# "War on Women" #4



## VocalLisa (Jan 4, 2014)

theyarnlady said:


> So I am out for one day and see that the Lib's other three sites got so boring and they had no response that they like nor anyone will post to again have to take over another site.
> 
> What did I learn the usual Lib's can bully their way through any topic with out an ounce of knowledge and change subjects at will. If one does not agree your wrong Lib's are right.
> 
> ...


You're rambling like a schizophrenic street person again. Missed your meds?


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## VocalLisa (Jan 4, 2014)

Gerslay said:


> I'm so surprised that you don't identify with your sisters who are underpaid in the Obama administration. I guess that's because you can't face the reality of it all...eh?


Those sisters are better paid than they had been in past administrations who didn't even acknowledge the discrepancies at all.


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## Janet Cooke (Aug 14, 2013)

Gerslay said:


> I didn't say I would pi$$ on you...Cheeky made a nasty comment about looking up the Jolly Green Giant's skirt and it was he who made that comment as a warning to her that she'd best step back so as not to get wet!
> 
> It was a joke, poopur!


You are a joke, Gerri.


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## VocalLisa (Jan 4, 2014)

Gerslay said:


> No dear, it proves that I don't give a "hoot" about Janet, her postings, or her opinions, in any way shape or form. Nor yours!


Well, you gave a hoot enough about her when you were making threats towards her.

Regardless, in general you don't give a hoot about truth or facts, so of course, it goes without saying you wouldn't give a hoot about her her opinions.

That's how conservatives like yourself stay in your little ignorant bubbles. Willful ignorance.


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## VocalLisa (Jan 4, 2014)

Gerslay said:


> Janet...have you noticed that you always respond to a topic that I post but I never respond to yours? Hmmmm!


Except of course when you're trying to get crazies here on the board to physically harm her.


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## VocalLisa (Jan 4, 2014)

Poor Purl said:


> Is this really the tone you want to take? Because if you're insulting, someone else will insult you back, and that will make you cry, as it has in the past. Besides, I don't know what "other three sites" you're talking about; we've had some really good conversations on a few, but I think you stop reading when you can't understand what's being said.


I have no idea what "other three sites" she's talking about either. It sounds to me she and her ilk has some other conspiracy theory cooking.


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## VocalLisa (Jan 4, 2014)

Gerripho said:


> The sad part is the falsehood is being taught in our schools. The other sad part is we (this country) is never given credit for all it's efforts to correct past wrongs. ...


In otherwords: "_"Americas Founders Worked Tirelessly Until Slavery Was No More_"

Sorry sweetie, it's gonna be hard to take you seriously when you start using Bachmann as your History professor.


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## Cindy S (Oct 20, 2013)

Gerslay said:


> DameMary and Cindy S...there's a real discussion for you...have at it!


Nah, I am far more interested in having a discussion about your door.........."Oh drats...I forgot to close the door!" from you at 11:12:55. I cannot begin to tell you how important that tidbit is in my life. :roll:


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## damemary (Mar 14, 2012)

You fooled me. You always have something to say about our discussions. You could ignore them, you know.



Gerslay said:


> No dear, it proves that I don't give a "hoot" about Janet, her postings, or her opinions, in any way shape or form. Nor yours!


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## MarilynKnits (Aug 30, 2011)

People who advocate inbreeding or "racial purity" need to study some science.

When I took Sociology, we had some studies on inbreeding. I think the families lived in isolated mountain regions and after a number of generations there were mental retardation (which was referred to as feeble mindedness) and physical abnormalities. I think the names were the Jukes and Kallicack families. I took Sociology in 1954 or 1955 and don't have the text any more, so that is off the top of my head.

Then we have the Hapsburgs who interbred among the royal families of western Europe. Another interesting sociological study.


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## damemary (Mar 14, 2012)

I'm beginning to see the light. Oh Powerful One, what will you do next to the evildoers? Stay tuned. Film at 11:00 PM.



EveMCooke said:


> Of course the discrepancy of pay between men and woman is President Obama's fault. Please, everything is President Obama's fault. Did you not see him standing on the grassy knoll in 1963, he was only a very small boy at the time but he was guilty. I also think, no I believe, it is his fault that my grandson's cat died last week. He caused the climate to change and this caused the cat to develop a face ulcer, which lead to the cat's death. But, definitely, it was President Obama's fault. He is very powerful indeed.


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## damemary (Mar 14, 2012)

And it's all President Obama's fault. He even neglected to save me a parking place at the grocery. Was he playing golf again?



Poor Purl said:


> And his bad influence preceded 2009, when he first took office. As if Bush left us in the Garden of Eden and Obama chased us out.


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## damemary (Mar 14, 2012)

That's my thought too, Lisa.



VocalLisa said:


> No without Gerslay or those like her, we could have could have HONEST disagreements with those who are left.
> 
> My issue with Gerslay or those like her is that they're not very truthful.


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## damemary (Mar 14, 2012)

You can talk to her if you wish, of course. We've all got different triggers.



SQM said:


> But Gerslay actually made a witty comment to me this morning. Let her stay for the rest of the day since she displayed a rare sense of humor.


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## damemary (Mar 14, 2012)

I feel sick.



Janet Cooke said:


> Gerripho wrote:
> Jefferson did not call Africans 60% human. Jefferson wrote the final draft of the Declaration of Independence. The reference to 60% (actually three-fifths) appears in the Constitution of the United States and Jefferson had no part in the deliberations or writing of that document.
> 
> Did you notice that she complained and repeated what you said?
> ...


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## SQM (Jun 22, 2012)

"Did you notice you stupid, stupid, person that I was explaining that pig Thomas Jefferson was not, as Gerri implied, staying out of the action because he disagreed with the 60% (though he did want a lesser presence on a federal level) but because he was not in the US to participate?"

Maybe stupid, stupid person is thinking Jefferson could have texted in his opinion.


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## VocalLisa (Jan 4, 2014)

joeysomma said:


> Thank you for stating true history. There are to many that believe only the rewritten progressive history. There are many who do not believe each person is responsible for himself, and blame past happenings for their plight and play the victim.


What's funny is this:



> Had the authors of the Constitution not used the three-fifths method of determining representatives for the House of Representatives, the southern, slave-holding states would have had many more representatives sent to the House and their influence would have been greater than it was.


The south ONLY wanted to call them 100% people in order to get more seats in congress... even though they would not actually be representing those people.

The North was simply saying that if they were going to get the benefit of the extra seats in congress then they should also be TAXED accordingly. IF the south was willing to PAY TAXES according to the population of blacks being 100% human, the north would've gone along with that.

The south wanted it both ways, they wanted the seats in the house, but they didn't want blacks counted when it came to determining taxes.

The North only agreed to the 35ths clause as a compromise to get the south to stop being moochers off the rest of the country and try and get them to pay their fair share in taxes.

It's that way now, most of the blue states pay more in federal taxes than they get back in federal aid. The Red states pay LESS in federal taxes than they get back in federal aid.

The Northern states are STILL footing the bill for the south. The South are the true "takers" while the North are the "makers".


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## Janet Cooke (Aug 14, 2013)

VocalLisa said:


> Except of course when you're trying to get crazies here on the board to physically harm her.


  and just in case I didn't notice she had to bring it to my attention, because (head cocked to the right) why would I comment on a message board to a commenter who won't directly respond to me?
Could it be, kind lady? Could it be that Janet has something she wants to say and the Guernsey is a convenient spot to launch from?


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## Janet Cooke (Aug 14, 2013)

joeysomma said:


> That's a good one. You are right he was not in the US to participate in the 80% discussion. He was dead!


Are you in the Day Room for an hour or two?


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## damemary (Mar 14, 2012)

Security!!!



Janet Cooke said:


> Are you in the Day Room for an hour or two?


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## SQM (Jun 22, 2012)

Janet Cooke said:


> Are you in the Day Room for an hour or two?


How I love my Cooke.

Go to Rebel Flag. More outrageous thinking.


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## Janet Cooke (Aug 14, 2013)

SQM said:


> How I love my Cooke.
> 
> Go to Rebel Flag. More outrageous thinking.


I don't think I could take it today. Sheesh, I already described one of the troubled ones as stupid...


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## damemary (Mar 14, 2012)

That's my girl.



Janet Cooke said:


> I don't think I could take it today. Sheesh, I already described one of the troubled ones as stupid...


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## SQM (Jun 22, 2012)

Janet Cooke said:


> I don't think I could take it today. Sheesh, I already described one of the troubled ones as stupid...


Yeah and I echoed you.

Come on. Don't let being very elderly stop you. Candace on Rebel needs help thinking.


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## Janet Cooke (Aug 14, 2013)

SQM said:



> Yeah and I echoed you.
> 
> Come on. Don't let being very elderly stop you. Candace on Rebel needs help thinking.


I could not care less about Candace and right now I am going to see my little angel baby, or big angel baby, woohoo!


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## SQM (Jun 22, 2012)

You are very lucky. How old?


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## VocalLisa (Jan 4, 2014)

SQM said:


> "Did you notice you stupid, stupid, person that I was explaining that pig Thomas Jefferson was not, as Gerri implied, staying out of the action because he disagreed with the 60% (though he did want a lesser presence on a federal level) but because he was not in the US to participate?"
> 
> Maybe stupid, stupid person is thinking Jefferson could have texted in his opinion.


Well, he was certainly part of the discussion in one way or the other:



> As Thomas Jefferson wrote in his notes on the debates, the southern states would be taxed "according to their numbers and their wealth conjunctly, while the northern would be taxed on numbers only."


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## Gerslay (Oct 4, 2011)

Janet Cooke said:


> Gerslay? Just because you don't "quote reply" doesn't mean you are not responding.
> And, Sweetie? I really, really don't care what you think.


Janet...have you noticed that you always respond to a TOPIC that I post but I never respond to yours? Hmmmm!

Key Word: TOPIC


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## Gerslay (Oct 4, 2011)

VocalLisa said:


> My only "ploy" is to aggressively speak truth, nothing passive about that.


Your passivity was that you dodged the question in that you rail against racism wherever you find it EXCEPT when its on your side of the aisle.

In the case of Margaret Sanger you actually condone her evil by doing the old switcheroo (your typical aggressive merry-go-round ploy) of pointing your finger at me, or anyone on the other side of the aisleanything at all, just so long as you don't have to face the truth.

You do it all the time and in the process you reveal who you really are. Once again, you shoot yourself in your foot. Or should I say, you shoot yourself in your other foot?


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## SQM (Jun 22, 2012)

I thought the final word was that indeed Sanger had some serious flaws but that Planned Parenthood is not Sanger and is an ally to women across the country who need its services.

Sister G - quit that argument. It is stale already and we have moved on. 

Bring up another issue.


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## Gerslay (Oct 4, 2011)

SQM said:


> I thought the final word was that indeed Sanger had some serious flaws but that Planned Parenthood is not Sanger and is an ally to women across the country who need its services.
> 
> Sister G - quit that argument. It is stale already and we have moved on.
> 
> Bring up another issue.


Just catching up with all the slams against me...I'll be finished in a sec.


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## Gerslay (Oct 4, 2011)

damemary said:


> Well, I guess you told us in your usual polite and thoughtful way. God bless.


After you remove your foot from your mouth you might want to scroll back about 10 pages and find that exchange began with one of your buds using that very line!

But that would call for too much integritysomething you rarely display.


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## Gerslay (Oct 4, 2011)

Okay SQM...I'm done!


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## SQM (Jun 22, 2012)

Gerslay said:


> Okay SQM...I'm done!


Good for you Sister G. Now let us decide on a mutual topic about the war on women. How about ageism in the workplace against women? or the problems of being a single older woman? Or women whose children never call or women whose children call too much? Would any of these suit?


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## Gerslay (Oct 4, 2011)

How about honor killings in India?
Or forced abortions in China?
Or lack of education in Pakistan?

How about something real instead of the palaver that fems in this country think are important?


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## Poor Purl (Apr 14, 2011)

VocalLisa said:


> I have no idea what "other three sites" she's talking about either. It sounds to me she and her ilk has some other conspiracy theory cooking.


Or else they're figments of her imagination.


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## SQM (Jun 22, 2012)

Okay Sister G. I think the feminists here would be happy to discuss any of your issues.

However Sister.....

If you are in your early 60s or younger and had a good career in a field besides teaching, nursing and secretary, then be grateful to the 2nd wave feminists who made it possible for you.

If you were treated with respect and did not have to make coffee or run errands to buy presents for your boss' mistress - be grateful to the feminists.

If your family needed your income as a second income to make ends meet, be thankful to the feminists for paving the way for you to work without feeling shame.

If you have a gay family member, thank the 2nd wave feminists for showing them how to form a pride movement.

And lastly, if you exercise your right to vote, thank the 1st wave feminists for allowing you into the polling place.


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## Poor Purl (Apr 14, 2011)

MarilynKnits said:


> People who advocate inbreeding or "racial purity" need to study some science.
> 
> When I took Sociology, we had some studies on inbreeding. I think the families lived in isolated mountain regions and after a number of generations there were mental retardation (which was referred to as feeble mindedness) and physical abnormalities. I think the names were the Jukes and Kallicack families. I took Sociology in 1954 or 1955 and don't have the text any more, so that is off the top of my head.
> 
> Then we have the Hapsburgs who interbred among the royal families of western Europe. Another interesting sociological study.


So much for eugenics. The Hapsburgs had no chins, like Mitch McConnell.


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## Poor Purl (Apr 14, 2011)

SQM said:


> "Did you notice you stupid, stupid, person that I was explaining that pig Thomas Jefferson was not, as Gerri implied, staying out of the action because he disagreed with the 60% (though he did want a lesser presence on a federal level) but because he was not in the US to participate?"
> 
> Maybe stupid, stupid person is thinking Jefferson could have texted in his opinion.


Or maybe she was thinking about George Jefferson.


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## Poor Purl (Apr 14, 2011)

VocalLisa said:


> The south ONLY wanted to call them 100% people in order to get more seats in congress... even though they would not actually be representing those people.
> 
> The North was simply saying that if they were going to get the benefit of the extra seats in congress then they should also be TAXED accordingly. IF the south was willing to PAY TAXES according to the population of blacks being 100% human, the north would've gone along with that.
> 
> ...


But who are the fakers?

This - the reason for the 3/5 rule - was something I'd never known. Thanks for the history lesson.


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## Poor Purl (Apr 14, 2011)

Janet Cooke said:


> and just in case I didn't notice she had to bring it to my attention, because (head cocked to the right) why would I comment on a message board to a commenter who won't directly respond to me?
> Could it be, kind lady? Could it be that Janet has something she wants to say and the Guernsey is a convenient spot to launch from?


Are you implying she's a cow? That works.


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## Janet Cooke (Aug 14, 2013)

Gerslay said:


> Janet...have you noticed that you always respond to a TOPIC that I post but I never respond to yours? Hmmmm!
> 
> Key Word: TOPIC


Gerri, when have you introduced a topic?


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## Janet Cooke (Aug 14, 2013)

Poor Purl said:


> Are you implying she's a cow? That works.


 ;-)


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## Janet Cooke (Aug 14, 2013)

Poor Purl said:


> So much for eugenics. The Hapsburgs had no chins, like Mitch McConnell.


Not an attractive look, we should remember that one for the next time some creep does the liberals are all ugly thing.


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## Janet Cooke (Aug 14, 2013)

Poor Purl said:


> Or else they're figments of her imagination.


Ravelry? 
Huffington Post?
Creative Knitting?


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## Gerslay (Oct 4, 2011)

SQM said:


> Okay Sister G. I think the feminists here would be happy to discuss any of your issues.
> 
> However Sister.....
> 
> ...


I was one of those feminists, a bra-burning child of the 60slove me some Janis Joplin and Bella Abzug! But that war is over and guess what WE WON!

I agree that a few squirmishes remain but I certainly dont want the government in my bedroom telling me how to live my life nor do I expect the government to pay for my birth control (not that I need it any longer). Its absurd what so-called feminists want today.

See if you can engage the Ladies of the Left into any of those meaningful topics. Ive tried and they wont go thereall they want to do is shoot down Republicans, Conservatives, and most especially Christian women.

There's hope for you yet, SQM, but they'll wear you down too!


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## SQM (Jun 22, 2012)

Christian Ladies (not you Poor Purl or me) - see there is hope for Sister G yet. She was on the correct side when she was younger. Sister G- it is the Republicans who interfere in our bedroom activities. The vast majority of the Ladies of the Left seem to be Christian. None of us our conservatives thankfully - listen to Ted Nugent and Cruz - scarey. Sister G - try to remember your values from your youth.


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## Janet Cooke (Aug 14, 2013)

SQM said:


> Christian Ladies (not you Poor Purl or me) - see there is hope for Sister G yet. She was on the correct side when she was younger. Sister G- it is the Republicans who interfere in our bedroom activities. The vast majority of the Ladies of the Left seem to be Christian. None of us our conservatives thankfully - listen to Ted Nugent and Cruz - scarey. Sister G - try to remember your values from your youth.


She is playing with you, who is asking for the gov't to pay for their birth control, SQM?
And she most certainly does what the government in someone's bedroom. She likes restrictions on abortion accessiblility.


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## Lkholcomb (Aug 25, 2013)

EveMCooke said:


> Of course the discrepancy of pay between men and woman is President Obama's fault. Please, everything is President Obama's fault. Did you not see him standing on the grassy knoll in 1963, he was only a very small boy at the time but he was guilty. I also think, no I believe, it is his fault that my grandson's cat died last week. He caused the climate to change and this caused the cat to develop a face ulcer, which lead to the cat's death. But, definitely, it was President Obama's fault. He is very powerful indeed.


 :lol:


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## SQM (Jun 22, 2012)

Cooke - I know what you are getting at. Sister G was ripe once but now intellectual rot has set in , in her old age. Sounds like some Vitamin B 12 will restore her thinking.


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## Cindy S (Oct 20, 2013)

Gerslay said "nor do I expect the government to pay for my birth control"..............but it is okay for the government to pay for Viagra? Oh yeah, I forgot, the majority of the government are men, how naïve of me!!


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## Janet Cooke (Aug 14, 2013)

SQM said:


> Cooke - I know what you are getting at. Sister G was ripe once but now intellectual rot has set in , in her old age. Sounds like some Vitamin B 12 will restore her thinking.


Go easy on that old age thing!
Feminism may have been all about the money for her back then as much as it is now.


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## SQM (Jun 22, 2012)

My oldest friend who lives in Fla is exactly your age Cooke. She always tells me how hip she is. I agree by telling her to look below her waist. : )

Money how?


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## Lkholcomb (Aug 25, 2013)

SQM said:


> Okay Sister G. I think the feminists here would be happy to discuss any of your issues.
> 
> However Sister.....
> 
> ...


May I add: If you were a nurse, that you no longer needed to stand up every time a doctor entered the room or automatically give them your seat (no matter if it was the first time you had a chance to sit in hours, needed to chart, or if the doctor had literally just come from another room where they had been sitting).


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## SQM (Jun 22, 2012)

Yikes LK.


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## Lkholcomb (Aug 25, 2013)

Janet Cooke said:


> She is playing with you, who is asking for the gov't to pay for their birth control, SQM?
> And she most certainly does what the government in someone's bedroom. She likes restrictions on abortion accessiblility.


Oh no, restrictions on abortion accessibility are putting the government where they belong.... In the doctor's office. Of course you want a second opinion from a politician! *sarcasm*

Now the laws regarding sex.... That is government in the bedroom.


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## Janet Cooke (Aug 14, 2013)

SQM said:


> My oldest friend who lives in Fla is exactly your age Cooke. She always tells me how hip she is. I agree by telling her to look below her waist. : )
> 
> Money how?


I can't tell you specifically, I don't know her, the movement was about several things, she is vehemently against sexual freedom, females exercising control over their own bodies, she does express interest in money, however. She likes to flaunt her accrual of property and complain about about those who might need the care and support of the US taxpayer.


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## damemary (Mar 14, 2012)

Poor Purl said:


> Or maybe she was thinking about George Jefferson.


 :XD: :XD: :XD: :XD: :XD: :XD: :XD: :XD: Movin on up.


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## MarilynKnits (Aug 30, 2011)

We owe much to the women who convened in Seneca Falls over 150 years ago, too. 

And what a switcheroo to go from Bella to the far right! Almost as radical as Rush becoming a Socialist.


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## Janet Cooke (Aug 14, 2013)

MarilynKnits said:


> We owe much to the women who convened in Seneca Falls over 150 years ago, too.
> 
> And what a switcheroo to go from Bella to the far right! Almost as radical as Rush becoming a Socialist.


Yes, indeed. Unbelievable.


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## SQM (Jun 22, 2012)

We all vote our class interest. We have to assume that her financial situation changed over the years.


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## Janet Cooke (Aug 14, 2013)

SQM said:


> We all vote our class interest. We have to assume that her financial situation changed over the years.


We don't have to assume anything. Most young people don't have much money and if they are lucky, if their parents protected their property from high end of life costs, and nothing catastrophic goes wrong life is easier at 60 than it was at 25.

You are from NY? You must know stories of Bella Abzug. She was one of those socialists referenced so disparagingly by Guernsey yesterday. 
The poorest county in the US is located in Kentucky, it is something like 97% Republican.


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## SQM (Jun 22, 2012)

I am saying that Sister G's politics changed because she may have more money now than when she was younger. We vote our financial interests.


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## Janet Cooke (Aug 14, 2013)

SQM said:


> I am saying that Sister G's politics changed because she may have more money now than when she was younger. We vote our financial interests.


Could be, maybe you know her where I don't.


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## theyarnlady (Feb 25, 2011)

Took the med's

no name

On your new Topic AHCA is W & S I OBC

Your words the right takes over all the site we start.

Must have been 

Obama Care

No had to be 

WOW which you are on now

Or could it be

A G Of Friendship 

Yes we took them all over because we are such nasty women. How dare we start sites that we take over?????????????

And the winning post of all


I meaning you no name Pm your friend and apologize


I pm friend no name no pm and no apology

Now I bet no name will say Oh I had wrong person

Be careful what you say your words will come back to haunt you.

Oh now I must go take more med's and cry woe is me.

Reason for no name is can't think of any to call someone who is not my friend.


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## Janet Cooke (Aug 14, 2013)

theyarnlady said:


> Took the med's
> 
> no name
> 
> ...


I love word association games, too


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## MarilynKnits (Aug 30, 2011)

Are you all right? Do we need to call anybody to help you? I hope you have not had a stroke or something! Or is your message a code to somebody?



theyarnlady said:


> Took the med's
> 
> no name
> 
> ...


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## Gerslay (Oct 4, 2011)

SQM said:


> I am saying that Sister G's politics changed because she may have more money now than when she was younger. We vote our financial interests.


No Q...the change happened when the Lord won the battle for my soul and the sanctity of life from conception forward became precious to me. When once I carried the banner for many causes now its just one...pro life. You choose the mother, I choose the child...there's no need to hate one another.


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## susanmos2000 (May 10, 2011)

theyarnlady said:


> Took the med's
> 
> no name
> 
> ...


Free verse--or does your antenna need adjusting?


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## Janet Cooke (Aug 14, 2013)

susanmos2000 said:


> Free verse--or does your antenna need adjusting?


It is obviously a message for someone she thinks we will ostracize if we know they have befriended her, too bad she doesn't understand we don't work that way.


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## Poor Purl (Apr 14, 2011)

MarilynKnits said:


> Are you all right? Do we need to call anybody to help you? I hope you have not had a stroke or something! Or is your message a code to somebody?


It does sound like a stroke; she has said she sometimes has seizures. I hope it's not that. I don't think she lives alone, so there's probably someone to help her. But it looks serious.


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## Poor Purl (Apr 14, 2011)

susanmos2000 said:


> Free verse--or does your antenna need adjusting?


You are evil! :twisted: :twisted: :twisted: :twisted: :twisted:


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## peacegoddess (Jan 28, 2013)

Gerslay said:


> How about honor killings in India?
> Or forced abortions in China?
> Or lack of education in Pakistan?
> 
> How about something real instead of the palaver that fems in this country think are important?


How about the rape of women in the military...or is that palaver? How about the high infant mortality rate in America due to lack of good prenatal services due to poverty.


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## Cindy S (Oct 20, 2013)

theyarnlady said:


> Took the med's
> 
> no name
> 
> ...


Somebody want to translate this into English?


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## Janet Cooke (Aug 14, 2013)

Cindy S said:


> Somebody want to translate this into English?


I am not sure why people don't understand this, other than not knowing who she is addressing, it is quite clear.

someone she cares about said something about needing to talk in PM. 
She either needs to apologize or expects an apology and has received no response to her PM. 
She is trying to reach out and say what the heck while maintaining confidentiality.

I hope that the person she cares so much about doesn't keep her hanging for long.

Oh, and I am guessing it is a leftie as she refers to the tiff about taking over threads started by righties, evil doers that we are.


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## Cindy S (Oct 20, 2013)

Janet Cooke said:


> I am not sure why people don't understand this, other than not knowing who she is addressing, it is quite clear.
> 
> someone she cares about said something about needing to talk in PM.
> She either needs to apologize or expects an apology and has received no response to her PM.
> ...


Okay, if you say so


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## Janet Cooke (Aug 14, 2013)

Cindy S said:


> Okay, if you say so


 I say so. Not that my saying so means much, I have been wrong many times in my life.


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## SQM (Jun 22, 2012)

The Cooke can translate for those speaking in tongues.


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## Cheeky Blighter (Nov 20, 2011)

Something to think about. Wombats have a problem with this as do some conservatives and religious zealots. Opinions and blind faith is all they've got.


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## Cheeky Blighter (Nov 20, 2011)

God gave us brains for a reason and it was to search for the truth and the truth will set us free.


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## susanmos2000 (May 10, 2011)

Janet Cooke said:


> I am not sure why people don't understand this, other than not knowing who she is addressing, it is quite clear.
> 
> someone she cares about said something about needing to talk in PM.
> She either needs to apologize or expects an apology and has received no response to her PM.
> ...


I'm sure you're right, Janet--but oh how boring. I was hoping it might be an acrostic, where the first letter of each line spells out a word. Nope:

T
N
O
Y
M
O
N
W
O
A
Y
A
I
I
N
B
O
R

doesn't mean anything anyway. Guess I was crediting the righties with a smidgen of creativity (my bad).


----------



## damemary (Mar 14, 2012)

Respectfully, GOP policies only favor the top 1% now. If you're not making $1M per annum, voting GOP is AGAINST your financial interests.



SQM said:


> I am saying that Sister G's politics changed because she may have more money now than when she was younger. We vote our financial interests.


----------



## damemary (Mar 14, 2012)

~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~
Does anyone know how to get in touch with this person? Sounds like she needs help.
~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~



theyarnlady said:


> Took the med's
> 
> no name
> 
> ...


----------



## damemary (Mar 14, 2012)

MarilynKnits said:


> Are you all right? Do we need to call anybody to help you? I hope you have not had a stroke or something! Or is your message a code to somebody?


yarnlady's post worried me too.


----------



## damemary (Mar 14, 2012)

I'm going to report to Admin.



Poor Purl said:


> It does sound like a stroke; she has said she sometimes has seizures. I hope it's not that. I don't think she lives alone, so there's probably someone to help her. But it looks serious.


----------



## damemary (Mar 14, 2012)

Good translation. Scary post.



Janet Cooke said:


> I am not sure why people don't understand this, other than not knowing who she is addressing, it is quite clear.
> 
> someone she cares about said something about needing to talk in PM.
> She either needs to apologize or expects an apology and has received no response to her PM.
> ...


----------



## damemary (Mar 14, 2012)

Thank you for the reminders, Cheeky.



Cheeky Blighter said:


> God gave us brains for a reason and it was to search for the truth and the truth will set us free.


----------



## Knitted by Nan (Aug 3, 2013)

theyarnlady said:


> Took the med's
> 
> no name
> 
> ...


Is it possible to get an English translation of the above posting please? I do not speak gibberish.


----------



## lovethelake (Apr 6, 2011)

Janet Cooke said:


> It is obviously a message for someone she thinks we will ostracize if we know they have befriended her, too bad she doesn't understand we don't work that way.


You don't work at all according to your posts, so don't worry it


----------



## lovethelake (Apr 6, 2011)

Poor Purl said:


> It does sound like a stroke; she has said she sometimes has seizures. I hope it's not that. I don't think she lives alone, so there's probably someone to help her. But it looks serious.


Sounds like you are acting like a doctor, and you should be charged with malpractice. Maybe you are the one that had the seizure, because you couldn't understand she was just being silly.

GAL


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## Poor Purl (Apr 14, 2011)

lovethelake said:


> Sounds like you are acting like a doctor, and you should be charged with malpractice. Maybe you are the one that had the seizure, because you couldn't understand she was just being silly.
> 
> GAL


Go ahead, sue me. Call the cops. If you think it's wrong for anyone to be concerned about someone who has admitted to having brain damage, maybe you're not as good a friend as you like to think.


----------



## Janet Cooke (Aug 14, 2013)

lovethelake said:


> Sounds like you are acting like a doctor, and you should be charged with malpractice. Maybe you are the one that had the seizure, because you couldn't understand she was just being silly.
> 
> GAL


You know, I was going to pass your little rants by just because you are so well educated I am sure that you can't truly understand Americanspeak. 
Those in the field learn very early in training to use non-definitive terms such as seems to be, appears and *sounds like*.
TheYarnLady, the person you couldn't even name, did not appear to be acting silly. Isn't it odd that her "enemies" could sense distress and her pals couldn't be bothered saying anything comforting in public?


----------



## Janet Cooke (Aug 14, 2013)

lovethelake said:


> You don't work at all according to your posts, so don't worry it


Well, so long as I have decided to break the ice I am going to say this.

You are right, I don't work very hard. I do just what I want to do. I earned that by making good choices. 
I may not be rich, I am secure. Best of all, I have love in my life. 
I take care of my kids and my kids take care of me. That is the way families work. I am sorry that you don't recognize that model. It is lovely. 
Bless you, Dear.


----------



## MarilynKnits (Aug 30, 2011)

And I am reminded of a jest my father used sometimes when confronted with crass stupidity. 

"When they were giving out brains, he thought they said 'trains' and he wasn't going any place"


----------



## Janet Cooke (Aug 14, 2013)

MarilynKnits said:


> And I am reminded of a jest my father used sometimes when confronted with crass stupidity.
> 
> "When they were giving out brains, he thought they said 'trains' and he wasn't going any place"


Yes, there are a variety of those sayings, just as there are a variety of stories about the creation and a variety of stories about godly retribution and rewards for living well and right. 
Thanks for reminding us.


----------



## MarilynKnits (Aug 30, 2011)

Janet Cooke said:


> Well, so long as I have decided to break the ice I am going to say this.
> 
> You are right, I don't work very hard. I do just what I want to do. I earned that by making good choices.
> I may not be rich, I am secure. Best of all, I have love in my life.
> ...


Sounds as if you have sound values. I am blessed that I still have my DH in reasonably good condition for his age and a DD who is caring and sometimes too doting. Enough to live on, no debts, some good friends, loving family who live far enough away to keep up the loving relationship.

Isn't it nice to reap the rewards of a carefully and simply lived life? Way to go, girl.


----------



## Huckleberry (May 27, 2013)

Poor Purl said:


> Go ahead, sue me. Call the cops. If you think it's wrong for anyone to be concerned about someone who has admitted to having brain damage, maybe you're not as good a friend as you like to think.


Poor Purl
amazing how quickly these folks like to threaten with Lawyers.
It shows great weakness.


----------



## Janet Cooke (Aug 14, 2013)

MarilynKnits said:


> Sounds as if you have sound values. I am blessed that I still have my DH in reasonably good condition for his age and a DD who is caring and sometimes too doting. Enough to live on, no debts, some good friends, loving family who live far enough away to keep up the loving relationship.
> 
> Isn't it nice to reap the rewards of a carefully and simply lived life? Way to go, girl.


Thanks and right backatcha!


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## Huckleberry (May 27, 2013)

Cheeky Blighter said:


> God gave us brains for a reason and it was to search for the truth and the truth will set us free.


Cheeky Blighter
THANK YOU. All so true.

Latest chaper in a Catholic Bishop's Life. He is expanding his private Residence to the tune of $ 500.000.00 which includes an Indoor Swimming Pool and Hot Tub. Wonder who he entertains.


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## peacegoddess (Jan 28, 2013)

For some reason this guy thought this would help sales. There is a picture, but it did not copy for this post.


A small marketing company in Waco, TX, was looking to drum up its decal business, so the owner decided to try a tactic that would get some attention. Photographing one of his female employees tied up and crumpled in a heap, he then turned that image into a very realistic tailgating decal, which was then applied to a company truck and ridden around town. 

Hornet Signs' owner Brad Kolb, who came up with idea, told news station KWTX his decal has gotten his business a lot of attention, albeit some of it negative. "I wasn't expecting the reactions we got, nor do we condone this by any means."



It's a curious statement. On the one hand, Kolb says he doesn't condone violence against women, while on the other, he conceived and created an offensive truck decal illustrating exactly that, and admits to enjoying the spike in business it's brought him.

It's not as if the image carries a tagline admonishing abuse against women; instead it's presented without comment, and it's meant to be a jokebecause a woman beaten and tied up is hilarious. 

When the image was posted on the KWTX Facebook page, it received the expected mix of outrage and eye-rolling; some commenters found it horrifying, and others accused critics of lacking "a sense of humor." More wondered how to explain the image to their kids when they're driving around Waco and happen to see it. 

While the Hornet Signs' truck decal is just inescapably awful, it's also right in line with a multitude of other companies who like to illustrate brutality against women, and present it in a very casual way, often as the punchline of a joke. Domestically and abroad, violating women continues to be a popular theme, not just in advertising, but in all forms of pop culture.

The big news isn't that it happened again, it's answering the question, when is it going to stop?


----------



## susanmos2000 (May 10, 2011)

peacegoddess said:


> For some reason this guy thought this would help sales. There is a picture, but it did not copy for this post.
> 
> A small marketing company in Waco, TX, was looking to drum up its decal business, so the owner decided to try a tactic that would get some attention. Photographing one of his female employees tied up and crumpled in a heap, he then turned that image into a very realistic tailgating decal, which was then applied to a company truck and ridden around town.
> 
> ...


This must be it. No comment necessary!


----------



## peacegoddess (Jan 28, 2013)

Who was the poster earlier in this thread that said something to the effect that there is no war on women in the U S?


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## Janet Cooke (Aug 14, 2013)

peacegoddess said:


> Who was the poster earlier in this thread that said something to the effect that there is no war on women in the U S?


Not THE poster, it is pretty much right down the division of values it always is. 
The right claims that there is no war on women, the left is smart enough to notice it.


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## Gerslay (Oct 4, 2011)

peacegoddess said:


> Who was the poster earlier in this thread that said something to the effect that there is no war on women in the U S?


Hmmm, let's see now

The "image" of A woman tied up in the back of a truck
-or-
The "reality" of 55 MILLION aborted babies

Gee, that's a tough one...

The image is sick for sure, the reality is pure evil.

Decide for yourselves where to place your outrage!!!


----------



## Janet Cooke (Aug 14, 2013)

Gerslay said:


> Hmmm, let's see now
> 
> The "image" of A woman tied up in the back of a truck
> -or-
> ...


You already boasted of being a "one note Johnny"; know any ASL? Place your finger on the side of your nose and shift your hand first in one direction and then the other.


----------



## Cindy S (Oct 20, 2013)

Gerslay said:


> Hmmm, let's see now
> 
> The "image" of A woman tied up in the back of a truck
> -or-
> ...


So you have a one track mind and can only be outraged at one thing at a time?


----------



## Poor Purl (Apr 14, 2011)

Huckleberry said:


> Poor Purl
> amazing how quickly these folks like to threaten with Lawyers.
> It shows great weakness.


Huckle, it's amazing how quick they are to threaten, period, all because we're concerned about everyone, not just our own. That's not mere weakness; it shows a divorce from reality.


----------



## Cindy S (Oct 20, 2013)

Poor Purl said:


> Huckle, it's amazing how quick they are to threaten, period, all because we're concerned about everyone, not just our own. That's not mere weakness; it shows a divorce from reality.


 :thumbup: :thumbup: :thumbup:


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## Poor Purl (Apr 14, 2011)

Huckleberry said:


> Cheeky Blighter
> THANK YOU. All so true.
> 
> Latest chaper in a Catholic Bishop's Life. He is expanding his private Residence to the tune of $ 500.000.00 which includes an Indoor Swimming Pool and Hot Tub. Wonder who he entertains.


Angels?


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## Cindy S (Oct 20, 2013)

Poor Purl said:


> Angels?


Or innocent children?


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## knitpresentgifts (May 21, 2013)

Gerslay said:


> I was one of those feminists, a bra-burning child of the 60slove me some Janis Joplin and Bella Abzug! But that war is over and guess what WE WON!
> 
> I agree that a few squirmishes remain but I certainly dont want the government in my bedroom telling me how to live my life nor do I expect the government to pay for my birth control (not that I need it any longer). Its absurd what so-called feminists want today.
> 
> ...


Hi Gerslay!

