# Bernat - how do you say?



## SKRB (Nov 14, 2013)

I have always heard and pronounced Bernat as "Bern-aye". I just watched a video where she pronounced it "Ber-knat".

I wonder how many knitting and crocheting terms we pronounce differently? Incorrectly?


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## chickkie (Oct 26, 2011)

I have always said Ber Knat.. Wouldn't it be spelled Bernet to be BerNay?


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## j-krau1 (Apr 7, 2011)

SKRB said:


> I have always heard and pronounced Bernat as "Bern-aye". I just watched a video where she pronounced it "Ber-knat".
> 
> I wonder how many knitting and crocheting terms we pronounce differently? Incorrectly?


And Paton is pronounced Payt-on, not Pat-ton as in General Patton. And I'm fairly certain the lady from Paton Bernat also said Ber-nat.


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## Jessica-Jean (Mar 14, 2011)

j-krau1 said:


> And Paton is pronounced Payt-on, not Pat-ton as in General Patton. And I'm fairly certain the lady from Paton Bernat also said Ber-nat.


Well, I suppose from a technical as-I-was-taught-in-1st-grade point of view, Pay-ton would be right, but I've only ever heard it said to rhyme with the general's name. I've always heard Bernat said to rhyme with rat.

I'll let you know when Yarnspirations gets back to me with an answer to my e-mail about this!


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## minniemo (Apr 23, 2011)

j-krau1 said:


> And Paton is pronounced Payt-on, not Pat-ton as in General Patton. And I'm fairly certain the lady from Paton Bernat also said Ber-nat.


minniemo wrote

A few of my friends worked in the Paton & Baldwins Mill and it was known as Patons pronounced with the long 'a' whereas the General Patton is the short 'a'. Also I understood that Bernat was rhyming with the pesky insect (gnat)


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## MaryE-B (May 11, 2012)

chickkie said:


> I have always said Ber Knat.. Wouldn't it be spelled Bernet to be BerNay?


My thoughts too.


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## Swedenme (May 28, 2014)

Bernat is a French word .they don't sound the T on the end it sounds more like bernah


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## Jalsh (Aug 6, 2012)

I watched a video where the girl was calling picot a "pea coat". I guess if you don't know better...right? What she was making was lovely, just beautiful.


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## farmkiti (Oct 13, 2011)

Never thought about it! I always just say it whatever way sounds right in my head and assume I'm right.... :lol: :lol: :lol:


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## CaroleD53 (Aug 7, 2012)

Paton & Baldwin originated here in Scotland. Their mill was near where I lived as a child. It's pronounced Payton.


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## Jessica-Jean (Mar 14, 2011)

Swedenme said:


> Bernat is a French word .they don't sound the T on the end it sounds more like bernah


 :?: http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Juan_Bernat


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## babysnapdragon (Nov 14, 2012)

Paton & Baldwin also has/d a factory in Darlington. Had a fascinating tour round it from fleece arriving, cleaned, washed (very smelly) dyed and so on right down to being made into yarn. All this when I was about 14 years old and have never forgotten it. Gave us tea and either cake or biscuits at the end of it.


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## CaroleD53 (Aug 7, 2012)

babysnapdragon said:


> Paton & Baldwin also has/d a factory in Darlington. Had a fascinating tour round it from fleece arriving, cleaned, washed (very smelly) dyed and so on right down to being made into yarn. All this when I was about 14 years old and have never forgotten it. Gave us tea and either cake or biscuits at the end of it.


The one here also had a very good factory shop. I wish it was still there.


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## galaxycraft (Feb 15, 2011)

Here is Bernat's Knitting person for how to's.  
Ber - gnat.


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## RoxyCatlady (Mar 22, 2011)

When I first started working at the yarn store, one of my fellow employees called it "Pay-tons" and that was the first time I'd heard it that way. Oddly enough, a phone call to order from the company resulted in either Pay-tons or Pat-tons, depending on who answered!! I still tend to default to the incorrect pronunciation I've always used - Pat-tons (and this I learned from my English mother!).

As for Bernat - always Ber-Nat. (or gnat, if you prefer). To Swedenme - Bernet would be the french version, if there were one, that would have the silent T.


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## DonnieK (Nov 23, 2011)

If Bernat is french, then it should be spelled Berneaux with "t" dropped. Of course now we are getting into the finer points here because I ask, is this French as in France, or French as in Canadian, or French as in Cajun Bayou?

And, does it matter? It is not one of the things that would take up a lot of my thinking time.


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## DonnieK (Nov 23, 2011)

If Bernat is french, then it should be spelled Berneaux with "t" dropped. Of course now we are getting into the finer points here because I ask, is this French as in France, or French as in Canadian, or French as in Cajun Bayou?

And, does it matter? Is it going to matter 5 years from now? It is not one of the things that would take up a lot of my thinking time.


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## DonnieK (Nov 23, 2011)

If Bernat is french, then it should be spelled Berneaux with "t" dropped. Of course now we are getting into the finer points here because I ask, is this French as in France, or French as in Canadian, or French as in Cajun Bayou?

And, does it matter? Is it going to matter 5 years from now? It is not one of the things that would take up a lot of my thinking time.


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## Ashenlachie (Dec 3, 2011)

I picked up all my knitting pronunciations from my mother oh so long ago and those are the ones I am comfortable with.
Some I have subsequently found to be "different" to other peoples'.
Admittedly Australia was a long way away from the rest of the world back in those days but pronunciation (like spelling) depends on where you originate from and is not really such a big deal. 
Imo


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## BethChaya (May 6, 2011)

I don't think they care how you pronounce it as long as you buy it.


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## SKRB (Nov 14, 2013)

BethChaya said:


> I don't think they care how you pronounce it as long as you buy it.


True words.


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## Jessica-Jean (Mar 14, 2011)

BethChaya said:


> I don't think they care how you pronounce it as long as you buy it.


You got that right! Here's their answer to my query:
*Hi
Thanks for contacting us.
Many people pronounce Bernat and Patons different way, both mean the same to us, yarn. It really does not matter which way they are pronounced. Thanks for contacting us.

Doris 
Customer Service*

They have no love lost on us would-be linguists!!


