# Empisal lace patterns



## annazygowski (Jan 2, 2013)

I have this great book from the 60's called "empisal knitting pattern". 
I'm wondering if anyone else has the book and has tried converting the charts in the book to modern punchcards?
I'm trying a few and there are some odd things.
In some lace patterns it asks you to run your knit carriage one row (rather than the usual 2 rows). So then you have two carriages on one side? :/
In other charts it specifies that you should move the "slide dial" a certain amount. Is the slide dial some kind of racking mechanism that moves the pattern position either right from center or left from centre? If so:COOL feature! And that definitely makes a big difference when converting the pattern!

It's a treasure trove of a book but the charting is a bit bonkers


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## Tallie9 (Jul 24, 2012)

This book was created for the '8 push button machines'....
Brother 585/588/601(Empisal 680L)/710.....There are also a few different titles for the same book...depending on which country it was sold in....
I have this book and use it for my 588.....and I have used it for my Brother 230(bulky manual selection) for slip..tuck..and lace.
I have known other machine knitters to use this book..

Be aware...all the patterns in this book are an 8 stitch repeat ...You could repeat the design 3 times on a 24 stitch punch card ...so it is do-able.....or.....5 times on a 40 stitch card(Passap)...

The 'slide dial' is equivolent to the racking mechanism of a ribber......but it also allows you to select all the opposite needles by sliding another lever from the 'A' position to the 'B' position.....

The lace carriage is parked on the left side of the bed....The main carriage on the right side of the bed....You would depress the numbered buttons(per your lace pattern) and operate the 'set lever' to bring out those needles...Run the lace carriage from left to right.....Then bring the lace carriage back to the left side of the bed....Now you would knit with the main carriage 2 rows.......If your lace pattern has a return arrow for the lace carriage....you would first depress the appropriate numbered buttons and operate the 'set lever' to bring out those needles and run the lace carriage from right to left.....


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## janetmk (Apr 11, 2013)

I have a book something like this and keep thinking I must get my head round this but I always seem to find something else to do, shame as the patterns are just great!


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## annazygowski (Jan 2, 2013)

Thanks. 
I am as far as having graphed out 24 repeat cards.
The slide dial is marked 1 to 8. Maybe you are thinking of the reverse knob??

The confusion with the lace carriage: I know how to operate a lace carriage when you have a return arrow. But in the last photo the lace carriage is run one way. Looking through the book, the most compelling lace designs have this one way lace carriage quirk. I am trying to visualize and graph this.

It is a great book!


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## Tallie9 (Jul 24, 2012)

annazygowski said:


> Thanks.
> I am as far as having graphed out 24 repeat cards.
> The slide dial is marked 1 to 8. Maybe you are thinking of the reverse knob??
> The confusion with the lace carriage: I know how to operate a lace carriage when you have a return arrow. But in the last photo the lace carriage is run one way. Looking through the book, the most compelling lace designs have this one way lace carriage quirk. I am trying to visualize and graph this.
> It is a great book!


I'm sorry...I did screw-up that explanation.....The 'slide dial' is the same as 'racking'........The 1 thru 8 push buttons are to select the needles....and the 'reverse knob' in 'A' position will bring those needles forward for the numbered buttons you have pushed.......In the 'B' position....it will bring the needles forward of the buttons you haven't pushed....

Before moving the lace carriage from left to right....the 'set lever' has to be cranked to bring the selected needles forward for transfer.....then you move the lace carriage to the right ....Now all the needles have returned to 'B' position.....so the lace carriage can be moved back across to the left side of the bed without any effect on the knitting......or....you can just lift it off of the right side of the bed and place it back on the left side of the bed.......Clearing the way to run the main carriage....
I realize that with some other machines(punchcard).....you cannot remove the lace carriage from the bed....so unless the carriage allows for a 'free pass' back across the bed(some equivolent of a 'Part Button').....there would be a problem with doing those patterns...


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## annazygowski (Jan 2, 2013)

Here is the cover of my book for anyone interested.

Thanks Tallie!

I think it's interesting to note that some laces in the book use the knit carriage in quirky ways and some use the lace carriage in quirky ways.
Converting these laces for use in studio or brother punch card mechanisms means locking the punchcard in certain places or like you say, employing free pass. 
I posted another lace example for anyone interested


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## janetmk (Apr 11, 2013)

Thanks for the greater explanation, yes this is the cover on the one I have, it was a bargain price and crammed full of patterns!