I'm with you; it _is_ absurd what the Dems/Libs think is the WOW today. I loved the irony of rolling out the charade at the last DNC convention with Fluke begging for payment of her birth control pills while good ole Billy Clinton, the womanizer in Chief, being the keynote speaker to get Obama some votes. (Not to forget the three time vote to remove God from the convention.)

How fun was that? When the Dems roll out the carpet for HillBilly's run at the Presidency, who will be the speaker saying they wished they could have fought for Hill's birth control back in the day? Chelsea or Huma?

Oh, we'll never have a meaningful discussion with these Libs, they are not capable of informed and intelligent debate of hot topics.


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## SQM (Jun 22, 2012)

Hi Ladies of the Left,

I see Land O' Lakes is spreading her nonsense very early this morning.

Sister G - you better show greater love for the women who will be hatching all of those unloved babies you prefer to be on this earth.

As for that poster - we have become so desensitized to violence towards women. I watch Netflix and so many shows make women the chronic victims of serial killers. That is why I loved "Dexter" - he overwhelmingly killed men. Refreshing change.


----------



## Poor Purl (Apr 14, 2011)

peacegoddess said:


> For some reason this guy thought this would help sales. There is a picture, but it did not copy for this post.
> 
> A small marketing company in Waco, TX, was looking to drum up its decal business, so the owner decided to try a tactic that would get some attention. Photographing one of his female employees tied up and crumpled in a heap, he then turned that image into a very realistic tailgating decal, which was then applied to a company truck and ridden around town.
> 
> ...


If it's the picture Susan posted, it's horrible. In fact, it's probably a traffic violation, being so big and so eye-catching that it interferes with movement.

Unfortunately, peacegoddess, the more ground women gain, the more vicious those slams are going to be. See what's happened since we elected a black president (or not totally white one). I'm afraid to think what will happen once we have our first woman president. We still have a very long way to go.


----------



## knitpresentgifts (May 21, 2013)

SQM said:


> We all vote our class interest. We have to assume that her financial situation changed over the years.


Brilliant as I've said similar prior. Does this mean, since presumably you have lots more $ now in your elder years, you, too, vote for your class interest (you vote for conservatives and Repubs now as opposed to your youthful votes for the liberals and Dems)?


----------



## Poor Purl (Apr 14, 2011)

peacegoddess said:


> For some reason this guy thought this would help sales. There is a picture, but it did not copy for this post.


Pictures don't copy the way text does, at least not for KP. You have to download the picture, then go down to "File/picture attachments" and select the ones you want posted. They come out at the end of your post.


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## Janet Cooke (Aug 14, 2013)

knitpresentgifts said:


> Brilliant as I've said similar prior. Does this mean, since presumably you have lots more $ now in your elder years, you, too, vote for your class interest (you vote for conservatives and Repubs now as opposed to your youthful votes for the liberals and Dems)?


You might do better to ask why you would be voting with those people who will bury you in a heartbeat cuz, baby, you are not in their league.


----------



## Poor Purl (Apr 14, 2011)

Janet Cooke said:


> You already boasted of being a "one note Johnny"; know any ASL? Place your finger on the side of your nose and shift your hand first in one direction and then the other.


 :XD: :XD: :XD: :XD: :XD: :XD: :XD:


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## knitpresentgifts (May 21, 2013)

SQM said:


> I am saying that Sister G's politics changed because she may have more money now than when she was younger. We vote our financial interests.


Again, I believe you are not voting for Libs/Dems today! How thoughtful of you.


----------



## Poor Purl (Apr 14, 2011)

Cindy S said:


> Or innocent children?


Post-born, living children? Not a problem.


----------



## knitpresentgifts (May 21, 2013)

Gerslay said:


> No Q...the change happened when the Lord won the battle for my soul and the sanctity of life from conception forward became precious to me. When once I carried the banner for many causes now its just one...pro life. You choose the mother, I choose the child...there's no need to hate one another.


Gerslay, these women Libs have to hate someone in order to survive and get through a day.

BTW: I had the receptionist at my stylist's salon take pictures of him foiling away my gray roots, and cutting and drying my hair. I'll post them next and show you how my "wig" (you know, that these Lib women tell me I wear) looks today. New avatar coming up! I never knew you could dye, cut and dry a wig. :-D

We had so much fun doing the pics, the owner wants to print them up big and perhaps decorate his salon with them. So thanks LWNs for the laughs and idea! (I'll not show those pics of my stylist's or my features, just the hair, baby, just the hair!)


----------



## SQM (Jun 22, 2012)

knitpresentgifts said:


> Brilliant as I've said similar prior. Does this mean, since presumably you have lots more $ now in your elder years, you, too, vote for your class interest (you vote for conservatives and Repubs now as opposed to your youthful votes for the liberals and Dems)?


There is a logical fallacy in the above statement. Who can be the first to find it?


----------



## Cindy S (Oct 20, 2013)

knitpresentgifts said:


> Gerslay, these women Libs have to hate someone in order to survive and get through a day.


Pot meet kettle!


----------



## Poor Purl (Apr 14, 2011)

SQM said:


> There is a logical fallacy in the above statement. Who can be the first to find it?


Is it that she thinks she's in your class? No way.


----------



## knitpresentgifts (May 21, 2013)

Here's the foiling:


photos courtesy of E.


----------



## knitpresentgifts (May 21, 2013)

Janet Cooke said:


> Well, so long as I have decided to break the ice I am going to say this.
> 
> You are right, I don't work very hard. I do just what I want to do. I earned that by making good choices.
> I may not be rich, I am secure. Best of all, I have love in my life.
> ...


You don't work at all presently is what you've told us sweetie; you're retired from a government job with a pension. Sounds to me there is a war on employment, not women, as you like to suggest.

Because you have your adult daughter and SIL and their child living in your home and until yesterday, your adult son who couldn't find a job nor had a car to drive to work so you were helping him with that as well.

So, where is the war focused if not on the middle class not having jobs available to them and gainful employment; because in your own life four adults must share one home in order to make ends meet?


----------



## knitpresentgifts (May 21, 2013)

Janet Cooke said:


> You might do better to ask why you would be voting with those people who will bury you in a heartbeat cuz, baby, you are not in their league.


What league is that, Janet?  Please be clear if you can.


----------



## Cindy S (Oct 20, 2013)

knitpresentgifts said:


> Here's the foiling:
> 
> photos courtesy of E.


My day can now go along happily, knowing that you got your hair done. Thank you, I was so dreading the rest of the day!!


----------



## knitpresentgifts (May 21, 2013)

SQM said:


> There is a logical fallacy in the above statement. Who can be the first to find it?


I knew it. You just say the words, but don't follow through in your own actions. You vote your purse as well. Nice to know SQM.

P.S. I know what you are questioning, but also know you don't mean it "as I said prior."

Love ya Sister Q.


----------



## MaidInBedlam (Jul 24, 2012)

Whether women should have complete freedom to choose or reject abortion is an issue none of us will ever settle here. The variety and division in beliefs we have won't permit any kind of general agreement. I happen to believe that a unique human being is created at the moment of conception. I also know that unique human being can't survive outside of its mother's womb until a certain point in its life.

Wherever there is sufficient evidence of how humans have lived, there is evidence that women have sought and used abortifacients. There are always reasons for any particular woman to want and achieve the end to a pregnancy. We would all do well to remember this when we discuss abortion. We would also do well to remember that this is not an ideal world.

In an ideal world, if a woman couldn't raise a child, there would always be someone willing to take on that responsibility. The so-called pro-life people don't address what happens to an unwanted child. They don't step up and care for unwanted children. When those of you who are pro-life (what a stupid term...) can prove that you are already helping to care for unwanted children in some significant way, then you can talk about restricting abortion. Until then, I suggest you get busy helping to give unwanted children the kind of life every person deserves.



Lkholcomb said:


> Sadly I have known people who do very strongly believe this. Amazingly even though they quote opinions about the woman not surviving even with abortion or that they can make both of them survive the science behind it is missing. I know many women who have sadly had to have abortions or they would have died long before the fetus would be at a viable stage. Since it was a pregnancy disease it would be "cured" by an abortion. Many of these are women who desperately wanted a child, some who had gone to great lengths to even get pregnant. It is a sad situation and not one that a person who has never had to face should be passing quick judgements over.
> 
> I wonder though if these same people are opposed to organ donation? Organs are procured while the person is still on life support, but is brain dead. Very early in pregnancy there is no brain to be tested to check for brain signals and as far as I know there has been no EEG's performed to prove that a fetus is in fact brain functioning or when it begins. So it would follow that the same rules would apply for brain dead people as it applied to an early pregnancy. And reaction to pain does not denote a thinking response. Pain reaction is a reflex and even people who are brain dead react to pain (how they react is an indication of how brain damaged or functioning they are).


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## knitpresentgifts (May 21, 2013)

Cindy S said:


> My day can now go along happily, knowing that you got your hair done. Thank you, I was so dreading the rest of the day!!


You're welcome Kettle. Some, like Huck and Vocal J. Blighter learn the truth best with pics and not struggling instead to understand the written word.

Those gals I mentioned think my hair is a wig - can you imagine their stupidity?


----------



## SQM (Jun 22, 2012)

KPN - your hair is gorgeous. Now what is underneath it is a different story.


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## knitpresentgifts (May 21, 2013)

SQM said:


> KPN - your hair is gorgeous. Now what is underneath it is a different story.


Not sure who you are addressing but I sure hope you like them.


----------



## MarilynKnits (Aug 30, 2011)

KPG wrote "Gerslay, these women Libs have to hate someone in order to survive and get through a day."

Poor dear doesn't understand that moderate thinkers do not go to the extreme of hating. Those of us in the middle of the bell curve truly pity the "Johnny One-Notes" who cannot see nuances and do not have the perspicacity to make a well thought out decision. Was it Gilbert & Sullivan who wrote: "She is more to be pitied than censured"? 

Labeling people is a short cut in thinking. But people who blindly follow a party line may be afraid to think.

As far as brutality toward women, I think it is the men who doubt their own manhood who are the worst offenders. In my social circles the husbands of my friends and my husband's friends are not afraid of women. They conduct their lives respecting people for their goodness, their intelligence, their humanity, not by gender or financial status. The bullies I have encountered try to compensate for their own shortcomings.

And that goes for the women who are trying to bully others into doing and thinking as they do and think. If they had true belief in their convictions they would live their lives and not need to make others conform to their way of thinking to validate them.


----------



## SQM (Jun 22, 2012)

knitpresentgifts said:


> Not sure who you are addressing but I sure hope you like them.


Sorry I got your initials wrong. However. I got the sentiment right.


----------



## cookiequeen (Jun 15, 2011)

knitpresentgifts said:


> Here's the foiling:
> 
> photos courtesy of E.


Please give it a rest!!!

"For every one who exalts himself will be humbled, and he who humbles himself will be exalted."


----------



## cookiequeen (Jun 15, 2011)

knitpresentgifts said:


> You're welcome Kettle. Some, like Huck and Vocal J. Blighter learn the truth best with pics and not struggling instead to understand the written word.
> 
> Those gals I mentioned think my hair is a wig - can you imagine their stupidity?


Here we go again. Do you have any impulse control whatsoever?


----------



## Janet Cooke (Aug 14, 2013)

alcameron said:


> Please give it a rest!!!
> 
> "For every one who exalts himself will be humbled, and he who humbles himself will be exalted."


First person I ever read brag about having to have her hair colored. It is a part of aging. Many females do it until we learn to accept ourselves in our natural state. I LOVE every one of my white hairs blending with the brown.


----------



## cookiequeen (Jun 15, 2011)

Janet Cooke said:


> First person I ever read brag about having to have her hair colored. It is a part of aging. Many females do it until we learn to accept ourselves in our natural state. I LOVE every one of my white hairs blending with the brown.


Me, too.


----------



## cookiequeen (Jun 15, 2011)

knitpresentgifts said:


> Hi Gerslay!
> 
> I'm with you; it _is_ absurd what the Dems/Libs think is the WOW today. I loved the irony of rolling out the charade at the last DNC convention with Fluke begging for payment of her birth control pills while good ole Billy Clinton, the womanizer in Chief, being the keynote speaker to get Obama some votes. (Not to forget the three time vote to remove God from the convention.)
> 
> ...


Another example of Christian behavior.


----------



## Cindy S (Oct 20, 2013)

Janet Cooke said:


> First person I ever read brag about having to have her hair colored. It is a part of aging. Many females do it until we learn to accept ourselves in our natural state. I LOVE every one of my white hairs blending with the brown.


 :thumbup: :thumbup: :thumbup: Who the heck has time for it anyway? I would rather spend my time and money volunteering at the battered women's shelter or the children's shelter. But to each their own, as they say!


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## SQM (Jun 22, 2012)

Cooke, I pictured you a dark blonde with a pony tail. I am off now to the haircutter's to get the color cut out. What a waste of time and money. Another war on women aimed at those of us of a certain age - to look young. Blah!

I am closing in on my 1000th posting. How can we celebrate this utterly meaningful event?

Should I post Boris giving me my pixie cut?


----------



## Janet Cooke (Aug 14, 2013)

alcameron said:


> Another example of Christian behavior.


This display is just as classy as Miley Cyrus' modeling of Bill's indiscretion during his years in the White House and just about as mature.


----------



## Gerslay (Oct 4, 2011)

knitpresentgifts said:


> Hi Gerslay!
> 
> I'm with you; it _is_ absurd what the Dems/Libs think is the WOW today. I loved the irony of rolling out the charade at the last DNC convention with Fluke begging for payment of her birth control pills while good ole Billy Clinton, the womanizer in Chief, being the keynote speaker to get Obama some votes. (Not to forget the three time vote to remove God from the convention.)
> 
> ...


Morning KPG!

Is that your new hairdo? It is GORGEOUS! I love the color...and the cut is to die for!

BRAVO!!!

(Ditto on the subject matter, BTW)


----------



## Gerslay (Oct 4, 2011)

knitpresentgifts said:


> Here's the foiling:
> photos courtesy of E.


I agree, you were long overdue for a cut.

The finale is awesome...you got it going on, kid!

(I call you 'kid' because I didn't spot a gray hair in all your crowning glory!)

:thumbup: :thumbup: :thumbup:


----------



## Gerslay (Oct 4, 2011)

Hey KPG...
Post something often so I can look at your gorgeous head of hair without having to page back all the time ... pretty please?
xoxo


----------



## MarilynKnits (Aug 30, 2011)

Hey Gerslay, Were you a suck up as a kid, too?

syc·o·phan·tic
&#716;sik&#601;&#712;fantik/
adjective
adjective: sycophantic

1.
behaving or done in an obsequious way in order to gain advantage.
"a sycophantic interview"
synonyms:	obsequious, servile, subservient, deferential, groveling, toadying, fawning, flattering, ingratiating, cringing, unctuous, slavish


----------



## rocky1991 (May 8, 2011)

Gerslay said:


> Hey KPG...
> Post something often so I can look at your gorgeous head of hair without having to page back all the time ... pretty please?
> xoxo


Are you a teenager? Groupie? Can you say "Grow up"?


----------



## Cindy S (Oct 20, 2013)

MarilynKnits said:


> Hey Gerslay, Were you a suck up as a kid, too?
> 
> syc·o·phan·tic
> ˌsikəˈfantik/
> ...


Groveling is a perfect description, thank you!


----------



## GrannyGoode (Oct 9, 2011)

Good morning, *MaidInBedlam,*

Your thoughts are well taken for serious consideration. We could all benefit by careful reflection on your solid points.

There is only one thing I would add, or perhaps alter, while not attempting to offend in any way, for perhaps you are not aware of what I am about to say.

The church to which I belong, The Church of Jesus Christ of Latter-day Saints -- we are commonly nicknamed Mormons -- is VERY compassionately active and involved in assisting young ladies of whatever religious persuasion (or no religious persuasion) during their difficult and oftentimes agonizing moments of unwedded pregnancy, regardless of the circumstances which resulted in pregnancy. No need to enumerate here the myriad of situations a young lady may face which brings her to the point of deciding whether to abort or not, and whether to keep the child or opt for adoption of her child to a loving couple.

My only purpose in mentioning all this is to let you and the other KPers here know that the LDS Church cares very much for each young lady in such circumstances, for the worth of souls is great in the eyes of our Heavenly Father. The Church truly respects each young lady as a daughter of God and is committed to assisting her and her child in any capacity they can, short of abortion for the sake of convenience.

Please note the last part of the last sentence I just wrote. In cases of rape or incest, or where the mother-to-be's health is in danger, the LDS Church will lovingly counsel the young lady in any manner they can should she desire such counsel and assistance, including abortion. The young lady also needs not feel guilty for her decision to abort, should she go that route.

I have been a Latter-day Saint since the age of fourteen. I am now sixty-five; I know whereof I speak. I know what the Church teaches. You are correct in stating that we do not live in an ideal world. Yet there are persons who give their level best in genuine Christlike compassion to help others. What more can any of us expect in this less than stellar human society?



MaidInBedlam said:


> Whether women should have complete freedom to choose or reject abortion is an issue none of us will ever settle here. The variety and division in beliefs we have won't permit any kind of general agreement. I happen to believe that a unique human being is created at the moment of conception. I also know that unique human being can't survive outside of its mother's womb until a certain point in its life.
> 
> Wherever there is sufficient evidence of how humans have lived, there is evidence that women have sought and used abortifacients. There are always reasons for any particular woman to want and achieve the end to a pregnancy. We would all do well to remember this when we discuss abortion. We would also do well to remember that this is not an ideal world.
> 
> In an ideal world, if a woman couldn't raise a child, there would always be someone willing to take on that responsibility. The so-called pro-life people don't address what happens to an unwanted child. They don't step up and care for unwanted children. When those of you who are pro-life (what a stupid term...) can prove that you are already helping to care for unwanted children in some significant way, then you can talk about restricting abortion. Until then, I suggest you get busy helping to give unwanted children the kind of life every person deserves.


----------



## Poor Purl (Apr 14, 2011)

MarilynKnits said:


> KPG wrote "Gerslay, these women Libs have to hate someone in order to survive and get through a day."
> 
> Poor dear doesn't understand that moderate thinkers do not go to the extreme of hating. Those of us in the middle of the bell curve truly pity the "Johnny One-Notes" who cannot see nuances and do not have the perspicacity to make a well thought out decision. Was it Gilbert & Sullivan who wrote: "She is more to be pitied than censured"?
> 
> ...


 :thumbup: :thumbup: :thumbup: :thumbup: :thumbup:


----------



## knitpresentgifts (May 21, 2013)

Gerslay said:


> Morning KPG!
> 
> Is that your new hairdo? It is GORGEOUS! I love the color...and the cut is to die for!
> 
> ...


Thank you, same "do" just "done" again. :-D

So who do you think will be the keynote speaker on the faux WOW scandal on the Dem side for 2016? Anyone worth listening to?

I think I'd prefer to hear a Repub or intelligent someone talk to an empty chair again. _That_ speech was memorable and worth listening to!


----------



## Poor Purl (Apr 14, 2011)

alcameron said:


> Me, too.


Then there are at least 3 of us. I've always felt that sitting in a hair salon or beauty parlor was a huge waste of time.


----------



## knitpresentgifts (May 21, 2013)

Gerslay said:


> I agree, you were long overdue for a cut.
> 
> The finale is awesome...you got it going on, kid!
> 
> ...


Hello, no gray, Gerslay? That's because the foiling at the crown did its job, silly.

The hair color is all mine (first pic = shows air dried hair) except for what is changed by the foil coloring so it will match the rest  you crack me up.


----------



## susanmos2000 (May 10, 2011)

knitpresentgifts said:


> You're welcome Kettle. Some, like Huck and Vocal J. Blighter learn the truth best with pics and not struggling instead to understand the written word.


So true, KPG (at least in your case). How does this one grab you? Perhaps you can start a new fashion among the righties.


----------



## Janet Cooke (Aug 14, 2013)

GrannyGoode said:


> Good morning, *MaidInBedlam,*
> 
> Your thoughts are well taken for serious consideration. We could all benefit by careful reflection on your solid points.
> 
> ...


----------



## knitpresentgifts (May 21, 2013)

SQM said:


> Cooke, I pictured you a dark blonde with a pony tail. I am off now to the haircutter's to get the color cut out. What a waste of time and money. Another war on women aimed at those of us of a certain age - to look young. Blah!
> 
> I am closing in on my 1000th posting. How can we celebrate this utterly meaningful event?
> 
> Should I post Boris giving me my pixie cut?


Don't expose Boris, but do show your pixie cut!


----------



## Poor Purl (Apr 14, 2011)

MarilynKnits said:


> Hey Gerslay, Were you a suck up as a kid, too?
> 
> syc·o·phan·tic
> ˌsikəˈfantik/
> ...


 :XD: :XD: :XD: :XD: :XD:


----------



## knitpresentgifts (May 21, 2013)

Gerslay said:


> Hey KPG...
> Post something often so I can look at your gorgeous head of hair without having to page back all the time ... pretty please?
> xoxo


O.. K . :-D


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## lovethelake (Apr 6, 2011)

Poor Purl said:


> Go ahead, sue me. Call the cops. If you think it's wrong for anyone to be concerned about someone who has admitted to having brain damage, maybe you're not as good a friend as you like to think.


Hilarious, there is not one of Yarnie's true friends that think you are a little bit sincere. But according to her emails, she and I are finding your comments more fun than watching a 'Saturday Night Live' performance.


----------



## Knitted by Nan (Aug 3, 2013)

alcameron said:


> Please give it a rest!!!
> 
> "For every one who exalts himself will be humbled, and he who humbles himself will be exalted."


I was thinking "Vanity, thy name be woman" or "Pride comes before a fall".

I would love to take a photo of my son's hair. I think that would be a photo of someone's hair we could ooh and aah over. His hair hangs to below his waist in beautiful red/golden ringlets. Natural, no perms, dyes, etc. He visits the hairdresser about once every two years to have a few inches snipped from the bottom. The only thing, he hates having his photo taken and I am a little slow with the ipad, unlatching the cover over the photo lens, aiming the camera, etc. But, he has hair to die for. He is 39 years old now, my baby.


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## lovethelake (Apr 6, 2011)

Janet Cooke said:


> You know, I was going to pass your little rants by just because you are so well educated I am sure that you can't truly understand Americanspeak.
> Those in the field learn very early in training to use non-definitive terms such as seems to be, appears and *sounds like*.
> TheYarnLady, the person you couldn't even name, did not appear to be acting silly. Isn't it odd that her "enemies" could sense distress and her pals couldn't be bothered saying anything comforting in public?


It appears that you are still a fool. Americanspeak is that like Ebonics?


----------



## Poor Purl (Apr 14, 2011)

lovethelake said:


> Hilarious, there is not one of Yarnie's true friends that think you are a little bit sincere. But according to her emails, she and I are finding your comments more fun than watching a 'Saturday Night Live' performance.


Do I care? No.


----------



## VocalLisa (Jan 4, 2014)

Gerslay said:


> Your passivity was that you dodged the question in that you rail against racism wherever you find it EXCEPT when its on your side of the aisle.


I rail against it when it's on "my side of the isle", I just don't rail against the RW misinterpretation of what racism is or isn't.

You seem to want your bigotries to be understood as "just another benign opinion."

For instance, it's fine if you believe that homosexuality is not right _FOR YOU_. But when you start advocating laws that prevent others from getting married etc... then that's bigotry.

And it's NOT "religious intolerance" to not allow you to foist your bigotry upon others in general society or in general commerce.

When it comes to Margaret Sanger, I didn't pull any switcheroo, I told the truth. It was the conservatives of that age that were into eugenics. Sanger was liberal when it came to birth control etc...but her ideas regarding eugenics came directly from the CONSERVATIVE "intellectuals" at the time. That's simply the truth of the matter.

Modern conservative ideology regarding not helping the poor and the indigent IS EUGENICS. When you call people "takers" and think they shouldn't have access to health care or food stamps ... THAT IS A FORM OF EUGENICS.

So, you're grossly hypocritical if you say you're against Eugenics, because Conservative political ideology when it comes to social issues and the poor and indigent IS THE EPITOME OF EUGENICS.

Your whole ideology is basically that if people can't/won't/don't pull themselves up by their own bootstraps, then it's better for society if we don't help them and just let them die off.

Conservatism IS essentially a form of Eugenics.


----------



## soloweygirl (Jun 9, 2012)

Poor Purl said:


> Then there are at least 3 of us. I've always felt that sitting in a hair salon or beauty parlor was a huge waste of time.


Then we should thank you for not wasting the talents of the hairdresser that was unfortunate enough to have you as a customer.


----------



## GrannyGoode (Oct 9, 2011)

Hello Janet,

I was referring to a young, unmarried pregnant girl (aka 'a girl in trouble,' the old-fashioned vernacular), that's all. Do you wish to spar over semantics? You shall have to take it elsewhere. Have a nice day. 



Janet Cooke said:


> GrannyGoode said:
> 
> 
> > Good morning, *MaidInBedlam,*
> ...


----------



## MarilynKnits (Aug 30, 2011)

Wow, you were able to translate your meows into English. Hope you didn't break any claws on the keyboard.

I too have better things to do than spend hours having my hair fussed with. And I am not intimidated by having gray hair. The people who love me love me, not an outer shell that tries to convey itself as a glamor b***h.



soloweygirl said:


> Then we should thank you for not wasting the talents of the hairdresser that was unfortunate enough to have you as a customer.


----------



## peacegoddess (Jan 28, 2013)

Yes the reality of women being subjected to violence is gruesome. The reality of rape of young women by football stars and their supposed military comrades in arms is gruesome, the reality of the infant mortality rate in the U S is gruesome. 

I understand many people object to abortions and I respect their decision not to have one.


----------



## Gerslay (Oct 4, 2011)

VocalLisa said:


> I rail against it when it's on "my side of the isle", I just don't rail against the RW misinterpretation of what racism is or isn't.
> 
> You seem to want your bigotries to be understood as "just another benign opinion."
> 
> ...


I bet it took you a long time to put that diatribe together...had to dig out your dictionary and all?

:thumbdown:


----------



## VocalLisa (Jan 4, 2014)

SQM said:


> I thought the final word was that indeed Sanger had some serious flaws but that Planned Parenthood is not Sanger and is an ally to women across the country who need its services.
> 
> Sister G - quit that argument. It is stale already and we have moved on.
> 
> Bring up another issue.


Yes, that's basically the final word. Gerri just can't let it go because she was proven wrong. She wanted to cast Sanger as some sort of liberal monster because of Eugenics, but if you're aware of the context of history at the time, you then understand she adopted those "flaws" from the CONSERVATIVES of that era.

Yes, essentially Sanger ULTIMATELY did some wonderful things for women in this country, AND Sanger had serious flaws.

Those flaws HAVE NOT transferred over to Planned Parenthood, _BUT the basic thought process of devaluing people who struggle in society and leaving them to hang out to dry IS alive and well in the GOP today._

That devaluing of imperfect human beings is the basis for Eugenics and it's the basis of RW ideology TODAY.


----------



## Gerslay (Oct 4, 2011)

Vocal Lisa:

The so-called 'warning' that you gave me in a PM dated Feb 13, 2014 has no power. No person has the authority to prohibit personal information being shared about anyone other than themselves unless that person is acting as agent to the party in question. 

Since you have stated, publicly and privately, that you are not JB you must therefore attest to the fact that you are acting on her behalf as her agent. However, that would be impossible since you also claim, publicly, that you dont even know JB.

Since you are neither of the above then your warning to me is nothing more than vapor and YOU have in fact threatened ME (for the THIRD TIME) and legal action could be taken against YOU.

P.S. I'll be glad to post your private warning and all your previous public posts in case you need a reminder of what youve actually claimed.


----------



## VocalLisa (Jan 4, 2014)

Gerslay said:


> I bet it took you a long time to put that diatribe together...had to dig out your dictionary and all?
> 
> :thumbdown:


No diatribe at all. Just a simple statement of facts. Conservatism IS the closest thing we have to Eugenics in our political culture today.


----------



## VocalLisa (Jan 4, 2014)

Gerslay said:


> Vocal Lisa:
> 
> The so-called 'warning' that you gave me in a PM dated Feb 13, 2014 has no power. No person has the authority to prohibit personal information being shared about anyone other than themselves unless that person is acting as agent to the party in question.
> 
> ...


Geeze, we were talking about Sanger.

Trying to change the subject because you were proven wrong AGAIN I see.

Again. I put up a picture of a house and of some women with blurred out faces and provided no information about them whatsoever.

It's stupid YOU who connected those things to YOU.

Oh, you can post the "private warning" if you want. I only sent it via PM because there'd be proof that you read the warning and then you couldn't claim ignorance.



> No person has the authority to prohibit personal information being shared about anyone other than themselves unless that person is acting as agent to the party in question.


True, but since you're aware I know exactly who you are and where you live, I'd have no problem sharing that with the party who might want to sue you. Including the screenshots of the fact you opened the PM, which will prevent you from claiming ignorance on the matter. And all the snarky defamation style posts you and your friends were making about her.


----------



## Gerslay (Oct 4, 2011)

VocalLisa said:


> True, but since you're aware I know exactly who you are and where you live, I'd have no problem sharing that with the party who might want to sue you. Including the screenshots of the fact you opened the PM, which will prevent you from claiming ignorance on the matter. And all the snarky defamation style posts you and your friends were making about her.


Very interesting...so you do know and/or are who you claim not to be. In other words, you're a liar!


----------



## Gerslay (Oct 4, 2011)

VocalLisa said:


> True, but since you're aware I know exactly who you are and where you live, I'd have no problem sharing that with the party who might want to sue you. Including the screenshots of the fact you opened the PM, which will prevent you from claiming ignorance on the matter. And all the snarky defamation style posts you and your friends were making about her.


Its your stupid vanity that brought this on!


----------



## Janet Cooke (Aug 14, 2013)

lovethelake said:


> Hilarious, there is not one of Yarnie's true friends that think you are a little bit sincere. But according to her emails, she and I are finding your comments more fun than watching a 'Saturday Night Live' performance.


She certainly had me fooled, that won't happen again. I was hoping that there was one of you who fell on the normal range of EQ. 
fool me once...


----------



## knitpresentgifts (May 21, 2013)

soloweygirl said:


> Then we should thank you for not wasting the talents of the hairdresser that was unfortunate enough to have you as a customer.


She would have been a mean and demanding customer and lousy tipper anyway; good that she stayed away.

Unfortunate though, that PoorPurl has to post an image of someone else instead of herself in her avatar while insulting any of us who do show actual representations of ourselves.


----------



## Gerslay (Oct 4, 2011)

VocalLisa said:


> True, but since you're aware I know exactly who you are and where you live, I'd have no problem sharing that with the party who might want to sue you. Including the screenshots of the fact you opened the PM, which will prevent you from claiming ignorance on the matter. And all the snarky defamation style posts you and your friends were making about her.


And vice versa... I know exactly who you are and where you live..just so we understand one another!


----------



## Janet Cooke (Aug 14, 2013)

knitpresentgifts said:


> She would have been a mean and demanding customer and lousy tipper anyway; good that she stayed away.
> 
> Unfortunate though, that PoorPurl has to post an image of someone else instead of herself though in her avatar while insulting any of us who do show actual representations of ourselves.


You really should talk to your stylist if that color is as pink as it looks in the pictures.


----------



## Janet Cooke (Aug 14, 2013)

VocalLisa said:


> No diatribe at all. Just a simple statement of facts. Conservatism IS the closest thing we have to Eugenics in our political culture today.


I hadn't really looked at it in that light, VocalLisa, thanks for opening my eyes.


----------



## knitpresentgifts (May 21, 2013)

Gerslay said:


> I bet it took you a long time to put that diatribe together...had to dig out your dictionary and all?
> 
> :thumbdown:


 :thumbup: I'm still waiting to hear from Janet on how she thinks there is a war on women but not on middle-class Americans.

Janet is the perfect example of a MC family living the reality of the failure of the ideals and policies of our present Administration and President. Until another responsible President and Admin is in place, the majority of Americans no longer have the American Dream but only a survival dream in their sights.


----------



## Janet Cooke (Aug 14, 2013)

GrannyGoode said:


> Hello Janet,
> 
> I was referring to a young, unmarried pregnant girl (aka 'a girl in trouble,' the old-fashioned vernacular), that's all. Do you wish to spar over semantics? You shall have to take it elsewhere. Have a nice day.


It seems to me that you have been needing a taste of your own haughtiness for a week or so.


----------



## susanmos2000 (May 10, 2011)

knitpresentgifts said:


> Janet is the perfect example of a MC family living the reality of the failure of the ideals and results of our present Administration and President with no hope in sight until another takes his place as the majority of American no longer have the American Dream but only survival in their sights.


Sounds like the buzz saw is making a guest appearance.

_brum-brum-brum-brum-brrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrr _

Yowzah! Talk about noise pollution.


----------



## lovethelake (Apr 6, 2011)

Poor Purl said:


> Do I care? No.


You must, or you would not have commented.

I think I hear the plinking of your nerve


----------



## knitpresentgifts (May 21, 2013)

Gerslay said:


> Very interesting...so you do know and/or are who you claim not to be. In other words, you're a liar!


That's obvious.


----------



## knitpresentgifts (May 21, 2013)

Janet Cooke said:


> You really should talk to your stylist if that color is as pink as it looks in the pictures.


Has your adult son moved out yet? What color car did he buy?

You might want to buy yourself a good monitor if my hair color looks pink on yours.


----------



## SQM (Jun 22, 2012)

KPG who I will now refer to as KGB - why are you so relentlessly rude?


----------



## Janet Cooke (Aug 14, 2013)

knitpresentgifts said:


> Has your adult son moved out yet? What color car did he buy?
> 
> You might want to buy yourself a good monitor if my hair color looks pink on yours.


No, and why would you care?
What color is the car you bought?
Just curious, that little dig... does that mean that if your adult child needed support and financial help from family in the middle of a major recession you wouldn't offer that help? Cuz that is certainly what those jibes imply.


----------



## Poor Purl (Apr 14, 2011)

soloweygirl said:


> Then we should thank you for not wasting the talents of the hairdresser that was unfortunate enough to have you as a customer.


Just what kind of bug was it that seems to have crawled up your a$$? It probably stings.


----------



## Janet Cooke (Aug 14, 2013)

Poor Purl said:


> Just what kind of bug was it that seems to have crawled up your a$$? It probably stings.


She may very well like it.


----------



## Poor Purl (Apr 14, 2011)

Marilyn, have I ever told you that I love you? Because I do (not that there's anything wrong with it).



MarilynKnits said:


> Wow, you were able to translate your meows into English. Hope you didn't break any claws on the keyboard.
> 
> I too have better things to do than spend hours having my hair fussed with. And I am not intimidated by having gray hair. The people who love me love me, not an outer shell that tries to convey itself as a glamor b***h.


----------



## knitpresentgifts (May 21, 2013)

Janet Cooke said:


> No, and why would you care?
> What color is the car you bought?


You care about my hair color, I'm was only mildly curious about what color car your son bought and being conversational.

You should consider buying yourself an Apple computer - that brand offers the best color resolutions on monitors/computers.

BTW: What league am I in? You don't answer many questions.


----------



## Gerslay (Oct 4, 2011)

knitpresentgifts said:


> :thumbup: I'm still waiting to hear from Janet on how she thinks there is a war on women but not on middle-class Americans. .


The war is always and only on the middle class:
The lower incomes have their subsidies...
The upper incomes have their loopholes...
Its only the middle class that pays for everything!


----------



## Poor Purl (Apr 14, 2011)

lovethelake said:


> You must, or you would not have commented.
> 
> I think I hear the plinking of your nerve


Of course I commented. I comment on everything that's addressed to me, as long as it's from someone whose posts I read.

What you hear is probably the buzzing of that insect that's headed in the direction of your colon as we speak.


----------



## Gerslay (Oct 4, 2011)

Poor Purl said:


> Of course I commented. I comment on everything that's addressed to me, as long as it's from someone whose posts I read.
> 
> What you hear is probably the buzzing of that insect that's headed in the direction of your colon as we speak.


You are a disgusting bully!


----------



## Poor Purl (Apr 14, 2011)

Poor Purl said:


> Just what kind of bug was it that seems to have crawled up your a$$? It probably stings.





Janet Cooke said:


> She may very well like it.


I have no doubt that she does.


----------



## VocalLisa (Jan 4, 2014)

Gerslay said:


> Just catching up with all the slams against me...I'll be finished in a sec.


There she goes again with the whiny martyrdom. You're no more "slammed" than you slam everyone else.

If you're gonna choose to be a witch, then you need to accept that you will be witched-back at in return.


----------



## Poor Purl (Apr 14, 2011)

Gerslay said:


> You are a disgusting bully!


How am I a bully? Did I throw her on the ground and steal her lunch money?

She said something nasty to me. I responded in kind. If she hadn't addressed anything to me, I wouldn't have sought her out to "bully" her.

And, Guernsey, disgust is in the eye of the beholder.


----------



## Poor Purl (Apr 14, 2011)

VocalLisa said:


> There she goes again with the whiny martyrdom. You're no more "slammed" than you slam everyone else.
> 
> If you're gonna choose to be a witch, then you need to accept that you will be witched-back at in return.


They don't seem to see that. They will say anything they feel like, no matter how insulting it is, and then whine about being bullied or slammed if they're answered in kind.


