I would like a Woman President, just not Hilary or Faux-ca-hontos as the joke goes.


----------



## Bettylex

:thumbup: :thumbup: :thumbup:


----------



## J.Carol

doglady said:


> I would like to see a woman as president, but I would want one with honor and that precludes any politicians. I am a democrat and my husband is a republican and as tell him "It's either my thieves in office or your thieves in office, but they are ALL thieves and criminals everyone of them!!! "


100% correct. I call it a one party government with two different faces. They all sleep in the same bed.


----------



## soloweygirl

susanmos2000 said:


> soloweygirl said:
> 
> 
> 
> Then why lie about it for months and blame it on a stupid video? Why not just come clean in the beginning and say it was a terrorist attack. That we were caught with our pants down which resulted in a terribly tragedy? That would have been far more acceptable to the American people than the administration's coverup
> 
> In this day and age, labeling an attack "terrorist" is no small matter. It's a judgement that can and will have serious repercussions for the victims, the perpetrators, and the country in which the attack took place. Not all attacks that result in a loss of life are terrorist. Not all terrorist attacks result in a loss of life. It's far better to weigh the evidence than hurl that label like a stick of dynamite.
> 
> 
> 
> BS. There were experts there at the time who called it a terrorist attack from the beginning. The admin didn't weigh anything other than what to do to cover their a$$es.
Click to expand...


----------



## susanmos2000

soloweygirl said:


> BS. There were experts there at the time who called it a terrorist attack from the beginning. The admin didn't weigh anything other than what to do to cover their a$$es.


Yes, and the so-called experts also jumped to the erroneous conclusion that the Kansas City bombing was the work of Muslim terrorists. No expert worth his or her salt will rush to judgement in such cases.


----------



## soloweygirl

alifletcher said:


> There will always be controversy surrounding a Presidential candidate. Anyone who does now want Hilliary or Elizabeth Warren, need to convince me there is a more viable candidate.


We don't have to convince you of anything. It is your job, as it is ours, to get the information for ourselves and then make an informed decision.


----------



## ELareau

Irish knitter said:


> I do not want to start a fight but I have lost all respect for Hillary after she said "who cares" after the death of our ambassador. I just finished 13 hours in Benghazi and they stated if she had moved right in the beginning none of them would have died and it WAS a terrorist attack and the whitehouse knew about it but kept their mouths shut.
> 
> Also...I have read what the whitehouse secret service said about her being "flying off the handle" at a moments notice; being B-tchy; in control and a all around pain in the a--.
> 
> All of this infornmation comes from reliable sources. They guy who wrote 13 hours in Benghazi was a survivor and just stated the facts. The secret service remarks I ran accross when I was looking up Caroline/John Kennedy's detail. They "tell all". Like the Bush twins were the worst to protect as they would run red lights to get rid of their agents and call "Daddy" when their agents caught up with them. The easiest to protect was Amy Carter.....her worst thing was roller skating in the whitehouse...
> 
> As I said before.....I am not trying to start an argument. Maybe we should be careful....
> 
> I will have to look to see where I got my whitehouse information.
> 
> Just think about the last Clinton whitehouse.....Bill was a front while Hillary ran it. We will be no better off than we are now.
> I am terrified if she wins....
> I do not like to get into politics but we are all doomed if she wins.......I want a woman in the whitehouse.....BUT the right woman and it is NOT hillary!!!


She was NOT referring to the Americans' deaths when she said "who cares" - contrary to what the Republicans would have you believe.

She was referring to "who's to blame". The investigative report showed that everything was done that could be. The Marines DID NOT ask for reinforcements prior to the event.

The republicans are going to illuminate a negative light on anything Obama administration related. It doesn't matter is it damages the country or not - and it is causing damage.


----------



## CarolfromTX

susanmos2000 said:


> If the Obama administration did in fact "know immediately" that Benghazi was a terrorist attack then they arrived at that conclusion by faulty reasoning. The situation in the Middle East is so complicated that snap judgements can never be made with any degree of accuracy.


There were RPGs involved. Who brings an RPG to a "spontaneous demonstration?" Terrorists, I guess.
The regime knew, and lied about it repeatedly. Of course, they said the Ft. Hood shooting wasn't a terrorist attack either, when it was clear after a few days that it was. I think the regime will lie when the truth would do as well.


----------



## Irish knitter

susanmos2000 said:


> soloweygirl said:
> 
> 
> 
> Then why lie about it for months and blame it on a stupid video? Why not just come clean in the beginning and say it was a terrorist attack. That we were caught with our pants down which resulted in a terribly tragedy? That would have been far more acceptable to the American people than the administration's coverup
> 
> In this day and age, labeling an attack "terrorist" is no small matter. It's a judgement that can and will have serious repercussions for the victims, the perpetrators, and the country in which the attack took place. Not all attacks that result in a loss of life are terrorist. Not all terrorist attacks result in a loss of life. It's far better to weigh the evidence than hurl that label like a stick of dynamite.
> 
> 
> 
> We really were not caught with our pants down.......the support group that could have rescued all of them were told 4 times to stand down; then they decided to disobey orders and go in but then it was too late!!
> Chris Stevens was alive until he tried to get out the back patio from the bathroom. If they had gone in any sooner they could have saved him!
Click to expand...


----------



## soloweygirl

sandj said:


> How can she be president if her husband was a former president? It must not matter if she was a First Lady?


The First Lady is NOT an elected position. It's a position fulfilled by the wife of the current president. If a president is not married, another family member could stand in for a First Lady. I think Dolly Madison stood in for Pres. Madison since he was not married.


----------



## jaygee28

mreckel said:


> It is still very early. The best candidate may not even be heard from yet. We all need to keep our minds open and truly listen to what each one says in addition to being sure they are trustworthy. It is critical for or nation and our national security.


Congrats! Finally a level head heard from! I had to open the door and windows to let all this hot air out, and sweep out the garbage that is being spouted. 
How quickly you turn this forum away from knit & crochet comradeship (oops, don't accuse me of being a communist now) and that it should be.
Politics is always passing on whatever dirt they can dig up, manufacture or actually make up. You really believe them? Your slant on those always proves that there are at least two sides or views and neither will admit the other is right - they just keep repeating the stuff. (Closet racism and feminism.?)?
You will never be able to "Prove" you are the right one! Let's get back to KP and avoid another silly blow-up. I am keeping my opinions quiet! Jheri


----------



## Grandma Jo

No Way, Hillary. Bill and Obama have already done enough damage to this country.


----------



## RosieC

Grandma Jo said:


> No Way, Hillary. Bill and Obama have already done enough damage to this country.


 :thumbup:


----------



## soloweygirl

sumpleby said:


> Trust me, this is not a "hate response," but ROFLMAO. Absolutely no one was "frightened by Palin." The woman is an idiot and showed it at every turn. People WERE frightened by the idea of her being one step away from being POTUS if something should happen to McCain.


They were afraid of Palin. McCain was a non issue as soon as Palin made her speech. After plenty of attacks against her character, for no other reason than fear, even the McCain campaign turned on Palin.


----------



## JusNeedles

It is sad (in my opinion) that Hillary is the best choice !!!! IF she is elected who do you think will REALLY running the country as he did years ago...just gets him out of the spotlight and he can continue with his shanigans (sp ?)........I have no confidence in her and her skills...Bengazhi (sp) and her attitude of "who cares" and the under handed way she handled the e mails which really belonged to the public...count me out ! I vote for Bugs bunny !


----------



## Irish knitter

sumpleby said:


> One among many other news reports from last November:
> 
> http://www.washingtonpost.com/world...49a070-71dd-11e4-ad12-3734c461eab6_story.html
> 
> House panel finds no intelligence failure in Benghazi attacks
> 
> An investigation by the Republican-led House Intelligence Committee has concluded that the CIA and U.S. military responded appropriately to the attacks on U.S. facilities in Benghazi, Libya, in 2012, dismissing allegations that the Obama administration blocked rescue attempts during the assault or sought to mislead the public afterward.
> 
> After a two-year probe that involved the review of thousands of pages of classified documents, the panel determined that the attack could not be blamed on an intelligence failure, and that CIA security operatives ably and bravely assisted State Department officials who were overwhelmed at a nearby but separate diplomatic compound.
> 
> The committee also found no evidence that there was either a stand down order or a denial of available air support, rejecting claims that have fed persistent conspiracy theories that the U.S. military was prevented from rescuing U.S. personnel from a night-time assault that killed U.S. Ambassador Christopher Stevens and three other Americans


The book written by the head of the navy seals says differently. It is a accounting minute by minute of what REALLY happened and this guy wrote the book in honor of hid friends who died. There is NO political overtones. Just pure facts......


----------



## J.Carol

soloweygirl said:


> They were afraid of Palin. McCain was a non issue as soon as Palin made her speech. After plenty of attacks against her character, for no other reason than fear, even the McCain campaign turned on Palin.


It's all a horse and pony show. They don't want us to see what's going on behind the curtain.


----------



## susanmos2000

Irish knitter said:


> We really were not caught with our pants down.......the support group that could have rescued all of them were told 4 times to stand down; then they decided to disobey orders and go in but then it was too late!!
> Chris Stevens was alive until he tried to get out the back patio from the bathroom. If they had gone in any sooner they could have saved him!


*sigh* No, they were not told to "stand down", as even the Senate Intelligence committee concluded in January 2014. Why not do a bit of research on the subject?


----------



## Irish knitter

ELareau said:


> She was NOT referring to the Americans' deaths when she said "who cares" - contrary to what the Republicans would have you believe.
> 
> She was referring to "who's to blame". The investigative report showed that everything was done that could be. The Marines DID NOT ask for reinforcements prior to the event.
> 
> The republicans are going to illuminate a negative light on anything Obama administration related. It doesn't matter is it damages the country or not - and it is causing damage.


They asked 4 times to help and were denied by the White House!!!! I have done my research and have gotten the unbias truth from an American......NOT THE GOVERNMENT!


----------



## sandj

peacegoddess said:


> Are you for real with this comment? Being a president's spouse does not exempt one from being president in the future.


A First Lady never became president? I wonder why?


----------



## Irish knitter

susanmos2000 said:


> *sigh* No, they were not told to "stand down", as even the Senate Intelligence committee concluded in January 2014. Why not do a bit of research on the subject?


I have done my research.......READ the book!!


----------



## sandj

soloweygirl said:


> The First Lady is NOT an elected position. It's a position fulfilled by the wife of the current president. If a president is not married, another family member could stand in for a First Lady. I think Dolly Madison stood in for Pres. Madison since he was not married.


Thank you!


----------



## J.Carol

susanmos2000 said:


> *sigh* No, they were not told to "stand down", as even the Senate Intelligence committee concluded in January 2014. Why not do a bit of research on the subject?


Intelligence committee ??? ...... ahahahahahahahhaha


----------



## soloweygirl

onegrannygoose said:


> I don't have to prove that your research is flawed. If you think FOX news is really news that automatically shows you that your research is slanted. You say that you read all of the opposite views however your responses prove that you don't.
> 
> If Obama is so bad why is the economy in the best shape it has been since before the Bush years?
> 
> Why is job growth continuing to climb month after month ? Why is unemployment down to 5% ?
> 
> Why is the stock market higher than ever before?
> 
> If you can explain all these things away I will listen to what you have to say.


The economy is stagnant. DGP was under 2% last quarter. On a robust economy, which this should be by now with all the money thrown at it, DGP should be at a minimum of 4%. That is NOT being in its best shape. Job growth is slow, low paying jobs and part time work are dominating the economy. What higher paying jobs are available are not being filled because our citizens lack the skills to fill them. Annual salaries have dropped. Where are the manufacturing jobs? Where are the green jobs Obama promised as he lent money to all those green businesses? Oh that's right, they closed their doors and cited bankruptcy. The stock market is the only thing that is doing well. Those that can afford to invest are doing so, the rest of us can't afford to do so.


----------



## JillF

SiberAngel said:


> If we vote based on personality, gender, race, etc., we are cheating ourselves out of a leader that can truly lead this country. Above all, we must understand that regardless of whom we elect, they are, first and foremost, politicians. Filter out the ones who are blowing smoke up your a$$ and promising things that are not within the scope of accomplishment without being a detriment to everyone else concerned; try not to vote based on one particular agenda, rather vote based on the greater good for this country. Remember the basic principles this country was founded upon. Is your proposed leader in sync with those principles? If not, then why expect tomatoes when you are planting lilies? To have a female president just because we've never had one, doesn't make good sense, unless she meets certain criteria and although I think Hilary Clinton has weathered many a storm, she is too much of a politician with her self interests and is generally not fit to run this country.


Well said!


----------



## susanmos2000

Irish knitter said:


> The book written by the head of the navy seals says differently. It is a accounting minute by minute of what REALLY happened and this guy wrote the book in honor of hid friends who died. There is NO political overtones. Just pure facts......


...as he, a man in the middle of a firefight, saw them. Hair-raising as his experiences may have been, he saw but a fraction of what was actually going on.


----------



## libra59_1

We'll be in worse trouble if she wins, than we are right now!


----------



## J.Carol

soloweygirl said:


> The economy is stagnant. DGP was under 2% last quarter. On a robust economy, which this should be by now with all the money thrown at it, DGP should be at a minimum of 4%. That is NOT being in its best shape. Job growth is slow, low paying jobs and part time work are dominating the economy. What higher paying jobs are available are not being filled because our citizens lack the skills to fill them. Annual salaries have dropped. Where are the manufacturing jobs? Where are the green jobs Obama promised as he lent money to all those green businesses? Oh that's right, they closed their doors and cited bankruptcy. The stock market is the only thing that is doing well. Those that can afford to invest are doing so, the rest of us can't afford to do so.


The Feds are dumping money into the stock market to make it look good.


----------



## loravaughn

If she is,elected just because she is a woman then you women who ekect her deserve what you get. My statement had nothing to do with politics. It was from being around and catching the butt end of her and her husband's shenanigans, mostly initiated by her stupidity and power grabbing.


----------



## Irish knitter

I just got finished reading ALL 38 pages!!!!!

WOW!!!!


----------



## susanmos2000

Irish knitter said:


> They asked 4 times to help and were denied by the White House!!!! I have done my research and have gotten the unbias truth from an American......NOT THE GOVERNMENT!


You don't even trust the findings of all those Republican-dominated investigative committees? Doesn't speak well of your faith in your own Party.


----------



## J.Carol

loravaughn said:


> If she is,elected just because she is a woman then you women who ekect her deserve what you get. My statement had nothing to do with politics. It was from being around and catching the butt end of her and her husband's shenanigans, mostly initiated by her stupidity and power grabbing.


Hillary doesn't have a snowballs chance of winning.....she is in the race for two reasons....the money....and the money....she is the controlled opposition....and with the huge some of monies she will take in....and funnel into her personal estate...this is her grand plan to take as much money....and grab whatever power she can along the way......she can charge a greater fee for her speeches.


----------



## Irish knitter

susanmos2000 said:


> ...as he, a man in the middle of a firefight, saw them. Hair-raising as his experiences may have been, he saw but a fraction of what was actually going on.


No....he saw it all; he was there.....

Mitchell Zuckoff with the Annex security team.

The book is 13 Hours......the inside account of what really happened in Benghazi.

This book documents the last hours of an American diplomatic outpost in one of the most dangerous corners of the globe. Based on firsthand accounts; it describes the bloody assault; tragic losses and heroic deeds at the US State Department Special Mission Compound and at a nearby CIA base called the Annex in Benghazi.


----------



## soloweygirl

susanmos2000 said:


> If the Obama administration did in fact "know immediately" that Benghazi was a terrorist attack then they arrived at that conclusion by faulty reasoning. The situation in the Middle East is so complicated that snap judgements can never be made with any degree of accuracy.


More BS. It wouldn't have been a snap judgment. A lot was going on in the region over the course of a few months. Both the British and Red Cross pulled out of Libya because of the escalating dangers. It was known there was terrorist activity in the area. It would not have been a snap judgment to claim it was a terrorist attack.


----------



## bahardaway

Save us from Hillory Clinton....I wouldn't vote for her if she was the only one running. I agree that Elizabeth Warren is a better choice. The Clinton's are one of the most dishonest big name families in America. She gives me the hives among other things....plus who wants old pants around his ankles Bill back in the White House...my 2 cents


----------



## nmgram

sandj said:


> A First Lady never became president? I wonder why?


My guess is because not one has run for the office before.


----------



## J.Carol

soloweygirl said:


> More BS. It wouldn't have been a snap judgment. A lot was going on in the region over the course of a few months. Both the British and Red Cross pulled out of Libya because of the escalating dangers. It was known there was terrorist activity in the area. It would not have been a snap judgment to claim it was a terrorist attack.


People are in high positions to make snap decisions.


----------



## soloweygirl

J.Carol said:


> People are in high positions to make snap decisions.


Exactly.


----------



## PARANDALL

Exactly!


jbandsma said:


> And, as such, can do much more good where she is.


----------



## susanmos2000

soloweygirl said:


> More BS. It wouldn't have been a snap judgment. A lot was going on in the region over the course of a few months. Both the British and Red Cross pulled out of Libya because of the escalating dangers. It was known there was terrorist activity in the area. It would not have been a snap judgment to claim it was a terrorist attack.


Sorry Soloweygirl, automatically branding every attack that occurs in a volatile area "terrorist" makes about as much sense as labeling every incident that occurs between a white cop and a black suspect "racial". Calling an individual/organization/country "terrorist" is a huge step because of the actions that must then by law take place--raids, arrests, economic sanctions, and overt military force. Whatever government officials may privately think about the whys and wherefores of an attack, they have a duty not to make it public until they're 100% sure.


----------



## mojave

J.Carol said:


> People are in high positions to make snap decisions.


Sometimes yes, sometimes no. Sources I read said Kennedy was urged to quickly order a full scale invasion of Cuba when the Russian missiles were spotted in the satellite photos. If he made that decision rather than choosing the naval blockade, it is probable the northern hemisphere of this planet would now be an uninhabitable radioactive wasteland.


----------



## theyarnlady

Irish knitter said:


> I have done my research.......READ the book!!


C Span the Benghazi three men who where apart of what happen reported these facts. They are on the record as facts. I watch it on C Span that day when these three where before the committee. So it is now on record what was done that day.

They were told to stand down . One of them was crying before committee about what had happen and what was not done to help those four men.


----------



## TAYATT

Hillary Clinton Election Video Cold Open - SNL


----------



## Kathie

libra59_1 said:


> We'll be in worse trouble if she wins, than we are right now!


Thoughts on Hillary

Then weigh her against the misogynistic, homophobic, anti public education, (check out Walkers cuts in education) anti middle class, ( check out their views on raising the minimum wage and equal pay for women) denial of environmental problems, (Walker wont allow the wordsclimate change to be used by WI officials), and the desire to interfere all over the world ideas of the Republicans it doesnt leave us much choice does it. We need better candidates across the board


----------



## NJG

GroodleMom said:


> Elizabeth Warren is a better choice: Strong, brilliant and without all the baggage.


I agree Elizabeth will someday be a terrific president, but she isn't running this time. I don't think she has enough foreign policy experience.


----------



## NJG

cathy47 said:


> This person cannot make up her mind how can she make decisions that are needed for this country. One min. she was next she wasn't.. not impressed. :thumbdown:


One minute she was what and then she wasn't. I don't understand your meaning.


----------



## theyarnlady

Kathie said:


> Thoughts on Hillary
> 
> Then weigh her against the misogynistic, homophobic, anti public education, (check out Walkers cuts in education) anti middle class, ( check out their views on raising the minimum wage and equal pay for women) denial of environmental problems, (Walker wont allow the wordsclimate change to be used by WI officials), and the desire to interfere all over the world ideas of the Republicans it doesnt leave us much choice does it. We need better candidates across the board


Not everyone in this state feels the same way as you do. There are actual people in this state who like what he has done. Maybe not everything , but they do like him and what he has done for this state.


----------



## Cheeky Blighter

tamarque said:


> Problem with Hilary is the same problem we had with B. Clinton and Obama. None of them have white male ruling class status. Hilary is Republican light which means little. We need to a complete redoing of the electoral politics to create meaningful change. Hilary, like Obama will support populace social issues like birth control and gay marriage. But like the others will not be able to withstand the power of the ruling 1% with its militaristic, genocidal agenda.
> 
> Personally, I can't stand Hilary but she will play with the boys. Elizabeth is a better choice but we have already seen her back off principled positions on larger political issues which are the real ones that control our lives. She will take on Wall Street on behalf of the consumer which Hilary will not.
> 
> On Benghazi: Global Research did an expose last year I think on the behind-the-scenes maneuvering. Unfortunately, allowing Benghazi to occur is business as usual for the ruling elite. Killing, or allowing to be killed, people who will blow the covers is not news in politics. So this is a non-issue for me because they all do it. Don't think I support this; I just don't see this as a unique event to separate her from the rest of the pack.


Many good points. :thumbup:


----------



## cathy73

Politics is a weird thing but I personally would prefer someone new. Not a democrat and not a republican, but someone who loves our country and has some brains and a backbone.


----------



## loubroy

Irish knitter said:


> I do not want to start a fight but I have lost all respect for Hillary after she said "who cares" after the death of our ambassador. I just finished 13 hours in Benghazi and they stated if she had moved right in the beginning none of them would have died and it WAS a terrorist attack and the whitehouse knew about it but kept their mouths shut.
> 
> Also...I have read what the whitehouse secret service said about her being "flying off the handle" at a moments notice; being B-tchy; in control and a all around pain in the a--.
> 
> All of this infornmation comes from reliable sources. They guy who wrote 13 hours in Benghazi was a survivor and just stated the facts. The secret service remarks I ran accross when I was looking up Caroline/John Kennedy's detail. They "tell all". Like the Bush twins were the worst to protect as they would run red lights to get rid of their agents and call "Daddy" when their agents caught up with them. The easiest to protect was Amy Carter.....her worst thing was roller skating in the whitehouse...
> 
> As I said before.....I am not trying to start an argument. Maybe we should be careful....
> 
> I will have to look to see where I got my whitehouse information.
> 
> Just think about the last Clinton whitehouse.....Bill was a front while Hillary ran it. We will be no better off than we are now.
> I am terrified if she wins....
> I do not like to get into politics but we are all doomed if she wins.......I want a woman in the whitehouse.....BUT the right woman and it is NOT hillary!!!


AMEN!!!!!


----------



## NJG

soloweygirl said:


> Hillary will have to answer questions this time around and not side step them or slough them off as she has in the past.
> 
> I agree with you galaxycraft, "she has not proven to be a leader".


So I am curious, who has proven to be a leader. Was Bush proven to be a leader because he invaded Iraq? Is Rand Paul a proven leader because he lied about his college degrees? Is Chris Cristie a proven leader because he tells people to "shut up and sit down?" It will be real interesting to know who you think a proven leader is.


----------



## alifletcher

So, again who do you think is a viable candidate ?


----------



## Cheeky Blighter

susanmos2000 said:


> You're right, but viewing the Clintons as anything but a two for one deal is virtually impossible. And I believe it's something the Republicans don't quite know how to deal with. Touting the notion that a vote for Hillary is in reality a vote for Bill could backfire big time--many Americans would see that as a plus.
> 
> This one included, I'm afraid. If Bill Clinton was eligible for a third term I'd vote for him in a heartbeat. That treacherous, do-nothing Congress needs to be put down with a firm hand, and Bill would be just the man for the job.


 :thumbup: :thumbup: :thumbup: :thumbup: :thumbup: :thumbup:


----------



## alifletcher

Although her major initiative, the Clinton health care plan failed, it certainly set the groundwork for the health care law we have today, the Affordable Care Act. And she played a leading role in advocating the creation of the State Children's Health Insurance Program, which provides state support for children whose parents cannot provide them with health coverage. She promoted nationwide immunization against childhood illnesses. She also played a leading role in creation of the Adoption and Safe Families Act and the Foster Care Independence Act. She encouraged older women to seek a mammogram for early detection of breast cancer (which is covered by Medicare) and successfully sought to increase research funding for prostate cancer and childhood asthma at the NIH. She worked to investigate illnesses that were reportedly affecting Veterans of the Gulf War; now commonly known as Gulf War Syndrome. And she created an Office on Violence Against Women at the Department of Justice. She is also the first first lady to hold a post graduate degree, and she traveled to more countries than any other first lady had at that time.

[See a collection of political cartoons on defense spending.]

As a U.S. senator, she was the first first lady to be elected to this office. She was instrumental in securing $21 billion in funding for the World Trade Center site's redevelopment. She subsequently took a leading role in investigating the health issues that 9/11 first responders were facing.

After visiting soldiers in Iraq, Clinton noted that the insurgency had failed to disrupt the democratic elections held earlier, and that parts of the country were functioning well. Noting that war deployments were draining regular and reserve forces, she cointroduced legislation to increase the size of the regular Army by 80,000 soldiers to ease the strain and supported retaining and improving health benefits for veterans. She also she introduced the Family Entertainment Protection Act.

That was just in her first term. She was easily re-elected and accomplished much in her second term as well. And who can forget her run for the presidency, receiving more than 17 million votes during the nomination process?

As our secretary of state, Clinton visited 112 countries, helping to repair a badly damaged U.S. reputation. She advocated an expanded role in global economic issues for the State Department and cited the need for an increased U.S. diplomatic presence, especially in Iraq, where the Defense Department had conducted diplomatic missions. Clinton unveiled the Global Hunger and Food Security program, prevailed over Vice President Biden to send an additional 21,000 troops to Afghanistan, saved the signing of a Turkish-Armenian accord, and assisted the president with major decisions as to the U.S. position with regard to the revolution in Egypt and the decision to use military force in Libya.


----------



## Janeway

The ACA is such a joke as well as Hilgory! Both of my daughters insurance premiums increased in order to pay for the "have nots" who gets cheap or don't pay for insurance!

Hilgory must stop covering up her deals as did Bill when he said I didn't have sex with that woman! Hilgory said who cares about Benghazi! What difference did it make! Hello, hello people put your head on straight about Hilgory!


----------



## train

If Hillary gets voted in, no one will have my sympathy.
I think she is a liar, and hasn't done anything for this country. And by the way, has any candidate even mentioned the southern border?


----------



## Cheeky Blighter

tamarque said:


> This is an uninformed opinion. Obama is only as powerful as the people behind and next to him. I dont like a lot of what he has supported, however, the GOP would have been even worse. They make no bones about their hatred for the American people. Their racism and sexism are not even veiled due to their incredible arrogance. But no president has the power alone to make changes. The office is a figure head position unless that person is part of the 1% oligarchy.
> 
> So we have a major dilemma with a 2 party system that prevents real alternatives getting elected. We get someone from the 1% and there are no mysteries about what they support which is clearly not the people, or we get someone who will promote some social programs and social justice (minimally) but will not confront the 1% on their hegemonic goals of controlling the world.
> 
> Thus, Obama is not a monolithic individual as no one is in his role. And not to recognize this is clearly uninformed.


Thanks for telling the truth. To believe otherwise is folly.


----------



## Fiona3

cathy47 said:


> This person cannot make up her mind how can she make decisions that are needed for this country. One min. she was next she wasn't.. not impressed. :thumbdown:


Totally agree!!! 👹👹👹


----------



## Kathie

theyarnlady said:


> Not everyone in this state feels the same way as you do. There are actual people in this state who like what he has done. Maybe not everything , but they do like him and what he has done for this state.


You are certainly right yarn lady. He even survived a recall election but the idea of drastically cutting funds for education in the state is really scary. Our citizens are all better off if the population is well educated. He does have money to help the Milwaukee Bucks build a new arena though and the idea that WI officials can't mention climate change is ludicrous. People like the idea that he has cut taxes but we will pay a heavy price for less educated populous and denial of existing environmental problems in the name of less taxes.


----------



## alifletcher

Her name is Hiliary .


----------



## Artbarn

joeysomma said:


> You missed one of his important votes, while in the Illinois Legislature. He did vote for letting babies die, if they were alive after aborted.


Yes, Joeysomma. You are right. I was in a rush because I had to go out. His vote on that issue is a disgrace.


----------



## lkb850

mojave said:


> Okay, one more posting to answer you and kpg
> I was military, received my discharges years ago. I took college courses while on active duty and earned my PhD after leaving the military. Have you only had one job your entire life? If yes, I hope you found it fulfilling. It would be sad to think circumstances prevented you from meeting your full potential.
> 
> Mojave, I want to thank you for your military service and sacrifice. My husband was military for 22 years (and he has had a second job for 21 years now). I know how hard it is to be in the military. Bless you.


----------



## Artbarn

WindingRoad said:


> That's correct up to a point. We should always wait to see if someone dies before we try to stop them from dying. Then in hindsight we can say we didn't want to jump to conclusions in such a volatile part of the world. Yep typical government think......


Yup. :thumbup:


----------



## Cheeky Blighter

mojave said:


> Your comments are meant to be insulting. They actually demonstrate your unfamiliarity with life in a university lab where there are graduate students.
> 
> Yes, trained in how to use scientific equipment. The monkey see, monkey push nearest button approach is disastrous when executed in a lab filled with high tech equipment. It requires most people at least six months to become full competent with all the equipment.
> 
> Yes, trained in how to design a rigorous experiment, how to collect data and samples, how to analyze the data using statistical software.
> 
> Yes, trained in how speak, stand, and present their research at a science conference. Trained in how to compose a high quality slide presentation. Too much information on one slide or cluttered graphs kill a presentation.
> 
> Yes, trained in how to write a journal article likely to be accepted for publication. Training in how to handle the criticism inherent in the peer review process.


She is intimidated by what she doesn't understand so she is always in attack mode. Fight of flight.


----------



## Artbarn

Irish knitter said:


> They asked 4 times to help and were denied by the White House!!!! I have done my research and have gotten the unbias truth from an American......NOT THE GOVERNMENT!


I'm with Irish Knitter. I've heard these same facts from the mouths of those who were there (again I've seen video of them making these statements).


----------



## Cheeky Blighter

WindingRoad said:


> Can you explain the recent uptick in Republican support? I didn't think so.


In your dreams.


----------



## Bridgeknitter

Oh my-- are there really 40 pages of political discussion on our KNITTER'S blog? 
I hope this isn't a sign of things to come.


----------



## Elin

"What difference does it make?"


----------



## Artbarn

susanmos2000 said:


> *sigh* No, they were not told to "stand down", as even the Senate Intelligence committee concluded in January 2014. Why not do a bit of research on the subject?


Well the people who were there would disagree with you and the Senate Intelligence Committee--maybe you're the one who should do the research. Oh wait, I did it for you: 
http://www.intelligence.senate.gov/press/record.cfm?id=349314


----------



## Artbarn

soloweygirl said:


> The economy is stagnant. DGP was under 2% last quarter. On a robust economy, which this should be by now with all the money thrown at it, DGP should be at a minimum of 4%. That is NOT being in its best shape. Job growth is slow, low paying jobs and part time work are dominating the economy. What higher paying jobs are available are not being filled because our citizens lack the skills to fill them. Annual salaries have dropped. Where are the manufacturing jobs? Where are the green jobs Obama promised as he lent money to all those green businesses? Oh that's right, they closed their doors and cited bankruptcy. The stock market is the only thing that is doing well. Those that can afford to invest are doing so, the rest of us can't afford to do so.


Exactly.


----------



## susanmos2000

Artbarn said:


> Well the people who were there would disagree with you and the Senate Intelligence Committee--maybe you're the one who should do the research. Oh wait, I did it for you:
> http://www.intelligence.senate.gov/press/record.cfm?id=349314


Sorry, Artbarn, That's just a brief summary of the findings and says nothing about orders being given to "Stand Down" (wonder why). I can produce a more detailed summary if you care to peruse it.


----------



## Artbarn

susanmos2000 said:


> ...as he, a man in the middle of a firefight, saw them. Hair-raising as his experiences may have been, he saw but a fraction of what was actually going on.


There are multiple people who were there and have spoken up on this, including high-level military officers.


----------



## Artbarn

susanmos2000 said:


> You don't even trust the findings of all those Republican-dominated investigative committees? Doesn't speak well of your faith in your own Party.


Maybe blind faith in one party isn't such a good thing.


----------



## Grandma Jo

Of all the candidates, Democrat or Republican, I prefer Republican Senator John McCain. He has been around for a long time and maybe he and God could get us out of the giant mess this country is in. I know I will get a lot of disagreement over this, but I think we need a real change.


----------



## Artbarn

susanmos2000 said:


> Sorry Soloweygirl, automatically branding every attack that occurs in a volatile area "terrorist" makes about as much sense as labeling every incident that occurs between a white cop and a black suspect "racial". Calling an individual/organization/country "terrorist" is a huge step because of the actions that must then by law take place--raids, arrests, economic sanctions, and overt military force. Whatever government officials may privately think about the whys and wherefores of an attack, they have a duty not to make it public until they're 100% sure.


What??!! It's based on facts, not guessing and automatically branding. Give up. The facts are there.


----------



## susanmos2000

Artbarn said:


> There are multiple people who were there and have spoken up on this, including high-level military officers.


Try to stay focused, Artbarn. We were discussing an account written from a Navy Seal's perspective.


----------



## collectordolls

What happened to voting for the right person. Not because they are a woman or black. She is not the right person to be president. She is a crook, did you forget about Whitewater. She let the men die in Benghazi, when she knew what was going on there. She did nothing for New York when she was senator. Are you all sheeple just vote for her because you want a woman in the White House. I would rather have Sarah Palin then Hilary. At least with Sarah you saw what you were getting, Hilary is a sneak and a back stabber.


----------



## gloriam

Knitter from Nebraska said:


> Strong women will always be called bit#hes. That's OK. Sometimes we need to be bit#hes to get the job done. I say, we should own it. It doesn't matter what they call us. We're better at multi tasking and better at solving problems. We're more peace seeking.
> 
> That said, Hillary Clinton is NOT the right woman for the job. She's in the pocket of corporate big wigs.


Have to agree with Nebraska, Hillary is definitely NOT a good choice.


----------



## theyarnlady

susanmos2000 said:


> Try to stay focused, Artbarn. We were discussing an account written from a Navy Seal's perspective.


I'm not Susan I watch it live on C Span and it is on the record. 
The committee heard it and any one who watch it live on C Span heard it.

I heard it from all those 3 witness. It wasn't a book it wasn't from a Navy Seal , it was on C Span and it was live. 
So I don't know where you got your information from but it sure was not in the records, as you have posted.


----------



## Artbarn

susanmos2000 said:


> Try to stay focused, Artbarn. We were discussing an account written from a Navy Seal's perspective.


I beg your pardon? You're telling me what I can and cannot discuss? There are accounts about Benghazi made by multiple military people, including high level military officers. It was a terrorist attack and Washington knew this from the start. You can't hide from the facts.


----------



## susanmos2000

Artbarn said:


> What??!! It's based on facts, not guessing and automatically branding. Give up. The facts are there.


Once again you're falling behind. The question wasn't whether Benghazi was or was not a terrorist attack. It's whether such a designation can be made without an investigation.


----------



## judeanne

I see the Fox News machine has invaded a lot of the women on this forum. Complain complain complain but never offer anything even close to a solution. There is not one repub alive either male or female who could do a better job than Hillary. And for the Obama bashers...get your heads out of the sand and read some truths about this brave man.


----------



## Artbarn

Artbarn said:


> Who said I got any of this from Fox News? How can you say that I don't learn from a variety of sources? Again, I say prove it. You can't.
> 
> The unemployment rate is based on how many people have jobs.  Unfortunately, too many of those jobs are part-time and minimum-wage jobs. You can't raise a family on those kinds of jobs. I have to leave now, but will come back later with more details.
> 
> I don't follow the stock market, so I can't answer that question.


Here is the link that I didn't have time to find earlier:
http://www.forbes.com/sites/anaswanson/2015/03/31/what-if-americas-unemployment-rate-is-really-wrong/

The true unemployment rate is between 7.4% and 9.4% because so many people are underemployed (part-time jobs or lower-paying jobs) and the people who have given up looking for employment are not included in the government unemployment rates.

We are not nearly as well off as this administration wants us to believe.


----------



## theyarnlady

Artbarn said:


> I beg your pardon? You're telling me what I can and cannot discuss? There are accounts about Benghazi made by multiple military people, including high level military officers. It was a terrorist attack and Washington knew this from the start. You can't hide from the facts.


Your right so very right. It can not be turned around as untrue.

Those three men who spoken before the congressionly Committee . One man who was a friend of Steven broke down as they were not allowed to go into Benghazi to help those four men. Those are the fact and it is on the record and no one can say otherwise.


----------



## Artbarn

susanmos2000 said:


> Once again you're falling behind. The question wasn't whether Benghazi was or was not a terrorist attack. It's whether such a designation can be made without an investigation.


I think you are the one who is falling behind. I already addressed this a couple of times. Of course this designation can be made when the facts are so blatant that an investigation is not necessary.

I'm done with this conversation. I'm going back to knitting.


----------



## Grandma Jo

judeanne said:


> I see the Fox News machine has invaded a lot of the women on this forum. Complain complain complain but never offer anything even close to a solution. There is not one repub alive either male or female who could do a better job than Hillary. And for the Obama bashers...get your heads out of the sand and read some truths about this brave man.


Oh Yeah, ha, ha, ha!!!!!!!!!


----------



## Jayne13

Didn't Hilary step down from sec. of state because of health problems? All of a sudden she got her health back? Obama wasn't qualified to run a country either. Lets wait to see who else will throw their hat in the ring on the GOP side. We need a man that has some balls & follows the constitution.


----------



## theyarnlady

judeanne said:


> I see the Fox News machine has invaded a lot of the women on this forum. Complain complain complain but never offer anything even close to a solution. There is not one repub alive either male or female who could do a better job than Hillary. And for the Obama bashers...get your heads out of the sand and read some truths about this brave man.


Oh please not again, if you do not agree with the left you are a Fox fan. Please there are more intelligent women on here who do not use the Fox bait like you are trying to use.

Try C Span you may learn more then what you think of as only women who watch Fox news have an opinion that is different from yours.


----------



## babesy

Judeanne,

There are so many debates televised on FOX where there is a conservative, and a liberal, plus the moderator. Does CNN or MSNBC do this? Answer please? Do you watch FOX once in a while, and with an open mind? My nephew in Atlanta worked for CNN, I watched hoping to catch a glimpse of him, and was aghast how the interviewers spin the news, what happened. They do have their own interpretation of truth there. MSNBC's ratings are in the tank, so are CNN, why? Because people want to learn the truth, and sometimes catch those lib/cons debates. FOX gives libs the chance to make their points.

Did you even know that?


----------



## Artbarn

babesy said:


> Judeanne,
> 
> There are so many debates televised on FOX where there is a conservative, and a liberal, plus the moderator. Does CNN or MSNBC do this? Answer please? Do you watch FOX once in a while, and with an open mind? My nephew in Atlanta worked for CNN, I watched hoping to catch a glimpse of him, and was aghast how the interviewers spin the news, what happened. They do have their own interpretation of truth there. MSNBC's ratings are in the tank, so are CNN, why? Because people want to learn the truth, and sometimes catch those lib/cons debates. FOX gives libs the chance to make their points.
> 
> Did you even know that?


 :thumbup:


----------



## jodymorse151

Irish knitter said:


> I am terrified if she wins....
> I do not like to get into politics but we are all doomed if she wins.......I want a woman in the whitehouse.....BUT the right woman and it is NOT hillary!!!


I am with you this though I do stay out of politics ... especially on HERE.

Saying she has experience because she was the wife of a president is like saying she can play football if her husband was a quarterback.

I will not read more of the posts because this could get ugly


----------



## theyarnlady

jodymorse151 said:


> I am with you this though I do stay out of politics ... especially on HERE.
> 
> Saying she has experience because she was the wife of a president is like saying she can play football if her husband was a quarterback.
> 
> I will not read more of the posts because this could get ugly


oh that is so so funny. good one :thumbup:


----------



## pierrette

Elin said:


> "What difference does it make?"


 :lol: :lol: :lol: :lol: :lol: :lol:


----------



## Country Bumpkins

TAYATT said:


> Hillary Clinton Election Video Cold Open - SNL
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> I missed that. Thank you so much. All to true! :shock: :-o


----------



## theyarnlady

Country Bumpkins said:


> I missed that. Thank you so much. All to true! :shock: :-o


and it was funny too. :thumbup:


----------



## Country Bumpkins

babesy said:


> Judeanne,
> 
> There are so many debates televised on FOX where there is a conservative, and a liberal, plus the moderator. Does CNN or MSNBC do this? Answer please? Do you watch FOX once in a while, and with an open mind? My nephew in Atlanta worked for CNN, I watched hoping to catch a glimpse of him, and was aghast how the interviewers spin the news, what happened. They do have their own interpretation of truth there. MSNBC's ratings are in the tank, so are CNN, why? Because people want to learn the truth, and sometimes catch those lib/cons debates. FOX gives libs the chance to make their points.
> 
> Did you even know that?


 :thumbup:


----------



## craftygac

Wow I have sat on the fence on answering this. I am a business women and worked hard and respected all the laws in business and government. I am sorry I will not vote for this women between the benghazi issue, breaking the rules about private emails, not respecting the public when they ask her questions, how can you trust a women who doesn't follow the rules. Elizabeth Warren if you vote for a tax increase on gas tax and you don't even know what the current tax is hello - this is not a smart women. She has scary values on who she backs. This is not a political forum but I can't sit back on this one. Clinton scares me and Warren has her head buried in the sand except for what she wants and who wants it. I use to think any one could be better than Obama (as my health care has gone done the tubes since he has taken over) but these two women sorry no in my book. I wish there was somewhere out there who could take over and fix the mess Obama created, our debt is outstanding, the world thinks he is a fool except for the muslims, its scary. I pray everyday a dark horse candidate can come out and straighten this mess out. Our senators need less time in office they get too comfortable they just get in it for the pension and health plan (mind you that we don't get they don't want the Obama plan they have their own including their own social security type pension). No wonder they don't work for us once they get into office. I have read the Obama health care plan from top to botton. God help the eldery that are sick. I have waited seven months to have two torn meniscus in one knee fixed. I pay good for my plan its not free and I watch illegals getting in before me as I barely make it to work of which I am 72 and still working. What is wrong with this picture. Think before you vote this year. I will probably make some enemies but its not just my opinion. God bless us all - because you are an eloquent speaker does not make you a good president. Just an opinon mine. A person that has worked since I have been 15 years of age and paid into the system and watch illegals come in and get a house, free health care, and subsidies to live on. Again what is wrong with this picture.


----------



## DGreen

sandj said:


> A First Lady never became president? I wonder why?


Are you joking or truly that ignorant of American history?


----------



## luvrcats

Hilary--President!!?? She will NEVER receive my vote. With all that she has done in a negative, lying way...how could she EVER be trusted to lead OUR country. I will pray that she doesn't have a chance!! Obama has done enough damage for generations to come.....do we really need more of the same.


----------



## babesy

Mrs. Clinton's scandal-ridden past. Another democrat bending the law to suit personal needs.


Private e-mail/private server scandal

Openly defying Federal Records Act (after accusing Bush of doing the same)

e-mail again - hiding her private knowledge of NSA practices and Benghazi

Sweetheart deal for her brother re: mining company in Haiti - this is one is quite incestuous involving Bill Clinton, Anthony Rodham, a permit the likes of which hasn't been issued by the Haitian govt. for 50 years, and the Bill's fundraising efforts to raise money for Haiti's rebuilding efforts.

Benghazi - 3 times help requested of State Department, and 3 times help denied. 

The mysterious video which State blamed the uprising on, and the arrest of the poor man blamed for making it. He is still in prison, to my knowledge, even though it has been thoroughly proven that the video story was concocted to cover up Clinton's ineptness.

"What difference, at this point, does it make?"

In 2007 - hiring Sandy Berger as her personal advisor. S B was the man convicted of smuggling personal records out of the National Archives for the purpose of covering up Bills' inability to contain terrorists during his presidency. A very stupid move on Hilary's part, to hire a criminal as her personal assistant.

A man named Peter Paul (yes, that's his name) made a significant donation to her campaign, but Hilary majorly under-reported it, allegedly benefitting by a huge sum of money flowing to Hilary's campaign chest. She took no responsibility for this.

Wikileaks sccandal - Clinton's state department gave the order for the spying on of American's phone conversations, computers, etc. which Hilary denied - even though her signature appeared at the bottom of the order.

I quote this directly from usasocialcontition.com: This is another of Hillary Clintons scandals that is just downright low. While serving as the Secretary of State, Clinton interceded 6 times in federal affairs in favor of companies that had directly contributed to Bill Clintons not-for-profit foundation. At best, this is woeful negligence on Hillarys part. At the worst, it is a blatant example of Hillary Clintons willingness to scratch the backs of those who help her and her husband. This kind of nefarious unethical action should have no place in Washington D.C., and the American people will certainly take note of this scandal during the presidential elections in 2016.

Now, I haven't cited "Vince Foster" and some of the older stuff, because I don't need to go any further back than all the above to make my point.


----------



## alifletcher

Are you serious ! Bill O'Reilly does not let anyone speak. He out yells everyone he interviews, Conservatives, Independents and Liberals !


----------



## Cheeky Blighter

mojave said:


> I do have major influence on what classes they take, what research they do. Why would I accept a grad who wants to do research in medieval French literature? My ignorance in that area is huge.
> If a graduate student wants to do research on the genetics of zebra fish, that student has no place in my lab. We don't do research in that area and do not have the facilities to support such research. All my graduate students do research related in some way to my research. It is the same in every university lab around the world. Grads do research in an area related to their advisor's research because the advisor has the equipment, experience and network of other scientists to support the grad's research.
> Please if you feel the need to insult me or my graduate students, at least take some time to know what you are talking about.


Some people are intimidated by education beyond high school. I believe they fear what they do not understand ergo it must then be bad or evil.


----------



## DGreen

J.Carol said:


> The Feds are dumping money into the stock market to make it look good.


Where do you get such bogus ideas? Source?


----------



## Cheeky Blighter

sumpleby said:


> Trust me, this is not a "hate response," but ROFLMAO. Absolutely no one was "frightened by Palin." The woman is an idiot and showed it at every turn. People WERE frightened by the idea of her being one step away from being POTUS if something should happen to McCain.


Saddest of all is solo really believes what she posted. :XD: :XD:


----------



## Cheeky Blighter

onegrannygoose said:


> I don't have to prove that your research is flawed. If you think FOX news is really news that automatically shows you that your research is slanted. You say that you read all of the opposite views however your responses prove that you don't.
> 
> If Obama is so bad why is the economy in the best shape it has been since before the Bush years?
> 
> Why is job growth continuing to climb month after month ? Why is unemployment down to 5% ?
> 
> Why is the stock market higher than ever before?
> 
> If you can explain all these things away I will listen to what you have to say.


 :thumbup: :thumbup: :thumbup: :thumbup: :thumbup: :thumbup:


----------



## luvrcats

to babesy......well said!


----------



## DGreen

Grandma Jo said:


> Of all the candidates, Democrat or Republican, I prefer Republican Senator John McCain. He has been around for a long time and maybe he and God could get us out of the giant mess this country is in. I know I will get a lot of disagreement over this, but I think we need a real change.


Perhaps you would like to invite that SOB to move to Montana to be YOUR senator. I've lived in Arizona longer than McCain has and he's not only useless, he's senile. He's history in 2016.


----------



## Pope

Way to go Hilary. YOU GO GIRL!!


----------



## Cheeky Blighter

soloweygirl said:


> They were afraid of Palin. McCain was a non issue as soon as Palin made her speech. After plenty of attacks against her character, for no other reason than fear, even the McCain campaign turned on Palin.


She was and is a joke no one but idiots took seriously. Get real :XD:


----------



## Cheeky Blighter

Irish knitter said:


> The book written by the head of the navy seals says differently. It is a accounting minute by minute of what REALLY happened and this guy wrote the book in honor of hid friends who died. There is NO political overtones. Just pure facts......


And how do you know it isn't all fiction?


----------



## Cheeky Blighter

Irish knitter said:


> I have done my research.......READ the book!!


Do you believe everything you read? Obviously you do. :thumbdown:


----------



## Cheeky Blighter

soloweygirl said:


> More BS. It wouldn't have been a snap judgment. A lot was going on in the region over the course of a few months. Both the British and Red Cross pulled out of Libya because of the escalating dangers. It was known there was terrorist activity in the area. It would not have been a snap judgment to claim it was a terrorist attack.


Simple minds see things simplistically. The world is much more complex than you can even imagine.


----------



## Janeway

Oh, I can read how the Democrats have jumped in on this thread! Here are facts about Hilgory!


----------



## Gerslay

3 pages pro Hillary ... 40 pages con Hillary

And what have we got? A handful of angry libs waking up to what the rest of the country really thinks about Hillary and her run for the Presidency.


----------



## collectordolls

train said:


> If Hillary gets voted in, no one will have my sympathy.
> I think she is a liar, and hasn't done anything for this country. And by the way, has any candidate even mentioned the southern border?


Why would they mention the southern border they want to get voted in. They need the immigrant vote.


----------



## Grandma Jo

DGreen said:


> Perhaps you would like to invite that SOB to move to Montana to be YOUR senator. I've lived in Arizona longer than McCain has and he's not only useless, he's senile. He's history in 2016.


Okay, if you say so!!!! Not enough people in Montana to bother with.


----------



## caseykey

Not reading all these posts but I lack respect for her. And she carries lots of baggage. We don't need more.


----------



## Stampergrandma

GroodleMom said:


> Elizabeth Warren is a better choice: Strong, brilliant and without all the baggage.


I agree with you, but I don't think Senator Warren is going to run for president this time around, she may be Hillary Clintons choice for V.P.