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## Gypsycream (Nov 23, 2011)

However you say it I just wish it was available in the UK


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## CaroleD53 (Aug 7, 2012)

Gypsycream said:


> However you say it I just wish it was available in the UK


 :thumbup:


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## owlet (Aug 18, 2013)

I always thought Bernat (Klein) yarns were German and would be pronounced Bernat. Turns out he was Serbian but all manufacturing was in Scotland. I can't imagine it would be 'Bernay' in any European language. If it were French it would be 'Berna' as in :
chat
Seurat
état


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## siouxann (Mar 5, 2011)

BethChaya said:


> I don't think they care how you pronounce it as long as you buy it.


That's the truth!


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## SouthernGirl (Dec 28, 2011)

True



BethChaya said:


> I don't think they care how you pronounce it as long as you buy it.


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## Marny CA (Jun 26, 2011)

'a rose by any other name ...'

If someone doesn't understand what I'm saying, I spell it. let them figure it out. ;-)


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## CaroleD53 (Aug 7, 2012)

owlet said:


> I always thought Bernat (Klein) yarns were German and would be pronounced Bernat. Turns out he was Serbian but all manufacturing was in Scotland. I can't imagine it would be 'Bernay' in any European language. If it were French it would be 'Berna' as in :
> chat
> Seurat
> état


I am feeling very silly. I never connected this with Bernat Klein until you pointed it out!!!


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## joannem602 (Feb 7, 2011)

Ashenlachie said:


> I picked up all my knitting pronunciations from my mother oh so long ago and those are the ones I am comfortable with.
> Some I have subsequently found to be "different" to other peoples'.
> Admittedly Australia was a long way away from the rest of the world back in those days but pronunciation (like spelling) depends on where you originate from and is not really such a big deal.
> Imo


I remember talking about knitting and crocheting with a coworker, and she kept mentioning making "mah-diffs". After a couple more references in context, I realized she was referring to motifs. Without thinking, I said, "oh - 'mo-teefs'". She told me it was how her mother had told her it was pronounced.


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## anjaa (Sep 19, 2012)

if you go to google translate
and type in Bernat
then select from English to French
and then click on the loudspeaker
you will hear it pronounced in French for you

https://translate.google.com/#en/fr/bernat


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## anjaa (Sep 19, 2012)

however (and I have to giggle) if you do the same with Paton

https://translate.google.com/#en/fr/paton

and you decide to try this out in a shop or store I am not sure anyone will understand what you are saying


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## Anna3703 (Mar 4, 2012)

Here we have always pronounced it : Burr-nat.....


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## morningstar (Mar 24, 2012)

Jessica-Jean said:


> :?: http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Juan_Bernat


 :thumbup:


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## .79315 (Dec 5, 2012)

A rose by any other name (or pronunciation) is still a rose. Pronounce it as you wish, I love the yarn.


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## morningstar (Mar 24, 2012)

Jessica-Jean said:


> You got that right! Here's their answer to my query:
> *Hi
> Thanks for contacting us.
> Many people pronounce Bernat and Patons different way, both mean the same to us, yarn. It really does not matter which way they are pronounced. Thanks for contacting us.
> ...


Thanks for a good laugh, Jessica-Jean! You always hit the ol' nail on the head!


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## Debiknit (Jul 7, 2011)

Okay. Now how do I pronounce picot and chiaogoo (as in the needles)? I say pie-cot and chia (as in chia pet)goo. I have
heard picot pronounced differently.


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## owlet (Aug 18, 2013)

Debiknit said:


> Okay. Now how do I pronounce picot and chiaogoo (as in the needles)? I say pie-cot and chia (as in chia pet)goo. I have
> heard picot pronounced differently.


Picot is from the French 'piquer' ('pee-kay') meaning 'to pick'.
It's pronounced 'pee-co'.

I've never heard of 'chiaogoo'! It sounds invented.


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## owlet (Aug 18, 2013)

Just looked at the Chiaogoo website and found this:

"What Does "ChiaoGoo" Mean and How the Heck Do You Pronounce It?"

Chiao (chau) - crafty
Goo (gu) - lady


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## Ronie (Jan 21, 2011)

well I always said 'Nay' too but then watching videos and they say it 'Nat' so I try to change my way of saying it.. not that I use this yarn.. (must be available in my area for me to use it ) it does make me wonder how many words do we mispronounce and don't even realize it!!


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## Phoebe's Mother (Aug 27, 2012)

Hi
Thanks for contacting us.
Many people pronounce Bernat and Patons different way, both mean the same to us, yarn. It really does not matter which way they are pronounced. Thanks for contacting us.

Doris 
Customer Service

Okay. . .I was going to "let it go". . .but I simply cannot. Therefore, I will share with all of the non-judgmental KPers that I am a bit peeved at the NON-answer Answer! Thanks to Jessica-Jean, for TRYING to get an answer for us, and for passing along the reply!


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## ann-other-knitter (Mar 17, 2012)

Paton like Eaton (my maiden name) has a Glottal Stop. Which means it is pronounced "Pay-n or Ea-n" try saying the words by swallowing the "t" and not pronouncing the "o".


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## ann-other-knitter (Mar 17, 2012)

Here is an explanation of Glottal stop as in the pronunciation of Patons.glottal stop

By Richard Nordquist
Grammar & Composition Expert
Share this 
AdsThe Last SentencePhoneticLondon GrammarNasal

"Nearly everybody makes a glottal stop instead of at least part of the t in words such as button." (Peter Ladefoged, Vowels and Consonants, 2005). 
Definition:

In phonetics, a stop sound made by rapidly closing the vocal cords.

See also:

Consonant
Stop (Phonetics)
Voice (Phonetics)
Examples and Observations:

"Glottalization is a general term for any articulation involving a simultaneous constriction, especially a glottal stop. In English, glottal stops are often used in this way to reinforce a voiceless plosive at the end of a word, as in what?"
(David Crystal, A Dictionary of Linguistics and Phonetics. Blackwell, 1997)


"We often make this stop--it's the sound we make when we say 'uh-oh.' In some languages, this is a separate consonant sound, but in English we often use it with d, t, k, g, b or p when one of those sounds happens at the end of a word or syllable. . . . We close the vocal cords very sharply and make the air stop for just a moment. We don't let the air escape.

