# #13 CLOSED - TOE UP SOCK (MAGIC LOOP) WITH DAROWIL-



## Designer1234

*WORKSHOP STARTS ON JANUARY 21/2013*

Welcome to our workshops.

We are excited to share that Darowil will be teaching this workshop on how to knit one toe up sock at a time using Magic Loop. If you are unfamiliar with the magic loop technique - read the requirements for needles and yarn here, then *go to workshop #10 Learn magic loop, and 
join darowil back here for Jan. 21st*...*Start on page 1 of the magic loop workshop. *

General guidelines for our workshop series. START HERE!
- Always start at this beginning post when first joining in
- Commenting on this workshop automatically signs you up . You do not need to take any further steps. These are FREE workshops. There is NO official sign up or fee.
* The alternate method to join is to click the word WATCH just above and to the left of this post.
- Out of courtesy to the teacher, who has taken time out to do this for us, please let the TEACHER answer technique questions or pattern corrects first UNLESS the teachers says that comments by the members is welcomed.
- If you have technical difficulties, please read the posts on our Workshop Home page, called TECH HELP. You find this by first clicking the words at the top or bottom of this page that say Knitting And Crochet Workshops With Designer1234 which takes you back to our workshop Home page.
- When sharing these workshops with others, and please do. Please share only this link. http://www.knittingparadise.com/s-105-1.html DO NOT SHARE A LINK TO AN INDIVIDUAL WORKSHOP. Those posts will be removed!
- These workshops will remain a permanent part of KP as long as KP operates. Our goal is to make these tutorials as easy to follow as possible. Therefore, over time, we will be deleting erroneous posts and trimming posts. Please continue to post. Please do not be alarmed if your posts suddenly disappear. YOU ARE STILL a part of the workshop, you WILL STILL get updates. You WONT have to read through pages and pages of non-subject material to go back and find what you missed.
- When all else fails, and you have READ ALL the help we have already posted here and in our Help sections, we will reply to PMs.

Your section managers  designer and prismaticr

Now, lets get crafting!


----------



## darowil

Although this workshop is closed it can still be read by anyone.
It is likely that all questions that you have will have been answered over the time this workshop has been opened so please read all the posts. The relevant sections have been clearly highlighted so you can see what section you are trying to find questions for. However if you still are struggling you can PM me
___________________________________________
Hi and welcome to this my second workshop in the Magic Loop series. I have really enjoyed the learning magic loop workshop and looking forward to working on socks with some old mates and some new ones.

If any one is coming to this workshop unable to do the magic loop Im sorry but you will first need to do my Magic Loop workshop. Learning the toe and magic loop at the same time will just not work. You dont need to be experts, just to be able to do it- even working a part of a piece and then going on to the socks will work but you must be able to work comfortably in the round on magic loop for this workshop.

I know this is a little early to provide the information yet again, but this coming weekend is the major weekend for my husbands work calendar and I am very much involved as well. Therefore from Thursday to Monday my time (around Wednesday to Sunday for most of you) I will not be able to access KP and so I need to provide a few days for people to ask questions before I go away.

The pattern I will provide on the 21st January is a very basic sock. The pattern will not be posted until the 21st January. *To ensure that you get notified when the pattern is posted go to the top of the page and just above the opening post are two boxes. One of these says WATCH, click on this and you will automatically be notified every time a new posting is made (if you post here first then you will also automatically be notified- in this case the box above will say unwatch and do not click this if you want notifications). This is all that you need to do to join in this workshop; no signup etc is needed.*

Some people have asked about doing 2 at a time on one circular. I have tried this and didnt like it. I found it took longer and was more confusing. Two balls of yarn means two lots of yarn to tangle- and you need to be very careful about which way you turn the work. All the extra pulling takes so long as well. . (Note that this is only my opinion and many people love this method.)

I do understand the risk of SSS (Second Sock Syndrome) and I do have some lonely unmatched socks lying around. However the large majority of my socks have their mates. But if you want to do two at once I suggest you use the method many use. It does require two circulars of the same size and two balls of yarn. You cast on and work one toe, then cast on and knit the second toe on the other circular. You then do the foot of one and then the second. And keep working like this.
This method could actually be good for learning the new techniques as you repeat it before you go and do the next new technique.

But for those interested in two at a time on one circular near the end of the workshop I will provide some general resources for sock knitting and include some for this method I will also give an general run down on sock construction etc. I thought of doing this first but I will wait and if it hasnt been addressed during the workshop I will talk about it at the end so that you have a basic understanding to help you work out your own socks. It is a very basic construction that you will notice as you go anyway, if you havent already noticed it on the socks you wear.

*SOCKS*
The best guide for needle size is the ball band- each yarn can be slightly different. 
I'm a non swatcher and tend to pick the size for my socks by what is hanging on my door free! But I always use between a 2.00mm and 2.5mm (US 0 or 1- we have a 2.25mm as well so that is one in between the US numbers) for 4 ply/fingering. BUT I am a loose needle who often needs to go down 2 needle sizes to get anywhere near the right tension. So depending on your average tension you can determine which needle size to use. Loose knitters pick the smallest size (or even one under), average knitters middle size and tight knitters largest size

Socks are stretchy and so the size is not essential- however they do need to have a firm tension (this helps them to wear better and to fit better) so use a size less than you normally would for a 4 ply/fingering.

One reason I don't worry with swatches is that to be accurate they should be done in the round and I figure that by time I knit enough to have a swatch I could be well on the way to having a sock knitted if the tension/gauge is correct and haven't lost anything if it is wrong as I would have needed to undone much the same amount of work anyway. On an individual sock this may mean I need to spend extra time on frogging but overall I have saved a lot of time as the majority of my socks work on my first needle chose.

But if you want more information on swatching for socks (applies to anything knitted in the round) go to 5mmdpns workshop 'just in time for Xmas'(dpns socks). On her first page she gives a bit more information, and also in barbyjones' post further down

Workshop link http://www.knittingparadise.com/s-105-1.html

If you need to buy needles you will need to guesstimate the needle size anyway. (Anyone who is looking at this without yet being able to do magic loop could use the yarn and needles to learn on and knit a swatch at the same time.)

For those who have already done 5mmdpns workshop you will find that my approach is totally different. Each have validity and indeed if you do both you will be able to work out your own style. 5mmdpns style does not work for me and I suspect mine won't work for her but each knitter needs to work out what works for them- there are very few definite rights and wrong ways in knitting- it is the final product that matters. However we can all learn from each other.

NEEDLES.
The needle is the most important tool. I am including this information again (from first workshop) because it is important though most of you should have some knowledge of this by now.

I find the best sizes are 80 or 100cm (30 or 40 inch). You can use longer needles if you have them, but it leaves you with extra cord to maneuver. However if you are thinking of later trying 2 socks on one circular at once and dont want to keep buying new needles then I recommend a 120cm length.

The cord is vital; it must be flexible but firm. I have used very successfully Addis, KnitPro (same as Knit Picks) and HiyaHiya. Lincraft over here sell a cheaper bamboo circular, which works OK if you want to trial it first without paying for more expensive needles.

Do not use very soft cords (the old Kollage was terrible IMHO, -the cord was too flexible and the joins terrible- though they have a new one now which I believe is better though I have not yet tried it)- or inflexible cords. If you do you will think the method is terrible, when it is the tools. When I first tried magic loop I used a circular with an unsuitable cord and almost gave up. I decided to try an expensive needle and havent looked back. 
As an aside I loved the feel of the Kollage needle tips and do want to try the new ones with the firm cords.

YARNS.
Using a sock yarn is advisable; most have some form of nylon in them, which helps with both durability and elasticity. Some sock yarns are specially woven with 100% wool but I still find some felting occur on heels- heat and friction after all are the two factors needed for felting and are present on heels especially (and toes to some extent). But not enough to be a problem yet.

Many sock yarns have a repeating pattern. If the yarn you have looks like it does (sometimes there is a picture on the band, or where you bought the yarn or it is clear that there are some large sections of colours) and you want to have identical rather than fraternal twins you will need to make sure you begin your first sock at the beginning of a colour change. This way you can begin the second sock at the same point. (Identical means the pattern starts and finishes in the same places so the socks are identical. Fraternal means you use the same yarn, but begin and end in different patterns so the pattern is the same but staring from a different point. This is purely personal preference

yarn amount
1 100gm (or 2 50gm)

5mmdpns' Information For Diabetics:
As I am a diabetic, and am a Diabetes Educator, I can tell you that the most important thing for the diabetic foot, is to make sure that the foot is not in any way experimenting pressure. That means the sock needs to be non-binding or tight, but be allowed to expand as the foot needs to. Once the heel is turned, the rest of the leg on the foot should be done in ribbing -- to provide support to stay up while allowing the swelling of the ankle/leg to do so comfortably. (I like a 2x2 ribbing as that gives the best stretch and support.)

Another thing is NO knots in the yarn but use another join such as knitting double for 3-4 stitches with end of the new ball of yarn overlapping the old yarn end.

The other aspect of a diabetic sock is to promote the foot to remain dry. The wool aspect of sock yarn does that. For those who are allergic to wool (such as myself) you will use a non-allergic-to-you yarn. Some suggestions are an alpaca/acrylic blend. If you are not able to use that, then you can knit with acrylic yarn (I do) and change your socks as often as your feet get damp. Zoe

Most all of the sock yarn sold in USA and Canada have a wool blend to them. You would want to check the label of the yarn to be sure. You will also want to make sure that the yarn is superwash wool yarn, as a non-superwash wool yarn will shrink. Some superwash wool does shrink a tiny bit, but not enough to be concerned about.

You can try on your sock and see how loose/tight the sock is to your foot. (My suggestion is to try on the sock after the evening meal as that is when your foot/ankles have swollen the most.) You can cast on extra stitches if the sock is fitting too tight with no wiggle room. Or, you may switch over to a slightly larger needle and continue on. 
Zoë
______________________________________
______________________________________
I will once again post the introduction here and download it. I will be converting it to a PDF, which Prismaticr says should enable most of you to open it. However the download is NOT essential as everything is available in this post so if you cant open it dont panic. A quick post to say you cant open it would be helpful for us to know that it is an issue, but especially for this introduction it is pretty superfluous anyway. But if we know that people are having difficulties we may be able to address them for the pattern- which it will be helpful to be able to download (though not essential).


----------



## darowil

mlw2504 said:


> Thank you for providing the toe up sock workshop. I like the idea of toe up because you can slip it on your foot to get the right measurement. This is another first for me. I have never made socks. I am looking forward to it.
> 
> I seems I remember reading that we néed 2 100 gram skeins for a pair of socks. Is this correct?


*yarn amount*
1 100gm (or 2 50gm)- I think I forgot that minor detail in here!


----------



## jmai5421

My socks with magic loop cuff down to practice instead of mittens and my sock yarn ready for the 21st. It is hard to see the color but it is a light blue and cranberry red. It is from Hobby Lobby called Snowflake. It is a wool blend and the color is actually called berries.
The new yarn for my toe up socks is black and white also from Hobby Lobby.


----------



## darowil

knezmom said:


> I bought my yarn yesterday, but I just realized I don't have size 2 circs as recommended on the ball band. I have size 1 and 4. Rats!


A 1 may work especially if you are a looser knitter. Socks have a far bit of flexibility and firmer is better than looser for them, so unless you are a tight knitter I owuld be inclined to go with what you have. If you become addicted then you buy more of the various sizes. I almost always pick my needles by what is available and how the yarn feels when I pick it up! Well for socks at least and looks like I am now doing fingerless mittens and similar approach likely, though can use larger needles there as firmness is not so important for wearability or comfort.


----------



## prismaticr

WOW - Just trimmed this down to 1 page!
Just a friendly reminder. Please read from Page 1 of this workshop....

40 people said they are joining in! Kudos to you all!!!!!

As friendly reminder, these workshops are NOT KAL's. You work at your own pace.
They get trimmed of erroneous posts as often as I can get to them, and fully cleaned before closing. At the end they are LOCKED to new public posts and remain a permanent part of KP. Teachers will generally answer questions by PM after closing time....
ALWAYS make sure you read from PAGE 1. most of the time your questions have been asked and answered... OR STARTING POSTS CAN BE CORRECTED!!!!!! When an error is caught we GO BACK AND FIX THE POSTS!

Keep the 'Joining in's' coming in and/or WATCH this topic as Darowil will be posting the pattern soon....
Reminder, she is away right now until the start date... 

SEE YOU ALL SOON!!!!!


----------



## darowil

yto111 said:


> Just wondering. I just got set of harmony interchangeable needles. Can we do magic loop with interchangeable if cables are long enough?


The only trouble with interchangeables for socks is that for many of us they are not small enough- you need to knit socks on a snaller size than you would normally use for the yarn weight (increases durabilty and improves fit) and there is a limit as to how small they are able to make them and keep the joins smooth.


----------



## darowil

Right I am starting to download things now. Please be patient as it comes in bits and pieces. First will come a cut and paste for the word document. I will then download the same document converted to a PDF. I will also download some photos. But when I have tried to add photos to the PDF and post them I haven't been able to get the document to download. Therefore I will send them to Prismaticr to download the pattern with the photos. But in the mean time you will be able to begin while waiting for her to get them downloaded as everything is available here. As I have been away and having a family crisis I haven't been able to get them to her ahead of time.
As with the introduction the contents of the PDF are identical to what I have below.

*BASIC TOE-UP SOCKS USING MAGIC LOOP.*

COMMENTS
I will speak of needles- this means the two tips- never will you be using two circulars at once-.

ABBREVIATIONS.

K knit
M1	make 1 (pick up loop between the worked stitch and the stitch to be worked, place it on the left needle and work into the back of the stitch.

w&t wrap and turn. Bring the yarn forward (to the front of the work), slip the next stitch onto the right needle purlwise, return the yarn to the back of the work (you have now wrapped the slipped stitch in the working yarn), slip the stitch back to the left needle. Turn the work ready to begin the next row.

spwk2tog	Slip next stitch to right needle, put left needle into the wrap around this stitch pick up wrap , leave this on the left needle and transfer the slipped stitch back onto the left needle. Work the stitch and the lifted wrap together (on a knit row knit together, on a purl row purl the stitches together),

spwsk3tog Slip next stitch to right needle, put left needle into both wraps around this stitch pick up wraps , leave them on the left needle and transfer the slipped stitch back onto the left needle. Work the stitch and the lifted wraps together (on a knit row knit together, on a purl row purl the stitches together),

MATERIALS
100gm 4 ply/fingering weight yarn. (either 1 100 gm ball or 2 50gm balls. 
Circular needle at least 80cm (100cm probably best length). Needle size- as I said in the introduction go by the size recommended on the yarn band., adapting for your own approximate tension- tending towards slightly tighter rather than looser. 
Needle for threading through ends the two yarn ends.
Scissors 
Tape measure (optional as I will be telling you how to do the measuring without a tape measure, assuming you are doing the socks for yourself, someone with a similar size hand or the persons hand easily accessible when you are knitting!).

*PATTERN--THIS IS THE CORRECTED PATTERN.*

TOE. 
This cast on is likely to be the most difficult part of this workshop for most of you. You CANNOT use a normal cast on. 
This is a figure of eight cast on.
Step 1.Make a slipknot onto one needle. This does not count as a stitch. It will be slipped off the needle later on in the cast on.. (or any type of knot that can be undone- this is just to hold the yarn on the needle for the beginning of the caston but you dont want a knot left after wards to press into the toe).
Photo 1 shows the slip knot in blue with a long green tail. This tail is simply to get the yarn to an easily recognizable point to get the socks matching. I tie it up, though there is no real reason why it couldnt be cut off leaving a small tail. (if you dont mind where it begins or you have a nonrepeating pattern or a solid yarn then simply do a slip knot leaving only a short tail to weave in at the end.

Step 2.Place the two needles parallel to each other with needle one (the one with the slipknot on it on the bottom (photo 2).

Then bring the yarn up behind the second (top) needle, over the needle to the front and it between the two needles so that it is again at the back (1st stitch). Photo 3 shows this, but very loose so it can be seen.

Step 3.The yarn is then taken under the first (bottom) needle in front and then between the two needles (2nd stitch).
This forms a figure of eight round the needles.

Repeat steps 2 and 3 until you have 12 stitches on each needle (total of 24, not counting the slipknot). Photo 4 shows the stitches firm as they should be.

Round 1- first half. pull needle one (bottom) through so its stitches are on the cable. Knit the stitches from needle two (top). Photo 5 hopefully show you what it looks like as you do it., turn the work

Round 1- second half. Move the stitches as for normal magic loop so that the worked stitches are on the cable and the unworked stitches back on their needle.

If desired a stitch marker can be used to mark the end of the row, but I never bother. The tail marks the MIDDLE of the round so the beginning of the round is the end with no tail. (and when you are working with such a fine yarn it really wont matter if you are half a round out.)

Slide the slipknot off the needle. For these 12 stitches this one time only knit into the back of the loop.

Round 2. K1, m1 knit to last stitch on needle, m1, k1. Repeat for second needle.
After round 2 you should have 28 stitches (14 on each needle for the top and bottom of the foot.)
Round 3. Knit round on both needles.

Work rounds 2 and 3 until 64 stitches (32 on each needle).

Work round 3 until desired length (see my hint below) (if doing identical twins begin the heel as close to a colour change as you can).

HEEL
For the heel you work the stitches on ONE needle ONLY and work in rows (32 stitches at the beginning- and end!).
This is a short row heel, which means that each row is stopped before the end of the previous row and then you turn the work around. Simply follow the instructions, remembering that the rows you are working are getting shorter, but that you still have the other stitches on the needle . You are simply not working them for the first half of the heel. And for the second half of the heel you gradually start working them again.

Row 1. Knit 31, w&t
Row 2. Purl30, w&t
Row 3. Knit 29, w&t
Row 4. Purl 28, w&t
Row 5. Knit 27, w&t
Row 6. Purl26, w&t
Row 7. Knit 25, w&t
Row 8. Purl24, w&t
Row 9. Knit 23, w&t
Row 10. Purl22, w&t
Row 11. Knit 21, w&t
Row 12. Purl20, w&t
Row 13. Knit 19, w&t
Row 14. Pur18, w&t
Row 15. Knit 17, w&t
Row 16. Purl16, w&t
Row 17. Knit 15, w&t
Row 18. Pur14, w&t
Row 19. Knit 13, w&t
Row 20. Purl12, w&t

This is the bottom half of the heel completed, now you begin to knit the top half which will pull the two halves together. I love watching how this comes out.

Row 21. knit 12, spwk2tog, w&t
Row 22. purl 13, spwk2tog, w&t
Row 23. Knit 14, spwsk3tog, w&t (note the change from here on picking up the wraps).
Row 24 Purl 15, spwsk3tog , w&t
Row 25. Knit 16, spwsk3tog , w&t
Row 26. Purl 17, spwsk3tog , w&t
Row 27 Knit 18, spwsk3tog , w&t
Row 28. Purl 19, spwsk3tog , w&t
Row 29. Knit 20, spwsk3tog , w&t
Row 30. Purl 21, spwsk3tog , w&t
Row 31 Knit 22, spwsk3tog , w&t
Row 32. Purl 23, spwsk3tog , w&t
Row 33. Knit 24 spwsk3tog , w&t
Row 34. Purl 25, spwsk3tog , w&t
Row 35. Knit 26, spwsk3tog , w&t
Row 36. Purl 27, spwsk3tog , w&t
Row 37. Knit 28, spwsk3tog , w&t
Row 38. Purl 29, spwsk3tog , w&t
Row 39. Knit 30 slip the last stitch to the right needle pick up the two wraps return the slipped stitch to the left needle and knit all three together, turn
Row 40 purl 31, slip the last stitch to the right needle pick up the two wraps return the slipped stitch to the left needle and purl all three together, turn

Now return to working in the round. 
Knit the heel stitches and then knit the stitches that have been resting on the cable. 
Knit until the desired length- leaving 5-10cms/1-2 inches for the cuff. (If using my measuring knit until the leg length is approximately to the beginning of the toe).

Work in rounds of k2p2 rib. Until the desired cuff length (I usually do about the length of the toe so the two halves of the sock are the same size).

Stretchy Cast off/bind off.

Work 2 stitches, slip left needle into the two stitches on the right needle and work them together. *Work one stitch, slip left needle into the two stitches on the right needle and work them together. Work from * to end of round. Thread the yarn through the last stitch (as with the normal cast off/bind off).

MEASURING HINT.
I rarely use a tape measure for my socks. I use my hand. This method works for both toe up and cuff down socks. If you want to use a tape measure then about 5cm/2 shorter than the foot length is a guide.
The length of your hand from the heel to the tip of your middle finger is the foot measurement before you begin to shape your heel or toe. Measure from the beginning of the work and when it is the length of your hand then you begin to shape the heel. 
And the foot and leg measurements work out well if they are the same. So for the leg work until the length is about the same as that from the heel to the beginning of the toe shaping. Then begin the cuff. Simply fold the sock across the heel shaping to measure.
(For those who do or might do cuff down you can use the same principle. Work the cuff until it is about one thumb length. Then work the leg until it is hand length (including cuff), work the heel then the foot until it is the length of the leg up to the cuff and work the toe.)

If I know the person I am knitting for has small feet I just make it slightly smaller than my hand, or bigger for a bigger foot. If working for someone with especially large or small feet then you can manage with a hand measurement of the person you are working them for.

When working the second sock if you are making identical twins then pull the yarn out until you find the same point (Make sure you pull the yarn the same way as you did for the first sock i.e. both from the middle or both from the outside). And in this case I work until I reach the same point in the pattern as with the first sock rather than measuring for beginning the heel and the cuff. After all the change in pattern will be more obvious than one or two rows difference in length once they are on someones feet.


----------



## darowil

If anyone was so prompt as to get the pattern will the download was BEFORE the photos I have changed the numbering of the photos in the pattern (both on this post direct and in the PDF download. 

And here I will post a photo of my last completed pair of socks using this pattern.


----------



## darowil

cindye6556 said:


> Thank goodness. Will be spending tomorrow at the surgery center with DH, and would like to have pattern on tablet so it won't be a wasted day.


I suggest you get the toe started before you go out- easy knitting once you get the first few rounds done- at least until the heel- but the beginning of the toe is a bit tricky as it is different to what you have likely done before.