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## annazygowski (Jan 2, 2013)

Here are my rough notes for my toyota 901 (handles like a brother) and the corresponding lace structure.


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## Tallie9 (Jul 24, 2012)

annazygowski said:


> Here is the cover of my book for anyone interested.
> 
> Thanks Tallie!
> 
> ...


I guess it does seem quirky if you've never used one of these '8 push button machines'......This was the first and only machine I had for many years.....so for me it was the norm...

I had posted that book awhile back...Brother Knitting Pattern is another title for the same book....I do have an extra copy with the Empisal title though...


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## Tallie9 (Jul 24, 2012)

annazygowski said:


> Here are my rough notes for my toyota 901 (handles like a brother) and the corresponding lace structure.


Let us know how it knits out...
...I would think that it would work well on the Toyota...
...Not so sure it would work with Singer/Studio lace carriages..


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## janetmk (Apr 11, 2013)

That's really helpful - I think mine says it was for a Jones! We have moved recently and not sure I can just put my hands on the book but I will try. These old books always have so much more in them than the new magazines that I am always on the look out for them, a pity for them to go to waste!


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## annazygowski (Jan 2, 2013)

I do a lot do hand transferred lace on my old industrial hand flats. These older books and their laces are similar to the ones in the books I have for the hand flats. If you break each movement down into a hand transfer then visualize how to apply it to a particular machine it does help.


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## janetmk (Apr 11, 2013)

Yes, I do quite a bit of hand knitting and was in Shetland in October for wool week - such a treat- and had reinforced - it's the holes to concentrate on in lace knitting!


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## janetmk (Apr 11, 2013)

- in designing that is....


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## susieknitter (Jul 14, 2011)

I always thought that the early Knitmaster/Singer machines were called Empisal and books like these were originally meant for them. Knitmaster later made machines that had the name Knitmaster Empisal on them, their manual,and machine boxes.....a bit like a car called a Ford ??????If I am right this would explain why there is only one movement with a lace carriage and also why the book is written/set out like a Knitmaster manual is.
Having said this if Tallie has the same book that is titled Brother then I must be wrong. Also if you can use the patterns.....which Tallie obviously can....then I suppose it doesn't matter anyway.


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## annazygowski (Jan 2, 2013)

Yes, I get the sense there are multiple books like this written for many machine types. ..and the machine types in some cases were interchangeable or identical but with a different name...


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## susieknitter (Jul 14, 2011)

annazygowski said:


> Yes, I get the sense there are multiple books like this written for many machine types. ..and the machine types in some cases were interchangeable or identical but with a different name...


I know that in the UK machines that were called Knitmaster/Empisal were sold as Singer or Studio in the USA. Later machines, made by this company, became known as Silver Reed.
The early Brother machines were originally called Jones.
The Passap and Pffaf were also the same machines marketed under different names.
I didn't know that Brother also used the name Empisal.......anything with Empisal on I have always thought was originally done for a Knitmaster/Singer/Studio machine.


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## annazygowski (Jan 2, 2013)

jeannie2954 kindly Pm'd me with a book title that has many equivalent patterns
I found it here:
http://machineknittingetc.com/brother-punch-cards-volume-5.html
weirdly enough it omits the lace patterns with the 1 direction knitting carriage quirk, but does include many of the other more conventional lace patterns found in the empisal book
the mystery deepens.....


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## susieknitter (Jul 14, 2011)

annazygowski said:


> jeannie2954 kindly Pm'd me with a book title that has many equivalent patterns
> I found it here:
> http://machineknittingetc.com/brother-punch-cards-volume-5.html
> weirdly enough it omits the lace patterns with the 1 direction knitting carriage quirk, but does include many of the other more conventional lace patterns found in the empisal book
> the mystery deepens.....


I can see what you are saying because I have this book and it was definitely written for Brother machines. I think that maybe there was some copying going on.
I don't know who used the name Empisal first nor how two different companies got away with using the same name.....if they did....I personally don't think that Brother ever used the name Empisal.
I have the manual for a Knitmaster 360/260 and it says at the top Empisal-Knitmaster as all the older Knitmaster knitting machine manuals do. I have never seen a Brother manual that says Empisal-Brother. This would be like Ford making a car called Silver Cloud...I can't see Rolls Royce being happy with that.