----------



## VocalLisa (Jan 4, 2014)

Gerslay said:


> How about honor killings in India?
> Or forced abortions in China?
> Or lack of education in Pakistan?
> 
> How about something real instead of the palaver that fems in this country think are important?


As long as we fail to adequately address the issues women have here, we have NO MORAL AUTHORITY to address the issues elsewhere.

How about the "fems" in this country maintain and improve the conditions here.

Sorry sweetie but it IS important that women not be forced into being raped by "Governor Ultrasounds".

It IS important that the government not be allowed to force women into unwanted gestation and childbirth or other medical procedures against her will.

It IS important that we get TRULY equal pay.

It IS important that we stop marginalizing the high degree of domestic abuse against women in this county.

And addressing those issues and more in this country does not prevent us from being active for women's rights in India, China and Pakistan.


----------



## VocalLisa (Jan 4, 2014)

SQM said:


> Okay Sister G. I think the feminists here would be happy to discuss any of your issues.
> 
> However Sister.....
> 
> ...


Exactly! And those women paved the way IN SPITE of women like Gerri who tend to argue AGAINST women's best interests. Arguments such as "_we should ignore our own issues and be thankful we're not Pakistani_" - type of ignorant, shallow self-defeating arguments.

I GUARANTEE you she's gonna claim that she was some sort of bra-burning feminist "back in the day".

But those who really were know about the "wannabes" back then. And they "grow up" and are stupid enough to think the "war was won" are the kind of women who did little more than let their husbands support them and developed no real life of their own in the outside world. They have NO IDEA what it has been like out there in the real world.

There is OF COURSE, nothing wrong with staying home and raising a family and not working outside of the home. It IS one of the toughest, most important jobs in the world to raise a family.

However, women who have done so, don't know as much about what it's like for women who haven't had the blessings to make that kind of "choice". They THINK they do, but they don't, and they really don't have the authority to speak about how the "war was won" when they really didn't have to "fight" out there in the mainstream man's-world.

Just like women who haven't had and raised children can't COMPLETELY understand what it's like to be a parent.


----------



## Janet Cooke (Aug 14, 2013)

knitpresentgifts said:


> You care about my hair color, I'm was only mildly curious about what color car your son bought and being conversational.
> 
> You should consider buying yourself an Apple computer - that brand offers the best color resolutions on monitors/computers.
> 
> BTW: What league am I in? You don't answer many questions.


I don't answer questions when they are boring, you don't answer questions when they are about values. 
<shrug>


----------



## knitpresentgifts (May 21, 2013)

lovethelake said:


> You must, or you would not have commented.
> 
> I think I hear the plinking of your nerve


Hey, LTL. It is amazing! Poor Purl responded to you even though she claims she only responds to the posts specifically addressed to her *and* she reads those posts. You didn't address PP, and I believe PP has said she no longer reads your posts, and yet PP had to have read yours recently in order to respond to you twice.

I think she's fibbing . :-D


----------



## VocalLisa (Jan 4, 2014)

Poor Purl said:


> So much for eugenics. The Hapsburgs had no chins, like Mitch McConnell.


----------



## Poor Purl (Apr 14, 2011)

VocalLisa said:


> As long as we fail to adequately address the issues women have here, we have NO MORAL AUTHORITY to address the issues elsewhere.
> 
> How about the "fems" in this country maintain and improve the conditions here.
> 
> ...


----------



## knitpresentgifts (May 21, 2013)

Janet Cooke said:


> I don't answer questions when they are boring, you don't answer questions when they are about values.
> <shrug>


So the war on you and your adult children and unemployment for Americans and the war on the middle class is boring? Thanks for clarifying your value system for me.

The color of the car I bought is of no value to me or you unless you wish to buy my car, and I wish to sell it to you for a fee. Perhaps, then, the color is of value.

What other question did you ask of me about values that I didn't answer?

I asked you what "league you said I was a part of" that "league" you placed a "value" on. You cannot even answer your own question posed to me.

Of what value, then, are you?


----------



## VocalLisa (Jan 4, 2014)

knitpresentgifts said:


> So the war on you and your adult children and unemployment for Americans and the war on the middle class is boring? ?


When you ever have something of value to say on those topics let us know. So far, it hasn't happened.

In the meantime, all you, Cousin It, wants to do is talk about your fur because people who focus on their hair so much usually have no other attractive physical attributes.


----------



## Janet Cooke (Aug 14, 2013)

knitpresentgifts said:


> Hey, LTL. It is amazing! Poor Purl responded to you even though she claims she only responds to the posts specifically addressed to her *and* she reads those posts. You didn't address PP, and I believe PP has said she no longer reads your posts, and yet PP had to have read yours recently in order to respond to you twice.
> 
> I think she's fibbing . :-D


We have all said at one time or another that we are not going to, do not , will not, shall not... read and/or respond. 
We have all repeatedly gone back on those desires and pledges. 
We just had an exchange, both of us have said that we were not going to read or speak of the other's posts.

So, another values question for ya, how are you on any plane that is higher than the woman you just said you think is fibbing?


----------



## VocalLisa (Jan 4, 2014)

MarilynKnits said:


> We owe much to the women who convened in Seneca Falls over 150 years ago, too.
> 
> And what a switcheroo to go from Bella to the far right! Almost as radical as Rush becoming a Socialist.


Oh, Rush and the rest of them are "socialists", they are just for Corporate Socialism.


----------



## Janet Cooke (Aug 14, 2013)

VocalLisa said:


> When you ever have something of value to say on those topics let us know. So far, it hasn't happened.
> 
> In the meantime, all you, Cousin It, wants to do is talk about your fur because people who focus on their hair so much usually have no other attractive physical attributes.


I don't know if KPG is beautiful, ugly, or somewhere in between so far as her physical attributes are concerned. 
Who cares? She was either born with those or paid some plastic surgeon and he did a terrible job, or horrors of all horrors, she was in a terrible accident.

What truly concerns me and you as well, I am sure, is that she is ugly to the depths of her being.


----------



## VocalLisa (Jan 4, 2014)

SQM said:


> I am saying that Sister G's politics changed because she may have more money now than when she was younger. We vote our financial interests.


Unless she's a billionaire, she's NOT voting her best interests, she might THINK she is, but it's more likely she was just easily conned into thinking her financial interests are the same as billionaires.


----------



## VocalLisa (Jan 4, 2014)

theyarnlady said:


> Took the med's
> 
> no name
> 
> ...


Meds apparently aren't working. You might need to talk to the doctor to up the dose.

Still posting like a schizoid vagrant.


----------



## VocalLisa (Jan 4, 2014)

Gerslay said:


> No Q...the change happened when the Lord won the battle for my soul..


If you went GOP, then the Lord LOST the battle for your soul.


----------



## Knitted by Nan (Aug 3, 2013)

knitpresentgifts said:


> Has your adult son moved out yet? What color car did he buy?
> 
> You might want to buy yourself a good monitor if my hair color looks pink on yours.


I am using an ipad and I see streaks of dark pinkish red colour. I thought ou were following the latest fad of the younger set and had modern streaks of bright colours added. There is pink there.


----------



## Janet Cooke (Aug 14, 2013)

VocalLisa said:


> If you went GOP, then the Lord LOST the battle for your soul.


It did occur to me that it is astounding how many of these people actually believe that they are so important that God battles for the soul that it is the individual's responsibility to nurture.


----------



## VocalLisa (Jan 4, 2014)

Gerslay said:


> The "image" of A woman tied up in the back of a truck ...
> The "reality" of 55 MILLION aborted babies
> 
> Decide for yourselves where to place your outrage!!!


Except 55 million aborted "babies" is not a reality.

But, regardless I'm not limited in where I can place my compassion or outrage.

But I understand that conservatives generally have trouble handling more than one thought in their head at the same time, so I can understand why you think you need to make the choice.

In the meantime, liberals will be able to be concerned for BOTH women's right's in the US and elsewhere AT THE SAME TIME.


----------



## VocalLisa (Jan 4, 2014)

Cindy S said:


> So you have a one track mind and can only be outraged at one thing at a time?


Yup, as is the case if one is shallow and simple-minded.

She didn't even know enough to be embarrassed to admit she can only hold one (inane) thought in her mind at a time.


----------



## knitpresentgifts (May 21, 2013)

Janet Cooke said:


> We have all said at one time or another that we are not going to, do not , will not, shall not... read and/or respond.
> We have all repeatedly gone back on those desires and pledges.
> We just had an exchange, both of us have said that we were not going to read or speak of the other's posts.
> 
> So, another values question for ya, how are you on any plane that is higher than the woman you just said you think is fibbing?


Hey, Cooke, I have a beautiful vivid green pla*in* to sell ya but it's way up high in the rollin' hills. You buyin'? 'Cause I'll sell it to you at a good value.

Do you think Jody Briesky is pretty and fibbing?


----------



## VocalLisa (Jan 4, 2014)

knitpresentgifts said:


> Gerslay, these women Libs have to hate someone in order to survive and get through a day.


No, Liberals fight for civil rights, conservatives fight AGAINST civil rights. Fighting against civil rights is literally trying to take the hate and bigotry in your hearts and make it "legal".

The Right's whole ideology is based off of hate.

The Left's whole ideology is to love you enemy and do what we can to help them when they're down.


----------



## VocalLisa (Jan 4, 2014)

knitpresentgifts said:


> Here's the foiling:
> 
> photos courtesy of E.


Ooops, you showed a little too much of your face in the second one... we can see it's quite... ummm... ROUND, to put it nicely.

And what is that weird lumpiness around your shoulders? It doesn't look like the cape is bunched up, so either you're wearing NFL sized shoulder pads, or you're the the Hunchback of Notre Dame.


----------



## Janet Cooke (Aug 14, 2013)

EveMCooke said:


> I am using an ipad and I see streaks of dark pinkish red colour. I thought ou were following the latest fad of the younger set and had modern streaks of bright colours added. There is pink there.


It happens, just the wrong mix and the pink shows, it is an error that occurs fairly often really.


----------



## Janet Cooke (Aug 14, 2013)

knitpresentgifts said:


> Hey, Cooke, I have a beautiful vivid green pla*in* to sell ya but it's way up high in the rollin' hills. You buyin'? 'Cause I'll sell it to you at a good value.
> 
> Do you think Jody Briesky is pretty and fibbing?


plane1

/plān/

noun

noun: plane; plural noun: planes

1.

a flat surface on which a straight line joining any two points on it would wholly lie.
"the horizontal plane"

synonyms: flat surface, level surface; More
horizontal

"a horizontal plane"

an imaginary flat surface through or joining material objects.
"the planets orbit the sun in roughly the same plane"

a flat or level surface of a material object.
"the plane of his forehead"

a flat surface producing lift by the action of air or water over and under it.

*2.

a level of existence, thought, or development.
"everything is connected on the spiritual plane"*

synonyms: level, degree, standard, stratum; More
position, rung, echelon

"a higher plane of achievement"

There ya go , YSB.


----------



## VocalLisa (Jan 4, 2014)

joeysomma said:


> How many aborted babies is a reality?


None, or at the most VERY rare, under extreme circumstances.


----------



## VocalLisa (Jan 4, 2014)

Gerslay said:


> You are a disgusting bully!


Says the "person" who tried to gather and entice board members up to physically harm another board member.

And REFUSES to take responsibility for it and apologize earnestly.

You really need to stop whining when you are merely treated IN KIND.


----------



## knitpresentgifts (May 21, 2013)

Janet Cooke said:


> There ya go , YSB.


1) What is your final offer on my plain?
2) Do you think Jody Briesky is pretty?
3) Do you think Jody fibs always or just sometimes?
4) Do you ever answer any question posed to you?
5) Do you ever say anything truthful?
6) Do you charge or otherwise accept monies or other forms of compensation or receipts from your adult children and relatives who live in your home?


----------



## VocalLisa (Jan 4, 2014)

knitpresentgifts said:


> Hey, Cooke, I have a beautiful vivid green pla*in* to sell ya but it's way up high in the rollin' hills. You buyin'? 'Cause I'll sell it to you at a good value.
> 
> Do you think Jody Briesky is pretty and fibbing?


I think JB knows the difference between a plain and a plane.

Then again, I'm pretty sure her vocabulary rises above a 2nd grade level, so whatever she'd have to teach you would PLAINLY go right over your head.


----------



## VocalLisa (Jan 4, 2014)

knitpresentgifts said:


> 1) What is your final offer on my plain?
> 2) Do you think Jody Briesky is pretty?


Who is Jody Briesky... or is that just ANOTHER one of your spelling errors?


----------



## Poor Purl (Apr 14, 2011)

Janet Cooke said:


> We have all said at one time or another that we are not going to, do not , will not, shall not... read and/or respond.
> We have all repeatedly gone back on those desires and pledges.
> We just had an exchange, both of us have said that we were not going to read or speak of the other's posts.
> 
> So, another values question for ya, how are you on any plane that is higher than the woman you just said you think is fibbing?


Apparently she claims I said I *only* respond to blah blah blah. I did not use the word "only," which seems to be the basis for her saying I'm fibbing. I said that I respond to *all* such messages, which would include LTL's.

I don't recall telling LTL I wouldn't read her messages, though that may have slipped my mind.

As for your last question, she might be flying somewhere, which would put her on a much higher plane. Like a 747.


----------



## Poor Purl (Apr 14, 2011)

VocalLisa said:


> Meds apparently aren't working. You might need to talk to the doctor to up the dose.
> 
> Still posting like a schizoid vagrant.


No no no. LTL says she's just "being silly," and worrying about her is "practicing medicine without a license." It looks to me like the word salad schizophrenics are known for.


----------



## Poor Purl (Apr 14, 2011)

VocalLisa said:


> Ooops, you showed a little too much of your face in the second one... we can see it's quite... ummm... ROUND, to put it nicely.
> 
> And what is that weird lumpiness around your shoulders? It doesn't look like the cape is bunched up, so either you're wearing NFL sized shoulder pads, or you're the the Hunchback of Notre Dame.


Or the reincarnation of Richard II, the one they found buried under a parking lot.


----------



## knitpresentgifts (May 21, 2013)

Poor Purl said:


> Apparently she claims I said I *only* respond to blah blah blah. I did not use the word "only," which seems to be the basis for her saying I'm fibbing. I said that I respond to *all* such messages, which would include LTL's.
> 
> I don't recall telling LTL I wouldn't read her messages, though that may have slipped my mind.
> 
> As for your last question, she might be flying somewhere, which would put her on a much higher plane. Like a 747.


Dear Poor Purl (Yes, I'm specifically addressing this post to you):

I didn't say that, and you know it as well as everyone reading this thread. You said you respond when specifically addressed, which is what I originally stated and LTL NEVER did on those posts mentioned; yet you STILL responded.

Too bad you aren't good at your fibbing either; must have slipped your mind how it is best done.


----------



## Janet Cooke (Aug 14, 2013)

Poor Purl said:


> A
> I don't recall telling LTL I wouldn't read her messages, though that may have slipped my mind.
> 
> As for your last question, she might be flying somewhere, which would put her on a much higher plane. Like a 747.


Did you have to play at "the rain in Spain falls mainly on the plain"?






It occurs to me that she doesn't need a plane to fly.


----------



## Poor Purl (Apr 14, 2011)

VocalLisa said:


> Ooops, you showed a little too much of your face in the second one... we can see it's quite... ummm... ROUND, to put it nicely.


Oh, dear, is that what I missed by speeding past her messages? Maybe I'll break my boycott for just one picture.


----------



## cookiequeen (Jun 15, 2011)

knitpresentgifts said:


> 1) What is your final offer on my plain?
> 2) Do you think Jody Briesky is pretty?
> 3) Do you think Jody fibs always or just sometimes?
> 4) Do you ever answer any question posed to you?
> ...


More Christian behavior.


----------



## knitpresentgifts (May 21, 2013)

Janet Cooke said:


> Did you have to play at "the rain in Spain falls mainly on the plain"?
> 
> 
> 
> ...


Exactly, correct, I only require renting a seat on a plane when I wish to fly somewhere so I don't _need_ one. I will say I once looked into purchasing a private jet once though.

P.S. There were gorgeous costumes created for Eliza in the movie version of My Fair Lady. (I didn't follow your link but assume it leads to the song from the musical.)


----------



## Janet Cooke (Aug 14, 2013)

alcameron said:


> More Christian behavior.


She can't help it, she is cycling again.


----------



## Cindy S (Oct 20, 2013)

Poor Purl said "As for your last question, she might be flying somewhere, which would put her on a much higher plane. Like a 747."

Or a broom.


----------



## MarilynKnits (Aug 30, 2011)

Maybe a broom? Oh, she is modern enough to use a computer. Maybe a vacuum cleaner if the wire is long enough.



Janet Cooke said:


> It occurs to me that she doesn't need a plane to fly.


----------



## Janet Cooke (Aug 14, 2013)

knitpresentgifts said:


> Dear Poor Purl (Yes, I'm specifically addressing this post to you):
> 
> I didn't say that, and you know it as well as everyone reading this thread. You said you respond when specifically addressed, which is what I originally stated and LTL NEVER did; yet you responded.
> 
> Too bad you aren't good at your fibbing either; must have slipped your mind how it is best done.


Never?


----------



## Janet Cooke (Aug 14, 2013)

lovethelake wrote:
You must, or you would not have commented.

I think I hear the plinking of your nerve



Poor Purl said:


> Of course I commented. I comment on everything that's addressed to me, as long as it's from someone whose posts I read.
> 
> What you hear is probably the buzzing of that insect that's headed in the direction of your colon as we speak.


Whose nerve would LTL have been referring to?


----------



## Poor Purl (Apr 14, 2011)

knitpresentgifts said:


> Dear Poor Purl (Yes, I'm specifically addressing this post to you):
> 
> I didn't say that, and you know it as well as everyone reading this thread. You said you respond when specifically addressed, which is what I originally stated and LTL NEVER did; yet you responded.
> 
> Too bad you aren't good at your fibbing either; must have slipped your mind how it is best done.


What I said: "Of course I commented. I comment on everything that's addressed to me, as long as it's from someone whose posts I read." No "only" there.

What you said: "Hey, LTL. It is amazing! Poor Purl responded to you even though she claims she only responds to the posts specifically addressed to her and she reads those posts."

You didn't understand what I said, which would be no big deal if you don't use it against me, but when you misstate what I've said and use it against me, it's - well, it's still no big deal, but it's a little annoyance.

I normally skip your posts even when addressed to me - I glanced at this one, saw how short it was, and broke my own rule. Now I'm going back to keeping it. Goodbye.


----------



## knitpresentgifts (May 21, 2013)

Janet Cooke said:


> lovethelake wrote:
> You must, or you would not have commented.
> 
> I think I hear the plinking of your nerve
> ...


Where exactly did LTL *address *Poor Purl in this post of the second one by LTL in question? You and PP are all about word smithing, or at least PP prides herself on it. Yet, she doesn't practice what she preaches.

LTL did not address PP; so go ahead and see how best to spin your and PP's lies again. No one is caring or listening, but give it your best shot since you cannot or refuse to answer anything of "value."


----------



## knitpresentgifts (May 21, 2013)

Poor Purl said:


> What I said: "Of course I commented. I comment on everything that's *addressed to me*, as long as it's from someone whose posts I read. " No "only" there.





knitpresentgifts said:


> What you said: "Hey, LTL. It is amazing! Poor Purl responded to you even though she claims she *only* responds to the posts  specifically addressed to her and she reads those posts."


How hilarious! LTL didn't *ADDRESS* you in either of her two recent posts being discussed.

Poor lie, Poor Purl. Goodbye!


----------



## Poor Purl (Apr 14, 2011)

Cindy S said:


> Poor Purl said "As for your last question, she might be flying somewhere, which would put her on a much higher plane. Like a 747."
> 
> Or a broom.


But a broom is not a plane. Though it's on a plane. Okay, Cindy, you're right.


----------



## Poor Purl (Apr 14, 2011)

Janet Cooke said:


> Never?


I think she was channeling Yarnie there. There was no sense in that message.


----------



## Janet Cooke (Aug 14, 2013)

Poor Purl wrote:
Do I care? No.



lovethelake said:


> You must, or you would not have commented.
> 
> I think I hear the plinking of your nerve


This would appear to be LTL addressing my Empress Poor Purl directly and specifically.

Thanks for playing.


----------



## lovethelake (Apr 6, 2011)

Poor Purl wrote:
Of course I commented. I comment on everything that's addressed to me, as long as it's from someone whose posts I read. 

What you hear is probably the buzzing of that insect that's headed in the direction of your colon as we speak.


You are a disgusting bully! 


------------------------------------------------------------

No she is just appears to be an angry old woman that has a fixation with women's anuses. I think this was the second reference of that body part by the AOW (plural this time) just in the last few pages. Personally I would find that language gross by 13 year old males, but with AOW it might be construed as sexual deviant behavior.


----------



## Janet Cooke (Aug 14, 2013)

lovethelake said:


> Poor Purl wrote:
> Of course I commented. I comment on everything that's addressed to me, as long as it's from someone whose posts I read.
> 
> What you hear is probably the buzzing of that insect that's headed in the direction of your colon as we speak.
> ...


There is no behavior, other than typing, knowing about your recent fascination with the reports on alleged homosexual behavior on the part of our POTUS you are a fine one to talk about anyone else being a deviant.

I get it, though, other than those fantasies about African American males you have never heard anything so course as the saying someone "has a bug up their butt". I will just bet.


----------



## Poor Purl (Apr 14, 2011)

lovethelake said:


> Poor Purl wrote:
> Of course I commented. I comment on everything that's addressed to me, as long as it's from someone whose posts I read.
> 
> What you hear is probably the buzzing of that insect that's headed in the direction of your colon as we speak.
> ...


What do I - or any of us - have to be angry about? The guy we supported is still President, for a second term. The ACA is law and is beginning to work. Roe v. Wade is also law, regardless of what you guys try to do to it. I'm pretty sanguine. It's you who haven't been able to get anything you want and feel the need to lash out at anyone who opposes you. Are you _angry_? I'd say you were enraged.

As for my being old, there are worse things that can happen to a person. Would you like me to pray that it never happens to you?

That word ("insect"? "colon"?) that you find so gross - I have to apologize for that. I used it in a message to Solow, not you, and then mistakenly referred to it in a message to you. I'm sorry. I can usually tell the difference between you two. It's no strange fixation; it's a common expression:

soloweygirl wrote:
Then we should thank you for not wasting the talents of the hairdresser that was unfortunate enough to have you as a customer.

Poor purl wrote: Just what kind of bug was it that seems to have crawled up your a$$? It probably stings.

Snark answering snark.


----------



## SQM (Jun 22, 2012)

I think Rich Purl has summed it up quite correctly. What is the point to all of these snide comments? No one's mind will be changed. Is the goal to see who leaves this arena first? Or who is going to be run over by someone's rollator? In a way it is sad that we are squabbling amongst ourselves. There is a war on women by men and how good it would be for them to see us divided rather than together - not unlike the underclass with the Blacks and Hispanics at each other's throats. How much more powerful they would be if they worked in concert against the real enemy - the super rich.

I say we choose a topic that affects all women globally and try to discuss some rational solutions. So much more meaningful.

Now I think I have one more post before I hit 1000. Should I save it for tomorrow for the digest exclaiming over someone's wash cloth or doll clothes?


----------



## VocalLisa (Jan 4, 2014)

knitpresentgifts said:


> Dear Poor Purl (Yes, I'm specifically addressing this post to you):
> 
> I didn't say that, and you know it as well as everyone reading this thread. You said you respond when specifically addressed, which is what I originally stated and LTL NEVER did on those posts mentioned; yet you STILL responded.
> 
> Too bad you aren't good at your fibbing either; must have slipped your mind how it is best done.


Nice try. But Purl was right.


----------



## VocalLisa (Jan 4, 2014)

knitpresentgifts said:


> Exactly, correct, I only require renting a seat on a plane when I wish to fly somewhere so I don't _need_ one.


So thanks for confirming that you've been PUTIN (_Posting Under the Influence of Narcotics_), we all could tell that you were "flyin' high", but it's nice to see you finally be honest about SOMETHING.


----------



## VocalLisa (Jan 4, 2014)

knitpresentgifts said:


> You and PP are all about word smithing, or at least PP prides herself on it.


"Wordsmithing" is one word.

It's self-evident you're unable to legitimately pride yourself on it.


----------



## susanmos2000 (May 10, 2011)

knitpresentgifts said:


> Exactly, correct, I only require renting a seat on a plane when I wish to fly somewhere so I don't _need_ one. I will say I once looked into purchasing a private jet once though.


*chuckle snort*


----------



## VocalLisa (Jan 4, 2014)

knitpresentgifts said:


> How hilarious! LTL didn't *ADDRESS* you in either of her two recent posts being discussed. !


Except she did.


----------



## VocalLisa (Jan 4, 2014)

susanmos2000 said:


> knitpresentgifts said:
> 
> 
> > Exactly, correct, I only require renting a seat on a plane when I wish to fly somewhere so I don't need one. I will say I once looked into purchasing a private jet once though.
> ...


Given the roundness of her face and the hunchback, it looks to me the Airline would require TWO seats on a plane to prevent the "spill over" to the passenger seated next to her. No wonder she "looked into" purchasing a private jet once. The airlines wouldn't allow her on for fear the jet wouldn't be able to get off the tarmac.


----------



## Lkholcomb (Aug 25, 2013)

GrannyGoode said:


> Good morning, *MaidInBedlam,*
> 
> Your thoughts are well taken for serious consideration. We could all benefit by careful reflection on your solid points.
> 
> ...


I do greatly respect the caring and service oriented attitudes that the LDS church has. I have many friends who are mormons and the majority are polite and respectful even if you differ greatly in opinions.

I think one of my most impressed moments was the first time we went to the Hill Cummorah festival. There were fundamentalists right on the side (legal distance) with megaphones screaming that we all were going to hell in addition to a bunch of other nasty things. Absolutely not one of the mormons paid them any mind. The protesters were the ones who looked bad. The peaceful handling of it was refreshing to see.


----------



## knitpresentgifts (May 21, 2013)

Poor Purl said:


> I think she was channeling Yarnie there. There was no sense in that message.


Poor Purl, broke your own rules again I see (reading MY posts).


----------



## knitpresentgifts (May 21, 2013)

lovethelake said:


> Poor Purl wrote:
> Of course I commented. I comment on everything that's addressed to me, as long as it's from someone whose posts I read.
> 
> What you hear is probably the buzzing of that insect that's headed in the direction of your colon as we speak.
> ...


 :thumbup: Both you and Gerslay are correct in your analysis of Poor Purl's posts and behavior.


----------



## knitpresentgifts (May 21, 2013)

Janet Cooke said:


> Poor Purl wrote:
> Do I care? No.
> 
> This would appear to be LTL addressing my Empress Poor Purl directly and specifically.
> ...


It would not appear that way; but you keep on believing whatever Janet.

I'll keep on waiting for you to answer any question of value.


----------



## knitpresentgifts (May 21, 2013)

Poor Purl said:


> soloweygirl wrote:
> Then we should thank you for not wasting the talents of the hairdresser that was unfortunate enough to have you as a customer.
> 
> Poor purl wrote: Just what kind of bug was it that seems to have crawled up your a$$? It probably stings.
> ...


Poor Purl; why don't you just stop your tedious charade and admit you lie?

YOU first started by agreeing to your BFFs snark, (Cindy's, Janet's, Alcameron's, etc.,) and *you* first posted your own snark about how you felt (as a direct insult to me) about spending time in a hair salon *before* Solo was even on-line.

Soloweygirl *weighed in * after your snark with her snark.

Even your old-age years of experience does you no good when you lie.


----------



## knitpresentgifts (May 21, 2013)

VocalLisa said:


> Nice try. But Purl was right.


Poor Purl lied; it's archived. Read it.


----------



## Lkholcomb (Aug 25, 2013)

Poor Purl said:


> Or the reincarnation of Richard II, the one they found buried under a parking lot.


That was Richard III, one of the York (white rose) kings. He was one one involved in the scandal/mystery surrounding the disappearance of his two nephews from the Tower who should have been next in the lineage. (these things just stick in my head, I don't know why, lol)

http://www.cnn.com/2013/02/03/world/europe/richard-iii-search-announcement/


----------



## susanmos2000 (May 10, 2011)

VocalLisa said:


> Given the roundness of her face and the hunchback, it looks to me the Airline would require TWO seats on a plane to prevent the "spill over" to the passenger seated next to her. No wonder she "looked into" purchasing a private jet once. The airlines wouldn't allow her on for fear the jet wouldn't be able to get off the tarmac.


I'm sure she's got that covered--that "hunched back" is probably a barrel or two or oil from the family-owned wells she once boasted of. No doubt she smuggles the stuff onto the plane to slip to the pilot and flight crew--insurance against the possibility of panic and an emergency jettisoning of her and all other "excess baggage" at twenty thousand feet.


----------



## knitpresentgifts (May 21, 2013)

VocalLisa said:


> Given the roundness of her face and the hunchback, it looks to me the Airline would require TWO seats on a plane to prevent the "spill over" to the passenger seated next to her. No wonder she "looked into" purchasing a private jet once. The airlines wouldn't allow her on for fear the jet wouldn't be able to get off the tarmac.


No wonder you took down your own portrait and replaced it with one of someone else who frankly appears like the Michelin Man or the Abominable Snowman even though I know who the man is and understand he is wearing his space suit. Obviously comparison of yourself to other's looks is one of your closely held traits and it is your instinct to attempt to prove yourself better and superior to others. It is also apparent you cannot understand that if I look "round" in the face and "hunchbacked" at the same time, that cannot possibly be the reality and that the angle of the photograph is slightly distorted in its skewed angle. I can assure you I am neither.

FYI: you don't see very well or live in reality


----------



## susanmos2000 (May 10, 2011)

knitpresentgifts said:


> No wonder you took down your own portrait and replaced it with one of someone else who frankly appears like the Michelin Man or the Abominable Snowman even though I know who the man is and understand he is wearing his space suit. Obviously comparison of yourself to other's looks is one of your closely held traits and it is your instinct to attempt to prove yourself better and superior to others. It is also apparent you cannot understand that if I look "round" in the face and "hunchbacked" at the same time, that cannot possibly be the reality and that the angle of the photograph is slightly distorted in its skewed angle. I can assure you I am neither.


No dice. Try again.


----------



## Lkholcomb (Aug 25, 2013)

I wonder, are most post-abortion folks also against IVF? In IVF te eggs are fertilized in a lab and the best ones are transferred or frozen, but some are discarded. Then if some are frozen, that doesn't allow the "life" to live.


----------



## susanmos2000 (May 10, 2011)

Lkholcomb said:


> I wonder, are most post-abortion folks also against IVF?


I would imagine so--and there too the need to abort looms as a distinct possibility. Multiple embryos are introduced into the woman's reproductive tract to ensure that at least one implants--but on rare occasions three, four, or more of them eventually do. Often that's far more than a woman's body is capable of handling. Wasn't there are British woman some years back who wound up with six or seven that way? If I remember correctly she refused a therapeutic abortion that would have reduced her brood down to three or four--and ultimately lost them all.

I think the anti-abortion crowd doesn't try to ban the IVF process because, quite frankly, they know they won't succeed. It's an expensive procedure (20K+ for a single treatment), and I don't believe it's covered by insurance. The couples that go this route are well-off financially and will simply go overseas for it if they have to. Just as in the pre-Roe days women with money went to Europe or Japan for abortions, and the poor suffered and died at the hands of the back-alley butchers.


----------



## Cheeky Blighter (Nov 20, 2011)

VocalLisa said:


> Given the roundness of her face and the hunchback, it looks to me the Airline would require TWO seats on a plane to prevent the "spill over" to the passenger seated next to her. No wonder she "looked into" purchasing a private jet once. The airlines wouldn't allow her on for fear the jet wouldn't be able to get off the tarmac.


You said it so well VocalLisa. :thumbup: :thumbup: :thumbup:


----------



## Cheeky Blighter (Nov 20, 2011)

Cindy S said:


> So you have a one track mind and can only be outraged at one thing at a time?


That's right, Cindy. Don't compound her confusion with more than one choice. Now she is really lost. I think men should be prosecuted for masturbating as all those sperm are just treated with no respect what so ever. Every act of sex must result in pregnancy or you are just killing thousands of human beings when you are supposed to be recreating more people.


----------



## Cheeky Blighter (Nov 20, 2011)

And they say there is no war on women?


----------



## Janet Cooke (Aug 14, 2013)

Poor Purl said:


> What do I - or any of us - have to be angry about? The guy we supported is still President, for a second term. The ACA is law and is beginning to work. Roe v. Wade is also law, regardless of what you guys try to do to it. I'm pretty sanguine. It's you who haven't been able to get anything you want and feel the need to lash out at anyone who opposes you. Are you _angry_? I'd say you were enraged.
> 
> As for my being old, there are worse things that can happen to a person. Would you like me to pray that it never happens to you?
> 
> ...


 :thumbup: :thumbup: :thumbup: :thumbup: :thumbup: :thumbup:


----------



## Janet Cooke (Aug 14, 2013)

SQM said:


> I think Rich Purl has summed it up quite correctly. What is the point to all of these snide comments? No one's mind will be changed. Is the goal to see who leaves this arena first? Or who is going to be run over by someone's rollator? In a way it is sad that we are squabbling amongst ourselves. There is a war on women by men and how good it would be for them to see us divided rather than together - not unlike the underclass with the Blacks and Hispanics at each other's throats. How much more powerful they would be if they worked in concert against the real enemy - the super rich.
> 
> I say we choose a topic that affects all women globally and try to discuss some rational solutions. So much more meaningful.
> 
> Now I think I have one more post before I hit 1000. Should I save it for tomorrow for the digest exclaiming over someone's wash cloth or doll clothes?


Great Idea. Start a thread.


----------



## Janet Cooke (Aug 14, 2013)

knitpresentgifts said:


> It would not appear that way; but you keep on believing whatever Janet.
> 
> I'll keep on waiting for you to answer any question of value.


I am just trying to figure out if your increased manipulation and nastiness matches the time when your husband announced he was leaving.


----------



## Cheeky Blighter (Nov 20, 2011)

Fair Game - You're on your own now.


----------



## Janet Cooke (Aug 14, 2013)

Cheeky Blighter said:


> Fair Game - You're on your own now.


It is so sad that this is really true for many.

"Mark my word, if and when these preachers get control of the (Republican) party, and they're sure trying to do so, it's going to be a terrible damn problem. Frankly, these people frighten me. Politics and governing demand compromise. But these Christians believe they are acting in the name of God, so they can't and won't compromise. It know, I've tried to deal with them." - Barry Goldwater


----------



## damemary (Mar 14, 2012)

Well, I'm glad , after worrying needlessly, that you are okay. I'm not sure what to think. I have decided not to fall for pranks like this anymore.



theyarnlady said:


> Took the med's
> 
> no name
> 
> ...


----------



## SQM (Jun 22, 2012)

Just read that Arizona legislators passed a bill that allows business people of "faith" to refuse to do business with the lesbian and gay communities if these lifestyles go against the business owners' beliefs.

Of course that can spread to single pregnant women and non-fundamentalist patrons. 

What next? Hobby Lobby?

(My 1000th post and I do want to say that I might try knitting a dish towel before I get to 2000. Maybe!)


----------



## Janet Cooke (Aug 14, 2013)

SQM said:


> Just read that Arizona legislators passed a bill that allows business people of "faith" to refuse to do business with the lesbian and gay communities if these lifestyles go against the business owners' beliefs.
> 
> Of course that can spread to single pregnant women and non-fundamentalist patrons.
> 
> ...


HAHAHAA, it is a great quick project, I tell ya!

If businesses do that it may just backfire on them. 
I have not figured out yet if Darden took the stance they did about ACA to give them cover about cutting back hours or if they lost enough business to have to cut back because of their position. 
Their food sucks.


----------



## damemary (Mar 14, 2012)

I cannot be trusted to plan celebrations. Might get rowdy and rude. Instead, allow me to say glad to have you. Enjoy.



SQM said:


> Cooke, I pictured you a dark blonde with a pony tail. I am off now to the haircutter's to get the color cut out. What a waste of time and money. Another war on women aimed at those of us of a certain age - to look young. Blah!
> 
> I am closing in on my 1000th posting. How can we celebrate this utterly meaningful event?
> 
> Should I post Boris giving me my pixie cut?


----------



## damemary (Mar 14, 2012)

We used to say 'goober smoocher. '



MarilynKnits said:


> Hey Gerslay, Were you a suck up as a kid, too?
> 
> syc·o·phan·tic
> ˌsikəˈfantik/
> ...


----------



## damemary (Mar 14, 2012)

Good to know. Thank you for informing us.



GrannyGoode said:


> Good morning, *MaidInBedlam,*
> 
> Your thoughts are well taken for serious consideration. We could all benefit by careful reflection on your solid points.
> 
> ...


----------



## SQM (Jun 22, 2012)

Thanks for the kind words Dame. I am also thrilled to announce that I will be having lunch in real time with one of the big stars here - POOR PURL. I am so excited. And since NYC does not have a Darden's or a Hobby Lobby, we are sure to have a grand old time.


----------



## damemary (Mar 14, 2012)

susanmos2000 said:


> Sounds like the buzz saw is making a guest appearance.
> 
> _brum-brum-brum-brum-brrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrr _
> 
> Yowzah! Talk about noise pollution.