----------



## darowil

Patchworkcat said:


> I knit socks using anywhere from a 2 mm to a 3 mm needle. You can't get those small sizes in an interchangable needle. Or, I should say ... I've never found any.
> 
> Jill


I currently have a sock on 1.5mm dpns (waiting for the chance to go and buy a circular in that size)- have a 2ply/laceweight yarn that I am making anklets in for wearing in sandals during summer. But they are slow work and might end up for next summer!

And no 3mm is the biggest I would use for socks, rarely more than a 2.5mm so interchangeables are no good for me either. I am gradually buiding up a supply of them in larger sizes, but rarely will I use them for magic loop- as for me thay will usually be used for larger diameter items whihc fit around the whole length of the needle.


----------



## darowil

Angora1 said:


> darowil said:
> 
> 
> 
> If anyone was so prompt as to get the pattern will the download was BEFORE the photos I have changed the numbering of the photos in the pattern (both on this post direct and in the PDF download.
> 
> And here I will post a photo of my last completed pair of socks using this pattern.
> 
> 
> 
> Love that yarn. :thumbup: :thumbup: :thumbup: :thumbup:
Click to expand...

It's a Regia design Yarn by Kaffe Fassett- you will probably be seeing a bit more of it as I have a sock on the circulars here is the same yarn but a different colour so I can work along with others as they go.


----------



## darowil

I asked Angora to test run the pattern for me- so the problems that arose last workshop shouldn't arise. She will be posting a photo of a completed sock soon so you can all see one done by a non-sock knitter following the pattern.

And yes Angora Kaffe Fassett has some amazing patterns. I have a couple here that I want to do one day,but always have too many things I want to do!


----------



## Cashmeregma

Darowil had me test her pattern and I absolutely love the sock pattern. I have never done socks so this is my first pair and I couldn't believe I could do it from written instructions. The heel is so easy. No gusset and somehow magically when you are done knitting the panel the heel is totally formed and you start knitting in the round again with everything together. It was rather unbelievable. This actually makes socks easy. We use Magic Loop to make Magic socks. :thumbup: :thumbup: :thumbup: Bravo Darowil. I know this is going to be a fabulous workshop. I'm going to do another pair with variegated sock yarn. 

Here is a photo of the one sock.


----------



## darowil

TOE
this makes an average womans size.
it is very easy to make it slightly bigger or smaller. simply cast on the same number of sitiches. but either work 2 less rows of increases (to 60, 30 onn each needle) or 2 extra rows (to 68, 34 on each needle). For the purpose of this workshop please avoid any other adjustments as they will require different caston and heel numbers. This just makes it easier to keep track off what is going on- and less confusing for others.


----------



## Granalou

It took me a couple of starts to set up toe to my satisfaction. No problem with the instructions , just getting used to magic loop manipulations. It's my first time using magic loop. I incorporated the reinforced toe stitch and have finished the increases. I'm now working up the foot section and have done the top side in a k2.p2 rib and the bottom in ss. Love how it looks Thank you so much Darowil!


----------



## darowil

Angora1 said:


> darowil said:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Angora1 said:
> 
> 
> 
> Hiya Hiya has an interchangeable set size 2 - 8 US
> 
> 
> 
> 2 US is 2.75mm so for tight knitters sould work and maybe average knitters, but for loose ones like me useless still.
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> Darowil, I am using 2 US and wonder if I should go down 1 size for the next pair? This was the needle size given on the yarn band. Can you tell at all from the photo where I have it on if too loose? Here is what I can measure for a gauge
> 8 sts to the inch 10 sts to 3 mm
> I don't know if I am tight or loose. Not talking personality here...LOL Just started knitting again about a year ago after 30 yrs. of not knitting.
Click to expand...

They do look like a smaller size would be better. Socks are best done more firmly than other things- they wear better this way and the firm fit on the foot is more comfortable as well. And wear on socks is important because they get a lot of friction etc- more so than probably anything else you would knit. (well a well=loved childs toy or blanket/afghan that is dragged everywhere might be an exception- but when you knit these you can't tell whether they will become this well loved).


----------



## darowil

Designer1234 said:


> I just posted on the magic loop workshop in error. but decided to leave it there.
> 
> I am loving this darowil -- and had no problem with the cast on -although for a few minutes I overthought it and didn't think I was doing it properly.
> 
> I am nearly finished the toe and love the look of it - nice as smooth and looks like it will be comfortable.
> 
> Question - If I want to do a pair for my hubby - whose foot is a bit heavier and wider than mine - would I just add a couple more stitches to each side?
> 
> I am using 2.75 needles so this pair will likely fit him - will likely have to adjust for my feet. I am knitting them tight -- lots of fun - great workshop.
> Thanks to angora1 for doing the first pair to check out the pattern. It is an excellent pattern!!


A couple of posts down I say can add or take 4 to change size without needing to change the caston number (or number go down to on the heel). Marked TOE


----------



## darowil

Angora1 said:


> DyakCraft has needles starting at 0. Think they are interchangeable. Expensive, but there are a lot of fans. Heard they have a following on Ravelry.
> Set Contains: 6 pairs of interchangeable 3.5 inch tips (US 0/2.00 mm, US 1/2.25 mm, US 1.5/2.50 mm, US 2/2.75 mm, US 2.5/3.00 mm, US 3/3.25 mm), 3 cables - 16 inch, 21 inch and 39 inch, and a needle roll.
> $145 There is a long waiting list for these.
> http://www.dyakcraft.com/metal.htm
> 
> http://www.ravelry.com/groups/dyakcraft-fiber-tools-lovers


Ideal for sock knitters! These are the small sizes in interchangeables. I would need to be able to get extra cords as well though before I considered them even- I always have a number of socks on the go at once. Tempting as it might be I think I will not be going fo rthese- I would wantto be able to use all the small tips at once (well not literally in that I will only knit one at a time, but have a few with work on them!).


----------



## darowil

Adding ribbing like this works well. Also good is a k3p1 rib- and that can be used either side. I will post a photo of one of my current projects. Th efinsihed sock is inside out. I went for the k3 side becuase I thought the colour changes might show up too much with purl as the main stitch. But I actually think it looks better- but by th etime I decided this I couldn't be bothered frogging! I will include a close up of the mainly knit side stretched on my hand to give an idea of what it looks like on the foot (but I have made this with 68 sttiches so it doesn;t strectch on my foot).
It is best to always leave the bottom of the foot in ss. Most other stitches will be uncomfortable to walk on. But almost anything can go on the top of the foot- though I would avoid anything really bulky as they may be uncomfortable when in shoes or boots. Generally the same pattern is then used on the leg as well- but going all around the leg. With my heel you work about 12 rows of ss on the back of the leg before beginning the pattern- this will be the top of the heel where the shoe might cause pressure thus making it uncomfortable to wear. (this is flexible so that if you are working a pattern with a set number of rounds and you want to begin at row one you can ss the appropriate number of rows so you can begin the back with row1.

Went to get my SD card out the computer for the next photos and it was still in the camera- realised I had forgotten to post the photos so here they come.

Note that a rib will pull in more than the ss and so the sock will look uneven, but that won't show when it is on the foot as the rib will then stretch to size.


----------



## darowil

knitwitconnie said:


> Darowil:
> I started my toe up sock (after two starts) I finally got the hang of the figure eight cast on (Okay, I cheated and went to Utube and WATCHED the demonstration several times before I got it as I'm more visual that way). So, my first question now after a few rows is:
> 
> Your M1 way is sometimes hard for me to find a bar (especially at the very first and second row) so I did a M1 by knitting twice into the same stitch. If I'm using a self patterning stitch and I pick up the bar on the row below, it might be a different color or I found it was hard to pick up without a hole. At least that was my initial problem. Is my kind of a M1 allowed in this pattern? Or do I need to start from now and do it the picking up the bar way, even though the bar might be the color of the row below (self patterning row.)
> So...my basic question is can I do a different M1 if I'm more comfortable and successful with it? Or will that type of increase (using the bar below) be more uncomfortable in the wearing of a sock? Knitting twice into the same stitch does produce a purl look on the second stitch.
> 
> Thanks for your help and for your willingness to show us novices the ropes of a toe up sock. This is fun!
> 
> Connie


Your way can work- the only thing to be aware of is that as you using the stitch to add one you should do the increase in the second to last stitch on the needle so you have one stitch at the edge to match the other end.
Are you doing your increases on alternate rows? The first patterns I used had increases every round to start with and the loops are very hard to find then so I started doing alternate rows and actually the more gradual tapering of the toe.
The issue of the colours doesn't actually occur becuase the loop you are picking up links the stich you just knitted and the next stitch you knit- remember that you knit it striaght away so that it immediatelly goes back down.
Here is a photo with as close a close up as I could get to focus of the change of colour in my toe


----------



## darowil

knitwitconnie said:


> darowil said:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> knitwitconnie said:
> 
> 
> 
> Darowil:
> I started my toe up sock (after two starts) I finally got the hang of the figure eight cast on (Okay, I cheated and went to Utube and WATCHED the demonstration several times before I got it as I'm more visual that way). So, my first question now after a few rows is:
> 
> Your M1 way is sometimes hard for me to find a bar (especially at the very first and second row) so I did a M1 by knitting twice into the same stitch. If I'm using a self patterning stitch and I pick up the bar on the row below, it might be a different color or I found it was hard to pick up without a hole. At least that was my initial problem. Is my kind of a M1 allowed in this pattern? Or do I need to start from now and do it the picking up the bar way, even though the bar might be the color of the row below (self patterning row.)
> So...my basic question is can I do a different M1 if I'm more comfortable and successful with it? Or will that type of increase (using the bar below) be more uncomfortable in the wearing of a sock? Knitting twice into the same stitch does produce a purl look on the second stitch.
> 
> Thanks for your help and for your willingness to show us novices the ropes of a toe up sock. This is fun!
> 
> Connie
> 
> 
> 
> Your way can work- the only thing to be aware of is that as you using the stitch to add one you should do the increase in the second to last stitch on the needle so you have one stitch at the edge to match the other end.
> Are you doing your increases on alternate rows? The first patterns I used had increases every round to start with and the loops are very hard to find then so I started doing alternate rows and actually the more gradual tapering of the toe.
> The issue of the colours doesn't actually occur becuase the loop you are picking up links the stich you just knitted and the next stitch you knit- remember that you knit it striaght away so that it immediatelly goes back down.
> Here is a photo with as close a close up as I could get to focus of the change of colour in my toe
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> Darowil: Yes, I did it in the second to the last stitch and after the first stitch at the beginning. The only difference was to knit twice into the same stitch. I'll go a few rows and then check it out again. Might switch to the bar now that the first couple rows are done. For some reason I had a hole on one side.
> 
> Next question: Is there a way to recognize which row is the increase rows and then the plain knit row if you put your work down at the end of a row? I sometimes get confused.
> Thanks again.
> C
Click to expand...

I was about to go and add to the last post, but will do it here instead to avoid a hole when you pick up the loop you knit into the back loop of the stitch- this gives a slight twist to the stich and closes up the hole.
All you can do is look closely at the first two stitches- you should be able to see if you did the increase on the row you have just done or the next. An advantage of the m1 as I did it is that it is very hard to find a loop to pick if the last row was a m1 so this also helps. But the new stitch with the m1 is also closer than the other stitches- and I think you would find the same with the kfb you are doing. This settles once you have knitted it on the next row.
But I do fudge- so when I go wrong on the toe I usually simply adjust the increases as I go. Often my last round of increases will be missing one, two or even three of the increases! Other times I discover that somehow I have started the increasing on the other half of a round, but I just keep going. It can cope with a couple of little errors like this, no one will be looking that closely at them that they will see this. If too many mistakes you will throw out the shape of the toe, but it can tolerate some fudging.


----------



## darowil

SueWilson49 said:


> Well, finally started at last. Had to frog some yarn as my ordered yarn has not arrived yet, must be the weather as I have several items outstanding that would normally be here by now! I too have a problem with M1 and I have, and am, using knit front and back for my increase. The yarn I am using is dark charcoal coloured and I can't see where to go with M1. The M1 increase has put me of socks in the past and I'm much happier with Kbf, it seems to how neatly on work.


I nearly gave kfb as an option! but decided that I might be confusing things too mcuh if I gave too options! But that OK. 
But if people go too far I won't be helping here becuase it will too sonfusing for others. FOr example if people decie they don't like th eheel and wan tto do a flap I won't help them here as it is totally different.


----------



## darowil

lynnw said:


> I'm about to start this workshop after practicing the figure eight, what a cool cast on! My sock yarn both on the ball and in the free pattern suggest a 3.25mm needle. I'm an average knitter, not too loose or too tight (except on DPs) but think that the 3.25 might not be as hardy as if they were knit tighter. Should I go down to 3mm, 2.75 mm or do as ball suggests?
> 
> Also re the new heel directions. will the pattern be reposted with the corrections included.
> 
> THX, Lynn


I would definitely go down (is it a 4 ply/fingering weight sock yarn?). Socks are definitely better firmer. I rearely use more than a 2.5mm for this weight- but I am a loose knitter. I've checked a number of my sock yarns and the largest suggested is 3mm, most around 2.5mm.
I need to ask prismaticr to change the orginal posting because I can't get in to change it now.


----------



## 5mmdpns

mlw2504 said:


> Darowil,
> 
> Is the right side supposed to be inside? Mine is, I thought I had better check before I get too much done.
> 
> Mary


Just tuck the toe of the sock through the loop and turn it the right way around. Then you will be knitting the right side on the outside of the sock! Zoe


----------



## Gweniepooh

Out of curiosity, I decided to read how Darowil was teaching this workshop. OMG it is so much more simple than the live class on this that I attended! Decided to try the caston and was hooked. 

I'm using a size 2 needle, KnitPicks Felici Boardwalk yarn that I've had for 2 years in my stash. After the class I took I was NOT going to do socks but Darowil has changed my perspective! Thank you! I thought I only be able to do boot socks and here I am making delicate soft socks. LOL


----------



## Designer1234

I feel the same way Gwen -- I am nearly ready to start my heel. I loved the caston -- I wonder if they would work on dpns -- I always disliked the toe on the other socks I made - these are great!



Gweniepooh said:


> Out of curiosity, I decided to read how Darowil was teaching this workshop. OMG it is so much more simple than the live class on this that I attended! Decided to try the caston and was hooked.
> 
> I'm using a size 2 needle, KnitPicks Felici Boardwalk yarn that I've had for 2 years in my stash. After the class I took I was NOT going to do socks but Darowil has changed my perspective! Thank you! I thought I only be able to do boot socks and here I am making delicate soft socks. LOL


----------



## darowil

SueWilson49 said:


> If I go with the k3p1 rib would I k4 then p1k3 X 6 then p1 to keep the rib centered?


How many stitches? if you have 32 stitches on one needle it should work with with k3p1 finsihing on p1. The ones I showed I had 34 stitches on the needle so I did started with k2p1 then went to k3p1. Think I fisnhed with k3. The when you do the leg you continue the rib from where this onbe finsihed. So if finish with p1 then k3 first on the second needle. For the 34 stitches I know I finshed with k1 to continue on with the k2 the next needle started with. So don't do k4 anywhere as you need ot to match up with the leg . You can begin with k1,2 or 3 or even purl 1 depending on how you want to arrange the stitches, but just remember that they will need to join onto the back of the leg later.


----------



## darowil

amg10241 said:


> Ihave to say I haven't been able to start, but I have been looking at the video for casting, Im confused about the wrap and turn? this seems complicated  any help is appreciated!
> thnks
> annemarie


More info is coming on that- this is the other area that will cause problems. But I suggest you wortry about one thing at a time- follow the instructions when you get there with the extra info I give (and a correction to the abbreviations may be called for from what Angora has written).


----------



## darowil

Designer1234 said:


> I feel the same way Gwen -- I am nearly ready to start my heel. I loved the caston -- I wonder if they would work on dpns -- I always disliked the toe on the other socks I made - these are great!
> 
> 
> 
> Gweniepooh said:
> 
> 
> 
> Out of curiosity, I decided to read how Darowil was teaching this workshop. OMG it is so much more simple than the live class on this that I attended! Decided to try the caston and was hooked.
> 
> I'm using a size 2 needle, KnitPicks Felici Boardwalk yarn that I've had for 2 years in my stash. After the class I took I was NOT going to do socks but Darowil has changed my perspective! Thank you! I thought I only be able to do boot socks and here I am making delicate soft socks. LOL
Click to expand...

Does work on dpns- though it is harder becuase you can't slip the stitches you aren't working with onto the cable. After a roun dor two you can add in the extra needle, but too hard for the first round. I have done it so I know it can be done.


----------



## darowil

HEELS
Dowager don't be bothered. This is the other area I thought people would have difficulty with, so I will add photos in (as I expected I needed to do). 
Unfortunately I've been out nearly all day and have my youngest daughter coming for tea in 15minutes- my older one is cooking it as it was actually meant to beat her place but she has ended up staying here for awhile. (and now she wants me go and help her!)
So I will need to come to back to it

Dowager, I think you are asking this from the pattern

HEELS
For the heel you work the stitches on ONE needle ONLY and work in rows (32 stitches at the beginning- and end!).
This is a short row heel, which means that each row is stopped before the end of the previous row and then you turn the work around. Simply follow the instructions, remembering that the rows you are working are getting shorter, but that you still have the other stitches on the needle . You are simply not working them for the first half of the heel. And for the second half of the heel you gradually start working them again.
Simply ignore all the stiches after the w&t- it is called a short row heel becuase the rows are short.
Both loops are on the left side of the stitch above each other
The abbreviations tell you how to do the w&t- and tells you what w&t stands for. (in the last two abbreviations the bold is simply to help show what the different parts stand for- these are not a standard abbreviation but one I made up as I had no idea where I even got this heel from.
I will ASAP add some photos with the wraps etc showing. I have just checked and I already have the photos in my workshop folder so won't take long once I can get a little bit of time- as they are taken I will be able to do it this evening before I go to bed.


----------



## darowil

maggieme said:


> Having done about 2 inches, I slipped them on my foot to find they are quite a bit too big.(I do have a size 5 foot -22 cms) I will make another stab at it in the morning. I am doing 7 sts to the inch on 2.75mm. Do you think I should go down to 56 sts or to 52 sts?


Don't know why they are so big as that is the right type of gauge. Going down 4 stitches will be easy to adapt, but if you need to go down more you will need to make extra adjustments to the cast on number and the heel. I usually use a 2 or 2.25, sometimes a 2.5 but rarely more because need a firm tension/gauge for them. Do you have a smaller needle? if so I would be inclined to go down 1 or 2 needle sizes and work on 60 stitches. Still cast on 12, but increase to 30 on each needle instead.
When I give more details on heels I will include info as to what to do for 60 and 68 sttiches.


----------



## darowil

HEEL
Ok I will post some photos that should make heels clearer- I was so sure I would need them that I took them a couple of weeks ago when I was knitting with bright yarn and each row a different colour so that the loops would show up well.


----------



## darowil

HEEL-different sizes 
If you are using 60 stitches for the heel simply work two less rows in each section of the heel- so you still work to the 12 stitches- start from row 3 so you begin with knit 29 (as you will be working with 30 sttiches).
if doing 68 stitches you will be working with 34 sttiches and you will need to add two rows to the beginning of the heel, knit 33, w&t; purl 32 W&t before row 1 in the pattern.


----------



## darowil

Dowager said:


> Good Morning.
> 
> I have frogged twice now. Part of my problem is,when turning. It shows on the first row you do the wrap and turn at the end, slip the stitch to the left needle, then turn. Then for the second round, it says knit 30. Do you count the slipped stitch as the first knit, or knit 30 AFTER the slipped stitch? It makes a difference. I keep winding up always going to the last stitch on one row to keep the count, but then on the next the count will end the proper number of stitches BEFORE the end of the row. Obviousoly, I am doing something wrong!


HEEL
The slipped sttitch is NOT counted. knit 30 means knit 30 stiches. Each row will be one stitch shorter than the one before it. If you do the w&t as said when you turn the work the slipped stitch is already on the right needle, that stitch is not used again until you are doing the second half of the heel.
Simply do exactly as it is written
row 1 knit 31 stitches, (you will have 1 stitch left on the left needle) Bring the yarn forward (to the front of the work), slip the next stitch onto the right needle purlwise, return the yarn to the back of the work (you have now wrapped the slipped stitch in the working yarn), slip the stitch back to the left needle. Turn the work ready to begin the next row. This stitch that is on the left needle now stays on that needle and is not worked until you get back to that point in the second half of the sock. When you turn the work it is already on the right needle so you do not count it.

row 2 purl 30 you will have 1 stitch left on the left needle) Bring the yarn forward (to the front of the work), slip the next stitch onto the right needle purlwise, return the yarn to the back of the work (you have now wrapped the slipped stitch in the working yarn), slip the stitch back to the left needle. Turn the work ready to begin the next row. This stitch that is on the left needle now stays on that needle and is not worked until you get back to that point in the second half of the sock. When you turn the work it is already on the right needle so you do not count it.

row 3 knit 29 (you will have 2 stitchs left on the left needle) Bring the yarn forward (to the front of the work), slip the next stitch onto the right needle purlwise, return the yarn to the back of the work (you have now wrapped the slipped stitch in the working yarn), slip the stitch back to the left needle. Turn the work ready to begin the next row. You now have 2 stitches on this needle that are not worked until the relevant part of the second half odf the heel

And keep working this way as the pattern says (remember the correction above).
Remember that for the first half of the heel every row is one stitch shorter than the one before, which gives that angled look to the rows in the photo above. You stop knitting the stitch BEFORE the last wrapped stitch, on one of those photos you see the first half dozen or so stitches each in a different colour lined up, each of these is the wrapped stitch from the rows before. Then when you get to the unwrapped section you can tell because there are a few stitches togetheer of the same colour
On the second half of the heel each row is one stitch longer than the one before so that you start to form the pocket.


----------



## darowil

Granalou said:


> Do you start working heel about 2 inches before the desired length of the foot???


yes


----------



## darowil

Dowager said:


> I think I finally got the wrap and turn and am now working on the heel.
> 
> Thanks for all the help from Angora1 and 5 and everyone else!


