# Things are heating up in the world #3



## Designer1234 (Aug 9, 2011)

Poor Purl said:


> Wasn't being unkind the point of the exercise? How about "porcine"?


I like that one --have never used it but it is an interesting word.


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## Knitted by Nan (Aug 3, 2013)

Wombatnomore said:


> Do it, don't do it. But I've got to say you are a low, base and ugly human being.


I object very strongly to your remark above. On behalf of all human beings I strongly object to you calling this poster a human being. She is of a lower order of being than human. She is even lower than a sub human creature.


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## Knitted by Nan (Aug 3, 2013)

SQM said:


> Seems like the word "liar" is our worst insult. Now that is the least of my sins. I think we should up the stakes and come up with a harsher word. The one who comes up with an insult that is better than "liar" wins tonight's point. I will give the first suggestion:
> 
> Fatty


Op shop reject.


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## Poor Purl (Apr 14, 2011)

EveMCooke said:


> Op shop reject.


We don't have op shops here; we have thrift shops. But "thrift shop reject" doesn't have that twist.


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## Poor Purl (Apr 14, 2011)

EveMCooke said:


> I object very strongly to your remark above. On behalf of all human beings I strongly object to you calling this poster a human being. She is of a lower order of being than human. She is even lower than a sub human creature.


Ultra sub human?


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## cookiequeen (Jun 15, 2011)

Poor Purl said:


> Ultra sub human?


I like plain old slob.


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## Poor Purl (Apr 14, 2011)

cookiequeen said:


> I like plain old slob.


She may or may not be a slob; she may be plain; but she's not old.


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## cookiequeen (Jun 15, 2011)

Poor Purl said:


> She may or may not be a slob; she may be plain; but she's not old.


A chazer bleibt a chazer


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## Poor Purl (Apr 14, 2011)

cookiequeen said:


> A chazer bleibt a chazer


Avadeh.


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## BrattyPatty (May 2, 2011)

Designer1234 said:


> I have never said she is a Saint. She is however a decent, kind person - I was not talking about you. I was answering KPG's post. Hypocrites are in the eyes of the beholder I guess. You never miss an opportunity to get into my conversations. And, as something I didn't call you on before, you said my workshops had nothing to do with me not coming here that much. How would you know that? As a matter of fact, they were the main reason as I worked about 6 hours a day on them, finding teachers, setting up schedules etc. and being involved with the actual classes. Yes, I said i got tired of the nastiness. However I have been on here since I put the workshops to rest until I decide whether to go back to them. If and when I do I won't be here as much. that is a fact. So please don't say you know my reasons for anything I say or do. You don't.
> 
> You love to jump all over me - and I don't mind - but get your facts straight. One of the main reasons I was tired of the nastiness then was because I was tired from doing the workshops and I found it impossible to keep up with both. As they were something very positive and often these threads are very negative I chose them. YOu put words in my mouth and told me my reasons when you don't know what you are talking about.
> 
> You don't know me - you don't like me and the feeling is mutual. So carry on with your superior posts, they are par for the course.


Careful, Shirley, she may steal your avatar too!She has many of our past and present avatars.
Keep on posting, Shirley. We love what you have to say.


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## BrattyPatty (May 2, 2011)

Wombatnomore said:


> No, she's the aka of an individual we're all familiar with. Trust me.


I agree wombat.


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## BrattyPatty (May 2, 2011)

knitpresentgifts said:


> I hope you've apologized to each and every Liberal and Dem poster you insulted and raked over the coals in your private e-mail communications to me when you claimed you were being grossly and unfairly attacked by them. I also love remembering how you said you were so shy and didn't feel free to post on particular threads because of the Libs who were always attacking you. Remember those e-mails? I do.
> 
> Seems you sway with the wind and say what others want to hear and are not true or truthful but just another Lib well versed in hypocrisy.


And you are just another Repug well versed in lies and no facts.
She chose to dump you, get over it.


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## Designer1234 (Aug 9, 2011)

BrattyPatty said:


> And you are just another Repug well versed in lies and no facts.
> She chose to dump you, get over it.


 :thumbup: :thumbup:


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## ute4kp (Nov 6, 2012)

Designer1234 said:


> Hie everyone -- just to let you know we are back on line. It has been a very hectic move. our furniture was late arriving so we had to stay with our family for 9 extra days.
> 
> We are nearly settled in and it is great to be back on line.
> 
> I see that the topics have been interesting . I will have to catch up. Snow storm in Alberta- plus l8 C here and lovely. We really like Vancouver Island.


Great that you're settled. There's no place like home.
:thumbup:


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## Designer1234 (Aug 9, 2011)

cookiequeen said:


> I like plain old slob.


actually, I rather like it too.


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## Designer1234 (Aug 9, 2011)

MaidInBedlam said:


> Folks, please note that Farmwoman uses the word "spew" which we have seen some of our favorite RWNs use . I wonder whose alter-ego she is :?: :?: :?: :?:


It does sound very familiar - in fact the whole post seems to be familiar -- I wonder too - (but not too much).


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## BrattyPatty (May 2, 2011)

Knitter from Nebraska said:


> So? Even when an article is documented with footnotes and verifiable quotes from doctors and scientists, you won't read them because you don't like the website? Well, let me give you the quick rundown.
> 
> Last month, a CDC whistleblower (a senior scientist) revealed that the CDC DELIBERATELY withheld crucial evidence proving that the MMR vaccine caused Autism. But you wouldn't want to read about that because the pro vaccine sites didn't report it.
> 
> ...


If the MMR vaccine does cause autism, then shouldn' everyone who had the vaccination have autism?
My nephew did not get the MMR and he is autistic.


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## BrattyPatty (May 2, 2011)

Country Bumpkins said:


> I am embarrassed for her.


I've been embarrassed for KPG too since she came on as Cherf.


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## ute4kp (Nov 6, 2012)

Poor Purl said:


> Piglets are small and cute. Boars are big; sows are big and female. Apologize to the piglets!


This little fellow is so cute.


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## BrattyPatty (May 2, 2011)

EveMCooke said:


> I object very strongly to your remark above. On behalf of all human beings I strongly object to you calling this poster a human being. She is of a lower order of being than human. She is even lower than a sub human creature.


 :thumbup: :thumbup: :thumbup:


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## BrattyPatty (May 2, 2011)

Wombatnomore said:


> Do it, don't do it. But I've got to say you are a low, base and ugly human being.


There is a case of the pot calling the kettle black again, Wombat.
KPG tries, but nobody believes a word she has to say.
The only thing bigger than her posterior end is her ego. 
Allmouth and no substance. A troll at best.


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## Designer1234 (Aug 9, 2011)

Sorry- double post - left the last one in.


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## Designer1234 (Aug 9, 2011)

Wombatnomore said:


> Credibility? You talk about credibility? You wouldn't know it if it hit you in the face. Shut your mouth.


actually wombat - I am not sure whether she is talking about you or me. Same old, same old for both of us. So each of us should pretend it is us and answer her. I think this one was me but maybe it was you? or maybe it was Me? hmm such a conundrum!

I think CB was talking about me - in her statement after KPG's post. Or, maybe she was talking about you. so much fun trying to figure out who they are insulting.

Not to worry about her posting private information. that is something we would expect from her. You have certainly made the right decision and maybe that is her problem???

I would imagine that many who have pm'd her are now afraid of angering her or she will tell the world about it. sad indeed- although maybe expected, not sad.

Anyway, how are you doing? well I hope. I am quite weary after a frustrating move. Our furniture was held up in Alberta and we were at our son's for 9 days. finally arrived last Saturday and we are finally pretty well settled in. This moving is not for seniors but we did manage-- I worried about him and he worried about me. My son worried about both of us so it was a long, worrisome time. all finished with now, and I love it here. I slept 9 hours last night and 3 hours this afternoon. Pat has come down with a cold and sore throat so I hope I don't get it. Our GD had the same flu when we stayed there so it is not surprising.

I have managed to lose 12 pounds this past two months - it would be great to keep it off - oh well we shall see. Moving long distance is not for the timid.


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## DGreen (Nov 1, 2012)

EveMCooke said:


> Op shop reject.


Jejune


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## Designer1234 (Aug 9, 2011)

BrattyPatty said:


> Careful, Shirley, she may steal your avatar too!She has many of our past and present avatars.
> Keep on posting, Shirley. We love what you have to say.


no problem Patty I have avatars to spare if anyone wants one. This one is a scene my son took on a whale watching tour 2 months ago in Victoria. I have lots of them if anyone wants one. also would be happy to share my work pictures so ask away and I will happily share them with any of us "Libs". I might even share them with the D and P's. grin.


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## DGreen (Nov 1, 2012)

Designer1234 said:


> no problem Patty I have avatars to spare if anyone wants one. This one is a scene my son took on a whale watching tour 2 months ago in Victoria. I have lots of them if anyone wants one. also would be happy to share my work pictures so ask away and I will happily share them with any of us "Libs". I might even share them with the D and P's. grin.


Great pic, by the way.


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## SQM (Jun 22, 2012)

Tonight's point goes to Ms. Eve because I did not know what the bleep she suggested and I liked that a lot. Honorable mention goes to Lummox for the same reason as does CQ's post which I think contained a verb I was not familiar with. I liked the variations on the theme of pig as well as the old standby of slob.(So appropriate for so many!!!)

Thanks for the great game.


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## Designer1234 (Aug 9, 2011)

knitpresentgifts said:


> I would be, but I've asked her to stop on a few occasions. She could but refuses. Her choice, and yes, her great loss. Why anyone would choose to harbor such hatred for no logical reason is beyond my understanding.


http://www.sherv.net/cm/emo/lol/dancing-cat-smiley-emoticon.gif[/IMG


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## Designer1234 (Aug 9, 2011)

In answer to your post above.

http://www.sherv.net/cm/emo/lol/dancing-cat-smiley-emoticon.gif[/IMG]


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## damemary (Mar 14, 2012)

Glad you're settled in Vancouver. Your son is a blessing. Love the dancing kitties. hugs



Designer1234 said:


> In answer to your post above.
> 
> http://www.sherv.net/cm/emo/lol/dancing-cat-smiley-emoticon.gif[/IMG]


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## Knitted by Nan (Aug 3, 2013)

> Thank you Gerslay. She is obsessed with me and struggling. Best to leave her to herself with her all-consuming hatred and ignore her as I do. She has lost all credibility because of her repeated insults and unsolicited attacks to others and simply cannot control herself or at least her words (evident by reading her prior posts).


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## ute4kp (Nov 6, 2012)

I have a question about home grown terrorist. Today they just arrested a guy for trying to go over to fight with Isis. Did I hear right on the news that the ones that already were over there fighting and now they come back that they can't be arrested? yeah I am confused.


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## Knitter from Nebraska (Jun 9, 2013)

On October 4th, (one day after the funeral of beheading victim in Oklahoma City) an Obama administration official hand delivered this message from the president, to the mosque that the killer attended.

"Your service is a powerful example of the powerful roots of the Abrahamic faiths and how our communities can come together with shared peace and dignity and a sense of justice."

I saw this message on several conservative sites, so I decided to look for confirmation and also see what the liberal sites were saying about it. I sifted through eight pages of Google listings and every mention of the message was on conservative sites. I found that very concerning. I did however, find a Snopes confirmation. Snopes tries to excuse the message because the administration claims the message was in thanks for service the mosque had performed following the Moore, OK tornado, A YEAR AND A HALF AGO!

I really have to wonder about the judgment of this president. Did he not think about how this would be taken by a people who had just suffered a terrorist attack by a member of that very mosque? If the letter were indeed meant to thank them for their service after the tornado, why did he wait a year and a half, to send it? Why was it hand delivered?

One also must ask, why isn't the mainstream or liberal media covering this? The media covered the fact that Jesse Jackson went to Texas to meet with the family of the Ebola victim, but didn't mention the fact that the president sent a message of thanks and support to a mosque that breeds terrorists. (Oh yes, I know that they deny this.).

I think we should all be concerned, either because the president is supporting a mosque that promotes terrorism OR because he doesn't have the judgment to understand how this would be received by the public. Note the use of the word "powerful" TWICE and the use of the word "justice". Bad choice of words, if one is trying to convey thanks. Even though Snopes says the message was predated to the beheading, one has to question why this message was hand delivered immediately following the beheading.

http://www.theblaze.com/stories/2014/10/06/read-the-message-obama-had-hand-delivered-to-the-mosque-reportedly-attended-by-oklahoma-beheading-suspect/

http://www.snopes.com/politics/religion/oklahoma.asp


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## theyarnlady (Feb 25, 2011)

Designer1234 said:


> actually wombat - I am not sure whether she is talking about you or me. Same old, same old for both of us. So each of us should pretend it is us and answer her. I think this one was me but maybe it was you? or maybe it was Me? hmm such a conundrum!
> 
> I think CB was talking about me - in her statement after KPG's post. Or, maybe she was talking about you. so much fun trying to figure out who they are insulting.
> 
> ...


So in other words it is o.k. for the Lib's to post PM's DameMary comes to mind. It is o.k. for Lib's to name call too. It is o.k. for you to start posting pictures after KGP posted pictures after her trip to Canada. But accuse her of taking over your adv.

Would think you may want to think what you post before you accuse others of doing the samething as Lib's. Oh but then you would have to admit you may be doing same thing. and Lib's can do no wrong.


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## galinipper (Apr 30, 2013)

Knitter from Nebraska said:


> On October 4th, (one day after the funeral of beheading victim in Oklahoma City) an Obama administration official hand delivered this message from the president, to the mosque that the killer attended.
> 
> "Your service is a powerful example of the powerful roots of the Abrahamic faiths and how our communities can come together with shared peace and dignity and a sense of justice."
> 
> ...


Not only praise, but mosque's get money to upgrade their security. The monies are from grants that are overseen by homeland security. Islamic Society of Baltimore (ISB) will be recieving $74,600.00 to upgrade and enhance their security. In fiscal year 2014, $13,000,000 was set aside to upgrade and enhance mosque's. The leader of the islamic society of Oklahoma claims that muslim's there have had a pretty rough time due to the beheading at Vaughan Foods.
Not to worry Jah'Keem, check is in the mail. Thank You taxpayers


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## Designer1234 (Aug 9, 2011)

theyarnlady said:


> So in other words it is o.k. for the Lib's to post PM's DameMary comes to mind. It is o.k. for Lib's to name call too. *It is o.k. for you to start posting pictures after KGP posted pictures after her trip to Canada. But accuse her of taking over your adv.*
> 
> Would think you may want to think what you post before you accuse others of doing the samething as Lib's. Oh but then you would have to admit you may be doing same thing. and Lib's can do no wrong.


First of all I am not sure what you mean by 'taking over my adv'" please explain --" adv"- remember I am known to be having mental problems so you have to be clearer when you post about what I think and say.

As far as me posting pictures of the rockies - I was born and raised in Calgary, and actually I complemented KPG's pictures on the topic she opened showing pictures of her Canadian trip.

However I won't apologize for posting pictures of my favorite place in the world, and my home until 3 weeks ago - here is a link to pictures and a topic I started in 2012 and you will find many posts by me about the Rockies.

http://www.knittingparadise.com/t-81485-1.html

I have enough problems with the way KPG acts here without trying to out do her with her pictures of my home area, which I am very proud of. She loved it too and just about everyone who has visited here feels the same when they go through the Canadian rockies - I am not sure exactly what you are complaining about. It is one thing I am in complete agreement with her and always will be. She enjoyed this part of the world and I don't in any way feel badly about that. It shows some good taste in my opinion. We drove through less than a month ago and I can't even be sure what pictures if any I posted but it certainly wasn't to put her down. Get real. I have plenty of feelings about her but certainly am not interested in arguing with her or you about the area I grew up in.

I was not in any way talking to you, by the way. She is quite able to fight her own battles and does so daily - no need for you to defend her. I will state again - I am glad she liked Canada - I thought her pictures were great. I am not going to stop posting mine in case you get hurt feelings on her behalf. The Rockies are beautiful enough for more than one of us to post about them.


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## SQM (Jun 22, 2012)

Hmmm! All these bearded men! Santa better get the No-No this year.


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## DGreen (Nov 1, 2012)

One also must ask, why isn't the mainstream or liberal media covering this?

*Because it isn't news*

the president sent a message of thanks and support to a mosque that breeds terrorists. (Oh yes, I know that they deny this.).

*Conclusion based on ??? (Nothing).*

Even though Snopes says the message was predated to the beheading, one has to question why this message was hand delivered immediately following the beheading.

*And we know how you will answer this question, don't we?*

Don't forget to add this to LTL's list of egregious behavior committed by Obama. Wouldn't want to leave out anything, now would we?


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## cookiequeen (Jun 15, 2011)

galinipper said:


> Not only praise, but mosque's get money to upgrade their security. The monies is from grants that are overseen by homeland security. Islamic Society of Baltimore (ISB) will be recieving $74,600.00 to upgrade and enhance their security. In fiscal year 2014, $13,000,000 was set aside to upgrade and enhance mosque's. The leader of the islamic society of Oklahoma claims that muslim's ther have had a pretty rough time due to the beheading at Vaughan Foods.
> Not to worry Jah'Keem, check is in the mail. Thank You taxpayers


But you don't believe anything in the media, do you?


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## DGreen (Nov 1, 2012)

Designer1234 said:


> First of all I am not sure what you mean by 'taking over my adv'" please explain --" adv"- remember I am known to be having mental problems so you have to be clearer when you post about what I think and say.
> 
> As far as me posting pictures of the rockies - I was born and raised in Calgary, and actually I complemented KPG's pictures on the topic she opened showing pictures of her Canadian trip.
> 
> ...


I couldn't figure out what she was talking about, either. KPG posted some ok photos, but she's not the gifted photographer she thinks she is. You can hardly take a bad photo of the Canadian Rockies.


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## cookiequeen (Jun 15, 2011)

DGreen said:


> One also must ask, why isn't the mainstream or liberal media covering this?
> 
> *Because it isn't news*
> 
> ...


 :thumbup: :thumbup: :thumbup: :thumbup: :thumbup:


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## Designer1234 (Aug 9, 2011)

DGreen said:


> One also must ask, why isn't the mainstream or liberal media covering this?
> 
> *Because it isn't news*
> 
> ...


I am sure she has a wonderful collection of untruths and exagerations which she reads over and over every day as nothing else is of importance to her except her hate for Obama. So add this to the list.


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## cookiequeen (Jun 15, 2011)

If someone from a church you belong to commits murder or let's say bombs a building, does that mean the whole church is suspect?


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## Poor Purl (Apr 14, 2011)

Knitter from Nebraska said:


> On October 4th, (one day after the funeral of beheading victim in Oklahoma City) an Obama administration official hand delivered this message from the president, to the mosque that the killer attended.
> 
> "Your service is a powerful example of the powerful roots of the Abrahamic faiths and how our communities can come together with shared peace and dignity and a sense of justice."
> 
> ...


I have to admit this President has said some stupid things recently; it's as if he's forgotten to think before he speaks.

It was certainly a bad time to send praise to that particular mosque, but I wouldn't call it a "mosque that promotes terrorism" or "that breeds terrorists" unless I knew that a) the imam does in fact promote terrorism or b) at least several moronic ISIS kids were members. Charles Starkweather (q.v.) was born (and later electrocuted) in Nebraska - may we say that Nebraska breeds serial killers?


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## Poor Purl (Apr 14, 2011)

cookiequeen said:


> If someone from a church you belong to commits murder or let's say bombs a building, does that mean the whole church is suspect?


You beat me again, but at least I got to remember Charlie Starkweather and his girlfriend.


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## DGreen (Nov 1, 2012)

cookiequeen said:


> But you don't believe anything in the media, do you?


Of course, conservatives are curiously blind to the fact that muslims (whose freedom to worship is the same as theirs) are at risk from right-wing extremists. Similar to them - only *slightly* crazier.

http://usnews.nbcnews.com/_news/2012/08/17/13321512-attacks-on-us-mosques-prompt-muslim-security-concerns?lite


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## galinipper (Apr 30, 2013)

cookiequeen said:


> But you don't believe anything in the media, do you?


My post said I believe 10% of what the media says. What's wrong with that.


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## Poor Purl (Apr 14, 2011)

DGreen said:


> Of course, conservatives are curiously blind to the fact that muslims (whose freedom to worship is the same as theirs) are at risk from right-wing extremists. Similar to them - only *slightly* crazier.
> 
> http://usnews.nbcnews.com/_news/2012/08/17/13321512-attacks-on-us-mosques-prompt-muslim-security-concerns?lite


That's okay, since Muslims aren't Christians, are they?


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## Gerslay (Oct 4, 2011)

DGreen said:


> I couldn't figure out what she was talking about, either. KPG posted some ok photos, but she's not the gifted photographer she thinks she is. You can hardly take a bad photo of the Canadian Rockies.


KPG posted some gorgeous pictures of the Canadian Rockies. Like you state, you can hardly taken an 'ok' picture of the CR!

She never claimed she was a gifted photographer... everyone else did!

Next insult?


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## cookiequeen (Jun 15, 2011)

galinipper said:


> Not only praise, but mosque's get money to upgrade their security. The monies are from grants that are overseen by homeland security. Islamic Society of Baltimore (ISB) will be recieving $74,600.00 to upgrade and enhance their security. In fiscal year 2014, $13,000,000 was set aside to upgrade and enhance mosque's. The leader of the islamic society of Oklahoma claims that muslim's there have had a pretty rough time due to the beheading at Vaughan Foods.
> Not to worry Jah'Keem, check is in the mail. Thank You taxpayers


What's your source, Facebook? WND? What year?


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## DGreen (Nov 1, 2012)

joeysomma said:


> Where is the "Freedom from Religion Foundation?"
> Tax money used to provide security for a "Church?"
> What happened to separation of church and state?
> They (FFR) sure complain enough when no taxpayer money is involved.


Tax money provides basic security for every church - it's called local law enforcement and taxpayers pay for it.

You confuse security concerns with "promoting" religion, which a completely different thing.

I'm a member of the FFR Foundation, so please clarify your last sentence with specifics. We don't have a problem with anyone practicing their religion on their own time with their own funds.


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## cookiequeen (Jun 15, 2011)

This is Joseph Farah, publisher of WND, an extremist conservative website
(2014, just Wikipedia)
When attempting to board a plane at Dulles International Airport Farah was found to have a loaded .38 caliber revolver in his bag.[21] He may face criminal charges or a fine. Farah cites stress and a lack of sleep for the reason he accidentally left the gun in his bag.[22]

If you choose to believe just 10% of what the media says, you might try to pick a little more reliable website.


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## DGreen (Nov 1, 2012)

cookiequeen said:


> This is Joseph Farah, publisher of WND, an extremist conservative website
> (2014, just Wikipedia)
> When attempting to board a plane at Dulles International Airport Farah was found to have a loaded .38 caliber revolver in his bag.[21] He may face criminal charges or a fine. Farah cites stress and a lack of sleep for the reason he accidentally left the gun in his bag.[22]
> 
> If you choose to believe just 10% of what the media says, you might try to pick a little more reliable website.


In his bag? He must have put it there. Which makes one wonder when he planned to take it out of the bag - before he left for the airport or on the way? Or after he got there? Who needs a gun in their luggage, anyway? I hope they throw the book at him.


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## BrattyPatty (May 2, 2011)

DGreen said:


> Of course, conservatives are curiously blind to the fact that muslims (whose freedom to worship is the same as theirs) are at risk from right-wing extremists. Similar to them - only *slightly* crazier.
> 
> http://usnews.nbcnews.com/_news/2012/08/17/13321512-attacks-on-us-mosques-prompt-muslim-security-concerns?lite


Slightly is an under statement.


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## GWPlver (Mar 15, 2013)

SQM said:


> See Farmerwoman - I steered you in the right direction. Mrs. Gifts will clasp you to the bosoms of those on D and P. Plus Mrs. Gifts is very placid and would never stir any ugly pots. I am happy you found some nicer ladies.


LOL!! So nicely put my favorite Sloth.


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## soloweygirl (Jun 9, 2012)

DGreen said:


> And cleverly. She's very astute and I enjoy her barbs and quips.
> 
> Farmlady was way out of bounds. Funny - we haven't heard any more from her. Perhaps she realized she was in over her head.


Patting yourself on the back for ganging up and bullying someone, are you? How nice.

FYI, she was no more out of bounds than you or your friends.


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## soloweygirl (Jun 9, 2012)

SQM said:


> Yes Siree Bob! When the Roller Derby Girls go skating - get out of the rink unless you can keep up. Now if her name was Tribeca Loft she might have done better.


Another pat on the back, how disappointing.


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## BrattyPatty (May 2, 2011)

soloweygirl said:


> Patting yourself on the back for ganging up and bullying someone, are you? How nice.
> 
> FYI, she was no more out of bounds than you or your friends.


Or you and yours.


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## BrattyPatty (May 2, 2011)

soloweygirl said:


> Another pat on the back, how disappointing.


If we were all downers like you are solo, it would be a very sad world.


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## Knitted by Nan (Aug 3, 2013)

> Patting yourself on the back for ganging up and bullying someone, are you? How nice.
> 
> FYI, she was no more out of bounds than you or your friends..


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## SQM (Jun 22, 2012)

soloweygirl said:


> Another pat on the back, how disappointing.


Why are you disappointed? You know my nature by now.

Happy Sukkot, Mrs. Girl and to TribecaLoft too.


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## DGreen (Nov 1, 2012)

soloweygirl said:


> Patting yourself on the back for ganging up and bullying someone, are you? How nice.
> 
> FYI, she was no more out of bounds than you or your friends.


No one abused poor little Farmwoman.

FYI, she was completely out of bounds to criticize dame and not even say why. Coward to run, and ignorant, to boot.


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## soloweygirl (Jun 9, 2012)

Designer1234 said:


> I have never said she is a Saint. She is however a decent, kind person - I was not talking about you. I was answering KPG's post. Hypocrites are in the eyes of the beholder I guess. You never miss an opportunity to get into my conversations. And, as something I didn't call you on before, you said my workshops had nothing to do with me not coming here that much. How would you know that? As a matter of fact, they were the main reason as I worked about 6 hours a day on them, finding teachers, setting up schedules etc. and being involved with the actual classes. Yes, I said i got tired of the nastiness. However I have been on here since I put the workshops to rest until I decide whether to go back to them. If and when I do I won't be here as much. that is a fact. So please don't say you know my reasons for anything I say or do. You don't.
> 
> You love to jump all over me - and I don't mind - but get your facts straight.  One of the main reasons I was tired of the nastiness then was because I was tired from doing the workshops and I found it impossible to keep up with both. As they were something very positive and often these threads are very negative I chose them. YOu put words in my mouth and told me my reasons when you don't know what you are talking about.
> 
> You don't know me - you don't like me and the feeling is mutual. So carry on with your superior posts, they are par for the course.


Your comprehension is definitely lacking. I did not say anything about your workshops being the reason you weren't on the threads. YOU MADE THAT UP. What I did say was that you need to make up your mind if you will or will not return to the threads as it was getting boring listening to you complain how the threads were so nasty and it saddened you and you didn't know if you will return after taking a break from posting, blah, blah blah. I was only referring to the fact that you continuously said you were leaving the political threads and then never left - not because of your workshops. You brought the workshops into the conversation later on. Be honest for a change. You are hardly a victim, so stop playing one.

What you said in your last paragraph goes both ways. "You don't know me - you don't like me and the feeling is mutual."


----------



## soloweygirl (Jun 9, 2012)

BrattyPatty said:


> Careful, Shirley, she may steal your avatar too!She has many of our past and present avatars.
> Keep on posting, Shirley. We love what you have to say.


I haven't stolen anyone's avatar. What are you talking about? Just jumping in to say something negative? Do you have to be part of the "group" 100% of the time or can't you be an individual?


----------



## soloweygirl (Jun 9, 2012)

ute4kp said:


> I have a question about home grown terrorist. Today they just arrested a guy for trying to go over to fight with Isis. Did I hear right on the news that the ones that already were over there fighting and now they come back that they can't be arrested? yeah I am confused.


It's not that the CAN"T be arrested, it is just that they WON"T be arrested. We have Eric Holder to thank for that. The FBI is going to watch them when they return.


----------



## knitpresentgifts (May 21, 2013)

DGreen said:


> Tax money provides basic security for every church - it's called local law enforcement and taxpayers pay for it.
> 
> You confuse security concerns with "promoting" religion, which a completely different thing.
> 
> I'm a member of the FFR Foundation, so please clarify your last sentence with specifics. We don't have a problem with anyone practicing their religion on their own time with their own funds.


Boy do you have trouble understanding what you read. The taxpayers' monies granted to the mosque in the story cited was for procuring and installing security equipment and upgrades. Nothing to do with basic calls to law enforcement.

The monies were granted by Obama because he supports Islamic groups AND used taxpayers monies to fund this mosque.

You confuse everything to suit your lies. You should also have a problem with that particular mosque because your funds will help them promote and practice their religion.

Glad you're happy supporting them.


----------



## soloweygirl (Jun 9, 2012)

BrattyPatty said:


> If we were all downers like you are solo, it would be a very sad world.


If I'm being a downer because I see no joy in gang bullying someone, then so be it. I can live quite comfortably being a "downer".


----------



## soloweygirl (Jun 9, 2012)

SQM said:


> Why are you disappointed? You know my nature by now.
> 
> Happy Sukkot, Mrs. Girl and to TribecaLoft too.


I did not detect your usual self in this instance, and found your post disappointing.


----------



## soloweygirl (Jun 9, 2012)

DGreen said:


> No one abused poor little Farmwoman.
> 
> FYI, she was completely out of bounds to criticize dame and not even say why. Coward to run, and ignorant, to boot.


Justify your behavior any way you want. You all were out of bounds in your attacks.


----------



## DGreen (Nov 1, 2012)

joeysomma said:


> What is the problem with this picture? Only because it is a poster that has been hanging in a school for the past 18 years. It does not depict any Religion, only Faith.
> No public funds involved.
> 
> http://www.theblaze.com/stories/2014/10/06/heres-the-picture-involving-two-children-that-atheists-are-demanding-officials-remove-from-a-school-and-the-districts-bold-response/


When all traces of Christianity are removed, what is left but Secular Humanism or Atheism, both are Religions.

I don't care how long it's been hanging there, it should be removed. There is no possible interpretation of this except to promote and endorse prayer, which belongs in the church or the home, NEVER in school. Children see it and automatically understand it is being taught simply BECAUSE it is in the school. Like ABC's, math, spelling. It's indoctrination, pure and simple, in a tax-supported environment.

You say, "When all traces of Christianity are removed, what is left but Secular Humanism or Atheism, both are Religions."

First of all, atheism is not a religion, nor is secular humanism. Religion is defined thus:

1. the belief in and worship of a superhuman controlling power, especially a personal God or gods

2. a particular system of faith and worship

If all traces of Christianity were removed, you would have lots of things left. How about Judaism? Islam? Buddhism? Confucianism? Hinduism? Or no religion, if that was your preference. Do you seriously have blinders so thick that you see ONLY Christianity as a valid belief system and that atheism completely precludes morality, ethics, or any belief system just because it excludes god? C'mon, Joey. Come clean and tell us what you really think.

By the way, I'm referring to YOUR thoughts, not bible quotes which are of no value whatever. We've been through that little tent revival before and I'm in no mood to hear it again.


----------



## galinipper (Apr 30, 2013)

cookiequeen said:


> What's your source, Facebook? WND? What year?


Here's an idea Al, Prove my post to be untrue and it will not only make you happy, but it would make me happy too, but sadly it's all very much truthful and business as usual.


----------



## DGreen (Nov 1, 2012)

knitpresentgifts said:


> Boy do you have trouble understanding what you read. The taxpayers' monies granted to the mosque in the story cited was for procuring and installing security equipment and upgrades. Nothing to do with basic calls to law enforcement.
> 
> The monies were granted by Obama because he supports Islamic groups AND used taxpayers monies to fund this mosque.
> 
> ...


I have no problem with my tax money going to ACTUALLY PHYSICALLY protect their right to practice their religion, the same as I have no problem with my tax dollars going to local law enforcement to protect your place of worship against thieves, vandals and arsonists. Mosques are under threat. Mostly by fundamentalist Christians.

Obama understands religious liberty, unlike you, who seem to think that anything besides Christianity should be stamped out.


----------



## galinipper (Apr 30, 2013)

cookiequeen said:


> This is Joseph Farah, publisher of WND, an extremist conservative website
> (2014, just Wikipedia)
> When attempting to board a plane at Dulles International Airport Farah was found to have a loaded .38 caliber revolver in his bag.[21] He may face criminal charges or a fine. Farah cites stress and a lack of sleep for the reason he accidentally left the gun in his bag.[22]
> 
> If you choose to believe just 10% of what the media says, you might try to pick a little more reliable website.


 I do choose to believe only 10%, why does that bother you? If you believe my post to be untrue then dispute it, I would welcome it. I don't know about WND or any of the other blah blah blah. But, if you are saying I got my info from them then prove it. Otherwise you are just kicking around dust and dirting the place up. It's a common tactic, attack the posters crediblity instead of the post.


----------



## Knitter from Nebraska (Jun 9, 2013)

Poor Purl said:


> I have to admit this President has said some stupid things recently; it's as if he's forgotten to think before he speaks.
> 
> It was certainly a bad time to send praise to that particular mosque, but I wouldn't call it a "mosque that promotes terrorism" or "that breeds terrorists" unless I knew that a) the imam does in fact promote terrorism or b) at least several moronic ISIS kids were members. Charles Starkweather (q.v.) was born (and later electrocuted) in Nebraska - may we say that Nebraska breeds serial killers?


Obviously, you didn't look at the article because there was a witness who says they do promote terrorism!


----------



## Knitter from Nebraska (Jun 9, 2013)

Poor Purl said:


> You beat me again, but at least I got to remember Charlie Starkweather and his girlfriend.


"GOT to remember"?!? Lucky you!


----------



## SQM (Jun 22, 2012)

joeysomma said:


> What is the problem with this picture? Only because it is a poster that has been hanging in a school for the past 18 years. It does not depict any Religion, only Faith. When all traces of Christianity are removed, what is left but Secular Humanism or Atheism, both are Religions.
> 
> No public funds involved. FFR Foundation has the problem of the expression of anything someone might think is religion on some place "their (FFR) tax dollars might have paid for. What about the other 99% of the population that are offended with what the FFR does. Of course they don't count.
> 
> ...


Your illustration does not cover all the faiths in America. Jews, Muslims, Buddhists, and Hindus do not pray like that. Atheism is not a religion; it is a viewpoint but secular humanism can be a religion.


----------



## DGreen (Nov 1, 2012)

joeysomma said:


> you forgot the third definition of religion:
> 
> re·li·gion noun \ri-ˈli-jən\
> 
> ...


The establishment clause supports my position perfectly. Thank you.

You don't have the lawsuit thing quite right. Atheists are claiming that Religious organizations and churches are treated differently from secular organizations. The exemptions are applied in a way that discriminates solely on the basis of whether an entitys members express beliefs and practices accepted as religious. The IRS treats your organization better if you profess belief in a supernatural deity. That's promoting religion.


----------



## DGreen (Nov 1, 2012)

joeysomma said:


> What is the problem with this picture? Only because it is a poster that has been hanging in a school for the past 18 years. It does not depict any Religion, only Faith. When all traces of Christianity are removed, what is left but Secular Humanism or Atheism, both are Religions.
> 
> No public funds involved. FFR Foundation has the problem of the expression of anything someone might think is religion on some place "their (FFR) tax dollars might have paid for. What about the other 99% of the population that are offended with what the FFR does. Of course they don't count.
> 
> ...


Keep it in the home or in church where it belongs. Your 99% figure is wrong, by the way. You are not nearly as large a majority as that and your numbers are declining because young people are rejecting Jesus in increasing numbers. And rightly so.


----------



## DGreen (Nov 1, 2012)

joeysomma said:


> I am so sorry your heart has been hardened. When you reject Jesus Christ as Savior enough times you may never be able to find him. I guess, I will be wasting my time trying to help you.
> 
> The 99% are those who are not atheists.


Don't feel sorry for me, Joey. My heart has been freed of the irrational guilt I was taught by Christianity. I don't believe in sin - original or otherwise. I no longer believe I'm horrible just because I was born and need blood sacrifice to save me from everlasting torture. I'm sorry for you that you can't face the world without Jesus looking out for you minute by minute.


----------



## Designer1234 (Aug 9, 2011)

soloweygirl said:


> Your comprehension is definitely lacking. I did not say anything about your workshops being the reason you weren't on the threads. YOU MADE THAT UP. What I did say was that you need to make up your mind if you will or will not return to the threads as it was getting boring listening to you complain how the threads were so nasty and it saddened you and you didn't know if you will return after taking a break from posting, blah, blah blah. I was only referring to the fact that you continuously said you were leaving the political threads and then never left - not because of your workshops. You brought the workshops into the conversation later on. Be honest for a change. You are hardly a victim, so stop playing one.
> 
> What you said in your last paragraph goes both ways. "You don't know me - you don't like me and the feeling is mutual."


The point is - what is it to you whether I decide to stay or go as often as I want. Others do that all the time. Why does it bug you so much? If it was boring to you and still is, so what- don't read my posts. I did say the workshops took most of my time -- I did say I had to choose, which I did do - I chose what I felt was a positive endeavour rather than this nastiness. Now I am not doing the workshops and I have decided, until I make up my mind whether to start them up again, that I will stay on these threads as long and post as often as I wish to. It isn't really any of your business whether I come in once a month, once a week, once a day or miss a month, miss a day, or miss an hour. I don't keep track of your posts or anyone elses, or count them.

I don't know why it seems to bother you so much.


----------



## Designer1234 (Aug 9, 2011)

soloweygirl said:


> Your comprehension is definitely lacking. I did not say anything about your workshops being the reason you weren't on the threads. YOU MADE THAT UP. What I did say was that you need to make up your mind if you will or will not return to the threads as it was getting boring listening to you complain how the threads were so nasty and it saddened you and you didn't know if you will return after taking a break from posting, blah, blah blah. I was only referring to the fact that you continuously said you were leaving the political threads and then never left - not because of your workshops. You brought the workshops into the conversation later on. Be honest for a change. You are hardly a victim, so stop playing one.
> 
> What you said in your last paragraph goes both ways. "You don't know me - you don't like me and the feeling is mutual."


The point is - what is it to you whether I decide to stay or go as often as I want. Others do that all the time. Why does it bug you so much? If it was boring to you and still is, so what- don't read my posts. I did say the workshops took most of my time -- I did say I had to choose, which I did do - I chose what I felt was a positive endeavour rather than this nastiness. Now I am not doing the workshops and I have decided, until I make up my mind whether to start them up again, that I will stay on these threads as long and post as often as I wish to. It isn't really any of your business whether I come in once a month, once a week, once a day or miss a month, miss a day, or miss an hour. I don't keep track of your posts or anyone elses, or count them.

If you find them boring - then DON'T read them.


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## knitpresentgifts (May 21, 2013)

DGreen said:


> I have no problem with my tax money going to ACTUALLY PHYSICALLY protect their right to practice their religion, the same as I have no problem with my tax dollars going to local law enforcement to protect your place of worship against thieves, vandals and arsonists. Mosques are under threat. Mostly by fundamentalist Christians.
> 
> Obama understands religious liberty, unlike you, who seem to think that anything besides Christianity should be stamped out.


Good, I'm happy you are supporting every religion out there. Except that isn't the topic you brought up, is it? You suggested that taxpayers should and do provide basic law enforcements services to even churches, mosques, etc.

EXCEPT this money was for security equipment and installation. The law doesn't allow any religious entity to have the American taxpayer fund such.

My place of worship pays for our own equipment, traffic officers and security details AS the organization should. The mosque is receiving $ from the American taxpayers as is illegal and supposedly against what your group rallies against, isn't it?

I think your group against religions should be up in arms (good pun!) because YOU and American taxpayers are actually buying that mosque security equipment and installation.

Too bad you don't stand behind what you preach.

Oh, and one more thing; Your insults in the posts you write to me fall on deaf ears because 1) they are lies and 2) they never are reflective of who I am or what I believe. You get that wrong every.single.time. too.

Did you know Liberals are known as pigeons? 
:-D


----------



## knitpresentgifts (May 21, 2013)

soloweygirl said:


> Justify your behavior any way you want. You all were out of bounds in your attacks.


Ah, come on Solo, let them have their fun.

You know Libs, when they have no valid argument or facts (rarely do they), they resort to insults and name calling. Seriously, what else can they do? They'll not think to join the correct side of the argument, listen to the facts, change their minds and will go down spouting their insults and vulgar lies and statements.

I'm certain FarmWoman saw right through them and is pleased to ignore them as we all should.

We need to cut them some slack because the President isn't doing them any favors and they are, after all, desperate on what they expect to be their demise in the midterm elections.


----------



## Wombatnomore (Dec 9, 2013)

DGreen said:


> When all traces of Christianity are removed, what is left but Secular Humanism or Atheism, both are Religions.
> 
> I don't care how long it's been hanging there, it should be removed. There is no possible interpretation of this except to promote and endorse prayer, which belongs in the church or the home, NEVER in school. Children see it and automatically understand it is being taught simply BECAUSE it is in the school. Like ABC's, math, spelling. It's indoctrination, pure and simple, in a tax-supported environment.
> 
> ...


Imagine.


----------



## knitpresentgifts (May 21, 2013)

DGreen said:


> Mosques are under threat. Mostly by fundamentalist Christians.


You said it, source it and prove it.


----------



## knitpresentgifts (May 21, 2013)

galinipper said:


> Otherwise you are just kicking around dust and dirting the place up. It's a common tactic, attack the posters crediblity instead of the post.


 :thumbup: It's all they got. The facts are the facts.


----------



## knitpresentgifts (May 21, 2013)

SQM said:


> Your illustration does not cover all the faiths in America. Jews, Muslims, Buddhists, and Hindus do not pray like that. Atheism is not a religion; it is a viewpoint but secular humanism can be a religion.


I don't know what you're talking about - I don't pray like that, and I'm a Christian. Seems you are just stereotyping again.


----------



## knitpresentgifts (May 21, 2013)

DGreen said:


> The establishment clause supports my position perfectly. Thank you.
> 
> You don't have the lawsuit thing quite right. Atheists are claiming that Religious organizations and churches are treated differently from secular organizations. The exemptions are applied in a way that discriminates solely on the basis of whether an entitys members express beliefs and practices accepted as religious. The IRS treats your organization better if you profess belief in a supernatural deity. That's promoting religion.


Wrong.


----------



## knitpresentgifts (May 21, 2013)

DGreen said:


> Keep it in the home or in church where it belongs. Your 99% figure is wrong, by the way. You are not nearly as large a majority as that and your numbers are declining because young people are rejecting Jesus in increasing numbers. And rightly so.


and wrong again ...


----------



## DGreen (Nov 1, 2012)

knitpresentgifts said:


> Good, I'm happy you are supporting every religion out there. Except that isn't the topic you brought up, is it? You suggested that taxpayers should and do provide basic law enforcements services to even churches, mosques, etc.
> 
> EXCEPT this money was for security equipment and installation. The law doesn't allow any religious entity to have the American taxpayer fund such.
> 
> ...


Funny. I didn't bring up the bit about mosques.

Aside from this particular question of protecting religious liberty against threats and acts of violence, I have not addressed you in a while. In fact, the last post I can find was to challenge your assertion that I had posted lies about the HL case. Which you ignored.

You seem inordinately fond of calling people "liar." Now you are calling me a liar for voicing an opinion and then actually tell me what I "should" be up in arms about. Save it, Nebraska.


----------



## knitpresentgifts (May 21, 2013)

DGreen said:


> Don't feel sorry for me, Joey. My heart has been freed of the irrational guilt I was taught by Christianity. I don't believe in sin - original or otherwise. I no longer believe I'm horrible just because I was born and need blood sacrifice to save me from everlasting torture. I'm sorry for you that you can't face the world without Jesus looking out for you minute by minute.


I'm sorry you don't believe enough in yourself or like yourself enough to make rational and thoughtful decisions or understand the world around you.

I'm shocked and saddened you had people in your life to tell you fairytales that you are a horrible person, that you'll paying the price of your sins and that you'll suffer from here to eternity. Yet since you don't believe in sin, you must believe you are a perfect being, without sin and therefore, do not need eternal life.

I guess if you believe that way, who cares for the here and now or the future or eternity, right?

Just wing it, perhaps take your life, or whatever you desire and like you began, presumably to your way of thinking, there will be a big bang and you're done.

Meaningless life, lived in despair, ugliness, alone and without hope. What an awful existence.


----------



## SQM (Jun 22, 2012)

knitpresentgifts said:


> I'm sorry you don't believe enough in yourself or like yourself enough to make rational and thoughtful decisions or understand the world around you.
> 
> I'm shocked and saddened you had people in your life to tell you fairytales that you are a horrible person, that you'll paying the price of your sins and that you'll suffer from here to eternity. Yet since you don't believe in sin, you must believe you are a perfect being, without sin and therefore, do not need eternal life.
> 
> ...


Oh the histrionics!

Green has liberated herself from inane bronze age thinking. Life is quite meaningful if you treat others well. A god is not necessary for that.


----------



## DGreen (Nov 1, 2012)

knitpresentgifts said:


> You said it, source it and prove it.


Here's a start.

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Islamic_Center_of_Murfreesboro


----------



## knitpresentgifts (May 21, 2013)

DGreen said:


> Funny. I didn't bring up the bit about mosques.
> 
> Aside from this particular question of protecting religious liberty against threats and acts of violence, I have not addressed you in a while. In fact, the last post I can find was to challenge your assertion that I had posted lies about the HL case. Which you ignored.
> 
> You seem inordinately fond of calling people "liar." Now you are calling me a liar for voicing an opinion and then actually tell me what I "should" be up in arms about. Save it, Nebraska.


You brought up the story about the mosques receiving law enforcement which is what we are discussing, except, now, as usual, you keep trying to change the subject and walk away from your argument because you cannot support it as it was a false argument from the start.

Can you ever tell the truth? You've addressed me often in just the last day or two. Want me to go back and count the times, including those on the HL thread that I don't even know about?

I didn't ignore your post in the HL thread, I didn't read it, and who knows if I'd choose to respond if I did. I specifically told you I don't pay attention to that thread much anymore, and I was done with that thread and discussion.

I work for a living and don't have the time or interest to follow every post you write. Surprise!

However, unlike you, I speak the truth. I'll assume then, you're not used to hearing the truth from those you normally converse. From me, expect the truth.

Oh, and I'm still waiting for at least three answers from you well before in our previous conversation that you ignored because you've got nothing but propaganda propping up your posts.

When you are faced with the truth and facts, you cut and run or like now, attempt to change the subject.

I call you a liar when you lie. Stop lying, and I'll stop pointing out that fact. Or better yet, don't communicate with me.

I'm not Nebraska either, liar.


----------



## knitpresentgifts (May 21, 2013)

SQM said:


> Oh the histrionics!
> 
> Green has liberated herself from inane bronze age thinking. Life is quite meaningful if you treat others well. A god is not necessary for that.


Then, I guess you believe you are in good company.

Why, then, did you go to D & P seeking comfort, support and sympathy when your SIL became gravelly ill? Seems you're not living the meaningful life or treating others as well as you think you are.

Answer: you were seeking God but didn't find Him. He doesn't open closed doors. That's up to you.


----------



## DGreen (Nov 1, 2012)

knitpresentgifts said:


> I'm sorry you don't believe enough in yourself or like yourself enough to make rational and thoughtful decisions or understand the world around you.
> 
> I'm shocked and saddened you had people in your life to tell you fairytales that you are a horrible person, that you'll paying the price of your sins and that you'll suffer from here to eternity. Yet since you don't believe in sin, you must believe you are a perfect being, without sin and therefore, do not need eternal life.
> 
> ...


I care very much about the here and now because I know it is the only thing I have. No heaven, no hell. If I am to live well, it's up to me, and I live quite well, quite morally and ethically. No thanks to the violent, misogynistic, brutal bible you think so much of.

As for despondent, alone, ugly and without hope? I'm LMAO.


----------



## knitpresentgifts (May 21, 2013)

DGreen said:


> I care very much about the here and now because I know it is the only thing I have. No heaven, no hell. If I am to live well, it's up to me, and I live quite well, quite morally and ethically. No thanks to the violent, misogynistic, brutal bible you think so much of.
> 
> As for despondent, along, ugly and without hope? I'm LMAO.


Good - so am I laughing at you for your ignorance.

BTW; wrong again, this is so tiresome correcting all your falsehoods. You don't know anything about the Bible I put my Faith in. In fact, you don't much about Christianity or most of the topics you've written your thoughts.

.... still waiting for answers, now on this thread ... I know they'll not be forthcoming .... ROFL


----------



## DGreen (Nov 1, 2012)

knitpresentgifts said:


> You brought up the story about the mosques receiving law enforcement which is what we are discussing.
> 
> I'm not Nebraska either, liar.


Nebraska or KPG - same hatefulness, different name.

It was galinipper who brought up the subject of mosques getting money for security, and Joesomma who directed questions to me. Liar.

galinipper wrote:
Not only praise, but mosque's get money to upgrade their security. The monies are from grants that are overseen by homeland security. Islamic Society of Baltimore (ISB) will be recieving $74,600.00 to upgrade and enhance their security. In fiscal year 2014, $13,000,000 was set aside to upgrade and enhance mosque's. The leader of the islamic society of Oklahoma claims that muslim's there have had a pretty rough time due to the beheading at Vaughan Foods.
Not to worry Jah'Keem, check is in the mail. Thank You taxpayers

from joesomma, quoting the above:
Where is the "Freedom from Religion Foundation?" 
Tax money used to provide security for a "Church?" 
What happened to separation of church and state?
They (FFR) sure complain enough when no taxpayer money is involved.


----------



## DGreen (Nov 1, 2012)

knitpresentgifts said:


> Good - so am I laughing at you for your ignorance.
> 
> BTW; wrong again, this is so tiresome correcting all your falsehoods. You don't know anything about the Bible I put my Faith in. In fact, you don't much about Christianity or most of the topics you've written your thoughts.
> 
> .... still waiting for answers, now on this thread ... I know they'll not be forthcoming .... ROFL


Ignorance? Hardly. Reading the bible is what made me an atheist. You should try it sometime.


----------



## SQM (Jun 22, 2012)

knitpresentgifts said:


> Then,I guess you believe you are in good company.
> 
> Why, then, did you go to D & P seeking comfort, support and sympathy when your SIL became gravelly ill? Seems you're not living the meaningful life or treating others as well as you think you are.
> 
> Answer: you were seeking God but didn't find Him. He doesn't open closed doors. That's up to you.


Why do you come here to be annoying? Your second paragraph makes no sense. If I found god, she would not be yours, remember???????


----------



## DGreen (Nov 1, 2012)

knitpresentgifts said:


> Then,I guess you believe you are in good company.
> 
> Why, then, did you go to D & P seeking comfort, support and sympathy when your SIL became gravelly ill? Seems you're not living the meaningful life or treating others as well as you think you are.
> 
> Answer: you were seeking God but didn't find Him. He doesn't open closed doors. That's up to you.


Amazing how much you "divine" about other's feelings, motives, lives and innermost thoughts. Quite a skill, KPG. No wonder you come across as so superior and all-knowing.


----------



## knitpresentgifts (May 21, 2013)

DGreen said:


> Here's a start.
> 
> http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Islamic_Center_of_Murfreesboro


 :XD: :XD: :XD: :XD: :XD: :XD:

Wikipedia? Seriously, I cannot breathe! Wikipedia?

OMG - you cannot honestly think Wiki is a source for anything except Liberal BS.

:XD: :XD: :XD: :XD: :XD: :XD: :XD: :XD: :XD: :XD: :XD: :XD: :XD: :XD: :XD:

You probably wrote your linked 'source' and then provided the link.

My, goodness, the total lack of intelligent thought ....


----------



## knitpresentgifts (May 21, 2013)

DGreen said:


> Nebraska or KPG - same hatefulness, different name.
> 
> It was galinipper who brought up the subject of mosques getting money for security, and Joesomma who directed questions to me. Liar.


I NEVER said who brought up the mosque story. I KNOW it was first KFN who brought up the story, but it was Galli who mentioned the security funding. I said YOU brought up the law enforcement discussion.

You're losing it - fast, liar.

Get back to the point of discussion.

WHY should the American taxpayer, according to you, pay for the procurement and installation of security equipment for that mosque?

I'll wait, on baited breath, for your answer as it ought to be good coming from one who doesn't like taxpayer supported religious institutions.


----------



## DGreen (Nov 1, 2012)

knitpresentgifts said:


> :XD: :XD: :XD: :XD: :XD: :XD:
> 
> Wikipedia? Seriously, I cannot breathe! Wikipedia?
> 
> ...


Well then, you're welcome to provide the "truth" about what happened. Knock yourself out. Please.


----------



## cookiequeen (Jun 15, 2011)

knitpresentgifts said:


> Then,I guess you believe you are in good company.
> 
> Why, then, did you go to D & P seeking comfort, support and sympathy when your SIL became gravelly ill? Seems you're not living the meaningful life or treating others as well as you think you are.
> 
> Answer: you were seeking God but didn't find Him. He doesn't open closed doors. That's up to you.


And they'll know,you are Christian by your love, by your love, yes, they'll know you are Christian by your love.
Or not!


----------



## knitpresentgifts (May 21, 2013)

DGreen said:


> Well then, you're welcome to provide the "truth" about what happened. Knock yourself out. Please.


You're the person who gave the statement (that young people are rejecting Jesus in increasing numbers).

What's the reason why you cannot find any source to back up your claims, except Wiki (if it even did)?


----------



## knitpresentgifts (May 21, 2013)

DGreen said:


> Ignorance? Hardly. Reading the bible is what made me an atheist. You should try it sometime.


If you read the Christian Bible, then your ignorance and lack of understanding of it and those people who influenced you in your life gets the credit for your choice to 'make' you an atheist.


----------



## knitpresentgifts (May 21, 2013)

DGreen said:


> Amazing how much you "divine" about other's feelings, motives, lives and innermost thoughts. Quite a skill, KPG. No wonder you come across as so superior and all-knowing.


That didn't take long, no facts, so the insults (which have always been there), the change of topic AGAIN are now followed by the name-calling. Time for me to exit your idiotic discussion.


----------



## SQM (Jun 22, 2012)

knitpresentgifts said:


> That didn't take long, no facts, so the insults (which have always been there), the change of topic AGAIN are now followed by the name-calling. Time for me to exit your idiotic discussion.


The air is cleared. Sorry I swore ladies.


----------



## DGreen (Nov 1, 2012)

knitpresentgifts said:


> I NEVER mentioned who brought up the mosque story. I KNOW it was first KFN who brought up the story, but it was Galli who mentioned the security grant. I said YOU brought up the law enforcement = security discussion.
> 
> You're losing it - fast, liar.
> 
> ...


Because there are so many who hate muslims and are opposed to them having the freedom to practice their religion. This freedom must be protected. My tax money goes for the military and Christians constantly remind us of how our brave soldiers are bleeding and dying to protect THEIR brand of religion. I see no difference between the two. I'm not trying to convince you; this is my view.

I HATE religion and everything it stands for. That is the very reason I defend FREEDOM OF RELIGION because it protects me from being forced to worship your god. Pray, worship, take the little wafer on Sunday because you're momentarily clean of sin. Whatever, just don't cram it down my throat.

You can call me all the names you want, since I am comfortable with my integrity and know full well that just because KPG says it does NOT make it true (which you haven't figured out yet). I'm truly done with your twisting statements so much that they are unrecognizable, your irrational rants, your outrageous accusations and insults.


----------



## DGreen (Nov 1, 2012)

knitpresentgifts said:


> You're the person who gave the statement (that young people are rejecting Jesus in increasing numbers).
> 
> What's the reason why you cannot find any source to back up your claims, except Wiki (if it even did)?


Because I'm ignoring that post, idiot. You supported the statement that 99% are believers. You back THAT up.


----------



## DGreen (Nov 1, 2012)

SQM said:


> Mrs. Gifts:
> 
> You totally annoyed me with your reference of my going to D&P. You are a nasty bitch.


That she is. She's stuck in 4th grade where little girls are still playing the clique game and threaten those on the outside with revealing secrets if they don't bow down to the leader.

I guess you'll be hearing from Admin.


----------



## Knitter from Nebraska (Jun 9, 2013)

Second possible case of Ebola in Texas, a police officer who entered the apartment to serve quarantine papers. He did not come in contact with any bodily fluids.

http://www.huffingtonpost.com/2014/10/08/second-texas-ebola-frisco-patient_n_5954454.html

Another link.
http://dfw.cbslocal.com/2014/10/08/frisco-patient-exhibiting-ebola-symptoms/


----------



## SQM (Jun 22, 2012)

DGreen said:


> That she is. She's stuck in 4th grade where little girls are still playing the clique game and threaten those on the outside with revealing secrets if they don't bow down to the leader.
> 
> I guess you'll be hearing from Admin.


Please do not quote my post if you censor what I actually wrote. That is what Mrs. Gifts did to me once.

Otherwise - I enjoy your comments.

I like Ostrich. I don't mind hearing from her.


----------



## DGreen (Nov 1, 2012)

SQM said:


> Please do not quote my post if you censor what I actually wrote. That is what Mrs. Gifts did to me once.
> 
> Otherwise - I enjoy your comments.
> 
> I like Ostrich. I don't mind hearing from her.


I did not mean to censor your words, I simply did not want Admin to "ding" me for repeating it. I apologize, as I can see where I might have given the impression that I disapproved. I DO NOT disapprove, believe me. I have to watch myself constantly when dealing with that person to keep my tongue and fingers in check.


----------



## SQM (Jun 22, 2012)

DGreen said:


> I did not mean to censor your words, I simply did not want Admin to "ding" me for repeating it. I apologize, as I can see where I might have given the impression that I disapproved. I DO NOT disapprove, believe me. I have to watch myself constantly when dealing with that person to keep my tongue and fingers in check.


Ha Ha. I must be older than you. Whatever few filters I had, are lost. I understand you were concerned. But maybe we are good for business here.


----------



## DGreen (Nov 1, 2012)

SQM said:


> Ha Ha. I must be older than you. Whatever few filters I had, are lost. I understand you were concerned. But maybe we are good for business here.


Mine are gone, too, unless I'm in a situation where it is clearly inappropriate to express myself that way. Like here, at work, or among strangers.

You are definitely good for the conversation. Love it when you're on line.


----------



## knitpresentgifts (May 21, 2013)

DGreen said:


> Because there are so many who hate muslims and are opposed to them having the freedom to practice their religion. This freedom must be protected. My tax money goes for the military and Christians constantly remind us of how our brave soldiers are bleeding and dying to protect THEIR brand of religion. I see no difference between the two. I'm not trying to convince you; this is my view.
> 
> I HATE religion and everything it stands for. That is the very reason I defend FREEDOM OF RELIGION because it protects me from being forced to worship your god. Pray, worship, take the little wafer on Sunday because you're momentarily clean of sin. Whatever, just don't cram it down my throat.
> 
> You can call me all the names you want, since I am comfortable with my integrity and know full well that just because KPG says it does NOT make it true (which you haven't figured out yet). I'm truly done with your twisting statements so much that they are unrecognizable, your irrational rants, your outrageous accusations and insults.


Wow, I cannot wait to tell every church, mosque, temple, shrine, religious center and organization to apply for federal monies to support their particular organization. Perhaps they should all apply for direct grants from your anti-religion group. Because, more Christians have been crucified and murdered recently than the number as compared to the Muslims. Since you stated those freedoms must be protected, I'll get the word out. Every religious organization would appreciate receiving taxpayer funds, I'm sure.

You don't have to convince me of anything you believe, you specifically state your hatreds. Fine with me. BTW: I don't take little wafers and you don't know what it signifies for those who do. Your ignorance is apparent plain as day again.

I have not called you names; I am stating the truth and facts. I know it bothers you, but I like them, so will continue to use them.

Here's one FACT for you. The military has no religion, no service member can express their religious belief, if any, when in service of our country, or while in uniform or while performing their military business/obligations/duties.

So, I know not one Christian who claims soldiers die and bleed to protect "their" religion, because those who do serve are not allowed nor make such statements while in the service. I doubt you heard any or many making that claim either; sounds like another of your fabrications. I'm certain you know just because you've made this claim, doesn't make it so. BTW: The military isn't available to defend any religion or faith-based organization, they are for the purpose of defending clear and present dangers to America and to do as directed by their commanding officers. ISIL, or the Muslim faith isn't under those same directives.

How fun, that after I signed out of your ridiculous 'discussion', you chose to follow my lead but kept on ranting. Better luck next time trying to prove your point while staying on topic. Trying dropping your insults, lies, talking points and name calling too. It would make the discussion more intelligent and interesting.


----------



## Knitter from Nebraska (Jun 9, 2013)

DGreen said:


> Funny. I didn't bring up the bit about mosques.
> 
> Aside from this particular question of protecting religious liberty against threats and acts of violence, I have not addressed you in a while. In fact, the last post I can find was to challenge your assertion that I had posted lies about the HL case. Which you ignored.
> 
> You seem inordinately fond of calling people "liar." Now you are calling me a liar for voicing an opinion and then actually tell me what I "should" be up in arms about. Save it, Nebraska.


WTF?


----------



## cookiequeen (Jun 15, 2011)

Pl


knitpresentgifts said:


> Wow, I cannot wait to tell every church, mosque, temple, shrine, religious center and organization to apply for federal monies to support their particular organization. Perhaps we should all apply for direct grants from your anti-religion group. Because, more Christians have been crucified and murdered recently than the number as compared to the Muslims. Since you stated those freedoms must be protected, I'll get the word out. Every religious organization could use some taxpayer funds, I'm sure. Those darn facts, sure are sticklers, huh?
> 
> You don't have to convince me of anything you believe, you specifically state your hatreds. Fine with me. BTW: I don't take little wafers and you don't know what it signifies for those who do. Your ignorance is apparent plain as day again.
> 
> ...


Give it up already. We all know you MUST have the last word, no matter how foolish you look. People are all entitled to their own beliefs and opinions, so learn to respect them. Everyone is sick to death of being called a fool and a liar by you who NEVER indulges in name-calling. It's enough.


----------



## knitpresentgifts (May 21, 2013)

DGreen said:


> Because I'm ignoring that post, idiot. You supported the statement that 99% are believers. You back THAT up.


Sigh, another lie by you.

I didn't support any statement that Joey and you discussed. In fact, I said only "wrong" to your claim that an increasing number of young people are rejecting Jesus.

You back THAT up (your claim).

Drop the name calling unless you are still a two-year old, it's embarrassing for you.


----------



## Poor Purl (Apr 14, 2011)

soloweygirl said:


> You are hardly a victim, so stop playing one.


 Like when you claim to be verbally abused?


----------



## Poor Purl (Apr 14, 2011)

Knitter from Nebraska said:


> Obviously, you didn't look at the article because there was a witness who says they do promote terrorism!


No, I didn't look at the article. Where was it published? But "they" is kind of nonspecific.


----------



## knitpresentgifts (May 21, 2013)

DGreen said:


> Mine are gone, too, unless I'm in a situation where it is clearly inappropriate to express myself that way. Like here, at work, or among strangers.
> 
> You are definitely good for the conversation. Love it when you're on line.


and more lies - it was just proven to me (from reviewing your prior posts to another KPer) that you recently used vulgar words "like here."

Like, SQM, I guess you cannot express yourself unless you are lying, name calling, insulting others or using vulgarity.

That is pure ignorance.

And good justification for me and hopefully others to ignore your posts or otherwise engage you.


----------



## Poor Purl (Apr 14, 2011)

Knitter from Nebraska said:


> Second possible case of Ebola in Texas, a police officer who entered the apartment to serve quarantine papers. He did not come in contact with any bodily fluids.
> 
> http://www.huffingtonpost.com/2014/10/08/second-texas-ebola-frisco-patient_n_5954454.html
> 
> ...


Poor Nebraska (birthplace of Charlie Starkweather; who knew?). You're trying to further a real discussion, but with KPG around nothing real can be discussed. Notice how she never speaks on a topic but only on what other people have said that she thinks she can criticize.

I read your links, and it sounds highly unlikely that the deputy actually has the disease. I often feel sore and have stomach pains, and I know I don't have Ebola.


----------



## Poor Purl (Apr 14, 2011)

Duplicate post. Sorry.


----------



## knitpresentgifts (May 21, 2013)

joeysomma said:


> I think she is very confused. She didn't even read what I wrote, and now wants me to back up what I didn't write.


Easy to understand Joey. When you state nothing but falsehoods and lies, it is extremely difficult to keep your story straight.

Then, like most, when confronted with the truth or asked to support her fabrications and claims, she gets defensive, angry and lashes out.


----------



## Knitted by Nan (Aug 3, 2013)

knitpresentgifts said:


> Oh, and one more thing; Your insults in the posts you write to me fall on deaf ears because 1) they are lies and 2) they never are reflective of who I am or what I believe. You get that wrong every.single.time. too.
> 
> Did you know Liberals are known as pigeons?
> :-D


Nobody, except you, is perfect. Oh, sorry, you are not perfect either because you have just admitted that you are deaf.


----------



## Designer1234 (Aug 9, 2011)

SQM said:


> Mrs. Gifts:
> 
> You totally annoyed me with your reference of my going to D&P. You are a nasty fuckin' bitch.


yep - there are no borders or limits to what she will say to people - she seems to have absolutely no apathy for those who are grieving or hurting. Don't let her get to you SQM - it is not surprising what she said. She is a nasty nasty person. One of these days her followers will start reading some of the hurtful personal things she says and get their eyes opened. I don't know whether that will happen though as they think she has the right to hurt people because we are 'LIBS' and for no other reason than she enjoys doing so. She is the 'leader' and decides all the important things - they read the posts and know exactly how nasty she is yet they 'adore' her.

I used to lurk but don't any more - don't want anythilng to do with any of them except 3 or 4 who are decent kind people. I just hope they are careful about letting her know if they are hurting about something in case she decides they are not worth her time.


----------



## Designer1234 (Aug 9, 2011)

knitpresentgifts said:


> and more lies - it was just proven to me (from reviewing your prior posts to another KPer) that you recently used vulgar words "like here."
> 
> Like, SQM, I guess you cannot express yourself unless you are lying, name calling, insulting others or using vulgarity.
> 
> ...


I think I am going to make a project of going back for 3 or 4 months and seeing how many times she has said she is going to ignore our posts. Sure doesn't put her money where her mouth is. You, my lady, are the most ignorant person on any of these threads. Believe it! please do ignore us. You follow us around and you never do anything but argue and try to hurt people. You never have an original thought. You are welcome over in D and P and that is not enough that you have them all at your feet. You come here with your superiority and insults and there is no information, discussion or anything else from you. SHAME.


----------



## Designer1234 (Aug 9, 2011)

cookiequeen said:


> Pl
> 
> Give it up already. We all know you MUST have the last word, no matter how foolish you look. People are all entitled to their own beliefs and opinions, so learn to respect them. Everyone is sick to death of being called a fool and a liar by you who NEVER indulges in name-calling. It's enough.










[/URL]


----------



## Designer1234 (Aug 9, 2011)

Poor Purl said:


> Poor Nebraska (birthplace of Charlie Starkweather; who knew?). You're trying to further a real discussion, but with KPG around nothing real can be discussed. Notice how she never speaks on a topic but only on what other people have said that she thinks she can criticize.
> 
> I read your links, and it sounds highly unlikely that the deputy actually has the disease. I often feel sore and have stomach pains, and I know I don't have Ebola.


I agree - KFN you have very worthwhile things to say and we all get side tracked by our 'constant' visitor. I applaud you for your strong opinions and your ability to express them. You are one who does put her money where her mouth is. (same old saying from my dad but it is important we do that).


----------



## DGreen (Nov 1, 2012)

EveMCooke said:


> Nobody, except you, is perfect. Oh, sorry, you are not perfect either because you have just admitted that you are deaf.


You're wasting your breath, Eve. It dawned on me today that I was seeing behaviors that were eerily familiar, having been married to an insane control freak for many years. KPG exhibits communication patterns very similar to my ex-husband's. I don't know what she's like in person, but based on her behavior here, IN MY OPINION she has a problem very similar to his.

Relationships with controlling people get a little tough to deal with. They always want everything to be, how they think of it should be. They pick on very petty issues and blow them out of proportion. This is only because they can't handle a situation (conversation) that has not turned out how they wanted it to.

Control freaks tend to have a lot of ego. They pick fights over anything they dislike. Few reasons to why you may be termed as a control freak are;
If you are very dominating, and want every small thing to be done as per your thinking.
If you try to control the behavior of everyone.
If you want everyone to listen only to what you say.
If you want everything to be perfect, and you know best so everyone has to abide by your opinion.
If you think all the decisions should be taken only by you.
If you think people should live their lives according to your whims and fancies.
If you keep interfering with other people, and try to correct and direct them in everything they do.
If anything that doesn't level up with your expectations disturbs you, leaving you with major disappointment, anger and frustration.
If you know people are afraid of your anger if they do not meet your expectations, and you use their weakness to your advantage.
In severe cases, control freaks can go to the extent of physically hurting someone, in the frustration of things not going their way. They start to feel very helpless if they have no control over a situation, and may begin to throw things around or destroy them.

Controlling Ways
There are many ways in which a control freak can try to control you. If anything you do is out of their rulebook, they will try to change it. To begin with, they would try to put across what they want, very clearly. If it doesn't work, they would try other ways of hinting at the same. They may dominate you and act bossy. They would try to tell you what they want and justify why they want it, in the best possible way. They would try to change your mind on what you are doing and tell you why you should not be doing it (if it is not according to them). They also try to control how you feel. Finally, if nothing works, they may try to emotionally blackmail you with tears, by portraying themselves as the victim. In extreme cases, they may physically abuse you and force you to do what they want.
Read more at Buzzle: http://www.buzzle.com/articles/control-freak-symptoms.html


----------



## Designer1234 (Aug 9, 2011)

knitpresentgifts said:


> and more lies - it was just proven to me (from reviewing your prior posts to another KPer) that you recently used vulgar words "like here."
> 
> Like, SQM, I guess you cannot express yourself unless you are lying, name calling, insulting others or using vulgarity.
> 
> ...


What do you do? sit there with your buddy, 
and pick apart everyone's post and then pick out a sentence or two to trash? And ignore the meat of their post?? you are something. Ignorance is something you should know the meaning of. Once again, PLEASE follow your promises to ignore our posts or otherwise engage us. It would be the nicest gift you could ever give us. But then we know you are not able to give up your fun - so I guess you will manage to spoil more of our topics. Maybe we should all join together and return the favor on D and P??? or wouldn't that be as much fun. Tit for tat??? I am only kidding. I have no interest in returning your favor by invading and disturbing your posts there. It is a thought though - if you don't stop attacking people personally and trying to spread your nastiness into our personal lives.


----------



## theyarnlady (Feb 25, 2011)

Oh happy day oh happy day when Jesus wash yes he wash all my sins away.


----------



## SQM (Jun 22, 2012)

theyarnlady said:


> Oh happy day oh happy day when Jesus wash yes he wash all my sins away.


I love that song. Was it from Jesus Christ Super Star?


----------



## Country Bumpkins (Feb 18, 2011)

SQM said:


> I love that song. Was it from Jesus Christ Super Star?


Yes it was.Black Sabbath . Jeff Fenholt became a Christian after he played it. Here is my favorite song of his. I have seen him in person singing it.


----------



## Country Bumpkins (Feb 18, 2011)

Here is his testimony.http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=3DahS72SuJ4


----------



## SQM (Jun 22, 2012)

Country Bumpkins said:


> Yes it was.Black Sabbath . Jeff Fenholt became a Christian after he played it. Here is my favorite song of his. I have seen him in person singing it.
> 
> 
> 
> ...


----------



## theyarnlady (Feb 25, 2011)

How about I'd like to teach the world to sing in perfect harmony .


----------



## SQM (Jun 22, 2012)

theyarnlady said:


> How about I'd like to teach the world to sing in perfect harmony .


Name The Source Of That Tune. Everybody play.

A Pepsi commercial?


----------



## Country Bumpkins (Feb 18, 2011)

SQM said:


> Wasn't Ozzie Osbourne in Black Shabbat? Your guy has a great voice.


Yes Ozzy was in Black Sabbath. 
I know Jeff is great. Did you listen to his testimony?


----------



## SQM (Jun 22, 2012)

Country Bumpkins said:


> Yes Ozzy was in Black Sabbath.
> I know Jeff is great. Did you listen to his testimony?


Big switch. He was heavy metal, I guess. Did you listen to Black Sabbath?

Oh My Bumps sees thru computer screens. No I did not listen to the testimonial. But if it brought him happiness, then a blessing on his head.


----------



## Country Bumpkins (Feb 18, 2011)

SQM said:


> Big switch. He was heavy metal, I guess. Did you listen to Black Sabbath?
> 
> Oh My Bumps sees thru computer screens. No I did not listen to the testimonial. But if it brought him happiness, then a blessing on his head.


I wasn't a big heavy metal fan . But I did listen to the radio when they sang. 
I wish you would listen to the testimonial. It is great . He was a big sinner but was changed after blaspheming in the Jesus Christ Superstar Broadway show.


----------



## SQM (Jun 22, 2012)

I never heard them.

Did you listen to secular music? If so, who were your favorites?


----------



## damemary (Mar 14, 2012)

theyarnlady said:


> So in other words it is o.k. for the Lib's to post PM's DameMary comes to mind. It is o.k. for Lib's to name call too. It is o.k. for you to start posting pictures after KGP posted pictures after her trip to Canada. But accuse her of taking over your adv.
> 
> Would think you may want to think what you post before you accuse others of doing the samething as Lib's. Oh but then you would have to admit you may be doing same thing. and Lib's can do no wrong.


And you make no sense. Sorry. Oh, what am I being accused? I only send PM's where appropriate to discuss something privately. Are you saying you have access to others' PM's? Please clarify.


----------



## damemary (Mar 14, 2012)

How do you decide which 10% to believe?



galinipper said:


> My post said I believe 10% of what the media says. What's wrong with that.


----------



## Country Bumpkins (Feb 18, 2011)

SQM said:


> I never heard them.
> 
> Did you listen to secular music? If so, who were your favorites?


I used to go to bed with music on. I love all of the 60's and 70's . I still like the oldies but goodie. Too many favorites . I have seen Sonny and Cher in person. Steppenwolf, The Three Dog Night. Grassroots, John Denver 3 times. I have even seen Tom Jones. LOL. Elvis came to my town but I didn't go. My dh bought the tickets and stayed in line all night to get them. I had 2 small babies. I didn't have a sitter. I have seen Steve Martin in person. 
I am not into rock and roll anymore. Just songs about The Rock. :wink:


----------



## damemary (Mar 14, 2012)

DGreen said:


> No one abused poor little Farmwoman.
> 
> FYI, she was completely out of bounds to criticize dame and not even say why. Coward to run, and ignorant, to boot.


I would really like to know what I've done to offend. I won't promise I won't do it again, but I want to understand.


----------



## Country Bumpkins (Feb 18, 2011)

joeysomma said:


> It is much older than Jesus Christ Super Star. I remember the Bass singer on Lawrence Welk singing it. Back in the 50's when we first got a TV.


I think you are right. I had heard it before. He is just the last one I remember singing it.


----------



## SQM (Jun 22, 2012)

Country Bumpkins said:


> I used to go to bed with music on. I love all of the 60's and 70's . I still like the oldies but goodie. Too many favorites . I have seen Sonny and Cher in person. Steppenwolf, The Three Dog Night. Grassroots, John Denver 3 times. I have even seen Tom Jones. LOL. Elvis came to my town but I didn't go. My dh bought the tickets and stayed in line all night to get them. I had 2 small babies. I didn't have a sitter. I have seen Steve Martin in person.
> I am not into rock and roll anymore. Just songs about The Rock. :wink:


How my hopes were dashed by the last sentence! Otherwise cool.


----------



## damemary (Mar 14, 2012)

SQM said:


> I love that song. Was it from Jesus Christ Super Star?


 :XD: :XD: :XD: :XD: :XD: :XD: :XD: :XD: The dame awards you a point for this reference.


----------



## Country Bumpkins (Feb 18, 2011)

SQM said:


> How my hopes were dashed by the last sentence! Otherwise cool.


What that Jesus is my Rock? He is.


----------



## Designer1234 (Aug 9, 2011)

damemary said:


> I would really like to know what I've done to offend. I won't promise I won't do it again, but I want to understand.


Dame - please don't worry about what you might have done. It was likely nothing. I think they are once again ganging up.

I am not sure who she is or was -- but hasn't been heard of since. It is nice to be back. I meant to write you but life has been hectic and today we had the first day with no stress. I love it here and have thought of you often while off line.


----------



## sumpleby (Aug 3, 2013)

Knitter from Nebraska said:


> Second possible case of Ebola in Texas, a police officer who entered the apartment to serve quarantine papers. He did not come in contact with any bodily fluids.
> 
> http://www.huffingtonpost.com/2014/10/08/second-texas-ebola-frisco-patient_n_5954454.html
> 
> ...


Oh brother. Did you bother to read?

"Sgt. Michael Monnig, an employee of the Dallas County Sheriff's Office, was taken to the hospital Wednesday *amid fears that he had been exposed to the Ebola virus*, the sheriff's office confirmed. *Authorities later announced that Monnig was at "minimal" risk, but said they were proceeding "with an abundance of caution."* "

And if they follow through, the guy will have to be held for up to 21 days, because that the time it takes for the illness to present itself.


----------



## DGreen (Nov 1, 2012)

damemary said:


> I would really like to know what I've done to offend. I won't promise I won't do it again, but I want to understand.


I don't think anyone knows but Farmwoman. Out of the blue, a harsh message to you. I looked up her previous posts and went down the whole list. Nothing but nice, sweet messages and compliments on different photos of knit projects, then WHAM.

I think she was completely out of line, especially since she didn't say what the hell she was objecting to, though she mentioned something about god-hating. She also posted another message on the HL thread, giving her 2-cents-worth on why people should buy their own birth control pills, while making some statements that clearly revealed she had NOT been following the subject at all. Maybe she was just cruising around and felt compelled to make a statement. Haven't heard from her since.


----------



## damemary (Mar 14, 2012)

It's a free country.



theyarnlady said:


> So in other words it is o.k. for the Lib's to post PM's DameMary comes to mind. It is o.k. for Lib's to name call too. It is o.k. for you to start posting pictures after KGP posted pictures after her trip to Canada. But accuse her of taking over your adv.
> 
> Would think you may want to think what you post before you accuse others of doing the samething as Lib's. Oh but then you would have to admit you may be doing same thing. and Lib's can do no wrong.


----------



## damemary (Mar 14, 2012)

I'm so happy for you and your family. hugs



Designer1234 said:


> Dame - please don't worry about what you might have done. It was likely nothing. I think they are once again ganging up.
> 
> I am not sure who she is or was -- but hasn't been heard of since. It is nice to be back. I meant to write you but life has been hectic and today we had the first day with no stress. I love it here and have thought of you often while off line.


----------



## damemary (Mar 14, 2012)

Thanks for the evaluation. I couldn't figure it out and now I know why.



DGreen said:


> I don't think anyone knows but Farmwoman. Out of the blue, a harsh message to you. I looked up her previous posts and went down the whole list. Nothing but nice, sweet messages and compliments on different photos of knit projects, then WHAM.
> 
> I think she was completely out of line, especially since she didn't say what the hell she was objecting to, though she mentioned something about god-hating. She also posted another message on the HL thread, giving her 2-cents-worth on why people should buy their own birth control pills, while making some statements that clearly revealed she had NOT been following the subject at all. Maybe she was just cruising around and felt compelled to make a statement. Haven't heard from her since.


----------



## DGreen (Nov 1, 2012)

damemary said:


> Thanks for the evaluation. I couldn't figure it out and now I know why.


Bizarre.

But the sudden shift to old songs and lyrics for the last page or two? Have I missed something?


----------



## Knitted by Nan (Aug 3, 2013)

News flash on my PC

http://www.abc.net.au/news/2014-10-09/ebola-scare-woman-under-observation-in-cairns-hospital/5802280
A Cairns nurse will find out tonight or early Friday morning whether she has become the first Australian to contract the deadly Ebola virus during the recent outbreak.
Sue-Ellen Kovack, 56, returned to Australia on the weekend after a month-long stay in Sierra Leone where she worked with the Red Cross treating patients of the outbreak.


----------



## lovethelake (Apr 6, 2011)

DGreen said:


> You're wasting your breath, Eve. It dawned on me today that I was seeing behaviors that were eerily familiar, having been married to an insane control freak for many years. KPG exhibits communication patterns very similar to my ex-husband's. I don't know what she's like in person, but based on her behavior here, IN MY OPINION she has a problem very similar to his.
> 
> Relationships with controlling people get a little tough to deal with. They always want everything to be, how they think of it should be. They pick on very petty issues and blow them out of proportion. This is only because they can't handle a situation (conversation) that has not turned out how they wanted it to.
> 
> ...


WOW sounds like Obama.


----------



## galinipper (Apr 30, 2013)

lovethelake said:


> WOW sounds like Obama.


Ah...HaHaHaHaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaa.
it is a perfect description :!: :!: :!: :!: :!: :!: :!:


----------



## galinipper (Apr 30, 2013)

damemary said:


> How do you decide which 10% to believe?


Refer back to your post that said "and I don't care," you'll find your answer there.
if you forgot it's on Oct 6th.


----------



## Gerslay (Oct 4, 2011)

galinipper said:


> Refer back to your post that said "and I don't care," you'll find your answer there.
> if you forgot it's on Oct 6th.


Bazinga!

:lol: :lol: :lol:


----------



## Knitter from Nebraska (Jun 9, 2013)

sumpleby said:


> Oh brother. Did you bother to read?
> 
> "Sgt. Michael Monnig, an employee of the Dallas County Sheriff's Office, was taken to the hospital Wednesday *amid fears that he had been exposed to the Ebola virus*, the sheriff's office confirmed. *Authorities later announced that Monnig was at "minimal" risk, but said they were proceeding "with an abundance of caution."* "
> 
> And if they follow through, the guy will have to be held for up to 21 days, because that the time it takes for the illness to present itself.


Oh, brother! I didn't express any opinion. I was only repeating what is now on every news outlet in America!


----------



## Designer1234 (Aug 9, 2011)

DGreen said:


> I couldn't figure out what she was talking about, either. KPG posted some ok photos, but she's not the gifted photographer she thinks she is. You can hardly take a bad photo of the Canadian Rockies.


It is a matter of point and click - they are so beautiful. Calgary is a great city and I have said she took interesting, truthful pictures of where I was born and raised and spent the last 20 years. I have acknowledged that publicly. Pictures from a holiday are a completely different subject than the things she says here. I don't carry grudges out on the main forum - She did a good job of showing off my home. I have never implied or said anything different. I am still not sure what Yarnie was talking about. However, I am not losing any sleep over it.

I know my motives and I know my city and I know the rockies. Her pictures of Calgary were great and so were those of the Rockies-- especially the Calgary tower and the Stampede and Zoo.

On here I don't think she does a good job. Two different places. I do think she has the need to tell everyone how great she is - It is hard, as you say, to take a bad picture. I have a Cannon SLR too and they are wonderful and it is difficult fail and not get a good shot. Her subject choices showed Calgary very well. enough said.


----------



## Designer1234 (Aug 9, 2011)

knitpresentgifts said:


> Sigh, another lie by you.
> 
> I didn't support any statement that Joey and you discussed. In fact, I said only "wrong" to your claim that an increasing number of young people are rejecting Jesus.
> 
> ...


WOW - that makes you about 4 months old.


----------



## Designer1234 (Aug 9, 2011)

cookiequeen said:


> And they'll know,you are Christian by your love, by your love, yes, they'll know you are Christian by your love.
> Or not!


not!!!!!!


----------



## Poor Purl (Apr 14, 2011)

lovethelake said:


> WOW sounds like Obama.


Sounds like everyone who's ever been elected president.

(The most recent <unelected> appointee deferred to his vice-president, who was the control freak in that couple.)


----------



## cookiequeen (Jun 15, 2011)

damemary said:


> It's a free country.


You better promise to keep your quips coming. Most of us enjoy them!


----------



## knitpresentgifts (May 21, 2013)

galinipper said:


> Ah...HaHaHaHaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaa.
> it is a perfect description :!: :!: :!: :!: :!: :!: :!:


Agreed - and provided by a Liberal - terrific!

I'm starting, only starting, to feel sorry for him. He has placed himself in a pitiable position, and if the Dems lose the Senate, he'll be more apt to challenge the Constitution again with his illegal immigration reforms. Not a pretty legacy in sight for him I'm afraid.