 :XD: :XD: :XD: :XD: :XD: :XD: :XD: :XD:


----------



## Cheeky Blighter (Nov 20, 2011)

SQM said:


> Thanks for the kind words Dame. I am also thrilled to announce that I will be having lunch in real time with one of the big stars here - POOR PURL. I am so excited. And since NYC does not have a Darden's or a Hobby Lobby, we are sure to have a grand old time.


I hope the two of you have a wonderful time!


----------



## Janet Cooke (Aug 14, 2013)

SQM said:


> Thanks for the kind words Dame. I am also thrilled to announce that I will be having lunch in real time with one of the big stars here - POOR PURL. I am so excited. And since NYC does not have a Darden's or a Hobby Lobby, we are sure to have a grand old time.


I hear she likes Indian food.


----------



## Lkholcomb (Aug 25, 2013)

susanmos2000 said:


> I would imagine so--and there too the need to abort looms as a distinct possibility. Multiple embryos are introduced into the woman's reproductive tract to ensure that at least one implants--but on rare occasions three, four, or more of them eventually do. Often that's far more than a woman's body is capable of handling. Wasn't there are British woman some years back who wound up with six or seven that way? If I remember correctly she refused a therapeutic abortion that would have reduced her brood down to three or four--and ultimately lost them all.
> 
> I think the anti-abortion crowd doesn't try to ban the IVF process because, quite frankly, they know they won't succeed. It's an expensive procedure (20K+ for a single treatment), and I don't believe it's covered by insurance. The couples that go this route are well-off financially and will simply go overseas for it if they have to. Just as in the pre-Roe days women with money went to Europe or Japan for abortions, and the poor suffered and died at the hands of the back-alley butchers.


Now some countries actually limit how many embryos can be used at a time because of complications from multiple embryos implanting. Of course the us has not followed suit


----------



## GrannyGoode (Oct 9, 2011)

Hi Janet and Cheeky Blighter,

Would either or both of you please enlighten me as to the poster of the young girl holding the Bible and the accompanying caption? Truly, I am sincere in wanting to understand what seems to me to be a very cruel attitude.

I'm not at all sure, but does the poster put forth the message that those who are against abortion are also in favor of "writing off the agony experienced by victims of violence"? The quotation marks are only to put my thoughts into words, however clumsily they appear. My intent is not to be confrontational; I truly desire to understand. Thanks.



Janet Cooke said:


> It is so sad that this is really true for many.
> 
> "Mark my word, if and when these preachers get control of the (Republican) party, and they're sure trying to do so, it's going to be a terrible damn problem. Frankly, these people frighten me. Politics and governing demand compromise. But these Christians believe they are acting in the name of God, so they can't and won't compromise. It know, I've tried to deal with them." - Barry Goldwater


----------



## Janet Cooke (Aug 14, 2013)

GrannyGoode said:


> Hi Janet and Cheeky Blighter,
> 
> Would either or both of you please enlighten me as to the poster of the young girl holding the Bible and the accompanying caption? Truly, I am sincere in wanting to understand what seems to me to be a very cruel attitude.
> 
> I'm not at all sure, but does the poster put forth the message that those who are against abortion are also in favor of "writing off the agony experienced by victims of violence"? The quotation marks are only to put my thoughts into words, however clumsily they appear. My intent is not to be confrontational; I truly desire to understand. Thanks.


You would probably do well to ask her.


----------



## damemary (Mar 14, 2012)

This is absolutely true. The bill is waiting on Gov Jan Brewer's desk. There is no indication of whether she will sign or veto the bill. Of course I assume this will be challenged in court if it is signed.



SQM said:


> Just read that Arizona legislators passed a bill that allows business people of "faith" to refuse to do business with the lesbian and gay communities if these lifestyles go against the business owners' beliefs.
> 
> Of course that can spread to single pregnant women and non-fundamentalist patrons.
> 
> ...


----------



## damemary (Mar 14, 2012)

Google and Apple have both looked at opening offices in Arizona. Corporations are offended by this new law.



Janet Cooke said:


> HAHAHAA, it is a great quick project, I tell ya!
> 
> If businesses do that it may just backfire on them.
> I have not figured out yet if Darden took the stance they did about ACA to give them cover about cutting back hours or if they lost enough business to have to cut back because of their position.
> Their food sucks.


----------



## damemary (Mar 14, 2012)

Oh, have fun and think of us. Enjoy.



SQM said:


> Thanks for the kind words Dame. I am also thrilled to announce that I will be having lunch in real time with one of the big stars here - POOR PURL. I am so excited. And since NYC does not have a Darden's or a Hobby Lobby, we are sure to have a grand old time.


----------



## Janet Cooke (Aug 14, 2013)

damemary said:


> This is absolutely true. The bill is waiting on Gov Jan Brewer's desk. There is no indication of whether she will sign or veto the bill. Of course I assume this will be challenged in court if it is signed.


Jan Brewer has acted as if she has some sense once or twice in the past few years. It seems that she understands that it is ridiculous to waste the taxpayers' monies fighting losing battles. 
Kansas passed a similar law, others have the same in the works. 
I can't see this being the work of ALEC. 
I haven't looked, either.


----------



## damemary (Mar 14, 2012)

Remember that Jan welcomed President Obama on the tarmac in AZ scolding him and pointing her finger.



Janet Cooke said:


> Jan Brewer has acted as if she has some sense once or twice in the past few years. It seems that she understands that it is ridiculous to waste the taxpayers' monies fighting losing battles.
> Kansas passed a similar law, others have the same in the works.
> I can't see this being the work of ALEC.
> I haven't looked, either.


----------



## Janet Cooke (Aug 14, 2013)

damemary said:


> Remember that Jan welcomed President Obama on the tarmac in AZ scolding him and pointing her finger.


Oh yes, I do. One of the most disrespectful acts I have ever seen by an American toward a POTUS. 
And still laughable that she had the gall, that ignorant pissah.


----------



## Poor Purl (Apr 14, 2011)

SQM said:


> Just read that Arizona legislators passed a bill that allows business people of "faith" to refuse to do business with the lesbian and gay communities if these lifestyles go against the business owners' beliefs.
> 
> Of course that can spread to single pregnant women and non-fundamentalist patrons.
> 
> ...


SQM, it says 1001. What happened to 1000?


----------



## Poor Purl (Apr 14, 2011)

SQM said:


> Thanks for the kind words Dame. I am also thrilled to announce that I will be having lunch in real time with one of the big stars here - POOR PURL. I am so excited. And since NYC does not have a Darden's or a Hobby Lobby, we are sure to have a grand old time.


Big what? I think you have me confused with someone else. BTW, this msg says you've posted 1001, but so does your previous one. Someone is screwing around with you odometer.


----------



## Poor Purl (Apr 14, 2011)

damemary said:


> Oh, have fun and think of us. Enjoy.


What do you think we'll talk about? Of course we'll think of you.

:roll: :roll: :roll: :roll: :roll:


----------



## Janet Cooke (Aug 14, 2013)

Poor Purl said:


> Big what? I think you have me confused with someone else. BTW, this msg says you've posted 1001, but so does your previous one. Someone is screwing around with you odometer.


That was my favorite skill as a teen, messing with the odometer...


----------



## GrannyGoode (Oct 9, 2011)

Janet,
Do you mean I should ask Cheeky Blighter (which I did)?



Janet Cooke said:


> You would probably do well to ask her.


----------



## Poor Purl (Apr 14, 2011)

Janet Cooke said:


> That was my favorite skill as a teen, messing with the odometer...


You could do that? You must have been very talented.


----------



## SQM (Jun 22, 2012)

Poor Purl said:


> Big what? I think you have me confused with someone else. BTW, this msg says you've posted 1001, but so does your previous one. Someone is screwing around with you odometer.


I wish that were true. Dame said you like Indian. Yummy!


----------



## damemary (Mar 14, 2012)

I shall substitute 'ignorant pissah' for my names for her. I'd forgotten the phrase. And I love it.



Janet Cooke said:


> Oh yes, I do. One of the most disrespectful acts I have ever seen by an American toward a POTUS.
> And still laughable that she had the gall, that ignorant pissah.


----------



## damemary (Mar 14, 2012)

I didn't know of her curry love. Must be someone else.



SQM said:


> I wish that were true. Dame said you like Indian. Yummy!


----------



## Gerslay (Oct 4, 2011)

damemary said:


> We used to say 'goober smoocher. '


Love you too...smooches and hugs!


----------



## Gerslay (Oct 4, 2011)

ooops...dbl post!


Smooches and hugs all around!


----------



## MaidInBedlam (Jul 24, 2012)

I'm very glad to hear that the LDS Church takes such an open-minded approach to helping women who have an unwanted pregnancy. It makes me feel the world is a little better than I thought it was. I do, however, expect more of myself, at least, in this less than perfect world and hope that as many people as possible will do the same. I believe we can make this world better if we keep on doing whatever we can become better individuals and do what we can to make this world a better place.


GrannyGoode said:


> Good morning, *MaidInBedlam,*
> 
> Your thoughts are well taken for serious consideration. We could all benefit by careful reflection on your solid points.
> 
> ...


----------



## SQM (Jun 22, 2012)

damemary said:


> I didn't know of her curry love. Must be someone else.


Late night mistake. It was the Cooke.


----------



## MaidInBedlam (Jul 24, 2012)

I earned every one of my white hairs and think they look great. There's still a section of my hair in the back that's unchanged so it looks like someone else's hair when I wear my hair a certain way. i have vainly been considering a perm to get some curls that will help make my sadly thinning hair look a bit thicker. I'm still trying to decide if my vanity has reached the stage of being sinful. I think I'll be OK if I avoid getting a henna rinse along with the perm. I've been tempted to have my hair look like it did a long time ago for just a little while, but I must resist temptation, so I am told.:-D


MarilynKnits said:


> Wow, you were able to translate your meows into English. Hope you didn't break any claws on the keyboard.
> 
> I too have better things to do than spend hours having my hair fussed with. And I am not intimidated by having gray hair. The people who love me love me, not an outer shell that tries to convey itself as a glamor b***h.


----------



## Poor Purl (Apr 14, 2011)

damemary said:


> I didn't know of her curry love. Must be someone else.


Do you know how to curry favor?


----------



## Poor Purl (Apr 14, 2011)

MaidInBedlam said:


> I earned every one of my white hairs and think they look great. There's still a section of my hair in the back that's unchanged so it looks like someone else's hair when I wear my hair a certain way. i have vainly been considering a perm to get some curls that will help make my sadly thinning hair look a bit thicker. I'm still trying to decide if my vanity has reached the stage of being sinful. I think I'll be OK if I avoid getting a henna rinse along with the perm. I've been tempted to have my hair look like it did a long time ago for just a little while, but I must resist temptation, so I am told.:-D


Why resist temptation? Isn't that where the fun is?


----------



## damemary (Mar 14, 2012)

It's less expensive than cosmetic surgery and hurts less. It may also bring a smile to your face.

But remember we just see you in our mind's eye. Do what you will just for yourself.



MaidInBedlam said:


> I earned every one of my white hairs and think they look great. There's still a section of my hair in the back that's unchanged so it looks like someone else's hair when I wear my hair a certain way. i have vainly been considering a perm to get some curls that will help make my sadly thinning hair look a bit thicker. I'm still trying to decide if my vanity has reached the stage of being sinful. I think I'll be OK if I avoid getting a henna rinse along with the perm. I've been tempted to have my hair look like it did a long time ago for just a little while, but I must resist temptation, so I am told.:-D


----------



## damemary (Mar 14, 2012)

Only with a very explicit recipe.



Poor Purl said:


> Do you know how to curry favor?


----------



## Poor Purl (Apr 14, 2011)

damemary said:


> Only with a very explicit recipe.


----------



## rocky1991 (May 8, 2011)

joeysomma said:


> Every abortion kills a baby. (or what ever name you want to call it as fetus, zygote, or blob of cells) It is still a baby.
> What reality are you in?


Potential baby.


----------



## Janet Cooke (Aug 14, 2013)

MaidInBedlam said:


> I'm very glad to hear that the LDS Church takes such an open-minded approach to helping women who have an unwanted pregnancy. It makes me feel the world is a little better than I thought it was. I do, however, expect more of myself, at least, in this less than perfect world and hope that as many people as possible will do the same. I believe we can make this world better if we keep on doing whatever we can become better individuals and do what we can to make this world a better place.


I would be happier to hear that their love of God drives them to extend kindnesses to women who have aborted that pregnancy that they didn't want. 
It is pretty easy to be kind to people who follow your line of respectability and activities. It is a whole lot more representative of God to show love and acceptance to those who do what WE think God disapproves of.

As people who volunteer or contribute to Planned Parenthood and to food banks, to agencies such as BirthRight and other agencies that help families with small children we are supporting any choice made by people who may have considered abortion.
How about those anti-choice folks? How do they support women who weren't swayed to maintain their gestational status?


----------



## Cheeky Blighter (Nov 20, 2011)

And they say there is no war on women? How any woman in her right mind can support the Republican Party I do not know!

These are the kind of spokespersons the Republicans have. Speaks volumes about their character and the disrespect they have for not only President Obama but all women.

Ted Nugent is becoming a real problem for Texas Republicans in their right-wing crusade to stop Wendy Davisso big that he actually had to come out and apologize for calling President Obama a subhuman mongrel.

We need candidate Democrat Wendy Davis to beat Ted Nugent and Sarah Palins favored candidate, Gregg Abbott.

I say apologize with quotes because it was really a nopology. Just read it for yourself: I do apologizenot necessarily to the Presidentbut on behalf of much better men than myself.

Basically, Ted Nugent called President Obama a subhuman mongrel 

and said women running for office were varmints, fat pigs, and dirty whores andbelieve it or notthat was causing headaches for his friends, like Republican candidate for Texas Governor Greg Abbott. So he had to nopologize.

Meanwhile, Greg Abbott and the Texas GOP havent bothered to comment on Nugents history with underage girlssomething hes admitted to and even wrote a song about.

Long story short: Ted Nugent is sinking Texas Republicans. Lets throw them an anvil and elect a pro-choice Democrat as the next governor of Texas.

Keep fighting,
Chris Bowers, Daily Kos


----------



## Cheeky Blighter (Nov 20, 2011)

And they say there is no War on Women? How any woman in her right mind can support the Republican Party I do not know!

These are the kind of spokespersons the Republicans have. Speaks volumes about their character and the disrespect they have for not only President Obama but all women.

Ted Nugent is becoming a real problem for Texas Republicans in their right-wing crusade to stop Wendy Davisso big that he actually had to come out and apologize for calling President Obama a subhuman mongrel.

We need candidate Democrat Wendy Davis to beat Ted Nugent and Sarah Palins favored candidate, Gregg Abbott.

I say apologize with quotes because it was really a nopology. Just read it for yourself: I do apologizenot necessarily to the Presidentbut on behalf of much better men than myself.

Basically, Ted Nugent called President Obama a subhuman mongrel 

and said women running for office were varmints, fat pigs, and dirty whores andbelieve it or notthat was causing headaches for his friends, like Republican candidate for Texas Governor Greg Abbott. So he had to nopologize.

Meanwhile, Greg Abbott and the Texas GOP havent bothered to comment on Nugents history with underage girlssomething hes admitted to and even wrote a song about.

Long story short: Ted Nugent is sinking Texas Republicans. Lets throw them an anvil and elect a pro-choice Democrat as the next governor of Texas.

Keep fighting,
Chris Bowers, Daily Kos


----------



## Gerslay (Oct 4, 2011)

I, a conservative, agree that Ted Nugent's remarks were despicable, out-of-bounds, and entirely inappropriate not only to the president, but also to women.

Once upon a time I enjoyed his antics...but as of late, not so much. He's got problems!


----------



## Janet Cooke (Aug 14, 2013)

Gerslay said:



> I, a conservative, agree that Ted Nugent's remarks were despicable, out-of-bounds, and entirely inappropriate not only to the president, but also to women.
> 
> Once upon a time I enjoyed his antics...but as of late, not so much. He's got problems!


I am glad to see you go that far, I hope that you will encourage all of the people you know in NC who are influential to diassociate themselves from Mr. Nugent. 
His actions are much more than what most of us would describe as antics. He is one sick individual. If he tells the truth about his sexual activities with children he is a criminal, one just like those people who have posters hanging on the public library walls.


----------



## SQM (Jun 22, 2012)

MaidInBedlam said:


> I earned every one of my white hairs and think they look great. There's still a section of my hair in the back that's unchanged so it looks like someone else's hair when I wear my hair a certain way. i have vainly been considering a perm to get some curls that will help make my sadly thinning hair look a bit thicker. I'm still trying to decide if my vanity has reached the stage of being sinful. I think I'll be OK if I avoid getting a henna rinse along with the perm. I've been tempted to have my hair look like it did a long time ago for just a little while, but I must resist temptation, so I am told.:-D


Nothing sinful about wanting to look nice for yourself or others. Sin should be reserved, if it exists, for how we treat others.


----------



## SQM (Jun 22, 2012)

damemary said:


> It's less expensive than cosmetic surgery and hurts less. It may also bring a smile to your face.
> 
> But remember we just see you in our mind's eye. Do what you will just for yourself.


And what we see in our mind's eye is not real - this is all virtual.


----------



## damemary (Mar 14, 2012)

Cheeky Blighter said:


> And they say there is no war on women? How any woman in her right mind can support the Republican Party I do not know!
> 
> These are the kind of spokespersons the Republicans have. Speaks volumes about their character and the disrespect they have for not only President Obama but all women.
> 
> ...


 :thumbup: :thumbup: :thumbup: :thumbup: :thumbup: :thumbup: :thumbup: :thumbup: :thumbup: :thumbup: :thumbup: :thumbup: :thumbup: :thumbup: :thumbup: :thumbup: :thumbup: :thumbup: Stand up for truth and the American Way.


----------



## damemary (Mar 14, 2012)

Thank you for your comments.



Gerslay said:


> I, a conservative, agree that Ted Nugent's remarks were despicable, out-of-bounds, and entirely inappropriate not only to the president, but also to women.
> 
> Once upon a time I enjoyed his antics...but as of late, not so much. He's got problems!


----------



## damemary (Mar 14, 2012)

That's how I get through the day. I didn't say it made sense.



SQM said:


> And what we see in our mind's eye is not real - this is all virtual.


----------



## SQM (Jun 22, 2012)

Gerslay said:


> I, a conservative, agree that Ted Nugent's remarks were despicable, out-of-bounds, and entirely inappropriate not only to the president, but also to women.
> 
> Once upon a time I enjoyed his antics...but as of late, not so much. He's got problems!


Credit where credit is due. The sun has shined today on the head of Sister G. Glory be Her Name!


----------



## damemary (Mar 14, 2012)

Very impressive.



SQM said:


> Credit where credit is due. The sun has shined today on the head of Sister G. Glory be Her Name!


----------



## cookiequeen (Jun 15, 2011)

Gerslay said:


> I, a conservative, agree that Ted Nugent's remarks were despicable, out-of-bounds, and entirely inappropriate not only to the president, but also to women.
> 
> Once upon a time I enjoyed his antics...but as of late, not so much. He's got problems!


 :thumbup: :thumbup: :thumbup:


----------



## Cindy S (Oct 20, 2013)

Gerslay said:


> I, a conservative, agree that Ted Nugent's remarks were despicable, out-of-bounds, and entirely inappropriate not only to the president, but also to women.
> 
> Once upon a time I enjoyed his antics...but as of late, not so much. He's got problems!


Yay!!! :thumbup: :thumbup: :thumbup:


----------



## knitpresentgifts (May 21, 2013)

Gerslay said:


> I, a conservative, agree that Ted Nugent's remarks were despicable, out-of-bounds, and entirely inappropriate not only to the president, but also to women.
> 
> Once upon a time I enjoyed his antics...but as of late, not so much. He's got problems!


I've not heard what he said and don't know much about him. I guess I'll have to check it out or will soon be hearing about it.


----------



## Poor Purl (Apr 14, 2011)

VocalLisa said:


> Nice try. But Purl was right.


Thanks, Lisa. There's one thing more annoying than petty arguments over things of no consequence, and that's arguing over those things with someone who can't follow the logic of the argument.


----------



## Poor Purl (Apr 14, 2011)

VocalLisa said:


> Given the roundness of her face and the hunchback, it looks to me the Airline would require TWO seats on a plane to prevent the "spill over" to the passenger seated next to her. No wonder she "looked into" purchasing a private jet once. The airlines wouldn't allow her on for fear the jet wouldn't be able to get off the tarmac.


*chuckle snort*


----------



## Poor Purl (Apr 14, 2011)

Lkholcomb said:


> That was Richard III, one of the York (white rose) kings. He was one one involved in the scandal/mystery surrounding the disappearance of his two nephews from the Tower who should have been next in the lineage. (these things just stick in my head, I don't know why, lol)
> 
> http://www.cnn.com/2013/02/03/world/europe/richard-iii-search-announcement/


You're right. I was off by one Plantagenet. Richard II was much duller but had a straight back, I think. And they stick in your head because they're important, unlike the arguments on this thread.


----------



## Lkholcomb (Aug 25, 2013)

Interesting, not one person on the anti-abortion side responded to my queries regarding the ethics of organ procurement vs. the ethics of abortion. Not one responded regarding the ethics of IVF in regards to abortion (which I remember actually being debated by those in the "pro-life" movement in my church way back when it was new).

It speaks volumes that not one has even bothered to approach the valid topics surrounding medical ethics in abortion, I think.


----------



## Poor Purl (Apr 14, 2011)

damemary said:


> I shall substitute 'ignorant pissah' for my names for her. I'd forgotten the phrase. And I love it.


Jan Brewer may be just an ignorant pissah, but she's _your_ ignorant pissah. Is it the heat that breeds all these politicians? It says a bunch that John McCain is the best of the lot.


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## Janet Cooke (Aug 14, 2013)

Lkholcomb said:


> Interesting, not one person on the anti-abortion side responded to my queries regarding the ethics of organ procurement vs. the ethics of abortion. Not one responded regarding the ethics of IVF in regards to abortion (which I remember actually being debated by those in the "pro-life" movement in my church way back when it was new).
> 
> It speaks volumes that not one has even bothered to approach the valid topics surrounding medical ethics in abortion, I think.


The reason for no response, My Dear Empress of the More Northern than East in the NorthEast, is because it isn't about ethics for so many, it is not about safety in health care, it is not about saving lives of babies. It is and always has been about punishing women who made "bad choices", had fun, enjoyed sex, were weak, or a dozen other labels that get slapped on the condition of having been caught out at being a sexually active person. 
They say it over and over when talking about "handouts". 
I cannot even begin to explain why anyone wants to punish another for having a little snuggle.


----------



## Janet Cooke (Aug 14, 2013)

Poor Purl said:


> Jan Brewer may be just an ignorant pissah, but she's _your_ ignorant pissah. Is it the heat that breeds all these politicians? It says a bunch that John McCain is the best of the lot.


But it is a dry heat, Empress, maybe they are dry roasted.


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## susanmos2000 (May 10, 2011)

Janet Cooke said:


> The reason for no response, My Dear Empress of the More Northern than East in the NorthEast, is because it isn't about ethics for so many, it is not about safety in health care, it is not about saving lives of babies. It is and always has been about punishing women who made "bad choices", had fun, enjoyed sex, were weak, or a dozen other labels that get slapped on the condition of having been caught out at being a sexually active person.
> They say it over and over when talking about "handouts".
> I cannot even begin to explain who anyone wants to punish another for having a little snuggle.


I'm sure it would be an exercise in futility, Janet--only the righties can explain their twisted logic. These pro-life mullahs shrilly and repeatedly condemn abortion as "murder", yet they're unwilling to kick an extra two dollars per month to make contraceptives available to all women and bring the rate of unintended pregnancy down.


----------



## Gerslay (Oct 4, 2011)

Lkholcomb said:


> Interesting, not one person on the anti-abortion side responded to my queries regarding the ethics of organ procurement vs. the ethics of abortion. Not one responded regarding the ethics of IVF in regards to abortion (which I remember actually being debated by those in the "pro-life" movement in my church way back when it was new).
> 
> It speaks volumes that not one has even bothered to approach the valid topics surrounding medical ethics in abortion, I think.


Truth be told I almost never read your posts. Its nothing against you personally its your writing style. For the most part your posts are too long...with long and densely packed paragraphs. If I can't capture what it is you're trying to get across in the first few sentences, I lose interest and move along.

Second, you often post late to the topic and many of us have moved on to other things and don't want to reopen a topic that seems to be concluding of its own weight.

Third, you're too nice. This thread should be renamed SWORL (Snarky Women of the Right and the Left). You might want to google "snarky quotes" and keep a page handy for those times when I throw down a Zinger and you raise with a Bazinga!

Just sayin!

Peace!


----------



## MaidInBedlam (Jul 24, 2012)

damemary said:


> It's less expensive than cosmetic surgery and hurts less. It may also bring a smile to your face.
> 
> But remember we just see you in our mind's eye. Do what you will just for yourself.


When I lived in Vancouver, BC in the 1990s, I went to a hairdresser who humorously kept suggesting I get a streak of "rock star blue" in my hair. Maybe I should do that now. :?::?::XD: :twisted: :?::?:


----------



## Janet Cooke (Aug 14, 2013)

MaidInBedlam said:


> When I lived in Vancouver, BC in the 1990s, I went to a hairdresser who humorously kept suggesting I get a streak of "rock star blue" in my hair. Maybe I should do that now. :?::?::XD: :twisted: :?::?:


Or maybe greens for spring would look nice.


----------



## damemary (Mar 14, 2012)

Very true. I believe that issues, their counterpoints and consequences all need to be examined.



Lkholcomb said:


> Interesting, not one person on the anti-abortion side responded to my queries regarding the ethics of organ procurement vs. the ethics of abortion. Not one responded regarding the ethics of IVF in regards to abortion (which I remember actually being debated by those in the "pro-life" movement in my church way back when it was new).
> 
> It speaks volumes that not one has even bothered to approach the valid topics surrounding medical ethics in abortion, I think.


----------



## damemary (Mar 14, 2012)

John McCain has tried everything, from Barry Goldwater to Tea Party (somewhat.) I've seen him sell his soul to the devil on occasion too.

At the end of Barry Goldwater's life, he was criticized by some in the GOP as too Liberal. (Go figure. ) I keep an eye on all of them. Currently like Krysten Simema and Ann Fitspatrick in AZ. Only time will tell.

I have noticed that this state's politics are changing quite a bit with influx of new residents and increases in minorities.



Poor Purl said:


> Jan Brewer may be just an ignorant pissah, but she's _your_ ignorant pissah. Is it the heat that breeds all these politicians? It says a bunch that John McCain is the best of the lot.


----------



## MaidInBedlam (Jul 24, 2012)

I was responding to one thing GrannyGoode said about how the LDS Church supports women with unwanted pregnancies. What she said seemed good to me. What she said, however, didn't go so far as talking about how her church might be supporting women after they have an abortion or choose to go through with having a child they didn't want.

I don't think anyone in the real world or here on KP has really said anything concrete about ongoing support of women who have an abortion or go through with an unwanted pregnancy. The pro-lifers in general seem to dwell all too much on making sure every pregnancy results in the birth of a child but they never say anything about better aid for these children. That really bothers me.

Right now, the kinds of aid a woman can find to help her take care of her and child are way too limited. The pro-life stance is limited in a way that leaves me disapproving of them. It's all well and good to support someone through a pregnancy or through the process of deciding to hava an abortion. It's the height of stupidity and lack of concern to fail to have a better set of plans to support mothers and children in any tangible way, or to act beyond their line of respectability and activities for women who chose abortion.

The entire subject of what *DOESN'T* happen after a woman has a child or an abortion and needs a variety of help is a mess. I don't think pro-lifers do anywhere near enough to extend kindnesses to women who chose to go through with an unwanted pregnancy or who aborted a pregnancy that they didn't want.

I could go on. The subject of what happens to someone who has an abortion or goes through with a pregnancy until a child is born gets me to rant and rave but I'm nor going to do any more of that right now, other than to say I think what you said is important and needs to be addressed in depth. Others who post here can carry on that discussion it they want to. Thanks for saying what you did say.


Janet Cooke said:


> I would be happier to hear that their love of God drives them to extend kindnesses to women who have aborted that pregnancy that they didn't want.
> It is pretty easy to be kind to people who follow your line of respectability and activities. It is a whole lot more representative of God to show love and acceptance to those who do what WE think God disapproves of.
> 
> As people who volunteer or contribute to Planned Parenthood and  to food banks, to agencies such as BirthRight and other agencies that help families with small children we are supporting any choice made by people who may have considered abortion.
> How about those anti-choice folks? How do they support women who weren't swayed to maintain their gestational status?


----------



## MaidInBedlam (Jul 24, 2012)

Double post.


----------



## damemary (Mar 14, 2012)

Janet Cooke said:


> But it is a dry heat, Empress, maybe they are dry roasted.


 :XD: :XD: :XD: :XD:


----------



## damemary (Mar 14, 2012)

Empress Lkholcomb, I always read your comments with interest. You always have such a well-reasoned point of view and you direct the discussion in interesting ways. Thanks for taking time to share.



Lkholcomb said:


> Interesting, not one person on the anti-abortion side responded to my queries regarding the ethics of organ procurement vs. the ethics of abortion. Not one responded regarding the ethics of IVF in regards to abortion (which I remember actually being debated by those in the "pro-life" movement in my church way back when it was new).
> 
> It speaks volumes that not one has even bothered to approach the valid topics surrounding medical ethics in abortion, I think.


----------



## damemary (Mar 14, 2012)

Now would be the perfect time to do it. (But please no tattoos or piercings. I don't think they age well, and heavens knows we don't want that. Getting old is tough enough as it is. )



MaidInBedlam said:


> When I lived in Vancouver, BC in the 1990s, I went to a hairdresser who humorously kept suggesting I get a streak of "rock star blue" in my hair. Maybe I should do that now. :?::?::XD: :twisted: :?::?:


----------



## MaidInBedlam (Jul 24, 2012)

Janet Cooke said:


> Or maybe greens for spring would look nice.


That may be the way to go. Maybe I could think of it as a way to encourage rain to fall on California and green it up properly. Where I live, the hills should have been emerald green for a couple of months. They're still brown. I have never seen this happen in my entire life. We're having a really serious, scary drought in this state.


----------



## damemary (Mar 14, 2012)

I hear it's President Obama's fault, but I don't believe it.

Ps. Purple is a pretty earth tone out here.



MaidInBedlam said:


> That may be the way to go. Maybe I could think of it as a way to encourage rain to fall on California and green it up properly. Where I live, the hills should have been emerald green for a couple of months. They're still brown. I have never seen this happen in my entire life. We're having a really serious, scary drought in this state.


----------



## MaidInBedlam (Jul 24, 2012)

If a person is brain dead, they're dead. Keeping them on life support long enough to harvest organs in the best condition possible seems like a pretty good thing to me.

I understand that sometimes when IVF results in a large number of fetuses (fetusi?) one or some may be aborted if a multiple birth is going to be difficult. I have a hard time with the fact that some women go to huge lengths to have a child when there are large numbers of children available for adoption.


Lkholcomb said:


> Interesting, not one person on the anti-abortion side responded to my queries regarding the ethics of organ procurement vs. the ethics of abortion. Not one responded regarding the ethics of IVF in regards to abortion (which I remember actually being debated by those in the "pro-life" movement in my church way back when it was new).
> 
> It speaks volumes that not one has even bothered to approach the valid topics surrounding medical ethics in abortion, I think.


----------



## Janet Cooke (Aug 14, 2013)

MaidInBedlam said:


> I was responding to one thing GrannyGood said about how the LDS Church supports women with unwanted pregnancies. What she said seemed good to me. What she said, however, didn't go so far as talking about how her church might be supporting women after they have an abortion or choose to go through with having a child they didn't want.
> 
> I don't think anyone in the real world or here on KP has really said anything concrete about ongoing support of women who have an abortion or go through with an unwanted pregnancy. The pro-lifers in general seem to dwell all too much on making sure every pregnancy results in the birth of a child but they never say anything about better aid for these children. That really bothers me.
> 
> ...


Thanks, MIB. 
You suggest some of the reasons that I continue to bring the "punishment" aspect and the post birth abandonment of families up repeatedly. 
None of us does everything that we could, we all fall into selfish behaviors and slide into a thoughtless mode from time to time. 
Maybe it needs to be thought of in the same way I think of the small amount of taxes I pay. My money goes to health and education and someone else can support the military industrial complex.


----------



## Poor Purl (Apr 14, 2011)

Janet Cooke said:


> But it is a dry heat, Empress, maybe they are dry roasted.


That's nuts!


----------



## Janet Cooke (Aug 14, 2013)

Poor Purl said:


> That's nuts!


Sometimes I feel like a ...


----------



## MaidInBedlam (Jul 24, 2012)

Janet Cooke said:


> Thanks, MIB.
> You suggest some of the reasons that I continue to bring the "punishment" aspect and the post birth abandonment of families up repeatedly.
> None of us does everything that we could, we all fall into selfish behaviors and slide into a thoughtless mode from time to time.
> Maybe it needs to be thought of in the same way I think of the small amount of taxes I pay. My money goes to health and education and someone else can support the military industrial complex.


 We're all imperfect, so I'm not worried about everyone doing everything they could to make this world a better place. Instead, I hope as many people as possible will act for the good. I consider this to be an example of my foolishly high ideals.ops:  When I was still paying taxes I really wished I could designate what they were used for, especially when some of my taxes automatically went to support the US war machine


----------



## MaidInBedlam (Jul 24, 2012)

I meant to add that I think it was a tragic moment in human evolution when we figured out that sperm was a necessary element of reproduction, and that the darned little wrigglers also determined the sex of babies. If women were considered solely and absolutely responsible for carrying on the existence of the human species we might get a bit more respect.(Yes, I'm being a bit silly, but I think I'm describing a good thing, too.)


Janet Cooke said:


> Thanks, MIB.
> You suggest some of the reasons that I continue to bring the "punishment" aspect and the post birth abandonment of families up repeatedly.
> None of us does everything that we could, we all fall into selfish behaviors and slide into a thoughtless mode from time to time.
> Maybe it needs to be thought of in the same way I think of the small amount of taxes I pay. My money goes to health and education and someone else can support the military industrial complex.


----------



## Poor Purl (Apr 14, 2011)

Lkholcomb said:


> Interesting, not one person on the anti-abortion side responded to my queries regarding the ethics of organ procurement vs. the ethics of abortion. Not one responded regarding the ethics of IVF in regards to abortion (which I remember actually being debated by those in the "pro-life" movement in my church way back when it was new).
> 
> It speaks volumes that not one has even bothered to approach the valid topics surrounding medical ethics in abortion, I think.


Here, Lk, is your answer: you're too serious, too informed, too polite. In other words, your posts make people think, and we ain't havin' none o' that.



Gerslay said:


> Truth be told I almost never read your posts. Its nothing against you personally its your writing style. For the most part your posts are too long...with long and densely packed paragraphs. If I can't capture what it is you're trying to get across in the first few sentences, I lose interest and move along.
> 
> Second, you often post late to the topic and many of us have moved on to other things and don't want to reopen a topic that seems to be concluding of its own weight.
> 
> ...


I'd be embarrassed to admit to that, but then I'm just an ignorant, unsaved non-Christian. (And if I were Gernslay, I'd be embarrassed to refer to my facetious but often unfunny remarks as "Zinger"s.)

I've asked a different question along the same lines and not even gotten a snarky answer: if the law cannot force the parents of a post-born, living child who needs a kidney transplant to surrender one of theirs (assuming compatibility), why should it be able to force the (female) parent of a fetus to surrender her entire body to the needs of that fetus?

The reason they don't answer your question or mine is that they'd need to use reason rather than religion, something they seem to be incapable of.


----------



## Poor Purl (Apr 14, 2011)

susanmos2000 said:


> I'm sure it would be an exercise in futility, Janet--only the righties can explain their twisted logic. These pro-life mullahs shrilly and repeatedly condemn abortion as "murder", yet they're unwilling to kick an extra two dollars per month to make contraceptives available to all women and bring the rate of unintended pregnancy down.


Allow women to enjoy sex with no negative consequences? You must be kidding.


----------



## Poor Purl (Apr 14, 2011)

damemary said:


> John McCain has tried everything, from Barry Goldwater to Tea Party (somewhat.) I've seen him sell his soul to the devil on occasion too.
> 
> At the end of Barry Goldwater's life, he was criticized by some in the GOP as too Liberal. (Go figure. ) I keep an eye on all of them. Currently like Krysten Simema and Ann Fitspatrick in AZ. Only time will tell.
> 
> I have noticed that this state's politics are changing quite a bit with influx of new residents and increases in minorities.


I remember the Johnson-Goldwater campaign very well (it was my first presidential vote). We all thought G was over the top. But he was nowhere near as crazy as today's "conservatives," whom he wouldn't have regarded as conservatives. At least Goldwater knew who he was and where he stood; McCain doesn't have that self-knowledge.