----------



## Stampergrandma

Irish knitter said:


> I do not want to start a fight but I have lost all respect for Hillary after she said "who cares" after the death of our ambassador. I just finished 13 hours in Benghazi and they stated if she had moved right in the beginning none of them would have died and it WAS a terrorist attack and the whitehouse knew about it but kept their mouths shut.
> 
> Also...I have read what the whitehouse secret service said about her being "flying off the handle" at a moments notice; being B-tchy; in control and a all around pain in the a--.
> 
> All of this infornmation comes from reliable sources. They guy who wrote 13 hours in Benghazi was a survivor and just stated the facts. The secret service remarks I ran accross when I was looking up Caroline/John Kennedy's detail. They "tell all". Like the Bush twins were the worst to protect as they would run red lights to get rid of their agents and call "Daddy" when their agents caught up with them. The easiest to protect was Amy Carter.....her worst thing was roller skating in the whitehouse...
> 
> As I said before.....I am not trying to start an argument. Maybe we should be careful....
> 
> I will have to look to see where I got my whitehouse information.
> 
> Just think about the last Clinton whitehouse.....Bill was a front while Hillary ran it. We will be no better off than we are now.
> I am terrified if she wins....
> I do not like to get into politics but we are all doomed if she wins.......I want a woman in the whitehouse.....BUT the right woman and it is NOT hillary!!!


Not to get too political, but the Clinton whitehouse did very well as far as the budget was concerned. It was a great economy during Mr. Clinton's run.


----------



## momeee

Artbarn said:


> Artbarn wrote:
> I didn't vote for him because I did my research. I saw exactly what his history was, what his experience was (or lack of it), how he avoided voting on so many important issues while in the Illinois legislature as well as the US Senate--he voted "present." I saw what kind of President he would be and he has proven me to be correct.
> 
> When he won the election, I said, "Well, the silver lining is that the
> American people have elected a black man as President." I thought that at least he would improve race relations. Instead, I see the opposite.
> 
> Really. Prove it. He was raised by communists and associated with radicals when he was growing up. He voted "present" numerous times in the Illinois legislature and the U.S. Senate to avoid taking a stand.


...and if we had access to all the documents he (or his handlers) paid millions to bury, we'd realize that he is much worse than what he has demonstrated to be, thus far. There is ABSOLUTELY NOTHING in his known background that is admirable or qualifies him to be the president.


----------



## g-mom

My forty year son says "She scares me, and she would be the undoing of our fragile nation."
I concur.


----------



## SQM

DGreen said:


> Where do you get such bogus ideas? Source?


So glad to see Bright Green back. This is your kind of thread.


----------



## Designer1234

Grandma Jo said:


> Okay, if you say so!!!! Not enough people in Montana to bother with.


Wow, what a nice thing to stay, a bit superior aren't you? Montana happens to have the nicest People you can imagine. I am sure they will really enjoy your statement. I wonder how many votes you lost from a State that if I am correct, votes Republican. How about giving your opinion of the people of the other states too?

Keep on insulting more and more of the people of the different States, somebody will start realizing how superior you feel. :XD: :XD: :XD: :mrgreen: :shock:


----------



## WindingRoad

GroodleMom said:


> Elizabeth Warren is a better choice: Strong, brilliant and without all the baggage.


Except that little heritage thingy.


----------



## WindingRoad

Stampergrandma said:


> Not to get too political, but the Clinton whitehouse did very well as far as the budget was concerned. It was a great economy during Mr. Clinton's run.


It didn't stand the test of time thought did it.


----------



## Lucas' mom

I am utterly horrified and amazed that ANYONE in his/her right mind would even consider using their vote to attempt to elect Hillary Clinton! Would anyone in his/her right mind vote for her simply because she is a woman? Have we REALLY slipped far in our values??


----------



## ute4kp

Janeway said:


> The ACA is such a joke as well as Hilgory! Both of my daughters insurance premiums increased in order to pay for the "have nots" who gets cheap or don't pay for insurance!
> 
> Hilgory must stop covering up her deals as did Bill when he said I didn't have sex with that woman! Hilgory said who cares about Benghazi! What difference did it make! Hello, hello people put your head on straight about Hilgory!


Your writing is that of a slack-jawed creep.


----------



## Stampergrandma

WindingRoad said:


> Did I ever say Hill was young? And Lizzy looks older than Hairy. She thinks money grows on trees I guess.


I'm sorry, but I don't quite get what you are saying here. Are you saying we should vote for someone who looks young and knows how to dress? I strongly disagree! Elizabeth Warren has the right idea on how to make our country great. I think the real question is not how old she looks, but how would she be able to get her ideals into reality. I think that's the big question for any politician.


----------



## SQM

I proudly reported Janeway's memes to the Ostrich. They were beyond any standard of good taste.


----------



## Stampergrandma

WindingRoad said:


> It didn't stand the test of time thought did it.


It did until G. Bush got into office and that's when it all fell down.


----------



## WindingRoad

Stampergrandma said:


> I'm sorry, but I don't quite get what you are saying here. Are you saying we should vote for someone who looks young and knows how to dress? I strongly disagree! Elizabeth Warren has the right idea on how to make our country great. I think the real question is not how old she looks, but how would she be able to get her ideals into reality. I think that's the big question for any politician.


Ah you agree with me. Funny how that works.


----------



## ute4kp

babesy said:


> Judeanne,
> 
> There are so many debates televised on FOX where there is a conservative, and a liberal, plus the moderator. Does CNN or MSNBC do this? Answer please? Do you watch FOX once in a while, and with an open mind? My nephew in Atlanta worked for CNN, I watched hoping to catch a glimpse of him, and was aghast how the interviewers spin the news, what happened. They do have their own interpretation of truth there. MSNBC's ratings are in the tank, so are CNN, why? Because people want to learn the truth, and sometimes catch those lib/cons debates. FOX gives libs the chance to make their points.
> 
> Did you even know that?


Foxy faux does not.


----------



## WindingRoad

Stampergrandma said:


> It did until G. Bush got into office and that's when it all fell down.


Good solid things don't fall down.


----------



## Stampergrandma

WindingRoad said:


> Except that little heritage thingy.


Really? :thumbdown:


----------



## WindingRoad

Stampergrandma said:


> Really? :thumbdown:


Yeah. She lied imagine that? A politician lying for money. I know it's hard to fathom.


----------



## Designer1234

alifletcher said:


> Although her major initiative, the Clinton health care plan failed, it certainly set the groundwork for the health care law we have today, the Affordable Care Act. And she played a leading role in advocating the creation of the State Children's Health Insurance Program, which provides state support for children whose parents cannot provide them with health coverage. She promoted nationwide immunization against childhood illnesses. She also played a leading role in creation of the Adoption and Safe Families Act and the Foster Care Independence Act. She encouraged older women to seek a mammogram for early detection of breast cancer (which is covered by Medicare) and successfully sought to increase research funding for prostate cancer and childhood asthma at the NIH. She worked to investigate illnesses that were reportedly affecting Veterans of the Gulf War; now commonly known as Gulf War Syndrome. And she created an Office on Violence Against Women at the Department of Justice. She is also the first first lady to hold a post graduate degree, and she traveled to more countries than any other first lady had at that time.
> 
> [See a collection of political cartoons on defense spending.]
> 
> As a U.S. senator, she was the first first lady to be elected to this office. She was instrumental in securing $21 billion in funding for the World Trade Center site's redevelopment. She subsequently took a leading role in investigating the health issues that 9/11 first responders were facing.
> 
> After visiting soldiers in Iraq, Clinton noted that the insurgency had failed to disrupt the democratic elections held earlier, and that parts of the country were functioning well. Noting that war deployments were draining regular and reserve forces, she cointroduced legislation to increase the size of the regular Army by 80,000 soldiers to ease the strain and supported retaining and improving health benefits for veterans. She also she introduced the Family Entertainment Protection Act.
> 
> That was just in her first term. She was easily re-elected and accomplished much in her second term as well. And who can forget her run for the presidency, receiving more than 17 million votes during the nomination process?
> 
> As our secretary of state, Clinton visited 112 countries, helping to repair a badly damaged U.S. reputation. She advocated an expanded role in global economic issues for the State Department and cited the need for an increased U.S. diplomatic presence, especially in Iraq, where the Defense Department had conducted diplomatic missions. Clinton unveiled the Global Hunger and Food Security program, prevailed over Vice President Biden to send an additional 21,000 troops to Afghanistan, saved the signing of a Turkish-Armenian accord, and assisted the president with major decisions as to the U.S. position with regard to the revolution in Egypt and the decision to use military force in Libya.


 :thumbup: :thumbup: :thumbup:


----------



## theyarnlady

Gerslay said:


> 3 pages pro Hillary ... 40 pages con Hillary
> 
> And what have we got? A handful of angry libs waking up to what the rest of the country really thinks about Hillary and her run for the Presidency.


 :thumbup:


----------



## WindingRoad

Designer1234 said:


> :thumbup: :thumbup: :thumbup:


First lady to be elected to what office?


----------



## gloria Lambe

Oh NO, anybody but Hillary - or Michelle - neither are FIT for the office of President of the United States...


----------



## ute4kp

SQM said:


> I proudly reported Janeway's memes to the Ostrich. They were beyond any standard of good taste.


How janewrongway can post anything like that is beyond belief of any rational person.


----------



## momeee

Artbarn said:


> I beg your pardon? You're telling me what I can and cannot discuss? There are accounts about Benghazi made by multiple military people, including high level military officers. It was a terrorist attack and Washington knew this from the start. You can't hide from the facts.


 :thumbup: :thumbup: :thumbup: :thumbup: :thumbup: :thumbup: :thumbup: :thumbup: :thumbup: :thumbup:


----------



## ute4kp

joeysomma said:


> Were you better off after his 8 years? We, definitely, were not.


Yes. Better.


----------



## sumnerusa

GroodleMom said:


> Elizabeth Warren is a better choice: Strong, brilliant and without all the baggage.


Elizabeth says she won't run.


----------



## Stampergrandma

ute4kp said:


> Yes. Better.


 :thumbup: :thumbup:


----------



## Stampergrandma

WindingRoad said:


> Ah you agree with me. Funny how that works.


Not quite!


----------



## yotbum

GroodleMom said:


> Elizabeth Warren is a better choice: Strong, brilliant and without all the baggage.


I completely agree with you. Elizabeth Warren is a remarkable woman. That said, she doesn't want to run. Hillary will pave the way for Warren and, hopefully, other strong and smart women to follow.


----------



## Jan's

Since I am not a liberal the thought of Hillary Clinton in the White House makes my skin crawl. I found that she and Bill did not just want to defeat others but destroy them as well. I have no respect for her. She is not warm, not easy to like, and work in the State Department is suspect at the least. Her handling of Benzhai was a mess and the email issue is a problem with me. I do not trust her and I do not find her truthful at all. I want someone younger, not with the baggage she has. I find her hard to listen to as she has a sharp tone and less than warm. Elizabeth Warren is so left wing that I really don't want her. I feel any republican will be better than the two of them put together. I am from Wisconsin so I really would like to see Scott Walker as President.


----------



## collectordolls

ute4kp said:


> She was my senator for 8 years.
> Excellent!!
> :thumbup:


So her being your senator for 8 years what did she do for you. Just curious


----------



## YasminaB

I used to think the world of her but changed my mind after Benghazi and the last scandal. She is a hard working woman but I do not trust her and she leaned too much for my taste towards the Palestinians YasminaB


----------



## collectordolls

susanmos2000 said:


> 3. She can play hardball with the Big Boys. I for one thought she handled the flap over her private email account like a champ. Using a private account was well within the law until late 2014, so labeling her a "felon" is simply nonsense. And I'm pleased that, after turning the relevant emails, she erased the rest and saved the taxpayers from funding another Benghazi circus. The Senate Judiciary Committee AKA Barnum & Bailey has demanded that she turn over her server, but good luck with that. They'd have to launch a huge legal battle to get that server, and what would they actually gain if they got their mitts on it? She erased everything--and not simply by hitting the delete button tens of thousand of times. Those messages are gone forever.


If she was so wonderful why would she erase everything on her server. I guess she must have something to hide


----------



## J.Carol

sumnerusa said:


> Elizabeth says she won't run.


Elizabeth Warren is a multi billionair. She's right up there with the rest of them. She just hasen't been called to the front by the big guys that control the whole system. They'll use her when she's needed. Throw a few more billions at her and you'll see her in all of her smiling glory.


----------



## Artbarn

Stampergrandma said:


> Not to get too political, but the Clinton whitehouse did very well as far as the budget was concerned. It was a great economy during Mr. Clinton's run.


Mainly because the dot com bubble hadn't burst yet.


----------



## Cheeky Blighter

mojave said:


> Sometimes yes, sometimes no. Sources I read said Kennedy was urged to quickly order a full scale invasion of Cuba when the Russian missiles were spotted in the satellite photos. If he made that decision rather than choosing the naval blockade, it is probable the northern hemisphere of this planet would now be an uninhabitable radioactive wasteland.


Discretion is the better part of valor.


----------



## Artbarn

momeee said:


> ...and if we had access to all the documents he (or his handlers) paid millions to bury, we'd realize that he is much worse than what he has demonstrated to be, thus far. There is ABSOLUTELY NOTHING in his known background that is admirable or qualifies him to be the president.


 :thumbup:


----------



## Loistec

DGreen said:


> You evidently have bought into the idea that a woman's worth is directly related to her appearance and nothing else. Regardless of anyone's opinion of Hillary Clinton, her appearance must never, ever be the criteria for evaluating her qualifications.
> 
> If those comments represent the depth of your political savvy, please do the country a favor and refrain from voting in any election.


So many uncalled for, catty, mysogynistic comments on her appearance!
How rude and ignorant!
I agree with DGreen, please dont vote!
:thumbup: :thumbup: :thumbup: :thumbup: :thumbup:


----------



## Cheeky Blighter

joeysomma said:


> Were you better off after his 8 years? We, definitely, were not.


Tough break, Joey. We were much better off.


----------



## WindingRoad

Cheeky Blighter said:


> Tough break, Joey. We were much better off.


Better from where?


----------



## J.Carol

sumpleby said:


> Trust me, this is not a "hate response," but ROFLMAO. Absolutely no one was "frightened by Palin." The woman is an idiot and showed it at every turn. People WERE frightened by the idea of her being one step away from being POTUS if something should happen to McCain.


I don't believe she was one step away from POTUS. I think she was told what to do by her handlers. They probably enticed her with a million $$$ ... give or take a few. They interjected her into the horse and pony show. Guess they were bored and needed something to do and get a few extra laughs. She actually did some pretty good acting but it was short lived. Here one day ... gone the next.


----------



## Mmeth

Having worked at a public university for 17 years where the policy was not to communicate with students on anything but the University web site, it is ridiculous that she used personal e mail accounts.....and that she erased
Them, tells me that she had something to hide.....lost all respect for,her with that....


----------



## Cheeky Blighter

WindingRoad said:


> Better from where?


Employers were doing well and were giving good raises to their employees. Nothing wrong with that. If Bill could run again I would vote for him again.


----------



## WindingRoad

Cheeky Blighter said:


> Employers were doing well and were giving good raises to their employees. Nothing wrong with that. If Bill could run again I would vote for him again.


Yes we know there is a f**l born every day. No need to remind us again. You've conveniently forgotten about the Bush tax cuts.


----------



## fdb123

Remember Mitch McConnell right after Obama's election saying his chief focus was blocking anything Obama tried to do? He's done a pretty good job of it, too. I think Hilary would face much the same from right wing Republicans, both as a woman and a Democrat. Hilary has her faults but she's also tough and very intelligent. ALL our politicians are tied into Big Business because America has created a system in which campaigns last for two years and cost more millions of dollars every year. I do think Hilary's politics support the middle class better than Ted Cruz's! She also has maintained some faith based principles without insisting that us non-Christians are bringing down the wrath of God on America.


----------



## Knitter from Nebraska

Gerslay said:


> Quite frankly, if you're right and only Jeb is qualified and that for the Dems there will only be Hillary then I probably won't vote at all...unless there's a third party independent that needs a vote to be eligible for matching funds. I've been politically active for over 50 years and if this is what its come to, if this is the best that we can do, then I just don't care anymore.


 :thumbup: :thumbup: :thumbup:


----------



## theyarnlady

Jan's said:


> Since I am not a liberal the thought of Hillary Clinton in the White House makes my skin crawl. I found that she and Bill did not just want to defeat others but destroy them as well. I have no respect for her. She is not warm, not easy to like, and work in the State Department is suspect at the least. Her handling of Benzhai was a mess and the email issue is a problem with me. I do not trust her and I do not find her truthful at all. I want someone younger, not with the baggage she has. I find her hard to listen to as she has a sharp tone and less than warm. Elizabeth Warren is so left wing that I really don't want her. I feel any republican will be better than the two of them put together. I am from Wisconsin so I really would like to see Scott Walker as President.


 :thumbup: We are lucky are we not to have him in this state.


----------



## BrattyPatty

Kathie said:


> Thoughts on Hillary
> 
> Then weigh her against the misogynistic, homophobic, anti public education, (check out Walkers cuts in education) anti middle class, ( check out their views on raising the minimum wage and equal pay for women) denial of environmental problems, (Walker wont allow the wordsclimate change to be used by WI officials), and the desire to interfere all over the world ideas of the Republicans it doesnt leave us much choice does it. We need better candidates across the board


So now Walker is taking away the 1st amendment rights if Wisconsin?
I am not surprised.


----------



## J.Carol

Cheeky Blighter said:


> Employers were doing well and were giving good raises to their employees. Nothing wrong with that. If Bill could run again I would vote for him again.


Mr. Clinton presents himself like an angel ... he's far from it. He's the one that finalized NAFTA (North American Free Trade Agreement). Freed trade with Mexico and Canada. George Bush started the agreement and Clinton finalized it. Bush also implemented CAFTA-DR (Central American Free Trade-Dominican Republic) and was signed in 2004. Interesting don't you think ..


----------



## BrattyPatty

Loistec said:


> So many uncalled for, catty, mysogynistic comments on her appearance!
> How rude and ignorant!
> I agree with DGreen, please dont vote!
> :thumbup: :thumbup: :thumbup: :thumbup: :thumbup:


 :thumbup: :thumbup: :thumbup: :thumbup: :thumbup:


----------



## Cassews

crispie said:


> Agreed


 I agree .. Bengazi sure did a number on all involved as well at the email crisis.


----------



## BrattyPatty

Cassews said:


> I agree .. Bengazi sure did a number on all involved as well at the email crisis.


What crisis?? Is the country going to fall apart because we don't have her personal emails?


----------



## alifletcher

babesy,
I am curious . What are your resources for this information ?


----------



## SQM

Cassews said:


> I agree .. Bengazi sure did a number on all involved as well at the email crisis.


Why are all the Benghazi fanatics focused on Hills? Let's not forget that it was the muslim terrorists who committed the outrage. Why has no one gone ballistic over them on this thread?


----------



## Crochet dreamin'

One word. GROSS!


----------



## mjzorn

OK, I have not the time to read FORTY-SEVEN pages of comments, but the first page or so has been such a civil discussion, I wish I did! Hope it stayed that way and I look forward to reading here what I can't get on many "professional journalism" sites!


----------



## knitpresentgifts

Did anyone hear Clinton's announcement message? I tried to stay connected to hear during the day but didn't hear a thing.

I believe it was a huge mistake for her to announce in the way she chose.

I wonder how many like me, didn't hear anything or how many anticipated hearing her and didn't. 

Out of sight and ear shot - out of mind to me. Unless you purposefully sought out her on-line announcement, who did she reach?


----------



## craftygac

Unemployment is low as they don't count the ones out of work or ran out of benefits. We have had accompanies that have been in business go bankrupt this past year. Eight trucking companies close up. Five excellentdoctors go to consultingbecause of health changes. Fallon health care give up and merge now you can't get the care we paid for. If you believe those stats you shouldn't. Hold your breath on the stock markets and put your money some place safe. Please look deep into history and back door activities of who you vote for. I am tired of disrespect of eliminating prayers taking out in God we trust and laughing at us the American voters who keep putting in people that take our hard working money and spend it foolishly or give it to the illegals freely Togo to college with after I spent80000$ putting my child thru college working figurative hrs a week while they use my our money Togo invocations and stupid t.v. comedy shows. Let's get a qualified business person in office. One who knows a budget. She would be a mistake. I usually use my prayers for helping sick people but I am using some prayers to have people to vote the right person in. God bless the U.S. and may we keep the peace and respect this country one time earned.


----------



## Globee

Excellent. She had a lot of cleaning up to do after the mess Bush and Cheney created.


----------



## Montana Gramma

I wonder who she would pick for her cabinet. Are there favors out there needing to be repaid, regardless of expertise? Politics of the good ol boys mentality? If she wants to spend time with a family of certain class structure due to income she is already not the candidate for all the people. Does anyone else see this as an insult or just a campaign gimmick?


----------



## Jan's

Amen!


----------



## J.Carol

knitpresentgifts said:


> Did anyone hear Clinton's announcement message? I tried to stay connected to hear during the day but didn't hear a thing.
> 
> I believe it was a huge mistake for her to announce in the way she chose.
> 
> I wonder how many like me, didn't hear anything or how many anticipated hearing her and didn't.
> 
> Out of sight and ear shot - out of mind to me. Unless you purposefully sought out her on-line announcement, who did she reach?


She probably didn't want to put much effort into reaching anyone. Hillary knows she doesn't have a snowballs chance of winning.....she is in the race for two reasons....the money....and the money....she is the controlled opposition....and with the huge sum of monies she will take in....and funnel into her personal estate...this is her grand plan to take as much money....and grab whatever power she can along the way......she can charge a greater fee for her speeches.


----------



## Revan

MrsB said:


> Hillary Clinton to Announce 2016 Run for President on Sunday. The former secretary of state, senator and first lady is to announce that she will indeed seek the Democratic nomination for president.
> 
> I'm so pleased that she has decided to run again. We need strong women in the White House in a more crucial and central position. After a few seasons of Scandal viewing, I've come to the conclusion that there maybe just too much underhanded shenanigans going on in the good ole boys club. Hillary is no pushover and the best candidate that has come along in a long time. I'm assuming that Obama endorses her.


Totally agree, although I would love for Elizabeth Warren to run, she is awesome!


----------



## Rootie

I wish we could a woman with a clear record. I to think of starting a new group with so much bad background. She seems to have a running list. Even go back to Arkansas. I'm all for a woman in the job.


----------



## Rootie

I wish we could a woman with a clear record. I to think of starting a new group with so much bad background. She seems to have a running list. Even go back to Arkansas


----------



## Jan's

Emails are just the tip of the iceberg with Hillary Clinton. She is so polarizing and imagine Bill again in the White House-both not up to the task!!!


----------



## craftygac

Sorry for wording errors and typing trying to use glasses that need replacing. Another side affect of less money now I pay more for health issue since Obama care took over. I apologize for ranting but in Mass the economy is not good and I don't respect Hillary since Bengali.


----------



## mojave

craftygac said:


> Sorry for wording errors and typing trying to use glasses that need replacing. Another side affect of less money now I pay more for health issue since Obama care took over. I apologize for ranting but in Mass the economy is not good and I don't respect Hillary since Bengali.


Hold down the Control key and hit the plus sign. It will increase the font size and the message window so you can see more easily. To reduce hold Control and hit the minus key


----------



## BrattyPatty

Montana Gramma said:


> I wonder who she would pick for her cabinet. Are there favors out there needing to be repaid, regardless of expertise? Politics of the good ol boys mentality? If she wants to spend time with a family of certain class structure due to income she is already not the candidate for all the people. Does anyone else see this as an insult or just a campaign gimmick?


 "The good old boys" That is the Bush way of doing things. I am sure she will pick a talented well educated cabinet, Most of our presidents have come from monied families. Why can't she? She has always championed the working middle class and poor as well as equality for women. 
Before you tar and feather her, why not do a quick bio research? She certainly wasn't born with a silver spoon in her mouth.


----------



## BrattyPatty

SQM said:


> Why are all the Benghazi fanatics focused on Hills? Let's not forget that it was the muslim terrorists who committed the outrage. Why has no one gone ballistic over them on this thread?


Because Benghazi is what they will use to try and defeat her. Unfortunately, for them the whole Benghazi "scandal" turned up nothing hang on her. That's all they have, SQ. It was a repug ploy to bring her down before she could run for president. They are very afraid of her because they know she can win in 2016.
They will never let go of it either. It's like listening to a broken record. I wonder how all of the families feel who lost loved ones in embassy strikes during GW"S term. They never held hearings for them. Most people didn't even hear about them. It's very sad when a political party will take those deaths in Benghazi and use them as a weapon for their own political gain.
And mark my words, you will hear nothing but Benghazi from republican candidates from now until November of 2016.


----------



## ummirain

Bitchy is a disgusting term to use for a strong,capable woman.
That is woman-hating at its finest.
Women have the right to have strong opinions and assert themselves,particularly when in a field dominated by men.
They had her back off the health care plan she helped design when fox news claimed she was outshining Bill.
Now, it is a law !
My son-in-law's life has been saved by the Affortable Care Act (Aka Obama Care) that Secretary Clinton worked on while Bill was fooling around.
She held her head high and I am proud of her intelligence, capability,and strength.
Behind Hillary 100%.
What a joy it has been for me to see a black man in the White House, now a woman headed there 
By the way,polls show she can't be beat.


----------



## Cru

There are some capable women out there if that is the criteria. Having been a Governer or CEO, and handled a budget is a real value-added ticket. Hate to see the debt being left to our next generations. Looks like close to $60,000 for every baby born today. With jobs being sent out of the country, go figure.


----------



## BrattyPatty

joeysomma said:


> If you call that a mess, 0bama has created a disaster.


Please give us a detailed report on that.


----------



## BrattyPatty

ummirain said:


> Bitchy is a disgusting term to use for a strong,capable woman.
> That is woman-hating at its finest.
> Women have the right to have strong opinions and assert themselves,particularly when in a field dominated by men.
> They had her back off the health care plan she helped design when fox news claimed she was outshining Bill.
> Now, it is a law !
> My son-in-law's life has been saved by the Affortable Care Act (Aka Obama Care) that Secretary Clinton worked on while Bill was fooling around.
> She held her head high and I am proud of her intelligence, capability,and strength.
> Behind Hillary 100%.
> What a joy it has been for me to see a black man in the White House, now a woman headed there
> By the way, polls show she can't be beat.


 I agree!

:thumbup: :thumbup: :thumbup: :thumbup: :thumbup: :thumbup: :thumbup: :thumbup: :thumbup: :thumbup: :thumbup: :thumbup: :thumbup: :thumbup: :thumbup: :thumbup: :thumbup: :thumbup: :thumbup: :thumbup:


----------



## ummirain

Elizabeth Warren is so far left (where I am) polls show she can't win.
Once the Kennedys
back Secretary Clinton, it's all over.
Getting my
"I'm ready for Hillary" tee shirts as soon as they are printed


----------



## BrattyPatty

joeysomma said:


> Open your eyes and ears to find out what is really going on in this world. Why should I bother to try to tell you, you don't believe me anyway?


I just wanted to see what you could produce and as usual you don't. However, you are correct in one aspect. We have completely different views of the world and I wouldn't believe you. Your glass is always half empty and mine will always be half full. :wink:


----------



## Artbarn

BrattyPatty said:


> What crisis?? Is the country going to fall apart because we don't have her personal emails?


We have no way of knowing what she's hiding in those emails. So the answer is probably not--but theoretically, who knows?


----------



## BrattyPatty

Artbarn said:


> We have no way of knowing what she's hiding in those emails. So the answer is probably not--but theoretically, who knows?


Personally, I don't care what was in them. I didn't see anyone getting their feathers ruffled when Colin Powell did the *same exact thing.*
Why such a ruckus over Hillary?


----------



## knitpresentgifts

J.Carol said:


> She probably didn't want to put much effort into reaching anyone. Hillary knows she doesn't have a snowballs chance of winning.....she is in the race for two reasons....the money....and the money....she is the controlled opposition....and with the huge sum of monies she will take in....and funnel into her personal estate...this is her grand plan to take as much money....and grab whatever power she can along the way......she can charge a greater fee for her speeches.


Perhaps, but if no one heard her announcement, who is going to contribute to her campaign if no one knows she is running.

I believe she isn't ready yet, but had to file before the deadline dates. She can no longer give compensated speeches, so the $ only flow from fund raising. I think she is afraid of hard-hitting questions and her past and wants to stay in the shadows as long as she can and sail her way into being the DNC candidate without much effort expended.


----------



## BrattyPatty

Jan's said:


> Emails are just the tip of the iceberg with Hillary Clinton. She is so polarizing and imagine Bill again in the White House-both not up to the task!!!


Bill Clinton did a great job with the economy. That is the major issue we face today. We are still trying to dig out from the previous president. 
Bill will not be in the oval office, nor do I believe he will hold any special office except for First Dude.
Hillary has been in public service for years. So what if she comes off as tough? The job requires that. If it is going to be a woman I am glad it's her.
I don't care what her hair looks like, I don't care what she wears. I care that she cares and will be an advocate for the middle class and the working poor.


----------



## Artbarn

BrattyPatty said:


> Because Benghazi is what they will use to try and defeat her. Unfortunately, for them the whole Benghazi "scandal" turned up nothing hang on her. That's all they have, SQ. It was a repug ploy to bring her down before she could run for president. They are very afraid of her because they know she can win in 2016.
> They will never let go of it either. It's like listening to a broken record. I wonder how all of the families feel who lost loved ones in embassy strikes during GW"S term. They never held hearings for them. Most people didn't even hear about them. It's very sad when a political party will take those deaths in Benghazi and use them as a weapon for their own political gain.
> And mark my words, you will hear nothing but Benghazi from republican candidates from now until November of 2016.


The difference between the deaths in embassies under Bush and Obama is the circumstances. All of those deaths are sad and terrible. None of the embassy deaths under Bush involved a scandal. Benghazi did.


----------



## Cheeky Blighter

BrattyPatty said:


> Bill Clinton did a great job with the economy. That is the major issue we face today. We are still trying to dig out from the previous president.
> Bill will not be in the oval office, nor do I believe he will hold any special office except for First Dude.


He will make a great first dude. :thumbup:


----------



## KnitterNatalie

Toby's Mom said:


> Excessive Baggage. Wish we had someone with a clean slate.


Amen to that!!!


----------



## BrattyPatty

Artbarn said:


> The difference between the deaths in embassies under Bush and Obama is the circumstances.  All of those deaths are sad and terrible. None of the embassy deaths under Bush involved a scandal. Benghazi did.


They were the same circumstances. The embassies were all attacked by terrorists!
Can you explain why Benghazi became a scandal and not one of the others were even mentioned??
It was a manufactured scandal by the republicans. They turned a tragic attack into a 3 ring circus. The talking points of the matter meant much more than the lives that were taken. To spend all of that taxpayer money on "investigations" (witch hunts), was such a sham. They came up with nothing. More than once!
Is it a matter of life and death if someone said protest and another said terrorist attack? I don't think so.


----------



## Artbarn

BrattyPatty said:


> Bill Clinton did a great job with the economy. That is the major issue we face today. We are still trying to dig out from the previous president.
> Bill will not be in the oval office, nor do I believe he will hold any special office except for First Dude.


I call BS on this. Obama doesn't have a clue about how to deal with the economy and his staff is equally clueless. It doesn't take 6+ years to fix the economy for a President who knows what to do. Send them all to an Economics 101 class.

Clinton had a good economy handed to him, but it was faltering when he left. GW Bush had 6 years of a good economy. The economy under his administration suffered from a Democrat Congress in the last 2 years, from 9/11, and from the Community Reinvestment Act (CRA) which was passed under Carter and strengthened under Clinton. The CRA caused the economic crash at the end of Bush's term.  Bush tried to warn Congress, but they wouldn't listen.


----------



## Artbarn

BrattyPatty said:


> Can you explain why Benghazi became a scandal and not one of the others were even mentioned??
> It was a manufactured scandal by the republicans. They turned a tragic attack into a 3 ring circus. The talking points of the matter meant much more than the lives that were taken. To spend all of that taxpayer money on "investigations" (witch hunts), was such a sham. They came up with nothing. More than once!
> Is it a matter of life and death if someone said protest and another said terrorist attack? I don't think so.


Benghazi didn't "become" a scandal. It WAS a scandal. It still is--and there are military people who tell the truth about it. Gee, how many times have I said this today?


----------



## Cheeky Blighter

joeysomma said:



> Open your eyes and ears to find out what is really going on in this world. Why should I bother to try to tell you, you don't believe me anyway?


joey it's hard to even listen to you. Your sources are always so far to the right that they are laughable and you buy right into it. You used to think for yourself when I first came out here and now you are just another talking head on the far right and not to be taken seriously. I guess you just gave up.


----------



## Artbarn

BrattyPatty said:


> Bill Clinton did a great job with the economy. That is the major issue we face today. We are still trying to dig out from the previous president.
> Bill will not be in the oval office, nor do I believe he will hold any special office except for First Dude.
> Hillary has been in public service for years. So what if she comes off as tough? The job requires that. If it is going to be a woman I am glad it's her.
> I don't care what her hair looks like, I don't care what she wears. I care that she cares and will be an advocate for the middle class and the working poor.


Boy are you going to be disappointed. Hillary is an advocate for Hillary. Period.


----------



## Irish knitter

DGreen said:


> Where do you get such bogus ideas? Source?


That is true. My husband was wondering when they will run out of money to keep propping it up. He is just waiting for the other shoe to fall (stock market crash). He was wondering if it will be before the election.


----------



## Cheeky Blighter

Artbarn said:


> Benghazi didn't "become" a scandal. It WAS a scandal. It still is--and there are military people who tell the truth about it. Gee, how many times have I said this today?


And what makes you an authority on the subject? The book you read? Before deciding if something is a scandal or a snowjob created by the Republicans you need to look at several different sources of information. Then form and informed decision.


----------



## BrattyPatty

Artbarn said:


> I call BS on this. Obama doesn't have a clue about how to deal with the economy and his staff is equally clueless. It doesn't take 6+ years to fix the economy for a President who knows what to do. Send them all to an Economics 101 class.
> 
> Clinton had a good economy handed to him, but it was faltering when he left. GW Bush had 6 years of a good economy. The economy under his administration suffered from a Democrat Congress in the last 2 years, from 9/11, and from the Community Reinvestment Act (CRA) which was passed under Carter and strengthened under Clinton. The CRA caused the economic crash at the end of Bush's term. Bush tried to warn Congress, but they wouldn't listen.


Sorry, but Bush got us into 2 unnecessary wars that we couldn't pay for.
He and he alone is responsible for the Great Recession. That happens when you cater to your criminal cronies. As for the rest you will have your opinion and I will have mine.
Besides it's not Bill that is running for president now, is it?

Yes, he shares the good economy with things already in place, but also achieved a lot more.

http://www.factcheck.org/2007/12/clinton-and-economic-growth-in-the-90s/


----------



## Montana Gramma

BrattyPatty said:


> "The good old boys" That is the Bush way of doing things. I am sure she will pick a talented well educated cabinet, Most of our presidents have come from monied families. Why can't she? She has always championed the working middle class and poor as well as equality for women.
> Before you tar and feather her, why not do a quick bio research? She certainly wasn't born with a silver spoon in her mouth.


I was just making a quierie. Do you not want to know who will be helping run the country? I could care less if she is monied or not, but why pick just one social strata for her campaign? I would like to know who her allies are in her world and will they serve her and the country well. I tar and feather no one with my question. I think posters are starting to take things a little personal on this thread now so guess I will bow out in making comments.


----------



## knitpresentgifts

Artbarn said:


> We have no way of knowing what she's hiding in those emails. So the answer is probably not--but theoretically, who knows?


All we need is to expense the cost of a pair of handcuffs and a subpoena and an attorney general with a backbone who isn't beholden to Obama to carry out the duties of his/her job, and we'd know exactly what she hid.


----------



## BrattyPatty

Artbarn said:


> Boy are you going to be disappointed. Hillary is an advocate for Hillary. Period.


That's your opinion and you are certainly entitled to it. I just don't agree with you.


----------



## Artbarn

BrattyPatty said:


> Personally, I don't care what was in them. I didn't see anyone getting their feathers ruffled when Colin Powell did the *same exact thing.*
> Why such a ruckus over Hillary?


Colin Powell did not do the same exact thing: "He might have occasionally used personal email addresses, as he did when emailing to family and friends." http://www.huffingtonpost.com/2015/03/03/colin-powell-emails-hillary-clinton_n_6792716.html

Hillary Clinton fired staff members for doing the same thing she did--because it was against the rules.


----------



## BrattyPatty

Artbarn said:


> Benghazi didn't "become" a scandal. It WAS a scandal. It still is--and there are military people who tell the truth about it. Gee, how many times have I said this today?


And there were military people who flat out lied about it.
Please explain to me your own theory of the "scandal." Not any rhetoric, just your own theory,


----------



## lins

I don't remember Hilary saying 'who cares'?

This is what she said.

Clinton: With all due respect, the fact is we had four dead Americans. Was it because of a protest or was it because of guys out for a walk one night who decided that theyd they go kill some Americans? What difference at this point does it make? It is our job to figure out what happened and do everything we can to prevent it from ever happening again, Senator. Now, honestly, I will do my best to answer your questions about this, but the fact is that people were trying in real time to get to the best information. The IC has a process, I understand, going with the other committees to explain how these talking points came out. But you know, to be clear, it is, from my perspective, less important today looking backwards as to why these militants decided they did it than to find them and bring them to justice, and then maybe well figure out what was going on in the meantime.

In answer to a question asked by Senator Johnson.


What difference at this point does it make? 
...at this point...in during, the questioning.


----------



## knitpresentgifts

Artbarn said:


> I call BS on this. Obama doesn't have a clue about how to deal with the economy and his staff is equally clueless. It doesn't take 6+ years to fix the economy for a President who knows what to do. Send them all to an Economics 101 class.
> 
> Clinton had a good economy handed to him, but it was faltering when he left. GW Bush had 6 years of a good economy. The economy under his administration suffered from a Democrat Congress in the last 2 years, from 9/11, and from the Community Reinvestment Act (CRA) which was passed under Carter and strengthened under Clinton. The CRA caused the economic crash at the end of Bush's term. Bush tried to warn Congress, but they wouldn't listen.


Don't forget the Dodd-Frank debacle that began the fall of the housing crisis and the free-fall of the economy. You're correct Bush warned Congress, and they didn't listen. We've all paid the price dearly.


----------



## Cheeky Blighter

BrattyPatty said:


> They were the same circumstances. The embassies were all attacked by terrorists!
> Can you explain why Benghazi became a scandal and not one of the others were even mentioned??
> It was a manufactured scandal by the republicans. They turned a tragic attack into a 3 ring circus. The talking points of the matter meant much more than the lives that were taken. To spend all of that taxpayer money on "investigations" (witch hunts), was such a sham. They came up with nothing. More than once!
> Is it a matter of life and death if someone said protest and another said terrorist attack? I don't think so.


The GOP won't even talk about the fake wars Bush started. They don't care about all our men and women that died for nothing or who came back maimed for life. Where are the tears for those thousands of people? They really pick and chose who they will cry for. Such hypocrites. That Benghazi was a carefully crafted tragedy to be used to their advantage. How shameful. They have nothing on Hillary so they keep making it up. Cheney in Bush should have been executed for war crimes but war is OK with the GOP.


----------



## BrattyPatty

lins said:


> I don't remember Hilary saying 'who cares'?
> 
> This is what she said.
> 
> Clinton: With all due respect, the fact is we had four dead Americans. Was it because of a protest or was it because of guys out for a walk one night who decided that theyd they go kill some Americans? What difference at this point does it make? It is our job to figure out what happened and do everything we can to prevent it from ever happening again, Senator. Now, honestly, I will do my best to answer your questions about this, but the fact is that people were trying in real time to get to the best information. The IC has a process, I understand, going with the other committees to explain how these talking points came out. But you know, to be clear, it is, from my perspective, less important today looking backwards as to why these militants decided they did it than to find them and bring them to justice, and then maybe well figure out what was going on in the meantime.
> 
> In answer to a question asked by Senator Johnson.


And that's that! :thumbup: :thumbup: :thumbup:


----------



## Cheeky Blighter

lins said:


> I don't remember Hilary saying 'who cares'?
> 
> This is what she said.
> 
> Clinton: With all due respect, the fact is we had four dead Americans. Was it because of a protest or was it because of guys out for a walk one night who decided that theyd they go kill some Americans? What difference at this point does it make? It is our job to figure out what happened and do everything we can to prevent it from ever happening again, Senator. Now, honestly, I will do my best to answer your questions about this, but the fact is that people were trying in real time to get to the best information. The IC has a process, I understand, going with the other committees to explain how these talking points came out. But you know, to be clear, it is, from my perspective, less important today looking backwards as to why these militants decided they did it than to find them and bring them to justice, and then maybe well figure out what was going on in the meantime.
> 
> In answer to a question asked by Senator Johnson.
> 
> What difference at this point does it make?
> ...at this point...in during, the questioning.


Thanks for the clarification. :thumbup:


----------



## Artbarn

Cheeky Blighter said:


> And what makes you an authority on the subject? The book you read? Before deciding if something is a scandal or a snowjob created by the Republicans you need to look at several different sources of information. Then form and informed decision.


Geez, I'm getting really tired of answering the same questions. Read the rest of the messages. I didn't read the book. I always look at many different sources of information and form my own opinions. I've SEEN videos of interviews of the men who were told to stand down--the men who eventually ignored what they were told and tried to save those lives. I've seen interviews of high-level military officers who said that they could have saved those four lives and that Washington knew from the beginning that the attack was terrorism. It doesn't take much to put two and two together.


----------



## knitpresentgifts

Artbarn said:


> Colin Powell did not do the same exact thing: "He might have occasionally used personal email addresses, as he did when emailing to family and friends." http://www.huffingtonpost.com/2015/03/03/colin-powell-emails-hillary-clinton_n_6792716.html
> 
> Hillary Clinton fired staff members for doing the same thing she did--because it was against the rules.


Colin Powell also followed and met the requirements of federal laws and turned over all govt e-mails before they were subpoenaed and before he left his position. Hillary did not and lied about what she did. I wrote a post on this thread outlining all the laws Hillary broke.


----------



## BrattyPatty

Cheeky Blighter said:


> The GOP won't even talk about the fake wars Bush started. They don't care about all our men and women that died for nothing or who came back maimed for life. Where are the tears who all those thousands of people? They really pick and chose who they will cry for. Such hypocrites. That Benghazi was a carefully crafted tragedy to be used to their advantage. How shameful. They have nothing on Hillary so they keep making it up. Cheney in Bush should have been executed for war crimes but war is OK with the GOP.


Not just the wars, Cheeky, but look at the list of embassies attacked by terrorists between 2000 and 2008. Those lives must not have meant as much to the GOP because a potential female presidential candidate was not
Sec. of State at the time. Hmmmm


----------



## lins

Cheeky Blighter said:


> The GOP won't even talk about the fake wars Bush started. They don't care about all our men and women that died for nothing or who came back maimed for life. Where are the tears who all those thousands of people? They really pick and chose who they will cry for. Such hypocrites. That Benghazi was a carefully crafted tragedy to be used to their advantage. How shameful. They have nothing on Hillary so they keep making it up. Cheney in Bush should have been executed for war crimes but war is OK with the GOP.


...and they all want war again. 
Cheney is grooming his new little Bush.


----------



## Cheeky Blighter

Artbarn said:


> Geez, I'm getting really tired of answering the same questions. Read the rest of the messages. I didn't read the book. I always look at many different sources of information and form my own opinions. I've SEEN videos of interviews of the men who were told to stand down--the men who eventually ignored what they were told and tried to save those lives. I've seen interviews of high-level military officers who said that they could have saved those four lives.


What about those killed in Iraq and Afghanistan. That is a tragedy of epic proportions. Do you care about the thousands who died there? Do you hold Bush and Cheney responsible for that?


----------



## Artbarn

BrattyPatty said:


> And there were military people who flat out lied about it.
> Please explain to me your own theory of the "scandal." Not any rhetoric, just your own theory,


Give it a rest. Who lied, other than Susan Rice, Hillary Clinton, and Barack Obama? Military people lied? Who?


----------



## BrattyPatty

lins said:


> ...and they all want war again.
> Cheney is grooming his new little Bush.


Of course he is! Iraq is war torn, so Cheney wants Iran. Oil, oil.........


----------



## Artbarn

lins said:


> I don't remember Hilary saying 'who cares'?
> 
> This is what she said.
> 
> Clinton: With all due respect, the fact is we had four dead Americans. Was it because of a protest or was it because of guys out for a walk one night who decided that theyd they go kill some Americans? What difference at this point does it make? It is our job to figure out what happened and do everything we can to prevent it from ever happening again, Senator. Now, honestly, I will do my best to answer your questions about this, but the fact is that people were trying in real time to get to the best information. The IC has a process, I understand, going with the other committees to explain how these talking points came out. But you know, to be clear, it is, from my perspective, less important today looking backwards as to why these militants decided they did it than to find them and bring them to justice, and then maybe well figure out what was going on in the meantime.
> 
> In answer to a question asked by Senator Johnson.
> 
> What difference at this point does it make?
> ...at this point...in during, the questioning.


The DIFFERENCE is that she knew that it was terrorism from the start. There were no guys out for a walk with RPGs. She lied.


----------



## Artbarn

knitpresentgifts said:


> Don't forget the Dodd-Frank debacle that began the fall of the housing crisis and the free-fall of the economy. You're correct Bush warned Congress, and they didn't listen. We've all paid the price dearly.


Exactly. :thumbup:


----------



## theyarnlady

BrattyPatty said:


> And there were military people who flat out lied about it.
> Please explain to me your own theory of the "scandal." Not any rhetoric, just your own theory,


Please I want to know what military people who lied about it. Where can I find information about this . I watch C Span and saw no one lying or the Dems on the committee I am sure would have called them out. No such thing happen, in fact just the opposite happen.


----------



## Cheeky Blighter

lins said:


> ...and they all want war again.
> Cheney is grooming his new little Bush.


Cheney is the devil incarnate. He does like a good war and for him it all about all the money he and his friends can make. Nothing like a good war to cheer them up on the right. Cheney never fought a day in his life and got several military deferments. It's OK as long as somebody else is doing the dying. No scandal there.


----------



## Artbarn

Cheeky Blighter said:


> The GOP won't even talk about the fake wars Bush started. They don't care about all our men and women that died for nothing or who came back maimed for life. Where are the tears for those thousands of people? They really pick and chose who they will cry for. Such hypocrites. That Benghazi was a carefully crafted tragedy to be used to their advantage. How shameful. They have nothing on Hillary so they keep making it up. Cheney in Bush should have been executed for war crimes but war is OK with the GOP.


OK, Cheeky Blighter. Keep drinking the Kool-Aid.


----------



## BrattyPatty

Artbarn said:


> Give it a rest. Who lied, other than Susan Rice, Hillary Clinton, and Barack Obama? Military people lied? Who?


So you don't have a theory. If you do a little research you will find that all different kinds of info was being transmitted to the WH, CIA etc.
It's only talking points that you are complaining about. Was it a protest? Was it an attack? We all know the answer to that one. It's not that unusual to get the wrong info during an attack. I believe they all reported what they believed was true based on the info that they got from Benghazi.


----------



## Cheeky Blighter

BrattyPatty said:


> Not just the wars, Cheeky, but look at the list of embassies attacked by terrorists between 2000 and 2008. Those lives must not have meant as much to the GOP because a potential female presidential candidate was not
> Sec. of State at the time. Hmmmm


Coincidence? I think not.


----------



## BrattyPatty

Artbarn said:


> OK, Cheeky Blighter. Keep drinking the Kool-Aid.


Oh, someone is getting nasty now. "Kool Aid" really is an outdated term. You can't provide any rersources or factual statements dealing with the conversation at hand, so you get snarky. Benghazi, Benghazi, Benghazi...........It's nauseating really, and so very old. It's been used to death.


----------



## KateLyn11

My belief is that that she put up will Bill's shenanigans due to a lust for political power, rather than her beliefs. I would rather have a president whose beliefs I don't share, but who is true to those beliefs rather than a president whose only belief is in expediency. This is just my opinion so I won't debate it. I can't remember the last time there was a presidential candidate that I could honestly vote FOR. I am tired of voting for the lesser of two evils.


----------



## Artbarn

Cheeky Blighter said:


> What about those killed in Iraq and Afghanistan. That is a tragedy of epic proportions. Do you care about the thousands who died there? Do you hold Bush and Cheney responsible for that?


Of course I care about the lives lost in Iraq and Afghanistan. War is a terrible thing. Bush and Cheney did what they were supposed to do--they did their jobs, which was to protect the citizens of this country after a horrendous attack.

The intelligence agencies from our allies told us that there were WMDs in Iraq. Hillary voted in favor of going to war with Iraq.


----------



## Cheeky Blighter

Artbarn said:


> OK, Cheeky Blighter. Keep drinking the Kool-Aid.


So do you feel great sadness for the people who died in needless wars the same as you do for the three in Benghazi? If you don't your value system is way off base. Where is your outrage for that?


----------



## Artbarn

Cheeky Blighter said:


> Cheney is the devil incarnate. He does like a good war and for him it all about all the money he and his friends can make. Nothing like a good war to cheer them up on the right. Cheney never fought a day in his life and got several military deferments. It's OK as long as somebody else is doing the dying. No scandal there.


OK, now this is getting ridiculous.


----------



## Cheeky Blighter

Cheeky Blighter said:


> So do you feel great sadness for the people who died in needless wars the same as you do for the three in Benghazi? If you don't your value system is way off base. Where is your outrage for that? It is you who has faulty thinking not I. I am so sick of the right referring to kool ade all the time. So unoriginal.


----------



## BrattyPatty

Cheeky Blighter said:


> So do you feel great sadness for the people who died in needless wars the same as you do for the three in Benghazi? If you don't your value system is way off base. Where is your outrage for that?


I am so tired of Benghazi. Yes, I am sad it had to happen, but it did, and it's over.


----------



## lins

joeysomma said:


> If you call that a mess, 0bama has created a disaster.[/qu
> 
> Really!
> 
> http://pleasecutthecrap.com/obama-accomplishments/


----------



## Cheeky Blighter

Artbarn said:


> OK, now this is getting ridiculous.


How so? You find it OK that people are sent off to die for oil and to make money off war and are not held accountable for it? Shame on you.


----------



## BrattyPatty

Artbarn said:


> Of course I care about the lives lost in Iraq and Afghanistan. War is a terrible thing. Bush and Cheney did what they were supposed to do--they did their jobs, which was to protect the citizens of this country after a horrendous attack.
> 
> The intelligence agencies from our allies told us that there were WMDs in Iraq. Hillary voted in favor of going to war with Iraq.