"This glottal stop is the last sound of these words:
words: light . . . flight . . . put . . . take . . . make . . . trip . . . report
multisyllable words: stoplight . . . apartment . . . backseat . . . assortment . . . workload . . . upbeat
phrases: right now . . . talk back . . . cook the books . . . hate mail . . . fax machine . . . back-breaking
You also hear it in words and syllables that end in t + a vowel + n. We don't say the vowel at all, so we say the t + n: button . . . cotton . . . kitten . . . Clinton . . . continent . . . forgotten . . . sentence."
(Charlsie Childs, Improve Your American English Accent. McGraw Hill, 2004)


"Nowadays younger speakers of many forms of British English have glottal stops at the ends of words such as cap, cat, and back. A generation or so ago speakers of BBC English would have regarded such a pronunciation as improper, almost as bad as producing a glottal stop between vowels in the London Cockney pronunciation of butter . . .. In America nearly everybody has a glottal stop in button and bitten . . .."
(Peter Ladefoged, Vowels and Consonants: An Introduction to the Sounds of Languages, Vol. 1, 2nd ed. Blackwell, 2005)
SUGGESTED FOR YOU
From Richard Nordquist, Our Grammar & Composition Expert


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## fourbyin (Oct 6, 2013)

So how do you pronounce zauberball or the full name of it which I can't even spell?


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## albie (Jun 2, 2011)

DonnieK said:


> If Bernat is french, then it should be spelled Berneaux with "t" dropped. Of course now we are getting into the finer points here because I ask, is this French as in France, or French as in Canadian, or French as in Cajun Bayou?
> 
> And, does it matter? Is it going to matter 5 years from now? It is not one of the things that would take up a lot of my thinking time.


you are right DonnieK. if you have to pronounce it 'right' everytime things would never get done, and that not only pertains to everything in this world. I try, but there are other things that are more important. i was taught Ber-knat and Patton. as long as I know what i am looking for, i don't care. the same thing with crochay or crocher.(crochet) depends where you were brought up and by whom. it is nice to know but my world does not stop if I don't.  :thumbup:  :thumbup:


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## islandgirl81 (Jul 29, 2013)

This is fun. I've pronounced Bernat Burrrrr-nay for a long time only because Burrrrr-gnat just never sounded as nice to me. 
Paton.....I've pronounced Pay-ton because if it was pronounced Pat-ton, it would have two T's in it. But that's me.
Picot....Peeee-co. This is how I've always pronounced it and on Knitting Daily Eunny Jang pronounces it this way and since she's a professional and I'm not, I assume she knows. 
As far as the company not letting us know how to pronounce the names correctly I say maybe they need someone else taking care of emails that does have the correct answer. I do understand they just want us to buy the yarn but a business should know how to pronounce the products they carry.
But like I said, that's just me and my thinking today.


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## SKRB (Nov 14, 2013)

fourbyin said:


> So how do you pronounce zauberball or the full name of it which I can't even spell?


In the LYS I was looking at it and she said zaa-ber-ball, rhymed with saucer. Sure was beautiful.


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## Hazel Blumberg - McKee (Sep 9, 2011)

I've always said "Ber-NATT."

Hazel


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## Marienkaeferoma (Mar 29, 2012)

fourbyin said:


> So how do you pronounce zauberball or the full name of it which I can't even spell?


In German 'z' is pronounced 'ts', 'au' is pronounced 'ow', 'er' is 'air', and 'a' is 'ah'. So, Zauberball = Tsow-bair-bahl


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## Debiknit (Jul 7, 2011)

Thanks for the information. This is fun. Only now I will have to learn to say some words differently.


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## grammylynn (Mar 2, 2013)

Jessica-Jean said:


> Well, I suppose from a technical as-I-was-taught-in-1st-grade point of view, Pay-ton would be right, but I've only ever heard it said to rhyme with the general's name. I've always heard Bernat said to rhyme with rat.
> 
> I'll let you know when Yarnspirations gets back to me with an answer to my e-mail about this!


I agree and have always done the same. As long as we keep buying I don't think they care what we call it. LOL I have heard it both ways and just assumed it was a regional way of talking. Being from Maine originally-- we talk funny anyway!

I used to work in a bank in Bar Harbor, ME that had customers around the world and everyone was told to lose the accent and pronounce our words fully especially when on the phone. Now I talk a new funny and don't notice it. I say LINDAR for LINDA so I'm told, I don't hear the "R" but others do and comment on it.


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## KnittingNut (Jan 19, 2011)

islandgirl81 said:


> This is fun. I've pronounced Bernat Burrrrr-nay for a long time only because Burrrrr-gnat just never sounded as nice to me.
> Paton.....I've pronounced Pay-ton because if it was pronounced Pat-ton, it would have two T's in it. But that's me.
> Picot....Peeee-co. This is how I've always pronounced it and on Knitting Daily Eunny Jang pronounces it this way and since she's a professional and I'm not, I assume she knows.
> As far as the company not letting us know how to pronounce the names correctly I say maybe they need someone else taking care of emails that does have the correct answer. I do understand they just want us to buy the yarn but a business should know how to pronounce the products they carry.
> But like I said, that's just me and my thinking today.


I have pronounced it Burrrr-nay since the 70's. I always assumed that this was the correct way, but either the name has morphed with time, or I was way off from the beginning. Interesting topic, but not life changing. I still like Bernat yarns no matter how it's pronounced. I especially love some of the vintage Bernat patterns/yarns that have been timeless, and lovely to work.


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## Linda333 (Feb 26, 2011)

I just called the company, and I have been saying it incorrectly all these years. According to the company, it is "BER net" and I have been pronouncing it as a French word without the "t" sound. By the way, the person who answered the phone got a giggle out of our discussion.

Have a safe holiday weekend.


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## yarnstars (Feb 26, 2011)

I have called the Bernat company with a question, and they answered the fone, "Ber nat" (rhymes with sat). Then they speak in French, I then say English and they speak English. I cannot tell you how many times I have been in JoAnns and heard customers call it Bernay. It is tru what RoxyCatlady said.


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## SKRB (Nov 14, 2013)

Linda333 said:


> I just called the company, and I have been saying it incorrectly all these years. According to the company, it is "BER net" and I have been pronouncing it as a French word without the "t" sound. By the way, the person who answered the phone got a giggle out of our discussion.
> .