----------



## Lkholcomb (Aug 25, 2013)

Janet Cooke said:


> The reason for no response, My Dear Empress of the More Northern than East in the NorthEast, is because it isn't about ethics for so many, it is not about safety in health care, it is not about saving lives of babies. It is and always has been about punishing women who made "bad choices", had fun, enjoyed sex, were weak, or a dozen other labels that get slapped on the condition of having been caught out at being a sexually active person.
> They say it over and over when talking about "handouts".
> I cannot even begin to explain why anyone wants to punish another for having a little snuggle.


Yes, I do believe that is why so many don't even want to talk about it. I have brought it up with people in real life as well and once presented with the ethics considerations and familiarity with other situations they have a glazed over look in their eyes. Their pamphlets didn't cover it. And that's not being mean, these are people who could practically quote the pamphlets front to back. But when the harder questions of medical ethics (and medical ethics is harder in my opinion that your run of the mill ethics) they just don't know what to say. I honestly think it is a telling show of how many more conservative religions stifle the thinking process.


----------



## damemary (Mar 14, 2012)

Poor Purl said:


> That's nuts!


 :XD: :XD: :XD: :XD: :XD: Good one Purl.


----------



## damemary (Mar 14, 2012)

Janet Cooke said:


> Sometimes I feel like a ...


 :XD: :XD: :XD: :XD: :XD: :XD: Tag team humor! I love it.


----------



## damemary (Mar 14, 2012)

So sorry. Duplicate posts. I have a handicap in controlling my hand at times.



Janet Cooke said:


> Sometimes I feel like a ...


 :XD: :XD: :XD: :XD: :XD: :XD: Tag team humor! I love it.


----------



## damemary (Mar 14, 2012)

Janet Cooke said:


> Sometimes I feel like a ...


 :XD: :XD: :XD: :XD: :XD: :XD: Tag team humor! I love it.


----------



## damemary (Mar 14, 2012)

Janet Cooke said:


> Sometimes I feel like a ...


 :XD: :XD: :XD: :XD: :XD: :XD: Tag team humor! I love it.


----------



## damemary (Mar 14, 2012)

Janet Cooke said:


> Sometimes I feel like a ...


 :XD: :XD: :XD: :XD: :XD: :XD: Tag team humor! I love it.


----------



## damemary (Mar 14, 2012)

Janet Cooke said:


> Sometimes I feel like a ...


 :XD: :XD: :XD: :XD: :XD: :XD: Tag team humor! I love it.


----------



## damemary (Mar 14, 2012)

Janet Cooke said:


> Sometimes I feel like a ...


 :XD: :XD: :XD: :XD: :XD: :XD: Tag team humor! I love it.


----------



## Poor Purl (Apr 14, 2011)

MaidInBedlam said:


> I was responding to one thing GrannyGoode said about how the LDS Church supports women with unwanted pregnancies. What she said seemed good to me. What she said, however, didn't go so far as talking about how her church might be supporting women after they have an abortion or choose to go through with having a child they didn't want.
> 
> I don't think anyone in the real world or here on KP has really said anything concrete about ongoing support of women who have an abortion or go through with an unwanted pregnancy. The pro-lifers in general seem to dwell all too much on making sure every pregnancy results in the birth of a child but they never say anything about better aid for these children. That really bothers me.
> 
> ...


Thank you for this post. It should give rise to some thought on the part of the anti-abortion crowd. So far all I've seen is adoption, though not every baby is adoptable, and not every woman - having carried a pregnancy to term and lived through the birth of her child - could so easily give it over to someone else.

In fact, given the excuses found to cut food stamps and welfare, you'd think they want the incidence of abortion to rise.


----------



## Poor Purl (Apr 14, 2011)

damemary said:


> Now would be the perfect time to do it. (But please no tattoos or piercings. I don't think they age well, and heavens knows we don't want that. Getting old is tough enough as it is. )


Also, please no little-old-lady blue hair. There are probably no canasta games where Empress Maid lives.


----------



## Lkholcomb (Aug 25, 2013)

Gerslay said:


> Truth be told I almost never read your posts. Its nothing against you personally its your writing style. For the most part your posts are too long...with long and densely packed paragraphs. If I can't capture what it is you're trying to get across in the first few sentences, I lose interest and move along.
> 
> Second, you often post late to the topic and many of us have moved on to other things and don't want to reopen a topic that seems to be concluding of its own weight.
> 
> ...


Interesting that you find a topic that is heavy in medical ethics, yet you don't read posts because they are too long or you can't capture the concept in the first couple sentences. Medical ethics (actually any ethics) is a longer drawn out discussion. Medical ethics especially is too complicated of an issue to capture in a couple sentences. Of course I have been having these discussion regarding medical ethics for a long time (hazard of the medical profession). I suppose one unfamiliar with it would not understand the complicated nature.

Many people pop in here and there to check the threads. Very few stay on the computer awaiting every post as it posts.

My dear, I am very familiar with snarkiness. I am sorry I mistakenly thought that perhaps this was an actual discussion on the topic title (War on Women) and the ensuing abortion debate. I was actually taught how to debate properly, and proper debating does not include name-calling, snarkiness, or just nastiness. I have had proper interactions with some on here, but when an actual issue is raised regarding the abortion issue the conservative, anti-abortion is rather quiet or chooses then to attack others.

And still, you have not given me your feelings regarding those topics I addressed. You obviously read the post you responded to, but yet again have failed to address the issue raised. I have had actual debates and discussions with anti-abortion people regarding these issues, yet here it is sadly lacking.

Just sayin'!


----------



## damemary (Mar 14, 2012)

Poor Purl said:


> I remember the Johnson-Goldwater campaign very well (it was my first presidential vote). We all thought G was over the top. But he was nowhere near as crazy as today's "conservatives," whom he wouldn't have regarded as conservatives. At least Goldwater knew who he was and where he stood; McCain doesn't have that self-knowledge.


I agree 100%. Goldwater scared the dickens out of me when he was running for President. Johnson too, for that matter. I was so young I may have paid too much attention to the ads. (Remember the daisy and the mushroom cloud?)

As an adult when Goldwater was in his twilight years, I found him refreshing. Did he age, or did I, or both? (Age as in maturing.)


----------



## damemary (Mar 14, 2012)

Sometimes I think they consider these as 'trick questions' rather than as legitimate considerations.



Lkholcomb said:


> Yes, I do believe that is why so many don't even want to talk about it. I have brought it up with people in real life as well and once presented with the ethics considerations and familiarity with other situations they have a glazed over look in their eyes. Their pamphlets didn't cover it. And that's not being mean, these are people who could practically quote the pamphlets front to back. But when the harder questions of medical ethics (and medical ethics is harder in my opinion that your run of the mill ethics) they just don't know what to say. I honestly think it is a telling show of how many more conservative religions stifle the thinking process.


----------



## damemary (Mar 14, 2012)

Thank you. You always leave me thinking. (A good thing.)



Lkholcomb said:


> Interesting that you find a topic that is heavy in medical ethics, yet you don't read posts because they are too long or you can't capture the concept in the first couple sentences. Medical ethics (actually any ethics) is a longer drawn out discussion. Medical ethics especially is too complicated of an issue to capture in a couple sentences. Of course I have been having these discussion regarding medical ethics for a long time (hazard of the medical profession). I suppose one unfamiliar with it would not understand the complicated nature.
> 
> Many people pop in here and there to check the threads. Very few stay on the computer awaiting every post as it posts.
> 
> ...


----------



## Poor Purl (Apr 14, 2011)

damemary said:


> I agree 100%. Goldwater scared the dickens out of me when he was running for President. Johnson too, for that matter. I was so young I may have paid too much attention to the ads. (Remember the daisy and the mushroom cloud?)
> 
> As an adult when Goldwater was in his twilight years, I found him refreshing. Did he age, or did I, or both? (Age as in maturing.)


Probably a combination of the two. He became less extreme as he aged.

John Dean seems to have adored him, and still says nice things about him, though Dean has little nice to say about today's "conservatives."


----------



## Lkholcomb (Aug 25, 2013)

MaidInBedlam said:


> I was responding to one thing GrannyGoode said about how the LDS Church supports women with unwanted pregnancies. What she said seemed good to me. What she said, however, didn't go so far as talking about how her church might be supporting women after they have an abortion or choose to go through with having a child they didn't want.
> 
> I don't think anyone in the real world or here on KP has really said anything concrete about ongoing support of women who have an abortion or go through with an unwanted pregnancy. The pro-lifers in general seem to dwell all too much on making sure every pregnancy results in the birth of a child but they never say anything about better aid for these children. That really bothers me.
> 
> ...


I find many anti-abortion people send their donation money to "pro-life" groups who use it for the purpose of making abortion illegal and scaring women into not having abortions (sometimes through direct intimidation) and they don't have any extra to give to other charities (I have been told this directly by the people who donated).

Interestingly a while ago I had a friend who put out a call for help (through Facebook) for an anonymous person who had gotten pregnant. She was a single mom of two and held a job just making ends meet. She didn't want to have an abortion but felt that she had no choice not to if she could not get a certain amount of money to live on during the time she would lose for maternity. She had seriously thought and did the math to figure out how much she needed. The person herself did not ask for money, but had confided in a friend and they told the person posting (someone I trust). She was just asking if people could help with just a little in some way. The people who got on there and left comments about her "killing her baby" and "she should have thought of this before she got pregnant" were numerous. One single pro-life person got on there and said she would help. She told the rest off. She told them that she pro-life and she was helping because she was pro-life and that if others were pro-life they should save the sermons and do what they could to actually help. I could have kissed her (she is another friend). But it didn't even slow the other nasty comments. It was a really sad thing.


----------



## Lkholcomb (Aug 25, 2013)

damemary said:


> Empress Lkholcomb, I always read your comments with interest. You always have such a well-reasoned point of view and you direct the discussion in interesting ways. Thanks for taking time to share.


Thank you, I always enjoy discussing things with you as you have intelligent discussions as well.


----------



## Lkholcomb (Aug 25, 2013)

MaidInBedlam said:


> If a person is brain dead, they're dead. Keeping them on life support long enough to harvest organs in the best condition possible seems like a pretty good thing to me.
> 
> I understand that sometimes when IVF results in a large number of fetuses (fetusi?) one or some may be aborted if a multiple birth is going to be difficult. I have a hard time with the fact that some women go to huge lengths to have a child when there are large numbers of children available for adoption.


And that with being brain dead is the crux of it. Very early pregnancies have no nervous or brain development yet, but people don't want to taken them "off life support" but don't have the ethical issue with their child, who has been born and lived, having organs harvested while technically alive.

I think people go to such great lengths to have "their" child and because healthy (and especially white) babies are not as common in the system. So many people don't want to adopt and older child or one with difficulties. I think their logic fails in that they may not even get a healthy child by giving birth to one. It is really a luck of the draw.


----------



## Lkholcomb (Aug 25, 2013)

MaidInBedlam said:


> We're all imperfect, so I'm not worried about everyone doing everything they could to make this world a better place. Instead, I hope as many people as possible will act for the good. I consider this to be an example of my foolishly high ideals.ops:  When I was still paying taxes I really wished I could designate what they were used for, especially when some of my taxes automatically went to support the US war machine


John Lewis (Atlanta, Georgia representative) has put forth a bill to allow tax payers to conscientiously object to war with their taxes. They can't not pay them, but their taxes would be spent elsewhere. Sadly I don't see it going through with this congress, but I truly hope one day it does.


----------



## Lkholcomb (Aug 25, 2013)

Poor Purl said:


> I'd be embarrassed to admit to that, but then I'm just an ignorant, unsaved non-Christian. (And if I were Gernslay, I'd be embarrassed to refer to my facetious but often unfunny remarks as "Zinger"s.)
> 
> I've asked a different question along the same lines and not even gotten a snarky answer: if the law cannot force the parents of a post-born, living child who needs a kidney transplant to surrender one of theirs (assuming compatibility), why should it be able to force the (female) parent of a fetus to surrender her entire body to the needs of that fetus?
> 
> The reason they don't answer your question or mine is that they'd need to use reason rather than religion, something they seem to be incapable of.


 :thumbup:


----------



## knitpresentgifts (May 21, 2013)

Gerslay said:


> Truth be told I almost never read your posts. Its nothing against you personally its your writing style. For the most part your posts are too long...with long and densely packed paragraphs. If I can't capture what it is you're trying to get across in the first few sentences, I lose interest and move along.
> 
> Second, you often post late to the topic and many of us have moved on to other things and don't want to reopen a topic that seems to be concluding of its own weight.


Gerslay, I agree somewhat with what you wrote. I didn't answer nor discuss because I never read her original questioning post. Prior, I've suffered through many of her very long posts, and even attempted a few discussions with her. She didn't stay on topic any time nor answer the questions or answer logically.

Also, I find not only do I not agree with most of her beliefs, she bores me to death, is unable to stay focused on the topic at hand, but also tries to parlay unrelated examples or twist others' words from the original discussion, doesn't use logic and tells us what Christians believe when she doesn't understand what they believe (I am one as you know) and she isn't one.

Roll that all together, and you'll know why I don't have interest or time for such foolishness as with most posters from the Lib side of the aisle posting in this thread; I do not read nor engage with most of what they post.

I'm interested in discussion with those from any side and any beliefs who can focus on the topic at hand and bring meaningful thought, logic, facts and discussion to the table without the snark and hateful behavior.

Besides, the War on Women for me doesn't exist and is not about medical procedures, abortion rights or organ donating/harvesting or whatever she wanted to discuss.


----------



## Lkholcomb (Aug 25, 2013)

Poor Purl said:


> Thank you for this post. It should give rise to some thought on the part of the anti-abortion crowd. So far all I've seen is adoption, though not every baby is adoptable, and not every woman - having carried a pregnancy to term and lived through the birth of her child - could so easily give it over to someone else.
> 
> In fact, given the excuses found to cut food stamps and welfare, you'd think they want the incidence of abortion to rise.


The reasons we were given in the church I went to a long time ago went along the lines of:

Abortion is the greater crime against man and god and is more important

The dads should just step up and support the kids

If women were such ho's they wouldn't have the problem (ok, that was my paraphrasing,  )

But it is all a deflection of the actual truth that they are ignoring a big part of Jesus' message. You know the whole, "if you see a man who has no coat and you have two give him one" and "that which you do unto the least of these you do unto me" message.

Apparently we just didn't read the fine print that said:

"Void this message if at some point in the future when you discover sperm and egg meet to form a zygote and progress, if implanted, to a fetus and then baby and people discover that you can stop the progression through chemical and medical means to stop that progression (not the herbals in use in Jesus' time that you can use up until the "quickening" per the old testament). Should this occur, screw the hungry, homeless, clotheless, and woman and children and give all your money to ensure that they stop this practice."

(I'm thinking I need to go to sleep, lol, I was up all night and my posts are getting a bit more colorful than normal, lol)


----------



## Lkholcomb (Aug 25, 2013)

damemary said:


> Sometimes I think they consider these as 'trick questions' rather than as legitimate considerations.


I think so. I don't think they are aware that hospitals and medical associations have actual ethics committees that address topics in such a manner.


----------



## Lkholcomb (Aug 25, 2013)

knitpresentgifts said:


> Gerslay, I agree somewhat with what you wrote. I didn't answer nor discuss because I never read her original questioning post. Prior, I've suffered through many of her very long posts, and even attempted a discussion with her. She didn't stay on topic any time nor answer the questions or answer logically.
> 
> Also, I find not only do I not agree with most of her beliefs, she bores me to death, is unable to stay focused on the topic at hand, but also tries to parlay unrelated examples or twist others' words from the original discussion, doesn't use logic and tells us what Christians believe when she doesn't understand what they believe (I am one as you know) and she isn't one.
> 
> ...


The "lengthy" posts with the discussions



> I wonder, are most post-abortion folks also against IVF? In IVF te eggs are fertilized in a lab and the best ones are transferred or frozen, but some are discarded. Then if some are frozen, that doesn't allow the "life" to live.


~page 117



> Sadly I have known people who do very strongly believe this. Amazingly even though they quote opinions about the woman not surviving even with abortion or that they can make both of them survive the science behind it is missing. I know many women who have sadly had to have abortions or they would have died long before the fetus would be at a viable stage. Since it was a pregnancy disease it would be "cured" by an abortion. Many of these are women who desperately wanted a child, some who had gone to great lengths to even get pregnant. It is a sad situation and not one that a person who has never had to face should be passing quick judgements over.
> 
> I wonder though if these same people are opposed to organ donation? Organs are procured while the person is still on life support, but is brain dead. Very early in pregnancy there is no brain to be tested to check for brain signals and as far as I know there has been no EEG's performed to prove that a fetus is in fact brain functioning or when it begins. So it would follow that the same rules would apply for brain dead people as it applied to an early pregnancy. And reaction to pain does not denote a thinking response. Pain reaction is a reflex and even people who are brain dead react to pain (how they react is an indication of how brain damaged or functioning they are).


~page 76

As for the topic of the post I refer to the original post by Joeysmomma (a much lengthier post than mine above), as you see abortion is THE topic:



> I know this is a controversial subject and I will be called all sorts of names by the liberals and progressives. I found this article this morning and it needed to be shared. If this will save the life of one baby, all the name calling will be worth it.
> 
> It's the Body Count That Counts in the 'War on Women'
> 
> ...


----------



## Cindy S (Oct 20, 2013)

KPG said "Besides, the War on Women for me doesn't exist and is not about medical procedures, abortion rights or organ donating/harvesting or whatever she wanted to discuss."

Amazing! Why would you waste your precious time if the subject of this thread doesn't exist for you? And yet you have something to say about the subject here almost daily.


----------



## damemary (Mar 14, 2012)

I didn't know that about John Dean. He was a hero of mine from Watergate.



Poor Purl said:


> Probably a combination of the two. He became less extreme as he aged.
> 
> John Dean seems to have adored him, and still says nice things about him, though Dean has little nice to say about today's "conservatives."


----------



## knitpresentgifts (May 21, 2013)

Cindy S said:


> KPG said "Besides, the War on Women for me doesn't exist and is not about medical procedures, abortion rights or organ donating/harvesting or whatever she wanted to discuss."
> 
> Amazing! Why would you waste your precious time if the subject of this thread doesn't exist for you? And yet you have something to say about the subject here almost daily.


Amazing, Cindy, that after more than 300 pages of posts you have no idea what the original subject of this thread is.

The Liberals concocted the phrase "WOW" and the war isn't on women but the babies killed by women (and men who often assist).

It is not a waste of my time to add my support, opinion and resources to stop the killing as I have done on this thread.

How unfortunate you didn't notice the war going on, the 55 million aborted babies and counting (that is known) even though you've presumably read the 300+ pages of this thread alone.

The very first post told you what the topic of this thread is, and yet it went right over your head.

You'd rather battle with snark and insult me than do something useful in the real war.

BTW: Learn to comprehend what you read. I didn't say abortion doesn't exist (which you imply is the topic of this thread); I said the WOW for me isn't about abortion "rights" (and other things). Learn the difference before you attempt to insult me again.


----------



## damemary (Mar 14, 2012)

You have the weight of the world on your shoulders. Thanks for the perspective.



Lkholcomb said:


> I find many anti-abortion people send their donation money to "pro-life" groups who use it for the purpose of making abortion illegal and scaring women into not having abortions (sometimes through direct intimidation) and they don't have any extra to give to other charities (I have been told this directly by the people who donated).
> 
> Interestingly a while ago I had a friend who put out a call for help (through Facebook) for an anonymous person who had gotten pregnant. She was a single mom of two and held a job just making ends meet. She didn't want to have an abortion but felt that she had no choice not to if she could not get a certain amount of money to live on during the time she would lose for maternity. She had seriously thought and did the math to figure out how much she needed. The person herself did not ask for money, but had confided in a friend and they told the person posting (someone I trust). She was just asking if people could help with just a little in some way. The people who got on there and left comments about her "killing her baby" and "she should have thought of this before she got pregnant" were numerous. One single pro-life person got on there and said she would help. She told the rest off. She told them that she pro-life and she was helping because she was pro-life and that if others were pro-life they should save the sermons and do what they could to actually help. I could have kissed her (she is another friend). But it didn't even slow the other nasty comments. It was a really sad thing.


----------



## damemary (Mar 14, 2012)

Thank you. I'm honored.



Lkholcomb said:


> Thank you, I always enjoy discussing things with you as you have intelligent discussions as well.


----------



## damemary (Mar 14, 2012)

How true. A case of blind hope over possibility.



Lkholcomb said:


> And that with being brain dead is the crux of it. Very early pregnancies have no nervous or brain development yet, but people don't want to taken them "off life support" but don't have the ethical issue with their child, who has been born and lived, having organs harvested while technically alive.
> 
> I think people go to such great lengths to have "their" child and because healthy (and especially white) babies are not as common in the system. So many people don't want to adopt and older child or one with difficulties. I think their logic fails in that they may not even get a healthy child by giving birth to one. It is really a luck of the draw.


----------



## damemary (Mar 14, 2012)

Lkholcomb said:


> John Lewis (Atlanta, Georgia representative) has put forth a bill to allow tax payers to conscientiously object to war with their taxes. They can't not pay them, but their taxes would be spent elsewhere. Sadly I don't see it going through with this congress, but I truly hope one day it does.


 :thumbup: :thumbup: :thumbup: :thumbup: :thumbup: It would make me very happy.


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## Lkholcomb (Aug 25, 2013)

Cindy S said:


> KPG said "Besides, the War on Women for me doesn't exist and is not about medical procedures, abortion rights or organ donating/harvesting or whatever she wanted to discuss."
> 
> Amazing! Why would you waste your precious time if the subject of this thread doesn't exist for you? And yet you have something to say about the subject here almost daily.


 :thumbup:


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## damemary (Mar 14, 2012)

I'm enjoying your posts....even more colorful than usual...especially in contrast with KPG's comment.

Take a nap and feel better.



Lkholcomb said:


> The reasons we were given in the church I went to a long time ago went along the lines of:
> 
> Abortion is the greater crime against man and god and is more important
> 
> ...


----------



## knitpresentgifts (May 21, 2013)

Lkholcomb said:


> :thumbup:


Good - I did read this post of yours.

You, too, have no idea the purpose of this thread from the OP.

You simply choose to agree with another without a clue.

Two peas in a pod.


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## Lkholcomb (Aug 25, 2013)

Cindy S said:


> KPG said "Besides, the War on Women for me doesn't exist and is not about medical procedures, abortion rights or organ donating/harvesting or whatever she wanted to discuss."
> 
> Amazing! Why would you waste your precious time if the subject of this thread doesn't exist for you? And yet you have something to say about the subject here almost daily.


As I'm sure you saw above the original post, in the first paragraph's concluding sentence states, "If this will save the life of one baby, all the name calling will be worth it." So it did definately begin with the topic of abortion. I must wonder why some seem inclined to deny it now, interesting really.


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## Cindy S (Oct 20, 2013)

Lkholcomb said:


> As I'm sure you saw above the original post, in the first paragraph's concluding sentence, "If this will save the life of one baby, all the name calling will be worth it." So it did definately begin with the topic of abortion. I must wonder why some seem inclined to deny it now, interesting really.


Inability to comprehend what she reads??


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## damemary (Mar 14, 2012)

I don't think of lkholcomb as a pea in a pod (??) She is an intelligent person with experience in health care ethics. That is more pertinent to the discussion than KPG's flaming ego. IMHO


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## damemary (Mar 14, 2012)

Inability to accept anything that does not further inflate her ego? It really should explode one of these days.



Cindy S said:


> Inability to comprehend what she reads??


----------



## Lkholcomb (Aug 25, 2013)

damemary said:


> I don't think of lkholcomb as a pea in a pod (??) She is an intelligent person with experience in health care ethics. That is more pertinent to the discussion than KPG's flaming ego. IMHO


Pea in a pod..... That's funny! I find I tend to have different views that a lot of people. I don't think there is one person on here I agree 100% with. My husband laughed at the pea in a pod comment. It's just more deflection from the actual discussion.


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## Cindy S (Oct 20, 2013)

Lkholcomb said:


> Pea in a pod..... That's funny! I find I tend to have different views that a lot of people. I don't think there is one person on here I agree 100% with. My husband laughed at the pea in a pod comment. It's just more deflection from the actual discussion.


Oh, I don't know, if I have to be a pea in a pod, I would be proud to share the pod with you.


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## MarilynKnits (Aug 30, 2011)

There has been an ongoing war on women throughout the ages. So many laws to marginalize and trivialize women, to make men their "guardians", to "protect them from the stress of managing their own money". Men, being larger, physically stronger, and more aggressive through the effects of male hormones, have used their strengths to keep women subservient. As time has progressed and brains and patience became more viable tools, women have become more able to prevail on some levels. Of course there are some women in politics who are enemies of ideas that would truly benefit women. But we have learned that not all women are bright, strong, and clear thinkers. Pity the stupid among us and try to save having them do us (as the larger aggregate) much harm.

Men make lovely pets, but poor masters.

And I am convinced that after G-d made man, the reason he (she?) made woman was because he (she?) decided he could do better. 

And now I am off to knit for a while.


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## knitpresentgifts (May 21, 2013)

Lkholcomb said:


> As I'm sure you saw above the original post, in the first paragraph's concluding sentence states, "If this will save the life of one baby, all the name calling will be worth it." So it did definately begin with the topic of abortion. I must wonder why some seem inclined to deny it now, interesting really.


I read another of your posts which PROVES _ exactly_ what I recently said about you. You twisted my words and use no logic nor understanding of the topic at hand.

I *never* said the topic wasn't abortion, now, did I?

I *said* the WOW (as nicknamed by the Libs) *does not exist* for *ME*, and *was not * the OP's topic. The OP doesn't believe there is a WOW either - the OP wants to stop abortions or the WAR on BABIES.

Get a clue, it is *you* who is in denial and without the ability to understand what is being discussed.


----------



## knitpresentgifts (May 21, 2013)

Cindy S said:


> Inability to comprehend what she reads??


Thanks for quoting me, applies to you and LKH however.


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## knitpresentgifts (May 21, 2013)

Lkholcomb said:


> Pea in a pod..... That's funny! I find I tend to have different views that a lot of people. I don't think there is one person on here I agree 100% with. My husband laughed at the pea in a pod comment. It's just more deflection from the actual discussion.


Get some rest in your pod then.

BTW: you've got company


----------



## Janet Cooke (Aug 14, 2013)

damemary said:


> :XD: :XD: :XD: :XD: :XD: :XD: Tag team humor! I love it.


Playing tag team without us? Not five pages at least!


----------



## Janet Cooke (Aug 14, 2013)

knitpresentgifts said:


> Gerslay, I agree somewhat with what you wrote. I didn't answer nor discuss because I never read her original questioning post. Prior, I've suffered through many of her very long posts, and even attempted a few discussions with her. She didn't stay on topic any time nor answer the questions or answer logically.
> 
> Also, I find not only do I not agree with most of her beliefs, she bores me to death, is unable to stay focused on the topic at hand, but also tries to parlay unrelated examples or twist others' words from the original discussion, doesn't use logic and tells us what Christians believe when she doesn't understand what they believe (I am one as you know) and she isn't one.
> 
> ...


We can celebrate another marvelous Christian.


----------



## Cindy S (Oct 20, 2013)

Janet Cooke said:


> We can celebrate another marvelous Christian.


Pass


----------



## Cheeky Blighter (Nov 20, 2011)

Janet Cooke said:


> Sometimes I feel like a ...


Sometimes I don't...


----------



## Poor Purl (Apr 14, 2011)

Cindy S said:


> KPG said "Besides, the War on Women for me doesn't exist and is not about medical procedures, abortion rights or organ donating/harvesting or whatever she wanted to discuss."
> 
> Amazing! Why would you waste your precious time if the subject of this thread doesn't exist for you? And yet you have something to say about the subject here almost daily.


How could she get attention if she didn't post on this and other threads? There aren't many threads devoted to her, how she looks, what she believes (?), what she thinks of people who think/believe/look differently, and which people are lying when she doesn't understand what they've said.


----------



## Poor Purl (Apr 14, 2011)

damemary said:


> I didn't know that about John Dean. He was a hero of mine from Watergate.


I think Dean roomed at boarding school with a son or grandson of Goldwater (it may have been college, but I think it was earlier than that) and spent a lot of time at his roommate's home. He was taken under Goldwater's wing; this may have lasted past law school. Anyway, he has said he loved BG. Wherever he learned how to be a person of principle, he learned well.


----------



## Cheeky Blighter (Nov 20, 2011)

Poor Purl said:


> I'd be embarrassed to admit to that, but then I'm just an ignorant, unsaved non-Christian. (And if I were Gernslay, I'd be embarrassed to refer to my facetious but often unfunny remarks as "Zinger"s.)
> 
> I've asked a different question along the same lines and not even gotten a snarky answer: if the law cannot force the parents of a post-born, living child who needs a kidney transplant to surrender one of theirs (assuming compatibility), why should it be able to force the (female) parent of a fetus to surrender her entire body to the needs of that fetus?
> 
> The reason they don't answer your question or mine is that they'd need to use reason rather than religion, something they seem to be incapable of.


You hit the nail on the head,Purl. Their religion is in black and white and to me totally lacking in compassion. It certainly frees one of any personal responsibility for one's own actions and makes it so much easier to hurt and judge others harshly. I see so many women judging other women and not a word about the moral obligations or responsibilities of men and it is tragic. I don't see Christianity as a religion kind to women but truly is waging a war on us and too many Christian women are active participants. Christianity really has done a lot to contributing to women seeing themselves as second class in society but I guess when you have an all male hierarchy that's what you end up with.


----------



## Poor Purl (Apr 14, 2011)

Lkholcomb said:


> Pea in a pod..... That's funny! I find I tend to have different views that a lot of people. I don't think there is one person on here I agree 100% with. My husband laughed at the pea in a pod comment. It's just more deflection from the actual discussion.


It is (or was) a brand of maternity clothes, making it very relevant to this discussion.


----------



## Poor Purl (Apr 14, 2011)

MarilynKnits said:


> There has been an ongoing war on women throughout the ages. So many laws to marginalize and trivialize women, to make men their "guardians", to "protect them from the stress of managing their own money". Men, being larger, physically stronger, and more aggressive through the effects of male hormones, have used their strengths to keep women subservient. As time has progressed and brains and patience became more viable tools, women have become more able to prevail on some levels. Of course there are some women in politics who are enemies of ideas that would truly benefit women. But we have learned that not all women are bright, strong, and clear thinkers. Pity the stupid among us and try to save having them do us (as the larger aggregate) much harm.
> 
> Men make lovely pets, but poor masters.
> 
> ...


This deserves recognition, though I can't think of a good-enough reply, except maybe

:thumbup: :thumbup: :thumbup: :thumbup: :thumbup: :thumbup:

Enjoy the knitting.


----------



## Cheeky Blighter (Nov 20, 2011)

Poor Purl said:


> Also, please no little-old-lady blue hair. There are probably no canasta games where Empress Maid lives.


Purl you brought back a funny memory. My dear granny had beautiful pastel blue hair and I always hoped that when I was old I would have such beautiful hair. She and her sisters all played Canasta on Sunday afternoons and they all had beautiful pastel colored hair. Thanks for the memories. :-D


----------



## Poor Purl (Apr 14, 2011)

Cheeky Blighter said:


> You hit the nail on the head,Purl. Their religion is in black and white and to me totally lacking in compassion. It certainly frees one of any personal responsibility for one's own actions and makes it so much easier to hurt and judge others harshly. I see so many women judging other women and not a word about the moral obligations or responsibilities of men and it is tragic. I don't see Christianity as a religion kind to women but truly is waging a war on us and too many Christian women are active participants. Christianity really has done a lot to contributing to women seeing themselves as second class in society but I guess when you have an all male hierarchy that's what you end up with.


I don't know whether I entirely agree with you, Cheeky. The Catholic Church, definitely male-dominated, has evolved considerably over its near-2,000-year history. Some Protestant denominations include women among their leaders, very liberal women. Even Orthodox Judaism has shown an ability to change its views and its practices with regard to women.

So I wouldn't damn all of Christianity, though the faith as practiced on KP seems to be rigid, unkind, and moralistic without being moral.


----------



## Poor Purl (Apr 14, 2011)

Cheeky Blighter said:


> Purl you brought back a funny memory. My dear granny had beautiful pastel blue hair and I always hoped that when I was old I would have such beautiful hair. She and her sisters all played Canasta on Sunday afternoons and they all had beautiful pastel colored hair. Thanks for the memories. :-D


It was my pleasure. I still often see them walking around the neighborhood or taking a bus. They all have standing appointments at the hairdresser's, whose supply of dyes seems to include those pastels.


----------



## Poor Purl (Apr 14, 2011)

Janet Cooke said:


> We can celebrate another marvelous Christian.


Neither, I.


----------



## Cheeky Blighter (Nov 20, 2011)

Poor Purl said:


> Probably a combination of the two. He became less extreme as he aged.
> 
> John Dean seems to have adored him, and still says nice things about him, though Dean has little nice to say about today's "conservatives."


Goldwater impressed me as a lot more intelligent than most of today's Republicans. I think he did mellow a bit as he got older but I have always been wary of anyone associated with the John Birch Society.


----------



## Janet Cooke (Aug 14, 2013)

Lkholcomb wrote...The "lengthy" posts with the discussions...

and there you have the disingenuous response (at best) 
as excuse from one who has made saving babies her one true cause. 
I do think that the Guernsey woman can be excused as she did admit that her battle on behalf of children is not based in logic or some thought process that she went through in order to determine which position to take. She has told us that it is a matter of faith. 
She could just as easily be set on a course of convincing people that the moon is reconstituted bleu cheese, it would be as helpful to little ones.


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## Poor Purl (Apr 14, 2011)

Lkholcomb said:


> I find many anti-abortion people send their donation money to "pro-life" groups who use it for the purpose of making abortion illegal and scaring women into not having abortions (sometimes through direct intimidation) and they don't have any extra to give to other charities (I have been told this directly by the people who donated).
> 
> Interestingly a while ago I had a friend who put out a call for help (through Facebook) for an anonymous person who had gotten pregnant. She was a single mom of two and held a job just making ends meet. She didn't want to have an abortion but felt that she had no choice not to if she could not get a certain amount of money to live on during the time she would lose for maternity. She had seriously thought and did the math to figure out how much she needed. The person herself did not ask for money, but had confided in a friend and they told the person posting (someone I trust). She was just asking if people could help with just a little in some way. The people who got on there and left comments about her "killing her baby" and "she should have thought of this before she got pregnant" were numerous. One single pro-life person got on there and said she would help. She told the rest off. She told them that she pro-life and she was helping because she was pro-life and that if others were pro-life they should save the sermons and do what they could to actually help. I could have kissed her (she is another friend). But it didn't even slow the other nasty comments. It was a really sad thing.


When you think of how frightening it must be to be pregnant at a time when you're penniless, alone, and raising children already, why would you want to make her life even worse? _You_ wouldn't, but those women who would much rather hate the sinner, and try to make her feel even worse than she does, can't possibly have souls. Or, at any rate, souls that don't already belong to the devil. Boy, are they in for an unpleasant surprise (assuming there is a Judgment Day, which I don't believe for a minute). It's Janet's cartoon all over again.

At some early point on one of the Obamacare threads, a woman got on with one of the horror stories Faux is always giving us, except she believed it was true and was at a loss what to do. A few on the left tried to help her with advice so she'd know how great - or small - the actual problem would be. The answer from the right: That's how it's going to be under Obamacare. No attempt to ease the woman's stress; just the political point and "tough noogies."


----------



## Poor Purl (Apr 14, 2011)

Janet Cooke said:


> Lkholcomb wrote...The "lengthy" posts with the discussions...
> 
> and there you have the disingenuous response (at best)
> as excuse from one who has made saving babies her one true cause.
> ...


You've got her number. (A pretty low number, by all appearances.)


----------



## Poor Purl (Apr 14, 2011)

Lkholcomb said:


> The reasons we were given in the church I went to a long time ago went along the lines of:
> 
> Abortion is the greater crime against man and god and is more important
> 
> ...


If this is how clever you are when sleepy, I can't wait to see you well rested.


----------



## Poor Purl (Apr 14, 2011)

Cheeky Blighter said:


> Goldwater impressed me as a lot more intelligent than most of today's Republicans. I think he did mellow a bit as he got older but I have always been wary of anyone associated with the John Birch Society.


As we all should be. They're resurfacing now, making politics a minefield.


----------



## Poor Purl (Apr 14, 2011)

damemary said:


> I didn't know that about John Dean. He was a hero of mine from Watergate.


This is what Wikipedia says about him and Goldwater: "After graduation, he joined a law firm in Washington, D.C.[which?] Having gone to prep school with the son[which?] of Barry Goldwater, he was a close friend of the senator and his family.[clarification needed]"

But you really have to get over to the page itself, to see the picture of Dean in 1972: http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/John_Dean


----------



## MarilynKnits (Aug 30, 2011)

My high school social studies teacher referred to them as the Birch John Society. Then he laughed and said "Oops, Freudian slip" - ri-i-ight! Yeah, I graduated high school 61 years ago so they have been lurking for a while.


----------



## Janet Cooke (Aug 14, 2013)

Poor Purl said:


> As we all should be. They're resurfacing now, making politics a minefield.


All this time I thought that the dinosaurs were extinct.