Oh please!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!! They used 9/11 as an excuse to go back into Iraq.
The UN found no WMD"S. Funny how Cheney's company, Haliburton, got the contracting job....Coincidence?


----------



## lins

:thumbup:


----------



## Artbarn

BrattyPatty said:


> So you don't have a theory. If you do a little research you will find that all different kinds of info was being transmitted to the WH, CIA etc.
> It's only talking points that you are complaining about. Was it a protest? Was it an attack? We all know the answer to that one. It's not that unusual to get the wrong info during an attack. I believe they all reported what they believed was true based on the info that they got from Benghazi.


There were RPGS--rocket propelled grenades. Protesters don't carry RPGs. The administration did not get the wrong info. They knew exactly what was going on from the start. You "believe they all reported what they believed was true based on the info that they got from Benghazi?" Then you're wrong.


----------



## BrattyPatty

Artbarn said:


> There were RPGS--rocket propelled grenades. Protesters don't carry RPGs. The administration did not get the wrong info. They knew exactly what was going on from the start. You "believe they all reported what they believed was true based on the info that they got from Benghazi?" Then you're wrong.


Then *prove* me wrong. That's all I'm asking.


----------



## Cheeky Blighter

lins said:


> joeysomma said:
> 
> 
> 
> If you call that a mess, 0bama has created a disaster.[/qu
> 
> http://pleasecutthecrap.com/obama-accomplishments/
> 
> 
> 
> Thanks, lins. Very informative. I guess if you walk around with blinders on you don't get to see much.
Click to expand...


----------



## lins

Cheeky Blighter said:


> Thanks for the clarification. :thumbup:


You're welcome.


----------



## Artbarn

BrattyPatty said:


> Oh, someone is getting nasty now. "Kool Aid" really is an outdated term. You can't provide any rersources or factual statements dealing with the conversation at hand, so you get snarky. Benghazi, Benghazi, Benghazi...........It's nauseating really, and so very old. It's been used to death.


You call my comments nasty? You should go back and re-read some of the stuff you wrote earlier today.

An "outdated term?" Seriously? I can't provide resources? Again, go back and read the rest of the messages.

Why don't you tell the families of those four men that you're tired of hearing about Beghazi. I'm tired of this nonsense.


----------



## babesy

All my information is in the public domain, a matter of public record.

It cannot be found on CNN, MSNBC or even Good Morning America, for if the news is not favorable to the Dems, it is simply not reported.

Simply not reported. Very important news stories are blown off by those protecting the current regime.

So, when you deny that it is true, all you are saying is that you have not seen it on the news program you choose to view.

Perhaps it would behoove you to do some channel surfing, and actually watch a fair and balanced news channel once in a while - you might be surprised by what is happening in the world.


----------



## BrattyPatty

lins said:


> You're welcome.


Thanks for sharing that link, lin!


----------



## Artbarn

Cheeky Blighter said:


> How so? You find it OK that people are sent off to die for oil and to make money off war and are not held accountable for it? Shame on you.


No, shame on you.


----------



## yorkie1

collectordolls said:


> If she was so wonderful why would she erase everything on her server. I guess she must have something to hide


 :thumbup: :thumbup: :thumbup: 
Like I also said she is a liar. Worst person to get in the White House. I'll bet the White, House staff really hate the thot. of her being president. Her being in the White House as 1st. lady was enough for them.


----------



## Cheeky Blighter

Artbarn said:


> There were RPGS--rocket propelled grenades. Protesters don't carry RPGs. The administration did not get the wrong info. They knew exactly what was going on from the start. You "believe they all reported what they believed was true based on the info that they got from Benghazi?" Then you're wrong.


Such grenades and many other things can be procured by anyone or didn't you know that? Why do you think we are being so careful who we arm in the Middle East? A lot of it has to do with these things getting into the wrong hands. Most of these groups like those in Benghazi are infiltrated by the other side and the bad guys can end up using these things against us.


----------



## BrattyPatty

Artbarn said:


> You call my comments nasty? You should go back and re-read some of the stuff you wrote earlier today.
> 
> An "outdated term?" Seriously? I can't provide resources? Again, go back and read the rest of the messages.
> 
> Why don't you tell the families of those four men that you're tired of hearing about Beghazi. I'm tired of this nonsense.


I do feel for their families as much as I care about all of the families who also lost loved ones, between 2000-20008, but never got a hearing. Once again it is a political party using those very deaths for their own political gains.


----------



## BrattyPatty

yorkie1 said:


> :thumbup: :thumbup: :thumbup:
> Like I also said she is a liar. Worst person to get in the White House. I'll bet the White, House staff really hate the thot. of her being president. Her being in the White House as 1st. lady was enough for them.


And you know this how? Were you a maid at the WH?


----------



## Artbarn

Cheeky Blighter said:


> Such grenades and many other things can be procured by anyone or didn't you know that? Why do you think we are being so careful who we arm in the Middle East? A lot of it has to do with these things getting into the wrong hands. Most of these groups like those in Benghazi are infiltrated by the other side and the bad guys can end up using these things against us.


Do you even know how big an RPG is? This isn't something you take with you when you're out for a walk.

And do you seriously think we're being careful who we arm in the Middle East?


----------



## Cheeky Blighter

Artbarn said:


> No, shame on you.


So you aren't sorry that all those people have died? Shame on you.


----------



## BrattyPatty

babesy said:


> All my information is in the public domain, a matter of public record.
> 
> It cannot be found on CNN, MSNBC or even Good Morning America, for if the news is not favorable to the Dems, it is simply not reported.
> 
> Simply not reported. Very important news stories are blown off by those protecting the current regime.
> 
> So, when you deny that it is true, all you are saying is that you have not seen it on the news program you choose to view.
> 
> Perhaps it would behoove you to do some channel surfing, and actually watch a fair and balanced news channel once in a while - you might be surprised by what is happening in the world.


Who are you directing this post to?


----------



## BrattyPatty

Artbarn said:


> You call my comments nasty? You should go back and re-read some of the stuff you wrote earlier today.
> 
> An "outdated term?" Seriously? I can't provide resources? Again, go back and read the rest of the messages.
> 
> Why don't you tell the families of those four men that you're tired of hearing about Beghazi. I'm tired of this nonsense.


Typical repug response. Spout off nothing but rhetoric and then run away.


----------



## Artbarn

Cheeky Blighter said:


> So you aren't sorry that all those people have died? Shame on you.


You have no idea what you're talking about. How dare you put words in my mouth?


----------



## Artbarn

BrattyPatty said:


> Typical repug response. Spout off nothing but rhetoric and then run away.


First, I am not a Republican.

Second, I've been on this blasted thread all day, with facts, sources, and links.

It's almost 1:30 AM here and I've had enough of being double-teamed by you and your friend.


----------



## Cheeky Blighter

Artbarn said:


> Do you even know how big an RPG is? This isn't something you take with you when you're out for a walk.
> 
> And do you seriously think we're being careful who we arm in the Middle East?


Yes, I do and all I am pointing out to you is that these things and things much larger can fall into the wrong hands and be used against us. I think it is very sad you feel only for the dead at Benghazi and not for our military and all the innocents we killed. All those lost lives are criminal but you only chose to mourn a few. I hope you have no one in the military in harms way as i have had wondering if you would ever see them again or if they would come home in one piece. I guess if you are a hawk those things don't matter. That's called collateral damage.


----------



## BrattyPatty

Artbarn said:


> First, I am not a Republican.
> 
> Second, I've been on this blasted thread all day, with facts, sources, and links.
> 
> It's almost 1:30 AM here and I've had enough of being double-teamed by you and your friend.


Then I apologize to you. I have been responding to the last 5 pages. I have not been on the thread all day as you have. It's not healthy.
I don't agree with you on Benghazi and I think Hillary will make an excellent president.


----------



## Cheeky Blighter

Artbarn said:


> First, I am not a Republican.
> 
> Second, I've been on this blasted thread all day, with facts, sources, and links.
> 
> It's almost 1:30 AM here and I've had enough of being double-teamed by you and your friend.


You must be getting some satisfaction out of it or you wouldn't be here. I am not trying to change your mind and I certainly will not be swayed by your opinions. Good night all.


----------



## BrattyPatty

Cheeky Blighter said:


> You must be getting some satisfaction out of it or you wouldn't be here. I am not trying to change your mind and I certainly will not be swayed by your opinions. Good night all.


Good night, Cheeky! Sweet Dreams! :-D


----------



## Artbarn

Cheeky Blighter said:


> Yes, I do and all I am pointing out to you is that these things and things much larger can fall into the wrong hands and be used against us. I think it is very sad you feel only for the dead at Benghazi and not for our military and all the innocents we killed. All those lost lives are criminal but you only chose to mourn a few. I hope you have no one in the military in harms way as i have had wondering if you would ever see them again or if they would come home in one piece. I guess if you are a hawk those things don't matter. That's called collateral damage.


You're putting words in my mouth again. You have no idea how I feel. So stop it.


----------



## lins

Artbarn said:


> Of course I care about the lives lost in Iraq and Afghanistan. War is a terrible thing. Bush and Cheney did what they were supposed to do--they did their jobs, which was to protect the citizens of this country after a horrendous attack.
> 
> The intelligence agencies from our allies told us that there were WMDs in Iraq. Hillary voted in favor of going to war with Iraq.


Oh my Gawd...where have you been?
There were no WMD's. Hilary and others voted for war because Cheney and Bush lied about that. 
She and others voted on the information that was given to them that was false. A president and and vice president lied to Congress.

How many people were killed or mamed because if their lies!
How many billions did Cheney make off these lies?


----------



## Cheeky Blighter

BrattyPatty said:


> Good night, Cheeky! Sweet Dreams! :-D


Same to you, Patty!


----------



## MommaJody

Hillary hid paperwork from an investigation during her time as first lady, she has lied about Benghazi, she used her personal email for official business and then deleted what she thought was relative not what the officials thought was relative. She was involved in Whitewater, and other illegal activities. I just want to know when she will ever be held accountable for all of her past wrong doings much less what we will have to endure if she becomes president. After the Obama administration, I don't know if our country can survive a Hillary Clinton administration. I would love to see this country run by a strong woman president, but not by a lying cheating woman that uses every underhanded way she can to get what she wants and BE DAMNED IF THAT IS WHAT IS BEST FOR THE USA. Wake up and do your own investigation from the time she was a lawyer in Arkansas to the present time if you don't believe the reports that come out and condemns some of her actions.


----------



## Jean williams

Hillary...no way, never! &#55356;


----------



## BrattyPatty

Then I suggest that the republicans get some serious candidates. The 2 clowns out of the waggon at this point can't do the job. They can't do the jobs that they do have!


----------



## lins

MommaJody said:


> Hillary hid paperwork from an investigation during her time as first lady, she has lied about Benghazi, she used her personal email for official business and then deleted what she thought was relative not what the officials thought was relative. She was involved in Whitewater, and other illegal activities. I just want to know when she will ever be held accountable for all of her past wrong doings much less what we will have to endure if she becomes president. After the Obama administration, I don't know if our country can survive a Hillary Clinton administration. I would love to see this country run by a strong woman president, but not by a lying cheating woman that uses every underhanded way she can to get what she wants and BE DAMNED IF THAT IS WHAT IS BEST FOR THE USA. Wake up and do your own investigation from the time she was a lawyer in Arkansas to the present time if you don't believe the reports that come out and condemns some of her actions.


As the House Select Committee gears up to spend up to more than $ 3 million on another investigation into the tragedy in Benghazi, the Republican-led House Intelligence Committee just completed and is about to release an exhaustive, nearly two year investigation that found no deliberate wrongdoing by the Administration.

This report exonerating the Administration of wrongdoing is one of many investigations into the tragedy. There have already been seven investigations, 13 hearings, 50 briefings, and 25,000 pages of documents have been released.

Why haven't these allegations gone anywhere? Could it be because none if the allegations are true? They keep trying and digging and nothing comes up.

..and the cost of these hearing that haven't gone anywhere? Priceless.

That's the crime, your tax dollar working on scandal instead of roads and bridges.


----------



## BrattyPatty

lins said:


> As the House Select Committee gears up to spend up to more than $ 3 million on another investigation into the tragedy in Benghazi, the Republican-led House Intelligence Committee just completed and is about to release an exhaustive, nearly two year investigation that found no deliberate wrongdoing by the Administration.
> 
> This report exonerating the Administration of wrongdoing is one of many investigations into the tragedy. There have already been seven investigations, 13 hearings, 50 briefings, and 25,000 pages of documents have been released.
> 
> Why haven't these allegations gone anywhere? Could it be because none if the allegations are true? They keep trying and digging and nothing comes up.
> 
> ..and the cost of these hearing that haven't gone anywhere? Priceless.
> 
> That's the crime, your tax dollar working on scandal instead of roads and bridges.


 :thumbup: :thumbup: :thumbup: :thumbup:

I still have to ask where is all of the right wing horror over all the other embassy attacks?


----------



## KateLyn11

MommaJody said:


> Hillary hid paperwork from an investigation during her time as first lady, she has lied about Benghazi, she used her personal email for official business and then deleted what she thought was relative not what the officials thought was relative. She was involved in Whitewater, and other illegal activities. I just want to know when she will ever be held accountable for all of her past wrong doings much less what we will have to endure if she becomes president. After the Obama administration, I don't know if our country can survive a Hillary Clinton administration. I would love to see this country run by a strong woman president, but not by a lying cheating woman that uses every underhanded way she can to get what she wants and BE DAMNED IF THAT IS WHAT IS BEST FOR THE USA. Wake up and do your own investigation from the time she was a lawyer in Arkansas to the present time if you don't believe the reports that come out and condemns some of her actions.


Expediency. Do what you need to do in the short term to fulfill you desires, not what is right in the long run and is in line with a personal sense of morality and personal code of conduct. Though I suppose expecting a politician to do their best, to do what is best, for the common good is an impossible dream.


----------



## Mothers Roost

My sentiments are that Hillary is so crooked that she will have to be screwed into the ground when she dies.


----------



## BrattyPatty

joeysomma said:


> Did they talk to Hillary? NO, so how could they say they did a complete investigation? She needs to testify under oath!


Really, joeysomma?
So, that person that we all watched on C span and CNN answering questions was a Hillary impersonator????


----------



## momeee

Mothers Roost said:


> My sentiments are that Hillary is so crooked that she will have to be screwed into the ground when she dies.


Very good! :lol: :lol: :lol: :lol:


----------



## MommaJody

My sentiments are that Hillary is so crooked that she will have to be screwed into the ground when she dies.


My sentiments exactly. Just once I would like to see her answer a question that was asked of her instead of her rambling on about something else. I would also like that answer to be truthful. Since I seriously doubt that will ever happen, I will just keep expecting answers like hers of "Who cares about that now. What difference does it make now?" Well, it makes a difference to me and I am PRETTY sure that it makes a difference to the families of those killed that could have been saved.


----------



## BrattyPatty

joeysomma said:


> Your so called accomplishments are more like disasters. 0bama is out to DESTROY the country as we knew it.


 :XD: :XD: :XD: :XD: :XD: :XD: :XD: :XD: :XD: :XD: :XD: :XD:

We are talking about Hillary in this thread. Are you lost?

6 years later we are still here, the country is making a come back economically, more jobs are being created.....


----------



## BrattyPatty

MommaJody said:


> My sentiments are that Hillary is so crooked that she will have to be screwed into the ground when she dies.
> 
> My sentiments exactly. Just once I would like to see her answer a question that was asked of her instead of her rambling on about something else. I would also like that answer to be truthful. Since I seriously doubt that will ever happen, I will just keep expecting answers like hers of "Who cares about that now. What difference does it make now?" Well, it makes a difference to me and I am PRETTY sure that it makes a difference to the families of those killed that could have been saved.


She NEVER said "Who cares about that now". If you are going to slam her, at least try being factual about it.


----------



## Mothers Roost

BrattyPatty said:


> She NEVER said "Who cares about that now". If you are going to slam her, at least try being factual about it.


"What difference does it make??", sure sounds like "who cares?" to me!!!


----------



## suzhuz

Who hoo! Go Hilary!


----------



## lins

BrattyPatty said:


> :thumbup: :thumbup: :thumbup: :thumbup:
> 
> I still have to ask where is all of the right wing horror over all the other embassy attacks?


Yeah, I wonder too. 
Ignorance and hatred for President Obama I guess? They just won't wake up.


----------



## BrattyPatty

Mothers Roost said:


> "What difference does it make??", sure sounds like "who cares?" to me!!!


You are cherry picking and not even in the same context as what she really said.

[qoute lin]
I don't remember Hilary saying 'who cares'?

This is what she said.

Clinton: "With all due respect, the fact is we had four dead Americans. Was it because of a protest or was it because of guys out for a walk one night who decided that theyd they go kill some Americans? What difference at this point does it make? It is our job to figure out what happened and do everything we can to prevent it from ever happening again, Senator. Now, honestly, I will do my best to answer your questions about this, but the fact is that people were trying in real time to get to the best information. The IC has a process, I understand, going with the other committees to explain how these talking points came out. But you know, to be clear, it is, from my perspective, less important today looking backwards as to why these militants decided they did it than to find them and bring them to justice, and then maybe well figure out what was going on in the meantime."

In answer to a question asked by Senator Johnson.

What difference at this point does it make?
...at this point...in during, the questioning. [end quote]


----------



## lins

Mothers Roost said:


> "What difference does it make??", sure sounds like "who cares?" to me!!!


Then you can't read what was written.

She was going after the petty Congressmen who were trying to make a scandal out of a tradgy.

She was trying to get them to look at the big picture of making the neccessary fixes so it wouldn't happen again, ie providing back the funds they withdrew from the State Department Security Budget.


----------



## Mothers Roost

If she HAD cared she would have sent help when it was requested......nothing anyone says will make me believe she cares about anyone but herself. Bad, Bad, Bad, for our country.


----------



## ute4kp

Loistec said:


> So many uncalled for, catty, mysogynistic comments on her appearance!
> How rude and ignorant!
> I agree with DGreen, please dont vote!
> :thumbup: :thumbup: :thumbup: :thumbup: :thumbup:


I know. It's so "middle school ".


----------



## ute4kp

WindingRoad said:


> Better from where?


From before we were. Ha ha hahaha hahahahaha.


----------



## MommaJody

To get them to look at the big picture of making the necessary fixes so it wouldn't happen again, ie providing back the funds they withdrew from the State Department Security Budget, could in part been accomplished by firing Hillary for her inefficiency in her job and the cost of her transporting herself all over the world. Her first two years in office expenses for travel was more than double what the two previous Secretary of States budget was for their full term.


----------



## lins

joeysomma said:


> Your so called accomplishments are more like disasters. 0bama is out to DESTROY the country as we knew it.


And how was the country as you knew it. Oh my gawd!!!

Please enlighten me on how it was better during the Bush Botch.


----------



## ute4kp

fdb123 said:


> Remember Mitch McConnell right after Obama's election saying his chief focus was blocking anything Obama tried to do? He's done a pretty good job of it, too. I think Hilary would face much the same from right wing Republicans, both as a woman and a Democrat. Hilary has her faults but she's also tough and very intelligent. ALL our politicians are tied into Big Business because America has created a system in which campaigns last for two years and cost more millions of dollars every year. I do think Hilary's politics support the middle class better than Ted Cruz's! She also has maintained some faith based principles without insisting that us non-Christians are bringing down the wrath of God on America.


 :thumbup: Like.


----------



## ute4kp

SQM said:


> Why are all the Benghazi fanatics focused on Hills? Let's not forget that it was the muslim terrorists who committed the outrage. Why has no one gone ballistic over them on this thread?


Foxy didn't say it so the foxyists don't say it either.


----------



## lins

Mothers Roost said:


> If she HAD cared she would have sent help when it was requested......nothing anyone says will make me believe she cares about anyone but herself. Bad, Bad, Bad, for our country.


In real time or fantasy time? What sort of time factor are you talking about here?

BTW, what happened to the funds for the State Department Security? Oh yeah, Republicans cut that back. Do you remember that part?


----------



## lins

MommaJody said:


> To get them to look at the big picture of making the necessary fixes so it wouldn't happen again, ie providing back the funds they withdrew from the State Department Security Budget, could in part been accomplished by firing Hillary for her inefficiency in her job and the cost of her transporting herself all over the world. Her first two years in office expenses for travel was more than double what the two previous Secretary of States budget was for their full term.


Yeah, I find that preferable to the trillions spent by the previous administration on their wars of greed.


----------



## sumpleby

I can predict one thing for a certainty, if Hillary Clinton or some other Democrat--even Elizabeth Warren--is elected we will be treated to more of the same from Republicans. Once again they will swear to do anything and everything they can to make sure that that person will fail.

The person could be the greatest thing since sliced bread. They could be the reincarnation of Jesus Christ. If they are Democrat the Republicans will stop at nothing to stop them.


----------



## ute4kp

ummirain said:


> Bitchy is a disgusting term to use for a strong,capable woman.
> That is woman-hating at its finest.
> Women have the right to have strong opinions and assert themselves,particularly when in a field dominated by men.
> They had her back off the health care plan she helped design when fox news claimed she was outshining Bill.
> Now, it is a law !
> My son-in-law's life has been saved by the Affortable Care Act (Aka Obama Care) that Secretary Clinton worked on while Bill was fooling around.
> She held her head high and I am proud of her intelligence, capability,and strength.
> Behind Hillary 100%.
> What a joy it has been for me to see a black man in the White House, now a woman headed there
> By the way,polls show she can't be beat.


 :thumbup: :thumbup: 
My husband (deceased now) complained I was too independent. Good thing I was so I could keep calm and carry on. Anyway I have to agree with you.


----------



## MommaJody

"As we knew it " - wasn't boughing to MUSLIMS. He stated during his speeches that he was going to fundamentally change America and Obama definitely has. He cancels the National day of prayer at the White house, but he had a big to do catering to the Muslims on the White house lawn. Our nation was built on Christian beliefs and up until Obama administration, our country was basically known as a Christian nation. Obama stated in one of his speeches that America was no longer a Christian nation. That was news to me until I started investigating all the changes he has made in our schools, cities, universities, and other sights in order for the Muslims to not be offended. I feel that if they were going to be offended, just stay away from those places. Our society should not have to change our way of life for one particular religion. Since he has started turning our nation into a freeloader nation, I believe Hillary will continue this turn of giving everything to the poor in order to get their vote. And, take a turn at checking into one of the biggest contributors to Hillary - China.


----------



## ute4kp

joeysomma said:


> Open your eyes and ears to find out what is really going on in this world. Why should I bother to try to tell you, you don't believe me anyway?


As expected a non answer.


----------



## lins

MommaJody said:


> "As we knew it " - wasn't boughing to MUSLIMS. He stated during his speeches that he was going to fundamentally change America and Obama definitely has. He cancels the National day of prayer at the White house, but he had a big to do catering to the Muslims on the White house lawn. Our nation was built on Christian beliefs and up until Obama administration, our country was basically known as a Christian nation. Obama stated in one of his speeches that America was no longer a Christian nation. That was news to me until I started investigating all the changes he has made in our schools, cities, universities, and other sights in order for the Muslims to not be offended. I feel that if they were going to be offended, just stay away from those places. Our society should not have to change our way of life for one particular religion. Since he has started turning our nation into a freeloader nation, I believe Hillary will continue this turn of giving everything to the poor in order to get their vote. And, take a turn at checking into one of the biggest contributors to Hillary - China.


Obama bows to Muslins? Bush holds their hands. So what's your point?


----------



## ute4kp

Artbarn said:


> OK, Cheeky Blighter. Keep drinking the Kool-Aid.


Please. You make the Kool aid.


----------



## MommaJody

I can't believe that BrattyPatty is wanting everything to be so factual. She must actual believe the numbers that the Obama administration is putting out to make the statement that the country is making a comeback economically and more jobs are being created. Does she not take into consideration that after so long on unemployment benefits that the administration just ignores those figures and start with the ones that came after them. Then when those reach the cutoff time, they drop that number. On and on and on. Where do you think those unemployed go after a certain time?


----------



## MommaJody

lins said:


> Obama bows to Muslins? Bush holds their hands. So what's your point?


Obama is the first President of the United States that actually bows to them as if they are his king. Oh, I guess you didn't see that new footage either huh?


----------



## Wombatnomore

Mothers Roost said:


> "What difference does it make??", sure sounds like "who cares?" to me!!!


Find the quote that backs up your assertion.


----------



## Wombatnomore

MommaJody said:


> Obama is the first President of the United States that actually bows to them as if they are his king. Oh, I guess you didn't see that new footage either huh?


Tell what footage so we can look it up.


----------



## Wombatnomore

Is this the footage to which you are referring Momma Jody?

http://www.beliefnet.com/columnists/watchwomanonthewall/2012/02/obama-admits-he-is-a-muslim-in-his-own-words-video.html


----------



## sumpleby

MommaJody said:


> Obama is the first President of the United States that actually bows to them as if they are his king. Oh, I guess you didn't see that new footage either huh?


Oh for pity's sake. The man returned a gesture in greeting. What did you want him to do--spit at them? There is absolutely nothing wrong with what he did.


----------



## ute4kp

Wombatnomore said:


> Is this the footage to which you are referring Momma Jody?
> 
> http://www.beliefnet.com/columnists/watchwomanonthewall/2012/02/obama-admits-he-is-a-muslim-in-his-own-words-video.html


They do this kind of chop editing on the comedy channel. I wonder if MommaJody has the unedited video. Hmmmm. I doubt it.


----------



## Wombatnomore

MommaJody said:


> I can't believe that BrattyPatty is wanting everything to be so factual. She must actual believe the numbers that the Obama administration is putting out to make the statement that the country is making a comeback economically and more jobs are being created. Does she not take into consideration that after so long on unemployment benefits that the administration just ignores those figures and start with the ones that came after them. Then when those reach the cutoff time, they drop that number. On and on and on. Where do you think those unemployed go after a certain time?


Why not factual? If you back up your statements with credible proof then there is little to argue about. There are far too many people who use pieces of information they hear from the media, from friends and the like who take it as gospel then use it as a weapon in discussions like these.

What's the point of that? If you're going to have a discussion about the candidacy for President of the United States, it may as well be informed and meaningful otherwise it's just a waste of time and energy.

Get your facts straight and there won't be any grief. Unless of course you want grief. :roll:


----------



## ute4kp

Hillary Rodham Clinton jumped back into presidential politics on Sunday, announcing her much-awaited second campaign for the White House. "Everyday Americans need a champion. I want to be that champion," she said.
As she did in 2007, Clinton began her campaign for the 2016 Democratic nomination with a video. But rather than follow it with a splashy rally, she instead plans to head to the early-voting states of Iowa and New Hampshire, looking to connect with voters directly at coffee shops, day care centers and some private homes.
"So I'm hitting the road to earn your vote. Because it's your time. And I hope you'll join me on this journey," Clinton said at the end of a video, which features a series of men, women and children describing their aspirations.
This voter-centric approach was picked with a purpose, to show that Clinton is not taking the nomination for granted. Only after about a month of such events will Clinton will give a broader speech outlining more specifics about her rationale for running.
The former secretary of state, senator and first lady enters the race in a strong position to succeed her rival from the 2008 campaign, President Barack Obama.
Her message will focus on strengthening economic security for the middle class and expanding opportunities for working families. The campaign is portraying her as a "tenacious fighter" who can get results and work with Congress, business and world leaders.
Clinton's strategy, described ahead of the announcement by two senior advisers who requested anonymity to discuss her plans, has parallels to the approach Obama took in 2012. He framed his re-election as a choice between Democrats focused on the middle class and Republicans who sought to protect the wealthy and return to policies that led the country into recession.


----------



## MommaJody

sumpleby said:


> Oh for pity's sake. The man returned a gesture in greeting. What did you want him to do--spit at them? There is absolutely nothing wrong with what he did.


Nothing wrong? So what, now the man that according to general understanding, the most powerful man on earth, bows to the leader of Saudi Arabia? What next bend down and shine his shoes? What's wrong with the usual gesture of shaking their hands? For pity's sakes is right. He should have NEVER have bowed to another leader. Should he have spit at them? Maybe, but common courtesy rules that out now doesn't it?


----------



## Wombatnomore

ute4kp said:


> They do this kind of chop editing on the comedy channel. I wonder if MommaJody has the unedited video. Hmmmm. I doubt it.


But seriously ute4kp, this is a great example of how information is twisted and spread around for propaganda purposes. I find it frightening that people actually believe in this stuff.


----------



## Wombatnomore

MommaJody said:


> Nothing wrong? So what, now the man that according to general understanding, the most powerful man on earth, bows to the leader of Saudi Arabia? What next bend down and shine his shoes? What's wrong with the usual gesture of shaking their hands? For pity's sakes is right. He should have NEVER have bowed to another leader. Should he have spit at them? Maybe, but common courtesy rules that out now doesn't it?


What you've written is just nonsense. You're talking about President Obama here. Show some respect.


----------



## MommaJody

ute4kp said:


> They do this kind of chop editing on the comedy channel. I wonder if MommaJody has the unedited video. Hmmmm. I doubt it.


Why should I keep footage when I actually was watching the event on live TV when it happened. Unlike some people, I actually have a life. I check my info and then go on. Since you think I should keep unedited video, then I guess you should keep actual unemployment records instead of believing what is given out by the administration instead of statistics. So, what do you think happens to the numbers of unemployed when they reach the cutoff date? Do they all of a sudden disappear from life or what?


----------



## MommaJody

Wombatnomore said:


> What you've written is just nonsense. You're talking about President Obama here. Show some respect.


When the man does something to receive some type of respect I will show some respect. Respect is earned not given on a whim.


----------



## Wombatnomore

MommaJody said:


> Why should I keep footage when I actually was watching the event on live TV when it happened. Unlike some people, I actually have a life. I check my info and then go on. Since you think I should keep unedited video, then I guess you should keep actual unemployment records instead of believing what is given out by the administration instead of statistics. So, what do you think happens to the numbers of unemployed when they reach the cutoff date? Do they all of a sudden disappear from life or what?


Why don't you find that information and provide a link to it here?


----------



## MommaJody

Wombatnomore said:


> Why don't you find that information and provide a link to it here?


Why don't you do like I did and go look for yourself instead of expecting someone to feed you "misinformation".


----------



## anjoda

I have been reading this thread, and had to jump several pages, as it has be getting really out of hand. I agree with the above post, there has been a lot of incorrect facts stated here. In my opinion President Obama has done an excellent job, with absolutely no help from that sorry lot in congress.
I think that you ladies should be honest, Not a single Republican, not even Jeb Bush, has the qualifications or experience that Hilliary Clinton has. The others are a bunch of inept, inexperienced, "boys". I, for one will definitely be voting for her. Mitt Romney showed exactly what he had in mind ror the country with his 1% exposed video. So, make no mistake, that is the agenda of the Republicans. Slash taxes for the rich and pay for the tax breaks by cutting all the social programs. That was tried before, and we all know where that put us. And better yet, squash the nuclear deal with Iran, and start a new war, because the ones we had for the past 10 years were not enough to pay for or enough of a sacrifice of our young troops. So, Hillary, I am on board.


----------



## MommaJody

I would just like for someone to list three POSITIVE things that Hillary has done for this country that is not to benefit her in the long run. I have studied her from her days in Little Rock, Arkansas. I haven't found one thing that she has accomplished that has been beneficial to anyone but her or her family. So please, enlighten me with all of her great accomplishments.


----------



## Wombatnomore

MommaJody said:


> Why don't you do like I did and go look for yourself instead of expecting someone to feed you "misinformation".


The problem is, you're the one making the claims and therefore it's beholden on you to back up what your saying. Other people shouldn't have to research the claims you make. Present your point of view properly and responsibly and you'll earn the respect you so very much believe in.


----------



## ute4kp

Wombatnomore said:


> But seriously ute4kp, this is a great example of how information is twisted and spread around for propaganda purposes. I find it frightening that people actually believe in this stuff.


I agree with you. I was just thinking my post was too short. I'm typing on a phablet letter by letter. I bought a BT keyboard. I don't like using it. Spell check and word prediction goes away with BT use. I see it's 3.45am here. Have to get to sleep. I have a dentist appt today. Good nite. G'day.


----------



## MommaJody

I just wish someone would run for the presidency that actually has the country's welfare at heart. So far, there is not one single solitary person that is running for the presidency that has a good moral character or a decent resume to become president. I think those people have vanished from the face of the earth. All we can do these days when we vote is to vote for the lesser of the evils running.


----------



## ute4kp

MommaJody said:


> Why should I keep footage when I actually was watching the event on live TV when it happened. Unlike some people, I actually have a life. I check my info and then go on. Since you think I should keep unedited video, then I guess you should keep actual unemployment records instead of believing what is given out by the administration instead of statistics. So, what do you think happens to the numbers of unemployed when they reach the cutoff date? Do they all of a sudden disappear from life or what?


Yes. I have all the records collected from meta data.


----------



## Wombatnomore

ute4kp said:


> I agree with you. I was just thinking my post was too short. I'm typing on a phablet letter by letter. I bought a BT keyboard. I don't like using it. Spell check and word prediction goes away with BT use. I see it's 3.45am here. Have to get to sleep. I have a dentist appt today. Good nite. G'day.


Nite young Squirrel!


----------



## ute4kp

MommaJody said:


> I would just like for someone to list three POSITIVE things that Hillary has done for this country that is not to benefit her in the long run. I have studied her from her days in Little Rock, Arkansas. I haven't found one thing that she has accomplished that has been beneficial to anyone but her or her family. So please, enlighten me with all of her great accomplishments.


It's a secret. I don't keep full documents for your benefit.


----------



## MommaJody

Wombatnomore said:


> The problem is, you're the one making the claims and therefore it's beholden on you to back up what your saying. Other people shouldn't have to research the claims you make. Present your point of view properly and responsibly and you'll earn the respect you so very much believe in.


It's not beholden to me to provide anything. Either you care enough to look something up or you don't, and that is your choice. Either you believe me or you don't and you are curious enough to look up things yourself. From the listings that I have been reading, you don't believe what doesn't go along with what you believed in before. So why should I look something up for you when you wouldn't believe it anyway? I am not asking you to believe me or to respect me. I am doing just like you and many others are, STATING MY OPINIONS. And of course, you know what they say about opinions, everyone has one.


----------



## MommaJody

ute4kp said:


> It's a secret. I don't keep full documents for your benefit.


I wasn't asking you personally. I said "someone."


----------



## Wombatnomore

MommaJody said:


> It's not beholden to me to provide anything. Either you care enough to look something up or you don't, and that is your choice. Either you believe me or you don't and you are curious enough to look up things yourself. *From the listings that I have been reading, you don't believe what doesn't go along with what you believed in before. So why should I look something up for you when you wouldn't believe it anyway?* I am not asking you to believe me or to respect me. I am doing just like you and many others are, STATING MY OPINIONS. And of course, you know what they say about opinions, everyone has one.


And what "listings" would they be? See, you're demonstrating the tactics of someone who can't back up what they're saying. An opinion is one thing, an informed opinion is quite another.

It might be that you can't be bothered backing up your claims or you may not know how to back up your claims. Either way, what ever you opine here is irrelevant to the discussion and you're wasting everyone's time including your own.


----------



## BrattyPatty

MommaJody said:


> I can't believe that BrattyPatty is wanting everything to be so factual. She must actual believe the numbers that the Obama administration is putting out to make the statement that the country is making a comeback economically and more jobs are being created. Does she not take into consideration that after so long on unemployment benefits that the administration just ignores those figures and start with the ones that came after them. Then when those reach the cutoff time, they drop that number. On and on and on. Where do you think those unemployed go after a certain time?


I go by what Forbes says about the numbers. Whether you like it not, things are getting better. The stock market has been up to 18,000 last week. There are more jobs since December of 2014.

I just wanted you to know that what you were saying about Hillary and Your "Who Cares "remark was wrong and cherry picked. As I said before, give the whole statement instead of taking 5 words and twisting them around to make it look that she didn't care what happened. I do not believe that that is fair.


----------



## MommaJody

Wombatnomore said:


> And what "listings" would they be? See, you're demonstrating the tactics of someone who can't back up what they're saying. An opinion is one thing, an informed opinion is quite another.
> 
> It might be that you can't be bothered backing up your claims or you may not know how to back up your claims. Either way, what ever you opine here is irrelevant to the discussion and you're wasting everyone's time including your own.


If you think I am wasting everyone's time, feel free to not look at my post and respond. As of now, this is still a free country. If you don't think my opinions are informed, then you and those that agree with you can feel free to ignore and not respond.


----------



## Wombatnomore

MommaJody said:


> I would just like for someone to list three POSITIVE things that Hillary has done for this country that is not to benefit her in the long run. I have studied her from her days in Little Rock, Arkansas. I haven't found one thing that she has accomplished that has been beneficial to anyone but her or her family. So please, enlighten me with all of her great accomplishments.


Here you go! The many achievements and awards of Hillary Rodham Clinton:

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Hillary_Rodham_Clinton_awards_and_honors


----------



## BrattyPatty

anjoda said:


> I have been reading this thread, and had to jump several pages, as it has be getting really out of hand. I agree with the above post, there has been a lot of incorrect facts stated here. In my opinion President Obama has done an excellent job, with absolutely no help from that sorry lot in congress.
> I think that you ladies should be honest, Not a single Republican, not even Jeb Bush, has the qualifications or experience that Hilliary Clinton has. The others are a bunch of inept, inexperienced, "boys". I, for one will definitely be voting for her. Mitt Romney showed exactly what he had in mind ror the country with his 1% exposed video. So, make no mistake, that is the agenda of the Republicans. Slash taxes for the rich and pay for the tax breaks by cutting all the social programs. That was tried before, and we all know where that put us. And better yet, squash the nuclear deal with Iran, and start a new war, because the ones we had for the past 10 years were not enough to pay for or enough of a sacrifice of our young troops. So, Hillary, I am on board.


 :thumbup: :thumbup: :thumbup: :thumbup:


----------



## Wombatnomore

MommaJody said:


> If you think I am wasting everyone's time, feel free to not look at my post and respond. As of now, this is still a free country. If you don't think my opinions are informed, then you and those that agree with you can feel free to ignore and not respond.


I'm just helping. If you want your opinion to matter, then make it matter. I'll continue to make suggestions if I so wish. Happy to help.


----------



## MommaJody

BrattyPatty said:


> I go by what Forbes says about the numbers. Whether you like it not, things are getting better. The stock market has been up to 18,000 last week. There are more jobs since December of 2014.
> 
> I just wanted you to know that what you were saying about Hillary and Your "Who Cares "remark was wrong and cherry picked. As I said before, give the whole statement instead of taking 5 words and twisting them around to make it look that she didn't care what happened. I do not believe that that is fair.


As I stated before, if you want to believe the numbers that the administration gives out to make them look good, by all means do so. I particularly choose to look deeper and see the real story.


----------



## MommaJody

Wombatnomore said:


> I'm just helping. If you want your opinion to matter, then make it matter. I'll continue to make suggestions if I so wish. Happy to help.


Helping who?


----------



## Wombatnomore

MommaJody said:


> Helping who?


You of course!


----------



## Wombatnomore

MommaJody said:


> As I stated before, if you want to believe the numbers that the administration gives out to make them look good, by all means do so. I particularly choose to look deeper and see the real story.


So you choose to look deeper to see the real story but you don't share what you find out. That's not fair either.


----------



## BrattyPatty

MommaJody said:


> I would just like for someone to list three POSITIVE things that Hillary has done for this country that is not to benefit her in the long run. I have studied her from her days in Little Rock, Arkansas. I haven't found one thing that she has accomplished that has been beneficial to anyone but her or her family. So please, enlighten me with all of her great accomplishments.


What has any candidate done for the country. That question is one that should be asked after they leave the office. She has rekindled friendships with our allies around the world as Sec of State. She flew 1 million miles as SOS in order to do that. She has worked on health care reform as a senator in New York. She fights for equality in the job force. She fights for womens rights.

Can you enlighten me with anything Ted Cruz has accomplished besides shutting down the government ?
How about Rand Paul? What has he accomplished for the good of our country?


----------



## BrattyPatty

Wombatnomore said:


> Here you go! The many achievements and awards of Hillary Rodham Clinton:
> 
> http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Hillary_Rodham_Clinton_awards_and_honors


Thanks for the link, Wombat!


----------



## MommaJody

BrattyPatty said:


> What has any candidate done for the country. That question is one that should be asked after they leave the office. She has rekindled friendships with our allies around the world as Sec of State. She flew 1 million miles as SOS in order to do that. She has worked on health care reform as a senator in New York. She fights for equality in the job force. She fights for womens rights.
> 
> Can you enlighten me with anything Ted Cruz has accomplished besides shutting down the government ?
> How about Rand Paul? What has he accomplished for the good of our country?


In my opinion the only reason she tried to rekindle friendships with our allies was in order for them to support her running for the presidency. If you go back and look at the laws, we have had equality in the workforce and women's rights for years.

As far as Ted Cruz or Rand Paul, I have nothing good to say about them either. Like I said in an earlier listing, I wish we honestly could get a presidential candidate that had a good moral compass and resume to become president. It's just that this listing was about Hillary. She has a listing of plenty of awards and honors, but if you have enough money and clout, anyone can get those. I still don't think she has done anything to deserve those other than the money and clout behind her. ''Would she be getting those awards and honors if she was actually charged with all the wrongdoings she has done? What if someone was actually able to get copies of the emails she deleted? What if she had not been able to worm her way out of a conviction in the Whitewater incident? Why was she not prosecuted for hiding the documents in her office in the supposedly vincent suicide? I don't look at just the awards and honors as most times they are given for nothing. I also look at all the wrongs that she has been involved in and yet always seems to worm her way out of it. Just like Bill did when he stated "It all depends on what your definition of "is" is. I mean, really, look at the whole picture. I'm not saying Cruz or Rand is any better. I'm just saying that I have known Hillary's track record for a LONG LONG time. It is not good.


----------



## damemary

galaxycraft said:


> No Way Jose! :thumbdown: She has not proven to be a leader. :thumbdown:
> From the first lady to the present.


 :?: :?: :?: :?: :?: :?: :?: Silly statement IMHO


----------



## damemary

Quite the contrary. Agree to disagree.



soloweygirl said:


> Hillary will have to answer questions this time around and not side step them or slough them off as she has in the past.
> 
> I agree with you galaxycraft, "she has not proven to be a leader".


----------



## damemary

And what about current and potential male candidates? I think Hillary Clinton's intelligence and experience make her the best qualified. Like it or not.



hildy3 said:


> When is the last time we had a male President with no baggage?


----------



## Wombatnomore

MommaJody said:


> In my opinion the only reason she tried to rekindle friendships with our allies was in order for them to support her running for the presidency. If you go back and look at the laws, we have had equality in the workforce and women's rights for years.
> 
> As far as Ted Cruz or Rand Paul, I have nothing good to say about them either. Like I said in an earlier listing, I wish we honestly could get a presidential candidate that had a good moral compass and resume to become president. It's just that this listing was about Hillary. She has a listing of plenty of awards and honors, but if you have enough money and clout, anyone can get those. I still don't think she has done anything to deserve those other than the money and clout behind her. ''Would she be getting those awards and honors if she was actually charged with all the wrongdoings she has done? What if someone was actually able to get copies of the emails she deleted? What if she had not been able to worm her way out of a conviction in the Whitewater incident? Why was she not prosecuted for hiding the documents in her office in the supposedly vincent suicide? I don't look at just the awards and honors as most times they are given for nothing. I also look at all the wrongs that she has been involved in and yet always seems to worm her way out of it. Just like Bill did when he stated "It all depends on what your definition of "is" is. I mean, really, look at the whole picture. I'm not saying Cruz or Rand is any better. I'm just saying that I have known Hillary's track record for a LONG LONG time. It is not good.


The link below gives 50 interesting facts about Hillary Rodham Clinton. Many are not flattering but there are many more that are. If you care to read this, think about what it takes to get to a point in life where you have been a Governors wife, First Lady of the White House, United States of America, a U.S. Senator, Secretary of State for the United States of America and now a candidate for the Presidency of the United States of America not to mention one of the top 100 lawyers in the country. Hillary must have done something right to have come this far as have the other candidates.

You speak of all of her wrong doings. Hillary Clinton has not been found guilty or convicted of any crime despite more investigations into the various issues than any other politician has had to endure more than likely. Like it or lump it, Hillary Clinton is running for the presidency of the United States of America. End of story.

http://facts.randomhistory.com/2009/03/10_hillary.html


----------



## damemary

A start:

Senator from NY 8 years.

Extensive experience in foreign affairs as Secretary of State.



CarolfromTX said:


> So to sum up Mrs. Clinton's achievements:
> 1. She's a woman and
> 2. She's a bi**h.
> 
> Great. What a resume! Anyone care to add to that exhaustive list of her good points? Anyone? **crickets**


----------



## Globee

Check out Snopes.com and you will learn what she accomplished


----------



## damemary

By Dan Payne

Updated March 20, 2015, 10:00 am

Suppose I told you about a candidate for president, who had this background:

Spent eight years in the U.S. Senate on the Armed Service Committee
Served on other committees on the budget, the environment, transportation, health, workplace safety, pensions, and children, families and the aging
Was honored as a tireless voice for children by the nations leading child advocacy organization
Was called by GOP Sen. Lindsey Graham one of the most effective secretary of states, greatest ambassadors for the American people that I have known in my lifetime in May 2012
Was named by Time magazine one of the 25 most powerful women of the past century

Its Hillary Clinton, and she may be the most qualified candidate for the presidency in a generation.

Despite ceaseless attacks on her that continue to this day, in 2014 she was named  for the 13th straight year and 19th time overall  by the American people as the most admired woman in the world, according to the Gallup organization.

Forbes magazine ranked her as one of most powerful people in the world nine times. She has been named eight times to Time magazines most influential 100 people on the planet.

In her first campaign for public office, she won a seat in the U.S. Senate from New York; the states first female senator, she defeated a popular New York politician 55 percent to 43 percent. She quickly established herself as a hard-working, respected U.S. senator, earning praise from Republican colleagues John McCain and Orrin Hatch, among others.

A graduate of Wellesley College and Yale Law School, she has worked with organizations dealing with the plight of migrant workers, indigents needing legal help, distressed children and families, and increasing educational opportunity. She helped run the western presidential campaign of U.S. Sen. George McGovern, and served on the legal staff on the U.S. House committee that impeached Richard Nixon.

As first lady in Arkansas, she chaired the Arkansas Educational Standards Committee, co-founded the Arkansas Advocates for Children and Families, and served on the boards of the Arkansas Childrens Hospital, Legal Services and the Childrens Defense Fund.

Ms. Clinton headed a task force that fashioned the countrys first national health care measure, which the Republicans in Washington vigorously trashed, inducing so much fear that it was scuttled.

Russias Vladimir Putin to Germanys Angela Merkel to Aung San Suu Kyi in Myanmar. Its hard to imagine Republican Gov. Scott Walker intimidating Putin with stories of how he faced down striking state workers, or North Koreas leader Kim Jong-un fretting over Gov. Chris Christies bluster, or Irans Supreme Leader Ali Khamenei staying awake at night over Sen. Marco Rubios name on that borderline traitorous letter sent to Iran by 47 GOP senators, or Cubas Castro brothers losing sleep over a third Bush in the White House, or Boko Haram, the Nigerian terrorists who have kidnapped young women and beheaded enemies, worrying about the fiery speeches of pediatric surgeon Ben Carson, a leading Republican presidential candidate in several states.

Rand Paul? He doesnt even believe we should have a foreign policy.

When the national Childrens Defense Fund honored Hillary Clinton in 2013, the groups president said: Shes brilliant. She cares deeply about children. She perseveres. Shes an incredibly hard worker, and she stays with it.

She would be the most qualified person to enter the White House in modern history, Minority Leader Nancy Pelosi declared. Shed be the best qualified person weve seen  with all due respect to President Clinton when he went in, President Obama and President Bush and everybody else.

Dan Payne is a Democratic political analyst for WBUR.



lovethelake said:


> I find it offensive that women are going vote for her just because of her gender. Is she the right person? I also find it offensive that women can even support her. During the bimbo eruptions I had turned on the TV to see the weather forecast while my daughter was eating her cereal. Then all of a sudden the cigar story came on. My daughter asked about it, and I was aghast and she was too young for the real answer. But was I thought was even worse is that Hillary stayed to him. If she had forgiven him but left him I would have respected her. But she stayed with him for his political connections so she could get the jobs she wanted. So what lesson has she taught our daughters? That if you stay with an adulterous husband that is convicted of perjury because that is the only way to make it in politics, it is okay. What????? If she is that good, then should have been able to be successful without Bill and his money.
> 
> I have yet had an answer to my question. Can you name 5 accomplishments that Hillary has done on her own and how do they make her qualified to be president? I can't think of one, honestly.


----------



## Wombatnomore

"She's a woman" and "She's a b***h."

Charming coming from another woman (I presume). Hillary Clinton is where she is because she is a formidable and capable politician and if that means she is forthright, uncompromising and relentless then power to her.


----------



## damemary

Lukelucy said:


> Hillary IS a god ole boy. Do not be fooled.


In spite misspelling (none of the candidates have claimed to be god...at least in front of cameras), I happen to think being one of the 'good old boys' is a plus in experience for Hillary Clinton. She knows how they operate and the most effective response.


----------



## damemary

NOTE: Commenting on a woman's fashion rather than qualifications is offensive.



Bunbun said:


> plus someone needs to take her aside and do a "What NOT to wear" on her and that hair. She does NOT look like someone I would want representing my country. She's trying to look like she's a teenager. YUK!


----------



## damemary

You obviously have not read much. Thank you for proving it.



theyarnlady said:


> Well you do know that you will never hear anything as she has nothing that she has accomplish. Well anything good and helpful to this country.


----------



## damemary

If you have eliminated the major GOP candidate with the Democratic one, who do you support for GOP Presidential candidate in 2016?

(Another direct hit to the foot by the GOP. Sometimes it's too easy. Back on alert.)