Great.

wrap and turn is useful for things other than heels as well. This pattern uses them for the wings, beak and tail of the penguin. I couldn't find a photo of the ones I have done so hopefully I can get the book cover on for you to see.
But the principle of short rows can be used in many other areas of knitting to. I have a jumper/sweater pattern which uses short row shaping (I haven't done it yet). The wraps aren't always used in short rows, but often are. The potato chip scarf which many have done here on KP uses short rows to give the twists to it. Many many uses once you grasp the idea of stopping in the middle of the row,


----------



## AverilC

First sock up to heel. Will wait until the morning now so that I can see properly what I am doing with the w&t. Never attempted socks before, let alone something knitted on such small needles, but have really enjoyed this. Am using Regia sockwool and 2mm needles. Fits me like a glove!


----------



## darowil

Angora1 said:


> More gorgeous yarn.
> Thanks for the photos. Yes, those are the two loops that I picked up once you said to do 2 loops. :thumbup: :thumbup: :thumbup: When we did just the 1 loop I did the top one.


HEEL
While I was showering just then I guess I was thinking about this as I suddenly thoguht that I should comment on this! 
It is important to pick up the wrap that you put round the stitch and not the loop between the two stitches. The wrap is the top one. Somtimes it can be hard to tell- and one way of fudging is to use the loop! Though I wouldn't recommend doing it too often on the one heel. There is a limit to how much fudge can be tolerated afterall.

I'm also sorry to say that I haven't managed to work out how to tink past a wrap and keep it! So I have found that fudge when possible as the only other feasible option seems to be to frog the whole heel! Any of the more experrienced wrap and turners found a way to avoid frogging the whole heel when near the end but a bit too wrong to get away with fudge?


----------



## darowil

AverilC said:


> First sock up to heel. Will wait until the morning now so that I can see properly what I am doing with the w&t. Never attempted socks before, let alone something knitted on such small needles, but have really enjoyed this. Am using Regia sockwool and 2mm needles. Fits me like a glove!


Looking good- interesting how diferent the yarns all work up. Regia have some great looking yarns anf they knit up nicely.


----------



## darowil

catlover1960 said:


> And I certainly hope that you will be going on and using other patterns! Nearer the end of this workshop I intend to give some references and hints- including how to use this basic sock pattern for cuff-down. I won't be giving anything like an exhaustive list- there are huge numbers of options out there both printed and online.


So you will be giving some tips on converting a cuff-down sock pattern to a toe-up pattern. I think that would be very helpful. I have made a lot of cuff-down socks and a few toe-up. I really liked the figure 8 cast on and am close to turning the heel so will see how I like it also. Thanks for providing this workshop.[/quote]

The last thing I want to do is have you all stuck doing only this for socks! I hope this will be a launching pad only. I hope Angora won't be the only convert to sock knitting from this! 
One of the big pluses of magic loop over dpns IMHO is the portability- its rather hard to lose your needle, but most of us working with dpns drop them at some time. And can you imagine trying to find the dropped needle in a plane?
I must admit to that I find it easier than juggling the porcupines- but I can and do juggle them. In fact I have two projects on the go on them at the moment. Why? almost always because I have used up all my circulars (or as for one project don't yet have a small enough circular).


----------



## darowil

Dowager said:


> darowil said:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Angora1 said:
> 
> 
> 
> More gorgeous yarn.
> Thanks for the photos. Yes, those are the two loops that I picked up once you said to do 2 loops. :thumbup: :thumbup: :thumbup: When we did just the 1 loop I did the top one.
> 
> 
> 
> HEEL
> While I was showering just then I guess I was thinking about this as I suddenly thoguht that I should comment on this!
> It is important to pick up the wrap that you put round the stitch and not the loop between the two stitches. The wrap is the top one. Somtimes it can be hard to tell- and one way of fudging is to use the loop! Though I wouldn't recommend doing it too often on the one heel. There is a limit to how much fudge can be tolerated afterall.
> 
> I'm also sorry to say that I haven't managed to work out how to tink past a wrap and keep it! So I have found that fudge when possible as the only other feasible option seems to be to frog the whole heel! Any of the more experrienced wrap and turners found a way to avoid frogging the whole heel when near the end but a bit too wrong to get away with fudge?
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> Ummm, what loop?
Click to expand...

the loop- maybe bar would be a better word-between the two stitches on the row you are knitting (the one you pick up when doing a m1 such as I used in the toes. 
To fudge when I have misplaced the wrap I pick up the loop/bar instead between the stitches and work it together with the stitch that should have been wrapped.


----------



## moachie844

This my 1st attempt at posting a picture and knitting socks. I am using size 3.25mm needles and Sensations - Soles and More (Grey Shades) yarn.


----------



## Dowager

These ladies on here appear to be knitting some rather intricate patterns in their socks! More complicated than what can be done with just self-striping yarn.

Are you ladies combining other patterns with Darowil's?


----------



## yto111

My mom and I are doing this together. Both of our socks are very holey, as you can see in this pic. Any ideas as to why? The wholes are at the tip of the toe.


----------



## darowil

moachie844 said:


> This my 1st attempt at posting a picture and knitting socks. I am using size 3.25mm needles and Sensations - Soles and More (Grey Shades) yarn.


Well moachie you've done both new tasks well. The photo is here and the socks look good. These colours are nice and versatile.


----------



## darowil

Dowager said:


> These ladies on here appear to be knitting some rather intricate patterns in their socks! More complicated than what can be done with just self-striping yarn.
> 
> Are you ladies combining other patterns with Darowil's?


Don't you bet on it Dowager- each of these socks have been knitted from the one ball of yarn! The trouble is you often can't tell from the info on the ball band or the ball itself what it will look like. 
This photo shows the socks I posted earleir with the yarn I knitted them from and the ball band(the exact same pattern as you are using) and a cuff for something else (I think I was going to do mittens!) with its yarn.
This phot shows my messy desk, some green yarn I was using for Christmas and never finished as well as yellow mittens I am working on. And this has shown me that I actiually have 3 projects on dpns- I had forgotten the mittens when I said two!


----------



## darowil

yto111 said:


> My mom and I are doing this together. Both of our socks are very holey, as you can see in this pic. Any ideas as to why? The wholes are at the tip of the toe.


My immediate reactions are that you forgot to knit into the back of the stitches on the second half of the first round or that you made the loops too large when wrapping them round the needle (remember that I said in one photo that I had them loose in that they were loose just to show how the loop is made, and that further down a posted one with the right tension.


----------



## darowil

KnottyMe said:


> yto111 said:
> 
> 
> 
> My mom and I are doing this together. Both of our socks are very holey, as you can see in this pic. Any ideas as to why? The wholes are at the tip of the toe.
> 
> 
> 
> I have repeatedly forgotten to knit in the back of those first stitches (for each and every time I've started over) but just knitting more tightly seems to make a difference. Now that I have a sock working fairly well, I'll probably do the second one the same way. I'm glad I have a fairly sizable cast on tail because I'll reinforce the toe stitches a bit with it. Is that a good fudge?
Click to expand...

Think we all need to treat ourselves to some edible fudge when we finish! It is probably best to match the toes- the only thing is it reinforces in your mind not using the back of the loop. But I don't even think twice about it now, it is second nature to do it, but I did do a lot of tinking of this part until it became second nature. Th egood thing is you realise quickly and so don't have much frogging to do.


----------



## darowil

Dori Sage said:


> Sorry to say I haven't gotten started yet. Tomorrow I'll go to the LYS to purchase a longer circular needle. I'm trying to finish GD's alligator scale fingerless gloves. Then I'll start the socks. Actually looking forward to it.


Thats OK Dori, will be open for quite a while still. good to have you join in.


----------



## darowil

cara said:


> Fiddlesticks it is 23rd Jan here in Australia and I have missed the toe up workshop - will it be repeated???I do hope so/


It keeps going for a while- and even after it is closed it will still be accessible- you just won't be able to post questions. But by all means join in. You work at your own pace so people at all different stages anyway. And some are still waiting yarn or needles to arrive so you won't be last by any means.


----------



## Designer1234

DAROWIL; I don't think this is a serious question, but I am wondering. when you are doing the w&t and are finished wrapping it - do you slip the wrapped stitch purplwise on the purl row and like a knitting stitch on the knit side -- or do you go in the back of all the stitches to slip it (which I have been doing - on the purl side, or from the front --or do you go in the front for all the slipped stitches

I have been going in the back on all the rows which would possibly twist the stitch - stitches on the both sides look good, just want to make sure that I learn it properly. I have tried both ways but can't see any difference it - does it matter?

I am going to carry on with it this way but would like to know your thoughts on this. Shirley


----------



## knitwitconnie

Darowil: 
I'm to the start of the top half of the heel, but I am looking at my heel and one side has a turn look (puff) and the other does not, it lays flat. I'll try to post a picture. I think I did my wrap and turns right, but why would one side have a turn look and the other flat if I did it right? I have made many cuff down sox and therefore, I'm thinking I need a turn look on both sides.


----------



## prismaticr

REMINDER TO ALL:
Always start on PAGE 1
ALL pattern corrections have already been added to the original posts AND the downloadable pdf's

When directing newbies to this and any workshop, you are only allowed to post the link to the home workshop sections

http://www.knittingparadise.com/s-105-1.html

ANY other links will be deleted or corrected to this link.

Please actually READ all the wonderful information your teacher has shared AND all the posts by other members helping out! Darowil has 3 elves in here, and they are on top of just about everything... {TO the "elves" you are awesome, but please keep to these suggestions as well...}

As always, I am here to help when I can.

and your socks are looking great! Keep an eye out for the "Parade" link to post your progress and finished socks for all to see!


----------



## Designer1234

mlw2504 said:


> Designer1234 said:
> 
> 
> 
> I just got my heel finished - it worked out beautifully. It didn't seem to make much sense but it works. I guess it doesn't really matter that much which way you go into the stitch to slip it. I am self taught and it has always worked for me but I do want darowil's opinion as to whether it matters.
> 
> I did find it a bit difficult to do the last part going into the 2 wraps. so I am wondering whether I was doing it incorrectly. whatever happened, I have a nice heel turn.
> 
> Darowil, this is a great workshop. I see what you mean about how interesting it is when the last part of the heel works!!
> 
> I am doing a 3 x 1 (3 knit -1 purl rib up the sock and it is looking quite nice. will change to a 2x 2 for the cuff. I am feeling pretty darned happy with this workshop.
> 
> I had no trouble with the magic loop on my full mittens so I feel as if I have learned so much from your two workshops. I will start the other sock and am sure it will work up really easily. thanks again.
> 
> 
> 
> Very nice. I will start mine so that the toes match and not worry about the rest. We will see how it turns out.
> 
> Mary
Click to expand...

that is what i am going to do - start with the same color but as the strips are different widths on mine for each color I am not going to worry too much-- (I rarely try to have the colorworks match , but these are definite stripes so wouln't be unhappy if they do match). He is easy and it is my first pair. next ones I will match. I have really enjoyed this process.


----------



## Designer1234

Dowager said:


> Mary


that is what i am going to do - start with the same color but as the strips are different widths on mine for each color I am not going to worry too much-- (I rarely try to have the colorworks match , but these are definite stripes so wouln't be unhappy if they do match). He is easy and it is my first pair. next ones I will match. I have really enjoyed this process.[/quote]

Mary, the nice think is that the latest fad among the young people is mismatched socks! Some of the expensive boutiques even sell them that way! So if your two socks don't quite match in the stripes or patterns, tell them you are a Fashionista and wanted them to have the very latest! *LOL*[/quote]

:thumbup:


----------



## darowil

Designer1234 said:


> DAROWIL; I don't think this is a serious question, but I am wondering. when you are doing the w&t and are finished wrapping it - do you slip the wrapped stitch purplwise on the purl row and like a knitting stitch on the knit side -- or do you go in the back of all the stitches to slip it (which I have been doing - on the purl side, or from the front --or do you go in the front for all the slipped stitches
> 
> I have been going in the back on all the rows which would possibly twist the stitch - stitches on the both sides look good, just want to make sure that I learn it properly. I have tried both ways but can't see any difference it - does it matter?
> 
> I am going to carry on with it this way but would like to know your thoughts on this. Shirley


HEELS
I don't think it really matters either- But I do a purlwise for the original slip on either a knit or purl row and then after the wrap to I slip it back onto the left needle again I put my left needle into the front of the stich. I have just tried doing it different ways and can't see any real difference between them either. And I just went and worked them together on the next row- as I slip the stich back to the needle after picking up the wrap(s) I automatically put the stitch back onto the left needle ready to work it. And as the stitch is not worked until then it's orientation wouldn't matter until now anyway. 
So the short answer to your question Sirley is just make sure the stitch is facing the way all your other stitches are before you work them- and until then which ever way works best for you.


----------



## SueWilson49

Sox at last! Photos of a) 1st sock started with fig 8 cast on, and b)second of a pair, the 1st cast on with Turkish co but this one with fig 8. Both being knitted with 2.25mm circulars, magic loop and 4ply sock yarn. Seems to take forever to get an inch up the foot!


----------



## darowil

mlw2504 said:


> [
> Very nice. I will start mine so that the toes match and not worry about the rest. We will see how it turns out.
> 
> Mary


If you start with matching areas in the toes I then begin the heel at at set point and simply start the next heel at the same point and ditto for the cuff. I find that this almost always works- the only times are when the yarn patterns are uneven. Working with 4ply/fingering weight ibeinge out by one or two rows is less obvious than the pattern being out. But it is amazing how well they match up with very little work.


----------



## darowil

Sarahb69 said:


> This may be a silly question, but when you do the m1 in the pattern, do you go into the bar between the stitches from the front towards the back, from the back towards the front or does it matter?
> 
> I'm still new to following anything more than a basic pattern and I have seen this m1 done both ways.


TOES
I pick it up by putting my right hand needlein from the right side through the frint and lift it twisting it slightly as I put it on the needle. I then knit into the back of htw stich to slcoe up the hole. However you can also knit into the front and have a neat row of holes going up the toe edge. Just be consistnet- so you either have the holes or have none!
When I ccan find my battery charger I will put some photos on for you If I haven't heard that you have it sorted. Try on a scrap piece of work to see which way gives you the neatest look- as with most knitting it is the outcome that matters not the method. And if you like the way it looks and it works wih the other ways you do things go for it.


----------



## darowil

Dorsey said:


> I have started 4 times with the cast on and each time I get these long stretched out stitches in the middle. I am trying to knit tightly but it is difficult with the sock yarn and size 3 needles. I just could not work with any smaller size needle. I don't think it should look like this, any suggestions?
> Dot


The Knit Picks video knits into the front of both lots of stitches for the cast on not just the second set as I do. I tried this and it did seem to be firmer- but then hard to increase on the first round so increase on round 2 instead. I know you said you couldn't work with smaller needle but if you had them and could just do the caston and first one or two rounds before going onto the size you plan would also help.


----------



## darowil

shirley m said:


> I love the fine wool and needles! here I am .... sitting here on a very hot morning, cyclone supposed to heading this way, doing the heel of darowil,s pattern. Chores to done, knitting socks rules!!!!!


They are perfect for the hot sticky weather- we are looking at 38 today- had meant to get out early for a walk but still here. Bit at least it is not sticky and no cyclones (other than very hot we dont get much bad weather. Our bad storms are nothing like what other places get. Far to way south for cyclones.)
I too love working with the small yarns- but it is slower progress.


----------



## darowil

SueWilson49 said:


> Sox at last! Photos of a) 1st sock started with fig 8 cast on, and b)second of a pair, the 1st cast on with Turkish co but this one with fig 8. Both being knitted with 2.25mm circulars, magic loop and 4ply sock yarn. Seems to take forever to get an inch up the foot!


They look, especially like the colours of Regia (well that is what it looks like, botht he yarn and the band). Have you done all them since this workshop staterted, becuase if so you would have done the equivalent to a foot by now.


----------



## Dowager

Here is a photo of how mine are going. Had to rip out the whole heel and start fresh on it.


----------



## darowil

Gweniepooh said:


> Out of curiosity, I decided to read how Darowil was teaching this workshop. OMG it is so much more simple than the live class on this that I attended! Decided to try the caston and was hooked.
> 
> I'm using a size 2 needle, KnitPicks Felici Boardwalk yarn that I've had for 2 years in my stash. After the class I took I was NOT going to do socks but Darowil has changed my perspective! Thank you! I thought I only be able to do boot socks and here I am making delicate soft socks. LOL


You've changed your avatar! I was looking for photos and found the wrong avatar next to your picture of the socks. I assume it is you- it looks like a great photo of you.


----------



## darowil

knitwitconnie said:


> Darowil:
> I'm to the start of the top half of the heel, but I am looking at my heel and one side has a turn look (puff) and the other does not, it lays flat. I'll try to post a picture. I think I did my wrap and turns right, but why would one side have a turn look and the other flat if I did it right? I have made many cuff down sox and therefore, I'm thinking I need a turn look on both sides.


HEELS
knitwitconnie, I hadn't fogotten you. Just decided to leave it and come back to it a the end. It certainly looks lopsided. Some of my photos on p3 of heels show how they should look (as does designers above). Check them on a cable where they may be able to take on cloer to the correct shape, but it looks as though despite your efforts you have ended up lopsided. This is most likely becuase you have been placing your w&ts wrongly- or forgetting them. This is easy to do- takes time to learn to read them, but the stitch you need to wrap will probably be a little closer to the one next to it than the others are, it has been pulled closer by the wrap on the stitch after it. And you can also look to see if there is a wrap on the stitch. I have never done this, but you could use a stitch marker at each end to remind you where the next w&t is. If you place it after you have completed the w&t the stitch before the marker will be the one that needs the w&t. So when you slip the stitch onto the right needle to begin the w&t remove the marker and then replace it when you have finished the w&t.
After every purl row you should have the same number of wrapped stitches at each end. (often I end up one out and then I fudge, but yours look like it may be too lopsided to fudge, unless you have a deformed foot of course!)
Another thing that might help people is that although you are working with decreasing numbers of stitches you will always have a total of 32 heel stitches.[/quote]

DESIGNER HERE:I wondered whether my numbers were right - I am going to mark that sentence down on my pattern. It is hard to know whether you are doing it correctly - thanks for this tip it will help me with my next sock. Shirley


----------



## darowil

julietinboots said:


> I got my heel turned tonight. I had to rip back to the beginning of the heel and start again mostly because I got lost as to where I was and I'm not positive got all the rows done the second time. I found a dropped stitch when it was done, from one of the knit 3tog I'm sure so just worked it up through to the current row. Then I didn't pull tight enough when restarting the knitting in the round so there is a small hole. I'm ok with the way it is looking so far.


those are small enough to fudge- and I still fudge on many pairs.


----------



## darowil

susan1461853 said:


> First sock ever and the toe is wonderful!! Thanks so much Darowil! Your directions for cast on were perfect. I just started tonight after work and have about half the foot done. I was not sure I could do this, but I am--and excited to work on the heel tomorrow. First KP workshop---LOVE IT!! Thanks again.


Brillant- I get really excoited when others ge tit- my poor husband tries to appear interested when I tell him people are getting but it is hard for him! And I do understand why.


----------



## knitwitconnie

Hi Darowil
PROGRESS! I ended up just continuing with the second half of the heel and it turned out fine. I did have an issue with "back to knitting in the round" as when I tried it the first time, I had holes on each side. I ripped back and picked up three stitches on each side and no more holes. I measured it on my foot and decided to leave the extra stitches for a few rows before knitting them together. Here is what I have so far. I love the workshop and am so grateful for learning this toe up technique! Thank you!

Connie



darowil said:


> knitwitconnie said:
> 
> 
> 
> Darowil:
> 
> knitwitconnie, I hadn't fogotten you. Just decided to leave it and come back to it a the end. It certainly looks lopsided. Some of my photos on p3 of heels show how they should look (as does designers above). Check them on a cable where they may be able to take on cloer to the correct shape, but it looks as though despite your efforts you have ended up lopsided. This is most likely becuase you have been placing your w&ts wrongly- or forgetting them. This is easy to do- takes time to learn to read them, but the stitch you need to wrap will probably be a little closer to the one next to it than the others are, it has been pulled closer by the wrap on the stitch after it. And you can also look to see if there is a wrap on the stitch. I have never done this, but you could use a stitch marker at each end to remind you where the next w&t is. If you place it after you have completed the w&t the stitch before the marker will be the one that needs the w&t. So when you slip the stitch onto the right needle to begin the w&t remove the marker and then replace it when you have finished the w&t.
> After every purl row you should have the same number of wrapped stitches at each end. (often I end up one out and then I fudge, but yours look like it may be too lopsided to fudge, unless you have a deformed foot of course!)
> Another thing that might help people is that although you are working with decreasing numbers of stitches you will always have a total of 32 heel stitches.
> 
> 
> 
> DESIGNER HERE:I wondered whether my numbers were right - I am going to mark that sentence down on my pattern. It is hard to know whether you are doing it correctly - thanks for this tip it will help me with my next sock. Shirley
Click to expand...


----------



## prismaticr

SO.... Since a few of you look close to finishing these wonderful socks, I went ahead and opened the Parade....
I already added a few of the progress pictures...

Feel free to add your finished sock or pair of socks as you get them done....

http://www.knittingparadise.com/t-140856-1.html#2694305


----------



## britgirl

Back to the sock. Was sidetracked as I was trying to finish a shawl for my GDs birthday at the weekend. Now that it is blocking, I am going to concentrate on this. I think I am about half way along the foot. I am curious to see how the number of rows for the foot from toe to heel compares with the ones I have knit from cuff down. I am guessing a similar number, especially since I am using the same yarn I have used in the past. We shall see.

Sue


----------



## darowil

knitwitconnie said:


> Hi Darowil
> PROGRESS! I ended up just continuing with the second half of the heel and it turned out fine. I did have an issue with "back to knitting in the round" as when I tried it the first time, I had holes on each side. I ripped back and picked up three stitches on each side and no more holes. I measured it on my foot and decided to leave the extra stitches for a few rows before knitting them together. Here is what I have so far. I love the workshop and am so grateful for learning this toe up technique! Thank you!
> 
> Connie


It looks good. 
One of the things that I was waiting for comments on was that sometimes holes form at he corners of the heel as you move into knitting in the round. So here is a section I had ready to post at the end of the workshop if it didn't arise before. (I am surprised that you needed 3 extra stitches though I only ever add 1 at each end).