It will be hard for me to change my mindset from Ber-nay to Ber-nat, I will try.


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## Anna3703 (Mar 4, 2012)

You're right, DonnieK and Albie, who cares?????


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## Jessica-Jean (Mar 14, 2011)

grammylynn said:


> ... I say LINDAR for LINDA so I'm told, I don't hear the "R" but others do and comment on it.


After my parents had me, they split and remarried, raising planned families in NYC and north-central Massachusetts. I still cannot for the life of me understand how and why my sister in Mass. named her daughter Diana, but says Die-ann-ER! I lived four years in Leominster, and I never heard anyone tack an -er instead of an -ah to the end of such words. Note, neither her British-born husband nor their son say it that way, nor did her Leominster-born mother nor _her_ British-born mother!

In a language/linguistics class I took, we were told that each child learns and creates its own language as it grows up. Mostly it picks up what it hears, but sometimes other influences get picked up along the way. 'Other influences' being TV, radio, peers, day-care workers, teachers, etc. Kids, like me, who are moved from region to region often in their early years, may end up with an unidentifiable 'accent' that baffles everyone around them as to their origin.


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## SAMkewel (Mar 5, 2011)

Phoebe's Mother said:


> Hi
> Thanks for contacting us.
> Many people pronounce Bernat and Patons different way, both mean the same to us, yarn. It really does not matter which way they are pronounced. Thanks for contacting us.
> 
> ...


I suspect the individual who "answered" the question doesn't know and doesn't care. I agree that it was a bit down-putting.


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## creatingjudy (Mar 29, 2014)

I agree. It is like the word "chevrolet". The t is silent in French. My grandmother always pronounced it "Ber-nae. So I follow at a grandmother myself. It would be helpful for the company to give us correct pronunciation. Have a nice day everyone!
judy


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## cherylthompson (Feb 18, 2013)

Jessica-Jean said:


> Well, I suppose from a technical as-I-was-taught-in-1st-grade point of view, Pay-ton would be right, but I've only ever heard it said to rhyme with the general's name. I've always heard Bernat said to rhyme with rat.
> 
> I'll let you know when Yarnspirations gets back to me with an answer to my e-mail about this!


 :thumbup: :thumbup:


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## onegrannygoose (May 13, 2011)

Swedenme said:


> Bernat is a French word .they don't sound the T on the end it sounds more like bernah


That is the way I learned it.


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## DollieD (Mar 7, 2011)

I agree!
In the 60's and 70's it was always the first pronunciation.
Now, they are pronouncing it differently, the second way.
I feel like, you say tomato, I say tomato!! You know?


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## Kaiess (Jan 25, 2013)

I believe Bernat is a US product so will be pronounced as Ber- natt


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## DollieD (Mar 7, 2011)

MaryE-B said:


> My thoughts too.


Just love your pupper!


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## islandgirl81 (Jul 29, 2013)

Jessica-Jean said:


> After my parents had me, they split and remarried, raising planned families in NYC and north-central Massachusetts. I still cannot for the life of me understand how and why my sister in Mass. named her daughter Diana, but says Die-ann-ER! I lived four years in Leominster, and I never heard anyone tack an -er instead of an -ah to the end of such words. Note, neither her British-born husband nor their son say it that way, nor did her Leominster-born mother nor _her_ British-born mother!
> 
> In a language/linguistics class I took, we were told that each child learns and creates its own language as it grows up. Mostly it picks up what it hears, but sometimes other influences get picked up along the way. 'Other influences' being TV, radio, peers, day-care workers, teachers, etc. Kids, like me, who are moved from region to region often in their early years, may end up with an unidentifiable 'accent' that baffles everyone around them as to their origin.


Have you ever seen the TV series Alaskan Bush People? The kids have their own accent. They don't have very much contact with people......so the show says. Anyways, I think it's interesting.


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## Kaiess (Jan 25, 2013)

Swedenme wrote:
Bernat is a French word .they don't sound the T on the end it sounds more like bernah

**onegrannygoose - That is the way I learned it.

but see
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Bernat_Mill 
I looked it up.

Kaiess


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## Kaiess (Jan 25, 2013)

ann-other-knitter said:


> Paton like Eaton (my maiden name) has a Glottal Stop. Which means it is pronounced "Pay-n or Ea-n" try saying the words by swallowing the "t" and not pronouncing the "o".


Sorry to contradict but Patons is a UK English word and is pronounced by sounditng the 't'. Pay-ton


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## Kaiess (Jan 25, 2013)

Jessica-Jean said:


> I lived four years in Leominster,


Is that Leominster in the US Jessica-Jean? If so how is it pronouncced?

I moved here from Leominster, England. Leominster is pronouncced 'Lemster'.


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## maysmom (Sep 22, 2011)

CaroleD53 said:


> Paton & Baldwin originated here in Scotland. Their mill was near where I lived as a child. It's pronounced Payton.


I had a patient named Paton and she pronounced it Pay-ton. Also had a friend named Bernat and she pronounced it Ber-gnat. You ladies are on the pronunciation ball!!


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## maysmom (Sep 22, 2011)

grammylynn said:


> I agree and have always done the same. As long as we keep buying I don't think they care what we call it. LOL I have heard it both ways and just assumed it was a regional way of talking. Being from Maine originally-- we talk funny anyway!
> 
> I used to work in a bank in Bar Harbor, ME that had customers around the world and everyone was told to lose the accent and pronounce our words fully especially when on the phone. Now I talk a new funny and don't notice it. I say LINDAR for LINDA so I'm told, I don't hear the "R" but others do and comment on it.


Like BAA HAABAA??


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## maysmom (Sep 22, 2011)

DonnieK said:


> If Bernat is french, then it should be spelled Berneaux with "t" dropped. Of course now we are getting into the finer points here because I ask, is this French as in France, or French as in Canadian, or French as in Cajun Bayou?
> 
> And, does it matter? It is not one of the things that would take up a lot of my thinking time.


I like the phrase "thinking time!!" Thanks!