Gerslay said:


> Please people...we don't want another Clinton or another Bush in the White House!
> 
> We've had a Bush in the upper echelons of government since 1971 when Geo H Bush became a member of the Texas House of Reps and since 1979 when Bill Clinton became AG in Arkansas. That's 44 and 36 years respectively. If either one of them wins the presidency we'll have one family dynasty in power for over half a century and the other for slightly less then half a century!
> 
> What are we...North Korea?


----------



## damemary

She's seen politics at the nastiest levels for her entire lifetime. She's been tested. And she doesn't suffer fools easily.



Wombatnomore said:


> I heard on the news there is concern that Hillary won't have a tough enough rival and therefore her capabilities will not be thoroughly tested.


----------



## damemary

And I think Hillary Clinton is just the person to do it. I may enjoy this.



susanmos2000 said:


> Frankly CB, after those 47 Republicans wrote that treasonous letter to Iran I lost confidence in their understanding of "fair play" and "the spirit of law". They play down and dirty, and the only way to beat them is to match them move for move.


----------



## damemary

Offensive on many bases. Go ahead and make your 'point.'



Pocahontas said:


> :thumbup: :thumbup: And many people voted for our current president for the sole reason that he is black.
> Our country is in a mess and only by the grace of God will we regain any strength and respect.


----------



## damemary

I think you're wasting your vote, but that's me.



SQM said:


> I agree with Gers. Too many Bushes and Clintons. Wish some other candidates would have the cajones to run against both. Remember - I trash Monarchies and both are owned by their respective political machines. Hills is too belligerent for my taste and Bush would be a Daddy's boy. The other Rep. candidates are not worth even talking about. I may stay home Nov, '16 and give neither any legitimacy. I have spent many years ignoring other worthless presidents.


----------



## damemary

Line up. Have a tea party.



theyarnlady said:


> I may have to join you. :thumbup:


----------



## damemary

Prove 'they' exist then. Scamper.



CarolfromTX said:


> Sure, if all concerned are on the up and up. But it's politics, so I ask you, what are the odds?! Mrs. Clinton and the libs will do everything in their power to bury those emails.


----------



## damemary

susanmos2000 said:


> How about write-in candidates? Huey, Dewey, and Louie? :-D


 :thumbup: :thumbup: :thumbup:


----------



## luvrcats

Did "she" actually accomplish anything good--or did her "dear", "sweet", and lying husband do it--can't see what benefit "she" would be in the White House. We need someone who doesn't lie--and would actually help we, the people. Wonder if there is ANYONE who cares about REAL life.


----------



## damemary

BrattyPatty said:


> People are looking for perfection in a presidential candidate. The media will have each candidate stripped down before the election, all the skeletons in the colsets will be exposed. Stories will be fabricated, too. People will be angry that their candidate is not perfect. Or that they don't have a spotless background.
> Let me remind you of something. There was only one perfect person that ever walked the earth and we hung him on a cross.


 :thumbup: :thumbup: :thumbup:


----------



## damemary

Irish knitter said:


> She did...it was on the news......when she was questioned about Bengazi and whether they could have been saved with her phone call she stated:
> 
> "who cares; they are dead now.....get over it"


 :XD: :XD: :XD: :XD: :XD: ROFL 'it was on the news.' :XD: :XD: :XD: :XD: :XD:Thanks Gracie. (Allen.)


----------



## luvrcats

And you really believe that we live in a better world due to the current president? Just ask the millions who are no longer counted who have yet to find a job. The media, unfortunately, "allows" us to hear only what they want us to hear. How many in our government tell the truth anymore....difficult to believe them anymore. :thumbdown: :thumbdown:


----------



## damemary

sharethefun said:


> And you really believe that we live in a better world due to the current president? Just ask the millions who are no longer counted who have yet to find a job. The media, unfortunately, "allows" us to hear only what they want us to hear. How many in our government tell the truth anymore....difficult to believe them anymore. :thumbdown: :thumbdown:


Cynics get what they expect.


----------



## DGreen

J.Carol said:


> I don't believe she was one step away from POTUS. I think she was told what to do by her handlers. They probably enticed her with a million $$$ ... give or take a few. They interjected her into the horse and pony show. Guess they were bored and needed something to do and get a few extra laughs. She actually did some pretty good acting but it was short lived. Here one day ... gone the next.


Too bad she didn't take the hint and disappear gracefully. She still is operating under the grossly mistaken idea that she is relevant.


----------



## damemary

good summary. thanks.



Wombatnomore said:


> The link below gives 50 interesting facts about Hillary Rodham Clinton. Many are not flattering but there are many more that are. If you care to read this, think about what it takes to get to a point in life where you have been a Governors wife, First Lady of the White House, United States of America, a U.S. Senator, Secretary of State for the United States of America and now a candidate for the Presidency of the United States of America not to mention one of the top 100 lawyers in the country. Hillary must have done something right to have come this far as have the other candidates.
> 
> You speak of all of her wrong doings. Hillary Clinton has not been found guilty or convicted of any crime despite more investigations into the various issues than any other politician has had to endure more than likely. Like it or lump it, Hillary Clinton is running for the presidency of the United States of America. End of story.
> 
> http://facts.randomhistory.com/2009/03/10_hillary.html


----------



## damemary

Wombatnomore said:


> "She's a woman" and "She's a b***h."
> 
> Charming coming from another woman (I presume). Hillary Clinton is where she is because she is a formidable and capable politician and if that means she is forthright, uncompromising and relentless then power to her.


 :thumbup: :thumbup: :thumbup: I wasn't much of a Hillary fan previously, but I'm becoming convinced.


----------



## Janeway

SQM said:


> I proudly reported Janeway's memes to the Ostrich. They were beyond any standard of good taste.


Well, well, so you are backstabbing again, but you always say you don't! Those picture quotes are facts so it won't do any good to report me as all of my friends will report you for being the hateful person you are known to be on KP!

Return to your Democratic friends!


----------



## susanmos2000

sumpleby said:


> I can predict one thing for a certainty, if Hillary Clinton or some other Democrat--even Elizabeth Warren--is elected we will be treated to more of the same from Republicans.


So true, Sumpleby. I can't help noticing that the exact same smears and epithets we've heard throughout Obama's terms in office--"arrogant" "above the law"--are now being flung at Clinton. I'm just waiting now for the birthers and the racists to get into the act. It seems pretty undeniable that Clinton is a Caucasian Christian woman born in Chicago, Illinois, but trust me--they'll soon be presenting "evidence" from some bizarre source(s) that Hillary is the illegitimate daughter of a mixed-race Iranian mullah and has already hired contractors to build a mosque in the basement of the White House.


----------



## damemary

susanmos2000 said:


> So true, Sumpleby. I can't help noticing that the exact same smears and epithets we've heard throughout Obama's terms in office--"arrogant" "above the law"--are now being flung at Clinton. I'm just waiting now for the birthers and the racists to get into the act. It seems pretty undeniable that Clinton is a Caucasian Christian woman born in Chicago, Illinois, but trust me--they'll soon be presenting "evidence" from some bizarre source(s) that Hillary is the illegitimate daughter of a mixed-race Iranian mullah and has already hired contractors to build a mosque in the basement of the White House.


Don't give them any ridiculous hints. They'll invent some more ridiculous hints. At least it will keep them busy for a bit. :XD:


----------



## MommaJody

It just seems very convenient that when someone gets really close to airing evidence about the Clintons and their dirty dealings, all of a sudden there is an "accident" that results in the death of that person. For instance, Vince. He was a good friend of the Clintons but when he started to air certain evidence, he supposedly committed suicide. I just find it hard to believe that someone that is left handed decided to commit suicide by shooting himself in the head with the right hand. Then the paperwork that the investigation was looking for could not be found. Then it was several months later that the papers were all of a sudden discovered in Hilary's office. Go back to the Arkansas years and you will be amazed at the number of "accidents" that happened to their enemies.


----------



## damemary

OK. That can be your tale. Scamper.



MommaJody said:


> It just seems very convenient that when someone gets really close to airing evidence about the Clintons and their dirty dealings, all of a sudden there is an "accident" that results in the death of that person. For instance, Vince. He was a good friend of the Clintons but when he started to air certain evidence, he supposedly committed suicide. I just find it hard to believe that someone that is left handed decided to commit suicide by shooting himself in the head with the right hand. Then the paperwork that the investigation was looking for could not be found. Then it was several months later that the papers were all of a sudden discovered in Hilary's office. Go back to the Arkansas years and you will be amazed at the number of "accidents" that happened to their enemies.


----------



## Moe C

MommaJody said:


> For instance, Vince. I just find it hard to believe that someone that is left handed decided to commit suicide by shooting himself in the head with the right hand.


Twice, no less!


----------



## E P Guinn

Irish knitter said:


> I do not want to start a fight but I have lost all respect for Hillary after she said "who cares" after the death of our ambassador. I just finished 13 hours in Benghazi and they stated if she had moved right in the beginning none of them would have died and it WAS a terrorist attack and the whitehouse knew about it but kept their mouths shut.
> 
> Also...I have read what the whitehouse secret service said about her being "flying off the handle" at a moments notice; being B-tchy; in control and a all around pain in the a--.
> 
> All of this infornmation comes from reliable sources. They guy who wrote 13 hours in Benghazi was a survivor and just stated the facts. The secret service remarks I ran accross when I was looking up Caroline/John Kennedy's detail. They "tell all". Like the Bush twins were the worst to protect as they would run red lights to get rid of their agents and call "Daddy" when their agents caught up with them. The easiest to protect was Amy Carter.....her worst thing was roller skating in the whitehouse...
> 
> As I said before.....I am not trying to start an argument. Maybe we should be careful....
> 
> I will have to look to see where I got my whitehouse information.
> 
> Just think about the last Clinton whitehouse.....Bill was a front while Hillary ran it. We will be no better off than we are now.
> I am terrified if she wins....
> I do not like to get into politics but we are all doomed if she wins.......I want a woman in the whitehouse.....BUT the right woman and it is NOT hillary!!!


I'm with you!!!


----------



## susanmos2000

damemary said:


> Don't give them any ridiculous hints. They'll invent some more ridiculous hints. At least it will keep them busy for a bit. :XD:


You're right Dame, but there isn't a doubt in my mind that these folks already have their noses to the grindstone. They work fast--I predict within one week "evidence" will emerge attacking Clinton's ethnicity, religion, and citizenship status.

Seven days...long enough for the crazies to comb the local jails and trailer parks for "impeccable sources", warm up their Photoshop programs, and produce the junk documents.


----------



## alifletcher

Again you do well disrespecting her. Who do you Think would do a better job and is more qualified ! I have not seen any other solutions in this thread.


----------



## alifletcher

When is the last time you looked at the unemployment rate ? its the lowest it has been. Eleven million people have health insurance that the middle class do not have to pay for. Do you have a child in college ? Tuition rates have been reduced for students by Our President. And if you were lucky enough to have insurance your child can remain on your plan until they are 26. Shall I go on ?


----------



## Globee

I think it's amazing that not one single republican comment on this site has mentioned Adelman and the Koch brothers. Do they really want the country run by these big money people who are out to enhance their own coffers. I find it very scary.


----------



## alifletcher

Really !


----------



## damemary

Conspiracy theories by the minute. I can hardly wait....NOT.



susanmos2000 said:


> You're right Dame, but there isn't a doubt in my mind that these folks already have their noses to the grindstone. They work fast--I predict within one week "evidence" will emerge attacking Clinton's ethnicity, religion, and citizenship status.
> 
> Seven days...long enough for the crazies to comb the local jails and trailer parks for "impeccable sources", warm up their Photoshop programs, and produce the junk documents.


----------



## damemary

alifletcher said:


> Again you do well disrespecting her. Who do you Think would do a better job and is more qualified ! I have not seen any other solutions in this thread.


 :thumbup: :thumbup: :thumbup: :thumbup:


----------



## craftygac

thanks for the help on how to increase type size.


----------



## MrsC

What we NEED is a honest, ethical PERSON who loves this country!


----------



## Gerslay

Globee said:


> I think it's amazing that not one single republican comment on this site has mentioned Adelman and the Koch brothers. Do they really want the country run by these big money people who are out to enhance their own coffers. I find it very scary.


Its not so amazing as a matter of fact its fairly typical of those who cry foul over the Koch brothers yet largely ignore George Soros:
 A left wing billionaire contributing huge amounts of money = democracy in action. 
 Two conservative billionaires doing the same = the end of democracy.


----------



## DGreen

alifletcher said:


> Again you do well disrespecting her. Who do you Think would do a better job and is more qualified ! I have not seen any other solutions in this thread.


Did you miss the one who thought McCain should partner with god? About as effective and credible as his last running mate.


----------



## WindingRoad

alifletcher said:


> When is the last time you looked at the unemployment rate ? its the lowest it has been. Eleven million people have health insurance that the middle class do not have to pay for. Do you have a child in college ? Tuition rates have been reduced for students by Our President. And if you were lucky enough to have insurance your child can remain on your plan until they are 26. Shall I go on ?


Student loan interest rates are the highest rates on any loan. That sorta makes up for the rest of it. Which tuition rates have decreased? Can you tell us which schools those are.


----------



## DGreen

WindingRoad said:


> Student loan interest rates are the highest rates on any loan. That sorta makes up for the rest of it. Which tuition rates have decreased? Can you tell us which schools those are.


Are you suggesting that student loan interest rates are the brainchild of Obama?


----------



## Silverfox70

Yes you should go on it just showes now uniformed most of you are I am voting republican I don't care who they choose just like the dem do this time instead of tryng to weigh the facts


----------



## Wombatnomore

damemary said:


> :thumbup: :thumbup: :thumbup: I wasn't much of a Hillary fan previously, but I'm becoming convinced.


I've always liked her. She's conducted herself with grace and humility in the face of deep humiliation and often undue criticism. I think with the right support, Hillary Clinton will be a fair and even handed leader, well, as far as her opposition will allow her to be. :roll:


----------



## WindingRoad

damemary said:


> In spite misspelling (none of the candidates have claimed to be god...at least in front of cameras), I happen to think being one of the 'good old boys' is a plus in experience for Hillary Clinton. She knows how they operate and the most effective response.


And she operates the very same way they do. Funny how that works isn't it. Just another follower. We need a leader. And it ain't her.


----------



## craftygac

At the age of 26 I would certainly hope if this economy was as good as most of you think it is would have a job to pay for their own. Wait till you get your non tax refund due to the subsidies being increased for health insurance. I am paying more and I am middle class. It was $980 a month it is now $1200 this is because of the Obama care. Yes its affordable now by our paying more to allow the illegals insurance. I would like to see a fund set up for those that can't pay but not freebies for those who don't work and live of the government. I hope all here stay healthy - I have seen two cases of cancer treatment not offered because they were 80 very scary. My last statement on this subject I like this knitters group and its the first time I let myself get caught up in politics and Obama care without discussing with business people. How can we reach those that don't understand I don't know how - we are all entitled to vote for whom we choose - but how do we get the right choices to vote for so our men in uniform can be safe, and our country. It is sad that our choices are limited to those that have had they way in government so long that we don't have a better choice to choose from. No one is perfect but if you go against the laws like email account when you shouldn't what keeps that same person from doing something to our country that she shouldn't just because she thinks she has the right any man for that reason. I
am done ranting. Back to crocheting and knitting for my new great granddaughter to be. I hope she can grow up in a country that is not knee deep in debt and a country that safe no matter who gets in. Back to prayers on that. Peace


----------



## WindingRoad

Wombatnomore said:


> I've always liked her. She's conducted herself with grace and humility in the face of deep humiliation and often undue criticism. I think with the right support, Hillary Clinton will be a fair and even handed leader, well, as far as her opposition will allow her to be. :roll:


She can't even take care of her own hair when she's not a home. And you think she can run a country. You can have her. Let her run Australia.


----------



## Silverfox70

Yes!!! The lord will come back and every wil bow


----------



## DGreen

WindingRoad said:


> She can't even take care of her own hair when she's not a home. And you think she can run a country. You can have her. Let her run Australia.


Stupid remark, TwistedRoad. Back to judging women by their hair and clothing, are you?


----------



## Wombatnomore

susanmos2000 said:


> So true, Sumpleby. I can't help noticing that the exact same smears and epithets we've heard throughout Obama's terms in office--"arrogant" "above the law"--are now being flung at Clinton. I'm just waiting now for the birthers and the racists to get into the act. It seems pretty undeniable that Clinton is a Caucasian Christian woman born in Chicago, Illinois, but trust me--they'll soon be presenting "evidence" from some bizarre source(s) that Hillary is the illegitimate daughter of a mixed-race Iranian mullah and has already hired contractors to build a mosque in the basement of the White House.


Have been seeing the republican 'attack ads' about Hillary over here. They're more like tacky Film Noir than a bite providing credible reasoning as to why the G-d fearing shouldn't vote for her. :mrgreen:


----------



## DGreen

Silverfox70 said:


> Yes!!! The lord will come back and every wil bow


ROFL


----------



## WindingRoad

DGreen said:


> Stupid remark, TwistedRoad. Back to judging women by their hair and clothing, are you?


I judge people by what they say and do. You're her buddy don't you keep up with what she says or are you another Pied Piper follower. She said herself she didn't know what to do with her hair when she was Sec of State. LOL Missed that one did you?


----------



## Wombatnomore

WindingRoad said:


> She can't even take care of her own hair when she's not a home. And you think she can run a country. You can have her. Let her run Australia.


And we'd be lucky and glad to have her. You wouldn't know a good thing if it slapped you every which way.


----------



## jodymorse151

So far 63 pages. We are not even started with this election cycle. This is worse than all the yard signs. Let's stop this and get back to knitting ... or gardening ... or playing with grandchildren ... or going to church ... or sitting in the sun with a cat ... or anything else but this.


----------



## Wombatnomore

Silverfox70 said:


> Yes!!! The lord will come back and every wil bow


Pardon?


----------



## DGreen

WindingRoad said:


> I judge people by what they say and do. You're her buddy don't you keep up with what she says or are you another Pied Piper follower. She said herself she didn't know what to do with her hair when she was Sec of State. LOL Missed that one did you?


Relegated to the "irrelevant" bin. Just like you.


----------



## DGreen

jodymorse151 said:


> So far 63 pages. We are not even started with this election cycle. This is worse than all the yard signs. Let's stop this and get back to knitting ... or gardening ... or playing with grandchildren ... or going to church ... or sitting in the sun with a cat ... or anything else but this.


Then go away!


----------



## jodymorse151

DGreen said:


> Then go away!


Oh I'm going ... KPers usually aren't his nasty


----------



## Wombatnomore

WindingRoad said:


> She can't even take care of her own hair when she's not a home. And you think she can run a country. You can have her. Let her run Australia.


What's her hair got to do with anything? So what? Yes, I think she could run a country because she's smart, experienced and she doesn't suffer fools among a myriad of other exceptional traits.


----------



## DGreen

craftygac said:


> Yes its affordable now by our paying more to allow the illegals insurance.


Don't believe everything you hear on Faux news.

...as the National Immigration Law Center has noted, undocumented immigrants cannot get subsidized health care coverage under the ACA and are not even allowed to purchase private insurance through the individual health insurance Marketplace at full cost. They are also not eligible for subsidized health care or Medicare, nonemergency Medicaid, or the Children's Health Insurance Program (CHIP).


----------



## knitpresentgifts

Wombatnomore said:


> I've always liked her. She's conducted herself with grace and humility in the face of deep humiliation and often undue criticism. I think with the right support, Hillary Clinton will be a fair and even handed leader, well, as far as her opposition will allow her to be. :roll:


Oh, are you referring to Wall Street, Goldman Sachs or the various foreign govts that support Hillary like China and Saudi Arabia for example? If that is the 'right support' you accept for one running for the office of POTUS, you should send her some of your funds too, and put your money where your mouth is. Or better yet, instead of influencing an American running for President with foreign ILLEGAL contributions, help Hill become your PM.


----------



## dianejohnson

Dorsey said:


> Dear Lord, who would want to see that slut's dress???


What is wrong with you? You call Hillary Clinton a slut? and turn your defaming comment into a PRAYER? You are simply beyond rational conversation.


----------



## knitpresentgifts

Wombatnomore said:


> And we'd be lucky and glad to have her. You wouldn't know a good thing if it slapped you every which way.


I'll ship her to you, make room.


----------



## knitpresentgifts

Wombatnomore said:


> What's her hair got to do with anything? So what? Yes, I think she could run a country because she's smart, experienced and she doesn't suffer fools among a myriad of other exceptional traits.


What does a gallon of Kool-Aid cost nowadays in Oz?


----------



## DGreen

joeysomma said:


> Now* all* student loans are regulated by the government, including the interest rates. Students can no longer shop for the best deal.


And the current rate was set in 2001 when overall interest rates were higher. Our current do-nothing, republican-controlled congress has refused to adjust the rate.


----------



## DGreen

dianejohnson said:


> What is wrong with you? You call Hillary Clinton a slut? and turn your defaming comment into a PRAYER? You are simply beyond rational conversation.


She was talking about Monica Lewinski, which of course, has nothing to do with Hillary, though most of the repubs criticize Hillary for forgiving Bill. Funny, I heard someplace that the traditional marriage so highly prized by the fundamentalists is supposed to be "till death do us part" and that forgiveness is a Christian value. Apparently the fundies have overlooked such inconvenient details.


----------



## Gerslay

Wombatnomore said:


> I've always liked her. She's conducted herself with grace and humility in the face of deep humiliation and often undue criticism. I think with the right support, Hillary Clinton will be a fair and even handed leader, well, as far as her opposition will allow her to be. :roll:


I've never liked her. She has never conducted herself with honesty and integrity. In the face of deep humiliation she chose to mock and ridicule those women who stand by their man and yet that's exactly what she did. She gets no credit for that bon mot...just one example among many!


----------



## DGreen

joeysomma said:


> Blame good old Harry for not bringing any bill up for even a discussion. How could Republicans do anything in Congress?


Yes, we've been over that again and again. No point in bringing up a bill that the repubs have already vowed to filibuster. Dead point, Joey. Go back to reading your bible.


----------



## Gerslay

jodymorse151 said:


> Oh I'm going ... KPers usually aren't his nasty


Most KPers aren't that nasty but that particular one always is!


----------



## SQM

lins said:


> In real time or fantasy time? What sort of time factor are you talking about here?
> 
> BTW, what happened to the funds for the State Department Security? Oh yeah, Republicans cut that back. Do you remember that part?


I am taking the privilege of inviting you to join us on LOLL. You are our type of thinker.


----------



## WindingRoad

DGreen said:


> And the current rate was set in 2001 when overall interest rates were higher. Our current do-nothing, republican-controlled congress has refused to adjust the rate.


And how long has it been republican controlled?


----------



## Gerslay

knitpresentgifts said:


> What does a gallon of Kool-Aid cost nowadays in Oz?


I'm pretty sure they don't have Kool-Aid in Oz...the closest is probably something called Cottees! I know this because I take an interest in things outside of my own country...doncha know?


----------



## knitpresentgifts

Gerslay said:


> I'm pretty sure they don't have Kool-Aid in Oz...the closest is probably something called Cottees! I know this because I take an interest in things outside of my own country...doncha know?


I do know, and do too! I think she'd benefit from a longer duration of internet connectivity so she could research and learn more before commenting. So, I was concerned too many of her $ were going toward the Kool-Aid.


----------



## lins

MommaJody said:


> Obama is the first President of the United States that actually bows to them as if they are his king. Oh, I guess you didn't see that new footage either huh?


Do you mean footage that is cut up and made into a Republican fairytale that's
edited to feed the minds of the gullible?
Do you mean footage of cut off sentences that lead into cut off sentences from another story that gets passed off as footage filled with crap from a hateful website?
Is that the footage you mean?


----------



## WindingRoad

lins said:


> Do you mean footage that is cut up and made into a Republican fairytale that's
> edited to feed the minds of the gullible?
> Do you mean footage of cut off sentences that lead into cut off sentences from another story that gets passed off as footage filled with crap from a hateful website?
> Is that the footage you mean?


Another foreigner commenting on American politics. Just so everyone knows.


----------



## DGreen

lins said:


> Do you mean footage that is cut up and made into a Republican fairytale that's
> edited to feed the minds of the gullible?
> Do you mean footage of cut off sentences that lead into cut off sentences from another story that gets passed off as footage filled with crap from a hateful website?
> Is that the footage you mean?


I don't think it's gullibility. Just those looking for validation for their hatred of anything remotely liberal.


----------



## knitpresentgifts

WindingRoad said:


> Another foreigner commenting on American politics. Just so everyone knows.


... sounds familiar ... when I spent my vacation in Canada last July, I had no problem hearing the facts of USA news. Why can't they who live there?


----------



## DGreen

WindingRoad said:


> Another foreigner commenting on American politics. Just so everyone knows.


Just so everyone knows, there are a lot of Americans who post here about Israeli politics and politics in other mid-eastern countries.


----------



## lins

MommaJody said:


> I can't believe that BrattyPatty is wanting everything to be so factual. She must actual believe the numbers that the Obama administration is putting out to make the statement that the country is making a comeback economically and more jobs are being created. Does she not take into consideration that after so long on unemployment benefits that the administration just ignores those figures and start with the ones that came after them. Then when those reach the cutoff time, they drop that number. On and on and on. Where do you think those unemployed go after a certain time?


That's the funny thing about facts. That's what they are, not what you want them to be.


----------



## lins

sumpleby said:


> Oh for pity's sake. The man returned a gesture in greeting. What did you want him to do--spit at them? There is absolutely nothing wrong with what he did.


 :thumbup: :thumbup: :thumbup:


----------



## dianejohnson

sandj said:


> How can she be president if her husband was a former president? It must not matter if she was a First Lady?





peacegoddess said:


> Are you for real with this comment? Being a president's spouse does not exempt one from being president in the future.


anyone with the ability to use a keyboard may comment on this forum. 
this doesn't guarantee a high level of intelligence, which is clearly shown in so many of these responses.


----------



## lins

MommaJody said:


> Nothing wrong? So what, now the man that according to general understanding, the most powerful man on earth, bows to the leader of Saudi Arabia? What next bend down and shine his shoes? What's wrong with the usual gesture of shaking their hands? For pity's sakes is right. He should have NEVER have bowed to another leader. Should he have spit at them? Maybe, but common courtesy rules that out now doesn't it?


What next bend down and shine his shoes?

What the heck?


----------



## SQM

Janeway said:


> Well, well, so you are backstabbing again, but you always say you don't! Those picture quotes are facts so it won't do any good to report me as all of my friends will report you for being the hateful person you are known to be on KP!
> 
> Return to your Democratic friends!


Oh Janeee. How quickly you forget. When the Dems were eating you alive, I so nicely steered you to Denim where you have been happily ever after. I am an Independent with friends on all sides. My reputation here is of being hateful???? Hardly. You acted in questionable taste so again I tried to save you from yourself.


----------



## lins

MommaJody said:


> When the man does something to receive some type of respect I will show some respect. Respect is earned not given on a whim.


Funny; he bows, nods, puts his hands together in prayer...I bet he even holds tbe door open for his wife. 
Pretty petty to be knocking these common courtesies.


----------



## lins

WindingRoad said:


> She can't even take care of her own hair when she's not a home. And you think she can run a country. You can have her. Let her run Australia.


So you think doing hair your is comparable to running a country?

Can you do your own hair? Maybe you should run for president.


----------



## WindingRoad

DGreen said:


> Just so everyone knows, there are a lot of Americans who post here about Israeli politics and politics in other mid-eastern countries.


Yes there are. I was just confirming it. That's all. Try to read of content.


----------



## WindingRoad

lins said:


> So you think doing hair your is comparable to running a country?
> 
> Can you do your own hair? Maybe you should run for president.


If you can't even wash and comb your hair I don't think you are fit for office. JMHO. If you don't like it too bad.


----------



## theyarnlady

dianejohnson said:


> What is wrong with you? You call Hillary Clinton a slut? and turn your defaming comment into a PRAYER? You are simply beyond rational conversation.


you did not understand what she posted the dress had to do with the women who wore it in the Presidents office to help said president in what call we call it with out offending a good time .


----------



## lins

joeysomma said:


> Now* all* student loans are regulated by the government, including the interest rates. Students can no longer shop for the best deal.


...and who's fault us that? Do your homework!


----------



## theyarnlady

SQM said:


> I am taking the privilege of inviting you to join us on LOLL. You are our type of thinker.


i think she would enjoy it too. If one does not want to hear what the real Hilliary is about she will.

Sorry all ready explained.


----------



## theyarnlady

lins said:


> ...and who's fault us that? Do your homework!


She did Ms Canada. I would suggest that some on the left may want to do the same.


----------



## lins

WindingRoad said:


> Another foreigner commenting on American politics. Just so everyone knows.


You don't jack about me or my family or where I come from.

As for following or commenting on what's going on in the core of American politics is what people who care about the world do. Not yap petty BS.


----------



## lins

DGreen said:


> I don't think it's gullibility. Just those looking for validation for their hatred of anything remotely liberal.


Yes, partly, but it's also their gullible acceptance of their party spin without thinking it through.


----------



## DGreen

lins said:


> ...and who's fault us that? Do your homework!


Whoever is at fault, the real crime is that nothing is being done to correct the problem. Remarkable, isn't it, that the republican mantra is "get an education" and yet doing so is often a prescription for lifelong debt. When people GENUINELY valued education by supporting it with tax dollars, education was truly a path to a better life and people could afford it. Nowadays, not so much.


----------



## judypfennemore

So interesting to read how people on the ground feel about Hilary ... And 64 pages to read - wonderful stuff. I'm sure I have a somewhat simplistic view, but my understanding of US politics is that whoever pays for the campaigns ,pulls the strings?


----------



## Janeway

MommaJody said:


> It just seems very convenient that when someone gets really close to airing evidence about the Clintons and their dirty dealings, all of a sudden there is an "accident" that results in the death of that person. For instance, Vince. He was a good friend of the Clintons but when he started to air certain evidence, he supposedly committed suicide. I just find it hard to believe that someone that is left handed decided to commit suicide by shooting himself in the head with the right hand. Then the paperwork that the investigation was looking for could not be found. Then it was several months later that the papers were all of a sudden discovered in Hilary's office. Go back to the Arkansas years and you will be amazed at the number of "accidents" that happened to their enemies.


Yes, Vince shot himself in the head not only once but twice with his right hand when he was left handed! :roll: :roll: :roll: :roll:

Think about this suicide for a minute! Impossible! :roll: :roll: :roll: :roll:


----------



## Montana Gramma

WindingRoad said:


> Another foreigner commenting on American politics. Just so everyone knows.


Must say, every country in the world is affected by the politics of the US, from foreign aid to the champion of democracy, so why should they not be enlightened or concerned about who wins the Presidency? 
Yes I am an alien in a foreign country or a foreigner in an alien country depending on which side of a border the discussion is engaged. For 46 years this has been my adopted country. My children are Americans and I feel I can have an opinion on anything affecting them and my Gkids without being called names or least remarked about in an offensive manner. And no I am not going back and find them for those who always request another look. 
And until the other candidates are heard from , you will not know my opinion, not that that matters. I have a personal opinion about Mrs Clinton , but it is mine and it won't enter the realm of her candidacy.


----------



## lins

dianejohnson said:


> anyone with the ability to use a keyboard may comment on this forum. this doesn't guarantee a high level of intelligence, which is clearly shown in so many of these responses.


I just had a coffee spill but it was worth it.


----------



## lins

WindingRoad said:


> If you can't even wash and comb your hair I don't think you are fit for office. JMHO. If you don't like it too bad.


If if that's your criterea for a president, may the force be with you...


----------



## DGreen

Janeway said:


> Yes, Vince shot himself in the head not only once but twice with his right hand when he was left handed! :roll: :roll: :roll: :roll:
> 
> Think about this suicide for a minute! Impossible! :roll: :roll: :roll: :roll:


Glad to know you were part of the investigation and didn't just get your information from YouTube. :roll: :roll: :roll: :roll:

From Wikipedia:

There have been three official investigations into Foster's death, all of which concluded that he committed suicide.

The first was by the United States Park Police in 1993, in whose jurisdiction the original investigation fell. Due to Foster's position in the White House, the Federal Bureau of Investigation assisted in the investigation. Investigations by a coroner and Independent Counsel Robert B. Fiske, in a 58-page report released in 1994, also concluded that Foster had committed suicide. Theories of a cover-up still persisted, some of which were promulgated by the Arkansas Project. After a three-year investigation, Whitewater independent counsel Ken Starr released a report in 1997 also concluding that the death was a suicide. In addition, two investigations by the U.S. Congress found that Foster committed suicide.


----------



## knitpresentgifts

SQM said:


> Oh Janeee. How quickly you forget. When the Dems were eating you alive, I so nicely steered you to Denim where you have been happily ever after. I am an Independent with friends on all sides. My reputation here is of being hateful???? Hardly. You acted in questionable taste so again I tried to save you from yourself.


Oh, SQM, how little you know. Janeway was part of Denim before you ever joined KP. Your reputation precedes you.


----------



## DGreen

"Oh, SQM, Jane was part of Denim before you ever joined KP. Your reputation precedes you."

Better look out, SQM. Next thing you know you will be called...wait for it


...wait for it

...wait for it


a liar.


----------



## SQM

I love you Bright Green.

So glad you are back.


----------



## Janeway

lins said:


> Do you mean footage that is cut up and made into a Republican fairytale that's
> edited to feed the minds of the gullible?
> Do you mean footage of cut off sentences that lead into cut off sentences from another story that gets passed off as footage filled with crap from a hateful website?
> Is that the footage you mean?


Oh, yes, another foreign Democrat, how funny, the last thing I heard about your country is how much your medical insurance was costing for care that you must wait several months to to to receive treatment!

If your country is do great, why can you only stay out of the country 6 months or you won't have medical insurance & might have trouble returning to Canada?

Why don't you voice your opinions in your own country & leave American Politics to Americans? Your opinions do not matter so you are simply writing irritating words!


----------



## lins

theyarnlady said:


> She did Ms Canada. I would suggest that some on the left may want to do the same.


obama and american student loans...google this, I dare you.


----------



## Janeway

DGreen said:


> "Oh, SQM, Jane was part of Denim before you ever joined KP. Your reputation precedes you."
> 
> Better look out, SQM. Next thing you know you will be called...wait for it
> 
> ...wait for it
> 
> ...wait for it
> 
> a liar.


No, you said it!


----------



## knitpresentgifts

DGreen said:


> "Oh, SQM, Jane was part of Denim before you ever joined KP. Your reputation precedes you."
> 
> Better look out, SQM. Next thing you know you will be called...wait for it
> 
> ...wait for it
> 
> ...wait for it
> 
> a liar.


Why would I call SQM a liar, she didn't lie, she doesn't know what she's talking about. That's all. You might want to lighten up.


----------



## Country Bumpkins

craftygac said:


> At the age of 26 I would certainly hope if this economy was as good as most of you think it is would have a job to pay for their own. Wait till you get your non tax refund due to the subsidies being increased for health insurance. I am paying more and I am middle class. It was $980 a month it is now $1200 this is because of the Obama care. Yes its affordable now by our paying more to allow the illegals insurance. I would like to see a fund set up for those that can't pay but not freebies for those who don't work and live of the government. I hope all here stay healthy - I have seen two cases of cancer treatment not offered because they were 80 very scary. My last statement on this subject I like this knitters group and its the first time I let myself get caught up in politics and Obama care without discussing with business people. How can we reach those that don't understand I don't know how - we are all entitled to vote for whom we choose - but how do we get the right choices to vote for so our men in uniform can be safe, and our country. It is sad that our choices are limited to those that have had they way in government so long that we don't have a better choice to choose from. No one is perfect but if you go against the laws like email account when you shouldn't what keeps that same person from doing something to our country that she shouldn't just because she thinks she has the right any man for that reason. I
> am done ranting. Back to crocheting and knitting for my new great granddaughter to be. I hope she can grow up in a country that is not knee deep in debt and a country that safe no matter who gets in. Back to prayers on that. Peace


 :thumbup:


----------



## yorkie1

Enough already! 66 pages is enough for any topic, don't you think?


----------



## DGreen

SQM said:


> I love you Bright Green.
> 
> So glad you are back.


Only momentarily. I seriously have better things to do, and I'm doing them. The plans for the Democratic fund raiser are going exceptionally well and further plans are in the works to build a reserve of $$ needed to soundly - no resoundingly - defeat the tea party republican charlatans who represent my district in 2016. We are gaining membership constantly from the ranks of not only liberals, but former republicans who are sick of the kind of liars and money-backed ALEC hacks who populate our state. The tide is turning against the fundamentalists and extremists and I'm pleased to be part of it.

Love you, too, SQM. An intelligent voice.


----------



## DGreen

yorkie1 said:


> Enough already! 66 pages is enough for any topic, don't you think?


Evidently not.


----------



## Montana Gramma

yorkie1 said:


> Enough already! 66 pages is enough for any topic, don't you think?


Do you remember when there were over 100 pages vilifying a fellow poster over grammar? The name calling was awful. Some get the bit in their teeth and there is a runaway. But a chat room allows that and we can read or leave, I usually read it all to see who is the aggressor.


----------



## DGreen

Janeway said:


> Your opinions do not matter so you are simply writing irritating words!


Lins' opinions matter every bit as much as yours, and they're far more reasoned.


----------



## Country Bumpkins

knitpresentgifts said:


> Oh, SQM, how little you know. Janeway was part of Denim before you ever joined KP. Your reputation precedes you.


That is the truth. Janeway has been with Denim since day one.


----------



## Janeway

SQM said:


> Oh Janeee. How quickly you forget. When the Dems were eating you alive, I so nicely steered you to Denim where you have been happily ever after. I am an Independent with friends on all sides. My reputation here is of being hateful???? Hardly. You acted in questionable taste so again I tried to save you from yourself.


Sorry, but you are totally wrong! I'm one of the original D&P ladies so you didn't direct me anywhere! Second, the Dem's "never" ate me alive as they only typed hateful words!

Several of your Dem friends were kicked off KP -- especially one who threatened one of the "right" people!

Then another lefty one told a "right" person to put a pencil between her teeth & enjoy her seizure! This person did in fact have seizures!

I'm on O2 & one of your left friends told me to "get" off the O2 hose as I was not thinking straight!

Now, report me as Admin is already watching this thread so we will see who is kicked off for hateful words!

All you Dem's know how yo do is type hateful words!


----------



## lins

Janeway said:


> Oh, yes, another foreign Democrat, how funny, the last thing I heard about your country is how much your medical insurance was costing for care that you must wait several months to to to receive treatment!
> 
> If your country is do great, why can you only stay out of the country 6 months or you won't have medical insurance & might have trouble returning to Canada?
> 
> Why don't you voice your opinions in your own country & leave American Politics to Americans? Your opinions do not matter so you are simply writing irritating words!


We are talking about American politics here, not Canadian.

As for my 'irritating words'? 
The truth is irritating to some...sorry I hurt your brain.


----------



## craftygac

Well I agree - we should keep politics out of this now that I vented I see its not the place. The place is where can these discussions do us some good. We are all different ladies with different views based on our experiences in life and what we have been dealt. Hopefully the right person will come along and get this country out of its debt and make it safe once again.


----------



## dianejohnson

DGreen said:


> The plans for the Democratic fund raiser are going exceptionally well and further plans are in the works to build a reserve of $$ needed to soundly - no resoundingly - defeat the tea party republican charlatans who represent my district in 2016. We are gaining membership constantly from the ranks of not only liberals, but former republicans who are sick of the kind of liars and money-backed ALEC hacks who populate our state. The tide is turning against the fundamentalists and extremists and I'm pleased to be part of it.


The absolute best comment I've read in this entire topic. Thank you very much!


----------



## Janeway

DGreen said:


> Only momentarily. I seriously have better things to do, and I'm doing them. The plans for the Democratic fund raiser are going exceptionally well and further plans are in the works to build a reserve of $$ needed to soundly - no resoundingly - defeat the tea party republican charlatans who represent my district in 2016. We are gaining membership constantly from the ranks of not only liberals, but former republicans who are sick of the kind of liars and money-backed ALEC hacks who populate our state. The tide is turning against the fundamentalists and extremists and I'm pleased to be part of it.
> 
> Love you, too, SQM. An intelligent voice.


Ms. Green, I donate money to feed the poor not to the political parties because the very rich donate to the Republican Party!

I feel sorry for you that you think the Democratic Party will win! Obo only won because of his color not because of anything else!

You have my sympathy!


----------



## Janeway

Wombatnomore said:


> And we'd be lucky and glad to have her. You wouldn't know a good thing if it slapped you every which way.


Why don't you become active in the politics of Australia your home country, but with the touch of fingers you criticize our Republican Party of which you know nothing! Relax your gingers & do something constructive in your country!


----------



## lins

DGreen said:


> Lins' opinions matter every bit as much as yours, and they're far more reasoned.


 Thanks. 

I have had enough here for today. 
The posts are getting to name calling, slut, hair grooming, murder...stupid stuff that makes some of these women here looks so shallow and foolish.
Some people don't care about the future only the past. 
Their way of thinking is so stagnant and I am truly sorry for them.


----------



## Country Bumpkins

craftygac said:


> Well I agree - we should keep politics out of this now that I vented I see its not the place. The place is where can these discussions do us some good. We are all different ladies with different views based on our experiences in life and what we have been dealt. Hopefully the right person will come along and get this country out of its debt and make it safe once again.


It is ok you vented. The bullies on KP don't like our opinions so they group together like wild dogs to try to tear people to shreds so they don't post against their views. I guess you already figured that out. There are all a few of them but they change ID# so they seems like a lot of them.


----------



## Janeway

jodymorse151 said:


> Oh I'm going ... KPers usually aren't his nasty


Only the Dem's are nasty people so please stay on KP as there are wonderful people here who are very helpful as I've learned so much about crafts! Just ignore the hateful bunch!

Happy crafting of your choice. Hugs, Janeway


----------



## judypfennemore

Totally fascinating! Have so enjoyed the good and the bad. But I'm going back to put my head down my ostrich hole in the sand - back to quietly clicking my needles.


----------



## Janeway

DGreen said:


> Don't believe everything you hear on Faux news.
> 
> ...as the National Immigration Law Center has noted, undocumented immigrants cannot get subsidized health care coverage under the ACA and are not even allowed to purchase private insurance through the individual health insurance Marketplace at full cost. They are also not eligible for subsidized health care or Medicare, nonemergency Medicaid, or the Children's Health Insurance Program (CHIP).


Oh, get real info & get your head out of the sand! Illegals are in fact on Welfare, food stamps & qualify for rent subsidies as this is why most states are struggling to stay above the water!

We have vets who put their lives on the line for our freedom, but are unemployed, homeless & without medical treatments because of Obo's love of the illegals.

Faux news must be where you get all of your info so tune in other stations!


----------



## Janeway

lins said:


> Thanks.
> 
> I have had enough here for today.
> The posts are getting to name calling, slut, hair grooming, murder...stupid stuff that makes some of these women here looks so shallow and foolish.
> Some people don't care about the future only the past.
> Their way of thinking is so stagnant and I am truly sorry for them.


Well, bye!


----------



## Janeway

judypfennemore said:


> Totally fascinating! Have so enjoyed the good and the bad. But I'm going back to put my head down my ostrich hole in the sand - back to quietly clicking my needles.


What are you making! Would love to see your work as I have several UFO's going at the same time.


----------



## Janeway

Have any of you noticed the AD's on KP? I've checked out some of them -- interesting!


----------



## Moe C

Janeway said:


> Have any of you noticed the AD's on KP? I've checked out some of them -- interesting!


If you mean "ads", they are interesting because they are tailored for you personally, based on your internet searches.


----------



## DGreen

Janeway said:


> Ms. Green, I donate money to feed the poor not to the political parties because the very rich donate to the Republican Party!
> 
> I feel sorry for you that you think the Democratic Party will win! Obo only won because of his color not because of anything else!
> 
> You have my sympathy!


Stay tuned, Janeway. In 2016 there will be 38 senate seats in play and by studying the demographics is almost certain that Democrats will regain control of the senate in 2016. Likewise, there are a number of House seats that will be contested and Democrats DO turn out for presidential-year elections. Enjoy the repubs while you can. They're toast.

As I said, many moderate republicans are jumping over to the Democratic side because the republican party has given in to the extremists and so far are proposing no viable candidates, but instead are taking people like Cruz seriously. He doesn't have a chance in hell of winning a primary, let alone an election anywhere but Texas. Scott Walker? He thinks being a boy scout qualifies him to make presidential decisions. I could go on...but you get the gist. The republican party is grasping at the Christian agenda out of desperation but the rest of the country won't buy it. The majority actually thinks gay marriage is ok and they don't want a theocracy.

I'm going to make sure the voters in my district remember exactly how bereft of ideas the republican party is without the handy pre-written ALEC legislation provided to them by big business. And I'm going to remind them that one of our illustrious representatives actually thinks people should be fined for not attending church (though she wisely refrained from identifying which church is acceptable).

Save your sympathy for yourself.


----------



## DGreen

Country Bumpkins said:


> There are all a few of them but they change ID# so they seems like a lot of them.


Keep your head in that bubble, CB. Repeating a myth doesn't make it so.


----------



## Loistec

Janeway said:


> Oh, get real info & get your head out of the sand! Illegals are in fact on Welfare, food stamps & qualify for rent subsidies as this is why most states are struggling to stay above the water!
> 
> We have vets who put their lives on the line for our freedom, but are unemployed, homeless & without medical treatments because of Obo's love of the illegals.
> 
> Faux news must be where you get all of your info so tune in other stations!


Ugh, you're such a troll! :thumbdown: :thumbdown: :thumbdown: :thumbdown:


----------



## DGreen

Loistec said:


> Ugh, you're such a troll! :thumbdown: :thumbdown: :thumbdown: :thumbdown:


 :thumbup: :thumbup: :thumbup: You are so correct.


----------



## sumnerusa

BrattyPatty said:


> Personally, I don't care what was in them. I didn't see anyone getting their feathers ruffled when Colin Powell did the *same exact thing.*
> Why such a ruckus over Hillary?


Jeb Bush dumped his emails also. Those emails leave a paper trail. She turned over thirty three thousand emails. What more can be asked? As far as her personal emails.....that's no ones business but hers. According to law, she has done nothing wrong.


----------



## Crochet dreamin'

Sometime back, in this thread, someone said, "It's so nice to have a polite discussion about this." (Or words to that effect.) But isn't that always the case when everyone is in total agreement? But as soon as someone dissents about the subject, the others get their dander up and then the name-calling begins. 
Some of this crowd are very much younger than others. They say the Young conservative has no heart, and the old liberal has no brains. Maybe that's true. 
But I'm telling you this. The Right has moved so far left, they could have been liberals back in the '50's, and the liberals have moved so far left, they could be (and are) communists. Read the communist manifesto! The problem with the right, is they get a lot of misinformation and then their opinions are immediately disregarded. But the same can be said about the liberals. The winning side always rewrites history. Bush certainly made a lot of mistakes and has been blamed for more than his share. Why, even Obama is Bush's fault!


----------



## alifletcher

joeysoma,

No we are not paying for the eleven million people in the middle class who now who have health insurance , they are ! We paid for them when they had no health insurance. People who had pre existing conditions became worse and had more costly co-mobidities once they had to go to hospitals. Now with insurance they seek medical attention before their conditions worsen and they pay their own premiums. Why is this not considered a solution to the overwhelming health costs they faced in the past ? You must have insurance because those who now can afford it through the Affordable Health Care Act are very grateful to now have it !


----------



## Artbarn

BrattyPatty said:


> :XD: :XD: :XD: :XD: :XD: :XD: :XD: :XD: :XD: :XD: :XD: :XD:
> 
> We are talking about Hillary in this thread. Are you lost?
> 
> 6 years later we are still here, the country is making a come back economically, more jobs are being created.....


You keep doing the bait and switch, Bratty Patty.

6 years is far too long to wait for what is en extremely weak "economic comeback."


----------



## alifletcher

Google websites for student loan forgiveness. There are step by step protocols to follow. And Yes it is President Obama who instituted it.


----------



## ummirain

Wow,name-calling instead of facts.
Many are doing ok under President Obama.
Last I heard,hungry children are hungry children.
Under Bush,farmers were paid to not plant soybeans and many varities of wheat.
All they had to do was mow whatever grew.
I have a child adopted from Cambodia,where she would have died from malnutrition. She was 16 pounds at age 3.
Now,a beautiful,talented,compassionate teen,with amazing health care.
We are so grateful to not be a hater .
Perhaps you can go by a little yarn to make you happier?


----------



## GWPlver

dianejohnson said:


> The absolute best comment I've read in this entire topic. Thank you very much!


Love your avatar!! So glad Stevie Ray is being posthumously inducted into the Rock and Roll Hall of Fame.


----------



## GWPlver

Loistec said:


> Ugh, you're such a troll! :thumbdown: :thumbdown: :thumbdown: :thumbdown:


And none of her post is true anyway.


----------



## ummirain

And your solution would have been....?
Takes time to equalize.
Law of physics


----------



## sumpleby

susanmos2000 said:


> So true, Sumpleby. I can't help noticing that the exact same smears and epithets we've heard throughout Obama's terms in office--"arrogant" "above the law"--are now being flung at Clinton. I'm just waiting now for the birthers and the racists to get into the act. It seems pretty undeniable that Clinton is a Caucasian Christian woman born in Chicago, Illinois, but trust me--they'll soon be presenting "evidence" from some bizarre source(s) that Hillary is the illegitimate daughter of a mixed-race Iranian mullah and has already hired contractors to build a mosque in the basement of the White House.


ROFLMAO

Wait...I thought it was going to be placed on the East Lawn of the White House--when did the location change...?


----------



## Country Bumpkins

DGreen said:


> Keep your head in that bubble, CB. Repeating a myth doesn't make it so.


I know it for fact.


----------



## Artbarn

MommaJody said:


> I can't believe that BrattyPatty is wanting everything to be so factual. She must actual believe the numbers that the Obama administration is putting out to make the statement that the country is making a comeback economically and more jobs are being created. Does she not take into consideration that after so long on unemployment benefits that the administration just ignores those figures and start with the ones that came after them. Then when those reach the cutoff time, they drop that number. On and on and on. Where do you think those unemployed go after a certain time?