----------



## soloweygirl (Jun 9, 2012)

Designer1234 said:


> The point is - what is it to you whether I decide to stay or go as often as I want. Others do that all the time. Why does it bug you so much? If it was boring to you and still is, so what- don't read my posts. I did say the workshops took most of my time -- I did say I had to choose, which I did do - I chose what I felt was a positive endeavour rather than this nastiness. Now I am not doing the workshops and I have decided, until I make up my mind whether to start them up again, that I will stay on these threads as long and post as often as I wish to. It isn't really any of your business whether I come in once a month, once a week, once a day or miss a month, miss a day, or miss an hour. I don't keep track of your posts or anyone elses, or count them.
> 
> I don't know why it seems to bother you so much.


It doesn't bother me whether you stay or leave - believe me. What does bother me is YOUR WHINING about it, over and over and over again. Grow up - that's something you should have done a long time ago.


----------



## soloweygirl (Jun 9, 2012)

knitpresentgifts said:


> Ah, come on Solo, let them have their fun.
> 
> You know Libs, when they have no valid argument or facts (rarely do they), they resort to insults and name calling. Seriously, what else can they do? They'll not think to join the correct side of the argument, listen to the facts, change their minds and will go down spouting their insults and vulgar lies and statements.
> 
> ...


I guess we should also give Damemary a few kudos for staying above it all as well. Maybe the whole scenario was planned by Farmwoman and Damemary, who are sitting back and having a good laugh. I hope they both have sturdy chairs.


----------



## soloweygirl (Jun 9, 2012)

knitpresentgifts said:


> You said it, source it and prove it.


Don't cancel your plans for the weekend.


----------



## soloweygirl (Jun 9, 2012)

SQM said:


> Wasn't Ozzie Osbourne in Black Shabbat? Your guy has a great voice.


Yes, Ozzie Osbourne was the lead singer in Black Sabbath for a number of years - until he was kicked out and pursued a solo career.


----------



## SQM (Jun 22, 2012)

soloweygirl said:


> Yes, Ozzie Osbourne was the lead singer in Black Sabbath for a number of years - until he was kicked out and pursued a solo career.


Mrs. Girl - I realized I have no sense about who you are. Are you retired? Did you listen to rock music? To you have kids and or grands?

It will be nice to meet you.


----------



## west coast kitty (May 26, 2012)

damemary said:


> And you make no sense. Sorry. Oh, what am I being accused? I only send PM's where appropriate to discuss something privately. Are you saying you have access to others' PM's? Please clarify.


You seem to have forgotten your totally disgraceful behaviour when you received a pm that Yarnie sent to you in error. Not only did you publicly refer to it on more than one occasion, you also passed it on to others who also referred to it and inferred that they themselves had received the pm. That episode clearly demonstrated your lack of integrity.


----------



## Wombatnomore (Dec 9, 2013)

west coast kitty said:


> You seem to have forgotten your totally disgraceful behaviour when you received a pm that Yarnie sent to you in error. Not only did you publicly refer to it on more than one occasion, you also passed it on to others who also referred to it and inferred that they themselves had received the pm. That episode clearly demonstrated your lack of integrity.


The real question is, how can someone send a PM by mistake? Think about it.


----------



## SQM (Jun 22, 2012)

Wombatnomore said:


> The real question is, how can someone send a PM by mistake? Think about it.


Mystery Solved without a hunt. Brava Sherlock!


----------



## Designer1234 (Aug 9, 2011)

soloweygirl said:


> It doesn't bother me whether you stay or leave - believe me. What does bother me is YOUR WHINING about it, over and over and over again. Grow up - that's something you should have done a long time ago.




That wasn't a whine, that was a song -- I had a cold! I prefer to be young in spirit, even though my hair is grey!! :thumbup: :thumbup: ;-) ;-)


----------



## Gerslay (Oct 4, 2011)

Wombatnomore said:


> The real question is, how can someone send a PM by mistake? Think about it.


It was explained that she mistakenly clicked on the name next to the one she wanted on her buddy list. Seems a simple mistake and is very plausible to me.

We all make simple mistakes all the time. Course I never put my skirt on upside down, but that's a whole other can of worms!


----------



## cookiequeen (Jun 15, 2011)

Wombatnomore said:


> The real question is, how can someone send a PM by mistake? Think about it.


Plus, the content of it said something about Yarnie, too. I think that's the real cause for the embarrassment.


----------



## Wombatnomore (Dec 9, 2013)

Gerslay said:


> It was explained that she mistakenly clicked on the name next to the one she wanted on her buddy list. Seems a simple mistake and is very plausible to me.
> 
> We all make simple mistakes all the time. Course I never put my skirt on upside down, but that's a whole other can of worms!


I don't buy it. I've looked at the possibility of sending a PM to an unintended recipient and you just cannot do it.


----------



## Wombatnomore (Dec 9, 2013)

west coast kitty said:


> You seem to have forgotten your totally disgraceful behaviour when you received a pm that Yarnie sent to you in error. Not only did you publicly refer to it on more than one occasion, you also passed it on to others who also referred to it and inferred that they themselves had received the pm. That episode clearly demonstrated your lack of integrity.


Consider the integrity of your fearless leader threatening to publish my private communications with her.


----------



## Gerslay (Oct 4, 2011)

Wombatnomore said:


> Consider the integrity of your fearless leader threatening to publish my private communications with her.


You defend the one who did reveal a private communication and demean the one who didn't?


----------



## west coast kitty (May 26, 2012)

Wombatnomore said:


> The real question is, how can someone send a PM by mistake? Think about it.


Such a weak attempt to deflect from the issue that was raised. The subject was the ethics of mentioning or commenting on pm's - several of you felt that even a mention of a pm was inappropriate. Yarnie merely pointed out that some of those commenting have done the same or worse using Dame's behaviour as an example. Another example of hypocrisy on the part of those posters.


----------



## west coast kitty (May 26, 2012)

cookiequeen said:


> Plus, the content of it said something about Yarnie, too. I think that's the real cause for the embarrassment.


There's nothing embarrassing about saying to be careful of what you say to people that you don't really know.


----------



## west coast kitty (May 26, 2012)

Wombatnomore said:


> Consider the integrity of your fearless leader threatening to publish my private communications with her.


She didn't print your messages nor did she distribute them to others, yet you make excuses or applaud that behaviour?


----------



## west coast kitty (May 26, 2012)

Gerslay said:


> You defend the one who did reveal a private communication and demean the one who didn't?


 :thumbup: there is no logic in those arguments.


----------



## Gerslay (Oct 4, 2011)

west coast kitty said:


> :thumbup: there is no logic in those arguments.


Absolutely...a curious juxtaposition of values.


----------



## kwright (Mar 16, 2012)

Hi, all! I just wanted to say 'hello' that some of you that I have not made contact with in awhile. Y'all are in grand form. The pot has been well stirred, and the words are totally airborne. May the Ebola stay grounded. May the spirits in the wind touch you ever so gently as they go past, and may the God(s) of your Fathers bless you, keep you safe, and hold you. If you do not believe in any, then I guess it does not apply to you in your own opinion. Bye now.


----------



## Gerslay (Oct 4, 2011)

kwright said:


> Hi, all! I just wanted to say 'hello' that some of you that I have not made contact with in awhile. Y'all are in grand form. The pot has been well stirred, and the words are totally airborne. May the Ebola stay grounded. May the spirits in the wind touch you ever so gently as they go past, and may the God(s) of your Fathers bless you, keep you safe, and hold you. If you do not believe in any, then I guess it does not apply to you in your own opinion. Bye now.


Thank you, kwright, and may God bless you too!
:-D


----------



## SQM (Jun 22, 2012)

Hey Wright -

So nice to hear from you. And thanks for the good wishes.


----------



## Wombatnomore (Dec 9, 2013)

Gerslay said:


> You defend the one who did reveal a private communication and demean the one who didn't?


I haven't defended anyone.


----------



## Wombatnomore (Dec 9, 2013)

west coast kitty said:


> Such a weak attempt to deflect from the issue that was raised. The subject was the ethics of mentioning or commenting on pm's - several of you felt that even a mention of a pm was inappropriate. Yarnie merely pointed out that some of those commenting have done the same or worse using Dame's behaviour as an example. Another example of hypocrisy on the part of those posters.


I did not attempt to deflect the subject. In fact my post questioning the other person's integrity for threatening me is right on topic. You just don't want to hear it or believe it to be true.

I've thought all along that the PM sent to damemary was intentional and that's why I posted about it.

You're insulting my intelligence by stating that PM was "sent in error." PMs can not be sent in error. You'd have to be totally blind and using a non-brail keyboard to do so and if that's the case with Yarn person, she shouldn't be attempting to send them.


----------



## Designer1234 (Aug 9, 2011)

west coast kitty said:


> There's nothing embarrassing about saying to be careful of what you say to people that you don't really know.


I agree - but accidents do happen. I clicked reply on a pm and thought i had clicked it on the pm immediately above the one I was answering . I was fortunate that it was an innocuous message but I was glad I hadn't sent it to the wrong person. It is not hard to do. I think it is better in the long run to avoid pm's if you want to say something really private and email instead - that way it is not on KP at all.

We are all human and mistakes can be made. I have made them as have others -- the thing is -- it is nice if an apology is accepted which often on these threads just isn't in the cards.


----------



## Designer1234 (Aug 9, 2011)

Wombatnomore said:


> I did not attempt to deflect the subject. In fact my post questioning the other person's integrity for threatening me is right on topic. You just don't want to hear it or believe it to be true.
> 
> I've thought all along that the PM sent to damemary was intentional and that's why I posted about it.
> 
> You're insulting my intelligence by stating that PM was "sent in error." PMs can not be sent in error. You'd have to be totally blind and using a non-brail keyboard to do so and if that's the case with Yarn person, she shouldn't be attempting to send them.


==========
Wombat they can -- I have done it - see my post before this one. I am not saying it happened in the case you are talking about but It has happened to me because I was careless.

I also received so many pm's asking questions about classes and dates etc. when I was doing the workshops that personal messages got lost in the crowd. I still think that personal stuff is best sent by email. I don't always do that as usually nothing I want kept a secret is posted.

Kitty, how was Edmonton? the weather doesn't sound too bad in that area right now but it will get worse as you well know too. Glad we made it to the coast before it got too difficult to drive the Trans Canada with our car all loaded.


----------



## Poor Purl (Apr 14, 2011)

Wombatnomore said:


> I did not attempt to deflect the subject. In fact my post questioning the other person's integrity for threatening me is right on topic. You just don't want to hear it or believe it to be true.
> 
> I've thought all along that the PM sent to damemary was intentional and that's why I posted about it.
> 
> You're insulting my intelligence by stating that PM was "sent in error." PMs can not be sent in error. You'd have to be totally blind and using a non-brail keyboard to do so and if that's the case with Yarn person, she shouldn't be attempting to send them.


I think you can send a PM to the wrong person if you have that person on your Buddy List (does that make dame a buddy of yarnie?) and address the PM by clicking on "Send PM."

BUT if the PM was not meant for dame and simply landed in her inbox, then *it was no longer a private communication* (between yarnie and whoever she intended), and thus there was *nothing wrong with making it somewhat more public.*

What I found interesting was that your reference to "your fearless leader" was understood and accepted by all who got into the conversation. No more pretending that they have no leader.


----------



## Wombatnomore (Dec 9, 2013)

Designer1234 said:


> ==========
> Wombat they can -- I have done it - see my post before this one. I am not saying it happened in the case you are talking about but It has happened to me because I was careless.
> 
> I also received so many pm's asking questions about classes and dates etc. when I was doing the workshops that personal messages got lost in the crowd. I still think that personal stuff is best sent by email. I don't always do that as usually nothing I want kept a secret is posted.
> ...


You say in your previous post that you were "glad [you] hadn't sent it to the wrong person." I'm confused.


----------



## Gerslay (Oct 4, 2011)

Poor Purl said:


> I think you can send a PM to the wrong person if you have that person on your Buddy List (does that make dame a buddy of yarnie?) and address the PM by clicking on "Send PM."
> 
> BUT if the PM was not meant for dame and simply landed in her inbox, then *it was no longer a private communication* (between yarnie and whoever she intended), and thus there was *nothing wrong with making it somewhat more public.*
> 
> What I found interesting was that your reference to "your fearless leader" was understood and accepted by all who got into the conversation. No more pretending that they have no leader.


How many times do we have to tell you that KPG is not our leader? Lake is our Queen. KPG is fearless though, on that you are correct!


----------



## Country Bumpkins (Feb 18, 2011)

Gerslay said:


> How many times do we have to tell you that KPG is not our leader? Lake is our Queen. KPG is fearless though, on that you are correct!


----------



## susanmos2000 (May 10, 2011)

Poor Purl said:


> Poor Nebraska (birthplace of Charlie Starkweather; who knew?). You're trying to further a real discussion, but with KPG around nothing real can be discussed. Notice how she never speaks on a topic but only on what other people have said that she thinks she can criticize.
> 
> I read your links, and it sounds highly unlikely that the deputy actually has the disease. I often feel sore and have stomach pains, and I know I don't have Ebola.


You were correct, Purl--the deputy tested negative for Ebola. Thank goodness.


----------



## Poor Purl (Apr 14, 2011)

Gerslay said:


> How many times do we have to tell you that KPG is not our leader? Lake is our Queen. KPG is fearless though, on that you are correct!


How many times? Until it appears to be true. But I didn't call her "fearless"; that was Wombat's word. I'd need some evidence for that, too.

But you accept the rest of my message. Good.


----------



## knitpresentgifts (May 21, 2013)

Wombatnomore said:


> I did not attempt to deflect the subject. In fact my post questioning the other person's integrity for threatening me is right on topic. You just don't want to hear it or believe it to be true.
> 
> You're insulting my intelligence by stating that PM was "sent in error." PMs can not be sent in error.


Who do you think believes you and your lies? You're insulting everyones' intelligence. You were bested at your own game and it drives you mad. No one threatened you. What are you afraid of; that your private e-mails to me about those you slammed (the Libs) won't like what you've said about them even after your apology tour? First you slammed the Libs and befriend the Conservatives. Then you publicly and continue to slam the Conservatives while attempting to befriend the Libs. Who do you think you are kidding? You only communicated with me to see if I'd give you dirt on others. Once you learned I wouldn't and refused to play your stupid game, you turned on me and private communications stopped. Only problem, you have nothing bad to say about me, so you take every opportunity to insult and try to put me down with your made up BS.

I haven't shared any of our private conversations on KP because I do have integrity, am honest, and have no desire to hurt even you. You need all the help you can get.

You need to go the way of Beth, Dan, Betsy, Tuff, Freedom, Mountain, Blue C, LaFarge and the hundreds of other names you call yourself.

No one cares for your actions on KP, everyone knows your game on KP, including Admin. You are not interesting and are a complete bore.

Go burrow away your sorrows and search for your own integrity.
You want a friend? Learn to become one.

P.S. The PM was sent by mistake to the wrong person. How dense can you be to not understand how a simple and harmless mistake was made. Because you're a mole, you certainly know how to make mountains from your molehills. At least you're good at that.


----------



## knitpresentgifts (May 21, 2013)

Gerslay said:


> How many times do we have to tell you that KPG is not our leader? Lake is our Queen. KPG is fearless though, on that you are correct!


Oh, you flatter me. The Queen won't like this, nope, not at'll.

Hail to the Queen! :-D


----------



## Designer1234 (Aug 9, 2011)

Wombatnomore said:


> You say in your previous post that you were "glad [you] hadn't sent it to the wrong person." I'm confused.


I just meant - that It would have been confusing to the other person to have received it.

It was a discussion about something personal -an answer to a question about a workshop. I just learned to be careful. 
Wombat, I am not taking you on. I am just saying that it is possible to send a pm to the wrong person. It happens.

In my case it was not a conversation that I wanted kept private - some of our pm's are private conversations - that is what they are set up for. things we don't care to discuss on the forum. The one I balled up wasn't one that I really cared about sharing but it couild have been.

Didn't this subject happen months ago? Why are we re hashing it now?


----------



## Wombatnomore (Dec 9, 2013)

knitpresentgifts said:


> Who do you think believes you and your lies? You're insulting everyones' intelligence. You were bested at your own game and it drives you mad. No one threatened you. What are you afraid of; that your private e-mails to me about those you slammed (the Libs) won't like what you've said about them even after your apology tour? First you slammed the Libs and befriend the Conservatives. Then you slammed the Conservatives and then befriend the Libs. Who do you think you are kidding? You only communicated with me to see if I'd give you dirt on others. Once you learned I wouldn't and refused to play your stupid game, you turned on me. Only problem, you have nothing bad to say about me, so you take every opportunity to insult and try to put me down with your made up BS.
> 
> I haven't shared any of our private conversations on KP because I do have integrity, am honest, and have no desire to hurt even you. You need all the help you can get.
> 
> ...


My oh my! I always know when I or anyone else is getting to you and it's due to the tone of your posts. But I'm not interested in getting into another slanging match with you except to say your above post does not reflect you to be a person of integrity and you did threaten me. Go back and look at your posts. I can't be bothered.


----------



## Wombatnomore (Dec 9, 2013)

Designer1234 said:


> I just meant - that It would have been confusing to the other person to have received it.
> 
> It was a discussion about something personal -an answer to a question about a workshop. I just learned to be careful.
> Wombat, I am not taking you on. I am just saying that it is possible to send a pm to the wrong person. It happens.
> ...


No.


----------



## knitpresentgifts (May 21, 2013)

Wombatnomore said:


> My oh my! I always know when I or anyone else is getting to you and it's due to the tone of your posts. But I'm not interested in getting into another slanging match with you except to say your above post does not reflect you to be a person of integrity and you did threaten me. Go back and look at your posts. I can't be bothered.


Oh, my! I always know when I or anyone else gets to you with the *truth* because you cannot handle the truth.

You cannot prove a single thing you say, so you lie and change your tone after you've been called out and exposed. I know you'll be bringing me up again soon and slinging it. I cannot wait to read and then ignore those childish outbursts as well.

Go back and read your two posts on Oct 7th where you bought this idiotic topic up again and said, "do or or do not do it, I don't care."

Because, today, apparently you *do* care. Let me know when you make up your mind, Ok?

Try to have a good day and be a friend, Vocal mate.


----------



## Designer1234 (Aug 9, 2011)

knitpresentgifts said:


> Oh, my! I always know when I or anyone else gets to you with the *truth* because you cannot handle the truth.
> 
> You cannot prove a single thing you say, so make it personal, lie again and again and change your tone after you've been called out and exposed. I know you'll be bringing me up again soon and slinging it. I cannot wait to ignore those outbursts as well.
> 
> Try to have a good day mate.


----------



## Gerslay (Oct 4, 2011)

Poor Purl said:


> How many times? Until it appears to be true. But I didn't call her "fearless"; that was Wombat's word. I'd need some evidence for that, too.
> 
> *But you accept the rest of my message.* Good.


I do not accept your comment now bolded.

I guess that's what I have to do with you from now on -- agree or disagree with each and every sentence? Nice game you've started!


----------



## soloweygirl (Jun 9, 2012)

SQM said:


> Mrs. Girl - I realized I have no sense about who you are. Are you retired? Did you listen to rock music? To you have kids and or grands?
> 
> It will be nice to meet you.


I listen to a variety of music, from Doo *** to Motown to R&B to country to bubble gum to easy listening to rock. Heavy metal is not my thing - too much screaming which drowns out any music as far as I'm concerned. Did enjoy watching the guitarists jump around in their skin tight pants though.


----------



## SQM (Jun 22, 2012)

soloweygirl said:


> I listen to a variety of music, from Doo *** to Motown to R&B to country to bubble gum to easy listening to rock. Heavy metal is not my thing - too much screaming which drowns out any music as far as I'm concerned. Did enjoy watching the guitarists jump around in their skin tight pants though.


Ha ha. So you are a hottie!


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## RachelL (Dec 18, 2011)

cookiequeen said:


> A chazer bleibt a chazer


Ooomein!


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## SQM (Jun 22, 2012)

What does bleibt mean? This is my favorite Al.


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## Poor Purl (Apr 14, 2011)

SQM said:


> What does bleibt mean? This is my favorite Al.


remains or stays (verbs, not nouns).


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## SQM (Jun 22, 2012)

Thanks for the translation. I like that expression. How do you pronounce bleibt?


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## Poor Purl (Apr 14, 2011)

SQM said:


> Thanks for the translation. I like that expression. How do you pronounce bleibt?


long i


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## Poor Purl (Apr 14, 2011)

Gerslay said:


> I do not accept your comment now bolded.
> 
> I guess that's what I have to do with you from now on -- agree or disagree with each and every sentence? Nice game you've started!


Not worth the trouble. I forfeit the game.


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## Wombatnomore (Dec 9, 2013)

Would you be comfortable if these two were allowed to return to their homeland Austria?:

http://nypost.com/2014/10/10/pregnant-teen-girls-who-joined-isis-weve-made-a-huge-mistake/

I wouldn't trust them under any circumstances. Why? Who is to know they're not planning to return to commit terrorist acts. I doubt their government would prohibit their return. At least I hope so.


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## Poor Purl (Apr 14, 2011)

Wombatnomore said:


> Would you be comfortable if these two were allowed to return to their homeland Austria?:
> 
> http://nypost.com/2014/10/10/pregnant-teen-girls-who-joined-isis-weve-made-a-huge-mistake/
> 
> I wouldn't trust them under any circumstances. Why? Who is to know they're not planning to return to commit terrorist acts. I doubt their government would prohibit their return. At least I hope so.


The NY Post is a sensationalist paper (I hesitate to call it a *news*paper) owned by your fellow Aussie - you guessed it - Rupert Murdoch. If these girls actually exist, I doubt that there are many facts in the story itself.


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## Wombatnomore (Dec 9, 2013)

Poor Purl said:


> The NY Post is a sensationalist paper (I hesitate to call it a *news*paper) owned by your fellow Aussie - you guessed it - Rupert Murdoch. If these girls actually exist, I doubt that there are many facts in the story itself.


How embarrassing. 

What's the go with the New York Times?


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## Wombatnomore (Dec 9, 2013)

Oh no, Murdoch's tentacles reach new depths:

http://finance.ninemsn.com.au/newsbusiness/aap/8917719/merger-makes-new-tv-production-powerhouse

He is hell bent on taking over the world. Maybe we should demand that he create an army to deal with IS? Why not? The guy is worth squillions and his corrupt capital ways deserve to be exploited for the common good. Yesterday.


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## Wombatnomore (Dec 9, 2013)

So IS is charging forward despite airstrikes from the coalition of the willing. They have boasted that they've taken 40% of Kobane in Syria and now they're advancing further in Iraq:

http://edition.cnn.com/2014/10/10/world/meast/isis-threat/

I understand that the allies want the respective armies of Syria and Iraq to topple IS but is that realistic? Turkey initially swore they would not allow IS to take border town of Kobane in Syria but have not acted yet. It's a bloody circus and it's victims, the Kurds are paying a price they should not have to pay. Pathetic.


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## SQM (Jun 22, 2012)

Wombatnomore said:


> How embarrassing.
> 
> What's the go with the New York Times?


Don't be embarrassed. I assume very few of us can name the newspaper in the Famous Melbourne.

The Times is the real newspaper. Considered one of the best in the country.


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## MaidInBedlam (Jul 24, 2012)

I find it interesting that we talk about *"the lies"(plural) * and *"the truth"(singular)* as if there are many lies but only one truth. This hardly seems realistic.


knitpresentgifts said:


> Oh, my! I always know when I or anyone else gets to you with the *truth* because you cannot handle the truth.
> 
> You cannot prove a single thing you say, so you lie and change your tone after you've been called out and exposed. I know you'll be bringing me up again soon and slinging it. I cannot wait to read and then ignore those childish outbursts as well.
> 
> ...


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## Designer1234 (Aug 9, 2011)

This is just an information note to let you know that I am opening the workshops again. If you are interested please
go to Workshop Happenings l0/14 at the following link.

http://www.knittingparadise.com/t-291636-1.html


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## susanmos2000 (May 10, 2011)

Wombatnomore said:


> Would you be comfortable if these two were allowed to return to their homeland Austria?:
> 
> http://nypost.com/2014/10/10/pregnant-teen-girls-who-joined-isis-weve-made-a-huge-mistake/
> 
> I wouldn't trust them under any circumstances. Why? Who is to know they're not planning to return to commit terrorist acts. I doubt their government would prohibit their return. At least I hope so.


I too wouldn't trust them--but let's not forget that these are underage children. If their families can manage to retrieve them I think their respective countries have a moral obligation to readmit them, debrief them, and allow them to resume their normal lives (under close supervision, of course). These girls seem naive and gullible, and I don't think they should be punished for life for one very dumb decision.


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## susanmos2000 (May 10, 2011)

Designer1234 said:


> This is just an information note to let you know that I am opening the workshops again. If you are interested please
> go to Workshop Happenings l0/14 at the following link.
> 
> http://www.knittingparadise.com/t-291636-1.html


Hi, Designer. I've never been involved in a workshop before and am definitely interested. The stashbuster sweater in particular is particularly tempting--I've knitted a few sweaters in the past and have been disappointed with the results each and every time. Maybe with a bit of guidance I could manage to avoid all the pitfalls that seem to come with this sort of project. Please keep us posted as to when the sweater workshop is to begin--I'm definitely in.


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## Designer1234 (Aug 9, 2011)

I will certainly do that. I think the Stashbuster is a very good one - we work with different yarns and different textures as well as different colors. I wear mine all the time and have a couple of coats I made the same way

Coats of many colors. check out the workshops if any of you get the chance - so much info there. I will gracefully back off posting as muchhere but will still be hanging around these threads. Too many friends and others to leave.


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## SQM (Jun 22, 2012)

Designer1234 said:


> This is just an information note to let you know that I am opening the workshops again. If you are interested please
> go to Workshop Happenings l0/14 at the following link.
> 
> http://www.knittingparadise.com/t-291636-1.html


YAY! Designer is back in town!!!!!

Shirley is there any way to make those baby top down triangular sweaters in adult size?


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## Designer1234 (Aug 9, 2011)

SQM said:


> YAY! Designer is back in town!!!!!
> 
> Shirley is there any way to make those baby top down triangular sweaters in adult size?


I am not sure which ones you are talking about - but usually we can figure something out. How about posting a pic or a pm giving me a link and I will see if that can be done.


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## SQM (Jun 22, 2012)

Designer1234 said:


> I am not sure which ones you are talking about - but usually we can figure something out. How about posting a pic or a pm giving me a link and I will see if that can be done.


You know those baby all-in-ones that make up the majority of the pictures here. They usually have a yoke and are knit top down. If I see one today, I will pm it to you.


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## Wombatnomore (Dec 9, 2013)

susanmos2000 said:


> I too wouldn't trust them--but let's not forget that these are underage children. If their families can manage to retrieve them I think their respective countries have a moral obligation to readmit them, debrief them, and allow them to resume their normal lives (under close supervision, of course). These girls seem naive and gullible, and I don't think they should be punished for life for one very dumb decision.


That's a fair point. If they are well supervised, of course.


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## SQM (Jun 22, 2012)

Wombatnomore said:


> That's a fair point. If they are well supervised, of course.


Why are you up at your ungodly hour?


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## Designer1234 (Aug 9, 2011)

SQM said:


> You know those baby all-in-ones that make up the majority of the pictures here. They usually have a yoke and are knit top down. If I see one today, I will pm it to you.


if you can find a picture on KP send me the link and I will see if it is possible to do an adult sweater.


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## Wombatnomore (Dec 9, 2013)

SQM said:


> Why are you up at your ungodly hour?


It is an ungodly hour. Woke up, had urge for a coffee, rest is history.


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## DGreen (Nov 1, 2012)

susanmos2000 said:


> I too wouldn't trust them--but let's not forget that these are underage children. If their families can manage to retrieve them I think their respective countries have a moral obligation to readmit them, debrief them, and allow them to resume their normal lives (under close supervision, of course). These girls seem naive and gullible, and I don't think they should be punished for life for one very dumb decision.


I agree - naïve and gullible. No reason to consign them to a lifetime of punishment under extreme Islamic control. Also, an issue we seldom discuss - they are now subject to genital mutilation as is the custom there. Horrific.


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## SQM (Jun 22, 2012)

Designer1234 said:


> if you can find a picture on KP send me the link and I will see if it is possible to do an adult sweater.


I hope this works. But I just need a simple pattern without a fancy yoke. Thanks.


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## Wombatnomore (Dec 9, 2013)

SQM said:


> I hope this works. But I just need a simple pattern without a fancy yoke.  Thanks.


Clicked on download and noticed OP has 68 private messages!


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## Knitted by Nan (Aug 3, 2013)

Wombatnomore said:


> Clicked on download and noticed OP has 68 private messages!


Yes I saw that and for a moment I thought I had all those private messages. Just proves that 2.31 am is past my bedtime. Also, some people must get a lot more PMs than I do.


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## SQM (Jun 22, 2012)

Wombatnomore said:


> Clicked on download and noticed OP has 68 private messages!


Didn't see it. I removed the link.


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## Poor Purl (Apr 14, 2011)

MaidInBedlam said:


> I find it interesting that we talk about *"the lies"(plural) * and *"the truth"(singular)* as if there are many lies but only one truth. This hardly seems realistic.


At first I thought, "Great question!" Then the answer came: the truth is the same for everyone at every time (except quantum physicists and Werner Heisenberg), but each lie depends on its author, its purpose,.... So one truth, many lies. That's what it's all about!


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## DGreen (Nov 1, 2012)

Poor Purl said:


> At first I thought, "Great question!" Then the answer came: the truth is the same for everyone at every time (except quantum physicists and Werner Heisenberg), but each lie depends on its author, its purpose,.... So one truth, many lies. That's what it's all about!


Then there is opinion.

How many people are there in the world? That's how many opinions there are.


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## SQM (Jun 22, 2012)

Poor Purl said:


> At first I thought, "Great question!" Then the answer came: the truth is the same for everyone at every time (except quantum physicists and Werner Heisenberg), but each lie depends on its author, its purpose,.... So one truth, many lies. That's what it's all about!


The truth is relative. Allah is the truth for a muslim while no god is the truth for atheists. Besides for science and math, the truth can vary. And Bright Green adds opinion to the mix which makes The Truth even more relative.


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## Knitter from Nebraska (Jun 9, 2013)

A healthcare worker who cared for Ebola patient at Texas Presbyterian, has tested positive for Ebola.
http://abcnews.go.com/Health/texas-health-care-worker-tests-positive-ebola/story?id=26135108

Fox news quotes Dr Daniel Varga, of Texas Health Resources as saying that "the worker WAS in full protective gear when they provided care to Duncan during his SECOND visit to the hospital".
http://www.foxnews.com/health/2014/10/12/health-care-worker-at-dallas-hospital-tests-positive-for-ebola/


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## Wombatnomore (Dec 9, 2013)

I like this:

There's my side of story and there's your side of the story and then there's the truth.


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## susanmos2000 (May 10, 2011)

Wombatnomore said:


> That's a fair point. If they are well supervised, of course.


Frankly, I think the appeal ISIS holds for these girls can be traced to major failings on the part of Western society. I'm sure it all seems like an adventure to them--certainly more exciting and exotic than the typical routine of high school, university, a dreary part-time job, etc. And I think the fact that Western converts are pretty rare plays into their decision to join--it appears that the girls are most often wooed away by an ISIS contact who succeeds in making them feel special and highly prized. They remind me of teens who listen to the sweet talk of older men and end up running away with them, much to their families' consternation.


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## Knitter from Nebraska (Jun 9, 2013)

DGreen said:


> Then there is opinion.
> 
> How many people are there in the world? That's how many opinions there are.


I disagree! Most people do not form their own opinions. They believe what they're told.


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## Wombatnomore (Dec 9, 2013)

Knitter from Nebraska said:


> A healthcare worker who cared for Ebola patient at Texas Presbyterian, has tested positive for Ebola.
> http://abcnews.go.com/Health/texas-health-care-worker-tests-positive-ebola/story?id=26135108
> 
> Fox news quotes Dr Daniel Varga, of Texas Health Resources as saying that "the worker WAS in full protective gear when they provided care to Duncan during his SECOND visit to the hospital".
> http://www.foxnews.com/health/2014/10/12/health-care-worker-at-dallas-hospital-tests-positive-for-ebola/


It's a worry. But I have faith in the US's ability to keep it in check just as I have faith in Australia's ability to deal with it (when it gets here).


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## Wombatnomore (Dec 9, 2013)

susanmos2000 said:


> Frankly, I think the appeal ISIS holds for these girls can be traced to major failings on the part of Western society. I'm sure it all seems like an adventure to them--certainly more exciting and exotic than the typical routine of high school, university, a dreary part-time job, etc. And I think the fact that Western converts are pretty rare plays into their decision to join--it appears that the girls are most often wooed away by an ISIS contact who succeeds in making them feel special and highly prized. They remind me of teens who listen to the sweet talk of older men and end up running away with them, much to their families' consternation.


True, like a novelty which wears off pretty quickly when they are faced with the barbarity which is IS.


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## DGreen (Nov 1, 2012)

susanmos2000 said:


> Frankly, I think the appeal ISIS holds for these girls can be traced to major failings on the part of Western society. I'm sure it all seems like an adventure to them--certainly more exciting and exotic than the typical routine of high school, university, a dreary part-time job, etc. And I think the fact that Western converts are pretty rare plays into their decision to join--it appears that the girls are most often wooed away by an ISIS contact who succeeds in making them feel special and highly prized. They remind me of teens who listen to the sweet talk of older men and end up running away with them, much to their families' consternation.


Western society AND the typical immaturity of the adolescent mind - exploring their place in the world apart from parents and authority. Some explore farther than others.


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## DGreen (Nov 1, 2012)

Knitter from Nebraska said:


> I disagree! Most people do not form their own opinions. They believe what they're told.


We know what you think, KPG. We've heard you tell us people are ignorant and don't think for themselves often enough.


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## Knitter from Nebraska (Jun 9, 2013)

Wombatnomore said:


> It's a worry. But I have faith in the US's ability to keep it in check just as I have faith in Australia's ability to deal with it (when it gets here).


I believe that the US has the "ability" to contain the disease but they're not using it. They are still allowing people from affected nations to enter the country. They are taking their temperature before and after they fly in. So what! They've already told us that the incubation period is up to 21 days. How is taking their temperature at the airport going to protect us?!? Duncan didn't have a fever when he entered the country, so why do they pretend that this is doing anything to protect Americans? They're also ASKING those who have come in contact with known cases to self isolate. There are those who will comply and those who won't. How is that going to contain the disease? There is much they could do to stop the spread of this disease, but they're not doing it!


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## susanmos2000 (May 10, 2011)

Wombatnomore said:


> True, like a novelty which wears off pretty quickly when they are faced with the barbarity which is IS.


Exactly. I think the rose-colored glasses fall away the instant they realize that the human rights they chose to give up can't be regained--in the blink of an eye they've changed from voluntary recruits to prisoners.


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## Wombatnomore (Dec 9, 2013)

Knitter from Nebraska said:


> I believe that the US has the "ability" to contain the disease but they're not using it. They are still allowing people from affected nations to enter the country. They are taking their temperature before and after they fly in. So what! They've already told us that the incubation period is up to 21 days. How is taking their temperature at the airport going to protect us?!? Duncan didn't have a fever when he entered the country, so why do they pretend that this is doing anything to protect Americans? They're also ASKING those who have come in contact with known cases to self isolate. There are those who will comply and those who won't. How is that going to contain the disease? There is much they could do to stop the spread of this disease, but they're not doing it!


Well this what the UN thinks:

http://www.news.com.au/world/breaking-news/we-can-control-ebola-spread-un-expert/story-e6frfkui-1227088197834

You could ban people from West Africa from entering the country but they'll still enter because all they have to do is leave from a different country.


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## susanmos2000 (May 10, 2011)

DGreen said:


> Western society AND the typical immaturity of the adolescent mind - exploring their place in the world apart from parents and authority. Some explore farther than others.


...and then find themselves mired in quicksand. You are so right, Green--the workings of the teenage mind makes these kids perfect recruits.


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## Wombatnomore (Dec 9, 2013)

susanmos2000 said:


> ...and then find themselves mired in quicksand. You are so right, Green--the workings of the teenage mind makes these kids perfect recruits.


I sorely remember my teenage years and have shared the journey with my son. Never again! It's such a difficult time and there's not a lot you can do about it except to love and guide them.


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## susanmos2000 (May 10, 2011)

Knitter from Nebraska said:


> I believe that the US has the "ability" to contain the disease but they're not using it. They are still allowing people from affected nations to enter the country. They are taking their temperature before and after they fly in. So what! They've already told us that the incubation period is up to 21 days. How is taking their temperature at the airport going to protect us?!? Duncan didn't have a fever when he entered the country, so why do they pretend that this is doing anything to protect Americans? They're also ASKING those who have come in contact with known cases to self isolate. There are those who will comply and those who won't. How is that going to contain the disease? There is much they could do to stop the spread of this disease, but they're not doing it!


I'm honestly surprised that you favor such a strict approach, Nebraska. After all, you spoken a number of times about encroaching totalitarianism and the dangers of letting the government micromanage our lives. Would you really favor granting the feds carte blanche to detain anyone they even suspected of being exposed to Ebola, locking them up in their apartments or Ebola quarantine camps, snooping through phone records and personal papers to determine every possible contact and then subjecting them to the same treatment? I'm not trying to be argumentative--I know you're genuinely worried about the Ebola crisis, but I do wonder how many basic rights you'd be willing to give up to keep yourself safe.


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## DGreen (Nov 1, 2012)

Wombatnomore said:


> Well this what the UN thinks:
> 
> http://www.news.com.au/world/breaking-news/we-can-control-ebola-spread-un-expert/story-e6frfkui-1227088197834
> 
> You could ban people from West Africa from entering the country but they'll still enter because all they have to do is leave from a different country.


The CDC makes dire predictions if conditions remain unchanged. The place to stop this horror is where it started, not only for our own protection, but because it is the humanitarian thing to do. The UN spokesman talks about systems in place being enough to see a DOWNTURN in cases within three months. THREE MONTHS? By then thousands more will have been infected and thousands more will have died. I agree with the CDC in that conditions need to be changed - and now. There are stories emerging about "community care centers" in the region that are very troubling, if true. Without aggressive disinfection and protective gear and proper disposal of bodies, they could become nothing more than death camps.

I don't believe the UN has a grasp of this at all and if they do, they are obviously lying.


----------



## Knitter from Nebraska (Jun 9, 2013)

Wombatnomore said:


> Well this what the UN thinks:
> 
> http://www.news.com.au/world/breaking-news/we-can-control-ebola-spread-un-expert/story-e6frfkui-1227088197834
> 
> You could ban people from West Africa from entering the country but they'll still enter because all they have to do is leave from a different country.


So, the doctor from the UN says they can turn things around in three months. Question: why haven't they before now? What have they been waiting for? I do agree with his statement that it's "less necessary" to screen those entering the country. That's the point I was making, along with the point that voluntary isolation will not contain the disease. Even the NBC news crew that were exposed to Muckpo (ebola patient at UNMC), violated the voluntary quarantine. They had to be issued an order to quarantine themselves.


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## Knitter from Nebraska (Jun 9, 2013)

Oops! Double post! My tablet has a mind of it's own today. Long delays and crazy autocorrect!


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## DGreen (Nov 1, 2012)

susanmos2000 said:


> I'm honestly surprised that you favor such a strict approach, Nebraska. After all, you spoken a number of times about encroaching totalitarianism and the dangers of letting the government micromanage our lives. Would you really favor granting the feds carte blanche to detain anyone they even suspected of being exposed to Ebola, locking them up in their apartments or Ebola quarantine camps, snooping through phone records and personal papers to determine every possible contact and then subjecting them to the same treatment? I'm not trying to be argumentative--I know you're genuinely worried about the Ebola crisis, but I do wonder how many basic rights you'd be willing to give up to keep yourself safe.


I always worry about the logistics of any plan to enforce quarantines. People need to eat, pay their bills. The economic fallout of being quarantined for many would be catastrophic. Do we have enough trained medical personnel to provide care for anyone who IS infected, whether at home or elsewhere? Too many questions and too much speculation. Truly frightening.


----------



## Poor Purl (Apr 14, 2011)

SQM said:


> The truth is relative. Allah is the truth for a muslim while no god is the truth for atheists. Besides for science and math, the truth can vary. And Bright Green adds opinion to the mix which makes The Truth even more relative.


Opinion only coincidentally has anything to do with the truth. But truth is absolute, the same for everyone - they just may not know what it is. If the universe exists (and I think everyone not on thorazine knows it does), it exists outside of anybody's mind.

Your examples have to do with faith, which is more like opinion. If there happens to be a god, whosever it is, then that's the truth; if there happens to be none, then that's the truth - but these are things we may never know.

I have a conference to get to, so have to stop, but I'll be back later. And that's the truth.


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## Poor Purl (Apr 14, 2011)

Wombatnomore said:


> I like this:
> 
> There's my side of story and there's your side of the story and then there's the truth.


YES!


----------



## susanmos2000 (May 10, 2011)

Knitter from Nebraska said:


> So, the doctor from the UN says they can turn things around in three months. Question: why haven't they before now? What have they been waiting for? I do agree with his statement that it's "less necessary" to screen those entering the country. That's the point I was making, along with the point that voluntary isolation will not contain the disease. Even the NBC news crew that were exposed to Muckpo (ebola patient at UNMC), violated the voluntary quarantine. They had to be issued an order to quarantine themselves.


Well, what would you do if you discovered that one of your casual contacts--say the guy who bagged your groceries or the woman sitting beside you at the hair salon--had developed Ebola? I assume you're retired and receive SS, so perhaps you could afford to sit through a three-week quarantine...but not everyone is as fortunate. Men and women in their prime with families to support _have_ to keep working, have to keep generating income. Imagine a secretary or low-level manager phoning his or her boss to say that they may have been exposed to Ebola and can't come to work for twenty-one days--they'd be fired on the spot. We know the Ebola is not highly contagious, and so I think it's awfully tempting for folks who may have been exposed to shrug off the worry and keep on with their daily routines.


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## Knitter from Nebraska (Jun 9, 2013)

susanmos2000 said:


> I'm honestly surprised that you favor such a strict approach, Nebraska. After all, you spoken a number of times about encroaching totalitarianism and the dangers of letting the government micromanage our lives. Would you really favor granting the feds carte blanche to detain anyone they even suspected of being exposed to Ebola, locking them up in their apartments or Ebola quarantine camps, snooping through phone records and personal papers to determine every possible contact and then subjecting them to the same treatment? I'm not trying to be argumentative--I know you're genuinely worried about the Ebola crisis, but I do wonder how many basic rights you'd be willing to give up to keep yourself safe.


No, none of those things. I believe that instead of voluntary isolation, an order of quarantine should be issued. Anyone violating the order would be put under quarantine involuntarily. But at the same time, they should make sure that the individual's needs are met ie food and necessities. Healthcare workers or CDC should make home visits (in protective gear, of course). People cannot remain in voluntary isolation if they don't have the necessities that they need to stay in. They should also be assured of job protection. You can't expect anyone to voluntarily give up everything.


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## Knitter from Nebraska (Jun 9, 2013)

DGreen said:


> I always worry about the logistics of any plan to enforce quarantines. People need to eat, pay their bills. The economic fallout of being quarantined for many would be catastrophic. Do we have enough trained medical personnel to provide care for anyone who IS infected, whether at home or elsewhere? Too many questions and too much speculation. Truly frightening.


I agree! These things need to be addressed.


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## susanmos2000 (May 10, 2011)

DGreen said:


> I always worry about the logistics of any plan to enforce quarantines. People need to eat, pay their bills. The economic fallout of being quarantined for many would be catastrophic. Do we have enough trained medical personnel to provide care for anyone who IS infected, whether at home or elsewhere? Too many questions and too much speculation. Truly frightening.


I agree--it's mind boggling to imagine the fallout if draconian anti-Ebola measures were put in place. Imagine the blow to the economy if the borders were completely sealed--no on in, no one out--as some Americans wish. Imagine too the government trying to provide for tens even hundreds of thousands of folks who were sealed in their apartments because they knew someone who knew someone who'd been exposed. It is frightening.


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## SQM (Jun 22, 2012)

Knitter from Nebraska said:


> A healthcare worker who cared for Ebola patient at Texas Presbyterian, has tested positive for Ebola.
> http://abcnews.go.com/Health/texas-health-care-worker-tests-positive-ebola/story?id=26135108
> 
> Fox news quotes Dr Daniel Varga, of Texas Health Resources as saying that "the worker WAS in full protective gear when they provided care to Duncan during his SECOND visit to the hospital".
> http://www.foxnews.com/health/2014/10/12/health-care-worker-at-dallas-hospital-tests-positive-for-ebola/


Hey you beat Our Wombat for posting the bad news.


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## susanmos2000 (May 10, 2011)

Knitter from Nebraska said:


> No, none of those things. I believe that instead of voluntary isolation, an order of quarantine should be issued. Anyone violating the order would be put under quarantine involuntarily. But at the same time, they should make sure that the individual's needs are met ie food and necessities. Healthcare workers or CDC should make home visits (in protective gear, of course). People cannot remain in voluntary isolation if they don't have the necessities that they need to stay in. They should also be assured of job protection. You can't expect anyone to voluntarily give up everything.


No, you can't. It's tempting, I think, to want to seal off the country and put out a "Temporarily closed for business" sign until the Ebola epidemic is under control. But we just can't. People need to work and the economy has to keep ticking along--the medical crisis will end at some point, but if our country is devastated economically it won't much matter.


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## SQM (Jun 22, 2012)

Do you think the govt. is lying about the transmission of Ebola? How did the NBC (?) journalist catch it? Can it mutate to air-borne?


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## Knitter from Nebraska (Jun 9, 2013)

susanmos2000 said:


> Well, what would you do if you discovered that one of your casual contacts--say the guy who bagged your groceries or the woman sitting beside you at the hair salon--had developed Ebola? I assume you're retired and receive SS, so perhaps you could afford to sit through a three-week quarantine...but not everyone is as fortunate. Men and women in their prime with families to support _have_ to keep working, have to keep generating income. Imagine a secretary or low-level manager phoning his or her boss to say that they may have been exposed to Ebola and can't come to work for twenty-one days--they'd be fired on the spot. We know the Ebola is not highly contagious, and so I think it's awfully tempting for folks who may have been exposed to shrug off the worry and keep on with their daily routines.


I'm not retired and don't receive SS. I'm dependent upon my husband's income just as others are dependent upon their incomes. I absolutely agree that this issue needs to be addressed! We cannot expect people to voluntarily stay home if it means they'll lose their jobs, homes, utilities, etc... A bill offering emergency assistance should be put before Congress immediately. And included in that bill should be job protection for those affected. For me personally? I would be able to isolate myself and would. But for many? It would be not only disastrous, but impossible.


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## Wombatnomore (Dec 9, 2013)

Knitter from Nebraska said:


> So, the doctor from the UN says they can turn things around in three months. Question: why haven't they before now? What have they been waiting for? I do agree with his statement that it's "less necessary" to screen those entering the country. That's the point I was making, along with the point that voluntary isolation will not contain the disease. Even the NBC news crew that were exposed to Muckpo (ebola patient at UNMC), violated the voluntary quarantine. They had to be issued an order to quarantine themselves.


I think they've dropped the ball by not acting sooner. This outbreak in West Africa has been bubbling along for months and months. Troops and specialist medical staff should have been deployed at the beginning IMO.

One of the biggest problems is the lack of infrastructure to nurse the affected people. That's only being addressed now.


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## Wombatnomore (Dec 9, 2013)

SQM said:


> Do you think the govt. is lying about the transmission of Ebola? How did the NBC (?) journalist catch it? Can it mutate to air-borne?


This is what I'm wondering. It's certainly a virulent bug and it's tenacious. Each time it infects it mutates slightly.


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## Knitter from Nebraska (Jun 9, 2013)

SQM said:


> Do you think the govt. is lying about the transmission of Ebola? How did the NBC (?) journalist catch it? Can it mutate to air-borne?


He says he helped clean out a car that an Ebola patient had ridden in. Sprayed it with disinfectant, assumably some of the spray hit him. I can't imagine why he'd do this without protective gear or why he'd do it at all.


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## Wombatnomore (Dec 9, 2013)

Poor Purl said:


> YES!


Here is another one I like and I said this to a newspaper reporter at a Coronial Inquest:

Don't let the truth get in the way of a good story!


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## susanmos2000 (May 10, 2011)

Wombatnomore said:


> This is what I'm wondering. It's certainly a virulent bug and it's tenacious. Each time it infects it mutates slightly.


I read something about that--can't remember the source, I'm afraid. I believe the gist of the article was the more contagious a virus is the greater the chance of mutation. The flu virus can mutate with ease in part because of its physical structure and partly because it's spread by the millions. I'm sure we have little to fear here in the West, where transmission is very uncommon, but it would be a different story in places like Liberia. I suppose if it does indeed mutate we'll see it first there, where the victims number in the tens of thousands.


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## susanmos2000 (May 10, 2011)

Knitter from Nebraska said:


> He says he helped clean out a car that an Ebola patient had ridden in. Sprayed it with disinfectant, assumably some of the spray hit him. I can't imagine why he'd do this without protective gear or why he'd do it at all.


I think it's just human nature to want to help others out, and that's a very good thing. The stories coming out of badly-hit areas are horrific, with people so frightened of the disease that little children whose parents have died being left to fend for themselves. It's really a terrible thing when people begin looking out for themselves and themselves alone.


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## Wombatnomore (Dec 9, 2013)

I know the Daily Mail is a rag but I thought I'd post this:

http://www.dailymail.co.uk/news/article-2789995/isis-publish-article-written-british-hostage-john-cantlie.html


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## Knitter from Nebraska (Jun 9, 2013)

SQM said:


> Do you think the govt. is lying about the transmission of Ebola? How did the NBC (?) journalist catch it? Can it mutate to air-borne?


I don't think "lying" is the right word. I think they're downplaying the situation. They say its only contagious with direct contact of bodily fluids but Canadian researchers experienced the spread of Ebola from pigs to monkeys, in close proximity, through aerosolized particles. The Ebolavirus can live on surfaces, though for how long, is debated. It's assumed that as soon as a person shows symptoms, they'll be too sick to be out and about. But what if they're out when they become sick? The incubation period varies from 2-21 days. I think we need to focus on the facts. Even those who are trained in disease control and are wearing protective equipment have contracted Ebola, either through failure of the equipment or through human error. We shouldn't underestimate the spread of the disease and we should take every precaution to contain it. Containment is the key!


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## SQM (Jun 22, 2012)

I remember in the '80s that people got nuts about Aids. The spread of ebola seems similar. Are we being hysterical?


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## susanmos2000 (May 10, 2011)

Knitter from Nebraska said:


> I don't think "lying" is the right word. I think they're downplaying the situation. They say its only contagious with direct contact of bodily fluids but Canadian researchers experienced the spread of Ebola from pigs to monkeys, in close proximity, through aerosolized particles. The Ebolavirus can live on surfaces, though for how long, is debated. It's assumed that as soon as a person shows symptoms, they'll be too sick to be out and about. But what if they're out when they become sick? The incubation period varies from 2-21 days. I think we need to focus on the facts. Even those who are trained in disease control and are wearing protective equipment have contracted Ebola, either through failure of the equipment or through human error.


I think it would have to be one or the other--how could a virus get through one of those hi-tech space suits if it was working properly? One thing to keep in mind is that the more ill someone with Ebola is the more contagious he or she is. Duncan eventually died of it, so of course his mortally-ill body was a major biological hazard--particularly in his last days. Protection needs to upped to the nth degree when dealing with folks who are seriously ill and leaking bodily fluids everywhere.


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## susanmos2000 (May 10, 2011)

SQM said:


> I remember in the '80s that people got nuts about Aids. The spread of ebola seems similar. Are we being hysterical?


I don't think so--never hurts to be extra cautious. I'm not unduly worried as I believe modern medicine will keep things more or less under control--but imagine if we'd had such an outbreak fifty years ago, in the time before genetic research and fast track vaccines. The world really would have been in serious trouble.


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## Knitter from Nebraska (Jun 9, 2013)

susanmos2000 said:


> I think it's just human nature to want to help others out, and that's a very good thing. The stories coming out of badly-hit areas are horrific, with people so frightened of the disease that little children whose parents have died being left to fend for themselves. It's really a terrible thing when people begin looking out for themselves and themselves alone.


I think that disinfecting places or things infected by Ebola should be left to professionals and certainly should be limited to those wearing protective gear. By his carelessness he put his co workers in danger and they are all in quarantine. And I never suggested that children be left to fend for themselves! Those children should be cared for in quarantine along with everyone else. The problem is that the world waited too long to do anything for these people. The situation became too huge for the countries to contain it. The key is to contain it quickly before it becomes out of control. Only time will tell if any country will do what they need to contain this disease.


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## Wombatnomore (Dec 9, 2013)

susanmos2000 said:


> I don't think so--never hurts to be extra cautious. I'm not unduly worried as I believe modern medicine will keep things more or less under control--but imagine if we'd had such an outbreak fifty years ago, in the time before genetic research and fast track vaccines. The world really would have been in serious trouble.


I read somewhere there is concern that Ebola will become a chronic epidemic. Now that's a scary thought.

The black plague was a huge problem way, way back. Here is some light reading!

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Black_Death


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## Knitter from Nebraska (Jun 9, 2013)

susanmos2000 said:


> I think it would have to be one or the other--how could a virus get through one of those hi-tech space suits if it was working properly? One thing to keep in mind is that the more ill someone with Ebola is the more contagious he or she is. Duncan eventually died of it, so of course his mortally-ill body was a major biological hazard--particularly in his last days. Protection needs to upped to the nth degree when dealing with folks who are seriously ill and leaking bodily fluids everywhere.


A lot has been said about not worrying about ebolavirus on surfaces. But if that were really the case, why did they incinerate nearly everything in the apartment that Duncan stayed in? Why not seal it up for a couple of days if the virus dies without a host? These poor people are left with almost nothing! Why?!?


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## susanmos2000 (May 10, 2011)

Knitter from Nebraska said:


> I think that disinfecting places or things infected by Ebola should be left to professionals and certainly should be limited to those wearing protective gear. By his carelessness he put his co workers in danger and they are all in quarantine. And I never suggested that children be left to fend for themselves! Those children should be cared for in quarantine along with everyone else. The problem is that the world waited too long to do anything for these people. The situation became too huge for the countries to contain it. The key is to contain it quickly before it becomes out of control. Only time will tell if any country will do what they need to contain this disease.


I didn't mean to imply that you did, Nebraska--of course no one would condone that. And I agree completely that dealing with Ebola patients--whether carting them off to the hospital or swabbing up their bodily fluids--is not a job for amateurs. That gunk coming out of them is toxic waste, and thankfully people are becoming more aware of it.


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## susanmos2000 (May 10, 2011)

Knitter from Nebraska said:


> A lot has been said about not worrying about ebolavirus on surfaces. But if that were really the case, why did they incinerate nearly everything in the apartment that Duncan stayed in? Why not seal it up for a couple of days if the virus dies without a host? These poor people are left with almost nothing! Why?!?


Well, Duncan was a biological time bomb. He became seriously ill and eventually died of the disease, so anything he touched was highly contaminated (the sicker one gets the higher the risk of contagion). I saw a snap of a Red Cross workers standing at arm's length to hand in clothing to the Duncan apartment--hopefully the residents were able to feed and clothe themselves adequately throughout the quarantine period. I think they were eventually put in a fresh home that some good-hearted and charitable people donated for that purpose.


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## susanmos2000 (May 10, 2011)

Wombatnomore said:


> I read somewhere there is concern that Ebola will become a chronic epidemic. Now that's a scary thought.
> 
> The black plague was a huge problem way, way back. Here is some light reading!
> 
> http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Black_Death


Ugh, yes--I've read about the Black Death. I think it finally burned itself out when practically everyone was a survivor and had resistance--a ghastly process that took hundreds of years. Hopefully we'll be luckier this time.


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## Wombatnomore (Dec 9, 2013)

Knitter from Nebraska said:


> A lot has been said about not worrying about ebolavirus on surfaces. But if that were really the case, why did they incinerate nearly everything in the apartment that Duncan stayed in? Why not seal it up for a couple of days if the virus dies without a host? These poor people are left with almost nothing! Why?!?


I haven't read or become aware of not worrying about surfaces. With anything this virulent and deadly I doubt there is anything else that can be done except to destroy most fomites which have come into contact with an infected person.


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## DGreen (Nov 1, 2012)

SQM said:


> I remember in the '80s that people got nuts about Aids. The spread of ebola seems similar. Are we being hysterical?


I think there is some hysteria, yes.

Ebola is different from AIDS. You can't catch AIDS just by touching a person's body, their sweat, blood or saliva, for instance. Much more intimate exchange of bodily fluids is necessary. People did get crazy, but the panic was educated away.

Ebola? Holding a sick person's sweaty hand could transmit the virus. Big difference as I understand it.


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## Wombatnomore (Dec 9, 2013)

DGreen said:


> I think there is some hysteria, yes.
> 
> Ebola is different from AIDS. You can't catch AIDS just by touching a person's body, their sweat, blood or saliva, for instance. Much more intimate exchange of bodily fluids is necessary. People did get crazy, but the panic was educated away.
> 
> Ebola? Holding a sick person's sweaty hand could transmit the virus. Big difference as I understand it.


I nursed AIDS patients back in the early '80s and the rigmarole of gowning, gloving, masking, head wear just to go into the room (which, knowing the mode of transmission was completely ridiculous). I felt so sorry for the poor patients, isolated because of ignorance.


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## Knitter from Nebraska (Jun 9, 2013)

I think another thing we have to consider is whether our healthcare workers will be walking off their jobs. There will always be those dedicated to healing that will stay to the very end. But what about those who will not take the risk? And what about all of those who work in supportive positions like receptionists, janitorial staff, or even nurse's aides? At what point will people decide that working in the healthcare industry is too dangerous? What are they going to do to assure people that even going to the emergency room will be safe? They need to start planning for these things now. They need to make sure that EVERY employee is protected. They need to make sure that everyone who comes into an emergency room is immediately isolated. Without these kinds of protections, no one will want to work there or even go there. 

The University of Nebraska Medical Center is where two Ebola patients have (and are) been (and are being) treated. It is also where I receive my healthcare. I'm giving this serious thought, especially in light of the latest person diagnosed. This person is a healthcare professional who WAS wearing protective gear. Just one incidence of human error could put me at risk. I'm grateful that at present, I'm healthy and don't need to go there at this time. But I'm a cancer survivor and have spent much time there. I'm considering changing healthcare systems. It comes down to whether I trust people I don't know, to not make a mistake.


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## sumpleby (Aug 3, 2013)

DGreen said:


> I think there is some hysteria, yes.
> 
> Ebola is different from AIDS. You can't catch AIDS just by touching a person's body, their sweat, blood or saliva, for instance. Much more intimate exchange of bodily fluids is necessary. People did get crazy, but the panic was educated away.
> 
> Ebola? Holding a sick person's sweaty hand could transmit the virus. Big difference as I understand it.


There is just as much hysteria now as there was about AIDS for years. People who had AIDS were shunned and vilified. No matter how much people were told about how it spread they refused to believe it. Sound familiar?


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## Knitter from Nebraska (Jun 9, 2013)

susanmos2000 said:


> Well, Duncan was a biological time bomb. He became seriously ill and eventually died of the disease, so anything he touched was highly contaminated (the sicker one gets the higher the risk of contagion). I saw a snap of a Red Cross workers standing at arm's length to hand in clothing to the Duncan apartment--hopefully the residents were able to feed and clothe themselves adequately throughout the quarantine period. I think they were eventually put in a fresh home that some good-hearted and charitable people donated for that purpose.


I think we need an honest answer on how long Ebola can live on surfaces. They keep assuring us with words but their actions say otherwise.


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## susanmos2000 (May 10, 2011)

Knitter from Nebraska said:


> I think another thing we have to consider is whether our healthcare workers will be walking off their jobs. There will always be those dedicated to healing that will stay to the very end. But what about those who will not take the risk? And what about all of those who work in supportive positions like receptionists, janitorial staff, or even nurse's aides? At what point will people decide that working in the healthcare industry is too dangerous? What are they going to do to assure people that even going to the emergency room will be safe? They need to start planning for these things now. They need to make sure that EVERY employee is protected. They need to make sure that everyone who comes into an emergency room is immediately isolated. Without these kinds of protections, no one will want to work there or even go there.
> 
> The University of Nebraska Medical Center is where two Ebola patients have (and are) been (and are being) treated. It is also where I receive my healthcare. I'm giving this serious thought, especially in light of the latest person diagnosed. This person is a healthcare professional who WAS wearing protective gear. Just one incidence of human error could put me at risk. I'm grateful that at present, I'm healthy and don't need to go there at this time. But I'm a cancer survivor and have spent much time there. I'm considering changing healthcare systems. It comes down to whether I trust people I don't know, to not make a mistake.


I'm not seriously worried about catching Ebola, but I admit I'd at least consider postponing any non-critical procedures until the virus is under control. The problem is that, if Ebola becomes a serious threat, EVERY emergency room and hospital will have seen at least one victim. Where do you go then?


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## Knitter from Nebraska (Jun 9, 2013)

sumpleby said:


> There is just as much hysteria now as there was about AIDS for years. People who had AIDS were shunned and vilified. No matter how much people were told about how it spread they refused to believe it. Sound familiar?


Are you suggesting that the scientists at the CDC and elsewhere are wrong about the mode of transmission in Ebola? The only information I've heard has come from the scientific community, not rumor nor speculation.


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## susanmos2000 (May 10, 2011)

Knitter from Nebraska said:


> I think we need an honest answer on how long Ebola can live on surfaces. They keep assuring us with words but their actions say otherwise.


Well, but researchers already know that. This from Vox:

"Ebola can also live on surfaces for a few hours, and in blood outside of the body, for up to a few days. So there is a risk of getting Ebola by touching a contaminated surface. But you'd then need to put your hands in your mouth or eyes. This is believed to be a less common mode of transmission. Again, most people seem to get infected through direct contact with bodily fluids."

I suppose the real question is how contaminated something like a table would be from the casual touch of an Ebola victim as opposed to s/he throwing up all over it. And I guess too that the risk of contracting it in a public place is rather small as someone who had the symptoms and was contagious would be unlikely to be sitting in a movie theater or browsing through a bookstore. They'd be home, probably, sick in bed and contaminating their own furniture, clothes, and bedding.


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## Knitter from Nebraska (Jun 9, 2013)

susanmos2000 said:


> I'm not seriously worried about catching Ebola, but I admit I'd at least consider postponing any non-critical procedures until the virus is under control. The problem is that, if Ebola becomes a serious threat, EVERY emergency room and hospital will have seen at least one victim. Where do you go then?


That's exactly how I feel! Except that I'm faced with the decision of whether to continue going where I go, knowing that Ebola is already in residence there. Would you go to your doctor if you knew there was Ebola in the building? (There are many buildings at UNMC, but I've been in all of them.). I'm not sure what I'm going to do. I'm just giving it some thought. If I had an emergency right now, I think I'd go to a different hospital, because I've not had time to work out how I feel.


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## Knitter from Nebraska (Jun 9, 2013)

susanmos2000 said:


> Well, but researchers already know that. This from Vox:
> 
> "Ebola can also live on surfaces for a few hours, and in blood outside of the body, for up to a few days. So there is a risk of getting Ebola by touching a contaminated surface. But you'd then need to put your hands in your mouth or eyes. This is believed to be a less common mode of transmission. Again, most people seem to get infected through direct contact with bodily fluids."
> 
> I suppose the real question is how contaminated something like a table would be from the casual touch of an Ebola victim as opposed to s/he throwing up all over it. And I guess too that the risk of contracting it in a public place is rather small as someone who had the symptoms and was contagious would be unlikely to be sitting in a movie theater or browsing through a bookstore. They'd be home, probably, sick in bed and contaminating their own furniture, clothes, and bedding.


But, if this is true, why did they incinerate all of the belongings of the woman whose apartment Duncan stayed in? Several days after he was admitted to the hospital?? I read that they only allowed her to keep a few photographs.


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## susanmos2000 (May 10, 2011)

Knitter from Nebraska said:


> That's exactly how I feel! Except that I'm faced with the decision of whether to continue going where I go, knowing that Ebola is already in residence there. Would you go to your doctor if you knew there was Ebola in the building? (There are many buildings at UNMC, but I've been in all of them.). I'm not sure what I'm going to do. I'm just giving it some thought. If I had an emergency right now, I think I'd go to a different hospital, because I've not had time to work out how I feel.


*shrug* I can't really blame you for that--really hard to willingly step into a place that has seen the bug when there are alternatives. As long as the situation isn't critical it can't hurt to postpone a procedure or choose a different hospital. I'm sure the risk of going to your usual doctor/hospital is minimal, but oh boy I'd be in a sweat for days afterwards worrying that every ache and pain was a symptom of the virus.


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## susanmos2000 (May 10, 2011)

Knitter from Nebraska said:


> But, if this is true, why did they incinerate all of the belongings of the woman whose apartment Duncan stayed in? Several days after he was admitted to the hospital?? I read that they only allowed her to keep a few photographs.


Again, I'm sure the apartment Duncan was staying in was highly contaminated. He was sick for days and doubtless had numerous attacks of diarrhea and vomiting. There's certainly no question that the abode of a victim can be a pest house--but I'm not sure the same can be said of a public place like a library or restaurant that the person just spent a short time in.


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## MaidInBedlam (Jul 24, 2012)

Poor Purl said:


> At first I thought, "Great question!" Then the answer came: the truth is the same for everyone at every time (except quantum physicists and Werner Heisenberg), but each lie depends on its author, its purpose,.... So one truth, many lies. That's what it's all about!


No, that's not what it's all about. Truth(s) and lies both have their individual authors. There is no such thing as one truth that is the same for everyone at every time.


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## MaidInBedlam (Jul 24, 2012)

Poor Purl said:


> Opinion only coincidentally has anything to do with the truth. But truth is absolute, the same for everyone - they just may not know what it is. If the universe exists (and I think everyone not on thorazine knows it does), it exists outside of anybody's mind.
> 
> Your examples have to do with faith, which is more like opinion. If there happens to be a god, whosever it is, then that's the truth; if there happens to be none, then that's the truth - but these are things we may never know.
> 
> I have a conference to get to, so have to stop, but I'll be back later. And that's the truth.


People often consider their opinions to be the truth, truth they can't be made to change. The existence of the universe is irrelevant here. I'm talking about a much smaller sandbox. We are trapped in the limitations of our senses. For us, truth isn't absolute, and it is of the social phenomenon about "the truth" and "lies" that I speak.


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## Wombatnomore (Dec 9, 2013)

MaidInBedlam said:


> People often consider their opinions to be the truth, truth they can't be made to change. The existence of the universe is irrelevant here. I'm talking about a much smaller sandbox. We are trapped in the limitations of our senses. For us, truth isn't absolute, and it is of the social phenomenon about "the truth" and "lies" that I speak.


This is interesting. Are you referring to us being captive to all kinds of media (for example), which manufactures 'truth' thereby making it questionable? (I guess I could say the same about lies).


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## soloweygirl (Jun 9, 2012)

Wombatnomore said:


> True, like a novelty which wears off pretty quickly when they are faced with the barbarity which is IS.


What is most worrisome is whether they will be able to leave ISIS. If the girls are there for a few months, the chances become less of a reality. ISIS has proven that they have no problem killing anyone for any reason.


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## Wombatnomore (Dec 9, 2013)

soloweygirl said:


> What is most worrisome is whether they will be able to leave ISIS. If the girls are there for a few months, the chances become less of a reality. ISIS has proven that they have no problem killing anyone for any reason.


Yes, and given the girls are apparently pregnant to their IS husbands. Will be interesting to see. I would feel uneasy about them returning to their country. I know they're only kids but...


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## Poor Purl (Apr 14, 2011)

susanmos2000 said:


> I'm honestly surprised that you favor such a strict approach, Nebraska. After all, you spoken a number of times about encroaching totalitarianism and the dangers of letting the government micromanage our lives. Would you really favor granting the feds carte blanche to detain anyone they even suspected of being exposed to Ebola, locking them up in their apartments or Ebola quarantine camps, snooping through phone records and personal papers to determine every possible contact and then subjecting them to the same treatment? I'm not trying to be argumentative--I know you're genuinely worried about the Ebola crisis, but I do wonder how many basic rights you'd be willing to give up to keep yourself safe.


I could quote Benjamin Franklin on freedom vs. security, but instead I'll turn to Ralph Waldo Emerson: "A foolish consistency is the hobgoblin of little minds....With consistency a great soul has simply nothing to do." Please don't expect consistency from Nebraska.


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## Knitter from Nebraska (Jun 9, 2013)

Poor Purl said:


> I could quote Benjamin Franklin on freedom vs. security, but instead I'll turn to Ralph Waldo Emerson: "A foolish consistency is the hobgoblin of little minds....With consistency a great soul has simply nothing to do." Please don't expect consistency from Nebraska.


Obviously, you didn't read my response! :roll: :roll: :roll:


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## Poor Purl (Apr 14, 2011)

Wombatnomore said:


> Here is another one I like and I said this to a newspaper reporter at a Coronial Inquest:
> 
> Don't let the truth get in the way of a good story!


Are you implying that reporters aren't entirely truthful?

And what's a Coronial Inquest?


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## Poor Purl (Apr 14, 2011)

SQM said:


> I remember in the '80s that people got nuts about Aids. The spread of ebola seems similar. Are we being hysterical?


I think we are. We were out to dinner with another couple one evening, and our waiter was obviously gay. The man we were with was afraid to eat anything the waiter brought; even though there was no direct physical contact, the waiter may have spit in the food. His wife told him that probably hadn't happened and wouldn't happen unless he kept being an idiot about it.

A few glasses of wine later, he relaxed.


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## Poor Purl (Apr 14, 2011)

MaidInBedlam said:


> No, that's not what it's all about. Truth(s) and lies both have their individual authors. There is no such thing as one truth that is the same for everyone at every time.


I guess it depends on your definition of "truth." Is it a description of objective reality, or is it what the individual, subjectively, believes to be the case?

I may be swayed by my mathematical background, but I think we have to distinguish between truth and belief. Your statement and SQM's are colloquial, not actual, I think.


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## Poor Purl (Apr 14, 2011)

MaidInBedlam said:


> People often consider their opinions to be the truth, truth they can't be made to change. The existence of the universe is irrelevant here. I'm talking about a much smaller sandbox. We are trapped in the limitations of our senses. For us, truth isn't absolute, and it is of the social phenomenon about "the truth" and "lies" that I speak.


People consider many things, but that doesn't make them true. I think it's fine to use the language as it's colloquially used in context, but truth is truth (try to disprove that! :?). Some word has to exist for what is really, objectively true.


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## Poor Purl (Apr 14, 2011)

Knitter from Nebraska said:


> Obviously, you didn't read my response! :roll: :roll: :roll:


Not until after I posted my Emerson message. (And I didn't pick that quote because I was looking for something relevant; I picked it because I knew beforehand that it was relevant.)


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## Knitter from Nebraska (Jun 9, 2013)

Poor Purl said:


> Not until after I posted my Emerson message. (And I didn't pick that quote because I was looking for something relevant; I picked it because I knew beforehand that it was relevant.)


You don't have to make excuses to me. I'm not the one who picks apart every single, little thing you post. I actually enjoy discussing what other people post, unlike some who don't want to discuss anything that doesn't fit their world view. You can call me inconsistent if you want, but I refuse to be placed in a box. My opinions are my own. Some lean left, some lean right and some are "out there". Despite the differences I have with others, I don't resort to personal attacks. I criticize statements, not the person making them.


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## Poor Purl (Apr 14, 2011)

Knitter from Nebraska said:


> You don't have to make excuses to me. I'm not the one who picks apart every single, little thing you post. I actually enjoy discussing what other people post, unlike some who don't want to discuss anything that doesn't fit their world view. You can call me inconsistent if you want, but I refuse to be placed in a box. My opinions are my own. Some lean left, some lean right and some are "out there". Despite the differences I have with others, I don't resort to personal attacks. I criticize statements, not the person making them.


I wasn't making excuses. What about? I admit, I sometimes pick apart other people's messages, but it's one of the silly things I do.

If you read the Emerson quote, you'd see he doesn't like consistency. He believes it's unimaginative and often takes the place of thinking. I would never accuse you of not thinking - sometimes I feel you overthink things, but that's probably better than my habit of not thinking but making jokes instead. The only place I see consistency as a virtue is in grammar.

I know that you and I rarely agree about issues, and you haven't criticized me, but you have said things like "pure propaganda" about what I've posted. And if you look at what you seem to think is my criticism of you, you'll see it's about what you post - though not message by message but the total picture - and not about you personally.


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## Knitter from Nebraska (Jun 9, 2013)

Poor Purl said:


> I wasn't making excuses. What about? I admit, I sometimes pick apart other people's messages, but it's one of the silly things I do.
> 
> If you read the Emerson quote, you'd see he doesn't like consistency. He believes it's unimaginative and often takes the place of thinking. I would never accuse you of not thinking - sometimes I feel you overthink things, but that's probably better than my habit of not thinking but making jokes instead. The only place I see consistency as a virtue is in grammar.
> 
> I know that you and I rarely agree about issues, and you haven't criticized me, but you have said things like "pure propaganda" about what I've posted. And if you look at what you seem to think is my criticism of you, you'll see it's about what you post - though not message by message but the total picture - and not about you personally.


I apologize! Apparently, I was reading words without absorbing what they were saying. I can see that now. I immediately took the fact that you said I wasn't consistent, as an insult. I always get defensive and back away after a round of attacks, and it isn't you I should be biting back at. I really do love the discourse, but it always seems to devolve into others calling me names, and I end up feeling as if I should just go away. I keep reminding myself of the old adage, "If you can't stand the heat, get out of the kitchen". But sometimes, it doesn't help.


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## DGreen (Nov 1, 2012)

Wombatnomore said:


> This is interesting. Are you referring to us being captive to all kinds of media (for example), which manufactures 'truth' thereby making it questionable? (I guess I could say the same about lies).


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## Knitter from Nebraska (Jun 9, 2013)

I was reading this article about the nurse who's contracted Ebola. My heart goes out to nurses everywhere. It would seem that they're expected to care for Ebola patients without bio containment suits. The CDC has declared that a gown, gloves and face mask or goggles is sufficient. In addition, it looks like it would be very difficult to remove these without touching the contaminated surfaces. On TV, we see everyone involved wearing the suits. Why aren't our nurses? Our Med Center has one of only four bio containment units in the country. They are fully equipped and train on a regular basis but other hospitals are not. I think that every hospital in the country should be setting aside areas as bio containment areas and every employee should be trained. If they don't have the proper equipment, they should get it. I think that the federal government should immediately purchase this equipment and send it to every hospital and urgent care center in the country. If we wait, we'll be in the same situation as Liberia. We can't wait! We have to be prepared to contain and stop the spread.

All of this really makes me wonder. Are we to expect our doctors and nurses to risk their lives to care for us? They have families, children. And what about support staff? My own husband works in hospitals and doctor's offices every day. At what point, will his work become dangerous? And will his employer provide the proper equipment? And what of training? If the very people most aware of the danger, have become victims due to human error, what will happen to the rest? I think that those who care for the Ebola patients are brave and are heroes. I also see those in the field of medicine, in a whole new light.
http://www.nytimes.com/2014/10/13/us/texas-health-worker-tests-positive-for-ebola.html


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## Gerslay (Oct 4, 2011)

St Augustine said that all truth is Gods truth, since God is the author of all reality.

People hate the truth for the sake of whatever it is that they love more than the truth. They love truth when it shines warmly on them, and hate it when it rebukes them.
- St Augustine


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## DGreen (Nov 1, 2012)

Gerslay said:


> St Augustine said that all truth is Gods truth, since God is the author of all reality.
> 
> People hate the truth for the sake of whatever it is that they love more than the truth. They love truth when it shines warmly on them, and hate it when it rebukes them.
> - St Augustine


Pretty good - except for the god part.


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## SQM (Jun 22, 2012)

DGreen said:


> Pretty good - except for the god part.


Substitute the Law of Physics. How does it read now?


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## Gerslay (Oct 4, 2011)

DGreen said:


> Pretty good - except for the god part.


That's odd, DGreen...you brought up St Augustine and so I assumed your knew that his search for the TRUTH was not only about the knowledge of God but also about finding God.


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## DGreen (Nov 1, 2012)

Gerslay said:


> That's odd, DGreen...you brought up St Augustine and so I assumed your knew that his search for the TRUTH was not only about the knowledge of God but also about finding God.


Nope. Only because it was a good point. Doesn't mean I agree with everything he said.


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## DGreen (Nov 1, 2012)

SQM said:


> Substitute the Law of Physics. How does it read now?


Better. Much better.


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## Poor Purl (Apr 14, 2011)

Knitter from Nebraska said:


> I apologize! Apparently, I was reading words without absorbing what they were saying. I can see that now. I immediately took the fact that you said I wasn't consistent, as an insult. I always get defensive and back away after a round of attacks, and it isn't you I should be biting back at. I really do love the discourse, but it always seems to devolve into others calling me names, and I end up feeling as if I should just go away. I keep reminding myself of the old adage, "If you can't stand the heat, get out of the kitchen". But sometimes, it doesn't help.


You do get insulted, and even I sometimes lose it with you, but trying to disprove what you've said (something that must feel to you like ganging up) takes some thought and some ingenuity, and we all learn something from it.

I still think your economics are way off base, but that can be left for another discussion, as you've reminded me.


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## Poor Purl (Apr 14, 2011)

Gerslay said:


> St Augustine said that all truth is Gods truth, since God is the author of all reality.
> 
> People hate the truth for the sake of whatever it is that they love more than the truth. They love truth when it shines warmly on them, and hate it when it rebukes them.
> - St Augustine


Augustine wasn't always so godly. But he was brilliant.

This is an excerpt from Wikipedia, but I think it's true anyway:

As a youth Augustine lived a hedonistic lifestyle for a time, associating with young men who boasted of their sexual exploits with women and men. They urged the inexperienced boys, like Augustine, to seek experience or to make up stories about their experiences in order to gain acceptance. It was during this period that he uttered his famous prayer, "Grant me chastity and continence, but not yet."

At about the age of 19, Augustine began an affair with a young woman in Carthage. Possibly because his mother wanted him to marry a person of his class, the woman remained his lover for over thirteen years and gave birth to his son Adeodatus, who was viewed as extremely intelligent by his contemporaries. In 385, Augustine abandoned his lover in order to prepare himself to marry an heiress.


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## soloweygirl (Jun 9, 2012)

susanmos2000 said:


> I agree--it's mind boggling to imagine the fallout if draconian anti-Ebola measures were put in place. Imagine the blow to the economy if the borders were completely sealed--no on in, no one out--as some Americans wish. Imagine too the government trying to provide for tens even hundreds of thousands of folks who were sealed in their apartments because they knew someone who knew someone who'd been exposed. It is frightening.


At the same time, what can we expect of those that do come down with symptoms? Will they seek treatment before their symptoms become severe? At this point, how many new people could they have infected? There is no easy answer. A plan is definitely needed. Unfortunately, this plan isn't going to be liked by all.


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## soloweygirl (Jun 9, 2012)

SQM said:


> I remember in the '80s that people got nuts about Aids. The spread of ebola seems similar. Are we being hysterical?


There are different strains of ebola. We need to know which strain is here and go from there. Panic spreads fast without knowledge. Common sense is needed as well. That's the best defense we have. It makes perfect sense to not go near someone that is showing signs they are sick, whether it be a cold , the flu or possibly ebola. If you need to help a sick child, then prepare yourself and again, use common sense.


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## DGreen (Nov 1, 2012)

soloweygirl said:


> There are different strains of ebola. We need to know which strain is here and go from there. Panic spreads fast without knowledge. Common sense is needed as well. That's the best defense we have. It makes perfect sense to not go near someone that is showing signs they are sick, whether it be a cold , the flu or possibly ebola. If you need to help a sick child, then prepare yourself and again, use common sense.


It might also make sense to set aside a separate entrance for people with fever or who suspect they have ebola - away from the cuts, broken bones, knife wounds and such that go to the ER. People take sick babies and children to the ER and my grandson had to sit in chairs when he had a collapsed lung. No excuse for exposing those people to ebola. KPG had some concerns about that very thing.


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## soloweygirl (Jun 9, 2012)

DGreen said:


> It might also make sense to set aside a separate entrance for people with fever or who suspect they have ebola - away from the cuts, broken bones, knife wounds and such that go to the ER. People take sick babies and children to the ER and my grandson had to sit in chairs when he had a collapsed lung. No excuse for exposing those people to ebola. KPG had some concerns about that very thing.


Agree. A lot of the planning comes down to common sense. It might be inconvenient, but it would be wise.


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## Gerslay (Oct 4, 2011)

Poor Purl said:


> Augustine wasn't always so godly. But he was brilliant.
> 
> This is an excerpt from Wikipedia, but I think it's true anyway:
> 
> ...


Augustine lived in very decadent times and he certainly lived that life to the fullest, but at the same time he was greatly troubled over the mud of his sinful life.

_"Too late have I loved You!"_ he once cried to God, but with his holy life he certainly made up for the sins he committed before his conversion.


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## Wombatnomore (Dec 9, 2013)

Poor Purl said:


> Are you implying that reporters aren't entirely truthful?
> 
> And what's a Coronial Inquest?


Our Coroner is the same as your Medical Examiner. Both investigate unusual deaths. Each case is examined in a court which in Australia is called a Coronial Inquest.

As for newspaper reporters and editors (they call themselves journalists but quite frankly, many of them are hacks IMO), I don't think they are held accountable correctly. For example, a screaming accusatory headline on page 3 appears and then, when the accusation is found to be incorrect, a small article of apology is delegated to page 19 (for example) after the damage is done. Anything to keep sales up. Makes me see red.


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## DGreen (Nov 1, 2012)

Wombatnomore said:


> Our Coroner is the same as your Medical Examiner. Both investigate unusual deaths. Each case is examined in a court which in Australia is called a Coronial Inquest.
> 
> As for newspaper reporters and editors (they call themselves journalists but quite frankly, many of them are hacks IMO), I don't think they are held accountable correctly. For example, a screaming accusatory headline on page 3 appears and then, when the accusation is found to be incorrect, a small article of apology is delegated to page 19 (for example) after the damage is done. Anything to keep sales up. Makes me see red.


Same "retraction" policy here. Not very honest, IMO.


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## Wombatnomore (Dec 9, 2013)

St. Augustines' quote IS the truth but sadly, the 'real truth' in many situations, particularly in the media becomes sullied all too frequently. I think truth is an imperative at all times but the lengths to which the media go in their quest to increase their bottom lines, sees news stories literally hacked to a point where the truth of the matter being reported is so diluted, the point of it all is lost.

And when the 'real truth' is finally arrived at (if ever), it's importance is gone or 'it's too late.'


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## Knitter from Nebraska (Jun 9, 2013)

DGreen said:


> It might also make sense to set aside a separate entrance for people with fever or who suspect they have ebola - away from the cuts, broken bones, knife wounds and such that go to the ER. People take sick babies and children to the ER and my grandson had to sit in chairs when he had a collapsed lung. No excuse for exposing those people to ebola. KPG had some concerns about that very thing.


No, I think you're mistaken. You're pretty much repeating what I said. And I'm ever so surprised that you would agree with me!


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## Knitter from Nebraska (Jun 9, 2013)

Poor Purl said:


> You do get insulted, and even I sometimes lose it with you, but trying to disprove what you've said (something that must feel to you like ganging up) takes some thought and some ingenuity, and we all learn something from it.
> 
> I still think your economics are way off base, but that can be left for another discussion, as you've reminded me.


Thank you!

And someday, we WILL have that discussion on the economy.


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## Knitter from Nebraska (Jun 9, 2013)

I guess I was wrong! I was worried that nurses would quit. But our local news just reported that UNMC had so many nurses volunteering to work in the Bio Containment Unit, that they had to start a waiting list.


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## Poor Purl (Apr 14, 2011)

Wombatnomore said:


> Our Coroner is the same as your Medical Examiner. Both investigate unusual deaths. Each case is examined in a court which in Australia is called a Coronial Inquest.
> 
> As for newspaper reporters and editors (they call themselves journalists but quite frankly, many of them are hacks IMO), I don't think they are held accountable correctly. For example, a screaming accusatory headline on page 3 appears and then, when the accusation is found to be incorrect, a small article of apology is delegated to page 19 (for example) after the damage is done. Anything to keep sales up. Makes me see red.


What we would call a coroner's inquest. I've never seen the adjective form. At least it's not "coronary."