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## Georget (Jul 14, 2011)

In our area Bernat has been pronounced Bernay and Paton as in the general for as long as I can remember-grandmother and great-gram and I'm over 70. Our LYS does not correct anyone's pronunciation and I'm almost certain ( almost) that neither company would correct me
as long as I continued to buy their products. :lol:


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## susanmassey (May 18, 2014)

I have always pronounced Bernat as Ber-nae but my daughters say Ber-nat. 
For the Paton yarn I have always used the long "a" sound.

It's funny to see the different ways that the words are being pronounced, that includes crocheting and knitting terms too.

I hope everyone out there has a good rest of the day and a wonderful long 4th of July weekend!


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## yarnstars (Feb 26, 2011)

Chevrolet is a french word, but Bernat is not. In French the et is pronounced with the ay sound. But since Bernat is not a French word, French pronunciation does not apply. Altho the Bernat company answers their fone in French, they say 
Bernat, rhyming it with sat.


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## Bunbun (Feb 13, 2013)

How about BOYE needles? It wasn't until some time ago I saw "BOYLE" when I looked at it. (I'd make a lousy proofreader!!!)


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## Palenque1978 (Feb 16, 2011)

If you're pronouncing it in English it's: Ber-net. If in French it's: Ber-naw. If in Spanish it's: Berr-nat. 

I always thought it was a French word...so, it's Ber-naw for me.


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## Palenque1978 (Feb 16, 2011)

onegrannygoose said:


> That is the way I learned it.


 :thumbup: :thumbup:


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## nellie47 (Nov 27, 2011)

I live not far from where the Bernat Mills and outlet stores were in Uxbridge,Ma It was pronounced ber nat.


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## happy senior (Apr 16, 2014)

Jessica-Jean,
Love your dry sense of humor.I pronounce it Bernot. Matters only if that is your last name!!!


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## knitnanny (Feb 28, 2012)

Although in French it would be pronounced as Bernay, Canadians say Ber-nat...it is made in Ontario and the store employees say Ber-nat too..


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## misellen (Mar 8, 2013)

BethChaya said:


> I don't think they care how you pronounce it as long as you buy it.


 :thumbup: :thumbup: :thumbup:


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## Villagerbgl (May 13, 2014)

So here is the cure say it different every time and you will be correct some of the tome. bTW I have often wondered my self.


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## RandyPandy (May 6, 2011)

Many years ago, when my children were young, I worked part time in a yarn store and was lucky to go to the yarn convention in NYC with the owner of the shop. We went to the Bernat room, as I had designed a sweater with their yarn. We met Mrs. Bernat. She pronounced her name, ber-nat.


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## Jessica-Jean (Mar 14, 2011)

Kaiess said:


> Swedenme wrote:
> Bernat is a French word .they don't sound the T on the end it sounds more like bernah
> 
> **onegrannygoose - That is the way I learned it.
> ...


Thanks for that Kaiess. I followed up and just searched the name Bernat. http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Bernat
Since most of the people listed are of Spanish/Catalan origin, that should put the kibosh on the idea of it ever being a name of French origin. In both Spanish and Catalan, every letter seen is pronounced - no silent 't'.

Plenty of Bernat families in Barcelona: http://blancas.paginasamarillas.es/jsp/resultados.jsp?ap1=bernat&sec=08&lo=barcelona&pgpv=1&tbus=0&nomprov=Barcelona&idioma=spa


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## disgo (Mar 2, 2013)

Okay then how about Bucket? :-o :shock: :lol: :roll: ;-) :? 

Try these:

Goyen
Creek
Pittier
Diddier
Gautier
Disney
Couturier
Atilier
Entredeux

Martha Pullen with her "southern" accent and PhD in Fine Arts says "en tre doe" while the manager at Hancock Fabrics with her BA said its "en tre dew" and had the store clerks all confused when what I wanted was a hemstitch needle for my machine--I found it myself by the way since there was no one they were waiting on or in the store and they all just ran off!


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## Jessica-Jean (Mar 14, 2011)

disgo said:


> Okay then how about Bucket? :-o :shock: :lol: :roll: ;-) :? ...


Hyacinth Bucket? My darling will re-watch every episode of Keeping Up Appearances and enjoy it every time. :thumbup: :thumbup:


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## morningstar (Mar 24, 2012)

Jessica-Jean said:


> Hyacinth Bucket? My darling will re-watch every episode of Keeping Up Appearances and enjoy it every time. :thumbup: :thumbup:


Me, too, Jessica-Jean! Me, too!


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## sseidel (Apr 20, 2012)

I say" Ber nay" out of habit after taking years of French in school!


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## chickkie (Oct 26, 2011)

it doesn't matter how you think it is said, it is how the person who owns the name says it that counts.


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## SKRB (Nov 14, 2013)

chickkie said:


> it doesn't matter how you think it is said, it is how the person who owns the name says it that counts.


So true, always try to learn how to pronounce names correctly. I actually broke a friendship over my ex-friend spelling my last name wrong. After a few times it seemed to be intentionally hurtful, and when your BFF intentionally spells your name wrong, it does hurt, a lot.


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## knittingdragon (Jun 15, 2012)

When I was at school we were taught that if a vowel is followed by one consonant then another vowel, the first vowel is pronounced long as in Paton = Pay-ton. If the vowel is followed by two consonants the vowel is pronounced short as in Patton = Pat-ton.
The only time I have come across "et" not being pronounced as it looks is in a number of French words as in the case of the surname of a friend of mine - Bonnet = Bon-nay.
We have a town near us called Ormeau. A lot of people pronounce it Or-mo - others pronounce it Or-meyo. It's the same as beau the French word for boyfriend pronounced Boh - not b-oh.


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## disgo (Mar 2, 2013)

Marienkaeferoma said:


> In German 'z' is pronounced 'ts', 'au' is pronounced 'ow', 'er' is 'air', and 'a' is 'ah'. So, Zauberball = Tsow-bair-bahl


Is that Lower or High German where Eliza Doolittle in "my Fair Lady" spoke Lower German until Professor Higgins got her to speak in High German?

Most of my upper class German family spoke High and my Bonn grandmother spoke in lower. confusing as a child to say the least.


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## disgo (Mar 2, 2013)

Jessica-Jean said:


> Hyacinth Bucket? My darling will re-watch every episode of Keeping Up Appearances and enjoy it every time. :thumbup: :thumbup:


Yes, the Bouquet Residence! Love how poor Richard tries to correct her and its his name for goodness sake. Just saw an episode the other Sat that was one I had missed--good thing I had my soaker of the finest of alpaca yarn in periwinkle blue on because I'm sure there was some moisture spilled during the program!