Right, MommaJody. The numbers of people who have given up searching for jobs do not appear in the reported unemployment numbers. Neither do the people who, in desperation, took part-time jobs, minimum-wage jobs, or jobs that paid much less than the ones they had before.

Those people, when added to the reported unemployment rate, equal the true unemployment rate. Forbes says that true unemployment is between 7.4% and 9.4%. 
http://www.forbes.com/sites/anaswanson/2015/03/31/what-if-americas-unemployment-rate-is-really-wrong/

Huge numbers of those people are trying to support families on low wages. Do you think they see this as an economic comeback?

As recently as February, unemployment among blacks was 10.4%.
http://www.ibtimes.com/black-unemployment-rate-2015-better-economy-african-americans-see-minimal-gains-1837870

The unemployment rate among black men, age 18-29, is traditionally even higher, although I couldn't find a a link to recent statistics


----------



## Artbarn

Wombatnomore said:


> Is this the footage to which you are referring Momma Jody?
> 
> http://www.beliefnet.com/columnists/watchwomanonthewall/2012/02/obama-admits-he-is-a-muslim-in-his-own-words-video.html


This is nonsense and you know it.


----------



## Artbarn

Wombatnomore said:


> But seriously ute4kp, this is a great example of how information is twisted and spread around for propaganda purposes. I find it frightening that people actually believe in this stuff.


But ute4kp is the one who posted this propaganda.


----------



## SQM

knitpresentgifts said:


> Why would I call SQM a liar, she didn't lie, she doesn't know what she's talking about. That's all. You might want to lighten up.


I know what I am talking about when I say - pick your own insult. You have tons to choose from. Make sure it is laced with some profanity.


----------



## Artbarn

MommaJody said:


> Why should I keep footage when I actually was watching the event on live TV when it happened. Unlike some people, I actually have a life. I check my info and then go on. Since you think I should keep unedited video, then I guess you should keep actual unemployment records instead of believing what is given out by the administration instead of statistics. So, what do you think happens to the numbers of unemployed when they reach the cutoff date? Do they all of a sudden disappear from life or what?


Wombatnomore (from Australia) could have looked this up and found footage in seconds, MommaJody. Instead she wanted you to look small and stupid.

Here you go, Wombat: http://www.bing.com/videos/search?q=obama+bows+to+saudi+king&FORM=VIRE1#view=detail&mid=3F94B9B6181708E93CB43F94B9B6181708E93CB4


----------



## Artbarn

anjoda said:


> I have been reading this thread, and had to jump several pages, as it has be getting really out of hand. I agree with the above post, there has been a lot of incorrect facts stated here. In my opinion President Obama has done an excellent job, with absolutely no help from that sorry lot in congress.
> I think that you ladies should be honest, Not a single Republican, not even Jeb Bush, has the qualifications or experience that Hilliary Clinton has. The others are a bunch of inept, inexperienced, "boys". I, for one will definitely be voting for her. Mitt Romney showed exactly what he had in mind ror the country with his 1% exposed video. So, make no mistake, that is the agenda of the Republicans. Slash taxes for the rich and pay for the tax breaks by cutting all the social programs. That was tried before, and we all know where that put us. And better yet, squash the nuclear deal with Iran, and start a new war, because the ones we had for the past 10 years were not enough to pay for or enough of a sacrifice of our young troops. So, Hillary, I am on board.


Hm. "Slash taxes for the rich and pay for the tax breaks by cutting all the social programs. That was tried before, and we all know where that put us." Yes, please tell us where.

Also, since you brought it up without any facts, please compare and contrast Jeb Bush's and Hillary Clinton's qualifications and experience.

"And better yet, squash the nuclear deal with Iran, and start a new war..." Those are not the only alternatives here. This statement shows how sorely lacking you are in understanding what is going on with the nuclear deal with Iran.


----------



## DGreen

Crochet dreamin' said:


> Sometime back, in this thread, someone said, "It's so nice to have a polite discussion about this." (Or words to that effect.) But isn't that always the case when everyone is in total agreement? But as soon as someone dissents about the subject, the others get their dander up and then the name-calling begins.
> Some of this crowd are very much younger than others. They say the Young conservative has no heart, and the old liberal has no brains. Maybe that's true.
> But I'm telling you this. The Right has moved so far left, they could have been liberals back in the '50's, and the liberals have moved so far left, they could be (and are) communists. Read the communist manifesto! The problem with the right, is they get a lot of misinformation and then their opinions are immediately disregarded. But the same can be said about the liberals. The winning side always rewrites history. Bush certainly made a lot of mistakes and has been blamed for more than his share. Why, even Obama is Bush's fault!


Please explain how republicans have moved to the left...? Exactly what have they done that is liberal in any way?


----------



## cookiequeen

The best reasons to vote for Hillary Clinton:
Cruz
Rubio
Walker
Huckabee
Paul
Palin
McCain
Christie
Trump


----------



## Artbarn

Wombatnomore said:


> Here you go! The many achievements and awards of Hillary Rodham Clinton:
> 
> http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Hillary_Rodham_Clinton_awards_and_honors


 :XD: :XD: :XD: These are awards, not accomplishments.


----------



## soloweygirl

susanmos2000 said:


> Once again you're falling behind. The question wasn't whether Benghazi was or was not a terrorist attack. It's whether such a designation can be made without an investigation.


Yes it can. An investigation happens after the fact. Intelligence reports on that particular area were reporting that terrorist activity in the area was growing. There were active terrorist cells in Libya. This group of people just didn't show up with heavy duty weapons out of the blue. It was organized. Right after the attack, a terrorist cell took responsibility.


----------



## Moe C

So, tell a Canadian something....is Hillary the only Dem candidate so far? Who else might run?


----------



## Artbarn

MommaJody said:


> In my opinion the only reason she tried to rekindle friendships with our allies was in order for them to support her running for the presidency. If you go back and look at the laws, we have had equality in the workforce and women's rights for years.
> 
> As far as Ted Cruz or Rand Paul, I have nothing good to say about them either. Like I said in an earlier listing, I wish we honestly could get a presidential candidate that had a good moral compass and resume to become president. It's just that this listing was about Hillary. She has a listing of plenty of awards and honors, but if you have enough money and clout, anyone can get those. I still don't think she has done anything to deserve those other than the money and clout behind her. ''Would she be getting those awards and honors if she was actually charged with all the wrongdoings she has done? What if someone was actually able to get copies of the emails she deleted? What if she had not been able to worm her way out of a conviction in the Whitewater incident? Why was she not prosecuted for hiding the documents in her office in the supposedly vincent suicide? I don't look at just the awards and honors as most times they are given for nothing. I also look at all the wrongs that she has been involved in and yet always seems to worm her way out of it. Just like Bill did when he stated "It all depends on what your definition of "is" is. I mean, really, look at the whole picture. I'm not saying Cruz or Rand is any better. I'm just saying that I have known Hillary's track record for a LONG LONG time. It is not good.


Exactly. :thumbup:


----------



## soloweygirl

Cheeky Blighter said:


> Saddest of all is solo really believes what she posted. :XD: :XD:


Then by all means prove it wrong.


----------



## soloweygirl

Cheeky Blighter said:


> Do you believe everything you read? Obviously you do. :thumbdown:


Unlike you, she doesn't wait for Rachel Maddow to tell her how and what to think.


----------



## Crochet dreamin'

DGreen said:


> Please explain how republicans have moved to the left...? Exactly what have they done that is liberal in any way?


Ah, grasshopper, this is a comparison. The comparison must be looked at from the vantage point of history. The values and mores have changed from the Eisenhower Nixon years. Those mores were even more left than the the conservative presidents that preceded them. They call the liberals "Progressives" but as a whole, the parties have both progressed. Progress is not always a good thing. Medicare was considered a bad thing by the conservatives when it was first introduced. Now, the conservatives are trying to hang on to Medicare! The same about Social Security. It was passed with the promise that it would never be used as I.D. But now, everyone uses it as an identifyer. It seems to be the nature of things to change: Movies have gotten raunchier, (not a good thing). Technology has gotten better. A good thing, unless it is misused or abused.
Change for change's sake is not good. The politicians in their quest for votes promise the masses more and more. They even bring people into the country in hopes that they will be grateful enough to vote for them. The conservatives, not to be outdone then decide that they must also be more "moderate" and show their charity by joining in with giveaway programs. Ultimately, we cannot kick the can down the road forever. There will be a reckoning. If everyone is on welfare, where will the money come from?


----------



## Designer1234

Artbarn said:


> :XD: :XD: :XD: These are awards, not accomplishments.


awards are given for accomplishments.


----------



## hushpuppy

Agree, NOT the right woman for the job, way too much baggage and in to many pockets!!!!!!


----------



## Artbarn

alifletcher said:


> When is the last time you looked at the unemployment rate ? its the lowest it has been. Eleven million people have health insurance that the middle class do not have to pay for. Do you have a child in college ? Tuition rates have been reduced for students by Our President. And if you were lucky enough to have insurance your child can remain on your plan until they are 26. Shall I go on ?


Who do you think is paying for those eleven million people's health insurance and the subsidies that many of those people are getting? And what about the people who no longer can afford health insurance because of Obamacare rules--people who don't qualify for subsidies?

Please see my other posts about the unemployment rate for my sources. The TRUE unemployment is between 7.4% and 9.4%. It includes those who have given up looking for employment and those who have taken part-time, minimum wage, and lower-wage jobs.

I believe that you are wrong about tuition rates being reduced by President Obama. I searched and cannot find any results. In fact, I don't see how Obama has any jurisdiction to reduce tuition rates, especially in private colleges.


----------



## soloweygirl

Jan's said:


> Since I am not a liberal the thought of Hillary Clinton in the White House makes my skin crawl. I found that she and Bill did not just want to defeat others but destroy them as well. I have no respect for her. She is not warm, not easy to like, and work in the State Department is suspect at the least. Her handling of Benzhai was a mess and the email issue is a problem with me. I do not trust her and I do not find her truthful at all. I want someone younger, not with the baggage she has. I find her hard to listen to as she has a sharp tone and less than warm. Elizabeth Warren is so left wing that I really don't want her. I feel any republican will be better than the two of them put together. I am from Wisconsin so I really would like to see Scott Walker as President.


She is not a warm person, nor very likable. Her campaign slogan of wanting to be the champion of the middle class is laughable. Who does she think will believe her after her whining about being dead broke after leaving the WH and not being able to obtain mortgageS on her multi million dollar homes? Even in her opening ad, she is sitting in a coffee shop (?) listening to a middle class man nodding her head in agreement with his problems. Take a look at her body. Her body is turned away from him. That says she's ready to bolt, not stay and listen.


----------



## Huckleberry

cookiequeen said:


> The best reasons to vote for Hillary Clinton:
> Cruz
> Rubio
> Walker
> Huckabee
> Paul
> Palin
> McCain
> Christie
> Trump


cookiequeen
how did we get that lucky.


----------



## soloweygirl

collectordolls said:


> If she was so wonderful why would she erase everything on her server. I guess she must have something to hide


I wonder why she needed her own server to begin with. It leads me to ask what did she intend to hide?


----------



## Moe C

Moe C said:


> So, tell a Canadian something....is Hillary the only Dem candidate so far? Who else might run?


Never mind, I looked it up myself.


----------



## Artbarn

Designer1234 said:


> awards are given for accomplishments.


No, most of these are awards given because she's famous. The question has been asked over and over to list Hillary Clinton's accomplishments as a Senator (bills in her name, etc.) and as Secretary of State (major treaties, etc.)


----------



## Artbarn

Moe C said:


> Never mind, I looked it up myself.


Sorry, Moe C. I was waiting for a Democrat to answer. At this time, Hillary is the only Democrat who has announced that she is running. Time will tell if anyone decides to take her on.


----------



## Artbarn

soloweygirl said:


> I wonder why she needed her own server to begin with. It leads me to ask what did she intend to hide?


If a Republican had done this, they'd hear the Democrats screaming all the way to the moon!


----------



## balloch8

I'm voting for her.


----------



## DGreen

Crochet dreamin' said:


> Ah, grasshopper, this is a comparison. The comparison must be looked at from the vantage point of history. The values and mores have changed from the Eisenhower Nixon years. Those mores were even more left than the the conservative presidents that preceded them. They call the liberals "Progressives" but as a whole, the parties have both progressed. Progress is not always a good thing. Medicare was considered a bad thing by the conservatives when it was first introduced. Now, the conservatives are trying to hang on to Medicare! The same about Social Security. It was passed with the promise that it would never be used as I.D. But now, everyone uses it as an identifyer. It seems to be the nature of things to change: Movies have gotten raunchier, (not a good thing). Technology has gotten better. A good thing, unless it is misused or abused.
> Change for change's sake is not good. The politicians in their quest for votes promise the masses more and more. They even bring people into the country in hopes that they will be grateful enough to vote for them. The conservatives, not to be outdone then decide that they must also be more "moderate" and show their charity by joining in with giveaway programs. Ultimately, we cannot kick the can down the road forever. There will be a reckoning. If everyone is on welfare, where will the money come from?


Yes, values have changed since Eisenhower - which was the 50's - except for the republicans who are trying to drag us back to those days of June Cleaver cleaning house in high heels and pearls, where women were forbidden access and even information on birth control and where Jim Crow was the rule in the south.

Republicans are NOT trying to hang onto Medicare - they are trying to eliminate it and turn social security into a voucher system that is vulnerable to gamblers on Wall Street. Pointing out the use of social security numbers as ID is hardly a significant or compelling point.

Change for change's sake? Who are you kidding? I would like very much to see an example of "change for change's sake" that you think is bad. Change always happens for a reason and one can't stop it; one can only try to keep up and make wise decisions as to how to respond as an individual or by voting.

NO ONE is "bringing people into the country" to garner votes. That is a completely outrageous claim.

The conservatives do NOT support any giveaway programs. Name ANY they support aside from corporate welfare.

And finally, your use of the term "grasshopper" is offensive. I'm certainly not your student to be referred to in a diminutive manner, particularly when your post is full of inaccuracies.


----------



## DGreen

balloch8 said:


> I'm voting for her.


 :thumbup: :thumbup: :thumbup:

You and millions of others.


----------



## cookiequeen

R


DGreen said:


> Yes, values have changed since Eisenhower - which was the 50's - except for the republicans who are trying to drag us back to those days of June Cleaver cleaning house in high heels and pearls, where women were forbidden access and even information on birth control and where Jim Crow was the rule in the south.
> 
> Republicans are NOT trying to hang onto Medicare - they are trying to eliminate it and turn social security into a voucher system that is vulnerable to gamblers on Wall Street. Pointing out the use of social security numbers as ID is hardly a significant or compelling point.
> 
> Change for change's sake? Who are you kidding? I would like very much to see an example of "change for change's sake" that you think is bad. Change always happens for a reason and one can't stop it; one can only try to keep up and make wise decisions as to how to respond as an individual or by voting.
> 
> NO ONE is "bringing people into the country" to garner votes. That is a completely outrageous claim.
> 
> The conservatives do NOT support any giveaway programs. Name ANY they support aside from corporate welfare.
> 
> And finally, your use of the term "grasshopper" is offensive. I'm certainly not your student to be referred to in a diminutive manner, particularly when your post is full of inaccuracies.


 :thumbup: :thumbup: :thumbup: :thumbup: :thumbup:


----------



## soloweygirl

lins said:


> I don't remember Hilary saying 'who cares'?
> 
> This is what she said.
> 
> Clinton: With all due respect, the fact is we had four dead Americans. Was it because of a protest or was it because of guys out for a walk one night who decided that theyd they go kill some Americans? What difference at this point does it make? It is our job to figure out what happened and do everything we can to prevent it from ever happening again, Senator. Now, honestly, I will do my best to answer your questions about this, but the fact is that people were trying in real time to get to the best information. The IC has a process, I understand, going with the other committees to explain how these talking points came out. But you know, to be clear, it is, from my perspective, less important today looking backwards as to why these militants decided they did it than to find them and bring them to justice, and then maybe well figure out what was going on in the meantime.
> 
> In answer to a question asked by Senator Johnson.
> 
> What difference at this point does it make?
> ...at this point...in during, the questioning.


It made a difference because the administration was lying about the cause of the attack - and the reason was the upcoming election. The admin was out there for weeks blaming a video as the reason for the spontaneous attack, not admitting that it was an attack by a terrorist group. Obama refused to walk back on his comments about Al Queada being on the run when in fact Al Queada was alive and well and getting stronger. Then there was the matter of the whole attack itself , how it was handled and its consequences.


----------



## Moe C

You have such a screwy electoral system. Doesn't Hillary have to win a bunch of primaries against other Dem candidates, in order to run for president? I could look that up too, but I"d rather go knit.


----------



## Mothers Roost

I did not say that Hillary said "Who cares?". I said that "What difference does it make?", sounds (translates) that way to me.


----------



## DGreen

soloweygirl said:


> It made a difference because the administration was lying about the cause of the attack - and the reason was the upcoming election. The admin was out there for weeks blaming a video as the reason for the spontaneous attack, not admitting that it was an attack by a terrorist group. Obama refused to walk back on his comments about Al Queada being on the run when in fact Al Queada was alive and well and getting stronger. Then there was the matter of the whole attack itself , how it was handled and its consequences.


◾Matt Olsen, director of the National Counterterrorism Center, was the first administration official to call it a terrorist attack during a Sept. 19 congressional hearing. Secretary of State Hillary Clinton did the same on Sept. 20.

Not weeks - the attack was September 11th.

Obama did not want to call it terrorism, but seems to me the subject here is Hillary and she did so 9 days after the attack, not the plural "weeks."


----------



## soloweygirl

lins said:


> Oh my Gawd...where have you been?
> There were no WMD's. Hilary and others voted for war because Cheney and Bush lied about that.
> She and others voted on the information that was given to them that was false. A president and and vice president lied to Congress.
> 
> How many people were killed or mamed because if their lies!
> How many billions did Cheney make off these lies?


Oh please, Bush and Cheney presented information that was given to us by our allies stating that there were WMD's. Those allies joined us in the fight against terror as well. It's something they would not have done if they knew their information was false. ISIS did find some buried WMD's after they took control of areas in Iraq. Yes they were old WMD's but it does prove that WMD's did exist in Iraq.


----------



## cooljourney12

So agree.


----------



## soloweygirl

BrattyPatty said:


> Then I suggest that the republicans get some serious candidates. The 2 clowns out of the waggon at this point can't do the job. They can't do the jobs that they do have!


How about the Democrats getting some serious candidates as well? Your clown certainly isn't trustworthy.


----------



## sumpleby

DGreen said:


> ◾Matt Olsen, director of the National Counterterrorism Center, was the first administration official to call it a terrorist attack during a Sept. 19 congressional hearing. Secretary of State Hillary Clinton did the same on Sept. 20.
> 
> Not weeks - the attack was September 11th.
> 
> Obama did not want to call it terrorism, but seems to me the subject here is Hillary and she did so 9 days after the attack, not the plural "weeks."


Actually, Obama called it an act of terrorism immediately. As Romney found to his cost when he tried to make a derisive point over the matter during the second debate. "Please proceed, Governor..."


----------



## soloweygirl

BrattyPatty said:


> :XD: :XD: :XD: :XD: :XD: :XD: :XD: :XD: :XD: :XD: :XD: :XD:
> 
> We are talking about Hillary in this thread. Are you lost?
> 
> 6 years later we are still here, the country is making a come back economically, more jobs are being created.....


It is not making an economic comeback. The whole economy is stagnant and teetering on the edge of another recession. The jobs that are being created are low skill, low wage jobs. That is hardly going to keep the economy moving upward.


----------



## soloweygirl

lins said:


> Yeah, I wonder too.
> Ignorance and hatred for President Obama I guess? They just won't wake up.


We are 6 years into Obama's presidency. It is long past time to stop blaming Bush for everything.


----------



## sumpleby

sorry, weird double post!


----------



## Artbarn

Globee said:


> I think it's amazing that not one single republican comment on this site has mentioned Adelman and the Koch brothers. Do they really want the country run by these big money people who are out to enhance their own coffers. I find it very scary.


I thought we were talking about Hillary Clinton. Those are rich men who donate to Republicans.

Since you've brought it up, should the Democrats be bringing up George Soros? This is a rich man who donates to Democrats. By the way, he was convicted of insider trading in France.


----------



## susanmos2000

Moe C said:


> You have such a screwy electoral system. Doesn't Hillary have to win a bunch of primaries against other Dem candidates, in order to run for president? I could look that up too, but I"d rather go knit.


Both the Republican and the Democrat candidates for President have to first win the nomination from their respective Parties. Most often there are many candidates trying to snatch the brass ring--in the GOP Cruz and Paul (and probably Walker, Trump, and Rubio) will be angling for it. At this point the Democrats have only Hillary. She's a shoo-in, but as she can't run against herself in the Primaries her Party will produce some lightweight to be her "opponent"--just a straw man or woman to function as a prop and then be knocked down.


----------



## lins

soloweygirl said:


> It made a difference because the administration was lying about the cause of the attack - and the reason was the upcoming election. The admin was out there for weeks blaming a video as the reason for the spontaneous attack, not admitting that it was an attack by a terrorist group. Obama refused to walk back on his comments about Al Queada being on the run when in fact Al Queada was alive and well and getting stronger. Then there was the matter of the whole attack itself , how it was handled and its consequences.


The day after the attack Obama called it a terrorist attack, ask Mitt.

At first it was an assumption that it was the video because it was causing so many riots in other parts of the country and other countries as well.
When they got the truth through their intelligence agencies then they reported what they knew to the public.

As for the attack itself...too bad the republicans cut the budget on securty funding for the State Department...too bad indeed.

This is all public knowledge already. 
Back to Benghazi, Benghazi, Benghazi, Benghazi...

Holy cow...let's go way back and talk about WMD's and thousands killed and mamed because of it.

Remember who Geb Bush has as main advisors...19-21 people that were the former Bush's team, lying advisors, PLUS Cheney, who must feel his pockets didn't get filled up enough off his first war.

It's far more important that this be talked about as they are already talking about more war. Is that what you want?

Solid effort should be made by the populace to keep these war mongers out of the Presidency. 
America should give a break to its military and strengthen it, not abuse it.


----------



## soloweygirl

Wombatnomore said:


> Why don't you find that information and provide a link to it here?


The Department of Labor will have those statistics.


----------



## Artbarn

craftygac said:


> At the age of 26 I would certainly hope if this economy was as good as most of you think it is would have a job to pay for their own. Wait till you get your non tax refund due to the subsidies being increased for health insurance. I am paying more and I am middle class. It was $980 a month it is now $1200 this is because of the Obama care. Yes its affordable now by our paying more to allow the illegals insurance. I would like to see a fund set up for those that can't pay but not freebies for those who don't work and live of the government. I hope all here stay healthy - I have seen two cases of cancer treatment not offered because they were 80 very scary. My last statement on this subject I like this knitters group and its the first time I let myself get caught up in politics and Obama care without discussing with business people. How can we reach those that don't understand I don't know how - we are all entitled to vote for whom we choose - but how do we get the right choices to vote for so our men in uniform can be safe, and our country. It is sad that our choices are limited to those that have had they way in government so long that we don't have a better choice to choose from. No one is perfect but if you go against the laws like email account when you shouldn't what keeps that same person from doing something to our country that she shouldn't just because she thinks she has the right any man for that reason. I
> am done ranting. Back to crocheting and knitting for my new great granddaughter to be. I hope she can grow up in a country that is not knee deep in debt and a country that safe no matter who gets in. Back to prayers on that. Peace


 :thumbup:


----------



## Artbarn

DGreen said:


> Then go away!


Wow. There is no need to be rude


----------



## J.Carol

alifletcher said:


> When is the last time you looked at the unemployment rate ? its the lowest it has been. Eleven million people have health insurance that the middle class do not have to pay for. Do you have a child in college ? Tuition rates have been reduced for students by Our President. And if you were lucky enough to have insurance your child can remain on your plan until they are 26. Shall I go on ?


Employment figures are fixed to look good. "Eleven million people have health insurance that the middle class do not have to pay for" ..... really? ....


----------



## DGreen

Artbarn said:


> Wow. There is no need to be rude


Taking it upon ones self to scold others for posting on an open forum is not only rude, but arrogant. That person was complaining that she didn't like the discussion - solution: leave.


----------



## Artbarn

Country Bumpkins said:


> It is ok you vented. The bullies on KP don't like our opinions so they group together like wild dogs to try to tear people to shreds so they don't post against their views. I guess you already figured that out. There are all a few of them but they change ID# so they seems like a lot of them.


 :thumbup:


----------



## Celt Knitter

You won't get anyone if you demand no baggage :roll: :roll: :roll: Isn't it time that women gave their support to their sisters so that our daughters and granddaughters can grow up thinking they that breaking the glass ceiling is possible? She's hardly likely to do worse than than most of the males who have held the office. It'll be a pity if this thread develops into another vitriolic party political tirade. Ah well, too late....I see the fangs are out and the claws unsheathed


crispie said:


> Agreed


----------



## Huckleberry

MrsB said:


> Hillary Clinton to Announce 2016 Run for President on Sunday. The former secretary of state, senator and first lady is to announce that she will indeed seek the Democratic nomination for president.
> 
> I'm so pleased that she has decided to run again. We need strong women in the White House in a more crucial and central position. After a few seasons of Scandal viewing, I've come to the conclusion that there maybe just too much underhanded shenanigans going on in the good ole boys club. Hillary is no pushover and the best candidate that has come along in a long time. I'm assuming that Obama endorses her.


MrsB
thank you for starting this thread. Hillary is a remarkable Woman. The few flaws she has, can be easily overlooked by all of her accomplishments and also her effort to perfect herself. I admire her for continuing to serve our Country. What an easy Life she could have. Just imagine what it could be like if Hillary would be President and Elizabeth Warren the Vice President. Well, one step at a time. Warren's future is bright anyway.


----------



## Artbarn

Moe C said:


> You have such a screwy electoral system. Doesn't Hillary have to win a bunch of primaries against other Dem candidates, in order to run for president? I could look that up too, but I"d rather go knit.


Well, I will respectfully disagree that our electoral system is screwy. Our founders thought very carefully about how this would work and there is a "method to the madness."

You are basically correct that Hillary would have to lead in the Democrat Primaries to run in the General Election against whoever leads in the Republican Primaries.


----------



## Artbarn

DGreen said:


> ◾Matt Olsen, director of the National Counterterrorism Center, was the first administration official to call it a terrorist attack during a Sept. 19 congressional hearing. Secretary of State Hillary Clinton did the same on Sept. 20.
> 
> Not weeks - the attack was September 11th.
> 
> Obama did not want to call it terrorism, but seems to me the subject here is Hillary and she did so 9 days after the attack, not the plural "weeks."


Except that the lie was told on September 12 even though it was known immediately by this administration that it was a terrorist attack.


----------



## Artbarn

soloweygirl said:


> Oh please, Bush and Cheney presented information that was given to us by our allies stating that there were WMD's. Those allies joined us in the fight against terror as well. It's something they would not have done if they knew their information was false. ISIS did find some buried WMD's after they took control of areas in Iraq. Yes they were old WMD's but it does prove that WMD's did exist in Iraq.


This is absolutely true.


----------



## Artbarn

sumpleby said:


> Actually, Obama called it an act of terrorism immediately. As Romney found to his cost when he tried to make a derisive point over the matter during the second debate. "Please proceed, Governor..."


No. That is absolutely false. During the debate Romney was correct and he was shut down by moderator, Candy Crowley, in his attempt to bring out the truth.


----------



## sumpleby

Artbarn said:


> No. That is absolutely false. During the debate Romney was correct and he was shut down by moderator, Candy Crowley, in his attempt to bring out the truth.


Sorry, you can say this until the cows come home, but the video of the press conference the next day shows that the president did call it a terror attack.






"No acts of terror will ever shake the resolve of this great nation..."


----------



## Crochet dreamin'

DGreen said:


> Yes, values have changed since Eisenhower - which was the 50's - except for the republicans who are trying to drag us back to those days of June Cleaver cleaning house in high heels and pearls, where women were forbidden access and even information on birth control and where Jim Crow was the rule in the south.
> 
> Republicans are NOT trying to hang onto Medicare - they are trying to eliminate it and turn social security into a voucher system that is vulnerable to gamblers on Wall Street. Pointing out the use of social security numbers as ID is hardly a significant or compelling point.
> 
> Change for change's sake? Who are you kidding? I would like very much to see an example of "change for change's sake" that you think is bad. Change always happens for a reason and one can't stop it; one can only try to keep up and make wise decisions as to how to respond as an individual or by voting.
> 
> NO ONE is "bringing people into the country" to garner votes. That is a completely outrageous claim.
> 
> The conservatives do NOT support any giveaway programs. Name ANY they support aside from corporate welfare.
> 
> And finally, your use of the term "grasshopper" is offensive. I'm certainly not your student to be referred to in a diminutive manner, particularly when your post is full of inaccuracies.


Prove it.


----------



## DGreen

Crochet dreamin' said:


> Prove it.


Prove what?


----------



## J.Carol

Artbarn said:


> Who do you think is paying for those eleven million people's health insurance and the subsidies that many of those people are getting? And what about the people who no longer can afford health insurance because of Obamacare rules--people who don't qualify for subsidies?
> 
> Please see my other posts about the unemployment rate for my sources. The TRUE unemployment is between 7.4% and 9.4%. It includes those who have given up looking for employment and those who have taken part-time, minimum wage, and lower-wage jobs.
> 
> I believe that you are wrong about tuition rates being reduced by President Obama. I searched and cannot find any results. In fact, I don't see how Obama has any jurisdiction to reduce tuition rates, especially in private colleges.


To qualify for subsidies your yearly income has to be about $25,000 a year. Over $25,000 no subsidies. This may vary from state to state give or take a few $$ ....

You are right about unemployment. I even think your figures are a bit low. The noise the media spews out about unemployment are rigged figures.

There is no such thing as free health care period. All tax payers pay for it ..... well ..... unless you make $25,000 a year or less.

I also search for tuition rates reduced by Obama. Haven't found anything substantial about it yet.


----------



## soloweygirl

Designer1234 said:


> awards are given for accomplishments.


Not always. Why did Obama receive the Nobel Peace Prize when he was only in office for a few months?


----------



## SQM

Artbarn said:


> Well, I will respectfully disagree that our electoral system is screwy. Our founders thought very carefully about how this would work and there is a "method to the madness."
> 
> You are basically correct that Hillary would have to lead in the Democrat Primaries to run in the General Election against whoever leads in the Republican Primaries.


Our founding fathers wanted to insure that only the wealthy would decide on the winning vote. While suffrage was granted to all white males, many of them were considered too stupid to understand who would be the best president. So the electoral college was set up to ensure that only the educated, white males made the actual decisions.


----------



## soloweygirl

Moe C said:


> You have such a screwy electoral system. Doesn't Hillary have to win a bunch of primaries against other Dem candidates, in order to run for president? I could look that up too, but I"d rather go knit.


It's hard to accomplish when you are the only candidate running from your party.

Hey, that could be one of Hillary's accomplishments.


----------



## soloweygirl

DGreen said:


> ◾Matt Olsen, director of the National Counterterrorism Center, was the first administration official to call it a terrorist attack during a Sept. 19 congressional hearing. Secretary of State Hillary Clinton did the same on Sept. 20.
> 
> Not weeks - the attack was September 11th.
> 
> Obama did not want to call it terrorism, but seems to me the subject here is Hillary and she did so 9 days after the attack, not the plural "weeks."


Read for content. I said the administration. Obama was stating it was the video right up to and during his speech at the UN. So yes, it was the plural "weeks".


----------



## Artbarn

soloweygirl said:


> It is not making an economic comeback. The whole economy is stagnant and teetering on the edge of another recession. The jobs that are being created are low skill, low wage jobs. That is hardly going to keep the economy moving upward.


Correct.


----------



## mjzorn

mmmm


----------



## mjzorn

mmmm


----------



## ute4kp

susanmos2000 said:


> So true, Sumpleby. I can't help noticing that the exact same smears and epithets we've heard throughout Obama's terms in office--"arrogant" "above the law"--are now being flung at Clinton. I'm just waiting now for the birthers and the racists to get into the act. It seems pretty undeniable that Clinton is a Caucasian Christian woman born in Chicago, Illinois, but trust me--they'll soon be presenting "evidence" from some bizarre source(s) that Hillary is the illegitimate daughter of a mixed-race Iranian mullah and has already hired contractors to build a mosque in the basement of the White House.


Foxies are in a tizzy because they've already lost the election. The way they cope is to spew hate soup as in the Exorcist.


----------



## lovethelake

Huckleberry said:


> MrsB
> thank you for starting this thread. Hillary is a remarkable Woman. The few flaws she has, can be easily overlooked by all of her accomplishments and also her effort to perfect herself. I admire her for continuing to serve our Country. What an easy Life she could have. Just imagine what it could be like if Hillary would be President and Elizabeth Warren the Vice President. Well, one step at a time. Warren's future is bright anyway.


What are her accomplishments?


----------



## mjzorn

Ha-ha! I was trying out what one posted about holding down the control key to get a larger font and it just posted the "mmmm" that I was trying it on!


----------



## lins

soloweygirl said:


> We are 6 years into Obama's presidency. It is long past time to stop blaming Bush for everything.


Holy cow...your country, and the world, was in the tank when Obama took over. What do you think he is, is a magician?

It took Bush 8 years to nearly ruin the 'thriving' country and you expect Obama to fix it yesterday?

Concidering he has got this far, while having to fight the Republicans all the way, who did nothing to help and as a matter of fact made every effort to stop him from improving the country, I would say BRAVO.

The hoodwinked and uninformed people would believe it's Obama's fault rather than the Republicans. 
What do the Republicans offer? Tell me what they offer, the average person.
I would like to know.

Hilary, like Obama, want to move the country forward...not back. 
She may have half of a chance because she is white.


----------



## J.Carol

soloweygirl said:


> Not always. Why did Obama receive the Nobel Peace Prize when he was only in office for a few months?


Hahaha .... his handlers gave him an ego boost for doing a good job. He was doing what he was told to do. Obama makes no decisions he just follows orders.


----------



## ute4kp

WindingRoad said:


> She can't even take care of her own hair when she's not a home. And you think she can run a country. You can have her. Let her run Australia.


Winding!!!!!


----------



## soloweygirl

lins said:


> The day after the attack Obama called it a terrorist attack, ask Mitt.
> 
> At first it was an assumption that it was the video because it was causing so many riots in other parts of the country and other countries as well.
> When they got the truth through their intelligence agencies then they reported what they knew to the public.
> 
> As for the attack itself...too bad the republicans cut the budget on securty funding for the State Department...too bad indeed.
> 
> This is all public knowledge already.
> Back to Benghazi, Benghazi, Benghazi, Benghazi...
> 
> Holy cow...let's go way back and talk about WMD's and thousands killed and mamed because of it.
> 
> Remember who Geb Bush has as main advisors...19-21 people that were the former Bush's team, lying advisors, PLUS Cheney, who must feel his pockets didn't get filled up enough off his first war.
> 
> It's far more important that this be talked about as they are already talking about more war. Is that what you want?
> 
> Solid effort should be made by the populace to keep these war mongers out of the Presidency.
> America should give a break to its military and strengthen it, not abuse it.


Well, he apparently didn't believe it because he went on for weeks saying the attack was the result of a video. Obama's administration was the one that were touting the video as the cause. It was not seen in other countries, let alone a reason for any protests. It was no doubt googled after all the administration's lies. Let's not even mention the 70K spent on making a video themselves stating that the video caused the tragedy in Benghazi.


----------



## sumpleby

lins said:


> ....Hilary, like Obama, want to move the country forward...not back.
> She may have half of a chance because she is white.


You have to take off a quarter of that chance because she's a woman. Then go back into a negative chance on top of that because she's a Democrat.

:wink:


----------



## Crochet dreamin'

Globee said:


> I think it's amazing that not one single republican comment on this site has mentioned Adelman and the Koch brothers. Do they really want the country run by these big money people who are out to enhance their own coffers. I find it very scary.


Spoken like a true liberal. There always has to be a scapegoat. Let's not mention G.E. and all the other companies that got bailed out and all the scandal that went with it. At least the Dems won't mention it. I would say the Koch bros did a lot more to help the economy than those that took bribes (my definition) and then left the country. They put people to work. I think the biggest crook if we're pointing fingers is probably the poli -Ticks (bloodsuckers) in our government. They take a lot more than they give back!


----------



## soloweygirl

J.Carol said:


> Employment figures are fixed to look good. "Eleven million people have health insurance that the middle class do not have to pay for" ..... really? ....


The original 11M might be covered, but that still leaves around 30M still uncovered. The gov't should have just paid for those 11M and allowed all those that lost their insurance and those that are now paying more for less coverage to keep what they were happy with.


----------



## ute4kp

jodymorse151 said:


> So far 63 pages. We are not even started with this election cycle. This is worse than all the yard signs. Let's stop this and get back to knitting ... or gardening ... or playing with grandchildren ... or going to church ... or sitting in the sun with a cat ... or anything else but this.


Reading all of this is tiring. I keep telling myself not to look. gah!


----------



## Crochet dreamin'

soloweygirl said:


> The original 11M might be covered, but that still leaves around 30M still uncovered. The gov't should have just paid for those 11M and allowed all those that lost their insurance and those that are now paying more for less coverage to keep what they were happy with.


Yeah, I know, kinda like "If you like your insurance, you can keep it." Or, "If you like your doctor, you can keep him."


----------



## Artbarn

Well, this has almost totally degenerated to people calling each other names or making stupid one-up comments. I'm going to go knit.


----------



## Crochet dreamin'

I'm leaving and deleting all the messages from KP my mail server. I must have a gazillion for this posting!


----------



## ute4kp

knitpresentgifts said:


> What does a gallon of Kool-Aid cost nowadays in Oz?


They have better drinks than your hillbilly swill.


----------



## knitpresentgifts

soloweygirl said:


> The original 11M might be covered, but that still leaves around 30M still uncovered. The gov't should have just paid for those 11M and allowed all those that lost their insurance and those that are now paying more for less coverage to keep what they were happy with.


I'm waiting to see the fallout when the employer mandate finally kicks in. I also wonder how many taxpayers had to pay back overestimated subsidies and/or penalties when filing their income tax return this year.


----------



## lins

soloweygirl said:


> Well, he apparently didn't believe it because he went on for weeks saying the attack was the result of a video. Obama's administration was the one that were touting the video as the cause. It was not seen in other countries, let alone a reason for any protests. It was no doubt googled after all the administration's lies. Let's not even mention the 70K spent on making a video themselves stating that the video caused the tragedy in Benghazi.


This kind of thinking is what led Mitt down the path of no return. 
Lies and innuendos don't add up to the truth...not a bit.


----------



## ute4kp

Gerslay said:


> I've never liked her. She has never conducted herself with honesty and integrity. In the face of deep humiliation she chose to mock and ridicule those women who stand by their man and yet that's exactly what she did. She gets no credit for that bon mot...just one example among many!


What is bon mot?


----------



## ute4kp

Gerslay said:


> I'm pretty sure they don't have Kool-Aid in Oz...the closest is probably something called Cottees! I know this because I take an interest in things outside of my own country...doncha know?


.


----------



## ummirain

Re:they are all Communists.
Last I heard not working too well in China,as Capitalism barged in.
Cubs wants our tourist $$.
Still alive in North Korea,tho.
The young may change that in the decades to come.
They spy on their citizens.
Oh,wait....sort of like the republican's Patriot Act? Hmmm
Now which party is closer to opression of the masses ?
Instead of hating...think.


----------



## ute4kp

WindingRoad said:


> Another foreigner commenting on American politics. Just so everyone knows.


.....and????


----------



## lins

J.Carol said:


> Hahaha .... his handlers gave him an ego boost for doing a good job. He was doing what he was told to do. Obama makes no decisions he just follows orders.


Oh my gawd...you must be talking about Bush and Cheney not Obama. 
Who gives Obama orders? Please tell me.


----------



## soloweygirl

sumpleby said:


> Sorry, you can say this until the cows come home, but the video of the press conference the next day shows that the president did call it a terror attack.
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> "No acts of terror will ever shake the resolve of this great nation..."


He did not specifically state that the Benghazi attack was a terrorist attack. He said repeatedly the attack. Acts of terror referred to both attacks on 9/11, in 2001 and 2012, but not to either specifically. He skirted the issue. Then he went on his campaign to blame the video.


----------



## J.Carol

BrattyPatty said:


> What has any candidate done for the country. That question is one that should be asked after they leave the office. She has rekindled friendships with our allies around the world as Sec of State. She flew 1 million miles as SOS in order to do that. She has worked on health care reform as a senator in New York. She fights for equality in the job force. She fights for womens rights.
> 
> Can you enlighten me with anything Ted Cruz has accomplished besides shutting down the government ?
> How about Rand Paul? What has he accomplished for the good of our country?


She flew 1,000 miles so this give her a medal ..... hahahaha


----------



## ute4kp

WindingRoad said:


> If you can't even wash and comb your hair I don't think you are fit for office. JMHO. If you don't like it too bad.


Now...now....now. You weren't able to clear the snow off your roof rack. So there! He he he he.


----------



## ummirain

Thanks for the grin !


----------



## ute4kp

theyarnlady said:


> She did Ms Canada. I would suggest that some on the left may want to do the same.


Stop mud slinging other people just because of their nationality. Not good.


----------



## ute4kp

judypfennemore said:


> So interesting to read how people on the ground feel about Hilary ... And 64 pages to read - wonderful stuff. I'm sure I have a somewhat simplistic view, but my understanding of US politics is that whoever pays for the campaigns ,pulls the strings?


Romney lost. He has tons of money.


----------



## lins

WindingRoad said:


> Can you explain the recent uptick in Republican support? I didn't think so.


It's called gerrymandering and voter suppression.


----------



## soloweygirl

lins said:


> This kind of thinking is what led Mitt down the path of no return.
> Lies and innuendos don't add up to the truth...not a bit.


What lies? Obama went on for weeks about the cause of the attack was the video, or "all the evidence" wasn't in to say it was a terrorist attack. He was on all the late night talk shows and The View saying it. He even took this speech to the UN and blamed the video. Those are the facts.


----------



## ute4kp

Janeway said:


> Oh, yes, another foreign Democrat, how funny, the last thing I heard about your country is how much your medical insurance was costing for care that you must wait several months to to to receive treatment!
> 
> If your country is do great, why can you only stay out of the country 6 months or you won't have medical insurance & might have trouble returning to Canada?
> 
> Why don't you voice your opinions in your own country & leave American Politics to Americans? Your opinions do not matter so you are simply writing irritating words!


Janewrongway......this is a terrible thing you wrote.


----------



## theyarnlady

ute4kp said:


> Stop mud slinging other people just because of their nationality. Not good.


Was not mud slining and am sorry you miss understood that. I could not remember her adv. name. So shot me gush I do not consider what I wrote as slinging mud.


----------



## lins

soloweygirl said:


> What lies? Obama went on for weeks about the cause of the attack was the video, or "all the evidence" wasn't in to say it was a terrorist attack. He was on all the late night talk shows and The View saying it. He even took this speech to the UN and blamed the video. Those are the facts.


Lies again...


----------



## soloweygirl

lins said:


> Oh my gawd...you must be talking about Bush and Cheney not Obama.
> Who gives Obama orders? Please tell me.


Valerie Jarret and George Soros.


----------



## ute4kp

yorkie1 said:


> Enough already! 66 pages is enough for any topic, don't you think?


Oh boy....wait until it reaches the maximum pages and splits off.


----------



## ute4kp

Country Bumpkins said:


> That is the truth. Janeway has been with Denim since day one.


Good! Go back.


----------



## ute4kp

Janeway said:



> Sorry, but you are totally wrong! I'm one of the original D&P ladies so you didn't direct me anywhere! Second, the Dem's "never" ate me alive as they only typed hateful words!
> 
> Several of your Dem friends were kicked off KP -- especially one who threatened one of the "right" people!
> 
> Then another lefty one told a "right" person to put a pencil between her teeth & enjoy her seizure! This person did in fact have seizures!
> 
> I'm on O2 & one of your left friends told me to "get" off the O2 hose as I was not thinking straight!
> 
> Now, report me as Admin is already watching this thread so we will see who is kicked off for hateful words!
> 
> All you Dem's know how yo do is type hateful words!


Huh???


----------



## Moe C

Thanks Susan & Linda for your elucidation of primaries, etc. But, Linda, yeah, the system is screwy. Electoral college? C'mon. And campaigning for two years? The way the government was set up with a division of powers was great, but the elections, not so much.

Another couple comments: rich people and rich corporations donate to both parties. There is no longer a party for the wealthy.

And...there are more people on disability in the US than ever and the rate of new applicants is skyrocketing.

And nobody has mentioned the Federal Reserve. Oh, don't get me started and I can't even vote.


----------



## ute4kp

Janeway said:


> Ms. Green, I donate money to feed the poor not to the political parties because the very rich donate to the Republican Party!
> 
> I feel sorry for you that you think the Democratic Party will win! Obo only won because of his color not because of anything else!
> 
> You have my sympathy!


Janewrongway.


----------



## ute4kp

Janeway said:


> Why don't you become active in the politics of Australia your home country, but with the touch of fingers you criticize our Republican Party of which you know nothing! Relax your gingers & do something constructive in your country!


How would you know?


----------



## lfitzie

I'd vote for Adolph Hitler before I'd vote for Hillary or the pretend indian, Elizabeth Warren and I'm from Massachusetts. We cannot take four more years of Saul Alinsky socialism/marxism. We are going down the tubes. We need someone who cares about our sinking country and will work for the taxpayers struggling to keep us afloat.


----------



## ute4kp

Country Bumpkins said:


> It is ok you vented. The bullies on KP don't like our opinions so they group together like wild dogs to try to tear people to shreds so they don't post against their views. I guess you already figured that out. There are all a few of them but they change ID# so they seems like a lot of them.


Bumpy, Such as your pal janewrongway.


----------



## Wombatnomore

knitpresentgifts said:


> Oh, are you referring to Wall Street, Goldman Sachs or the various foreign govts that support Hillary like China and Saudi Arabia for example? If that is the 'right support' you accept for one running for the office of POTUS, you should send her some of your funds too, and put your money where your mouth is. Or better yet, instead of influencing an American running for President with foreign ILLEGAL contributions, help Hill become your PM.


I'm not referring to anything you're suggesting. Everything you've said above is purely speculative and very spiteful. If you're going to discuss the various candidates for the presidency, try a little humility and control yourself.


----------



## ute4kp

Janeway said:


> Have any of you noticed the AD's on KP? I've checked out some of them -- interesting!


No.


----------



## lins

ute4kp said:


> Stop mud slinging other people just because of their nationality. Not good.


That's okay...

I guess she thinks that if you don't live in the USA you don't care what the USA is doing, or the world for that matter.
I can't imagine anyone being that dumb but then again I can see it right here in some of the posts.


----------



## Cheeky Blighter

Artbarn said:


> Of course I care about the lives lost in Iraq and Afghanistan. War is a terrible thing. Bush and Cheney did what they were supposed to do--they did their jobs, which was to protect the citizens of this country after a horrendous attack.
> 
> The intelligence agencies from our allies told us that there were WMDs in Iraq. Hillary voted in favor of going to war with Iraq.


Protect us from the phantom WMDs. Are you serious? Where were they?


----------



## sumpleby

soloweygirl said:


> He did not specifically state that the Benghazi attack was a terrorist attack. He said repeatedly the attack. Acts of terror referred to both attacks on 9/11, in 2001 and 2012, but not to either specifically. He skirted the issue. Then he went on his campaign to blame the video.


Oh brother.


----------



## Cheeky Blighter

BrattyPatty said:


> Oh please!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!! They used 9/11 as an excuse to go back into Iraq.
> The UN found no WMD"S. Funny how Cheney's company, Haliburton, got the contracting job....Coincidence?


Don't forget Blackwater.


----------



## Wombatnomore

Gerslay said:


> I've never liked her. She has never conducted herself with honesty and integrity. In the face of deep humiliation she chose to mock and ridicule those women who stand by their man and yet that's exactly what she did. She gets no credit for that bon mot...just one example among many!


Sour grapes on your part Gerslay. Shame!


----------



## ute4kp

sumpleby said:


> ROFLMAO
> 
> Wait...I thought it was going to be placed on the East Lawn of the White House--when did the location change...?


It'll be on HGTV as a reno project. Bwa hahaha.


----------



## Globee

Absolutely right!!


----------



## ute4kp

Artbarn said:


> But ute4kp is the one who posted this propaganda.


What propaganda?


----------



## lins

soloweygirl said:


> Valerie Jarret and George Soros.


Adelsons and Kochs...the auditioning is happening now.


----------



## Wombatnomore

Gerslay said:


> I'm pretty sure they don't have Kool-Aid in Oz...the closest is probably something called Cottees! I know this because I take an interest in things outside of my own country...doncha know?


Sour grapes and belligerence! Nasty.


----------



## ute4kp

cookiequeen said:


> The best reasons to vote for Hillary Clinton:
> Cruz
> Rubio
> Walker
> Huckabee
> Paul
> Palin
> McCain
> Christie
> Trump


Hi cookie.

:thumbup: :thumbup: :thumbup:


----------



## Wombatnomore

knitpresentgifts said:


> I do know, and do too! I think she'd benefit from a longer duration of internet connectivity so she could research and learn more before commenting. So, I was concerned too many of her $ were going toward the Kool-Aid.


I research plenty unlike yourself.


----------



## ute4kp

Moe C said:


> So, tell a Canadian something....is Hillary the only Dem candidate so far? Who else might run?


So far as I know.


----------



## J.Carol

lins said:


> Oh my gawd...you must be talking about Bush and Cheney not Obama.
> Who gives Obama orders? Please tell me.


Bush, Cheney and Obama are all told what to say and do. The Federal Reserve runs the horse and pony show. The Federal Reserve is a separate entity from our Federal Government. A company established in 1913. Look it up for free on the internet "The Creature From Jekyll Island" .... it tells you in detail how the Federal Reserve came about. These are the guys that endlessly print our money, they run the show.