As for reporters and newspapers, you probably have a good picture of how they do things. Even the Gray Lady, The New York Times, does that correction thing in small type on an inner page.


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## Wombatnomore (Dec 9, 2013)

soloweygirl said:


> There are different strains of ebola. We need to know which strain is here and go from there. Panic spreads fast without knowledge. Common sense is needed as well. That's the best defense we have. It makes perfect sense to not go near someone that is showing signs they are sick, whether it be a cold , the flu or possibly ebola. If you need to help a sick child, then prepare yourself and again, use common sense.


The World Health Organisation is a good place to have questions about the disease answered:

http://www.who.int/csr/disease/ebola/en/


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## Poor Purl (Apr 14, 2011)

joeysomma said:


> Very true. Also the courts cannot change fiction into Truth.


You mean like "corporations are people"?


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## Wombatnomore (Dec 9, 2013)

Another IS call for arms. As one commentator says to relax gun laws so we can protect ourselves, I wonder if that's not a bad idea.

http://www.dailymail.co.uk/news/article-2791104/every-muslim-house-crusader-kill-renews-calls-attacks-australians.html


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## Poor Purl (Apr 14, 2011)

Wombatnomore said:


> The World Health Organisation is a good place to have questions about the disease answered:
> 
> http://www.who.int/csr/disease/ebola/en/


There's an op ed piece in today's NY Times called *How to Quarantine Against Ebola* by a doctor who's written a book on cancer. He says that there's a way to test blood in asymptomatic people that will show the virus's genes long before symptoms appear. He suggests giving the test to passengers, possibly before they board the plane, and use the time on the plane as a "quarantine." The results would be known by the time they land, and medical personnel will then know whom they have to pull aside and separate from the public before they become contagious.

The author, Siddhartha Mukherjee, ends the article "Ebola is an ingenious virus. To fight it, we need to be just as ingenious."

http://www.nytimes.com/2014/10/13/opinion/how-to-quarantine-against-ebola.html?_r=0


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## Wombatnomore (Dec 9, 2013)

Poor Purl said:


> There's an op ed piece in today's NY Times called *How to Quarantine Against Ebola* by a doctor who's written a book on cancer. He says that there's a way to test blood in asymptomatic people that will show the virus's genes long before symptoms appear. He suggests giving the test to passengers, possibly before they board the plane, and use the time on the plane as a "quarantine." The results would be known by the time they land, and medical personnel will then know whom they have to pull aside and separate from the public before they become contagious.
> 
> The author, Siddhartha Mukherjee, ends the article "Ebola is an ingenious virus. To fight it, we need to be just as ingenious."
> 
> http://www.nytimes.com/2014/10/13/opinion/how-to-quarantine-against-ebola.html?_r=0


That is ingenious but will sensible heads prevail and take up on this method? Like most logical arguments, this one may just drift into oblivion I'm afraid.


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## Poor Purl (Apr 14, 2011)

Wombatnomore said:


> That is ingenious but will sensible heads prevail and take up on this method? Like most logical arguments, this one may just drift into oblivion I'm afraid.


I doubt that it will be used. The test costs between $60 and $200 to administer, and though that's still cheaper than burning everything in a home or seeing people die from the disease, it will be seen as too expensive.


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## cookiequeen (Jun 15, 2011)

Poor Purl said:


> You mean like "corporations are people"?


 :XD: :XD: :XD: :XD:


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## Gerslay (Oct 4, 2011)

*Food For Thought: Republicans are more informed than Democrats, according to Pew research*

"Few traits better characterize contemporary liberals than their false sense of intellectual superiority.

We're all familiar with the clichés. Conservatives and libertarians who deviate from liberal articles of faith, from global warming alarmism to Keynesian economics to bureaucratized social engineering, are "deniers," unmoored from rationality and "settled science." Leftist author Thomas Frank captured that mindset with the title of his book "What's the Matter with Kansas?," asserting that Republican voters aren't even capable of aligning their votes with their supposedly self-evident best interests.

There's only one problem.

The actual, objective sociological evidence continues to demonstrate that the opposite is true. Republicans routinely prove themselves more knowledgeable than Democrats."

http://cfif.org/v/index.php/commentary/54-state-of-affairs/2339-republicans-more-informed-than-democrats-according-to-pew-research


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## susanmos2000 (May 10, 2011)

joeysomma said:


> Like "gay marriage" is a marriage.


*snort* Why not express your views about gay marriage to all those eager same-sex couples now lining up in front of City Halls all over the country? Look straight into their joyful faces and tell them it's not possible to love someone of the same sex and that their marriages are a sham. I dare you.


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## Knitter from Nebraska (Jun 9, 2013)

Gerslay said:


> *Food For Thought: Republicans are more informed than Democrats, according to Pew research*
> 
> "Few traits better characterize contemporary liberals than their false sense of intellectual superiority.
> 
> ...


 :thumbup: :XD:


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## Country Bumpkins (Feb 18, 2011)

joeysomma said:


> They can "love" anyone they want, but the so-called marriage is a sham. I would tell them to their face. I also would tell them, they are loved by their Heavenly Father, and he has a better plan for their life.
> 
> Marriage is ordained by God between a man and a woman. You can call anything else a marriage but it is an abomination in the sight of God. The orders by the courts in allowing so-called Homosexual marriage will bring our country to destruction. Also acceptance of homosexuality as normal behavior is forced on Christians, to destroy them and their businesses.
> 
> ...


Amen


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## DGreen (Nov 1, 2012)

joeysomma said:


> They can "love" anyone they want, but the so-called marriage is a sham. I would tell them to their face. I also would tell them, they are loved by their Heavenly Father, and he has a better plan for their life.
> 
> Marriage is ordained by God between a man and a woman. You can call anything else a marriage but it is an abomination in the sight of God. The orders by the courts in allowing so-called Homosexual marriage will bring our country to destruction. Also acceptance of homosexuality as normal behavior is forced on Christians, to destroy them and their businesses.
> 
> ...


I have never been able to understand the reasoning behind Christians' claims that homosexual marriage would destroy our country. How? It doesn't affect you.

No one is forcing acceptance on you. It is Christians who are trying to force their beliefs on others by insisting homosexuality is immoral and homosexuals should not have the same rights as others. I truly don't get it.


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## DGreen (Nov 1, 2012)

joeysomma said:


> Each citizen should have the same rights as any other citizen. Homosexuals think they are special and are entitled to special rights. Then they are forcing anyone who disagrees with them to do as they want. They want to take others rights away, if they do not accept Homosexual "BEHAVIOR." And it is behavior they are NOT born that way.


What special rights are you talking about? How do they "force" people to do what they want. And what is it that they want people to do? Your answer is vague to the point of being meaningless.


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## Wombatnomore (Dec 9, 2013)

DGreen said:


> What special rights are you talking about? How do they "force" people to do what they want. And what is it that they want people to do? Your answer is vague to the point of being meaningless.


And that there has not been a reasonably timed response is astutely observed.


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## Poor Purl (Apr 14, 2011)

DGreen said:


> I have never been able to understand the reasoning behind Christians' claims that homosexual marriage would destroy our country. How? It doesn't affect you.
> 
> No one is forcing acceptance on you. It is Christians who are trying to force their beliefs on others by insisting homosexuality is immoral and homosexuals should not have the same rights as others. I truly don't get it.


You didn't read Joey's message closely enough. Doesn't she say that God abominates any but heterosexual marriage? She knows exactly what God wants and doesn't want, and if such marriage will destroy us all, it certainly affects us all. :roll: :roll: :roll:


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## DGreen (Nov 1, 2012)

Wombatnomore said:


> And that there has not been a reasonably timed response is astutely observed.


She bailed. Off line.

The Christian version of a hit and run.


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## DGreen (Nov 1, 2012)

Poor Purl said:


> You didn't read Joey's message closely enough. Doesn't she say that God abominates any but heterosexual marriage? She knows exactly what God wants and doesn't want, and if such marriage will destroy us all, it certainly affects us all. :roll: :roll: :roll:


Makes sense when you put it that way, Purl. :XD:


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## Country Bumpkins (Feb 18, 2011)

God is the creator. What ever He says goes. Doesn't matter what opinions people have. If what He says is sin . It is sin. Joeys never hits and runs. She has a family to tend too. She doesn't stay online all day and night. God's Word the Bible is how people know what God thinks.


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## theyarnlady (Feb 25, 2011)

Country Bumpkins said:


> God is the creator. What ever He says goes. Doesn't matter what opinions people have. If what He says is sin . It is sin. Joeys never hits and runs. She has a family to tend too. She doesn't stay online all day and night. God's Word the Bible is how people know what God thinks.


yes Joey has a busy life not a hit and run life but a busy life.

Amen to that CB.

How do I know the Bible tells me so.


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## DGreen (Nov 1, 2012)

Country Bumpkins said:


> God is the creator. What ever He says goes. Doesn't matter what opinions people have. If what He says is sin . It is sin. Joeys never hits and runs. She has a family to tend too. She doesn't stay online all day and night. God's Word the Bible is how people know what God thinks.


There is no god, CB.

Let's not start on the scripture quotes again, ok?


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## Country Bumpkins (Feb 18, 2011)

DGreen said:


> There is no god, CB.
> 
> Let's not start on the scripture quotes again, ok?


There is a God . How can anyone be so arrogant to act like they know more than God? Or judge scriptures. I am so sorry to hear anyone talk like you do.


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## DGreen (Nov 1, 2012)

Country Bumpkins said:


> There is a God . How can anyone be so arrogant to act like they know more than God? Or judge scriptures. I am so sorry to hear anyone talk like you do.


Christians spouting scripture are equally offensive to me.


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## Country Bumpkins (Feb 18, 2011)

DGreen said:


> Christians spouting scripture are equally offensive to me.


That is sad. I hope you find out the Truth.


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## DGreen (Nov 1, 2012)

Country Bumpkins said:


> That is sad. I hope you find out the Truth.


Very Christian of you. Now let it go.


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## Gerslay (Oct 4, 2011)

DGreen said:


> There is no god, CB.
> 
> Let's not start on the scripture quotes again, ok?


You can't have it both ways DGreen...you can't post quotes of Saint Augustine and then say that someone can't quote posts of Saint Paul.


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## SQM (Jun 22, 2012)

No one is going to convince the other about the rights of gays to marry. If one side wants to display an antediluvian attitude, let them. 

Everyone has the right to be happy. (Not that I found marriage so great.)

I have a beautiful gay marriage to go to next month. Two lovely guys who love each other. Both are from great families and wonderfully successful. Going to wear a black cocktail dress with Steve Madden high top black with red roses sneakers. At the Harvard Club. OOOO. So excited.


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## DGreen (Nov 1, 2012)

Gerslay said:


> You can't have it both ways DGreen...you can't post quotes of Saint Augustine and then say that someone can't quote posts of Saint Paul.


I certainly can if the intent of the post is to condemn me to hell and to convert me.


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## theyarnlady (Feb 25, 2011)

DGreen said:


> I certainly can if the intent of the post is to condemn me to hell and to convert me.


No one is condemn you to hell because you don't believe in hell so how can anyone convert you if you don't believe in God? But you believe in hell as you mention it.

You confuse yourself and me? what do you believe in? If Hell then you must also believe there is another place that you will or want to go to when you die.


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## DGreen (Nov 1, 2012)

theyarnlady said:


> No one is condemn you to hell because you don't believe in hell so how can anyone convert you if you don't believe in God? But you believe in hell as you mention it.
> 
> You confuse yourself and me? what do you believe in? If Hell then you must also believe there is another place that you will or want to go to when you die.


I'm an atheist so I don't believe in god, hell, sin, heaven or any of the other things Christians believe in. Or any of the bible.

CB took it upon herself some time back to tell me how wrong I am, how I'm going to hell, that I'll be sorry, that all I need to do is read the bible...ad nauseum. She most definitely was preaching to me how I am so wrong in so many ways, that I need to sort of fall on my knees and accept jesus Christ as my lord and savior....it went on and on.

What CB evidently cannot accept is the fact that there are many people like me, who upon careful reflection and with sound mind, have concluded that there is no god. There is no place for any god in my life. I have the same right to utter those words as any Christian does to praise the god they believe is real. I'll be more than happy to enumerate the many reasons I lack faith in god to anyone who is sincerely interested.

Furthermore, CB and others have difficulty understanding why I find this offensive. I don't believe I have ever expressed any other attitude besides tolerance - up to the bright red line where Christians think their beliefs should be enshrined into law.


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## Wombatnomore (Dec 9, 2013)

DGreen said:


> I'm an atheist so I don't believe in god, hell, sin, heaven or any of the other things Christians believe in. Or any of the bible.
> 
> CB took it upon herself some time back to tell me how wrong I am, how I'm going to hell, that I'll be sorry, that all I need to do is read the bible...ad nauseum. She most definitely was preaching to me how I am so wrong in so many ways, that I need to sort of fall on my knees and accept jesus Christ as my lord and savior....it went on and on.
> 
> ...


I will attest to that. Evangelism has been a corner-stone to many conversations of some Christians on this site. Even when a person says they're not interested it persists. Rather than research evangelism, I have come to the conclusion that those who evangelize, do so for their own benefit, sort of 'if I keep on keeping on with my devotion to G-d, I really will go to heaven.'


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## DGreen (Nov 1, 2012)

SQM said:


> No one is going to convince the other about the rights of gays to marry. If one side wants to display an antediluvian attitude, let them.
> 
> Everyone has the right to be happy. (Not that I found marriage so great.)
> 
> I have a beautiful gay marriage to go to next month. Two lovely guys who love each other. Both are from great families and wonderfully successful. Going to wear a black cocktail dress with Steve Madden high top black with red roses sneakers. At the Harvard Club. OOOO. So excited.


Sounds like a GREAT time. You go, girl.


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## Gerslay (Oct 4, 2011)

DGreen said:


> I'm an atheist so I don't believe in god, hell, sin, heaven or any of the other things Christians believe in. Or any of the bible.
> 
> CB took it upon herself some time back to tell me how wrong I am, how I'm going to hell, that I'll be sorry, that all I need to do is read the bible...ad nauseum. She most definitely was preaching to me how I am so wrong in so many ways, that I need to sort of fall on my knees and accept jesus Christ as my lord and savior....it went on and on.
> 
> ...


You can find it offensive all you want. So what? Are you asking for special treatment? You can make any statement as to what you believe or don't believe. But we are equally entitled to make our own statements. If you don't like them just ignore them, like we ignore yours. Really, why make it a problem?


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## Gerslay (Oct 4, 2011)

Once upon a time I used to say that I was an atheist because that's what God wanted me to be. 

The joke was on me!


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## SQM (Jun 22, 2012)

Gerslay said:


> Once upon a time I used to say that I was an atheist because that's what God wanted me to be.
> 
> The joke was on me!


What changed you?


----------



## Gerslay (Oct 4, 2011)

Wombatnomore said:


> I will attest to that. Evangelism has been a corner-stone to many conversations of some Christians on this site. Even when a person says they're not interested it persists. Rather than research evangelism, I have come to the conclusion that those who evangelize, do so for their own benefit, sort of 'if I keep on keeping on with my devotion to G-d, I really will go to heaven.'


Politics and religion are two hot topics. With politics we agree, disagree, argue, or ignore one other's viewpoints and opinions all the time. With religion why are we so easily offended and overly sensitive?

If a person is strong enough to buck the norms of convention and state that she is an atheist then she ought to be strong enough to withstand a little scripture posted on an insignificant thread in a knitting forum!


----------



## Gerslay (Oct 4, 2011)

SQM said:


> What changed you?


The hound of heaven chased me and I finally stopped running!


----------



## Poor Purl (Apr 14, 2011)

DGreen said:


> There is no god, CB.
> 
> Let's not start on the scripture quotes again, ok?


Honestly, D, there you go again, not understanding anything. Of course there's a God; the Bible says so. And we know the Bible is true because God wrote it.

Got it? Good.


----------



## SQM (Jun 22, 2012)

http://www.cbc.ca/news/world/catholic-church-makes-stunning-overture-toward-gays-1.2797497

What breed is the hound of heaven?


----------



## DGreen (Nov 1, 2012)

Gerslay said:


> You can find it offensive all you want. So what? Are you asking for special treatment? You can make any statement as to what you believe or don't believe. But we are equally entitled to make our own statements. If you don't like them just ignore them, like we ignore yours. Really, why make it a problem?


I've never tried to convert anyone to atheism, but have been PERSONALLY hounded by Christians who DO NOT ignore, but who, like Country Bumpkin, sees my statements as an opportunity to prosthelytize. Not asking for special treatment in any way - that's the province of the religious.


----------



## Gerslay (Oct 4, 2011)

SQM said:


> http://www.cbc.ca/news/world/catholic-church-makes-stunning-overture-toward-gays-1.2797497
> 
> What breed is the hound of heaven?


A mixed breed...fully human and fully divine. Jesus.


----------



## DGreen (Nov 1, 2012)

Poor Purl said:


> Honestly, D, there you go again, not understanding anything. Of course there's a God; the Bible says so. And we know the Bible is true because God wrote it.
> 
> Got it? Good.


What would I do without you to keep me on the straight and narrow?


----------



## Wombatnomore (Dec 9, 2013)

Gerslay said:


> Politics and religion are two hot topics. With politics we agree, disagree, argue, or ignore one other's viewpoints and opinions all the time. With religion why are we so easily offended and overly sensitive?
> 
> If a person is strong enough to buck the norms of convention and state that she is an atheist then she ought to be strong enough to withstand a little scripture posted on an insignificant thread in a knitting forum!


No. That is not what is happening. Green has stated her stance on G-d and it is a firm "I do not believe." Yet, even on this thread, and only a relatively few posts prior to this, you have CB and others hoping she will be saved.

If some Christians are genuinely not evangelising, they would respect her comments and not continue. But they have and they do. Even you Gerslay, by merely weighing in.


----------



## Poor Purl (Apr 14, 2011)

Gerslay said:


> You can't have it both ways DGreen...you can't post quotes of Saint Augustine and then say that someone can't quote posts of Saint Paul.


So I'll quote Ralph Waldo Emerson: "A foolish consistency is the hobgoblin of little minds." Of course D can have it both ways. At least she can ask for it. And you - and CB - can refuse to give her what she wants.

But why post on this thread? We've been talking about ISIS and Ebola, and you're welcome to join in. But why bring in Scripture?


----------



## SQM (Jun 22, 2012)

Gerslay said:


> A mixed breed...fully human and fully divine. Jesus.


The Gers is always so clever.

Glad you are happy and found what gets you thru the night. (Old song - who sang it?)

Also happy for Bright Green since she is liberated from bronze age thinking.


----------



## susanmos2000 (May 10, 2011)

DGreen said:


> Sounds like a GREAT time. You go, girl.


I agree--it promises to be a truly special occasion. With so many problems in the world it's heart warming to see at least some forms of bigotry and hate crumbling before our eyes. How can anyone see the tears of joy shed by so many same-sex couples upon marriage and still want to take such a basic and fundamental right away from them? Ultra conservatives must have hearts of stone.


----------



## Gerslay (Oct 4, 2011)

Wombatnomore said:


> No. That is not what is happening. Green has stated her stance on G-d and it is a firm "I do not believe." Yet, even on this thread, and only a relatively few posts prior to this, you have CB and others hoping she will be saved.
> 
> If some Christians are genuinely not evangelising, they would respect her comments and not continue. But they have and they do. Even you Gerslay, by merely weighing in.


Womby...it all started because DG posted a quote from St Augustine. I continued with quotes of my own. I had no idea she was an atheist and I really don't care if she is or if she isn't. But she's not getting special treatment because of it...and neither are you.


----------



## Wombatnomore (Dec 9, 2013)

Gerslay said:


> Womby...it all started because DG posted a quote from St Augustine. I continued with quotes of my own. I had no idea she was an atheist and I really don't care if she is or if she isn't. But she's not getting special treatment because of it...and neither are you.


Okay, then go away. If you don't consider what Green or I say is special, then why respond? In my post, I stated that you weighing in supported my claim that evangelism is evident on this and other threads because it's true. If you don't think there is any merit in my thoughts, why respond. Really?


----------



## Gerslay (Oct 4, 2011)

Poor Purl said:


> I'm the one (in addition to you) who posted quotes of St. Augustine. Unless - as has happened before - I missed something.
> 
> But I'll now quote Ralph Waldo Emerson: "A foolish consistency is the hobgoblin of little minds." Of course D can have it both ways. At least she can ask for it. And you - and CB - can refuse to give her what she wants.
> 
> But why post on this thread? We've been talking about ISIS and Ebola, and you're welcome to join in. But why bring in Scripture?


Why are you asking me why I'm posting on this thread? Am I not allowed? The subject came from the discussion of TRUTH as singular and LIES as plural of which you took part. (I forget who started it.) That it has evolved to this point is because DG quoted St Augustine and now wants to deny others the right to do the same.


----------



## Gerslay (Oct 4, 2011)

Wombatnomore said:


> Okay, then go away. If you don't consider what Green or I say is special, then why respond? In my post, I stated that you weighing in supported my claim that evangelism is evident on this and other threads because it's true. If you don't think there is any merit in my thoughts, why respond. Really?


You are so funny, you love to command people to leave, to stop posting, to post only in a certain way, etc. I ask you again...who made you thread monitor?


----------



## DGreen (Nov 1, 2012)

susanmos2000 said:


> I agree--it promises to be a truly special occasion. With so many problems in the world it's heart warming to see at least some forms of bigotry and hate crumbling before our eyes. How can anyone see the tears of joy shed by so many same-sex couples upon marriage and still want to take such a basic and fundamental right away from them? Ultra conservatives must have hearts of stone.


Even here in Arizona, there are signs that same-sex marriage will be legal soon, thanks to the recent SCOTUS non-ruling. There is no doubt they knew that refusing to hear the case would be the final blow to laws like the Defense of Marriage Act and various state laws against same-sex marriage. I am rejoicing for those who have waited so long for this. As you say, hate and bigotry crumbling before our eyes.


----------



## Wombatnomore (Dec 9, 2013)

Gerslay said:


> Why are you asking me why I'm posting on this thread? Am I not allowed? The subject came from the discussion of TRUTH as singular and LIES as plural of which you took part. (I forget who started it.) That it has evolved to this point is because DG quoted St Augustine and now wants to deny others the right to do the same.


The thing is, you insert yourself in a controversial way. It's perfectly fine for people to quote whomever they wish and to do so without the fear of being branded a hypocrite. But then, as I've found before, many people on this site ignore the fact that they are hypocrites.


----------



## Gerslay (Oct 4, 2011)

Wombatnomore said:


> The thing is, you insert yourself in a controversial way. It's perfectly fine for people to quote whomever they wish and to do so without the fear of being branded a hypocrite. But then, as I've found before, many people on this site ignore the fact that they are hypocrites.


Now your offended by controversy? And while you're at it, please state where I was controversial.


----------



## DGreen (Nov 1, 2012)

Gerslay said:


> Why are you asking me why I'm posting on this thread? Am I not allowed? The subject came from the discussion of TRUTH as singular and LIES as plural of which you took part. (I forget who started it.) That it has evolved to this point is because DG quoted St Augustine and now wants to deny others the right to do the same.


Your statement is flawed, G. The quote was relative to the idea of truth. If I quoted Ronald Regan that would not make me a republican, you know. Evangelizing is something else altogether. I let CB know evangelizing in the way she has done in the past is not ok.


----------



## Wombatnomore (Dec 9, 2013)

Gerslay said:


> You are so funny, you love to command people to leave, to stop posting, to post only in a certain way, etc. I ask you again...who made you thread monitor?


It's not a question of 'thread monitors,' that's a convenient argument and I'm not at all surprised. The fact that you comment on this thread is the issue. Normally you don't but when a juicy religious theme arises, there you are, lock, stock and barrel, rolling out your platitudes. You're not fooling anyone. Only yourself.


----------



## Gerslay (Oct 4, 2011)

Wombatnomore said:


> It's not a question of 'thread monitors,' that's a convenient argument and I'm not at all surprised. The fact that you comment on this thread is the issue. Normally you don't but when a juicy religious theme arises, there you are, lock, stock and barrel, rolling out your platitudes. You're not fooling anyone. Only yourself.


Womby, this subject started at 9am our time...(and even earlier now that I think about it). You were probably sleeping like a baby...you have come late to the topic.


----------



## Wombatnomore (Dec 9, 2013)

Gerslay said:


> Womby, this subject started at 9am our time...(and even earlier now that I think about it). You were probably sleeping like a baby...you have come late to the topic.


Is that all you can come up with? I've been visiting this site frequently over the last 24 hours. Do not assume anything. That is a sad trait of yours. Deal with it.


----------



## Gerslay (Oct 4, 2011)

Wombatnomore said:


> Is that all you can come up with? I've been visiting this site frequently over the last 24 hours. Do not assume anything. That is a sad trait of yours. Deal with it.


Nighty night Womby...kiss kiss hug hug!


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## Wombatnomore (Dec 9, 2013)

Gerslay said:


> Nighty night Womby...kiss kiss hug hug!


Oh, you!


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## SQM (Jun 22, 2012)

http://www.cbc.ca/news/world/catholic-church-makes-stunning-overture-toward-gays-1.2797497

Mrs. Somma,

I am reposting this link. Even the pope is lightening up.

Live and Let Live. (Who said that - James Bond?)


----------



## Knitter from Nebraska (Jun 9, 2013)

susanmos2000 said:


> I agree--it promises to be a truly special occasion. With so many problems in the world it's heart warming to see at least some forms of bigotry and hate crumbling before our eyes. How can anyone see the tears of joy shed by so many same-sex couples upon marriage and still want to take such a basic and fundamental right away from them? Ultra conservatives must have hearts of stone.


What I find a little amusing, is that all of this only confirms my faith. It was all predicted a long time ago, in the Bible. We are seeing Biblical prophecy unfold, in your words and the words of others.

It is written!


----------



## Knitter from Nebraska (Jun 9, 2013)

SQM said:


> http://www.cbc.ca/news/world/catholic-church-makes-stunning-overture-toward-gays-1.2797497
> 
> Mrs. Somma,
> 
> ...


This too, was predicted!


----------



## DGreen (Nov 1, 2012)

Poor Purl said:


> So I'll quote Ralph Waldo Emerson: "A foolish consistency is the hobgoblin of little minds." Of course D can have it both ways. At least she can ask for it. And you - and CB - can refuse to give her what she wants.
> 
> But why post on this thread? We've been talking about ISIS and Ebola, and you're welcome to join in. But why bring in Scripture?


They bring in scripture because it is the central force in their lives. Everything, everything, is seen in the light of their religious beliefs. Which is why fundies are so dangerous to separation of church and state and why the extreme right panders to them.


----------



## susanmos2000 (May 10, 2011)

joeysomma said:


> Meet new victims of so-called 'marriage equality'
> 
> Dozens of Christians prosecuted, fined for non-participation in same-sex weddings


Sorry, but this has nothing to do with granting same-sex couples "special privileges". Rather, American business owners are expected to comply with certain regulations, and that includes not discriminating on the basis of age, race, and sexual orientation. The fact that modern-day bigots can find passages in the Bible to support their twisted beliefs means nothing--in the days of segregation racists had plenty of Biblical scriptures at their disposal to "prove" that the races shouldn't mingle.


----------



## theyarnlady (Feb 25, 2011)

DGreen said:


> I'm an atheist so I don't believe in god, hell, sin, heaven or any of the other things Christians believe in. Or any of the bible.
> 
> CB took it upon herself some time back to tell me how wrong I am, how I'm going to hell, that I'll be sorry, that all I need to do is read the bible...ad nauseum. She most definitely was preaching to me how I am so wrong in so many ways, that I need to sort of fall on my knees and accept jesus Christ as my lord and savior....it went on and on.
> 
> ...


I for one want to know your reason for not believing there is a God? what happen to you as a child ? Did you believe then? I want to understand what led you to believe in something else.
Also I want to know what do you think will happen to you when you die. As we all will die,you must have some point that you believe what will happen?


----------



## Gerslay (Oct 4, 2011)

Wombatnomore said:


> It's not a question of 'thread monitors,' that's a convenient argument and I'm not at all surprised. The fact that you comment on this thread is the issue. Normally you don't but when a juicy religious theme arises, *there you are, lock, stock and barrel, rolling out your platitudes.* You're not fooling anyone. Only yourself.


I don't speak in platitudes, Womby. I don't feel morally superior to anyone. Christians aren't sinless, though we do sin less than when we used to sin more. Platitudes often seem morally righteous but they leave out the truly Righteous One, which I never do. I always point the glory to the Lord and never to myself.

Unless I'm clowning around, but that's another story...

They say my bratitude
is just an attitude
gotta take the latitude
to say that it's okay
it's not a platitude
to feel some ratitude
so show some bratitude
to the world today

...Bratz


----------



## SQM (Jun 22, 2012)

Knitter from Nebraska said:


> This too, was predicted!


Where? In 50 Shades of Gray???????


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## DGreen (Nov 1, 2012)

Civil rights is the fundamental question, and whether protected groups should have the same rights as everyone else. Not special rights. Equal rights.

Protected groups have one basic thing in common - they have been illegally discriminated against due to who they ARE, not what they do. A person of color has no control over their ethnicity. A woman was born that way. An old person can't choose to become younger. A gay person WAS BORN THAT WAY. This is where the problem arises - there are those who won't accept that, based on simple bigotry or religious belief. Fortunately, courts recognize it is not a choice and therefore rule that discrimination against gays is a violation of their civil rights. 

If the businesses you are weeping over had refused service to blacks or women or old people, the case would be cut and dried. Such discrimination would be easily understood as illegal. If a business decided to close rather than serve blacks, we would all say "good riddance." But when it comes to discrimination against gays, committed in the name of religious belief, you're ok with that. It's still illegal discrimination. 

You enjoy the same protections, by the way. Employers cannot employ a religious test for hiring and that protects you. Courts must be blind to religious belief and that protects you. You can't be refused service because you're a Christian. You can't be refused housing because of your religion. See? This equal rights thing, which you take for granted, works to benefit all and protects your religious freedom. 

By the way, you have not bothered to answer my question on the impending destruction of our country because gays are on their way to being accepted as equals. Kindly refrain from posting quotes of others' ideas and tell us why YOU think this is the case. Are you so insecure in your thinking that you must have an "authority" speak for you? We all quote others to support our arguments. You haven't bothered to articulate your own thoughts first.


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## susanmos2000 (May 10, 2011)

Knitter from Nebraska said:


> What I find a little amusing, is that all of this only confirms my faith. It was all predicted a long time ago, in the Bible. We are seeing Biblical prophecy unfold, in your words and the words of others.
> 
> It is written!


Give me a break. Sixty years ago bigots mistook the reality of black children and white sitting side by side in the classroom as a sign of the End Times. That they were wrong goes without saying. I can't fathom the mind that sees evil in the happy tear-filled eyes of a legally joined same-sex couple.


----------



## theyarnlady (Feb 25, 2011)

Wombatnomore said:


> I will attest to that. Evangelism has been a corner-stone to many conversations of some Christians on this site. Even when a person says they're not interested it persists. Rather than research evangelism, I have come to the conclusion that those who evangelize, do so for their own benefit, sort of 'if I keep on keeping on with my devotion to G-d, I really will go to heaven.'


Then what you are saying as I am understanding you came to a belief that came about with no understanding of why you believe as you do.

My resaon and this is just mine and I am not telling you you have to believe in my God is.
I have had things happen in my life that no earthly person can explain. As my God gave me free will as he says he does to all on this earth. It led me to question why, and my thruth was shown in things that others that I have ask either leds to they believe as I do or they don't. I want to know why one would close the door on my belief and open the door to what they have had happen in their life to come to that conclusion. as you have said you have never study the word how do you explain why you beleive this is not true. At least Green siad she would explain why. You on the other hand seem to be following beleif leds me to beleive you just go with the flow.


----------



## DGreen (Nov 1, 2012)

theyarnlady said:


> Then what you are saying as I am understanding you came to a belief that came about with no understanding of why you believe as you do.
> 
> You on the other hand seem to be following beleif leds me to beleive you just go with the flow.


I don't read that at all in wombat's post.


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## SQM (Jun 22, 2012)

Why HI Yarnie,

I too have had many totally inexplicable happenings but I never for one minute thought that it was connected to any man-made religion or to a god. It was just one of those things; just one of those crazy things.


----------



## Designer1234 (Aug 9, 2011)

DGreen said:


> Civil rights is the fundamental question, and whether protected groups should have the same rights as everyone else. Not special rights. Equal rights.
> 
> Protected groups have one basic thing in common - they have been illegally discriminated against due to who they ARE, not what they do. A person of color has no control over their ethnicity. A woman was born that way. An old person can't choose to become younger. A gay person WAS BORN THAT WAY. This is where the problem arises - there are those who won't accept that, based on simple bigotry or religious belief. Fortunately, courts recognize it is not a choice and therefore rule that discrimination against gays is a violation of their civil rights.
> 
> ...


 :thumbup:


----------



## Wombatnomore (Dec 9, 2013)

Gerslay said:


> I don't speak in platitudes, Womby. I don't feel morally superior to anyone. Christians aren't sinless, though we do sin less than when we used to sin more. Platitudes often seem morally righteous but they leave out the truly Righteous One, which I never do. I always point the glory to the Lord and never to myself.
> 
> Unless I'm clowning around, but that's another story...
> 
> ...


Okay, maybe I should have used the word 'attitude' you 'bratitude.'


----------



## theyarnlady (Feb 25, 2011)

DGreen said:


> I don't read that at all in wombat's post.


Then we agree to disagree. As I really want to know whyall of you believe as you do?

Gerslay has stated why she believes as she does, so has Joey as have CB and others. Even I today stated why I believe as I do.

I want to know why you all have come to this concludtion? It is not done in anything other then to know what happen in all of your lives to led you to what you believe.

I want to know with out causing a war of words. I know many of you do not believe in the words of the Bible , and think the words have been change over time. But from what I have read the words may not be the same but they carry the same meaning. That has not change since God pronnouce them to the Jewish nation. Also with anthrpologist finding things that have brought out truth that what is said in the Bible has happen. I want to know what you think and why you have come to that concludsion. Sorry about word spelling to lazy to look it up again.


----------



## Wombatnomore (Dec 9, 2013)

SQM said:


> Where? In 50 Shades of Gray???????


 :XD:


----------



## susanmos2000 (May 10, 2011)

joeysomma said:


> There is no *scientific* evidence that Homosexuals are born that way. It is all behavior. If they were they could not change to heterosexual behavior. Every sexual act (other than rape) is a person's choice before it happens. You are believing propaganda.


Oh please. There's plenty of scientific evidence that gay men and women are born that way.

From Harvard.edu:

"Although many researchers claim that sexuality has a genetic basis, others have argued that prenatal hormones and brain development play a more crucial role. Differences in brain morphology and function between men are women are thought to arise prenatally. Research has shown that homosexuality in males correlates weakly to birth order; men with several older brothers are more likely to be gay, implicating that different hormonal environments in the womb may lead to different sexualities in adults (Bogaert 2006). Morphological differences were also seen between the brains of straight and gay men upon autopsy (Swaab and Hofman 1990). More recently, studies on adult men and women have shown that gay men have brain responses more like straight females and lesbian women have brain responses similar to those of straight men (Savic and Lindström 2008). These authors point to a biological basis for sexuality rooted not necessarily in genetics but rather in brain functionality, as programmed by responses to maternal hormones during early development."


----------



## Poor Purl (Apr 14, 2011)

theyarnlady said:


> Then we agree to disagree. As I really want to know whyall of you believe as you do?


Because no God would have allowed the Nazis to murder infants and babies so cruelly. I was in high school when I realized that, and have never since found any reason to believe.


----------



## Wombatnomore (Dec 9, 2013)

theyarnlady said:


> Then we agree to disagree. As I really want to know whyall of you believe as you do?
> 
> Gerslay has stated why she believes as she does, so has Joey as have CB and others. Even I today stated why I believe as I do.
> 
> ...


Since I was a little girl going to church and Sunday school, I have questioned the existence of G-d. Nothing has happened in my life which would have induced me to either embrace or reject G-d. I don't think there is a G-d.


----------



## susanmos2000 (May 10, 2011)

joeysomma said:


> When their so-called right trumps another person's First Amendment right, everyone looses. Just like your Freedom From Religion Foundation is helping to bring down the Country. Please tell me who is injured by a poster of American Flag with a small boy and girl in front of it with folded hands. Why is someones offence take preference over the rest of the people who look at it?


I've seen that poster and, besides the obvious fact that it promotes religion, find it offensive on the grounds that it's unbelievably saccharine and kitsch.

You're a gung-ho Christian of course and want everyone to be exposed to your beliefs, but I wonder how you'd feel about a public school that posted Islamic symbols and pages from the Koran on the grounds that a majority of parents and students favored it.


----------



## theyarnlady (Feb 25, 2011)

Poor Purl said:


> Because no God would have allowed the Nazis to murder infants and babies so cruelly. I was in high school when I realized that, and have never since found any reason to believe.


In my belief what happen was allowed because of evil in this world and it has not change since the begin. 
when Eve chose evil she did it of her own free will. Just like Hilter and those who followed him and those that allowed him to do that.

God never promise us who believe a rose garden. We would be asailed just like the dewish people through the cnetury's have been asailed.
Right now Chritians in the mideast are being killed. I saw on the news that one man because he would not deny his faith in God was shot in the head in front of his child. That Child still clings to her faith that God would be there. He was he brought her to safety. He has his reason and I do not understand it all some day when I am before him he will explain. The world will always be at war or rumors of war. But God will be my God, and he promise me to be there when my life ends on this earth.

You still are his chose one He loves the Jewish people. He is a fataher to all who love him even those who do not. As I have read in my bible. What father would not correct his child. Believe me he has corrected me more then once, and not with a pat on the behind, that would have been much easier for me. But being who I am he knew what had to be done.

I am not telling you what to believe so please do not take it that way. It is just my truth of what has happen to me.


----------



## susanmos2000 (May 10, 2011)

joeysomma said:


> Brain responses are psychological not scientific. It is a learned behavior. They do not have an extra gene like Downs Syndrome.


*sigh* Did you bother to read the posted article, Joey? It makes the point that the prenatal hormones a fetus is exposed to have a big effect on it and its future sexuality. Gayness is not a learned behavior--autopsies have shown that the brains of gay men and women are structurally different than those of the straights. It's not simply a matter of DNA--brains form in utero, and the fetal environment plays a crucial role in this.


----------



## Country Bumpkins (Feb 18, 2011)

DGreen said:


> I've never tried to convert anyone to atheism, but have been PERSONALLY hounded by Christians who DO NOT ignore, but who, like Country Bumpkin, sees my statements as an opportunity to prosthelytize. Not asking for special treatment in any way - that's the province of the religious.


Atheism is believing in nothing. How can you convert someone to believing in nothing?


----------



## Poor Purl (Apr 14, 2011)

theyarnlady said:


> In my belief what happen was allowed because of evil in this world and it has not change since the begin.
> when Eve chose evil she did it of her own free will. Just like Hilter and those who followed him and those that allowed him to do that.
> 
> God never promise us who believe a rose garden. We would be asailed just like the dewish people through the cnetury's have been asailed.
> ...


Your belief clearly gives you something: peace or happiness, or something else that satisfies you.

Not everyone can be satisfied with that. And I am shocked -shocked - that you would even think of God patting you "on the behind." :roll:


----------



## theyarnlady (Feb 25, 2011)

susanmos2000 said:


> I've seen that poster and, besides the obvious fact that it promotes religion, find it offensive on the grounds that it's unbelievably saccharine and kitsch.
> 
> You're a gung-ho Christian of course and want everyone to be exposed to your beliefs, but I wonder how you'd feel about a public school that posted Islamic symbols and pages from the Koran on the grounds that a majority of parents and students favored it.


Not everyone who claims to be a Christian is . Joey has shown she is a Christian over and over again with how she has help othersand shown how she believes.

One school that I have heard about had such a thing happen and they were totally against it. Islam preach and this was on the news, not Fox either national news) Why then is there no up roar about that from nonbelievers. It is against the law according to what one has said. No religion. Yet even young people who are Christian are told they can not have a meeting at the poll(flag poll ) out side the school to pray. Is it fair, I for one do not think so.


----------



## Country Bumpkins (Feb 18, 2011)

Knitter from Nebraska said:


> What I find a little amusing, is that all of this only confirms my faith. It was all predicted a long time ago, in the Bible. We are seeing Biblical prophecy unfold, in your words and the words of others.
> 
> It is written!


YES!


----------



## Poor Purl (Apr 14, 2011)

Country Bumpkins said:


> Atheism is believing in nothing. How can you convert someone to believing in nothing?


Atheism is *not* "believing in nothing." It simply omits God from the long list of things one does believe in.


----------



## sumpleby (Aug 3, 2013)

joeysomma said:


> Each citizen should have the same rights as any other citizen. Homosexuals think they are special and are entitled to special rights. Then they are forcing anyone who disagrees with them to do as they want. They want to take others rights away, if they do not accept Homosexual "BEHAVIOR." And it is behavior they are NOT born that way.


How is expecting the same rights as everyone else asking for "special rights"?!? No one is forcing heterosexuals to take part in a homosexual relationship. You are being irrational.


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## SQM (Jun 22, 2012)

Country Bumpkins said:


> Atheism is believing in nothing. How can you convert someone to believing in nothing?


We don't convert others. We wait for them to grow up and think.

(Sorry Bumps. I was not putting down your beliefs. It fits you and makes you happy - then it is good.)


----------



## theyarnlady (Feb 25, 2011)

Poor Purl said:


> Your belief clearly gives you something: peace or happiness, or something else that satisfies you.
> 
> Not everyone can be satisfied with that. And I am shocked -shocked - that you would even think of God patting you "on the behind." :roll:


What did your father do to you when you did something wrong?

Did he just say to you go do it I don't care. It is the same way with my God.

If I do something that is wrong, if I hurt someone, or will cause harm to myself . Why would I not expect to be corrected in away that I understand. I do not think my God would pat me on the behind as that would not stop me. He needs and does show me when I have done wrong. Sometimes it is in a gentel way sometimes it is in away that I fine it hard to except at the time but down the road of life see what it was meant for and why.


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## cookiequeen (Jun 15, 2011)

People either have faith or they don't. I don't care why someone believes in God or doesn't. It's a choice (unlike homosexuality). People who have made their choices don't have to be questioned or yammered at, particularly on this forum; and nobody should be made fun of because of his/her beliefs. Just my opinion.

P.S. And when someone who believes in God continues to belittle others, calls them fool, liar, or worse, and thinks less of them for any number of reasons, they are NOT demonstrating their faith.


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## theyarnlady (Feb 25, 2011)

SQM said:


> Why HI Yarnie,
> 
> I too have had many totally inexplicable happenings but I never for one minute thought that it was connected to any man-made religion or to a god. It was just one of those things; just one of those crazy things.


But then how do you believe that it even happen? If it is just a crazy thing why does it not happen to all people on this earth?


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## SQM (Jun 22, 2012)

joeysomma said:


> No scientific proof they were born that way. Did the brains of gay men change because they were born that way or because of their homosexual behavior? Scientists do not agree. If they were born that way, why can they change to heterosexual behavior?


For the same reason you cannot change to homosexual behavior.


----------



## susanmos2000 (May 10, 2011)

theyarnlady said:


> Not everyone who claims to be a Christian is . Joey has shown she is a Christian over and over again with how she has help othersand shown how she believes.
> 
> One school that I have heard about had such a thing happen and they were totally against it. Islam preach and this was on the news, not Fox either national news) Why then is there no up roar about that from nonbelievers. It is against the law according to what one has said. No religion. Yet even young people who are Christian are told they can not have a meeting at the poll(flag poll ) out side the school to pray. Is it fair, I for one do not think so.


If any public school is truly pushing Islam then yes, I have a problem with that--exactly as I would with a school that promoted Christianity, Judaism, or Hinduism. The trouble with letting public school students express their Christianity is that the same freedom cannot be denied students belonging to other religions. I believe it was Oklahoma that opened up that very can of worms--when a Christian monument went up in front of the state capitol there was then no reason to deny other religious groups that same form of expression. End result: a statue of Baphomet, the goat-headed god, going up right beside the one that commemorates the Ten Commandments.


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## theyarnlady (Feb 25, 2011)

o.k. enough you will start to think I am trying to shove my beliefs down your throat.

I can not make you believe as I do. It is my belief's alone. 

IT is only my God that can show what is true. I am just a person who is passing through this life just as you all are.


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## cookiequeen (Jun 15, 2011)

joeysomma said:


> No scientific proof they were born that way. Did the brains of gay men change because they were born that way or because of their homosexual behavior? Scientists do not agree. If they were born that way, why can they change to heterosexual behavior? Prenatal hormones? How did they find these hormones? A guess at best. Just looking for an excuse.


This is just not true. Nobody "chooses" his/her gender. Talk about regressive thinking!


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## SQM (Jun 22, 2012)

theyarnlady said:


> But then how do you believe that it even happen? If it is just a crazy thing why does it not happen to all people on this earth?


I verify thru my senses and my daughter heard the same things that I did. Some of us are more sensitive to inexplicable occurrences. I did not see or sense the presence of a god but I was in awe that a special door opened for me. And it certainly changed my outlook. There is more to life, Horatio.... I guess it made me believe in Shakespeare more.


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## SQM (Jun 22, 2012)

joeysomma said:


> Homosexual behavior can be changed to heterosexual. It doesn't make the news.


And woe to the unlucky bride!


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## cookiequeen (Jun 15, 2011)

joeysomma said:


> Homosexual behavior can be changed to heterosexual. It doesn't make the news.


Give it up. Concentrate on something you can do something about. Like getting rid of antediluvian thinking.


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## sumpleby (Aug 3, 2013)

joeysomma said:


> Below is a sampling of recent cases in which Christians have been sued, fined or forced out of business for refusing to provide a service to a same-sex couple.
> 
>  New Mexico Christian photographers Jon and Elaine Huguenin were sued by two lesbians under the states sexual orientation law after declining to photograph the lesbians commitment ceremony.
>  The Ocean Grove Camp Meeting Association in New Jersey, was convicted of discrimination after two lesbians, Harriet Bernstein and Luisa Paster, decided to hold their commitment ceremony on the Methodist-run associations popular family friendly boardwalk. After that, Ocean Grove quit the wedding-hosting business.
> ...


It wasn't all that long ago that businesses were complaining about being "forced" to do business with blacks. Would you say it would be OK to do that today?


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## Country Bumpkins (Feb 18, 2011)

SQM said:


> We don't convert others. We wait for them to grow up and think.
> 
> (Sorry Bumps. I was not putting down your beliefs. It fits you and makes you happy - then it is good.)


Maybe that is problem. Thinking and not believing. It all about faith.


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## SQM (Jun 22, 2012)

Country Bumpkins said:


> Maybe that is problem. Thinking and not believing. It all about faith.


Of which I have little.


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## MaidInBedlam (Jul 24, 2012)

Wombatnomore said:


> This is interesting. Are you referring to us being captive to all kinds of media (for example), which manufactures 'truth' thereby making it questionable? (I guess I could say the same about lies).


Please, you're acting as if you don't understand a simple statement. I said "We are trapped in the limitations of our senses."


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## Country Bumpkins (Feb 18, 2011)

SQM said:


> I verify thru my senses and my daughter heard the same things that I did. Some of us are more sensitive to inexplicable occurrences. I did not see or sense the presence of a god but I was in awe that a special door opened for me. And it certainly changed my outlook. There is more to life, Horatio.... I guess it made me believe in Shakespeare more.


satan is the angel of darkness . He can do all kind of things in the spirit. he has fooled many people.
Aramaic Bible in Plain English
2 Corinthians 11:14
And not to wonder at this, for if he who is Satan resembles an Angel of light,


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## Country Bumpkins (Feb 18, 2011)

SQM said:


> Of which I have little.


I know.


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## cookiequeen (Jun 15, 2011)

joeysomma said:


> You are right, they DO NOT choose if they are a boy or a girl. They DO choose what they will do with it.


Not what I meant. 
There are people who are naturally attracted to the same sex. I have a gay brother. He was always gay. My parents didn't TEACH him to be gay. Nobody at school taught him to be gay. He didn't learn it in a book. I'm happy that he's married and in a wonderful relationship. He and his partner are both active in their church (christian) where they are totally welcomed. Thank heavens for accepting, tolerant people.


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## SQM (Jun 22, 2012)

Country Bumpkins said:


> satan is the angel of darkness . He can do all kind of things in the spirit. he has fooled many people.
> Aramaic Bible in Plain English
> 2 Corinthians 11:14
> And not to wonder at this, for if he who is Satan resembles an Angel of light,


Actually my paranormal experiences have been pleasant and somewhat fun. Satan must have a great sense of humor.


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## Knitter from Nebraska (Jun 9, 2013)

This, from a homosexual; "I wasn't born this way, I choose to be gay.". And; " I've convinced a few men to try out my sexuality". And this; "It's time for the LGBT community to stop fearing the word " choice", and to reclaim the dignity of sexual autonomy. "
http://www.newrepublic.com/article/116378/macklemores-same-love-sends-wrong-message-about-being-gay

This from another homosexual;
Lets look at the science
 Quite simply, THERE IS NO GAY GENE! Even openly homosexual researchers have come to that conclusion. In 1996, a research team of five led by Dean Hamer at the National Cancer Institute released a study that attempted to link homosexuality with a specific region of the X chromosome. Dean Hamer made the statement environmental factors play a role. There is not a single master gene that makes people gay. He went on to say, I dont think we will ever be able to predict who will be gay. 1
 A well-known brain study of 1991 by Simon Levay tried to find the differences in the hypothalamuses (a very small portion of the brain) of both homosexual and heterosexual men. Levay, who was one of the researchers and himself a gay activist, offered criticism of his own work: Its important to stress what I didnt find. I did not prove that homosexuality is genetic, or find a genetic cause for being gay. I didnt show that gay men are born that way, the most common mistake people make in interpreting my work. Nor did I locate a gay center of the brain. 2
 Clinical professor of psychiatry at the Albert Einstein School of Medicine and past president of the National Association for Research and Therapy of Homosexuality, Dr. Charles Socarides, argues that since psychologists and ministers have treated homosexuality with success, the genetic cause theory must be suspect. 3
 We have all heard bits and pieces from the famous twin study conducted in 1991 by psychologist Michael Bailey and psychiatrist Richard Pillar. But the truth of their own study flies in the face of conventional wisdom. This study attempted to show that homosexuality occurs more frequently among identical twins than fraternal twins. The interesting result is that the study actually provides support for ENVIRONMENTAL factors versus genetics. If homosexuality was a part of the genetic code then both identical twins would have been homosexual 100 percent of the timebut that was not what they discovered! 4
 Prominent researchers Bruce Parsons, William Byne (psychiatrist with a doctorate in biology), Richard Freidman (psychiatrist), and J. Downey each came to the conclusion that there is no evidence to support a biologic theory, but rather that homosexuality could be best explained by an alternative model where temperamental and personality traits interact with the familial and social milieu as the individuals sexuality emerges. 5
http://www.dennisjernigan.com/needhelp/1257-no-one-is-born-gay

So...not ALL homosexuals think they were "born this way". For some, it is definitely a choice!


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## MaidInBedlam (Jul 24, 2012)

Poor Purl said:


> People consider many things, but that doesn't make them true. I think it's fine to use the language as it's colloquially used in context, but truth is truth (try to disprove that! :?). Some word has to exist for what is really, objectively true.


Maybe we need to distinguish "fact" from "truth". It's a fact that I'll die if I don't have any water to drink for a few days. I may think it's a fact that I'll die if I don't have Cheerios for breakfast, but it's not true. I'm really amazed that some people here don't seem to underatand the simple statement "We are trapped in the limitations of our senses."

Maybe "fact" is the word that describes what is really, objectively true. Truth is never truth, including as it does, little things like belief and opinion. Truth is subjective.


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## susanmos2000 (May 10, 2011)

SQM said:


> And woe to the unlucky bride!


I agree--quite a _menage a trois_: the bride, the groom, and his portable shock machine hitting the sheets each night.


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## Poor Purl (Apr 14, 2011)

theyarnlady said:


> What did your father do to you when you did something wrong?
> 
> Did he just say to you go do it I don't care. It is the same way with my God.
> 
> If I do something that is wrong, if I hurt someone, or will cause harm to myself . Why would I not expect to be corrected in away that I understand. I do not think my God would pat me on the behind as that would not stop me. He needs and does show me when I have done wrong. Sometimes it is in a gentel way sometimes it is in away that I fine it hard to except at the time but down the road of life see what it was meant for and why.


My father did whatever my mother told him to do if we did something wrong. Mom was the disciplinarian. But when we got old enough to think for ourselves, my parents knew us well enough and respected us enough to know we wouldn't do anything terrible, anything really bad, like eating a fruit from the wrong tree. :mrgreen:


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## MaidInBedlam (Jul 24, 2012)

joeysomma said:


> They can "love" anyone they want, but the so-called marriage is a sham. I would tell them to their face. I also would tell them, they are loved by their Heavenly Father, and he has a better plan for their life.
> 
> Marriage is ordained by God between a man and a woman. You can call anything else a marriage but it is an abomination in the sight of God. The orders by the courts in allowing so-called Homosexual marriage will bring our country to destruction. Also acceptance of homosexuality as normal behavior is forced on Christians, to destroy them and their businesses.
> 
> ...


You seem to have forgotten that we're all supposedly created in God's image. Maybe His image is more complex than you realize.


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## susanmos2000 (May 10, 2011)

Knitter from Nebraska said:


> This, from a homosexual; "I wasn't born this way, I choose to be gay.". And; " I've convinced a few men to try out my sexuality". And this; "It's time for the LGBT community to stop fearing the word " choice", and to reclaim the dignity of sexual autonomy. "
> http://www.newrepublic.com/article/116378/macklemores-same-love-sends-wrong-message-about-being-gay
> 
> This from another homosexual;
> ...


Yes? And why would anyone choose a sexual orientation that, until quite recently, meant a lifetime of living in the closet to avoid being ostracized?


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## Poor Purl (Apr 14, 2011)

joeysomma said:


> No scientific proof they were born that way. Did the brains of gay men change because they were born that way or because of their homosexual behavior? Scientists do not agree. If they were born that way, why can they change to heterosexual behavior? Prenatal hormones? How did they find these hormones? A guess at best. Just looking for an excuse.


You're mistaken if you think anyone can simply "change to heterosexual behavior." Homosexual men have married women since forever, to hide their sexual makeup from others. Some have had children with their female wives. That doesn't mean they didn't prefer to be with men; they probably fantasized about men while having sex with women.

What do you mean by "How did they <whoever they are> find these hormones?" Hormones are manufactured by the body, and a fetus is flooded with whatever hormones the mother has plenty of.


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## Knitter from Nebraska (Jun 9, 2013)

susanmos2000 said:


> Yes? And why would anyone choose a sexual orientation that, until quite recently, meant a lifetime of living in the closet to avoid being ostracized?


You would have to ask them.


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## Knitter from Nebraska (Jun 9, 2013)

joeysomma said:


> Thank you for your articles.


You're welcome! There were many more to choose from. I just grabbed a couple off the first page of links.


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## Poor Purl (Apr 14, 2011)

joeysomma said:


> No scientific proof they were born that way. Did the brains of gay men change because they were born that way or because of their homosexual behavior? Scientists do not agree. If they were born that way, why can they change to heterosexual behavior? Prenatal hormones? How did they find these hormones? A guess at best. Just looking for an excuse.


Sure. All those gay men decided at some point "I want to have people make fun of me or not hire me or even, in the past, put me in prison, so I'll become gay."

Did you *decide* one day to be heterosexual? Why would you imagine that gay people make such a decision?


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## Poor Purl (Apr 14, 2011)

MaidInBedlam said:


> Maybe we need to distinguish "fact" from "truth". It's a fact that I'll die if I don't have any water to drink for a few days. I may think it's a fact that I'll die if I don't have Cheerios for breakfast, but it's not true. I'm really amazed that some people here don't seem to underatand the simple statement "We are trapped in the limitations of our senses."
> 
> Maybe "fact" is the word that describes what is really, objectively true. Truth is never truth, including as it does, little things like belief and opinion. Truth is subjective.


Okay, in everyday speech that's probably how it's seen. Having studied logic, however, and dealing with truth in truth tables, I can't help thinking of truth as absolute. We don't have fact tables.


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## Poor Purl (Apr 14, 2011)

Knitter from Nebraska said:


> You would have to ask them.


And the answer is usually "I had no choice."


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## Knitted by Nan (Aug 3, 2013)

Posters are writing as if there were only two choices, homosexuality and hetrosexuality. They are forgetting bisexual people. Homo/hetero can be aligned on a scale of 1 - totally homo to 10 totally hetero and most people lie in between 1 to 10. Many homosexual and bi sexual males and females do marry heterosexual partners and some are very happy with regard to their sexual life, unfortunately some are not. Many such marriages are successful because the both or either of the partners do not have a strong sex drive. Many marriages succeed because sex is not the driving part of their marriage. Other succeed because the homosexual partner has lovers, sometimes with the other partners knowledge and consent other times without the other partners knowledge and consent. Sometimes both partners have lovers. Unfortunately many homosexual males and females try to fit into 'normal' society and do commit themselves to heterosexual marriages. This was more evident in earlier times, it has only been recently that homosexual people can come out of the cupboard and tell people that they are homosexual. Many homosexual males and females also have the 'romantic' ideal of marriage - mum, dad and kids, and want that too. Unfortunately, many of these marriages also fail. Some do not. But, people marry because of mutual attractions, not just sexual attraction. People marry because they share many common interests, music, literature, art, study, politics, religion, sport, to name just a few. Many such marriages do endure because the couple can function as a team in so many areas, it is in bed when they fail to connect.

Yes, I speak from experience. My second husband was bisexual. We were together for 20 years. We did share many common interests in music, art, history, politics, the list could go on. OK I cannot complain about the sexual side of the marriage, it was not there most of the time. I found out that he was having affairs on the side. I will not go into public details of how I found out because that is not to be aired on a public forum. One thing I did experience with him was I met so many, many homosexual males and females. I will let you all into a little secret; they are all normal people just like you, me and others, they just have a different sexual preference to non homosexuals, that is all. Some are good, some are very good, some are bad and some are downright very bad. But, you cannot change a homosexual into a hetrosexual. It has been tried with various methods and all have failed, they have just resulted in very confused and mixed up people.

No, my marriage did not fail because my ex was a homosexual, it failed because he was an asshole in many way. It also failed because he 'got' religion and went overboard on Buddhism, and believe me he went overboard. We had 11 monks and staying at our house on one occasion.

I ask the people who are stating that homosexuality can be cured, and they state instances of this cure, if they genuinely know any homosexual people. I mean really know them in depth, not just casual acquaintances. Have they ever discussed the topic with homosexual people, and I mean a meaningful discussion, not one based on the belief that the homosexual is a sinner who needs to be cured and forgiven. People who do know homosexual people on a close and personal relationship basis will know what I am talking about, others will not have a clue and will merely state some study or other that appears to support their view that homosexuals choose to be homosexuals.


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## Poor Purl (Apr 14, 2011)

joeysomma said:


> Truth is truth, never subjective. God is truth.


But God is subjective, though you may not realize it.


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## Knitter from Nebraska (Jun 9, 2013)

Poor Purl said:


> You're mistaken if you think anyone can simply "change to heterosexual behavior." Homosexual men have married women since forever, to hide their sexual makeup from others. Some have had children with their female wives. That doesn't mean they didn't prefer to be with men; they probably fantasized about men while having sex with women.
> 
> What do you mean by "How did they <whoever they are> find these hormones?" Hormones are manufactured by the body, and a fetus is flooded with whatever hormones the mother has plenty of.


IN MY OPINION, there are those who CHOOSE the behavior and can change if they want to. And then, there are those who because their bodies have been flooded with hormones, believe that they were born that way. After all, our environment is absolutely flooded with hormones. They're in our food and water and in the air. However, we can't dismiss testing and treatment for hormone imbalances. Hormone imbalance is very treatable!

Bottom line: feeling a certain way is one thing, acting on it is another. Disallowing rape, having sex is a choice. Anyone who claims to be a believer in GOD, knows what HIS teachings are. GOD doesn't change!


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## Poor Purl (Apr 14, 2011)

joeysomma said:


> I was designed by God to be heterosexual. Anything else would be my choice, and be contrary with God's plan for my life. Women are to be the helpmate of our husband, it is our task to have children and raise them. The natural way.


I would ask how you know all that, but I already know how you would answer.

So other people must - in keeping with God's plan for their life - have been designed by God to be homosexual.

And did you have natural childbirth ("the natural way" ) for all your children? Or did you have some painkillers to help you give birth?


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## Knitter from Nebraska (Jun 9, 2013)

Poor Purl said:


> Sure. All those gay men decided at some point "I want to have people make fun of me or not hire me or even, in the past, put me in prison, so I'll become gay."
> 
> Did you *decide* one day to be heterosexual? Why would you imagine that gay people make such a decision?


An alcoholic doesn't choose to be one, but he chooses whether or not to take a drink. A gambler doesn't choose to be addicted to gambling but he chooses whether to gamble. Both of these things will destroy your life and make it impossible to keep a job. Both of these things can lead to being put in prison. The urge is just as strong in these people! Its a choice whether or not, they give in to these urges. Some do, some do not. Regardless of what urges we feel, we are still responsible for the choices we make.


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## MaidInBedlam (Jul 24, 2012)

susanmos2000 said:


> Yes? And why would anyone choose a sexual orientation that, until quite recently, meant a lifetime of living in the closet to avoid being ostracized?


Why would anyone choose to be a homosexual? Why would anyone choose to only have the ability to flip burgers? Why would anyone choose to be blind? Why would anyone choose to have to wear size 23 shoes?

The answer to these questions isn't blowing in the wind. The answer to all these question is:
They're not choices.
They're not choices.
They're not choices.
They're not choices.
They're not choices.
They're not choices.
They're not choices.
They're not choices.
They're not choices.
They're not choices.
They're not choices.
They're not choices.
They're not choices.
They're not choices.
They're not choices.
.


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## DGreen (Nov 1, 2012)

susanmos2000 said:


> I've seen that poster and, besides the obvious fact that it promotes religion, find it offensive on the grounds that it's unbelievably saccharine and kitsch.
> 
> You're a gung-ho Christian of course and want everyone to be exposed to your beliefs, but I wonder how you'd feel about a public school that posted Islamic symbols and pages from the Koran on the grounds that a majority of parents and students favored it.


I've talked about this before. The poster is undeniably Christian and shows children praying the way Christians do (not the way muslims do, for instance). Because children would see it in a TEACHING environment, it is promoting Christianity in school. Which is against the law in a publicly funded institution. Appropriate in the home? Yes. Appropriate in a church? Yes. NOT IN SCHOOL. No one says you can't teach YOUR children your brand of religion but you can't impose that at taxpayer's expense on other people's children. Once again, if the poster had a muslim kneeling on a carpet with the American flag in the background on the wall, Christians would be out with the torches and pitchforks.


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## Poor Purl (Apr 14, 2011)

Knitter from Nebraska said:


> IN MY OPINION, there are those who CHOOSE the behavior and can change if they want to. And then, there are those who because their bodies have been flooded with hormones, believe that they were born that way. After all, our environment is absolutely flooded with hormones. They're in our food and water and in the air. However, we can't dismiss testing and treatment for hormone imbalances. Hormone imbalance is very treatable!
> 
> Bottom line: feeling a certain way is one thing, acting on it is another. Disallowing rape, having sex is a choice. Anyone who claims to be a believer in GOD, knows what HIS teachings are. GOD doesn't change!


That may be _your_ opinion, but it's not your opinion we're interested in; it's the opinion of the gay people we come across.

And in your last sentences, you are specifically talking about the Christian God as you see him. Many believers in God have a very different picture of him. It is, once again, a matter of opinion.


----------



## susanmos2000 (May 10, 2011)

Knitter from Nebraska said:


> An alcoholic doesn't choose to be one, but he chooses whether or not to take a drink. A gambler doesn't choose to be addicted to gambling but he chooses whether to gamble. Both of these things will destroy your life and make it impossible to keep a job. Both of these things can lead to being put in prison. The urge is just as strong in these people! Its a choice whether or not, they give in to these urges. Some do, some do not. Regardless of what urges we feel, we are still responsible for the choices we make.


Sorry, compulsive gambling and drinking are destructive to oneself and others--same-sex love is not. What goes on between consenting adults is absolutely no one else's business.


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## susanmos2000 (May 10, 2011)

DGreen said:


> I've talked about this before. The poster is undeniably Christian and shows children praying the way Christians do (not the way muslims do, for instance). Because children would see it in a TEACHING environment, it is promoting Christianity in school. Which is against the law in a publicly funded institution. Appropriate in the home? Yes. Appropriate in a church? Yes. NOT IN SCHOOL. No one says you can't teach YOUR children your brand of religion but you can't impose that at taxpayer's expense on other people's children. Once again, if the poster had a muslim kneeling on a carpet with the American flag in the background on the wall, Christians would be out with the torches and pitchforks.


Oh boy, would they!


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## DGreen (Nov 1, 2012)

joeysomma said:


> Homosexual behavior can be changed to heterosexual. It doesn't make the news.


You got it backwards, Joey. Heterosexual behavior cannot be changed to homosexual. Homosexuals can be bullied and coerced and threatened into TRYING to become hetero but that is nothing more than an extreme form of abuse.


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## MaidInBedlam (Jul 24, 2012)

joeysomma said:


> God gave us free choice. Adam and Eve were created perfect, then they sinned.


God gave us free choice. Adam and Eve had free will and made a choice that came from their free will. If they had been created perfect, they wouldn't have had free will or the ability to exercise it.


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## MaidInBedlam (Jul 24, 2012)

Repeat post!


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## MaidInBedlam (Jul 24, 2012)

Another repeat post!!


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## MaidInBedlam (Jul 24, 2012)

Yet another repeat post!!!


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## Poor Purl (Apr 14, 2011)

susanmos2000 said:


> Sorry, compulsive gambling and drinking are destructive to oneself and others--same-sex love is not. What goes on between consenting adults is absolutely no one else's business.


Well put.


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## susanmos2000 (May 10, 2011)

Poor Purl said:


> Well put.


Thanks, Purl.


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## Knitter from Nebraska (Jun 9, 2013)

Poor Purl said:


> But God is subjective, though you may not realize it.


GOD is not subjective! He is unchanging! HE is, was and ever shall be!


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## Knitter from Nebraska (Jun 9, 2013)

Poor Purl said:


> I would ask how you know all that, but I already know how you would answer.
> 
> So other people must - in keeping with God's plan for their life - have been designed by God to be homosexual.
> 
> And did you have natural childbirth ("the natural way" ) for all your children? Or did you have some painkillers to help you give birth?


GOD isn't the one who polluted the earth with hormones! GOD created a perfect earn and HE created man and woman! You should look to the chemical companies and the pharmaceutical companies if you want to know why some people don't feel like the gender they were born with. And then look at satan, who whispers in everyone's ear, that it's perfectly fine to act on our urges!


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## Knitter from Nebraska (Jun 9, 2013)

MaidInBedlam said:


> Why would anyone choose to be a homosexual? Why would anyone choose to only have the ability to flip burgers? Why would anyone choose to be blind? Why would anyone choose to have to wear size 23 shoes?
> 
> The answer to these questions isn't blowing in the wind. The answer to all these question is:
> They're not choices.
> ...


I already posted two links in which two separate homosexuals declared that it was a choice. So, apparently you don't speak for all.


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## Knitter from Nebraska (Jun 9, 2013)

Poor Purl said:


> That may be _your_ opinion, but it's not your opinion we're interested in; it's the opinion of the gay people we come across.
> 
> And in your last sentences, you are specifically talking about the Christian God as you see him. Many believers in God have a very different picture of him. It is, once again, a matter of opinion.


Again, I posted links to two articles of homosexuals declaring that it is a choice. Just ignore that, and keep repeating the mantra! "They're victims. They were born that way. They have no choice.".

One cannot believe in GOD, without believing in the word of GOD!


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## susanmos2000 (May 10, 2011)

joeysomma said:


> Then why is their life expectancy shorter than heterosexuals? Why do they have more sexually transmitted diseases?


You can thank rampant bigotry for that.

A Columbia University study, which was published online in the Social Science & Medicine journal, found that "lesbian, gay and bisexual people in communities with high levels of anti-gay prejudice lived an average of 12 years less than their counterparts in more accepting environments.

"Our findings indicate that sexual minorities living in communities with higher levels of prejudice die sooner than sexual minorities living in low-prejudice communities, and that these effects are independent of established risk factors for mortality, including household income, education, gender, ethnicity, and age, as well as the average income and education level of residents in the communities where the respondents lived," the study's lead author, Mark Hatzenbuehler, an assistant professor of Sociomedical Sciences at Columbia University's Mailman School of Public Health, is quoted in a press release as saying.

He added, "In fact, our results for prejudice were comparable to life expectancy differences that have been observed between individuals with and without a high school education."


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## Country Bumpkins (Feb 18, 2011)

Knitter from Nebraska said:


> GOD is not subjective! He is unchanging! HE is, was and ever shall be!


 :thumbup:


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## cookiequeen (Jun 15, 2011)

I really can't believe that in today's world there is still condemnation of people who are gay--or whatever. I went for a walk for an hour and came back to see that it's still going on. Pretty bad when people are more conservative than the Pope!


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## DGreen (Nov 1, 2012)

Knitter from Nebraska said:


> GOD isn't the one who polluted the earth with hormones! GOD created a perfect earn and HE created man and woman! You should look to the chemical companies and the pharmaceutical companies if you want to know why some people don't feel like the gender they were born with. And then look at satan, who whispers in everyone's ear, that it's perfectly fine to act on our urges!


Then the homosexuality mentioned in the bible was because of big pharma and chemical companies releasing hormones in the environment?

I haven't heard from Satan, myself. I don't act on every urge I have either. Speaking only for myself, of course.


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## DGreen (Nov 1, 2012)

EveMCooke said:


> Posters are writing as if there were only two choices, homosexuality and hetrosexuality. They are forgetting bisexual people. Homo/hetero can be aligned on a scale of 1 - totally homo to 10 totally hetero and most people lie in between 1 to 10. Many homosexual and bi sexual males and females do marry heterosexual partners and some are very happy with regard to their sexual life, unfortunately some are not. Many such marriages are successful because the both or either of the partners do not have a strong sex drive. Many marriages succeed because sex is not the driving part of their marriage. Other succeed because the homosexual partner has lovers, sometimes with the other partners knowledge and consent other times without the other partners knowledge and consent. Sometimes both partners have lovers. Unfortunately many homosexual males and females try to fit into 'normal' society and do commit themselves to heterosexual marriages. This was more evident in earlier times, it has only been recently that homosexual people can come out of the cupboard and tell people that they are homosexual. Many homosexual males and females also have the 'romantic' ideal of marriage - mum, dad and kids, and want that too. Unfortunately, many of these marriages also fail. Some do not. But, people marry because of mutual attractions, not just sexual attraction. People marry because they share many common interests, music, literature, art, study, politics, religion, sport, to name just a few. Many such marriages do endure because the couple can function as a team in so many areas, it is in bed when they fail to connect.
> 
> Yes, I speak from experience. My second husband was bisexual. We were together for 20 years. We did share many common interests in music, art, history, politics, the list could go on. OK I cannot complain about the sexual side of the marriage, it was not there most of the time. I found out that he was having affairs on the side. I will not go into public details of how I found out because that is not to be aired on a public forum. One thing I did experience with him was I met so many, many homosexual males and females. I will let you all into a little secret; they are all normal people just like you, me and others, they just have a different sexual preference to non homosexuals, that is all. Some are good, some are very good, some are bad and some are downright very bad. But, you cannot change a homosexual into a hetrosexual. It has been tried with various methods and all have failed, they have just resulted in very confused and mixed up people.
> 
> ...


Excellent, thoughtful post. Thank you, Eve.


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## DGreen (Nov 1, 2012)

Knitter from Nebraska said:


> I already posted two links in which two separate homosexuals declared that it was a choice. So, apparently you don't speak for all.


That's two. Out of how many?


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## Poor Purl (Apr 14, 2011)

Knitter from Nebraska said:


> GOD is not subjective! He is unchanging! HE is, was and ever shall be!


To you.


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## Poor Purl (Apr 14, 2011)

joeysomma said:


> I was given a hypo without my knowledge for my first one, and the only way I could feel the contractions was with my hands on my stomach. I guess I was in labor a few hours, but only uncomfortable for about an hour.
> I kept reminding them with the next two that I wanted no pain medicine. About 4 hours of labor for second one, less than 3 for the 3rd one. And I breast fed all.


Good for you! That's the way it should be, assuming you can tolerate it.


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## Poor Purl (Apr 14, 2011)

Knitter from Nebraska said:


> GOD isn't the one who polluted the earth with hormones! GOD created a perfect earn and HE created man and woman! You should look to the chemical companies and the pharmaceutical companies if you want to know why some people don't feel like the gender they were born with. And then look at satan, who whispers in everyone's ear, that it's perfectly fine to act on our urges!


The ancient Greeks practiced both hetero- and homosexuality. No chemical companies, no pharmaceutical companies.

Also no Christians for more than 400 years to come.

If you would introduce me to Satan, maybe I'd believe in him. Not otherwise.


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## Poor Purl (Apr 14, 2011)

Knitter from Nebraska said:


> Again, I posted links to two articles of homosexuals declaring that it is a choice. Just ignore that, and keep repeating the mantra! "They're victims. They were born that way. They have no choice.".
> 
> One cannot believe in GOD, without believing in the word of GOD!


*Your* God. Many believe in God without having any idea what's in the Bible. Many others know the Bible but don't believe in God. I think it's hard to accept that, if you're a Christian, but it's true.

Let me know 5 years from now what those same two ex-homosexuals have to say.


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## DGreen (Nov 1, 2012)

joeysomma said:


> The Law of Moses also says that "if a man finds a betrothed young woman in the countryside, and the man forces her and lies with her, then only the man who lay with her shall die. But you shall do nothing to the young woman; there is in the young woman no sin deserving of death, for just as when a man rises against his neighbor and kills him, even so is this matter." (Numbers 22:25-26)
> 
> Should we then spare rapists and let them go, because "we are not under the law?"


Let's begin with this fascinating passage, which appears to be a quote from scripture and is attributed to Numbers 22:25-26. Since I don't keep a bible in the house, I looked up Numbers 22:25-26 on the internet and it has nothing whatever to do with rape, but something about beating a donkey with a stick.

Curiously, the actual part of the bible that talks about forcing a woman reads thus:

"If within the city a man comes upon a maiden who is betrothed, and has relations with her, you shall bring them both out of the gate of the city and there stone them to death: the girl because she did not cry out for help though she was in the city, and the man because he violated his neighbors wife."

So the writer appears to have taken what is commonly known as "license" in this instance. And begs the question of what to do about the rapist who violates an UNbetrothed maiden.

The general tone of the article you copied for our reading pleasure pretty much comes out and says homosexuals should be charged with a crime and should be punished, and quotes St. Bernard that such evildoers should be put to death.

My earnest question to you, Joey, is whether you agree and believe that homosexuals should be put to death, or whether simply punishing them will satisfy the commands of the bible? This is a simple, straightforward question to you. What do YOU believe about this?

More to come. It's a long piece and raises some compelling questions.


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## SQM (Jun 22, 2012)

Knitter from Nebraska said:


> This, from a homosexual; "I wasn't born this way, I choose to be gay.". And; " I've convinced a few men to try out my sexuality". And this; "It's time for the LGBT community to stop fearing the word " choice", and to reclaim the dignity of sexual autonomy. "
> http://www.newrepublic.com/article/116378/macklemores-same-love-sends-wrong-message-about-being-gay
> 
> This from another homosexual;
> ...


Who would choose to be gay with people on this planet who would post like you just did? No one claims it is genetic since gay people in most instances had straight parents. Whatever the etiology, all people have the right to pursue happiness. This whole discussion is irrelevant to equal rights.


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## Poor Purl (Apr 14, 2011)

cookiequeen said:


> I really can't believe that in today's world there is still condemnation of people who are gay--or whatever. I went for a walk for an hour and came back to see that it's still going on. Pretty bad when people are more conservative than the Pope!


 :thumbup: :thumbup: :thumbup:


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## Poor Purl (Apr 14, 2011)

SQM said:


> Who would choose to be gay with people on this planet would would post like you just did? No one claims it is genetic since gay people in most instances had straight parents. Whatever the etiology, all people have the right to pursue happiness. This whole discussion is irrelevant to equal rights.


This whole discussion is irrelevant to how real people behave.


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## soloweygirl (Jun 9, 2012)

joeysomma said:


> They can "love" anyone they want, but the so-called marriage is a sham. I would tell them to their face. I also would tell them, they are loved by their Heavenly Father, and he has a better plan for their life.
> 
> Marriage is ordained by God between a man and a woman. You can call anything else a marriage but it is an abomination in the sight of God. The orders by the courts in allowing so-called Homosexual marriage will bring our country to destruction. Also acceptance of homosexuality as normal behavior is forced on Christians, to destroy them and their businesses.
> 
> ...


 Joey, are you saying you are not opposed to the homosexual couple's love for each other, just to their marriage? You seem to have different viewpoints going on. I don't see where acceptance of homosexuality will destroy Christianity. I have some homosexual and Lesbian friends that do attend church regularly. They haven't kept their lifestyles a secret and say they are accepted in their churches.


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## Knitter from Nebraska (Jun 9, 2013)

DGreen said:


> That's two. Out of how many?


I don't know how many! It doesn't matter how many. If even ONE said it was a choice, that would negate the idea that they were all born that way. And on that subject, "Eight major studies of identical twins in Australia, the US, and Scandinavia during the last two decades all arrive at the same conclusion: gays were not born that way."

http://www.hollanddavis.com/?p=3647


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## Knitter from Nebraska (Jun 9, 2013)

Oops! Double post! Tablet's acting wonky again.


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## SQM (Jun 22, 2012)

soloweygirl said:


> Joey, are you saying you are not opposed to the homosexual couple's love for each other, just to their marriage? You seem to have different viewpoints going on. I don't see where acceptance of homosexuality will destroy Christianity. I have some homosexual and Lesbian friends that do attend church regularly. They haven't kept their lifestyles a secret and say they are accepted in their churches.


Big Cheers for Mrs. Girl! And while I am here - Thanks to Ms. Eve for her candor and good sense.


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## DGreen (Nov 1, 2012)

joeysomma said:


> In this one thing Islam has it right, as they are an abomination in the sight of God.
> 
> They should be treated like rapists and murderers, as it is a crime. The "brilliant?" people in the court system (mainly liberal judges) haven't figured it out yet.


Once again you have refused to answer a simple question. Let me rephrase the question.

Do you believe homosexuals should be put to death?


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## SQM (Jun 22, 2012)

Knitter from Nebraska said:


> I don't know how many! It doesn't matter how many. If even ONE said it was a choice, that would negate the idea that they were all born that way. And on that subject, "Eight major studies of identical twins in Australia, the US, and Scandinavia during the last two decades all arrive at the same conclusion: gays were not born that way."
> 
> http://www.hollanddavis.com/?p=3647


When I first came back to NYC after my marriage, there were two sets of identical twins moving in my floor when I did. In each case, one was gay and the other straight. How do you explain that?


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## SQM (Jun 22, 2012)

DGreen said:


> Once again you have refused to answer a simple question. Let me rephrase the question.
> 
> Do you believe homosexuals should be put to death?


Please say no. Who would do our hair?


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## soloweygirl (Jun 9, 2012)

joeysomma said:


> Each citizen should have the same rights as any other citizen. Homosexuals think they are special and are entitled to special rights. Then they are forcing anyone who disagrees with them to do as they want. They want to take others rights away, if they do not accept Homosexual "BEHAVIOR." And it is behavior they are NOT born that way.


If "each citizen should have the same rights as any other citizen", then why shouldn't homosexuals have the same right to marry as any other citizen? Why would allowing homosexuals to get married give them special rights? If everyone can get married, why not homosexuals? There are interfaith marriages, interracial marriages, marriages for money or business or bloodlines, etc. Why not same sex marriages? Interfaith marriages often have both faiths conducting the marriage. I know there are some ministers that do perform same sex marriages so all churches are not against it.


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## SQM (Jun 22, 2012)

joeysomma said:


> Their personal life is between them and God. It is their personal business. But when they force their lifestyle on others like making the government call what they are doing normal and punish people who refuse to accept it.
> I will never accept homosexuality as normal, I can accept the individual, but not their lifestyle.
> 
> As far as destroying Christianity, just look at what happened to the Christians who would not make wedding cakes or take wedding photographs, or print gay T-Shirts, one person at a time.


Gay people are not the enemies of Christians. ISIS is. Save your ire for them.


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## SQM (Jun 22, 2012)

soloweygirl said:


> If "each citizen should have the same rights as any other citizen", then why shouldn't homosexuals have the same right to marry as any other citizen? Why would allowing homosexuals to get married give them special rights? If everyone can get married, why not homosexuals? There are interfaith marriages, interracial marriages, marriages for money or business or bloodlines, etc. Why not same sex marriages? Interfaith marriages often have both faiths conducting the marriage. I know there are some ministers that do perform same sex marriages so all churches are not against it.


Mrs. Girl - I am falling in love with you today. A social liberal!!!! Who would think?


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## Knitter from Nebraska (Jun 9, 2013)

SQM said:


> Who would choose to be gay with people on this planet who would post like you just did? No one claims it is genetic since gay people in most instances had straight parents. Whatever the etiology, all people have the right to pursue happiness. This whole discussion is irrelevant to equal rights.


Equal rights, you say? They have the same rights as everyone else! Every person in this country has a right to marry a person of the opposite sex. Period! After all, the very definition of marriage is the union of a man and woman. No, they don't want equal rights. They want to change the definition of marriage and thereby corrupt both the word and the institution itself! They're not willing to accept a legal union that gives them the same rights and privileges because they want to force others to accept and approve their way of life. Furthermore, I've no respect for those who hijack perfectly good words and distort their meaning! They're not gay unless they're carefree and happy!


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## soloweygirl (Jun 9, 2012)

SQM said:


> No one is going to convince the other about the rights of gays to marry. If one side wants to display an antediluvian attitude, let them.
> 
> Everyone has the right to be happy. (Not that I found marriage so great.)
> 
> I have a beautiful gay marriage to go to next month. Two lovely guys who love each other. Both are from great families and wonderfully successful. Going to wear a black cocktail dress with Steve Madden high top black with red roses sneakers. At the Harvard Club. OOOO. So excited.


Sounds like quite a party. Put some sparkle on those high tops. I've been to 4 same sex marriages and a Silver Wedding anniversary last summer. All were wonderful.


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## Knitter from Nebraska (Jun 9, 2013)

Poor Purl said:


> This whole discussion is irrelevant to how real people behave.


How is it irrelevant to how "real people" behave?


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## SQM (Jun 22, 2012)

Knitter from Nebraska said:


> Equal rights, you say? They have the same rights as everyone else! Every person in this country has a right to marry a person of the opposite sex. Period! After all, the very definition of marriage is the union of a man and woman. No, they don't want equal rights. They want to change the definition of marriage and thereby corrupt both the word and the institution itself! They're not willing to accept a legal union that gives them the same rights and privileges because they want to force others to accept and approve their way of life. Furthermore, I've no respect for those who hijack perfectly good words and distort their meaning! They're not gay unless they're carefree and happy!


Grow up. The laws have changed. And considering the divorce rate for decades, there is nothing precious about marriage. So use gay as it was originally intended and see how many laughs you will get. I now see your ultra conservative side. Rather discuss economics with you.


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## Knitter from Nebraska (Jun 9, 2013)

SQM said:


> When I first came back to NYC after my marriage, there were two sets of identical twins moving in my floor when I did. In each case, one was gay and the other straight. How do you explain that?


They weren't BORN that way! It was a choice! That's what I've been saying!


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## Knitter from Nebraska (Jun 9, 2013)

joeysomma said:


> Their personal life is between them and God. It is their personal business. But when they force their lifestyle on others like making the government call what they are doing normal and punish people who refuse to accept it.
> I will never accept homosexuality as normal, I can accept the individual, but not their lifestyle.
> 
> As far as destroying Christianity, just look at what happened to the Christians who would not make wedding cakes or take wedding photographs, or print gay T-Shirts, one person at a time.


I agree! And I will add, any church that welcomes and accepts this behavior is not a biblical church, but has sunk to apostasy!


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## SQM (Jun 22, 2012)

soloweygirl said:


> Sounds like quite a party. Put some sparkle on those high tops. I've been to 4 same sex marriages and a Silver Wedding anniversary last summer. All were wonderful.


Mrs. Girl!!!!!!!!!!!!!