SKRB said:


> So true, always try to learn how to pronounce names correctly. I actually broke a friendship over my ex-friend spelling my last name wrong. After a few times it seemed to be intentionally hurtful, and when your BFF intentionally spells your name wrong, it does hurt, a lot.


Here, here (as in agreement). My peer of over 20 years always spelled my name Gordan and I was tempted but didn't spell her name Pat as Pot! My good friend always got a kick out of a four year old boy who would call me Gort Dan very distinctly and I would have to not burst out laughing to encourage such "rude" behavior!


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## Villagerbgl (May 13, 2014)

Jessica-Jean said:


> Hyacinth Bucket? My darling will re-watch every episode of Keeping Up Appearances and enjoy it every time. :thumbup: :thumbup:


My first thought. 2!


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## ramram0003 (Nov 7, 2011)

Interesting!


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## Jessica-Jean (Mar 14, 2011)

On another topic, I met (sadly!) a new word: walmartians. Even more sadly, I googled it, found it, watched some. Ugh! I now think of myself as slightly overweight. 

However, back to linguistic discussion. Would one pronounce it :arrow: wall-mart-ee-anns - clearly saying the 't', or 
:arrow: wall-Martians - to rhyme with presumed inhabitants of the planet Mars?


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## morningstar (Mar 24, 2012)

Jessica-Jean said:


> On another topic, I met (sadly!) a new word: walmartians. Even more sadly, I googled it, found it, watched some. Ugh! I now think of myself as slightly overweight.
> 
> However, back to linguistic discussion. Would one pronounce it :arrow: wall-mart-ee-anns - clearly saying the 't', or
> :arrow: wall-Martians - to rhyme with presumed inhabitants of the planet Mars?


Now you've done it, Jessica-Jean! Of course I had to google it, didn't I? Horrors! :shock:


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## RoxyCatlady (Mar 22, 2011)

Jessica-Jean said:


> On another topic, I met (sadly!) a new word: walmartians. Even more sadly, I googled it, found it, watched some. Ugh! I now think of myself as slightly overweight.
> 
> However, back to linguistic discussion. Would one pronounce it :arrow: wall-mart-ee-anns - clearly saying the 't', or
> :arrow: wall-Martians - to rhyme with presumed inhabitants of the planet Mars?


I've always said it in my head like the inhabitants of the planet, lol...

Interesting discussion, even if it gets side-tracked some times! 
A couple of my favourites: depending on where you live, apparently, Houston. If in Texas, it is "hews ton", but in New York, it is "house ton".
And one that I shook my head at: Overheard in a grocery store: Oh, look, they have tortillas on sale --- instead of "tor TEE ahs", she said it "TORT illas" (think, kind of rhyme with turtle)


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## SKRB (Nov 14, 2013)

Jessica-Jean said:


> On another topic, I met (sadly!) a new
> 
> However, back to linguistic discussion. Would one pronounce it :arrow: wall-mart-ee-anns - clearly saying the 't', or
> :arrow: wall-Martians - to rhyme with presumed inhabitants of the planet Mars?


I think it is Wal-mart-ee-anns. Eye shocker.


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## morningstar (Mar 24, 2012)

RoxyCatlady said:


> I've always said it in my head like the inhabitants of the planet, lol...
> 
> Interesting discussion, even if it gets side-tracked some times!
> A couple of my favourites: depending on where you live, apparently, Houston. If in Texas, it is "hews ton", but in New York, it is "house ton".
> And one that I shook my head at: Overheard in a grocery store: Oh, look, they have tortillas on sale --- instead of "tor TEE ahs", she said it "TORT illas" (think, kind of rhyme with turtle)


We always say and have heard Hews-ton in our New York, New Jersey, Connecticut, Pennsylvania existence. Our area is a melting pot, for sure, so those who said it differently may not have been locals. The Spanish speaking folks must cringe when we order their foods though. :-D


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## Jessica-Jean (Mar 14, 2011)

morningstar said:


> We always say and have heard Hews-ton in our New York, New Jersey, Connecticut, Pennsylvania existence. Our area is a melting pot, for sure, so those who said it differently may not have been locals. The Spanish speaking folks must cringe when we order their foods though. :-D


Umm ... Born New Yorker here (waving foolishly at my monitor). When I was living in NYC (1946-1970), Houston Street was _not_ pronounced the same as that same-spelling city in Texas. It's _still_ said HOUSE-ton, at least by the natives. Besides, if it weren't, where would the term So-Ho have come from? It's short for SOuth of HOuston, its geographical location.


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## morningstar (Mar 24, 2012)

Jessica-Jean said:


> Umm ... Born New Yorker here (waving foolishly at my monitor). When I was living in NYC (1946-1970), Houston Street was _not_ pronounced the same as that same-spelling city in Texas. It's _still_ said HOUSE-ton, at least by the natives. Besides, if it weren't, where would the term So-Ho have come from? It's short for SOuth of HOuston, its geographical location.


Of course, Jessica-Jean! That's it! I had forgotten about that. Guess old age...and the shock from the Wal-Mart photos...has caught up with me! Have you seen So-Ho lately? Wow! NJ had a milk company called Tuscan...so, yes, people ignored the spelling of Tucson, AZ and called the Dairy TOO-SON instead of TUS-CAN. English is an impossible language and I am in awe of anyone who can learn it as a second language.


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## ltcmomky (Aug 22, 2013)

I'm pretty sure that when you walk up to the counter to check out with any yarn.....they'll take your money and smile no matter what you call it. Don't stress yourselves. ;-)


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## KnittingNut (Jan 19, 2011)

Never heard of Walmartians before.......so like a train wreck I had to take a look on Google. Well, I laughed, was appalled, etc. Creepy sad. I've shopped once at Walmart in the past - it was my last visit.


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## SAMkewel (Mar 5, 2011)

I don't know which is more sad; that there are people like the "Walmartians" or that they are regularly held up for ridicule online.


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## calisuzi (Apr 1, 2013)

I pronounce it Bernay, maybe she dumbed it down for Americans. It has always been my understanding that the T at the end of French words was silent.