HOLES AT HEEL JOINS
Often where you move from the heel to working in the round again you get holes at each end of the heel. This is easily addressed by picking up a stitch inside the stitch between the just worked heel stitches and the other set of stitches. Working into a stitch rather than the loop between the stitches works more effectively at closing up a hole. Then on the next round knit this stitch and the stitch before it together so that you return to your 64 stitches (32 heel sttiches). I pick the stitch up at the end of each of the last two rows of the heel and then when I turn to work the next row I just slip that stitch rather than work it (it makes a slight slope down to match up with the front of the leg stitches).

Now if I had managed to find my charger I would take a photo of where I mean. The loop between the stitches which seems the logical place to pick up can though pull up more and so still leave a hole, whereas working into a stitch it has more strength and so tends to stay in place.


----------



## darowil

britgirl said:


> Back to the sock. Was sidetracked as I was trying to finish a shawl for my GDs birthday at the weekend. Now that it is blocking, I am going to concentrate on this. I think I am about half way along the foot. I am curious to see how the number of rows for the foot from toe to heel compares with the ones I have knit from cuff down. I am guessing a similar number, especially since I am using the same yarn I have used in the past. We shall see.
> 
> Sue


Other knitting often interferes with what we want to knit. We will insist on doing a number of things that we need to do!
What you have done of the sock looks good and the toe looks fine.


----------



## prismaticr

FROM ozziedee....

Hi ladies I do not know what went wrong but could not post my picture of my very first sock so here it is.
ozziedee


----------



## darowil

ozziedee Its a great looking sock. Wonderful bright colours. Looks like th elong repeats of a Noro (although they are not hte only ones who do those long repeats that aren't actually repeats, so I guess I should say those long colour blocks or something. 
I can't decide whetehr I like the way the Noro doesn't actually repeat- sure can't do identical twins fromthem. And sometimes pretty hard to tell that they are even fraternal, desoite coming fromt he same ball.


----------



## darowil

Dowager said:


> O. K. I thought I had followed your instructions on picking up stitches between the two halves when you finish the heel and are goin to return to knitting in the round. However, somewhere I went wrong. I now have a 'hole" on one side of the sock, and not on the other, *sigh*


How big a hole? If not big look at my post above. If it is big it would indicate that you probably still had your numbers wrong- is it small enough to fudge by picking up one or two sttiches and then decreasing them over the next row or two.


----------



## mlw2504

Darowil,

I finished my heel, and it came out beautiful! But, my working yarn ended up on the front needle and I can't figure out how to get it in the right position. I guess I could just do the purl stitch instead of the knit??? Any suggestions. I don't want to frog it, it is too nice, not even any holes in it.

Mary


----------



## darowil

Mary after doing the final purl row of the heels you turn the work again, the yarn for this one will still be on the front needle as you have only been working on this set of stitches.


----------



## Dowager

Dowager said:


> I will try to get a photo. I think I am just going to have to sew it shut on the inside after it's finished.


Got the photo, hope it shows up well


----------



## darowil

Dowager said:


> Dowager said:
> 
> 
> 
> I will try to get a photo. I think I am just going to have to sew it shut on the inside after it's finished.
> 
> 
> 
> Got the photo, hope it shows up well
Click to expand...

You seem to have about 3 rows there which have just been knitted and not had the wraps worked, Did you run out of stitches again at this end? You could frog back to that point and fudge by picking up stitches in those row ends- and decrease one a row until you get back to the correct number.


----------



## Designer1234

susan1461853 said:


> Is there a YouTube video? Can't make sense of it and terrified to mess up and frog!! I can never pick up stitches correctly!


I would suggest that you put a nylon thread life line on the purl side at the beginning of the heel. Then if you pick up from it you would have them going in the right direction and not lose all your work. I have just started using lifelines and they are so helpful.


----------



## darowil

susan1461853 said:


> Help!! Finished the first part of the heel correctly (I think). Knitted row 20, wrapped and turned. Now in middle, says to knit 12, spwk2tog, w&t but it's on the purl side. Is this right?


row 20 is purl 12,w&t as the last row of the first half of the heel.
row21, knit 12, spwk2tog. (as the frist row of the second half of the heel.
I've checked all the various versions I have here and they all seem have been correct. And it is correct in the last version that was posted.


----------



## darowil

susan1461853 said:


> Is there a YouTube video? Can't make sense of it and terrified to mess up and frog!! I can never pick up stitches correctly!


HEEL
You are not picking up a sttich you are picking up the yarn you have wrapped around the stich- look for itaround the stitch you have just slipped to the right needle.
I will look for videos, but the last one that was posted seems to have confused people because it was slightly differently done to what I had said. Have a good look at my photo above where I show myself lifting up the two wraps, and earleir ones showing the wraps. Very easy to see what you are looking for in these because of the colour contrasts.


----------



## darowil

KnottyMe said:


> Dowager said:
> 
> 
> 
> I will try to get a photo. I think I am just going to have to sew it shut on the inside after it's finished.
> 
> 
> 
> Yup. me too. I'm going to need a triple batch of fudge. I have no clue how I did it, but I dropped the last stitch of the heel on both sides.
> 
> :?:
Click to expand...

HEEL
Can you pick them up?. Even if you loose the wrap around them-and it is very hard if not impossible to pick up the wraps when you have dropped the stitch or frogged- you can fudge it by picking up the loop (as for a m1) and knitting that with the stitch you have just picked up as if it was the wrap.


----------



## darowil

Designer1234 said:


> susan1461853 said:
> 
> 
> 
> Is there a YouTube video? Can't make sense of it and terrified to mess up and frog!! I can never pick up stitches correctly!
> 
> 
> 
> I would suggest that you put a nylon thread life line on the purl side at the beginning of the heel. Then if you pick up from it you would have them going in the right direction and not lose all your work. I have just started using lifelines and they are so helpful.
Click to expand...

I've never tried a lifeline on these- wonder if you could pick up the wrap with them? (actually rarely tried one even) I haven't found a way to be able to keep the wrap when dropping a stitch or frogging. So small mistakes are fudged not tinked if I need to go past a wrap or else the whole heel is frogged.


----------



## darowil

susan1461853 said:


> It was such a pretty toe (sigh). I got to the right row (20 WAS purl--exactly as written) but then couldn't get the second half with the spwk2tog rows AT ALL! Tried frogging back and ended ripping the whole thing out........ Perhaps a picture would help? I feel so stupid but I won't give up! Already restarted and have another pretty toe. Maybe I'll just make toes!!


There is a photo of picking up both wraps on page 4 along with a number of other photos for the heel.

You will probably need to frog the whole heel when major issues arise (if someone knows how to frog wraps and not lose them I would be eternally grateful BTW) But you shouldn't need to go back any further than that. Simply pull the heel off the needle and frog until it won't go any further. If you don't take the leg stiches of the cable they will come undone. From the time you do the first heel stitch to the last just pretend you have no other stitches on the cable and no matter how many times you frog you only need work on those 32 stitches. The others currently don't exist. When you get to the end of the heel the yarn will be attached to the last foot sttich but can't go past there as long as you ignore those stitches.

Edit is that your beutiful toe and you in your avatar by any chance? What fun.


----------



## julietinboots

The progress has slowed. I am using sz 1 needles and they have a sharp point. My finger has been stabbed under the fingernail too many times making it sore along with sort of cut on the side of the finger so I'm wearing my leather thimble. That just slows me down-a lot! But I will keep on keeping on.


----------



## 123wendy

Second try on heel, success. One the changes I made was on the last row of purl. I slipped that first stitch, that brought in in line when going back to round.


----------



## darowil

julietinboots said:


> The progress has slowed. I am using sz 1 needles and they have a sharp point. My finger has been stabbed under the fingernail too many times making it sore along with sort of cut on the side of the finger so I'm wearing my leather thimble. That just slows me down-a lot! But I will keep on keeping on.


But you really truly have got past the hard part now- well done. There is only one new thing now and it is not nearly as difficult as the cast on and heel. Just need a special cast off that is elastic- and my big problem with this was remembering to do it differently.


----------



## darowil

pmarch said:


> I've started and frogged twice. I used size 2 needle, to big, size 1 to big. However when doing top down I use size 2 no problem. Is it because this a toe up that it feels bigger. Should I stay with the one I'm currently working in which is a size 1, feels big but once I get to the foot, maybe it would be ok? Help!


Unless you have a different yarn it should be the same (what about stitch count how does that compare?). I use the same needles for either way. An advantage of toe up is they are very easy to try on as you go especially on magic loop so try them on. (note that I am not you saying you cannot do cuff down and/or on dpns as some do. Simply that it is harder- especially getting over the heel).


----------



## darowil

Dowager and others struggling- how about getting some thick yarn floating around in a light color so it is easy to see and practising the heel s. No need to do the toe etc, just cast on and knit a few rounds. I was going to say don't worry about how many stitches but maybe keep to the number I said just so you get the practice and really get the chance to get it worked out ( and to avoid confusion).


----------



## Granalou

Having sooo much fun. I should have them finished in a few days. I left my 1st sock on needles part way up the leg and started the 2nd to make sure I had enough yarn.

Dowager, I wish I could sit and knit with you. We could put our heads together and fix the poblem. You are really patient and hanginging there. Don't give up.

Granalou/Jan


----------



## 5mmdpns

prismaticr said:


> Darowil....
> Question on these socks... I need to adjust my sizing for diabetic feet. I was working along with size US 2, but think i need to go up to US 3????
> Any suggestions?
> Also is there a better yarn for socks for diabetics? Or regular sock yarn???
> Thought you might know....
> 
> PS> Angora/Dowager/5mmdpns - If you know USA Sock Yarns better, HELP.......
> 
> THANKS


As I am a diabetic, and am a Diabetes Educator, I can tell you that the most important thing for the diabetic foot, is to make sure that the foot is not in any way experimenting pressure. That means the sock needs to be non-binding or tight, but be allowed to expand as the foot needs to. Once the heel is turned, the rest of the leg on the foot should be done in ribbing -- to provide support to stay up while allowing the swelling of the ankle/leg to do so comfortably. (I like a 2x2 ribbing as that gives the best stretch and support.)

Another thing is NO knots in the yarn but use another join such as knitting double for 3-4 stitches with end of the new ball of yarn overlapping the old yarn end.

The other aspect of a diabetic sock is to promote the foot to remain dry. The wool aspect of sock yarn does that. For those who are allergic to wool (such as myself) you will use a non-allergic-to-you yarn. Some suggestions are an alpaca/acrylic blend. If you are not able to use that, then you can knit with acrylic yarn (I do) and change your socks as often as your feet get damp. Zoe 

Most all of the sock yarn sold in USA and Canada have a wool blend to them. You would want to check the label of the yarn to be sure. You will also want to make sure that the yarn is superwash wool yarn, as a non-superwash wool yarn will shrink. Some superwash wool does shrink a tiny bit, but not enough to be concerned about.

You can try on your sock and see how loose/tight the sock is to your foot. (My suggestion is to try on the sock after the evening meal as that is when your foot/ankles have swollen the most.) You can cast on extra stitches if the sock is fitting too tight with no wiggle room. Or, you may switch over to a slightly larger needle and continue on.


----------



## catlover1960

I just finished my socks. They were knit 2 at a time on a 47" cable needle. I have some nerve damage in my left foot that is causing some other problems, so made my socks ankle length at the suggestion of my physiotherapist. They were made with Patons Kroy Sock yarn in the color jacquard denim.


----------



## darowil

x-rayknitter said:


> This is my first workshop, i have tried socks many times read a lot of books. But now I have this wonderful group to help me. the problem is I wear a size 5 1/2 shoe all the patterns are for normal feet. I'm using a 3 needle and super fine sock yarn. I kept the same Number of cast on, and kept trying on the toe. This was a little big but I went forward and reduced the increase to 28 per needle, didn't touch my foot. So I frogged again I feel this needs more than a smaller needle.


I assume you are talking aobut a US 3 in which case is large even for the fingering weight sock yarns. I often us a US 0. Even for a tight knitter I would rarely recommend more than a US 2. I am doing a pair in 2ply (laceweight in the US) and using 1.5mm (a US 000). Socks must be knitted more firmly than other items in the same weight- it increases their durability (important because maybe no item you knit will get more wear on a consistent basis) and it helps them fit better.


----------



## darowil

Granalou said:


> Having sooo much fun. I should have them finished in a few days. I left my 1st sock on needles part way up the leg and started the 2nd to make sure I had enough yarn.
> 
> Dowager, I wish I could sit and knit with you. We could put our heads together and fix the poblem. You are really patient and hanginging there. Don't give up.
> 
> Granalou/Jan


Great looking socks. You've come with one the big advantages of toe-up socks. You can knit them to the size you want based on how much yarn you have. Something that you simply can't do with a cuff down as the leg length can be any legth you like, but a foot is much more limited. You can remove a few rows from a foot but no more.
And one of the things with socks is how easy it is to change each pair if you want. No one pair need ever be the same between the yarns available these days and the flexibilty of socks to adapt. But more on this nearer the end of the workshop.


----------



## darowil

prismaticr said:


> Dowager said:
> 
> 
> 
> Thank you SOOO much, 5 , forthe above post. I am diabetic, and I didn't even know all this. When I was diagnosed several years ago, I was given no "Education", just handed pills and a kit to take my sugar levels, and sent on my way. I knew some stores sold diabetic socks, but had no idea what the diference was or why they were needed, so paid no attention to them as they cost more. I have heard our local hospital has some kind of diabetic classes, so I should probably see if my doctor would recommend them, and if I can arrange transportation to them (I can't drive, and our town has no public transportation, and even the
> greyhound bus no longer stops here, so we are essentially stranded.)
> 
> 
> 
> SO... later on these posts will be deleted, but...
> Dowager, When my DH was first diagnosed, we knew all about Diabetes as both his father and my father and extended family are/were diabetics... That said, I have bought several special diabetic socks and sadly need more... BUUUTTTT, now that we all have Darowil's easy to knit pattern (Sorry 5... toe up is way easier for me) I thought maybe I really could save some money and make several pairs of cool colors and what not for both of us to wear...
> 
> that said... I AM allergic to Wool. makes me itch crazy... ANNDD I have only found cotton/nylon blend in sock weight...
> 
> SO WHERE DO I GET GOOD, Not too expensive, NON wool sock yarn???????? send me links if you have a good website!
> 
> PS Dowager - take those classes if you can get to them, they are a ton of knowledge you often dont think of on your own, and have the most amazing recipes that totally dont taste like you are missing anything... I go for the recipe swap... great stuff!
Click to expand...

Your question and Zoes answer though should stay in- actually when you do the final clean up as you close the workshop if you can move it up near the introduction it would be easilly accessible for anyone else starting before they go out and buy yarn etc.

I have three yarns inmy sock yarn box with no wool in them. The Wendy Happy yarn I got from Deramores in the UK, though I am fairly sure it is availbe in the US. This is 75% bamboo and 25% nylon. Bamboo tends to stretch during wearing but the nylon helps this and I don't recall problems withthis when I wear them. And the rib that Zoe suggest would certainly help them stay up as well. This is beutiful soft yarn
Th eother two I have had for a long time and haven't yet got around to knitting up- the story of my life. As many socks as I knit I still seem to acculmulate patterns and yarn quicker than I can knit them. Sound familar anyone?

These two are both Crystal Palace YArns; Maizy 82% corn Fiber and 18% elastic nylon and Panda Cotton, 59% bamboo, 25% cotton and 16% elastic nylon. Think I go tthem from the US but can't remember for sure, proboably either WEBS or Simply Sock Yarn.
Actually the Simply Socks Yarn Company would be worth looking at as they sell only- guess what? SOCK YARN. Much as I would love to wander through WEBS this would be even better- imagine being surrounded by nothing but socks yarns! If I ever get to the US I will have to arrange my trip around a vist on one of their very limited open days. They are primarily an online store. http://www.simplysockyarn.com/servlet/StoreFront


----------



## darowil

grannyfabulous4 said:


> OK, I have finally gotten a chance to start my socks and on the toe, I have a hole on each side. What did I do wrong? It appears it is the very first round?


Is it from the round where you increased? If so knit into the back of the loop you pick up, or else knit into the front of all the loops and have a neat row of holes all the way up the toe- look at the first posting on page 4.
Or before the first increase? I sometimes have one small hole where the yarn tail is and then I simply use the tail to close up the hole. But I haven't had two holes on this part. 
And is this all you have done or have you done more rounds- because with the early rounds it is hard to tell, a few rounds are needed to pull it together firmly.


----------



## darowil

catlover1960 said:


> I just finished my socks. They were knit 2 at a time on a 47" cable needle. I have some nerve damage in my left foot that is causing some other problems, so made my socks ankle length at the suggestion of my physiotherapist. They were made with Patons Kroy Sock yarn in the color jacquard denim.


Well done, they look great and the colour is lovely- have you posted on the parade of our socks as well? Well I just answered my own question- thanks for putting it there as well.

Yes you can make the legs any length you like (much longer than the length I gave and you may need to start some increases to fit the calf, but you can make them as short as you like.


----------



## jmai5421

darowil said:


> Granalou said:
> 
> 
> 
> That will be my next experiment. Two at a time on 2 circs. I like the maic loop but I think two at a time on magic loop would be too much fiddling and diddling for me. I am bying sock yarn in batches of 2 with the same dye lot so I can make two pair,1/2 of each skien for the first pair and the 2nd halves for the 2nd pair. Hope to make socks for the men in the family ( 1 husband, 3 sons and 5 grown grandsons) for Christmas 2013.
> 
> 
> 
> I've tried two at a time on magic loop and found it too fiddly. A major problems I had other than the fiddliness was knowing where to start when I put the work down. Because when you pick it up if you have finshed working a full needle you have two options as to where to start from. I guess you need to train yourself to NEVER put the work down at the end of a needle even for 15 seconds but always knit at least a few sttiches- the row you are in the middle of is clearly the one you degin on then.
> But 2 circulars coul dhelp the fiddleness (if I can find 2 the same size empty!).
Click to expand...

I wonder if you could mark the first sock with a marker or a contrasting piece of yarn so you always know what side and which sock you are working on.


----------



## darowil

SueWilson49 said:


> Help!!! Just about to start the heel and reading through the instructions. Please, what does spwk2tog mean? Is it slip one purlwise then knit 2 together? And what, when coming to row 23 do you mean by 'note the change from here on picking up the wraps'


Read the abreviations- tell you exactly what to do. note the change is just to draw your attention to the fact that the abreviation has changed (and don't try to work out from this abbreviation as I should have changed it slightly more than I did- just use the instructions) - the second one applies to all the rows after the the first two picking up wraps.


----------



## susan1461853

Not perfect, but I'm getting the idea. My husband even said "It looks very sock-like!". The pictures rally helped Darowil! Wonderful! Of course I want it to be perfect!!! :lol: :thumbup:


----------



## darowil

susan1461853 said:


> Not perfect, but I'm getting the idea. My husband even said "It looks very sock-like!". The pictures rally helped Darowil! Wonderful! Of course I want it to be perfect!!! :lol: :thumbup:


They look good. And they do say pratice makes perfect- but despite all the practice I have had mine don't come out perfect- some not far off but others look good with fudge, and others just need frogging.


----------



## knitwitconnie

This is my first toe up sock! I think it's working out fine and I will make the cuff ribbed as long as possible until I run short of yarn. That's awesome to be able to do that. Can't do that with cuff down socks, which I've made dozens of, but this is great! I'm a new convert to toe up from now on. Thanks Darowil !!!


Off to start the second one sometime soon. Plus I have a pair of cuff-down to finish and it's not nearly as exciting! I do have one question about starting the second sock.....do I have to waste a lot of yarn to start at the same point? Or just find the starting point in the yarn and start there, adding the scrap bit later if I need it? Not sure. 

yarn: Berroco "Comfort Sock" self patterning color 1816

Sorry about the small picture. Not sure how to get it larger. Can anyone help? thanks.


----------



## bkennard

bkennard said:


> darowil said:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> bkennard said:
> 
> 
> 
> Any hints on how to do the heel. I can't get past row 1 of it. I have read the instructions while trying to do it and just can't get it.
> 
> 
> 
> Have you looked at the photos and read all the comments on the heels?- they are many of them.
> You are doing a wrap- this means that you are wrapping the atich in the yarn, after you finish the wrap your yarn should be around 3 sides of the stitch you have just wrapped as you begin the next stitch.
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> I have read and looked at everything. This morning I just decided to dive in and try it again. I thinking have it now. Will be doing the leg to the cuff shortly.
Click to expand...

Here is a picture of what I have so far


----------



## darowil

knitwitconnie said:


> I do have one question about starting the second sock.....do I have to waste a lot of yarn to start at the same point? Or just find the starting point in the yarn and start there, adding the scrap bit later if I need it? Not sure.


This is a purelly personal preference, some people like them to match exactlyy- identical twins- others don't mind- fraternal twins. If you are happy with fraternal twins then start at the beginning of the ball (and as you are using up all your yarn on the cuff, unless they are close to the same ataring point- and some are- you will be better beginning at the beginning of the ball.

Well done on fisnihing the first sock. I rarely do a cuff down sock now.Casting on all those stitches and then the kitchener at the end. Only when I am after a specfic sock do I normally do cuff down. And the ability to adjust more easily as you go.