I cannot believe you are writing this. So you are more like my evil republican twin - fiscal conservative, social liberal. I performed a same-sex marriage two years ago. The ladies had to come up from Fla. and found me as an interfaith minister. That was jolly and what a bunch of great women.


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## Knitter from Nebraska (Jun 9, 2013)

joeysomma said:


> If there is a written law like there is for rapists and murders, and if they are found guilty, they should be put to death, by the law. But then why are you worried about that, when you seem to agree that an unborn baby can be put to death just for being inconvenient.


 :thumbup:


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## SQM (Jun 22, 2012)

Knitter from Nebraska said:


> They weren't BORN that way! It was a choice! That's what I've been saying!


The gay twins were not so happy. Why would they choose being gay? Plus even tho both were identical - each gay twin had totally different mannerisms than their sibs. Of course they were born to the same environment. I would say something inborn occurred.


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## SQM (Jun 22, 2012)

Knitter from Nebraska said:


> I agree! And I will add, any church that welcomes and accepts this behavior is not a biblical church, but has sunk to apostasy!


Nebs is now Judge Nebs. And as mean spirited as those on TV.


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## Knitter from Nebraska (Jun 9, 2013)

joeysomma said:


> Marriage in God's eyes is between one man and one woman, Period. Just because one church does it, it does not mean all need to do it. If your friend jumped off a bridge, does that mean you have to do it to.


Marriage was in everyone's eyes, between one man and one woman, UNTIL they tried to change the definition of the word!


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## Knitter from Nebraska (Jun 9, 2013)

SQM said:


> Grow up. The laws have changed. And considering the divorce rate for decades, there is nothing precious about marriage. So use gay as it was originally intended and see how many laughs you will get. I now see your ultra conservative side. Rather discuss economics with you.


I've been honest all along! I'm a Christian and I'm a conservative! Start a thread on economics and I'll be there!


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## SQM (Jun 22, 2012)

Why not emphasis the "they" in your distasteful comment.


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## DGreen (Nov 1, 2012)

joeysomma said:


> If there is a written law like there is for rapists and murders, and if they are found guilty, they should be put to death, by the law. But then why are you worried about that, when you seem to agree that an unborn baby can be put to death just for being inconvenient.


Next logical question.

Should such laws be passed, based on biblical principles?

We're not talking about abortion here. FOCUS, Joey.


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## Knitter from Nebraska (Jun 9, 2013)

SQM said:


> The gay twins were not so happy. Why would they choose being gay? Plus even tho both were identical - each gay twin had totally different mannerisms than their sibs. Of course they were born to the same environment. I would say something inborn occurred.


More likely experiences that occurred after birth. Identical twins have identical genes and identical experiences in the womb. So it couldn't be inborn.


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## Knitter from Nebraska (Jun 9, 2013)

SQM said:


> Nebs is now Judge Nebs. And as mean spirited as those on TV.


It's not I, who judges. I follow the Word of GOD.


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## Knitter from Nebraska (Jun 9, 2013)

SQM said:


> Why not emphasis the "they" in your distasteful comment.


It may be distasteful, but it's true.

The definition of marriage was common knowledge in the past. It wasn't a union of just two people who loved each other. People married for various reasons. But it was always the union of one man and one woman! That is, until the homosexuals came along and tried to force others to accept their definition.


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## SQM (Jun 22, 2012)

Nebs - I am no longer discussing the topic. Neither of us will change our minds. So let us move from the pointless to the absurd. Oh - we are already there.


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## soloweygirl (Jun 9, 2012)

joeysomma said:


> One of the special privileges that homosexuals demand:
> 
> The government in Kentucky is forcing a Christian t-shirt company to make pro-homosexual t-shirts. As one report says:
> 
> ...


I think Kentucky's actions are wrong. It's not the state's business. Whatever transpires should be between the business and the customer. No one else should be brought into it. Not the state, any commission or newspaper. For one business that doesn't want to serve gays or lesbians, there are plenty of others that want that business. The businesses that do accept the gay community will have a whole new avenue of growth for their businesses. Those that don't, for their own reasons, will lose out on the income. I don't see the point of destroying or threatening a business over a service that can be obtained elsewhere.


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## Country Bumpkins (Feb 18, 2011)

DGreen said:


> Once again you have refused to answer a simple question. Let me rephrase the question.
> 
> Do you believe homosexuals should be put to death?


Why on Earth would you say something like that?


----------



## DGreen (Nov 1, 2012)

soloweygirl said:


> I think Kentucky's actions are wrong. It's not the state's business. Whatever transpires should be between the business and the customer. No one else should be brought into it. Not the state, any commission or newspaper. For one business that doesn't want to serve gays or lesbians, there are plenty of others that want that business. The businesses that do accept the gay community will have a whole new avenue of growth for their businesses. Those that don't, for their own reasons, will lose out on the income. I don't see the point of destroying or threatening a business over a service that can be obtained elsewhere.


Illegal discrimination and civil rights definitely is the business of government. Just the same as if they were refusing service to a black person.


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## DGreen (Nov 1, 2012)

Country Bumpkins said:


> Why on Earth would you say something like that?


Read the entire thread and you will understand.


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## susanmos2000 (May 10, 2011)

Knitter from Nebraska said:


> More likely experiences that occurred after birth. Identical twins have identical genes and identical experiences in the womb. So it couldn't be inborn.


No, they don't. Identical twins begin as one fertilized egg, but after the split their experiences in the womb are not identical. Things like the position in the uterus and possible compression of the umbilical cord can affect how well the nutrients and hormones flow to each, for example. And new research shows that such twins have very similar but not 100% identical DNA. All human genes are susceptible to mutation, and the process begins even before the egg divides.


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## susanmos2000 (May 10, 2011)

Knitter from Nebraska said:


> It may be distasteful, but it's true.
> 
> The definition of marriage was common knowledge in the past. It wasn't a union of just two people who loved each other. People married for various reasons. But it was always the union of one man and one woman! That is, until the homosexuals came along and tried to force others to accept their definition.


*koff koff* Historically one man and multiple women has been perfectly acceptable--didn't King David have 7 wives?


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## Knitter from Nebraska (Jun 9, 2013)

susanmos2000 said:


> No, they don't. Identical twins begin as one fertilized egg, but after the split their experiences in the womb are not identical. Things like the position in the uterus and possible compression of the umbilical cord can affect how well the nutrients and hormones flow to each, for example. And new research shows that such twins have very similar but not 100% identical DNA. All human genes are susceptible to mutation, and the process begins even before the egg divides.


Evidence!


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## SQM (Jun 22, 2012)

soloweygirl said:


> I think Kentucky's actions are wrong. It's not the state's business. Whatever transpires should be between the business and the customer. No one else should be brought into it. Not the state, any commission or newspaper. For one business that doesn't want to serve gays or lesbians, there are plenty of others that want that business. The businesses that do accept the gay community will have a whole new avenue of growth for their businesses. Those that don't, for their own reasons, will lose out on the income. I don't see the point of destroying or threatening a business over a service that can be obtained elsewhere.


Revive me. I cannot believe that Girl is writing this.


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## soloweygirl (Jun 9, 2012)

susanmos2000 said:


> If any public school is truly pushing Islam then yes, I have a problem with that--exactly as I would with a school that promoted Christianity, Judaism, or Hinduism. The trouble with letting public school students express their Christianity is that the same freedom cannot be denied students belonging to other religions. I believe it was Oklahoma that opened up that very can of worms--when a Christian monument went up in front of the state capitol there was then no reason to deny other religious groups that same form of expression. End result: a statue of Baphomet, the goat-headed god, going up right beside the one that commemorates the Ten Commandments.


And there it remains. The atheists had their ceremony with only 40 people attending. More people were protesting for the statue to be placed than actually bothered to show up for the ceremony. Go figure.


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## DGreen (Nov 1, 2012)

soloweygirl said:


> And there it remains. The atheists had their ceremony with only 40 people attending. More people were protesting for the statue to be placed than actually bothered to show up for the ceremony. Go figure.


How many showed up is immaterial. How many protested is immaterial. They had the right to do what they did. Freedom of religion. By he way, it was not atheists, it was Satanists. Big difference.


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## soloweygirl (Jun 9, 2012)

joeysomma said:


> I was designed by God to be heterosexual. Anything else would be my choice, and be contrary with God's plan for my life. Women are to be the helpmate of our husband, it is our task to have children and raise them. The natural way.


If you were designed by God to be heterosexual, then why couldn't John Doe be designed by God to be homosexual? This would seem to be God's plan for John Doe. Since God planned John Doe to be homosexual then he should be accepted as such, otherwise all others would be going against God's plan.


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## susanmos2000 (May 10, 2011)

Knitter from Nebraska said:


> Evidence!


How about this?


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## DGreen (Nov 1, 2012)

susanmos2000 said:


> How about this?


I'm not getting the point of that photo.


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## soloweygirl (Jun 9, 2012)

EveMCooke said:


> Posters are writing as if there were only two choices, homosexuality and hetrosexuality. They are forgetting bisexual people. Homo/hetero can be aligned on a scale of 1 - totally homo to 10 totally hetero and most people lie in between 1 to 10. Many homosexual and bi sexual males and females do marry heterosexual partners and some are very happy with regard to their sexual life, unfortunately some are not. Many such marriages are successful because the both or either of the partners do not have a strong sex drive. Many marriages succeed because sex is not the driving part of their marriage. Other succeed because the homosexual partner has lovers, sometimes with the other partners knowledge and consent other times without the other partners knowledge and consent. Sometimes both partners have lovers. Unfortunately many homosexual males and females try to fit into 'normal' society and do commit themselves to heterosexual marriages. This was more evident in earlier times, it has only been recently that homosexual people can come out of the cupboard and tell people that they are homosexual. Many homosexual males and females also have the 'romantic' ideal of marriage - mum, dad and kids, and want that too. Unfortunately, many of these marriages also fail. Some do not. But, people marry because of mutual attractions, not just sexual attraction. People marry because they share many common interests, music, literature, art, study, politics, religion, sport, to name just a few. Many such marriages do endure because the couple can function as a team in so many areas, it is in bed when they fail to connect.
> 
> Yes, I speak from experience. My second husband was bisexual. We were together for 20 years. We did share many common interests in music, art, history, politics, the list could go on. OK I cannot complain about the sexual side of the marriage, it was not there most of the time. I found out that he was having affairs on the side. I will not go into public details of how I found out because that is not to be aired on a public forum. One thing I did experience with him was I met so many, many homosexual males and females. I will let you all into a little secret; they are all normal people just like you, me and others, they just have a different sexual preference to non homosexuals, that is all. Some are good, some are very good, some are bad and some are downright very bad. But, you cannot change a homosexual into a hetrosexual. It has been tried with various methods and all have failed, they have just resulted in very confused and mixed up people.
> 
> ...


Thanks for sharing this.


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## Knitter from Nebraska (Jun 9, 2013)

susanmos2000 said:


> How about this?


While I understand that one identical twin may be born larger than the other or sustain brain damage, they still share the same DNA. The picture you posted tells me nothing. Nowhere is there any sort of documentation stating that these babies are identical twins. They could be fraternal twins or not be related at all.


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## lovethelake (Apr 6, 2011)

Knitter from Nebraska said:


> They weren't BORN that way! It was a choice! That's what I've been saying!


Friend, I have to disagree with you. I do not believe that almost all gay people choose to be gay. I believe unless there was something so horrific in their past that affected their ability to choose rationally, I do not believe being gay is a choice. Like all people (again with the exception of our most 'unique' , 'special', or 'truly in need') have the free will to choose how to live their lives. I hope I do not get slammed for this...........but come on now, haven't we all met young children that our gut told us that they were gay? I know I have, and the best part of that meeting allowed me to be more vigilant of that child. Not in the sense of over protecting or categorizing, but to be sensitive to that being "different" as a teenager is brutal, and I would not want that person bullied. People are who they are, and often, even with the best intentions, we are not going to change them. Accepting does not mean condoning if what the person is doing is truly evil. A metaphor could be you can forgive a person, but that does not mean you must forget what they have done or ever have to associate with them again.


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## susanmos2000 (May 10, 2011)

DGreen said:


> I'm not getting the point of that photo.


Just that so-called identical twins don't have identical experiences in the womb.


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## soloweygirl (Jun 9, 2012)

SQM said:


> When I first came back to NYC after my marriage, there were two sets of identical twins moving in my floor when I did. In each case, one was gay and the other straight. How do you explain that?


Switched at birth????


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## Knitter from Nebraska (Jun 9, 2013)

lovethelake said:


> Friend, I have to disagree with you. I do not believe that almost all gay people choose to be gay. I believe unless there was something so horrific in their past that affected their ability to choose rationally, I do not believe being gay is a choice. Like all people (again with the exception of our most 'unique' , 'special', or 'truly in need') have the free will to choose how to live their lives. I hope I do not get slammed for this...........but come on now, haven't we all met young children that our gut told us that they were gay? I know I have, and the best part of that meeting allowed me to be more vigilant of that child. Not in the sense of over protecting or categorizing, but to be sensitive to that being "different" as a teenager is brutal, and I would not want that person bullied. People are who they are, and often, even with the best intentions, we are not going to change them. Accepting does not mean condoning if what the person is doing is truly evil. A metaphor could be you can forgive a person, but that does not mean you must forget what they have done or ever have to associate with them again.


I've not said that ALL of them choose to be gay, but that SOME do! I also said that I believe that some are gay because of hormonal imbalances or exposure to external forces. I only know that GOD didn't make them that way. I also understand that you can accept a person, without accepting their actions. But IMO, it's their actions that they want us to accept.


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## Knitter from Nebraska (Jun 9, 2013)

susanmos2000 said:


> Just that so-called identical twins don't have identical experiences in the womb.


"So-called" being the key word. Evidence?


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## soloweygirl (Jun 9, 2012)

joeysomma said:


> Their personal life is between them and God. It is their personal business. But when they force their lifestyle on others like making the government call what they are doing normal and punish people who refuse to accept it.
> I will never accept homosexuality as normal, I can accept the individual, but not their lifestyle.
> 
> As far as destroying Christianity, just look at what happened to the Christians who would not make wedding cakes or take wedding photographs, or print gay T-Shirts, one person at a time.


I don't condone people being punished and businesses being destroyed for not accepting gays as customers. That is just stupid. Instead of forcing themselves on businesses that don't want to do business with them, find the businesses that want to. There will be more that want their business.


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## susanmos2000 (May 10, 2011)

Knitter from Nebraska said:


> While I understand that one identical twin may be born larger than the other or sustain brain damage, they still share the same DNA. The picture you posted tells me nothing. Nowhere is there any sort of documentation stating that these babies are identical twins. They could be fraternal twins or not be related at all.


Your argument, Nebraska, was that identical twins share the same DNA and have identical experiences in the womb, and consequently should have the same sexual orientation if such a thing is inborn. I believe you're being deliberately obtuse about this--research has shown that "identical" twins do not have identical DNA, and the size discrepancy detected in 1 in 4 twin births shows that very often the twins don't receive identical blood flow from the placenta. Different DNA and different prenatal experiences may well lead to two different sexual orientations.


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## Poor Purl (Apr 14, 2011)

lovethelake said:


> Friend, I have to disagree with you. I do not believe that almost all gay people choose to be gay. I believe unless there was something so horrific in their past that affected their ability to choose rationally, I do not believe being gay is a choice. Like all people (again with the exception of our most 'unique' , 'special', or 'truly in need') have the free will to choose how to live their lives. I hope I do not get slammed for this...........but come on now, haven't we all met young children that our gut told us that they were gay? I know I have, and the best part of that meeting allowed me to be more vigilant of that child. Not in the sense of over protecting or categorizing, but to be sensitive to that being "different" as a teenager is brutal, and I would not want that person bullied. People are who they are, and often, even with the best intentions, we are not going to change them. Accepting does not mean condoning if what the person is doing is truly evil. A metaphor could be you can forgive a person, but that does not mean you must forget what they have done or ever have to associate with them again.


I never thought I'd say this to you, but

:thumbup: :thumbup: :thumbup:


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## susanmos2000 (May 10, 2011)

Knitter from Nebraska said:


> "So-called" being the key word. Evidence?


This from Scientific American:

Identical Twins' Genes Are Not Identical
Twins may appear to be cut from the same cloth, but their genes reveal a different pattern
April 3, 2008 |By Anne Casselman

Identical twins are identical, right? After all, they derive from just one fertilized egg, which contains one set of genetic instructions, or genome, formed from combining the chromosomes of mother and father.

But experience shows that identical twins are rarely completely the same. Until recently, any differences between twins had largely been attributed to environmental influences (otherwise known as "nurture"), but a recent study contradicts that belief.

Geneticist Carl Bruder of the University of Alabama at Birmingham, and his colleagues closely compared the genomes of 19 sets of adult identical twins. In some cases, one twin's DNA differed from the other's at various points on their genomes. At these sites of genetic divergence, one bore a different number of copies of the same gene, a genetic state called copy number variants.

Normally people carry two copies of every gene, one inherited from each parent. "There are, however, regions in the genome that deviate from that two-copy rule, and that's where you have copy number variants," Bruder explains. These regions can carry anywhere from zero to over 14 copies of a gene.

Scientists have long used twins to study the roles of nature and nurture in human genetics and how each affects disease, behavior, and conditions, such as obesity. But Bruder's findings suggest a new way to study the genetic and environmental roots of disease.

For example, one twin in Bruder's study was missing some genes on particular chromosomes that indicated a risk of leukemia, which he indeed suffered. The other twin did not.

Bruder therefore believes that the differences in identical twins can be used to identify specific genetic regions that coincide with specific diseases. Next, he plans to examine blood samples from twin pairs in which only one suffers from asthma or psoriasis to see whether he can find gene copy number changes that relate to either of these illnesses.

The result might also call into question the many findings of previous twin studies that assumed identical twins were indeed identical, Bruder notes. "It's pretty unlikely they're going to significantly change any of the results found so far," counters Kerry Jang, a psychologist at the University of British Columbia in Vancouver, who runs Canada's largest twin study. "We can adjust our models to take [genetic differences] into account in the same way we've adjusted for different environments."

The discovery of this genetic variation gives hope for an obscure but pressing issue in the case of a criminal suspect who is an identical twin. "If one twin is a suspect and the whereabouts of the other twin cannot be determined, then the jury is often left without the ability to find guilt beyond a reasonable doubt" in cases that rely on DNA evidence, says Frederick Bieber, a pathologist at Harvard Medical School.

"If the twin issue comes up in a criminal investigation it's possible that if there are [copy number variants] that differ between the two twins that might help sort that out," Bieber says.

Given that there are 80 pairs of identical twins in Virginia's convicted offender database alone, this might not be as small an issue as it may sound. And such genetic variation also matters to the population at large.

Bruder speculates that such variation is a natural occurrence that accumulates with age in everyone. "I believe that the genome that you're born with is not the genome that you die withat least not for all the cells in your body," he says.

Charles Lee, a geneticist at Brigham and Womens Hospital in Boston, agrees. Genetic variations can arise after a double strand of DNA breaks when exposed to ionizing radiation or carcinogens. "It reminds us to be careful about our environment because our environment can help to change our genome," he says.

Plus, these variations may predict age-related diseases. Lee adds: "As you age  your chances for having a genomic rearrangement that causes a certain disease increases all the time."

The differences between identical twins increase as they age, because environmentally triggered changes accumulate. But twins can also begin their lives with differences, according to Bruder's study, and that calls into question their very name.

"Maybe we shouldn't call them identical twins," Harvard's Bieber says. "We should call them 'one-egg twins.'"


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## Poor Purl (Apr 14, 2011)

Knitter from Nebraska said:


> "So-called" being the key word. Evidence?


Oh, come on, already. Have you never met gay people? You'd learn a lot more that way than through some on-line "evidence."


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## soloweygirl (Jun 9, 2012)

SQM said:


> Mrs. Girl!!!!!!!!!!!!!
> 
> I cannot believe you are writing this. So you are more like my evil republican twin - fiscal conservative, social liberal. I performed a same-sex marriage two years ago. The ladies had to come up from Fla. and found me as an interfaith minister. That was jolly and what a bunch of great women.


Although I'm not a Republican, I am the "other" twin. I was always classified as the "other" one by many relatives. What's the other one doing? Does the other one have a boyfriend? Are the other one's grades the same? Is the other one getting married, etc., etc. Being compared all the time was the pits.


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## DGreen (Nov 1, 2012)

susanmos2000 said:


> Just that so-called identical twins don't have identical experiences in the womb.


Very true.


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## soloweygirl (Jun 9, 2012)

Knitter from Nebraska said:


> It may be distasteful, but it's true.
> 
> The definition of marriage was common knowledge in the past. It wasn't a union of just two people who loved each other. People married for various reasons. But it was always the union of one man and one woman! That is, until the homosexuals came along and tried to force others to accept their definition.


That's just it. They want the definition to change and be accepted. They are not forcing heterosexuals to have sex with them or to marry them. Just accept that they, too, want to marry a person they love, share their life together and even include children into it. What is so horrible about that.


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## soloweygirl (Jun 9, 2012)

SQM said:


> Revive me. I cannot believe that Girl is writing this.


I guess I emerged from the box you placed me in.  :wink:


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## soloweygirl (Jun 9, 2012)

DGreen said:


> How many showed up is immaterial. How many protested is immaterial. They had the right to do what they did. Freedom of religion. By he way, it was not atheists, it was Satanists. Big difference.


I didn't say they didn't have the right to protest. I was saying that they made a big deal about their having the statue and then couldn't be bothered showing up for the ceremony they protested for.


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## DGreen (Nov 1, 2012)

joeysomma said:


> God did not plan him to be homosexual, he chose that way to live his life. God still loves him and has a wonderful plan for his life, if he would only choose it.
> 
> We are all sinners, as am I. I am just saved by the Grace of God.


How can you say god still loves him when you posted a long "sermon" earlier that very clearly and in no uncertain terms calls for homosexuals to be killed  because they are abhorrent in the eyes of god? You posted this piece to support the basis for your disapproval of homosexuality and to support the notion that any nation that tolerates homosexuality will be punished. Presumably that is the logic you use to claim gays are destroying the country. (So glad it's not the democrats).

You also quite recently supported the idea of putting homosexuals to death "if it is supported by law."

I can only assume that god and you will love the homosexual if he renounces his homosexuality - is that the wonderful plan god has for this person? You can't be serious. You are professing love out of one side of your mouth and supporting executing them out of the other.

By the way, I'm still waiting for an answer to my last question. Do you or do you not believe laws punishing homosexuals by death should be passed? Yes or no. Not difficult.


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## SQM (Jun 22, 2012)

soloweygirl said:


> Switched at birth????


You are great today. So you win today's point for showing another side of yourself. Yay to Mrs. Girl!!!!!!!!


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## Country Bumpkins (Feb 18, 2011)

DGreen said:


> I'm not getting the point of that photo.


Me either.


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## DGreen (Nov 1, 2012)

joeysomma said:


> Answering Ted Olson on same-sex marriage
> By Mona Charen October 14, 2014 11:43 am
> 
> _Appearing on "Fox News Sunday" to discuss the Supreme Court's decision to let stand a number of judicial rulings overturning the acts of legislators and/or voters in 16 states, famed advocate Ted Olson offered the kind of reasoning that, in his former incarnation as a conservative, he would have scorned. "Over 59 percent of Americans now believe that marriage equality should be the law of the land," he proclaimed. Seconds later he seemed to contradict himself: "We have a Constitution and Bill of Rights precisely because we want protections from majority rule."
> ...


Is this intended to reflect YOUR views or do you post this merely to add to the conversation?


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## Knitter from Nebraska (Jun 9, 2013)

susanmos2000 said:


> Your argument, Nebraska, was that identical twins share the same DNA and have identical experiences in the womb, and consequently should have the same sexual orientation if such a thing is inborn. I believe you're being deliberately obtuse about this--research has shown that "identical" twins do not have identical DNA, and the size discrepancy detected in 1 in 4 twin births shows that very often the twins don't receive identical blood flow from the placenta. Different DNA and different prenatal experiences may well lead to two different sexual orientations.


You keep saying this but you've not shown one shred of evidence. I've acknowledged that difference in birth weights and brain damage can occur to make identical twins seem different. But my statement stands that identical twins have the same DNA. Are you suggesting that homosexuality may be caused by damage done to the brain in utero? Please present the source of your information!

PS I just saw your source, am reading it now.


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## DGreen (Nov 1, 2012)

soloweygirl said:


> I didn't say they didn't have the right to protest. I was saying that they made a big deal about their having the statue and then couldn't be bothered showing up for the ceremony they protested for.


How many was "they?" Immaterial. Does it require equal numbers for people to have rights respected?


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## Knitter from Nebraska (Jun 9, 2013)

susanmos2000 said:


> This from Scientific American:
> 
> Identical Twins' Genes Are Not Identical
> Twins may appear to be cut from the same cloth, but their genes reveal a different pattern
> ...


A few things come to mind, first he studied 19 sets of twins and says " some" had different DNA than their twin. Is "some" one? More than one? He states that identical twins"can" begin life with different DNA, but nothing in this article supports this. Its a known fact that DNA can be damaged, especially as we age or as we are exposed to harmful things. This would seem to support what I said about hormonal or environmental issues being at the root of people feeling like they were created gay. Neither does this study negate previous twin studies.


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## Knitter from Nebraska (Jun 9, 2013)

Poor Purl said:


> Oh, come on, already. Have you never met gay people? You'd learn a lot more that way than through some on-line "evidence."


Are you saying that I could tell if identical twins had different DNA just by knowing them?!? Nonsense! If someone presents a statement as fact, they should be prepared to back it up! You expect evidence from me all of time (and then you usually reject that evidence)!


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## Wombatnomore (Dec 9, 2013)

joeysomma said:


> One of the special privileges that homosexuals demand:
> 
> *The government in Kentucky is forcing a Christian t-shirt company to make pro-homosexual t-shirts...*
> 
> Just like Hobby Lobby forced the Supreme Court to allow them to omit covering some contraceptives?


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## Wombatnomore (Dec 9, 2013)

Knitter from Nebraska said:


> Evidence!


It's self evident.


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## Country Bumpkins (Feb 18, 2011)

Wombatnomore said:


> joeysomma said:
> 
> 
> > One of the special privileges that homosexuals demand:
> ...


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## Wombatnomore (Dec 9, 2013)

Knitter from Nebraska said:


> Are you saying that I could tell if identical twins had different DNA just by knowing them?!? Nonsense! If someone presents a statement as fact, they should be prepared to back it up! You expect evidence from me all of time (and then you usually reject that evidence)!


PP's post isn't about identical twins.


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## Wombatnomore (Dec 9, 2013)

Country Bumpkins said:


> You didn't get the story straight.


What part of the story?


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## Country Bumpkins (Feb 18, 2011)

Wombatnomore said:


> What part of the story?


Home » Kentucky Attempts to Force Christian Business to Produce Pro-******** T-Shirts
Kentucky Attempts to Force Christian Business to Produce Pro-******** T-Shirts
Theodore Shoebat October 13, 2014
53 Comments

Share156 Tweet38 Share257 4 Email9

The government in Kentucky is forcing a Christian t-shirt company to make pro-homosexual t-shirts. As one report says:

A Kentucky Human Rights Commission examiner has ordered a Christian screen printing company to print t-shirts that bear pro-homosexual messages and undergo diversity training for declining to make shirts for a "gay pride" celebration two years ago.

The Lexington-Fayette Urban County Human Rights Commission issued the recommendations of its hearing examiner on Tuesday, declaring that Hands On Originalsa company that identifies as "Christian outfitters" on the home page of its websiteviolated the Lexington Fairness Ordinance by passing on the requested order because of its religious convictions.

The Gay and Lesbian Services Organization of Lexington (GLSO) had wanted the company to print t-shirts for the 2012 Lexington Gay Pride Festival. When manager Blaine Adamson declined the order due to the company's biblical convictions not to be partaker of another man's sins (1 Timothy 5:22, Ephesians 5:7), GLSO filed a complaint with the HRC.

"I want the truth to come outit's not that we have a sign on the front door that says, 'No Gays Allowed,'" owner Blaine Adamson said following the filing of the complaint. "We'll work with anybody. But if there's a specific message that conflicts with my convictions, then I can't promote that."

Why is this happening? It's happening because so many people believe that since Christ came and died for our sins, homosexuality must be tolerated.

When it is mentioned that laws abolishing homosexuality should be enacted, there are always those who will say, "how do you justify that in a New Testament context?" or "We are living in the new covenant, therefore this is not biblical." Or, "We are no longer under the law."

Such objections are truly a product of a society saturated in the drizzling fat of tolerance. Even many conservatives today fall for this way of reasoning.

The Law of Moses says, "Whoso killeth any person, the murderer shall be put to death" (Numbers 35:50), should we then throw out this law because "we are no longer under the law"? Should murderers be let go because "we are in the new covenant"?

The Law of Moses also says that "if a man finds a betrothed young woman in the countryside, and the man forces her and lies with her, then only the man who lay with her shall die. But you shall do nothing to the young woman; there is in the young woman no sin deserving of death, for just as when a man rises against his neighbor and kills him, even so is this matter." (Numbers 22:25-26)

Should we then spare rapists and let them go, because "we are not under the law?"

The modern Christian permits the punishment of murderers and rapists (and rightfully so), and there is no argument over "New Testament context," or no remarks such as, "We're in the New Covenant." But, when someone says homosexuals are to be to death, all of a sudden the Old Testament is thrown out, and the arguments of, "Well it's not in the New Testament," are found all over the place.

The New Testament never says rapists should be put to death, but no one (with sense that is) would use this as an argument to spare rapists.

Why are homosexuals all of a sudden exempt from the Divine Law? The only reason why is modern toleration of evil.

St. Peter said that governors are appointed by God "to punish those who do evil" (1 Peter 2:14) Will the modernly minded Christian then argue that homosexuality is not evil? All Christians agree that homosexuality is evil, and thus I do not see how they can argue that governors should not punish the *********.

St. Paul said that "rulers are not a terror to good works, but to evil." (Romans 13:3) Are homosexuals not committing evil when they promote their wickedness, and conduct themselves in their deplorable acts? Or are they doing "good works"? Absolutely not. The state, then, must be a terror to them, for that is what they are appointed to do  to be a terror to evil-doers.

St. Bernard says that the Christian officer who "kills an evil doer, he is not a man-killer, but, if I may so put it, an evil killer." So I do not see how it is all of a sudden ungodly for a state to punish these pernicious *********. Let us not forget that the Scriptures has not one line favorable to these malicious homosexuals.

St. Paul described them as "being filled with all unrighteousness, sexual immorality, wickedness, covetousness, maliciousness; full of envy, murder, strife, deceit, evil-mindedness; they are whisperers, backbiters, haters of God, violent, proud, boasters, inventors of evil things, disobedient to parents, undiscerning, untrustworthy, unloving, unforgiving, unmerciful; who, knowing the righteous judgment of God, that those who practice such things are deserving of death, not only do the same but also approve of those who practice them." (Romans 1:29-31)

Not only does St. Paul describe the ********* as being utterly sinister, but also as "deserving of death", and I would like to see how the modernly minded "Christians" would argue against Paul, and ask this holy man how he would justify such a strong remark in a "New Testament context," or how they would misconstrue his words through sophism to support their mindless theories.

Christ tells us, "You shall love the Lord your God with all your heart, with all your soul, with all your mind, and with all your strength." (Mark 12:30) When King Josiah "brake down the houses of the *********" (2 Kings 23:7), the Scriptures describe him as turning "to the Lord with all his heart, and with all his soul, and with all his might" (2 Kings 23:25), and thus he was following the first commandment taught by Christ.

A state can therefore suppress and lawfully execute homosexuals in loving "the Lord your God with all your heart, with all your soul, with all your mind, and with all your strength", just as King Josiah did.

I would go so far as to say, that the suppression of homosexuals by a state is an expressing of love for God, and for one's neighbor. For it shows that the nation does not want to tolerate what is hateful to God, and it prevents the homosexuals from influencing children, and tyrannizing Christians, as they are beginning to do now.

But you have those who use the new covenant as a way to argue that laws cannot be applied to homosexuals, as if Christ's sacrifice on the Cross all of a sudden promoted anarchy. The New covenant does not mean no government laws. How a Christian governor loves God as an individual is through prayer and observing virtue. But how a Christian governor loves God though his governmental office is done by enacting laws that suppress and uproot evil and promulgate righteousness. In the words of St. Augustine,

A sovereign serves God one way as man, another way as king; he serves Him as man by living according to faith, he serves Him as king by exerting the necessary strength to sanction laws which command goodness and prohibit its opposite. (Letter 185, ch. 19, trans. Parsons)

They are those who say that homosexuals cannot be punished because "Christ died for them." Since when does the state have anything to do with salvation? The new covenant is being applied as though it saves people from temporal punishment, and such argumentation only makes the state a superintendent of salvation. The state does not dictate salvation; salvation is between man and God, not man and the state. If a person commits wickedness, the state should spare him because "Christ paid for it all," that would not be love but license and anarchy.

Even the ancient Christians understood this. Constantine saw how in Phoenicia they forced women to be temple prostitutes, and how their poor children had no knowledge of who their father was. Scorning such an abusive practice, Constantine hastened to abolish this evil, and he had churches built over the place where these demonic orgies were done, and ordered that a bishop and a sacred clergy be put over them. He saw with contempt the diabolical temple of Venus at Aphaca, on Mount Libanus in Phoenicia, where homosexual rites were done, and orgies were performed. In the words of Eusebius,

Here men underserving of the name forgot the dignity of their sex, and propitiated the demon by their effeminate conduct. Here too unlawful commerce of women and adulterous intercourse, with other horrible infamous practices, were perpetuated in this temple as in a place beyond the scope and restraint of law. (Eusebius, Life of Constantine, 3.40)

Did Constantine tolerate such a place? Did he say, "live and let live" and went on with it? Did he say the usual opinion of, "well as along as they're not hurting anyone, I don't care"? Absolutely not. He was a defender of Christendom, not a impotent governor who allows his country to decay through indifferentism. He had the entire building demolished, and the depraved rituals observed within it outlawed. (Eusebius, Life of Constantine, 3.40; Socrates, 1.18)

How do you think Constantine or Moses would respond to all of the disgusting ******** bath houses around the country? They would obliterate them, and rightfully so. So then, let nations that love God arise, and destroy the houses of the *********.

Read more at http://freedomoutpost.com/2014/10/kentucky-attempts-force-christian-business-produce-pro-********-t-shirts/#8kiU5cKMM16IM2s2.99


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## Knitted by Nan (Aug 3, 2013)

susanmos2000 said:


> This from Scientific American:
> 
> Identical Twins' Genes Are Not Identical
> Twins may appear to be cut from the same cloth, but their genes reveal a different pattern
> ...


That is an extremely interesting study. It is well worth reading further details.


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## Knitted by Nan (Aug 3, 2013)

soloweygirl said:


> That's just it. They want the definition to change and be accepted. They are not forcing heterosexuals to have sex with them or to marry them. Just accept that they, too, want to marry a person they love, share their life together and even include children into it. What is so horrible about that.


Yes, you have said it. People just want to be accepted as they are. Back in the 70s when I was a member of the CAMP (Campaign against moral persecution) I met so many who had tried so hard to fit in the heterosexual world and be heterosexual, and failed. So many broken lives, so many who turned to alcohol or drugs or who completely withdrew from life and avoided any social interaction. I also met so many who had been in long term same sex relationships and were extremely well adjusted people. They had successful careers and social lives.

Every Sunday evening the club held a BBQ for the members and I attended with my two children, this was before my third child was born in 1974. The children were never in any harm and it gave them the chance to understand that some people are different in their sexual orientation.

One thing the club opened my eyes to was the fact that there was prejudices in the homosexual world. Some of the members did not like transgender people, some did not like the 'screaming queens' and some did not like cross dressers, although most cross dressers were heterosexual.

All three of my children grew up with an understand and acceptance of all people.

It does sadden me to read the comments made by some people. Unfortunately homophobia still exists today. My eldest son when he was 10 years old, asked a very vocal anti homosexual male "what would you rather see, two men kissing on the street corner or two men fighting on the street corner?" Cheeky boy, the poor man could not answer as no matter what he said it would have been incorrect. He asked another man who said he would never turn his back on a homosexual man because he would never trust that person and he did not want to be sexually propositioned by a homosexual, "when you walk down the street are you constantly attacked by heterosexual females, because homosexual males and heterosexual females are attracted to the same thing, handsome, hunky males". When the poor man stuttered that he had never been propositioned by a heterosexual female my son suggested that perhaps both heterosexual females and homosexual males did not find him attractive.

Same sex couples can now adopt children in Australia and many same sex couples have children by surrogacy. Just like heterosexual couples, some have excellent parenting skills some do not, but the majority make excellent parents.

It does seem that some posters would like the death penalty introduced for homosexuality, and this I cannot understand. Please, they are just normal people with a different sexual orientation. And yes, as another poster said, sometimes you can detect this at a very early age. I have had this said to me so many times, "I knew from a very young age that I was different".

Understanding and acceptance, not condemnation.

I think I had better add, No I am not a lesbian. I joined CAMP because my best friend was a lesbian and I joined to support her. She was very wary of joining alone, she wanted someone there as a friend. My next door neighbour, who had known this friend for many years also joined, as did a neighbour two doors further along the street. She also enjoyed my friends company and wanted to be there for her.


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## Wombatnomore (Dec 9, 2013)

Great. Turkey is using the battle for the city of Kobane in Syria between IS and the Kurds to ATTACK THE KURDS!

http://www.nytimes.com/2014/10/15/world/europe/turkey-airstrike-kurds-isis.html?hp&action=click&pgtype=Homepage&version=HpSum&module=first-column-region®ion=top-news&WT.nav=top-news

Now a further complication to this mess. It was only a week or so ago that the Turks vowed they would not allow Kobane to be taken by IS. So which is it Turkey?


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## DGreen (Nov 1, 2012)

Country Bumpkins said:


> Home » Kentucky Attempts to Force Christian Business to Produce Pro-******** T-Shirts
> Kentucky Attempts to Force Christian Business to Produce Pro-******** T-Shirts
> Theodore Shoebat October 13, 2014
> 53 Comments
> ...


Joey, you posted this already today. Evidently I'm the only one who read it, because had anyone read through the "reasoning" they would be screaming bloody murder.

Let me summarize what you posted as "reasoning".

According to the piece quoted, believing in the new testament does not allow you to disregard anything the old testament says. Just because Jesus didn't condemn homosexuality doesn't mean it is not abhorrent and must be punished by death as is written in the old testament.

Homosexuals are evil-doers, they are filled with wickedness, covetousness, maliciousness, envy, murder, strife, deceit; they are backbiters, haters of God, violent, proud, inventors of evil things, disobedient to parents, undiscerning, untrustworthy, unloving, unforgiving, unmerciful. They are deserving of death.

A state can therefore suppress and lawfully execute homosexuals to prove they are loving God with all their hearts, minds, and strength. Suppression of homosexuals by a state (in context also means nation) is an expression of love for God and thereby prevents homosexuals from influencing children and tyrannizing Christians.

According to the sermon/article, nations must punish homosexuals with death.

*******

Everybody with me so far? You can go back and read the article to make sure I'm not overstating the case here.

What the article suggests is a theocracy. So Joey, if you truly believe in what you posted (twice now), this is what you are saying. There is no other interpretation. And you say homosexuals are trying to take away our freedoms? You claim to be tolerant? The article specifically says you can't be tolerant and be a Christian. That is why I asked whether you thought laws should be passed to condemn gays to death - for clarification so we all know exactly where you stand.


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## Wombatnomore (Dec 9, 2013)

EveMCooke said:


> Yes, you have said it. People just want to be accepted as they are. Back in the 70s when I was a member of the CAMP (Campaign against moral persecution) I met so many who had tried so hard to fit in the heterosexual world and be heterosexual, and failed. So many broken lives, so many who turned to alcohol or drugs or who completely withdrew from life and avoided any social interaction. I also met so many who had been in long term same sex relationships and were extremely well adjusted people. They had successful careers and social lives.
> 
> Every Sunday evening the club held a BBQ for the members and I attended with my two children, this was before my third child was born in 1974. The children were never in any harm and it gave them the chance to understand that some people are different in their sexual orientation.
> 
> ...


It all boils down to acceptance and tolerance, virtues that unfortunately don't hold any value to some.


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## Knitted by Nan (Aug 3, 2013)

Country Bumpkins said:


> Home » Kentucky Attempts to Force Christian Business to Produce Pro-******** T-Shirts
> Kentucky Attempts to Force Christian Business to Produce Pro-******** T-Shirts
> 
> How do you think Constantine or Moses would respond to all of the disgusting ******** bath houses around the country? They would obliterate them, and rightfully so. So then, let nations that love God arise, and destroy the houses of the *********.


Country Bumpkins I have deleted most of your post in my reply as my reply only addresses one issue.

You mention *********, you do know what ********* do, agreed. Well, did you know that not all homosexual men engage in sodomy. In fact, some homosexual males find it distasteful and refuse to perform it. Yes, homosexual men can, and do, enjoy a fulfilling sexual relationship without performing sodomy. I will not go into detail here but if you need help understanding this I am sure someone will enlighten you.

Did you know that many heterosexual couples perform and enjoy sodomy. So should heterosexual couples who engage in sodomy be obliterated?


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## Knitted by Nan (Aug 3, 2013)

Wombatnomore said:


> Great. Turkey is using the battle for the city of Kobane in Syria between IS and the Kurds to ATTACK THE KURDS!
> 
> http://www.nytimes.com/2014/10/15/world/europe/turkey-airstrike-kurds-isis.html?hp&action=click&pgtype=Homepage&version=HpSum&module=first-column-region®ion=top-news&WT.nav=top-news
> 
> Now a further complication to this mess. It was only a week or so ago that the Turks vowed they would not allow Kobane to be taken by IS. So which is it Turkey?


On the one hand Turkey is supporting the Kurds whilst on the other hand and in another location Turkey is persecuting the Kurds. Turkey does not want a free Kurdish state within their borders.


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## Wombatnomore (Dec 9, 2013)

EveMCooke said:


> Country Bumpkins I have deleted most of your post in my reply as my reply only addresses one issue.
> 
> You mention *********, you do know what ********* do, agreed. Well, did you know that not all homosexual men engage in sodomy. In fact, some homosexual males find it distasteful and refuse to perform it. Yes, homosexual men can, and do, enjoy a fulfilling sexual relationship without performing sodomy. I will not go into detail here but if you need help understanding this I am sure someone will enlighten you.
> 
> Did you know that many heterosexual couples perform and enjoy sodomy. So should heterosexual couples who engage in sodomy be obliterated?


And that would be the greater majority, particularly heterosexual men.


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## Wombatnomore (Dec 9, 2013)

EveMCooke said:


> On the one hand Turkey is supporting the Kurds whilst on the other hand and in another location Turkey is persecuting the Kurds. Turkey does not want a free Kurdish state within their borders.


They can't be supporting the Kurds in Kobane according to the article. Doesn't make sense as to why they would use the pre-existent crisis to their own ends.


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## Country Bumpkins (Feb 18, 2011)

I posted this in regards to Wombat's post. Not Joeys.


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## DGreen (Nov 1, 2012)

EveMCooke said:


> On the one hand Turkey is supporting the Kurds whilst on the other hand and in another location Turkey is persecuting the Kurds. Turkey does not want a free Kurdish state within their borders.


But then, it changes every day. Who knows what is next.


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## Country Bumpkins (Feb 18, 2011)

EveMCooke said:


> Country Bumpkins I have deleted most of your post in my reply as my reply only addresses one issue.
> 
> You mention *********, you do know what ********* do, agreed. Well, did you know that not all homosexual men engage in sodomy. In fact, some homosexual males find it distasteful and refuse to perform it. Yes, homosexual men can, and do, enjoy a fulfilling sexual relationship without performing sodomy. I will not go into detail here but if you need help understanding this I am sure someone will enlighten you.
> 
> Did you know that many heterosexual couples perform and enjoy sodomy. So should heterosexual couples who engage in sodomy be obliterated?


It was not my post but to Wombat not getting the story straight about the tee shirts. I don't care to talk about gays. I am not going into it with any of you.


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## Knitted by Nan (Aug 3, 2013)

Country Bumpkins said:


> It was not my post but to Wombat not getting the story straight about the tee shirts. I don't care to talk about gays. I am not going into it with any of you.


Please do not bury your head in the sand, please open your eyes and your mind.


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## DGreen (Nov 1, 2012)

joeysomma said:


> I answered. I if you don't like my answer, not my problem. Besides this is not the same question.


No, you said you would support a law that executed people for homosexuality. I'm asking if you think such a law SHOULD be passed. Like here, in the US.

In the absence of an answer, I'm going to make the reasonable assumption that you will say "yes" because you would likely choose god over country.

This means you wish to have a theocracy instead of democracy. If we started passing laws to conform to the old testament, this country would definitely be destroyed as we know it - which is the land of the free. You want something like ISIS, who kill gleefully in obedience to their holy book. Think about it.

I have and will continue to champion religious FREEDOM. You want everyone else to conform to your religion. So who really wants to take away rights from others?


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## Knitted by Nan (Aug 3, 2013)

Wombatnomore said:


> They can't be supporting the Kurds in Kobane according to the article. Doesn't make sense as to why they would use the pre-existent crisis to their own ends.


I was listening to this on the radio last night whilst I was driving to the gym. They said Turkey was shifting its position regarding helping the Kurds. It seems that the Kurds from Turkey were having more success in fighting IS than the Kurds from Iraq. It seems that Turkey fears the Kurds more than they fear IS. Turkey has been fighting the Kurds who live in Turkey for many years, they do not want to establish a Kurdish state within Turkey. I cannot find any reference to this in today's news, but it is only 7.53 am so it may be a little early.


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## Country Bumpkins (Feb 18, 2011)

EveMCooke said:


> Please do not bury your head in the sand, please open your eyes and your mind.


What are you talking about? How am I burying my head in the sand? I don't care to talk about anyone's sex life. My mind is wide open to sin. Maybe you are speaking to yourself Martha.


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## cookiequeen (Jun 15, 2011)

soloweygirl said:


> If "each citizen should have the same rights as any other citizen", then why shouldn't homosexuals have the same right to marry as any other citizen? Why would allowing homosexuals to get married give them special rights? If everyone can get married, why not homosexuals? There are interfaith marriages, interracial marriages, marriages for money or business or bloodlines, etc. Why not same sex marriages? Interfaith marriages often have both faiths conducting the marriage. I know there are some ministers that do perform same sex marriages so all churches are not against it.


 :thumbup: :thumbup: :thumbup:


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## DGreen (Nov 1, 2012)

joeysomma said:


> Constantine had a theocracy. Most of the article was about what he did. If the government makes a law that says if a homosexual is found guilty and is sentenced to death, then I agree. (This is the third time I have told you this).
> 
> I have never claimed to be tolerant. Homosexuals, liberals and the Freedom of Religious Foundation are the most intolerant people in the US. If they were tolerant there would be no law suits, if a baker respectfully decline to make a commitment cake, or decorated gay pride cookies, or to remove a cross on a hill in the desert.


Then you don't understand the concept of civil rights. Study up.


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## cookiequeen (Jun 15, 2011)

Knitter from Nebraska said:


> I agree! And I will add, any church that welcomes and accepts this behavior is not a biblical church, but has sunk to apostasy!


What's a "biblical" church?


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## DGreen (Nov 1, 2012)

joeysomma said:


> Constantine had a theocracy. Most of the article was about what he did. If the government makes a law that says if a homosexual is found guilty and is sentenced to death, then I agree. (This is the third time I have told you this).
> 
> I have never claimed to be tolerant. Homosexuals, liberals and the Freedom of Religious Foundation are the most intolerant people in the US. If they were tolerant there would be no law suits, if a baker respectfully decline to make a commitment cake, or decorated gay pride cookies, or to remove a cross on a hill in the desert.


Freedom FROM Religion Foundation. Get it right. I'm a member.


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## DGreen (Nov 1, 2012)

joeysomma said:


> It seems you do not either.


Oh, but I do, Joey.


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## DGreen (Nov 1, 2012)

cookiequeen said:


> What's a "biblical" church?


The one that is "right" about how to follow the bible.


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## cookiequeen (Jun 15, 2011)

soloweygirl said:


> I think Kentucky's actions are wrong. It's not the state's business. Whatever transpires should be between the business and the customer. No one else should be brought into it. Not the state, any commission or newspaper. For one business that doesn't want to serve gays or lesbians, there are plenty of others that want that business. The businesses that do accept the gay community will have a whole new avenue of growth for their businesses. Those that don't, for their own reasons, will lose out on the income. I don't see the point of destroying or threatening a business over a service that can be obtained elsewhere.


But it is the state's business. It's a question of violating civil rights.

Sorry DGreen. I just saw that you answered this. I'm behind the times. Little did I know that this topic would STILL be a hot one.


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## DGreen (Nov 1, 2012)

cookiequeen said:


> But it is the state's business. It's a question of violating civil rights.
> 
> Sorry DGreen. I just saw that you answered this. I'm behind the times. Little did I know that this topic would STILL be a hot one.


Some appear to think custom and privilege equates to a "right." Reminding people of civil rights can't be done too often.


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## Poor Purl (Apr 14, 2011)

Knitter from Nebraska said:


> Are you saying that I could tell if identical twins had different DNA just by knowing them?!? Nonsense! If someone presents a statement as fact, they should be prepared to back it up! You expect evidence from me all of time (and then you usually reject that evidence)!


No. I'm just saying that if you knew a couple of gay people, you'd know they were born that way.


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## Poor Purl (Apr 14, 2011)

Country Bumpkins said:


> Home » Kentucky Attempts to Force Christian Business to Produce Pro-******** T-Shirts
> Kentucky Attempts to Force Christian Business to Produce Pro-******** T-Shirts
> Theodore Shoebat October 13, 2014
> 53 Comments


Pro-******** T-Shirts? Oh, please.


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## Poor Purl (Apr 14, 2011)

DGreen said:


> Joey, you posted this already today. Evidently I'm the only one who read it, because had anyone read through the "reasoning" they would be screaming bloody murder.
> 
> Let me summarize what you posted as "reasoning".
> 
> ...


If Christians have to do things in keeping with the "Old" Testament, why don't they keep kosher? Apparently they can pick and choose on some issues; why not all?


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## cookiequeen (Jun 15, 2011)

Poor Purl said:


> If Christians have to do things in keeping with the "Old" Testament, why don't they keep kosher? Apparently they can pick and choose on some issues; why not all?


Good one. I'll dig out my sheitel.


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## Poor Purl (Apr 14, 2011)

cookiequeen said:


> Good one. I'll dig out my sheitel.


Make sure it's the glatt one.


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## cookiequeen (Jun 15, 2011)

Poor Purl said:


> Make sure it's the glatt one.


But of course!


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## susanmos2000 (May 10, 2011)

Poor Purl said:


> Pro-******** T-Shirts? Oh, please.


Uh-huh. Below is the silkscreen they refused to do up. Shocking, isn't it?


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## Country Bumpkins (Feb 18, 2011)

susanmos2000 said:


> Uh-huh. Below is the silkscreen they refused to do up. Shocking, isn't it?


Do you want to be forced to do something you don't believe it? Go ahead and make fun. You will have your turn .


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## cookiequeen (Jun 15, 2011)

joeysomma said:


> I said what I said , you don't presume to tell me what I mean. I answered your question and then you changed the question. How smart is that?
> 
> This country was founded as a Christian Nation and Sodomy Laws are felonies. I wonder how many of those laws are still on the books. I bet many are, they are just not enforced.
> 
> At the present time there is little Religious Freedom and we are loosing more and more.


Religious rights cannot negate civil rights in the public sphere. We are not losing any religious rights.


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## Poor Purl (Apr 14, 2011)

susanmos2000 said:


> Uh-huh. Below is the silkscreen they refused to do up. Shocking, isn't it?


I think they spelled "********" wrong.


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## Poor Purl (Apr 14, 2011)

cookiequeen said:


> Religious rights cannot negate civil rights in the public sphere. We are not losing any religious rights.


What seems to constitute religious freedom in some people's minds is the freedom to force their religious practices on the public and to display their religious symbols in publicly supported places. Anything less than that is a loss of religious rights. To the religious right, anyway.


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## cookiequeen (Jun 15, 2011)

Poor Purl said:


> What seems to constitute religious freedom in some people's minds is the freedom to force their religious practices on the public and to display their religious symbols in publicly supported places. Anything less than that is a loss of religious rights. To the religious right, anyway.


I know, and it's just plain wrong.


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## cookiequeen (Jun 15, 2011)

joeysomma said:


> Baloney!


I have not lost one religious right. Which religious rights have you lost?


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## sumpleby (Aug 3, 2013)

There are people who would refuse service to blacks and latinos if the law didn't forbid it. They once argued that their "rights" were being infringed when they could no longer do that. Would you say we should go back to those "good old days?"


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## cookiequeen (Jun 15, 2011)

joeysomma said:


> Every one of these has lost the Right to say No, because of their Religious Beliefs. I have lost the same rights because of the court decision in each case.
> 
>  New Mexico Christian photographers Jon and Elaine Huguenin were sued by two lesbians under the states sexual orientation law after declining to photograph the lesbians commitment ceremony.
>  The Ocean Grove Camp Meeting Association in New Jersey, was convicted of discrimination after two lesbians, Harriet Bernstein and Luisa Paster, decided to hold their commitment ceremony on the Methodist-run associations popular family friendly boardwalk. After that, Ocean Grove quit the wedding-hosting business.
> ...


So which rights have you lost? The act of discriminating is not a religious right. People are equal under the law. You can't say "no" because the person is blond, or black, or sick, or old, so why should you be able to say "no" because someone is gay? Saying "no" is not a religious right. And neither is discrimination.


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## cookiequeen (Jun 15, 2011)

sumpleby said:


> There are people who would refuse service to blacks and latinos if the law didn't forbid it. They once argued that their "rights" were being infringed when they could no longer do that. Would you say we should go back to those "good old days?"


 :thumbup: :thumbup: :thumbup:


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## Knitted by Nan (Aug 3, 2013)

Country Bumpkins said:


> Do you want to be forced to do something you don't believe it? Go ahead and make fun. You will have your turn .


Nasty, nasty, it is not necessary to be so nasty. Nobody is making fun of you, but you are being very nasty today.


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## Country Bumpkins (Feb 18, 2011)

EveMCooke said:


> Nasty, nasty, it is not necessary to be so nasty. Nobody is making fun of you, but you are being very nasty today.


I didn't say she was making fun of me.


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## annamatilda (Aug 10, 2012)

'


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## cookiequeen (Jun 15, 2011)

Country Bumpkins said:


> I didn't say she was making fun of me.


CB, you stay up soooo late!!


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## Country Bumpkins (Feb 18, 2011)

cookiequeen said:


> CB, you stay up soooo late!!


It is only 11 here.


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## cookiequeen (Jun 15, 2011)

Country Bumpkins said:


> It is only 11 here.


OK, you have my permission to stay up tonight!


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## Country Bumpkins (Feb 18, 2011)

cookiequeen said:


> OK, you have my permission to stay up tonight!


Thank you. I am a night owl. Sleep in late.


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## cookiequeen (Jun 15, 2011)

Country Bumpkins said:


> Thank you. I am a night owl. Sleep in late.


I get up at 6 every morning, no matter what time I go to bed. I'm the opposite of my husband!


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## MaidInBedlam (Jul 24, 2012)

Knitter from Nebraska said:


> I already posted two links in which two separate homosexuals declared that it was a choice. So, apparently you don't speak for all.


Two homosexuals is hardly a landslide. They also have some compelling reason to say they chose to be homosexual. If you enjoy reading fairy (pun very much intended) tales, find some real ones.


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## Country Bumpkins (Feb 18, 2011)

cookiequeen said:


> I get up at 6 every morning, no matter what time I go to bed. I'm the opposite of my husband!


I know you work out early.
I used to get up early with kids but now I am an owl like dh. He stays up later than I do.


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## cookiequeen (Jun 15, 2011)

Country Bumpkins said:


> I know you work out early.
> I used to get up early with kids but now I am an owl like dh. He stays up later than I do.


You should see me. (Lucky you can't)
I'm sitting in my chair in my PJs, tablet in my lap, knitting in my hands, and I'm texting with my son on the phone. I'm still reading last night's KPG newsletter.
Signing off for now.
Latergator


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## MaidInBedlam (Jul 24, 2012)

Poor Purl said:


> Okay, in everyday speech that's probably how it's seen. Having studied logic, however, and dealing with truth in truth tables, I can't help thinking of truth as absolute. We don't have fact tables.


What the heck is a truth table?


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## Poor Purl (Apr 14, 2011)

MaidInBedlam said:


> Two homosexuals is hardly a landslide. They also have some compelling reason to say they chose to be homosexual. If you enjoy reading fairy (pun very much intended) tales, find some real ones.


Two pretty confused homosexuals, if in fact they ever really were.


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## Poor Purl (Apr 14, 2011)

MaidInBedlam said:


> What the heck is a truth table?


You just brought me back to today. I've taught them to undergrads, so I assumed you'd learned about them, but you wouldn't have been one of my undergrads, unless you're much younger than I thought. Sorry. It's a technique for taking a bunch of statements and determining the truth or falsity of combinations of them.

If I thought you really wanted to know, I'd send you to http://www.millersville.edu/~bikenaga/math-proof/truth-tables/truth-tables.html for a first lesson.


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## Knitted by Nan (Aug 3, 2013)

Poor Purl said:


> You just brought me back to today. I've taught them to undergrads, so I assumed you'd learned about them, but you wouldn't have been one of my undergrads, unless you're much younger than I thought. Sorry. It's a technique for taking a bunch of statements and determining the truth or falsity of combinations of them.
> 
> If I thought you really wanted to know, I'd send you to http://www.millersville.edu/~bikenaga/math-proof/truth-tables/truth-tables.html for a first lesson.


But you took me back to yesterday. 1991 in fact, summer, boiling hot, especially in the demountables because the new computer school buildings had not been finished at the Uni. No air conditioning only a fan at the back of the room, recirculating the hot air. Doing a computer maths unit, taking a mid term exam which counted towards our final marks and figuring out the truth tables together with the question on structured English. No leaving the exam room in the first 15 minutes or the final 15 minutes. The guy sitting in front of me comes down with a massive nose bleed only 10 minutes into the exam. I think everyone was more concerned for the poor guy than for the exam, especially as the monitors would not let him leave the room until after the initial 15 minutes. Others were urging him to just go up and bleed all over her and her papers on her desk. Not fun. Now I have a headache remembering those danged things, must push them out of my left ear. I was a lot younger when I took that unit of study, I was only 50 years old. Too darned old to do it now.


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## lovethelake (Apr 6, 2011)

Poor Purl said:


> I never thought I'd say this to you, but
> 
> :thumbup: :thumbup: :thumbup:


Take cover, the sky is falling............snorting with laughter


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## lovethelake (Apr 6, 2011)

soloweygirl said:


> Although I'm not a Republican, I am the "other" twin. I was always classified as the "other" one by many relatives. What's the other one doing? Does the other one have a boyfriend? Are the other one's grades the same? Is the other one getting married, etc., etc. Being compared all the time was the pits.


I have boy/girl twins. I was so obsessed about not letting them being twins define them. I anguished over names (no Jen and Jon, Mike and Meg). I had them in different preschool classes. I referred to them as the babies, until my daughter chided me and said "we are not babies". To be honest, I did a pretty good job of letting them be separate identities. But to this day, even with their very different personalities, they are the best of friends.


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## Poor Purl (Apr 14, 2011)

EveMCooke said:


> But you took me back to yesterday. 1991 in fact, summer, boiling hot, especially in the demountables because the new computer school buildings had not been finished at the Uni. No air conditioning only a fan at the back of the room, recirculating the hot air. Doing a computer maths unit, taking a mid term exam which counted towards our final marks and figuring out the truth tables together with the question on structured English. No leaving the exam room in the first 15 minutes or the final 15 minutes. The guy sitting in front of me comes down with a massive nose bleed only 10 minutes into the exam. I think everyone was more concerned for the poor guy than for the exam, especially as the monitors would not let him leave the room until after the initial 15 minutes. Others were urging him to just go up and bleed all over her and her papers on her desk. Not fun. Now I have a headache remembering those danged things, must push them out of my left ear. I was a lot younger when I took that unit of study, I was only 50 years old. Too darned old to do it now.


What a vivid picture! It's funny how a simple phrase can bring up such recollection.

I doubt that you're too darned old to do anything. You're just old enough to choose not to.


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## Knitted by Nan (Aug 3, 2013)

Poor Purl said:


> I doubt that you're too darned old to do anything. You're just old enough to choose not to.


I'll pay that. :XD: :XD:

If you like Indian or Pakistani dancing, someone has posted a great video on KP, here is the link. I recommend watching it.

http://www.knittingparadise.com/t-292546-1.html


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## Poor Purl (Apr 14, 2011)

lovethelake said:


> Take cover, the sky is falling............snorting with laughter


I have a contact with the Iron Dome people. You can ignore the falling sky.

Seriously, I was impressed with your defense of gay people. I assume the Vatican's new stance on homosexuality allows you to express it, but have you always had that opinion or did it change with the Church?


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## Wombatnomore (Dec 9, 2013)

2nd health care worker in Texas has been diagnosed with Ebola:

http://www.nytimes.com/2014/10/16/us/ebola-outbreak-texas.html?hp&action=click&pgtype=Homepage&version=HpSum&module=span-ab-lede-package-region&region=top-news&WT.nav=top-news


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## susanmos2000 (May 10, 2011)

Wombatnomore said:


> 2nd health care worker in Texas has been diagnosed with Ebola:
> 
> http://www.nytimes.com/2014/10/16/us/ebola-outbreak-texas.html?hp&action=click&pgtype=Homepage&version=HpSum&module=span-ab-lede-package-region®ion=top-news&WT.nav=top-news


I saw this--in fact, there's a new thread ("I know i will get flak for this" ) that deals with this very subject. A lot of people appear to be panicking, but I for one was a bit relieved to hear about the numerous breaches of protocol in that Dallas hospital--nurses fixing rips in their protective suits with tape, Duncan laying in the hospital ER for hours etc etc. It's terrible, but at least we know now how two nurses caught the virus off him. In fact, I'm amazed that more staff members aren't showing symptoms.


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## MaidInBedlam (Jul 24, 2012)

joeysomma said:


> My Freedom of Religion is the right to say NO when it is something God has told me it is wrong. I know what is right and wrong by reading and studying the Bible.
> 
> As far as the discrimination against blacks, it was not the Christian doing it. Almost all Christian Conservatives have treated Blacks as equals since the beginning of our Country.
> If you don't believe me go back in History to the middle of the 1800's. It was a Republican President and Congress that freed the Slaves. A Republican President and Congress that passed the Amendments that gave them the right to vote and full citizenship. Then a Democrat President and Congress that brought in the Jim Crow laws, and separate but equal. It took a World War and another Republican President to start to bring back equality to Blacks. Now it is Liberal Democratic Propaganda that is keeping the blacks enslaved to Democratic programs. 50 years of Democratic programs to help the poor, and now there are more of them. That's helping them????


You have no innate sense of what's right and wrong? No one, for example, your parents, taught you anything about what's right and wrong? If you learned what's right and wrong by reading and studying the Bible, what did you do about knowing what was right or wrong before your reading skills were developed enough so you could read and study the Bible

As for the Republican Party, I suggest you do some reading about its history. When Abraham Lincoln was elected it was the party that stood up for abolition. As for the rest of what you say the Republican Party did after the Civil War, I repeat, the Republican Party was radically different from the Republican Party we have today. You can exercise your right to freedom of speech by driveling along about any subject you would like to, but the Bible isn't going to teach you diddly about American History. By the by, the history of the Democratic Party in the South makes for very interesting reading.


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## DGreen (Nov 1, 2012)

joeysomma said:


> My Freedom of Religion is the right to say NO when it is something God has told me it is wrong. I know what is right and wrong by reading and studying the Bible.
> 
> As far as the discrimination against blacks, it was not the Christian doing it. Almost all Christian Conservatives have treated Blacks as equals since the beginning of our Country.
> If you don't believe me go back in History to the middle of the 1800's. It was a Republican President and Congress that freed the Slaves. A Republican President and Congress that passed the Amendments that gave them the right to vote and full citizenship. Then a Democrat President and Congress that brought in the Jim Crow laws, and separate but equal. It took a World War and another Republican President to start to bring back equality to Blacks. Now it is Liberal Democratic Propaganda that is keeping the blacks enslaved to Democratic programs. 50 years of Democratic programs to help the poor, and now there are more of them. That's helping them????


You are perfectly free to say no. *But you have to live with the consequences if saying no is illegal. * Simple. This is not taking away your freedom in any way. It is not taking away your right to practice your religion no matter how many times you stamp your feet and say it is. When it comes to the rights of a black person to be served in a place of business, your religious beliefs are immaterial. You're open for business and can't discriminate illegally. If you choose not to associate with blacks due to your religious beliefs, you are free to make that choice. Substitute the word "gay" for black and maybe that will get through to you.

What's up with a world war helping "bring back" equality to blacks? You'll need to explain that one.

Christian conservatives have not treated blacks as equals since the beginning of our country. I'm not sure where you get the "conservatives" part, but most slave owners were Christians and for a slave owner to treat a slave as an equal is a contradiction in terms.


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## MaidInBedlam (Jul 24, 2012)

I'm 65, graduating from high school in 1967, but starting college in 1973. I checked out the link you provided. The tables seem to give a passing glance into syllogisms, but I learned more about those in various English classes. I don't think they present a technique I care to use.


Poor Purl said:


> You just brought me back to today. I've taught them to undergrads, so I assumed you'd learned about them, but you wouldn't have been one of my undergrads, unless you're much younger than I thought. Sorry. It's a technique for taking a bunch of statements and determining the truth or falsity of combinations of them.
> 
> If I thought you really wanted to know, I'd send you to http://www.millersville.edu/~bikenaga/math-proof/truth-tables/truth-tables.html for a first lesson.


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## MaidInBedlam (Jul 24, 2012)

There are more than 2 homosexuals in this world. Obviously, I don't speak for those two drops in the great, big basket of homosexuals.


Knitter from Nebraska said:


> I already posted two links in which two separate homosexuals declared that it was a choice. So, apparently you don't speak for all.


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## MaidInBedlam (Jul 24, 2012)

Though the word "sodomy" is now commonly used to refer to anal sex, it actually refers to other sexual acts such as men performing oral sex on women, and women performing oral sex on men. I won't even get into the stuff about having sexual congress with chickens.


EveMCooke said:


> Country Bumpkins I have deleted most of your post in my reply as my reply only addresses one issue.
> 
> You mention *********, you do know what ********* do, agreed. Well, did you know that not all homosexual men engage in sodomy. In fact, some homosexual males find it distasteful and refuse to perform it. Yes, homosexual men can, and do, enjoy a fulfilling sexual relationship without performing sodomy. I will not go into detail here but if you need help understanding this I am sure someone will enlighten you.
> 
> Did you know that many heterosexual couples perform and enjoy sodomy. So should heterosexual couples who engage in sodomy be obliterated?


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## Country Bumpkins (Feb 18, 2011)

Stop putting me in your disgusting post!


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## Knitter from Nebraska (Jun 9, 2013)

MaidInBedlam said:


> There are more than 2 homosexuals in this world. Obviously, I don't speak for those two drops in the great, big basket of homosexuals.


I never claimed that it was a choice for all, only SOME! Two are, SOME! Thus, I made my point! I hate it when reactionaries attack about something that wasn't even stated! If you think I'm wrong that SOME people choose to engage in homosexual sex, PROVE IT!!! Otherwise, stop trying to twist my words!


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## Designer1234 (Aug 9, 2011)

susanmos2000 said:


> Uh-huh. Below is the silkscreen they refused to do up. Shocking, isn't it?


It boggles the mind!!! And it is called a ******** T Shirt?

how ridiculous!!! Narrow, rigid -- :shock: :shock: :shock: :shock:


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## Designer1234 (Aug 9, 2011)

Knitter from Nebraska said:


> I never claimed that it was a choice for all, only SOME! Two are, SOME! Thus, I made my point! I hate it when reactionaries attack about something that wasn't even stated! If you think I'm wrong that SOME people choose to engage in homosexual sex, PROVE IT!!! Otherwise, stop trying to twist my words!


The vast majority are born Gay -- do you accept that? Yes, I imagine 2 or 4 or even 6 decide to find out if they like that life style- however more and more people are realizing that it isn't a choice. Are you saying you don't believe it is not a choice? Do you accept that?

KFN-- no one is attacking you. You made a statement that most of us who are Progressive or Liberal feel strongly about. We are not attacking you personally. Your opinions differ with some of us sometimes. Our group does not have to agree with everyone about everything. We respect your opinions so don't take our questions or possible disagreement personally. OK? We are not out to attack you - we have the right to disagree as you have the right to disagree with us as well.


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## MaidInBedlam (Jul 24, 2012)

Two is a pretty small "some". Yes, some people experiment with homosexual activities out of curiosity and the vast majority stroll back to their original sexual orientation. And let's not forget those pesky bisexuals. I don't quite understand why I have to say any of this, but it seems important to you. I'm not interested in trying to prove anything to you.


Knitter from Nebraska said:


> I never claimed that it was a choice for all, only SOME! Two are, SOME! Thus, I made my point! I hate it when reactionaries attack about something that wasn't even stated! If you think I'm wrong that SOME people choose to engage in homosexual sex, PROVE IT!!! Otherwise, stop trying to twist my words!


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## Country Bumpkins (Feb 18, 2011)

Bible Verses About Sodomy
Bible verses related to Sodomy from the King James Version (KJV) by Relevance

- Sort By Book Order

Leviticus 20:13 - If a man also lie with mankind, as he lieth with a woman, both of them have committed an abomination: they shall surely be put to death; their blood [shall be] upon them.

Leviticus 18:22 - Thou shalt not lie with mankind, as with womankind: it [is] abomination.

1 Corinthians 6:9 - Know ye not that the unrighteous shall not inherit the kingdom of God? Be not deceived: neither fornicators, nor idolaters, nor adulterers, nor effeminate, nor abusers of themselves with mankind,

Jude 1:7 - Even as Sodom and Gomorrha, and the cities about them in like manner, giving themselves over to fornication, and going after strange flesh, are set forth for an example, suffering the vengeance of eternal fire.

Romans 1:26 - For this cause God gave them up unto vile affections: for even their women did change the natural use into that which is against nature:

Romans 1:27 - And likewise also the men, leaving the natural use of the woman, burned in their lust one toward another; men with men working that which is unseemly, and receiving in themselves that recompence of their error which was meet.

Genesis 19:1-38 - And there came two angels to Sodom at even; and Lot sat in the gate of Sodom: and Lot seeing [them] rose up to meet them; and he bowed himself with his face toward the ground; (Read More...)

1 Timothy 1:9-10 - Knowing this, that the law is not made for a righteous man, but for the lawless and disobedient, for the ungodly and for sinners, for unholy and profane, for murderers of fathers and murderers of mothers, for manslayers, (Read More...)

1 Corinthians 6:9-11 - Know ye not that the unrighteous shall not inherit the kingdom of God? Be not deceived: neither fornicators, nor idolaters, nor adulterers, nor effeminate, nor abusers of themselves with mankind, (Read More...)

Romans 1:26-27 - For this cause God gave them up unto vile affections: for even their women did change the natural use into that which is against nature: (Read More...)

Romans 1:1-32 - Paul, a servant of Jesus Christ, called [to be] an apostle, separated unto the gospel of God, (Read More...)

Leviticus 18:1-30 - And the LORD spake unto Moses, saying, (Read More...)

1 Timothy 1:10 - For whoremongers, for them that defile themselves with mankind, for menstealers, for liars, for perjured persons, and if there be any other thing that is contrary to sound doctrine;

1 Corinthians 6:9-10 - Know ye not that the unrighteous shall not inherit the kingdom of God? Be not deceived: neither fornicators, nor idolaters, nor adulterers, nor effeminate, nor abusers of themselves with mankind, (Read More...)

Micah 1:1-16 - The word of the LORD that came to Micah the Morasthite in the days of Jotham, Ahaz, [and] Hezekiah, kings of Judah, which he saw concerning Samaria and Jerusalem. (Read More...)

Romans 1:28 - And even as they did not like to retain God in [their] knowledge, God gave them over to a reprobate mind, to do those things which are not convenient;

Romans 1:24-27 - Wherefore God also gave them up to uncleanness through the lusts of their own hearts, to dishonour their own bodies between themselves: (Read More...)

1 Kings 22:46 - And the remnant of the *********, which remained in the days of his father Asa, he took out of the land.

1 Kings 15:12 - And he took away the ********* out of the land, and removed all the idols that his fathers had made.

1 Kings 14:24 - And there were also ********* in the land: [and] they did according to all the abominations of the nations which the LORD cast out before the children of Israel.

Judges 19:22 - [Now] as they were making their hearts merry, behold, the men of the city, certain sons of Belial, beset the house round about, [and] beat at the door, and spake to the master of the house, the old man, saying, Bring forth the man that came into thine house, that we may know him.

Exodus 20:14 - Thou shalt not commit adultery.

Romans 1:24 - Wherefore God also gave them up to uncleanness through the lusts of their own hearts, to dishonour their own bodies between themselves:

Matthew 19:5 - And said, For this cause shall a man leave father and mother, and shall cleave to his wife: and they twain shall be one flesh?

Deuteronomy 23:17 - There shall be no whore of the daughters of Israel, nor a ******** of the sons of Israel.

Leviticus 18:24 - Defile not ye yourselves in any of these things: for in all these the nations are defiled which I cast out before you:

Genesis 1:28 - And God blessed them, and God said unto them, Be fruitful, and multiply, and replenish the earth, and subdue it: and have dominion over the fish of the sea, and over the fowl of the air, and over every living thing that moveth upon the earth.

Genesis 1:27 - So God created man in his [own] image, in the image of God created he him; male and female created he them.

1 Corinthians 6:11 - And such were some of you: but ye are washed, but ye are sanctified, but ye are justified in the name of the Lord Jesus, and by the Spirit of our God.

Romans 1:24-28 - Wherefore God also gave them up to uncleanness through the lusts of their own hearts, to dishonour their own bodies between themselves: (Read More...)

John 3:16 - For God so loved the world, that he gave his only begotten Son, that whosoever believeth in him should not perish, but have everlasting life.

2 Kings 23:7 - And he brake down the houses of the *********, that [were] by the house of the LORD, where the women wove hangings for the grove.

Genesis 19:5 - And they called unto Lot, and said unto him, Where [are] the men which came in to thee this night? bring them out unto us, that we may know them.

Genesis 18:1-33 - And the LORD appeared unto him in the plains of Mamre: and he sat in the tent door in the heat of the day; (Read More...)

1 Corinthians 6:10 - Nor thieves, nor covetous, nor drunkards, nor revilers, nor extortioners, shall inherit the kingdom of God.

1 Corinthians 6:1 - Dare any of you, having a matter against another, go to law before the unjust, and not before the saints?

Matthew 5:31 - It hath been said, Whosoever shall put away his wife, let him give her a writing of divorcement:

Matthew 5:28 - But I say unto you, That whosoever looketh on a woman to lust after her hath committed adultery with her already in his heart.

Genesis 19:4-8 - But before they lay down, the men of the city, [even] the men of Sodom, compassed the house round, both old and young, all the people from every quarter: (Read More...)http://www.kingjamesbibleonline.org/bible-verses-about-sodomy/


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## Designer1234 (Aug 9, 2011)

changed my mind


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## Country Bumpkins (Feb 18, 2011)

Designer1234 said:


> I get weary of being Preached at.


How did you know it was to you?


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## Designer1234 (Aug 9, 2011)

Country Bumpkins said:


> How did you know it was to you?


You preach to all of us - all the time.

I am over 80 and have made my own choices -- It is tiring to have you Preach to us constantly.

I know you believe completely and I know you feel you have the right to do so, but I still get weary of it Margaret. I am quite sure all of us do.

You try to force your beliefs down our throats. I will face my maker as you will face your maker. I choose a different way than you do. We will know when we meet our maker. Not before.


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## Country Bumpkins (Feb 18, 2011)

Designer1234 said:


> You preach to all of us - all the time.


I didn't put my opinion just scriptures. If you as a Christian are offended by scriptures. What can I say about that?


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## Country Bumpkins (Feb 18, 2011)

Designer1234 said:


> You preach to all of us - all the time. I am over 80 and have made my own choices -- It is tiring to have you Preach to us constantly. I know you believe completely and I know you feel you have the right to do so, but I still get weary of it Margaret. I am quite sure all of us do. You try to force your beliefs down our throats. I will face my maker as you will face your maker. I choose a different way than you do. We will know when we meet our maker. Not before.


Maybe the Holy Spirit is convicting you. Shirley I am not forcing anything. You say you are a Christian so why are you upset over God's word. You should agree with me.


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## Designer1234 (Aug 9, 2011)

Country Bumpkins said:


> Maybe the Holy Spirit is convicting you. Shirley I am not forcing anything. You say you are a Christian so why are you upset over God's word. You should agree with me.


======
That is your opinion - I will choose - you don't have to judge me. I am quite content with my chosen path and the Christianity I follow.

I have lived a long, hard life in some ways, life -with losses that have at times been unbearable- my faith has helped me through those times -and I have reached my own conclusions. I was raised in your type of Christianity - I found a lot of hypocrisy, and still do- I believe differently than you do. I don't push my beliefs on you - you push your beliefs on us though. We will find out who is correct when we meet our Maker. I am not afraid of that day. I know you are sincere and I know that I am sincere - I think God knows my heart and you don't have to Preach to me or to Judge me.

No matter, I know you won't stop.


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## Country Bumpkins (Feb 18, 2011)

I am not judging you. God is the Judge. You are the one reacting. You could have kept quiet.I didn't preach. Just scriptures. I didn't call your name either. I never even said what I believe.


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## DGreen (Nov 1, 2012)

Country Bumpkins said:


> Maybe the Holy Spirit is convicting you. Shirley I am not forcing anything. You say you are a Christian so why are you upset over God's word. You should agree with me.


According to you, EVERYONE should agree with you because you know what god wants.

Not forcing, but sounding like a rusty gate. We are EXCHANGING ideas here. You are REPEATING ideas from others. Makes me think of the old saying, "if you ever had an original thought it would die of loneliness."


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## DGreen (Nov 1, 2012)

joeysomma said:


> Totally wrong, wrong, wrong. A Black person cannot change the color of his skin no matter it he wants to. A homosexual person is still a person, (NOT A SPECIAL PERSON WITH SPECIAL RIGHTS) I would never enable them to sin against God with a marriage ceremony or reception.
> Since you say it is their right, then it is my right (or any Christian's right to say NO to helping them sin against God. No government law will not make me help send someone to hell.
> 
> As far as the rest. Study the real history of the US.


And as I said, discrimination is illegal so you pay the consequences. There is no conflict here. Your choice.

Real history? Yes, real history, not your revisionist propaganda. Slavery was real, it existed and it was practiced by Christians. You can't dispute that and have a shred of credibility.


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## DGreen (Nov 1, 2012)

Country Bumpkins said:


> I never even said what I believe.


Pants on fire, there CB.


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## Country Bumpkins (Feb 18, 2011)

DGreen said:


> Pants on fire, there CB.


I didn't on the scripture I posted.


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## soloweygirl (Jun 9, 2012)

EveMCooke said:


> Yes, you have said it. People just want to be accepted as they are. Back in the 70s when I was a member of the CAMP (Campaign against moral persecution) I met so many who had tried so hard to fit in the heterosexual world and be heterosexual, and failed. So many broken lives, so many who turned to alcohol or drugs or who completely withdrew from life and avoided any social interaction. I also met so many who had been in long term same sex relationships and were extremely well adjusted people. They had successful careers and social lives.
> 
> Every Sunday evening the club held a BBQ for the members and I attended with my two children, this was before my third child was born in 1974. The children were never in any harm and it gave them the chance to understand that some people are different in their sexual orientation.
> 
> ...


Thank you for your post, I have seen many broken lives and spirits over the years. It is such a shame that the LBGY community can't be accepted for who they are. they are not a threat to society.


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## DGreen (Nov 1, 2012)

Country Bumpkins said:


> Bible Verses About Sodomy
> Bible verses related to Sodomy from the King James Version (KJV) by Relevance
> 
> - Sort By Book Order
> ...


That's a very, very long list, Joey. There are numerous duplicates; either you didn't read over it or wanted to post an impressive number of scriptures.

For those of us who reject the bible, this is immaterial to the discussion. Believers already know what you believe about the bible. Sadly, you don't appear to be so well-versed in the concept of equality under the law and civil rights.


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## DGreen (Nov 1, 2012)

Country Bumpkins said:


> I didn't on the scripture I posted.


It is reasonable to assume that you believe the scripture you posted. Are you saying you post scripture you DON'T believe?


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## soloweygirl (Jun 9, 2012)

sumpleby said:


> There are people who would refuse service to blacks and latinos if the law didn't forbid it. They once argued that their "rights" were being infringed when they could no longer do that. Would you say we should go back to those "good old days?"


People have also been refused service because of their lack of attire - "no shirt, no shoes, no service". Are their rights being infringed upon?


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## DGreen (Nov 1, 2012)

joeysomma said:


> A bit confused???????


Not me.


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## DGreen (Nov 1, 2012)

soloweygirl said:


> People have also been refused service because of their lack of attire - "no shirt, no shoes, no service". Are their rights being infringed upon?


Those are willful behaviors and the business has a right to define those rules.


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## sumpleby (Aug 3, 2013)

Straw man argument.


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## soloweygirl (Jun 9, 2012)

lovethelake said:


> I have boy/girl twins. I was so obsessed about not letting them being twins define them. I anguished over names (no Jen and Jon, Mike and Meg). I had them in different preschool classes. I referred to them as the babies, until my daughter chided me and said "we are not babies". To be honest, I did a pretty good job of letting them be separate identities. But to this day, even with their very different personalities, they are the best of friends.


Growing up we have 7 sets of twins, identical and fraternal - even had one set of girl fraternal twins - in our grade. My mother insisted that we were in separate classes because she wanted us to be individuals, not part of a set. Some of the other parents only wanted their twins to be together. I worked at a place that had a set of female identical twins that still did everything together and dressed too similar not to be dressed the same. I couldn't help but wonder what was going to happen to the one twin that was left behind. It was a sad situation.


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## soloweygirl (Jun 9, 2012)

DGreen said:


> Those are willful behaviors and the business has a right to define those rules.


So is marriage. Unless it is an arranged marriage, marriage is willful.


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## sumpleby (Aug 3, 2013)

soloweygirl said:


> So is marriage. Unless it is an arranged marriage, marriage is willful.


So is black people wanting to shop in certain stores...


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## DGreen (Nov 1, 2012)

soloweygirl said:


> So is marriage. Unless it is an arranged marriage, marriage is willful.


And your point?


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## Designer1234 (Aug 9, 2011)

Country Bumpkins said:


> I am not judging you. God is the Judge. You are the one reacting. You could have kept quiet.I didn't preach. Just scriptures. I didn't call your name either. I never even said what I believe.


Sorry about your name. I have seen you use people's names often - It slipped out. I think of you by your name not your avatar name. No need to report me again as you said you did before. I have no problem with anyone calling me Shirley. It isn't a big thing or an insult to me so I didn't think anything about it. By the way I was never approached by Admin
(even with all the threats that someone was reporting me over the years) - to correct anything I have ever said since I started on KP.

You are judging me and all the rest of us here. You are correct God will judge me so you don't have to try to change my way of believing. I have evolved into the person I am for over 80 years through life exeriences - so no need for you to Preach to me. I have asked you to Pray for me in the past, because I know you. I don't think it is anyone's place to 
decide whether someone is going to hell which you have said you were trying to stop in some of your posts to different left leaning members.

We are responsible for ourselves, not others in my opinion. I would never try to stop you from believing what you preach. I just would prefer if you don't Preach the way you do. However, I am aware that you are not likely to stop.


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## DGreen (Nov 1, 2012)

joeysomma said:


> Freedom of Religion ??? Free Speech ???? Not if this mayor has her way.
> 
> Whatever happened to the separation of Church and State?


Whatever happened to using your brain?

In exchange for TAX-FREE status, churches may NOT preach on elections and try to influence the votes of members.

The article is not very thorough and I really don't feel like researching everything you post, Joey. You NEVER do anything but cut and paste, leaving the reader to draw their own conclusions. Not very effective way to argue whatever your point might be.


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## Designer1234 (Aug 9, 2011)

Country Bumpkins said:


> I am not judging you. God is the Judge. You are the one reacting. You could have kept quiet.I didn't preach. Just scriptures. I didn't call your name either. I never even said what I believe.