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## SAMkewel (Mar 5, 2011)

calisuzi said:


> I pronounce it Bernay, maybe she dumbed it down for Americans. It has always been my understanding that the T at the end of French words was silent.


According to the rest of this thread, it would be "Bernay" and French if it were spelled Bernet, which it isn't. The last name of Bernat, if you Google it, is not French. Interesting, don't you think?


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## Jessica-Jean (Mar 14, 2011)

morningstar said:


> Of course, Jessica-Jean! That's it! I had forgotten about that. Guess old age...and the shock from the Wal-Mart photos...has caught up with me! Have you seen So-Ho lately? Wow! NJ had a milk company called Tuscan...so, yes, people ignored the spelling of Tucson, AZ and called the Dairy TOO-SON instead of TUS-CAN. English is an impossible language and I am in awe of anyone who can learn it as a second language.


No, I rarely get down to NYC since my mother died in 1997. I'm sure I wouldn't recognize the area; it was all industrial, ultra-poor, and utterly run-down the last time I cycled west on Houston to get across the bridge on my way out to Jamaica along Metropolitain Avenue. That was around 45 years ago. It wasn't yet known as So-Ho either.

The mind, mine anyway, rebels against the spelling vs. pronunciation of Tucson. It's totally against every spelling rule that was ever drilled into my first-grade brain! I'm sure that your NJ dairy was owned and named by an Italian for his area of origin in Tuscany. Since both Tucson and Tuscan are foreign to folks whose _only_ language is English, the mis-pronunciation doesn't really surprise me.

I agree with you about the nigh impossibility of learning/mastering English as a second (third, or more) language. I thank my lucky stars it's my first, because I'm _sure_ I'd never manage to learn it from scratch as an adult.


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## Jessica-Jean (Mar 14, 2011)

ltcmomky said:


> I'm pretty sure that when you walk up to the counter to check out with any yarn.....they'll take your money and smile no matter what you call it. Don't stress yourselves. ;-)


Who's stressing? It's all fun repartee.


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## Jessica-Jean (Mar 14, 2011)

SAMkewel said:


> I don't know which is more sad; that there are people like the "Walmartians" or that they are regularly held up for ridicule online.


Most humans - regardless of upbringing, cultural background, language - seem to feel better about themselves by seeing others as being inferior. Gladiators, clowns falling on banana peels, or the beyond-morbidly-obese flaunting their Michelin-Man rolls.

In school - Roman Catholic private mostly-girls school - we were indoctrinated, from kindergarten on up, to consider *all* non-Catholics as just a step above Satan himself! This didn't work too well with me, because my home was in a 99% Jewish area. If I wanted to play with the kids on the block, I had to play with non-Catholics. Yet, we were daily taught that they were destined to damnation and that we could - _somehow_ - 'catch' their damned destiny!

Our society is no better then the RC church. We are taught - through advertisements and the all-pervasive media - that thin is good and fat is bad. And it's not a new trend at all. My classmates - from first grade on - teased me because I was bigger (as in head-and-shoulders-taller, although I was about a year younger) then they were. I wasn't the' fatty' they called me, but that didn't stop them from taunting me. Where'd all that good Christian upbringing go? There wasn't any trace of it in the schoolyard, that's sure!

Societal expectations, crowd psychology, the need-to-feel-better-than - these all conspire to encourage photographers to become paparazzi and perfectly ordinary camera-carriers to snap shots of the most shocking examples of humanity they come across ... and others to look and laugh and mock. This is perhaps _not_ the best use of this most powerful tool that is the internet.


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## SAMkewel (Mar 5, 2011)

Jessica-Jean said:


> Most humans - regardless of upbringing, cultural background, language - seem to feel better about themselves by seeing others as being inferior. Gladiators, clowns falling on banana peels, or the beyond-morbidly-obese flaunting their Michelin-Man rolls.
> 
> In school - Roman Catholic private mostly-girls school - we were indoctrinated, from kindergarten on up, to consider *all* non-Catholics as just a step above Satan himself! This didn't work too well with me, because my home was in a 99% Jewish area. If I wanted to play with the kids on the block, I had to play with non-Catholics. Yet, we were daily taught that they were destined to damnation and that we could - _somehow_ - 'catch' their damned destiny!
> 
> ...


I grew up as a Methodist in a predominately Roman Catholic town; we were constantly being warned against one another, which most of us simply ignored to our advantage :~). We went on our merry way while the "adults" stressed over it. 'Tis better to not get me going on my total disenchantment with organized religion.

At the age of eleven I had my full height of 5'10" and towered above all others, especially the males, in spite of being the youngest in the class, so I also know how that goes.

Regarding the needs of most humans to have others to look down upon, as the family scapegoat I'm also well aware of that nauseating feature of the human psyche. It seems to me that those of us who have been targeted the most make a choice early on, early to join or resist. I try to stay in the resistor's camp, thus assuring myself of remaining the family's black sheep for being different. Ain't life a hoot?


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## Jessica-Jean (Mar 14, 2011)

SAMkewel said:


> ... Ain't life a hoot?


It sure beats the alternative!! :thumbup:


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## morningstar (Mar 24, 2012)

Jessica-Jean said:


> No, I rarely get down to NYC since my mother died in 1997. I'm sure I wouldn't recognize the area; it was all industrial, ultra-poor, and utterly run-down the last time I cycled west on Houston to get across the bridge on my way out to Jamaica along Metropolitain Avenue. That was around 45 years ago. It wasn't yet known as So-Ho either.
> 
> The mind, mine anyway, rebels against the spelling vs. pronunciation of Tucson. It's totally against every spelling rule that was ever drilled into my first-grade brain! I'm sure that your NJ dairy was owned and named by an Italian for his area of origin in Tuscany. Since both Tucson and Tuscan are foreign to folks whose _only_ language is English, the mis-pronunciation doesn't really surprise me.
> 
> I agree with you about the nigh impossibility of learning/mastering English as a second (third, or more) language. I thank my lucky stars it's my first, because I'm _sure_ I'd never manage to learn it from scratch as an adult.