Just a bit of information that can be interesting. John F. Kennedy was against the Federal Reserve. He signed an executive order to abolish it and 6 months later he was assinated.


----------



## susanmos2000

Moe C said:


> Thanks Susan & Linda for your elucidation of primaries, etc. But, Linda, yeah, the system is screwy.


I can't but agree with you both--it does appear strange when you try to look at it objectively. It's always fascinating watching the candidates bash each other in their efforts to secure their Party's nomination--then, the day after the Primary, declare themselves BFF and team up against the opposing Party.


----------



## Wombatnomore

lins said:


> Do you mean footage that is cut up and made into a Republican fairytale that's
> edited to feed the minds of the gullible?
> Do you mean footage of cut off sentences that lead into cut off sentences from another story that gets passed off as footage filled with crap from a hateful website?
> Is that the footage you mean?


I'm not certain she knows what she means. Will not produce any evidence to back up her claims on this point. Claims that's up to us.


----------



## ute4kp

soloweygirl said:


> She is not a warm person, nor very likable. Her campaign slogan of wanting to be the champion of the middle class is laughable. Who does she think will believe her after her whining about being dead broke after leaving the WH and not being able to obtain mortgageS on her multi million dollar homes? Even in her opening ad, she is sitting in a coffee shop (?) listening to a middle class man nodding her head in agreement with his problems. Take a look at her body. Her body is turned away from him. That says she's ready to bolt, not stay and listen.


The forensic body watcher has spoken.


----------



## Cheeky Blighter

joeysomma said:


> Maybe you need to get your facts straight!


What facts would those be?


----------



## ute4kp

soloweygirl said:


> I wonder why she needed her own server to begin with. It leads me to ask what did she intend to hide?


Probably all your emails.


----------



## Cheeky Blighter

joeysomma said:


> Did they talk to Hillary? NO, so how could they say they did a complete investigation? She needs to testify under oath!


Yes. Where were you?


----------



## Wombatnomore

WindingRoad said:


> Another foreigner commenting on American politics. Just so everyone knows.


Touchy! There are those of us who are interested in international affairs. Broadens one's horizons and massively reduces myopia therefore resulting in an informed citizen of the world. You should try it.


----------



## lins

Janeway wrote:
Why don't you become active in the politics of Australia your home country, but with the touch of fingers you criticize our Republican Party of which you know nothing! Relax your gingers & do something constructive in your country!



ute4kp said:


> How would you know?


Lol...it's absurd, isn't it?


----------



## Cheeky Blighter

joeysomma said:


> Your so called accomplishments are more like disasters. 0bama is out to DESTROY the country as we knew it.


No that would be the traitors on your side.


----------



## Wombatnomore

dianejohnson said:


> anyone with the ability to use a keyboard may comment on this forum.
> this doesn't guarantee a high level of intelligence, which is clearly shown in so many of these responses.


 :thumbup:


----------



## lins

Cheeky Blighter said:


> Yes. Where were you?


 :thumbup: :lol:


----------



## lins

Cheeky Blighter said:


> No that would be the traitors on your side.


 :thumbup: :thumbup: :thumbup:


----------



## ute4kp

Moe C said:


> You have such a screwy electoral system. Doesn't Hillary have to win a bunch of primaries against other Dem candidates, in order to run for president? I could look that up too, but I"d rather go knit.


Her party has to vote her in to be the Dem candidate. Yeah that's basically how it is.


----------



## ute4kp

soloweygirl said:


> Not always. Why did Obama receive the Nobel Peace Prize when he was only in office for a few months?


The Norwegian Nobel Committee is responsible for the selection of eligible candidates and the choice of the Nobel Peace Prize Laureates. The Committee is composed of five members appointed by the Storting (Norwegian parliament).

Ask them and post the reply here.


----------



## Wombatnomore

Janeway said:


> Oh, yes, another foreign Democrat, how funny, the last thing I heard about your country is how much your medical insurance was costing for care that you must wait several months to to to receive treatment!
> 
> If your country is do great, why can you only stay out of the country 6 months or you won't have medical insurance & might have trouble returning to Canada?
> 
> Why don't you voice your opinions in your own country & leave American Politics to Americans? Your opinions do not matter so you are simply writing irritating words!


Another predictable spiteful missive.


----------



## Wombatnomore

Janeway said:


> Why don't you become active in the politics of Australia your home country, but with the touch of fingers you criticize our Republican Party of which you know nothing! Relax your gingers & do something constructive in your country!


Why don't you accept the fact that there are people in this world who are interested in international affairs and who have every right to voice their opinion?

You're acting like a petulant child whose toy was taken away.


----------



## Wombatnomore

lins said:


> Thanks.
> 
> I have had enough here for today.
> The posts are getting to name calling, slut, hair grooming, murder...stupid stuff that makes some of these women here looks so shallow and foolish.
> Some people don't care about the future only the past.
> Their way of thinking is so stagnant and I am truly sorry for them.


Well said.


----------



## Cheeky Blighter

MommaJody said:


> Nothing wrong? So what, now the man that according to general understanding, the most powerful man on earth, bows to the leader of Saudi Arabia? What next bend down and shine his shoes? What's wrong with the usual gesture of shaking their hands? For pity's sakes is right. He should have NEVER have bowed to another leader. Should he have spit at them? Maybe, but common courtesy rules that out now doesn't it?


Bush gave the Arabs kisses and held their hands. What does that mean? Maybe, we don't want to know.


----------



## Janeway

Loistec said:


> Ugh, you're such a troll! :thumbdown: :thumbdown: :thumbdown: :thumbdown:


Nope, I'm not a troll, but you must know all about it since you mentioned troll!


----------



## lins

J.Carol said:


> Bush, Cheney and Obama are all told what to say and do. The Federal Reserve runs the horse and pony show. The Federal Reserve is a separate entity from our Federal Government. A company established in 1913. Look it up for free on the internet "The Creature From Jekyll Island" .... it tells you in detail how the Federal Reserve came about. These are the guys that endlessly print our money, they run the show.
> 
> Just a bit of information that can be interesting. John F. Kennedy was against the Federal Reserve. He signed an executive order to abolish it and 6 months later he was assinated.


They do get appointed for a long time and yes they do control the money.

http://www.federalreserve.gov/pubs/frseries/frseri.htm


----------



## J.Carol

ute4kp said:


> The Norwegian Nobel Committee is responsible for the selection of eligible candidates and the choice of the Nobel Peace Prize Laureates. The Committee is composed of five members appointed by the Storting (Norwegian parliament).
> 
> Ask them and post the reply here.


Hahah ..... he was given a cookie for doing what he was told to do. Obama does not run this country. Check out the history of the Federal Reserve ..... established in 1913. Some really interesting history about why and how our system is like it is today and who is the boss. Very informative.


----------



## ute4kp

lfitzie said:


> I'd vote for Adolph Hitler before I'd vote for Hillary or the pretend indian, Elizabeth Warren and I'm from Massachusetts. We cannot take four more years of Saul Alinsky socialism/marxism. We are going down the tubes. We need someone who cares about our sinking country and will work for the taxpayers struggling to keep us afloat.


Whaaaaatttttt !!!!!! OMG!!!!!!!!!
How can you promote a nazi??????? Adolf.....really??????


----------



## ute4kp

lins said:


> That's okay...
> 
> I guess she thinks that if you don't live in the USA you don't care what the USA is doing, or the world for that matter.
> I can't imagine anyone being that dumb but then again I can see it right here in some of the posts.


Unfortunately so.


----------



## Cheeky Blighter

MommaJody said:


> Why don't you do like I did and go look for yourself instead of expecting someone to feed you "misinformation".


So you admit what you posted was misinformation? Thanks for your honest. :thumbup:


----------



## Cheeky Blighter

anjoda said:


> I have been reading this thread, and had to jump several pages, as it has be getting really out of hand. I agree with the above post, there has been a lot of incorrect facts stated here. In my opinion President Obama has done an excellent job, with absolutely no help from that sorry lot in congress.
> I think that you ladies should be honest, Not a single Republican, not even Jeb Bush, has the qualifications or experience that Hilliary Clinton has. The others are a bunch of inept, inexperienced, "boys". I, for one will definitely be voting for her. Mitt Romney showed exactly what he had in mind ror the country with his 1% exposed video. So, make no mistake, that is the agenda of the Republicans. Slash taxes for the rich and pay for the tax breaks by cutting all the social programs. That was tried before, and we all know where that put us. And better yet, squash the nuclear deal with Iran, and start a new war, because the ones we had for the past 10 years were not enough to pay for or enough of a sacrifice of our young troops. So, Hillary, I am on board.


An educated voter. You are a breath of fresh air. :thumbup:


----------



## Wombatnomore

Artbarn said:


> But ute4kp is the one who posted this propaganda.


I was referring to the link I posted which you said was "nonsense."


----------



## ute4kp

lins said:


> Janeway wrote:
> Why don't you become active in the politics of Australia your home country, but with the touch of fingers you criticize our Republican Party of which you know nothing! Relax your gingers & do something constructive in your country!
> 
> Lol...it's absurd, isn't it?


It's so sad.


----------



## Celt Knitter

Oh so true! We only become interested if you have oil and we can figure out a way to take it from you! Hand on heart, (and the others with fingers crossed behind our backs) we have never interfered or expressed our opinions in the affairs of other countries.


Wombatnomore said:


> Touchy! There are those of us who are interested in international affairs. Broadens one's horizons and massively reduces myopia therefore resulting in an informed citizen of the world. You should try it.


----------



## Wombatnomore

Artbarn said:


> Wombatnomore (from Australia) could have looked this up and found footage in seconds, MommaJody. Instead she wanted you to look small and stupid.
> 
> Here you go, Wombat: http://www.bing.com/videos/search?q=obama+bows+to+saudi+king&FORM=VIRE1#view=detail&mid=3F94B9B6181708E93CB43F94B9B6181708E93CB4


Not my fault if people choose to make baseless claims. As I said, may as well make an opinion count.


----------



## Janeway

alifletcher said:


> joeysoma,
> 
> No we are not paying for the eleven million people in the middle class who now who have health insurance , they are ! We paid for them when they had no health insurance. People who had pre existing conditions became worse and had more costly co-mobidities once they had to go to hospitals. Now with insurance they seek medical attention before their conditions worsen and they pay their own premiums. Why is this not considered a solution to the overwhelming health costs they faced in the past ? You must have insurance because those who now can afford it through the Affordable Health Care Act are very grateful to now have it !


You are soooo wrong about ACA as both my daughters ins has increased to the amount that they would be better off paying for any medical treatment. Both DDs were paying $2,000 deductible for each person but since ACA, they each have a $10,000 deductible that will then only pay 80% of the bill!

You need to get your facts straight! Both DDs "hate" ACA! Check with real people not what you are spoon fed by the Left!


----------



## ute4kp

Cheeky Blighter said:


> Bush gave the Arabs kisses and held their hands. What does that mean? Maybe, we don't want to know.


Soooooooooooooo
funny!!!!!!!!


----------



## Wombatnomore

Artbarn said:


> :XD: :XD: :XD: These are awards, not accomplishments.


They are accomplishments. Tsk, tsk, sour grapes again.


----------



## lins

ute4kp said:


> It's so sad.


 :thumbup:


----------



## J.Carol

lins said:


> They do get appointed for a long time and yes they do control the money.
> 
> http://www.federalreserve.gov/pubs/frseries/frseri.htm


Yep


----------



## ute4kp

Janeway said:


> Nope, I'm not a troll, but you must know all about it since you mentioned troll!


Yes. Everyone must realize what you trolls are up to.


----------



## Wombatnomore

Artbarn said:


> No, most of these are awards given because she's famous. The question has been asked over and over to list Hillary Clinton's accomplishments as a Senator (bills in her name, etc.) and as Secretary of State (major treaties, etc.)


In the words of one of your compatriots, you look it up for yourself.


----------



## Janeway

GWPlver said:


> And none of her post is true anyway.


Oh, great, GW has settled in for the fight! Roll up your sleeves my dear -- you don't know up from down.

I do post the truth you just cannot comprehend what is truth because you only resort to name calling!


----------



## Cheeky Blighter

damemary said:


> By Dan Payne
> 
> Updated March 20, 2015, 10:00 am
> 
> Suppose I told you about a candidate for president, who had this background:
> 
> Spent eight years in the U.S. Senate on the Armed Service Committee
> Served on other committees on the budget, the environment, transportation, health, workplace safety, pensions, and children, families and the aging
> Was honored as a tireless voice for children by the nations leading child advocacy organization
> Was called by GOP Sen. Lindsey Graham one of the most effective secretary of states, greatest ambassadors for the American people that I have known in my lifetime in May 2012
> Was named by Time magazine one of the 25 most powerful women of the past century
> 
> Its Hillary Clinton, and she may be the most qualified candidate for the presidency in a generation.
> 
> Despite ceaseless attacks on her that continue to this day, in 2014 she was named  for the 13th straight year and 19th time overall  by the American people as the most admired woman in the world, according to the Gallup organization.
> 
> Forbes magazine ranked her as one of most powerful people in the world nine times. She has been named eight times to Time magazines most influential 100 people on the planet.
> 
> In her first campaign for public office, she won a seat in the U.S. Senate from New York; the states first female senator, she defeated a popular New York politician 55 percent to 43 percent. She quickly established herself as a hard-working, respected U.S. senator, earning praise from Republican colleagues John McCain and Orrin Hatch, among others.
> 
> A graduate of Wellesley College and Yale Law School, she has worked with organizations dealing with the plight of migrant workers, indigents needing legal help, distressed children and families, and increasing educational opportunity. She helped run the western presidential campaign of U.S. Sen. George McGovern, and served on the legal staff on the U.S. House committee that impeached Richard Nixon.
> 
> As first lady in Arkansas, she chaired the Arkansas Educational Standards Committee, co-founded the Arkansas Advocates for Children and Families, and served on the boards of the Arkansas Childrens Hospital, Legal Services and the Childrens Defense Fund.
> 
> Ms. Clinton headed a task force that fashioned the countrys first national health care measure, which the Republicans in Washington vigorously trashed, inducing so much fear that it was scuttled.
> 
> Russias Vladimir Putin to Germanys Angela Merkel to Aung San Suu Kyi in Myanmar. Its hard to imagine Republican Gov. Scott Walker intimidating Putin with stories of how he faced down striking state workers, or North Koreas leader Kim Jong-un fretting over Gov. Chris Christies bluster, or Irans Supreme Leader Ali Khamenei staying awake at night over Sen. Marco Rubios name on that borderline traitorous letter sent to Iran by 47 GOP senators, or Cubas Castro brothers losing sleep over a third Bush in the White House, or Boko Haram, the Nigerian terrorists who have kidnapped young women and beheaded enemies, worrying about the fiery speeches of pediatric surgeon Ben Carson, a leading Republican presidential candidate in several states.
> 
> Rand Paul? He doesnt even believe we should have a foreign policy.
> 
> When the national Childrens Defense Fund honored Hillary Clinton in 2013, the groups president said: Shes brilliant. She cares deeply about children. She perseveres. Shes an incredibly hard worker, and she stays with it.
> 
> She would be the most qualified person to enter the White House in modern history, Minority Leader Nancy Pelosi declared. Shed be the best qualified person weve seen  with all due respect to President Clinton when he went in, President Obama and President Bush and everybody else.
> 
> Dan Payne is a Democratic political analyst for WBUR.


 :thumbup: :thumbup: :thumbup: :thumbup: :thumbup: :thumbup:


----------



## Janeway

Artbarn said:


> You keep doing the bait and switch, Bratty Patty.
> 
> 6 years is far too long to wait for what is en extremely weak "economic comeback."


You caught on quickly as bait & switch is all Bratty Patty & her gang of Lefties are capable of writing!


----------



## lins

Janeway said:


> You are soooo wrong about ACA as both my daughters ins has increased to the amount that they would be better off paying for any medical treatment. Both DDs were paying $2,000 deductible for each person but since ACA, they each have a $10,000 deductible that will then only pay 80% of the bill!
> 
> You need to get your facts straight! Both DDs "hate" ACA! Check with real people not what you are spoon fed by the Left!


GOP Congresswoman from Wasington State, Kathy McMorris Rodgers, tried to get people to post negtive things about the ACA and was surprised to say the least. Her Facebook page went viral.

http://www.dailykos.com/story/2015/03/26/1373436/-Republican-Congresswoman-gets-surprise-on-Facebook-after-asking-constituents-for-ACA-horror-stories


----------



## Janeway

Artbarn said:


> Wombatnomore (from Australia) could have looked this up and found footage in seconds, MommaJody. Instead she wanted you to look small and stupid.
> 
> Here you go, Wombat: http://www.bing.com/videos/search?q=obama+bows+to+saudi+king&FORM=VIRE1#view=detail&mid=3F94B9B6181708E93CB43F94B9B6181708E93CB4


Wombat never looks anything up so we have stopped posting links ax she is too lazy to look at the site or post information.

Thank you for trying to help but you will find Wombat changes her mind when put into a corner!


----------



## luvrcats

to Mrs.C.....I agree....but, we will ever attain such a goal!


----------



## Jules934

Just too much baggage.


----------



## Jules934

Just too much baggage.


----------



## Janeway

hushpuppy said:


> Agree, NOT the right woman for the job, way too much baggage and in to many pockets!!!!!!


Thank you!


----------



## Wombatnomore

ute4kp said:


> They have better drinks than your hillbilly swill.


 :XD: :XD: :XD:


----------



## J.Carol

Janeway said:


> Thank you!


I agree with you 100% but all politicians have their hand in pockets. Money is what move our whole system.


----------



## SQM

ute4kp said:


> What is bon mot?


A good word in French.


----------



## Wombatnomore

Janeway said:


> Wombat never looks anything up so we have stopped posting links ax she is too lazy to look at the site or post information.
> 
> Thank you for trying to help but you will find Wombat changes her mind when put into a corner!


Is that so? Interesting that you make such assumptions based on absolutely nothing. I'm more informed than you'll ever be.


----------



## Janeway

ute4kp said:


> Janewrongway......this is a terrible thing you wrote.


And this is your concern? I don't think it is any of your business as this person is trying to voice her opinion on our politics when she needs to look at her own country!

The Name is Janeway!  What kind of name is ute4kp? Couldn't you think of anything constructive?

Clean out your own closet!


----------



## SQM

Cheeky Blighter said:


> Bush gave the Arabs kisses and held their hands. What does that mean? Maybe, we don't want to know.


Please!

The LGBTs would be insulted by your suggestion.


----------



## lins

lfitzie said:


> I'd vote for Adolph Hitler before I'd vote for Hillary or the pretend indian, Elizabeth Warren and I'm from Massachusetts. We cannot take four more years of Saul Alinsky socialism/marxism. We are going down the tubes. We need someone who cares about our sinking country and will work for the taxpayers struggling to keep us afloat.


I would be so ashamed of myself if I had been as disrespectful as you are to have posted this.

My father fought overseas in WWII.


----------



## Cheeky Blighter

Globee said:


> I think it's amazing that not one single republican comment on this site has mentioned Adelman and the Koch brothers. Do they really want the country run by these big money people who are out to enhance their own coffers. I find it very scary.


They never will mention them either. All they know how to do is try to discredit whoever they believe is their enemy. when they finally see who their enemy is it will really scare them and it isn't the Democrats.


----------



## Cheeky Blighter

Gerslay said:


> Its not so amazing as a matter of fact its fairly typical of those who cry foul over the Koch brothers yet largely ignore George Soros:
>  A left wing billionaire contributing huge amounts of money = democracy in action.
>  Two conservative billionaires doing the same = the end of democracy.


And she won't even mention Adelman. He has even more money.
They live in a bubble.


----------



## Montana Gramma

Janeway said:


> Oh, yes, another foreign Democrat, how funny, the last thing I heard about your country is how much your medical insurance was costing for care that you must wait several months to to to receive treatment!
> 
> If your country is do great, why can you only stay out of the country 6 months or you won't have medical insurance & might have trouble returning to Canada?
> 
> Why don't you voice your opinions in your own country & leave American Politics to Americans? Your opinions do not matter so you are simply writing irritating words!


Canadians buy health insurance to leave the country and it is not cheap, and most countries only allow 5 months 29 days in an other country without a visa. No Canadian has trouble getting back into Canada unless it would be a legal issue and then they most likely are banned from further travel to that country. Anyone in the US on Medicare should check too, Medicare does not pay for illness out of the country, I buy extra insurance whenever I travel to be covered. 
And as I said before, there isn't a country in this world that isn't connected to US politics, so why should they not take an interest in the process and state an opinion? Chat rules do not prohibit any nationality from commenting. And just as everyone on here, they swing left and right and so what? If everything is taken so personally on KP chat forums, when they do not know the person formally, how in the world can anyone get along in debating subjects?


----------



## lovethelake

Is Dan Payne the best you can do? He is a Canadian actor. WBUR is Boston's NPR station, you know the one that needs our tax money because it can't stand on its own merits. 

Hilarious. I mean couldn't you even site CNN (the Clinton News Network). Maybe we could review the Clinton Body Bag count, that would be a walk down memory lane


----------



## DGreen

J.Carol said:


> Hahaha .... his handlers gave him an ego boost for doing a good job. He was doing what he was told to do. Obama makes no decisions he just follows orders.


Handlers? Who are these mysterious and powerful people?


----------



## Moe C

Well, it's obvious after all this hair-pulling and eye-gouging that women are not fit for high office.


----------



## Cheeky Blighter

lins said:


> You don't jack about me or my family or where I come from.
> 
> As for following or commenting on what's going on in the core of American politics is what people who care about the world do. Not yap petty BS.


lins you are far better informed on what is going on in the U.S. than any of the righties are. They lead very provincial sheltered lives and are very unaware that any countries exist outside their own and if they do they have a superiority complex that won't quit. Thanks for your eloquent and factual posts.


----------



## Huckleberry

Artbarn said:


> This is absolutely true.


Artbarn
keep the Horse in front of the carriage, it is absolutely FALSE.


----------



## DGreen

J.Carol said:


> Bush, Cheney and Obama are all told what to say and do. The Federal Reserve runs the horse and pony show. The Federal Reserve is a separate entity from our Federal Government. A company established in 1913. Look it up for free on the internet "The Creature From Jekyll Island" .... it tells you in detail how the Federal Reserve came about. These are the guys that endlessly print our money, they run the show.
> 
> Just a bit of information that can be interesting. John F. Kennedy was against the Federal Reserve. He signed an executive order to abolish it and 6 months later he was assinated.


Unmitigated garbage. AND hinting at a Kennedy conspiracy theory to boot.


----------



## mojave

Who is Adelman? 

I know Sheldon Adelson but have never heard of a wealthy Republican power broker named Adelman.


----------



## Cheeky Blighter

DGreen said:


> Only momentarily. I seriously have better things to do, and I'm doing them. The plans for the Democratic fund raiser are going exceptionally well and further plans are in the works to build a reserve of $$ needed to soundly - no resoundingly - defeat the tea party republican charlatans who represent my district in 2016. We are gaining membership constantly from the ranks of not only liberals, but former republicans who are sick of the kind of liars and money-backed ALEC hacks who populate our state. The tide is turning against the fundamentalists and extremists and I'm pleased to be part of it.
> 
> Love you, too, SQM. An intelligent voice.


Thanks for all your hard work, Diane! :thumbup:


----------



## felix

she hasn't proved to be a leader because she hasn't had that opportunity....i know that secretary of state is a huge responsibility but president is even bigger.she is a smart cookie, don't let anyone tell you different but since she was defeated by our idiot leader we can't do worse...


----------



## lins

Cheeky Blighter said:


> lins you are far better informed on what is going on in the U.S. than any of the righties are. They lead very provincial sheltered lives and are very unaware that any countries exist outside their own and if they do they have a superiority complex that won't quit. Thanks for your eloquent and factual posts.


Well thank-you. My dander got up a little there.


----------



## Huckleberry

Cheeky Blighter said:


> lins you are far better informed on what is going on in the U.S. than any of the righties are. They lead very provincial sheltered lives and are very unaware that any countries exist outside their own and if they do they have a superiority complex that won't quit. Thanks for your eloquent and factual posts.


Cheeky Blighter
my, you are kind, they don't even know what is happening in their immediate area. Check it out, pin some buttons on your Blouse with the names of your local Government staff and you will be asked often "who is that"?


----------



## Celt Knitter

:thumbup: :thumbup: :thumbup:

What an insult to the memory of the millions murdered by Hitler. It is embarrassing that an American has expressed such an opinion on a public international forum. I bet lfitzie calls herself a Christian as well. I doubt if she knows anything about socialism or Marxism either.


lins said:


> I would be so ashamed of myself if I had been as disrespectful as you are to have posted this.
> 
> My father fought overseas in WWII.


----------



## DGreen

Cheeky Blighter said:


> lins you are far better informed on what is going on in the U.S. than any of the righties are. They lead very provincial sheltered lives and are very unaware that any countries exist outside their own and if they do they have a superiority complex that won't quit. Thanks for your eloquent and factual posts.


 :thumbup: :thumbup: :thumbup:


----------



## Huckleberry

lins said:


> Well thank-you. My dander got up a little there.


lins
don't a let a few knuckleheads spoil your day. There are plenty of us who like our wonderful neighbors and friends in far lands.


----------



## lins

Celt Knitter said:


> :thumbup: :thumbup: :thumbup:
> 
> What an insult to the memory of the millions murdered by Hitler. It is embarrassing that an American has expressed such an opinion on a public international forum. I bet lfitzie calls herself a Christian as well. I doubt if she knows anything about socialism or Marxism either.


 :thumbup: :thumbup: :thumbup:


----------



## Cheeky Blighter

cookiequeen said:


> The best reasons to vote for Hillary Clinton:
> Cruz
> Rubio
> Walker
> Huckabee
> Paul
> Palin
> McCain
> Christie
> Trump


 :thumbup: :thumbup: :thumbup: :thumbup: :thumbup: :thumbup: :thumbup: :thumbup:


----------



## lins

Huckleberry said:


> lins
> don't a let a few knuckleheads spoil your day. There are plenty of us who like our wonderful neighbors and friends in far lands.


Thanks,

I have lots of friends and family in far lands and we have family in America.

I do get a little upset to see that hatred and discrimination is still here today. It's 2015. It should be better by now. 
It seems worse today.
It's so sad.

Take care.


----------



## peacegoddess

Why I will not vote for Hillary R Clinton.

Foreign Policy:
Pushed for 09 troop surge 
Proponent of drone strikes leading to 2,400 civilian deaths
Approved of netanyahu's assult on Gaza
Was against investigation into coup in Guatemala
Economy:
Strong financial connections to Goldman Saschss, Morgan Stanley, and J P Morgan

Actions taken while legal counsel for Rose Law firm in Arkansas favoring utility companies over low and moderate income families.
Board member of Walmart

Civil Liberties
voted for Patriot Act
Defends NSA serveillance
Accused Snowden of terrorism

Environment:
While secretary of State she supported and encouraged hydrofracking world wide.
Silent on Keystone XL


----------



## Cheeky Blighter

soloweygirl said:


> It made a difference because the administration was lying about the cause of the attack - and the reason was the upcoming election. The admin was out there for weeks blaming a video as the reason for the spontaneous attack, not admitting that it was an attack by a terrorist group. Obama refused to walk back on his comments about Al Queada being on the run when in fact Al Queada was alive and well and getting stronger. Then there was the matter of the whole attack itself , how it was handled and its consequences.


Poor solo one note. That's all you have and it's going nowhere.


----------



## Cheeky Blighter

soloweygirl said:


> Oh please, Bush and Cheney presented information that was given to us by our allies stating that there were WMD's. Those allies joined us in the fight against terror as well. It's something they would not have done if they knew their information was false. ISIS did find some buried WMD's after they took control of areas in Iraq. Yes they were old WMD's but it does prove that WMD's did exist in Iraq.


How many times are you going to repeat yourself? It will never be true. Dream on.


----------



## Cheeky Blighter

soloweygirl said:


> How about the Democrats getting some serious candidates as well? Your clown certainly isn't trustworthy.


All we need is one good one. Your side has nothing. Hillary will eat them up and spit them out. :thumbup:


----------



## lins

Huckleberry said:


> lins
> don't a let a few knuckleheads spoil your day. There are plenty of us who like our wonderful neighbors and friends in far lands.


Thanks,

I have lots of friends and family in far lands and we have family in America.

I admit I do get a little upset to see that hatred and discrimination is still here today. It's 2015. It should be better by now. 
It seems worse today.
It's so sad.

Take care.


----------



## J.Carol

DGreen said:


> Handlers? Who are these mysterious and powerful people?


The Federal Reserve. Check out the history of this company that was established in 1913. At no charge you can find out all about the Federal Reserve. They are a company they are not a part of our Federal government. They print and distribute our Federal Reserve Notes to the banks in our country. Very interesting history that explains why our country is financially in a not very good situation today. It may be a lot to read but it helps us to understand in depth how the whole USA system works.


----------



## Cheeky Blighter

SQM said:


> Our founding fathers wanted to insure that only the wealthy would decide on the winning vote. While suffrage was granted to all white males, many of them were considered too stupid to understand who would be the best president. So the electoral college was set up to ensure that only the educated, white males made the actual decisions.


Thanks for explaining to the uneducated. :thumbup:


----------



## Cheeky Blighter

ute4kp said:


> Foxies are in a tizzy because they've already lost the election. The way they cope is to spew hate soup as in the Exorcist.


It's not a pretty sight either.


----------



## Cheeky Blighter

J.Carol said:


> Hahaha .... his handlers gave him an ego boost for doing a good job. He was doing what he was told to do. Obama makes no decisions he just follows orders.


Do you even know who gives out the Noble Prize? Obviously, not.


----------



## SQM

Should we start a new thread on the guy ( I am blocking his name) who threw in his hat today? Rubio. I unfortunately remembered.


----------



## Cheeky Blighter

soloweygirl said:


> He did not specifically state that the Benghazi attack was a terrorist attack. He said repeatedly the attack. Acts of terror referred to both attacks on 9/11, in 2001 and 2012, but not to either specifically. He skirted the issue. Then he went on his campaign to blame the video.


You are only embarrassing yourself now dear. You need to come up with something else besides Benghazi.


----------



## Cheeky Blighter

J.Carol said:


> She flew 1,000 miles so this give her a medal ..... hahahaha


You don't have a clue what you are posting do you?


----------



## susanmos2000

peacegoddess said:


> Why I will not vote for Hillary R Clinton.
> 
> Foreign Policy:
> Pushed for 09 troop surge
> Proponent of drone strikes leading to 2,400 civilian deaths
> Approved of netanyahu's assult on Gaza
> Was against investigation into coup in Guatemala
> Economy:
> Strong financial connections to Goldman Saschss, Morgan Stanley, and J P Morgan
> 
> Actions taken while legal counsel for Rose Law firm in Arkansas favoring utility companies over low and moderate income families.
> Board member of Walmart
> 
> Civil Liberties
> voted for Patriot Act
> Defends NSA serveillance
> Accused Snowden of terrorism
> 
> Environment:
> While secretary of State she supported and encouraged hydrofracking world wide.
> Silent on Keystone XL


Excuse my language, folks, but based on this Hillary should be a conservative's wet dream. Where's the problem?


----------



## SQM

Cheeky Blighter said:


> You don't have a clue what you are posting do you?


Hope she did not go to my high school.


----------



## susanmos2000

SQM said:


> Should we start a new thread on the guy ( I am blocking his name) who threw in his hat today? Rubio. I unfortunately remembered.


There's already one going, SQM. I think Sumpleby began it.


----------



## DGreen

peacegoddess said:


> Why I will not vote for Hillary R Clinton.
> 
> Foreign Policy:
> Pushed for 09 troop surge
> Proponent of drone strikes leading to 2,400 civilian deaths
> Approved of netanyahu's assult on Gaza
> Was against investigation into coup in Guatemala
> Economy:
> Strong financial connections to Goldman Saschss, Morgan Stanley, and J P Morgan
> 
> Actions taken while legal counsel for Rose Law firm in Arkansas favoring utility companies over low and moderate income families.
> Board member of Walmart
> 
> Civil Liberties
> voted for Patriot Act
> Defends NSA serveillance
> Accused Snowden of terrorism
> 
> Environment:
> While secretary of State she supported and encouraged hydrofracking world wide.
> Silent on Keystone XL


I'm with you, Goddess. But if it comes down to Hillary or a republican (no matter which one), I'll cast my vote for Hillary.


----------



## Cheeky Blighter

lins said:


> That's okay...
> 
> I guess she thinks that if you don't live in the USA you don't care what the USA is doing, or the world for that matter.
> I can't imagine anyone being that dumb but then again I can see it right here in some of the posts.


Sad isn't it and they think they know what is going on. They don't even understand what goes on inside the U.S. let alone other countries. Ignorance is bliss for them.


----------



## Cheeky Blighter

sumpleby said:


> Oh brother.


She is like a dog with a bone.


----------



## Cheeky Blighter

Wombatnomore said:


> Touchy! There are those of us who are interested in international affairs. Broadens one's horizons and massively reduces myopia therefore resulting in an informed citizen of the world. You should try it.


Wombat you could give the righties lessons in American politics. :thumbup:


----------



## SQM

Cheeky Blighter said:


> Wombat you could give the righties lessons in American politics. :thumbup:


Wombat is an Americaphile. She was born on the wrong continent. She is wonderfully informed. How many of us can discuss Australia? EvieeeeM - you do not count in this tally.


----------



## J.Carol

Cheeky Blighter said:


> Do you even know who gives out the Noble Prize? Obviously, not.


Do you ?? I don't think you even know who gives out a Noble Prize. A man that hands the prize to another person is told what to do. He is just a third party. The big guy in the sky tells him what to do. You want to know who the big guy in the sky is ??? Do some heavy duty research .. it take hours of reading. Step outside of the box. Look else where for some answers rather than we all sit around bickering with each other. We should all be interested in finding a way out of this mess and develop a somewhat constructive discussion.


----------



## Cheeky Blighter

SQM said:


> A good word in French.


Your full of bon mots SQM. :thumbup:


----------



## Cheeky Blighter

SQM said:


> Please!
> 
> The LGBTs would be insulted by your suggestion.


And rightfully so!


----------



## Cheeky Blighter

Montana Gramma said:


> Canadians buy health insurance to leave the country and it is not cheap, and most countries only allow 5 months 29 days in an other country without a visa. No Canadian has trouble getting back into Canada unless it would be a legal issue and then they most likely are banned from further travel to that country. Anyone in the US on Medicare should check too, Medicare does not pay for illness out of the country, I buy extra insurance whenever I travel to be covered.
> And as I said before, there isn't a country in this world that isn't connected to US politics, so why should they not take an interest in the process and state an opinion? Chat rules do not prohibit any nationality from commenting. And just as everyone on here, they swing left and right and so what? If everything is taken so personally on KP chat forums, when they do not know the person formally, how in the world can anyone get along in debating subjects?


 :thumbup: :thumbup: :thumbup:


----------



## SQM

J.Carol said:


> Do you ?? I don't think you even know who gives out a Noble Prize. A man that hands the prize to another person is told what to do. He is just a third party. The big guy in the sky tells him what to do. You want to know who the big guy in the sky is ??? Do some heavy duty research .. it take hours of reading. Step outside of the box. Look else where for some answers rather than we all sit around bickering with each other. We should all be interested in finding a way out of this mess and develop a somewhat constructive discussion.


Big man in the sky? Is that Trump in a penthouse?


----------



## susanmos2000

J.Carol said:


> Do you ?? I don't think you even know who gives out a Noble Prize. A man that hands the prize to another person is told what to do. He is just a third party. The big guy in the sky tells him what to do. You want to know who the big guy in the sky is ??? Do some heavy duty research .. it take hours of reading. Step outside of the box. Look else where for some answers rather than we all sit around bickering with each other. We should all be interested in finding a way out of this mess and develop a somewhat constructive discussion.


I'm going to have to do some heavy research just to understand your post, J.Carol. "The big guy in the sky" who tells people what to do? Are you talking about God or international corporations or what?


----------



## SQM

i think J. Carol needs to cork her bottle.


----------



## Cheeky Blighter

mojave said:


> Who is Adelman?
> 
> I know Sheldon Adelson but have never heard of a wealthy Republican power broker named Adelman.


You are correct, mojave. It is Adelson.


----------



## mmorris

Not impressed either! She has too much baggage from her past. :thumbdown:


----------



## Cheeky Blighter

Huckleberry said:


> Cheeky Blighter
> my, you are kind, they don't even know what is happening in their immediate area. Check it out, pin some buttons on your Blouse with the names of your local Government staff and you will be asked often "who is that"?


Sad but true, Huck and they are proud of their lack of information.


----------



## mmorris

That, my friend, is the perfect definition of politics.! :thumbup:


----------



## susanmos2000

SQM said:


> i think J. Carol needs to cork her bottle.


Yep, it's closing time at the local tavern (or should be).


----------



## sumpleby

SQM said:


> Should we start a new thread on the guy ( I am blocking his name) who threw in his hat today? Rubio. I unfortunately remembered.


Already did. It's called "Marco Rubio."


----------



## mojave

Cheeky Blighter said:


> You are correct, mojave. It is Adelson.


Thank you. I am far from agreeing with many of Sheldon's political positions but he and Miriam throw some awesome parties.


----------



## Moe C

mojave said:


> Thank you. I am far from agreeing with many of Sheldon's political positions but he and Miriam throw some awesome parties.


Is that name dropping?


----------



## Cheeky Blighter

SQM said:


> Should we start a new thread on the guy ( I am blocking his name) who threw in his hat today? Rubio. I unfortunately remembered.


Maybe KPG will. It doesn't look like her guy, Cruz, or her thread are going anywhere. We had to help her out and posted there and she didn't even say thank you. No manners that one.
If you do start one let me know. :thumbup:


----------



## susanmos2000

Cheeky Blighter said:


> Maybe KPG will. It doesn't look like her guy, Cruz, or her thread are going anywhere. We had to help her out and posted there and she didn't even say thank you. No manners that one.
> If you do start one let me know. :thumbup:


Sumpleby has one going, Cheeky.


----------



## peacegoddess

susanmos2000 said:


> Excuse my language, folks, but based on this Hillary should be a conservative's wet dream. Where's the problem?


Exactly why I believe there is little difference between centrist democrats like Obama and Clinton and republicans.


----------



## Cheeky Blighter

J.Carol said:


> Do you ?? I don't think you even know who gives out a Noble Prize. A man that hands the prize to another person is told what to do. He is just a third party. The big guy in the sky tells him what to do. You want to know who the big guy in the sky is ??? Do some heavy duty research .. it take hours of reading. Step outside of the box. Look else where for some answers rather than we all sit around bickering with each other. We should all be interested in finding a way out of this mess and develop a somewhat constructive discussion.


Sorry but you are offering nothing. You may be correct about some things but you are a conspiracy theory fanatic and I can't take you seriously. Not everyone is bought and paid for.


----------



## Cheeky Blighter

SQM said:


> Big man in the sky? Is that Trump in a penthouse?


Those things are expensive. I don't know if the Donald could even afford to buy one. :lol:


----------



## Cheeky Blighter

mojave said:


> Thank you. I am far from agreeing with many of Sheldon's political positions but he and Miriam throw some awesome parties.


 :XD: :XD: :XD: :XD: :XD: :XD: :XD: :XD: :XD: :XD:


----------



## Cheeky Blighter

peacegoddess said:


> Exactly why I believe there is little difference between centrist democrats like Obama and Clinton and republicans.


I have to agree with you peacegoddess.


----------



## DGreen

J.Carol said:


> Do you ?? I don't think you even know who gives out a Noble Prize. A man that hands the prize to another person is told what to do. He is just a third party. The big guy in the sky tells him what to do. You want to know who the big guy in the sky is ??? Do some heavy duty research .. it take hours of reading. Step outside of the box. Look else where for some answers rather than we all sit around bickering with each other. We should all be interested in finding a way out of this mess and develop a somewhat constructive discussion.


If a constructive discussion includes the New World Order, you won't find any takers among the more intelligent posters. Your post smacks of conspiracy theory.


----------



## SQM

DGreen said:


> If a constructive discussion includes the New World Order, you won't find any takers among the more intelligent posters. Your post smacks of conspiracy theory.


If she discusses aliens and motherships, I am in with her.


----------



## DGreen

Long post, but wonderful take on Hillary's campaign. From The Daly Kos (and yes, unapologetically liberal):

The ad is also overwhelmingly positive so the contrast between Clintons positive message and the Republican response will be immediate and glaring. Part of the handicap Republicans are faced with is they have no positions to run on. Gutting Social Security and Medicare isnt much of a platform and the public is finally catching on, after only 40 years, that supply side economics is a sham and tax breaks for billionaires dont buy us anything. Bombing Iran is not going to play well next to that ad.

Since they dont have any issues to run on, the billionaires club that the GOP has become will almost certainly go negative in a big way. They cant help themselves and dont have a lot of options in either respect.

The smart response would be for Republicans to ignore Clinton altogether. Acknowledge shes in the race and go back to their business. That would be smart, so theres no real threat Republicans will do that. Theyll stick their head in the noose and climb over the rail because that's who they've become.

Whether you like Clinton or not your choices in this election are not going to be between competing policy ideas. *Your choice in the 2016 race is going to be between crazy and not crazy. You can vote for the nice lady in the Clinton ad or the nutcase behind Door Number 2. For the overwhelming majority of Americans that choice is going to be a no brainer.*

(My addition of bold type)


----------



## Grandma Jo

I am just wondering how a group of nice ladies that are willing to help others with knitting problems can do such a complete turnabout when it comes to politics. In 84 pages, do you really think you have changed anyone mind. I don't think so. Fight on and have a blast. I am leaving this for good, I am sick and tired of it.


----------



## mojave

DGreen said:


> Your choice in the 2016 race is going to be between crazy and not crazy. You can vote for the nice lady in the Clinton ad or the nutcase behind Door Number 2. For the overwhelming majority of Americans that choice is going to be a no brainer.


Perhaps it is a sense of caution derived from years of science training, however, it seems a bit early to engage in such loud crowing. There are many months yet before the final showdown in November 2016. Wild cards in the form of natural and/or economic catastrophes, unexpected demise of candidates or financial backers, political upheavals in other parts of the world all have potential to induce significant change in voter choices.


----------



## susanmos2000

DGreen said:


> Long post, but  wonderful take on Hillary's campaign. From The Daly Kos (and yes, unapologetically liberal):
> 
> The ad is also overwhelmingly positive so the contrast between Clintons positive message and the Republican response will be immediate and glaring. Part of the handicap Republicans are faced with is they have no positions to run on. Gutting Social Security and Medicare isnt much of a platform and the public is finally catching on, after only 40 years, that supply side economics is a sham and tax breaks for billionaires dont buy us anything. Bombing Iran is not going to play well next to that ad.
> 
> Since they dont have any issues to run on, the billionaires club that the GOP has become will almost certainly go negative in a big way. They cant help themselves and dont have a lot of options in either respect.
> 
> The smart response would be for Republicans to ignore Clinton altogether. Acknowledge shes in the race and go back to their business. That would be smart, so theres no real threat Republicans will do that. Theyll stick their head in the noose and climb over the rail because that's who they've become.
> 
> Whether you like Clinton or not your choices in this election are not going to be between competing policy ideas. *Your choice in the 2016 race is going to be between crazy and not crazy. You can vote for the nice lady in the Clinton ad or the nutcase behind Door Number 2. For the overwhelming majority of Americans that choice is going to be a no brainer.*
> 
> (My addition of bold type)


I love it! :XD: :XD: :thumbup:

(But with one caveat  For the vast majority of Republicans, the act of voting already IS a no brainer. That's just where the problem lies.)


----------



## DGreen

mojave said:


> Perhaps it is a sense of caution derived from years of science training, however, it seems a bit early to engage in such loud crowing. There are many months yet before the final showdown in November 2016. Wild cards in the form of natural and/or economic catastrophes, unexpected demise of candidates or financial backers, political upheavals in other parts of the world all have potential to induce significant change in voter choices.


You are spot on, Mojave. However, I feel confident that the republicans will not be able to field a candidate that can appeal to moderates AND the Tea Party at the same time. This divide will open the door for us liberals. The republican party has devolved into a looney bin, full of Christian extremists gun ammoholics and haters. If they reform themselves between now and then, I'll be profoundly surprised. In the meantime, I'm working hard to identify and register every Democrat I can find in my district, as well as raise funds to assist our cause in Arizona. It's an uphill battle.


----------



## Celt Knitter

I think it smacks of smack....and anyone who subscribes to the New World Order conspiracy theory must be smoking some serious stuff.


DGreen said:


> If a constructive discussion includes the New World Order, you won't find any takers among the more intelligent posters. Your post smacks of conspiracy theory.


----------



## DGreen

susanmos2000 said:


> I love it! :XD: :XD: :thumbup:
> 
> (But with one caveat  For the vast majority of Republicans, the act of voting IS a no brainer. That's just where the problem lies.)


 :thumbup: :thumbup: :thumbup:


----------



## DGreen

Celt Knitter said:


> I think it smacks of smack....and anyone who subscribes to the New World Order conspiracy theory must be smoking some serious stuff.


Conspiracy theorists would be better off smoking something. As it is, they believe that crap straight and sober.

I find that sobering.


----------



## Globee

And have these all be checked out. I know that she was on the Walmart board when bill was governor of Arkansas. That was a very long time ago.


----------



## SQM

mojave said:


> Perhaps it is a sense of caution derived from years of science training, however, it seems a bit early to engage in such loud crowing. There are many months yet before the final showdown in November 2016. Wild cards in the form of natural and/or economic catastrophes, unexpected demise of candidates or financial backers, political upheavals in other parts of the world all have potential to induce significant change in voter choices.


Mojave - for what it is worth coming from me - I think this is the smartest observation on this thread. People plan and the gods laugh.


----------



## J.Carol

SQM said:


> i think J. Carol needs to cork her bottle.


Hahaha .... your are too darn funny. I'll cork my bottle if you corks yours. We can sit down together and have an interesting talk about where in world is this place taking all of us. We could have some fun. Some serious talk and some light hearted laughs ........


----------



## susanmos2000

J.Carol said:


> Hahaha .... your are too darn funny. I'll cork my bottle if you corks yours. We can sit down together and have an interesting talk about where in world is this place taking all of us. We could have some fun. Some serious talk and some light hearted laughs ........


You seem sincere, J.Carol, so I withdraw (and apologize) for my remark about the tavern. But can you give us a few more details about what we should be researching? Where in the world do YOU think this place is taking us? (What's "this place". Who's "us"?)


----------



## SQM

J.Carol said:


> Hahaha .... your are too darn funny. I'll cork my bottle if you corks yours. We can sit down together and have an interesting talk about where in world is this place taking all of us. We could have some fun. Some serious talk and some light hearted laughs ........


Actually I would not mind that since I am moving back to Chicago after a lot of decades. I am a northsider. What about you?


----------



## Huckleberry

DGreen said:


> Conspiracy theorists would be better off smoking something. As it is, they believe that crap straight and sober.
> 
> I find that sobering.


DGreen
I'll drink to that. 
I did go to a Tea Party meeting tonight dressed like a hooker so to for sure get attention among these Holy Rollers. Some attendees where terribly uncomfortable about my presence. Makes one wonder, doesn't it. I told them that I am ready to make changes in my Life and boy they were eager to convert me. They were hanging onto me like flies to Horse poop. They are really in a recruiting mood and I got the feeling it wasn't just to add a voter to the GOP list.
Will go as someone's Grandma to another gathering next time. My theatrical training is coming in handy.


----------



## MommaJody

DGreen said:


> Glad to know you were part of the investigation and didn't just get your information from YouTube. :roll: :roll: :roll: :roll:
> 
> From Wikipedia:
> 
> There have been three official investigations into Foster's death, all of which concluded that he committed suicide.
> 
> The first was by the United States Park Police in 1993, in whose jurisdiction the original investigation fell. Due to Foster's position in the White House, the Federal Bureau of Investigation assisted in the investigation. Investigations by a coroner and Independent Counsel
> 
> Robert B. Fiske, in a 58-page report released in 1994, also concluded that Foster had committed suicide. Theories of a cover-up still persisted, some of which were promulgated by the Arkansas Project. After a three-year investigation, Whitewater independent counsel Ken Starr released a report in 1997 also concluding that the death was a suicide. In addition, two investigations by the U.S. Congress found that Foster committed suicide.


Yeah and we know how truthful those investigations are don't we when it involves someone in the white house? After all, some people still believe that Lee Harvey Oswald killed Kennedy all by himself.


----------



## Huckleberry

MommaJody said:


> Yeah and we know how truthful those investigations are don't we when it involves someone in the white house? After all, some people still believe that Lee Harvey Oswald killed Kennedy all by himself.


MommaJody
you are easy to entertain, aren't you.


----------



## MommaJody

Designer1234 said:


> awards are given for accomplishments.


Really? Like the honorary doctorate that was given to Bill Cosby, which could have been listed as an award or accomplishment for Bill Cosby right?Yet it didn't take long at all for that honorary doctorate to be taken away when he was accused of sexual misconduct. Heck, they didn't even wait until it went to trial and him to be found guilty before taking that honorary doctorate away. Let's see. How many of Hillary's award and accomplishments would be taken away if something as serious, maybe not sexual misconduct, but something else as serious was brought to the attention of the American public and spread across the news like Bill Cosby.


----------



## MommaJody

Huckleberry said:


> MommaJody
> you are easy to entertain, aren't you.


Of course I am. After all, I keep reading ill informed information from you.


----------



## yorkie1

Grandma Jo said:


> I am just wondering how a group of nice ladies that are willing to help others with knitting problems can do such a complete turnabout when it comes to politics. In 84 pages, do you really think you have changed anyone mind. I don't think so. Fight on and have a blast. I am leaving this for good, I am sick and tired of it.