I have said enough about this. I know you are not going to stop. But don't say you are not judging any of us who do not have the same exact beliefs that you do. You are and you are very clear about it. I can read scriptures when I am reading my Bible, when I want to and when I am in Church. I don't post them here as this is a Political Thread, not a religious thread at least here on this side of the Political Spectrum. I can't say the same for most of those on the right. It is their right and we have no problem with believing - we have a problem with it being used Politically in many cases.

Enough from me. I am not going to answer anything more about this nor am I going to acknowledge any reply.


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## DGreen (Nov 1, 2012)

Designer1234 said:


> I have said enough about this. I know you are not going to stop. But don't say you are not judging any of us who do not have the same exact beliefs that you do. You are and you are very clear about it. I can read scriptures when I am reading my Bible, when I want to and when I am in Church. I don't post them here as this is a Political Thread, not a religious thread at least here on this side of the Political Spectrum. I can't say the same for most of those on the right. It is their right and we have no problem with believing - we have a problem with it being used Politically in many cases.
> 
> Enough from me. I am not going to answer anything more about this nor am I going to acknowledge any reply.


I'm with you. Joey can continue if she wishes but she'll be talking to herself.


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## Wombatnomore (Dec 9, 2013)

I am totally shocked to learn that nursing staff who cared for the Liberian gentleman did not wear protective gear for two days after his admission until his Ebola diagnosis was confirmed!

This is one of the most unforgivable failures. Any suspicion of any contagious disease, barrier nursing and full protection garb until diagnosis is the international standard in infectious diseases care. Unbelievable!


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## susanmos2000 (May 10, 2011)

soloweygirl said:


> Growing up we have 7 sets of twins, identical and fraternal - even had one set of girl fraternal twins - in our grade. My mother insisted that we were in separate classes because she wanted us to be individuals, not part of a set. Some of the other parents only wanted their twins to be together. I worked at a place that had a set of female identical twins that still did everything together and dressed too similar not to be dressed the same. I couldn't help but wonder what was going to happen to the one twin that was left behind. It was a sad situation.


I remember three sets: two sets of identical girls (Shelly and Sherry, Diane and Stacy) and one set of fraternal twins (Diane and David). Diane and Stacy were total opposites as far as personality goes--one was quiet and the other very outspoken--but the S's not only looked alike but acted alike as well. Even after ten years I still couldn't tell them apart!


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## cookiequeen (Jun 15, 2011)

I


joeysomma said:


> My Freedom of Religion is the right to say NO when it is something God has told me it is wrong. I know what is right and wrong by reading and studying the Bible.
> 
> As far as the discrimination against blacks, it was not the Christian doing it. Almost all Christian Conservatives have treated Blacks as equals since the beginning of our Country.
> If you don't believe me go back in History to the middle of the 1800's. It was a Republican President and Congress that freed the Slaves. A Republican President and Congress that passed the Amendments that gave them the right to vote and full citizenship. Then a Democrat President and Congress that brought in the Jim Crow laws, and separate but equal. It took a World War and another Republican President to start to bring back equality to Blacks. Now it is Liberal Democratic Propaganda that is keeping the blacks enslaved to Democratic programs. 50 years of Democratic programs to help the poor, and now there are more of them. That's helping them????


But you are not the one doing what you think is a sin, according to your God.
I'm not getting into a discussion of which party did what when. Let's just say times have changed and we still have discrimination.


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## Gerslay (Oct 4, 2011)

Wombatnomore said:


> I am totally shocked to learn that nursing staff who cared for the Liberian gentleman did not wear protective gear for two days after his admission until his Ebola diagnosis was confirmed!
> 
> This is one of the most unforgivable failures. Any suspicion of any contagious disease, barrier nursing and full protection garb until diagnosis is the international standard in infectious diseases care. Unbelievable!


I know people who know the Dallas hospital very well and none of them have a good word to say about it. It's ranked 15th in the state...which is not a hospital I'd choose to go to if I suspected that I had something serious.

The way the hospital treated Duncan initially and how it protected the staff subsequently comes close to bordering on the criminal.

My mother was a nurse and if she had been expected to perform her duties under those circumstances I would have advised her to find a job elsewhere.

...and now we hear that the CDC told the second nurse that she could travel, by plane, while she was being monitored?

They better get a handle on this thing and quick or we'll all be quarantining ourselves in our own homes.


----------



## damemary (Mar 14, 2012)

Maybe she was possessed? I just get curious, but I don't care much about people who don't clarify their statements. Thanks for the feedback.



DGreen said:


> I don't think anyone knows but Farmwoman. Out of the blue, a harsh message to you. I looked up her previous posts and went down the whole list. Nothing but nice, sweet messages and compliments on different photos of knit projects, then WHAM.
> 
> I think she was completely out of line, especially since she didn't say what the hell she was objecting to, though she mentioned something about god-hating. She also posted another message on the HL thread, giving her 2-cents-worth on why people should buy their own birth control pills, while making some statements that clearly revealed she had NOT been following the subject at all. Maybe she was just cruising around and felt compelled to make a statement. Haven't heard from her since.


----------



## damemary (Mar 14, 2012)

A party somewhere?



DGreen said:


> Bizarre.
> 
> But the sudden shift to old songs and lyrics for the last page or two? Have I missed something?


----------



## damemary (Mar 14, 2012)

Bazinga truly.



Designer1234 said:


> WOW - that makes you about 4 months old.


----------



## damemary (Mar 14, 2012)

You can count on me Cookie. Just back from vacation. I'll catch up and I'm sure not everyone will be thrilled. Oh well.



cookiequeen said:


> You better promise to keep your quips coming. Most of us enjoy them!


----------



## damemary (Mar 14, 2012)

Many of us appreciate Designer1234's comments. Go away if you don't.



soloweygirl said:


> It doesn't bother me whether you stay or leave - believe me. What does bother me is YOUR WHINING about it, over and over and over again. Grow up - that's something you should have done a long time ago.


----------



## damemary (Mar 14, 2012)

Thank you for reminding me of Yarnie's faux pas. Since I frequently cannot follow her comments, I simply asked her personally in a PM if she would clarify for me. Quite frankly I didn't want to ignore someone who needed help. When I got no response, I asked the group at large. I have no idea how many she sent PM's to.

I don't see a lack of integrity or disgraceful behavior on my part. I think of it as reaching out to someone. Doesn't seem worthy of vendetta, but suit yourself kitty.



west coast kitty said:


> You seem to have forgotten your totally disgraceful behaviour when you received a pm that Yarnie sent to you in error. Not only did you publicly refer to it on more than one occasion, you also passed it on to others who also referred to it and inferred that they themselves had received the pm. That episode clearly demonstrated your lack of integrity.


----------



## damemary (Mar 14, 2012)

Good point.



Wombatnomore said:


> The real question is, how can someone send a PM by mistake? Think about it.


----------



## damemary (Mar 14, 2012)

Atta girl!



Designer1234 said:


> That wasn't a whine, that was a song -- I had a cold! I prefer to be young in spirit, even though my hair is grey!! :thumbup: :thumbup: ;-) ;-)


 :lol: :lol: :lol: :lol:


----------



## damemary (Mar 14, 2012)

Why would I be on her buddy list? Think about that, friends.



Gerslay said:


> It was explained that she mistakenly clicked on the name next to the one she wanted on her buddy list. Seems a simple mistake and is very plausible to me.
> 
> We all make simple mistakes all the time. Course I never put my skirt on upside down, but that's a whole other can of worms!


----------



## damemary (Mar 14, 2012)

KPG has revealed personal information about others and threatened still more. Get your head on strait.



Gerslay said:


> You defend the one who did reveal a private communication and demean the one who didn't?


 :twisted: :twisted: :twisted:


----------



## damemary (Mar 14, 2012)

Bullfeathers.

When you don't have something solid to gripe about, you review thousands of old comments looking for something. Warning, don't get me started.



west coast kitty said:


> Such a weak attempt to deflect from the issue that was raised. The subject was the ethics of mentioning or commenting on pm's - several of you felt that even a mention of a pm was inappropriate. Yarnie merely pointed out that some of those commenting have done the same or worse using Dame's behaviour as an example. Another example of hypocrisy on the part of those posters.


 :hunf: :hunf: :hunf:


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## damemary (Mar 14, 2012)

Maybe we should change opinions on printing PM's if they are being used inappropriately. I don't see it in the Forum rules. Is it just something we have assumed? Comments please.



west coast kitty said:


> She didn't print your messages nor did she distribute them to others, yet you make excuses or applaud that behaviour?


 :roll: :roll: :roll: :?:


----------



## damemary (Mar 14, 2012)

west coast kitty said:


> :thumbup: there is no logic in those arguments.


 :XD: :XD: :XD: :XD: :XD: :XD: :XD: :XD: ROFL Since when did that stop you & buddies?


----------



## damemary (Mar 14, 2012)

Been opening a dictionary or thesaurus lately?



Gerslay said:


> Absolutely...a curious juxtaposition of values.


----------



## Gerslay (Oct 4, 2011)

damemary said:


> KPG has revealed personal information about others and threatened still more. Get your head on strait.
> 
> :twisted: :twisted: :twisted:


Bullfeathers.

Now who's reviewing thousands of old comments looking for something to gripe about?

Own your own and stop looking to deflect!


----------



## damemary (Mar 14, 2012)

Excellent point.



Poor Purl said:


> I think you can send a PM to the wrong person if you have that person on your Buddy List (does that make dame a buddy of yarnie?) and address the PM by clicking on "Send PM."
> 
> BUT if the PM was not meant for dame and simply landed in her inbox, then *it was no longer a private communication* (between yarnie and whoever she intended), and thus there was *nothing wrong with making it somewhat more public.*
> 
> What I found interesting was that your reference to "your fearless leader" was understood and accepted by all who got into the conversation. No more pretending that they have no leader.


----------



## damemary (Mar 14, 2012)

Gerslay said:


> How many times do we have to tell you that KPG is not our leader? Lake is our Queen. KPG is fearless though, on that you are correct!


 :XD: :XD: :XD: :XD: :XD: You need a better court to serve them better. The smooches are too much for me.


----------



## Gerslay (Oct 4, 2011)

damemary said:


> :XD: :XD: :XD: :XD: :XD: You need a better court to serve them better. The smooches are too much for me.


(((((xoxo ♥ DAME ♥ xoxo)))))


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## Designer1234 (Aug 9, 2011)

damemary said:


> Maybe we should change opinions on printing PM's if they are being used inappropriately. I don't see it in the Forum rules. Is it just something we have assumed? Comments please.
> 
> :roll: :roll: :roll: :?:


I think they should remain private but mistakes CAN be made. If we don't want them to remain private then all should agree. I understood since I came on KP that it is expected that PM's are kept between the people who are talking to each other. However I have not ever noticed anything in the rules. So I think it is best to speak privately by email if you don't mind sharing your email address with someone you wish to talk to.

We are responsible for our own pm's and it is good to know that mistakes can be made. I learned that by sending a reply to the wrong person , at least I was fortunate I sent a workshop pm answer to the wrong person by clicking on the wrong one when I was replying. I am very careful now.

I think if you want to be sure something remains absolutely private talk by emails -right off of KP.

Accidents do happen. Dame has explained (I am sure for the second or third time her reason for asking about it. It was not some devious way to get even -and no harm was meant.


----------



## damemary (Mar 14, 2012)

Hi Susan. You have addressed the work issue quite well.

Add this. Who brings groceries and how? Medicine? Who keeps people in quarantine? It's not as simple as saying the words.



susanmos2000 said:


> Well, what would you do if you discovered that one of your casual contacts--say the guy who bagged your groceries or the woman sitting beside you at the hair salon--had developed Ebola? I assume you're retired and receive SS, so perhaps you could afford to sit through a three-week quarantine...but not everyone is as fortunate. Men and women in their prime with families to support _have_ to keep working, have to keep generating income. Imagine a secretary or low-level manager phoning his or her boss to say that they may have been exposed to Ebola and can't come to work for twenty-one days--they'd be fired on the spot. We know the Ebola is not highly contagious, and so I think it's awfully tempting for folks who may have been exposed to shrug off the worry and keep on with their daily routines.


----------



## damemary (Mar 14, 2012)

IMHO People are over-reacting because the PR people in government are not believable. They don't believe themselves. Why should anyone else?

People will stop worrying about it like they did about
AIDS.



SQM said:


> I remember in the '80s that people got nuts about Aids. The spread of ebola seems similar. Are we being hysterical?


----------



## Designer1234 (Aug 9, 2011)

damemary said:


> KPG has revealed personal information about others and threatened still more. Get your head on strait.
> 
> :twisted: :twisted: :twisted:










-- so true but then the unwritten rules don't matter to her. She is above all that.


----------



## damemary (Mar 14, 2012)

IMHO the current Supreme Court is the place to turn fiction into truth.



Poor Purl said:


> You mean like "corporations are people"?


----------



## damemary (Mar 14, 2012)

Interesting.



Poor Purl said:


> There's an op ed piece in today's NY Times called *How to Quarantine Against Ebola* by a doctor who's written a book on cancer. He says that there's a way to test blood in asymptomatic people that will show the virus's genes long before symptoms appear. He suggests giving the test to passengers, possibly before they board the plane, and use the time on the plane as a "quarantine." The results would be known by the time they land, and medical personnel will then know whom they have to pull aside and separate from the public before they become contagious.
> 
> The author, Siddhartha Mukherjee, ends the article "Ebola is an ingenious virus. To fight it, we need to be just as ingenious."
> 
> http://www.nytimes.com/2014/10/13/opinion/how-to-quarantine-against-ebola.html?_r=0


----------



## damemary (Mar 14, 2012)

joeysomma said:


> They can "love" anyone they want, but the so-called marriage is a sham. I would tell them to their face. I also would tell them, they are loved by their Heavenly Father, and he has a better plan for their life.
> 
> Marriage is ordained by God between a man and a woman. You can call anything else a marriage but it is an abomination in the sight of God. The orders by the courts in allowing so-called Homosexual marriage will bring our country to destruction. Also acceptance of homosexuality as normal behavior is forced on Christians, to destroy them and their businesses.
> 
> ...


 :thumbdown: :thumbdown: :thumbdown: :thumbdown: :thumbdown: You forget. This is your opinion. Many don't agree. The bible is your answer, not everyone's.


----------



## Designer1234 (Aug 9, 2011)

damemary said:


> Bullfeathers.
> 
> When you don't have something solid to gripe about, you review thousands of old comments looking for something. Warning, don't get me started.
> 
> :hunf: :hunf: :hunf:


I wonder sometimes if they have a list somewhere with every thing we have said so that they can twisti it and return it at a later date. Quote me all you want. I don't carry a score card and I doubt any of the rest of the Liberal, Progressive, Democrats or whatever we are do either.


----------



## damemary (Mar 14, 2012)

The way I look at it, if you are not intending to become sexually active with a person, what business of yours is their sex life? To each their own.



DGreen said:


> I have never been able to understand the reasoning behind Christians' claims that homosexual marriage would destroy our country. How? It doesn't affect you.
> 
> No one is forcing acceptance on you. It is Christians who are trying to force their beliefs on others by insisting homosexuality is immoral and homosexuals should not have the same rights as others. I truly don't get it.


----------



## damemary (Mar 14, 2012)

You have expressed opinions as fact. For example, homosexuals are 'born that way.'



joeysomma said:


> Each citizen should have the same rights as any other citizen. Homosexuals think they are special and are entitled to special rights. Then they are forcing anyone who disagrees with them to do as they want. They want to take others rights away, if they do not accept Homosexual "BEHAVIOR." And it is behavior they are NOT born that way.


----------



## Designer1234 (Aug 9, 2011)

damemary said:


> You can count on me Cookie. Just back from vacation. I'll catch up and I'm sure not everyone will be thrilled. Oh well.


we are glad to have you back! I hope your holiday went well.


----------



## Gerslay (Oct 4, 2011)

Designer1234 said:


> I wonder sometimes if they have a list somewhere with every thing we have said so that they can twisti it and return it at a later date. Quote me all you want. I don't carry a score card and I doubt any of the rest of the Liberal, Progressive, Democrats or whatever we are do either.


Designer, how come you haven't noticed that tonight its Dame who is searching through back pages looking for something to stir up trouble?

There's the Liberal, Progressive, Democrat you claim doesn't exist!


----------



## damemary (Mar 14, 2012)

The LAST thing I need is joey's opinions.



Poor Purl said:


> You didn't read Joey's message closely enough. Doesn't she say that God abominates any but heterosexual marriage? She knows exactly what God wants and doesn't want, and if such marriage will destroy us all, it certainly affects us all. :roll: :roll: :roll:


----------



## damemary (Mar 14, 2012)

DGreen said:


> She bailed. Off line.
> 
> The Christian version of a hit and run.


 :XD: :XD: :XD: :XD: Bazinga.


----------



## damemary (Mar 14, 2012)

Sounds lovely. Much happiness to all.



SQM said:


> No one is going to convince the other about the rights of gays to marry. If one side wants to display an antediluvian attitude, let them.
> 
> Everyone has the right to be happy. (Not that I found marriage so great.)
> 
> I have a beautiful gay marriage to go to next month. Two lovely guys who love each other. Both are from great families and wonderfully successful. Going to wear a black cocktail dress with Steve Madden high top black with red roses sneakers. At the Harvard Club. OOOO. So excited.


----------



## damemary (Mar 14, 2012)

STOP. No one is convincing anyone, and the rest of us are tired of the topic.



theyarnlady said:


> No one is condemn you to hell because you don't believe in hell so how can anyone convert you if you don't believe in God? But you believe in hell as you mention it.
> 
> You confuse yourself and me? what do you believe in? If Hell then you must also believe there is another place that you will or want to go to when you die.


----------



## Designer1234 (Aug 9, 2011)

Country Bumpkins said:


> I am not judging you. God is the Judge. You are the one reacting. You could have kept quiet.I didn't preach. Just scriptures. I didn't call your name either. I never even said what I believe.


Quoting a full page of scriptures is not Preaching????? come on!


----------



## damemary (Mar 14, 2012)

We obviously share a lack of belief in religion. Our beliefs are as important as yours.



DGreen said:


> I'm an atheist so I don't believe in god, hell, sin, heaven or any of the other things Christians believe in. Or any of the bible.
> 
> CB took it upon herself some time back to tell me how wrong I am, how I'm going to hell, that I'll be sorry, that all I need to do is read the bible...ad nauseum. She most definitely was preaching to me how I am so wrong in so many ways, that I need to sort of fall on my knees and accept jesus Christ as my lord and savior....it went on and on.
> 
> ...


----------



## Designer1234 (Aug 9, 2011)

damemary said:


> :thumbdown: :thumbdown: :thumbdown: :thumbdown: :thumbdown: You forget. This is your opinion. Many don't agree. The bible is your answer, not everyone's.


The Bible is hundreds and Hundreds of years old!


----------



## damemary (Mar 14, 2012)

Satire alert!



Poor Purl said:


> Honestly, D, there you go again, not understanding anything. Of course there's a God; the Bible says so. And we know the Bible is true because God wrote it.
> 
> Got it? Good.


----------



## damemary (Mar 14, 2012)

DGreen said:


> I've never tried to convert anyone to atheism, but have been PERSONALLY hounded by Christians who DO NOT ignore, but who, like Country Bumpkin, sees my statements as an opportunity to prosthelytize. Not asking for special treatment in any way - that's the province of the religious.


 :thumbup: :thumbup: :thumbup: :thumbup:


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## damemary (Mar 14, 2012)

I was on vacation for a week for wedding in Williamsburg VA. I'm determined to catch up. See ya.



Gerslay said:


> Womby, this subject started at 9am our time...(and even earlier now that I think about it). You were probably sleeping like a baby...you have come late to the topic.


----------



## Designer1234 (Aug 9, 2011)

damemary said:


> STOP. No one is convincing anyone, and the rest of us are tired of the topic.


agreed!!!!! It goes on and on and never stops and never changes. No one pays attention. You would think they would realize this is not the place to Preach but they will, on and on.


----------



## damemary (Mar 14, 2012)

Has joey found a new theme? Abortion, bye bye?



joeysomma said:


> Oligarchy In America-Tyranny Of The Federal Judiciary
> 
> This is not how the Supreme Court was intended to operate.
> 
> ...


----------



## damemary (Mar 14, 2012)

Live and let die? Bond.



SQM said:


> http://www.cbc.ca/news/world/catholic-church-makes-stunning-overture-toward-gays-1.2797497
> 
> Mrs. Somma,
> 
> ...


----------



## damemary (Mar 14, 2012)

Knitter from Nebraska said:


> What I find a little amusing, is that all of this only confirms my faith. It was all predicted a long time ago, in the Bible. We are seeing Biblical prophecy unfold, in your words and the words of others.
> 
> It is written!


Then it must be true? I don't think so.


----------



## damemary (Mar 14, 2012)

theyarnlady said:


> I for one want to know your reason for not believing there is a God? what happen to you as a child ? Did you believe then? I want to understand what led you to believe in something else.
> Also I want to know what do you think will happen to you when you die. As we all will die,you must have some point that you believe what will happen?


Honestly Yarnie, as a child I learned the Baltimore Catechism doctrine. There were many things I questioned. A virgin birth? Seemed more likely an excuse to avoid stoning, and many more. When I die, I think I will stop existing. I'm not arrogant enough to worry what will happen to the rest of the world...or to me.


----------



## damemary (Mar 14, 2012)

Country Bumpkins said:


> Atheism is believing in nothing. How can you convert someone to believing in nothing?


Logic?


----------



## damemary (Mar 14, 2012)

Poor Purl said:


> Your belief clearly gives you something: peace or happiness, or something else that satisfies you.
> 
> Not everyone can be satisfied with that. And I am shocked -shocked - that you would even think of God patting you "on the behind." :roll:


Agreed.


----------



## damemary (Mar 14, 2012)

Poor Purl said:


> Atheism is *not* "believing in nothing." It simply omits God from the long list of things one does believe in.


 :thumbup: :thumbup: :thumbup: :thumbup: :thumbup: :thumbup: :thumbup: :thumbup: :thumbup:


----------



## damemary (Mar 14, 2012)

Joey has founded a new crusade.....just as silly as the last. IMHO



sumpleby said:


> How is expecting the same rights as everyone else asking for "special rights"?!? No one is forcing heterosexuals to take part in a homosexual relationship. You are being irrational.


----------



## damemary (Mar 14, 2012)

SQM said:


> We don't convert others. We wait for them to grow up and think.
> 
> (Sorry Bumps. I was not putting down your beliefs. It fits you and makes you happy - then it is good.)


It is good for yarnie, CB, etc... not everyone. Now IMHO, that is good for all. Respect for other's beliefs, faith and lack thereof. We're all different.


----------



## damemary (Mar 14, 2012)

Thank you for your wisdom Cookie. You demonstrate Christian Behavior. You walk the walk. You also teach us much more about God's intention for mankind than the bible thumpers' quotes. IMHO



cookiequeen said:


> People either have faith or they don't. I don't care why someone believes in God or doesn't. It's a choice (unlike homosexuality). People who have made their choices don't have to be questioned or yammered at, particularly on this forum; and nobody should be made fun of because of his/her beliefs. Just my opinion.
> 
> P.S. And when someone who believes in God continues to belittle others, calls them fool, liar, or worse, and thinks less of them for any number of reasons, they are NOT demonstrating their faith.


----------



## damemary (Mar 14, 2012)

SQM said:


> I verify thru my senses and my daughter heard the same things that I did. Some of us are more sensitive to inexplicable occurrences. I did not see or sense the presence of a god but I was in awe that a special door opened for me. And it certainly changed my outlook. There is more to life, Horatio.... I guess it made me believe in Shakespeare more.


Raise your voices for Shakespeare for helping us find the truth in mankind!


----------



## damemary (Mar 14, 2012)

Knitter from Nebraska said:


> This, from a homosexual; "I wasn't born this way, I choose to be gay.". And; " I've convinced a few men to try out my sexuality". And this; "It's time for the LGBT community to stop fearing the word " choice", and to reclaim the dignity of sexual autonomy. "
> http://www.newrepublic.com/article/116378/macklemores-same-love-sends-wrong-message-about-being-gay
> 
> This from another homosexual;
> ...


And dare I ask where you found this 'information?'


----------



## damemary (Mar 14, 2012)

Most interesting points. Thank you.



MaidInBedlam said:


> Maybe we need to distinguish "fact" from "truth". It's a fact that I'll die if I don't have any water to drink for a few days. I may think it's a fact that I'll die if I don't have Cheerios for breakfast, but it's not true. I'm really amazed that some people here don't seem to underatand the simple statement "We are trapped in the limitations of our senses."
> 
> Maybe "fact" is the word that describes what is really, objectively true. Truth is never truth, including as it does, little things like belief and opinion. Truth is subjective.


----------



## damemary (Mar 14, 2012)

This proves something, but I'm not sure what it proves.



joeysomma said:


> Truth is truth, never subjective. God is truth.


----------



## damemary (Mar 14, 2012)

Thanks Eve.



EveMCooke said:


> Posters are writing as if there were only two choices, homosexuality and hetrosexuality. They are forgetting bisexual people. Homo/hetero can be aligned on a scale of 1 - totally homo to 10 totally hetero and most people lie in between 1 to 10. Many homosexual and bi sexual males and females do marry heterosexual partners and some are very happy with regard to their sexual life, unfortunately some are not. Many such marriages are successful because the both or either of the partners do not have a strong sex drive. Many marriages succeed because sex is not the driving part of their marriage. Other succeed because the homosexual partner has lovers, sometimes with the other partners knowledge and consent other times without the other partners knowledge and consent. Sometimes both partners have lovers. Unfortunately many homosexual males and females try to fit into 'normal' society and do commit themselves to heterosexual marriages. This was more evident in earlier times, it has only been recently that homosexual people can come out of the cupboard and tell people that they are homosexual. Many homosexual males and females also have the 'romantic' ideal of marriage - mum, dad and kids, and want that too. Unfortunately, many of these marriages also fail. Some do not. But, people marry because of mutual attractions, not just sexual attraction. People marry because they share many common interests, music, literature, art, study, politics, religion, sport, to name just a few. Many such marriages do endure because the couple can function as a team in so many areas, it is in bed when they fail to connect.
> 
> Yes, I speak from experience. My second husband was bisexual. We were together for 20 years. We did share many common interests in music, art, history, politics, the list could go on. OK I cannot complain about the sexual side of the marriage, it was not there most of the time. I found out that he was having affairs on the side. I will not go into public details of how I found out because that is not to be aired on a public forum. One thing I did experience with him was I met so many, many homosexual males and females. I will let you all into a little secret; they are all normal people just like you, me and others, they just have a different sexual preference to non homosexuals, that is all. Some are good, some are very good, some are bad and some are downright very bad. But, you cannot change a homosexual into a hetrosexual. It has been tried with various methods and all have failed, they have just resulted in very confused and mixed up people.
> 
> ...


----------



## damemary (Mar 14, 2012)

cookiequeen said:


> I really can't believe that in today's world there is still condemnation of people who are gay--or whatever. I went for a walk for an hour and came back to see that it's still going on. Pretty bad when people are more conservative than the Pope!


 :thumbup: :thumbup: :thumbup: :thumbup: :thumbup: :thumbup: :thumbup: :thumbup: :thumbup:


----------



## damemary (Mar 14, 2012)

SQM said:


> When I first came back to NYC after my marriage, there were two sets of identical twins moving in my floor when I did. In each case, one was gay and the other straight. How do you explain that?


God's sense of humor?


----------



## damemary (Mar 14, 2012)

At heart, marriage is a contract between two people. It affords rights to the spouses. Why should anyone be deprived of these rights?



soloweygirl said:


> If "each citizen should have the same rights as any other citizen", then why shouldn't homosexuals have the same right to marry as any other citizen? Why would allowing homosexuals to get married give them special rights? If everyone can get married, why not homosexuals? There are interfaith marriages, interracial marriages, marriages for money or business or bloodlines, etc. Why not same sex marriages? Interfaith marriages often have both faiths conducting the marriage. I know there are some ministers that do perform same sex marriages so all churches are not against it.


----------



## damemary (Mar 14, 2012)

joeysomma said:


> If there is a written law like there is for rapists and murders, and if they are found guilty, they should be put to death, by the law. But then why are you worried about that, when you seem to agree that an unborn baby can be put to death just for being inconvenient.


I was afraid that was coming.


----------



## damemary (Mar 14, 2012)

It's a simple question that deserves a response. Do you believe that homosexuals should be put to death?



Country Bumpkins said:


> Why on Earth would you say something like that?


----------



## damemary (Mar 14, 2012)

DGreen said:


> Illegal discrimination and civil rights definitely is the business of government. Just the same as if they were refusing service to a black person.


 :thumbup: :thumbup: :thumbup: :thumbup: :thumbup: :thumbup: :thumbup: :thumbup: :thumbup:


----------



## damemary (Mar 14, 2012)

Well put! Bravo!



DGreen said:


> No, you said you would support a law that executed people for homosexuality. I'm asking if you think such a law SHOULD be passed. Like here, in the US.
> 
> In the absence of an answer, I'm going to make the reasonable assumption that you will say "yes" because you would likely choose god over country.
> 
> ...


----------



## damemary (Mar 14, 2012)

cookiequeen said:


> I have not lost one religious right. Which religious rights have you lost?


Just lost her marbles?


----------



## damemary (Mar 14, 2012)

I'm an early riser too, 6:00 AM or earlier. I go back East and fall into their time zone immediately.



cookiequeen said:


> I get up at 6 every morning, no matter what time I go to bed. I'm the opposite of my husband!


----------



## damemary (Mar 14, 2012)

susanmos2000 said:


> I saw this--in fact, there's a new thread ("I know i will get flak for this" ) that deals with this very subject. A lot of people appear to be panicking, but I for one was a bit relieved to hear about the numerous breaches of protocol in that Dallas hospital--nurses fixing rips in their protective suits with tape, Duncan laying in the hospital ER for hours etc etc. It's terrible, but at least we know now how two nurses caught the virus off him. In fact, I'm amazed that more staff members aren't showing symptoms.


They will. Despite extensive contact with the patient who died, this patient and their family contacts were not being monitored. Doesn't spread confidence.


----------



## damemary (Mar 14, 2012)

I smell lawsuits.



Wombatnomore said:


> I am totally shocked to learn that nursing staff who cared for the Liberian gentleman did not wear protective gear for two days after his admission until his Ebola diagnosis was confirmed!
> 
> This is one of the most unforgivable failures. Any suspicion of any contagious disease, barrier nursing and full protection garb until diagnosis is the international standard in infectious diseases care. Unbelievable!


----------



## damemary (Mar 14, 2012)

damemary said:


> You have expressed opinions as fact. For example, homosexuals are 'born that way.'


Excuse me. The comment should read "homosexuals are NOT born that way." In truth sexual orientation is inborn. That is the fact.


----------



## damemary (Mar 14, 2012)

Beautiful trip to Williamsburg VA for fall wedding. Lovely in every way.



Designer1234 said:


> we are glad to have you back! I hope your holiday went well.


----------



## Wombatnomore (Dec 9, 2013)

Gerslay said:


> I know people who know the Dallas hospital very well and none of them have a good word to say about it. It's ranked 15th in the state...which is not a hospital I'd choose to go to if I suspected that I had something serious.
> 
> The way the hospital treated Duncan initially and how it protected the staff subsequently comes close to bordering on the criminal.
> 
> ...


I totally agree. Our Prime Minister, in his infinite wisdom, has decided NOT to send personnel to West Africa because he can't guarantee an exit strategy to safely get them out should they fall ill! Meanwhile, the U.S., UK and others have sent in troops and medical staff without batting an eye lid. Again, unbelievable.


----------



## DGreen (Nov 1, 2012)

Designer1234 said:


> I wonder sometimes if they have a list somewhere with every thing we have said so that they can twisti it and return it at a later date. Quote me all you want. I don't carry a score card and I doubt any of the rest of the Liberal, Progressive, Democrats or whatever we are do either.


There is such a list. Click on anyone's username and it brings up their profile with a list of comments.


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## Wombatnomore (Dec 9, 2013)

damemary said:


> At heart, marriage is a contract between two people. It affords rights to the spouses. Why should anyone be deprived of these rights?


Dame, glad to hear your vac. was enjoyable.

If and when the day comes, where one simply says "I'm going to a wedding" without the impulse to describe it as a 'gay wedding,' it will be a grand day indeed.


----------



## Poor Purl (Apr 14, 2011)

damemary said:


> The LAST thing I need is joey's opinions.


They're not joey's opinions; they're God's. And therefore they're the LAST thing you'll get.


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## Poor Purl (Apr 14, 2011)

damemary said:


> Beautiful trip to Williamsburg VA for fall wedding. Lovely in every way.


What about the shawl?


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## damemary (Mar 14, 2012)

Poor Purl said:


> They're not joey's opinions; they're God's. And therefore they're the LAST thing you'll get.


The last thing I hear before being struck by a bolt of lightening?


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## damemary (Mar 14, 2012)

I got it done. It is a huge hit. I got a picture & will post.



Poor Purl said:


> What about the shawl?


----------



## GWPlver (Mar 15, 2013)

damemary said:


> I smell lawsuits.


Yep - they have been filed. Negligence, malpractice, discrimination, etc.,


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## GWPlver (Mar 15, 2013)

Wombatnomore said:


> . If and when the day comes, where one simply says "I'm going to a wedding" without the impulse to describe it as a 'gay wedding,' it will be a grand day indeed.


Me too, Wombat, and hopefully that day will be sooner than later. I do believe the tide is finally turning.


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## soloweygirl (Jun 9, 2012)

Gerslay said:


> Designer, how come you haven't noticed that tonight its Dame who is searching through back pages looking for something to stir up trouble?
> 
> There's the Liberal, Progressive, Democrat you claim doesn't exist!


 :thumbup: :thumbup: :thumbup: :thumbup: :thumbup:

Her pathetic excuse is that she's been away and catching up.


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## Wombatnomore (Dec 9, 2013)

GWPlver said:


> Me too, Wombat, and hopefully that day will be sooner than later. I do believe the tide is finally turning.


I certainly hope so.


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## Designer1234 (Aug 9, 2011)

damemary said:


> Thank you for your wisdom Cookie. You demonstrate Christian Behavior. You walk the walk. You also teach us much more about God's intention for mankind than the bible thumpers' quotes. IMHO


 :thumbup: :thumbup:


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## Designer1234 (Aug 9, 2011)

soloweygirl said:


> :thumbup: :thumbup: :thumbup: :thumbup: :thumbup:
> 
> Her pathetic excuse is that she's been away and catching up.


So it's a pathetic excuse if you have been away to go back and catch up???????? Iwould imagine we all do that. I know I do and I would imagine most of you do. However, I don't go through people's posts on their threads to try to find something to attack them about. Once it is done it is done.

I feel that that is something a couple of you do all the time as suddenly something that was said weeks ago is brought up. It seems as if what is happening now isnot always as exciting?


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## Poor Purl (Apr 14, 2011)

damemary said:


> The last thing I hear before being struck by a bolt of lightening?


Exactly.


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## Poor Purl (Apr 14, 2011)

damemary said:


> I got it done. It is a huge hit. I got a picture & will post.


Good! I'll look for it.


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## west coast kitty (May 26, 2012)

Designer1234 said:


> I think they should remain private but mistakes CAN be made. If we don't want them to remain private then all should agree. I understood since I came on KP that it is expected that PM's are kept between the people who are talking to each other. However I have not ever noticed anything in the rules. So I think it is best to speak privately by email if you don't mind sharing your email address with someone you wish to talk to.
> 
> We are responsible for our own pm's and it is good to know that mistakes can be made. I learned that by sending a reply to the wrong person , at least I was fortunate I sent a workshop pm answer to the wrong person by clicking on the wrong one when I was replying. I am very careful now.
> 
> ...


Asking about a PM might be a sign of concern, but circulating a PM to a group of other people, some of whom also choose to publicly comment on that pm is not an accident, nor is it a request for clarification or a sign of concern. It shows a lack of integrity regardless of whether the PM was intentionally or accidentally received.

The subject of PM's was raised by the Libs on this thread. I did not have to go digging through old posts to come up with a rebuttal, my memory of that incident is quite clear.


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## damemary (Mar 14, 2012)

soloweygirl said:


> :thumbup: :thumbup: :thumbup: :thumbup: :thumbup:
> 
> Her pathetic excuse is that she's been away and catching up.


 :XD: :XD: :XD: I'm beginning to understand President Obama even better. I can't catch a break either. :XD: :XD: :XD:


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## DGreen (Nov 1, 2012)

joeysomma said:


> An up date on Houston's Homosexual Mayor and her "non-discrimination ordinance that gives special rights and protections to homosexuals and lesbians."
> 
> Houston Sermon Demand Really About Future Hate Crime Lawsuits


If this is your proof that there is a national conspiracy to destroy religion and promote homosexuality, you'll have to do better than that.


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## Wombatnomore (Dec 9, 2013)

DGreen said:


> If this is your proof that there is a national conspiracy to destroy religion and promote homosexuality, you'll have to do better than that.


Green, please don't encourage!


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## DGreen (Nov 1, 2012)

Wombatnomore said:


> Green, please don't encourage!


Ooh. Sorry.


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## knitpresentgifts (May 21, 2013)

west coast kitty said:


> Asking about a PM might be a sign of concern, but circulating a PM to a group of other people, some of whom also choose to publicly comment on that pm is not an accident, nor is it a request for clarification or a sign of concern. It shows a lack of integrity regardless of whether the PM was intentionally or accidentally received.
> 
> The subject of PM's was raised by the Libs on this thread. I did not have to go digging through old posts to come up with a rebuttal, my memory of that incident is quite clear.


 :thumbup: :thumbup: :thumbup: Exactly, WCK - most often evident in the Libs' posts; lack of integrity.


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## Designer1234 (Aug 9, 2011)

west coast kitty said:


> Asking about a PM might be a sign of concern, but circulating a PM to a group of other people, some of whom also choose to publicly comment on that pm is not an accident, nor is it a request for clarification or a sign of concern. It shows a lack of integrity regardless of whether the PM was intentionally or accidentally received.
> 
> The subject of PM's was raised by the Libs on this thread. I did not have to go digging through old posts to come up with a rebuttal, my memory of that incident is quite clear.


------------------------
Just a correction, it was raised by one of the libs on this thread, not all of us. I wasn't here when this happened, I just know Dame and I know Yarnie, neither are liars. It is still quite possible that it was not intentional or it was a misunderstanding.

Lots of things occur here, lots of name calling , lots of unkindness - each day, that is why I don't go back and keep track. Our memories are all quite clear of hurts we have received, on both sides. It is sad.


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## damemary (Mar 14, 2012)

Your opinion. No less. No more. It might show more integrity on your part to keep it that way.



knitpresentgifts said:


> :thumbup: :thumbup: :thumbup: Exactly, WCK - always evident in the Libs' posts; lack of integrity.


----------



## Designer1234 (Aug 9, 2011)

damemary said:


> Your opinion. No less. No more. It might show more integrity on your part to keep it that way.


changed my mind


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## Designer1234 (Aug 9, 2011)

soloweygirl said:


> :thumbup: :thumbup: :thumbup: :thumbup: :thumbup:
> 
> Her pathetic excuse is that she's been away and catching up.


Pathetic? She HAS been away, and she has been catching up. Since our posts are mentioned over and over byone or two of your group including Solo, you sound a bit foolish.

So let's all gang up on Dame today about something that happened awhile ago? Especially as she dared to say she was 
catching up because she had been away.

I do that, I bet you all do that. You guys had better find something more to 
attack us about. You should read your posts, they are pathetic, to use the words of my friend Solo - who has gone back for over a year to find my posts to use for attacks. She has quoted my posts, has ridiculed my posts and has used them constantly when I first came back. The pot calling the kettle black ( yep) Par for the course. You are pathetic.


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## west coast kitty (May 26, 2012)

Designer1234 said:


> ------------------------
> Just a correction, it was raised by one of the libs on this thread, not all of us. I wasn't here when this happened, I just know Dame and I know Yarnie, neither are liars. It is still quite possible that it was not intentional or it was a misunderstanding.
> 
> Lots of things occur here, lots of name calling , lots of unkindness - each day, that is why I don't go back and keep track. Our memories are all quite clear of hurts we have received, on both sides. It is sad.


I read your original and edited posts. I'm surprised because it seems as if you are condoning or making excuses for someone who copied a PM and sent it out to others. I don't trust a person that would do that.


----------



## Designer1234 (Aug 9, 2011)

west coast kitty said:


> I read your original and edited posts. I'm surprised because it seems as if you are condoning or making excuses for someone who copied a PM and sent it out to others. I don't trust a person that would do that.


==========
I edited my posts and often do so that I don't over react or say something I don't mean. It might be an idea if more of us did that rather than say some of the things that are said here. I am sure Dame knows herself as do her friends. You don't have to tell her you don't trust her. She likely doesn't care. I have been called a bigot today , I just know where it comes from -

Kitty - Let's let it go, you have expressed your opinion, I have expressed mine. KPG has managed to insert hers, and others have joined in. I guess its let's go after Dame today.

Well, I know her, and I will stand up for her. Just as you stand up for your friends. I am finished with this.

So Dame, lets go have coffee and leave them to their attacks.

NO conversations ever seem to be allowed between two people, you all gang up. Well, I guess you will have to gang up on both of us today. let your games begin.


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## DGreen (Nov 1, 2012)

Designer1234 said:


> ==========
> I edited my posts and often do so that I don't over react or say something I don't mean. It might be an idea if more of us did that rather than say some of the things that are said here. I am sure Dame knows herself as do her friends. You don't have to tell her you don't trust her. She likely doesn't care. I have been called a bigot today , I just know where it comes from -
> 
> Kitty - Let's let it go, you have expressed your opinion, I have expressed mine. KPG has managed to insert hers, and others have joined in. I guess its let's go after Dame today.
> ...


I stand with you and Dame. Give it a rest, people.


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## Designer1234 (Aug 9, 2011)

damemary said:


> I was afraid that was coming.


I knew it was coming -- over and over.


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## soloweygirl (Jun 9, 2012)

Designer1234 said:


> So it's a pathetic excuse if you have been away to go back and catch up???????? Iwould imagine we all do that. I know I do and I would imagine most of you do. However, I don't go through people's posts on their threads to try to find something to attack them about. Once it is done it is done.
> 
> I feel that that is something a couple of you do all the time as suddenly something that was said weeks ago is brought up. It seems as if what is happening now isnot always as exciting?


Catching up reading the posts is one thing. Making snide remarks or attacking a poster a week later is quite another. Is it really necessary? The answer to that is NO.


----------



## soloweygirl (Jun 9, 2012)

Designer1234 said:


> Pathetic? She HAS been away, and she has been catching up. Since our posts are mentioned over and over byone or two of your group including Solo, you sound a bit foolish.
> 
> So let's all gang up on Dame today about something that happened awhile ago? Especially as she dared to say she was
> catching up because she had been away.
> ...


What the hell are you talking about? I have not gone back over your posts (barf) to use your words for any kind of an attack of/on you. Please PROVIDE PROOF OF THAT. I have never ridiculed your posts. I have not used any of your words when you first came back - whatever that means. All I have ever done was to tell you to S--t or get off the pot as far as your whining about leaving or staying. PERIOD. Apparently you know you do this because you can't stop bringing up the fact that I called you on it.

I repeat, please provide proof that I have gone back over your posts to use your words in order to attack you. Somehow, I doubt that you will do so because no evidence exists.


----------



## Poor Purl (Apr 14, 2011)

damemary said:


> Your opinion. No less. No more. It might show more integrity on your part to keep it that way.


Why would the cons want to show integrity? It would only make them seem more believable.


----------



## Designer1234 (Aug 9, 2011)

soloweygirl said:


> What the hell are you talking about? I have not gone back over your posts (barf) to use your words for any kind of an attack of/on you. Please PROVIDE PROOF OF THAT. I have never ridiculed your posts. I have not used any of your words when you first came back - whatever that means. All I have ever done was to tell you to S--t or get off the pot as far as your whining about leaving or staying. PERIOD. Apparently you know you do this because you can't stop bringing up the fact that I called you on it.
> 
> I repeat, please provide proof that I have gone back over your posts to use your words in order to attack you. Somehow, I doubt that you will do so because no evidence exists.


----------



## Poor Purl (Apr 14, 2011)

west coast kitty said:


> I read your original and edited posts. I'm surprised because it seems as if you are condoning or making excuses for someone who copied a PM and sent it out to others. I don't trust a person that would do that.


You seem unable to understand that once the supposedly private message appeared in dame's inbox, it had become no longer private. There was now a third party (damemary) who knew its contents. Why keep secret something that was not a secret?

When CB calls people by names that they've been keeping secret, do you distrust her? When KPG does likewise, and appends an untrue accusation to it, do you have problems then? Of course not; you know what would happen if you did.

Making the message public was what anyone would do, esp. if she was trying to make sense of it.


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## Designer1234 (Aug 9, 2011)

Poor Purl said:


> You seem unable to understand that once the supposedly private message appeared in dame's inbox, it had become no longer private. There was now a third party (damemary) who knew its contents. Why keep secret something that was not a secret?
> 
> When CB calls people by names that they've been keeping secret, do you distrust her? When KPG does likewise, and appends an untrue accusation to it, do you have problems then? Of course not; you know what would happen if you did.
> 
> Making the message public was what anyone would do, esp. if she was trying to make sense of it.




I am so glad you taught me how to do emoticons. They express my feelings better than I do sometimes and I don't get into as much trouble   :|


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## Poor Purl (Apr 14, 2011)

Designer1234 said:


> I am so glad you taught me how to do emoticons. They express my feelings better than I do sometimes and I don't get into as much trouble   :|


You put them to good use. I love getting applause.


----------



## Designer1234 (Aug 9, 2011)

Poor Purl said:


> You put them to good use. I love getting applause.


I only use this one on special occasions.


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## Designer1234 (Aug 9, 2011)

joeysomma said:


> Texas Attorney General Greg Abbott Responds to Houston Sermon Demand
> 
> One of the ways the Left has beaten constitutionalists is by having people in places of authority to control the narrative and the legislation.
> 
> ...


----------



## Wombatnomore (Dec 9, 2013)

World Health Organisation admits it bungled it's management of the Ebola outbreak:

http://www.9news.com.au/Health/2014/10/18/03/22/WHO-admits-botching-Ebola-response


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## Designer1234 (Aug 9, 2011)

joeysomma said:


> Rev. Billy Graham: America is Just as Wicked as Sodom and Gomorrah Ever Were
> 
> 17 October 2014
> 
> ...


----------



## Country Bumpkins (Feb 18, 2011)

Poor Purl said:


> You seem unable to understand that once the supposedly private message appeared in dame's inbox, it had become no longer private. There was now a third party (damemary) who knew its contents. Why keep secret something that was not a secret?
> 
> When CB calls people by names that they've been keeping secret, do you distrust her? When KPG does likewise, and appends an untrue accusation to it, do you have problems then? Of course not; you know what would happen if you did.
> 
> Making the message public was what anyone would do, esp. if she was trying to make sense of it.


.


----------



## susanmos2000 (May 10, 2011)

Thanks for pointing that out, Designer. What the heck was happening in 1962 that would compel him to say such a thing? As far as I know that was the conservatives' Golden Age--the time of Jim Crow, Vietnam, and no Roe vs. Wade.


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## Wombatnomore (Dec 9, 2013)

There's a big wide world outside if the U.S.A. Why not look at how other countries have dealt with the homosexual marriage issue. 

I read somewhere here that Arizona has just granted rights for same sex couples to marry.

I'm interested in what the world is doing, not just my own country. There's not a lot going on with this site to suggest that US citizens are interested in any other countries than their own.


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## Designer1234 (Aug 9, 2011)

Wombatnomore said:


> There's a big wide world outside if the U.S.A. Why not look at how other countries have dealt with the homosexual marriage issue.
> 
> I read somewhere here that Arizona has just granted rights for same sex couples to marry.
> 
> I'm interested in what the world is doing, not just my own country. There's not a lot going on with this site to suggest that US citizens are interested in any other countries than their own.


I don't think the ones that are anti gay have any interest in looking at what other countries do. Their opinions are written in stone about many many things. They have no interest in other ideas.


----------



## Knitted by Nan (Aug 3, 2013)

I was just reading the news headlines and this item caught my eye.

MORE than 200 schoolgirls kidnapped in Nigeria in April will be set free under an agreement the government has reached with Boko Haram militants.

Unfortunately I cannot gain access to the complete article as it is from a newspaper that charges for access.

Has anyone else heard any more about the release of the girls.


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## Poor Purl (Apr 14, 2011)

EveMCooke said:


> I was just reading the news headlines and this item caught my eye.
> 
> MORE than 200 schoolgirls kidnapped in Nigeria in April will be set free under an agreement the government has reached with Boko Haram militants.
> 
> ...


This should work: http://www.bbc.com/news/world-africa-29665165


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## Knitted by Nan (Aug 3, 2013)

Poor Purl said:


> This should work: http://www.bbc.com/news/world-africa-29665165


Thanks. I could not search for another link as my son informed me whilst I was typing that he was 'powering down' the modem to 'reset his xbox' or whatever it is he does. It clears the cache from the xbox, or something, not overly interested in what it does as long as he tells me before he does it. It is a tad annoying if he does it whilst I am on line.

No, I do not speak modem or xbox and I am not really interested in learning either.


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## DGreen (Nov 1, 2012)

Wombatnomore said:


> There's a big wide world outside if the U.S.A. Why not look at how other countries have dealt with the homosexual marriage issue.
> 
> I read somewhere here that Arizona has just granted rights for same sex couples to marry.
> 
> I'm interested in what the world is doing, not just my own country. There's not a lot going on with this site to suggest that US citizens are interested in any other countries than their own.


Right you are, Wombat. Americans curiously suffer from the collective delusion that we are the best in the world and are right about all issues. The rest of the world? Meh.

Arizona didn't exactly grant rights to same sex couples. They merely conceded to the decision made by the courts that their law prohibiting same sex marriage is unconstitutional. With the tide of public opinion and legal opinion running against them, they have opted for a temporary concession. It took mere moments for our resident ALEC-backed organization to bemoan the decision and vow to fight on against this "travesty." ALEC provided the text of the law banning same sex marriage in the first place.

In case you are not familiar with ALEC, it is described well in this article, http://www.alecexposed.org/wiki/What_is_ALEC%3F. Please take a moment to read about them. Arizona is well represented at their conventions (our current governor spoke at one of their conventions) and come home to propose right-wing extremist bills. A couple of their agenda items are particularly troubling to me personally; the idea that public education should be privatized in favor of for-profit charter schools and the plan (well into implementation) to privatize prisons.

Arizona allows citizens to take DIRECT TAX CREDITS of up to $250 for contributions or tuition to private and charter schools. The funding for these credits is taken directly from the state education budget, thereby reducing funding for public education to the tune of millions each year. Many, many charter schools are run by churches and there is almost no oversight as to how they spend money, nor is there any requirement for staff to be certified with teaching certificates. There is almost no oversight of their curriculum, so they are free to teach creationism and other such nonsense at will, as it is their "religious right." In Arizona, our governor has stopped talking about public education and now refers to the school system as "government education." Quite literally, dumbing down our future.

Arizona taxpayers are burdened with the cost of constructing prisons which are then turned over to private, for-profit companies. They are cesspools of abuse and mismanagement, and we take the worst of the worst from other states to expand the size of the prison population. Free enterprise being what it is, ALEC then hands model legislation to our representatives intended to maximize sentencing for even minor crimes in order to keep the prisons full to the max. Thanks to our good old Sheriff Joe, people of color are incarcerated disproportionately and once in the system, find it almost impossible to escape.

There is an undeniable link between the ALEC agenda and a shameless appeal to the right-leaning fundamentalist Christian voter. I'm not worried in the least about the threat of some phantom new world order - ALEC is a real conspiracy that can be documented and the money traced. Right here in my own small town, an ALEC-backed organization took out a half-page ad in the newspaper to promote their right-wing lackeys, while our puny democratic organization (of which I am a member) could barely afford a two-column ad. Money speaks.


----------



## DGreen (Nov 1, 2012)

EveMCooke said:


> I was just reading the news headlines and this item caught my eye.
> 
> MORE than 200 schoolgirls kidnapped in Nigeria in April will be set free under an agreement the government has reached with Boko Haram militants.
> 
> ...


I saw that, too. But an agreement is still not having the girls back. Horrifying situation. Waiting for the US to pay attention - could be a long wait since girls have no political power.


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## Designer1234 (Aug 9, 2011)

DGreen said:


> Thanks to our good old Sheriff Joe, people of color are incarcerated disproportionately and once in the system, find it almost impossible to escape.


I will never understand the Sheriff Joe Aprpaio situation. He was first elected when we were 'snowbirds' in Mesa, Arizona and we thought he would be voted out right away. He is still there -He is so arrogant -- He treats prisoners like slaves in some ways and has made a name for himself all over the States.

I imagine he is one of the heroes of the Far Right and even though we were in Arizona half of each year for ll years we never got the feeling that the average person was 'for 'him.

However I do realize that the snow birds, (Americans and Canadians from Colder climes, are usually in a place where you can go merrily on with your 'park' life and have no idea what is really happening with the citizens in that area or the Political situation there. We made a point at that time to avoid getting into Political or Religious discussions among ourselves, which seemed a good idea at the time.

It was, however the first time I heard someone listening to Rush Limbaugh with adoration. She and her husband were the first I ever heard agreeing with all his unrealistic and 
over the top ideas. I had no idea that those feelings were starting to spread among the right wing Americans. None of the Americans we were close to (mostly hikers and crafts persons like us) ever spoke well of him and we did know that some were Republicans and Some Democrats but there was no feeling of division.

Most of the snow birds were American from Illinois, Michigan, and other northern states with about 30% from Western Canada - and a few from Ontario.

We did know there was a difference in our ideas and our backgrounds from those Americans we know, and as we all went back to the same park every year we got to know each other well enough to have some pretty heated discussions those later years. It was like having two home towns in two different countries.

That is where I really got to know a lot of Americans and I liked them. It is also where a lot of Americans got to know Canadians and liked us. Lots in common, but still differences.

We still, up to last summer had life long friends come up from the States who we took to Banff and Lake Louise and around Calgary. I am still in touch with 6 or 7 couples, 3 strong Republicans and as many Democrats who still go to the same park and are good friends. I don't believe they get into politics to much - however I could be wrong maybe they have some royal battles, but 3 of those couples, not the same Political Party are coming up to Canada and we hope out here next summer.


----------



## DGreen (Nov 1, 2012)

Designer1234 said:


> I will never understand the Sheriff Joe Aprpaio situation. He was first elected when we were 'snowbirds' in Mesa, Arizona and we thought he would be voted out right away. He is still there -He is so arrogant -- He treats prisoners like slaves in some ways and has made a name for himself all over the States.
> 
> I imagine he is one of the heroes of the Far Right and even though we were in Arizona half of each year for ll years we never got the feeling that the average person was 'for 'him.
> 
> ...


If Joe Arpaio was just an egotistical blowhard I wouldn't mind him nearly as much as I do. But he's far worse than that. People die in his jail and the thugs he hires get off scott free. Arizona has a lot - LOT - of retirees, and a lot of wingnuts who vote for the extreme right-wing candidates out of fear. Our proximity to the border provides plenty of fodder for the fear-mongers. Arpaio plans raids to round up people based on racial profiling and he's hardly secretive about it. He's a menace and is running for office again at 80 years old. (THERE'S some ego for you). He'll win easily. Baffling to me, since most of my acquaintances detest him and consider him an embarrassment.

I'm glad you visit our beautiful state and have forged such friendships.


----------



## SQM (Jun 22, 2012)

Bright Green - my bro lives in Phoenix - how far from you?


----------



## Designer1234 (Aug 9, 2011)

EveMCooke said:


> I was just reading the news headlines and this item caught my eye.
> 
> MORE than 200 schoolgirls kidnapped in Nigeria in April will be set free under an agreement the government has reached with Boko Haram militants.
> 
> ...


I hope it is true, but can you imagine what they have been through? It is very sad and sickens me.


----------



## DGreen (Nov 1, 2012)

SQM said:


> Bright Green - my bro lives in Phoenix - how far from you?


We are 75 miles from Mesa - out of the blistering heat and only in the roasting heat in the summer. Phoenix is huge, so hard to know how far. Which part of Phoenix does he live in?


----------



## SQM (Jun 22, 2012)

On Camelback Road in some gated community where an ex governor lives.


----------



## Designer1234 (Aug 9, 2011)

susanmos2000 said:


> Thanks for pointing that out, Designer. What the heck was happening in 1962 that would compel him to say such a thing? As far as I know that was the conservatives' Golden Age--the time of Jim Crow, Vietnam, and no Roe vs. Wade.


I don't know, but it is interesting that it is being used now.It appeared to me when I read it (yes I do read some of the posts from D and P members) that it was implied by whoever wrote the article) that he was speaking recently. At least at first I read it that way and wondered how he was able to do that when he is not well at all. Interesting though. His projections didn't happen obviously.
I admire him and always have but he often spoke like that. From what I remember of the 60's there was a lot of problems as far as racial unrest etc. but I don't remember feeling he was 
in agreement with the racists. I think he was sincere. It does change the power of his words to know however that it was said in the 60's not now.


----------



## DGreen (Nov 1, 2012)

SQM said:


> On Camelback Road in some gated community where an ex governor lives.


Camelback Road runs for about 30-40 miles - starting at the Scottsdale city limits and extending west in a straight line to Glendale and farther. If he lives in the "Biltmore" district (very upscale) that is a part of central Phoenix.

I live in a small town northeast of the Phoenix metropolitan area at about 5,000 feet elevation. Tall pines. Cool summer nights, wildlife (elk tracks in my front yard and snake poop in the back), a dusting of snow in the winter. After 50+ years in the heat of the Phoenix area, this is paradise. 15-20 degrees cooler than metro Phoenix. But, I can easily zip down to do shopping and visit my children and grandchildren. The best of both worlds.


----------



## Designer1234 (Aug 9, 2011)

DGreen said:


> If Joe Arpaio was just an egotistical blowhard I wouldn't mind him nearly as much as I do. But he's far worse than that. People die in his jail and the thugs he hires get off scott free. Arizona has a lot - LOT - of retirees, and a lot of wingnuts who vote for the extreme right-wing candidates out of fear. Our proximity to the border provides plenty of fodder for the fear-mongers. Arpaio plans raids to round up people based on racial profiling and he's hardly secretive about it. He's a menace and is running for office again at 80 years old. (THERE'S some ego for you). He'll win easily. Baffling to me, since most of my acquaintances detest him and consider him an embarrassment.
> 
> I'm glad you visit our beautiful state and have forged such friendships.


He scares me - and I have never understood it. I do know that the Border problems are huge in Arizona. He is power hungry and I think he feels he has complete freedom to do whatever he wants. The laws mean nothing to him. I agree l00% with you, about him. The worse thing about it is that he believes his own hype and that he is above the law and 
doesn't have to answer to anyone. He is a dictator who has 
found his place in the world. Scary indeed.


----------



## DGreen (Nov 1, 2012)

Designer1234 said:


> I don't know, but it is interesting that it is being used now.It appeared to me when I read it (yes I do read some of the posts from D and P members) that it was implied by whoever wrote the article) that he was speaking recently. At least at first I read it that way and wondered how he was able to do that when he is not well at all. Interesting though. His projections didn't happen obviously.
> I admire him and always have but he often spoke like that. From what I remember of the 60's there was a lot of problems as far as racial unrest etc. but I don't remember feeling he was
> in agreement with the racists. I think he was sincere.


For some (or perhaps one), anything said by Graham is valid forever and they're happy to dredge up whatever seems to support their gloom-and-doom predictions of god's impending wrath. A respected evangelist? Even better. I agree, he is sincere. I personally don't have any use for him, as you probably already know. He's skillful at leading god's sheep, though, good shepherd that he is.


----------



## DGreen (Nov 1, 2012)

Designer1234 said:


> He scares me - and I have never understood it. I do know that the Border problems are huge in Arizona. He is power hungry and I think he feels he has complete freedom to do whatever he wants. The laws mean nothing to him. I agree l00% with you, about him.


Border problems are NOT huge in Arizona. Conservative hype.

Perhaps I should elaborate on that a little.

Illegals/undocumented foreigners do cross our border. Among them are drug dealers and other unsavory characters. I'm not dismissing that fact.

However, Arizona also has front-line border patrol fighting that and when the economy tanked, there was a reduction in the flow of crossings. Duh. Illegals come here primarily to WORK. The biggest problem is the lack of a program to permit workers to cross legally. We hire them. We depend on them. They do the work Americans won't do. The other thing is the failed "war on drugs" that provides such huge incentives to smuggle drugs. We spend millions on bad policy when there are far better ways to deal with marijuana and other illegal substances. We have invented an enforcement culture among law enforcement that is self-promoting and fanatic at times.

Arizona has far bigger problems. We have abundant sunshine, yet Germany has more solar energy than we do. We have the potential for business development but instead focus on attracting prisons instead of high-tech industry. We are allowing our public education sysem to be decimated on the altar of right wing privatization. Oh yes, we have problems, but the border isn't even close to being the biggest to my way of thinking.


----------



## Designer1234 (Aug 9, 2011)

DGreen said:


> For some (or perhaps one), anything said by Graham is valid forever and they're happy to dredge up whatever seems to support their gloom-and-doom predictions of god's impending wrath. A respected evangelist? Even better. I agree, he is sincere. I personally don't have any use for him, as you probably already know. He's skillful at leading god's sheep, though, good shepherd that he is.


----------------------
I come from a different generation -- My opinions of many things have changed over the years as I have lived my life. I admired him because I felt he was sincere. I didn't necessarily agree with him in many ways, but I don't remember reading a hint of negativity about his personal life or his leadership. I admire Christians who live their Christianity - I believe he did.

HOwever, that was written in the 60's . People were a lot more innocent then, sad to say. I was never a 'follower' I always felt that a narrow rigid belief was not for me. I just respected that he was sincere. I feel that he contributed a lot to his Church and was not a hypocrite. Which is more than can be said of other "Preachers" who were hypocrites.


----------



## Designer1234 (Aug 9, 2011)

DGreen said:


> Border problems are NOT huge in Arizona. Conservative hype.
> 
> Perhaps I should elaborate on that a little.
> 
> ...


======
I find your post interesting. Thanks for your opinion. I have never thought too deeply about it. I know when we were there we never heard that much about the border problems and I did know that a lot of the farm labourers worked for much less than American workers would accept. It was not something that I heard much about. I know that the hispanics are much more prevalent there than in northern parts of the States which is not surprising. I will have to read more about the situation there.

there was talk in Arizona when we were there to start using 
more solar energy. It would certainly be hugely successful there with your climate and sunshine. I do know that the border is a bone of contention but not just in Arizona - I have read how there is a lot of disagreement about what to do with the border and those who are not citizens. I like to have discussions about things that are interesting.

Well, we are going to go to a farmer's market here in our new home. It is not a sunny day but It sounds as if it is open all year around. Right in the center of town. You sure couldn't do that in Alberta! We are rested and finally are caught up with all the changeovers. I am very impressed with the BC people we have dealt with to transfer services over - I have been told that once you are in the system it is very well run.

We are going to take a drive into the 'wine area' and possibly pick up a bottle of wine for when friends come by. We expect some visitors next week although it isn't confirmed.


----------



## Country Bumpkins (Feb 18, 2011)

joeysomma said:


> What Billy Graham said in the sixties is far more relevant now. It applies to what is happening in the world right now. As with many pastors, when you hear or read their sermons from the past, you would think they were written yesterday. God is Good.


 :thumbup:


----------



## DGreen (Nov 1, 2012)

susanmos2000 said:


> Thanks for pointing that out, Designer. What the heck was happening in 1962 that would compel him to say such a thing? As far as I know that was the conservatives' Golden Age--the time of Jim Crow, Vietnam, and no Roe vs. Wade.


Doesn't matter what was happening in the world at the time - or now. The message was, has been, and always will be the same. Prayer. Our leaders must pray for answers! Our nation can only be saved by prayer! We must return to the values of the bible or be destroyed!

Assuming a lot of people who heard his message in 1962 did as he asked and prayed fervently, and the presidents who met with him did the same - and have continued to do so - there's been precious little action from god. At least, not in any good way.


----------



## Knitted by Nan (Aug 3, 2013)

Designer1234 said:


> ----------------------
> I come from a different generation -- My opinions of many things have changed over the years as I have lived my life. I admired him because I felt he was sincere. I didn't necessarily agree with him in many ways, but I don't remember reading a hint of negativity about his personal life or his leadership. I admire Christians who live their Christianity - I believe he did.
> 
> HOwever, that was written in the 60's . People were a lot more innocent then, sad to say. I was never a 'follower' I always felt that a narrow rigid belief was not for me. I just respected that he was sincere. I feel that he contributed a lot to his Church and was not a hypocrite. Which is more than can be said of other "Preachers" who were hypocrites.


This excerpt may explain his statement, made in 1962. It relates to his 15 week cruscade of Australia in 1959. You will see that he was concerned with 
the evils of Cold War, 
perceived threats to the family, 
'juvenile delinquency' 
and the sexualised threat of rock music, 
Americanisation, 
and extensive non-British, mainly Catholic, migration.

Graham preached on most of these matters and his message supported a prevailing conviction about moral decline



> During 1959 Billy Graham, the charismatic American evangelist, conducted a 15-week crusade in Australia and New Zealand. In Melbourne, 719 000 people attended 25 meetings, the largest on 15 March at the Melbourne Cricket Ground attracting 143 750, a record for a single venue and for the ground. All the major Protestant denominations were represented on the platforms. The massive attendances may be explained in part by the Cold War, perceived threats to the family, 'juvenile delinquency' and the sexualised threat of rock music, Americanisation, and extensive non-British, mainly Catholic, migration. Graham preached on most of these matters and his message supported a prevailing conviction about moral decline, reinforced by the filming of On the beach in Melbourne at the same time.


http://www.emelbourne.net.au/biogs/EM00193b.htm


----------



## soloweygirl (Jun 9, 2012)

Designer1234 said:


>


A gyrating cat as proof. I expected no more. Obviously you are a liar and make things up to pass off as the truth. It must be such a joy for those around you. Wondering what you will bring up and who you will use it against is such a pleasant way to live. I can imagine that your friends and family make a game of it. Making bets on who will be the target and what will be brought up. Ranking right up there with all the football pools. How special.


----------



## soloweygirl (Jun 9, 2012)

EveMCooke said:


> I was just reading the news headlines and this item caught my eye.
> 
> MORE than 200 schoolgirls kidnapped in Nigeria in April will be set free under an agreement the government has reached with Boko Haram militants.
> 
> ...


I hope the girls are released soon. I wonder how they will be accepted back into their communities. Then certainly have been through one horrific time.


----------



## soloweygirl (Jun 9, 2012)

EveMCooke said:


> I was just reading the news headlines and this item caught my eye.
> 
> MORE than 200 schoolgirls kidnapped in Nigeria in April will be set free under an agreement the government has reached with Boko Haram militants.
> 
> ...


I hope the girls are released soon. I wonder how they will be accepted back into their communities. Then certainly have been through one horrific time.


----------



## knitpresentgifts (May 21, 2013)

soloweygirl said:


> A gyrating cat as proof. I expected no more. Obviously you are a liar and make things up to pass off as the truth. It must be such a joy for those around you. Wondering what you will bring up and who you will use it against is such a pleasant way to live. I can imagine that your friends and family make a game of it. Making bets on who will be the target and what will be brought up. Ranking right up there with all the football pools. How special.


Thanks, Solo, you made me laugh! That is always good and special. :-D


----------



## Poor Purl (Apr 14, 2011)

soloweygirl said:


> A gyrating cat as proof. I expected no more. Obviously you are a liar and make things up to pass off as the truth. It must be such a joy for those around you. Wondering what you will bring up and who you will use it against is such a pleasant way to live. I can imagine that your friends and family make a game of it. Making bets on who will be the target and what will be brought up. Ranking right up there with all the football pools. How special.


Oh, come on. Grow up, and grow a sense of humor. And leave "friends and family" out of it.

And why is a "gyrating cat" any worse than dog shoes (which I actually love, because they're really funny)?


----------



## DGreen (Nov 1, 2012)

joeysomma said:


> What Billy Graham said in the sixties is far more relevant now. It applies to what is happening in the world right now. As with many pastors, when you hear or read their sermons from the past, you would think they were written yesterday. God is Good.


And prayer is the answer.


----------



## soloweygirl (Jun 9, 2012)

Poor Purl said:


> Oh, come on. Grow up, and grow a sense of humor. And leave "friends and family" out of it.
> 
> And why is a "gyrating cat" any worse than dog shoes (which I actually love, because they're really funny)?


I have a wonderful sense of humor. I just don't like people lying about me, making things up and passing that off as the truth.

I didn't offer the dog shoes as proof of anything although Designer offered the gyrating cat as her proof.


----------



## Poor Purl (Apr 14, 2011)

soloweygirl said:


> I have a wonderful sense of humor. I just don't like people lying about me, making things up and passing that off as the truth.
> 
> I didn't offer the dog shoes as proof of anything although Designer offered the gyrating cat as her proof.


Don't you question the sense of humor of someone who says "I have a wonderful sense of humor"?

In case you missed the joke, the cat was a comment on your message, not a proof of anything, though it has proven that your sense of humor may not be as wonderful as you think.


----------



## DGreen (Nov 1, 2012)

joeysomma said:


> There will always be an answer to prayer. Yes, no, or maybe.


The challenge is knowing which is which, since your god isn't exactly clear about these things. So, I guess you can pick whichever supposed "answer" supports your notions. How handy - you can still praise god, no matter what happens.

Hmm. Wonder what/why your god would say "no" to the poor child being raped by a pedophile, praying for help. His free will to do evil trumps that child's suffering, I guess. God is so loving and kind.


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## DGreen (Nov 1, 2012)

Poor Purl said:


> Don't you question the sense of humor of someone who says "I have a wonderful sense of humor"?
> 
> In case you missed the joke, the cat was a comment on your message, not a proof of anything, though it has proven that your sense of humor may not be as wonderful as you think.


 :thumbup:


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## Poor Purl (Apr 14, 2011)

DGreen said:


> And prayer is the answer.


----------



## DGreen (Nov 1, 2012)

Can you give us a link, Purl? Too small to read.


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## Poor Purl (Apr 14, 2011)

DGreen said:


> Can you give us a link, Purl? Too small to read.


All I was sending was the cartoon and caption. Was that too small? I'll try again. In the meantime:

*Man Infected with Ebola Misinformation Through Casual Contact With Cable News
BY ANDY BOROWITZ*

CANTON, OH (The Borowitz Report)An Ohio man has become infected with misinformation about the Ebola virus through casual contact with cable news, the Centers for Disease Control has confirmed.

Tracy Klugian, thirty-one, briefly came into contact with alarmist Ebola hearsay during a visit to the Akron-Canton airport, where a CNN report about Ebola was showing on one of the televisions in the airport bar. Mr. Klugian is believed to have been exposed to cable news for no more than ten minutes, but long enough to become infected, a spokesman for the C.D.C. said. Within an hour, he was showing signs of believing that an Ebola outbreak in the United States was inevitable and unstoppable.

Once Klugians condition was apparent, the Ohio man was rushed to a public library and given a seventh-grade biology textbook, at which point he started to stabilize, the spokesman said.

But others exposed to the widening epidemic of Ebola misinformation may not be so lucky. A man in Oklahoma was exposed to Elisabeth Hasselbeck on Fox for over three minutes, the C.D.C. spokesman said gravely. We hope were not too late.

http://www.newyorker.com/humor/borowitz-report/man-infected-ebola-misinformation-casual-contact-cable-news?intcid=mod-most-popular


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## SQM (Jun 22, 2012)

Poor Purl said:


> From this week's New Yorker magazine (sorry, I couldn't save just the cartoon - the rest of the page is irrelevant, though it may be interesting):


Why Hi-de-ho PP!

Loved the cartoon. I have one from the same source - The Caption is "Creator's Remorse" and it shows god looking down on the earth and thinking - "What the hell was I thinking?"


----------



## Poor Purl (Apr 14, 2011)

DGreen said:


> Can you give us a link, Purl? Too small to read.


Is this better?


----------



## DGreen (Nov 1, 2012)

Poor Purl said:


> All I was sending was the cartoon and caption. Was that too small? I'll try again. In the meantime:
> 
> *Man Infected with Ebola Misinformation Through Casual Contact With Cable News
> BY ANDY BOROWITZ*
> ...


Now THAT'S funny.


----------



## DGreen (Nov 1, 2012)

Poor Purl said:


> Is this better?


Yep. Thanks.

Funny stuff.


----------



## Designer1234 (Aug 9, 2011)

soloweygirl said:


> A gyrating cat as proof. I expected no more. Obviously you are a liar and make things up to pass off as the truth. It must be such a joy for those around you. Wondering what you will bring up and who you will use it against is such a pleasant way to live. I can imagine that your friends and family make a game of it. Making bets on who will be the target and what will be brought up. Ranking right up there with all the football pools. How special.


-----------------
Wow - you really dislike me don't you. I think it is better sometimes to do a dancing cat, or a smiley face than get into a fight with someone who you have nothing in common with. You have your opinion of me, you don't know me and I don't know you - you have made it clear you have no use for me and as a result I have no wish to deal with you. I tried and you made it clear you prefer to fight. I am going to try not to fight with you any more Solo -but some of your posts are so far out I will answer you - even if it is with a dancing cat.- you have your 
agenda, and I certainly seem to be a goodly part of what you don't like. That is okay, - my skin has gotten a lot thicker since I have come back here. Call me what you wish, I cared at the beginning , now I expect nothing else from you. So attack away, get as personal as you wish . It is interesting that I seem to get your back up. However, that is your choice.

I will post the way I feel, I will use emoticons when I want and I will read or not read your insults.

I just checked back -- you hand it out pretty well but you sure can't take it. I have read every insult you have made about me since I came back on these threads, so read your posts -I will reply when I feel like it. You have a convenient memory. That is what the h__ I am talking about.

I tried to let it go, and suggested, because once in awhile we agree that we let the bad feelings go-- you made it clear you don't want to do that and you insinuated that I was lying, once again. So I don't worry in the least if I upset you.

Dancing cats are not insulting, I have one where I stick my tongue out . also others that are nasty. I only use them when I am sick of someone's posts or I am trying to avoid a fight. didn't work this time. The cat got to you!!

I have never once ever brought your friends and family into these threads, that shows what you really are. None of us do -except on our own threads with our friends. I would not lower myself to attack your family.

It is like KPG and her suggestion I should have a doctor to check me out for alzheimers the day that I posted that my sister didn't know me when I called her, as she is going away from me very quickly with alzheimers. I was hurting a lot that day. KPG must have enjoyed her knife. We don't forget when someone says something like that. I am not a liar. So rant away all you want. I will answer what I feel like answering.

Very nice people -both of you. 
Enough said.


----------



## Poor Purl (Apr 14, 2011)

DGreen said:


> Yep. Thanks.
> 
> Funny stuff.


You must have a "wonderful sense of humor." :lol:


----------



## Designer1234 (Aug 9, 2011)

soloweygirl said:


> I have a wonderful sense of humor. I just don't like people lying about me, making things up and passing that off as the truth.
> 
> I didn't offer the dog shoes as proof of anything although Designer offered the gyrating cat as her proof.


ye Gods! :shock: :shock: :shock: :shock: :hunf:


----------



## Poor Purl (Apr 14, 2011)

SQM said:


> Why Hi-de-ho PP!
> 
> Loved the cartoon. I have one from the same source - The Caption is "Creator's Remorse" and it shows god looking down on the earth and thinking - "What the hell was I thinking?"


And Hoo-de-la-de-wada to you, SQ. I saw that cartoon - was it last week? In wading through the New Yorker website I came across the following:

Are You There, People? Its Me, God
BY JAY MARTEL

Heres my problem: I dont believe in people. To me, human beings and their world are nothing more than the product of our collective imagination, a sad manifestation of our need to feel important beyond our actual existence. I also cant help feeling that our lives would be better if no one believed in people; only then would we be able to truly deal with our problems without nursing the delusion of a universe thats completely dependent on us.

The bottom line is that there are no easy answers to the questions we all have about life. Why are we here? Why are we all-seeing, all-knowing and immortal? How are we able to be everywhere at the same time? I dont pretend to know. I do know, however, that these questions are not made easier by believing theres a planet of people somewhere out there who depend on us to land their planes safely.

<There's more: http://www.newyorker.com/humor/daily-shouts/are-you-there-people-its-me-god >


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## Poor Purl (Apr 14, 2011)

joeysomma said:


> Solo, she would prefer to stick her tongue at comments about God. She will answer to God someday, for those comments.


God? Solo is God? Who would have thought....?


----------



## DGreen (Nov 1, 2012)

Poor Purl said:


> You must have a "wonderful sense of humor." :lol:


I don't know about wonderful. Twisted? Irreverent, definitely.


----------



## SQM (Jun 22, 2012)

Poor Purl said:


> And Hoo-de-la-de-wada to you, SQ. I saw that cartoon - was it last week? In wading through the New Yorker website I came across the following:
> 
> Are You There, People? Its Me, God
> BY JAY MARTEL
> ...


Good Quote.

Following link is to a Lebanese woman who addressed the UN recently.


----------



## Designer1234 (Aug 9, 2011)

joeysomma said:


> Solo, she would prefer to stick her tongue at comments about God. She will answer to God someday, for those comments.


Joey - we know your beliefs and we have no problem with you believing what you do - but judging others isn't part of your religion. God Judges,not you. You worry about your afterlife and I will worry about mine.


----------



## Designer1234 (Aug 9, 2011)

To change the subject as I am sure we are all bored with this past discussion ladies, My sister in law just sent me this and I found it rather interesting. The story is true and I enjoyed reading it again. I read an article when the information was released. here it is:


=================

Cool piece of History - I thought this was fascinating!

Starting in 1941, an increasing number of British
Airmen found themselves as the involuntary guests
of the Third Reich, and the Crown was casting about
for ways and means to facilitate their escape. Now
obviously, one of the most helpful aids to that end
is a useful and accurate map, one showing not only
where stuff was, but also showing the locations of
'safe houses' where a POW on-the-lam could go for
food and shelter.

Paper maps had some real drawbacks -- they make
a lot of noise when you open and fold them, they
wear out rapidly, and if they get wet, they turn into
mush.

Someone in MI-5 (similar to America s OSS ) got
the idea of printing escape maps on silk. It's
durable, can be scrunched-up into tiny wads,
and unfolded as many times as needed, and
makes no noise whatsoever.

At that time, there was only one manufacturer
in Great Britain that had perfected the technology
of printing on silk, and that was John
Waddington, Ltd. When approached by the
government, the firm was only too happy to do
its bit for the war effort.

By pure coincidence, Waddington was also the
U.K. Licensee for the popular American board
game, Monopoly. As it happened, 'games and
pastimes' was a category of item qualified for
insertion into 'CARE packages', dispatched by
the International Red Cross to prisoners of war.

Under the strictest of secrecy, in a securely
guarded and inaccessible old workshop on
the grounds of Waddington's, a group of
sworn-to-secrecy employees began mass
producing escape maps, keyed to each
region of Germany or Italy where Allied
POW camps were.
When processed, these maps could be folded
into such tiny dots that they would actually
fit inside a Monopoly playing piece.

As long as they were at it, the clever workmen
at Waddington's also managed to add:

1. A playing token, containing a small magnetic
compass
2. A two-part metal file that could easily be
screwed together
3. Useful amounts of genuine high-denomination
German, Italian, and French currency, hidden within the piles of
Monopoly money!

British and American air crews were advised,
before taking off on their first mission, how
to identify a 'rigged' Monopoly set -- by means
of a tiny red dot, one cleverly rigged to look
like an ordinary printing glitch, located in the
corner of the Free Parking square.

Of the estimated 35,000 Allied POWS who
successfully escaped, an estimated one-third
were aided in their flight by the rigged Monopoly
sets... Everyone who did so was sworn to secrecy
Indefinitely, since the British Government might
want to use this highly successful ruse in still
another, future war. The story wasn't declassified
until 2007, when the surviving craftsmen from
Waddington's, as well as the firm itself, were
finally honoured in a public ceremony.
It's always nice when you can play that Get Out
of Jail' Free' card!


----------



## Knitted by Nan (Aug 3, 2013)

Designer1234 said:


> To change the subject as I am sure we are all bored with this past discussion ladies, My sister in law just sent me this and I found it rather interesting. The story is true and I enjoyed reading it again. I read an article when the information was released. here it is:
> 
> =================
> 
> ...


That is one really cool piece of history, thanks for posting. :thumbup: :thumbup: :thumbup:


----------



## SQM (Jun 22, 2012)

Designer1234 said:


> To change the subject as I am sure we are all bored with this past discussion ladies, My sister in law just sent me this and I found it rather interesting. The story is true and I enjoyed reading it again. I read an article when the information was released. here it is:
> 
> =================
> 
> ...


Great story.


----------



## Designer1234 (Aug 9, 2011)

SQM said:


> Great story.


I read about it in one of the UK papers. A friend told me about it so I googled it.Shortly after the story was released. Good for them!!!


----------



## Designer1234 (Aug 9, 2011)

Designer1234 said:


> I read about it in one of the UK papers. A friend told me about it so I googled it.Shortly after the story was released. Good for them!!!


It was the first time my Sister IL had heard of it - we talked about it when she was here yesterday and she sent me the article.


----------



## Knitted by Nan (Aug 3, 2013)

SQM said:


> Good Quote.
> 
> Following link is to a Lebanese woman who addressed the UN recently.
> 
> ...


----------



## Designer1234 (Aug 9, 2011)

EveMCooke said:


> Thanks for the video link, it is well worth watching.


She is excellent - thanks for the link. I heard it twice.


----------



## Designer1234 (Aug 9, 2011)

Poor Purl said:


> Don't you question the sense of humor of someone who says "I have a wonderful sense of humor"?
> 
> In case you missed the joke, the cat was a comment on your message, not a proof of anything, though it has proven that your sense of humor may not be as wonderful as you think.


Yep - You must be smarter than she is Purl. It was obvious. 
I doubt she will understand or agree .


----------



## Wombatnomore (Dec 9, 2013)

DGreen said:


> Right you are, Wombat. Americans curiously suffer from the collective delusion that we are the best in the world and are right about all issues. The rest of the world? Meh.


It seems that the 'ALEC' is getting away with political high treason! Can it not be challenged legally?


----------



## Poor Purl (Apr 14, 2011)

DGreen said:


> I don't know about wonderful. Twisted? Irreverent, definitely.


I was just quoting solow. Hers is wonderful, so yours must be at least that.


----------



## Wombatnomore (Dec 9, 2013)

Poor Purl said:


> And Hoo-de-la-de-wada to you, SQ. I saw that cartoon - was it last week? In wading through the New Yorker website I came across the following:
> 
> Are You There, People? Its Me, God
> BY JAY MARTEL
> ...


I agree with this. Is that bad?


----------



## Wombatnomore (Dec 9, 2013)

Brigitte Gabriel is certainly not afraid of her own shadow. One very brave lady.


----------



## Designer1234 (Aug 9, 2011)

joeysomma said:


> Satan is the ruler of the world. God has let the reprobates rule. As it was prophesized it would happen before His return.


Hmm- all this time I thought that God was the leader of the world. That has been stated many many times by people on this thread.


----------



## Wombatnomore (Dec 9, 2013)

I wonder how long this will last:

http://www.nytimes.com/2014/10/18/world/middleeast/isis-militants-in-syrian-border-town-begin-to-retreat-after-a-monthlong-battle.html?ref=todayspaper&_r=0


----------



## DGreen (Nov 1, 2012)

Wombatnomore said:


> It seems that the 'ALEC' is getting away with political high treason! Can it not be challenged legally?


There have been challenges and lawsuits. Here in Arizona, one of our legislators that accepted a "scholarship" to the supposed training was charged with accepting a gift and not declaring the true value. It's murky, particularly since so many legislators are members of the group. They sure as hell are not going to go after themselves or each other. I agree, the whole thing stinks.

One of the ballot propositions we are facing in the upcoming election has to do with an ALEC-authored initiative put forth by one of their "front" groups. It essentially intends to give Arizona the supposed "right" to refuse to spend any state money or resources to enforce any federal law that Arizona considers unconstitutional. Which means if the Arizona legislature feels the Environmental Protection Agency has overstepped it's bounds, they can refuse to comply, creating a litigation nightmare that we taxpayers would have to fund at the expense of who knows what. Until settled, Arizona would simply not comply. There are MANY federal mandates this could apply to.