----------



## darowil

knitwitconnie said:


> For self stripping yarn that comes out with such a lovely pattern, if you are wanting identical socks, you need to start your cast on at the same place in the yarn pattern as you did for the first sock. If you dont mind the sock mates not being identical, then you just go ahead and start anywhere you like with the yarn.
> For self stripping yarn, I buy two balls. Find the same pattern of yarn color on each and make my slip knots there for the cast on. That way I get two identical socks. When I end off the yarn on both, I will now have two identical start places for my next pair of socks.
> For myself, I have two identical sets of needles and knit both socks at once, alternating between the two of them. I finish them both at the same time. This works for me. Zoe


Thanks Zoe! Appreciate the tip. I usually make worsted weight wool sox in plain colors so my first venture into self striping was the pair of sock yarn that I made cuff down (am to the heels on both of those) as I also use a second 40" circular to keep the two about the same place to avoid SSS (Second Sock Syndrome!) However, all three of my magic loop sox needles are occupied so I will have to finish one of them before finishing this class toe up pair. Anxious to get the old ones off the needles and devote my time to toe up from now on. 
thanks again.
Connie[/quote]

Isn't terible when you need to put off starting a new pair beciuase you are using all your needles? Today or tomorrow I am gheading off to get some new needles (I want a very small circular, 1.5 or 1.7mm US000 or 00). She also has the new Kollage circulars withthe firmwe cord. Now I have just come up with a great excuse to get them and use them- so I can post on th emagic loop worshop before it is closed what I thought of them, as I had commented that I didn't like the soft cords they had. And while I am down thereI just might have tolook at her lovely hand dyed yarns- though unless I get some to knit for my MILs birthday I should resist. I have a number of her skeind here already in various states of use, including unstarted!


----------



## SueWilson49

Hi all, me again, having all sorts of of problems with the wraps on the heels. My wool is alpaca sock yarn so slightly fuzzy to start with and after it has been frogged and poked and prodded trying to pick up the wrap, it's well and truly unworkable with !! One thing I have noticed, not just on these socks but on other things I have knitted, when I knit on circulars and continuously knit, my stitches are a lot 'denser' than when I do knit then purl rows?? Any body else find this? I have tried to take a pix but it doesn't show that much on the photo.


----------



## KnottyMe

UNCLE!! I am going to bind off this sock and start over with a different yarn (the 2nd skein is a different dye lot anyway and would never look good). It has been a great learning experience so far and on subsequent socks I'll know to look for and try to avoid the hole at the toe, knit into the back of the toe stitches, wrap and turn the heel instead of crash and burn and drop stitches. I'll know not to freak out when or if I come upon another knot in the yarn. I will not put my muscles in knots trying to knit too tightly with such tiny needles. I also now know that my hands and feet are not precisely proportional.

Next up is Knit Picks Stroll. Is anyone using it? If I get enough progress on the next, I'll post a picture.

Thank you!!! :thumbup:


----------



## Designer1234

marywallis said:


> Just keeping in touch. I have a toe done, everyone has such beautiful colors. The socks look so nice. I love the magic loop. marywallis


I have one sock done and am about 2 inches up from my second toe. It sure does look better than my first one. I might make 3 as my first one looks pretty scruffy - and I am much happier the way the toe went on this one. I know I will do a better job on the heel too as I fudged it a bit -- had problems with the double wraps, but have read the instructions 3 times so can see what I was doing wrong. I did finish it so that is something. Now I am fine tuning it. great workshop

My socks are a weird stripe pattern -and I finally gave up trying to match them but hubby doesn't mind at all ( in fact I never worry about them matching, however as they are for him I thought they would be too 'loud' but he loves them.

I am going to use a basic color for the other pairs with this yarn as an accent as this was the Kroy sock yarn I got for 2.00 per ball which is very good here. I have 4 balls left of each color. Iguess I could make us matching pairs so we could be 'twins' no we would get them mixedup. I handwash all my socks even though they are machine washable but the other socks I have made look brand new so it is worth it.


----------



## bkennard

This is my finished sock. I made it as an ankle sock. Waiting on a sock yarn order so that i can make a complete set. So, this is my test sock. I sure learned alot with this class.


----------



## darowil

Maryhm said:


> darowil said:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Maryhm said:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> darowil said:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> susan1461853 said:
> 
> 
> 
> Is there a YouTube video? Can't make sense of it and terrified to mess up and frog!! I can never pick up stitches correctly!
> 
> 
> 
> HEEL
> You are not picking up a sttich you are picking up the yarn you have wrapped around the stich- look for itaround the stitch you have just slipped to the right needle.
> I will look for videos, but the last one that was posted seems to have confused people because it was slightly differently done to what I had said. Have a good look at my photo above where I show myself lifting up the two wraps, and earleir ones showing the wraps. Very easy to see what you are looking for in these because of the colour contrasts.
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> I'm still a little confused where the two wraps came from. I finished the first part of the heel per instructions but only have one wrap around each stitch. I may be just having a mental block, so, if you would, help me understand the two wraps.
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> The first two rows of the second half of the heel have one wrap. The rest of the rows have two- the first half of the heel you added one wrap, and then when you come to the end of each row on the second half you also wrap, 1+1=2 so two wraps. I have done it without this second wrap but it isn't any harder (as by now you have the wrapping sorted out and picking up one or two is no different really-an occasional miss is fine) but it looks neater the way I have written it- and I would think it would be a bit stronger too.
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> Well, that solves the problem. I didn't realize I was to continue to wrap on the second part of the heel but, sure enough, there it is in the instructions. I will try to go back the two rows and correct my mistake. Thank you so much. I have really been enjoying both classes even though I have been knitting magic loop/two at a time. I'm always looking for new techniques and outlooks. I have definitely learned something new.
Click to expand...

Glad you sorted it out- and that you have learnt stuff even though you had some of the skills.
If you haven't gone back might be better not going back, fudge by picking the loop for a m1 jsut for the two rows. Very hard (in fact I haven't worked out how to do it!) to go back and not loose wraps. An occasional m1 type pickup doesn't matter! And how do I know you ask? Experience- fudge is much nicer than frogs as well!


----------



## darowil

Kissnntell said:


> same here, sue
> i think it's because of the diff tensions
> i knit tighter than i purl
> that gives it a loftier feel then the denser feel of circs & solid knitting


I was getting ready to say the same thing. If you are really worried by it you can always use a different size needle for the purl row. If your purl is tighter use a larger neeedle, if your purl is looser use a smaller needle. (if you want to do this for socks and you have dpns in the right size you can use one of them, unless it is a very short one).

Sue that heel doesn't look too bad- by the time it is on a foot it won't show- they strectch to the shape of the heel. Again I know through experience! And the different tension/gauge doesn't show up in th eohotos (well I just see it knowing what you have said).


----------



## darowil

susan1461853 said:


> My purl rows are always looser and knitting in the round produces a lovely dense knit. Unfortunately the purl rows are looser on the heel. Hoping after washing it will all even out. Does anyone know if that happens?


Certainly washing will help even it out. Why not try it on the finshed sock before beginning the next one- and if not and you are bothered by it try my suggestion above. Or finish the pair so they match.


----------



## darowil

all you froggers out there. I have started a toe today- and am sitting here thinking that maybe I have fudged too much and that frogging is called for. Have only done few rounds and already got my count way off.
However the main purpose was to try out my new Kollage circulars. And they are better than the old ones with the soft cord. The cord is really good. The join is much better, but still not perfect. I will use this one again but the old soft cord with the terrible jin I will not use (well as short straights I could). And as I have said before I do like the square needles. I was told today that they knit up smaller so to use a size larger than would normally use.


----------



## darowil

Saroj said:


> I am not a sock lover because I never wear one. My feet are very warm. However, I was intrigued by the cast on method and loved it. I did tell all the ladies in my knit club about the method. I am trying to see if I can knit mittens top down. Have not figured out the thumb yet. Any suggestions? Saroj


Yes!- I have just found a link for fingerless miittens done cuff down so that the thumb gussett will be done the way you want. http://www.lifeincleveland.com/2010/04/leftover-sock-yarn-mitts.html It was on one of yesterdays posts in Kp would you believe? Have printe dit off for me too, gereat way to use up leftover sock yarn knowing when to stop! And I have a heap of hte stuff.


----------



## Cashmeregma

**Was thinking about this workshop and what a fabulous opportunity it is to learn tips and a special way of doing knitting from an experienced knitter in Australia. We didn't have to fly over there, find Darowil and go to her knitting session, although that would have been fun. We get to learn it in the comfort of our home. She is a day ahead of us and our day is her night, and she is in the middle of summer, yet here we are sharing knitting tips. I have always wanted to learn socks and just love this method
:thumbup: :thumbup: :thumbup:


----------



## susan1461853

Wanted to show off my BIG sock--2 wouldn't fit in the picture :lol: very cozy bed socks for a good friend.


----------



## susan1461853

marywallis said:


> What a beautiful sock- looks so soft and warm, what yarn did you use. marywallis


Thank you!! I've attached pics of the label.


----------



## britgirl

Well, I have done the heel and am working on the cuff now. I feel like I am on the home stretch now. The heel wasn't bad at all, the worst part was starting to work in the round again and pulling the stitches together again. Yes, I have a little hole, but think I can fix that without too much difficulty. On the second sock I think I will try to pick up a stitch or two as per Darowil's instructions that I didn't happen to see until after I had already worked it.

Sue


----------



## Gweniepooh

Have _finally_ finished the toe part and am about to begin the heel. Just a tad apprehensive but will give it my best go.


----------



## darowil

knitwitconnie said:


> I haven't thought of using Sensation yarn (lots in my stash via JoAnn's Fabrics). But those socks are really pretty! Sensation is a #"5" though, so not a real sock weight, but more like worsted (4).
> Would that not be a little too bulky for wearing as a normal shoe sock? (or at least it would make a bigger sock) but slippers would be awesome or for in-boot wear as well. My sock weight seems to be similar to a fingering weight like a 3? or a #1 or so. I'll bet these worked up faster. They are very pretty and look warm.


Some people do make socks with heavy yarns for boots. 
But most are as you say around a fingering weight- this works well for most people. There are a few sock yarns that are heavier which are helpful for those in very cold areas or who have very cold feet.
Th eother thing as I say in my introduction is that for socks to wear in shoes etc really need for a sock yarn for wear and tear. I don't wear bedsocks so haven't ever knitted them. Maybe I should knit some for my MIL- she wears my knitted socks to bed and during the day. An dthwy would be quick and cheap as I could use aheavy yarn and don't need to pay the money for a sock yarn.


----------



## darowil

britgirl said:


> Well, I have done the heel and am working on the cuff now. I feel like I am on the home stretch now. The heel wasn't bad at all, the worst part was starting to work in the round again and pulling the stitches together again. Yes, I have a little hole, but think I can fix that without too much difficulty. On the second sock I think I will try to pick up a stitch or two as per Darowil's instructions that I didn't happen to see until after I had already worked it.
> 
> Sue


It was a case of trying to work how much info to give at once without it being too overwhelming!
But they do look good and yes you are on the homeward stretch.


----------



## darowil

grannyfabulous4 said:


> Gweniepooh, I am with you. I had to frog the toe, so am apprehensive about the heel, since it seems there were some problems for others with that. I love your yarn.


Depending on how you work you could well be best simply staring witht heinsrtuctions and doing what they say- without even trying to figure them out first- and only if that doesn't work trying to figure it out and going to the questions. Often trying to think ahead causes more problems than just doing what it says.


----------



## darowil

grannyfabulous4 said:


> Yes, Darowil, I agree about starting with the instructions. I was taught that crocheting and knitting patterns are to be followed, not read, so I usually just follow the instructions. It has been foggy and hazy here all day and with my eyes needing "repair", I haven't done much today on the socks, but hope to work some tonight, so I am ready for the heel in the morning and before "repair" work is done! My daughter spent a month in your lovely part of the world and keeps in touch with a pen pal from middle school, some 30 years ago, so Australia is on my bucket list, as was learning to knit socks, toe up!


HEELS
Especially with your eyes make sure you have a very good light- seeing the loop coul dbe difficult otherwise.
Actually now there is a suggestion I should maybe have made earlier for others! I will add a heading to this to draw others attention to it.


----------



## darowil

Gweniepooh said:


> Thank you the yarn is knitpicks Felici, color Boardwalk. I made it through the first 21 rows of the heel, messed up on row 24 so badlu I frogged back to the beginning of the heel. Here we go again. I do know what I did wrong so hopefully I'll get it right this time.
> 
> 
> 
> grannyfabulous4 said:
> 
> 
> 
> Gweniepooh, I am with you. I had to frog the toe, so am apprehensive about the heel, since it seems there were some problems for others with that. I love your yarn.
Click to expand...

Unfortuantelly I haven't worked out how to tink the heel- only grog all the way back to the beginning of the heel- if too messed for fudge of course. 
edit- don't think I will remove my mistake in the last paragraph. It might explain why frogging is needed in the first place! I'm sure you all realise that what I meant to say was go all the way back. Maybe the grog was added to the fudge, so that a frog was needed.


----------



## yto111

Well here is my sock through the heel. I am frogging the entire thing and starting over. I did a lot of fudging, But ultimately the sock is way too big. The yarn called for a size 3 needle. I knit tightly so I used a size four. If I decrease the size by 4 stitches, do I have to recalculate the pattern? or will the heel just have fewer rows?


----------



## Mandonan

I fit it! I finally completed an entire sock! I'm just so geeked I want to shout it from the rooftops! Thank you so much to Darrowil and all the testers and knitters who have helped along the way! A special thanks to those who have provided laughs when I needed them most! You are a special group! My husband couldn't believe I was learning to do socks from someone in Australia! I love computers!


----------



## darowil

yto111 said:


> Well here is my sock through the heel. I am frogging the entire thing and starting over. I did a lot of fudging, But ultimately the sock is way too big. The yarn called for a size 3 needle. I knit tightly so I used a size four. If I decrease the size by 4 stitches, do I have to recalculate the pattern? or will the heel just have fewer rows?


For only 4 stitches you are correct simply less rows in the heel- do the w&ts until 12 sttiches and then two less in the second half as well. And you can simply frog down to 60 sttiches instead of needing to do the toe again
The fudging doesn't show up but unless you have some someone else with a big foot to give it too you need to get it about right. They do have some freedom but if way too big it will never be comfortable.


----------



## darowil

Mandonan said:


> I fit it! I finally completed an entire sock! I'm just so geeked I want to shout it from the rooftops! Thank you so much to Darrowil and all the testers and knitters who have helped along the way! A special thanks to those who have provided laughs when I needed them most! You are a special group! My husband couldn't believe I was learning to do socks from someone in Australia! I love computers!


It looks great- just as well you are not near me- my daughter woul dbe over to steal them. She loves purple and even delicate stripes which she loves even more. Aren't computers amazing (most of the time)? I certainly never thought I would be teaching people in North America to knit through the computer. I don't consider myself myself very computer savvy but was still able to do this (mind you almost 2 years on KP has taught me how to get my way round here so that sure helped).
And feel free to shout it from the rooftops, it deserves it.


----------



## darowil

Gweniepooh said:


> DAROWIL: I'm afraid you'll sign off before I check through all the questions so please forgive me if this has already been answered.
> 
> On the second half of the heel rows 28 & 29 AND rows 33 & 34 are both purl rather than the pattern of K a row P a roll. Is this correct? I've done it and it has created a ridge on the outside of the sock?
> 
> WELL HORSEFEATHERS! Sorry but now saw a post saying corrections had been made to the pattern which of course I didn't see bercause I followed advicse to just follow the pattern before looking at qustions and OF COURSE I had printed out the pattern BEFORE any corrections had been made. Oh well...Guess who IS NOT frogging again...it is what it is. Next pair will be better. Now to reprint the pattern for the future


Sorry- I must remember to mention that next time! It seems so long ago now though it is only a week. 
Makes it unique anyway!


----------



## jmai5421

sewknitbeadgrandma said:


> Mandonan said:
> 
> 
> 
> I fit it! I finally completed an entire sock! I'm just so geeked I want to shout it from the rooftops! Thank you so much to Darrowil and all the testers and knitters who have helped along the way! A special thanks to those who have provided laughs when I needed them most! You are a special group! My husband couldn't believe I was learning to do socks from someone in Australia! I love computers!
> 
> 
> 
> Great Job!
> Love the color. Bet it won't be long before you are screaming from the roof tops "I made a pair of socks".
Click to expand...

I love your sock too and especially the color. Was that a k2,p2 or k3,p1. I like how you did the same stitch for all of the instep. I did a k3,p1 for the cuff but will do all of the instep next time. Yes it is hard to believe our teacher is in Australia and is able to help and encourage each and everyone of us.


----------



## darowil

Mandonan said:


> Thanks everyone for your kind words! I used a K2P2 for the rib. Next pair I'm going to try to do the reinforced toe and heel. I have the toe for my second sock done so today I will work on the foot. The heel is what gave me the most trouble, I did have to pick up a couple of extra stitches on each side when I joined back together to go circular again. It looks good though, no holes. Not sure what I did wrong that the hole would have been so large without the extra stitches. This is a learning experience! The first sock is half worn out already from being frogged to the beginning so many times! I just couldn't frog the heel and then be able to pick up the stitches, probably because I need my glasses changed!


You should only need to frog the heel itself- if you are having troubles picking up the stitches once you have frogged the heel why not put a lifeline in those 32 sttiches before you start the heel to make picking up the stitches easier if you need to- and if you don't you haven't lost anything.


----------



## darowil

jmai5421 said:


> [
> I love your sock too and especially the color. Was that a k2,p2 or k3,p1. I like how you did the same stitch for all of the instep. I did a k3,p1 for the cuff but will do all of the instep next time. Yes it is hard to believe our teacher is in Australia and is able to help and encourage each and everyone of us.


Your color is so practical though- goes with almost anything. It looks good- I don't know why your castoff rolls! I assume as you say you are knitting left ahnded that you are moving your stitches from the right needle to the left? Try working your k2tog into the opposite leg of the stitch to what you have done. But if any one has other ideas please share them - I am going by guesswork here largely! The cast off is looser -did you change needle size to cast off? if you did this could also explain it as it is a looser castoff already- but this is needed to get it over the heel. My castoff doesn't roll, but it does flare out a little (if I had managed to find my camera charger I would post a photo) but it doesn't roll. ANd once it is on a leg that flaring doesn't show up as the rest of the cuff stretches. If you look back at my postings of finished socks you can just work out the flaring at the top.


----------



## darowil

knitwitconnie said:


> Darowil, do you have any suggestions on what to use to reinforce the heel and toe? I found something called "Woolly Nylon" at JoAnn Fabrics on line and it worked for a pair of worsted weight. Haven't tried anything for sock weight yet. Is there anything we should use to keep homemade socks lasting longer in those two wear areas? So grateful to have learned this toe up method!! You are awesome to take us all on! Thank you for all your hard work.
> Connie
> 
> I have never reinforced any socks made with sock yarn- they already have reinforcemnt worked into them generally (that is one thing that the polymide, nylon etc added does), And I have heard that adding reinforcment actually can wear the yarn quicker as it rubs on the yarn around it and can gradually cut into the yarn. This rubbing against each other is one reason why socks needed to knitted firmly as well- if they are loose as they move in the shoe the sttiches rub against each other and cause friction, but if they are snug against each other they don't move so much-less friction= less wear.
> 
> However Mandonan is talking about a different stich I believe for reinforcing the toe and heel. It was given by by someone earlier on this workshop. And it can be done, but again I have never bothered becuase of the reinforcement added to the yarn (becuase it is added to the yarn it is a part of the fiber and so doesn't cause frictionlike when you add it yourself). But if you are not using a sock yarn someform of reinforcemnt woul dbe helpful- as would some knitting elsatic in the cuff as most other yarns don't have enoughstretch and support at the asme time to keep socks up. HOw many of you remember trying to keep your socks up as a child? They didn't have these materials back then.


----------



## darowil

jmai5421 said:


> I sometimes wish that there would be directions for the basics for lefthanded knitters.
> I understand about your charger. I left mine at the cabin when we closed. I have been very careful not reviewing on the camera and taking only the necessare pictures. The battery is beginning to go. I will be albe to get the charger the end of April when we move up there.


Yes I did do it in the rib- and it does work out better, though when I was first using it I did it in knit only as it was too difficult trying get it all worked out- and even now occasionally my mind will blank out.
As an aside I have just finished knitting my Ashton (finally)- a shawlette designed by Stevieland who is a regular poster here on KP for those who don't know- and she uses the same castoff for the shawl. i wish I had my charger because I would like to take before and after blocking photos.
I have borrowed a book from the Handknitters guild here on left handed knitting. I will look it up tomorrow- but it is in the bedroom where my husband is already sleeping (I have a left handed daughter who has somehow learnt to knit left handed which is why I picked up the book.)


----------



## Cashmeregma

I'm not done with my socks yet as I want to add some pink roses, but this shows the cast off quite well as it is in a different color and it shows how beautifully it fits the leg. There is no problem with rolling on mine and I'm so sorry yours is rolling. It should work L handed also in my thinking.


----------



## darowil

Angora1 said:


> I'm not done with my socks yet as I want to add some pink roses, but this shows the cast off quite well as it is in a different color and it shows how beautifully it fits the leg. There is no problem with rolling on mine and I'm so sorry yours is rolling. It should work L handed also in my thinking.


Looks good with the different coloured castoff- would never of thought of that myself.
The photos show exactly what I was trying to explain so thank you Angora. In the first one there is a slight flaring of the top of the cuff, but no sign of it once it is on the leg.


----------



## darowil

Another reason to go for sock yarns when using the self patterning and self stripping is that they are designed for small numbers of stiches and working in the round and thus show up the pattern best. the repeats could be too long in those designed for larger items- and working straight and in the round also make a difference because in the round each new round starts at the same point but with straight knitting each new row begins at the opposite end to the last row.


----------



## darowil

I have only tried it once and didn't like it ! So I'm sorry but I can't help. There are a number of books available but if you googgle toe-up two at a time socks you should get some good hits as well. And add magic loop if you are getting hits for two circulars and definitely want to do magic loop. 
I am thinking as I go here, but I wonder whether two at a time on two circulars would work? Seems it might solve a number of my hassles with doing them on magic loop except for tangling the yarn. Maybe when I have two needles the same size free I will give it a try.
Many people do as I suggested early on if they have two needles and work two sokcs as the same time doing a heel than the other and keeping alternating like this.


----------



## darowil

Mandonan said:


> I was thinking more of doing the reinforced stitch that was shown by another knitter early in the game. It was a slip one knit one across instead of knit every stitch. I was unsure about doing that along with learning the toes and heels so I did it straight up.
> 
> This is so fun! Thanks again for all your time and knowledge!


i did mention that- but I think I went back in and added it after I had posted and so you could well have missed it.


----------



## darowil

britgirl said:


> I am not quite up to the cast off, but I have used that cast off whilst knitting Dee's shawls and it is a pretty loose cast off. That is alright if it doesn't stretch overly when actually worn.