 :thumbup: :thumbup: :thumbup: :thumbup: :thumbup: :thumbup: :thumbup: :thumbup: :thumbup:


----------



## susanmos2000

MommaJody said:


> Really? Like the honorary doctorate that was given to Bill Cosby, which could have been listed as an award or accomplishment for Bill Cosby right?Yet it didn't take long at all for that honorary doctorate to be taken away when he was accused of sexual misconduct. Heck, they didn't even wait until it went to trial and him to be found guilty before taking that honorary doctorate away. Let's see. How many of Hillary's award and accomplishments would be taken away if something as serious, maybe not sexual misconduct, but something else as serious was brought to the attention of the American public and spread across the news like Bill Cosby.


Well, what in heavens name could be worth so much media ink? Candidates running for President are vetted thoroughly, and you can bet their opponents and the media leave no stone in their search for something juicy. The election is seventeen months away--plenty of time to unearth affairs, illegitimate children, unpaid parking tickets, or whatever.


----------



## SQM

susanmos2000 said:


> Well, what in heavens name could be worth so much media ink? Candidates running for President are vetted thoroughly, and you can bet their opponents and the media leave no stone in their search for something juicy. The election is seventeen months away--plenty of time to unearth affairs, illegitimate children, unpaid parking tickets, or whatever.


Whatever? Would picking their noses disqualify them?


----------



## GR. Gram

Thank you for that truism, but this discussion is good to get folks minds working, looking, thinking. Every daY WE CAn pick up the lie, a truth, and evasion of truth by omission. I WONDER IF THE NEXT PRESIDENT WILL BE SO ''SLOW'' AS TO NEED HIS TelePrompTer CARTED Around for his speeches. 
Wouldn't it have been grand IF B.O. had done things differently, and brought our country to greatness. OH, what a feather in our caps that would hAVE BEEN. Also I had hoped that the !st lady would have Taken up the plight of the young black girls,their health issues, pregnancy, and how to do more than survive on welfare. but then welfare IS THE DEMOCRATS KEY VOTER, SO WHY HELP THEM IMPROVE THEIR LIVES.SOOO SADDD !


----------



## susanmos2000

GR. Gram said:


> Thank you for that truism, but this discussion is good to get folks minds working, looking, thinking. Every daY WE CAn pick up the lie, a truth, and evasion of truth by omission. I WONDER IF THE NEXT PRESIDENT WILL BE SO ''SLOW'' AS TO NEED HIS TelePrompTer CARTED Around for his speeches.
> Wouldn't it have been grand IF B.O. had done things differently, and brought our country to greatness. OH, what a feather in our caps that would hAVE BEEN. Also I had hoped that the !st lady would have Taken up the plight of the young black girls,their health issues, pregnancy, and how to do more than survive on welfare. but then welfare IS THE DEMOCRATS KEY VOTER, SO WHY HELP THEM IMPROVE THEIR LIVES.SOOO SADDD !


Well, maybe your mental anguish will register in President Obama's consciousness, and he'll improve in the next twenty months or so. 
:roll:


----------



## MommaJody

ute4kp said:


> Romney lost. He has tons of money.


Did he really lose or did Hurricane Sandy come at a convenient time to change the way of voting? It's awful funny that Romney was way ahead until they decided to let anyone that said they were registered to vote, to use a computer to vote without the usual proof of registration. If they were going to make exceptions to the rule, why not let the registered voters vote at a later date? After all, an exception is an exception.


----------



## MommaJody

DGreen said:


> Unmitigated garbage. AND hinting at a Kennedy conspiracy theory to boot.


Gargbage? Go check the facts. The Federal Reserve is NOT a government entity.


----------



## sumpleby

MommaJody said:


> Really? Like the honorary doctorate that was given to Bill Cosby, which could have been listed as an award or accomplishment for Bill Cosby right?Yet it didn't take long at all for that honorary doctorate to be taken away when he was accused of sexual misconduct. Heck, they didn't even wait until it went to trial and him to be found guilty before taking that honorary doctorate away. Let's see. How many of Hillary's award and accomplishments would be taken away if something as serious, maybe not sexual misconduct, but something else as serious was brought to the attention of the American public and spread across the news like Bill Cosby.


The Nobel Peace Prize is not an "honorary degree."


----------



## susanmos2000

MommaJody said:


> Did he really lose or did Hurricane Sandy come at a convenient time to change the way of voting? It's awful funny that Romney was way ahead until they decided to let anyone that said they were registered to vote, to use a computer to vote without the usual proof of registration. If they were going to make exceptions to the rule, why not let the registered voters vote at a later date? After all, an exception is an exception.


Give me a break. Obama won by an Electoral College margin of 332/206. New York and New Jersey--the only two states knocked offline--were worth a total of 43 Electoral votes. Even if he'd lost in both those states the election would have turned out the same.


----------



## MommaJody

sumpleby said:


> The Nobel Peace Prize is not an "honorary degree."


Okay, it is not an honorary degree. So, what was Obama supposed to have done during a short three months in office, that warranted him receiving The Nobel Peace Prize over all the other people in the world that had been working toward peace for years? What special act did he specifically do in that short of time to warrant the award? Again, it is another case of being the golden boy/girl of the behind the scenes financial backers.


----------



## susanmos2000

I see you're from Texas, Mama Jody. Somehow I'm not surprised. Listening to you rant about how President Obama stole the election, the Nobel Peace etc is as painful as listening to those Southerners who still insist that the Confederacy triumphed.


----------



## ute4kp

MommaJody said:


> Did he really lose or did Hurricane Sandy come at a convenient time to change the way of voting? It's awful funny that Romney was way ahead until they decided to let anyone that said they were registered to vote, to use a computer to vote without the usual proof of registration. If they were going to make exceptions to the rule, why not let the registered voters vote at a later date? After all, an exception is an exception.


I replied to a question that only the rich become President. Your message is not relevant.


----------



## mojave

MommaJody said:


> Okay, it is not an honorary degree. So, what was Obama supposed to have done during a short three months in office, that warranted him receiving The Nobel Peace Prize over all the other people in the world that had been working toward peace for years? What special act did he specifically do in that short of time to warrant the award? Again, it is another case of being the golden boy/girl of the behind the scenes financial backers.


Copied directly from the Nobel Prize website

Your Majesties, Mr. President and Nobel Peace Prize Laureate, Your Royal Highnesses, Excellencies, ladies and gentlemen,

On the 9th of October this year, the Norwegian Nobel Committee announced that the Nobel Peace Prize for 2009 was to be awarded to President Barack H. Obama "for his extraordinary efforts to strengthen international diplomacy and cooperation between peoples. The Committee has attached special importance to Obama's vision of and work for a world free from nuclear weapons".

The rest of the lengthy speech can be found at the link given below. Please take the time to read it. 
http://www.nobelprize.org/nobel_prizes/peace/laureates/2009/presentation-speech.html


----------



## Wombatnomore

Cheeky Blighter said:


> Wombat you could give the righties lessons in American politics. :thumbup:


Cheeky, they'd love that now wouldn't they? :mrgreen:


----------



## Wombatnomore

SQM said:


> Wombat is an Americaphile. She was born on the wrong continent. She is wonderfully informed. How many of us can discuss Australia? EvieeeeM - you do not count in this tally.


Dear Sloth, I'd love to live in the States! It's a great country and I could visit you all often. :-D


----------



## Wombatnomore

SQM said:


> Big man in the sky? Is that Trump in a penthouse?


 :XD: :XD: :XD: :XD: :XD:


----------



## BrattyPatty

MommaJody said:


> Did he really lose or did Hurricane Sandy come at a convenient time to change the way of voting? It's awful funny that Romney was way ahead until they decided to let anyone that said they were registered to vote, to use a computer to vote without the usual proof of registration. If they were going to make exceptions to the rule, why not let the registered voters vote at a later date? After all, an exception is an exception.


 :XD: :XD: :XD: :XD: :XD: :XD: 
Romney lost because more people voted for President Obama.
He hung himself with his 47% comment.


----------



## Wombatnomore

SQM said:


> i think J. Carol needs to cork her bottle.


Or wrap herself up in that box she's talking about.


----------



## BrattyPatty

Wombatnomore said:


> :XD: :XD: :XD: :XD: :XD:


big man in the sky.....
Possibly the guy who captains the mother ship?


----------



## Wombatnomore

DGreen said:


> Long post, but wonderful take on Hillary's campaign. From The Daly Kos (and yes, unapologetically liberal):
> 
> The ad is also overwhelmingly positive so the contrast between Clintons positive message and the Republican response will be immediate and glaring. Part of the handicap Republicans are faced with is they have no positions to run on. Gutting Social Security and Medicare isnt much of a platform and the public is finally catching on, after only 40 years, that supply side economics is a sham and tax breaks for billionaires dont buy us anything. Bombing Iran is not going to play well next to that ad.
> 
> Since they dont have any issues to run on, the billionaires club that the GOP has become will almost certainly go negative in a big way. They cant help themselves and dont have a lot of options in either respect.
> 
> The smart response would be for Republicans to ignore Clinton altogether. Acknowledge shes in the race and go back to their business. That would be smart, so theres no real threat Republicans will do that. Theyll stick their head in the noose and climb over the rail because that's who they've become.
> 
> Whether you like Clinton or not your choices in this election are not going to be between competing policy ideas. *Your choice in the 2016 race is going to be between crazy and not crazy. You can vote for the nice lady in the Clinton ad or the nutcase behind Door Number 2. For the overwhelming majority of Americans that choice is going to be a no brainer.*
> 
> (My addition of bold type)


It amuses me no end Green how the republican 'attack ad' distorts Mrs. Clinton's face no doubt in an attempt to make their ramshackle voice-over sound more 'scary.'


----------



## Huckleberry

MommaJody said:


> Did he really lose or did Hurricane Sandy come at a convenient time to change the way of voting? It's awful funny that Romney was way ahead until they decided to let anyone that said they were registered to vote, to use a computer to vote without the usual proof of registration. If they were going to make exceptions to the rule, why not let the registered voters vote at a later date? After all, an exception is an exception.


MommaJody
he won and won honestly. Reality my dear.


----------



## Wombatnomore

mojave said:


> Perhaps it is a sense of caution derived from years of science training, however, it seems a bit early to engage in such loud crowing. There are many months yet before the final showdown in November 2016. Wild cards in the form of natural and/or economic catastrophes, unexpected demise of candidates or financial backers, political upheavals in other parts of the world all have potential to induce significant change in voter choices.


That's true but it would be good to see at least one candidate stay the course of the campaign calmly and intelligently, assisting voters to make sense of whatever challenges may emerge.


----------



## Wombatnomore

DGreen said:


> You are spot on, Mojave. However, I feel confident that the republicans will not be able to field a candidate that can appeal to moderates AND the Tea Party at the same time. This divide will open the door for us liberals. The republican party has devolved into a looney bin, full of Christian extremists gun ammoholics and haters. If they reform themselves between now and then, I'll be profoundly surprised. In the meantime, I'm working hard to identify and register every Democrat I can find in my district, as well as raise funds to assist our cause in Arizona. It's an uphill battle.


You're doing such good work Green. You walk the walk.


----------



## BrattyPatty

joeysomma said:


> Maybe you your actually read about the founding of our country and the reason for the Electoral College before you make such stupid remarks.


Nothing stops you from making stupid remarks. Why pick on others?


----------



## Wombatnomore

Huckleberry said:


> DGreen
> I'll drink to that.
> I did go to a Tea Party meeting tonight dressed like a hooker so to for sure get attention among these Holy Rollers. Some attendees where terribly uncomfortable about my presence. Makes one wonder, doesn't it. I told them that I am ready to make changes in my Life and boy they were eager to convert me. They were hanging onto me like flies to Horse poop. They are really in a recruiting mood and I got the feeling it wasn't just to add a voter to the GOP list.
> Will go as someone's Grandma to another gathering next time. My theatrical training is coming in handy.


A tastefully dressed hooker I'm sure Huckleberry!


----------



## MommaJody

susanmos2000 said:


> I see you're from Texas, Mama Jody. Somehow I'm not surprised. Listening to you rant about how President Obama stole the election, the Nobel Peace etc is as painful as listening to those Southerners who still insist that the Confederacy triumphed.


No, I don't think the South triumphed; However, if we had, maybe we would have smarter people up North than we do now. Heck, the North still thinks that the war was about slavery, when in actuality it was about the states having the right to make their own laws for their state instead of the Federal government telling them what to do. And if it is so painful for you, please by all means feel free to not participate in this discussion anymore. It is still a free country at the present time. Don't know if that will last for long after Hillary gets in office.


----------



## Wombatnomore

MommaJody said:


> Gargbage? Go check the facts. The Federal Reserve is NOT a government entity.


You check the facts. You tell everyone else to.


----------



## Wombatnomore

MommaJody said:


> Okay, it is not an honorary degree. So, what was Obama supposed to have done during a short three months in office, that warranted him receiving The Nobel Peace Prize over all the other people in the world that had been working toward peace for years? What special act did he specifically do in that short of time to warrant the award? Again, it is another case of being the golden boy/girl of the behind the scenes financial backers.


Why don't you research that for yourself?


----------



## susanmos2000

MommaJody said:


> No, I don't think the South triumphed; However, if we had, maybe we would have smarter people up North than we do now. Heck, the North still thinks that the war was about slavery, when in actuality it was about the states having the right to make their own laws for their state instead of the Federal government telling them what to do. And if it is so painful for you, please by all means feel free to not participate in this discussion anymore. It is still a free country at the present time. Don't know if that will last for long after Hillary gets in office.


It should be self-evident that any state or states that view their fellow Americans as property needs to be told what to do--they obviously can't tell right from wrong.


----------



## BrattyPatty

susanmos2000 said:


> It should be self-evident that any state or states that view their fellow Americans as property needs to be told what to do--they obviously can't tell right from wrong.


 :thumbup: :thumbup: :thumbup: :thumbup:


----------



## ute4kp

susanmos2000 said:


> It should be self-evident that any state or states that view their fellow Americans as property needs to be told what to do--they obviously can't tell right from wrong.


 :thumbup: :thumbup: :thumbup: :thumbup: :thumbup: :thumbup: :thumbup: :thumbup: :thumbup:


----------



## MommaJody

susanmos2000 said:


> It should be self-evident that any state or states that view their fellow Americans as property needs to be told what to do--they obviously can't tell right from wrong.


Then why did the Northern states feel in the beginning that they had the right to view "fellow Americans?" or should you say the Poor Irish (indentured survents, that were treated as slaves) the African race.(who were sold to the Americans from being captured not only by slave traders, but also by other African tribes) and other races, who, were not Americans at the time? When did they reach the the devine point that they should be allowed to rule what the rest of the country did or didn't do, that only they knew right from wrong? Did someone finally get a conscience or did they do then what you are trying to do now? Only instead of deciding you are right and we are wrong, you are choosing a particular candidate and then trying to shove your belief down everyone else's throat. And if they don't agree with you, instead of having a friendly discussion, resort to name calling, stating that if the person doesn't agree with you that they are stupid, uninformed, and ignorant. And now, you go even lower trying to intimidate someone because of the state they live in not even knowing one thing about that person. You don't know where they have lived all their life, what type of education, how informed they are or not. All you see is that they don't agree with your "gang" and therefore there must be something wrong with them. It must be nice sitting up there on top of your throne believing your views are the one true belief and anyone that doesn't agree is beneath you. Me, myself, I feel sorry for people like you that feel that you need to try to bully or demean someone because they don't believe everything you spout out. Oh well, some of us have working brains and actually use them in order to make our own conclusions of the facts instead of having someone like you to force your beliefs down our throat.


----------



## BrattyPatty

MommaJody said:


> Then why did the Northern states feel in the beginning that they had the right to view "fellow Americans?" or should you say the Poor Irish (indentured survents, that were treated as slaves) the African race.(who were sold to the Americans from being captured not only by slave traders, but also by other African tribes) and other races, who, were not Americans at the time? When did they reach the the devine point that they should be allowed to rule what the rest of the country did or didn't do, that only they knew right from wrong? Did someone finally get a conscience or did they do then what you are trying to do now? Only instead of deciding you are right and we are wrong, you are choosing a particular candidate and then trying to shove your belief down everyone else's throat. And if they don't agree with you, instead of having a friendly discussion, resort to name calling, stating that if the person doesn't agree with you that they are stupid, uninformed, and ignorant. And now, you go even lower trying to intimidate someone because of the state they live in not even knowing one thing about that person. You don't know where they have lived all their life, what type of education, how informed they are or not. All you see is that they don't agree with your "gang" and therefore there must be something wrong with them. It must be nice sitting up there on top of your throne believing your views are the one true belief and anyone that doesn't agree is beneath you. Me, myself, I feel sorry for people like you that feel that you need to try to bully or demean someone because they don't believe everything you spout out. Oh well, some of us have working brains and actually use them in order to make our own conclusions of the facts instead of having someone like you to force your beliefs down our throat.


The poor Irish were indentured to pay off the debt of their passage over to America. They worked the cost of the passage off and if they wanted to stay in service, the people that they worked for paid them. In many circumstances the indentured's children were put in boarding schools at the expense of the employer.
As for the rest, you chose to post in here and as I have read, your posts were not so friendly either. I will say the same for myself.
Political topics get heated. Those anti Hillary posters have been just as vocal and gang like, too. It's what happens in heated topics.


----------



## damemary

Concise and eloquent. Thank you.



DGreen said:


> Taking it upon ones self to scold others for posting on an open forum is not only rude, but arrogant. That person was complaining that she didn't like the discussion - solution: leave.


 :thumbup: :thumbup: :thumbup:


----------



## damemary

sumpleby said:


> Sorry, you can say this until the cows come home, but the video of the press conference the next day shows that the president did call it a terror attack.
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> "No acts of terror will ever shake the resolve of this great nation..."


This quote is taken out of context, but, it could be argued that the President said 'no act of terror will shake resolve' but not that the particular act was proven to be terrorism right away.


----------



## damemary

Crochet dreamin' said:


> Prove it.


Electing the GOP would prove it, but I'd rather not. There's lots of 'proof' out there. I'm not inclined to do your homework for you.


----------



## damemary

Are you claiming it's better to have a bunch of candidates who are largely unqualified and unfit to serve? Interesting way the GOP has of shooting itself in the foot. Go to it. I'm enjoying this.



soloweygirl said:


> It's hard to accomplish when you are the only candidate running from your party.
> 
> Hey, that could be one of Hillary's accomplishments.


----------



## damemary

ute4kp said:


> Foxies are in a tizzy because they've already lost the election. The way they cope is to spew hate soup as in the Exorcist.


 :XD: :XD: :XD: :XD: I think they miss Karl Rove. At least he had a plan. Sneaky, but a plan.


----------



## damemary

Many accomplishments for Hillary Clinton are included in this thread, titled "Hillary Clinton." If you were truly interested, you could read it there. Otherwise, please refrain from posting anything. Thank you. God bless.



lovethelake said:


> What are her accomplishments?


----------



## damemary

Wisdom from Canada. Thank you very much.



lins said:


> Holy cow...your country, and the world, was in the tank when Obama took over. What do you think he is, is a magician?
> 
> It took Bush 8 years to nearly ruin the 'thriving' country and you expect Obama to fix it yesterday?
> 
> Concidering he has got this far, while having to fight the Republicans all the way, who did nothing to help and as a matter of fact made every effort to stop him from improving the country, I would say BRAVO.
> 
> The hoodwinked and uninformed people would believe it's Obama's fault rather than the Republicans.
> What do the Republicans offer? Tell me what they offer, the average person.
> I would like to know.
> 
> Hilary, like Obama, want to move the country forward...not back.
> She may have half of a chance because she is white.


 :thumbup: :thumbup: :thumbup: :thumbup: :thumbup: :thumbup:


----------



## damemary

An intelligent, clever remark. (from the French.)



ute4kp said:


> What is bon mot?


----------



## damemary

ummirain said:


> Re:they are all Communists.
> Last I heard not working too well in China,as Capitalism barged in.
> Cubs wants our tourist $$.
> Still alive in North Korea,tho.
> The young may change that in the decades to come.
> They spy on their citizens.
> Oh,wait....sort of like the republican's Patriot Act? Hmmm
> Now which party is closer to opression of the masses ?
> Instead of hating...think.


 :thumbup:


----------



## damemary

ute4kp said:


> Stop mud slinging other people just because of their nationality. Not good.


I give them 'credit.' Zings directed at international comments are the only GOP comments that don't directly offend voters.

Let's see. Women. Blacks. All minorities. LGRT. Anyone who thinks. Now, don't we all feel better?


----------



## damemary

lins said:


> It's called gerrymandering and voter suppression.


 :thumbup: :thumbup: :thumbup:


----------



## damemary

ute4kp said:


> Good! Go back.


 :thumbup: :thumbup: :thumbup: :thumbup: :thumbup: :thumbup: :thumbup: That would make my day. Perhaps she could charter a bus and take her merry band along.


----------



## damemary

<<<whispering...shhhhh we'll wake her.>>>>>>>



ute4kp said:


> Huh???


----------



## damemary

FYI Hitler's dead.



lfitzie said:


> I'd vote for Adolph Hitler before I'd vote for Hillary or the pretend indian, Elizabeth Warren and I'm from Massachusetts. We cannot take four more years of Saul Alinsky socialism/marxism. We are going down the tubes. We need someone who cares about our sinking country and will work for the taxpayers struggling to keep us afloat.


----------



## damemary

Wombatnomore said:


> I'm not referring to anything you're suggesting. Everything you've said above is purely speculative and very spiteful. If you're going to discuss the various candidates for the presidency, try a little humility and control yourself.


That eliminates all comments from that area. * humility and control yourself* indeed.


----------



## damemary

ute4kp said:


> The forensic body watcher has spoken.


And where are the body *snatchers* when you need them?


----------



## damemary

ute4kp said:


> Probably all your emails.


 :XD: :XD: :XD: :XD: Atta girl!


----------



## damemary

ute4kp said:


> The Norwegian Nobel Committee is responsible for the selection of eligible candidates and the choice of the Nobel Peace Prize Laureates. The Committee is composed of five members appointed by the Storting (Norwegian parliament).
> 
> Ask them and post the reply here.


 :XD: :XD: :XD: :XD: :XD:


----------



## damemary

ute4kp said:


> Whaaaaatttttt !!!!!! OMG!!!!!!!!!
> How can you promote a nazi??????? Adolf.....really??????


At least it's a dead Nazi? Just when you think it's safe.......


----------



## damemary

lins said:


> GOP Congresswoman from Wasington State, Kathy McMorris Rodgers, tried to get people to post negtive things about the ACA and was surprised to say the least. Her Facebook page went viral.
> 
> http://www.dailykos.com/story/2015/03/26/1373436/-Republican-Congresswoman-gets-surprise-on-Facebook-after-asking-constituents-for-ACA-horror-stories


 :thumbup: :thumbup: :thumbup: :thumbup: :thumbup:


----------



## damemary

Wombatnomore said:


> Is that so? Interesting that you make such assumptions based on absolutely nothing. I'm more informed than you'll ever be.


 :thumbup: :thumbup: :thumbup: :thumbup: :thumbup:


----------



## damemary

Dream on.



Moe C said:


> Well, it's obvious after all this hair-pulling and eye-gouging that women are not fit for high office.


----------



## damemary

Give him a few days and his hat will be flat.



SQM said:


> Should we start a new thread on the guy ( I am blocking his name) who threw in his hat today? Rubio. I unfortunately remembered.


----------



## damemary

Cheeky Blighter said:


> You are only embarrassing yourself now dear. You need to come up with something else besides Benghazi.


 :XD: :XD: :XD: It didn't work the first time, or the second, or the third etc. Please try something else. Or not. You aren't making points.

(I hate to try to help solo but I *almost* feel sorry for her. *I'm over it.*)


----------



## damemary

You just want to play. Let's have a piece of chocolate instead.



SQM said:


> If she discusses aliens and motherships, I am in with her.


----------



## damemary

I saw that. Good analysis.



DGreen said:


> Long post, but wonderful take on Hillary's campaign. From The Daly Kos (and yes, unapologetically liberal):
> 
> The ad is also overwhelmingly positive so the contrast between Clintons positive message and the Republican response will be immediate and glaring. Part of the handicap Republicans are faced with is they have no positions to run on. Gutting Social Security and Medicare isnt much of a platform and the public is finally catching on, after only 40 years, that supply side economics is a sham and tax breaks for billionaires dont buy us anything. Bombing Iran is not going to play well next to that ad.
> 
> Since they dont have any issues to run on, the billionaires club that the GOP has become will almost certainly go negative in a big way. They cant help themselves and dont have a lot of options in either respect.
> 
> The smart response would be for Republicans to ignore Clinton altogether. Acknowledge shes in the race and go back to their business. That would be smart, so theres no real threat Republicans will do that. Theyll stick their head in the noose and climb over the rail because that's who they've become.
> 
> Whether you like Clinton or not your choices in this election are not going to be between competing policy ideas. *Your choice in the 2016 race is going to be between crazy and not crazy. You can vote for the nice lady in the Clinton ad or the nutcase behind Door Number 2. For the overwhelming majority of Americans that choice is going to be a no brainer.*
> 
> (My addition of bold type)


----------



## damemary

DGreen said:


> You are spot on, Mojave. However, I feel confident that the republicans will not be able to field a candidate that can appeal to moderates AND the Tea Party at the same time. This divide will open the door for us liberals. The republican party has devolved into a looney bin, full of Christian extremists gun ammoholics and haters. If they reform themselves between now and then, I'll be profoundly surprised. In the meantime, I'm working hard to identify and register every Democrat I can find in my district, as well as raise funds to assist our cause in Arizona. It's an uphill battle.


But it's the way to win. Registration and support is the way to win. So proud of your hard work.


----------



## damemary

DGreen said:


> Conspiracy theorists would be better off smoking something. As it is, they believe that crap straight and sober.
> 
> I find that sobering.


 :XD: :XD: :XD:


----------



## damemary

Huckleberry said:


> DGreen
> I'll drink to that.
> I did go to a Tea Party meeting tonight dressed like a hooker so to for sure get attention among these Holy Rollers. Some attendees where terribly uncomfortable about my presence. Makes one wonder, doesn't it. I told them that I am ready to make changes in my Life and boy they were eager to convert me. They were hanging onto me like flies to Horse poop. They are really in a recruiting mood and I got the feeling it wasn't just to add a voter to the GOP list.
> Will go as someone's Grandma to another gathering next time. My theatrical training is coming in handy.


 :XD: :XD: :XD: :XD: :XD: :XD: :XD: :XD: I'd love to see you and DGreen working a crowd.


----------



## damemary

Ah. The old JFK conspiracy theory. Haven't heard that one for a while. I guess it's all they got.



MommaJody said:


> Yeah and we know how truthful those investigations are don't we when it involves someone in the white house? After all, some people still believe that Lee Harvey Oswald killed Kennedy all by himself.


----------



## damemary

susanmos2000 said:


> Well, what in heavens name could be worth so much media ink? Candidates running for President are vetted thoroughly, and you can bet their opponents and the media leave no stone in their search for something juicy. The election is seventeen months away--plenty of time to unearth affairs, illegitimate children, unpaid parking tickets, or whatever.


 :XD: :XD: :XD: :XD: Especially for someone who's been in the public eye for so long. But it will help the fiction writers out there. But the little GOP boy has cried 'wolf' so often...... :XD: :XD: :XD:


----------



## damemary

Does this mean God wanted Romney to lose so He sent Hurricane Sandy? I'm trying to follow.



MommaJody said:


> Did he really lose or did Hurricane Sandy come at a convenient time to change the way of voting? It's awful funny that Romney was way ahead until they decided to let anyone that said they were registered to vote, to use a computer to vote without the usual proof of registration. If they were going to make exceptions to the rule, why not let the registered voters vote at a later date? After all, an exception is an exception.


----------



## damemary

sumpleby said:


> The Nobel Peace Prize is not an "honorary degree."


 :thumbup: :thumbup: :thumbup:


----------



## sumpleby

damemary said:


> This quote is taken out of context, but, it could be argued that the President said 'no act of terror will shake resolve' but not that the particular act was proven to be terrorism right away.


Sorry, no, it wasn't taken out of context. Listen to the press conference.


----------



## damemary

I meant a few words were written here, out of context of the entire discussion. I only mentioned 'it could be argued.'



sumpleby said:


> Sorry, no, it wasn't taken out of context. Listen to the press conference.


----------



## GR. Gram

While we are blaming B> O., remember it is the woman behind the man, and it is not Michelle, but VALERIE.pulling his strings, ands now that he has OUR WH FULL OF HIS MUSLIM BROTHERS, it will be interesting to see the next 2 years.
Every advisor, and any one close helping with decisions is a muslim.check it out.Don't you just love having a foreigner of president. And why has he spent over a MILLION $ to HIDE his past? HUUMMMM? Is he hiding his sex capades, his birth place, his paid government foreign student grants, hiss stolen SS number? These questions have not been answered and stupid people still voted for him, you check more when you buy a gallon of milk than you did for president. Dems will vote for any thing if the big boys in washington say so. Shane on them all. God Bless America.


----------



## DGreen

Huckleberry said:


> DGreen
> I'll drink to that.
> I did go to a Tea Party meeting tonight dressed like a hooker so to for sure get attention among these Holy Rollers. Some attendees where terribly uncomfortable about my presence. Makes one wonder, doesn't it. I told them that I am ready to make changes in my Life and boy they were eager to convert me. They were hanging onto me like flies to Horse poop. They are really in a recruiting mood and I got the feeling it wasn't just to add a voter to the GOP list.
> Will go as someone's Grandma to another gathering next time. My theatrical training is coming in handy.


Huck, you have way more nerve than I do! That's hilarious.


----------



## DGreen

Wombatnomore said:


> You're doing such good work Green. You walk the walk.


Thanks, Wombat. It's going to take a lot of work to offset the influence of Citizens United. The big money interests can throw lots of money into buying elections - all we have here in my little town is "boots on the ground." I'm so thankful I am retired and have the time to try to make a difference.


----------



## DGreen

GR. Gram said:


> Thank you for that truism, but this discussion is good to get folks minds working, looking, thinking. Every daY WE CAn pick up the lie, a truth, and evasion of truth by omission. I WONDER IF THE NEXT PRESIDENT WILL BE SO ''SLOW'' AS TO NEED HIS TelePrompTer CARTED Around for his speeches.
> Wouldn't it have been grand IF B.O. had done things differently, and brought our country to greatness. OH, what a feather in our caps that would hAVE BEEN. Also I had hoped that the !st lady would have Taken up the plight of the young black girls,their health issues, pregnancy, and how to do more than survive on welfare. but then welfare IS THE DEMOCRATS KEY VOTER, SO WHY HELP THEM IMPROVE THEIR LIVES.SOOO SADDD !


No doubt you are keen on looking hard for lies, omissions and errors. As for the teleprompter, you need to drag yourself into reality. They ALL use teleprompters and only an idiot thinks otherwise.

If Michelle had focused only on the challenges of black girls and women, you would accuse her of being racist. There's no pleasing you haters.


----------



## DGreen

MommaJody said:


> Gargbage? Go check the facts. The Federal Reserve is NOT a government entity.


Garbage? Yes. Go back and read your own post.


----------



## LindaLu

She scares me.


----------



## DGreen

MommaJody said:


> No, I don't think the South triumphed; However, if we had, maybe we would have smarter people up North than we do now. Heck, the North still thinks that the war was about slavery, when in actuality it was about the states having the right to make their own laws for their state instead of the Federal government telling them what to do. And if it is so painful for you, please by all means feel free to not participate in this discussion anymore. It is still a free country at the present time. Don't know if that will last for long after Hillary gets in office.


How about you drag yourself into the current era, where TODAY the southern states are the poorest in the country, are the least educated, and use the most government assistance, all the while digging themselves deeper into ignorance and poverty because of their extreme politics.


----------



## DGreen

GR. Gram said:


> While we are blaming B> O., remember it is the woman behind the man, and it is not Michelle, but VALERIE.pulling his strings, ands now that he has OUR WH FULL OF HIS MUSLIM BROTHERS, it will be interesting to see the next 2 years.
> Every advisor, and any one close helping with decisions is a muslim.check it out.Don't you just love having a foreigner of president. And why has he spent over a MILLION $ to HIDE his past? HUUMMMM? Is he hiding his sex capades, his birth place, his paid government foreign student grants, hiss stolen SS number? These questions have not been answered and stupid people still voted for him, you check more when you buy a gallon of milk than you did for president. Dems will vote for any thing if the big boys in washington say so. Shane on them all. God Bless America.


You reveal yourself as a true tea party "patriot" and conspiracy theory believer, GR. We've heard all your nonsense and it's all been refuted over and over - but believe what you wish.


----------



## damemary

Bigotry.



GR. Gram said:


> While we are blaming B> O., remember it is the woman behind the man, and it is not Michelle, but VALERIE.pulling his strings, ands now that he has OUR WH FULL OF HIS MUSLIM BROTHERS, it will be interesting to see the next 2 years.
> Every advisor, and any one close helping with decisions is a muslim.check it out.Don't you just love having a foreigner of president. And why has he spent over a MILLION $ to HIDE his past? HUUMMMM? Is he hiding his sex capades, his birth place, his paid government foreign student grants, hiss stolen SS number? These questions have not been answered and stupid people still voted for him, you check more when you buy a gallon of milk than you did for president. Dems will vote for any thing if the big boys in washington say so. Shane on them all. God Bless America.


----------



## damemary

IMHO, no one has more nerve than Huck.



DGreen said:


> Huck, you have way more nerve than I do! That's hilarious.


----------



## damemary

DGreen said:


> How about you drag yourself into the current era, where TODAY the southern states are the poorest in the country, are the least educated, and use the most government assistance, all the while digging themselves deeper into ignorance and poverty because of their extreme politics.


 :thumbup: :thumbup: :thumbup:


----------



## DGreen

damemary said:


> Bigotry.


The "God bless America" part is very revealing. My guess is that if one scratches the surface of GM her religious beliefs will also be shown to be of the more extreme type. Give her time, though, she'll no doubt do that herself. I've observed that people who believe that the bible is the literal truth also are prone to believing other outrageous things. They can't be swayed or reasoned with.


----------



## Silverfox70

The bible says the Christians will persecuted in the end every knee will bow!!!


----------



## damemary

Really? I had no idea. (Sarcasm alert.)



Silverfox70 said:


> The bible says the Christians will persecuted in the end every knee will bow!!!


----------



## Silverfox70

Just stateing the facts


----------



## DGreen

Silverfox70 said:


> Just stateing the facts


Facts to you are myths to others. Like the myth of Christian persecution.


----------



## Silverfox70

I am through just like the lord you can believe what you want as far I am concerned


----------



## DGreen

Silverfox70 said:


> I am through just like the lord you can believe what you want as far I am concerned


You are through jus like the lord? What does that mean?


----------



## damemary

DGreen said:


> Facts to you are myths to others. Like the myth of Christian persecution.


 :XD: :XD: :XD:


----------



## Silverfox70

you can have your regilious so humanists or unbelieve he will keep knocking but not forever you will have hardened heart and their is not way anyone can change that


----------



## lins

Silverfox70 said:


> Yes!!! The lord will come back and every wil bow


???????


----------



## Silverfox70

Knee will bow


----------



## lins

Silverfox70 said:


> The bible says the Christians will persecuted in the end every knee will bow!!!


??????


----------



## damemary

Do you really want to hear? Tell me after you translate the reply. This one will answer anything. It won't make any sense of course. IMHO I might even apologize to those offended, and applaud those who understand.



DGreen said:


> You are through jus like the lord? What does that mean?


----------



## DGreen

Silverfox70 said:


> you can have your regilious so humanists or unbelieve he will keep knocking but not forever you will have hardened heart and their is not way anyone can change that


You are correct about one thing - no one will change my opinion of religion.


----------



## DGreen

damemary said:


> Do you really want to hear? Tell me after you translate the reply. this one will answer anything. It won't make any sense of course.


It doesn't make sense now and I thought I had heard every bible quote there is.


----------



## Silverfox70

Then have a good time because some day you know their a heaven and a hell go for it


----------



## Silverfox70

If you know every quote their is then why don't you read it for yourself so you are informed


----------



## damemary

<<<whispering....Well that's thinking you told them.>>>>



Silverfox70 said:


> you can have your regilious so humanists or unbelieve he will keep knocking but not forever you will have hardened heart and their is not way anyone can change that


----------



## lins

Silverfox70 said:


> I am through just like the lord you can believe what you want as far I am concerned


Has your key board gone wonky? Are you posting this sh#t because you don't know what thread you're in? 
It's not even Sunday...give me a break.


----------



## lins

Silverfox70 said:


> Knee will bow


????


----------



## damemary

Told you so. (I couldn't resist.)



DGreen said:


> It doesn't make sense now and I thought I had heard every bible quote there is.


----------



## damemary

<<<whispering...And there's a their and a there. (Helps in translation.)>>>>



Silverfox70 said:


> Then have a good time because some day you know their a heaven and a hell go for it


----------



## damemary

Because reading and misquoting something doesn't make a convincing argument.



Silverfox70 said:


> If you know every quote their is then why don't you read it for yourself so you are informed


----------



## Moe C

Flamin' Nora! Shoot this thread and put it out of its misery!


----------



## DGreen

damemary said:


> Told you so. (I couldn't resist.)


Sharp as usual, Dame. The fundies only know so many answers and they are consistently ridiculous.


----------



## Silverfox70

Only the truth but I am rwDy to shut it down have. Good time


----------



## damemary

I'm afraid it's the neurons not the keyboard.



lins said:


> Has your key board gone wonky? Are you posting this sh#t because you don't know what thread you're in?
> It's not even Sunday...give me a break.


----------



## DGreen

damemary said:


> <<<whispering...And there's a their and a there. (Helps in translation.)>>>>


There you go again, criticizing their spelling.


----------



## Silverfox70

Maybe it's just a stupid Christian right? Lol


----------



## damemary

My bad. I was just trying to translate.



DGreen said:


> There you go again, criticizing their spelling.


----------



## DGreen

Silverfox70 said:


> Maybe it's just a stupid Christian right? Lol


You said it.


----------



## lins

damemary said:


> I'm afraid it's the neurons not the keyboard.


Honestly...sigh.


----------



## DGreen

Silverfox70 said:


> Only the truth but I am rwDy to shut it down have. Good time


Brilliant.


----------



## damemary

DGreen said:


> You said it.


 :XD: :XD: :XD: :XD: :XD:


----------



## damemary

???

to shut it down have....I?

rwDy= rowdy? rewordy?

Help. I feel like I'm trapped in a game show.



DGreen said:


> Brilliant.


----------



## Janeway

Rumor has it that Monica Lewinski will be voting Republican this year because the Democrats left a bad taste in her mouth!


----------



## lins

Janeway said:


> Rumor has it that Monica Lewinski will be voting Republican this year because the Democrats left a bad taste in her mouth!


...looks to me like you have no taste.


----------



## DGreen

lins said:


> ...looks to me like you have no taste.


 :XD: :XD: :XD: :XD:


----------



## lins

Silverfox70 said:


> Maybe it's just a stupid Christian right? Lol





Silverfox70 said:


> Then have a good time because some day you know their a heaven and a hell go for it


You can go through life being a scardy cat...shaking in your boots...thinking someone is WATCHING you from above but do you want to know where people are really taking notice of you? Right here, on earth.

Did you know that in some religions that idiots, religious extremists, are blowing up and killing themselves and people because their God promised them virgins up in heaven? Is that the same heaven you're talikng about?
Wow hey? What a reward. A make believe virgin for blowing up people.

What about those Catholic priests?
Look at all the money their followers donate to the Catholic Church.
Well, actually the Catholic Church need it. They need it to pay a lot of lawyers for their sexual sins against trusting children. 
Is God watching them? Are those priests going to heaven or hell when they die? Where do you think they should go?

Going to church can be a good social exercise for some but going to church because you're afraid of God because he's watching you or to get your sins forgiven...really?

I didn't want to post this here on this thread but you brought it on.


----------



## Celt Knitter

This is living proof of the failure to teach critical thinking skills in our education system. Where is your proof for any of these ridiculous assertions? There is a significant difference between a point of view backed up with evidence and a party political rant.


GR. Gram said:


> While we are blaming B> O., remember 7/*it is the woman behind the man, and it is not Michelle, but VALERIE.pulling his strings, ands now that he has OUR WH FULL OF HIS MUSLIM BROTHERS, it will be interesting to see the next 2 years.
> Every advisor, and any one close helping with decisions is a muslim.check it out.Don't you just love having a foreigner of president. And why has he spent over a MILLION $ to HIDE his past? HUUMMMM? Is he hiding his sex capades, his birth place, his paid government foreign student grants, hiss stolen SS number? These questions have not been answered and stupid people still voted for him, you check more when you buy a gallon of milk than you did for president. Dems will vote for any thing if the big boys in washington say so. Shane on them all. God Bless America.


----------



## DGreen

Celt Knitter said:


> This is living proof of the failure to teach critical thinking skills in our education system. Where is your proof for any of these ridiculous assertions? There is a significant difference between a point of view backed up with evidence and a party political rant.


Knitter, all you need to do to find "proof" is to go to YouTube. Along with the assertions mentioned, you will also find plenty of "evidence" on the existence of the New World Order, US government complicity in 9-11, that the Sandy Hook massacre never happened, and that Michelle Obama is really a male. Proof positive, I kid you not! One particularly fascinating video shows a woman in New Jersey fighting chemtrails with a spray bottle of vinegar. Right there before your eyes, she sprays her vinegar at airplanes flying about 30,000 feet above her head and within about 20 minutes she has vanquished the chemtrails - they gradually just go away! I mean, if you have doubts, it's right there in the video, just like the stuff about Obama.


----------



## DGreen

lins said:


> You can go through life being a scardy cat...shaking in your boots...thinking someone is WATCHING you from above but do you want to know where people are really taking notice of you? Right here, on earth.
> 
> Did you know that in some religions that idiots, religious extremists, are blowing up and killing themselves and people because their God promised them virgins up in heaven? Is that the same heaven you're talikng about?
> Wow hey? What a reward. A make believe virgin for blowing up people.
> 
> What about those Catholic priests?
> Look at all the money their followers donate to the Catholic Church.
> Well, actually the Catholic Church need it. They need it to pay a lot of lawyers for their sexual sins against trusting children.
> Is God watching them? Are those priests going to heaven or hell when they die? Where do you think they should go?
> 
> Going to church can be a good social exercise for some but going to church because you're afraid of God because he's watching you or to get your sins forgiven...really?
> 
> I didn't want to post this here on this thread but you brought it on.


The Catholic Church is working VERY hard to avoid paying restitution to victims of sex abuse on the grounds, believe it or not, that doing so would violate their religious beliefs.

See the story at

http://jezebel.com/catholic-church-says-its-against-religion-to-pay-sex-ab-1690958948


----------



## Poor Purl

Janeway said:


> Sorry, but you are totally wrong! I'm one of the original D&P ladies so you didn't direct me anywhere! Second, the Dem's "never" ate me alive as they only typed hateful words!
> 
> Several of your Dem friends were kicked off KP -- especially one who threatened one of the "right" people!
> 
> *Then another lefty one told a "right" person to put a pencil between her teeth & enjoy her seizure! This person did in fact have seizures!*


 This was a lie! The "lefty" never said that, and she proved it months ago. Stick with the program.



> I'm on O2 & one of your left friends told me to "get" off the O2 hose as I was not thinking straight!
> 
> Now, report me as Admin is already watching this thread so we will see who is kicked off for hateful words!
> 
> All you Dem's know how yo do is type hateful words!


Do you think your words are loving words? I suspect you do more reporting than the entire bunch of us combined.


----------



## DGreen

lins said:


> You can go through life being a scardy cat...shaking in your boots...thinking someone is WATCHING you from above but do you want to know where people are really taking notice of you? Right here, on earth.
> 
> Did you know that in some religions that idiots, religious extremists, are blowing up and killing themselves and people because their God promised them virgins up in heaven? Is that the same heaven you're talikng about?
> Wow hey? What a reward. A make believe virgin for blowing up people.
> 
> What about those Catholic priests?
> Look at all the money their followers donate to the Catholic Church.
> Well, actually the Catholic Church need it. They need it to pay a lot of lawyers for their sexual sins against trusting children.
> Is God watching them? Are those priests going to heaven or hell when they die? Where do you think they should go?
> 
> Going to church can be a good social exercise for some but going to church because you're afraid of God because he's watching you or to get your sins forgiven...really?
> 
> I didn't want to post this here on this thread but you brought it on.


The parallels between the TYPE of beliefs held by the fundamentalist Christians and the extreme republicans are strikingly similar, including the fact that they are FEAR BASED. What an unfortunate way to live one's life.


----------



## susanmos2000

Silverfox70 said:


> Only the truth but I am rwDy to shut it down have. Good time


Even Google Translate couldn't make sense of this one. :roll:


----------



## lins

DGreen said:


> The Catholic Church is working VERY hard to avoid paying restitution to victims of sex abuse on the grounds, believe it or not, that doing so would violate their religious beliefs.
> 
> See the story at
> 
> http://jezebel.com/catholic-church-says-its-against-religion-to-pay-sex-ab-1690958948


That sickens me...really disgusting.
Wake up people!


----------



## krashdragon

Just because she's female doesn't mean she'll be any better than the arrogant sob there now.
Hillary is just another one of those politicians who to their own mind think they are important. Remember... a politicians job is getting elected. Nothing in the job description says anything about knowing how to govern as opposed to a dictatorship... or even common sense.
How well do you think she'll run the military? Think she has any idea at all?
How about letting illegals into the country?.... my grandparents emigrated legally... and learned English. And became citizens.
Seems she gets caught in more lies every week.

The idiots that voted for obama just because he was black and would vote for hillary just because she's female deserve the loss of individual freedoms that we are experiencing. You'll notice eventually.


----------



## DGreen

lins said:


> That sickens me...really disgusting.
> Wake up people!


We have the Supreme Court to thank for that outrage, along with the disaster of Citizens United. Of course, Scalia is on record as believing that religious freedom only applies to Christians, so there may be worse to come.


----------



## DGreen

krashdragon said:


> Just because she's female doesn't mean she'll be any better than the arrogant sob there now.
> Hillary is just another one of those politicians who to their own mind think they are important. Remember... a politicians job is getting elected. Nothing in the job description says anything about knowing how to govern as opposed to a dictatorship... or even common sense.
> How well do you think she'll run the military? Think she has any idea at all?
> How about letting illegals into the country?.... my grandparents emigrated legally... and learned English. And became citizens.
> Seems she gets caught in more lies every week.
> 
> The idiots that voted for obama just because he was black and would vote for hillary just because she's female deserve the loss of individual freedoms that we are experiencing. You'll notice eventually.


Specifically which freedoms would that be?


----------



## DGreen

susanmos2000 said:


> Even Google Translate couldn't make sense of this one. :roll:


I used to get letters from my grandmother that were similarly difficult to decipher - but then, she only went to school up to the third grade.


----------



## DGreen

krashdragon said:


> Remember... a politicians job is getting elected. Nothing in the job description says anything about knowing how to govern as opposed to a dictatorship... or even common sense.


Describes Cruz to a "T"


----------



## Metrogal

Toby's Mom said:


> Excessive Baggage. Wish we had someone with a clean slate.


AMEN to that!


----------



## Huckleberry

Wombatnomore said:


> A tastefully dressed hooker I'm sure Huckleberry!


Wombatnomore
It does not take all that much to stand out in that crowd I found out. They all were "uniformed". I had never seen a bunch of them together. It felt like being in a commune.


----------



## Huckleberry

Silverfox70 said:


> Just stateing the facts


Silverfox
whose facts, pretty please?


----------



## Huckleberry

lins said:


> ...looks to me like you have no taste.


lins
confirmed.


----------



## Celt Knitter

You have just proved my point about the absence of critical thinking skills. YouTube, for all its many virtues, is not a credible academic source. It is frequently a sounding board for unsubstantiated conspiracy theorists and brain-festering eccentric thinkers; even terrorists groups use it to recruit. It is, however, an excellent source of material for teaching students critical thinking skills and the difference between fact and opinion. It is the least reliable of media sources because at least journalists are supposed to have been educated, however much their output is controlled by their media owners and advertisers. There is a "smart" YouTube. You can access it through Open Culture.


DGreen said:


> Knitter, all you need to do to find "proof" is to go to YouTube. Along with the assertions mentioned, you will also find plenty of "evidence" on the existence of the New World Order, US government complicity in 9-11, that the Sandy Hook massacre never happened, and that Michelle Obama is really a male. Proof positive, I kid you not! One particularly fascinating video shows a woman in New Jersey fighting chemtrails with a spray bottle of vinegar. Right there before your eyes, she sprays her vinegar at airplanes flying about 30,000 feet above her head and within about 20 minutes she has vanquished the chemtrails - they gradually just go away! I mean, if you have doubts, it's right there in the video, just like the stuff about Obama.


----------



## Celt Knitter

Google Translator had a meltdown at this. Were you thinking of Bill Maher's movie by any chance?


Silverfox70 said:


> you can have your regilious so humanists or unbelieve he will keep knocking but not forever you will have hardened heart and their is not way anyone can change that


----------



## Poor Purl

You left out Rick Perry. And I bet a few more Ricks will throw their cowboy hats into the ring. (Santorum, Scott, ...)


cookiequeen said:


> The best reasons to vote for Hillary Clinton:
> Cruz
> Rubio
> Walker
> Huckabee
> Paul
> Palin
> McCain
> Christie
> Trump


----------



## Country Bumpkins

MommaJody said:


> Then why did the Northern states feel in the beginning that they had the right to view "fellow Americans?" or should you say the Poor Irish (indentured survents, that were treated as slaves) the African race.(who were sold to the Americans from being captured not only by slave traders, but also by other African tribes) and other races, who, were not Americans at the time? When did they reach the the devine point that they should be allowed to rule what the rest of the country did or didn't do, that only they knew right from wrong? Did someone finally get a conscience or did they do then what you are trying to do now? Only instead of deciding you are right and we are wrong, you are choosing a particular candidate and then trying to shove your belief down everyone else's throat. And if they don't agree with you, instead of having a friendly discussion, resort to name calling, stating that if the person doesn't agree with you that they are stupid, uninformed, and ignorant. And now, you go even lower trying to intimidate someone because of the state they live in not even knowing one thing about that person. You don't know where they have lived all their life, what type of education, how informed they are or not. All you see is that they don't agree with your "gang" and therefore there must be something wrong with them. It must be nice sitting up there on top of your throne believing your views are the one true belief and anyone that doesn't agree is beneath you. Me, myself, I feel sorry for people like you that feel that you need to try to bully or demean someone because they don't believe everything you spout out. Oh well, some of us have working brains and actually use them in order to make our own conclusions of the facts instead of having someone like you to force your beliefs down our throat.