The area is now very classy, expensive, artsy, and lovely. So many of those industrial buildings have been converted into luxury residences.  We seldom go into the city now but the young ones keep us informed. Our daughter is planning a walk across the Brooklyn bridge for all of us in October. Whew! :roll:


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## Jessica-Jean (Mar 14, 2011)

morningstar said:


> ... Our daughter is planning a walk across the Brooklyn bridge for all of us in October. Whew! :roll:


Is walking across it such a big deal? What's the occasion?

*Un*like Robert Moses' creations, the George Washington, Brooklyn, Manhattan and Williamsburg bridges were designed to accommodate pedestrian traffic. At one time, even the RFK Triborough Bridge had a pedestrian walkway, at least from Queens to upper Manhattan. I crossed it with my bicycle in 1968 and was dismayed - due to repair work, to have to lug the bike down four stories of scaffolding/stairs, ride on Randall's Island a bit and lug it back up to the bridge proper! That kinda put a damper on the day's outing; I went home on a different bridge. I've no idea if it's still pedestrian accessible or if it is or ever has been possible to get to the Bronx afoot. The Queensboro has had its inaccessible-to-foot-or-cycle-traffic periods. I was ordered not to bike across it on more than one occasion in the 60s, but I defied the policeman and charged on by anyway. Thanks to some bright light in the city's administration, it now has a legal walk/cycle lane. (Imagine that! A _sensible_ person in City Hall!! It happens sometimes.)


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## Bunbun (Feb 13, 2013)

JJ, I'm not a person who is into comedy but I could watch Hyacinth forever. That lady could really act. I loved that whole series.


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## Bunbun (Feb 13, 2013)

in my hometown the Southern Baptists swore that all us Methodists were going to Hell because we wore Choir ROBES. I don't know why wearing robes was sacrilegious to them none of them could give me an answer but were sure we were going to hell as a result.


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## SAMkewel (Mar 5, 2011)

Jessica-Jean said:


> It sure beats the alternative!! :thumbup:


I'd say that depends upon the myriad, uncontrollable circumstances of one's current life. If one remains upright and mobile to a point, mentally alert, etc., it probably does. Otherwise, I have this theory that for a good many, the alternative is a blessing. I'm not in favor of assisting the alternative, only in accepting that there can be a good side to the alternative. Even Jack Kevorkian chose to go the natural way (go figure).


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## SAMkewel (Mar 5, 2011)

Bunbun said:


> in my hometown the Southern Baptists swore that all us Methodists were going to Hell because we wore Choir ROBES. I don't know why wearing robes was sacrilegious to them none of them could give me an answer but were sure we were going to hell as a result.


Back in the olden days, wearing robes was associated with the Roman Catholic church. I remember the hubbub when the choirs in my Methodist church began wearing choir robes at all ages. Happily, I haven't ended up in hell--yet. I don't think there's any real proof for any of these ideas, so I don't "stress myself" over that, either.


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## Bunbun (Feb 13, 2013)

I wouldn't run around the house looking like that, let alone go out in public. We must have a very quiet WM here. Thank goodness!!!


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## morningstar (Mar 24, 2012)

Jessica-Jean said:


> Is walking across it such a big deal? What's the occasion?
> 
> *Un*like Robert Moses' creations, the George Washington, Brooklyn, Manhattan and Williamsburg bridges were designed to accommodate pedestrian traffic. At one time, even the RFK Triborough Bridge had a pedestrian walkway, at least from Queens to upper Manhattan. I crossed it with my bicycle in 1968 and was dismayed - due to repair work, to have to lug the bike down four stories of scaffolding/stairs, ride on Randall's Island a bit and lug it back up to the bridge proper! That kinda put a damper on the day's outing; I went home on a different bridge. I've no idea if it's still pedestrian accessible or if it is or ever has been possible to get to the Bronx afoot. The Queensboro has had its inaccessible-to-foot-or-cycle-traffic periods. I was ordered not to bike across it on more than one occasion in the 60s, but I defied the policeman and charged on by anyway. Thanks to some bright light in the city's administration, it now has a legal walk/cycle lane. (Imagine that! A _sensible_ person in City Hall!! It happens sometimes.)


It will be a joy to walk the Brooklyn Bridge...both ways...with my daughter. She is in denial about Mom's age though. She also wants to add the Botanical Gardens and that famous pizza joint (can't remember the name) for lunch. Of course, when we go back across: "Let's do the Seaport, Mom!" Your adventures in the 60's, I have a few of my own. A bunch of us nurses nearly got arrested for going after Gov. (Rocky) regarding some issues. Another story for another post. Those were the days, my friend!


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## RedQueen (Nov 25, 2012)

SKRB said:


> I have always heard and pronounced Bernat as "Bern-aye". I just watched a video where she pronounced it "Ber-knat".
> 
> I wonder how many knitting and crocheting terms we pronounce differently? Incorrectly?


If you were speaking French you might say Ber nay but in English it is Ber-nat.


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## Jessica-Jean (Mar 14, 2011)

RedQueen said:


> If you were speaking French you might say Ber nay but in English it is Ber-nat.


Actually, were you pronouncing it in French, it would be Ber-nah. It ends in -at, not -et. Ending in -et would sound -ay.


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## RedQueen (Nov 25, 2012)

Duly corrected.


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## mamalava (Apr 26, 2014)

chickkie said:


> it doesn't matter how you think it is said, it is how the person who owns the name says it that counts.


Yup. I once had a professor try to pronounce my Dutch name as though it were French. Since when did Van Der ____ ever come from France?! :shock: Just because it's not English doesn't make it French.

I say burr nat. I have been saying Patton, but only because I wasn't looking close enough. My first grader could read it correctly...


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## MaryA (Jan 26, 2011)

disgo said:


> Is that Lower or High German where Eliza Doolittle in "my Fair Lady" spoke Lower German until Professor Higgins got her to speak in High German?
> 
> Most of my upper class German family spoke High and my Bonn grandmother spoke in lower. confusing as a child to say the least.


I don't know if my husbands grandparents spoke High or Low German, but the last name is Holz. Pronounced Holts. Now everyone who sees the name spelled says Holes with the es as a z sound. Anyone who hears the name ALWAYS spells it with a t - Holtz. Go figure.

I am from the south, but grew up in Michigan
I taught myself to read using phonics. So I say Tuesday, not Toosday. Have taken a lot of flack for that one but it still looks like a u pronunciation to me.


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