I've never had it stretch while wearing the socks when I have used sock yarn- they are all as firm as when I fisnhed them. What is good is not just that it is loose more importantly for socks that it is elastic- so it stretches to go ove rthe heel, but then goes to the size of the calf. And getting ove rth ecalf is the most important reason for a stretchy cuff, though you don't want a tight one on your calf.

A k2p2 is more elastic than a k1p1 rib and so stays up better. I do occasionally do a k1p1 rib when it suits the pattern better- but the k2p2 is defiantly better. ( When I do k3p1 socks I still do a k2p2 rib at the top, but as long as you match them up by making sure that the p2 covers the purl a stitch and 1 knit it doesn't really show up but holds the sock up better).


----------



## darowil

jmai5421 said:


> I like the k3,p1 but did not know about doing the k2,p2 for the top. How long do you do the k2,p2 on the cuff? Do you do it just for the cast off orw or more rows?
> 
> Angora1 I love your sock, especially the color change. I also really like the cuff pattern.
> 
> Are any of you going to do the lace sock on the next workshop? Of course along with the dead fish hat. That will be fun. I like to see all the color combinations on those hats. I am not good with matching colors. I am still going to do the lace sock. I hope I am not biting off more than I can chew.


I do about 1 1/2 inchs of k2p2 rib- the socks on the keyboard when I show both sides of the k3p1 rib have the k2p2 rib for the cuff and you should be able to see from the inside view where I started the cuff.


----------



## darowil

Angora1 said:


> It was supposed to be for this Christmas.


I have the same thing! fortunately now down to one pair of mittens (and if I don't remember to phone QANTAS one mitten to replace one I think got left on a plane). Oh and some anklets in laceweight yarn for Maryanne. And of course my jumper to knit from yarn I was given.


----------



## britgirl

Am I correct in thinking that the first part of each round is actually the back (bottom) of sock? This being so, I assume that any pattern for the top of the foot would actually be knit on the second row (part) of each round. 

Sue


----------



## Designer1234

ATTENTION SOCK KNITTERS. HERE is the information on our next sock workshop which will be taught by patchworkcat (Jill).She has designed a lovely patterned sock called the* 3 leaf Clover Rib sock*. She has kindly removed this pattern from being for sale on Ravelry and her blog, and is offering the full pattern and instruction the workshop for us. This sock is gorgeous.

The workshop is on February 25, and I will be opening it a few days prior to that date - (likely on the Friday or Saturday prior to that.

It is not a toe up sock, but uses magic loop. I really think that all of us can make this lovely sock. Jill will teach this pattern step by step and I hope you will join us. Please watch this workshop , the new "Workshop Happenings' which appears 2 or 3 times a week on the daily digest and on Main - I will post the day before the workshop opens.

Thanks to darowil for this great workshop- I am just in the middle of my heel and it is much easier the second time around !


----------



## darowil

Dintoo said:


> Darowil: another big thanks to you and your elves for this workshop--magic loop and toe up socks. You make everything easy. I'm almost finished my first sock (was late getting started) and am looking forward to finishing both socks. They are muted copper colors, very pretty, I think. Sorry I can't post a picture-- I knit better than I can use a computer. I'm so glad I found this forum.Didn't know I had so much to learn. Thanks again. Jinny.


Do you have digital camera and a grandchild, niece etc? These are all you need- thye can do th etask for you- and may be able to show you as well. Once you know what to do it is 'just' a matter of following prompts. KP has given me great confidence in posting photos- I was always hesitant about it but now I don't think twice. I have learnt and gained a lot more from KP than just knitting!
But so exciting that you have got one knitted.


----------



## darowil

Designer and I have settled on March 19th for the Dead Fish HAt- the workshops are so popular that it is just too busy until then to fit it in. So in the meantime try another pair of socks withmy pattern if you are fisnhed, then do the lvoely lace ones and be ready for the fishie. (and of course most of you will be doing other things as well!) 
Most of you are probably ready to have these socks as a mindless knit- other than the toe and heels. most of you will still need to concentrate on them. I always have a pair of this pattern attached to my handbag, I rarely leave home wothout the current pair (it is a conscious decision to take it off the bag and go without it).


----------



## darowil

Couldn't see a photo of the pick up point. But you will have the loop that links the two stitches. Don't pick up this but look at the stich on the needle, then find the one under this and put the tip of your needle into this sttich and then work it as a knit or purl (depending on which row you are doing). I usually do this as the last step of the two final rows of the heel- 
so I would do

Row 39. Knit 30 slip the last stitch to the right needle pick up the two wraps return the slipped stitch to the left needle and knit all three together, *pick up stich as above* turn 
Row 40 *slip the picked up sttich*purl 31, slip the last stitch to the right needle pick up the two wraps return the slipped stitch to the left needle and purl all three together,*pick up a sttich as above* turn 
* first round of leg.
slip one knit to last two stitches on needle, k2tog, move to the next needle knit to end.
second round, k2 tog and then continue in ss until desired length.*
This can be done in different way- basically I try to form a slight slope hence the slipping .
But you can simply pick up and then knit it straight together on the very next rounds.
Or you can even on the first round after the heel simply pick one up and immediately knit the 2tog (and the other end of the needle as you get back there do the same thing.


----------



## mlw2504

I finished my first sock. First sock ever. Thank you Darowil for this workshop. I have really learned a lot. I have wanted to knit socks for a long time, but couldn't seem to get started.

Now I have to get the mate started so I will be finished and ready for the lace sock workshop.


----------



## Designer1234

jmai5421 said:


> shellicat said:
> 
> 
> 
> Hi, I'm new to the website and this workshop, I read where you can't do a regular cast on for the toe-ups. I taught myself how to do just that, by using the purl bumps as the second side of the toe row. I've had no problem making several pairs and find the toe just as durable. I've always had trouble with the figure 8 cast on and found this by mistake and sheer desparation!!
> 
> 
> 
> That is a neat idea for those of us that can't get the figure 8 cast on. I am working on getting the cast off/bind off right.
Click to expand...

For some reason I didn't have any problems with the toe but got completely off track with the heel 2nd portion. I finally, with the help of darowil got it figured out , I hope.


----------



## 123wendy

My socks are finished.


----------



## Naneast

My toe up magic loop sock is in progress. I'm using a solid pink color and it's close to the Valentine's day so I added a heart pattern by Janine Le Cras.


----------



## britgirl

That would really be mindless knitting! That really would be magic!

Did manage to get a few rows done at the doc's office. It is nice to have something small to work on like a sock.

Here's a pick of my sock's competition. Definitely not mindless knitting! It's the Edwina shawl by Dee (Stevieland). I am really hoping to finish it within the next week. It got put aside for a while as I was working on Christmas gifts, but now I am anxious to finish it, but I really wanted to participate in this workshop. So I have to divide my time between the sock and the shawl. Late at night when I am tired, there is no way that I can knit lace, especially with 450 plus stitches on my needles, so hopefully that's when I will get some more done on the sock.

Sue


Angora1 said:


> britgirl said:
> 
> 
> 
> Just got it cast on a little while ago. Hoping to get all the toe increases before going to a doc appt this afternoon so I can have some mindless knitting to do on the foot.
> 
> Sue
> 
> 
> Angora1 said:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> britgirl said:
> 
> 
> 
> Well, I have done the heel and am working on the cuff now. I feel like I am on the home stretch now. The heel wasn't bad at all, the worst part was starting to work in the round again and pulling the stitches together again. Yes, I have a little hole, but think I can fix that without too much difficulty. On the second sock I think I will try to pick up a stitch or two as per Darowil's instructions that I didn't happen to see until after I had already worked it.
> 
> Sue
> 
> 
> 
> Sue, how is your second sock coming? What lovely yarn you have and the colors so intense. That blue is amazing.
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> 
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> Isn't that the wonderful part about knowing how to do socks now. Take it with us. Keep at it. They sure will be beautiful when done as already are.
> Did have to laugh as I picture you knitting the sock on your foot, but I do know what you mean. Honest. :lol: :lol: :lol: Just felt good to laugh.
Click to expand...


----------



## darowil

Designer1234 said:


> For some reason I didn't have any problems with the toe but got completely off track with the heel 2nd portion. I finally, with the help of darowil got it figured out , I hope.


Looks like it sfine from hare.
I wouldn't even think of kniiting those colours for a man! Maybe I should see what DH wants. He might surprise me- just as I think I finally have him osrted and know what he wants he comes up with something that seems totally out of character. And I'm sure he always knows just what I like etc! So why am I surprised?


----------



## darowil

123wendy said:


> My socks are finished.


There are a jeansy colour aren't they?- nothing like making
up my own word. Its great fun watchin gas the socks come to fruition, all so different as well.


----------



## darowil

lifeline said:


> I made my first sock as far as the heel with ML. I was very pleased with how it turned out BUT i frogged it. I thought I knew better...I am a loose knitter, but thought I could still make these socks on my 3mm interchangables. NO I COULDN'T. Much to loose. So I am now waiting for 4 fixed circulars coming in the post...2 mm, 2.25 mm, 2.5 mm and a 2.75mm. I can't wait for them to arrive so I can begin to experiment.


With socks it is better to be a bit too firm rather than too loose- and 2mm or 2.25mm works for me on most sock weight yarns, depending on what needles I have I will go up to a 2.5mm but never bigger for these yarns. A few yarns also work up better on the bigger needles although meant to be the same size. After a while you can often tell by the feel how it will knit up - needles wise that is- I still can't tell by looking how it might look)


----------



## darowil

britgirl said:


> That would really be mindless knitting! That really would be magic!
> 
> Did manage to get a few rows done at the doc's office. It is nice to have something small to work on like a sock.
> 
> Here's a pick of my sock's competition. Definitely not mindless knitting! It's the Edwina shawl by Dee (Stevieland). I am really hoping to finish it within the next week. It got put aside for a while as I was working on Christmas gifts, but now I am anxious to finish it, but I really wanted to participate in this workshop. So I have to divide my time between the sock and the shawl. Late at night when I am tired, there is no way that I can knit lace, especially with 450 plus stitches on my needles, so hopefully that's when I will get some more done on the sock.
> 
> Sue
> 
> 
> Angora1 said:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> britgirl said:
> 
> 
> 
> Just got it cast on a little while ago. Hoping to get all the toe increases before going to a doc appt this afternoon so I can have some mindless knitting to do on the foot.
> /quote]
> 
> I've just finished the Ashton and the cast off she uses is the same one that I have given you for these socks. I do envy those who can design things like this- but I while I have the technical skill I don't have the creative streak needed.
> The shawls are most certainly not portable (or mindless) but socks are beutifully so, I always have one from this pattern on the go so I have mindless work to do out. And at least one other more complex pair
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Click to expand...
Click to expand...


----------



## darowil

janwalla said:


> KnottyMe said:
> 
> 
> 
> I had to visit my LYS today and pick up a size 1-1/2 or 2.5mm pair of needles. Seems like all the sock yarn I've been using would work with something between 1's and 2's.
> 
> BTW, while I was there I had to pick up more sock yarn, well of course, and I found several brands that have NO wool in them. For those of you who are sensitive to wool, you might look up Knit One Crochet Too Pediwick (made in Taiwan), and Kraemer Saucon Socks (made in Pennsylvania), and On Your Toes (forgot to see where it's made). I'm going to try to Pediwick bamboo/nylon blend.
> 
> 
> 
> There is also a great sock yarn called CoBaSi by HiKoo Not a bad price too, made of Cotton Bamboo and silk etc. http://www.abundant-yarn.com/store/pc/viewPrd.asp?idproduct=7532
> 
> Also if anyone wants to order any cheap sock yarn, a shop on Ebay is selling Regia for £1.50p per 100g ball and posts worldwide I'm not sure how much postage it would be but there is a number you can call for a price. here is the link<
> http://stores.ebay.co.uk/Aileens-Wool-Shop/Regia-Sock-Yarn-/_i.html?_fsub=3348460010&_sid=164263570&_trksid=p4634.c0.m322
Click to expand...

Useful info re the nonwool yarns thanks on behalf of those who need these.
That ebay seller has some very good prices for the Regias- but I might try to avoid them. Very tempted though buy the red white and blue ! My football team are red white and blue and I don't like the ones I made so far! And one daughter doesn't have any so very tempted to buy a couple of them at least. But I don't need more- even I will take a while to knit these- and these don't include the solids and the handpainted that my socks club lady does!


----------



## darowil

knitwitconnie said:


> Darowil:
> I'm trying to review the wrap and turn directions for my second heel and can't find the page they were on. Thanks. Too much to read through and looking for the video link someone posted. It was also helpful.


Are you looking for the info scattered throughout the instructions- which I too would need to search for as I wrote answers as I went.
Or the orginal instructions which are in the abbreviations att he beginning of the pattern?


----------



## darowil

The wheeze said:


> After I do my cast on I end up with my needle to be stitched in the back instead of the front. What did I do wrong? And is there a way to fix it?


Is this for the very first round? or have you done a few rounds?
If you have done a few then turn it inside out and start working on the front needle- working on th b ack needle will have you with purl on the outside but turning the work inside out will bring the stocking stitch side to the outside and as long as you knit the front needle from then on you will be fine.

If the very first round just work it and then make sure for the second round that you have the smooth side on the outside and that you work on the fron tneedle- at this stage it will actually be hard to tell as it knits up flat for a while- so you just need to make sure that needle you are working is closer to you than the cable


----------



## Cashmeregma

Darowil, I love your story about climbing the mountain and you really had an obstacle that could have kept you from making it, but you did it. :thumbup: :thumbup: :thumbup: What an inspiration you are and what a fascinating life you have.

Here's some inspiration from one of your humble students. I finished my socks. :thumbup: :thumbup: :thumbup: I am soooooooooo happy. Guess you all know they are a gift for my DIL so I wanted them to be very special. I also did a picture book of my grandchildren and her & our son's children of the last 2 years for her. OK, here's the post.


----------



## darowil

Angora1 said:


> Darowil, I love your story about climbing the mountain and you really had an obstacle that could have kept you from making it, but you did it. :thumbup: :thumbup: :thumbup: What an inspiration you are and what a fascinating life you have.
> 
> Here's some inspiration from one of your humble students. I finished my socks. :thumbup: :thumbup: :thumbup: I am soooooooooo happy. Guess you all know they are a gift for my DIL so I wanted them to be very special. I also did a picture book of my grandchildren and her & our son's children of the last 2 years for her. OK, here's the post.


I really like seeing your innovations to patterns- so effective.


----------



## darowil

lifeline said:


> My new needles have arrieved, so I will be casting on this evening. They so look everso frgile :?


You should see the pair I am working with currently (1.5mm dpns) on a pair of socks in 2ply (laceweight). Th eintention is to wear them under my sandeals to avoid my feet being exposed to the sun, but they won't ge ttoo much wear this year! Next summer will have to do. Have now got a 1.75mm circular- woul dhave liked the 1.5 but her only cable was very long and I would have spent all my time pulling it through. 
But how exciting to be actually starting them- I guess you should have started by now.


----------



## darowil

Angora1 said:


> britgirl said:
> 
> 
> 
> I think the first pair of socks is the hardest to knit, but once you get that concept, your hooked, and you'll find yourself able to do them without a pattern!
> 
> Sue
> 
> 
> Angora1 said:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Patchworkcat said:
> 
> 
> 
> Angora, they're beautiful! Good job. Love the even stitches, the contrast trim at the cuff, and the tiny flowers. I've used the mini cables before for socks and love the way it still stretches nicely. Good choice.
> 
> Jill
> 
> 
> 
> Thank you Jill. A dream come true to have knit a pair of socks. I just couldn't understand the concept.
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> 
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> Wow, that is a thought. No pattern to carry around. Just need to do another pair and study the pattern and that is definitely a great possibility. Thanks for the idea and thanks for the compliment.
Click to expand...

One reason for the 12 for the caston and heel is to make it easy to remember- then all you really need a pattern for is the heel- and after a while you won't need it for that either. The socks I take out with me are not accompanied by a pattern as I have learnt the heel. And as I will explain later this pattern is easilly adapted to cuff down as well.

So many are finishing their socks that I will put the extra information on soon. Much of it has been scattered through this workshop but I will try and gather the information together so you have it all together.


----------



## darowil

Angora1 said:


> Patchworkcat said:
> 
> 
> 
> One really cool thing about socks, toe up or top down, you can use the same pattern over and over and over, but by changing the stitch pattern on the leg (and top of foot), each pair looks unique. I nearly always have a sock on the needles, no matter what else I may be working on, too.
> 
> Jill
> 
> 
> 
> Yes, I love that idea. I already have another ball of yarn and I do believe if I had done these socks in my size I would have had enough yarn on this skein for 2 pair???? Not sure. I'm excited about having a small project that will fit in the purse and no pattern once I've learned the sequence of toe and heel. :thumbup:
Click to expand...

Generally I find that only one pair comes from a 100gm ball, but sometimes there is a lot left. I have a very large collection of leftover sock yarn- its rather scarry as it shows how many socks I have knitted! Occasionally I have have come across one that gets two pairs. But 2 100gm balls would often do three pairs (does depend as well on what pattern if any you put in the sock as some use a fair bit of yarn up). But often you would have enough for mittens- especially fingerless.


----------



## darowil

how much yarn is left after a pair of socks also depends on whether in a self patterning or striping yarn you have matched the colurs up- this can use a fair bit of extra yarn. (in fact I have at times determined the length of my socks by the fact that by making htem slightly shorter I can start at the same place without going through almost a whole repeat!)


----------



## darowil

Webs http://www.yarn.com 
Simply Socks Yarn Company (SSYC) http://www.simplysockyarn.com/servlet/StoreFront 
These two are in the US
In the UK Deramores http://www.deramores.com/?currency=AUD 
Black Sheep Yarns http://www.blacksheepwools.com

But there are many and others use different ones. Webs and SSYC have the biggest range. Bu the UK ones are very resonable if they have what you want- their postage is cheaper. I once got some Wendy Happy yarn from Deramores and for comparison I tried an Australian site, as well as the yarn being about twice as expensive here the postage was more! And when I got stuff recently from Black Sheep Yarns the VAT (20%) was taken off- they (just looked their site and nowhere near as good as when I got stuff maybe it wasn't them afterallt!). Some UK sites seem to do this but not others. Can't remember whether Deramores took it off or not.


----------



## Designer1234

*The FISH HAT WORKSHOP WILL BE ON MARCH 19 - WITH DAROWIL so mark down your calendars*. We have some outstanding workshops coming up this spring. The interest is outstanding too.


----------



## darowil

KnottyMe said:


> Can anyone tell me how the fish hat started?


quoting fromthe patttern here 'It was specially designed for a boy called Jonas, fish lover and future sea biologist." The pattern is a free downlaodable pattern- it is on dpns so people can simply do it on dpns. But I will converting it to magic loop and explaining to people what I do as I go so that they can learn to convert patterns for themselves.


----------



## Designer1234

A lot of the young people love the mix matched socks. I usually make them for myself too. I have made mix matched hats using the same colored yarns too and they were very well received. 

I really believe after years of painting that there isn't a 'wrong' way to do things as far as color is concerned. Look at a flower garden - all the colors look good together. I think that the feeling that some colors don't blend might be incorrect. I think it is how you mix them. jmo. Designer


----------



## darowil

Dowager said:


> Well, I FINALLY finished the first sock last night! I am starting the toe on he second one today. We shall see how SSS does! *LOL*


Congratulations- not just for finishing it but for perservering as well.


----------



## darowil

coachchro said:


> I have looked through many of the postings Is there a chart to help me figure out the stitches for sizes. Appreciate it


No becuase I have been trying to keep things easy for new sock knitters. (the only suggestions I have made is 4 stitches less or more because this doesn't require any changes in how the pattern is worked other than a couple of extra rows or a couple less)


----------



## darowil

ritasroy said:


> Hi
> I am joining in, will be picking up my small needles .tomorrow.
> Been reading the posts , it says download introduction,
> is that the only corrected download I need to get , to read the instructions you have written and the important posts?


There are two downloads- one is the introduction which provides information posted on the 12th January and then on the 20th I have posted the pattern and both are there as both posts and downloads. The downloads are the same as the posts, just easier for most people to print off.


----------



## jmai5421

My socks, finished. I like them rolled top and all. I will work on the left handed cast off on my next pair. My daughter likes the rolled top. She said she would lilke them better if they were a brighter colors. But the black would be o.k. I don't remember offering them to her!
Anyway I love them and the fit.
Thanks for the workshops Darowil. The magic loop is awesome. You can't beat the toe up socks-no kirchner stitch. Only I have to admit that I turned my socks in side out and did a three needle bind off instead of the kirchner. I don't have a ridge and I don't have to worry about diabetes and tight or irritating socks. Anyway these are perfect and so easy to take any place. Harder to lose a circular needle in the chair or car. Thanks again Darowil.


----------



## Granalou

I finished my socks yesterday and very pleased with the toe up techniques. Thank you Darowil for teaching this interesting and fun workshop. I hope to start the lace sock workshop and will check in on your Fish hat workshop. I did make a fish hat for a grandson for christmas, but did a lot of fudging . Although I vowed I would not make another one maybe your workshop will give me some tips to facilitate and give me incentive to try another one. 

Not sure where to post finished socks, so will post them here. If they look huge that is because they are for a 6'4" grandson and he has feet to match. LOL


----------



## darowil

mlw2504 said:


> Darowil,
> 
> I am about ready to start my second pair and want to do the k3p1 rib from the toe . Is the front needle the one I start my pattern on? Do I need to worry about centering the pattern or just start with knit 3?
> 
> Mary


MAry starting with k3 is fine. It doesn't actually matter which one you do it on- the only thing to do is make sure you do the heel on the other side. It is best to start it once you finish the toe- I have tried it on the toe but it pulls the toe in a bit much. Normally about a dozen rows are done with the back in st st after the heel shaping (but keep up with the rib pattern for the front of the foot. This brings the begining of the leg pattern up above shoe height. This is not so important with the rib, but for some things you wouldn't want them rubbing on the heel. Heels and toes are normally plain although I have doen an occasional pair with a pattern in the heel. If I remember I will post a photo tomorrow of a recent pair I made (but it is not the short row heel I taught here either). Toes you also need to be careful with becuase you don't want lace toes or the wearers toes can get caught in the holes. An dof course make sure that the back stitches match up with the front stitches when you start the rib (and as long as you are using one of my 3 sizes no problem with matching up as multiple of 4).