Campaign literature I got in the mail today claims the intent of this initiative is to refuse to comply with federal guidelines prohibiting release of information on foster children under the care of Child Protective Services. The idea is this information must be available to someone in order to monitor abuse in the system or some such thing and TO PROTECT CHILDREN.

It is, in fact, intended to evade federal law and the EPA, the Bureau of Land Management and other regulatory bodies to the benefit of businesses.


----------



## Wombatnomore (Dec 9, 2013)

DGreen said:


> There have been challenges and lawsuits. Here in Arizona, one of our legislators that accepted a "scholarship" to the supposed training was charged with accepting a gift and not declaring the true value. It's murky, particularly since so many legislators are members of the group. They sure as hell are not going to go after themselves or each other. I agree, the whole thing stinks.
> 
> One of the ballot propositions we are facing in the upcoming election has to do with an ALEC-authored initiative put forth by one of their "front" groups. It essentially intends to give Arizona the supposed "right" to refuse to spend any state money or resources to enforce any federal law that Arizona considers unconstitutional. Which means if the Arizona legislature feels the Environmental Protection Agency has overstepped it's bounds, they can refuse to comply, creating a litigation nightmare that we taxpayers would have to fund at the expense of who knows what. Until settled, Arizona would simply not comply. There are MANY federal mandates this could apply to.
> 
> ...


Totally outrageous! It's blindingly a conflict of interests with actual Legislators being on board. I don't understand how it continues to exist. Have there been Senate inquiries about ALEC's activities? How can it be a legal entity? Just jaw-dropping. :shock:


----------



## Wombatnomore (Dec 9, 2013)

joeysomma said:


> She is often on FOX news.


And your point is?


----------



## DGreen (Nov 1, 2012)

Wombatnomore said:


> Totally outrageous! It's blindingly a conflict of interests with actual Legislators being on board. I don't understand how it continues to exist. Have there been Senate inquiries about ALEC's activities? How can it be a legal entity? Just jaw-dropping. :shock:


I agree. Which is why I am politically active in my community, doing everything I can to throw the three current representatives in my district, out of office. Remember, we are saddled with the Tea Party doing every dirty trick in the book to take control of our country. ALEC is hand-in-glove with them and the ultra-conservative right. It's very depressing, actually. If you want to see what the Tea Party believes in, just Google their official website and it's all spelled out. But more worrisome stuff is a little deeper in the site. Click on "Martial Law" for some mind-boggling rhetoric. Rhetoric that a lot of people believe.


----------



## Designer1234 (Aug 9, 2011)

Joey there is more free speech and discussion here than in many other countries in the world. After reading some of the things that go on in the US. I would think there is more openness and less restrictions here than down there. Not somethings you would agree with, I imagine.

Certainly, no matter who tells you different, we have an excellent health care system. But then that has to start somewhere.

There are Conservatives and Liberals, however there is not the dreadful division here that there is down there. I just Pray that it stays that way.


----------



## DGreen (Nov 1, 2012)

Designer1234 said:


> Joey there is more free speech and discussion here than in many other countries in the world. After reading some of the things that go on in the US. I would think there is more openness and less restrictions here than down there. Not somethings you would agree with, I imagine.
> 
> Certainly, no matter who tells you different, we have an excellent health care system. But then that has to start somewhere.
> 
> There are Conservatives and Liberals, however there is not the dreadful division here that there is down there. I just Pray that it stays that way.


I hope it stays that way, too. The divisions here in the US are deeply troubling. It is not same sex marriage that will destroy our country, it is he intractable polarization we have found ourselves mired in that is the real threat.


----------



## Designer1234 (Aug 9, 2011)

DGreen said:


> I hope it stays that way, too. The divisions here in the US are deeply troubling. It is not same sex marriage that will destroy our country, it is he intractable polarization we have found ourselves mired in that is the real threat.


I agree -- it is the fact that there is little interest in meeting half way and it is getting more and more worrisome.


----------



## Designer1234 (Aug 9, 2011)

joeysomma said:


> I guess no free speech in Canada, if you think Homosexuality is a sin.
> 
> Christian on trial for telling dangers of homosexuality
> 
> ...


----------



## DGreen (Nov 1, 2012)

Designer1234 said:


> I agree -- it is the fact that there is little interest in meeting half way and it is getting more and more worrisome.


My only ray of hope is that the American people are much more reasonable than our legislators and elected officials. Well, mostly. There are some....as I'm sure you are aware. But they are a minority.


----------



## Designer1234 (Aug 9, 2011)

Canada is a decent country and we don't pick on those who are different - I guess it is best you live in the States Joey, I doubt you would appreciate the things that I love most about my country.


----------



## Designer1234 (Aug 9, 2011)

Designer1234 said:


> As I said above It is a good country and we don't pick on those who are different - I guess it is best you live in the States Joey, I doubt you would appreciate the things that I love most about my country as our
> Government isn't repressive - so far it has remained that way in most cases. Although it hasn't always been that way with our first Nations peoples. Not perfect but a pretty darned good place to live. I would never be anything but a Canadian. I imagine you feel the same about your country. I would hope so I just added some to my post.


----------



## Designer1234 (Aug 9, 2011)

DGreen said:


> I hope it stays that way, too. The divisions here in the US are deeply troubling. It is not same sex marriage that will destroy our country, it is he intractable polarization we have found ourselves mired in that is the real threat.


I agree and no one will budge an inch and there is actual hatred in some cases -- It is sad watching it happening.


----------



## Poor Purl (Apr 14, 2011)

Wombatnomore said:


> I agree with this. Is that bad?


Nothing truly funny is bad. I thought this was funny. I hope you did, too.


----------



## Poor Purl (Apr 14, 2011)

Wombatnomore said:


> Totally outrageous! It's blindingly a conflict of interests with actual Legislators being on board. I don't understand how it continues to exist. Have there been Senate inquiries about ALEC's activities? How can it be a legal entity? Just jaw-dropping. :shock:


It's really just a question of who writes the actual legislation. At one time it was mainly legislators; more recently, lobbyists have been writing laws that favor their industries. ALEC is just one more level, and because it was created to write laws favoring some very wealthy individuals and corporations, it very often is called upon by politicians who are wholly owned subsidiaries of those VWI&C.


----------



## Wombatnomore (Dec 9, 2013)

Poor Purl said:


> Nothing truly funny is bad. I thought this was funny. I hope you did, too.


Funny and very clever. Thanks for sharing.


----------



## Wombatnomore (Dec 9, 2013)

DGreen said:


> I agree. Which is why I am politically active in my community, doing everything I can to throw the three current representatives in my district, out of office. Remember, we are saddled with the Tea Party doing every dirty trick in the book to take control of our country. ALEC is hand-in-glove with them and the ultra-conservative right. It's very depressing, actually. If you want to see what the Tea Party believes in, just Google their official website and it's all spelled out. But more worrisome stuff is a little deeper in the site. Click on "Martial Law" for some mind-boggling rhetoric. Rhetoric that a lot of people believe.


You must feel beside yourself with frustration. Here's hoping that the American voters wisely keep these a$$'s at bay. The next Federal election in the U.S. is going to be very interesting. I plan to closely follow it.


----------



## Wombatnomore (Dec 9, 2013)

Poor Purl said:


> It's really just a question of who writes the actual legislation. At one time it was mainly legislators; more recently, lobbyists have been writing laws that favor their industries. ALEC is just one more level, and because it was created to write laws favoring some very wealthy individuals and corporations, it very often is called upon by politicians who are wholly owned subsidiaries of those VWI&C.


Do the American public tolerate this or is there outrage?


----------



## Poor Purl (Apr 14, 2011)

Designer1234 said:


> To change the subject as I am sure we are all bored with this past discussion ladies, My sister in law just sent me this and I found it rather interesting. The story is true and I enjoyed reading it again. I read an article when the information was released. here it is:
> 
> =================
> 
> ...


What a great story!


----------



## Poor Purl (Apr 14, 2011)

SQM said:


> Good Quote.
> 
> Following link is to a Lebanese woman who addressed the UN recently.
> 
> ...


----------



## Poor Purl (Apr 14, 2011)

Wombatnomore said:


> Do the American public tolerate this or is there outrage?


As long as they can get 700 channels on their TV, the American public will go along with anything - usually they won't even know it's happening. That's why this coming election is going to be a bad one for the Democrats, and for the American people - all those TV ads.


----------



## Poor Purl (Apr 14, 2011)

Designer1234 said:


> I read about it in one of the UK papers. A friend told me about it so I googled it.Shortly after the story was released. Good for them!!!


I sent it on to my party-pooper husband, and this is how he responded:

Sounds apocryphal. That no un-coded information would have been printed on anything that could have been intercepted by the enemy as that could have endangered all involved seems more credible. http://www.truthorfiction.com/rumors/m/monopoly-game.htm#.VEM_w3XfCY0


----------



## Wombatnomore (Dec 9, 2013)

Poor Purl said:


> As long as they can get 700 channels on their TV, the American public will go along with anything - usually they won't even know it's happening. That's why this coming election is going to be a bad one for the Democrats, and for the American people - all those TV ads.


It's disappointing that the majority of populations (also here in Australia), don't really care or know about the politics of their countries. Although voting in Australia is compulsory, many (if not most) people continue to vote as their parents did or they cast a 'donkey' vote. I cast a donkey vote once; wrote on the ballot papers "no thanks" in red lipstick only because there was no other option in my view.

I still feel a little bit that way now and I don't vote for either major party. Usually vote for a minor party and an independent who seems to have something to offer.


----------



## SQM (Jun 22, 2012)

joeysomma said:


> She is often on FOX news.


Blah. The woman who sent it to me is a conservative from Israel.

But maybe I should be cheering fox for having the "integrity" to have her on.


----------



## DGreen (Nov 1, 2012)

Wombatnomore said:


> It's disappointing that the majority of populations (also here in Australia), don't really care or know about the politics of their countries. Although voting in Australia is compulsory, many (if not most) people continue to vote as their parents did or they cast a 'donkey' vote. I cast a donkey vote once; wrote on the ballot papers "no thanks" in red lipstick only because there was no other option in my view.
> 
> I still feel a little bit that way now and I don't vote for either major party. Usually vote for a minor party and an independent who seems to have something to offer.


We get what we deserve, don't we?


----------



## Gerslay (Oct 4, 2011)

Wombatnomore said:


> And your point is?


The point is she's been a hero of the conservative right for a long time and when we've posted her remarks no one on the left bothered to read them.

She frequently speaks at American conservative organizations such as The Heritage Foundation, Christians United for Israel, Evangelicals, and Jewish groups.

In her own words, she gives voice to "what many in America are thinking, but afraid to say out loud, for fear of being labeled a racist, bigot, Islamophobic, or intolerant."


----------



## Designer1234 (Aug 9, 2011)

Poor Purl said:


> I sent it on to my party-pooper husband, and this is how he responded:
> 
> Sounds apocryphal. That no un-coded information would have been printed on anything that could have been intercepted by the enemy as that could have endangered all involved seems more credible. http://www.truthorfiction.com/rumors/m/monopoly-game.htm#.VEM_w3XfCY0


I watched the BBC when it was released, actually I was surfing the news and this came on. I never heard more about it until I talked to sil the other day.


----------



## SQM (Jun 22, 2012)

Gerslay said:


> The point is she's been a hero of the conservative right for a long time and when we've posted her remarks no one on the left bothered to read them.
> 
> She frequently speaks at American conservative organizations such as The Heritage Foundation, Christians United for Israel, Evangelicals, and Jewish groups.
> 
> In her own words, she gives voice to "what many in America are thinking, but afraid to say out loud, for fear of being labeled a racist, bigot, Islamophobic, or intolerant."


I was going to post it first on D & P knowing we share similar views on Israel.


----------



## Designer1234 (Aug 9, 2011)

SQM said:


> I was going to post it first on D & P knowing we share similar views on Israel.


I think she is very courageous and I applaud her.


----------



## Wombatnomore (Dec 9, 2013)

Gerslay said:


> The point is she's been a hero of the conservative right for a long time and when we've posted her remarks no one on the left bothered to read them.
> 
> She frequently speaks at American conservative organizations such as The Heritage Foundation, Christians United for Israel, Evangelicals, and Jewish groups.
> 
> In her own words, she gives voice to "what many in America are thinking, but afraid to say out loud, for fear of being labeled a racist, bigot, Islamophobic, or intolerant."


When have you posted her remarks?


----------



## Gerslay (Oct 4, 2011)

Wombatnomore said:


> When have you posted her remarks?


There have been various things posted from her and about her but because she's a Christian perhaps your prejudices caused you to not bother to read them? Just asking!


----------



## Designer1234 (Aug 9, 2011)

Gerslay said:


> There have been various things posted from her and about her but because she's a Christian perhaps your prejudices caused you to not bother to read them? Just asking!


Come on, Gers -- so many things are posted by your group it would take every minute of the day to read them all. I found her interesting, brave and very smart. Much of what she said I agree with. She must have a huge amount of courage in my opinion. You know, once in awhile we do have some agreement -- it is sort of sad we have to be ridiculed so as a result we rarely post when we do have thoughts in common.

In this case many of the things she said I agreed with although not all. I have always believed Israel should exist and should protect herself - I also have believed that Isreal has to defend herself or will be wiped off the face of the earth. I would like to hear more from her. If you post something about her - please mention it. With so many posts and quotes from Joey, and others it is hard to keep up. I admit I don't read them all as I already know in most cases that I won't agree and she does it to make a point which she made the first day she posted. However, I find this woman very interesting and would like to hear more about her and more of her words.

Our group is made up of individuals, with different ideas in some cases. Even though we are those 'terrible' Libs, we don't always agree with each other the way you all do.

Our group respects each other and we have every right to express differences. That to me is the best thing about us- we don't judge each other if we don't all agree with each other all the time.

Rarely do we ever see that coming out of D and P which makes me wonder why? I am sure that all of you are not on exactly the same page about everything but no one ever admits it. I guess it is called a 'closed camp' as my Dad used to say. Oh well, to each his own. I like our way the best. We can think and we can speak and we can disagree.


----------



## Poor Purl (Apr 14, 2011)

SQM said:


> Blah. The woman who sent it to me is a conservative from Israel.
> 
> But maybe I should be cheering fox for having the "integrity" to have her on.


Fox is required to be strongly pro-Israel, so they ought to have her on.


----------



## Poor Purl (Apr 14, 2011)

SQM said:


> I was going to post it first on D & P knowing we share similar views on Israel.


Similar? Maybe. You (or at least I think you) believe Israel should exist as a permanent home for Jews; they believe Israel should exist as a final stage for Jews to convert to Christianity.


----------



## Designer1234 (Aug 9, 2011)

Poor Purl said:


> Similar? Maybe. You (or at least I think you) believe Israel should exist as a permanent home for Jews; they believe Israel should exist as a final stage for Jews to convert to Christianity.


I agree with you about the right wing people on these threads agreeing with Isreal and the conversion of Jews.

However I did agree with a lot of what she said and I think she has a great deal of courage. I think Israel should exist as a permanent home for Jews too. Not because they will meet Christian requirements but because they have been vilified all over the world and it is still happening. I believe that it is the chosen land and they should stay there and fight for their country. After seeing the pictures of the camps when I was a teenager , I have always thought so. The world owes them a place to call their own. It is a gut feeling I have always had and always will have. Not necessarily for religious reasons.


----------



## Gerslay (Oct 4, 2011)

Designer1234 said:


> Come on, Gers -- so many things are posted by your group it would take every minute of the day to read them all. I found her interesting, brave and very smart. Much of what she said I agree with. She must have a huge amount of courage in my opinion. You know, once in awhile we do have some agreement -- it is sort of sad we have to be ridiculed so as a result we rarely post when we do have thoughts in common.
> 
> In this case many of the things she said I agreed with. I would like to hear more from her. If you post something about her - please mention it. With so many posts and quotes from Joey, and others it is hard to keep up. I admit I don't read them all as I already know in most cases that I won't agree. However, I find her very interesting and would like to hear more about her and more of her words.
> 
> ...


D&P is a group of women who have one basic thing in common and that is that we choose to not have drama on our thread. We are all very different; some of us are Christian, some are Jewish, and some never say what they are...some are conservative politically and socially, and some are one but not the other...some of us love to cook while others hate it. We're actually a very diverse group with a big age span, we live all over the country, and we speak with different accents. We welcome and enjoy our differences.

That you think us a "closed camp" speaks to the prejudice I was referring to with Wombat.


----------



## Poor Purl (Apr 14, 2011)

Designer1234 said:


> I agree with you about the right wing people on these threads agreeing with Isreal and the conversion of Jews.
> 
> However I did agree with a lot of what she said and I think she has a great deal of courage. I think Israel should exist as a permanent home for Jews too. Not because they will meet Christian requirements but because they have been vilified all over the world and it is still happening. I believe that it is the chosen land and they should stay there and fight for their country. After seeing the pictures of the camps when I was a teenager , I have always thought so. The world owes them a place to call their own. It is a gut feeling I have always had and always will have. Not necessarily for religious reasons.


Thank you, Designer. I bet those medical tests you took over the summer showed that both your heart and your gut are working well.

I don't know whether the world owes anyone a place to call their own, but after 65 years of fighting for a place, it's time for them to be able to claim it.


----------



## Gerslay (Oct 4, 2011)

Poor Purl said:


> Similar? Maybe. You (or at least I think you) believe Israel should exist as a permanent home for Jews; they believe Israel should exist as a final stage for Jews to convert to Christianity.


That is so totally wrong, so abhorrent a thing to say, that it doesn't even deserve this reply.


----------



## MaidInBedlam (Jul 24, 2012)

Designer1234 said:


> I hope it is true, but can you imagine what they have been through? It is very sad and sickens me.


And what kind of "home" will those 200 school girls come home to? They were attending a Christian school when they were abducted. The next time they were seen on that awful video, they were dressed in Muslim style clothing and chanting Muslim prayers. What if they aren't virgins anymore? In many cultures girls are blamed for things they were forced to do.


----------



## Poor Purl (Apr 14, 2011)

Gerslay said:


> That is so totally wrong, so abhorrent a thing to say, that it doesn't even deserve this reply.


Then why make it?

Don't the end-times require that Jews inhabit Israel and then either come to Jesus or go down in flames?


----------



## Gerslay (Oct 4, 2011)

Poor Purl said:


> Then why make it.
> 
> I made it to say no comment.


----------



## MaidInBedlam (Jul 24, 2012)

Think of all their messages as going into your spam folder if you happen to notice one of your detractors is addressing you. If God can have a spam folder, so can you. They're easy to ignore and to empty, too.


Designer1234 said:


> -----------------
> Wow - you really dislike me don't you. I think it is better sometimes to do a dancing cat, or a smiley face than get into a fight with someone who you have nothing in common with. You have your opinion of me, you don't know me and I don't know you - you have made it clear you have no use for me and as a result I have no wish to deal with you. I tried and you made it clear you prefer to fight. I am going to try not to fight with you any more Solo -but some of your posts are so far out I will answer you - even if it is with a dancing cat.- you have your
> agenda, and I certainly seem to be a goodly part of what you don't like. That is okay, - my skin has gotten a lot thicker since I have come back here. Call me what you wish, I cared at the beginning , now I expect nothing else from you. So attack away, get as personal as you wish . It is interesting that I seem to get your back up. However, that is your choice.
> 
> ...


----------



## Poor Purl (Apr 14, 2011)

Gerslay said:


> Poor Purl said:
> 
> 
> > Then why make it.
> ...


----------



## Poor Purl (Apr 14, 2011)

MaidInBedlam said:


> Think of all their messages as going into your spam folder if you happen to notice one of your detractors is addressing you. If God can have a spam folder, so can you. They're easy to ignore and to empty, too.


I have to comment on your avatar: I am in love with hummingbirds. It's a very serious affair. Thanks for that beautiful picture.


----------



## DGreen (Nov 1, 2012)

Gerslay said:


> Poor Purl said:
> 
> 
> > Then why make it.
> ...


----------



## SQM (Jun 22, 2012)

Poor Purl said:


> Similar? Maybe. You (or at least I think you) believe Israel should exist as a permanent home for Jews; they believe Israel should exist as a final stage for Jews to convert to Christianity.


I don't judge motives. I judge behavior.


----------



## MaidInBedlam (Jul 24, 2012)

joeysomma said:


> Satan is the ruler of the world. God has let the reprobates rule. As it was prophesized it would happen before His return.


As God's oldest son, it doesn't seem very strange that God's letting him run the business for a while. You do know Billy Graham associated with all the Presidents he could once he was famous enough to do so. I suppose his son has taken on that job now. Are they some of the reprobates God has let rule?


----------



## Poor Purl (Apr 14, 2011)

joeysomma said:


> Why are they required to be pro-Israel. The only thing they are required to be is a reputable truthful news organization. Which they are. If a mistake is made, it is corrected on the beginning of that program the next day.
> 
> The ones that do not believe it are to conditioned by the main stream media, that defends the president's unlawfulness. How long after Benghazi did it take the Man stream media to report it had nothing to do with a Video? Within 24 hours they interviewed someone from Libya that stated it was a terrorist attack. It took about 2 weeks more for Obama to really admit it was a terrorist attack.


Fox, like all Republicans, is required to be pro-Israel. That's how the GOP expects to attract the Jewish vote.

Your first paragraph is pure baloney. Murdoch has admitted, boastfully, that they never take anything back, even when proven wrong.

As for your second paragraph, no matter how much of the truth comes out, you'll never accept it and will keep on pretending more happened in Benghazi than actually did. But at least you found a way to mention it yet again, even though it was way off topic.


----------



## MaidInBedlam (Jul 24, 2012)

joeysomma said:


> Solo, she would prefer to stick her tongue at comments about God. She will answer to God someday, for those comments.


And God will pat her on the back and congratulate her for not suffering fools gladly. :twisted:


----------



## Country Bumpkins (Feb 18, 2011)

MaidInBedlam said:


> As God's oldest son, it doesn't seem very strange that God's letting him run the business for a while. You do know Billy Graham associated with all the Presidents he could once he was famous enough to do so. I suppose his son has taken on that job now. Are they some of the reprobates God has let rule?


 :?:


----------



## Poor Purl (Apr 14, 2011)

MaidInBedlam said:


> As God's oldest son, it doesn't seem very strange that God's letting him run the business for a while. You do know Billy Graham associated with all the Presidents he could once he was famous enough to do so. I suppose his son has taken on that job now. Are they some of the reprobates God has let rule?


----------



## MaidInBedlam (Jul 24, 2012)

Country Bumpkins said:


> :?:


Satan has been characterized as God's oldest son, but I don't expect you're widely read enough in theology or satire to have encountered that idea.


----------



## Poor Purl (Apr 14, 2011)

MaidInBedlam said:


> And God will pat her on the back and congratulate her for not suffering fools gladly. :twisted:


----------



## MaidInBedlam (Jul 24, 2012)

I love it!!! Thank you for a much need break from the usual stuff around here. :-D :-D :-D


Designer1234 said:


> To change the subject as I am sure we are all bored with this past discussion ladies, My sister in law just sent me this and I found it rather interesting. The story is true and I enjoyed reading it again. I read an article when the information was released. here it is:
> 
> =================
> 
> ...


----------



## galinipper (Apr 30, 2013)

Wombatnomore said:


> When have you posted her remarks?


She's been talked about on the D&P thread. You can find it on my list of posts if you don't believe me. I have posted pics also. I have seen her lecture once and went to another lecture which she had to cancel due to death threats, her security shut it down. she is a US based journalist and news producer, she started her career as anchor for World News, an arabic news program. She has addressed audiences at FBI, Special OPs command, Congress and the list continues on in that fashion and not just this Country.
She is founder of www.actforamerica.org

footnote: I am neither a Christian or a Jew


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## MaidInBedlam (Jul 24, 2012)

When I lived in Vancouver in the 1990s, I found a great deal more freedom of the press. It took me a while to get used to the CBC news, and they were the mainstream!


Designer1234 said:


> Joey there is more free speech and discussion here than in many other countries in the world. After reading some of the things that go on in the US. I would think there is more openness and less restrictions here than down there. Not somethings you would agree with, I imagine.
> 
> Certainly, no matter who tells you different, we have an excellent health care system. But then that has to start somewhere.
> 
> There are Conservatives and Liberals, however there is not the dreadful division here that there is down there. I just Pray that it stays that way.


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## Country Bumpkins (Feb 18, 2011)

MaidInBedlam said:


> Satan has been characterized as God's oldest son, but I don't expect you're widely read enough in theology or satire to have encountered that idea.


God has only ONE son, Jesus. Lucifer was a Arch Angel. He was the most beautiful . He got the big head and thought he was more powerful than God. He got 1/3 of the angels to try to over thrown Heaven. He got a big surprise . God kicked down to earth. He is the prince and power of the air. I don't believe in theology or satire. Only the Word of God.
I can't give you scriptures because everyone will say I am preaching. :roll:


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## Country Bumpkins (Feb 18, 2011)

MaidInBedlam said:


> Satan has been characterized as God's oldest son, but I don't expect you're widely read enough in theology or satire to have encountered that idea.


Don't throw or spin it back in my direction because you are wrong. How do you know how widely I have read ? You have to get nasty don't you. Can't have a conversation with one of you.


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## MaidInBedlam (Jul 24, 2012)

Poor Purl said:


> I have to comment on your avatar: I am in love with hummingbirds. It's a very serious affair. Thanks for that beautiful picture.


We have a lot of Anna's around here and feeders for them. Once on vacation at Lake Tahoe a hummer held its place right in front of me, a few inches from my nose. I was ten. I was amazed and thrilled. It was very cool.

Looks like I'm going to have to change my avatar to a hummingbird again. Hummingbird Lovers Unite!!

PS: This avatar's for you.


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## Country Bumpkins (Feb 18, 2011)

galinipper said:


> She's been talked about on the D&P thread. You can find it on my list of posts if you don't believe me. I have posted pics also. I have seen her lecture once and went to another lecture which she had to cancel due to death threats, her security shut it down. she is a US based journalist and news producer, she started her career as anchor for World News, an arabic news program. She has addressed audiences at FBI, Special OPs command, Congress and the list continues on in that fashion and not just this Country.
> She is founder of www.actforamerica.org
> 
> footnote: I am neither a Christian or a Jew


 :thumbup: I love her! I would love to have been to one of her lectures.


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## Wombatnomore (Dec 9, 2013)

Gerslay said:


> There have been various things posted from her and about her but because she's a Christian perhaps your prejudices caused you to not bother to read them? Just asking!


And what are my prejudices precisely?


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## soloweygirl (Jun 9, 2012)

Designer1234 said:


> -----------------
> Wow - you really dislike me don't you. I think it is better sometimes to do a dancing cat, or a smiley face than get into a fight with someone who you have nothing in common with. You have your opinion of me, you don't know me and I don't know you - you have made it clear you have no use for me and as a result I have no wish to deal with you. I tried and you made it clear you prefer to fight. I am going to try not to fight with you any more Solo -but some of your posts are so far out I will answer you - even if it is with a dancing cat.- you have your
> agenda, and I certainly seem to be a goodly part of what you don't like. That is okay, - my skin has gotten a lot thicker since I have come back here. Call me what you wish, I cared at the beginning , now I expect nothing else from you. So attack away, get as personal as you wish . It is interesting that I seem to get your back up. However, that is your choice.
> 
> ...


Dislike you? No, more to the point would be finding something to like about you.

The rest of your post is your usual BS. It's always someone else insulting you and you never insult anyone. You always play the innocent one - spare me the victim mentality.(This is where PP will pipe in on cue.)

To be clear, what gets my back up is your lying. Yes you do lie. I asked for proof in that last post and you responded with the cat. I didn't find the cat insulting, those are YOUR words. I said the cat was your version of proof, since you couldn't back up your with with proof.

If I was so wrong about you bringing up the past then why did you bring KPG into your post?? Your post has nothing to do with KPG. You do it so often you don't even know you do it.

You're right - enough said.


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## Wombatnomore (Dec 9, 2013)

galinipper said:


> She's been talked about on the D&P thread. You can find it on my list of posts if you don't believe me. I have posted pics also. I have seen her lecture once and went to another lecture which she had to cancel due to death threats, her security shut it down. she is a US based journalist and news producer, she started her career as anchor for World News, an arabic news program. She has addressed audiences at FBI, Special OPs command, Congress and the list continues on in that fashion and not just this Country.
> She is founder of www.actforamerica.org
> 
> footnote: I am neither a Christian or a Jew


Given I don't read D&P I would not have known.

I have read up about Brigitte Gabriel and I admire her fearless stance against radical Islam. That she is a woman makes it even more impressive.


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## soloweygirl (Jun 9, 2012)

Country Bumpkins said:


> Don't throw or spin it back in my direction because you are wrong. How do you know how widely I have read ? You have to get nasty don't you. Can't have a conversation with one of you.


Spam folder CB. Seattle feels our posts should go into one, so why should her posts be treated any other way. Although I would bypass the spam folder and toss it straight into the trash can.


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## Gerslay (Oct 4, 2011)

Poor Purl said:


> But, again, don't the end-times require that Jews inhabit Israel and then either come to Jesus or go down in flames?


We've been this way before Purl. When the Jews' Messiah comes and they accept Him will it matter what His name is, or was, or if He'd been here before?

I think not, and that is what Christians believe.


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## Gerslay (Oct 4, 2011)

DGreen said:


> "That is so totally wrong, so abhorrent a thing to say, that it doesn't even deserve this reply."
> 
> The way to say "no comment" is, "no comment."


Have you told that to Designer who likes to make no comments in much the same way?


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## Gerslay (Oct 4, 2011)

Wombatnomore said:


> And what are my prejudices precisely?


An assumptiion that "Christians" have nothing worthy to say for you to read.


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## Gerslay (Oct 4, 2011)

MaidInBedlam said:


> Satan has been characterized as God's oldest son, but I don't expect you're widely read enough in theology or satire to have encountered that idea.


I've encountered that lie many times over.


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## Wombatnomore (Dec 9, 2013)

Gerslay said:


> An assumptiion that "Christians" have nothing worthy to say for you to read.


And how did you arrive at that conclusion?


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## Gerslay (Oct 4, 2011)

Wombatnomore said:


> And how did you arrive at that conclusion?


You just posted this as one example:
"Given I don't read D&P I would not have known."


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## Wombatnomore (Dec 9, 2013)

Gerslay said:


> You just posted this as one example:
> "Given I don't read D&P I would not have known."


How convenient Gerslay. It's not because Christians post on D&P that I don't read the thread. I simply don't read it, that's all. If I was prejudice against Christians, why would I bother conversing with you?

You're being a bit weird today. Are you alright?


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## Gerslay (Oct 4, 2011)

Wombatnomore said:


> How convenient Gerslay. It's not because Christians post on D&P that I don't read the thread. I simply don't read it, that's all. If I was prejudice against Christians, why would I bother conversing with you?
> 
> You're being a bit weird today. Are you alright?


What is this...20 questions?

:lol: :lol: :lol:


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## Wombatnomore (Dec 9, 2013)

Gerslay said:


> What is this...20 questions?
> 
> :lol: :lol: :lol:


I'm glad you're okay.


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## Knitanon (Sep 2, 2012)

Gerslay said:


> You just posted this as one example:
> "Given I don't read D&P I would not have known."


Since when are there any true Christians at D&P?


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## Knitter from Nebraska (Jun 9, 2013)

Gerslay said:


> The point is she's been a hero of the conservative right for a long time and when we've posted her remarks no one on the left bothered to read them.
> 
> She frequently speaks at American conservative organizations such as The Heritage Foundation, Christians United for Israel, Evangelicals, and Jewish groups.
> 
> In her own words, she gives voice to "what many in America are thinking, but afraid to say out loud, for fear of being labeled a racist, bigot, Islamophobic, or intolerant."


You forgot to mention that she also speaks to TEA party groups. I think it's absolutely hilarious to hear all the libs praising this ultra conservative, JUST because she's pro Israel! Not one of them would have bothered to listen to her speak on anything else! This is a perfect example of why we shouldn't judge people based on whether they're liberal or conservative, democrat or republican, Christian, Jew or anything else! Everyone deserves to be judged by their OWN words and actions! And everyone should go to you tube and see what else Bridget Gabriel has to say. You might be surprised at how much we have in common!


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## Poor Purl (Apr 14, 2011)

MaidInBedlam said:


> I love it!!! Thank you for a much need break from the usual stuff around here. :-D :-D :-D


Thank you for more hummies. I'm actually smiling, even though we've been doing tax stuff.


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## Poor Purl (Apr 14, 2011)

joeysomma said:


> This story has been proven false by Poor Purl on page 62 of this thread.
> 
> http://www.truthorfiction.com/rumors/m/monopoly-game.htm#.VEQDjWzfTmJ


The Bible has been proven false many times in many pages, but it still makes a good story. Can't you just enjoy the story? (And it was not me but my party-pooper husband that said the story was false.)


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## Poor Purl (Apr 14, 2011)

soloweygirl said:


> You always play the innocent one - spare me the victim mentality.(This is where PP will pipe in on cue.)


You mean by pointing out how you cried that I abused you when I was just paying back an insult from you? Okay, done.


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## Poor Purl (Apr 14, 2011)

galinipper said:


> She's been talked about on the D&P thread.


That might explain why none of us commented on her before. I'd never heard of her, but I appreciate the introduction. (I only read what's on D&P when I need a new cream-cheese recipe.)


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## Poor Purl (Apr 14, 2011)

MaidInBedlam said:


> We have a lot of Anna's around here and feeders for them. Once on vacation at Lake Tahoe a hummer held its place right in front of me, a few inches from my nose. I was ten. I was amazed and thrilled. It was very cool.
> 
> Looks like I'm going to have to change my avatar to a hummingbird again. Hummingbird Lovers Unite!!
> 
> PS: This avatar's for you.


Thank you - I really appreciate it. Those pea-sized brains never fail to impress me. I was once scolded for having moved the feeder a foot to the left. I swear, a ruby-throated little guy flew over, then flew to the original spot, babbling at me, then back to the feeder. He was obviously showing me where it belonged.


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## Poor Purl (Apr 14, 2011)

Gerslay said:


> We've been this way before Purl. When the Jews' Messiah comes and they accept Him will it matter what His name is, or was, or if He'd been here before?
> 
> I think not, and that is what Christians believe.


Yes, it would certainly matter if he'd been here before, especially if he claimed to be divine. *If* the messiah comes (and there's some disagreement about whether he will), he will be born from two human parents, because above all else, Jewish tradition states that God is One and has one name.


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## Country Bumpkins (Feb 18, 2011)

http://www.jewfaq.org/name.htm Please note: This page contains the Name of God. If you print it out, please treat it with appropriate respect.

The Significance of Names

In Jewish thought, a name is not merely an arbitrary designation, a random combination of sounds. The name conveys the nature and essence of the thing named. It represents the history and reputation of the being named.

This is not as strange or unfamiliar a concept as it may seem at first glance. In English, we often refer to a person's reputation as his "good name." When a company is sold, one thing that may be sold is the company's "good will," that is, the right to use the company's name. The Hebrew concept of a name is very similar to these ideas.

An example of this usage occurs in Ex. 3:13-22: Moses asks God what His "name" is. Moses is not asking "what should I call you;" rather, he is asking "who are you; what are you like; what have you done." That is clear from God's response. God replies that He is eternal, that He is the God of our ancestors, that He has seen our affliction and will redeem us from bondage.

Another example of this usage is the concepts of chillul Ha-Shem and kiddush Ha-Shem. An act that causes God or Judaism to come into disrespect or a commandment to be disobeyed is often referred to as "chillul Ha-Shem," profanation of The Name. Clearly, we are not talking about a harm done to a word; we are talking about harm to a reputation. Likewise, any deed that increases the respect accorded to God or Judaism is referred to as "kiddush Ha-Shem," sanctification of The Name.

Because a name represents the reputation of the thing named, a name should be treated with the same respect as the thing's reputation. For this reason, God's Names, in all of their forms, are treated with enormous respect and reverence in Judaism.
The Names of God

I have often heard people refer to the Judeo-Christian God as "the nameless God" to contrast our God with the ancient pagan gods. I always found this odd, because Judaism clearly recognizes the existence of a Name for God; in fact, we have many Names for God.

The most important of God's Names is the four-letter Name represented by the Hebrew letters Yod-Hei-Vav-Hei (YHVH). It is often referred to as the Ineffable Name, the Unutterable Name or the Distinctive Name. Linguistically, it is related to the Hebrew root Hei-Yod-Hei (to be), and reflects the fact that God's existence is eternal. In scripture, this Name is used when discussing God's relation with human beings, and when emphasizing his qualities of lovingkindness and mercy. It is frequently shortened to Yah (Yod-Hei), Yahu or Yeho (Yod-Hei-Vav), especially when used in combination with names or phrases, as in Yehoshua (Joshua, meaning "the Lord is my Salvation"), Eliyahu (Elijah, meaning "my God is the Lord"), and Halleluyah ("praise the Lord").

The first Name used for God in scripture is Elohim. In form, the word is a masculine plural of a word that looks feminine in the singular (Eloha). The same word (or, according to Rambam, a homonym of it) is used to refer to princes, judges, other gods, and other powerful beings. This Name is used in scripture when emphasizing God's might, His creative power, and His attributes of justice and rulership. Variations on this Name include El, Eloha, Elohai (my God) and Elohaynu (our God).

God is also known as El Shaddai. This Name is usually translated as "God Almighty," however, the derivation of the word "Shaddai" is not known. According to some views, it is derived from the root meaning "to heap benefits." According a Midrash, it means, "The One who said 'dai'" ("dai" meaning enough or sufficient) and comes from the fact that when God created the universe, it expanded until He said "DAI!" (perhaps the first recorded theory of an expanding universe?). The name Shaddai is the one written on the mezuzah scroll. Some note that Shaddai is an acronym of Shomer Daltot Yisrael, Guardian of the Doors of Israel.

Another significant Name of God is YHVH Tzva'ot. This Name is normally translated as "Lord of Hosts." The word "tzva'ot" means "hosts" in the sense of a military grouping or an organized array. The Name refers to God's leadership and sovereignty. Interestingly, this Name is rarely used in scripture. It never appears in the Torah (i.e., the first five books). It appears primarily in the prophetic books of Isaiah, Jeremiah, Haggai, Zechariah and Malachi, as well as many times in the Psalms.
Writing the Name of God

Jews do not casually write any Name of God. This practice does not come from the commandment not to take the Lord's Name in vain, as many suppose. In Jewish thought, that commandment refers solely to oath-taking, and is a prohibition against swearing by God's Name falsely or frivolously (the word normally translated as "in vain" literally means "for falsehood").

Judaism does not prohibit writing the Name of God per se; it prohibits only erasing or defacing a Name of God. However, observant Jews avoid writing any Name of God casually because of the risk that the written Name might later be defaced, obliterated or destroyed accidentally or by one who does not know better.

The commandment not to erase or deface the name of God comes from Deut. 12:3. In that passage, the people are commanded that when they take over the promised land, they should destroy all things related to the idolatrous religions of that region, and should utterly destroy the names of the local deities. Immediately afterwards, we are commanded not to do the same to our God. From this, the rabbis inferred that we are commanded not to destroy any holy thing, and not to erase or deface a Name of God.

It is worth noting that this prohibition against erasing or defacing Names of God applies only to Names that are written in some kind of permanent form. Orthodox rabbis have held that writing on a computer is not a permanent form, thus it is not a violation to type God's Name into a computer and then backspace over it or cut and paste it, or copy and delete files with God's Name in them. However, once you print the document out, it becomes a permanent form. That is why observant Jews avoid writing a Name of God online: because there is a risk that someone else will print it out and deface it. See a 1998 discussion of the issue at The Sanctity of God's Name, Part 1: Erasing Sacred Texts from a Computer Screen if you're interested, but be aware that the lengthy article is thick with technical religious jargon, not always explained.

Normally, we avoid writing the Name by substituting letters or syllables, for example, writing "G-d" instead of "God." In addition, the number 15, which would ordinarily be written in Hebrew as Yod-Hei (10-5), is normally written as Teit-Vav (9-6), because Yod-Hei is a Name. See Hebrew Alphabet for more information about using letters as numerals.
Pronouncing the Name of God

Nothing in the Torah prohibits a person from pronouncing the Name of God. Indeed, it is evident from scripture that God's Name was pronounced routinely. Many common Hebrew names contain "Yah" or "Yahu," part of God's four-letter Name. The Name was pronounced as part of daily services in the Temple.

The Mishnah confirms that there was no prohibition against pronouncing The Name in ancient times. In fact, the Mishnah recommends using God's Name as a routine greeting to a fellow Jew. Berakhot 9:5. However, by the time of the Talmud, it was the custom to use substitute Names for God. Some rabbis asserted that a person who pronounces YHVH according to its letters (instead of using a substitute) has no place in the World to Come, and should be put to death. Instead of pronouncing the four-letter Name, we usually substitute the Name "Adonai," or simply say "Ha-Shem" (lit. The Name).

Although the prohibition on pronunciation applies only to the four-letter Name, Jews customarily do not pronounce any of God's many Names except in prayer or study. The usual practice is to substitute letters or syllables, so that Adonai becomes Adoshem or Ha-Shem; Elohaynu and Elohim become Elokaynu and Elokim; Eil becomes Keil, etc.

With the Temple destroyed and the prohibition on pronouncing The Name outside of the Temple, pronunciation of the Name fell into disuse. Scholars passed down knowledge of the correct pronunciation of YHVH for many generations, but eventually the correct pronunciation was lost, and we no longer know it with any certainty. We do not know what vowels were used, or even whether the Vav in the Name was a vowel or a consonant. See Hebrew Alphabet for more information about the difficulties in pronouncing Hebrew. Some religious scholars suggest that the Name was pronounced "Yahweh," but others do not find this pronunciation particularly persuasive. Historian Flavius Josephus, who was born a kohein at a time when the pronunciation of the Name was still known, said that the name was four vowels (War of the Jews, Book V, Chapter 5), probably referring to the fact that each of the four consonants in the name can serve in Hebrew as a vowel or vowel marker. See Hebrew Alphabet.

Some people render the four-letter Name as "Jehovah," but this pronunciation is particularly unlikely. The word "Jehovah" comes from the fact that ancient Jewish texts used to put the vowels of the Name "Adonai" (the usual substitute for YHVH) under the consonants of YHVH to remind people not to pronounce YHVH as written. A sixteenth century German Christian scribe, while transliterating the Bible into Latin for the Pope, wrote the Name out as it appeared in his texts, with the consonants of YHVH and the vowels of Adonai, and came up with the word JeHoVaH ("J" is pronounced "Y" in German), and the name stuck.
Oops. I am preaching again.


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## Country Bumpkins (Feb 18, 2011)

Names for God found in Sacred Scripture
and some of the passages in which these names are found:

All Scripture quotations are from the New Jerusalem Bible (NJB) unless otherwise noted as from the New American Bible (NAB).

Elohim = "God" (plural) as in the Creator: In the beginning God (Elohim) created the heaven and the earth (Genesis 1:1).

El Elyon = "God (singular) Most High": And Melchizedek king of Salem brought out bread and wine; now he was a priest of [El Elyon] God the Most High. And He blessed him and said, ''blessed be Abram of God Most High, possessor of heaven and earth; and blessed be God Most High, who has delivered your enemies into your hand (Genesis 14:18-20).

El Roi = "God Who Sees": Then she called the name of the LORD who spoke to her, 'You are a [El Roi] God who sees'; for she said, 'Have I even remained alive here after seeing Him?' Therefore the well was called Beer-lahai-roi [well of the living one who sees me] (Genesis 16:13-14).

El Shaddai = "God Almighty" or "God the All-Sufficient One"; the etymology is so ancient that Biblical scholars do not agree on the meaning of this name: I AM El Shaddai. Live in my presence, be perfect, and I shall grant a covenant between myself and you, and make you very numerous. And Abram bowed to the ground (Genesis 17:2-3).

Yahweh = found in Scripture as the consonants YHWH, known as the "Tetragramaton" is God's holy Covenant name. The letters form a word or words from the verb "to be" and most scholars translate it as "I AM who I AM" or "I will be who I will be", or "the Self-Existent One: Moses said to God, 'Look, if I go to the Israelites and say to them, The God of your ancestors has sent me to you, and they say to me, 'What is His name?' what am I to tell them?' God said to Moses, 'I AM He who is. Tell them that I AM who I am sent you (Exodus 3:13-14).

Adonai = "Lord" (Note: LORD, all in capital letters is a substitution out of reverence for God's covenant name "Yahweh"): Then Moses said to the LORD, 'Please Lord, I have never been eloquent, neither recently nor in time past, nor since you have spoken to your servant; for I am slow of speech and slow of tongue. And the LORD said to him, 'Who has made men's mouth? Or who make him dumb or deaf, or seeing or blind? Is it not I, the LORD?' (Exodus 4:10-12, NAB).

Yahweh-jireh = "Yahweh will provide" or "I AM will provide": But the angel of the LORD called to him from heaven and said, 'Abraham, Abraham!' And he said, 'Here I am.' And he said, 'Do not stretch out your hand against the lad, and do nothing to him; for now I know that you fear God, since you have not withheld your son, your only son, form Me.' Then Abraham raised his eyes and looked, and behind him he saw a ram caught up in the thicket by his horns; and Abraham went and took the ram, and offered him up for a burnt offering in the place of his son. And Abraham called the name of that place [Yahweh jireh] The LORD will provide, as it is said to this day: On the Mountain Yahweh provides (Genesis 22:11-14).

Yahweh-rapha = "Yahweh who heals": If you will give earnest heed to the voice of Yahweh your God and do what He regards as right, if you pay attention to His commandments and keep all His laws, I shall never inflict on you any of the diseases that I inflicted on the Egyptians, for I am Yahweh your Healer [Yahweh rapha] (Exodus 15:26).

Yahwehnissi = "Yahweh My Banner": (after willing a battle with God's assistance ) Moses built an altar, and named it Yahweh is My Banner [Yahweh-nissi] ...(Exodus 17:16).

Yahweh-mekoddishkem = "Yahweh Who Sanctifies You": And Yahweh spoke to Moses, saying, 'But as for you, speak to the sons of Israel, saying, "You shall surely observe My Sabbaths; for this is a sign between Me and you throughout your generations, that you may know that I am Yahweh who sanctifies you [Yahweh-mekoddishkem]...(Exodus 31:12).

Yahweh-shalom = "Yahweh is Peace": He said, 'Alas, my Lord, Yahweh! Now I have seen the Angel of Yahweh face to face ' Yahweh answered, 'Peace be with you; have no fear; you will not die.' Gideon built an altar there to Yahweh and called it Yahweh is peace [Yahweh-shalom] (Judges 6:22-24).

Yahweh-sabaoth = "Yahweh of Hosts" (the "hosts" are the army of angels who serve God): Who is He, this king of glory? Yahweh of Hosts [Yahweh-saboath], He is the king of glory (Psalm 46:7, NJB); The LORD of Hosts [Yahweh-sabaoth] is with us; the God of Jacob is our stronghold (Psalms 22:10, NAB).

Yahweh-raah = "Yahweh My Shepherd": The LORD [Yahweh raah] is my shepherd; I shall not want ...(Psalms 23:1, NAB).

Yahweh-tsidkenu = "Yahweh Our Saving Justice": Look, the days are coming, Yahweh declares, when I shall rise an upright Branch for David; He will reign as king and be wise, doing what is just and upright in the country. In his days Judah will triumph and Israel live in safety, and this is the name He will be called Yahweh-our-saving-justice [Yahweh-tsidkenu] (Jeremiah 23:5-6).

The Names of Jesus in the Book of Revelation:

1:5 The First-born from the dead
1:5 The highest of earthly kings
1:8 The Alpha and Omega (also 22:13)
1:8 Lord God
1:8 The Almighty
1:13 Son of Man
1:17 The First and the Last (also 1:11;21:6;22:13)
1:18 The Living One
2:18 Son of God
3:14 Witness (also "faithful witness" in 1:5)
4:11 Creator
5:5 Lion of the Tribe of Judah
5:5 Root of David
5:6 The Lamb
7:17 The Shepherd
12:10 Christ (Anointed)
19:11 Faithful and True
19:13 Word of God
19:16 King of Kings
19:16 Lord of Lords

What ever word you use when you call upon the name of God, remember to call in reverence and in love for the word that expresses the essence of God in His most intimate relationship with you is LOVE, for God is love (1 John 4:16c).

We are waiting for Yahweh;
He is our help and our shield,
For in Him our heart rejoices,
In His holy name we trust.
Yahweh, let your faithful love rest on us.
As our hope has rested in you.
Psalms 33:20-22

Michal Hunt, Copyright © 2003 Agape Bible Study. Permissions All Rights Reserved.


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## Country Bumpkins (Feb 18, 2011)

Amen


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## DGreen (Nov 1, 2012)

Country Bumpkins said:


> Amen


You forgot one.

Jee-zusssss! Chrrr-ist!!


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## Gerslay (Oct 4, 2011)

Knitanon said:


> Since when are there any true Christians at D&P?


Out of the grave comes ... TADA ... Janet!

Still stylin like a dingleberry I see!


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## west coast kitty (May 26, 2012)

Designer1234 wrote:
As I said above It is a good country and we don't pick on those who are different - I guess it is best you live in the States Joey, I doubt you would appreciate the things that I love most about my country as our 
Government isn't repressive - so far it has remained that way in most cases. Although it hasn't always been that way with our first Nations peoples. Not perfect but a pretty darned good place to live. I would never be anything but a Canadian. I imagine you feel the same about your country. I would hope so I just added some to my post.
--------------

I love Canada too and I'm forever grateful that my parents were able to escape from communist East Germany and that Canada has provided a wonderful home for us.

But Canada has also seen declining freedoms.

For several years, free speech at our universities has been repressed 
http://news.nationalpost.com/2012/10/31/free-speech-at-canadian-universities-abysmal-report-says/
http://news.nationalpost.com/2012/11/27/pro-choice-student-unions-banning-of-anti-abortion-club-called-more-university-censorship/
http://news.nationalpost.com/2013/04/03/york-university-student-union-endorses-boycott-of-israeli-academics/

Graduates of Trinity Western University Law Faculty are banned from practicing law in Ontario and Nova Scotia, not because of their curriculum, but because of their Christian values ...

"But of course there is one religious group against which it is perfectly acceptable to discriminate in 2014: Christians. Because in recent weeks the Law Society of Upper Canada and the Nova Scotia Barristers' Society have both voted to ban from practising in their provinces any student who graduates from the new law school at B.C.s Trinity Western University.

This isnt just a ban on ostentatious displays of religiosity or a ban for people working in government jobs, like Quebec proposed. Ontario and Nova Scotia will ban any graduate of this school from working as a lawyer, at all, in private or in public, no matter how they conduct themselves. They wont even be allowed to draft a will or a contract."

http://www.torontosun.com/2014/04/28/ban-on-christian-values

Quebec has repressed Christians for years, but it has only been since they have extended their policies to Muslims that there has been a loud outcry. Human Rights Tribunals have been overwhelmed with frivolous cases to the point that a court ruling has come back to say that people do not have the right not to be offended.

Unfortunately most people don't object until the repression hits them too.


----------



## DGreen (Nov 1, 2012)

joeysomma said:


> I guess you didn't read: "Another example of this usage is the concepts of chillul Ha-Shem and kiddush Ha-Shem. An act that causes God or Judaism to come into disrespect or a commandment to be disobeyed is often referred to as "chillul Ha-Shem," *profanation* of The Name. Clearly, we are not talking about a harm done to a word; we are talking about harm to a reputation."
> But then why are you commenting when you don't * think* there is one?


Oh Joey, I have plenty of comments about your god. None of them nice.


----------



## DGreen (Nov 1, 2012)

west coast kitty said:


> Designer1234 wrote:
> As I said above It is a good country and we don't pick on those who are different - I guess it is best you live in the States Joey, I doubt you would appreciate the things that I love most about my country as our
> Government isn't repressive - so far it has remained that way in most cases. Although it hasn't always been that way with our first Nations peoples. Not perfect but a pretty darned good place to live. I would never be anything but a Canadian. I imagine you feel the same about your country. I would hope so I just added some to my post.
> --------------
> ...


This is a Christian's take on the controversy. Not quite so cut and dried as suggested, that there is suppression of Christians. Others see the school's policies as illegally discriminatory, which affects accreditation. Two sides to the story, so before anyone concludes that Canada discriminates against Christians, do your homework.


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## Poor Purl (Apr 14, 2011)

Country Bumpkins said:


> http://www.jewfaq.org/name.htm Please note: This page contains the Name of God. If you print it out, please treat it with appropriate respect.
> 
> <I cut it all out because I found myself unable to pay attention to it.>
> 
> Oops. I am preaching again.


Surprise, surprise. Did you mean this for me because I said that God's name is one (i.e., singular)? If not, I just wasted a lot of time.

Those aren't names of God any more than "Country Bumpkins" is your name. They're ways for people to refer to Him. Except for the tetragrammaton (the 4-letter name), which is the closest anyone has come to the real name; that is actually a form of the verb "to be."

Do you still not believe in "theology," "the systematic and rational study of concepts of God and of the nature of religious truths, or the learned profession acquired by completing specialized training in religious studies, usually at a university, seminary or school of divinity." Isn't that like saying you don't believe in history or logic or biology?

Do you still have nothing to say about ISIS or Ebola or any other news?


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## Country Bumpkins (Feb 18, 2011)

Poor Purl said:


> Surprise, surprise. Did you mean this for me because I said that God's name is one (i.e., singular)? If not, I just wasted a lot of time.
> 
> Those aren't names of God any more than "Country Bumpkins" is your name. They're ways for people to refer to Him. Except for the tetragrammaton (the 4-letter name), which is the closest anyone has come to the real name; that is actually a form of the verb "to be."
> 
> ...


I guess you know more that the Jews .
:roll:


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## Country Bumpkins (Feb 18, 2011)

Country Bumpkins said:


> I guess you know more that the Jews .
> :roll:


God is all the names I posted. He is the 
Great I AM.


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## Poor Purl (Apr 14, 2011)

Country Bumpkins said:


> I guess you know more that the Jews .
> :roll:


"the Jews"? Was your piece written by *the* Jews? or is it by some Jews (probably one Jew). I don't know more, but I know that anyone, even "the Jews," can express things imperfectly. Besides, whatever made you think that something calling itself "jewfaq" is an expert? That's a name, not a description.


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## DGreen (Nov 1, 2012)

joeysomma said:


> The websites to support your view?? Or just opinion, no facts?


There's enough cutting and pasting going on here.

Opinion. No facts. Do your own research and reach your own conclusions. Nothing wrong with that - just don't come back and claim your CONCLUSIONS are fact or "truth." Or saying that Canada suppresses Christians is a FACT when that is merely your conclusion/opinion based on one article you read.

You see, your problem is a failure of critical thinking and the tendency to narrowly cherry-pick information. When you read an article that agrees with you, you cut and paste it (often without any personal commentary, leaving the reader to assume your meaning), as if to say, "See there - this article says I'm right!"

Yes, we all cite articles that agree with our points of view. This is to be expected. HOWEVER, when the source is clearly biased, it deserves to be challenged or ignored. Believe as you wish, but I almost always read what several sources have to say about a given topic before deciding which one, in MY opinion, is most credible. I have definite opinions, but I don't believe everything I read or hear. It appears your mind is made up and you need constant validation from others, or from "experts."

I merely stated there are other versions of the story (which I find more credible) and invited others to do their own homework and draw their own conclusions.


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## Wombatnomore (Dec 9, 2013)

Country Bumpkins said:


> I guess you know more that the Jews .
> :roll:


Why don't you answer the questions put to you?


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## Poor Purl (Apr 14, 2011)

Country Bumpkins said:


> God is all the names I posted. He is the
> Great I AM.


I guess you know more than this Jew?

Three times a day, and more often on some holidays, observant Jews recite the prayer _Aleinu_:

Aleinu le'shabeiach la'adon hakol, 
lateit gedulah leyotzeir bereshit, 
she'lo asanu ke'goyei ha'aratzot, 
ve'lo samanu ke'mishpechot ha'adamah, 
she'lo sam chelkeinu kahem, 
ve'goraleinu ke'chol hamonam. 
Va'anachnu korim, u'mishtachavim, u'modim, 
lifnei melech, malchei ham'lachim, 
hakadosh baruch Hu. 
She'hu noteh shamayim, ve'yoseid aretz, 
u'moshav yikaro bashamayim mi-ma'al, 
u'sh'chinat u-zo be'gavhei me'romim. 
Hu Eloheinu, ein od. Emet malkeinu, efes zulato. 
Kakatuv be'torato, ve'yadata hayom, ve'hashevota Eil le'vavecha. 
Ki Adonai, Hu ha-Elohim, bashamayim mi-ma'al, 
ve'al ha'aretz mi-tachat. Ein od. 
Kakatuv be'toratecha: "Adonai yimloch le'olam va'ed." 
Ve'ne'emar: "Ve'haya Adonai le'melech al kol ha'aretz, 
bayom hahu yihiyeh Adonai echad, u'shemo echad."

The last two lines translate into English as

And it is said "God will be king over all the earth.
On that day <Judgment day> God will be one and his name will be one."

See, it says "one," and it's repeated three times a day.

Now somebody, Wombat maybe, or SQM, please stop me from going on like this. Maybe I should go to Karverr's prayer thread.

Nah.


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## DGreen (Nov 1, 2012)

Wombatnomore said:


> Why don't you answer the questions put to you?


She's still looking for something to cut and paste.


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## west coast kitty (May 26, 2012)

DGreen said:


> This is a Christian's take on the controversy. Not quite so cut and dried as suggested, that there is suppression of Christians. Others see the school's policies as illegally discriminatory, which affects accreditation. Two sides to the story, so before anyone concludes that Canada discriminates against Christians, do your homework.


I would suggest that you could do a little more homework -- The Toronto Sun isn't anything close to a Christian publication and it made reference to previous quotas on Jews in Canadian universities and professions. It's not a new issue - it's a shift.

The accreditation issue is related to Trinity being a Christian values university - not it's curriculum or an inability to pass the bar exams in any province.

Another link also referred to university support for boycotts on Israeli academics. Quebec legislated new restrictions that make even peaceful protest more difficult after students protested tuition fee hikes.

There are a multitude of examples where Canadian freedoms of speech and expression are being limited -- and not just for Christians. Many liberal and socialist groups are object to those cases where their freedoms have been affected.

Canada is a wonderful country, but citizens have an obligation to make sure our freedoms aren't eroded. Remember the poem -

"First they came for the socialists...."


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## Designer1234 (Aug 9, 2011)

west coast kitty said:


> Designer1234 wrote:
> As I said above It is a good country and we don't pick on those who are different - I guess it is best you live in the States Joey, I doubt you would appreciate the things that I love most about my country as our
> Government isn't repressive - so far it has remained that way in most cases. Although it hasn't always been that way with our first Nations peoples. Not perfect but a pretty darned good place to live. I would never be anything but a Canadian. I imagine you feel the same about your country. I would hope so I just added some to my post.
> --------------
> ...


I am not arguing with you about any of that. I never expressed that our Government is perfect. I just said that we don't as yet have the problems to the extent that they do in the States so far. I don't feel that we have a repressive Govt. - I do think that there are Politicians who have mis stepped (two or 3 of our Senators for example. - the previous Premier of Alberta was way out of line . Politicians often abuse their powers. I am not about to have a she said, she said with you -- I spoke as a Canadian who is glad I live here and in comparison to what is happening in the States - in my opinion - I think we are in pretty good shape. I worry that the right and left will take each other on here too. Obviously it is something to worry about as I don't believe my post was in any way anti right wing. I am a liberal who has voted Conservative many times, as I don't have much use for those who represent the liberal party here and even in Federal Politics. I have voted for the person, rather than the party.

I had hoped that you and I would not get into an argument about Canadian Politics,

I posted a long reply and decided to delete most of it. I refuse to get into a discussion about our different opinions. there is enough of that on these threads already.


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## Country Bumpkins (Feb 18, 2011)

Poor Purl said:


> I guess you know more than this Jew?
> 
> Three times a day, and more often on some holidays, observant Jews recite the prayer _Aleinu_:
> 
> ...


You don't believe in God so why do you care what his Names are?
http://www.jewishencyclopedia.com/articles/11305-names-of-god


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## Designer1234 (Aug 9, 2011)

DGreen said:


> This is a Christian's take on the controversy. Not quite so cut and dried as suggested, that there is suppression of Christians. Others see the school's policies as illegally discriminatory, which affects accreditation. Two sides to the story, so before anyone concludes that Canada discriminates against Christians, do your homework.


agreed. I am sorry I posted my post as obviously I have hit a raw nerve. I think there are two sides to the story but will not fight it out here. If you read my post before I edited it - just know that I was struggling to express my feelings -of disappointment and frustration. I remain and will always be a liberal - I am also a Christian. Yes, it is quite possible and there are quite a few of us who don't agree with the far right.


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## Designer1234 (Aug 9, 2011)

CB do you really think any of us are going to read all of that??



Country Bumpkins said:


> You don't believe in God so why do you care what his Names are.
> http://www.jewishencyclopedia.com/articles/11305-names-of-god
> The unedited full-text of the 1906 Jewish Encyclopedia
> search tips & recommendations
> ...


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## Country Bumpkins (Feb 18, 2011)

I wasn't talking to you. I am answering PP. Just ignore.


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## Designer1234 (Aug 9, 2011)

Well,I will be back later, Pat and I are going to play Canasta. I just asked him for a game. It is a good stress reliever.


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## Designer1234 (Aug 9, 2011)

Country Bumpkins said:


> I wasn't talking to you. I am answering PP. Just ignore.


Well CB you posted a long post and I am talking to you. I doubt anyone but you will or has read it. Pretty hard to ignore when it takes up the equivalent of 2 pages. Oh well, never mind.


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## Poor Purl (Apr 14, 2011)

Are you seriously posting something this long just to tell me I'm wrong? Your post is truly obscene, since on this matter you have no understanding of what is being said. 


Country Bumpkins said:


> You don't believe in God so why do you care what his Names are.


Not to mention that this is not the thread to post it on.


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## Designer1234 (Aug 9, 2011)

Poor Purl said:


> Are you seriously posting something this long just to tell me I'm wrong? Your post is truly obscene, since on this matter you have no understanding of what is being said.
> 
> Not to mention that this is not the thread to post it on.


 :thumbup: :thumbup:


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## Country Bumpkins (Feb 18, 2011)

Poor Purl said:


> Are you seriously posting something this long just to tell me I'm wrong? Your post is truly obscene, since on this matter you have no understanding of what is being said.
> 
> Not to mention that this is not the thread to post it on.


Why you posted the same subject? Why is the Names of God obsecene to a Jew?


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## Country Bumpkins (Feb 18, 2011)

Designer1234 said:


> Well CB you posted a long post and I am talking to you. I doubt anyone but you will or has read it. Pretty hard to ignore when it takes up the equivalent of 2 pages. Oh well, never mind.


Don't worry I am not minding you. :shock: I thought you were leaving.


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## Poor Purl (Apr 14, 2011)

Designer1234 said:


> CB do you really think any of us are going to read all of that??


Now that you know how to use emoticons better than I do, I'd like to teach you how to delete parts of an overlong message. Highlight what you want to delete, and hit the delete or backspace key. Poof, it disappears like magic.


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## DGreen (Nov 1, 2012)

Designer1234 said:


> Well CB you posted a long post and I am talking to you. I doubt anyone but you will or has read it. Pretty hard to ignore when it takes up the equivalent of 2 pages. Oh well, never mind.


She seems to think the length of the message somehow adds weight. Sad she has no thoughts of her own. A flippin' encyclopedia article. Amazing. CB definitely needs to get a grip.


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## Poor Purl (Apr 14, 2011)

Country Bumpkins said:


> Why you posted the same subject? Why is the Names of God obsecene to a Jew?


It's not the names that are obscene; it's the fact that you posted such a long message without understanding what it's really about - that's what I find obscene.

But you're right; I should have let you talk to yourself rather than get into it with you. So from now on, the floor's all yours.


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## Poor Purl (Apr 14, 2011)

DGreen said:


> She seems to think the length of the message somehow adds weight. Sad she has no thoughts of her own.


It is sad. Well, it serves me right for answering her, but the rest of you don't deserve this.

Jeez (another one of those names)


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## Country Bumpkins (Feb 18, 2011)

Poor Purl said:


> It's not the names that are obscene; it's the fact that you posted such a long message without understanding what it's really about - that's what I find obscene.
> 
> But you're right; I should have let you talk to yourself rather than get into it with you. So from now on, the floor's all yours.


I find it obscene that you claim to be a Jew but do not know the Names of God. I wanted to make sure you would see all the names instead of posting a link. You are welcome.


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## Country Bumpkins (Feb 18, 2011)

DGreen said:


> She seems to think the length of the message somehow adds weight. Sad she has no thoughts of her own. A flippin' encyclopedia article. Amazing. CB definitely needs to get a grip.


All I have to say is Jesus or God and you flip out. How am I the one that needs a grip?


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## Designer1234 (Aug 9, 2011)

Country Bumpkins said:


> Don't worry I am not minding you. :shock: I thought you were leaving.


Just because you were so nasty to say that, I am staying. You sure have gotten Bitter CB.


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## Designer1234 (Aug 9, 2011)

Knitanon said:


> Since when are there any true Christians at D&P?


Knitanon - nice to see you back I missed talking to you.

Same old same old, here though.


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## Designer1234 (Aug 9, 2011)

changed my mind.


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## SQM (Jun 22, 2012)

Poor Purl said:


> I guess you know more than this Jew?
> 
> Three times a day, and more often on some holidays, observant Jews recite the prayer _Aleinu_:
> 
> ...


I don't argue religion here unless someone is bashing Israel. Nor am I as knowledgeable as you are. But it is fine to stop. Let us decide to call the Jewish god Bobala and forget about the rest.


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## DGreen (Nov 1, 2012)

Country Bumpkins said:


> I find it obscene that you claim to be a Jew but do not know the Names of God. I wanted to make sure you would see all the names instead of posting a link. You are welcome.


A little judgment going on there? Who are you to say what she "should" know?


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## Poor Purl (Apr 14, 2011)

SQM said:


> I don't argue religion here unless someone is bashing Israel. Nor am I as knowledgeable as you are. But it is fine to stop. Let us decide to call the Jewish god Bobala and forget about the rest.


Great idea. Perfect name. I've stopped.


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## DGreen (Nov 1, 2012)

joeysomma said:


> Government to Use IRS to Gag Churches
> 
> Posted on October 17, 2014 by Frank Camp
> 
> ...


_

That dead horse is beginning to stink._


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## Poor Purl (Apr 14, 2011)

DGreen said:


> A little judgment going on there? Who are you to say what she "should" know?


Someone who says she doesn't believe in theology, that's who.


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## Designer1234 (Aug 9, 2011)

Knitter from Nebraska said:


> You forgot to mention that she also speaks to TEA party groups. I think it's absolutely hilarious to hear all the libs praising this ultra conservative, JUST because she's pro Israel! Not one of them would have bothered to listen to her speak on anything else! This is a perfect example of why we shouldn't judge people based on whether they're liberal or conservative, democrat or republican, Christian, Jew or anything else! Everyone deserves to be judged by their OWN words and actions! And everyone should go to you tube and see what else Bridget Gabriel has to say. You might be surprised at how much we have in common!


no matter -- I agreed with much of what she said. I am definitely pro Israel for reasons I have stated on this and other threads over the years.


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## DGreen (Nov 1, 2012)

Poor Purl said:


> Someone who says she doesn't believe in theology, that's who.


Check.


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## Designer1234 (Aug 9, 2011)

Knitter from Nebraska said:


> You forgot to mention that she also speaks to TEA party groups. I think it's absolutely hilarious to hear all the libs praising this ultra conservative, JUST because she's pro Israel! Not one of them would have bothered to listen to her speak on anything else! This is a perfect example of why we shouldn't judge people based on whether they're liberal or conservative, democrat or republican, Christian, Jew or anything else! Everyone deserves to be judged by their OWN words and actions! And everyone should go to you tube and see what else Bridget Gabriel has to say. You might be surprised at how much we have in common!


Why is it so hilarious? We have our own opinions as do you. I don't agree with all that is posted here and certainly they don't all agree with me. What is hilarious about that? I do agree that we should not 'label; people and I admit I have been guilty of that. It is just that the same words seem to come out of everyone's mouth. We don't pretend to all agree on different subjects. Hilarious - why??? I though her speech was excellent - why is that hilarious? I also would be interested in seeing what else she says. I might not agree with all of it, or possibly none of it. This speech was in agreement with my opinion. Just because the Right feels that only they can agree about certain things doesn't mean it is necessarily true.


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## Designer1234 (Aug 9, 2011)

Designer1234 said:


> agreed. I am sorry I posted my post as obviously I have hit a raw nerve. I think there are two sides to the story but will not fight it out here. If you read my post before I edited it - just know that I was struggling to express my feelings -of disappointment and frustration. I remain and will always be a liberal - I am also a Christian. Yes, it is quite possible and there are quite a few of us who don't agree with the far right.


It is also a fact that I don't agree with all Liberals either-- but I consider myself liberal thinking. And do agree with most lof those on this thread.


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## Designer1234 (Aug 9, 2011)

Designer1234 said:


> agreed. I am sorry I posted my post as obviously I have hit a raw nerve. I think there are two sides to the story but will not fight it out here. If you read my post before I edited it - just know that I was struggling to express my feelings -of disappointment and frustration. I remain and will always be a liberal - I am also a Christian. Yes, it is quite possible and there are quite a few of us who don't agree with the far right.


It is also a fact that I don't agree with all Liberals either-- but I consider myself liberal thinking. I will clarify-- I agree with much more of what is believed on the left than I agree with the far right. I agree with very little that is said by those on the right who Preach all the time.


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## Designer1234 (Aug 9, 2011)

changed my mind -- enough for tonight.


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## Designer1234 (Aug 9, 2011)

DGreen said:


> There's enough cutting and pasting going on here.
> 
> Opinion. No facts. Do your own research and reach your own conclusions. Nothing wrong with that - just don't come back and claim your CONCLUSIONS are fact or "truth." Or saying that Canada suppresses Christians is a FACT when that is merely your conclusion/opinion based on one article you read.
> 
> ...


 :thumbup: :thumbup:


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## damemary (Mar 14, 2012)

I agree. Same sex marriage is a diversion to keep people from working on the true issues that exist now.



DGreen said:


> I hope it stays that way, too. The divisions here in the US are deeply troubling. It is not same sex marriage that will destroy our country, it is he intractable polarization we have found ourselves mired in that is the real threat.


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## Designer1234 (Aug 9, 2011)

Poor Purl said:


> I guess you know more than this Jew?
> 
> Three times a day, and more often on some holidays, observant Jews recite the prayer _Aleinu_:
> 
> ...


you are doing fine. Don't apologize you make more sense than most of us do. I agree Purl, you make more sense than a lot of us. You are so knowledgeable about thinks I am not familiar with. I have learned a lot from you and I like your quick answers and that you don't suffer fools gladly.


----------



## damemary (Mar 14, 2012)

Designer1234 said:


> Canada is a decent country and we don't pick on those who are different - I guess it is best you live in the States Joey, I doubt you would appreciate the things that I love most about my country.


 :thumbup: :thumbup: :thumbup: Oh Canada.


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## Designer1234 (Aug 9, 2011)

joeysomma said:


> Since you live in Arizona and not in Canada, And you say it is only opinion. You really have no idea of what is happening in Canada. When was the last time you were there? What other connection do you have except maybe visiting?
> And while you are expressing your opinion, please tell us about the mussels they are finding under the ice in Greenland.


are you an expert on Canada JOey? or are you a closet Canadian. If so why? Or do you feel you know more than the rest of us about Canada. Interested to hear your answer.


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## damemary (Mar 14, 2012)

Creativity and ingenuity at its best!!!



Poor Purl said:


> What a great story!


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## damemary (Mar 14, 2012)

Too bad you sent it. Wasting time again.



Gerslay said:


> That is so totally wrong, so abhorrent a thing to say, that it doesn't even deserve this reply.


----------



## damemary (Mar 14, 2012)

DGreen said:


> "That is so totally wrong, so abhorrent a thing to say, that it doesn't even deserve this reply."
> 
> The way to say "no comment" is, "no comment."


 :XD: :XD: :XD:


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## damemary (Mar 14, 2012)

Bravo! Well put.



MaidInBedlam said:


> And God will pat her on the back and congratulate her for not suffering fools gladly. :twisted:


 :XD: :XD: :XD:


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## damemary (Mar 14, 2012)

MaidInBedlam said:


> Satan has been characterized as God's oldest son, but I don't expect you're widely read enough in theology or satire to have encountered that idea.


 :XD: :XD: :XD:


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## Poor Purl (Apr 14, 2011)

Designer1234 said:


> you are doing fine. Don't apologize you make more sense than most of us do. I agree Purl, you make more sense than a lot of us. You are so knowledgeable about thinks I am not familiar with. I have learned a lot from you and I like your quick answers and that you don't suffer fools gladly.


Thank you, Designer.


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## Designer1234 (Aug 9, 2011)

Gerslay said:


> D&P is a group of women who have one basic thing in common and that is that we choose to not have drama on our thread. We are all very different; some of us are Christian, some are Jewish, and some never say what they are...some are conservative politically and socially, and some are one but not the other...some of us love to cook while others hate it. We're actually a very diverse group with a big age span, we live all over the country, and we speak with different accents. We welcome and enjoy our differences.
> 
> That you think us a "closed camp" speaks to the prejudice I was referring to with Wombat.


YOu might have described us. I think you are right, I guess you aren't as closed as I have thought. It just seems that only one message comes from all of you. I have never seen a discussion between you , you have seen lots of discussions between us. If you are correct, why do you all say the same thing although I admit there are some who never come here -Iwonder why it is only 3 or 4 or 5 of you come here to disagree with us. We have been asked not to go there, I don't, and I don't think the rest of us do. I do believe that you treat each other well, but I wonder at some of the things that are posted here, superiority, arrogance by some,treating us like children by one,-- accusations of lies, constant preaching, talking down to us. I am not saying that about you but it would be nice to have a discussion rather than be treated asif we are idiots, liars and fools. We are not. We are liberal thinking and that is what you all either fear or hate or at least that is what comes across to me. It would be so much better if we could try to meet middle ground but I don't think you think that middle ground will do. Interesting. I know that your nastiness is often reciprocated -it is a mess in many ways and it is a shame in others. I wonder where the attack will come from on this post. I am expressing how I feel and will likely be called a liar again. Anyway, I am glad you have the kind of thread you want. I don't think any of us want to go and invade it. I think that somehow, for the sake of your country someone is going to have to give a bit, on both sides. I once again say that I hope the same division does not cause the same problems at home.


----------



## damemary (Mar 14, 2012)

Solo, I must pipe in to say that I know Shirley and she is a decent person who doesn't lie. I will give you the benefit of the doubt. Perhaps you have confused her. If you did it on purpose, then I must call you a liar. I find nothing likable about you or your friends. Wouldn't it be best to stay away from each other? No one is likely to change their mind at this point.



soloweygirl said:


> Dislike you? No, more to the point would be finding something to like about you.
> 
> The rest of your post is your usual BS. It's always someone else insulting you and you never insult anyone. You always play the innocent one - spare me the victim mentality.(This is where PP will pipe in on cue.)
> 
> ...


----------



## damemary (Mar 14, 2012)

And you'll believe any yarn that comes along. Seems arrogant to me.



Gerslay said:


> We've been this way before Purl. When the Jews' Messiah comes and they accept Him will it matter what His name is, or was, or if He'd been here before?
> 
> I think not, and that is what Christians believe.


----------



## damemary (Mar 14, 2012)

Bazinga!



Knitanon said:


> Since when are there any true Christians at D&P?


 :XD: :XD: :XD:


----------



## damemary (Mar 14, 2012)

joeysomma said:


> There is nothing false in the Bible!


 :XD: :XD: :XD:


----------



## damemary (Mar 14, 2012)

Poor Purl said:


> You mean by pointing out how you cried that I abused you when I was just paying back an insult from you? Okay, done.


 :XD: :XD: :XD:


----------



## damemary (Mar 14, 2012)

Poor Purl said:


> That might explain why none of us commented on her before. I'd never heard of her, but I appreciate the introduction. (I only read what's on D&P when I need a new cream-cheese recipe.)


 :XD: :XD: :XD:


----------



## damemary (Mar 14, 2012)

It's happened to me too. Feisty little devils. I love them too.



Poor Purl said:


> Thank you - I really appreciate it. Those pea-sized brains never fail to impress me. I was once scolded for having moved the feeder a foot to the left. I swear, a ruby-throated little guy flew over, then flew to the original spot, babbling at me, then back to the feeder. He was obviously showing me where it belonged.


----------



## damemary (Mar 14, 2012)

Gerslay said:


> Out of the grave comes ... TADA ... Janet!
> 
> Still stylin like a dingleberry I see!


I guess you'd be the one who imagines she knows. Go play.


----------



## damemary (Mar 14, 2012)

Think hard. Call a meeting. Maybe you can figure it out.



joeysomma said:


> I guess you didn't read: "Another example of this usage is the concepts of chillul Ha-Shem and kiddush Ha-Shem. An act that causes God or Judaism to come into disrespect or a commandment to be disobeyed is often referred to as "chillul Ha-Shem," *profanation* of The Name. Clearly, we are not talking about a harm done to a word; we are talking about harm to a reputation."
> But then why are you commenting when you don't * think* there is one?


----------



## damemary (Mar 14, 2012)

I think the comments have more to do with the people who hijack the bible and quote it out of context. Their concept of god has no purpose in the discussion.



DGreen said:


> Oh Joey, I have plenty of comments about your god. None of them nice.


----------



## damemary (Mar 14, 2012)

Country Bumpkins said:


> I guess you know more that the Jews .
> :roll:


 :?: :?: :?: :?: :?: :?: :?: :?:


----------



## damemary (Mar 14, 2012)

And I AM the Wizard of OZ.



Country Bumpkins said:


> God is all the names I posted. He is the
> Great I AM.


----------



## damemary (Mar 14, 2012)

Applause. Applause.



DGreen said:


> There's enough cutting and pasting going on here.
> 
> Opinion. No facts. Do your own research and reach your own conclusions. Nothing wrong with that - just don't come back and claim your CONCLUSIONS are fact or "truth." Or saying that Canada suppresses Christians is a FACT when that is merely your conclusion/opinion based on one article you read.
> 
> ...


 :thumbup: :thumbup: :thumbup: :thumbup: :thumbup:


----------



## damemary (Mar 14, 2012)

I'd be happy with a clear comment without typos.



Wombatnomore said:


> Why don't you answer the questions put to you?


----------



## damemary (Mar 14, 2012)

Poor Purl is a Jew. Look it up.



Country Bumpkins said:


> You don't believe in God so why do you care what his Names are?
> http://www.jewishencyclopedia.com/articles/11305-names-of-god


----------



## damemary (Mar 14, 2012)

Poor Purl said:


> It is sad. Well, it serves me right for answering her, but the rest of you don't deserve this.
> 
> Jeez (another one of those names)


 :XD: :XD: :XD:


----------



## damemary (Mar 14, 2012)

joeysomma said:


> FYI: this was addressed to DGreen who was stating her opinions about Canada with out any proof of what she was saying.
> 
> BTW: We have had a second home in Canada since 1998.


>>>>Aren't you special?


----------



## Poor Purl (Apr 14, 2011)

damemary said:


> And I AM the Wizard of OZ.


----------



## Poor Purl (Apr 14, 2011)

damemary said:


> Poor Purl is a Jew. Look it up.


She doesn't understand what that means, and how it's very different from being a Christian.


----------



## Designer1234 (Aug 9, 2011)

joeysomma said:


> FYI: this was addressed to DGreen who was stating her opinions about Canada with out any proof of what she was saying.
> 
> BTW: We have had a second home in Canada since 1998.


Good for you -- however, I am a Canadian and I agree with Green about her impression of what is happening so we are at a standoff there too. I don't believe there is a hidden agenda against Christians in Canada. I do believe that Human rights are important to a lot of Canadians however. I don't believe it is an agenda against the Christian Church, I believe it is the belief that people should be treated equally If what WCK says is true I don't like what is being done. I am not up to date with our news or any news for that matter. However there has been some legislation to protect Gay rights which I agree with. So I know that will not be to your liking.


----------



## Wombatnomore (Dec 9, 2013)

Poor Purl said:


> I guess you know more than this Jew?
> 
> Three times a day, and more often on some holidays, observant Jews recite the prayer _Aleinu_:
> 
> ...


Stop if you must but I have to say, I quite like this side of you.


----------



## Poor Purl (Apr 14, 2011)

Wombatnomore said:


> Stop if you must but I have to say, I quite like this side of you.


That's not what Phil used to tell me. :roll: :roll: :roll:


----------



## Wombatnomore (Dec 9, 2013)

Poor Purl said:


> Are you seriously posting something this long just to tell me I'm wrong? Your post is truly obscene, since on this matter you have no understanding of what is being said.
> 
> Not to mention that this is not the thread to post it on.


She's quite nuts. Stop now. You don't need to defend yourself against this - and let's call it what it is - abuse.


----------



## Country Bumpkins (Feb 18, 2011)

Poor Purl said:


> That's not what Phil used to tell me. :roll: :roll: :roll:


 :thumbup: :lol: :lol: :lol: :lol:


----------



## Designer1234 (Aug 9, 2011)

damemary said:


> Poor Purl is a Jew. Look it up.


I wondered if she realized that. Likely not. not that it makes any difference really. Purl has been very gracious to all of them. so has SQM.


----------



## Wombatnomore (Dec 9, 2013)

damemary said:


> I'd be happy with a clear comment without typos.


 :XD: :XD:


----------



## Designer1234 (Aug 9, 2011)

damemary said:


> :XD: :XD: :XD:


never feel you need to apologise to us. Someone said something to me that I will repeat to you as it meant a lot and that is - you are a treasure Purl. Don't even think about changing your posts or yourself. you are valued here certainly by me.


----------



## Wombatnomore (Dec 9, 2013)

Poor Purl said:


> That's not what Phil used to tell me. :roll: :roll: :roll:


Yes, well Phil was a construct and I'm not and I'm here right now.


----------



## west coast kitty (May 26, 2012)

Designer1234 said:


> I am not arguing with you about any of that. I never expressed that our Government is perfect. I just said that we don't as yet have the problems to the extent that they do in the States so far. I don't feel that we have a repressive Govt. - I do think that there are Politicians who have mis stepped (two or 3 of our Senators for example. - the previous Premier of Alberta was way out of line . Politicians often abuse their powers. I am not about to have a she said, she said with you -- I spoke as a Canadian who is glad I live here and in comparison to what is happening in the States - in my opinion - I think we are in pretty good shape. I worry that the right and left will take each other on here too. Obviously it is something to worry about as I don't believe my post was in any way anti right wing. I am a liberal who has voted Conservative many times, as I don't have much use for those who represent the liberal party here and even in Federal Politics. I have voted for the person, rather than the party.
> 
> I had hoped that you and I would not get into an argument about Canadian Politics,
> 
> I posted a long reply and decided to delete most of it. I refuse to get into a discussion about our different opinions. there is enough of that on these threads already.


I saw your original post just before I left for dinner. I'm wondering why you felt the need to classify my post as an argument? You have often said that you believe people can have different opinions and have a discussion without it turning nasty. Why is it an argument if I post, but not when someone you agree with posts?

There was nothing nasty in my post - it expressed my concern that Canadian universities, public bodies and government were limiting some of our freedoms. It's a concern that has been expressed by many Canadians that cross ALL political, social and economic boundaries. The difference is in the topic or issue that different groups are concerned about.

It's very easy for groups with power to impose rules, but that doesn't mean all of them are good rules. It's up to all of us to make sure that our officials don't put unreasonable limits on our freedoms. Canadian Liberals and NDP have put forward their concerns, why can't Conservatives?


----------



## Designer1234 (Aug 9, 2011)

Designer1234 said:


> you are doing fine. Don't apologize you make more sense than most of us do. I agree Purl, you make more sense than a lot of us. You are so knowledgeable about thinks I am not familiar with. I have learned a lot from you and I like your quick answers and that you don't suffer fools gladly.


 the word thinks and other of my spelling errors are my spell check I type too fast I guess. Sorry, missed that one.


----------



## Wombatnomore (Dec 9, 2013)

Country Bumpkins said:


> :thumbup: :lol: :lol: :lol: :lol:


Cheap shot Bump. What about answering the many questions you're asked and show us some of that superior intellect of yours.


----------



## DGreen (Nov 1, 2012)

joeysomma said:


> FYI: this was addressed to DGreen who was stating her opinions about Canada with out any proof of what she was saying.
> 
> BTW: We have had a second home in Canada since 1998.


My opinions do not require proof, Joey. That's why they are called opinions and not facts.