----------



## damemary (Mar 14, 2012)

MarilynKnits said:


> There has been an ongoing war on women throughout the ages. So many laws to marginalize and trivialize women, to make men their "guardians", to "protect them from the stress of managing their own money". Men, being larger, physically stronger, and more aggressive through the effects of male hormones, have used their strengths to keep women subservient. As time has progressed and brains and patience became more viable tools, women have become more able to prevail on some levels. Of course there are some women in politics who are enemies of ideas that would truly benefit women. But we have learned that not all women are bright, strong, and clear thinkers. Pity the stupid among us and try to save having them do us (as the larger aggregate) much harm.
> 
> Men make lovely pets, but poor masters.
> 
> ...


 :thumbup: :thumbup: :thumbup: :thumbup: :thumbup: :thumbup: :thumbup: :thumbup: :thumbup: :thumbup: :thumbup: :thumbup: :thumbup: Well put.


----------



## damemary (Mar 14, 2012)

Sticky fingers compounded by the fact that this system does not allow me to interrupt....or am I missing something? (Mine shows five duplicates, not five pages. Is it different?)



Janet Cooke said:


> Playing tag team without us? Not five pages at least!


----------



## damemary (Mar 14, 2012)

Or feed them to the lions.



Janet Cooke said:


> We can celebrate another marvelous Christian.


----------



## damemary (Mar 14, 2012)

Couldn't help myself. I must have mixed my snorts and snarks.



Cindy S said:


> Pass


----------



## damemary (Mar 14, 2012)

I find it depends on the company.



Cheeky Blighter said:


> Sometimes I don't...


----------



## damemary (Mar 14, 2012)

Polictics corrupts even the good ones. IMHO



Poor Purl said:


> I think Dean roomed at boarding school with a son or grandson of Goldwater (it may have been college, but I think it was earlier than that) and spent a lot of time at his roommate's home. He was taken under Goldwater's wing; this may have lasted past law school. Anyway, he has said he loved BG. Wherever he learned how to be a person of principle, he learned well.


----------



## damemary (Mar 14, 2012)

Reasonable position. Thanks for sharing.



Cheeky Blighter said:


> You hit the nail on the head,Purl. Their religion is in black and white and to me totally lacking in compassion. It certainly frees one of any personal responsibility for one's own actions and makes it so much easier to hurt and judge others harshly. I see so many women judging other women and not a word about the moral obligations or responsibilities of men and it is tragic. I don't see Christianity as a religion kind to women but truly is waging a war on us and too many Christian women are active participants. Christianity really has done a lot to contributing to women seeing themselves as second class in society but I guess when you have an all male hierarchy that's what you end up with.


----------



## damemary (Mar 14, 2012)

I thought of that also!



Poor Purl said:


> It is (or was) a brand of maternity clothes, making it very relevant to this discussion.


----------



## damemary (Mar 14, 2012)

Marilynknits has made a valuable contribution to the discussion.



Poor Purl said:


> This deserves recognition, though I can't think of a good-enough reply, except maybe
> 
> :thumbup: :thumbup: :thumbup: :thumbup: :thumbup: :thumbup:
> 
> Enjoy the knitting.


----------



## damemary (Mar 14, 2012)

Janet Cooke said:


> Lkholcomb wrote...The "lengthy" posts with the discussions...
> 
> and there you have the disingenuous response (at best)
> as excuse from one who has made saving babies her one true cause.
> ...


 :XD: :XD: :XD: :XD: :XD:


----------



## damemary (Mar 14, 2012)

Poor Purl said:


> If this is how clever you are when sleepy, I can't wait to see you well rested.


 :thumbup: :thumbup: :thumbup: :thumbup: Any time. Any condition. A breath of fresh truth.


----------



## Cheeky Blighter (Nov 20, 2011)

Cindy S said:


> Inability to comprehend what she reads??


That and no compassion for other women. I wonder how many children she has given birth to, how many abortions she has had that she can sit in judgement on other women and the heart wrenching decisions they make, many times all alone. As they say, walk a mile in my shoes before you tell me or anyone else what is ethical or moral. Judge not lest you be judged. Isn't that important? I am so proud of the intelligence and empathy that the women on the left have shown on this thread and I thank you for your speaking truth to the outright lies and ignorance coming from the right.


----------



## damemary (Mar 14, 2012)

Over the years, many extreme organizations strove to effect the outcomes of elections. The difference now is the size of their war chests and the impunity with which they use them.



Poor Purl said:


> As we all should be. They're resurfacing now, making politics a minefield.


----------



## Poor Purl (Apr 14, 2011)

Janet Cooke said:


> All this time I thought that the dinosaurs were extinct.


 :XD: :XD: :XD: :XD: :XD:


----------



## damemary (Mar 14, 2012)

Poor Purl said:


> This is what Wikipedia says about him and Goldwater: "After graduation, he joined a law firm in Washington, D.C.[which?] Having gone to prep school with the son[which?] of Barry Goldwater, he was a close friend of the senator and his family.[clarification needed]"
> 
> But you really have to get over to the page itself, to see the picture of Dean in 1972: http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/John_Dean


Hard not to feel sorry for that fresh-faced idealistic lad, knowing what the future holds for him. (For me, anyway.)


----------



## damemary (Mar 14, 2012)

Janet Cooke said:


> All this time I thought that the dinosaurs were extinct.


 :XD: :XD: :XD: :XD:


----------



## damemary (Mar 14, 2012)

Cheeky Blighter said:


> That and no compassion for other women. I wonder how many children she has given birth to, how many abortions she has had that she can sit in judgement on other women and the heart wrenching decisions they make, many times all alone. As they say, walk a mile in my shoes before you tell me or anyone else what is ethical or moral. Judge not lest you be judged. Isn't that important? I am so proud of the intelligence and empathy that the women on the left have shown on this thread and I thank you for your speaking truth to the outright lies and ignorance coming from the right.


That's why I do this. I refuse to let lies stand unanswered.


----------



## Poor Purl (Apr 14, 2011)

MarilynKnits said:


> My high school social studies teacher referred to them as the Birch John Society. Then he laughed and said "Oops, Freudian slip" - ri-i-ight! Yeah, I graduated high school 61 years ago so they have been lurking for a while.


Uh-oh. You have a few years on me, and KPG called me an "old fool." I hate to think what name she'll make up for you.


----------



## Poor Purl (Apr 14, 2011)

damemary said:


> Sticky fingers compounded by the fact that this system does not allow me to interrupt....or am I missing something? (Mine shows five duplicates, not five pages. Is it different?)


No more than two pages. KP must love your messages; it keeps repeating them.


----------



## Poor Purl (Apr 14, 2011)

damemary said:


> Or feed them to the lions.


 :mrgreen: :mrgreen: :mrgreen: :mrgreen: :mrgreen:


----------



## Poor Purl (Apr 14, 2011)

damemary said:


> Marilynknits has made a valuable contribution to the discussion.


She usually does. She's very clever.


----------



## Poor Purl (Apr 14, 2011)

damemary said:


> I thought of that also!


Of course. I was surprised nobody beat me to it, but you're two hours behind me (in time zones, nothing else).


----------



## Poor Purl (Apr 14, 2011)

Cheeky Blighter said:


> That and no compassion for other women. I wonder how many children she has given birth to, how many abortions she has had that she can sit in judgement on other women and the heart wrenching decisions they make, many times all alone. As they say, walk a mile in my shoes before you tell me or anyone else what is ethical or moral. Judge not lest you be judged. Isn't that important? I am so proud of the intelligence and empathy that the women on the left have shown on this thread and I thank you for your speaking truth to the outright lies and ignorance coming from the right.


It's to speak truth to those lies and ignorance that we keep coming back. It's certainly not to get into some dumb argument with KPG or LTL or someone like that.


----------



## Poor Purl (Apr 14, 2011)

damemary said:


> Hard not to feel sorry for that fresh-faced idealistic lad, knowing what the future holds for him. (For me, anyway.)


Doesn't he look about 16 in that picture? But it was taken in 1972, when he was already a lawyer in Nixonland. I think he once gave as a reason for giving evidence against the admin that his "youthful good looks" would have made a prison sentence a real hardship for him.


----------



## sallycarr (Nov 5, 2013)

Did you know more black babies were aborted in NYC in 2013 than were born alive?


----------



## Poor Purl (Apr 14, 2011)

damemary said:


> Over the years, many extreme organizations strove to effect the outcomes of elections. The difference now is the size of their war chests and the impunity with which they use them.


I don't know how rich the Birchers are. They've been replaced by Heritage and the Kochs.


----------



## Janet Cooke (Aug 14, 2013)

sallycarr said:


> Did you know more black babies were aborted in NYC in 2013 than were born alive?


Interesting question, do you have documentation that shows that?
BTW, did you know that babies are not aborted?


----------



## Poor Purl (Apr 14, 2011)

sallycarr said:


> Did you know more black babies were aborted in NYC in 2013 than were born alive?


Source, please.


----------



## Janet Cooke (Aug 14, 2013)

Poor Purl said:


> I don't know how rich the Birchers are. They've been replaced by Heritage and the Kochs.


I think of it as a huge old Oak split by lightning.


----------



## Janet Cooke (Aug 14, 2013)

Poor Purl said:


> Source, please.


I cannot imagine that in February of 2014 that figures for 2013 are available. It just doesn't work that way.


----------



## Poor Purl (Apr 14, 2011)

sallycarr said:


> Did you know more black babies were aborted in NYC in 2013 than were born alive?


According to the Kaiser Family Foundation, New York State doesn't keep abortion statistics by race. How did you find this out?


----------



## Poor Purl (Apr 14, 2011)

Janet Cooke said:


> I cannot imagine that in February of 2014 that figures for 2013 are available. It just doesn't work that way.


The only way to have such a number so soon is for someone to stand outside every clinic and count them as they happen (like exit polls). So one more lie, which will now spread among the entire crew.


----------



## sallycarr (Nov 5, 2013)

the year was 2012.

http://www.infowars.com/nyc-more-black-babies-killed-by-abortion-than-born/


----------



## Janet Cooke (Aug 14, 2013)

Poor Purl said:


> The only way to have such a number so soon is for someone to stand outside every clinic and count them as they happen (like exit polls). So one more lie, which will now spread among the entire crew.


Maybe Margaret Sanger came back from the dead.


----------



## Poor Purl (Apr 14, 2011)

sallycarr said:


> the year was 2012.
> 
> http://www.infowars.com/nyc-more-black-babies-killed-by-abortion-than-born/


Ah, yes, Alex Jones. The great conspiracy theorist. I doubt that any respectable statistical information will give that result.


----------



## SQM (Jun 22, 2012)

Who is Alex Jones? Statistics can lie; I know that as a truth.

Who is Sally Carr? She is hiding and has only posted 5 times. Should we be honored or drive her away?


----------



## Poor Purl (Apr 14, 2011)

SQM said:


> Who is Alex Jones? Statistics can lie; I know that as a truth.
> 
> Who is Sally Carr? She is hiding and has only posted 5 times. Should we be honored or drive her away?


Alex Jones is a conspiracy RWN. Click on her link and you'll see how believable he is.

Who cares who Sally Carr is. I (who unfortunately answered her) say she deserves to be ignored for posting a message that couldn't possibly be true.


----------



## Janet Cooke (Aug 14, 2013)

sallycarr said:


> the year was 2012.
> 
> http://www.infowars.com/nyc-more-black-babies-killed-by-abortion-than-born/


Welcome to the Forum, sallycarr. 
I will have to review this when I am less tired, I guess. 
I didn't even see a reference to induced abortions.


----------



## galinipper (Apr 30, 2013)

..


----------



## galinipper (Apr 30, 2013)

...


----------



## SQM (Jun 22, 2012)

Poor Purl said:


> Alex Jones is a conspiracy RWN. Click on her link and you'll see how believable he is.
> 
> Who cares who Sally Carr is. I (who unfortunately answered her) say she deserves to be ignored for posting a message that couldn't possibly be true.


I would prefer to sort socks or clean the litter box than to listen to fascists spew their she-it.

I am always curious about people. The Secret Service were on my block this afternoon and I had tons of fun chatting with them. Did you know they started out as an anti-counterfeit org. in the Civil War?

Maybe the Carr has something interesting about her aside from her delusional political views.


----------



## galinipper (Apr 30, 2013)

... pc problem


----------



## Lkholcomb (Aug 25, 2013)

Cindy S said:


> Oh, I don't know, if I have to be a pea in a pod, I would be proud to share the pod with you.


Why thank you 
;-)


----------



## Janet Cooke (Aug 14, 2013)

SQM said:


> I would prefer to sort socks or clean the litter box than to listen to fascists spew their she-it.
> 
> I am always curious about people. The Secret Service were on my block this afternoon and I had tons of fun chatting with them. Did you know they started out as an anti-counterfeit org. in the Civil War?
> 
> Maybe the Carr has something interesting about her aside from her delusional political views.


I am guessing that one of the most interesting things about her is her landing on this thread after five posts in all the time she has been a member, to be so quickly joined by the person sporting the Sarah Palin HO heels. 
Just a coincidence, I am sure.


----------



## SQM (Jun 22, 2012)

Hmm! Another new neighbor moves into the block - a nipper. Must we nip her in the bud?

Loved your warm welcome to the Carr, Cooke. Did it open the floodgates to all the others? NIMBY!


----------



## Gerslay (Oct 4, 2011)

Lkholcomb:

It is so nteresting that you complain that the right isn't reading or commenting on your posts but when someone from the right explains why they're not reading your posts (because quite frankly it was so long as to approach tediousness) you complain about that also. You get all defensive and point the finger instead of possibly learning something that would make you more easily understood which would provide you with the stimulating debate that you claim you seek.

Interesting also that if you go back to when you posted those comments you'll see that no one from the left (your pals, your buds, your toadies) replied to you either to supply you with the stimulating debate that you claim you seek.

You didn't denigrate them for not responding, now did you?

Course not...you'd have to have some integrity to do that!


----------



## Janet Cooke (Aug 14, 2013)

galinipper said:


> ...


How interesting to see the same website that touts Sanger's alleged racist stance used as a highlight.


----------



## Janet Cooke (Aug 14, 2013)

Gerslay said:


> Lkholcomb:
> 
> It is so nteresting that you complain that the right isn't reading or commenting on your posts but when someone from the right explains why they're not reading your posts (because quite frankly it was so long as to approach tediousness) you complain about that also. You get all defensive and point the finger instead of possibly learning something that would make you more easily understood which would provide you with the stimulating debate that you claim you seek.
> 
> ...


You really do operate totally on faith, it seems; there isn't the flash of a single neuron, is there?


----------



## Lkholcomb (Aug 25, 2013)

knitpresentgifts said:


> I read another of your posts which PROVES _ exactly_ what I recently said about you. You twisted my words and use no logic nor understanding of the topic at hand.
> 
> I *never* said the topic wasn't abortion, now, did I?
> 
> ...


You did indeed say the topic wasn't abortion. To answer your question I use your post, on page 125



knitpresentgifts said:


> Gerslay, I agree somewhat with what you wrote. I didn't answer nor discuss because I never read her original questioning post. Prior, I've suffered through many of her very long posts, and even attempted a few discussions with her. She didn't stay on topic any time nor answer the questions or answer logically.
> 
> Also, I find not only do I not agree with most of her beliefs, she bores me to death, is unable to stay focused on the topic at hand, but also tries to parlay unrelated examples or twist others' words from the original discussion, doesn't use logic and tells us what Christians believe when she doesn't understand what they believe (I am one as you know) and she isn't one.
> 
> ...


----------



## Lkholcomb (Aug 25, 2013)

Poor Purl said:


> It is (or was) a brand of maternity clothes, making it very relevant to this discussion.


 :lol:


----------



## SQM (Jun 22, 2012)

Why Sister G. Hope you enjoyed your Sabbath and are filled with the heavenly love of the Gods. Try to maintain your spiritual holiness by not bitching for at least 3 posts. Of course your comrades are welcome here and we love to hear what they say since we all have a huge supply of barf bags sitting next to our #2 circulars.


----------



## Gerslay (Oct 4, 2011)

SQM said:


> Who is Sally Carr? She is hiding and has only posted 5 times. Should we be honored or drive her away?


???

Sort of like VocalLisa who became a new member and within 30 minutes found herself in one of the most controversial threads and began ranting and raging about Mitt Romney's black grandchild.

Oh I forgot...she's not a racist, right? She wasn't exploiting the racial issue for her own personal political agenda now was she?

???

Uh huh!


----------



## Gerslay (Oct 4, 2011)

SQM said:


> Why Sister G. Hope you enjoyed your Sabbath and are filled with the heavenly love of the Gods. Try to maintain your spiritual holiness by not bitching for at least 3 posts. Of course your comrades are welcome here and we love to hear what they say since we all have a huge supply of barf bags sitting next to our #2 circulars.


I changed your name...its SQUIRM!


----------



## Lkholcomb (Aug 25, 2013)

Poor Purl said:


> When you think of how frightening it must be to be pregnant at a time when you're penniless, alone, and raising children already, why would you want to make her life even worse? _You_ wouldn't, but those women who would much rather hate the sinner, and try to make her feel even worse than she does, can't possibly have souls. Or, at any rate, souls that don't already belong to the devil. Boy, are they in for an unpleasant surprise (assuming there is a Judgment Day, which I don't believe for a minute). It's Janet's cartoon all over again.
> 
> At some early point on one of the Obamacare threads, a woman got on with one of the horror stories Faux is always giving us, except she believed it was true and was at a loss what to do. A few on the left tried to help her with advice so she'd know how great - or small - the actual problem would be. The answer from the right: That's how it's going to be under Obamacare. No attempt to ease the woman's stress; just the political point and "tough noogies."


Yup, it's kicking them when they are down.

I say come judgement day I'll bring the beer and you bring the popcorn (you know how easy it will be to make that when we are roasting in hell.... It should be their official food, no river Styx put a river of popcorn, lol) we will have quite the show.


----------



## Lkholcomb (Aug 25, 2013)

Janet Cooke said:


> Lkholcomb wrote...The "lengthy" posts with the discussions...
> 
> and there you have the disingenuous response (at best)
> as excuse from one who has made saving babies her one true cause.
> ...


 :thumbup:


----------



## SQM (Jun 22, 2012)

Maybe the Carr and Lisa are the same person, also.


----------



## Cheeky Blighter (Nov 20, 2011)

Poor Purl said:


> It's to speak truth to those lies and ignorance that we keep coming back. It's certainly not to get into some dumb argument with KPG or LTL or someone like that.


 :thumbup: :thumbup: :thumbup:


----------



## Gerslay (Oct 4, 2011)

Janet Cooke said:


> You really do operate totally on faith, it seems; there isn't the flash of a single neuron, is there?


Your a coward...you hide behind VocalLisa and let her do your dirty work for you.

Grow a pair of your own!


----------



## SQM (Jun 22, 2012)

Cooke hiding behind anyone? You make me laugh. Sister G - you are sinking into ungodliness with nasty comments. Try to maintain the presence of the Holy Spirit for at least one post. Say something nice to us.


----------



## west coast kitty (May 26, 2012)

Poor Purl said:


> Alex Jones is a conspiracy RWN. Click on her link and you'll see how believable he is.
> 
> Who cares who Sally Carr is. I (who unfortunately answered her) say she deserves to be ignored for posting a message that couldn't possibly be true.


I haven't a clue who Alex Jones is but I did click on the pdf link referrenced in the report published by NY Dept of Health -

....The report is entitled, Summary of Vital Statistics 2012 The City of New York, Pregnancy Outcomes, and was prepared by the New York City Department of Health and Mental Hygiene, Office of Vital Statistics. (See Pregnancy Outcomes NYC Health 2012.pdf)....... You can verify the pdf yourself

There is a lot of interesting information about maternal health, pre natal health, and various statistics - including the table mentioned by the previous poster. Unless the NY Health Dept is publishing incorrect numbers, they are in fact inconsistent with what was posted.


----------



## Cheeky Blighter (Nov 20, 2011)

Poor Purl said:


> It's to speak truth to those lies and ignorance that we keep coming back. It's certainly not to get into some dumb argument with KPG or LTL or someone like that.


We certainly couldn't get into an intelligent discussion. Everything is "closed" on the right.


----------



## MarilynKnits (Aug 30, 2011)

You are making me blush. Just calls 'em like I see 'em.

It really is funny that we broad minded people are labeled "libs" by the people whose reactions are consistently far right. From what I have seen, we are thinkers, liberal minded or more conservative as the situation warrants. I feel sorry for people who are incapable of thinking for themselves and deciding whether to take a more or less moderate view.

I was raised in a very Democrat family, spent my most formative years in a very conservative community, and married into a Republican family. I have learned to keep my own counsel when political issues arise. I roll my eyes internally hearing how bigoted some people are or how gullible others are.

A thread like this is so interesting, seeing how it brings out the worst in some people and the best in others. It really must be pushing some hot buttons to be on volume #3, having hit over 300 pages since the OP. Should be heading to #4 before long, unless Admin picks herself up off the floor and stops laughing long enough to cut it off.

But I read in the paper this weekend that half the people surveyed in a poll don't believe in the science of evolution. And there is still a flat Earth society. Unreal.



Poor Purl said:


> She usually does. She's very clever.


----------



## Lkholcomb (Aug 25, 2013)

Poor Purl said:


> According to the Kaiser Family Foundation, New York State doesn't keep abortion statistics by race. How did you find this out?


There have been commercials around here as of late regarding by an organization specializing in the "statistics" of racial divide with abortion. I wonder if this could be the source.


----------



## Gerslay (Oct 4, 2011)

SQM said:


> Cooke hiding behind anyone? You make me laugh. Sister G - you are sinking into ungodliness with nasty comments. Try to maintain the presence of the Holy Spirit for at least one post. Say something nice to us.


I've said many 'nice' things, SQUIRM...most recently to Lkholcomb to give her a heads up as to what she can do if she really wants a sincere debate (which I doubt she really wants, it was just another ploy)...and before that a decent comment about Ted Nugent.

I guess you missed them.


----------



## galinipper (Apr 30, 2013)

SQM said:


> Hmm! Another new neighbor moves into the block - a nipper. Must we nip her in the bud?


No, just a drive-by, nip if you need to.


----------



## rocky1991 (May 8, 2011)

Janet Cooke said:


> Welcome to the Forum, sallycarr.
> I will have to review this when I am less tired, I guess.
> I didn't even see a reference to induced abortions.


Any articles that starts with: NYC: More Black Babies Killed by Abortion Than Born
is suspect in my book. It sounds as if "babies" are being killed. Alex Jones also said that the US government was involved in the Oklahoma City bombing. To be taken with a grain of salt.


----------



## Janet Cooke (Aug 14, 2013)

SQM said:


> Cooke hiding behind anyone? You make me laugh. Sister G - you are sinking into ungodliness with nasty comments. Try to maintain the presence of the Holy Spirit for at least one post. Say something nice to us.


I thought that VocalLisa and I were one and the same. 
I also think that person you refer to in the ever so wrapped in the love of God verbiage is a fantastic example of Christian love and humility. 
I think that she said something nice yesterday. 
I do believe she had her fingers crossed.

BTW, did you have a chance to look up any cuter than cute patterns yet?


----------



## Gerslay (Oct 4, 2011)

Janet Cooke said:


> I thought that VocalLisa and I were one and the same.
> I also think that person you refer to in the ever so wrapped in the love of God verbiage is a fantastic example of Christian love and humility.
> I think that she said something nice yesterday.
> I do believe she had her fingers crossed.
> ...


I've never seen anyone on the left apologize to anyone on the right. I've never seen anyone on the left agree with any statement from anyone on the right. I've never seen anyone on the left be 'nice' to anyone on the right.

Never one time. Not one!

Do you honestly think that none of the above was ever called for or required from any of you?

Bunch of finger-pointing hypocrites, every one!


----------



## Lkholcomb (Aug 25, 2013)

Gerslay said:


> Lkholcomb:
> 
> It is so nteresting that you complain that the right isn't reading or commenting on your posts but when someone from the right explains why they're not reading your posts (because quite frankly it was so long as to approach tediousness) you complain about that also. You get all defensive and point the finger instead of possibly learning something that would make you more easily understood which would provide you with the stimulating debate that you claim you seek.
> 
> ...


As commented before, medical ethics is always long. It's the nature of the beast, as one familiar with it understands.

My "lengthy" posts were actual #1 a few sentences and #2 two paragraphs long. In fact they were shorter than your above post!

I did not ask a question of the left, but of the anti-abortion side. As well on the more recent one a left person did indeed respond Susan2000.

I am still quite interested in your points regarding the 2 medical ethics regarding abortion issues. Still no actual response to it. I would be greatly interested in your prose in debating, so I may change my style to the most effective format should mine be inadequate. So please demonstrate, unless you adhere to the philosophy of, "do what I say, not what I do" regarding proper debate form.


----------



## SQM (Jun 22, 2012)

To the older sister I never had Cooke - I cannot really imagine knitting any type of cloths be they for face or dish. What I could use tho is a pattern for an adult bib. Tired of wearing a store bought dishtowel around my neck.

I think Carr drove away and the Nipper might have left too. Quelle dommage!


----------



## Gerslay (Oct 4, 2011)

Lkholcomb said:


> As commented before, medical ethics is always long. It's the nature of the belief.
> 
> My "lengthy" posts were actual #1 a few sentences and #2 two paragraphs long. In fact they were shorter than your above post!
> 
> ...


I'm not interested. I notice that you don't respond to all of my posts and I assume that's because you are also not interested. However, I'm the one who is not complaining or whining about it.


----------



## Janet Cooke (Aug 14, 2013)

Gerslay said:


> I've never seen anyone on the left apologize to anyone on the right. I've never seen anyone on the left agree with any statement from anyone on the right. I've never seen anyone on the left be 'nice' to anyone on the right.
> 
> Never one time. Not one!
> 
> ...


I really don't give a chit what you have seen.

I thought you wouldn't respond directly to my posts. 
I just complimented your wonderful portrayal of a Christian woman.


----------



## Lkholcomb (Aug 25, 2013)

Janet Cooke said:


> You really do operate totally on faith, it seems; there isn't the flash of a single neuron, is there?


I'm excited, apparently I have toadies! Who knew? Lol :lol:


----------



## SQM (Jun 22, 2012)

I will now say something nice about the right.

________________________________________________

I am thinking.
__________________________________________________

I am trying.
___________________________________________________

I got it! 

Right and write are homophones and the right is homophobic. 

Did I write, right?


----------



## Wombatnomore (Dec 9, 2013)

Well, well, well! Isn't this interesting? You've all abandoned the Obamacare is working thread quite abruptly haven't you? It's now on page 5 of the chit-chat section. Funny that....

So here you all are continuing your oneupmanship with the usual tactics - intimidate, taunt, chastise, acting like it's your thread and your thread only and woe betide anyone who dares to invade. 

Pull your heads in.


----------



## Janet Cooke (Aug 14, 2013)

Gerslay said:


> I'm not interested. I notice that you don't respond to all of my posts and I assume that's because you are also not interested. However, I'm the one who is not complaining or whining about it.


She was neither complaining nor whining. 
Lkholcomb commented that not one person who would be on the anti-choice side bothered to respond. 
You had to be disrespectful in a response. 
Three day old doggie dinner.


----------



## Gerslay (Oct 4, 2011)

No, but I see you've been wearing your brown lipstick again.

SQUIRM >>> TOADY IN WAITING!


----------



## Gerslay (Oct 4, 2011)

Janet Cooke said:


> She was neither complaining nor whining.
> Lkholcomb commented that not one person who would be on the anti-choice side bothered to respond.
> You had to be disrespectful in a response.
> Three day old doggie dinner.


Didn't you read...NOT INTERESTED!


----------



## Janet Cooke (Aug 14, 2013)

Gerslay said:


> No, but I see you've been wearing your brown lipstick again.
> 
> SQUIRM >>> TOADY IN WAITING!


You would know about brown lipstick, I am sure. 
Could you explain what that would refer to?
A bronze I can appreciate with the right skin tones...


----------



## SQM (Jun 22, 2012)

No More - I am sure you have been taught to at least say Hello when you enter a room before the vitriol begins.

So start over.


----------



## Cheeky Blighter (Nov 20, 2011)

Poor Purl said:


> I don't know whether I entirely agree with you, Cheeky. The Catholic Church, definitely male-dominated, has evolved considerably over its near-2,000-year history. Some Protestant denominations include women among their leaders, very liberal women. Even Orthodox Judaism has shown an ability to change its views and its practices with regard to women.
> 
> So I wouldn't damn all of Christianity, though the faith as practiced on KP seems to be rigid, unkind, and moralistic without being moral.


No, not damning all of Christianity. Just the Catholic church the church I was raised in. The Catholic church has millions of very liberal and progressive women so it is the church not the women who are holding them back. We were married by a friend who came to the U.S. from England so she could be an ordained priest in the Episcopal church as the Anglican church she grew up in was still not ordaining women. I also lived with very liberal Corondelet nuns as a young woman. They desired ordination but were not allowed the privilege of this sacrament. I am well aware that there are Protestant churches and the various branches of Judaism permit women to be ordained rabbis. That makes it all the more frustrating and hurtful to me as someone raised in that religion that the church still does not see fit to allow women ordination.


----------



## Lkholcomb (Aug 25, 2013)

west coast kitty said:


> I haven't a clue who Alex Jones is but I did click on the pdf link referrenced in the report published by NY Dept of Health -
> 
> ....The report is entitled, Summary of Vital Statistics 2012 The City of New York, Pregnancy Outcomes, and was prepared by the New York City Department of Health and Mental Hygiene, Office of Vital Statistics. (See Pregnancy Outcomes NYC Health 2012.pdf)....... You can verify the pdf yourself
> 
> There is a lot of interesting information about maternal health, pre natal health, and various statistics - including the table mentioned by the previous poster. Unless the NY Health Dept is publishing incorrect numbers, they are in fact inconsistent with what was posted.


I looked also, I'm interested did you find the requirements regarding reporting? Like if they are required to report abortion statistics are they required to report the racial information as well or is that part optional. That could, and has in the past, skewed many a report. Not the fault of the reporting agency of course, but one reason why reporting methods are so important to report.

I was quite interested and excited to see that the overall abortion rate has been declining. That's good news, don't you agree?


----------



## Janet Cooke (Aug 14, 2013)

Wombatnomore said:


> Well, well, well! Isn't this interesting? You've all abandoned the Obamacare is working thread quite abruptly haven't you? It's now on page 5 of the chit-chat section. Funny that....
> 
> So here you all are continuing your oneupmanship with the usual tactics - intimidate, taunt, chastise, acting like it's your thread and your thread only and woe betide anyone who dares to invade.
> 
> Pull your heads in.


Be good if you pulled your head out... it appears to be stuck up your butt.


----------



## SQM (Jun 22, 2012)

actually if SQUIRM is me, I do indeed wear brown lipstick. Scarey that she knows.

The only reference to brown lipstick I can remember was in Bonfire of the Vanities, I think. Otherwise, the reference has gone under my head.


----------



## west coast kitty (May 26, 2012)

joeysomma said:


> "Unless the NY Health Dept is publishing incorrect numbers, they are in fact *inconsistent* with what was posted."
> 
> Do mean that the article is consistent with the statistics released by the NYC Health Department?


Sorry Joey - it was a typo on my part. The pdf of the NY Health statistics uses the same numbers as was posted by sallycarr. The report can be read directly by clicking on the pdf link - no need to read Alex Jones


----------



## Janet Cooke (Aug 14, 2013)

Lkholcomb said:


> I looked also, I'm interested did you find the requirements regarding reporting? Like if they are required to report abortion statistics are they required to report the racial information as well or is that part optional. That could, and has in the past, skewed many a report. Not the fault of the reporting agency of course, but one reason why reporting methods are so important to report.
> 
> I was quite interested and excited to see that the overall abortion rate has been declining. That's good news, don't you agree?


It will continue to decline as sensible people make use of access to a variety of effective birth control methods, I think. So wonder.


----------



## Gerslay (Oct 4, 2011)

SQM said:


> No More - I am sure you have been taught to at least say Hello when you enter a room before the vitriol begins.
> 
> So start over.


Stop telling me what to do.

Were you a school teacher?


----------



## Janet Cooke (Aug 14, 2013)

Gerslay said:


> Stop telling me what to do.
> 
> Were you a school teacher?


I think that she just recognizes you for a child.


----------



## SQM (Jun 22, 2012)

You are not No More. No more is the wombat or old bat or whatever. Was a teacher but not in school districts.


----------



## Gerslay (Oct 4, 2011)

Janet Cooke said:


> I think that she just recognizes you for a child.


Do you people EVER speak for yourselves?


----------



## Gerslay (Oct 4, 2011)

Downton Abbey...toodleoooooooo


----------



## SQM (Jun 22, 2012)

Cooke is just a faster typist than I am. And indeed I speak not only for myself but for reason and logic.


----------



## Cheeky Blighter (Nov 20, 2011)

Janet Cooke said:


> How interesting to see the same website that touts Sanger's alleged racist stance used as a highlight.


They have only a couple "sources" of propaganda Janet and those are suspect as regards their journalistic integrity. Are those "hooker" heels she is wearing. When the GOP had their convention in St. Paul all the working girls wore shoes just like those to simplify things for the guys attending the convention.
Gallinipper has been around before. Her name is that of a giant species of mosquito. I had a theory as to why she selected that
moniker and it has proved to be true.


----------



## Lkholcomb (Aug 25, 2013)

Gerslay said:


> I'm not interested. I notice that you don't respond to all of my posts and I assume that's because you are also not interested. However, I'm the one who is not complaining or whining about it.


I was not whining nor complaining (not appropriate for a debate discussion). I was however noting the interesting trend of the anti-abortion folks in here to shy from actual medical ethics discussions. Thank you so very kindly for demonstrating this deflection.

I do not respond to all of your posts as I chose not to respond to name calling or character besmirching, must be my lack of integrity.

And thank you so very much for demonstrating proper form in debating. I shall make note for the future.


----------



## Lkholcomb (Aug 25, 2013)

Janet Cooke said:


> She was neither complaining nor whining.
> Lkholcomb commented that not one person who would be on the anti-choice side bothered to respond.
> You had to be disrespectful in a response.
> Three day old doggie dinner.


Hmm, I guess my original observation that they avoid these questions on purpose is accurate. I had so wanted it to be a simple oversight of posts on their part.


----------



## Janet Cooke (Aug 14, 2013)

SQM said:


> Cooke is just a faster typist than I am. And indeed I speak not only for myself but for reason and logic.


 :thumbup: :thumbup: :thumbup:

Or I am on a different rhythm.

One of my all time favorite Top 40 silly songs.


----------



## Poor Purl (Apr 14, 2011)

Lkholcomb said:


> There have been commercials around here as of late regarding by an organization specializing in the "statistics" of racial divide with abortion. I wonder if this could be the source.


A few messages up, West Coast Kitty claims to have seen a pdf of a report
"....The report is entitled, Summary of Vital Statistics 2012 The City of New York, Pregnancy Outcomes, and was prepared by the New York City Department of Health and Mental Hygiene, Office of Vital Statistics. (See Pregnancy Outcomes NYC Health 2012.pdf)....... You can verify the pdf yourself." If this is official, it should be worth looking at.


----------



## Poor Purl (Apr 14, 2011)

west coast kitty said:


> I haven't a clue who Alex Jones is but I did click on the pdf link referrenced in the report published by NY Dept of Health -
> 
> ....The report is entitled, Summary of Vital Statistics 2012 The City of New York, Pregnancy Outcomes, and was prepared by the New York City Department of Health and Mental Hygiene, Office of Vital Statistics. (See Pregnancy Outcomes NYC Health 2012.pdf)....... You can verify the pdf yourself
> 
> There is a lot of interesting information about maternal health, pre natal health, and various statistics - including the table mentioned by the previous poster. Unless the NY Health Dept is publishing incorrect numbers, they are in fact *inconsistent* with what was posted.


Did you mean inconsistent or consistent? Maybe I ought to look at the pdf myself.


----------



## Cheeky Blighter (Nov 20, 2011)

Gerslay said:


> I changed your name...its SQUIRM!


Somebody is on a testosterone rush tonight, SQM.


----------



## Cheeky Blighter (Nov 20, 2011)

Gerslay said:


> I changed your name...its SQUIRM!


Somebody is on a testosterone high tonight, SQM.


----------



## Cheeky Blighter (Nov 20, 2011)

SQM said:


> Maybe the Carr and Lisa are the same person, also.


Are you referring to VocalLisa? She and I are one in the same don't you know? We informed by a RWN. If not that Lisa then never mind. ;-)


----------



## Cheeky Blighter (Nov 20, 2011)

Gerslay said:


> I've never seen anyone on the left apologize to anyone on the right. I've never seen anyone on the left agree with any statement from anyone on the right. I've never seen anyone on the left be 'nice' to anyone on the right.
> 
> Never one time. Not one!
> 
> ...


And you would be a big fibber and I am being gracious in calling you that. I have apologized to at least two righties in the last couple days. I know you wouldn't recognize an apology if you saw one so that's probably why you didn't see mine. You sure are sounding like another RWN or two. Maybe it's that mosquito thing and they are multiplying. We may have to get out Patty's can of RAID. They get hysterical when they even see the can brought out.