----------



## catlover1960

I just finished my second pair of socks. It was a free pattern found on the internet and I was able to practice the figure 8 cast on and the short row heel as well as the stretchy cast off.


----------



## darowil

Mandonan said:


> My next pair I want to make with the reinforced stitch on toe and heel. (The slip one knit one). Will this work on both the toe and heel? This is where I wear out my socks and I want the extra thickness there. Do I do it on the entire toe and entire heel?


I have only ever done it on the flap and gussett heel. Trying to think out how it would work on the short row heel. It should work I think. You would need to watch that you stopped the slips before the w&ts. Would you want it on the bottom of the heel where you press on it? 
If it is where the shoe rubs that your socks wear out then just do the first 12 rows after joining back up into a round with the reinforced stitch. The first comments above are thinking as I go and I'm not sure of. But this one I know will work.


----------



## darowil

catlover1960 said:


> I just finished my second pair of socks. It was a free pattern found on the internet and I was able to practice the figure 8 cast on and the short row heel as well as the stretchy cast off.


Brillant- I am planning to give some info later as to how to carry on further with socks- but so many of doing it already I almost think I don't need to. Must sort it out soon and post! I have some of it writtten out but want to integrate it with what has come up here as well! Try and get the relevant points in so people can have three downloadable documents with most of the pertinent points on them instead of needing to come back here everytime.


----------



## darowil

mlw2504 said:


> Darowil,
> 
> I have the toe completed on my second pair and am ready to start my k3p1 rib. I am using Regia yarn this time and WOW! it feels so luxurious. I am using US #2 needle and it looks great!
> 
> I look forward to your suggestions for making other socks.
> 
> Mary


great! Regia have some great sock yarns.


----------



## darowil

Dorsey said:


> Am I the only one having a problem with wrap and turn? I have frogged and frogged. Finally got the toe and I like it, but my wraps and turns have me defeated!!!! I can't find any other remarks from anyone having trouble with this. My camera and computer are not talking to each other now or I would post a picture of my miserable heels. There are holes on the knit wraps and not so much on the purl ones. I try to snug the stitches but I still have the holes and besides my wraps look awful! Boo hoo! I have knit lots of socks with dpns top down but am feeling I will never succeed this way. I will keep on trying, but feel rather defeated! Everyone else is glowing with success, darn it!
> Dot


Many many questions on this. My suggestionn to one lady was to get a thicker light coloured yarn, cast on a similar number of stitches and work a couple of rows of st st then work the heel- it may be easier to see the wraps etc. Look in the earlier pages, not the later. Most of those who have struggled have now posted about their success, but for some it has a very hard slog. So no you aren't the onely one. Go through the questions- looking for ones marked HEELS. It is while actually since I needed to put this in so if you have been mainly looking at the end pages it is no wonder you are feeling discouraged. So go through these and keep my pattern in front of you including the photos. If you are still having problems I will still be here to answer questions.


----------



## darowil

pmarch said:


> Don't feel bad Dorsey . I frogged mine out about 4 times. But now I know how it works still had to frog back to beginning of heel, lost count. Lol


After a while you will be able to tell which stitch is the one- the next one to be wrapped sits slightly more snuggly next the one that had just been wrapped (doesn't seem to show so much in the first few rows- but those are easy to see because you can check easily how many have already been wrapped. And I still sometimes need to turn my work around to see I have wrapped that stitich. Because I always loose count! (and still ge tit wrong so that I either need to fudge or frog.


----------



## darowil

jmai5421 said:


> Angora1 said:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> jmai5421 said:
> 
> 
> 
> My socks, finished. I like them rolled top and all. I will work on the left handed cast off on my next pair. My daughter likes the rolled top. She said she would lilke them better if they were a brighter colors. But the black would be o.k. I don't remember offering them to her!
> Anyway I love them and the fit.
> Thanks for the workshops Darowil. The magic loop is awesome. You can't beat the toe up socks-no kirchner stitch. Only I have to admit that I turned my socks in side out and did a three needle bind off instead of the kirchner. I don't have a ridge and I don't have to worry about diabetes and tight or irritating socks. Anyway these are perfect and so easy to take any place. Harder to lose a circular needle in the chair or car. Thanks again Darowil.
> 
> 
> 
> They look so smart in the dark colors. Really worked into a nice pattern with that yarn. No wonder your daughter was eyeing them, but hopefully since she wants brighter colors, you can keep this pair.
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> Yes, I am keeping this pair and we are going to pick out yarn for a new pair for her, hopefully from my stash. I wore mine all day yesterday. They are so comfortable and I love the fit. And yes they fit her perfectly. I have another daughter visiting next week from Arizona. Ummmmm do I show them to her or hide them!?!
Click to expand...

Guess you want to show off- and what better excuse than to have her ewant them too? I always throw a pair of socks into everyones Christmas stocking. An dmy SIL is likely ot put in an order for what he wants! And not always socks either.


----------



## jmai5421

Love your picture Dowager.

These are some sock/slippers I made for myself and my sisters. My sisters want more so I offered to teach them to knit. They are super bulky size 13 DPN's. They go real fast. I did make these a couple inches longer in the cuff, not paying attention and like them that way. The pattern is lion brand cottage socks knitted (they have a crochet pattern, too). They are warm and comphy-perfect for house slippers in the MN winter.
They aren't toe up but can be made using the magic loop.


----------



## Designer1234

I finished the first sock of my third pair and really like the Drops yarn - I like the way the colors blend -


----------



## susan1461853

jmai5421 said:


> Love your picture Dowager.
> 
> These are some sock/slippers I made for myself and my sisters. My sisters want more so I offered to teach them to knit. They are super bulky size 13 DPN's. They go real fast. I did make these a couple inches longer in the cuff, not paying attention and like them that way. The pattern is lion brand cottage socks knitted (they have a crochet pattern, too). They are warm and comphy-perfect for house slippers in the MN winter.
> They aren't toe up but can be made using the magic loop.


Love those socks!!


----------



## darowil

JulesKnit said:


> Thanks so much1 I was really hesitant to ask such a simple question---but goin nuts over it! It's all so easy appearing yet I can complicate anything...which brings me to this question. When I do this cast on it appears as if there is 13 on my first needle (due to the slip knot I guess and 12 on the other. If I understand correctly after knitting - my first row of 12 I turn the work and remove the slip knot and then knit the next 12.Right?


correct- the slip knot simply holds the yarn on the needle so you don't need to juggle holding it in place while getting the stitches started.


----------



## britgirl

I just finished my socks. Here is a pic of them off the needles. I'm pretty happy with them. Hope my daughter likes them too. Thanks, Darowil, for the workshop. I enjoyed participating and learning two techniques, Magic Loop and toe-up all at one time.

Sue


----------



## knitwitconnie

I love everyone's finished sox! Here are mine, (almost done) except I'm not sure how long to keep making them as I have yarn left! If I keep going up my calf in k1p1 rib, I assume i'll have to add more stitches soon, so I may be done in a few more rows. Here they are, fraternal twins, tried to match stripes at the toe and it didn't work but somehow they ended up matching. 

Yarn: Berroco "Comfort Sock" Color 1816 (a self patterning yarn)
Needles: size 1 (I knit loose, so downsized) 

They are a perfect fit and I'm really happy with the toe up method. I'm so glad I took the workshop. Thank you Darowil and Designer1234. I think I'm a convert to using toe up as it's more fun to be done with the hard stuff and easy knitting all the way up and have choices on how long you want the sox that way. Thanks again! Great workshop.


----------



## darowil

diane647 said:


> Love your socks. I'm having trouble finding the pattern. What page is it on?


The pattern is on page 1, there are two downloads one is an introduction to the workshop and the other is the pattern. (this is a very basic sock so if you are talking about any of the others you will need to specify which sock you meant but also look at later posts becuase a few links etc have been given by others for their socks).
If you do want to do the basic socks I suggest you simply follow the pattern first and only look at the questions if you have a problem with a particular area- my replies are clearly marked as to which part I am dealing with. Looking at the questions and answers before you get there can be very overwhelming. And if you manage it following the instructions than no need to worry about the questions. Make sure you check the abbreviations as not only do they tell what they mean but also how to do the steps that are likely to be new such as wrap and turns.
And the pattern assumes that you can do Magic Loop. If you can't that is easy you go to my first workshop which teaches the magic loop- again follow my instructions, then if you have questions check the posts to see if they have been asked. If not you will need to PM me as that workshop was closed this morning- simply meaning that you can't ask questions on it anymore. I am very willing to answer questions that have not yet been addressed.


----------



## knitwitconnie

Okay, I have my new sox on my feet and they fit great! The only problem I have is how to make more and faster!! (Both my daughters have expressed interest in me knitting them a pair! ) And I have a lot of yarn in my stash, so probably will have a pair going in a sox bag I can take along.

I do have one question, however. How do you get your handknit sox to look good and wear well? Before I have them off the needles, they look a bit "fuzzy" on the bottom of the foot where the older yarn is worked around in my knitting bag. i put them in a plastic bag to keep them from that frayed look while making them, but they look "fuzzy" already a little bit and they are brand new. My sock yarn is good quality with nylon, so just wondered what you use and if anyone else has this happen?

Thanks
Connie


----------



## Sarahb69

darowil said:


> Dorsey said:
> 
> 
> 
> Am I the only one having a problem with wrap and turn? I have frogged and frogged. Finally got the toe and I like it, but my wraps and turns have me defeated!!!! I can't find any other remarks from anyone having trouble with this. My camera and computer are not talking to each other now or I would post a picture of my miserable heels. There are holes on the knit wraps and not so much on the purl ones. I try to snug the stitches but I still have the holes and besides my wraps look awful! Boo hoo! I have knit lots of socks with dpns top down but am feeling I will never succeed this way. I will keep on trying, but feel rather defeated! Everyone else is glowing with success, darn it!
> Dot
> 
> 
> 
> Many many questions on this. My suggestionn to one lady was to get a thicker light coloured yarn, cast on a similar number of stitches and work a couple of rows of st st then work the heel- it may be easier to see the wraps etc. Look in the earlier pages, not the later. Most of those who have struggled have now posted about their success, but for some it has a very hard slog. So no you aren't the onely one. Go through the questions- looking for ones marked HEELS. It is while actually since I needed to put this in so if you have been mainly looking at the end pages it is no wonder you are feeling discouraged. So go through these and keep my pattern in front of you including the photos. If you are still having problems I will still be here to answer questions.
Click to expand...

Well, I've put one of my 2 projects on hold now till my knitting friend is back from the UK to help me. I decided to have a go at the heel turn and cast on the 32 stitches to practice on scrap yarn.

After completing all the instructions for the heel, it looks like it might be right, but I've taken a couple of pics to show how it came out. If you could have a look and let me know what you think before I cast on with my good sock yarn, I would be grateful.


----------



## darowil

For some reason I didn't get emails for the last page or so- must have accidently deleted one I think and just now have had time to realise that didn't get any when I was reading a post about wrap and turns! 
 HEEL
Have just been looking at the digest and Jules2444 posted that she had a sudden realisation that she was pulling her wraps too tight so that impossible to find them- and pulled it in too much so left holes. Maybe this is what some of you are doing who are struggling. JUST PLACE IT AROUND, DON'T PULL IT TIGHT (oh dear the light seems to have gone on my caps shift- no light on and I don't watch my screeen as I type! this is why the capitals- but at least it was good timing for them)

And now I will go and look at the posts above


----------



## darowil

knitwitconnie said:


> Okay, I have my new sox on my feet and they fit great! The only problem I have is how to make more and faster!! (Both my daughters have expressed interest in me knitting them a pair! ) And I have a lot of yarn in my stash, so probably will have a pair going in a sox bag I can take along.
> 
> I do have one question, however. How do you get your handknit sox to look good and wear well? Before I have them off the needles, they look a bit "fuzzy" on the bottom of the foot where the older yarn is worked around in my knitting bag. i put them in a plastic bag to keep them from that frayed look while making them, but they look "fuzzy" already a little bit and they are brand new. My sock yarn is good quality with nylon, so just wondered what you use and if anyone else has this happen?
> 
> Thanks
> Connie


Connie my response was also going to be asking how much you frogged (my spell check doesn't recognise this as a word!)- sometimes that can cause problems. But other than that I haven't ever had that problem with any of my sock yarns- and I don't treat them with care any more! Some never even get into a bag but are left lying around soemwhere.
The socks do look like a good fit. What yarn was it, colours are wonderful? Mind you often if I am asked I can't always remember, but new sockers are likely to remember.
Are you a tight knitter? If so maybe you are putting too much stress on the yarn as you knit it? trying to force the needles into the stitches. If so maybe you need to consciously loosen up- changing needles sizes may help but they will stilll be tight on the needles.
Or the opposite, too loose so the stitches aren't snug enough- in which case using smaller needles will help.


----------



## darowil

pmarch said:


> Well I finally got to the heel and finished it. One side was correct the other side was opposite. I just stitched. Maybe I should learn to re knit in the front loop in stead of the back. This happened to me once before one side I knit like I usually do and was ok, the other side I had to reverse what I did to come out right. Guess with the next sock I will have to do it reversed . Wish me luck.


Do you do your purl the same way? I suspect not as both sides different. But yes it would be worth while making sure you always work from the front (or always the back and adjust, but probably easier overall to make yourself knit into the front of the stitch- it won't be long before it become second nature).

Just heard some birds- dawn must be coming soon- yes I am awake way too early yet again.


----------



## darowil

Sarahb69 said:


> [
> 
> After completing all the instructions for the heel, it looks like it might be right, but I've taken a couple of pics to show how it came out. If you could have a look and let me know what you think before I cast on with my good sock yarn, I would be grateful.


Sarah those 'heels' look really good- so go ahead and start the socks proper- and have fun.


----------



## knitwitconnie

Darowil,
I am not a very tight knitter, in fact, I usually have to go down a size in everything to get gauge because I knit lose enough. I think the wearing issue is in the handling or storing. I drag it in my knitting bag and that might be just excess stress. I'll keep looking to figure out a solution. 
I finished the sox with a stretchy bindoff I found on U tube and it worked well for me and made a slight "scalloped" look to the bindoff, which I like. The link to the video: Cat Bordhi-PERSONAL FOOTPRINTS-Jeny's Surprisingly Stretchy ...

www.youtube.com/watch?v=abBhe-JYmgI

The yarn: Yarn: Berroco "Comfort Sock" Color 1816 (a self patterning yarn)
Needles: size 1 (I knit loose, so downsized)

There are a number of similar Berroco yarns in blues and other colors like the one I chose. The self pattern is amazing. I'm sure if you google Berroco yarn and where to get it, you will see some of the colors. I was really pleased with how it looks like I did a lot of color changing here, but it is all self patterned! 
Thank you so much for opening my eyes to the toe up way to make sox. I'm hooked. I prefer it to cuff down for many reasons, the biggest is I hate the Kitchener stitch! So getting the toe and heel out of the way first is a big plus.

I also LOVE your storage shelves and yarn! Thanks for sharing your source! (IKEA) ? I'll have to check that out. 
Thanks again for all your time and effort in teaching this class.

Connie my response was also going to be asking how much you frogged (my spell check doesn't recognise this as a word!)- sometimes that can cause problems. But other than that I haven't ever had that problem with any of my sock yarns- and I don't treat them with care any more! Some never even get into a bag but are left lying around soemwhere.
The socks do look like a good fit. What yarn was it, colours are wonderful? Mind you often if I am asked I can't always remember, but new sockers are likely to remember.
Are you a tight knitter? If so maybe you are putting too much stress on the yarn as you knit it? trying to force the needles into the stitches. If so maybe you need to consciously loosen up- changing needles sizes may help but they will stilll be tight on the needles.
Or the opposite, too loose so the stitches aren't snug enough- in which case using smaller needles will help.[/quote]


----------



## Naneast

Here are my Valentine's socks. I made 2 at a time with a #2 circular needle 40" long, toe up magic loop following the pattern of Janine Le Cras. I used sock yarn (I lost the lable) which I wound into 2 balls. I finished by BO using K1, *YO,K1* technique. Thanks Darowil for the workshop.


----------



## darowil

Naneast said:


> Here are my Valentine's socks. I made 2 at a time with a #2 circular needle 40" long, toe up magic loop following the pattern of Janine Le Cras. I used sock yarn (I lost the lable) which I wound into 2 balls. I finished by BO using K1, *YO,K1* technique. Thanks Darowil for the workshop.


They do look good, a lot of work in those!- I have also used that BO but keep slipping back to the first one I did! And haven't done it enough to decide whcih I prefer overall.


----------



## darowil

Dowager said:


> darowil said:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Dowager said:
> 
> 
> 
> AGain, my thanks Darowil. My socks aren't perfect, but I'm proud of them anyway, and with a bit of fudging here and there no one but me will ever know
> 
> 
> 
> Did youever get the second finished? And was th eheel any better?
> And no-one else will look at tyour socks as closly as you will.
> And fudging works well!
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> I am finishing the cuff on the second sock, and yes, it came out better than the first. What I have noticed on the heel is thatwhile I have a bit of a hole, it works better on one sir of the sock than the other for some reason. Did that on both socks! And I think maybe I need to loosen up on the wraps too, as I did have a hard time seeing them. I need new glasses, and that is also, I think, affecting thi project. I've not knit with this fine a yarn or this small a needle before, and it is hard for me to see the stitches properly. Gotta get in to see my optometrist soon. As soon as I get this second sock finished and washed and blocked, I will get a pic and post it.
Click to expand...

Good light helps too! DH bought me one with a magnifying glass on it- which I do use sometimes especially when working with dark colours. Good too for those doing cross-stitch.


----------



## darowil

shirley m said:


> This was my problem! I am so used to 'tugging' the last stitch when using DPN's, once I realised this, all went well. I also found tha Addi needle cord stiffness a bit of a problem. I love the pattern,and start my second pair today. Thank you Darowil..... now I just need to find more people who will wear socks. Shirley M.
> 
> 
> darowil said:
> 
> 
> 
> For some reason I didn't get emails for the last page or so- must have accidently deleted one I think and just now have had time to realise that didn't get any when I was reading a post about wrap and turns!
> HEEL
> Have just been looking at the digest and Jules2444 posted that she had a sudden realisation that she was pulling her wraps too tight so that impossible to find them- and pulled it in too much so left holes. Maybe this is what some of you are doing who are struggling. JUST PLACE IT AROUND, DON'T PULL IT TIGHT (oh dear the light seems to have gone on my caps shift- no light on and I don't watch my screeen as I type! this is why the capitals- but at least it was good timing for them)
> 
> And now I will go and look at the posts above
Click to expand...

I have a pile that need to work out what ot do with- I knit tham at a much quicker rate than I can give them away!


----------



## Designer1234

darowil said:


> Pegster said:
> 
> 
> 
> Angora...Where is the sock hall of fame...I would like to see them too...
> 
> 
> 
> http://www.knittingparadise.com/t-140856-3.html#2729418
Click to expand...

Hi Ladies - just a correction of the name. it is called the "*Parade of Socks*' not the hall of fame. we put a parade in on all the different projects made by the workshops so if you search Paraded of... they will all be there. Wonderful socks.


----------



## Designer1234

lifeline said:


> Designer, I know you have asked us to not put up non-sock posts, but I would like to say a BIG thank you to Darowil; for doing the workshop. It has been a great learning curve


.

it has been a wonderful workshop in every way. She has been so easy to work with and she really knows what she is talking about.

I know we all agree with this!


----------



## Designer1234

knitwitconnie said:


> Okay, I have my new sox on my feet and they fit great! The only problem I have is how to make more and faster!! (Both my daughters have expressed interest in me knitting them a pair! ) And I have a lot of yarn in my stash, so probably will have a pair going in a sox bag I can take along.
> 
> I do have one question, however. How do you get your handknit sox to look good and wear well? Before I have them off the needles, they look a bit "fuzzy" on the bottom of the foot where the older yarn is worked around in my knitting bag. i put them in a plastic bag to keep them from that frayed look while making them, but they look "fuzzy" already a little bit and they are brand new. My sock yarn is good quality with nylon, so just wondered what you use and if anyone else has this happen?
> 
> Thanks
> Connie


personally- I have 6 pair made for my husband and 6 pair for me. we don't wear them for long periods of time and he puts his and I put mine in my bathroom sink-- I just hand wash them wit a mild liquid soap-
and hang them to dry on the shower bar. I realize not everyone wants to do that - but some of our socks are 2 years old. the odd pair shows a bit but that is the yarn. as it started piling right at the beginning - (most expensive yarn too).


----------



## Designer1234

Well, I just finished another bright pair of socks. they are drops 'delight' and I like the feel of them. they have some wonderful combinations of color. 

here they are. thanks so much. I really like doing the toe up socks and find the magic loop so much handier - Shirley


----------



## Designer1234

sewknitbeadgrandma said:


> Designer1234 said:
> 
> 
> 
> Well, I just finished another bright pair of socks. they are drops 'delight' and I like the feel of them. they have some wonderful combinations of color.
> 
> here they are. thanks so much. I really like doing the toe up socks and find the magic loop so much handier - Shirley
> 
> 
> 
> Love the socks. Are they for me???
Click to expand...

sure, we can meet for lunch! :thumbup: :lol:


----------



## darowil

coachchro said:


> What heel are you doing with your Toe up Magic Loop socks?


Theone provided in the pattern for this workshop is a short row heel with wrap and turns.


----------



## Sarahb69

Designer1234 said:


> here they are. thanks so much. I really like doing the toe up socks and find the magic loop so much handier - Shirley


I love these socks, Shirley...so beautiful, with the colour and baby cables.

I finally cast on for my first pair. I got through the toe increases and 5 rows in to the foot when I took this pic. I had to frog the toe 3 times trying to get the m1 the pattern called for work to my satisfaction. In the end, I decided to change it to the kfb. I hope it will come out ok.


----------



## darowil

Thet are looking good so far.