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## annazygowski (Jan 2, 2013)

But look what I found?
This photo was taken from a thread on this forum.
The book has the same cover and is labelled brother.
Weird! I feel like this book is a third party publication.


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## susieknitter (Jul 14, 2011)

annazygowski said:


> But look what I found?
> This photo was taken from a thread on this forum.
> The book has the same cover and is labelled brother.
> Weird! I feel like this book is a third party publication.


I think you are right. If Tallie has this same book, along with the one with Empisal on the front cover, then perhaps she can see if they differ regarding the patterns inside....particularly the lace once.
Then we will know that if you have a Knitmaster machine you want the one with Emprisal on the front and if you have a Brother machine you want the one with Brother on the front....or the brains to work out the difference between how the two makes of machines work :lol: :lol: which Tallie obviously has. :thumbup:


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## janetmk (Apr 11, 2013)

Yes, I thought that too, but I am pretty sure that is the same cover, I just can't put my hands on it as all my books are in boxes, it is VERY frustrating but I am pretty sure it said Jones. I might be wrong! I will have another search tomorrow, but there are so manly boxes still ......but Tallie has mentioned Brother....


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## susieknitter (Jul 14, 2011)

janetmk said:


> Yes, I thought that too, but I am pretty sure that is the same cover, I just can't put my hands on it as all my books are in boxes, it is VERY frustrating but I am pretty sure it said Jones. I might be wrong! I will have another search tomorrow, but there are so manly boxes still ......but Tallie has mentioned Brother....


The Brother machines were called Jones to start with.


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## janetmk (Apr 11, 2013)

Yes, strange though the use of Empisal and Jones/ Brother ! Wish I could just put my hands on the book....


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## charmknits (Jan 26, 2014)

susieknitter said:


> I always thought that the early Knitmaster/Singer machines were called Empisal and books like these were originally meant for them. Knitmaster later made machines that had the name Knitmaster Empisal on them, their manual,and machine boxes.....a bit like a car called a Ford ??????If I am right this would explain why there is only one movement with a lace carriage and also why the book is written/set out like a Knitmaster manual is.
> Having said this if Tallie has the same book that is titled Brother then I must be wrong. Also if you can use the patterns.....which Tallie obviously can....then I suppose it doesn't matter anyway.


I have the book titled "Brother Knitting Pattern". It is for my Brother 800 knitting machine. Those old pictures look very similar. It has nearly 1,000 pattern-12 stitch designs and 12 garment patterns. I am attaching an image of 1 page regarding lace on this machine.


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## charmknits (Jan 26, 2014)

ooops - I guess I got off track................my hard-cover book is 12 stitch patterns. Just remember it said "Brother Knitting Pattern" on the cover.


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## annazygowski (Jan 2, 2013)

Thanks!
Very interesting. 
Still wondering how to convert these empisal lace patterns that feature one row with a knit carriage between 2 rows of lace.
I think I will have to make some test punchcards.


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## janetmk (Apr 11, 2013)

Gosh another one to look out for!


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## charmknits (Jan 26, 2014)

charmknits said:


> I have the book titled "Brother Knitting Pattern". It is for my Brother 800 knitting machine. Those old pictures look very similar. It has nearly 1,000 pattern-12 stitch designs and 12 garment patterns. I am attaching an image of 1 page regarding lace on this machine.


Just additional note for anyone interested in the 12 stitch designs book - it can be downloaded in 3 parts at
https://app.box.com/shared/3g5d0rq9q7/1/834136744


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## leanne17 (Aug 21, 2013)

Hi, Empisal, Knitmaster, Studio and Singer are basically the same, and the lace carriage actually does the knitting. Whereas Brother machines use the lace carriage to transfer the stitches and the main carriage to knit.
So patterns for Empisal etc machines knit continually to the end of the lace pattern. Brother machines, the carriages have to be continually changed to knit the lace.