----------



## Cheeky Blighter (Nov 20, 2011)

SQM said:


> I will now say something nice about the right.
> 
> ________________________________________________
> 
> ...


You are a genius!


----------



## Poor Purl (Apr 14, 2011)

west coast kitty said:



> I haven't a clue who Alex Jones is but I did click on the pdf link referrenced in the report published by NY Dept of Health -
> 
> ....The report is entitled, Summary of Vital Statistics 2012 The City of New York, Pregnancy Outcomes, and was prepared by the New York City Department of Health and Mental Hygiene, Office of Vital Statistics. (See Pregnancy Outcomes NYC Health 2012.pdf)....... You can verify the pdf yourself
> 
> There is a lot of interesting information about maternal health, pre natal health, and various statistics - including the table mentioned by the previous poster. Unless the NY Health Dept is publishing incorrect numbers, they are in fact inconsistent with what was posted.


I did an independent search rather than click on anyone's link and came up with http://www.nyc.gov/html/doh/downloads/pdf/vs/vs-pregnancy-outcomes-2012.pdf . There is a huge amount of information there, and I would think it's correct. The statistic given about the number of induced abortions as against live birth shows a large number of terminations compared to births.

I don't know what to attribute this to, but I would assume the terminations were voluntary, not forced, which indicates to me only that a lot of black women did not want to carry their pregnancies to term. There are many reasons, I'm sure: health of mother, size of family, family income, etc. etc. There was no table showing number of pregnancies due to rape or incest, or terminations of those.

Thanks for pointing this out - the instant I saw "Alex Jones" I closed the tab, so never even saw the link.


----------



## Poor Purl (Apr 14, 2011)

Cheeky Blighter said:


> And you would be a big fibber and I am being gracious in calling you that. I have apologized to at least two righties in the last couple days. I know you wouldn't recognize an apology if you saw one so that's probably why you didn't see mine. You sure are sounding like another RWN or two. Maybe it's that mosquito thing and they are multiplying. We may have to get out Patty's can of RAID. They get hysterical when they even see the can brought out.


I also apologized to two righties (probably not the same ones) between yesterday and today. I even used the word "apology" in one, so anyone actually reading messages would have caught it. Fibber? I think you were overly gracious calling her that.


----------



## Poor Purl (Apr 14, 2011)

Cheeky Blighter said:


> Somebody is on a testosterone high tonight, SQM.


 :XD: :XD: :XD: :XD: :XD:


----------



## Poor Purl (Apr 14, 2011)

Cheeky Blighter said:


> Somebody is on a testosterone rush tonight, SQM.


Talking about Guernsey?


----------



## Poor Purl (Apr 14, 2011)

Janet Cooke said:


> I think that she just recognizes you for a child.


 :thumbup: :thumbup: :thumbup: :thumbup: :thumbup:


----------



## SQM (Jun 22, 2012)

Janet Cooke said:


> :thumbup: :thumbup: :thumbup:
> 
> Or I am on a different rhythm.
> 
> ...


----------



## SQM (Jun 22, 2012)

Rich and Smart Purl - Did you finish your homework? Give me a brief summary of what you learned.


----------



## SQM (Jun 22, 2012)

Certainly not a testosterone high and my nose is too stuffed for any other.


----------



## Poor Purl (Apr 14, 2011)

Gerslay said:


> Your a coward...you hide behind VocalLisa and let her do your dirty work for you.
> 
> Grow a pair of your own!


I'm pretty certain Janet's a woman and has no use for the "pair" you're talking about. You, on the other hand, ...

But Janet's been pretty outspoken. I've never known her to hide - or even mask - her opinion, so you really don't know what you're talking about.

Besides, that's a very strange response to the message she wrote you. Hers doesn't hold back anything, and VocalLisa is nowhere to be seen:


Janet Cooke said:


> You really do operate totally on faith, it seems; there isn't the flash of a single neuron, is there?


----------



## Janet Cooke (Aug 14, 2013)

SQM said:


> And one of mine - especially for the RWers here.
> 
> 
> 
> ...


----------



## SQM (Jun 22, 2012)

"I'm pretty certain Janet's a woman"

Do real men knit washcloths?


----------



## Janet Cooke (Aug 14, 2013)

Poor Purl says:

I'm pretty certain Janet's a woman and has no use for the "pair" you're talking about. You, on the other hand, ...

But Janet's been pretty outspoken. I've never known her to hide - or even mask - her opinion, so you really don't know what you're talking about.

Besides, that's a very strange response to the message she wrote you. Hers doesn't hold back anything, and VocalLisa is nowhere to be seen:

Guernsey gives an excellent demonstration of a good Christian lady's thought processes.


----------



## Janet Cooke (Aug 14, 2013)

SQM said:


> "I'm pretty certain Janet's a woman"
> 
> Do real men knit washcloths?


I am pretty sure that at least one of the men on the site have mentioned using the little cotton squares to practice stitches.


----------



## Poor Purl (Apr 14, 2011)

Gerslay said:


> I've never seen anyone on the left apologize to anyone on the right. I've never seen anyone on the left agree with any statement from anyone on the right. I've never seen anyone on the left be 'nice' to anyone on the right.
> 
> Never one time. Not one!
> 
> ...


Then you don't read many messages. I apologized to two righties just yesterday. Neither of them was gracious enough to accept my apologies, but that's not why I did it.

The fact that you've never seen it, "Never one time. Not one!" just means you've never bothered to look - either that, or the memory's going.

In fact, not a single rightie has ever apologized to anyone here, either, excepting (maybe) you.


----------



## Poor Purl (Apr 14, 2011)

SQM said:


> Cooke is just a faster typist than I am. And indeed I speak not only for myself but for reason and logic.


 :thumbup: :thumbup: :thumbup:


----------



## Poor Purl (Apr 14, 2011)

Cheeky Blighter said:


> They have only a couple "sources" of propaganda Janet and those are suspect as regards their journalistic integrity. Are those "hooker" heels she is wearing. When the GOP had their convention in St. Paul all the working girls wore shoes just like those to simplify things for the guys attending the convention.
> Gallinipper has been around before. Her name is that of a giant species of mosquito. I had a theory as to why she selected that
> moniker and it has proved to be true.


You mean she's a pest? (She spells it with one "l" which may have a reason or may just be a misspelling.)


----------



## knitpresentgifts (May 21, 2013)

Gerslay said:


> I'm not interested. I notice that you don't respond to all of my posts and I assume that's because you are also not interested. However, I'm the one who is not complaining or whining about it.


 :thumbup: True; she doesn't say anything against anyone who agrees with her Liberal/Left/Dem POV. Another reason not to read her posts; if you read the post of one Lib/Dem you know what they all would say anyhow.


----------



## knitpresentgifts (May 21, 2013)

Cheeky Blighter said:


> Are you referring to VocalLisa? She and I are one in the same don't you know?


Yes, we all know, Jody. You pointed it out again and again and again.


----------



## Janet Cooke (Aug 14, 2013)

knitpresentgifts said:


> :thumbup: True; she doesn't say anything against anyone who agrees with her Liberal/Left/Dem POV. Another reason not to read her posts; if you read the post of one Lib/Dem you know what they all would say anyhow.


Aren't you the one who commented not so long ago about the libs being nasty to each other?


----------



## Poor Purl (Apr 14, 2011)

Lkholcomb said:


> I was not whining nor complaining (not appropriate for a debate discussion). I was however noting the interesting trend of the anti-abortion folks in here to shy from actual medical ethics discussions. Thank you so very kindly for demonstrating this deflection.
> 
> I do not respond to all of your posts as I chose not to respond to name calling or character besmirching, must be my lack of integrity.
> 
> And thank you so very much for demonstrating proper form in debating. I shall make note for the future.


You expect a lot. First she whines, mistakenly complains that we don't apologize to the righties (who've never apologized, themselves), then accuses you of doing those things, which you never do, as far as I know. You do have a solid grasp of sarcasm, though.


----------



## knitpresentgifts (May 21, 2013)

Wombatnomore said:


> Well, well, well! Isn't this interesting? You've all abandoned the Obamacare is working thread quite abruptly haven't you? It's now on page 5 of the chit-chat section. Funny that....
> 
> So here you all are continuing your oneupmanship with the usual tactics - intimidate, taunt, chastise, acting like it's your thread and your thread only and woe betide anyone who dares to invade.
> 
> Pull your heads in.


Hi Wombatnomore. Welcome to yet another thread begun by a Christian conservative that has been soiled and infiltrated by the Lib/LWNs.

Let me guess, or better said, I'm willing to bet not one person was helped by the ACA thread begun by Cheeky Blighter who claimed she began that thread to assist others in regard to the ACA law.

I knew from the OP, the intent was simply another thread for her to publicly post her agenda (to accuse everyone of being a racist if they don't like President Obama's policie, or don't agree with Cheek's beliefs.) I recognized the fake and insincere intent immediately so never posted in that thread or read much of it.

Don't be fooled; those of us on this thread have seen the Liberal merry-go-round more times then we can count; its never-ending.

PM me if you'd like, and I can fill you in on the who's who.


----------



## Poor Purl (Apr 14, 2011)

Janet Cooke said:


> :thumbup: :thumbup: :thumbup:
> 
> Or I am on a different rhythm.
> 
> ...


----------



## Poor Purl (Apr 14, 2011)

SQM said:


> Rich and Smart Purl - Did you finish your homework? Give me a brief summary of what you learned.


No. It was - um - not very exciting. I'll read a few more pages later, but I already know how the story ends. I have Wharton to read, too. I'll get back to that soon. You guys wrote too much here for me to catch up to.


----------



## Poor Purl (Apr 14, 2011)

SQM said:


> And one of mine - especially for the RWers here.
> 
> 
> 
> ...


----------



## Janet Cooke (Aug 14, 2013)

Poor Purl said:


> You expect a lot. First she whines, mistakenly complains that we don't apologize to the righties (who've never apologized, themselves), then accuses you of doing those things, which you never do, as far as I know. You do have a solid grasp of sarcasm, though.


This is the same woman who accused you of being a bully; I believe it was just yesterday that she did that. 
I thought that accusation was pretty darned funny, if not very evocative of good Christian actions.


----------



## Janet Cooke (Aug 14, 2013)

Poor Purl said:


> Just right. And that gold pantsuit, yum.


Ah, the good ol' days.


----------



## Poor Purl (Apr 14, 2011)

Janet Cooke said:


> Poor Purl says:
> 
> I'm pretty certain Janet's a woman and has no use for the "pair" you're talking about. You, on the other hand, ...
> 
> ...


An excellent demonstration! I responded twice before I realized she was quoting a message from you that showed the opposite of what she was complaining about. But she got to pat herself on the back once again, boasting about her "zinger."


----------



## Janet Cooke (Aug 14, 2013)

Poor Purl said:


> An excellent demonstration! I responded twice before I realized she was quoting a message from you that showed the opposite of what she was complaining about. But she got to pat herself on the back once again, boasting about her "zinger."


As a woman I used to work with said often... "nuthin' goin' on upstairs".


----------



## Wombatnomore (Dec 9, 2013)

Janet Cooke said:


> Be good if you pulled your head out... it appears to be stuck up your butt.


Your sounding more and more like one of your other selves, oh yes, cheekyblighter and to poorpurl (olde thing she is!), with references to butts, colons and baboon backsides just in the last 24 hours no less!

It seems to be an emerging pattern - you get incensed and ruffled and you reach for the low road.

Be good if you curbed your filthy references hey?


----------



## Poor Purl (Apr 14, 2011)

Janet Cooke said:


> This is the same woman who accused you of being a bully; I believe it was just yesterday that she did that.
> I thought that accusation was pretty darned funny, if not very evocative of good Christian actions.


She apparently doesn't know what bullying is. She is more to be pitied than censured.


----------



## Janet Cooke (Aug 14, 2013)

Wombatnomore said:


> Your sounding more and more like one of your other selves, oh yes, cheekyblighter and to poorpurl (olde thing she is!), with references to butts, colons and baboon backsides just in the last 24 hours no less!
> 
> It seems to be an emerging pattern - you get incensed and ruffled and you reach for the low road.
> 
> Be good if you curbed your filthy references hey?


Only conservative whackjobs think that anatomy is filthy. Most of us glory in the beauty of nature and both animal and human forms. 
The only incense around here is lemon patchouli.


----------



## Poor Purl (Apr 14, 2011)

Wombatnomore said:


> Your sounding more and more like one of your other selves, oh yes, cheekyblighter and to poorpurl (olde thing she is!), with references to butts, colons and baboon backsides just in the last 24 hours no less!
> 
> It seems to be an emerging pattern - you get incensed and ruffled and you reach for the low road.
> 
> Be good if you curbed your filthy references hey?


Ah, here's the wombat to teach us right from wrong. Anyway, you're confused about who's who. Still, as long as you're not confused about who the hell cares?


----------



## Wombatnomore (Dec 9, 2013)

SQM said:


> You are not No More. No more is the wombat or old bat or whatever. Was a teacher but not in school districts.


Poor, poor kids.


----------



## Wombatnomore (Dec 9, 2013)

Poor Purl said:


> Ah, here's the wombat to teach us right from wrong. Anyway, you're confused about who's who. Still, as long as you're not confused about who cares?


Oooh...someone else is getting ruffled! Skirt up over your head yet?


----------



## Poor Purl (Apr 14, 2011)

Wombatnomore said:


> Poor, poor kids.


Okay, if you're not Solow, you're doing a really good imitation. You young whippersnapper.


----------



## west coast kitty (May 26, 2012)

Lkholcomb said:


> I looked also, I'm interested did you find the requirements regarding reporting? Like if they are required to report abortion statistics are they required to report the racial information as well or is that part optional. That could, and has in the past, skewed many a report. Not the fault of the reporting agency of course, but one reason why reporting methods are so important to report.
> 
> I was quite interested and excited to see that the overall abortion rate has been declining. That's good news, don't you agree?


I skimmed the report - the only reference I recall for requirements is that all pregnancy outcomes must be reported. It did say more info was available thru the Vital Statistics Dept so you could do more research. Based on the report, black women from 20-29 years are having signficantly higher rates of abortion than live births.

I agree that the declining abortion rate is very good news. I don't know enough about NY or it's people to understand these dynamics, but I find it disturbing that black women seem to have higher risk factors such as overweight or obesity, poor nutrition, lack of late term maternity care etc than any other group in the stats. IMO that is a flag that public health and social services are not reaching black women in a meaningful way or that some other factor is at play.

Abortion in Canada has also generally been declining, but a major concern is the increase in gender specific abortion. Several years ago many districts in my province stopped providing gender info from ultra sounds - this concern has now spread to many other provinces. The concern was initally raised by medical professionals.


----------



## Wombatnomore (Dec 9, 2013)

Janet Cooke said:


> Only conservative whackjobs think that anatomy is filthy. Most of us glory in the beauty of nature and both animal and human forms.
> The only incense around here is lemon patchouli.


I am not a conservative. I don't live in your country. No, anatomy isn't filthy but your use of it to offend is. Here's hoping the lemon patchouli will calm you down.


----------



## Poor Purl (Apr 14, 2011)

Wombatnomore said:


> Oooh...someone else is getting ruffled! Skirt up over your head yet?


Not ruffled. I look forward to your showing up for a good practice session. I don't know what your second sentence means in Aussie, but in English it's no better than all those objections you have to naming body parts.

Where my skirt is is of no business to a kid like you, anyway.


----------



## west coast kitty (May 26, 2012)

Poor Purl said:


> Did you mean inconsistent or consistent? Maybe I ought to look at the pdf myself.


I did mean consistent but think it is always a good idea to read the info yourself - some very interesting information in the report. Would also be interesting to know how that compared to other major centres


----------



## SQM (Jun 22, 2012)

"I am not a conservative."

What is the counterpart to conservatism in Australia then?

As for my career, I did work most of it helping kids and adults from poor families so you are absolutely correct, No More.


----------



## Gerslay (Oct 4, 2011)

One (1) post of mine ellicits seventeen (17) responses from you

1 to 17

Low score wins!


::::: fools :::::


----------



## Poor Purl (Apr 14, 2011)

Gerslay said:


> One (1) post of mine ellicits seventeen (17) responses from you
> 
> 1 to 17
> 
> ...


If this is how you amuse yourself, good luck. Which post was it that ellicits (your spelling) 17 responses? I can't imagine any one of them is so riveting. But you're right - anyone who reads your messages with any attention is a fool. Thanks for pointing that out to me, and goodbye, Guernsey.


----------



## Gerslay (Oct 4, 2011)

Poor Purl said:


> If this is how you amuse yourself, good luck. Which post was it that elicits (your spelling) 17 responses? I can't imagine any one of them is so riveting. But you're right - anyone who reads your messages with any attention is a fool. Thanks for pointing that out to me, and goodbye, Guernsey.


Amuse yourself PP and take the "l" out!


----------



## Gerslay (Oct 4, 2011)

What one post Purl? Over and over and over again...every ONE post that I make ELICITS an onslaught, a tirade from the left...and I just sit back and watch you all perform!

::::: fools :::::


----------



## Gerslay (Oct 4, 2011)

Dance, Ballerinas, Dance!


----------



## Cheeky Blighter (Nov 20, 2011)

Poor Purl said:


> If this is how you amuse yourself, good luck. Which post was it that ellicits (your spelling) 17 responses? I can't imagine any one of them is so riveting. But you're right - anyone who reads your messages with any attention is a fool. Thanks for pointing that out to me, and goodbye, Guernsey.


 :thumbup: :thumbup: :thumbup: mooooo


----------



## Cheeky Blighter (Nov 20, 2011)

Gerslay said:


> Dance, Ballerinas, Dance!


Is your avatar a ballet slipper for one of your hooves? or perhaps a nut cup? You are either missing one or three to complete the set.
That testosterone is still cranking you up!


----------



## Poor Purl (Apr 14, 2011)

Cheeky Blighter said:


> :thumbup: :thumbup: :thumbup: mooooo


This must be how she gets 17: she counts every message that makes fun of her as a response. Good. Let's see whether we can raise that to 27.


----------



## Poor Purl (Apr 14, 2011)

Cheeky Blighter said:


> Is this avatar a ballet slipper for one of your hooves?


 :XD: :XD: :XD: :XD: :XD: Sure looks like it.


----------



## Cheeky Blighter (Nov 20, 2011)

Poor Purl said:


> This must be how she gets 17: she counts every message that makes fun of her as a response. Good. Let's see whether we can raise that to 27.


I'm hoping she will go run on a tread mill or lift some weights and chill a bit. I think her hormone therapy is way off, so agressive.


----------



## Poor Purl (Apr 14, 2011)

Cheeky Blighter said:


> I'm hoping she will go run on a tread mill or lift some weights and chill a bit. I think her hormone therapy is way off, so agressive.


You're right, Cheeky. I guess that's how she "grew a pair."


----------



## susanmos2000 (May 10, 2011)

Cheeky Blighter said:


> Is your avatar a ballet slipper for one of your hooves? or perhaps a nut cup? You are either missing one or three to complete the set.
> That testosterone is still cranking you up!


 :XD: :XD: :XD:


----------



## damemary (Mar 14, 2012)

I think they'd like to choke me.



Poor Purl said:


> No more than two pages. KP must love your messages; it keeps repeating them.


----------



## damemary (Mar 14, 2012)

What is the source of this stastic? Thank you.



sallycarr said:


> Did you know more black babies were aborted in NYC in 2013 than were born alive?


----------



## damemary (Mar 14, 2012)

Birchers are chump change. NRA? Kochs.'



Poor Purl said:


> I don't know how rich the Birchers are. They've been replaced by Heritage and the Kochs.


----------



## damemary (Mar 14, 2012)

That makes three requests for black abortions in NYC for sources for statistics.


----------



## damemary (Mar 14, 2012)

Alex Jones Radio show is a right-wing blog with questionable credibility. Ignore. More lies and exaggerations.



sallycarr said:


> the year was 2012.
> 
> http://www.infowars.com/nyc-more-black-babies-killed-by-abortion-than-born/


----------



## damemary (Mar 14, 2012)

Alex Jones is a right wing conspiracy theorist with no credibility.

SallyCarr registered at KP 11/2013 and has only posted 5 comments, all anti President Obama.

Flush. Flush. I feel better.



SQM said:


> Who is Alex Jones? Statistics can lie; I know that as a truth.
> 
> Who is Sally Carr? She is hiding and has only posted 5 times. Should we be honored or drive her away?


----------



## damemary (Mar 14, 2012)

If this were true, what is your point?



galinipper said:


> ..


----------



## damemary (Mar 14, 2012)

SQM said:


> I would prefer to sort socks or clean the litter box than to listen to fascists spew their she-it.
> 
> I am always curious about people. The Secret Service were on my block this afternoon and I had tons of fun chatting with them. Did you know they started out as an anti-counterfeit org. in the Civil War?
> 
> Maybe the Carr has something interesting about her aside from her delusional political views.


>>>>I don't care to know anything else about her.


----------



## damemary (Mar 14, 2012)

You don't suppose they are finally getting organized, do you? I guess that must be pretty easy when it doesn't involve many people.



Janet Cooke said:


> I am guessing that one of the most interesting things about her is her landing on this thread after five posts in all the time she has been a member, to be so quickly joined by the person sporting the Sarah Palin HO heels.
> Just a coincidence, I am sure.


----------



## damemary (Mar 14, 2012)

Snort, barf.



SQM said:


> Why Sister G. Hope you enjoyed your Sabbath and are filled with the heavenly love of the Gods. Try to maintain your spiritual holiness by not bitching for at least 3 posts. Of course your comrades are welcome here and we love to hear what they say since we all have a huge supply of barf bags sitting next to our #2 circulars.


----------



## damemary (Mar 14, 2012)

See you there. I'll bring chilled wine, cheese and fruit.



Lkholcomb said:


> Yup, it's kicking them when they are down.
> 
> I say come judgement day I'll bring the beer and you bring the popcorn (you know how easy it will be to make that when we are roasting in hell.... It should be their official food, no river Styx put a river of popcorn, lol) we will have quite the show.


----------



## damemary (Mar 14, 2012)

SQM said:


> Maybe the Carr and Lisa are the same person, also.


 :XD: :XD: :XD: :XD: :XD: :XD:


----------



## damemary (Mar 14, 2012)

Did you consider that a radio 'personality' might be making things up? I did.



west coast kitty said:


> I haven't a clue who Alex Jones is but I did click on the pdf link referrenced in the report published by NY Dept of Health -
> 
> ....The report is entitled, Summary of Vital Statistics 2012 The City of New York, Pregnancy Outcomes, and was prepared by the New York City Department of Health and Mental Hygiene, Office of Vital Statistics. (See Pregnancy Outcomes NYC Health 2012.pdf)....... You can verify the pdf yourself
> 
> There is a lot of interesting information about maternal health, pre natal health, and various statistics - including the table mentioned by the previous poster. Unless the NY Health Dept is publishing incorrect numbers, they are in fact inconsistent with what was posted.


----------



## Poor Purl (Apr 14, 2011)

damemary said:


> Did you consider that a radio 'personality' might be making things up? I did.


I did at first, but it's real. I don't know the reasons; black women in NYC seem to suffer a lot from various conditions, including poverty, that could interfere with pregnancy. It's an interesting report in any case.


----------



## damemary (Mar 14, 2012)

joeysomma said:


> "Unless the NY Health Dept is publishing incorrect numbers, they are in fact *inconsistent* with what was posted."
> 
> Do mean that the article is consistent with the statistics released by the NYC Health Department?


No. I mean these statistics are probably invented or exaggerated. Just because Alex Jones publishes them does not mean they come from the NY Health Dept. (Perhaps someone more familiar with NYC innerworking can check the names of departments and the figures themselves. )

Grow your own cojones.


----------



## damemary (Mar 14, 2012)

My guess is that the whole thing is invented.



west coast kitty said:


> I haven't a clue who Alex Jones is but I did click on the pdf link referrenced in the report published by NY Dept of Health -
> 
> ....The report is entitled, Summary of Vital Statistics 2012 The City of New York, Pregnancy Outcomes, and was prepared by the New York City Department of Health and Mental Hygiene, Office of Vital Statistics. (See Pregnancy Outcomes NYC Health 2012.pdf)....... You can verify the pdf yourself
> 
> There is a lot of interesting information about maternal health, pre natal health, and various statistics - including the table mentioned by the previous poster. Unless the NY Health Dept is publishing incorrect numbers, they are in fact inconsistent with what was posted.


----------



## ute4kp (Nov 6, 2012)

Lkholcomb said:


> He couldn't be. Christian literally means "follower of Christ". He was the Christ, so he would have just been spinning in circles if he was a Christian and trying to follow himself. Allow that image makes me laugh, lol.


 :XD: :XD: :XD:


----------



## damemary (Mar 14, 2012)

Riiiiiiiiiight! Good girl.



SQM said:


> I will now say something nice about the right.
> 
> ________________________________________________
> 
> ...


 :XD: :XD: :XD: :XD: :XD: :XD: :XD: :XD: :XD: :XD: :XD:


----------



## damemary (Mar 14, 2012)

Janet Cooke said:


> Be good if you pulled your head out... it appears to be stuck up your butt.


I say leave it there.


----------



## Poor Purl (Apr 14, 2011)

damemary said:


> No. I mean these statistics are probably invented or exaggerated. Just because Alex Jones publishes them does not mean they come from the NY Health Dept. (Perhaps someone more familiar with NYC innerworking can check the names of departments and the figures themselves. )
> 
> Grow your own cojones.


I checked them. They're authentic. I don't know what follows from the fact that more black women choose to terminate pregnancy than to carry it to term, but it _is_ a fact. The report also shows that the abortion rate has been going down.


----------



## susanmos2000 (May 10, 2011)

Poor Purl said:


> I checked them. They're authentic. I don't know what follows from the fact that more black women choose to terminate pregnancy than to carry it to term, but it _is_ a fact. The report also shows that the abortion rate has been going down.


I found this in the New York Times--pretty interesting.

To Court Blacks, Foes of Abortion Make Racial Case
By SHAILA DEWAN
Published: February 26, 2010

ATLANTA  For years the largely white staff of Georgia Right to Life, the states largest anti-abortion group, tried to tackle the disproportionately high number of black women who undergo abortions. But, staff members said, they found it difficult to make inroads with black audiences.

So in 2009, the group took money that it normally used for advertising a pregnancy hot line and hired a black woman, Catherine Davis, to be its minority outreach coordinator.

Ms. Davis traveled to black churches and colleges around the state, delivering the message that abortion is the primary tool in a decades-old conspiracy to kill off blacks.

The idea resonated, said Nancy Smith, the executive director.

We were shocked when we spent less money and had more phone calls to the hot line, Ms. Smith said.

This month, the group expanded its reach, making national news with 80 billboards around Atlanta that proclaim, Black children are an endangered species, and a Web site, www.toomanyaborted.com.

Across the country, the anti-abortion movement, long viewed as almost exclusively white and Republican, is turning its attention to African-Americans and encouraging black abortion opponents across the country to become more active.

A new documentary, written and directed by Mark Crutcher, a white abortion opponent in Denton, Tex., meticulously traces what it says are connections among slavery, Nazi-style eugenics, birth control and abortion, and is being regularly screened by black organizations.

Black abortion opponents, who sometimes refer to abortions as womb lynchings, have mounted a sustained attack on the Planned Parenthood Federation of America, spurred by a sting operation by young white conservatives who taped Planned Parenthood employees welcoming donations specifically for aborting black children.

Whats giving it momentum is blacks are finally figuring out whats going down, said Johnny M. Hunter, a black pastor and longtime abortion opponent in Fayetteville, N.C. The game changes when blacks get involved. And in the pro-life movement, a lot of the groups that have been ignored for years, theyre now getting galvanized.

The factors fueling the focus on black women  an abortion rate far higher than that of other races and the ties between the effort to legalize and popularize birth control and eugenics  are, at heart, old news. But they have been given exaggerated new life by the Internet, slick repackaging, high production values and money, like the more than $20,000 that Georgia Right to Life invested in the billboards.

Data from the federal Centers for Disease Control and Prevention show that black women get almost 40 percent of the countrys abortions, even though blacks make up only 13 percent of the population. Nearly 40 percent of black pregnancies end in induced abortion, a rate far higher than for white or Hispanic women.

Day Gardner, now the president of the National Black Pro-Life Union in Washington, said those figures shocked her at first.

I just really assumed that white people aborted more than anyone else, and black people would not do this because were culturally a religious people, we have large families, Ms. Gardner said.

Many black anti-abortion leaders, including Ms. Davis and Alveda King, a niece of the Rev. Dr. Martin Luther King Jr. and the director of African-American outreach for Priests for Life, often recount their own abortion histories (each woman had two).

Abortion opponents say the number is so high because abortion clinics are deliberately located in black neighborhoods and prey upon black women. The evidence, they say, is everywhere: Planned Parenthoods response to the anti-abortion ad that aired during the Super Bowl featured two black athletes, they note, and several womens clinics offered free services  including abortions  to evacuees after Hurricane Katrina.

The more I dug into it, the more vast I found that the network was, Ms. Davis said. And I realized that African-American women just did not know the truth, they did not understand the truth about the abortion industry.

But those who support abortion rights dispute the conspiracy theory, saying it portrays black women as dupes and victims. The reason black women have so many abortions is simple, they say: too many unwanted pregnancies.

Its a perfect storm, said Loretta Ross, the executive director of the SisterSong Women of Color Reproductive Health Collective in Atlanta, listing a lack of access to birth control, lack of education, and even a high rate of sexual violence. Theres an assumption that every time a girl is pregnant its because of voluntary activity, and its so not the case, Ms. Ross said.

But, she said, the idea that abortion is intended to wipe out blacks may be finding fertile ground in a population that has experienced so much sanctioned prejudice and violence.

Black opponents of abortion are fond of saying that black people were anti-abortion and anti-birth control early on, pointing to Marcus Garveys conviction that blacks could overcome white supremacy through reproduction, and black militants who protested family planning clinics.

But that is only half the picture, scholars say. Black women were eager for birth control even before it was popularized by Margaret Sanger, the founder of Planned Parenthood, and black doctors who provided illegal abortions were lauded as community heroes.

Some male African-American leaders were so furious about what they perceived as genocidal intentions that in one case they burned down a clinic, said Carole Joffe, the author of Dispatches From the Abortion Wars. But women were very resolute, saying, We want birth control. 

In 2008, Lila Rose, a college student at U.C.L.A. and the founder of an anti-abortion group called Live Action, released four audio recordings of a man trying to make donations to Planned Parenthood clinics to pay for black womens abortions. In one, the caller, played by James OKeefe III, the provocateur recently arrested on charges that he tried to tamper with the telephones of Senator Mary L. Landrieu, Democrat of Louisiana, said, You know, we just think, the less black kids out there, the better, to which the Planned Parenthood employee replies, Understandable, understandable.

Planned Parenthood has apologized for the employees statements and says they do not reflect the organizations values or policies.

The recordings led to calls by black leaders to withdraw financing of Planned Parenthood, which receives about $350 million a year in government money for education and medical services. They reinvigorated old claims that the organization was a front for racial genocide and that Sanger viewed blacks as undesirable.

Scholars acknowledge that Sanger did ally herself with eugenics, at the time a mainstream movement, but said she believed that birth control, sterilization and abortion should be voluntary and not based on race. She was also allied with black leaders like W.E.B. Du Bois and Dr. King, who praised her efforts to bring birth control to black families.

Its unfair to characterize those efforts as racially targeted in a negative way, said Ellen Chesler, a historian and Sanger biographer, who is now on the board of Planned Parenthood.

Still, enough threads of truth weave through the theory to make Maafa 21, the documentary whose name is a Swahili word used to refer to the slavery era, persuasive to some viewers, at least at a recent screening at Morris Brown College, a historically black institution in Atlanta.

Before we saw the movie, I was pro-choice, said Markita Eddy, a sophomore. But were she to get pregnant now, Ms. Eddy said, it showed me that maybe I should want to keep my child no matter what my position was, just because of the conspiracy.


----------



## west coast kitty (May 26, 2012)

damemary said:


> Did you consider that a radio 'personality' might be making things up? I did.


I don't know if he makes things up or not -- but I did not comment on what he said. If you read my post, you would see I specifically said was referring to the pdf report from NY Dept of Health link provided on the website. Your friends Poor Purl and LKHolcomb seem to have followed up on the information and commented on it. Perhaps you shouldn't jump to conclusions


----------



## damemary (Mar 14, 2012)

What was their point?



Poor Purl said:


> I checked them. They're authentic. I don't know what follows from the fact that more black women choose to terminate pregnancy than to carry it to term, but it _is_ a fact. The report also shows that the abortion rate has been going down.


----------



## damemary (Mar 14, 2012)

Oh great. Now we have a new conspiracy theory.


susanmos2000 said:


> I found this in the New York Times--pretty interesting.
> 
> To Court Blacks, Foes of Abortion Make Racial Case
> By SHAILA DEWAN
> ...


----------



## damemary (Mar 14, 2012)

Here's something to think about. Abortion is not for me but I believe the issue should be between a woman and her doctor. 

Basically it means little to my life at this point. It's up to the women to whom abortion is a personal, immediate concern to carry on the fight. Good luck. I'm outta here.


----------



## Poor Purl (Apr 14, 2011)

damemary said:


> Oh great. Now we have a new conspiracy theory.


It's a 4-year-old story.


----------



## Poor Purl (Apr 14, 2011)

damemary said:


> What was their point?


It has no point. It's a report done annually by the NYC Dept. of Health on vital statistics having to do with pregnancy, purely statistical and very interesting.

http://www.nyc.gov/html/doh/downloads/pdf/vs/vs-pregnancy-outcomes-2012.pdf


----------



## Poor Purl (Apr 14, 2011)

I seem to have missed this before. Brilliant


SQM said:


> I will now say something nice about the right.
> 
> ________________________________________________
> 
> ...


You did. It was a rite of passage.


----------



## Poor Purl (Apr 14, 2011)

Cheeky Blighter said:


> No, not damning all of Christianity. Just the Catholic church the church I was raised in. The Catholic church has millions of very liberal and progressive women so it is the church not the women who are holding them back. We were married by a friend who came to the U.S. from England so she could be an ordained priest in the Episcopal church as the Anglican church she grew up in was still not ordaining women. I also lived with very liberal Corondelet nuns as a young woman. They desired ordination but were not allowed the privilege of this sacrament. I am well aware that there are Protestant churches and the various branches of Judaism permit women to be ordained rabbis. That makes it all the more frustrating and hurtful to me as someone raised in that religion that the church still does not see fit to allow women ordination.


What an interesting history you've outlined. I never knew about the Corondelet nuns, and now I want to.

The Church has changed in the past, though not always for the better. For instance, celibacy in the priesthood is relatively recent (less than 1,000 years old). And between Galileo's day and now, there's been a far greater acceptance of science. Who knows what the Pope has up his sleeve where women are concerned? But I suppose there's a lot to overcome, since Paul seemed not to have cared much for women, and he's the one who set the rules.

And there I am, trying to cheer you up but instead depressing myself. Let's all look at your avatar. Your cat (I assume it's yours) has such a beautiful expression, so calm and wise-seeming. It makes me feel better every time I see it.


----------



## MaidInBedlam (Jul 24, 2012)

I don't understand what you mean by saying someone's organs are being harvested while they are "technically" alive. Someone who is brain dead is dead and gone, period. The body hooked up to machines that keep it from rotting are doing nothing but creating an appearance of life where none exists. So-called life support is a useless and expensive form of make believe once the brain is dead.


Lkholcomb said:


> And that with being brain dead is the crux of it. Very early pregnancies have no nervous or brain development yet, but people don't want to taken them "off life support" but don't have the ethical issue with their child, who has been born and lived, having organs harvested while technically alive.
> 
> I think people go to such great lengths to have "their" child and because healthy (and especially white) babies are not as common in the system. So many people don't want to adopt and older child or one with difficulties. I think their logic fails in that they may not even get a healthy child by giving birth to one. It is really a luck of the draw.


----------



## Lkholcomb (Aug 25, 2013)

Poor Purl said:


> A few messages up, West Coast Kitty claims to have seen a pdf of a report
> "....The report is entitled, Summary of Vital Statistics 2012 The City of New York, Pregnancy Outcomes, and was prepared by the New York City Department of Health and Mental Hygiene, Office of Vital Statistics. (See Pregnancy Outcomes NYC Health 2012.pdf)....... You can verify the pdf yourself." If this is official, it should be worth looking at.


I did find it and looked at it. The abortion reporting is mandatory, however it does not say that the reporting of race in this is. Many times they have an extra section in surveys for optional info, if race is optional it is possible some races are underreported. I do wish that it went into detail about the methods used to obtain the info (I must be spoiled by medical research, lol)

Another interesting thing in the study is that the rate of spontaneous abortion (miscarriage) is higherin the black population than any other race. Often poorer populations have worse maternal health which can lead to miscarriages. Yet, I hear no concern about "saving" those "babies" and improving maternal and pregnancy services. Interesting, that, don't you think?


----------



## Lkholcomb (Aug 25, 2013)

Poor Purl said:


> You expect a lot. First she whines, mistakenly complains that we don't apologize to the righties (who've never apologized, themselves), then accuses you of doing those things, which you never do, as far as I know. You do have a solid grasp of sarcasm, though.