----------



## darowil

grannyfabulous4 said:


> Eye surgery is over, but having trouble getting the 2 eyes to play nice together!lol Darowil, I am working on the heel now and so far so good. Hope they don't close this class too soon!!! I have enjoyed the work on this sock so far and after several years of saying I was going to learn to knit socks, very happy with your easy to follow instructions. Keep up the good work.


It will be closed early next week- but you can still access this workshop- you just won't be be able to ask questions through it. But I am not planning on leaving KP so you will always be able to PM me with unanswered questions- or for moral support. 
Glad that you are back on board managing to get some knitting done again.


----------



## knitwitconnie

Darowil.
Can your sock pattern be adjusted to worsted weight yarn? I'd also like to do this in sock yarn but sized for children. Any ideas how to make those changes would be appreciated! Thanks for this class and wonderful pattern!!


----------



## prismaticr

Alright - So this workshop will be closed by Feb 15. This means no new posts will be allowed after that point.
Also all erroneous posts and general chit chat will be removed to allow future knitters to work up these wonderful socks and read all the questions and relevant answers easily....

Please continue to post all finished socks on our Parade of Toe up socks http://www.knittingparadise.com/t-140856-1.html

that all said, life has interfered with my time to knit socks, but I have finally gotten to the end of the toe and am proud to post it here... I will of course post my finished socks in the parade when they get done....

Happy socks all!


----------



## janwalla

I'm about to attempt the heel again tonight !! I didn't like it when I did it! It was too lumpy and had holes in it, I persevered and tried to finish it but it was just so awful I pulled it out. I get the idea of the W&T but I think I got mixed up and couldn't understand the double W&T's Do they only appear when you lift the original one up to knit? (then W&T again on that stitch) But that would leave 1 again? It would be good If I could see a visual? I think I am understanding it when I read it, but putting it into practice is another thing !!!lol


----------



## darowil

janwalla said:


> It would be good If I could see a visual? I think I am understanding it when I read it, but putting it into practice is another thing !!!lol


Well you could try looking at the posted photos- such as the shot of picking up the two wraps.

The double wrap occurs on the second half of the heel once you put a wrap round the previously wrapped stitch Which is why the first two rows of the second half of the heel are different to the rest of this half as they have not been wrapped a second time..


----------



## darowil

janwalla said:


> darowil said:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> janwalla said:
> 
> 
> 
> It would be good If I could see a visual? I think I am understanding it when I read it, but putting it into practice is another thing !!!lol
> 
> 
> 
> Well you could try looking at the posted photos- such as the shot of picking up the two wraps.
> 
> The double wrap occurs on the second half of the heel once you put a wrap round the previously wrapped stitch Which is why the first two rows of the second half of the heel are different to the rest of this half as they have not been wrapped a second time..
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> Thanks Darowil, Its funny I can manage the normal short rows but the double ones?, I pick up both loops and I manage a couple then I don't know whats going wrong when Ive finished the heel and look, it seems really lumpy and not as nice as those posted? I frogged out another 2 heels last night I pulled it all out ready again for today, so Im off to re -read all of this again and see what I'm doing wrong! Ill not let a pair of socks beat me though! :thumbup: :lol: :lol:
Click to expand...

Practice on thicker yarn- my suggestions for this are earleir in the postings. Might be easier to see what you are doing- are you forgetting to do the w&t after picking up the two wraps and knitting them together? If you aren't doing this yu will only find the one wrap. (and it can be done this way, but IMHO it looks much neater and firmer the way I have said in the pattern).


----------



## darowil

janwalla said:


> Yes!!!!!!!!!!! Many thanks to Darowil and everyone else who helped, I have successfully completed my heels after the 5th attempt, I think I was too critical, so this time I just went for it, did it and kept knitting, when I eventually looked at them, they were fine! Im now knitting the legs.


brillant! Hope to see them soon. 
Sometimes too people overthink instead of just doing what the pattern says. And enough people have done it to have ironed out the mistakes that existed in the early ones (its OK for any newies all the patterns on here now are the correct ones) so you can be assured that following exactly what it says works.


----------



## darowil

sewknitbeadgrandma said:


> sewknitbeadgrandma said:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> sewknitbeadgrandma said:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> KnottyMe said:
> 
> 
> 
> Although a latecomer, you won't be far behind me. I should finish my first "good" sock today and start its mate tomorrow. Had to take some time off and babyproof the house for a visit from my grandson. What a job. :-D Can't wait.
> 
> Darowil's written instructions are quite clear to follow.
> 
> 
> 
> I plan to FINALLY start my first Magic Loop Toe Up sock tomorrow. I have been reading everything possible. So welcome KnottyMe & all who are hesitant to start. Kudos to those that have started & finished. Darowil has done a FANTASTIC job on this workshop.
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> Started as planned this am. Conquered the figure 8 cast on. Now trying the M1 to look right with no holes. Helps to read the instructions carefully. I counted 1/2 round as a round. DUH. Practise makes perfect.
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> Well- hours later & totally peeved. My M1 are holes. Not getting it.
Click to expand...

You are probably not knitting into the back of the stitch- but if they are all holes leave them- one of the early toes posted was done this way and the holes look really good, a design feature -some men may not want them but otherwise there is no reason why you can't leave the holes. They are too small for the toes to get caught in them.


----------



## darowil

As you would have gathered I have had virtully no computer time while my brother and family have been here. Week continues busy but I will be posting my summary and additional information before this closes.  Minday evening here and tomorrow I will be out almost all day racing round th ecountry side so will not likely be around tomorrow. Wednesday is fairly free so I will try to do it Wednesday. Fortunatelly I have been working on it all through the workshop so it shouldn't take me too long.


----------



## darowil

julietinboots said:


> Yea!! Finished my socks and wore them today with my boots. Very comfortable and warm, my feet even began to get warm before I finished my shopping. Going to post on the parade now.


its exciting when you get to wear socks you knitted. I still get a lot of enjoyment out of wearing mine.


----------



## darowil

knezmom said:


> 5mmdpns said:
> 
> 
> 
> Wrap and turn video for heel by Knit Freedom.
> http://knitfreedom.com/techniques/short-rows-wrap-and-turn
> 
> 
> 
> This video is HUGELY helpful! I'm not quite there, but the last part is making me nervous because I don't understand them and this class is going to close tomorrow!
> 
> Can you tell me what spswk2tog and spswsk2tog mean in words? Is this shown at the end of the Knit Freedom video?
> 
> And my family doesn't understand why half a sock that just goes to my heel makes me giddy! Thank you to the teachers and designers and to everyone who has asked a question that has helped me through this! Happy Valentines Day!
Click to expand...

If you look at the abbreviations it tells you in words what each one means. As I said somewhere the abbreviation I have used is my own (I can't remember where I found this way of doing the heels so no idea what abbreviations they used for this) and therefore it will not be in the video. I did not post any video links etc because any I looked at were slightly different to mine and I was trying to avoid confusing people by showing them something different to what I was doing. And I did the heel I usually do becuase it the one I find works best- and I wanted to know well what I was talking about!
And while this class closes it will still be availble to read- and I can be contacted by PM. But I do ask that before PMing the whole topic is read- very few issues are likely to arise that have not been addressed already.


----------



## darowil

*FINAL SOCK INFORMATION *
Now that you have knitted at least one sock you can see how they have 5 sections. And almost all socks have the same set up. Whether toe-up or cuff-down). Toe, foot, heel, leg and cuff.

As long as you have the same number of stitches (or similar increasing or decreasing a few stitches to get the stitch count correct) you can mix and match any of these parts.

To make a sock a little bigger or smaller simply cast on 60 or 68 stitches and work as the pattern says- If you are using 60 stitches for the heel simply work two less rows in each section of the heel- so you still work to the 12 stitches- start from row 3 so you begin with knit 29 (as you will be working with 30 stitches).
if doing 68 stitches you will be working with 34 stitches and you will need to add two rows to the beginning of the heel, knit 33, w&t; purl 32 W&t before row 1 in the pattern.

The number of stitches caston and left for the heel are actually a matter of personal preference. I use 12 because I quite like the size toe tip and heel width and using the same for toe and heel makes it easy to remember!

There are a number of different cast-ons as well. I first did this one because of the three in the Socks a-la- carte Toes up this one only needed the circular needles0- the others seemed to require an extra needle and I wanted to be able to cast on with only the needles I was going to be using.

The short row heel (like the one you did here) is the same for both toe-up and cuff-down.

It is best to always leave the bottom of the foot in ss. Most other stitches will be uncomfortable to walk on. But almost anything can go on the top of the foot- though I would avoid anything really bulky as they may be uncomfortable when in shoes or boots. Generally the same pattern is then used on the leg as well- but going all around the leg. With my heel you work about 12 rows of stst on the back of the leg before beginning the pattern- this will be the top of the heel where the shoe might cause pressure thus making it uncomfortable to wear. (this is flexible so that if you are working a pattern with a set number of rounds and you want to begin at row one you can stst the appropriate number of rows so you can begin the back with row1.

While patterns for toe up and cuff down can be interchanged remember that they will be worked the other way so will basically be upside down which wont matter at all for some patterns, will make some difference for others but others will require a lot of adjustment to make them work,

There are many different heels and toes. Many heels are a version of the short row heel (not all have the wraps but these make the heel edge neater, firmer and I would think stronger. The other main option for heels is the traditional flap and gusset style. The flap can be reinforced (as someone described for the toe) which can help prolong the life of the heel-, which could be very useful for someone who wears out the heels quickly. But the short row heel uses less yarn, which can be useful. (and note that the flap and gusset also uses short rows though not with the w&t.)

One way of adding interest to plain socks is to do contrasting toes, heel and cuffs. The short row heel is ideal for this as it is worked entirely separately to the rest of the foot. Note that the sweet tomato heel which so many rave about does not work here as it has full rounds through the heel at different times. For this reason it doesnt work so well with the self patterning and self stripping yarns either as you have a couple of full rounds of pattern that keep appearing on the front side and so throwing it out more often than for the other heels.

While I have given you the length for a calf length sock they can be made any length from anklet to above the knee. However if you go much bigger than mine I suggest getting a pattern for the length you want, as increases will be needed to cater for the calf.

Jonelle Raffino & Katherine Cade have three books out that are good for working out your own sock. They have a number of heel, toe, leg and cuff patterns that can be picked and mixed as desired. _Socks a la Carte, Socks a la Carte 2 toes up_ and one on colour work. I have the first two and frequently use them, especially the leg patterns. (simply because I have tried the heels and fall back on the one I taught. And I prefer k2p2 rib for the cuff as it has the mpst elasticity and so helps keep up the sock).

Another useful book is _The Sock Knitters Workshop_ by Ewa Jostes and Stephanie van der Linden. They give a range of toes and heels including suggestions for different shaped feet. They have some patterns as well. What can be very useful are the charts at the back giving a guide as to how many stitches to use for different foot sizes and in different weight yarns. I have found some mistakes in my edition, and have heard from others that they have as well. However I have been told that in later editions these have fixed . (And for any of you who are doing the colour workshop there is a Mosaic Pattern sock here which I have done- and it is really is not all that difficult- though it does need concentration)

A site many people say is very helpful for learning to knit socks is Silvers http://www.cometosilver.com/socks/ I have never used it (as I can knit socks!) and so I have no personal experience with it.

A few things I have picked up over time, which I left out simply to keep things little simpler but which can help improve your socks. Some have been raised during the workshop already but as I had them altogether I may as well post them all her in the one place as well.

. https://www.ravelry.com/account/login For those who dont know about Ravelry it is a free site and has many aspects to it. The one most commonly used is the huge range of patterns. And you can refine your search very easily. For example I put in socks and came up with 278 pages of patterns! However on the left side is a list of filters and from here you can select a large range of filters, for example under Attributes there is sock techniques then heels and then 5 options here. Other selections include crotchet or knit, free, and yarn weight . I used the attributes of short-row- heel, free, knitting, with photo and worsted weight and dropped to only 72 patterns.
Ravelry is free to join but you must sign up to access the patterns. But they do not pester you with anything once you have joined up. It is a site well worth joining for anything knitting (or crotchet) related

Holes at heel join.
Often where you move from the heel to working in the round again you get holes at each end of the heel. This is easily addressed by picking up a stitch inside the backstitch between the just worked heel stitches and the other set of stitches. Working into a stitch rather than the loop between the stitches works more effectively at closing up a hole. Then on the next round knit this stitch and the stitch before it together so that you return to your 64 stitches. I pick the stitch up at the end of each of the last two rows of the heel and then when I turn to work the next row I just slip that stitch rather than work it (it makes a slight slope down to match up with the front of the leg stitches).
More detailed info from the workshop:
you will have the loop that links the two stitches. Don't pick up this but look at the stich on the needle, then find the one under this and put the tip of your needle into this sttich and then work it as a knit or purl (depending on which row you are doing). I usually do this as the last step of the two final rows of the heel- 
so I would do

Row 39. Knit 30 slip the last stitch to the right needle pick up the two wraps return the slipped stitch to the left needle and knit all three together, pick up stich as above turn 
Row 40 slip the picked up sttichpurl 31, slip the last stitch to the right needle pick up the two wraps return the slipped stitch to the left needle and purl all three together,pick up a sttich as above turn 
first round of leg.
slip one knit to last two stitches on needle, k2tog, move to the next needle knit to end.
second round, k2 tog and then continue in ss until desired length.
This can be done in different way- basically I try to form a slight slope hence the slipping .
But you can simply pick up and then knit it straight together on the very next rounds.
Or you can even on the first round after the heel simply pick one up and immediately knit the 2tog (and the other end of the needle as you get back there do the same thing.
Stretchy castoff/bind off
Recently I have tried working three stitches to begin with, work two together leaving the 1st stitch on the needle until the end of the castoff/bind off. Then work the castoff/bind off as in the pattern. After working the last two together slip the first stitch onto the right needle and work them together. This has the advantage of evening out the height differences more effectively than the basic way. 
And this is also not the only stretchy castoff/bond off around. Goggle if you want to try a different one!
*Top Down*
This pattern I have provided can be easily adapted for cuff down.
Simply cast on (in a loose normal caston- I use long tail for sock cuffs). Work rib until desired length, knit leg until desired length, do the heel exactly as above and knit foot until desired length.
For the toe 
Odd rows k1, ssk knit to last 3 stitches on the needle, k2tog knit 1. Repeat for second needle
Even rows- knit
Repeat these two round until 12 stitches on each needle. And join with Kitchener stitch (Youtube if you dont know how to do this).

Or go the workshops and follow 5mmdpns, she has a different heel- that is for cuff down only. (link to the workshops in my signature below any of my postings)
And the principle of the hand for measuring is exactly the same, but this time the thumb gives a guide as to how long to make the rib. After the rib knit until the whole leg is the length of the hand. Then the foot (including the heel) is knitted to the length of the leg before you start shaping the toe.

*Two at a time.*
Many have asked about two at a time. As I have said I found it too fiddly but for those interested in trying here are some links. Note that these are not the same as the pattern I have given you- different heels and toes. http://www.knitpicks.com/Two+At+A+Time+Toe+Up+Magic+Loop+Socks+Pattern_PD50631220.html 
http://www.knitpicks.com/cfpatterns/pattern_display.cfm?ID=50417220 
These two Knit picks both use different castons and different heels




 a 7 part you tube (which I have not looked at as our internet was about to run out of credit!).

*different weight yarns. *
http://knitfreedom.com/free-patterns has a number of sock patterns in different weights including worsted weight 
And Ravelry as I have said has a large range so if you want a scok in a specfic yarn weight go there.

*Diabetic socks.*
I have cut and pasted a posting from 5mmdpns here on knitting socks for diabetics. Diabetics have specific needs in their socks and as 5mmdpns knows exactly what she is talking about (cant get much better than a sock knitting Diabetic Diabetes educator to tell us how to knit socks for diabetics after all!) I have added it in here as well. 
As I am a diabetic, and am a Diabetes Educator, I can tell you that the most important thing for the diabetic foot, is to make sure that the foot is not in any way experimenting pressure. That means the sock needs to be non-binding or tight, but be allowed to expand as the foot needs to. Once the heel is turned, the rest of the leg on the foot should be done in ribbing -- to provide support to stay up while allowing the swelling of the ankle/leg to do so comfortably. (I like a 2x2 ribbing as that gives the best stretch and support.)

Another thing is NO knots in the yarn but use another join such as knitting double for 3-4 stitches with end of the new ball of yarn overlapping the old yarn end.

The other aspect of a diabetic sock is to promote the foot to remain dry. The wool aspect of sock yarn does that. For those who are allergic to wool (such as myself) you will use a non-allergic-to-you yarn. Some suggestions are an alpaca/acrylic blend. If you are not able to use that, then you can knit with acrylic yarn (I do) and change your socks as often as your feet get damp. Zoe

Most all of the sock yarn sold in USA and Canada have a wool blend to them. You would want to check the label of the yarn to be sure. You will also want to make sure that the yarn is superwash wool yarn, as a non-superwash wool yarn will shrink. Some superwash wool does shrink a tiny bit, but not enough to be concerned about.

You can try on your sock and see how loose/tight the sock is to your foot. (My suggestion is to try on the sock after the evening meal as that is when your foot/ankles have swollen the most.) You can cast on extra stitches if the sock is fitting too tight with no wiggle room. Or, you may switch over to a slightly larger needle and continue on.

I hope that as a result of this workshop I will have introduced to something new- but would love to think that it was only a beginning and that you will experiment in every aspect of the socks. Every aspect of socks can be done in a number of different ways and no one way is right. Some suit certain people better than others so I have provided you with the pattern that I prefer as a basic pattern, not as THE way to knit socks.

I will post this in its in entirety but I will also post it as a PDF file- but don't worry if you can't access it as everything in it is already here. And if you need to you can cut and paste this post into a Word document or similar.


----------



## darowil

Well this about finishes the workshop- will most likely be closing tomorrow.
I have really enjoyed taking both these workshops and loved seeing people learning new skills- some learning socks from scratch others a different way. I love seeing people extend their skills. Two workshops coming up will enable you to extend the skills learnt in this and the magic loop workshop.

The first is Patchworkcats lace sock workshop starting 23rd February. This can be done on magic loop. uses a flap and gusset heel and is cuff down thus extending your sock knitting skills and for some also introduces you to lace knitting. And even oif you have done lace before you may not have done it in the round. So I strongly recommend this to all of you. A photo of the sock you will be doing was posted earlier in this topic (and is also posted in the workshop happenings from todays digest). I plan to do the sock as well- so I hope I will see you all there.
And the other workshop that will extned your skills learnt here is my Dead Fish Hat workshop. The pattern is a dpns pattern and can be done this way. But I will be leading you through converting the pattern from dpns to magic loop.
Both these workshops will be announced through the digest but can also be accessed through the link below in my signature (as well as other workshops that could be useful but are not related to this one).


----------



## darowil

Although this workshop will soon be closed it can still be read by anyone. 
It is likely that all questions that you have will have been answered over the time this workshop has been opened so please read all the posts. The relevant sections have been clearly highlighted so you can see what section you are trying to find questions for. However if you still are struggling you can PM me


----------



## Designer1234

DESIGNER1234 here. I just want to thank Darowil for teaching this wonderful workshop! She has given information here that will be used by many many KP members who are interested in learning how to make toe up socks! 

I thank her also for volunteering to do this, and for doing such a great job.

I would also like to thank our two other Workshop managers, who spent many hours trimming this workshop down so that only pertinent information is here. 

prismaticr and angora1 -- thanks to you both! Shirley (Designer1234


----------



## prismaticr

Add on post from Darowil says:

Prismaticr found this link recently and the patttern is the same as mine even with the double w&t for the heel. But she uses a heavier weight yarn so for all those wanting a pattern for heavy weight socks here you are! And one that you will be able to do with out any problems after mine. I'm enjoying seeing the pairs as they come up on the parade- keep it up.

http://olivemermaids.blogspot.com/2010/02/toe-up-raggi-socks.html


----------



## prismaticr

Topic is now closed. For additional information not found on these pages. please try and private message (pm) the listed teacher.

Thank you and happy knitting/crocheting!


----------



## Designer1234

Designer1234 said:


> *WORKSHOP STARTS ON JANUARY 21/2013*
> 
> Welcome to our workshops.
> 
> We are excited to share that Darowil will be teaching this workshop on how to knit one toe up sock at a time using Magic Loop. If you are unfamiliar with the magic loop technique - read the requirements for needles and yarn here, then *go to workshop #10 Learn magic loop, and
> join darowil back here for Jan. 21st*...*Start on page 1 of the magic loop workshop. *
> 
> General guidelines for our workshop series. START HERE!
> - Always start at this beginning post when first joining in
> - Commenting on this workshop automatically signs you up . You do not need to take any further steps. These are FREE workshops. There is NO official sign up or fee.
> * The alternate method to join is to click the word WATCH just above and to the left of this post.
> - Out of courtesy to the teacher, who has taken time out to do this for us, please let the TEACHER answer technique questions or pattern corrects first UNLESS the teachers says that comments by the members is welcomed.
> - If you have technical difficulties, please read the posts on our Workshop Home page, called TECH HELP. You find this by first clicking the words at the top or bottom of this page that say Knitting And Crochet Workshops With Designer1234 which takes you back to our workshop Home page.
> - When sharing these workshops with others, and please do. Please share only this link. http://www.knittingparadise.com/s-105-1.html DO NOT SHARE A LINK TO AN INDIVIDUAL WORKSHOP. Those posts will be removed!
> - These workshops will remain a permanent part of KP as long as KP operates. Our goal is to make these tutorials as easy to follow as possible. Therefore, over time, we will be deleting erroneous posts and trimming posts. Please continue to post. Please do not be alarmed if your posts suddenly disappear. YOU ARE STILL a part of the workshop, you WILL STILL get updates. You WONT have to read through pages and pages of non-subject material to go back and find what you missed.
> - When all else fails, and you have READ ALL the help we have already posted here and in our Help sections, we will reply to PMs.
> 
> Your section managers  designer and prismaticr
> 
> Now, lets get crafting!


*/NOTE:::: IMPORTANT! The pattern has been corrected. The INCORRECT PATTERN HAS BEEN REMOVED. Follow the information. (this is for those who are coming in to read the workshop after it is closed.*


----------