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## annazygowski (Jan 2, 2013)

I think in the case of the empisal pattern book here, that the knitting machine that corresponds with it uses both a knitting carriage and lace carriage
at least according to the charts
it is an old book so we are talking an older knitting machine with less advanced capabilities
seems though that there is alot of overlap brand and model wise!

charmknits: thanks for the link! 
that book is quite the treasure 
these older books are fabulous, very content rich (if sometime vague on the details?


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## Tallie9 (Jul 24, 2012)

susieknitter said:


> I didn't know that Brother also used the name Empisal.......anything with Empisal on I have always thought was originally done for a Knitmaster/Singer/Studio machine.


Sue....I thought this too...until I saw an Empisal 680L...and this machine is identical to my Brother 588...


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## Tallie9 (Jul 24, 2012)

annazygowski said:


> But look what I found?
> This photo was taken from a thread on this forum.
> The book has the same cover and is labelled brother.
> Weird! I feel like this book is a third party publication.


The old posting of the Brother 588 machine and the Brother Knitting Pattern book was mine....
...Tallie


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## Tallie9 (Jul 24, 2012)

susieknitter said:


> I think you are right. If Tallie has this same book, along with the one with Empisal on the front cover, then perhaps she can see if they differ regarding the patterns inside....particularly the lace once.
> Then we will know that if you have a Knitmaster machine you want the one with Emprisal on the front and if you have a Brother machine you want the one with Brother on the front....or the brains to work out the difference between how the two makes of machines work :lol: :lol: which Tallie obviously has. :thumbup:


This is what I know for sure.....The following 3 books have identical covers...and identical content....The only thing that is different with all 3 books are the titles:
Brother Knitting Pattern.....sold in the US
Empisal Knitting Pattern.....sold in Australia
Vendomatic Knitting Pattern....sold in Holland and Germany

I personally own copies of the first 2....
Linoxgirl I know owns a copy of the third because I helped her find it....

I would not be surprised if there were others sold with different titles in others countries....Maybe with the Jones name in Great Britain....Who knows?

Someone posted a picture of a book with a different cover(lady wearing a red&white stripe knit dress)that has the title Brother Knitting Pattern.....This is not the same book as the other three mentioned....This book was produced for the Brother KH800 and has a 12 stitch pattern repeat(as opposed to an 8 stitch repeat).....That being said.....I am sure this book could also be used for its' patterns on other machines.. It probably contains most of the same designs that appear in the other books.....I do find it more tedious to decipher the patterns though...


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## janetmk (Apr 11, 2013)

Thanks


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## Linuxgirl (May 25, 2013)

And as Tallie9 mentioned it, here's a picture of my "Vendomatic" book. I'm starting to think, Brother must have licenced some of that KH 58x line to Empisal if they are so much alike. Usually there are quite a few differences between Brother and Empisal machines. Would also explain why the same book has been published for different machine brands.
Anyway it's a great book. I would rather try to use the hand knitting charts for making the punchcards, I think. Seems easier to me.


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## Ferol Pat (Jun 18, 2013)

Oh yes its for the PB 8, I used to work on one long ago and remember it was wonderful because you could do so many patterns, just a bit more concentration needed


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## annazygowski (Jan 2, 2013)

There are some great edgings and circular motifs in the back. 
Thanks for the vendomatic and brother book shots!


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## 30Knitter (Apr 9, 2012)

Most of those lace patterns and others were brought up to date in some of the punch card books. You just have to look for them. Some may have been in the first Brother books.


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## annazygowski (Jan 2, 2013)

I scoured all available books. While many are included, the ones I inquired about are not included.


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## 30Knitter (Apr 9, 2012)

annazygowski said:


> I scoured all available books. While many are included, the ones I inquired about are not included.


You are looking for lace patterns for the Knitmaster/Studio/Singer machines. You are also looking for simple lace, which only those machines can do. Brother/Knitking only does fashion lace, which makes two or more knit rows between transfers.

Knitmaster/Studio/Singer machines make simple lace and fashion lace. The simple lace patterns only have one row between transfers, this is because simple lace transfers and knits in the same row.


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## crazyK (Jan 13, 2014)

Hi, Iam able to put these patterns onto cards or electronic grids
All brother knitting machines have different settings.
Iwould have to know the model of the knitting machine that you have.