You are free to disagree and state why. Grow up.


----------



## Poor Purl (Apr 14, 2011)

Wombatnomore said:


> She's quite nuts. Stop now. You don't need to defend yourself against this - and let's call it what it is - abuse.


Nuts, yes; abuse, probably not. I think the fact that I regard myself as an observant Jew (most of the time) without believing in a deity is so at odds with CB's way of being a Christian that it must give rise to serious cognitive dissonance.

The abused object is the thread itself, which has had good discussions and arguments about real, practical, earthly events and isn't the place for name-calling (at God, you know).


----------



## Designer1234 (Aug 9, 2011)

west coast kitty said:


> I saw your original post just before I left for dinner. I'm wondering why you felt the need to classify my post as an argument? You have often said that you believe people can have different opinions and have a discussion without it turning nasty. Why is it an argument if I post, but not when someone you agree with posts?
> 
> There was nothing nasty in my post - it expressed my concern that Canadian universities, public bodies and government were limiting some of our freedoms. It's a concern that has been expressed by many Canadians that cross ALL political, social and economic boundaries. The difference is in the topic or issue that different groups are concerned about.
> 
> It's very easy for groups with power to impose rules, but that doesn't mean all of them are good rules. It's up to all of us to make sure that our officials don't put unreasonable limits on our freedoms. Canadian Liberals and NDP have put forward their concerns, why can't Conservatives?


I guess I took you wrong. I apologize. We do that to each other on these threads. I have voted Conservative for the last four Provincial Alberta elections and the Federal election as I have said in my previous post. However, I have strong feelings about individual rights and I really don't feel that Christians are being badly treated here- as I stated in my reply. I have been away from the news for over a month and as far as the University situation I am not familiar with that. If it is true I don't agree with it. My family members go to the University of Toronto not the western Branch . I will follow up on that. I certainly 
feel that there might be two sides to that story but I will have to check my facts before I continue with the conversation. I do hope that we can have a discussion - it would be a nice change. However, I sort of hate inserting Canadian Politics into this thread (which I realise I caused) as there is so much going on and so much disagreement I hate for it to be added to with our politics.

Anyway onward and upward.

I am getting tired and have had enough for today. Talk to you all later.


----------



## Poor Purl (Apr 14, 2011)

Wombatnomore said:


> Yes, well Phil was a construct and I'm not and I'm here right now.


I beg your pardon! Phil was a real live person with kids and a beard and apparently other things that he liked to display. He may not have been on KP, but he was not a construct.

He was more like a destruct, if there is such a word.


----------



## Poor Purl (Apr 14, 2011)

Wombatnomore said:


> Cheap shot Bump. What about answering the many questions you're asked and show us some of that superior intellect of yours.


 :thumbup: :lol: :lol: :lol: :lol:


----------



## Wombatnomore (Dec 9, 2013)

Poor Purl said:


> Nuts, yes; abuse, probably not. I think the fact that I regard myself as an observant Jew (most of the time) without believing in a deity is so at odds with CB's way of being a Christian that it must give rise to serious cognitive dissonance.
> 
> The abused object is the thread itself, which has had good discussions and arguments about real, practical, earthly events and isn't the place for name-calling (at God, you know).


And a good dose if cognitive bias. It's the absolute rejection of any opinion other than her own and that of her crony which is so annoying. Sure, they can be that way but not here.


----------



## Wombatnomore (Dec 9, 2013)

Poor Purl said:


> I beg your pardon! Phil was a real live person with kids and a beard and apparently other things that he liked to display. He may not have been on KP, but he was not a construct.
> 
> He was more like a destruct, if there is such a word.


Destruct. Indeed he is/was.


----------



## damemary (Mar 14, 2012)

Designer1234 said:


> never feel you need to apologise to us. Someone said something to me that I will repeat to you as it meant a lot and that is - you are a treasure Purl. Don't even think about changing your posts or yourself. you are valued here certainly by me.


Me too.


----------



## Poor Purl (Apr 14, 2011)

Wombatnomore said:


> And a good dose if cognitive bias. It's the absolute rejection of any opinion other than her own and that of her crony which is so annoying. Sure, they can be that way but not here.


Unfortunately, there's no stopping them, so we have to suffer fools, but not gladly.


----------



## Gerslay (Oct 4, 2011)

Poor Purl said:


> Nuts, yes; abuse, probably not. I think the fact that I regard myself as an observant Jew (most of the time) without believing in a deity is so at odds with CB's way of being a Christian that it must give rise to serious cognitive dissonance.
> 
> The abused object is the thread itself, which has had good discussions and arguments about real, practical, earthly events and isn't the place for name-calling (at God, you know).


Purl, would you call yourself a Jewish atheist...and isn't that a contradiction?


----------



## susanmos2000 (May 10, 2011)

Designer1234 said:


> I guess I took you wrong. I apologize. We do that to each other on these threads. I have voted Conservative for the last four Provincial Alberta elections and the Federal election as I have said in my previous post. However, I have strong feelings about individual rights and I really don't feel that Christians are being badly treated here- as I stated in my reply. I have been away from the news for over a month and as far as the University situation I am not familiar with that. If it is true I don't agree with it. My family members go to the University of Toronto not the western Branch . I will follow up on that. I certainly
> feel that there might be two sides to that story but I will have to check my facts before I continue with the conversation. I do hope that we can have a discussion - it would be a nice change. However, I sort of hate inserting Canadian Politics into this thread (which I realise I caused) as there is so much going on and so much disagreement I hate for it to be added to with our politics.


But why? I'm personally fascinated by Trinity Law School and the issue of whether its graduates should or should not be allowed to practice law. I checked and we do have at least one "Christian" law school in the US (Liberty University School of Law)--I can't imagine the ensuing ruckus here if its graduates were similarly barred. And as hateful as I find bigotry, I'm not even sure I'd be in favor of such a ban. People do have the right to hold their personal beliefs in regards to race and gender orientation no matter how loathsome.


----------



## DGreen (Nov 1, 2012)

Gerslay said:


> Purl, would you call yourself a Jewish atheist...and isn't that a contradiction?


Whether it is a contradiction or not is immaterial, so why ask? Purl has every right to follow Jewish customs and traditions, to believe or not believe, according to her conscience and understanding. Doesn't have to make sense to anyone but Purl.


----------



## Designer1234 (Aug 9, 2011)

DGreen said:


> Whether it is a contradiction or not is immaterial, so why ask? Purl has every right to follow Jewish customs and traditions, to believe or not believe, according to her conscience and understanding. Doesn't have to make sense to anyone but Purl.


 :thumbup: :thumbup: It is called Freedom of choice.


----------



## DGreen (Nov 1, 2012)

susanmos2000 said:


> But why? I'm personally fascinated by Trinity Law School and the issue of whether its graduates should or should not be allowed to practice law. I checked and we do have at least one "Christian" law school in the US (Liberty University School of Law)--I can't imagine the ensuing ruckus here if its graduates were similarly barred. And as hateful as I find bigotry, I'm not even sure I'd be in favor of such a ban. People do have the right to hold their personal beliefs in regards to race and gender orientation no matter how loathsome.


After reading a little more about the ruckus, I'm inclined to agree with you. I find their demand that all agree to their nonsensical code of conduct ridiculous and laughable, but that is a separate issue. Is the education sound and does it meet accreditation standards? If it does, denying graduates licensure would be wrong.


----------



## Designer1234 (Aug 9, 2011)

susanmos2000 said:


> But why? I'm personally fascinated by Trinity Law School and the issue of whether its graduates should or should not be allowed to practice law. I checked and we do have at least one "Christian" law school in the US (Liberty University School of Law)--I can't imagine the ensuing ruckus here if its graduates were similarly barred. And as hateful as I find bigotry, I'm not even sure I'd be in favor of such a ban. People do have the right to hold their personal beliefs in regards to race and gender orientation no matter how loathsome.


I agree - well put.


----------



## susanmos2000 (May 10, 2011)

DGreen said:


> After reading a little more about the ruckus, I'm inclined to agree with you. I find their demand that all agree to their nonsensical code of conduct ridiculous and laughable, but that is a separate issue. Is the education sound and does it meet accreditation standards? If it does, denying graduates licensure would be wrong.


I totally agree, Green. If the legal curriculum offered by the school is flawed then accreditation should be yanked, and any graduates failing to uphold professional standards should be disbarred. But I'm not in favor of a blanket ban on these folks.


----------



## DGreen (Nov 1, 2012)

susanmos2000 said:


> I totally agree, Green. If the legal curriculum offered by the school is flawed then accreditation should be yanked, and any graduates failing to uphold professional standards should be disbarred. But I'm not in favor of a blanket ban on these folks.


We are definitely on the same page. My grandson attended what is probably the best all-men's college prep school in the southwest and my granddaughter is currently attending one of the best all-women's prep schools in the southwest. Both are Catholic schools. Both teach religion as part of the curriculum and foster public service as a core value. The academic standards are very high and they don't mix science or history or math or anything else with religion - there is clear separation. Not all religious schools maintain such integrity and therein lies the question of accreditation. If a person wants to attend a school that teaches creationism and a skewed version of history, it is up to the rest of the world to recognize the kind of diploma that represents and act accordingly. Even though I'm atheist, I wholeheartedly support my daughter's decision to send her children to those schools. My grandkids are getting a first-rate education which has opened doors to schools like Marquette, Columbia, Notre Dame and other top-tier schools. Accreditation and academic standards are the only rational criteria on which a diploma should be judged.


----------



## galinipper (Apr 30, 2013)

Designer1234 said:


> I guess I took you wrong. I apologize. We do that to each other on these threads. I have voted Conservative for the last four Provincial Alberta elections and the Federal election as I have said in my previous post. However, I have strong feelings about individual rights and I really don't feel that Christians are being badly treated here- as I stated in my reply. I have been away from the news for over a month and as far as the University situation I am not familiar with that. If it is true I don't agree with it. My family members go to the University of Toronto not the western Branch . I will follow up on that. I certainly
> feel that there might be two sides to that story but I will have to check my facts before I continue with the conversation. I do hope that we can have a discussion - it would be a nice change. However, I sort of hate inserting Canadian Politics into this thread (which I realise I caused) as there is so much going on and so much disagreement I hate for it to be added to with our politics.
> 
> Anyway onward and upward.
> ...


I have read about FinTRAC following the money flow from Canada to ISIS, they, FinTRAC, claim a 450% increase from 2008....... I have read that Calgary is a jihadi base for recruiting young Canadian men like Salman Ashrafi, the suicide bomber that killed 46 in Iraq....Does the Canadian media tell the whole story, are they in the pocket of politicians, do the stories leak out a little bit at a time?


----------



## Poor Purl (Apr 14, 2011)

Gerslay said:


> Purl, would you call yourself a Jewish atheist...and isn't that a contradiction?


I call myself a Jew, which I am. Jewishness is a matter of inheritance - anyone with a Jewish mother is Jewish. There are some practices that are expected to go along with that, like circumcision in boys, but the Jewishness is there. Other than by birth, there is conversion, a process about which I know very little, except that it takes a long time and a lot of study. It is also possible to drop out of the Jewish community by accepting a different religion and its beliefs, like the so-called Jews for Jesus or Messianic Jews.

I've even heard an Orthodox rabbi admit that belief in God is not necessary to be a "good Jew." I don't call myself an atheist because I see no reason to give a name to an absence of something, just as I don't call myself a non-blonde because my hair is - was - dark.


----------



## Poor Purl (Apr 14, 2011)

DGreen said:


> Whether it is a contradiction or not is immaterial, so why ask? Purl has every right to follow Jewish customs and traditions, to believe or not believe, according to her conscience and understanding. Doesn't have to make sense to anyone but Purl.


Thank you - I wish I'd read your message before writing mine. Owing to my pedanticness, I don't tell people to mind their own business even when it's warranted, but maybe I should have, and maybe I'll edit it out.

Come to think of that, why should my "contradiction" bother Gerslay more than those of her fellow Christians on D&P, who are often very un-Christian in their speech and behavior?


----------



## Poor Purl (Apr 14, 2011)

Designer1234 said:


> I agree - well put.


I love your thread painting. Thank you for the beautiful little hummer (which in slang is not something you'd want me to be thanking you for).


----------



## DGreen (Nov 1, 2012)

Poor Purl said:


> Thank you - I wish I'd read your message before writing mine. Owing to my pedanticness, I don't tell people to mind their own business even when it's warranted, but maybe I should have, and maybe I'll edit it out.
> 
> Come to think of that, why should my "contradiction" should bother Gerslay more than those of her fellow Christians on D&P, who are often very un-Christian in their speech and behavior?


I liked your answer - and this one.


----------



## Poor Purl (Apr 14, 2011)

DGreen said:


> I liked your answer - and this one.


I finally realized what your avatar is a picture of: a very graceful hovering hummingbird. It's a wonderful photograph (if that's what it is - it's so well composed that it could be a painting). I think I'll have to drop Hedy and get myself a hummer.


----------



## Gerslay (Oct 4, 2011)

DGreen said:


> Whether it is a contradiction or not is immaterial, so why ask? Purl has every right to follow Jewish customs and traditions, to believe or not believe, according to her conscience and understanding. Doesn't have to make sense to anyone but Purl.


I was curious and was not challenging Purl.

Why does that bother you?


----------



## Gerslay (Oct 4, 2011)

Poor Purl said:


> Thank you - I wish I'd read your message before writing mine. Owing to my pedanticness, I don't tell people to mind their own business even when it's warranted, but maybe I should have, and maybe I'll edit it out.
> 
> Come to think of that, why should my "contradiction" bother Gerslay more than those of her fellow Christians on D&P, who are often very un-Christian in their speech and behavior?


The contradiction didn't bother me...I was just curious. Thanks for answering me in the first place, though I wish you hadn't regretted it in the second place.

Peer pressure?


----------



## DGreen (Nov 1, 2012)

Poor Purl said:


> I finally realized what your avatar is a picture of: a very graceful hovering hummingbird. It's a wonderful photograph (if that's what it is - it's so well composed that it could be a painting). I think I'll have to drop Hedy and get myself a hummer.


Thank you. I took that photo this summer and I love it. My shutter speed had to be something like 1/2400 second to stop the wings. It is cropped - thank you Lightroom! We have three feeders and as many as 10 hummers that visit, fight, chirp and perform aerobatic feats right outside my dining room window. Alas, they have all flown away with fall.

Did you know that hummingbirds cannot walk? They must fly, since their legs do not have the muscles necessary to walk.


----------



## damemary (Mar 14, 2012)

IMHO you can call yourself anything you choose. It's when others try to label you that people get into trouble. MYOB.



Gerslay said:


> Purl, would you call yourself a Jewish atheist...and isn't that a contradiction?


----------



## DGreen (Nov 1, 2012)

Gerslay said:


> I was curious and was not challenging Purl.
> 
> Why does that bother you?


Perhaps it is your general, overall tone on this thread, which I consistently find to be somewhat negative.


----------



## damemary (Mar 14, 2012)

It was rude as you expressed it. IMHO



Gerslay said:


> I was curious and was not challenging Purl.
> 
> Why does that bother you?


----------



## damemary (Mar 14, 2012)

Gerslay said:


> The contradiction didn't bother me...I was just curious. Thanks for answering me in the first place, though I wish you hadn't regretted it in the second place.
> 
> Peer pressure?


Perhaps an open mind and honest alternatives......


----------



## Wombatnomore (Dec 9, 2013)

Back to the business of bearing bad news although this piece is a pretty good summary of how the Ebola issue is being dealt with by the citizens of the U.S.A:

http://www.nytimes.com/2014/10/20/us/fear-of-ebola-closes-schools-and-shapes-politics.html?ref=todayspaper&_r=0


----------



## Wombatnomore (Dec 9, 2013)

Ungodly hour due to continuing mouth pain.


----------



## Gerslay (Oct 4, 2011)

PP, Green, and Dame:

I asked a genuine sincere non-confrontational question and I'm the one who is negative and rude?

You folks need to calm down and not see everything in such a negative light yourselves!


----------



## Wombatnomore (Dec 9, 2013)

Turkey acts at last:

http://www.nytimes.com/2014/10/21/world/middleeast/kobani-turkey-kurdish-fighters-syria.html?hp&action=click&pgtype=Homepage&version=LedeSum&module=first-column-region&region=top-news&WT.nav=top-news


----------



## Gerslay (Oct 4, 2011)

Wombatnomore said:


> Ungodly hour due to continuing mouth pain.


Are you still dealing with that dry socket, Womby?

I've heard it can be the most intense pain. I hope it resolves quickly!


----------



## Wombatnomore (Dec 9, 2013)

Gerslay said:


> Are you still dealing with that dry socket, Womby?
> 
> I've heard it can be the most intense pain. I hope it resolves quickly!


Thank you G. Plus 2 ulcers - one on tongue, one on roof of mouth. Tea Tree oil was suggested but it's not really doing much. Icy water gargles help.


----------



## Poor Purl (Apr 14, 2011)

Gerslay said:


> The contradiction didn't bother me...I was just curious. Thanks for answering me in the first place, though I wish you hadn't regretted it in the second place.
> 
> Peer pressure?


Not from peers. Whenever I put too much personal info into a post, it gets saved to be used against me in future.


----------



## Wombatnomore (Dec 9, 2013)

Poor Purl said:


> Not from peers. Whenever I put too much personal info into a post, it gets saved to be used against me in future.


That's a beautiful avatar. So is Green's.


----------



## Poor Purl (Apr 14, 2011)

Wombatnomore said:


> Ungodly hour due to continuing mouth pain.


Sorry. Is it a tooth, or just allover pain? If it's a tooth, oil of clove or even just chewing an aspirin can dull the pain until you can get to a dentist. I don't know what to do about allover mouth pain except get drunk.


----------



## DGreen (Nov 1, 2012)

Wombatnomore said:


> That's a beautiful avatar. So is Green's.


I've never seen an albino hummingbird if that's what it is. Remarkable!


----------



## Gerslay (Oct 4, 2011)

Wombatnomore said:


> Thank you G. Plus 2 ulcers - one on tongue, one on roof of mouth. Tea Tree oil was suggested but it's not really doing much. Icy water gargles help.


I hate the smell of TT oil...can't use it for that reason and never found it to be all that effective when I did try it.


----------



## Poor Purl (Apr 14, 2011)

Gerslay said:


> PP, Green, and Dame:
> 
> I asked a genuine sincere non-confrontational question and I'm the one who is negative and rude?
> 
> You folks need to calm down and not see everything in such a negative light yourselves!


Did I call you rude or negative? Maybe it's time you learned to distinguish between people.

However, your "non-confrontational" questions sometimes feel like challenges, as when you found it hard to believe that at no time would Judaism accept a trinitarian deity. And it's surely challenging to imply that someone's view of herself is contradictory.


----------



## Poor Purl (Apr 14, 2011)

Wombatnomore said:


> Thank you G. Plus 2 ulcers - one on tongue, one on roof of mouth. Tea Tree oil was suggested but it's not really doing much. Icy water gargles help.


Getting drunk should help, too. You can gargle with it (whatever it is) if you like, but don't spit it out.


----------



## Llavaia (Oct 14, 2013)

Just read this whole post from beginning....nice ladies!


----------



## Poor Purl (Apr 14, 2011)

Wombatnomore said:


> That's a beautiful avatar. So is Green's.


Green's is a perfect photograph that she took. Mine is taken from Google images. It's a good picture of an albino ruby-throat but nowhere near as good as Green's.


----------



## Gerslay (Oct 4, 2011)

Poor Purl said:


> Did I call you rude or negative? Maybe it's time you learned to distinguish between people.
> 
> However, your "non-confrontational" questions sometimes feel like challenges, as when you found it hard to believe that at no time would Judaism accept a trinitarian deity. And it's surely challenging to imply that someone's view of herself is contradictory.


Not directly, PP, but you did agree with Green who did.

I'm sorry if you think I was challenging you. I wasn't. I won't bother you with anymore questions.

And I didn't find it hard to believe that Judaism would not accept a trinitarian deity. That again was raised for discussion purposes only.


----------



## Poor Purl (Apr 14, 2011)

DGreen said:


> I've never seen an albino hummingbird if that's what it is. Remarkable!


Apparently they're very rare, but they sure are pretty. There are a few other pictures at http://dailypicksandflicks.com/2011/09/28/rare-albino-hummingbird-in-virginia-picture-gallery/


----------



## damemary (Mar 14, 2012)

Check to see if mouthwash called Oxywash is available. I got it from my dentist. No burn but comforting. Good luck.



Wombatnomore said:


> Ungodly hour due to continuing mouth pain.


----------



## damemary (Mar 14, 2012)

Free country. Everyone gets a personal opinion. We can gauge how our comments affect others....at least I do. Does 3 to 1 mean anything to you?



Gerslay said:


> PP, Green, and Dame:
> 
> I asked a genuine sincere non-confrontational question and I'm the one who is negative and rude?
> 
> You folks need to calm down and not see everything in such a negative light yourselves!


----------



## Poor Purl (Apr 14, 2011)

DGreen said:


> Thank you. I took that photo this summer and I love it. My shutter speed had to be something like 1/2400 second to stop the wings. It is cropped - thank you Lightroom! We have three feeders and as many as 10 hummers that visit, fight, chirp and perform aerobatic feats right outside my dining room window. Alas, they have all flown away with fall.
> 
> Did you know that hummingbirds cannot walk? They must fly, since their legs do not have the muscles necessary to walk.


I did know they can't walk, but they fly like nobody's business. For two summers I sat on a porch (rented house) and watched their choreography, without ever getting bored. Since the owners have been using their house and not renting it, I've had awful, boring summers.

Here's a piece on albinism in hummingbirds: http://beautyofbirds.com/albinohummingbirds.html


----------



## Wombatnomore (Dec 9, 2013)

Poor Purl said:


> Sorry. Is it a tooth, or just allover pain? If it's a tooth, oil of clove or even just chewing an aspirin can dull the pain until you can get to a dentist. I don't know what to do about allover mouth pain except get drunk.


 :XD: :XD: :XD: Now that is an attractive option!

Tooth was pulled 10 days ago. Saw dentist last Friday. She says it's healing however she found a large ulcer on the side of the roof of mouth plus there's another one on side of tongue. Ouch!

Sorry, too much information. I'll be quiet now.


----------



## damemary (Mar 14, 2012)

Purl, your new avatar is beautiful. I'm sure Hedy would love it. My avatar is from Yahoo images too. DGreen's photography skill is way beyond me.


----------



## Wombatnomore (Dec 9, 2013)

Australian troops to be deployed in Iraq to support the good guys against IS:

http://www.9news.com.au/world/2014/10/20/19/16/australia-just-days-away-from-ramping-up-involvement-in-fight-against-isil


----------



## Wombatnomore (Dec 9, 2013)

damemary said:


> Purl, your new avatar is beautiful. I'm sure Hedy would love it.


Yours is gorgeous too Dame.

Hummingbirds are so cute. Don't see them where I live - too urban.


----------



## damemary (Mar 14, 2012)

Welcome Llavaia. Please feel free to comment when you wish.



Llavaia said:


> Just read this whole post from beginning....nice ladies!


----------



## damemary (Mar 14, 2012)

Join in whenever you wish. Get your mind off it.



Wombatnomore said:


> :XD: :XD: :XD: Now that is an attractive option!
> 
> Tooth was pulled 10 days ago. Saw dentist last Friday. She says it's healing however she found a large ulcer on the side of the roof of mouth plus there's another one on side of tongue. Ouch!
> 
> Sorry, too much information. I'll be quiet now.


----------



## damemary (Mar 14, 2012)

Arizona is on the migratory route. We see them all year round. Quite the show. Don't dare wear a bright pink or red shirt while filling feeders!



Wombatnomore said:


> Yours is gorgeous too Dame.
> 
> Hummingbirds are so cute. Don't see them where I live - too urban.


----------



## Poor Purl (Apr 14, 2011)

Llavaia said:


> Just read this whole post from beginning....nice ladies!


Hi, Llavaia. Did you read all 3 parts or just this last one? Could you use a sarcasm smiley? And what do you think of vaccines?

I had a long conversation last week on the M104 with a woman, entirely sane, who claimed fluoridated water was the cause of arthritis, dementia, and some other awful things. Naturally, she was against vaccines as well.

I hope you and dh are well, in your empty nest.


----------



## Wombatnomore (Dec 9, 2013)

damemary said:


> Arizona is on the migratory route. We see them all year round. Quite the show. Don't dare wear a bright pink or red shirt while filling feeders!


Do they advance en masse?


----------



## Poor Purl (Apr 14, 2011)

Gerslay said:


> Not directly, PP, but you did agree with Green who did.
> 
> I'm sorry if you think I was challenging you. I wasn't. I won't bother you with anymore questions.
> 
> And I didn't find it hard to believe that Judaism would not accept a trinitarian deity. That again was raised for discussion purposes only.


So when you told me that you had asked other Jews about it and they had no answer, that was for discussion purposes? I guess it could have been. Anyway, I hope the discussion (which actually ended only yesterday) was satisfying.

Please don't stop asking questions. But you need to understand that I've been a Jew in majority Christian neighborhoods all my life and have been challenged often. And beaten up once. So I should have learned to be wary about answering questions.


----------



## Poor Purl (Apr 14, 2011)

Wombatnomore said:


> :XD: :XD: :XD: Now that is an attractive option!
> 
> Tooth was pulled 10 days ago. Saw dentist last Friday. She says it's healing however she found a large ulcer on the side of the roof of mouth plus there's another one on side of tongue. Ouch!
> 
> Sorry, too much information. I'll be quiet now.


Just keep your mouth shut, but please don't stop typing. Your condition sounds awful; didn't the doctor suggest anything for the ulcers?


----------



## Poor Purl (Apr 14, 2011)

damemary said:


> Purl, your new avatar is beautiful. I'm sure Hedy would love it. My avatar is from Yahoo images too. DGreen's photography skill is way beyond me.


What a sweetie that is, all comfy on someone's finger. They have such different personalities, which you can distinguish if you have too much free time and watch them for days on end.


----------



## Poor Purl (Apr 14, 2011)

Wombatnomore said:


> Australian troops to be deployed in Iraq to support the good guys against IS:
> 
> http://www.9news.com.au/world/2014/10/20/19/16/australia-just-days-away-from-ramping-up-involvement-in-fight-against-isil


I wish them luck, as I do our own troops. All we can do is hope they come back safe and with all their parts.


----------



## Wombatnomore (Dec 9, 2013)

Poor Purl said:


> Just keep your mouth shut, but please don't stop typing. Your condition sounds awful; didn't the doctor suggest anything for the ulcers?


:XD:
Salt water mouth washes which I have been keeping up with.

I was sad to note that the albino hummingbird isn't attractive to the other birds and that's why they're so rare!


----------



## Poor Purl (Apr 14, 2011)

Wombatnomore said:


> Yours is gorgeous too Dame.
> 
> Hummingbirds are so cute. Don't see them where I live - too urban.


Are there hummingbirds in Australia? I once read that they were found only in the New World, i.e. the Western hemisphere. The British have nightingales (which are wonderful, too) but no hummers; we have hummers but no nightingales. I bet Oz has marsupial hummingbirds that sing like nightingales.


----------



## Poor Purl (Apr 14, 2011)

damemary said:


> Arizona is on the migratory route. We see them all year round. Quite the show. Don't dare wear a bright pink or red shirt while filling feeders!


So Arizona isn't all prisons and headless corpses (your governor is a hoot)? Lucky you.


----------



## Poor Purl (Apr 14, 2011)

Wombatnomore said:


> :XD:
> Salt water mouth washes which I have been keeping up with.
> 
> I was sad to note that the albino hummingbird isn't attractive to the other birds and that's why they're so rare!


Hummingbirds are racist? Ooh!


----------



## Wombatnomore (Dec 9, 2013)

Poor Purl said:


> Are there hummingbirds in Australia? I once read that they were found only in the New World, i.e. the Western hemisphere. The British have nightingales (which are wonderful, too) but no hummers; we have hummers but no nightingales. I bet Oz has marsupial hummingbirds that sing like nightingales.


No, sorry. I got confused with our honeyeaters:

http://www.ozanimals.com/wildlife/Bird/Honeyeaters.html

I wouldn't be surprised about the marsupial/hummingbird/nightingale arrangement. We sure do have some very strange little creatures down here.


----------



## Wombatnomore (Dec 9, 2013)

Poor Purl said:


> Hummingbirds are racist? Ooh!


Poor little things. However, the albino variety must strike it lucky sometimes because it seems they are very much present.


----------



## MaidInBedlam (Jul 24, 2012)

joeysomma said:


> This story has been proven false by Poor Purl on page 62 of this thread.
> 
> http://www.truthorfiction.com/rumors/m/monopoly-game.htm#.VEQDjWzfTmJ


Joey, by now you must know I don't care what you say. I like the Monopoly story. I don't care if it's true or false. I don't care that you are hopelessly ignorant of Christian theology, either. Eventually, God'll give you the straight skinny.


----------



## MaidInBedlam (Jul 24, 2012)

My Tibetan neighbor, a very nice little old lady, spins her prayer wheel on her walks as she is working on saying the billion names of God.


Country Bumpkins said:


> http://www.jewfaq.org/name.htm Please note: This page contains the Name of God. If you print it out, please treat it with appropriate respect.
> 
> The Significance of Names
> 
> ...


----------



## soloweygirl (Jun 9, 2012)

Poor Purl said:


> You mean by pointing out how you cried that I abused you when I was just paying back an insult from you? Okay, done.


Absolutely, right on cue.


----------



## Wombatnomore (Dec 9, 2013)

MaidInBedlam said:


> My Tibetan neighbor, a very nice little old lady, spins her prayer wheel on her walks as she is working on saying the billion names of God.


 :XD: :XD: :XD:


----------



## MaidInBedlam (Jul 24, 2012)

Us Catholics can pray what's called The Liturgy of the Hours or The Divine Office eight times a day. We can also pray The Little Office of the Blessed Virgin Mary twice a day. Ain't we got fun? Believer though I am, I've never quite understood why the heck anyone needs a triune God. Also, does 10 chances a day to pray make us Catholics twice as good as the Muslims?


Poor Purl said:


> I guess you know more than this Jew?
> 
> Three times a day, and more often on some holidays, observant Jews recite the prayer _Aleinu_:
> 
> ...


----------



## MaidInBedlam (Jul 24, 2012)

Duplicate post. Ooops


----------



## Poor Purl (Apr 14, 2011)

Wombatnomore said:


> No, sorry. I got confused with our honeyeaters:
> 
> http://www.ozanimals.com/wildlife/Bird/Honeyeaters.html
> 
> I wouldn't be surprised about the marsupial/hummingbird/nightingale arrangement. We sure do have some very strange little creatures down here.


They're very cute, the honeyeaters, but no other bird can fly backwards, and few can hover like helicopters. And what other birds can fly 500 miles over water without landing? Can you tell how I feel about hummingbirds?


----------



## soloweygirl (Jun 9, 2012)

Wombatnomore said:


> Back to the business of bearing bad news although this piece is a pretty good summary of how the Ebola issue is being dealt with by the citizens of the U.S.A:
> 
> http://www.nytimes.com/2014/10/20/us/fear-of-ebola-closes-schools-and-shapes-politics.html?ref=todayspaper&_r=0


On the brighter side, some good news. Nigeria is officially Ebola free - cleared by WHO. The relatives and girlfriend of Duncan, the Dallas Ebola patient, have been cleared of the Ebola virus.


----------



## Poor Purl (Apr 14, 2011)

MaidInBedlam said:


> Joey, by now you must know I don't care what you say. I like the Monopoly story. I don't care if it's true or false. I don't care that you are hopelessly ignorant of Christian theology, either. Eventually, God'll give you the straight skinny.


You don't mince words, do you? Good for you!

We have the same bird in our avatars, in two different positions (poses?). Did you know the photographer was a 15-year-old?


----------



## Poor Purl (Apr 14, 2011)

Wombatnomore said:


> Poor little things. However, the albino variety must strike it lucky sometimes because it seems they are very much present.


 :XD: :XD: :XD:


----------



## Poor Purl (Apr 14, 2011)

MaidInBedlam said:


> My Tibetan neighbor, a very nice little old lady, spins her prayer wheel on her walks as she is working on saying the billion names of God.


Please, ask her not to publish them where CB can copy and paste them.


----------



## Poor Purl (Apr 14, 2011)

soloweygirl said:


> Absolutely, right on cue.


You wouldn't want to be proved wrong, would you?


----------



## Poor Purl (Apr 14, 2011)

MaidInBedlam said:


> Us Catholics can pray what's called The Liturgy of the Hours or The Divine Office eight times a day. We can also pray The Little Office of the Blessed Virgin Mary twice a day. Ain't we got fun? Believer though I am, _I've never quite understood why the heck anyone needs a triune God_. Also, does 10 chances a day to pray make us Catholics twice as good as the Muslims?


Safety in numbers? Three always brings God luck? Unitarian churches don't have enough spires?


----------



## Llavaia (Oct 14, 2013)

Poor Purl said:


> Hi, Llavaia. Did you read all 3 parts or just this last one? Could you use a sarcasm smiley? And what do you think of vaccines?
> 
> I had a long conversation last week on the M104 with a woman, entirely sane, who claimed fluoridated water was the cause of arthritis, dementia, and some other awful things. Naturally, she was against vaccines as well.
> 
> I hope you and dh are well, in your empty nest.


Hi Purl....dh and I are doing great...love , love , love our empty nest..try to enjoy each day to the fullest since I don't know if and when the other shoe will drop. As far as her dislike of fluoridated water .... I hope she still has her teeth...arthritis... If you are lucky enough to age you will have it..it's called being alive and dementia ... ?????? .. As far as vaccines go to me it is a no brainer....yes you must vaccinate...the alternative is vastly more dangerous than the vaccine..not to vaccinate is moronic... Now I am in trouble for that one...you can all disagree but please don't call me FAT !!!! And how are you sweet lady ? And dh and son? Please let me know when we can have a cup of coffee .. 
Luci


----------



## Llavaia (Oct 14, 2013)

Oh ... And purl stay off the M104...


----------



## susanmos2000 (May 10, 2011)

Poor Purl said:


> Please, ask her not to publish them where CB can copy and paste them.


 :XD: :XD:


----------



## Designer1234 (Aug 9, 2011)

galinipper said:


> I have read about FinTRAC following the money flow from Canada to ISIS, they, FinTRAC, claim a 450% increase from 2008....... I have read that Calgary is a jihadi base for recruiting young Canadian men like Salman Ashrafi, the suicide bomber that killed 46 in Iraq....Does the Canadian media tell the whole story, are they in the pocket of politicians, do the stories leak out a little bit at a time?


I just moved from Calgary. You are correct. There was an apartment building in downtown Calgary where a group of young muslims met and lived. One of them was from somewhere else, I am sorry I am not sure about where or when. However, he conivinced 4 or 5 young men including a set of twins to join the jihadists. There was also an inman(?) living there and he is under investigation. Both the twins were killed as well as at least one of the others. I have not been checking the news for over a month so am not sure what has transpired as far as the inman is concerned. The parents of the twins were considered excellent citizens and have much sympathy from their friends and neighbours. I don't know more than that.

This news has been public since it was first discovered as far as I know. I do not believe there was a cover up. Maybe WCK might know more about that. We were in the midst of a lot of turmoil and I just didn't watch any news sources the way I usually do. I have not heard of any cover up by the Government. There was lots in the paper and on the news at the time the twins were killed, and even before that when the cell was discovered. Kitty might know more than I do. You are however correct. I believe you are correct that one of them was a suicide bomber and many were killed when he committed the bombing. That is all I know.


----------



## Poor Purl (Apr 14, 2011)

Llavaia said:


> Hi Purl....dh and I are doing great...love , love , love our empty nest..try to enjoy each day to the fullest since I don't know if and when the other shoe will drop. As far as her dislike of fluoridated water .... I hope she still has her teeth...arthritis... If you are lucky enough to age you will have it..it's called being alive and dementia ... ?????? .. As far as vaccines go to me it is a no brainer....yes you must vaccinate...the alternative is vastly more dangerous than the vaccine..not to vaccinate is moronic... Now I am in trouble for that one...you can all disagree but please don't call me FAT !!!! And how are you sweet lady ? And dh and son? Please let me know when we can have a cup of coffee ..
> Luci


I can't disagree with anything you've said. Did you read all those arguments against vaccines? They were an ordeal.

I'm ready for coffee - my only remaining pain requires me to wear backless shoes, so I can walk now. Name the day and the corner (but maybe let's do it in PMs).


----------



## Poor Purl (Apr 14, 2011)

Llavaia said:


> Oh ... And purl stay off the M104...


This I can't agree with. It goes right past my house. I'll just make sure to sit only in the single seats.


----------



## Wombatnomore (Dec 9, 2013)

soloweygirl said:


> On the brighter side, some good news. Nigeria is officially Ebola free - cleared by WHO. The relatives and girlfriend of Duncan, the Dallas Ebola patient, have been cleared of the Ebola virus.


Nigeria were hyper vigilant at tracing everyone from 'patient zero' and according to WHO, that accounts for it's success. The U.S. has essentially done the same once they got into the swing of things.


----------



## Wombatnomore (Dec 9, 2013)

Poor Purl said:


> They're very cute, the honeyeaters, but no other bird can fly backwards, and few can hover like helicopters. And what other birds can fly 500 miles over water without landing? Can you tell how I feel about hummingbirds?


 :XD: They are amazing birds and very beautiful.

You're listed as one of the frequent posters PP!


----------



## Poor Purl (Apr 14, 2011)

Wombatnomore said:


> :XD: They are amazing birds and very beautiful.
> 
> You're listed as one of the frequent posters PP!


Where? On KP? This does not bode well.


----------



## Poor Purl (Apr 14, 2011)

Wombatnomore said:


> :XD: They are amazing birds and very beautiful.
> 
> You're listed as one of the frequent posters PP!


You're right - just above tamarque. But way below the yarnlady, who's in the 8th spot, and damemary, the 10th. I think it's time for me to give it a rest, while you catch up.


----------



## DGreen (Nov 1, 2012)

Poor Purl said:


> So Arizona isn't all prisons and headless corpses (your governor is a hoot)? Lucky you.


No, in fact we have at lease one sanctuary in Sabino Canyon that is world renowned. And the Grand Canyon, Canyon de Chelly, many other natural wonders; too many to list. Just crazy politics.

Barry Goldwater would have been liberal compared to our current legislators.


----------



## DGreen (Nov 1, 2012)

Poor Purl said:


> Please, ask her not to publish them where CB can copy and paste them.


 :thumbup: :thumbup: :thumbup: :thumbup:


----------



## Poor Purl (Apr 14, 2011)

DGreen said:


> No, in fact we have at lease one sanctuary in Sabino Canyon that is world renowned. And the Grand Canyon, Canyon de Chelly, many other natural wonders; too many to list. Just crazy politics.
> 
> Barry Goldwater would have been liberal compared to our current legislators.


I knew someone who subscribed to _Arizona Highways_, so I've seen some wonderful pictures. But your politicians are loony - John McCain seems to be the sanest one, and he's a few marbles short.


----------



## DGreen (Nov 1, 2012)

Poor Purl said:


> I knew someone who subscribed to _Arizona Highways_, so I've seen some wonderful pictures. But your politicians are loony - John McCain seems to be the sanest one, and he's a few marbles short.


John McCain is getting senile. And yes, he's one of the more rational politicians. VERY red state, but it's slowly shifting as young people move here.


----------



## DGreen (Nov 1, 2012)

joeysomma said:


> City Officials Order Black Couple to Perform KKK Wedding
> 
> The above story is fictional but based on a true account related to same-sex marriage.


If this is based on a true story, then why is this article twisting the story to make it more reprehensible? The actual story, if I understand the article correctly, is same-sex marriage and the KKK is not a factor at all except to raise alarm at what someone thinks COULD happen.

Nothing there Joey. The fundamental concepts remain the same - if a business (in this case definitely a business, not a church) offers public accommodation it must offer it to all without illegally discriminating against same-sex couples. The choice is simple and straightforward. Either offer to all or offer to none because bigoted religious beliefs do NOT outweigh civil rights. There are penalties for breaking the law. Fines and jail time. Get over it because it isn't going to change.


----------



## SQM (Jun 22, 2012)

Llavaia said:


> Just read this whole post from beginning....nice ladies!


Hi Llavia,

I live in NY also and have met PP. I am mostly nice on all the threads. Nice to meet you.


----------



## SQM (Jun 22, 2012)

Poor Purl said:


> I knew someone who subscribed to _Arizona Highways_, so I've seen some wonderful pictures. But your politicians are loony - John McCain seems to be the sanest one, and he's a few marbles short.


I am in Chicago with my evil Republican twin and he lives in Phoenix and seems to sort of like the governor. He also said that crime has gone down since that maniac sheriff instituted tents for jail. Not fun sleeping in the desert with 120 degree weather. The conditions have deterred small crimes. (Evil Child. I was able to call him a stup today - a name I have not used in 50 years for him.)


----------



## Poor Purl (Apr 14, 2011)

SQM said:


> I am in Chicago with my evil Republican twin and he lives in Phoenix and seems to sort of like the governor. He also said that crime has gone down since that maniac sheriff instituted tents for jail. Not fun sleeping in the desert with 120 degree weather. The conditions have deterred small crimes. (Evil Child. I was able to call him a stup today - a name I have not used in 50 years for him.)


Funny, crime has gone down in NY without putting prisoners into tents in the desert. That sheriff is simply a sadist and publicity hound. I'm sure Brother Evil likes him.

How long will you be in Chicago?


----------



## SQM (Jun 22, 2012)

Poor Purl said:


> Funny, crime has gone down in NY without putting prisoners into tents in the desert. That sheriff is simply a sadist and publicity hound. I'm sure Brother Evil likes him.
> 
> How long will you be in Chicago?


Be back Friday night. Quite miserable here.

Evil Twin said that abortions are one reason why crime has gone down in NYC and elsewhere.


----------



## Poor Purl (Apr 14, 2011)

SQM said:


> Be back Friday night. Quite miserable here.
> 
> Evil Twin said that abortions are one reason why crime has gone down in NYC and elsewhere.


Tell him I think he's a stup, too.

Are you there for your sister-in-law? Is she still holding on?


----------



## SQM (Jun 22, 2012)

No she left. Had the wake today and the coffin was open. None of her features were hers. I'll be damned if I will let that happen to me. But I got over my squeamishness over dead bodies. She just looked empty and like someone else especially her nose which seemed to have been totally substitute with another person's. Dead is a very silly state.


----------



## Designer1234 (Aug 9, 2011)

SQM said:


> No she left. Had the wake today and the coffin was open. None of her features were hers. I'll be damned if I will let that happen to me. But I got over my squeamishness over dead bodies. She just looked empty and like someone else especially her nose which seemed to have been totally substitute with another person's. Dead is a very silly state.


I am sorry that your sister in law has gone. It is very hard but possibly a blessing. I know it makes you sad and I know it is hard when it is your twins' wife. My thoughts are with you and Please know we all care about you. Shirley


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## Designer1234 (Aug 9, 2011)

joeysomma said:


> I do believe The First Amendment of the Constitution trumps any one's civil rights.


It is very obvious that that is the case Joey. To Clarify, It is very obvious that you believe civil rights are not that important.


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## SQM (Jun 22, 2012)

T


Designer1234 said:


> I am sorry that your sister in law has gone. It is very hard but possibly a blessing. I know it makes you sad and I know it is hard when it is your twins' wife. My thoughts are with you and Please know we all care about you. Shirley


Thanks for the kind words - it was my older bro's wife - my bro the Historian.


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## Poor Purl (Apr 14, 2011)

SQM said:


> No she left. Had the wake today and the coffin was open. None of her features were hers. I'll be damned if I will let that happen to me. But I got over my squeamishness over dead bodies. She just looked empty and like someone else especially her nose which seemed to have been totally substitute with another person's. Dead is a very silly state.


How sad. But I guess dead bodies really are empty. They're certainly expressionless, which is why she must have looked different. I don't understand the part about her nose, though.

At least you're not taking death seriously, it being so silly. (Sarcasm alert, in case you missed it.)

I'm sorry she's gone, but she wasn't herself even before she died, as you described her. Take care.


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## DGreen (Nov 1, 2012)

joeysomma said:


> I do believe The First Amendment of the Constitution trumps any one's civil rights.


Look up the Civil Rights Act of 1964, which gets it's authority from the equal protection clause. This is the same constitutional authority upon which recent courts have decided laws against same-sex marriage are unconstitutional.

You are free to say what you want and to think what you want. You just can't DO what you want if it is illegal discrimination. This is a simple concept, Joey. Stamping your feet won't make it go away. Scream all you want but no one is taking away your religious freedom. People like you screamed the same way when slavery was abolished and when women got the vote. You will observe that churches are still open and you can still attend and no one is jailed for doing so. You can pray - you can even pray in public, but you can't promote your religion on the taxpayer's dime.

As I explained before, those offering public accommodation can't violate civil rights of gays any more than they can refuse service to blacks, old people, women, or those of OTHER faiths that they don't approve of. If they can't hold their nose and serve them, they can CHOOSE to go out of business. And should go out of business for breaking the law.

By the way, the KKK will never be a "protected class" because they have the option and choice to join the club - they were not born that way. Whoever wrote that article and "made up" story is an idiot and does not grasp the fundamental concept of civil rights. But they do understand how to inflame prejudice and bigotry.


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## Designer1234 (Aug 9, 2011)

DGreen said:


> Look up the Civil Rights Act of 1964, which gets it's authority from the equal protection clause. This is the same constitutional authority upon which recent courts have decided laws against same-sex marriage are unconstitutional.
> 
> You are free to say what you want and to think what you want. You just can't DO what you want if it is illegal discrimination. This is a simple concept, Joey. Stamping your feet won't make it go away. Scream all you want but no one is taking away your religious freedom. People like you screamed the same way when slavery was abolished and when women got the vote. You will observe that churches are still open and you can still attend and no one is jailed for doing so. You can pray - you can even pray in public, but you can't promote your religion on the taxpayer's dime.
> 
> ...


----------



## Designer1234 (Aug 9, 2011)

DGreen said:


> If this is based on a true story, then why is this article twisting the story to make it more reprehensible? The actual story, if I understand the article correctly, is same-sex marriage and the KKK is not a factor at all except to raise alarm at what someone thinks COULD happen.
> 
> Nothing there Joey. The fundamental concepts remain the same - if a business (in this case definitely a business, not a church) offers public accommodation it must offer it to all without illegally discriminating against same-sex couples. The choice is simple and straightforward. Either offer to all or offer to none because bigoted religious beliefs do NOT outweigh civil rights. There are penalties for breaking the law. Fines and jail time. Get over it because it isn't going to change.


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## DGreen (Nov 1, 2012)

SQM said:


> I am in Chicago with my evil Republican twin and he lives in Phoenix and seems to sort of like the governor. He also said that crime has gone down since that maniac sheriff instituted tents for jail. Not fun sleeping in the desert with 120 degree weather. The conditions have deterred small crimes. (Evil Child. I was able to call him a stup today - a name I have not used in 50 years for him.)


Your Evil Twin has been drinking Sheriff Joe's Kool-Aid. Tent City actually has evaporative coolers; while it is very hot in the summer, 120 is something of an exaggeration. I don't believe Sheriff Joe has deterred anything. He just says so and people believe him because they like to think the bad guys are being punished.

My problem with Sheriff Joe is that he treats prisoners very badly as "punishment" when the overwhelming majority of those incarcerated in his jail are awaiting trial. Innocent until proven guilty? He doesn't seem to understand the concept at all and neither do a lot of senile old people who vote for him. I hate the bastard. People die in his jail all too often then he investigates himself and goes on with his business. Arizona is a crazy place.

Janet Brewer became governor when Janet Napolitano left for Homeland Security. She had been Secretary of State and has to have a bevy of advisors at her elbow constantly to tell her what to do.


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## Poor Purl (Apr 14, 2011)

DGreen said:


> Look up the Civil Rights Act of 1964, which gets it's authority from the equal protection clause. This is the same constitutional authority upon which recent courts have decided laws against same-sex marriage are unconstitutional.
> 
> You are free to say what you want and to think what you want. You just can't DO what you want if it is illegal discrimination. This is a simple concept, Joey. Stamping your feet won't make it go away. Scream all you want but no one is taking away your religious freedom. People like you screamed the same way when slavery was abolished and when women got the vote. You will observe that churches are still open and you can still attend and no one is jailed for doing so. You can pray - you can even pray in public, but you can't promote your religion on the taxpayer's dime.
> 
> ...


Do you honestly expect adult behavior? You can be as reasonable and as logical as you like, but it won't get through to the spoiled child inside the grandmother's body.


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## DGreen (Nov 1, 2012)

Designer1234 - 

Thanks, Lady! I will continue to explain these concepts until she gets tired of me. It may take a while, I know.


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## DGreen (Nov 1, 2012)

SQM said:


> No she left. Had the wake today and the coffin was open. None of her features were hers. I'll be damned if I will let that happen to me. But I got over my squeamishness over dead bodies. She just looked empty and like someone else especially her nose which seemed to have been totally substitute with another person's. Dead is a very silly state.


I'm so sorry for your loss, SQM. My condolences to your brother and family.


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## Designer1234 (Aug 9, 2011)

DGreen said:


> Designer1234 -
> 
> Thanks, Lady! I will continue to explain these concepts until she gets tired of me. It may take a while, I know.


you are very welcome. I read every word you post as you have studied and learn what you are talking about. I know my own feelings but I also am learning a lot from you.

She will never get it


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## DGreen (Nov 1, 2012)

Poor Purl said:


> Do you honestly expect adult behavior? You can be as reasonable and as logical as you like, but it won't get through to the spoiled child inside the grandmother's body.


Of course I don't expect adult behavior, and your characterization of a child inside a grandmother's body is spot on. I just can't let her religious persecution nonsense go unchallenged!


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## Designer1234 (Aug 9, 2011)

DGreen said:


> Of course I don't expect adult behavior, and your characterization of a child inside a grandmother's body is spot on. I just can't let her religious persecution nonsense go unchallenged!


good for you! I agree with you. My problem too, I can't let some of the stupidity pass.


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## DGreen (Nov 1, 2012)

Designer1234 said:


> you are very welcome. I read every word you post as you have studied and learn what you are talking about. I know my own feelings but I also am learning a lot from you.
> 
> She will never get it


Designer, you are very kind. I know she probably won't ever get it, but one must try.


----------



## DGreen (Nov 1, 2012)

Poor Purl said:


> Apparently they're very rare, but they sure are pretty. There are a few other pictures at http://dailypicksandflicks.com/2011/09/28/rare-albino-hummingbird-in-virginia-picture-gallery/


OOOh - I like the photo with the red rose!


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## DGreen (Nov 1, 2012)

Poor Purl said:


> I knew someone who subscribed to _Arizona Highways_, so I've seen some wonderful pictures. But your politicians are loony - John McCain seems to be the sanest one, and he's a few marbles short.


DH and I drove to Phoenix today to do a little shopping. The drive is 75 miles of breathtaking scenery. This is Stewart Mountain to the east of Phoenix; at the base of the mountain is a dam creating Saguaro Lake. This photo taken several months ago but we pass it whenever we drive to Phoenix.


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## Poor Purl (Apr 14, 2011)

DGreen said:


> DH and I drove to Phoenix today to do a little shopping. The drive is 75 miles of breathtaking scenery. This is Stewart Mountain to the east of Phoenix; at the base of the mountain is a dam creating Saguaro Lake. This photo taken several months ago but we pass it whenever we drive to Phoenix.


Omigod - breathtaking is right. Even in a teeny tiny picture it looks just stunning.


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## Poor Purl (Apr 14, 2011)

DGreen said:


> OOOh - I like the photo with the red rose!


Now I know why angels look the way they do: to imitate hummingbirds. That picture really is a beauty.


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## Wombatnomore (Dec 9, 2013)

joeysomma said:


> I did read the Civil Rights act of 1964. Where does it say that this act say that it over rides the First Amendment? Where does the word sexual orientation appear? Where does it say that homosexual marriages are a civil right?
> 
> http://media.nara.gov/rediscovery/02233.pdf


What is it that you want Joey?

Are you able to make a statement, encompassing all of your desires for the U.S. and put to rest this constant toing and froing which gets nobody anywhere?

Look at it as a challenge. It will give you the opportunity to review your own position on the state of the union and maybe even enlighten others.

I'll watch with interest on this request.


----------



## damemary (Mar 14, 2012)

Believe me. I'd much rather have you as Frequent Poster than SOME people.



Poor Purl said:


> Where? On KP? This does not bode well.


----------



## damemary (Mar 14, 2012)

DGreen said:


> No, in fact we have at lease one sanctuary in Sabino Canyon that is world renowned. And the Grand Canyon, Canyon de Chelly, many other natural wonders; too many to list. Just crazy politics.
> 
> Barry Goldwater would have been liberal compared to our current legislators.


 :thumbup: :thumbup: :thumbup: :thumbup:


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## damemary (Mar 14, 2012)

Oh you ain't seen the Libertarians. Election time brings the out in full force. The rest of the year we just hear about them when they're indicted.



Poor Purl said:


> I knew someone who subscribed to _Arizona Highways_, so I've seen some wonderful pictures. But your politicians are loony - John McCain seems to be the sanest one, and he's a few marbles short.


----------



## damemary (Mar 14, 2012)

AAAACK! Free speech has limits and you know it. Try yelling 'FIRE' in a crowded theater if you don't believe it. All you've proven is that you are the Ugly American. My opinion, of course.



joeysomma said:


> I do believe The First Amendment of the Constitution trumps any one's civil rights.


----------



## damemary (Mar 14, 2012)

Sorry. Death is a sad part of life. My condolences to your family.



SQM said:


> No she left. Had the wake today and the coffin was open. None of her features were hers. I'll be damned if I will let that happen to me. But I got over my squeamishness over dead bodies. She just looked empty and like someone else especially her nose which seemed to have been totally substitute with another person's. Dead is a very silly state.


----------



## damemary (Mar 14, 2012)

Well put! Thank you for taking time to explain.



DGreen said:


> Look up the Civil Rights Act of 1964, which gets it's authority from the equal protection clause. This is the same constitutional authority upon which recent courts have decided laws against same-sex marriage are unconstitutional.
> 
> You are free to say what you want and to think what you want. You just can't DO what you want if it is illegal discrimination. This is a simple concept, Joey. Stamping your feet won't make it go away. Scream all you want but no one is taking away your religious freedom. People like you screamed the same way when slavery was abolished and when women got the vote. You will observe that churches are still open and you can still attend and no one is jailed for doing so. You can pray - you can even pray in public, but you can't promote your religion on the taxpayer's dime.
> 
> ...


----------



## damemary (Mar 14, 2012)

I love reading your comments.



DGreen said:


> Designer1234 -
> 
> Thanks, Lady! I will continue to explain these concepts until she gets tired of me. It may take a while, I know.


----------



## damemary (Mar 14, 2012)

Onward!



DGreen said:


> Of course I don't expect adult behavior, and your characterization of a child inside a grandmother's body is spot on. I just can't let her religious persecution nonsense go unchallenged!


----------



## damemary (Mar 14, 2012)

I must remind everyone to visit AZ spring, fall, or winter. You will see things you can't imagine. It should be on everyone's bucket list.



DGreen said:


> DH and I drove to Phoenix today to do a little shopping. The drive is 75 miles of breathtaking scenery. This is Stewart Mountain to the east of Phoenix; at the base of the mountain is a dam creating Saguaro Lake. This photo taken several months ago but we pass it whenever we drive to Phoenix.


----------



## DGreen (Nov 1, 2012)

Poor Purl said:


> Omigod - breathtaking is right. Even in a teeny tiny picture it looks just stunning.


Seems that a lot of people think Arizona is all desert, but nothing could be farther from the truth. About the only thing we lack is ocean front property.

The entire northern half of the state is mountainous. I live in what is known as "Rim Country" because a few miles north of here is the Mogollon (pronounced muggy-own) Rim, a 3,000 ft. escarpment running for about 200 miles across the northland. Standing on the edge, one can literally see hundreds of miles and range after range of mountains. And all of it beautiful.


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## DGreen (Nov 1, 2012)

joeysomma said:


> I did read the Civil Rights act of 1964. Where does it say that this act say that it over rides the First Amendment? Where does the word sexual orientation appear? Where does it say that homosexual marriages are a civil right?
> 
> http://media.nara.gov/rediscovery/02233.pdf


Your question is a red herring and is totally irrelevant.

When two conflicting rights bump up against each other, the courts decide the case based on who would be harmed more in that SPECIFIC case. You can still practice your religion. You just can't use it to harm others. As in the case of yelling "fire" in a crowded theater.

Let me remind you again, your bible endorses any number of things we don't tolerate any more. Take slavery; using your argument you could make a case for your "right" to keep slaves because you believe strongly the bible gives you that right. You could make a case for stoning a woman who has been raped based on your belief in the bible. You have stated plainly you would endorse laws condemning homosexuals to death as your bible directs. You can't do any of those things legally. Speech? Protected.

By the way, the yelling "fire" example is not rhetorical - that really happened and a lot of people died in a union dispute where goons hired by the industry deliberately created a panic.


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## damemary (Mar 14, 2012)

Again a magnificent explanation. Thank you.



DGreen said:


> Your question is a red herring and is totally irrelevant.
> 
> When two conflicting rights bump up against each other, the courts decide the case based on who would be harmed more in that SPECIFIC case. You can still practice your religion. You just can't use it to harm others. As in the case of yelling "fire" in a crowded theater.
> 
> ...


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## DGreen (Nov 1, 2012)

damemary said:


> Again a magnificent explanation. Thank you.


Thanks, but I doubt it will sink in. People who believe their religious freedom is being taken away are not used to critical thinking - too foreign. There's also a perceived threat and a lot of irrational fear.

I love the way our system was designed because it provides real protections while being flexible enough to accommodate changing realities. Things the founding fathers could not have dreamed of. The constitution is a thing of beauty and truly is not hard to understand if one only wants to understand.


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## MaidInBedlam (Jul 24, 2012)

Poor Purl said:


> You don't mince words, do you? Good for you!
> 
> We have the same bird in our avatars, in two different positions (poses?). Did you know the photographer was a 15-year-old?


Mince words? God forbid!! Isn't that a sin of some kind? :twisted:

I liked your avatar and cruised online for white hummingbird pictures and found the one you're using for your avatar in what looks like a slightly different shot of the same bird so I thought I'd use it for my avatar. I didn't know the photographer was a 15-year old. Pretty cool. I thought maybe I could start a white hummingbird avatar fad. :thumbup:


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## damemary (Mar 14, 2012)

I've given up on influencing closed-minded people. I just appreciate the way you organize your thoughts and express ideas. I didn't say you were a magician.



DGreen said:


> Thanks, but I doubt it will sink in. People who believe their religious freedom is being taken away are not used to critical thinking - too foreign. There's also a perceived threat and a lot of irrational fear.
> 
> I love the way our system was designed because it provides real protections while being flexible enough to accommodate changing realities. Things the founding fathers could not have dreamed of. The constitution is a thing of beauty and truly is not hard to understand if one only wants to understand.


----------



## MaidInBedlam (Jul 24, 2012)

Duplicate post.


----------



## MaidInBedlam (Jul 24, 2012)

Again?


----------



## MaidInBedlam (Jul 24, 2012)

There's a stutter of my post going on here.


----------



## MaidInBedlam (Jul 24, 2012)

Yet again?


----------



## MaidInBedlam (Jul 24, 2012)

Poor Purl said:


> They're very cute, the honeyeaters, but no other bird can fly backwards, and few can hover like helicopters. And what other birds can fly 500 miles over water without landing? Can you tell how I feel about hummingbirds?


I tried to say I thought you liked them quite a lot, got 4 repeats and edited them all out. Where's my coffee"?


----------



## MaidInBedlam (Jul 24, 2012)

Poor Purl said:


> Please, ask her not to publish them where CB can copy and paste them.


CB will have to get her own prayer wheel.


----------



## Designer1234 (Aug 9, 2011)

damemary said:


> I must remind everyone to visit AZ spring, fall, or winter. You will see things you can't imagine. It should be on everyone's bucket list.


Dame - I second the motion. It is so beautiful and so different than where I come from. I fell in love with the desert when we drove over the hill and looked down on St. George Utah and saw all the red rocks etc. Then when we came into Phoenix it was like a new world opened up.

The Giant Saquaros, the wonderful shrubs and cacti. We spent our first two weeks in Arizona camping at Usery Park in Mesa(?) Apache Junction(?) that was where I really fell in love with that wonderful place. Pat hiked all over the Superstition mountains the years we were there- picacho Peak, Flat iron, and on and on. Have you ever been to the Gallery of the sun in Tucson (It is where all Ted DeGrazias work is kept and he is buried. What a wonderful place.

Whether you are interested in art, or crafts of any kind, please take the time all of you who go through or to Arizona to visit it. It is near Sabino Canyon (?). where even I hiked.

As you see, I am a fan of Arizona it was a second home to me for 11 years.


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## MaidInBedlam (Jul 24, 2012)

Purl, here's another pretty nifty picture of hummingbirds.


----------



## Llavaia (Oct 14, 2013)

SQM said:


> Hi Llavia,
> 
> I live in NY also and have met PP. I am mostly nice on all the threads. Nice to meet you.


Hi SQM... Nice to meet you! East or west sider? I would like to meet you..


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## MaidInBedlam (Jul 24, 2012)

How ever so like you to believe a website called "Godfather Politics" Thank you for your consistency.


joeysomma said:


> City Officials Order Black Couple to Perform KKK Wedding


----------



## MaidInBedlam (Jul 24, 2012)

DGreen said:


> Designer1234 -
> 
> Thanks, Lady! I will continue to explain these concepts until she gets tired of me. It may take a while, I know.


If you believe the two of you will meet in Heaven, you'll have all of eternity to attempt to explain those few simple truths to joey. And that still won't be enough time to succeed in the effort...


----------



## Designer1234 (Aug 9, 2011)

MaidInBedlam said:


> Mince words? God forbid!! Isn't that a sin of some kind? :twisted:
> 
> I liked your avatar and cruised online for white hummingbird pictures and found the one you're using for your avatar in what looks like a slightly different shot of the same bird so I thought I'd use it for my avatar. I didn't know the photographer was a 15-year old. Pretty cool. I thought maybe I could start a white hummingbird avatar fad. :thumbup:


First time I have heard of a white one. I have seen some of the young man's pictures somewhere on line - maybe I missed the white one -- do you have a link to his photos.

Green, did you know the the admin of KP also have another forum for photographers? set up exactly like this one - WONDERFUL photos and even a political chit chat like this one or even more nasty. I will see if I still have the link. worth looking at it if you are interested in photography.

http://www.uglyhedgehog.com/t-170364-1.html

http://www.uglyhedgehog.com


----------



## DGreen (Nov 1, 2012)

Designer1234 said:


> First time I have heard of a white one. I have seen some of the young man's pictures somewhere on line - maybe I missed the white one -- do you have a link to his photos.
> 
> Green, did you know the the admin of KP also have another forum for photographers? set up exactly like this one - WONDERFUL photos and even a political chit chat like this one or even more nasty. I will see if I still have the link. worth looking at it if you are interested in photography.
> 
> ...


I did not know that. Even more nasty? Oh my. I definitely need to check that out.


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## MaidInBedlam (Jul 24, 2012)

I googled "pictures of hummingbirds" and found tons of different pictures, including several of the white one.


Designer1234 said:


> First time I have heard of a white one. I have seen some of the young man's pictures somewhere on line - maybe I missed the white one -- do you have a link to his photos.
> 
> Green, did you know the the admin of KP also have another forum for photographers? set up exactly like this one - WONDERFUL photos and even a political chit chat like this one or even more nasty. I will see if I still have the link. worth looking at it if you are interested in photography.
> 
> ...


----------



## DGreen (Nov 1, 2012)

MaidInBedlam said:


> If you believe the two of you will meet in Heaven, you'll have all of eternity to attempt to explain those few simple truths to joey. And that still won't be enough time to succeed in the effort...


Don't believe in an afterlife, so I'll escape that version of hell.


----------



## Designer1234 (Aug 9, 2011)

DGreen said:


> Your question is a red herring and is totally irrelevant.
> 
> When two conflicting rights bump up against each other, the courts decide the case based on who would be harmed more in that SPECIFIC case. You can still practice your religion. You just can't use it to harm others. As in the case of yelling "fire" in a crowded theater.
> 
> ...


You cut to the meat of a situation better than most, Green. I applaud you -- not with an emoticom but saying so loudly!

I learn from all your posts. You clarify a lot of things I am fuzzy about ( or unaware of). Fuzzy? boy that sure left me open for some comments from the right!


----------



## DGreen (Nov 1, 2012)

Designer1234 said:


> First time I have heard of a white one. I have seen some of the young man's pictures somewhere on line - maybe I missed the white one -- do you have a link to his photos.
> 
> Green, did you know the the admin of KP also have another forum for photographers? set up exactly like this one - WONDERFUL photos and even a political chit chat like this one or even more nasty. I will see if I still have the link. worth looking at it if you are interested in photography.
> 
> ...


Great owl shot. I did check out the site and will spend some happy time there. A visual feast. Thank you so much.


----------



## DGreen (Nov 1, 2012)

Designer1234 said:


> You cut to the meat of a situation better than most, Green. I applaud you -- not with an emoticom but saying so loudly!
> 
> I learn from all your posts. You clarify a lot of things I am fuzzy about ( or unaware of). Fuzzy? boy that sure left me open for some comments from the right!


Thanks again.


----------



## Designer1234 (Aug 9, 2011)

Llavaia said:


> Hi SQM... Nice to meet you! East or west sider? I would like to meet you..


Welcome Llavia - SQM is telling the truth, one of the more polite members of this thread. Funny too. I hope you will spend some time with us.


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## Designer1234 (Aug 9, 2011)

MaidInBedlam said:


> How ever so like you to believe a website called "Godfather Politics" Thank you for your consistency.


This has proven to be a hoax -- Joey, check what you are posting. Oh, I see you knew that when you posted it. Sort of a waste of time??? but then that is 'par for the course' not unusual, infact it is true most of the time.


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## MaidInBedlam (Jul 24, 2012)

Googled a bit more for the photographer of the albino hummingbird and ended up here. Michael Brown is the photographer. I don't think all the pictures here are his, but they're still pretty amazing. There are more views of the albino, too. For some reason the photos start getting mixed with other pics that don't seem to have anything to do with hummers... 
https://www.google.com/search?q=mic...qCK-t8gHLh4CABw&ved=0CEMQsAQ&biw=1093&bih=496


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## Poor Purl (Apr 14, 2011)

damemary said:


> Oh you ain't seen the Libertarians. Election time brings the out in full force. The rest of the year we just hear about them when they're indicted.


 :XD: :XD: :XD: :XD: :XD:


----------



## Poor Purl (Apr 14, 2011)

joeysomma said:


> I did read the Civil Rights act of 1964. Where does it say that this act say that it over rides the First Amendment? Where does the word sexual orientation appear? Where does it say that homosexual marriages are a civil right?
> 
> http://media.nara.gov/rediscovery/02233.pdf


Did you read all the case law stemming from it? Or the cases leading up to the same-sex marriage opinions? Or is your approach to law like your approach to mathematics: all surface, and no follow-up?


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## Wombatnomore (Dec 9, 2013)

DGreen said:


> DH and I drove to Phoenix today to do a little shopping. The drive is 75 miles of breathtaking scenery. This is Stewart Mountain to the east of Phoenix; at the base of the mountain is a dam creating Saguaro Lake. This photo taken several months ago but we pass it whenever we drive to Phoenix.


Speaking of deserts, this is a shot of our Simpson Desert which spreads over the borders of the Northern Territory, Queensland, South Australia and Victoria:


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## Poor Purl (Apr 14, 2011)

MaidInBedlam said:


> Mince words? God forbid!! Isn't that a sin of some kind? :twisted:
> 
> I liked your avatar and cruised online for white hummingbird pictures and found the one you're using for your avatar in what looks like a slightly different shot of the same bird so I thought I'd use it for my avatar. I didn't know the photographer was a 15-year old. Pretty cool. I thought maybe I could start a white hummingbird avatar fad. :thumbup:


A hummingbird fad is enough; let's not decide on the basis of color. But where is your white one?


----------



## Poor Purl (Apr 14, 2011)

MaidInBedlam said:


> CB will have to get her own prayer wheel.


She'll probably invent one, and after that the typewriter.


----------



## MaidInBedlam (Jul 24, 2012)

Poor Purl said:


> A hummingbird fad is enough; let's not decide on the basis of color. But where is your white one?


Yes, let's not get tripped up by color. I changed my avatar to another hummingbird picture I thought you'd like. If you want a real feast of sight, google "pictures of hummingbirds".


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## Wombatnomore (Dec 9, 2013)

Sore mouth! Empathy or just 'aaww' would suffice.


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## Knitted by Nan (Aug 3, 2013)

Wombatnomore said:


> Speaking of deserts, this is a shot of our Simpson Desert which spreads over the borders of the Northern Territory, Queensland, South Australia and Victoria:


Sorry Wombat but your map of the Simpson Desert is not correct, the map is a map of a trip to the Simpson Desert and not of the desert itself. I will attach an accurate map of the Simpson Desert, as well as one showing the desert areas of Western Australia. Your map shows the Simpson Desert as coming down almost to the coast. It does not extend into Victoria or NSW.
.

The Simpson Desert is a large area of dry, red sandy plain and dunes in Northern Territory, South Australia and Queensland in central Australia. It is the fourth largest Australian desert, with an area of 176,500 km² (68,100 sq mi) and is the world's largest sand dune desert.


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## knitpresentgifts (May 21, 2013)

EveMCooke said:


> Sorry Wombat but your map of the Simpson Desert is not correct, the map is a map of a trip to the Simpson Desert and not of the desert itself. I will attach an accurate map of the Simpson Desert, as well as one showing the desert areas of Western Australia. Your map shows the Simpson Desert as coming down almost to the coast of NSW.


What do you expect from one who calls herself an Aussie but is only an impostor? ROFL


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## soloweygirl (Jun 9, 2012)

SQM said:


> No she left. Had the wake today and the coffin was open. None of her features were hers. I'll be damned if I will let that happen to me. But I got over my squeamishness over dead bodies. She just looked empty and like someone else especially her nose which seemed to have been totally substitute with another person's. Dead is a very silly state.


I'm sorry for your loss.


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## DGreen (Nov 1, 2012)

joeysomma said:


> Homosexually is not a protected class of citizens.. They want SPECIAL rights. Just read what the Mayor of Houston wants for homosexuals. Their rights end where mine begin and also the other way around. How is NOT baking a specific kind of cake hurting anyone? Oh, poor little boys or girls, their feelings are hurt. So all they are doing is using the court system to punish someone that hurts their feelings.
> 
> As far as the slaves in the Bible, they were nothing like what was in the South. They were either indentured servants that were freed in the 7th year. Or they were the captives of war and usually the Hebrews were the slaves.
> 
> ...


Please try to get a grasp of equal protection under the law. Not special rights. The SAME as everyone else.

Your apologist description of slavery of the bible is pure BS.

Let's hear how you deny that the bible says to stone a women for not crying out loudly enough while being raped.

The mayor of Houston has been resoundingly rebuked. She was over the line and does NOT represent what is happening in the entire country.


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## DGreen (Nov 1, 2012)

Wombatnomore said:


> Speaking of deserts, this is a shot of our Simpson Desert which spreads over the borders of the Northern Territory, Queensland, South Australia and Victoria:


Gorgeous.


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## Poor Purl (Apr 14, 2011)

MaidInBedlam said:


> Purl, here's another pretty nifty picture of hummingbirds.


Not just nifty - peachy keen. What a gorgeous red throat one of them has.


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## Poor Purl (Apr 14, 2011)

MaidInBedlam said:


> If you believe the two of you will meet in Heaven, you'll have all of eternity to attempt to explain those few simple truths to joey. And that still won't be enough time to succeed in the effort...


The more sarcastic you get, the funnier you are. And truthier.


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## knitpresentgifts (May 21, 2013)

DGreen said:


> Let's hear how you deny that the bible says to stone a women for not crying out loudly enough while being raped.


All I can say is thank God you're an atheist because you don't understand a darn thing written in the Bible. The Bible NEVER says to stone a woman who was raped whether or not she cried out. In * fact,* it says the complete opposite (do nothing to the victim) - it specifies to punish the man who is guilty. The Bible also speaks to the fact not to presume every sexual act is adulterous. God never approves of rape, and you have no idea what you're talking about on this subject. Can't say I'm surprised.

I know you're referring to Deut 22, so don't bothering preaching to me your opinions - I guarantee you, you're wrong and the words and lesson in the Bible flew over your head if you ever bothered to read and understand what you read. Perhaps, you are just repeating what you've heard like a parrot, taking a verse or two out of context to support your agenda. I suggest you read the verses *in context* yourself until you understand them so you'll recognize how foolish you appear talking about what is or isn't in the written Word.


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## Poor Purl (Apr 14, 2011)

knitpresentgifts said:


> All I can say is thank God you're an atheist because you don't understand a darn thing written in the Bible. The Bible NEVER says to stone a woman who was raped whether or not she cried out. In * fact,* it says the complete opposite (do nothing to the victim) - it specifies to punish the man who is guilty. The Bible also speaks to the fact not to presume every sexual act is adulterous. God never approves of rape, and you have no idea what you're talking about on this subject. Can't say I'm surprised.
> 
> I know you're referring to Deut 22, so don't bothering preaching to me your opinions - I guarantee you, you're wrong and the words and lesson in the Bible flew over your head.


Deuteronomy 22 (English Standard Version): 23 If there is a betrothed virgin, and a man meets her in the city and lies with her, 24 then *you shall bring them both out to the gate of that city, and you shall stone them to death with stones, the young woman because she did not cry for help though she was in the city*, and the man because he violated his neighbor's wife. So you shall purge the evil from your midst."
:?: :?: :?: :?: :?:


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## Poor Purl (Apr 14, 2011)

Wombatnomore said:


> Sore mouth! Empathy or just 'aaww' would suffice.


Aaww.


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## Poor Purl (Apr 14, 2011)

MaidInBedlam said:


> Yes, let's not get tripped up by color. I changed my avatar to another hummingbird picture I thought you'd like. If you want a real feast of sight, google "pictures of hummingbirds".


Been there, done that, going to do it again.


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## Poor Purl (Apr 14, 2011)

Wombatnomore said:


> Speaking of deserts, this is a shot of our Simpson Desert which spreads over the borders of the Northern Territory, Queensland, South Australia and Victoria:


Is the sand really that red or is it a trick of the light? What beautiful color!


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## knitpresentgifts (May 21, 2013)

Poor Purl said:


> Deuteronomy 22 (English Standard Version): 23 If there is a betrothed virgin, and a man meets her in the city and lies with her, 24 then *you shall bring them both out to the gate of that city, and you shall stone them to death with stones, the young woman because she did not cry for help though she was in the city*, and the man because he violated his neighbor's wife. So you shall purge the evil from your midst."
> :?: :?: :?: :?: :?:


And right on cue, another athestist who has no idea what she is talking about. The verse you quoted isn't talking about a woman who was raped which is what Green challenged a Christian to deny. But you don't know that, do you. :-D I warned Green not to quote Deut 22 but you just couldn't help yourself butting in thinking you were so smart. NOT - ROFLMBO


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## Poor Purl (Apr 14, 2011)

knitpresentgifts said:


> And right on cue, another idiot who has no idea what she is talking about. This verse isn't talking about a woman who was raped. But you don't know that, do you. I warned Green not to quote Deut 22 but you just couldn't help yourself thinking you were so smart. NOT - ROFLMBO


Show me where it says "unless she was raped" and maybe I'll believe you.

In fact, the Bible makes no distinction between a woman who is willing and one who isn't - if she didn't scream loud enough, she's put to death whether she was being raped or just hooking up.


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## knitpresentgifts (May 21, 2013)

Poor Purl said:


> Show me where it says "unless she was raped" and maybe I'll believe you.
> 
> In fact, the Bible makes no distinction between a woman who is willing and one who isn't - if she didn't scream loud enough, she's put to death whether she was being raped or just hooking up.


Wrong, wrong and wrong.

You are ignorant of *all* the Bible teaches and incorrect in every statement you wrote. Hit the Good Book, Polly, and maybe, just maybe, you'll learn something.

I have no desire to even read your posts never mind heed your bidding and demands and respond. I only read your stupid post because I didn't recognize the avatar and your post immediately followed mine.


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## Poor Purl (Apr 14, 2011)

knitpresentgifts said:


> Wrong, wrong and wrong.
> 
> You are ignorant of *all* the Bible teaches and incorrect in every statement you wrote. Hit the Good Book, Polly, and maybe, just maybe, you'll learn something.
> 
> I have no desire to even read your posts never mind heed your bidding and demands and respond. I only read your stupid post because I didn't recognize the avatar and your post immediately followed mine.


My bidding??? My demands??? You really _are_ insane. There's nothing you can do that I would possibly want.


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## DGreen (Nov 1, 2012)

Poor Purl said:


> Deuteronomy 22 (English Standard Version): 23 If there is a betrothed virgin, and a man meets her in the city and lies with her, 24 then *you shall bring them both out to the gate of that city, and you shall stone them to death with stones, the young woman because she did not cry for help though she was in the city*, and the man because he violated his neighbor's wife. So you shall purge the evil from your midst."
> :?: :?: :?: :?: :?:


Thanks, Purl. Evidently there are some "revisions" to the bible that are intended to make the original text more palatable. No doubt KPG is referring to the more modern version.


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## knitpresentgifts (May 21, 2013)

DGreen said:


> Thanks, Purl. Evidently there are some "revisions" to the bible that are intended to make the original text more palatable. No doubt KPG is referring to the more modern version.


Wrong again, Polly. Want a cracker?

No reason or need to change the original text - it only takes you and your twin to comprehend what the written words mean in ANY version of the Bible. I cannot help either of you with that, you're on your own. You might want to confer with Pitiful Pearl - she makes demands though, so be forewarned.

Oh, the Bible was written perfectly the first time, and any version tells the same story and therefore, revisions are not necessary.

BTW: How do you feel about the "Show Me" state?


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## Designer1234 (Aug 9, 2011)

knitpresentgifts said:


> Wrong, wrong and wrong.
> 
> You are ignorant of *all* the Bible teaches and incorrect in every statement you wrote. Hit the Good Book, Polly, and maybe, just maybe, you'll learn something.
> 
> I have no desire to even read your posts never mind heed your bidding and demands and respond. I only read your stupid post because I didn't recognize the avatar and your post immediately followed mine.


Here we go again -- same old same old Arrogance - threats which you never follow - please don't read our posts, keep your word about ignoring us. Then we will ignore you. Happliy. Why don't you try it. Arrogant, nasty, unkind, supercilious - so many words that fit you to a T. I have never seen anyone like you - you do everything you can to insult and degrade us - and as a result you don't have a person who likes you over here - but that must be your hope I guess. Sad though.


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## DGreen (Nov 1, 2012)

joeysomma said:


> As far as the slaves in the Bible, they were nothing like what was in the South. They were either indentured servants that were freed in the 7th year. Or they were the captives of war and usually the Hebrews were the slaves.
> 
> Exodus 21:2 NKJV
> 
> _If you buy a Hebrew servant, he shall serve six years; and in the seventh he shall go out free and pay nothing._


25 But if a man find a betrothed damsel in the field, and the man force her, and lie with her: then the man only that lay with her shall die. 26 But unto the damsel thou shalt do nothing; there is in the damsel no sin worthy of death: for as when a man riseth against his neighbor, and slayeth him, even so is this matter: 27 For he found her in the field, and the betrothed damsel cried, and there was none to save her. 28 If a man find a damsel that is a virgin, which is not betrothed, and lay hold on her, and lie with her, and they be found; 29 Then the man that lay with her shall give unto the damsel's father fifty shekels of silver, and she shall be his wife; because he hath humbled her, he may not put her away all his days

"And lay hold on her"  and "because he hath humbled her"

Doesn't sound like consensual sex. Note the attacker can just pay off the father because girls are considered property anyway. Pity the poor girl, being forced into such a marriage. But KPG, as usual, will dispute and defend this because she "knows" the bible and what it really means.

********
However, you may purchase male or female slaves from among the foreigners who live among you. You may also purchase the children of such resident foreigners, including those who have been born in your land. You may treat them as your property, passing them on to your children as a permanent inheritance. You may treat your slaves like this, but the people of Israel, your relatives, must never be treated this way. Leviticus 25:44-46


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## Designer1234 (Aug 9, 2011)

DGreen said:


> 25 But if a man find a betrothed damsel in the field, and the man force her, and lie with her: then the man only that lay with her shall die. 26 But unto the damsel thou shalt do nothing; there is in the damsel no sin worthy of death: for as when a man riseth against his neighbor, and slayeth him, even so is this matter: 27 For he found her in the field, and the betrothed damsel cried, and there was none to save her. 28 If a man find a damsel that is a virgin, which is not betrothed, and lay hold on her, and lie with her, and they be found; 29 Then the man that lay with her shall give unto the damsel's father fifty shekels of silver, and she shall be his wife; because he hath humbled her, he may not put her away all his days
> 
> "And lay hold on her" and "because he hath humbled her"
> 
> ...


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## DGreen (Nov 1, 2012)

Poor Purl said:


> My bidding??? My demands??? You really _are_ insane. There's nothing you can do that I would possibly want.


Gee, things had been so quiet and (mostly) congenial lately. KPG has awakened from her nap. Or maybe the love fest over at D&P was getting boring and she could no longer stifle her need to tell us how smart she is and how heroic by coming to CB's rescue.


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## Designer1234 (Aug 9, 2011)

changed my mind. don't feel like singing


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## DGreen (Nov 1, 2012)

knitpresentgifts said:


> Oh, the Bible was written perfectly the first time, and any version tells the same story and therefore, revisions are not necessary.


Listed below are the most common English versions of the Bible. In choosing which Bible version(s) you are going to use/study, do research, discuss with Christians you respect, read the Bibles for yourself, and ultimately, ask God for wisdom regarding which Bible version He desires you to use.

King James Version (KJV)
New International Version (NIV)
New American Standard Bible (NASB)
New King James Version (NKJV)
English Standard Version (ESV)
New Living Translation (NLT)
Holman Christian Standard Bible (HCSB)
New Revised Standard Version (NRSV)
New Century Version (NCV)
New English Bible (NEB)
American Standard Version (ASV)
Good News Bible (GNB) / Todays English Version (TEV)
Amplified Bible (AMP)
Todays New International Version (TNIV)
New English Translation (NET)
Revised Standard Version (RSV)
Contemporary English Version (CEV)
Gods Word Translation (GW)
Common English Bible (CEB)
New International Readers Version (NIrV)
Easy-To-Read Version (ERV)
Complete Jewish Bible (CJB)
Bible in Basic English (BBE)
21st Century King James Version (KJ21)
What is the Modern King James Version (MKJV)?
What is the Modern English Version (MEV)?
World English Bible (WEB)
Revised English Bible (REB)
Jerusalem Bible (JB)
New American Bible (NAB)
The Living Bible (TLB)
The Message (MSG)
Young's Literal Translation (YLT)
The Bishops' Bible
Douay-Rheims Version (DRV)
Tyndale Bible
Geneva Bible

Read them ALL? ROFL
Sorry for the cut and paste, ladies. Too good to pass up.


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## Poor Purl (Apr 14, 2011)

Designer1234 said:


> Here we go again -- same old same old Arrogance - threats which you never follow - please don't read our posts, keep your word about ignoring us. Then we will ignore you. Happliy. Why don't you try it. Arrogant, nasty, unkind, supercilious - so many words that fit you to a T. I have never seen anyone like you - you do everything you can to insult and degrade us - and as a result none of us can stand you.


Everything you say is true. But I must apologize for the demands I make on people. At least, I think I must apologize because I have no idea what they are.


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## Knitted by Nan (Aug 3, 2013)

knitpresentgifts said:


> What do you expect from one who calls herself an Aussie but is only an impostor? ROFL


This is a totally unnecessary and nasty comment.


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## Poor Purl (Apr 14, 2011)

DGreen said:


> Thanks, Purl. Evidently there are some "revisions" to the bible that are intended to make the original text more palatable. No doubt KPG is referring to the more modern version.


Aha. I believe there is a Revised Standard Version. I was going to check the original - in Hebrew - to see what it says, but I've changed my mind. I've already wasted too much time on the ravings of a lunatic.

Besides, I need to get back to my demands, whatever they are.


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## Poor Purl (Apr 14, 2011)

DGreen said:


> Gee, things had been so quiet and (mostly) congenial lately. KPG has awakened from her nap. Or maybe the love fest over at D&P was getting boring and she could no longer stifle her need to tell us how smart she is and how heroic by coming to CB's rescue.