 :thumbup:


----------



## Country Bumpkins

MommaJody said:


> No, I don't think the South triumphed; However, if we had, maybe we would have smarter people up North than we do now. Heck, the North still thinks that the war was about slavery, when in actuality it was about the states having the right to make their own laws for their state instead of the Federal government telling them what to do. And if it is so painful for you, please by all means feel free to not participate in this discussion anymore. It is still a free country at the present time. Don't know if that will last for long after Hillary gets in office.


 :thumbup: Thank you!


----------



## DGreen

Celt Knitter said:


> You have just proved my point about the absence of critical thinking skills. YouTube, for all its many virtues, is not a credible academic source. It is frequently a sounding board for unsubstantiated conspiracy theorists and brain-festering eccentric thinkers; even terrorists groups use it to recruit. It is, however, an excellent source of material for teaching students critical thinking skills and the difference between fact and opinion. It is the least reliable of media sources because at least journalists are supposed to have been educated, however much their output is controlled by their media owners and advertisers. There is a "smart" YouTube. You can access it through Open Culture.


You did recognize my post as satire, right? Not sure what to make of your post.


----------



## lovethelake

DGreen said:


> The Catholic Church is working VERY hard to avoid paying restitution to victims of sex abuse on the grounds, believe it or not, that doing so would violate their religious beliefs.
> 
> See the story at
> 
> http://jezebel.com/catholic-church-says-its-against-religion-to-pay-sex-ab-1690958948


Here is what the libs consider a reliable source:
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Jezebel_(website)

Pathetic


----------



## damemary

Valid considerations. Thank you.



lins said:


> You can go through life being a scardy cat...shaking in your boots...thinking someone is WATCHING you from above but do you want to know where people are really taking notice of you? Right here, on earth.
> 
> Did you know that in some religions that idiots, religious extremists, are blowing up and killing themselves and people because their God promised them virgins up in heaven? Is that the same heaven you're talikng about?
> Wow hey? What a reward. A make believe virgin for blowing up people.
> 
> What about those Catholic priests?
> Look at all the money their followers donate to the Catholic Church.
> Well, actually the Catholic Church need it. They need it to pay a lot of lawyers for their sexual sins against trusting children.
> Is God watching them? Are those priests going to heaven or hell when they die? Where do you think they should go?
> 
> Going to church can be a good social exercise for some but going to church because you're afraid of God because he's watching you or to get your sins forgiven...really?
> 
> I didn't want to post this here on this thread but you brought it on.


----------



## damemary

Well put. Keep thinking even if it's lonely.



Celt Knitter said:


> This is living proof of the failure to teach critical thinking skills in our education system. Where is your proof for any of these ridiculous assertions? There is a significant difference between a point of view backed up with evidence and a party political rant.


----------



## damemary

Someone actually said, 'It's true. It's in the news.' All news are the same? Yup.



DGreen said:


> Knitter, all you need to do to find "proof" is to go to YouTube. Along with the assertions mentioned, you will also find plenty of "evidence" on the existence of the New World Order, US government complicity in 9-11, that the Sandy Hook massacre never happened, and that Michelle Obama is really a male. Proof positive, I kid you not! One particularly fascinating video shows a woman in New Jersey fighting chemtrails with a spray bottle of vinegar. Right there before your eyes, she sprays her vinegar at airplanes flying about 30,000 feet above her head and within about 20 minutes she has vanquished the chemtrails - they gradually just go away! I mean, if you have doubts, it's right there in the video, just like the stuff about Obama.


----------



## damemary

Any word of whether Pope Francis has talked to the Archbishop of Milwaukee? Just asking. Might make a difference. It might not.



DGreen said:


> The Catholic Church is working VERY hard to avoid paying restitution to victims of sex abuse on the grounds, believe it or not, that doing so would violate their religious beliefs.
> 
> See the story at
> 
> http://jezebel.com/catholic-church-says-its-against-religion-to-pay-sex-ab-1690958948


----------



## lins

DGreen said:


> We have the Supreme Court to thank for that outrage, along with the disaster of Citizens United. Of course, Scalia is on record as believing that religious freedom only applies to Christians, so there may be worse to come.


I am sure there is worse to come.

Look at this?
http://thinkprogress.org/health/2015/04/07/3643669/north-carolina-abortion-training/


----------



## Celt Knitter

Sorry, I didn't  I was too busy and tired from spending half the night collating sample of logical fallacies from the postings. I think I'll probably have enough for an encyclopedia by 2016


DGreen said:


> You did recognize my post as satire, right? Not sure what to make of your post.


----------



## damemary

And I bet Admin is reevaluating things. Some people are too much bother.



Poor Purl said:


> Do you think your words are loving words? I suspect you do more reporting than the entire bunch of us combined.


----------



## DGreen

lovethelake said:


> Here is what the libs consider a reliable source:
> http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Jezebel_(website)
> 
> Pathetic


What is pathetic is the church's attempts to cover up and deny the scandal and to try to shield their assets to keep from paying restitution.

http://www.nytimes.com/2013/07/02/us/dolan-sought-vatican-permission-to-shield-assets.html?pagewanted=all


----------



## soloweygirl

Cheeky Blighter said:


> All we need is one good one. Your side has nothing. Hillary will eat them up and spit them out. :thumbup:


We'll see. She isn't doing that great in the polls. Even before she announced her run, she was losing points against the potential Republican candidates. Some were even ahead of her. Not a good sign for your only candidate.


----------



## Huckleberry

Celt Knitter said:


> This is living proof of the failure to teach critical thinking skills in our education system. Where is your proof for any of these ridiculous assertions? There is a significant difference between a point of view backed up with evidence and a party political rant.


Celt Knitter
critical thinking is being squelched in some groups from early childhood on. Sad.


----------



## lins

lovethelake said:


> Here is what the libs consider a reliable source:
> http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Jezebel_(website)
> 
> Pathetic


 200 little deaf boys...molested by their beloved priest. It happened.

5 years ago.

http://www.nytimes.com/2010/03/25/world/europe/25vatican.html?pagewanted=all&_r=0


----------



## Huckleberry

soloweygirl said:


> We'll see. She isn't doing that great in the polls. Even before she announced her run, she was losing points against the potential Republican candidates. Some were even ahead of her. Not a good sign for your only candidate.


soloweygirl
we shall see is right. Fortunately most of my Fellow citizens have good sense and shall vote for the Person with the most experience. You support Marco Rubio for example who wants to keep the Cuban People from some day experiencing Democracy? Selfish B.............. he is.


----------



## Huckleberry

lins said:


> 200 little deaf boys...molested by their beloved priest. It happened.
> 
> 5 years ago.
> 
> http://www.nytimes.com/2010/03/25/world/europe/25vatican.html?pagewanted=all&_r=0


lins
just image, the abuses we are now hearing about are just the tip of the Iceberg. Kids in the past were scared to death to reveal their abuse. And some day we hear about the hanky panky between Priests and Nuns. It is a sin that the Catholic Church does now allow them to marry.


----------



## DGreen

Huckleberry said:


> soloweygirl
> we shall see is right. Fortunately most of my Fellow citizens have good sense and shall vote for the Person with the most experience. You support Marco Rubio for example who wants to keep the Cuban People from some day experiencing Democracy? Selfish B.............. he is.


Not only that, he's quite shifty when it comes to trying to be what both sides of the fence want regarding religion.

He'll profess whatever is expedient, evidently.

At the Huffington Post reports:

Marco Rubio's walk with God has been meandering and, some might say, fickle. As a child Rubio, who was baptized Catholic, made a brief but fervent conversion to Mormonism. His switch to the Church of the Latter Day Saints lasted three years.

As an adult, from 2000 to 2004 Rubio took a detour from his Catholic roots to exclusively attend Miami's Christ Fellowship, a Southern Baptist megachurch to which Rubio has given at least $50,000.

Now straddling both Christ Fellowship and the Catholic Church, Marco Rubio seems positioned to appeal both to conservative Catholics but also the anti-LGBT, demon-casting, creationist segment of the Protestant evangelical right.


----------



## lins

Huckleberry said:


> lins
> just image, the abuses we are now hearing about are just the tip of the Iceberg. Kids in the past were scared to death to reveal their abuse. And some day we hear about the hanky panky between Priests and Nuns. It is a sin that the Catholic Church does now allow them to marry.


So true. There must be millions out there, quietly abused. All those countries.

Yes, why not allow them to marry? I have never understood that either.


----------



## DGreen

lins said:


> So true. There must be millions out there, quietly abused. All those countries.
> 
> Yes, why not allow them to marry? I have never understood that either.


Silly girl. Sex is sinful and nasty and only permitted for procreation. Priests must not be allowed to marry - since they are seen as being so close to god and must be pure.


----------



## lins

Huckleberry said:


> soloweygirl
> we shall see is right. Fortunately most of my Fellow citizens have good sense and shall vote for the Person with the most experience. You support Marco Rubio for example who wants to keep the Cuban People from some day experiencing Democracy? Selfish B.............. he is.


Yeah...what was it he said yesterday? I want to move the country forward.
I don't want to go back. 
Well buddy, scrapping the Cuba deal is not moving forward.


----------



## lins

DGreen said:


> Silly girl. Sex is sinful and nasty and only permitted for procreation. Priests must not be allowed to marry - since they are seen as being so close to god and must be pure.


 :thumbup: :thumbup: :thumbup:


----------



## lins

Huckleberry said:


> soloweygirl
> we shall see is right. Fortunately most of my Fellow citizens have good sense and shall vote for the Person with the most experience. You support Marco Rubio for example who wants to keep the Cuban People from some day experiencing Democracy? Selfish B.............. he is.


 :thumbup: :thumbup: :thumbup:


----------



## soloweygirl

Huckleberry said:


> soloweygirl
> we shall see is right. Fortunately most of my Fellow citizens have good sense and shall vote for the Person with the most experience. You support Marco Rubio for example who wants to keep the Cuban People from some day experiencing Democracy? Selfish B.............. he is.


At this point I don't support anyone, so stop assuming you know otherwise. Since Hillary is the only candidate presently for your party, you are left with the only choice being Hillary or no one.


----------



## Huckleberry

DGreen said:


> Not only that, he's quite shifty when it comes to trying to be what both sides of the fence want regarding religion.
> 
> He'll profess whatever is expedient, evidently.
> 
> At the Huffington Post reports:
> 
> Marco Rubio's walk with God has been meandering and, some might say, fickle. As a child Rubio, who was baptized Catholic, made a brief but fervent conversion to Mormonism. His switch to the Church of the Latter Day Saints lasted three years.
> 
> As an adult, from 2000 to 2004 Rubio took a detour from his Catholic roots to exclusively attend Miami's Christ Fellowship, a Southern Baptist megachurch to which Rubio has given at least $50,000.
> 
> Now straddling both Christ Fellowship and the Catholic Church, Marco Rubio seems positioned to appeal both to conservative Catholics but also the anti-LGBT, demon-casting, creationist segment of the Protestant evangelical right.


DGreen
thank you for always filling me in. Rather unstable Rubio is, I'd say. Looks like nobody can count on him for any length of time. He obviously has not grown up as yet.


----------



## Designer1234

-


----------



## soloweygirl

DGreen said:


> Not only that, he's quite shifty when it comes to trying to be what both sides of the fence want regarding religion.
> 
> He'll profess whatever is expedient, evidently.
> 
> At the Huffington Post reports:
> 
> Marco Rubio's walk with God has been meandering and, some might say, fickle. As a child Rubio, who was baptized Catholic, made a brief but fervent conversion to Mormonism. His switch to the Church of the Latter Day Saints lasted three years.
> 
> As an adult, from 2000 to 2004 Rubio took a detour from his Catholic roots to exclusively attend Miami's Christ Fellowship, a Southern Baptist megachurch to which Rubio has given at least $50,000.
> 
> Now straddling both Christ Fellowship and the Catholic Church, Marco Rubio seems positioned to appeal both to conservative Catholics but also the anti-LGBT, demon-casting, creationist segment of the Protestant evangelical right.


If anyone is shifty it is Hillary. She and Bill have always been for something when it is popular and then against it when its popularity shifts.


----------



## Country Bumpkins

DGreen said:


> Not only that, he's quite shifty when it comes to trying to be what both sides of the fence want regarding religion.
> 
> He'll profess whatever is expedient, evidently.
> 
> At the Huffington Post reports:
> 
> Marco Rubio's walk with God has been meandering and, some might say, fickle. As a child Rubio, who was baptized Catholic, made a brief but fervent conversion to Mormonism. His switch to the Church of the Latter Day Saints lasted three years.
> 
> As an adult, from 2000 to 2004 Rubio took a detour from his Catholic roots to exclusively attend Miami's Christ Fellowship, a Southern Baptist megachurch to which Rubio has given at least $50,000.
> 
> Now straddling both Christ Fellowship and the Catholic Church, Marco Rubio seems positioned to appeal both to conservative Catholics but also the anti-LGBT, demon-casting, creationist segment of the Protestant evangelical right.


What is wrong with going to more than one church? Maybe he wants to be well rounded in his faith.
I have always gone to more than one church. You can understand where everyone is coming from then. I have been in most churches in my town. Then you can have faith and not be religious.


----------



## Poor Purl

lovethelake said:


> Here is what the libs consider a reliable source:
> http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Jezebel_(website)
> 
> Pathetic


If it tells the truth, why not? I never heard of it, and all you can point to is _one_ lib, singular, not _the_ libs, plural, so you need to get your own facts straight before ridiculing others.

What's really pathetic is that you think you have to defend the Church against charges of sexual abuse. I don't recall you ever even disapproving of some priests' behavior.


----------



## Designer1234

Country Bumpkins said:


> What is wrong with going to more than one church? Maybe he wants to be well rounded in his faith.
> I have always gone to more than one church. You can understand where everyone is coming from then. I have been in most churches in my town. Then you can have faith and not be religious.


Changed my mind.


----------



## Celt Knitter

Don't I know it It's the result of teaching to tests, which leaves every child behind and opens the door for the manipulation and corruption of the education system. The Atlanta scandal is just the tip of the iceberg. It's not just critical thinking either; 1 in 5 US children only can reach the median in math internationally......what a disaster for the country economically.


Huckleberry said:


> Celt Knitter
> critical thinking is being squelched in some groups from early childhood on. Sad.


----------



## rab1738

It truly amazes me that anyone can even think of voting for Hillary after all she has done and not done. She should be in jail but the Clinton machine manages to skirt by everything. She is evil. If you want to really find out who she is, please read "The Case against Hillary Clinton" by Peggy Noonan. Everyone owes it to the future of our country to read this book. I am begging you -- Please, please do not vote for Hillary. Having said all of that and reading what has been posted, I think we should stick to knitting/crocheting subjects.


----------



## sumpleby

susanmos2000 said:


> Even Google Translate couldn't make sense of this one. :roll:


she mistyped the word "ready," that's all.


----------



## sumpleby

lins said:


> So true. There must be millions out there, quietly abused. All those countries.
> 
> Yes, why not allow them to marry? I have never understood that either.


In the early years, priests COULD marry. In the Greek Orthodox Catholic church they still can. Here's a timeline for the Catholic church:

https://www.futurechurch.org/brief-history-of-celibacy-in-catholic-church

A Brief History of Celibacy in the
Catholic Church

First Century
Peter, the first pope, and the apostles that Jesus chose were, for the most part, married men. The New Testament implies that women presided at eucharistic meals in the early church.

Second and Third Century
Age of Gnosticism: light and spirit are good, darkness and material things are evil. A person cannot be married and be perfect. However, most priests were married.

Fourth Century
306-Council of Elvira, Spain, decree #43: a priest who sleeps with his wife the night before Mass will lose his job.
*325-Council of Nicea: decreed that after ordination a priest could not marry. Proclaimed the Nicene Creed.*
352-Council of Laodicea: women are not to be ordained. This suggests that before this time there was ordination of women.
*385-Pope Siricius left his wife in order to become pope. Decreed that priests may no longer sleep with their wives.*

Fifth Century
401-St. Augustine wrote, Nothing is so powerful in drawing the spirit of a man downwards as the caresses of a woman.

Sixth Century
567-2nd Council of Tours: any cleric found in bed with his wife would be excommunicated for a year and reduced to the lay state.
*580-Pope Pelagius II: his policy was not to bother married priests as long as they did not hand over church property to wives or children.*
590-604-Pope Gregory the Great said that all sexual desire is sinful in itself (meaning that sexual desire is intrinsically evil?).

Seventh Century
France: documents show that the majority of priest were married.

Eighth Century
St. Boniface reported to the pope that in Germany almost no bishop or priest was celibate.

Ninth Century
836-Council of Aix-la-Chapelle openly admitted that abortions and infanticide took place in convents and monasteries to cover up activities of uncelibate clerics.
St. Ulrich, a holy bishop, argued from scripture and common sense that the only way to purify the church from the worst excesses of celibacy was to permit priests to marry.

Eleventh Century
1045-

Benedict IX dispensed himself from celibacy and resigned in order to marry.
1074-Pope Gregory VII said anyone to be ordained must first pledge celibacy: priests [must] first escape from the clutches of their wives.
1095-Pope Urban II had priests wives sold into slavery, children were abandoned.

Twelfth Century
1123-Pope Calistus II: First Lateran Council decreed that clerical marriages were invalid.
1139-Pope Innocent II: Second Lateran Council confirmed the previous councils decree.

Fourteenth Century
Bishop Pelagio complains that women are still ordained and hearing confessions.

Fifteenth Century
*Transition; 50% of priests are married and accepted by the people.*

Sixteenth Century
1545-63-Council of Trent states that celibacy and virginity are superior to marriage.
1517-Martin Luther.
1530-Henry VIII.

Popes who were married

St. Peter, Apostle
St. Felix III 483-492 (2 children)
St. Hormidas 514-523 (1 son)
St. Silverus (Antonia) 536-537
Hadrian II 867-872 (1 daughter)
Clement IV 1265-1268 (2 daughters)
Felix V 1439-1449 (1 son)

Popes who were the sons of other popes, other clergy
Name of Pope Papacy Son of
St. Damascus I 366-348 St. Lorenzo, priest
St. Innocent I 401-417 Anastasius I
Boniface 418-422 son of a priest
St. Felix 483-492 son of a priest
Anastasius II 496-498 son of a priest
St. Agapitus I 535-536 Gordiaous, priest
St. Silverus 536-537 St. Homidas, pope
Deusdedit 882-884 son of a priest
Boniface VI 896-896 Hadrian, bishop
John XI 931-935 Pope Sergius III
John XV 989-996 Leo, priest

Popes who had illegitimate children after 1139
Innocent VIII 1484-1492 several children
Alexander VI 1492-1503 several children
Julius 1503-1513 3 daughters
Paul III 1534-1549 3 sons, 1 daughter
Pius IV 1559-1565 3 sons
Gregory XIII 1572-1585 1 son


----------



## J.Carol

sumpleby said:


> In the early years, priests COULD marry. In the Greek Orthodox Catholic church they still can. Here's a timeline for the Catholic church:
> 
> https://www.futurechurch.org/brief-history-of-celibacy-in-catholic-church
> 
> A Brief History of Celibacy in the
> Catholic Church
> 
> First Century
> Peter, the first pope, and the apostles that Jesus chose were, for the most part, married men. The New Testament implies that women presided at eucharistic meals in the early church.
> 
> Second and Third Century
> Age of Gnosticism: light and spirit are good, darkness and material things are evil. A person cannot be married and be perfect. However, most priests were married.
> 
> Fourth Century
> 306-Council of Elvira, Spain, decree #43: a priest who sleeps with his wife the night before Mass will lose his job.
> *325-Council of Nicea: decreed that after ordination a priest could not marry. Proclaimed the Nicene Creed.*
> 352-Council of Laodicea: women are not to be ordained. This suggests that before this time there was ordination of women.
> *385-Pope Siricius left his wife in order to become pope. Decreed that priests may no longer sleep with their wives.*
> 
> Fifth Century
> 401-St. Augustine wrote, Nothing is so powerful in drawing the spirit of a man downwards as the caresses of a woman.
> 
> Sixth Century
> 567-2nd Council of Tours: any cleric found in bed with his wife would be excommunicated for a year and reduced to the lay state.
> *580-Pope Pelagius II: his policy was not to bother married priests as long as they did not hand over church property to wives or children.*
> 590-604-Pope Gregory the Great said that all sexual desire is sinful in itself (meaning that sexual desire is intrinsically evil?).
> 
> Seventh Century
> France: documents show that the majority of priest were married.
> 
> Eighth Century
> St. Boniface reported to the pope that in Germany almost no bishop or priest was celibate.
> 
> Ninth Century
> 836-Council of Aix-la-Chapelle openly admitted that abortions and infanticide took place in convents and monasteries to cover up activities of uncelibate clerics.
> St. Ulrich, a holy bishop, argued from scripture and common sense that the only way to purify the church from the worst excesses of celibacy was to permit priests to marry.
> 
> Eleventh Century
> 1045-
> 
> Benedict IX dispensed himself from celibacy and resigned in order to marry.
> 1074-Pope Gregory VII said anyone to be ordained must first pledge celibacy: priests [must] first escape from the clutches of their wives.
> 1095-Pope Urban II had priests wives sold into slavery, children were abandoned.
> 
> Twelfth Century
> 1123-Pope Calistus II: First Lateran Council decreed that clerical marriages were invalid.
> 1139-Pope Innocent II: Second Lateran Council confirmed the previous councils decree.
> 
> Fourteenth Century
> Bishop Pelagio complains that women are still ordained and hearing confessions.
> 
> Fifteenth Century
> *Transition; 50% of priests are married and accepted by the people.*
> 
> Sixteenth Century
> 1545-63-Council of Trent states that celibacy and virginity are superior to marriage.
> 1517-Martin Luther.
> 1530-Henry VIII.
> 
> Popes who were married
> 
> St. Peter, Apostle
> St. Felix III 483-492 (2 children)
> St. Hormidas 514-523 (1 son)
> St. Silverus (Antonia) 536-537
> Hadrian II 867-872 (1 daughter)
> Clement IV 1265-1268 (2 daughters)
> Felix V 1439-1449 (1 son)
> 
> Popes who were the sons of other popes, other clergy
> Name of Pope Papacy Son of
> St. Damascus I 366-348 St. Lorenzo, priest
> St. Innocent I 401-417 Anastasius I
> Boniface 418-422 son of a priest
> St. Felix 483-492 son of a priest
> Anastasius II 496-498 son of a priest
> St. Agapitus I 535-536 Gordiaous, priest
> St. Silverus 536-537 St. Homidas, pope
> Deusdedit 882-884 son of a priest
> Boniface VI 896-896 Hadrian, bishop
> John XI 931-935 Pope Sergius III
> John XV 989-996 Leo, priest
> 
> Popes who had illegitimate children after 1139
> Innocent VIII 1484-1492 several children
> Alexander VI 1492-1503 several children
> Julius 1503-1513 3 daughters
> Paul III 1534-1549 3 sons, 1 daughter
> Pius IV 1559-1565 3 sons
> Gregory XIII 1572-1585 1 son


Thanks so much for all of this info .... very interesting !!!!


----------



## Celt Knitter

Peggy Noonan supported Regan and later also supported Bush but subsequently changed her mind. She is entitled to her own opinion but I think you can safely leave it to all of us to make up our own minds. Sticking to our knitting/crocheting is a really bad idea in a democracy. Women fought for the right to vote and be involved in the running of the country and we owe it to our foremothers' to build on those rights. In spite of all the resources of the GOP targeted at them, the Clintons were neither convicted nor jailed so please don't assume you know more about the law than the Supreme Court. Although I will read and research for myself opinions expressed on here, I will certainly not base my voting preferences on what has mainly been a polarized diatribe on here. If you want to know how that happened, read the linguist Dr Deborah Tannen's "The Argument Culture: Stopping America's War of Words," a very readable linguistic analysis of the war of words in present day America.


rab1738 said:


> It truly amazes me that anyone can even think of voting for Hillary after all she has done and not done. She should be in jail but the Clinton machine manages to skirt by everything. She is evil. If you want to really find out who she is, please read "The Case against Hillary Clinton" by Peggy Noonan. Everyone owes it to the future of our country to read this book. I am begging you -- Please, please do not vote for Hillary. Having said all of that and reading what has been posted, I think we should stick to knitting/crocheting subjects.


----------



## lins

.


sumpleby said:


> In the early years, priests COULD marry. In the Greek Orthodox Catholic church they still can. Here's a timeline for the Catholic church:
> 
> https://www.futurechurch.org/brief-history-of-celibacy-in-catholic-church
> 
> A Brief History of Celibacy in the
> Catholic Church
> 
> First Century
> Peter, the first pope, and the apostles that Jesus chose were, for the most part, married men. The New Testament implies that women presided at eucharistic meals in the early church.
> 
> Second and Third Century
> Age of Gnosticism: light and spirit are good, darkness and material things are evil. A person cannot be married and be perfect. However, most priests were married.
> 
> Fourth Century
> 306-Council of Elvira, Spain, decree #43: a priest who sleeps with his wife the night before Mass will lose his job.
> *325-Council of Nicea: decreed that after ordination a priest could not marry. Proclaimed the Nicene Creed.*
> 352-Council of Laodicea: women are not to be ordained. This suggests that before this time there was ordination of women.
> *385-Pope Siricius left his wife in order to become pope. Decreed that priests may no longer sleep with their wives.*
> 
> Fifth Century
> 401-St. Augustine wrote, Nothing is so powerful in drawing the spirit of a man downwards as the caresses of a woman.
> 
> Sixth Century
> 567-2nd Council of Tours: any cleric found in bed with his wife would be excommunicated for a year and reduced to the lay state.
> *580-Pope Pelagius II: his policy was not to bother married priests as long as they did not hand over church property to wives or children.*
> 590-604-Pope Gregory the Great said that all sexual desire is sinful in itself (meaning that sexual desire is intrinsically evil?).
> 
> Seventh Century
> France: documents show that the majority of priest were married.
> 
> Eighth Century
> St. Boniface reported to the pope that in Germany almost no bishop or priest was celibate.
> 
> Ninth Century
> 836-Council of Aix-la-Chapelle openly admitted that abortions and infanticide took place in convents and monasteries to cover up activities of uncelibate clerics.
> St. Ulrich, a holy bishop, argued from scripture and common sense that the only way to purify the church from the worst excesses of celibacy was to permit priests to marry.
> 
> Eleventh Century
> 1045-
> 
> Benedict IX dispensed himself from celibacy and resigned in order to marry.
> 1074-Pope Gregory VII said anyone to be ordained must first pledge celibacy: priests [must] first escape from the clutches of their wives.
> 1095-Pope Urban II had priests wives sold into slavery, children were abandoned.
> 
> Twelfth Century
> 1123-Pope Calistus II: First Lateran Council decreed that clerical marriages were invalid.
> 1139-Pope Innocent II: Second Lateran Council confirmed the previous councils decree.
> 
> Fourteenth Century
> Bishop Pelagio complains that women are still ordained and hearing confessions.
> 
> Fifteenth Century
> *Transition; 50% of priests are married and accepted by the people.*
> 
> Sixteenth Century
> 1545-63-Council of Trent states that celibacy and virginity are superior to marriage.
> 1517-Martin Luther.
> 1530-Henry VIII.
> 
> Popes who were married
> 
> St. Peter, Apostle
> St. Felix III 483-492 (2 children)
> St. Hormidas 514-523 (1 son)
> St. Silverus (Antonia) 536-537
> Hadrian II 867-872 (1 daughter)
> Clement IV 1265-1268 (2 daughters)
> Felix V 1439-1449 (1 son)
> 
> Popes who were the sons of other popes, other clergy
> Name of Pope Papacy Son of
> St. Damascus I 366-348 St. Lorenzo, priest
> St. Innocent I 401-417 Anastasius I
> Boniface 418-422 son of a priest
> St. Felix 483-492 son of a priest
> Anastasius II 496-498 son of a priest
> St. Agapitus I 535-536 Gordiaous, priest
> St. Silverus 536-537 St. Homidas, pope
> Deusdedit 882-884 son of a priest
> Boniface VI 896-896 Hadrian, bishop
> John XI 931-935 Pope Sergius III
> John XV 989-996 Leo, priest
> 
> Popes who had illegitimate children after 1139
> Innocent VIII 1484-1492 several children
> Alexander VI 1492-1503 several children
> Julius 1503-1513 3 daughters
> Paul III 1534-1549 3 sons, 1 daughter
> Pius IV 1559-1565 3 sons
> Gregory XIII 1572-1585 1 son


Subhumans turning churches into crime scenes.


----------



## J.Carol

J.Carol said:


> The Federal Reserve. Check out the history of this company that was established in 1913. At no charge you can find out all about the Federal Reserve. They are a company they are not a part of our Federal government. They print and distribute our Federal Reserve Notes to the banks in our country. Very interesting history that explains why our country is financially in a not very good situation today. It may be a lot to read but it helps us to understand in depth how the whole USA system works.


#1 The Federal Reserve System Is A Privately Owned Banking Cartel

The Federal Reserve is not a government agency.

The truth is that it is a privately owned central bank. It is owned by the banks that are members of the Federal Reserve system. We do not know how much of the system each bank owns, because that has never been disclosed to the American people.

The Federal Reserve openly admits that it is privately owned. When it was defending itself against a Bloomberg request for information under the Freedom of Information Act, the Federal Reserve stated unequivocally in court that it was not an agency of the federal government and therefore not subject to the Freedom of Information Act.

In fact, if you want to find out that the Federal Reserve system is owned by the member banks, all you have to do is go to the Federal Reserve website.


----------



## lins

quote=joeysomma]Not exactly! General statement, nothing specific about what happened in Libya.] 


We are taking the Republicans at their word that after their many extensive and costly investigations they have found no wrong doing.

So don't 'you' believe the Republican Congress after all these hearings and investigations or are you saying they are just plain incompetent?


----------



## judiostudio

Hillary Clinton, because of using an unsecure e-mail server that did not end in .gov and then willfully destroying all correspondence (which rightfully belongs to the government and should be archived for the people through the freedom of information act) on that e-mail server is liable for three years in jail and is prohibited from holding any public office.

https://theruggedindividualist.wordpress.com/2015/04/07/oh-boy-gottcha/

Besides, who in their right mind wants to listen to that harsh, shrill voice for 4 years?


----------



## lins

judiostudio said:


> Hillary Clinton, because of using an unsecure e-mail server that did not end in .gov and then willfully destroying all correspondence (which rightfully belongs to the government and should be archived for the people through the freedom of information act) on that e-mail server is liable for three years in jail and is prohibited from holding any public office.
> 
> https://theruggedindividualist.wordpress.com/2015/04/07/oh-boy-gottcha/
> 
> Besides, who in their right mind wants to listen to that harsh, shrill voice for 4 years?


When someone sends an email there is always a copy. If you send me an email, I have a copy. You cannot erase the copy that you have sent me. It is now mine.

It was not required that she have a government email at that time. The law changed recently.

As for your last comment don't you think it's kinda' bitchy and petty?


----------



## Globee

Oh for heavens sake. Peggy Noonan is a dyed in the wool conservative. Would you really expect her to say good things about Hillary.


----------



## judiostudio

As for your last comment don't you think it's kinda' bitchy and petty?[/quote]

Nope! Just true .


----------



## GR. Gram

DGREEN..SORRY SWEETIE, YOU ARE WRONG, I AM NOT A tea party person, just an old lady Whoo has lived the best Years of this countries life. born in 1930, lived in NYC in late 30's, early 40's, moved back to family FARM, RURAL country, during ww2, then moved to largest city in my native state in New England,
remember my mom crying when ww2 broke as we have family in EUROPE. As a grade schooler in farm country I weeded GOV, farm land for food for G.I.'s 10 cents a row. Made 20 cents in 6 hours. Carried any metal,can's, etc. to school which was the ''recycle' collection place. remember tooth paste in metal tubes?. and food stamps, shoe & sugar stamps, lines for butter every other week, nylons, lol, stores open 1 hour, lines, you got 2 pair, no color choice, GAS rationing,,I HAD A VICTORY BIKE THEN TOO, MOM HAD TO GO TO BOARD AND GET SPECIAL PERMIT FOR IT. Today's kids would be un able to deal with what we all did in ww2. Yes I am for God and COUNTRY, the COUNTRY THAT GAVE ME THIS GREAT ABILITY TO BETTER MYSELF FROM A FARM KID TO A retired old lady, living in a comfortable retirement community, a great CCRC. that takes cARE OF ME FOREVER. LOST HUSBAND 5 YEARS AGO, AFTER 61 YEARS. Have 3 kids, 7 grands, 11 great grands. I aM JUST A GRATEFUL american OLD LADY WHO LOVES HER COUNTRY.


----------



## Designer1234

lins said:


> When someone sends an email there is always a copy. If you send me an email, I have a copy. You cannot erase the copy that you have sent me. It is now mine.
> 
> It was not required that she have a government email at that time. The law changed recently.
> 
> As for your last comment don't you think it's kinda' bitchy and petty?


 :thumbup:


----------



## Huckleberry

judiostudio said:


> Hillary Clinton, because of using an unsecure e-mail server that did not end in .gov and then willfully destroying all correspondence (which rightfully belongs to the government and should be archived for the people through the freedom of information act) on that e-mail server is liable for three years in jail and is prohibited from holding any public office.
> 
> https://theruggedindividualist.wordpress.com/2015/04/07/oh-boy-gottcha/
> 
> Besides, who in their right mind wants to listen to that harsh, shrill voice for 4 years?


judiostudio
Secretary of State Hillary Clinton is entitled to privacy of her Email just like the rest of us. I know, you Righties love to spend money frivolously to investigate her once again rather than support the Needy. What a nice bunch of Christians you are. Tens of millions have been wasted to go after the Clintons and all you did is looking like Idiots. Congratulations at least you are consistent.


----------



## nanamonticello

Having read this thread of messages that seems to have long legs and keeps growing. I thought I would add my two cents. It's a NO VOTE for me. Hillary Clinton was not intelligent enough to know how to use something as simple as two phones or handle two email accounts, how in the heck would she be able to manage the complexities of running the country? I think NOT!! She was not even able to handle security for our overseas Ambassadors, how would she handle the security of our entire country? Again, I think NOT!!


----------



## GR. Gram

HILLARY CAN'T KEEP TRACK OF BILLY BOY, HOW THE HWCK WILL SHE BE ABLE TO KEEP TRACK OF OUR COUNTRY. BESIDES, WHEN THE PHONE RINGS At 3am and age NSWERS IT, AND TURNS OVER IN BED TO TELL BILL, AND HE IS NOT THERE will she be able to make clear headed decisions, while she is wondering where Billy is, or rather who he is with? lol He has saID HE WILL NOT LIVE IN THE WH IF SHE WINS, SO LADIES, THINK OF THAT, THINK HOW YOUR JUDGEMENT MIGHT BE COLORED BY THE DISTRACTION of a WONDERING HUSBAND,,,LOLWE SHALL SEE HOW SMART the American people are, considering as the AUTHOR OF OBAMA Care has said we are stupid. on second thought, some of us will agree !


----------



## damemary

lins said:


> quote=joeysomma]Not exactly! General statement, nothing specific about what happened in Libya.]
> 
> We are taking the Republicans at their word that after their many extensive and costly investigations they have found no wrong doing.
> 
> So don't 'you' believe the Republican Congress after all these hearings and investigations or are you saying they are just plain incompetent?


 :XD: :XD: :XD:


----------



## Cheeky Blighter

Poor Purl said:


> Do you think your words are loving words? I suspect you do more reporting than the entire bunch of us combined.


 :thumbup: :thumbup: :thumbup: :thumbup: :thumbup: :thumbup:


----------



## Cheeky Blighter

DGreen said:


> The parallels between the TYPE of beliefs held by the fundamentalist Christians and the extreme republicans are strikingly similar, including the fact that they are FEAR BASED. What an unfortunate way to live one's life.


Yes, it is pathetic way to live isn't it.


----------



## damemary

Huckleberry said:


> judiostudio
> Secretary of State Hillary Clinton is entitled to privacy of her Email just like the rest of us. I know, you Righties love to spend money frivolously to investigate her once again rather than support the Needy. What a nice bunch of Christians you are. Tens of millions have been wasted to go after the Clintons and all you did is looking like Idiots. Congratulations at least you are consistent.


 :XD: :XD: :XD:


----------



## jodymorse151

Gerslay said:


> Most KPers aren't that nasty but that particular one always is!


Thank you ... I almost took it personally!


----------



## Cheeky Blighter

DGreen said:


> Describes Cruz to a "T"


Describes their whole lineup. They have nothing.


----------



## sumpleby

GR. Gram said:


> HILLARY CAN'T KEEP TRACK OF BILLY BOY, HOW THE HWCK WILL SHE BE ABLE TO KEEP TRACK OF OUR COUNTRY. BESIDES, WHEN THE PHONE RINGS At 3am and age NSWERS IT, AND TURNS OVER IN BED TO TELL BILL, AND HE IS NOT THERE will she be able to make clear headed decisions, while she is wondering where Billy is, or rather who he is with? lol He has saID HE WILL NOT LIVE IN THE WH IF SHE WINS, SO LADIES, THINK OF THAT, THINK HOW YOUR JUDGEMENT MIGHT BE COLORED BY THE DISTRACTION of a WONDERING HUSBAND,,,LOLWE SHALL SEE HOW SMART the American people are, considering as the AUTHOR OF OBAMA Care has said we are stupid. on second thought, some of us will agree !


Put down the pills and back away slowly. Everything will be alright in the morning.


----------



## jodymorse151

rab1738 said:


> It truly amazes me that anyone can even think of voting for Hillary after all she has done and not done. She should be in jail but the Clinton machine manages to skirt by everything. She is evil. If you want to really find out who she is, please read "The Case against Hillary Clinton" by Peggy Noonan. Everyone owes it to the future of our country to read this book. I am begging you -- Please, please do not vote for Hillary.
> 
> Having said all of that and reading what has been posted, I think we should stick to knitting/crocheting subjects.


My point exactly!!!


----------



## Huckleberry

GR. Gram said:


> DGREEN..SORRY SWEETIE, YOU ARE WRONG, I AM NOT A tea party person, just an old lady Whoo has lived the best Years of this countries life. born in 1930, lived in NYC in late 30's, early 40's, moved back to family FARM, RURAL country, during ww2, then moved to largest city in my native state in New England,
> remember my mom crying when ww2 broke as we have family in EUROPE. As a grade schooler in farm country I weeded GOV, farm land for food for G.I.'s 10 cents a row. Made 20 cents in 6 hours. Carried any metal,can's, etc. to school which was the ''recycle' collection place. remember tooth paste in metal tubes?. and food stamps, shoe & sugar stamps, lines for butter every other week, nylons, lol, stores open 1 hour, lines, you got 2 pair, no color choice, GAS rationing,,I HAD A VICTORY BIKE THEN TOO, MOM HAD TO GO TO BOARD AND GET SPECIAL PERMIT FOR IT. Today's kids would be un able to deal with what we all did in ww2. Yes I am for God and COUNTRY, the COUNTRY THAT GAVE ME THIS GREAT ABILITY TO BETTER MYSELF FROM A FARM KID TO A retired old lady, living in a comfortable retirement community, a great CCRC. that takes cARE OF ME FOREVER. LOST HUSBAND 5 YEARS AGO, AFTER 61 YEARS. Have 3 kids, 7 grands, 11 great grands. I aM JUST A GRATEFUL american OLD LADY WHO LOVES HER COUNTRY.


GR. GRAM
sounds like you like the physical country but not its people. Glad you are well taken care of and HOPE that at least now and then you acknowledge the work all of the young people do to keep everything in good order and to your liking. I am sure it isn't old folks cleaning your Toilet and doing your laundry and whatever else needs constant care. Also you may recognize that most of the Staff is way underpaid. A tip now and then would be a nice gesture. Don't forget a thank you now and then. Sorry to have to remind you since you have nothing good to say about young people. Try to be a retired NICE old lady and stop putting today's young down.


----------



## Huckleberry

GR. Gram said:


> HILLARY CAN'T KEEP TRACK OF BILLY BOY, HOW THE HWCK WILL SHE BE ABLE TO KEEP TRACK OF OUR COUNTRY. BESIDES, WHEN THE PHONE RINGS At 3am and age NSWERS IT, AND TURNS OVER IN BED TO TELL BILL, AND HE IS NOT THERE will she be able to make clear headed decisions, while she is wondering where Billy is, or rather who he is with? lol He has saID HE WILL NOT LIVE IN THE WH IF SHE WINS, SO LADIES, THINK OF THAT, THINK HOW YOUR JUDGEMENT MIGHT BE COLORED BY THE DISTRACTION of a WONDERING HUSBAND,,,LOLWE SHALL SEE HOW SMART the American people are, considering as the AUTHOR OF OBAMA Care has said we are stupid. on second thought, some of us will agree !


GR. GRAM
sounds like you need a change in medication or have somebody keep track of what your are ingesting. Something is going bonkers.


----------



## DGreen

GR. Gram said:


> DGREEN..SORRY SWEETIE, YOU ARE WRONG, I AM NOT A tea party person, just an old lady Whoo has lived the best Years of this countries life. born in 1930, lived in NYC in late 30's, early 40's, moved back to family FARM, RURAL country, during ww2, then moved to largest city in my native state in New England,
> remember my mom crying when ww2 broke as we have family in EUROPE. As a grade schooler in farm country I weeded GOV, farm land for food for G.I.'s 10 cents a row. Made 20 cents in 6 hours. Carried any metal,can's, etc. to school which was the ''recycle' collection place. remember tooth paste in metal tubes?. and food stamps, shoe & sugar stamps, lines for butter every other week, nylons, lol, stores open 1 hour, lines, you got 2 pair, no color choice, GAS rationing,,I HAD A VICTORY BIKE THEN TOO, MOM HAD TO GO TO BOARD AND GET SPECIAL PERMIT FOR IT. Today's kids would be un able to deal with what we all did in ww2. Yes I am for God and COUNTRY, the COUNTRY THAT GAVE ME THIS GREAT ABILITY TO BETTER MYSELF FROM A FARM KID TO A retired old lady, living in a comfortable retirement community, a great CCRC. that takes cARE OF ME FOREVER. LOST HUSBAND 5 YEARS AGO, AFTER 61 YEARS. Have 3 kids, 7 grands, 11 great grands. I aM JUST A GRATEFUL american OLD LADY WHO LOVES HER COUNTRY.


I'm genuinely sorry to hear that you lost your husband. After such a long life together, you must still miss him.

I'm also glad to hear you will be taken care of without worry. So many are not so fortunate due to ill health. I can tell you appreciate your circumstances.

Your story is the much the same as that of my parents and grandparents. They struggled through the depression, worked hard all their lives and tried to pass on a better life to their children. Our family was strong and my mother, too, cried many tears in the frightening days of WWII while her uncles fought in Europe. She reminded me more than once how terrible the war was because they didn't know how it would end. Moving from Oklahoma to California, my grandparents settled in, raised families, grew gardens, sewed their own clothes, made that tank of gas last as long as possible and lived by the saying, "Make do, make it last, make it over or do without."

There is a difference, though. My family valued the idea of generosity and were always first to help a family member, a friend or a neighbor in need. They did not see the need of others as an opportunity to judge their circumstances; their giving was founded in the belief that they were part of a living, breathing community of humans that depended on each other not only for help as needed, but for improving that community, for seeing to the well-being of the whole and for contributing freely to the common good. They lived and taught love and respect for all.

They didn't look for lies or deceit in others, and they didn't fall prey to thoughtlessly following any political party, ideology or fad. They would have been horrified at some of the things you have posted about our President. Things that are blatant, unfounded lies. Since you repeat them, one can only assume you believe them. So sad.

Your story and my story are not unique and people today DO face very difficult hardships and challenges. You are wrong that people today couldn't survive hardship. They can and they do - every day. Perhaps you should get out of your comfortable little piece of paradise and take a look at reality instead of believing our President is a muslim (though that would not be a crime), that he is merely a puppet acting on the whims of some phantom, unnamed, power, and all the other claims you made that have been proven again and again and again to be false. Why do you want to believe those things? What is the source of such hate?


----------



## damemary

Well put. Thanks for sharing and giving us all some things to consider.



DGreen said:


> I'm genuinely sorry to hear that you lost your husband. After such a long life together, you must still miss him.
> 
> I'm also glad to hear you will be taken care of without worry. So many are not so fortunate due to ill health. I can tell you appreciate your circumstances.
> 
> Your story is the much the same as that of my parents and grandparents. They struggled through the depression, worked hard all their lives and tried to pass on a better life to their children. Our family was strong and my mother, too, cried many tears in the frightening days of WWII while her uncles fought in Europe. She reminded me more than once how terrible the war was because they didn't know how it would end. Moving from Oklahoma to California, my grandparents settled in, raised families, grew gardens, sewed their own clothes, made that tank of gas last as long as possible and lived by the saying, "Make do, make it last, make it over or do without."
> 
> There is a difference, though. My family valued the idea of generosity and were always first to help a family member, a friend or a neighbor in need. They did not see the need of others as an opportunity to judge their circumstances; their giving was founded in the belief that they were part of a living, breathing community of humans that depended on each other not only for help as needed, but for improving that community, for seeing to the well-being of the whole and for contributing freely to the common good. They lived and taught love and respect for all.
> 
> They didn't look for lies or deceit in others, and they didn't fall prey to thoughtlessly following any political party, ideology or fad. They would have been horrified at some of the things you have posted about our President. Things that are blatant, unfounded lies. Since you repeat them, one can only assume you believe them. So sad.
> 
> Your story and my story are not unique and people today DO face very difficult hardships and challenges. You are wrong that people today couldn't survive hardship. They can and they do - every day. Perhaps you should get out of your comfortable little piece of paradise and take a look at reality instead of believing our President is a muslim (though that would not be a crime), that he is merely a puppet acting on the whims of some phantom, unnamed, power, and all the other claims you made that have been proven again and again and again to be false. Why do you want to believe those things? What is the source of such hate?


----------



## susanmos2000

DGreen said:


> I'm genuinely sorry to hear that you lost your husband. After such a long life together, you must still miss him.
> 
> I'm also glad to hear you will be taken care of without worry. So many are not so fortunate due to ill health. I can tell you appreciate your circumstances.
> 
> Your story is the much the same as that of my parents and grandparents. They struggled through the depression, worked hard all their lives and tried to pass on a better life to their children. Our family was strong and my mother, too, cried many tears in the frightening days of WWII while her uncles fought in Europe. She reminded me more than once how terrible the war was because they didn't know how it would end. Moving from Oklahoma to California, my grandparents settled in, raised families, grew gardens, sewed their own clothes, made that tank of gas last as long as possible and lived by the saying, "Make do, make it last, make it over or do without."
> 
> There is a difference, though. My family valued the idea of generosity and were always first to help a family member, a friend or a neighbor in need. They did not see the need of others as an opportunity to judge their circumstances; their giving was founded in the belief that they were part of a living, breathing community of humans that depended on each other not only for help as needed, but for improving that community, for seeing to the well-being of the whole and for contributing freely to the common good. They lived and taught love and respect for all.
> 
> They didn't look for lies or deceit in others, and they didn't fall prey to thoughtlessly following any political party, ideology or fad. They would have been horrified at some of the things you have posted about our President. Things that are blatant, unfounded lies. Since you repeat them, one can only assume you believe them. So sad.
> 
> Your story and my story are not unique and people today DO face very difficult hardships and challenges. You are wrong that people today couldn't survive hardship. They can and they do - every day. Perhaps you should get out of your comfortable little piece of paradise and take a look at reality instead of believing our President is a muslim (though that would not be a crime), that he is merely a puppet acting on the whims of some phantom, unnamed, power, and all the other claims you made that have been proven again and again and again to be false. Why do you want to believe those things? What is the source of such hate?


Beautifully said--and very moving. Thanks, Green.


----------



## mmorris

Hillary has to win the Primaries first, then the Nomination, and the Election. I'm still trying to decide but there is plenty of time. :roll: :lol:


----------



## DGreen

susanmos2000 said:


> Beautifully said--and very moving. Thanks, Green.


Thank you.


----------



## lovethelake

lins said:


> When someone sends an email there is always a copy. If you send me an email, I have a copy. You cannot erase the copy that you have sent me. It is now mine.
> 
> It was not required that she have a government email at that time. The law changed recently.
> 
> As for your last comment don't you think it's kinda' bitchy and petty?


The law was in effect while she was SOS, so your comment is wrong. How hard is it to follow Obama's edicts? You have a red phone for home and a blue phone for SOS business. And I thought she was so smart. Maybe a blue one for home so Bill can remember Monica when he sees it.


----------



## lovethelake

Huckleberry said:


> GR. GRAM
> sounds like you need a change in medication or have somebody keep track of what your are ingesting. Something is going bonkers.


When did you become a doctor? Leave her alone, and stop picking on people younger than yourself.


----------



## susanmos2000

lovethelake said:


> The law was in effect while she was SOS, so your comment is wrong. How hard is it to follow Obama's edicts? You have a red phone for home and a blue phone for SOS business. And I thought she was so smart. Maybe a blue one for home so Bill can remember Monica when he sees it.


No, it wasn't, LTL. The Federal Records Act, as it read while Clinton was in office, had nothing to say about electronic communications. Obama didn't amend it until late 2014--long after Clinton left office.


----------



## lins

Huckleberry said:


> judiostudio
> Secretary of State Hillary Clinton is entitled to privacy of her Email just like the rest of us. I know, you Righties love to spend money frivolously to investigate her once again rather than support the Needy. What a nice bunch of Christians you are. Tens of millions have been wasted to go after the Clintons and all you did is looking like Idiots. Congratulations at least you are consistent.


 :thumbup:


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