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## annazygowski (Jan 2, 2013)

Oh gosh, that is nice of you to offer but I am just looking for the knowledge on how to replicate those specific designs myself. I know how to punch cards. I will do some more research on the studio singer lace. I have a studio 270 with lace carriage so I'll follow that lead and see where it takes me! Thanks


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## crazyK (Jan 13, 2014)

You can not use the same way to put the patterns on all machine punch cards, the electronic is different to the punchcards. KH 820 machine do not do the lace as all the others machines.
I hope this helps when looking at the way they do it in the book


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## lillypit (Dec 9, 2012)

I have three books Empisal-Knitmaster MOD 250 (One hour guide to Instant Knitting) (Stitch pattern Book) and (Needle selector Manual . How to use the Automatic needle selector )

sorry they are in reverse I used the computer camera!


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## annazygowski (Jan 2, 2013)

Amazing!


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## crazyK (Jan 13, 2014)

Brother made the Empisal knitting machine, we sold it in Australia but it you came from New Zealand it was called a Brother. My first machine was an Empisal KH90, It had no facitility for fairisle, had to use a small green piece called a Picker, which after you selected your needles for the first colour you would lay the yarn over the needles and then you would run the picker over the needles to close the latches, then with the carriage set to slip you would run the carriage to the right then bring it back again, then you would repeat the process for the second colour
I didn't make too many garment with all over fairisle.
Kathy


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## clareskitchen (Aug 7, 2015)

Yes, Empisal is a very confusing brand name. As mentioned, here in Australia it was given to machines which later (around the mid-800 series) became Brother. In contrast, in the UK the era of machines called Empisal in Australia were labelled Jones. The machines labelled Empisal Knitmaster in the UK are called Singer here in Australia - all Japanese machines. The name Singer was also given to a European line of machines. I've never known an industry to have such confusing use of brand names!
So regarding the Jones/Empisal/Brother pattern chart books for 8 stitch machines...yes, they are all the Brother family of machines and therefore their lace patterns can't all be used on an Empisal-Knitmaster/Singer machine because of the different way lace is produced between the two machine families...


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## crazyK (Jan 13, 2014)

If you have a KH820 Empisal knitting machine, again this is a Broher knitting machine, If you had the first compendium with all the patterns in it, (it has a lady on the cover wearing a veil over a black hat) be careful because the lace patterns are not the same as for the other Brother punch cards. It selects the rows differently.
crazyk


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## Esttyquin (Mar 23, 2017)

Tallie9 said:


> This book was created for the '8 push button machines'....
> Brother 585/588/601(Empisal 680L)/710.....There are also a few different titles for the same book...depending on which country it was sold in....
> I have this book and use it for my 588.....and I have used it for my Brother 230(bulky manual selection) for slip..tuck..and lace.
> I have known other machine knitters to use this book..
> ...


Good evening, Can i still get this book today? Really in dere need of it.


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## Tallie9 (Jul 24, 2012)

Esttyquin said:


> Good evening, Can i still get this book today? Really in dere need of it.


Here you can download.....The last 2 books on the page are called Jones Knitting Pattern....First book is the original version....Second book has some variation in the clothing patterns but otherwise is pretty much the same as the first..
http://machineknittingetc.com/brother-knitking/punch-cards.html?p=2

It is still possible to find the physical book....Ebay(I noticed an 'Empisal Knitting Pattern' copy out of Australia)...private sellers ....Not sure in your country where to look...
I have an extra copy but the shipping is usually expensive....


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## Esttyquin (Mar 23, 2017)

Tallie9 said:


> Here you can download.....The last 2 books on the page are called Jones Knitting Pattern....First book is the original version....Second book has some variation in the clothing patterns but otherwise is pretty much the same as the first..
> http://machineknittingetc.com/brother-knitking/punch-cards.html?p=2
> 
> It is still possible to find the physical book....Ebay(I noticed an 'Empisal Knitting Pattern' copy out of Australia)...private sellers ....Not sure in your country where to look...
> I have an extra copy but the shipping is usually expensive....


Ow, will make do with the downloads. Am really grateful.


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## Brijbuf (Oct 21, 2018)

Anna, I am in Burlington, do you want to sell this book? It is for an 8 button machine and I have one. Norma p.s. you have answered my Kijiji ads a few times.


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