Don't you miss the peace and quiet we had arguing about vaccines and planning the demise of ISIS and curing Ebola?


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## Poor Purl (Apr 14, 2011)

Designer1234 said:


> Merrily, Merrily, Merrily Merrily, life is but a Dream!! lets have a sing along! It's a great day for singing a song!!! It's a great day ! hmmm Hmmmmm, Hummmmmmm -


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## Knitted by Nan (Aug 3, 2013)

Poor Purl said:


> Is the sand really that red or is it a trick of the light? What beautiful color!


 Red colour in these sands is caused by a haematitic clay cutan formed during Pleistocene lateralization, enhanced by aging, and covered over by a thin silica coat. A Holocene limonitic fluff occurs on top of the silica coat. Coarser grains are yellower because they have more yellow fluff and less red cutan; red sediments are darker because they contain carbonaceous dots. With aging, sands change from yellow to red and become darker and less intensely coloured because of a four-stage process: weathering to limonite, dehydration to diffuse hematite, recrystallization to hematite crystals, and green-darkening. Thus Holocene sands are orange, Pleistocene brick-red, and early Palaeozoic dull liver colour.
Taken from
Reddening of desert sands; Simpson Desert, N. T., Australia
http://jsedres.geoscienceworld.org/content/46/3/604.abstract

The three colours of the Aboriginal flag are Red = the colour of the earth, yellow = the colour of the sun and black = the colour of their skin.


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## Poor Purl (Apr 14, 2011)

EveMCooke said:


> This is a totally unnecessary and nasty comment.


Shh. She thinks Wombatnomore is VocalLisa and therefore not an Aussie. It must have come to her in one of her hallucinations.


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## Poor Purl (Apr 14, 2011)

EveMCooke said:


> Red colour in these sands is caused by a haematitic clay cutan formed during Pleistocene lateralization, enhanced by aging, and covered over by a thin silica coat. A Holocene limonitic fluff occurs on top of the silica coat. Coarser grains are yellower because they have more yellow fluff and less red cutan; red sediments are darker because they contain carbonaceous dots. With aging, sands change from yellow to red and become darker and less intensely coloured because of a four-stage process: weathering to limonite, dehydration to diffuse hematite, recrystallization to hematite crystals, and green-darkening. Thus Holocene sands are orange, Pleistocene brick-red, and early Palaeozoic dull liver colour.
> Taken from
> Reddening of desert sands; Simpson Desert, N. T., Australia
> http://jsedres.geoscienceworld.org/content/46/3/604.abstract
> ...


I read every word of this, but understood only the last sentence. But I have no doubt you're right.


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## Knitted by Nan (Aug 3, 2013)

Designer1234 said:


> Merrily, Merrily, Merrily Merrily, life is but a Dream!! lets have a sing along! It's a great day for singing a song!!! It's a great day ! hmmm Hmmmmm, Hummmmmmm -


Here we go loopy loo
Here we go loopy lie
All on a summers day.

This song best describes her as she is definitely loopy loo. I am looking out of my window and the red geraniums, the red bottle brush and the red hibiscus are all in full bloom and are so pretty. The birds are chirping in the trees and it is almost dawn. There in a wind blowing, almost from due north. They say we should get a thunderstorm later in the day with heavy rain. Sheep alert down south.

Now, isn't that far more interesting reading that the post from a certain other poster, who I shall just call a FOB.


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## Poor Purl (Apr 14, 2011)

EveMCooke said:


> Here we go loopy loo
> Here we go loopy lie
> All on a summers day.
> 
> ...


It sounds stunning. I can see the apartment building across the street, which is less aesthetically pleasing.

I loved your song when I was in kindergarten, but the last line was "All on a Saturday night."


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## Designer1234 (Aug 9, 2011)

DGreen said:


> Listed below are the most common English versions of the Bible. In choosing which Bible version(s) you are going to use/study, do research, discuss with Christians you respect, read the Bibles for yourself, and ultimately, ask God for wisdom regarding which Bible version He desires you to use.
> 
> King James Version (KJV)
> New International Version (NIV)
> ...


I was raised with the King James Version and now the New King James version. I just learned something new. Didn't realize there were so many copies. Hmm. KPG will really have fun with that post trying to deny -- chuckle

You are amazing Green. Hats of to you.


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## Knitted by Nan (Aug 3, 2013)

Poor Purl said:


> It sounds stunning. I can see the apartment building across the street, which is less aesthetically pleasing.
> 
> I loved your song when I was in kindergarten, but the last line was "All on a Saturday night."


That is my problem, I did not go to kindy. It was not free back then. I always tell people I failed Kindy, I failed cut and paste and sandbox. I could not remember the last line, but now I am hearing it in my head and I can hear "all on a Saturday night". Thanks for setting me straight.

Australia is in mourning at the moment. Gough Whitlam died, aged 98 years. He was a former Prime Minister. He was the leader of the Australian Labor Party in the 70s. A great man. There is a thread here on KP where some Aussies have expressed their feelings.


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## Designer1234 (Aug 9, 2011)

EveMCooke said:


> Here we go loopy loo
> Here we go loopy lie
> All on a summers day.
> 
> ...


 I like loopy de loo a lot better - more fitting. There's a song in my heart! I wonder if someone would take a 'slow boat to China ' wouldn't that be nice? 'Autumn leaves' here on the island -- so beautiful. When there's s breeze on Lake Louise? (she loved Lake Louise so that is a song she might sing.) maybe Sentimental Journey?? hmm maybe I will feel that once I am here for awhile. Even Springtime in the rockies might give me a pang or two.

I always feel better when I join a sing along. Anyone else have a title or two to add to the list? I still like Loopy de loo best I think. Still the most fitting.

I think we shall burst into song again the next time she says she WON'T read our posts! what do you think dear friends?

I have the neck band finished on my sweater. Tomorrow I will do the bottom band and then finish with fancy cuffs. I always do my cuffs last. Better fit that way. Otherwise I always get them too short. this one will be a bit big as I have lost 20 pounds, hopefully it will look like a tunic - and not ridiculous. I hope to finish it tomorrow.

Son just arrived with a new cell phone - not an I phone but a good one so I can learn to text and travel with it. He is such a sweetie. I think he is glad we are here - The little one is going to dress up as a peacock for halloween. She wasn't sure whether she could but Pat and I searched all over yesterday and I found some peacock feathers for her and also some of the right colored pipe cleaners for the crown feathers. She was just beaming. DIL comes up with some great costumes so I imagine they will sort something out.

She is enjoying her new school here -carrying on with French Immersion -- showed me l00% on 3 tests she wrote so I am a proud Nana.


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## Knitted by Nan (Aug 3, 2013)

Designer1234 said:


> I like loopy de loo a lot better - more fitting. There's a song in my heart! I wonder if someone would take a 'slow boat to China ' wouldn't that be nice? 'Autumn leaves' here on the island -- so beautiful. When there's s breeze on Lake Louise? (she loved Lake Louise so that is a song she might sing.) maybe Sentimental Journey?? hmm maybe I will feel that once I am here for awhile. Even Springtime in the rockies might give me a pang or two.
> 
> I always feel better when I join a sing along. Anyone else have a title or two to add to the list? I still like Loopy de loo best I think. Still the most fitting.
> 
> I think we shall burst into song again the next time she says she WON'T read our posts! what do you think dear friends?


I think that is a great idea. I hope you do not mind if I burst into our unofficial national anthem "Waltzing Matilda"

Once a jolly swagman, camped by a billabong, under the shade of a coolibah tree.

Do you know it?


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## Designer1234 (Aug 9, 2011)

Poor Purl said:


> Everything you say is true. But I must apologize for the demands I make on people. At least, I think I must apologize because I have no idea what they are.


you never have to apologise to me. I think you are A1!


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## Designer1234 (Aug 9, 2011)

EveMCooke said:


> I think that is a great idea. I hope you do not mind if I burst into our unofficial national anthem "Waltzing Matilda"
> 
> Once a jolly swagman, camped by a billabong, under the shade of a coolibah tree.
> 
> Do you know it?


yep == and he sang as he watched and waited for the bilybong, Who comes a waltzing (?) Matilda with me!!

Been awhile - might have missed a word or two. We had aussie friends in Calgary and every time they had a drink or two that was what we all sang with them. so much fun. Now an evening like those would put me under!! Fun times down under too, where we met them. They used to call Pat and I the 'up overs'

Pokeri keri anna from New Zealand is my favorite, also God Defend New Zealand. Many memories. Our friends all learned Oh Canada for us and we reciprocated. Lots of laughs.


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## Designer1234 (Aug 9, 2011)

Poor Purl said:


> It sounds stunning. I can see the apartment building across the street, which is less aesthetically pleasing.
> 
> I loved your song when I was in kindergarten, but the last line was "All on a Saturday night."


that brings back a memory or two. Nat King Cole,Patsy Cline,
so many good singers and songs too. My favorite of Nat King Cole was Nature Boy, Might be before your time???

Then there were the Beatles. Hey Jude was well loved at our house. And So many others.

Oh JOEY why don't you just relax - and have some fun for a change??


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## Designer1234 (Aug 9, 2011)

EveMCooke said:


> This is a totally unnecessary and nasty comment.


Eve, she doesn't know how to comment any other way - everything is unnecessary and nasty.


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## Designer1234 (Aug 9, 2011)

Poor Purl said:


> Shh. She thinks Wombatnomore is VocalLisa and therefore not an Aussie. It must have come to her in one of her hallucinations.


heh heh heh - sounds like something she would think up. ha ha!


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## Designer1234 (Aug 9, 2011)

EveMCooke said:


> That is my problem, I did not go to kindy. It was not free back then. I always tell people I failed Kindy, I failed cut and paste and sandbox. I could not remember the last line, but now I am hearing it in my head and I can hear "all on a Saturday night". Thanks for setting me straight.
> 
> Australia is in mourning at the moment. Gough Whitlam died, aged 98 years. He was a former Prime Minister. He was the leader of the Australian Labor Party in the 70s. A great man. There is a thread here on KP where some Aussies have expressed their feelings.


I am sorry to hear that. I believe he was your Prime Minister when we were in New Zealand where we heard a lot more Auzzie news. He was highly thought of even up here where we aren't always that familiar with your Politicians.


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## Designer1234 (Aug 9, 2011)

knitpresentgifts said:


> And right on cue, another athestist who has no idea what she is talking about. The verse you quoted isn't talking about a woman who was raped which is what Green challenged a Christian to deny. But you don't know that, do you. :-D I warned Green not to quote Deut 22 but you just couldn't help yourself butting in thinking you were so smart. NOT - ROFLMBO


oh go take a long walk off a short pier and have a good swim (I added the last because I worry that she would report me as threatning her. Not that it would do her any good.


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## DGreen (Nov 1, 2012)

Poor Purl said:


> Aha. I believe there is a Revised Standard Version. I was going to check the original - in Hebrew - to see what it says, but I've changed my mind. I've already wasted too much time on the ravings of a lunatic.
> 
> Besides, I need to get back to my demands, whatever they are.


Think hard, Purl. You're a smart girl - I'm sure you can come up with something to demand. My suggestion? Go away.


----------



## lovethelake (Apr 6, 2011)

Designer1234 said:


> oh go take a long walk off a short pier and have a good swim (I added the last because I worry that she would report me as threatning her. Not that it would do her any good.


No I just think you are nasty. Always ready to get your dig in.


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## Poor Purl (Apr 14, 2011)

Designer1234 said:


> that brings back a memory or two. Nat King Cole,Patsy Cline,
> so many good singers and songs too. My favorite of Nat King Cole was Nature Boy, Might be before your time???
> 
> Then there were the Beatles. Hey Jude was well loved at our house. And So many others.
> ...


I loved Nature Boy. It had a mysterious air to it, just right for a young girl. I still love Nat KIng Cole, who was also a marvelous pianist in addition to his wonderful singing. I listen to old pop music a lot.


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## Poor Purl (Apr 14, 2011)

Designer1234 said:


> yep == and he sang as he watched and waited for the bilybong, Who comes a waltzing (?) Matilda with me!!
> 
> Been awhile - might have missed a word or two. We had aussie friends in Calgary and every time they had a drink or two that was what we all sang with them. so much fun. Now an evening like those would put me under!! Fun times down under too, where we met them. They used to call Pat and I the 'up overs'
> 
> Pokeri keri anna from New Zealand is my favorite, also God Defend New Zealand. Many memories. Our friends all learned Oh Canada for us and we reciprocated. Lots of laughs.


Just one mistake: He sang as he watched and waited till his _billy boiled_. I used to sing it to my son when he was a toddler, and he always asked for it when we were on a train - I have no idea why.


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## knitpresentgifts (May 21, 2013)

DGreen said:


> Listed below are the most common English versions of the Bible. In choosing which Bible version(s) you are going to use/study, do research, discuss with Christians you respect, read the Bibles for yourself, and ultimately, ask God for wisdom regarding which Bible version He desires you to use.
> 
> Read them ALL? ROFL
> .


What's the matter Green, can't read and understand my simple words specifically written to you?

Here, I've reposted just for you:

_"Oh, the Bible was written perfectly the first time, and any version tells the same story and therefore, revisions are not necessary.  _

I told you it doesn't matter what version of the Bible you read because they all tell the same story. Thank you for the list, but every version one will back up my statements if the editors did not bastardize the original Words.

Leave it to you, you couldn't understand that it doesn't matter which version of the Bible you read; it's apparent you don't understand the verses to which you referred.

I find that is true with most atheists, particularly when they try to diss or discuss The Bible - that don't know what they are talking about but prance around telling everyone what they don't know.

Hilarious.


----------



## Poor Purl (Apr 14, 2011)

DGreen said:


> Think hard, Purl. You're a smart girl - I'm sure you can come up with something to demand. My suggestion? Go away.


Designer beat me to it with "go take a long walk on a short pier." How about "Go outside and play in traffic"?


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## knitpresentgifts (May 21, 2013)

lovethelake said:


> No I just think you are nasty. Always ready to get your dig in.


I assume you're talking about Designer. If so, :thumbup:

How many times has she said 'enough said' or 'I'm out of here' or 'that is a fact' now? :-D :-D :-D

Because I assume she is the same old Crab Apple she always was, insulting everyone, mostly me, and thinking she is adding to the conversation.

So easy to ignore them, LTL, you must.


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## Designer1234 (Aug 9, 2011)

lovethelake said:


> No I just think you are nasty. Always ready to get your dig in.


Oh, Hi!!


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## Designer1234 (Aug 9, 2011)

knitpresentgifts said:


> I assume you're talking about Designer. If so, :thumbup:
> 
> How many times has she said 'enough said' or 'I'm out of here' or 'that is a fact' now? :-D :-D :-D
> 
> ...


Just like you are, once again??? Are you going to teach her how? hmmm


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## Designer1234 (Aug 9, 2011)

Poor Purl said:


> Just one mistake: He sang as he watched and waited till his _billy boiled_. I used to sing it to my son when he was a toddler, and he always asked for it when we were on a train - I have no idea why.


you are right, I knew it wasn't correct but couldn't remember the right words for the life of me.


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## DGreen (Nov 1, 2012)

Poor Purl said:


> Designer beat me to it with "go take a long walk on a short pier." How about "Go outside and play in traffic"?


How about, "How many times do I have to flush to get rid of you?"


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## Designer1234 (Aug 9, 2011)

DGreen said:


> How about, "How many times do I have to flush to get rid of you?"


I like that one too. Actually you girls are brilliant.


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## Designer1234 (Aug 9, 2011)

oops, double post.

Oh, by the way wombat - lots of nice things being said about your shawl. With good reason.


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## Poor Purl (Apr 14, 2011)

Designer1234 said:


> Oh, Hi!!


 :XD: :XD: :XD:


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## Poor Purl (Apr 14, 2011)

DGreen said:


> How about, "How many times do I have to flush to get rid of you?"


You win!


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## Designer1234 (Aug 9, 2011)

Poor Purl said:


> You win!


They are all pretty good but I think it is the best one. although I still do like ' a long walk off a short pier' I love the picture that comes to mind.

We just had a really good spaghetti dinner - both of us ate way too much. Lucky for me dh is doing the dishes. He is one of those unsual men who says 'if mom cooks we clean up. My dil's have all thought my sons were really well trained in dish doing -- not me - my dear hubby - every meal. Now it is second nature for my son.

It has been a real gift he has given me all these years.(59) He appreciates all I do and I appreciate all he does. we are so very lucky. Knew each other 3 days. still shake my head.

Oh well, back to my knitting. I WILL be back if anyone is concerned I am dropping out of sight (grin).


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## Knitted by Nan (Aug 3, 2013)

lovethelake said:


> No I just think you are nasty. Always ready to get your dig in.


Up jumped the swagman jumped into the billabong
You'll never catch me alive said he,
And his ghost may be heard as you pass by that billabong
You'll come a Waltzing Matilda with me.


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## Wombatnomore (Dec 9, 2013)

Designer1234 said:


> oops, double post.
> 
> Oh, by the way wombat - lots of nice things being said about your shawl. With good reason.


Thanks Designer. I've just replied to your post in that thread.


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## Wombatnomore (Dec 9, 2013)

I had written him a letter which I had, for want of better

Knowledge, sent to where I met him down the Lachlan, years ago,

He was shearing when I knew him, so I sent the letter to him,

Just on spec, addressed as follows, Clancy, of The Overflow.


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## Knitted by Nan (Aug 3, 2013)

Poor Purl said:


> I loved Nature Boy. It had a mysterious air to it, just right for a young girl. I still love Nat KIng Cole, who was also a marvelous pianist in addition to his wonderful singing. I listen to old pop music a lot.


 I remember Nature Boy, my older sister would sing it. It was a gentler time back then and you could understand the lyrics. They did not gyrate across the stage with the guitars protruding out the front at an awkward angle. Question: why is awkward such an awkward word to spell and why does it look funny when you write it?


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## Knitted by Nan (Aug 3, 2013)

knitpresentgifts said:


> What's the matter Green, can't read and understand my simple words specifically written to you?
> .......
> I find that is true with most atheists, particularly when they try to diss or discuss The Bible - that don't know what they are talking about but prance around telling everyone what they don't know.
> 
> Hilarious.


Bang Bang!
chitty chitty
Chitty Chitty Bang Bang
Chitty Chitty Bang Bang
Chitty Chitty Bang Bang.
Chitty Chitty Bang Bang.
Chitty Bang Bang Chitty Chitty Bang Bang
Chitty Bang Bang Chitty Chitty Bang Bang
Chitty Bang Bang Chitty Chitty Bang Bang
Oh you pretty Chitty Bang Bang,
Chitty Chitty Bang Bang
We love you.


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## Wombatnomore (Dec 9, 2013)

I sang Nat King Coles 'The Autumn Leaves' to the whole school of acting for singers (of which I was taking part) years ago.

It's such a beautiful song and lovely to sing. I love Nat King Cole and his daughter Natalie. Both fine singers.


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## Knitted by Nan (Aug 3, 2013)

knitpresentgifts said:


> I assume you're talking about Designer. If so, :thumbup:
> 
> How many times has she said 'enough said' or 'I'm out of here' or 'that is a fact' now? :-D :-D :-D
> 
> ...


Then in comes the swagman all covered with flies
He throws down his roll, wipes the sweat from his eyes
But when he is told he say, "What's this I hear?
I've trudged fifty flamin' miles to a pub with no beer?"


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## Knitted by Nan (Aug 3, 2013)

Designer1234 said:


> you are right, I knew it wasn't correct but couldn't remember the right words for the life of me.


We do not mind if you fluff the words here and there, just as long as you join in the chorus. :thumbup: :thumbup:


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## Knitted by Nan (Aug 3, 2013)

Designer1234 said:


> They are all pretty good but I think it is the best one. although I still do like ' a long walk off a short pier' I love the picture that comes to mind.
> 
> We just had a really good spaghetti dinner - both of us ate way too much. Lucky for me dh is doing the dishes. He is one of those unsual men who says 'if mom cooks we clean up. My dil's have all thought my sons were really well trained in dish doing -- not me - my dear hubby - every meal. Now it is second nature for my son.
> 
> ...


Did you have garlic bread with the spag for dinner. Just love garlic bread, especially with Italian food.


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## Knitted by Nan (Aug 3, 2013)

Wombatnomore said:


> I had written him a letter which I had, for want of better
> 
> Knowledge, sent to where I met him down the Lachlan, years ago,
> 
> ...


I prefer the lines

The language uninviting of the gutter children fighting.


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## damemary (Mar 14, 2012)

Tucson is amazing. It has 10,000 ft (?) Mt. Lemmon right on the edge of town. Everything from cactus to pines. It's all there.



Designer1234 said:


> Dame - I second the motion. It is so beautiful and so different than where I come from. I fell in love with the desert when we drove over the hill and looked down on St. George Utah and saw all the red rocks etc. Then when we came into Phoenix it was like a new world opened up.
> 
> The Giant Saquaros, the wonderful shrubs and cacti. We spent our first two weeks in Arizona camping at Usery Park in Mesa(?) Apache Junction(?) that was where I really fell in love with that wonderful place. Pat hiked all over the Superstition mountains the years we were there- picacho Peak, Flat iron, and on and on. Have you ever been to the Gallery of the sun in Tucson (It is where all Ted DeGrazias work is kept and he is buried. What a wonderful place.
> 
> ...


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## Designer1234 (Aug 9, 2011)

EveMCooke said:


> I remember Nature Boy, my older sister would sing it. It was a gentler time back then and you could understand the lyrics. They did not gyrate across the stage with the guitars protruding out the front at an awkward angle. Question: why is awkward such an awkward word to spell and why does it look funny when you write it?


because it acts like it sounds and means?????


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## Designer1234 (Aug 9, 2011)

EveMCooke said:


> Did you have garlic bread with the spag for dinner. Just love garlic bread, especially with Italian food.


yep == first bread I have made since we moved. Tomorrow I am going to go to meet some ladies who are knitters. I have been enquiring around and I think I will also do some things for Charity. Not sure what they will need. there is a hospital near here so I am sure I can find some use for afghans or baby things. I have a sock to finish for my husband and my sweater. I also want to start another stashbuster as I am going to teach it - not sure whether it will be a cardigan or pullover. The class won't be until Febrary so I have some time.


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## Designer1234 (Aug 9, 2011)

EveMCooke said:


> We do not mind if you fluff the words here and there, just as long as you join in the chorus. :thumbup: :thumbup:


That I will but I have to admit the last time I sang Jolly swagman was with our Aussie Friends at an Australian party they took us to in Calgary. We had a great time and I met a lot of Aussie Canadians. The whole group sang it. also I still call Australia home. It is funny I am a Canadian whereever i go and it seems the same with those "downunder".


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## BrattyPatty (May 2, 2011)

Hi Shirl! Just got home from Palm Beach and see that things haven't changed much. 
Looks like KPG has been on one of her senseless rants again.They are becoming routine.
Hope your move went well and that you will be happy where you are living now.
After being in Florida for a week, it was hard to come home to the chilly fall weather.


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## cookiequeen (Jun 15, 2011)

Designer1234 said:


> yep == first bread I have made since we moved. Tomorrow I am going to go to meet some ladies who are knitters. I have been enquiring around and I think I will also do some things for Charity. Not sure what they will need. there is a hospital near here so I am sure I can find some use for afghans or baby things. I have a sock to finish for my husband and my sweater. I also want to start another stashbuster as I am going to teach it - not sure whether it will be a cardigan or pullover. The class won't be until Febrary so I have some time.


Hi, friends
I'm glad the class isn't until February because I'd like to take it and I have too many things going on now.
Shirley, you're really jumping right into your new location! I hope you find a good group of knitters there.


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## BrattyPatty (May 2, 2011)

soloweygirl said:


> Your comprehension is definitely lacking. I did not say anything about your workshops being the reason you weren't on the threads. YOU MADE THAT UP. What I did say was that you need to make up your mind if you will or will not return to the threads as it was getting boring listening to you complain how the threads were so nasty and it saddened you and you didn't know if you will return after taking a break from posting, blah, blah blah. I was only referring to the fact that you continuously said you were leaving the political threads and then never left - not because of your workshops. You brought the workshops into the conversation later on. Be honest for a change. You are hardly a victim, so stop playing one.
> 
> What you said in your last paragraph goes both ways. "You don't know me - you don't like me and the feeling is mutual."


Nobody is twisting your arm to read her posts. Wow, talk about unoriginal! Your first sentence is from the KPG playbook.


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## Designer1234 (Aug 9, 2011)

EveMCooke said:


> We do not mind if you fluff the words here and there, just as long as you join in the chorus. :thumbup: :thumbup:


You are a friend, Eve. I wish we could all get together. It would be a fun time. They are lots of fun when you meet people on line who you have never met. I organized a retreat in 2000 with Online quilters from the CdnQuiltswappers and quilt chat - it is an annual even now and some of the original group still attend every year. We had people from Maine, Mass. NY, California and Idaho, as well as 2 from the Maritimes, Barrie Ont. Winnipeg, Saskatoon, Alberta and BC. No one looked like we expected them to look.Life long friends. I am still in touch with most of them. I haven't gone for the past 3 years since Pat was sick as I don't quilt any more.


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## cookiequeen (Jun 15, 2011)

BrattyPatty said:


> Hi Shirl! Just got home from Palm Beach and see that things haven't changed much.
> Looks like KPG has been on one of her senseless rants again.They are becoming routine.
> Hope your move went well and that you will be happy where you are living now.
> After being in Florida for a week, it was hard to come home to the chilly fall weather.


Hi, Bratty. 
Thought about going to Minnesota, but our weather here was so glorious that I couldn't quite bring myself to do it!


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## BrattyPatty (May 2, 2011)

soloweygirl said:


> I haven't stolen anyone's avatar. What are you talking about? Just jumping in to say something negative? Do you have to be part of the "group" 100% of the time or can't you be an individual?


Google your user name and see how many are there including mine.
Why is that, solo? The rest of your post is ridiculous.


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## Designer1234 (Aug 9, 2011)

BrattyPatty said:


> Hi Shirl! Just got home from Palm Beach and see that things haven't changed much.
> Looks like KPG has been on one of her senseless rants again.They are becoming routine.
> Hope your move went well and that you will be happy where you are living now.
> After being in Florida for a week, it was hard to come home to the chilly fall weather.


Yes we are ensconced on Vancouver Island after what seemed an endless move, between packing, moving, waiting for our furniture and finally moving in and unpacking. Both of us have taken it really easy but we are loving it. Thanks for the kind thoughts. Yes, our 'friend ' is still visiting us - same old thing. Never will change. Nice to see you back. You are a huge part of this group and I missed you.


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## BrattyPatty (May 2, 2011)

cookiequeen said:


> Hi, Bratty.
> Thought about going to Minnesota, but our weather here was so glorious that I couldn't quite bring myself to do it!


Hi Al! Went to Florida for a family funeral. My uncle, the patriarch of the family passed away. The service was beautiful and touching.
I celebrated his life with all of my cousins. We were treated to 2 days at the Breakers in Palm Beach by his daughter in law.What a place! 
I got back Friday to 50 dg and misty rain.  Oh well, it is Minnesota after all! My son picked me up and we tuled around Minneapolis for the day. Had a great time with him, too!
Please do come! We can get together with Cheeky and have some fun!


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## Designer1234 (Aug 9, 2011)

BrattyPatty said:


> Google your user name and see how many are there including mine.
> Why is that, solo? The rest of your post is ridiculous.


She gives me a hard time because I leave and you a hard time because you stay - really!!!

I think she is due for another kitty dance.

(Solo really likes it when I post a dancing cat)


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## BrattyPatty (May 2, 2011)

Speaking of Florida, did you happen to see clips of the latest debate between Charlie Christ and Rick Scott?


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## BrattyPatty (May 2, 2011)

Designer1234 said:


> She gives me a hard time because I leave and you a hard time because you stay - really!!!
> 
> I think she is due for another kitty dance.
> 
> (Solo really likes it when I post a dancing cat)


HAHAHAHA!! Love that dancing kitty! Oh well, some people consider the glass half empty while I prefer to consider it as half full.


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## Poor Purl (Apr 14, 2011)

Wombatnomore said:


> I had written him a letter which I had, for want of better
> 
> Knowledge, sent to where I met him down the Lachlan, years ago,
> 
> ...


This is very similar to the songs by Robert W. Service about Alaska during the Gold Rush, like "Dangerous Dan McGrew" and "The Cremation of Sam McGee."

*The Shooting of Dan McGrew*
_A bunch of the boys were whooping it up in the Malamute saloon;
The kid that handles the music-box was hitting a jag-time tune;
Back of the bar, in a solo game, sat Dangerous Dan McGrew,
And watching his luck was his light-o'-love, the lady that's known as Lou.

When out of the night, which was fifty below, and into the din and the glare,
There stumbled a miner fresh from the creeks, dog-dirty, and loaded for bear.
He looked like a man with a foot in the grave and scarcely the strength of a louse,
Yet he tilted a poke of dust on the bar, and he called for drinks for the house.
There was none could place the stranger's face, though we searched ourselves for a clue;
But we drank his health, and the last to drink was Dangerous Dan McGrew. _

And on and on till everyone's dead except the lady that's known as Lou. There's also

*Sam McGee*
_ There are strange things done in the midnight sun
By the men who moil for gold;
The Arctic trails have their secret tales
That would make your blood run cold;
The Northern Lights have seen queer sights,
But the queerest they ever did see
Was that night on the marge of Lake Lebarge
I cremated Sam McGee. _

Et cetera, et cetera, and so forth.


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## Wombatnomore (Dec 9, 2013)

Poor Purl said:


> This is very similar to the songs by Robert W. Service about Alaska during the Gold Rush, like "Dangerous Dan McGrew" and "The Cremation of Sam McGee."
> 
> *The Shooting of Dan McGrew*
> _A bunch of the boys were whooping it up in the Malamute saloon;
> ...


Spooky! Very similar. In year 6 we were taught to recite Clancy of the Overflow by rote. Every week, we had to stand and recite it. I have fond memories of that. It wasn't until later that I understood the poem's literary significance. Studying it, I marvel at how well it is written and how it truly captured the stockman's way of life then.

http://www.wallisandmatilda.com.au/clancy-of-the-overflow.shtml


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## Poor Purl (Apr 14, 2011)

EveMCooke said:


> I remember Nature Boy, my older sister would sing it. It was a gentler time back then and you could understand the lyrics. They did not gyrate across the stage with the guitars protruding out the front at an awkward angle. Question: why is awkward such an awkward word to spell and why does it look funny when you write it?


At the risk of sounding pedantic --- wait, look who I'm apologizing to!

K is a funny letter; a lot of comedians say so. The the K is surrounded by two W's. How many words do you think have two W's in them? Not many, and even fewer have them in combination with a K. It's the _wkw_ that makes it look awkward.

But back to Nature Boy: in the forties and fifties, most popular songs were written by people who wrote for Broadway: they were literate, they were adult, they were professional, and they worked hard on both music and lyrics. They didn't have to perform the songs they wrote; they left that to other professionals. Sometime in the sixties, the music was taken over by rebellious guys in their teens and twenties. They had recently invented sex, they all could play guitars (a much simpler instrument than a piano), and they had very loud voices, which were often unpleasant. This is what the kids wanted to listen to, and you end up with what you described.

Recently, as those guys have grown into their sixties and seventies, many of them have started singing the old standards. Not even just the older singers. Lady Gaga recently made a CD with Tony Bennett, and she's very good.


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## Poor Purl (Apr 14, 2011)

EveMCooke said:


> Bang Bang!
> chitty chitty
> Chitty Chitty Bang Bang
> Chitty Chitty Bang Bang
> ...


----------



## Poor Purl (Apr 14, 2011)

EveMCooke said:


> Then in comes the swagman all covered with flies
> He throws down his roll, wipes the sweat from his eyes
> But when he is told he say, "What's this I hear?
> I've trudged fifty flamin' miles to a pub with no beer?"


What a perfect response.


----------



## Poor Purl (Apr 14, 2011)

EveMCooke said:


> I prefer the lines
> 
> The language uninviting of the gutter children fighting.


What are these lines from?


----------



## Poor Purl (Apr 14, 2011)

BrattyPatty said:


> Hi Shirl! Just got home from Palm Beach and see that things haven't changed much.
> Looks like KPG has been on one of her senseless rants again.They are becoming routine.
> Hope your move went well and that you will be happy where you are living now.
> After being in Florida for a week, it was hard to come home to the chilly fall weather.


Yay, Patty's back. (Isn't there a song with the words "her shoes Patty wack in the front and the back" in it?


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## Poor Purl (Apr 14, 2011)

BrattyPatty said:


> Nobody is twisting your arm to read her posts. Wow, talk about unoriginal! Your first sentence is from the KPG playbook.


 :thumbup: :thumbup: :thumbup:


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## Poor Purl (Apr 14, 2011)

Designer1234 said:


> She gives me a hard time because I leave and you a hard time because you stay - really!!!
> 
> I think she is due for another kitty dance.
> 
> (Solo really likes it when I post a dancing cat)


We all like it when you post a dancing cat (except maybe CookieQueen), but nobody likes it as much as Solo. It goes so well with her doggie shoes.


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## Poor Purl (Apr 14, 2011)

BrattyPatty said:


> Speaking of Florida, did you happen to see clips of the latest debate between Charlie Christ and Rick Scott?


I saw some. Rick Scott is so bizarre looking, and he has a mechanical way of speaking. Wasn't he once convicted of some kind of medical fraud? or at least accused?

Oh, well. Once a Rick, always a Rick.


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## Poor Purl (Apr 14, 2011)

Wombatnomore said:


> Spooky! Very similar. In year 6 we were taught to recite Clancy of the Overflow by rote. Every week, we had to stand and recite it. I have fond memories of that. It wasn't until later that I understood the poem's literary significance. Studying it, I marvel at how well it is written and how it truly captured the stockman's way of life then.
> 
> http://www.wallisandmatilda.com.au/clancy-of-the-overflow.shtml


Does Clancy have a tune? McGrew does.


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## Poor Purl (Apr 14, 2011)

Wombatnomore said:


> Spooky! Very similar. In year 6 we were taught to recite Clancy of the Overflow by rote. Every week, we had to stand and recite it. I have fond memories of that. It wasn't until later that I understood the poem's literary significance. Studying it, I marvel at how well it is written and how it truly captured the stockman's way of life then.
> 
> http://www.wallisandmatilda.com.au/clancy-of-the-overflow.shtml


It's a wonderfully written poem. The internal rhymes are very clever. Thanks for sharing.


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## Knitted by Nan (Aug 3, 2013)

Poor Purl said:


> What are these lines from?


_'Clancy of the overflow'_. By Banjo Paterson. They poem Wombat quoted from.


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## Knitter from Nebraska (Jun 9, 2013)

We are actively aiding and abetting isis!

http://www.thedailybeast.com/articles/2014/10/19/u-s-humanitarian-aid-going-to-isis.html


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## Poor Purl (Apr 14, 2011)

Knitter from Nebraska said:


> We are actively aiding and abetting isis!
> 
> http://www.thedailybeast.com/articles/2014/10/19/u-s-humanitarian-aid-going-to-isis.html


Not voluntarily. And I'd wait to hear it from something other than the Daily Beast before I got up in arms about it. Tina Brown, like Arianna Huffington, is a PR collector rather than a truth teller.

But welcome back, Nebraska. I haven't heard from you in days. Were you absent, or am I absent-minded?


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## Poor Purl (Apr 14, 2011)

EveMCooke said:


> _'Clancy of the overflow'_. By Banjo Paterson. They poem Wombat quoted from.


He's very good. I'd love to hear it sung. The rhymes are really clever.

Okay, to Google!
_5 minutes later_






This has good pictures, but I'm not impressed by the melody. I still love the lyrics.


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## DGreen (Nov 1, 2012)

Poor Purl said:


> Not voluntarily. And I'd wait to hear it from something other than the Daily Beast before I got up in arms about it. Tina Brown, like Arianna Huffington, is a PR collector rather than a truth teller.
> 
> But welcome back, Nebraska. I haven't heard from you in days. Were you absent, or am I absent-minded?


Nebraska evidently would rather have the world let innocent people die than provide humanitarian aid. After all, they're nothing but takers.


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## lovethelake (Apr 6, 2011)

DGreen said:


> Nebraska evidently would rather have the world let innocent people die than provide humanitarian aid. After all, they're nothing but takers.


Prove that statement, because think it is slanderous and totally untrue. I considerate that comment not only a total lie, but possibly an act of desperation to either get attention.


----------



## Designer1234 (Aug 9, 2011)

I just posted this about l0 minutes ago:

ATTENTION: I just turned on the news. A soldier standing on guard in front of the "Tomb of the Unknown Soldier" in front of our Parliament buildings was shot. I understand (I just turned it on) that there is someone in the Parliament buildings now and the Prime Minister has been removed and is safe. Shots have been heard in the main foyer of Parliament Hill.It is happening right now and is 'raw' news. SHEESH!!

They have been saying this past week that those in uniform should be very very careful so they must have known something was in the air.

It just came on that one of thje Members of Parliament texted that the Police have shot the shooter - not confirmed. Another text from a different MP confirms this.

I imagine the news is on American stations now too.


----------



## Designer1234 (Aug 9, 2011)

Since then it sounds as if the shooter was killed (confirmed by text from two Members of Parliament who witnessed it). The Prime Minister and Leader of the Opposition have been taken out of the Building and are safe.

No word as to whether the Soldier who was guarding the unknown Soldiers Tomb survived but he was taken to the hospital I believe.


----------



## DGreen (Nov 1, 2012)

lovethelake said:


> Prove that statement, because think it is slanderous and totally untrue. I considerate that comment not only a total lie, but possibly an act of desperation to either get attention.


We all know KPG's position on issues, which is consistently negative and critical when it comes to our current government. Because of her comment, one can reasonably assume she posted it with the intent to criticize. You can defend her all you want; everyone here knows she is unfailingly negative.

By the way, you didn't finish your last sentence or was that your complete thought?


----------



## knitpresentgifts (May 21, 2013)

DGreen said:


> We all know KPG's position on issues, which is consistently negative and critical when it comes to our current government. Because of her comment, one can reasonably assume she posted it with the intent to criticize. You can defend her all you want; everyone here knows she is unfailingly negative.
> 
> By the way, you didn't finish your last sentence or was that your complete thought?


Drinking so early Green? You can never keep people nor facts straight. I'm not KFN, nor am I negative or agree nor hold the same positions as she does on most things.

Get a grip and stop your forever disparaging of everything not Liberal.

Oh, and I don't spend 24/7 on KP running my mouth about the issues, unlike you, so you have no idea of my position on most things.

I remain flattered, however, how often you, and I presume all the Libs, bring up my name constantly. At least I know y'all are reading my every word. Maybe you'll learn something. :-D


----------



## Designer1234 (Aug 9, 2011)

knitpresentgifts said:


> Drinking so early Green? You can never keep people nor facts straight. I'm not KFN, nor am I negative or agree or hold the same positions as she does on most things.
> 
> Get a grip and stop your forever disparaging of everything not Liberal.
> 
> ...


I would start a sing along but as Ottawa is under attack I will not bother --


----------



## Poor Purl (Apr 14, 2011)

DGreen said:


> Nebraska evidently would rather have the world let innocent people die than provide humanitarian aid. After all, they're nothing but takers.


I wouldn't go that far. If it's clear that all humanitarian aid is going to the inhuman ISIS, I'd want the plug pulled. But I'd want to wait until we know it for a fact.


----------



## Poor Purl (Apr 14, 2011)

lovethelake said:


> Prove that statement, because think it is slanderous and totally untrue. I considerate that comment not only a total lie, but possibly an act of desperation to either get attention.


Obviously it's an opinion, and therefore can't be "totally untrue" or "a total lie."

And "an act of desperation to *either* get attention" or what? DGreen gets plenty of attention already; I doubt that she's desperate for more. Of course, you could say the same about your own truncated message.


----------



## Knitted by Nan (Aug 3, 2013)

.


----------



## Knitted by Nan (Aug 3, 2013)

lovethelake said:


> Prove that statement, because think it is slanderous and totally untrue. I considerate that comment not only a total lie, but possibly an act of desperation to either get attention.


----------



## Poor Purl (Apr 14, 2011)

Designer1234 said:


> I would start a sing along but as Ottawa is under attack I will not bother --


Just keep on dancing. I hope the situation is over and they've caught everyone involved. It doesn't sound like Canada (unless the shooter is a French separatist).


----------



## Knitted by Nan (Aug 3, 2013)

knitpresentgifts said:


> Drinking so early Green? You can never keep people nor facts straight. I'm not KFN, nor am I negative or agree nor hold the same positions as she does on most things.
> 
> Get a grip and stop your forever disparaging of everything not Liberal.
> 
> ...


----------



## Poor Purl (Apr 14, 2011)

Love it!


----------



## Designer1234 (Aug 9, 2011)

Poor Purl said:


> Just keep on dancing. I hope the situation is over and they've caught everyone involved. It doesn't sound like Canada (unless the shooter is a French separatist).


Remember we are next door to the States and have the same values so we are actually quite a logical place. Sad and scary.

I guess we are going to have to live differently now too. So sad.

It still seems as if they think there might be 2 or 3 more people. It is hard to know at this stage - but better safe than sorry. It is sad. The tomb of the Unknown soldier is a wonderful memorial - the two soldiers standing on guard there (24 hours there is an honor guard from all the services) were attacked. one shot in the Chest and now in the hospital. It sounds as if the terrorist drove to the Parliament buildings and was in the main foyer (which is huge) PM and Leaders of the opposition were taken out of the building. Two Members of Parliament texted when they shot the terrorist as they saw it so that is definite information. Police believe there are more but I am not sure if that is the case. Scary stuff.

We have had young Canadians join the jihadists (actually there was a cell discoveredin Calgary recently. 3 young Calgarians joined them and have been killed, One was a
suicide bomber from what I have heard. I am not very knowledgeable as we were off line, off tv and packing and moving for the past month so missed a lot about it.


----------



## Poor Purl (Apr 14, 2011)

EveMCooke said:


> knitpresentgifts said:
> 
> 
> > Maybe you'll learn something.


The only thing I've learned from reading KPG's messages is how to throw up noiselessly.


----------



## Poor Purl (Apr 14, 2011)

Designer1234 said:


> Remember we are next door to the States and have the same values so we are actually quite a logical place. Sad and scary.
> 
> I guess we are going to have to live differently now too. So sad.
> 
> ...


It must feel as though you came back to a different county.

I know that Canada is right above the border, but the gun culture is certainly different. I'm sorry things are moving in the wrong direction. It was always so comforting to know that if things got really bad here, we could just go north.


----------



## Designer1234 (Aug 9, 2011)

Poor Purl said:


> The only thing I've learned from reading KPG's messages is how to throw up noiselessly.


beautifully stated!


----------



## Designer1234 (Aug 9, 2011)

lovethelake said:


> Prove that statement, because think it is slanderous and totally untrue. I considerate that comment not only a total lie, but possibly an act of desperation to either get attention.


----------



## Designer1234 (Aug 9, 2011)

Poor Purl said:


> It must feel as though you came back to a different county.
> 
> I know that Canada is right above the border, but the gun culture is certainly different. I'm sorry things are moving in the wrong direction. It was always so comforting to know that if things got really bad here, we could just go north.


You are right - our gun laws and ideas are at the other end of the spectrum in most people. However we stand with the US on most things internationally. It is logical to attack us here. However, Interesting to see what changes happen. Certainly we will likely start paying more attention to anti terrorist activities. We have, in my opinion good police forces here and excellent Emergency Services people (ambulance, Paramedics and EMT's) (I know as Pat was one of them before he retired. The world is getting smaller and this group infiltrates everywhere from the sounds of things.

It is something that I think needs to be dealt with by all the western Countries (that includes down under) as the "WESt" ( in the eyes of IS..I am still watching the Canadian Broadcasting Corp. CBC and it seems there is no absolute confirmation that there are other shooters. It sounds as if they think there are, but don't know whether they know there are. More news as to what is actually happening. CBC is the one we watch for national news if anyone is interested. I see CNN and Fox are both reporting on it too. I think your first info might be CBC though.


----------



## BrattyPatty (May 2, 2011)

lovethelake said:


> Prove that statement, because think it is slanderous and totally untrue. I considerate that comment not only a total lie, but possibly an act of desperation to either get attention.


Spoken like a true hick, LTL. 
LtL _considerates_ things


----------



## Wombatnomore (Dec 9, 2013)

What's happened in Canada is shocking. I'm watching it all unfold on television. For a fleeting second whilst watching, I wondered if it was a 'drill.' Given that Canada has only very recently raised it's terror threat, it would make sense but sadly, I realized I was wrong.

I fear the events in Canada is a precursor for many others involving many western countries. Will it be ongoing? My hunch is yes.


----------



## Wombatnomore (Dec 9, 2013)

Reports coming in that the soldier shot at the War Memorial has died. Bloody hell.


----------



## Poor Purl (Apr 14, 2011)

BrattyPatty said:


> Spoken like a true hick, LTL.
> LtL _considerates_ things


Wow, I missed that. It's so good to have you around, Patty.


----------



## Gerslay (Oct 4, 2011)

BrattyPatty said:


> Spoken like a true hick, LTL.
> LtL _considerates_ things


For your 'consideration' Brat!



BrattyPatty said:


> My son picked me up and we *tuled *around Minneapolis for the day. Had a great time with him, too!


(Edited the full post for brevity.)


----------



## Poor Purl (Apr 14, 2011)

Gerslay said:


> For your 'consideration' Brat!(Edited the full post for brevity.)
> 
> 
> BrattyPatty said:
> ...


Good catch, Gerslay! I'm pretty sure she meant "tulled," as she was wearing a bridal veil and he was in a tutu.


----------



## Gerslay (Oct 4, 2011)

Poor Purl said:


> Good catch, Gerslay! I'm pretty sure she meant "tulled," as she was wearing a bridal veil and he was in a tutu.


Well that explains it then...!

:thumbup:


----------



## Cindy S (Oct 20, 2013)

lovethelake said:


> Prove that statement, because think it is slanderous and totally untrue. I considerate that comment not only a total lie, but possibly an act of desperation to either get attention.


For Pete's sake, someone translate this into understandable English


----------



## BrattyPatty (May 2, 2011)

Gerslay said:


> Well that explains it then...!
> 
> :thumbup:


Tule around is slang for out and about. You won't find it in the dictionary,
Gerslay. But you had to try.


----------



## BrattyPatty (May 2, 2011)

Cindy S said:


> For Pete's sake, someone translate this into understandable English


That's rural Virginia"'English", Cindy. Good luck with that! 
I think someone has been hitting the moonshine a little too hard!


----------



## BrattyPatty (May 2, 2011)

Poor Purl said:


> Good catch, Gerslay! I'm pretty sure she meant "tulled," as she was wearing a bridal veil and he was in a tutu.


 :XD: :XD: :XD: :XD: 
I can't imagine my son in a tutu. The spell check on this site poo poo'ed
tulled.


----------



## BrattyPatty (May 2, 2011)

Poor Purl said:


> I saw some. Rick Scott is so bizarre looking, and he has a mechanical way of speaking. Wasn't he once convicted of some kind of medical fraud? or at least accused?
> 
> Oh, well. Once a Rick, always a Rick.


He is accused of many, many dirty deeds, Purl. Scott refused to come out on the stage because the rules of the debate stated that no electronic devices could be used. He threw a fit because Christ had a fan under his podium. When in the second debate, Charlie Christ was alone on the stage . Scott blatantly lied and said " You said you weren't coming" to Christ.
You are correct. He is very weird looking right down to his skinny bald head and pointed ears.


----------



## soloweygirl (Jun 9, 2012)

BrattyPatty said:


> Nobody is twisting your arm to read her posts. Wow, talk about unoriginal! Your first sentence is from the KPG playbook.


What does KPG have to do with my post to Designer? Speaking of being unoriginal, you're still acting the age of the child in your avatar, although she is obviously way more mature. You're another one that must be a "joy" to be around in a social setting.


----------



## BrattyPatty (May 2, 2011)

soloweygirl said:


> What does KPG have to do with my post to Designer? Speaking of being unoriginal, you're still acting the age of the child in your avatar, although she is obviously way more mature. You're another one that must be a "joy" to be around in a social setting.


You make me laugh. You have not one original thought in your little head. I am sure you are way more mature than me, too. You come off as a sour and bitter old bag. A crotchety old woman with a bad attitude and the typical downer outlook on life.
As matter of fact I am a blast in social settings! I picture you standing far from the laughter and thinking of ways to pee on everyone's parade. 
Good try, but your inane barbs can't get under my skin, solo. Never have and never will.
Have a sparkling day! :XD: :XD: :XD:

Someone let the dogs out, it smells in here.


----------



## Designer1234 (Aug 9, 2011)

Cindy S said:


> For Pete's sake, someone translate this into understandable English


not possible????


----------



## Designer1234 (Aug 9, 2011)

BrattyPatty said:


> :XD: :XD: :XD: :XD:
> I can't imagine my son in a tutu. The spell check on this site poo poo'ed
> tulled.


In Canada we would have said tooled around. Different places different spellings. We used to say that when we biked or motor biked or drove aimlessly. Haven't heard it for some time.


----------



## BrattyPatty (May 2, 2011)

Designer1234 said:


> In Canada we would have said tooled around. Different places different spellings.


It could very well be that it is spelled the same way as in Canada, Shirl!
Purl had it right, though. Tulle is a fabric.


----------



## Designer1234 (Aug 9, 2011)

BrattyPatty said:


> It could very well be that it is spelled the same way as in Canada, Shirl!
> Purl had it right, though. Tulle is a fabric.


Right Bratty. I see you are one of Solo's favorite people too. I don't feel so "alone" now. Maybe we should feel honoured (Canadian spelling, not spell check for once).

Yep , I have used tulle often in my wall hangings, makes good lake ice


----------



## Designer1234 (Aug 9, 2011)

lovethelake said:


> Prove that statement, because think it is slanderous and totally untrue. I considerate that comment not only a total lie, but possibly an act of desperation to either get attention.


 :shock: :shock: :shock: :shock: :shock: :shock: :shock:


----------



## BrattyPatty (May 2, 2011)

Designer1234 said:


> :shock: :shock: :shock: :shock: :shock: :shock: :shock:


..."either get attention" or what? I just hate when people leave you hanging.

:shock: :?: :shock: :?:


----------



## knitpresentgifts (May 21, 2013)

BrattyPatty said:


> ..."either get attention" or what? I just hate when people leave you hanging.
> 
> :shock: :?: :shock: :?:


Oh, you must mean like Damemary did today on another thread:



damemary said:


> Bravo to Canada's government Health Care SYSYEM.
> 
> Sympathy to all those subjected to such violence....unless.....


Please explain what the heck a "SYSYEM" is and thanks for identifying the people you hate.

Hate is a strong word but you're up to it I guess.


----------



## knitpresentgifts (May 21, 2013)

BrattyPatty said:


> He is accused of many, many dirty deeds, Purl. Scott refused to come out on the stage because the rules of the debate stated that no electronic devices could be used. He threw a fit because Christ had a fan under his podium. When in the second debate, Charlie Christ was alone on the stage . Scott blatantly lied and said " You said you weren't coming" to Christ.
> You are correct. He is very weird looking right down to his skinny bald head and pointed ears.


You're wrong in your explanation about what actually happened - not surprised.

You probably were fed the info as being one of the last 100 people who actually watch MSNBC.


----------



## galinipper (Apr 30, 2013)

BrattyPatty said:


> Tule around is slang for out and about. You won't find it in the dictionary,
> Gerslay. But you had to try.


Tule is in the urban dictionary: 
It is a f--t that smells horrible and will not leave, therefore it is named tule f--t after California's tule fog that clings close to the ground and smells the place up and will not leave. Tooled around would have been a more comfortable ride.


----------



## knitpresentgifts (May 21, 2013)

soloweygirl said:


> What does KPG have to do with my post to Designer? Speaking of being unoriginal, you're still acting the age of the child in your avatar, although she is obviously way more mature. You're another one that must be a "joy" to be around in a social setting.


Funny thing, they claim they ignore me and everytime I check back to see who one of those posters I follow is referring to, often the post refers to me or mentions my name.

They are obsessed with me Solo.  Maybe now is the time to tell them long ago I filed for the adware/search and receive a royalty every time they mention me on KP. I'm raking it in - thanks y'all! :-D


----------



## knitpresentgifts (May 21, 2013)

galinipper said:


> Tule is in the urban dictionary:
> It is a f--t that smells horrible and will not leave, therefore it is named tule f--t after California's tule fog that clings close to the ground and smells the place up and will not leave. Tooled around would have been a more comfortable ride.


  if the fog hovers, claim it ...


----------



## Knitted by Nan (Aug 3, 2013)

knitpresentgifts said:


> Funny thing, they claim they ignore me and everytime I check back to see who one of those posters I follow is referring to, often the post refers to me or mentions my name.
> 
> They are obsessed with me Solo.  Maybe now is the time to tell them long ago I filed for the adware/search and receive a royalty every time they mention me on KP. I'm raking it in - thanks y'all! :-D


----------



## BrattyPatty (May 2, 2011)

galinipper said:


> Tule is in the urban dictionary:
> It is a f--t that smells horrible and will not leave, therefore it is named tule f--t after California's tule fog that clings close to the ground and smells the place up and will not leave. Tooled around would have been a more comfortable ride.


That is so expected of you and nothing more.


----------



## BrattyPatty (May 2, 2011)

knitpresentgifts said:


> if the fog hovers, claim it ...


Sorry, idiot, you own it!


----------



## BrattyPatty (May 2, 2011)

knitpresentgifts said:


> Funny thing, they claim they ignore me and everytime I check back to see who one of those posters I follow is referring to, often the post refers to me or mentions my name.
> 
> They are obsessed with me Solo.  Maybe now is the time to tell them long ago I filed for the adware/search and receive a royalty every time they mention me on KP. I'm raking it in - thanks y'all! :-D


Obsessed? No. Disgusted is the better description. You are nothing but a troll who drags the stench of her cave around her. Once again, your ego is getting the best of you, which isn't saying much.


----------



## BrattyPatty (May 2, 2011)

Exactly, Eve!


----------



## galinipper (Apr 30, 2013)

BrattyPatty said:


> That is so expected of you and nothing more.


When you said it couldn't be found in the dictionary, that's when I knew it could.


----------



## BrattyPatty (May 2, 2011)

knitpresentgifts said:


> Please explain what the heck a "SYSYEM" is and thanks for identifying the people you hate.
> 
> Hate is a strong word but you're up to it I guess.


What in the hell are you talking about? Direct your spews to the person whom you quoted. I had nothing to do with SYSEMS nor did I point out all of the people I hate. Take it up with dame. Are things slow on the etsy front, KPG? Or are you hitting the bottle early today?


----------



## BrattyPatty (May 2, 2011)

knitpresentgifts said:


> You're wrong in your explanation about what actually happened - not surprised.
> 
> You probably were fed the info as being one of the last 100 people who actually watch MSNBC.


I would rather be in the "last 100" who watches MSNBC than be the idiot who watches and believes everything she hears on Fox News.

BTW, I heard about this on a local Florida news station. Now since Rick Scott is the governor of Florida, I don't think it was a biased source. The clips on the second debate were shown on CNN as well as MSNBC. Of course they wouldn't have been shown on Fox. It would make a stupid, lying Republican look stupid and like the liar he is.
Keep showing me what you don't know, Cheryl. It is quite amusing.

:XD: :XD: :XD: :XD: :XD:


----------



## Poor Purl (Apr 14, 2011)

BrattyPatty said:


> :XD: :XD: :XD: :XD:
> I can't imagine my son in a tutu. The spell check on this site poo poo'ed
> tulled.


Sshhh. I was trying to distract Gerslay. At least spell check didn't poo poo tutu.

Have you tried "tooled around"?


----------



## BrattyPatty (May 2, 2011)

Poor Purl said:


> Sshhh. I was trying to distract Gerslay. At least spell check didn't poo poo tutu.
> 
> Have you tried "tooled around"?


Yes, Designer pointed that out to me. I have no problem saying that my son and I were "farting" around in Minneapolis. It's very common slang, wouldn't you say? :XD: :XD: :XD:


----------



## BrattyPatty (May 2, 2011)

galinipper said:


> When you said it couldn't be found in the dictionary, that's when I knew it could.


You are so clever!!


----------



## Poor Purl (Apr 14, 2011)

BrattyPatty said:


> Yes, Designer pointed that out to me. I have no problem saying that my son and I were "farting" around in Minneapolis. It's very common slang, wouldn't you say? :XD: :XD: :XD:


Around here we might say "futz around," which translates to "fart," also. So, yes, very common slang. Which is why the very common KPG dealt it here.


----------



## knitpresentgifts (May 21, 2013)

galinipper said:


> When you said it couldn't be found in the dictionary, that's when I knew it could.


 :XD:


----------



## BrattyPatty (May 2, 2011)

Poor Purl said:


> Around here we might say "futz around," which translates to "fart," also. So, yes, very common slang. Which is why the very common KPG dealt it here.


Yes, her verbal flatulence and know-nothing hot air are stinking up the place as usual.


----------



## knitpresentgifts (May 21, 2013)

BrattyPatty said:


> What in the hell are you talking about? Direct your spews to the person whom you quoted. I had nothing to do with SYSEMS nor did I point out all of the people I hate. Take it up with dame. Are things slow on the etsy front, KPG? Or are you hitting the bottle early today?


Wow - you can't spell, you cannot recopy one word I questioned, don't understand proper use of grammar, punctuation nor capitalization and cannot speak the truth. Is there anything you can do well?

No wonder I've ignored your posts for so long - thanks for the reminder.

What the heck are you talking about with etsy? BTW - I don't care, so consider this a rhetorical question.

I don't drink - that's your and the Libs' habit I believe.

Thanks for mentioning my name = $ cha-ching!


----------



## BrattyPatty (May 2, 2011)

knitpresentgifts said:


> Wow - you can't spell, you cannot copy, don't understand grammar nor punctuation and cannot speak the truth. Is there anything you can do well?
> 
> What the heck are you talking about with etsy? BTW - I don't care, so consider this a rhetorical question.
> 
> ...


Nobody knows anything except the great and powerful KPG. Ignore the putz behind the curtain. We all know what that turned out to be. A big egotistical farce.


----------



## knitpresentgifts (May 21, 2013)

BrattyPatty said:


> BTW, I heard about this on a local Florida news station. Now since Rick Scott is the governor of Floridia, I don't think it was a biased source.


Where is Floridia? Is that near Moronica or west of Idiotica? I have to ask as only you would know.


----------



## BrattyPatty (May 2, 2011)

knitpresentgifts said:


> Where is Floridia? Is that near Moronica?


Right next to your hot air balloon. Moronica? Your birth place? I don't think so. Floridians have better taste than that. Idiotica? Where you live now? Idiotica seems to be your constant state of mind. Only you would know those 2 imaginary places since they pertain only to you.

You are projecting again. The nurse will be right there with your daily dose.


----------



## knitpresentgifts (May 21, 2013)

BrattyPatty said:


> Nobody knows anything except the great and powerful KPG. Ignore the putz behind the curtain. We all know what that turned out to be. A big egotistical farce.


and again - Metadata keyword = cha-ching $!


----------



## BrattyPatty (May 2, 2011)

knitpresentgifts said:


> and again - Metadata keyword = cha-ching $!


Only in your hallucinations.


----------



## Gerslay (Oct 4, 2011)

BrattyPatty said:


> Tule around is slang for out and about. You won't find it in the dictionary,
> Gerslay. But you had to try.


Its tooling around and it IS found in the dictionary!

Tool around: ride in a car with no particular goal and just for the pleasure of it. (Wiktionary - Free Dictionary - OnlineSlangDictionary)

Goober!


----------



## BrattyPatty (May 2, 2011)

Gerslay said:


> Its tooling around and it IS found in the dictionary!
> 
> Tool around: ride in a car with no particular goal and just for the pleasure of it. (Wiktionary - Free Dictionary - OnlineSlangDictionary)
> 
> Goober!


I never said that "tooling" was not in the dictionary. I said _tuling_ was not.
Get with it Gerslay! Goober backatcha.


----------



## BrattyPatty (May 2, 2011)

LoveTheLaughter said:


> You had a brick and mortar store that went bankrupt and a failed etsy site.
> And you "don't drink" because you're a not-so-recovering alcoholic.
> 
> You need to get to those meetings sweetie. Quite obviously you've had a relapse.


 :thumbup: :thumbup: :thumbup: :thumbup: :XD: :XD: :XD: :XD:
So, a bankrupt brick and mortar store, a failed etsy site, and a drinking problem. Though the info is amusing, it is not at all surprising, Love the Laughter!
Glad I saw this before it was deleted. $$Ca-Ching!$$ Now who really knows nothing, Cherf/KPG? No wonder you are such a mess.


----------



## Gerslay (Oct 4, 2011)

BrattyPatty said:


> I never said that "tooling" was not in the dictionary. I said tuling was not.
> Get with it Gerslay! Goober backatcha.


Nice try, but that's a fail! You might want to be careful of your own spelling before you correct someone else!


----------



## GWPlver (Mar 15, 2013)

My thoughts are with our friends in Canada right now. Such a terrible situation.


----------



## BrattyPatty (May 2, 2011)

Gerslay said:


> Nice try, but that's a fail! You might want to be careful of your own spelling before you correct someone else!


Gerslay wrote:
For your 'consideration' Brat!

BrattyPatty wrote:
My son picked me up and we *tuled* around Minneapolis for the day. Had a great time with him, too!

(Edited the full post for brevity.)

Get your glasses fixed. It's exactly what I said in my quote. You failed again!

Are you saying that taking the word consider and turning it into considerate is a misspell? They are 2 completely different words!
2 fails to you. Once again, they are 2 different words and meanings, but tuled was what I said was not in the dictionary. Plain and simple.


----------



## Gerslay (Oct 4, 2011)

Goober!


----------



## knitpresentgifts (May 21, 2013)

BrattyPatty said:


> :thumbup: :thumbup: :thumbup: :thumbup: :XD: :XD: :XD: :XD:
> So, a bankrupt brick and mortar store, a failed etsy site, and a drinking problem. Though the info is amusing, it is not at all surprising, Love the Laughter!
> 
> Glad I saw this before it was deleted. $$Ca-Ching!$$


$ Cha-ching! :XD:

Never had a bankrupt brick and mortar store, nor a failed Etsy site and never a drinking problem.

Love the $ you earn me though!

Channeling Crab Apple - "enough said."

Cha-ching!

Oh, and Brat? Take some spelling lessons or at least stop correcting others when your skills are so lacking - it's Cha-ching and two (not 2).
+++++++++++++++
Oops - ETA - Lisa was talking to Bratty. I thought they were discussing me (as they usually do). :-D Oh, well, never had any of the failures the Brat did. Never had anyone in my family on SNAP either.

I didn't know the Brat had so many failures. Guess it runs in her circle of family and friends.


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## BrattyPatty (May 2, 2011)

Uh huh. Nurse is on the way for you. In the meantime, pour yourself another double to hold you over.


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## knitpresentgifts (May 21, 2013)

Gerslay said:


> Its tooling around and it IS found in the dictionary!
> 
> Tool around: ride in a car with no particular goal and just for the pleasure of it. (Wiktionary - Free Dictionary - OnlineSlangDictionary)
> 
> Goober!


She once claimed to be a certified gemologist and had no clue what a raw gemstone is when I discussed with RU. (I miss her.)

Goober doesn't cut it G. Neither does her hateful, always insulting and often foul/vulgar posts.


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## knitpresentgifts (May 21, 2013)

Gerslay said:


> Nice try, but that's a fail! You might want to be careful of your own spelling before you correct someone else!


Don't ask her to spell Florida!


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## Gerslay (Oct 4, 2011)

knitpresentgifts said:


> $ Cha-ching! :XD:
> 
> Never had a bankrupt brick and mortar store, nor a failed Etsy site and never a drinking problem.
> 
> ...


You can say that again, knitpresentgifts!!!


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## knitpresentgifts (May 21, 2013)

Yeah!

Although you could have mentioned my user name and earned me some cash, Gerslay. I'd split it with you. 

What kind of a friend are you anyway?


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## Gerslay (Oct 4, 2011)

knitpresentgifts said:


> Yeah!
> 
> Although you could have mentioned my user name and earned me some cash, Gerslay. I'd split it with you.
> 
> What kind of a friend are you anyway?


Your wish is my command, my vaulted leader!

ooops! Did I just say that?

:XD: :XD: :XD:


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## knitpresentgifts (May 21, 2013)

Gerslay said:


> Your wish is my command, my vaulted leader!
> 
> ooops! Did I just say that?
> 
> :XD: :XD: :XD:


Cool - I owe you now .... (btw: KPG earns $ too) :-D


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## knitpresentgifts (May 21, 2013)

:thumbup: good catch Admin


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## knitpresentgifts (May 21, 2013)

Gerslay - let's go where the conversation is satisfying and the spelling legible.


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## BrattyPatty (May 2, 2011)

knitpresentgifts said:


> Gerslay - let's go where the conversation is satisfying and the spelling legible.


Great idea! I would suggest that you go somewhere that you are wanted, but that would leave you no place to go. Have fun in Idiotica, your private little world.
:XD: :XD: :XD: :XD: :XD: :XD: :XD: :XD: :XD:


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## BrattyPatty (May 2, 2011)

knitpresentgifts said:


> She once claimed to be a certified gemologist and had no clue what a raw gemstone is when I discussed with RU. (I miss her.)
> 
> Goober doesn't cut it G. Neither does her hateful, always insulting and often foul/vulgar posts.


And your posts are any better? Please!! You can't get it through your tiny little brain that "raw diamond" is a sales term and not a geological term used to teach, or practice the art of gemology. One day you will see something beyond yourself and maybe really learn something. Until then, keep showing me what you don't know. :XD: :XD: :XD: :XD: :XD:


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## Designer1234 (Aug 9, 2011)

BrattyPatty said:


> Yes, Designer pointed that out to me. I have no problem saying that my son and I were "farting" around in Minneapolis. It's very common slang, wouldn't you say? :XD: :XD: :XD:


That expresses it very well,.


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## Designer1234 (Aug 9, 2011)

GWPlver said:


> My thoughts are with our friends in Canada right now. Such a terrible situation.


Thank you - it is quite horifying. The worst part is that the shooter appears to be a Canadian who has become radicalized.

Very sad for the family of the fallen soldier.


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## Designer1234 (Aug 9, 2011)

knitpresentgifts said:


> Wow - you can't spell, you cannot recopy one word I questioned, don't understand proper use of grammar, punctuation nor capitalization and cannot speak the truth. Is there anything you can do well?
> 
> No wonder I've ignored your posts for so long - thanks for the reminder.
> 
> ...


Oh quit being so Preachy!! (new word).


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## Designer1234 (Aug 9, 2011)

knitpresentgifts said:


> $ Cha-ching! :XD:
> 
> Never had a bankrupt brick and mortar store, nor a failed Etsy site and never a drinking problem.
> 
> ...


-----------------------
What exactly do you gain by posts like this--??? Nothing.


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## BrattyPatty (May 2, 2011)

knitpresentgifts said:


> $ Cha-ching! :XD:
> 
> Never had a bankrupt brick and mortar store, nor a failed Etsy site and never a drinking problem.
> 
> ...


You make me laugh! At least I have a family. I have never had to file bankruptcy on a business that I was too stupid to run, unlike you.
I never had a failed etsy site and certainly do not have a drinking problem and a lying problem like you do. Sad thing is is that you believe your own lies.
What I do have is a loving husband, 2 great kids, and a very beautiful grand daughter. Sorry, you missed out on all of that, Cheryl. Maybe that is why you are so bitter. Trying to make up for all the things lacking in your life? Oh well, it was your choice. As much as you try you will never take that joy from me. Nor will you know that joy. How sad for you.
WIC and SNAP are 2 completely different programs. I thought "the self proclaimed know it all" of this site would know that. Oh wait! You really do know nothing nor do you have anything to give but bulls*#t.
Keep praying over in D&P. You need it more than you think.
Remember that God looks down on those who are jealous.


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## damemary (Mar 14, 2012)

Dear Shirley, No matter what nastiness creeps into your life, your DH and dear loyal friends are with you. You're a fortunate woman.


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## BrattyPatty (May 2, 2011)

damemary said:


> Dear Shirley, No matter what nastiness creeps into your life, your DH and dear loyal friends are with you. You're a fortunate woman.


I'll second that!!


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## damemary (Mar 14, 2012)

I love looking forward to winter in the desert instead of dreading it.



BrattyPatty said:


> Hi Shirl! Just got home from Palm Beach and see that things haven't changed much.
> Looks like KPG has been on one of her senseless rants again.They are becoming routine.
> Hope your move went well and that you will be happy where you are living now.
> After being in Florida for a week, it was hard to come home to the chilly fall weather.


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## damemary (Mar 14, 2012)

They march in lockstep....or else they don't get to play.



BrattyPatty said:


> Nobody is twisting your arm to read her posts. Wow, talk about unoriginal! Your first sentence is from the KPG playbook.


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## BrattyPatty (May 2, 2011)

damemary said:


> I love looking forward to winter in the desert instead of dreading it.


It isn't too bad today, dame. It's in the mid 60's and sunny here. When I left Palm Beach it was 85. 
I have to laugh. The last time I visited Vegas was in Feb. My sister, niece and nephew were all in jackets. I was in T shirts and capris. 74dg was the temp for the week that I was there. Your winters are great! I may become a snow bird after all!
We are supposed to have a lot of snow and cold temps again this year, just like we had last year.


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## SQM (Jun 22, 2012)

DGreen said:


> How about, "How many times do I have to flush to get rid of you?"


I have not been getting this thread so I am not sure what you are talking about but this is funny Bright Green.


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## damemary (Mar 14, 2012)

DGreen said:


> We all know KPG's position on issues, which is consistently negative and critical when it comes to our current government. Because of her comment, one can reasonably assume she posted it with the intent to criticize. You can defend her all you want; everyone here knows she is unfailingly negative.
> 
> By the way, you didn't finish your last sentence or was that your complete thought?


 :XD: :XD: :XD: I wondered the same thing when I tried to decipher it. Good to know I'm not alone.


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## BrattyPatty (May 2, 2011)

SQM said:


> I have not been getting this thread so I am not sure what you are talking about but this is funny Bright Green.


SQ, so sorry for your loss. I was in Fla for my uncle's funeral around the same time you lost your sister. (((((Hugs)))))


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## BrattyPatty (May 2, 2011)

damemary said:


> They march in lockstep....or else they don't get to play.


 :XD: :XD: :XD: :XD: I think you are right!


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## BrattyPatty (May 2, 2011)

Designer1234 said:


> -----------------------
> What exactly do you gain by posts like this--??? Nothing.


Shirley, it does not bother me. She tries to insult me by using my daughter and grandchild. 5 minutes later she is over in D&P reciting bible quotes.
What rational person does that? Who does she think she is fooling?

In the words of Madeline Kahn " Ha! I laugh at that!"


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## SQM (Jun 22, 2012)

BrattyPatty said:


> SQ, so sorry for your loss. I was in Fla for my uncle's funeral around the same time you lost your sister. (((((Hugs)))))


Thanks Brat. I send you condolences for your loss. Totally no fun. Hope you only hear good news in the future.


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## BrattyPatty (May 2, 2011)

damemary said:


> :XD: :XD: :XD: I wondered the same thing when I tried to decipher it. Good to know I'm not alone.


I still say she was hitting the moonshine pretty hard :XD:


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## damemary (Mar 14, 2012)

KPG proves repeatedly that she is not anyone you'd want to know.



Designer1234 said:


> -----------------------
> What exactly do you gain by posts like this--??? Nothing.


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## damemary (Mar 14, 2012)

Whoooooo! That's telling it like it is. You go girl.



BrattyPatty said:


> You make me laugh! At least I have a family. I have never had to file bankruptcy on a business that I was too stupid to run, unlike you.
> I never had a failed etsy site and certainly do not have a drinking problem and a lying problem like you do. Sad thing is is that you believe your own lies.
> What I do have is a loving husband, 2 great kids, and a very beautiful grand daughter. Sorry, you missed out on all of that, Cheryl. Maybe that is why you are so bitter. Trying to make up for all the things lacking in your life? Oh well, it was your choice. Live with it. God does not love people who are jealous of their neighbor's goods.
> WIC and SNAP are 2 completely different programs. I thought "the self proclaimed know it all" of this site would know that. Oh wait! You really do know nothing nor do you have anything to give but bulls*#t.
> Keep praying over in D&P. You need it more than you think.


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## BrattyPatty (May 2, 2011)

SQM said:


> Thanks Brat. I send you condolences for your loss. Totally no fun. Hope you only hear good news in the future.


Same to you, dear sloth!


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## damemary (Mar 14, 2012)

Love to see you out here...or anywhere, anytime.



BrattyPatty said:


> It isn't too bad today, dame. It's in the mid 60's and sunny here. When I left Palm Beach it was 85.
> I have to laugh. The last time I visited Vegas was in Feb. My sister, niece and nephew were all in jackets. I was in T shirts and capris. 74dg was the temp for the week that I was there. Your winters are great! I may become a snow bird after all!
> We are supposed to have a lot of snow and cold temps again this year, just like we had last year.


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## BrattyPatty (May 2, 2011)

damemary said:


> Love to see you out here...or anywhere, anytime.


You never know.........! :-D


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## damemary (Mar 14, 2012)

I think the answer to DGreen's question is, 'you have to use a plunger to get rid of all the crap.'



SQM said:


> I have not been getting this thread so I am not sure what you are talking about but this is funny Bright Green.


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## damemary (Mar 14, 2012)

BrattyPatty said:


> Shirley, it does not bother me. She tries to insult me by using my daughter and grandchild. 5 minutes later she is over in D&P reciting bible quotes.
> What rational person does that? Who does she think she is fooling?
> 
> In the words of Madeline Kahn " Ha! I laugh at that!


And I throw in some raspberries.


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## BrattyPatty (May 2, 2011)

damemary said:


> I think the answer to DGreen's question is, 'you have to use a plunger to get rid of all the crap.'


 :XD: :XD: :XD: :XD:


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## BrattyPatty (May 2, 2011)

Designer1234 said:


> Oh quit being so Preachy!! (new word).


Preachy! It has a nice ring to it, Shirley!


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## Designer1234 (Aug 9, 2011)

damemary said:


> Dear Shirley, No matter what nastiness creeps into your life, your DH and dear loyal friends are with you. You're a fortunate woman.


I know how fortunate. I do not lose any sleep over this thread Dame. I actually finished the bottom band of my sweater and have only the two cuffs to do today.

I had a nice time knitting with some very nice Duncan ladies today and I met WCK who was very gracious. We were all feeling badly about what happened this morning. No politics but worry and sadness about what happened in Ottawa. When your country is attacked, things fall into perspective.

My sweater fits, which for me is always something I wonder about in case my math was incorrect. I just have both cuffs to knit and I am finished. I think it will be good for this part of the world.


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## Designer1234 (Aug 9, 2011)

damemary said:


> I love looking forward to winter in the desert instead of dreading it.


I don't blame you -- your winter in Arizona is like our summer in Alberta, actually it is even nicer. Lasts longer too. Small wonder many of us head south to get away from the weather.


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## BrattyPatty (May 2, 2011)

Designer1234 said:


> I know how fortunate. I do not lose any sleep over this thread Dame. I actually finished the bottom band of my sweater and have only the two cuffs to do today.
> 
> I had a nice time knitting with some very nice Duncan ladies today and I met WCK who was very gracious. We were all feeling badly about what happened this morning. No politics but worry and sadness about what happened in Ottawa. When your country is attacked, things fall into perspective.
> 
> My sweater fits, which for me is always something I wonder about in case my math was incorrect. I just have both cuffs to knit and I am finished. I think it will be good for this part of the world.


I hope it is all over with Shirley. I have always looked at Canada as a great neighbor and such a peaceful country. It is heart breaking to hear of this.


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## BrattyPatty (May 2, 2011)

Designer1234 said:


> I don't blame you -- your winter in Arizona is like our summer in Alberta, actually it is even nicer. Lasts longer too. Small wonder many of us head south to get away from the weather.


I have an idea! Let's go visit dame this winter. We can lose our January pale skin and sit in the sunshine with a good friend.


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## BrattyPatty (May 2, 2011)

Designer1234 said:


> I know how fortunate. I do not lose any sleep over this thread Dame. I actually finished the bottom band of my sweater and have only the two cuffs to do today.
> 
> I had a nice time knitting with some very nice Duncan ladies today and I met WCK who was very gracious. We were all feeling badly about what happened this morning. No politics but worry and sadness about what happened in Ottawa. When your country is attacked, things fall into perspective.
> 
> My sweater fits, which for me is always something I wonder about in case my math was incorrect. I just have both cuffs to knit and I am finished. I think it will be good for this part of the world.


You are on a roll! I have 6 hats done for the neonatal care unit at our hospital. I am working on a cabled poncho and matching hat for Brynn.
I have 2 hats and 2 pair of mittens done for her.
I am now crocheting a stuffed cow for her. Her great grandmother owns a farm and Brynn loves the cows. Also in the works is an afghan for DH. I have to get these finished so I can get started on a quilt for my grand nephew.


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## Designer1234 (Aug 9, 2011)

I just watched our Prime Minister and the leader of the Opposition speaking. I am proud that our leader of the Opposition has promised that his party will back everything that the Prime Minister has said. It is not a time for pulling away, it is time to pull together. That is what it should be. Mr. Mulcare is quite a fiery Politician but he spoke quietly and promised complete support for everything decided by the Government. I am proud to be a Canadian. Political differences disappear when we are in trouble. .

God Save our land, Glorious and Free ! I know that sounds Dramatic but it is part of our Anthem and fitting today. 

Thanks to all those on these and other KP threads who have posted in support of Canada today.


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## BrattyPatty (May 2, 2011)

!


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## BrattyPatty (May 2, 2011)

I wish that the parties here in the US Would pull together and work together on anything!
When is your next workshop, Shirley?


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## Knitter from Nebraska (Jun 9, 2013)

Poor Purl said:


> Not voluntarily. And I'd wait to hear it from something other than the Daily Beast before I got up in arms about it. Tina Brown, like Arianna Huffington, is a PR collector rather than a truth teller.
> 
> But welcome back, Nebraska. I haven't heard from you in days. Were you absent, or am I absent-minded?


Intentionally absent! There's been no discussion, just tit for tat between liberals and conservatives. Booorrrinngg! I read an article which linked to the Daily Beast article. I thought perhaps... it would spark discussion??? Its getting pretty bad when the libs reject their own sources. I've nowhere to turn. :XD: :XD: :XD:


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## BrattyPatty (May 2, 2011)

Knitter from Nebraska said:


> Intentionally absent! There's been no discussion, just tit for tat between liberals and conservatives. Booorrrinngg! I read an article which linked to the Daily Beast article. I thought perhaps... it would spark discussion??? Its getting pretty bad when the libs reject their own sources. I've nowhere to turn. :XD: :XD: :XD:


Ah the H. Post is only a drop in the bucket for resources, KFN  
Nice to see you.


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## Knitter from Nebraska (Jun 9, 2013)

DGreen said:


> Nebraska evidently would rather have the world let innocent people die than provide humanitarian aid. After all, they're nothing but takers.


Stunning discourse!!! As usual!!!


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## SQM (Jun 22, 2012)

Just heard on the hotel TV about Canada. I am sending my best wishes for Canada's safety and the end to all jihadists.


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## Designer1234 (Aug 9, 2011)

BrattyPatty said:


> I wish that the parties here in the US Would pull together and work together on anything!
> When is your next workshop, Shirley?


In January -- I have two starting in 2015. One is basic lace scarf Jan.5th and the other might interest you it is a really pretty little baby or toddler jacket being taught by Tamarqe on the 20th

I will be teaching a pullover sweater which can be knit in a stashbuster style or a design of mine (quite simple). in Febaruary.


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## BrattyPatty (May 2, 2011)

Designer1234 said:


> In January -- I have two starting in 2015. One is basic lace scarf Jan.5th and the other might interest you it is a really pretty little baby or toddler jacket being taught by Tamarqe on the 20th
> 
> I will be teaching a pullover sweater which can be knit in a stashbuster style or a design of mine (quite simple). in Febaruary.


They both sound good to me! The pullover interests me. I have a large stash that needs to be pared down. Both novelty and wools/acrylics.
I will have time in February to do this.
I can't believe how fast the holidays are approaching us. It will be good to relax and start a project after the holidays. Feb will be the only month I have all to myself until July.


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## Designer1234 (Aug 9, 2011)

Knitter from Nebraska said:


> Intentionally absent! There's been no discussion, just tit for tat between liberals and conservatives. Booorrrinngg! I read an article which linked to the Daily Beast article. I thought perhaps... it would spark discussion??? Its getting pretty bad when the libs reject their own sources. I've nowhere to turn. :XD: :XD: :XD:


You are welcome back here -- I think you take yourself too seriously. There is a lot going on in the world and different conversations are going on all the time. I am getting so weary of all the libs being called 'libs' as if it is a dirty word. We are not the same - many of us don't agree on everything - we are individuals. Sometimes a subject doesn't catch on.

I hope you will stay but we have been 'visited' by some of our 'friends this last two days, and yes, it might have over ridden serious discussion. This is a place when sometimes discussion falls by the wayside. We sang songs last night. We have discussions sometimes that have nothing to do with Politics. You might find it to be the only thing that interests you but sometimes I personally need a change of focus, and I think the others to too. You are taking it too personally.

The world is not coming to an end. Things are happening all over that are worrisome, but sometimes we don't want to have a deep discussion. I hope you will say but don't get upset if we don't follow your agenda . YOu are a bright, honest person with excellent opinions, and we like you coming around but how about calling us by our names? Personally we are more than 'libs' we are individuals who have liberal opinions but they don't all happen to be exactly the same. Some are interested in one thing, others are interested in other things.

Anyway, I am sick at heart tonight - the more I think of it the more i know my country has undergone a change today, and not for a good reason. I am saddened and worried. We have had other bad things happen as well this past week. My home city was a place where jihadist radicals discussed, and left and joined Is and were killed in action with them. One killed people by becoming a suicide bomber - I believe. It is sad indeed. Anyway I am glad to see you are back. I was wondering about you. Shirley


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## BrattyPatty (May 2, 2011)

I hope that Canada will heal as we did, Shirley. We can't let these demons take away our peace of mind and sense of security. If we do, they win. That is exactly what they want.
I remember feeling the same way as you do on 9/11. It will take time to get over the shock of it all.
My thoughts are with you.


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## Designer1234 (Aug 9, 2011)

BrattyPatty said:


> They both sound good to me! The pullover interests me. I have a large stash that needs to be pared down. Both novelty and wools/acrylics.
> I will have time in February to do this.
> I can't believe how fast the holidays are approaching us. It will be good to relax and start a project after the holidays. Feb will be the only month I have all to myself until July.


Okay - I will plan it the first week in February so you have to join us. I hope others will from here.
I would love to see all of you join us -- I think we can easily get too caught up with the negativity of these threads. I look forward to having the workshops to work on again although I am only booking 2 a month and sometimes not even that. I think they are worthwhile. It is good however to get out on the normal threads and forget about fighting with each other. 
The workshops don't include Politics or Religion and it is a nice thing. I think either of the sweaters would be good Brat.

We can talk about what kind of sweater you want to knit and you can do it. I personally like the stashbusters even if it only consists of 2 - 5 colors - still gets rid of some yarn.

I like the one I just finished. I am working on the sleeve cuffs right now. I finished the bottom band when I was knitting with the ladies this afternoon.


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## Knitter from Nebraska (Jun 9, 2013)

BrattyPatty said:


> Ah the H. Post is only a drop in the bucket for resources, KFN
> Nice to see you.


Nice to see you, too! "Ah the H"??? I don't get it. I am feeling rather slow right now, though. I've spent the last three days cleaning out every closet, cupboard, drawer and pantry, not to mention the basement. Tomorrow, baseboards, light fixtures, windows and blinds!


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## Designer1234 (Aug 9, 2011)

BrattyPatty said:


> I hope that Canada will heal as we did, Shirley. We can't let these demons take away our peace of mind and sense of security. If we do, they win. That is exactly what they want.
> I remember feeling the same way as you do on 9/11. It will take time to get over the shock of it all.
> My thoughts are with you.


Before someone from over there jumps me for what i have said. I don't for a minute think this is as bad as 9/11 - 9/11 changed the world as we know it. The courage and the way people joined together was something I will always remember. It seems to have also caused a lot of division.

I just feel sad for my beautiful country -- we don't ever bother anyone although we stand up for what we believe - We have always done so. I just hate to see the insidious changes that are happening in North America.


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## admin (Jan 12, 2011)

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