Yes, sarcasm is the second language spoken fluently in our home.


----------



## Lkholcomb (Aug 25, 2013)

MaidInBedlam said:


> I don't understand what you mean by saying someone's organs are being harvested while they are "technically" alive. Someone who is brain dead is dead and gone, period. The body hooked up to machines that keep it from rotting are doing nothing but creating an appearance of life where none exists. So-called life support is a useless and expensive form of make believe once the brain is dead.


A person is not pronounced "dead" (according to medical requirements) until their heart has stopped beating. There is no death certificate for "brain dead". That is why there is a need for family to take them off life support. A person can live "brain dead" on machines for a long time. The time of death on their death certificate is when their heart stops beating, not when they have "brain death".

That is where the similarity is. In the case of brain death, the person is still on "life support" but with no brain activity and many people see no issue taking then off life support. An embryo also has no brain activity, but there is a large movement trying to prohibit taking them off "life support".


----------



## damemary (Mar 14, 2012)

OK. It's an old conspiracy theory.



Poor Purl said:


> It's a 4-year-old story.


----------



## damemary (Mar 14, 2012)

An old conspiracy theory with no point.



Poor Purl said:


> It has no point. It's a report done annually by the NYC Dept. of Health on vital statistics having to do with pregnancy, purely statistical and very interesting.
> 
> http://www.nyc.gov/html/doh/downloads/pdf/vs/vs-pregnancy-outcomes-2012.pdf


----------



## damemary (Mar 14, 2012)

quote=Lkholcomb]I did find it and looked at it. The abortion reporting is mandatory, however it does not say that the reporting of race in this is. Many times they have an extra section in surveys for optional info, if race is optional it is possible some races are underreported. I do wish that it went into detail about the methods used to obtain the info (I must be spoiled by medical research, lol)

Another interesting thing in the study is that the rate of spontaneous abortion (miscarriage) is higherin the black population than any other race. Often poorer populations have worse maternal health which can lead to miscarriages. Yet, I hear no concern about "saving" those "babies" and improving maternal and pregnancy services. Interesting, that, don't you think?[/quote]

I think I would call it shameful.


----------



## Janet Cooke (Aug 14, 2013)

Cheeky Blighter said:


> :thumbup: :thumbup: :thumbup: mooooo


...and a cackle


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## Janet Cooke (Aug 14, 2013)

Poor Purl said:


> I checked them. They're authentic. I don't know what follows from the fact that more black women choose to terminate pregnancy than to carry it to term, but it _is_ a fact. The report also shows that the abortion rate has been going down.


I have not reviewed the full report yet, so I should probably keep my fingers still. If I do I will forget my point unless I take notes and that's not happening.

I did note that there is sloppy reporting, this is mentioned at least once, specifically at the point that the report covers a huge spike in the numbers of spontaneous abortions. It seems that institutions are lax about reporting those. 
That made my mind go to the old days when LOTS of nice safe induced abortions were accomplished by reporting that a young lady needed a D&C due to hemoraging. 
Maybe there are a whole lot more abortions then we know they are just performed while away on vacation or under another name. 
And, of course, access to effective birth control may be a factor as well. The "morning after plus" pills may be in higher use in households with more disposable funds.

Much more concerning than poor people choosing to keep their families small or to delay starting a family is the early delivery and low birth rate numbers. 
That spells a life time of lower performance, more time and effort for Mom and Dad to spend keeping services on track and more public monies than necessary being spent on sped services.


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## Janet Cooke (Aug 14, 2013)

damemary said:


> quote=Lkholcomb]I did find it and looked at it. The abortion reporting is mandatory, however it does not say that the reporting of race in this is. Many times they have an extra section in surveys for optional info, if race is optional it is possible some races are underreported. I do wish that it went into detail about the methods used to obtain the info (I must be spoiled by medical research, lol)
> 
> Another interesting thing in the study is that the rate of spontaneous abortion (miscarriage) is higherin the black population than any other race. Often poorer populations have worse maternal health which can lead to miscarriages. Yet, I hear no concern about "saving" those "babies" and improving maternal and pregnancy services. Interesting, that, don't you think?


I think I would call it shameful.[/quote]

You are correct, Lkholcomb, people will often refuse to fill out the proper statistics on those forms. I seem to remember being embroiled in discussions about that at the time of the last federal census. 
People claimed that they were going to cite erroneous information just to screw with the numbers. 
I can remember being appalled by this as folks were oblivious to the fact that this is how their communities tap into much needed financial resources. That they didn't understand that seemed to indicate that they did indeed need that money coming in to educate the next generations better.

Damemary, these statistics about the pre-pregnancy overweight of the moms has an impact as well. It just goes to show that Michelle Obama is on the right track with her emphasis on moving and eating properly. That can be so hard in inner city neighborhoods. 
I will leave that part of the discussion to those who have seen it up close and personal, though.


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## Poor Purl (Apr 14, 2011)

damemary said:


> An old conspiracy theory with no point.


Sorry, Empress Dame, but either you're channeling James Joyce in writing your messages or you're confusing two things. (I would guess Joyce, but I'll go on anyway.)

The old conspiracy (not a theory, but a real conspiracy) is reported in the New York Times: "To Court Blacks, Foes of Abortion Make Racial Case
By SHAILA DEWAN
Published: February 26, 2010"

What has no point, because it's an impartial study, is a report of the NYC Dept. of Health on the statistics of pregnancy termination, which has a lot of interesting information about the subject but is currently being used by the right, for a change, to bring back the conspiracy in the above article. That's not why the study was done, but it's how the right is using it.

For instance, the anti-choice people point only to the numbers of (voluntary) induced abortions, which is higher among black women than the number of live births. What they ignore is the other statistics: the higher (involuntary) incidence, among black women, of poverty, low birth weight, premature births among other things, all of which should be examined. They only want to focus on the pre-birth stats; once again, who cares what happens after birth?


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## Poor Purl (Apr 14, 2011)

joeysomma said:


> What a great bunch of intelligent people! Some one makes a statement then corrects it and gives a website. It takes 10 + pages of denials before someone on the left actually reads the website to confirm the statement was really true.


The website the first poster gave is a piece of - well, I bet even you know. The statement she made was the least important thing that came out of the authentic report, at least as regards living, breathing, post-born people, but none of those is on your agenda.

If you looked at the rest of that report, you'd see where one battle in the War on Women should be fought. Instead you're playing follow the leader by using a picture of a dead animal on someone's head as an avatar.


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## Janet Cooke (Aug 14, 2013)

joeysomma said:


> What a great bunch of intelligent people! Some one makes a statement then corrects it and gives a website. It takes 10+ pages of denials before someone on the left actually reads the website to confirm the statement was really true.


Yes, Maureen O'Sullivan, people have discussions, and no I don't think there were 10plus pages of denials, I do think that you are quickly lowering yourself to the level of the lovely Christian ladies who are incapable of thought.


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## Poor Purl (Apr 14, 2011)

Janet Cooke said:


> Yes, Maureen O'Sullivan, people have discussions, and no I don't think there were 10plus pages of denials, I do think that you are quickly lowering yourself to the level of the lovely Christian ladies who are incapable of thought.


I loved Maureen O'Sullivan; why pick on her? She wasn't the one with hair like a dead animal.

It is a shame that the only remaining rightie who tried to have useful conversations is now stooping to snark.


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## Janet Cooke (Aug 14, 2013)

Poor Purl said:


> I loved Maureen O'Sullivan; why pick on her? She wasn't the one with hair like a dead animal.
> 
> It is a shame that the only remaining rightie who tried to have useful conversations is now stooping to snark.


Sorry, Empress, that was just who popped into my head when I saw that pic, I didn't even check to see if it was IDed. 
Conversations apparently need to be carried out between the separate groups with occasional insightful input, I guess. 
Trying to talk together is a monumental fail.


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## Lkholcomb (Aug 25, 2013)

Janet Cooke said:


> You are correct, Lkholcomb, people will often refuse to fill out the proper statistics on those forms. I seem to remember being embroiled in discussions about that at the time of the last federal census.
> People claimed that they were going to cite erroneous information just to screw with the numbers.
> I can remember being appalled by this as folks were oblivious to the fact that this is how their communities tap into much needed financial resources. That they didn't understand that seemed to indicate that they did indeed need that money coming in to educate the next generations better.
> 
> ...


I remember in sociology class in college them discussing how one of the least accurate ways to do a study was by survey (particularly paper survey) because people had less qualms about lying to a paper. Ever since then I actually look at how the data is collected. Scientific research lays out in specifics how it was collected, so I'm spoiled now lol.


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## Lkholcomb (Aug 25, 2013)

joeysomma said:


> What a great bunch of intelligent people! Some one makes a statement then corrects it and gives a website. It takes 10+ pages of denials before someone on the left actually reads the website to confirm the statement was really true.


Interesting, you must have missed my post. The original post was by Carr on 130, my post which addressed the study the article was based on was on page 132. I would be happy to copy and paste said posts if you still can't seem to find them, I understand how easy it is to miss a post here and there.

So no, my dear, it did not take 10+ pages, but 2 for not only a response but a furtherance of checking the statistics that the article posted was referencing.


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## Poor Purl (Apr 14, 2011)

Janet Cooke said:


> Sorry, Empress, that was just who popped into my head when I saw that pic, I didn't even check to see if it was IDed.
> Conversations apparently need to be carried out between the separate groups with occasional insightful input, I guess.
> Trying to talk together is a monumental fail.


That it is. They don't ever want to hear what we say (unless it's an apology), and who would want to be preached to the way they preach to us (and never apologize).

FYI, Maureen O'Sullivan played Jane in the Tarzan movies and was the mother of Mia Farrow.

Maureen O'Hara had a full head of red curly hair; maybe that's who you were thinking of.

Maureen O'Wool looks like what's on Joey's avatar's head.


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## Lkholcomb (Aug 25, 2013)

Janet Cooke said:


> Yes, Maureen O'Sullivan, people have discussions, and no I don't think there were 10plus pages of denials, I do think that you are quickly lowering yourself to the level of the lovely Christian ladies who are incapable of thought.


In 2 pages I actually addressed the report the article was referencing, but I must have invisible posts, or I don't count as the "left".


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## Poor Purl (Apr 14, 2011)

Lkholcomb said:


> In 2 pages I actually addressed the report the article was referencing, but I must have invisible posts.


...that take up ten pages.


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## Lkholcomb (Aug 25, 2013)

Poor Purl said:


> ...that take up ten pages.


Well I do make lengthy posts after all.


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## Poor Purl (Apr 14, 2011)

Lkholcomb said:


> Well I do make lengthy posts after all.


...full of whining and complaining. See, I read them.


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## Lkholcomb (Aug 25, 2013)

Poor Purl said:


> ...full of whining and complaining. See, I read them.


Well you must be the only person who can get through the tedious and illogical posts. :thumbup:


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## Poor Purl (Apr 14, 2011)

Lkholcomb said:


> Well you must be the only person who can get through the tedious and illogical posts. :thumbup:


Surely not the only one. Illogic and tedium sometimes run rampant here.


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## west coast kitty (May 26, 2012)

Lkholcomb said:


> I did find it and looked at it. The abortion reporting is mandatory, however it does not say that the reporting of race in this is. Many times they have an extra section in surveys for optional info, if race is optional it is possible some races are underreported. I do wish that it went into detail about the methods used to obtain the info (I must be spoiled by medical research, lol)
> 
> Another interesting thing in the study is that the rate of spontaneous abortion (miscarriage) is higherin the black population than any other race. Often poorer populations have worse maternal health which can lead to miscarriages. Yet, I hear no concern about "saving" those "babies" and improving maternal and pregnancy services. Interesting, that, don't you think?


In my reply to you I did express concern that black women overall had more high risk factors and that their needs did not seem to be addressed --- this is a partial quote of my previous post -- 
"I agree that the declining abortion rate is very good news. I don't know enough about NY or it's people to understand these dynamics, but I find it disturbing that black women seem to have higher risk factors such as overweight or obesity, poor nutrition, lack of late term maternity care etc than any other group in the stats. IMO that is a flag that public health and social services are not reaching black women in a meaningful way or that some other factor is at play."

I also mentioned that the report indicated more details were available thru Vital Statistics so you could do more research if you choose. Since there was no "Other" category in the table the totals by race should add up to the total for the City, so you could do the math if those details are important to you


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## west coast kitty (May 26, 2012)

Poor Purl said:


> That it is. They don't ever want to hear what we say (unless it's an apology), and who would want to be preached to the way they preach to us (and never apologize).
> 
> FYI, Maureen O'Sullivan played Jane in the Tarzan movies and was the mother of Mia Farrow.
> 
> ...


Is it really necessary to make personal insults? Does it add to the discussion?


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## Poor Purl (Apr 14, 2011)

west coast kitty said:


> In my reply to you I did express concern that black women overall had more high risk factors and that their needs did not seem to be addressed --- this is a partial quote of my previous post --
> "I agree that the declining abortion rate is very good news. I don't know enough about NY or it's people to understand these dynamics, but I find it disturbing that black women seem to have higher risk factors such as overweight or obesity, poor nutrition, lack of late term maternity care etc than any other group in the stats. IMO that is a flag that public health and social services are not reaching black women in a meaningful way or that some other factor is at play."
> 
> I also mentioned that the report indicated more details were available thru Vital Statistics so you could do more research if you choose. Since there was no "Other" category in the table the totals by race should add up to the total for the City, so you could do the math if those details are important to you


I saw that, though I didn't respond at the time. As a New Yorker, I'm concerned about the findings you mention. We just replaced a mayor who claimed to be looking after everybody's health, and he did have some effect on smoking and trans-fats used in restaurant food, but he made a big deal about the size of soft-drink containers that turned some people against him.

As to helping women in the black community improve their health, I don't see that he did anything. Maybe our new mayor will accomplish something. He's a white man married to a black woman and may get some input on that problem - at least I hope he will.

New York is so large, and in some areas so densely populated, that it's easy for many to fall through the cracks. Still, having gone to social work school, I'm disturbed that there's not more being done by agencies to improve the birth statistics and lower the rate of abortions.

Thank you for your very thoughtful input.


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## Poor Purl (Apr 14, 2011)

west coast kitty said:


> Is it really necessary to make personal insults? Does it add to the discussion?


No but it adds to the fun. There has never been a "discussion" here, or at least not for several weeks. If Joey hadn't posted her own snarky comment, I wouldn't have done it.


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## Poor Purl (Apr 14, 2011)

joeysomma said:


> The last 10+ pages show that many do not read. You dismiss articles by their headlines or authors without making any effort to read what they say.
> 
> Maybe the headline is an attention getter, and the actual article says the opposite of what is said in the headline.
> 
> ...


Where do you see that? I read this on Daily Kos, not here, and wrote a response. You need to understand that KP is not the only place we get our information.

I don't see where the headline contradicts the content - she was indeed fired for paying for the firefighters' food.

What is your response to the incident you write about?


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## MaidInBedlam (Jul 24, 2012)

Sorry if my post was a bit stiff. I didn't mean it to come off that way. I'm well aware that a person is not pronounced dead until their heart stops beating. I think the medical community needs to do some catching up, IMO. My personal belief is that once the brain is dead, the person is dead and gone. I really do think keeping what is a piece of meat on so-called life support is a perverse procedure that gulls the living into thinking there is some tiny crumb of hope that their loved one will "wake up".

Keeping a corpse on life support for a short period of time to remove organs makes sense to me. It's a way of assuring that the removed organs are in the best shape possible.

The concept of using brain death as the standard by which true death has been achieved is somewhat controversial. There are people who think it means a person is completely dead, and people who think a person is still alive until their heart stops beating. I happen to believe brain death is the right standard to use when declaring that a person is dead.


Lkholcomb said:


> A person is not pronounced "dead" (according to medical requirements) until their heart has stopped beating. There is no death certificate for "brain dead". That is why there is a need for family to take them off life support. A person can live "brain dead" on machines for a long time. The time of death on their death certificate is when their heart stops beating, not when they have "brain death".
> 
> That is where the similarity is. In the case of brain death, the person is still on "life support" but with no brain activity and many people see no issue taking then off life support. An embryo also has no brain activity, but there is a large movement trying to prohibit taking them off "life support".


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## Country Bumpkins (Feb 18, 2011)

Poor Purl said:


> That it is. They don't ever want to hear what we say (unless it's an apology), and who would want to be preached to the way they preach to us (and never apologize).
> 
> FYI, Maureen O'Sullivan played Jane in the Tarzan movies and was the mother of Mia Farrow.
> 
> ...


So ugly! I can't believe you said that!


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## Janet Cooke (Aug 14, 2013)

Lkholcomb said:


> Well I do make lengthy posts after all.


hahahhahaaa


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## Janet Cooke (Aug 14, 2013)

Country Bumpkins said:


> So ugly! I can't believe you said that!


It is another great display of Christian behavior, thanks CB.


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## Janet Cooke (Aug 14, 2013)

Poor Purl said:


> That it is. They don't ever want to hear what we say (unless it's an apology), and who would want to be preached to the way they preach to us (and never apologize).
> 
> FYI, Maureen O'Sullivan played Jane in the Tarzan movies and was the mother of Mia Farrow.
> 
> ...


LOL, I am not sure how you can tell what color the hair is in that atrocity Joeysomma is using. I would think blonde, but, who can know?

The picture reminded me of Tarzan movies which was why I said O'Sullivan. 
Anyway, it is gauche to display that horse's tail on a head.


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## Poor Purl (Apr 14, 2011)

joeysomma said:


> She was an employee not the manager.


Okay, the headline was a bit misleading, but the point of the story didn't depend on her job title. I guess if she were manager, it would have been the corporation that was to blame for her firing. Since she was only an employee, it was the manager who was to blame, maybe. But what is your response to the incident? Should anyone, employee or manager, be fired for doing what she did *with her own money*?


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## Janet Cooke (Aug 14, 2013)

MaidInBedlam said:


> Sorry if my post was a bit stiff. I didn't mean it to come off that way. I'm well aware that a person is not pronounced dead until their heart stops beating. I think the medical community needs to do some catching up, IMO. My personal belief is that once the brain is dead, the person is dead and gone. I really do think keeping what is a piece of meat on so-called life support is a perverse procedure that gulls the living into thinking there is some tiny crumb of hope that their loved one will "wake up".
> 
> Keeping a corpse on life support for a short period of time to remove organs makes sense to me. It's a way of assuring that the removed organs are in the best shape possible.
> 
> The concept of using brain death as the standard by which true death has been achieved is somewhat controversial. There are people who think it means a person is completely dead, and people who think a person is still alive until their heart stops beating. I happen to believe brain death is the right standard to use when declaring that a person is dead.


I agree with you in most cases, there are always exceptions, of course. 
Families often have a very difficult time accepting what might be the proper time to say it's over. 
I had a small bit of THIS coversation with my brother this morning. He related how difficult it was for his wife,an only child, to say "no more" in comparison to our family in the same circumstances for my mother. We were five siblings, all agreed. It made moving forward much easier.


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## susanmos2000 (May 10, 2011)

Poor Purl said:


> Where do you see that? I read this on Daily Kos, not here, and wrote a response. You need to understand that KP is not the only place we get our information.
> 
> I don't see where the headline contradicts the content - she was indeed fired for paying for the firefighters' food.
> 
> What is your response to the incident you write about?


I think while it was a generous gesture on Levia's part, it ultimately showed a certain lack of judgement. As a teen manager at two different McDonald's I remember the issue of free for men and women in uniform (in our case firefighters and cops) was a sticky one. Of course we wanted to show our gratitude, but giving them free food created a lot of uncertainty on both sides. Some were embarrassed, others (particularly the regulars) never certain if the day's meal was going to be free or not and how much they dared order. Some of the businesses around us also resented the practice--they viewed those free burgers and fries as bribes to get the uniformed crowd to come in and hang around the restaurant as long as possible, providing additional security for us at the expense of the neighborhood.

Anyway, after eight year's of employment Levia should have learned that in McDonald Land your boss' no is final. According to WIVB.com's account, she first asked her manager to permission to donate the food and, when it was refused, went over his or her head and called the corporate office. That's a big no-no--there's a clear and stated hierarchy, and employees who try to circumvent the chain of command for any reason are going to be tossed out on their ears.


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## Poor Purl (Apr 14, 2011)

Country Bumpkins said:


> So ugly! I can't believe you said that!


Yes, the original picture was indeed ugly. If people need to follow their leader and show the backs of their heads, they deserve to be criticized.

You certainly made fun of Susanmos2000 when she used Mrs. Bates's back as her avatar. You kept calling her Norman. But if I just post a nice picture of a very woolly sheep, you call it ugly and can't believe I said that! I think the sheep is rather handsome.

Since I have your attention (if you actually read this), I'm curious about why you call yourself Country Bumpkins (plural). Wouldn't you just be one Bumpin (no s)?


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## Janet Cooke (Aug 14, 2013)

susanmos2000 said:


> I think while it was a generous gesture on Levia's part, it ultimately showed a certain lack of judgement. As a teen manager at two different McDonald's I remember the issue of free for men and women in uniform (in our case firefighters and cops) was a sticky one. Of course we wanted to show our gratitude, but giving them free food created a lot of uncertainty on both sides. Some were embarrassed, others (particularly the regulars) never certain if the day's meal was going to be free or not and how much they dared order. Some of the businesses around us also resented the practice--they viewed those free burgers and fries as bribes to get the uniformed crowd to come in and hang around the restaurant as long as possible, providing additional security for us at the expense of the neighborhood.
> 
> Anyway, after eight year's of employment Levia should have learned that in McDonald Land your boss' no is final. According to WIVB.com's account, she first asked her manager to permission to donate the food and, when it was refused, went over his or her head and called the corporate office. That's a big no-no--there's a clear and stated hierarchy, and employees who try to circumvent the chain of command for any reason are going to be tossed out on their ears.


It seems that she will benefit in the end. 
What I don't understand is that these places seem to lack a disciplinary policy.


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## Poor Purl (Apr 14, 2011)

susanmos2000 said:


> I think while it was a generous gesture on Levia's part, it ultimately showed a certain lack of judgement. As a teen manager at two different McDonald's I remember the issue of free for men and women in uniform (in our case firefighters and cops) was a sticky one. Of course we wanted to show our gratitude, but giving them free food created a lot of uncertainty on both sides. Some were embarrassed, others (particularly the regulars) never certain if the day's meal was going to be free or not and how much they dared order. Some of the businesses around us also resented the practice--they viewed those free burgers and fries as bribes to get the uniformed crowd to come in and hang around the restaurant as long as possible, providing additional security for us at the expense of the neighborhood.
> 
> Anyway, after eight year's of employment Levia should have learned that in McDonald Land your boss' no is final. According to WIVB.com's account, she first asked her manager to permission to donate the food and, when it was refused, went over his or her head and called the corporate office. That's a big no-no--there's a clear and stated hierarchy, and employees who try to circumvent the chain of command for any reason are going to be tossed out on their ears.


I hadn't seen the part where she tried to get permission but was refused. In that case she was forewarned and might have expected to be fired.


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## Janet Cooke (Aug 14, 2013)

Poor Purl said:


> Where do you see that? I read this on Daily Kos, not here, and wrote a response. You need to understand that KP is not the only place we get our information.
> 
> I don't see where the headline contradicts the content - she was indeed fired for paying for the firefighters' food.
> 
> What is your response to the incident you write about?


I missed that posting totally. Sheesh.


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## susanmos2000 (May 10, 2011)

Poor Purl said:


> I hadn't seen the part where she tried to get permission but was refused. In that case she was forewarned and might have expected to be fired.


Here's the WIVB.com version of events--pretty much the same story with some additional details.

http://wivb.com/2014/02/18/mcdonalds-worker-fired-after-paying-for-food-donation/


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## Country Bumpkins (Feb 18, 2011)

Poor Purl said:


> Yes, the original picture was indeed ugly. If people need to follow their leader and show the backs of their heads, they deserve to be criticized.
> 
> You certainly made fun of Susanmos2000 when she used Mrs. Bates's back as her avatar. You kept calling her Norman. But if I just post a nice picture of a very woolly sheep, you call it ugly and can't believe I said that! I think the sheep is rather handsome.
> 
> Since I have your attention (if you actually read this), I'm curious about why you call yourself Country Bumpkins (plural). Wouldn't you just be one Bumpin (no s)?


But susan loved being called Norman. Susan was making fun of KGP by using her avatar as a dead man's mother. Joey is only showing herself. My name is my wood working business that my husband and I own. Why are you poor purl?


----------



## susanmos2000 (May 10, 2011)

Janet Cooke said:


> It seems that she will benefit in the end.
> What I don't understand is that these places seem to lack a disciplinary policy.


There is--an iron-bound policy of written warnings and write ups. It's been years, but I believe minor offenses like carelessness and coming in late merited the three-strikes you're out treatment--for big stuff like insubordination, threats, and stealing they'd cut right to the chase and fire you on the spot.


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## Poor Purl (Apr 14, 2011)

Janet Cooke said:


> I agree with you in most cases, there are always exceptions, of course.
> Families often have a very difficult time accepting what might be the proper time to say it's over.
> I had a small bit of THIS coversation with my brother this morning. He related how difficult it was for his wife,an only child, to say "no more" in comparison to our family in the same circumstances for my mother. We were five siblings, all agreed. It made moving forward much easier.


When my (baby) brother died nearly two years ago, after a long battle with pancreatic cancer which he at first seemed to have won, I found it hard to accept that he and his wife and children had given up trying to save him. After all, he had transferred care from Memorial Sloan Kettering, a cancer hospital, to a local New Jersey hospital, and I was certain that if he were in "better" hands he would have had better outcomes.

I knew he didn't want to be transported to yet another facility, but I tried to suggest Johns Hopkins' program of giving second opinions after looking over a patient's records without needing to see the patient. My niece, who had been a nurse, said yes to me but then didn't give me her email address so that I could send her the info on the program. She knew that he didn't want to keep fighting any more.

She was right; there was no hope. At least he died in peace, at home with his wife and daughters in the room, without staff people trying heroic measures to keep him alive for how long? a week or two?


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## susanmos2000 (May 10, 2011)

Country Bumpkins said:


> But susan loved being called Norman. Susan was making fun of KGP by using her avatar as a dead man's mother. Joey is only showing herself.


Yes--herself as a child. The hair might be short and white now, but IMHO opinion that's an improvement. Sixty years ago it bore a strong resemblance to a horse's tail--braided with ribbons it might have carried her to first place in the local pony show.


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## Poor Purl (Apr 14, 2011)

Country Bumpkins said:


> But susan loved being called Norman. Susan was making fun of KGP by using her avatar as a dead man's mother. Joey is only showing herself. My name is my wood working business that my husband and I own. Why are you poor purl?


I'm named for a doll, Poor Pearl, that was popular in the sixties and seventies.

I don't think Susan _loved_ being called Norman, but you're right about her reason. Thanks for explaining your plural; I've been puzzled about it. I think the woodworking business is an excellent one to be in (except in a bad economy, when almost no business is excellent), and it's the kind of business Jesus could have run.

As for the (I think beautiful) sheep, it was a response to Joey's message "What a great bunch of intelligent people! Some one makes a statement then corrects it and gives a website. It takes 10+ pages of denials before someone on the left actually reads the website to confirm the statement was really true." As usual, snark for snark.


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## Janet Cooke (Aug 14, 2013)

susanmos2000 said:


> Here's the WIVB.com version of events--pretty much the same story with some additional details.
> 
> http://wivb.com/2014/02/18/mcdonalds-worker-fired-after-paying-for-food-donation/


If I recall, it was two separate issues
1. would the franchisee or corporate pay? NO
2. the employees banded together and paid. 
a. the food must have been worse than ever by then

She supposedly made a rude gesture to a boss. 
She denies it.


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## Country Bumpkins (Feb 18, 2011)

Never a bad economy for repairing or building. Something always needs to be fixed. We have to turn away work.


----------



## MarilynKnits (Aug 30, 2011)

I think Real Men knit anything they darn well please. And eat quiche if they feel like it. As do Real Women. Real People speak their minds and usually have minds to speak.



SQM said:


> "I'm pretty certain Janet's a woman"
> 
> Do real men knit washcloths?


----------



## Poor Purl (Apr 14, 2011)

Country Bumpkins said:


> Never a bad economy for repairing or building. Something always needs to be fixed. We have to turn away work.


I'm happy to know that. I hope you continue to have the same kind of luck always.


----------



## Poor Purl (Apr 14, 2011)

Janet Cooke said:


> LOL, I am not sure how you can tell what color the hair is in that atrocity Joeysomma is using. I would think blonde, but, who can know?
> 
> The picture reminded me of Tarzan movies which was why I said O'Sullivan.
> Anyway, it is gauche to display that horse's tail on a head.


As far as I can tell in that small a picture, the person in the avatar is naked under all that hair. So probably not Joey after all. I've known girls who would have given anything to have hair like what you call an atrocity.


----------



## Poor Purl (Apr 14, 2011)

joeysomma said:


> She was an employee not the manager.


Apparently she was the manager for that shift. "Levia, a 23-year-old single mom with twins, works two jobs and is putting herself through nursing school. *During her morning shift as a manager at McDonalds* last week, while several local fire departments worked in sub-zero temperatures to put out a house fire, Levia says she saw a way to help."

http://wivb.com/2014/02/18/mcdonalds-worker-fired-after-paying-for-food-donation/


----------



## Janet Cooke (Aug 14, 2013)

Poor Purl said:


> Apparently she was the manager for that shift. "Levia, a 23-year-old single mom with twins, works two jobs and is putting herself through nursing school. *During her morning shift as a manager at McDonalds* last week, while several local fire departments worked in sub-zero temperatures to put out a house fire, Levia says she saw a way to help."
> 
> http://wivb.com/2014/02/18/mcdonalds-worker-fired-after-paying-for-food-donation/


She should have called over to Dunkin's and had someone bring them a Box of Joe or two.


----------



## Country Bumpkins (Feb 18, 2011)

Poor Purl said:


> I'm happy to know that. I hope you continue to have the same kind of luck always.


Thank you


----------



## Poor Purl (Apr 14, 2011)

Janet Cooke said:


> She should have called over to Dunkin's and had someone bring them a Box of Joe or two.


 :XD: :XD: :XD:


----------



## Huckleberry (May 27, 2013)

MarilynKnits said:


> I think Real Men knit anything they darn well please. And eat quiche if they feel like it. As do Real Women. Real People speak their minds and usually have minds to speak.


MarilynKnits
Bingo!


----------



## Huckleberry (May 27, 2013)

Just seemed to have seen Joeysomma's hair in the Westminster Dog Show. Did not come in first, a Terrier did.


----------



## SQM (Jun 22, 2012)

As I wrote in another thread, maybe we should be more concerned about the Religious Freedom Act that is now on the desk of Arizona's governor or the anti-gay bill in Uganda rather than this sniping. Do we care about the war on gay women here?


----------



## MaidInBedlam (Jul 24, 2012)

If someone is declared "brain dead" I would want to be as certain as possible that they were completely brain dead. I can see some potential for misuse of that criterium to prove death.

There have been a couple of cases in the news fairly recently where the question of what "dead" means. There was also a case of a 13 year old girl i the area where I live being declared brain dead and the family refusing to take her off life support. It was a truly tragic story from beginning to end. It seems to me that stopping the use of life supporting equipment would be very hard decision to make because the person seems to be alive in the sense that they are warm to the touch and respond to some stimuli.

This is a tough question, just as difficult as deciding at what point a fetus is viable, or when the brain begins to develop. We do some incredible things to help very premature babies survive. Some of what's done damages these babies. For example, there is an antibiotic used on premature babies that is ototoxic, toxic to the ears and hearing. The damage caused doesn't show up until the surviving child is a few years old. Between 1939 and 1954 too much oxygen was used in incubators used for premature babies. This caused an eye condition called retrolental fibroplagia (RLF).Most people who are blind or visually impaired and who were born between those years owe their condition to RLF. It's my understanding that this condition is much rarer since the breakthrough in 1954 when medical science showed the link between too much oxygen and RLF. I have several blind friends born between 1946 and 1950 who are all blind because of RLF.

This is what Wikipedia has to say about it:
"Retinopathy of prematurity (ROP) or Terry syndrome,[1] previously known as retrolental fibroplasia (RLF), is a disease of the eye affecting prematurely-born babies generally having received intensive neonatal care, in which oxygen therapy is often used and advantageous. It is thought to be caused by disorganized growth of retinal blood vessels which may result in scarring and retinal detachment. ROP can be mild and may resolve spontaneously, but it may lead to blindness in serious cases. As such, all preterm babies are at risk for ROP, and very low birth weight is an additional risk factor. Both oxygen toxicity and relative hypoxia can contribute to the development of ROP."

My mother has her health care directive which prohibits taking "heroic measures" to Keep. I'm the one in the family tasked with making the hard decision about when it might be time to say it's over, if that kind of situation should occur. I have a brother, which is a good thing, and we are all very clear about what my mother wants in terms of end-of-life decisions. I'm especially glad we have that clarity because it just makes everything worse of there's disagreement in the family in such an awful circumstance.

I guess if we're talking about beginning of life issues here we can also talk about end of life issues, not to mention the subject of ethics someone else brought up.



Janet Cooke said:



> I agree with you in most cases, there are always exceptions, of course.
> Families often have a very difficult time accepting what might be the proper time to say it's over.
> I had a small bit of THIS coversation with my brother this morning. He related how difficult it was for his wife,an only child, to say "no more" in comparison to our family in the same circumstances for my mother. We were five siblings, all agreed. It made moving forward much easier.


----------



## susanmos2000 (May 10, 2011)

MaidInBedlam said:


> This is a tough question, just as difficult as deciding at what point a fetus is viable, or when the brain begins to develop. We do some incredible things to help very premature babies survive. Some of what's done damages these babies.


So true, Maid. According to Wikipedia, almost half (46%) of children born between 22 and 25 weeks are severely disabled. I do wonder sometimes if life can hold any meaning for children who will never see, hear, speak, or even sit up.


----------



## Janet Cooke (Aug 14, 2013)

SQM said:


> As I wrote in another thread, maybe we should be more concerned about the Religious Freedom Act that is now on the desk of Arizona's governor or the anti-gay bill in Uganda rather than this sniping. Do we care about the war on gay women here?


OK, I have started 3 times. I am getting sick of this.

The success of having marriage equality stand in so many states felt so good that it is really hard to regroup and think of how to take on more battles. 
You mention Uganda, the state has set out a mighty challenge there, are we going to go after Uganda because they are a weaker nation than Russia even though what Russia is doing is encouraging their citizenry to do the same as Uganda?
Other than emailing Governor Brewer what influence is someone from NY or Mass going to have?


----------



## SQM (Jun 22, 2012)

Emailing her is a good idea. Let her know the country is watching her.


----------



## Poor Purl (Apr 14, 2011)

Janet Cooke said:


> OK, I have started 3 times. I am getting sick of this.
> 
> The success of having marriage equality stand in so many states felt so good that it is really hard to regroup and think of how to take on more battles.
> You mention Uganda, the state has set out a mighty challenge there, are we going to go after Uganda because they are a weaker nation than Russia even though what Russia is doing is encouraging their citizenry to do the same as Uganda?
> Other than emailing Governor Brewer what influence is someone from NY or Mass going to have?


None, on Arizona or Uganda or Russia. (Though I believe the law in Uganda was drafted by American Christians, living in DC - now those people have influence.)


----------



## damemary (Mar 14, 2012)

I felt that the post was not worth investigating. 1. It seemed like it was using statistics to malign a minority. 2. I could think of no reason to be interested. 3. Sorry to admit I've only read bits and pieces of James Joyce.



Poor Purl said:


> Sorry, Empress Dame, but either you're channeling James Joyce in writing your messages or you're confusing two things. (I would guess Joyce, but I'll go on anyway.)
> 
> The old conspiracy (not a theory, but a real conspiracy) is reported in the New York Times: "To Court Blacks, Foes of Abortion Make Racial Case
> By SHAILA DEWAN
> ...


----------



## damemary (Mar 14, 2012)

Poor Purl said:


> The website the first poster gave is a piece of - well, I bet even you know. The statement she made was the least important thing that came out of the authentic report, at least as regards living, breathing, post-born people, but none of those is on your agenda.
> 
> If you looked at the rest of that report, you'd see where one battle in the War on Women should be fought. Instead you're playing follow the leader by using a picture of a dead animal on someone's head as an avatar.


At least the dead animal suits her.


----------



## west coast kitty (May 26, 2012)

susanmos2000 said:


> So true, Maid. According to Wikipedia, almost half (46%) of children born between 22 and 25 weeks are severely disabled. I do wonder sometimes if life can hold any meaning for children who will never see, hear, speak, or even sit up.


Do you also wonder about the meaning of life for older children or adults who can't hear, speak or sit up? Do you think that your wondering is what makes organizations supporting people with disabilities leery about legislation that uses that type of criteria in witholding care or active euthanasia?


----------



## lovethelake (Apr 6, 2011)

Country Bumpkins said:


> But susan loved being called Norman. Susan was making fun of KGP by using her avatar as a dead man's mother. Joey is only showing herself. My name is my wood working business that my husband and I own. Why are you poor purl?


Because she is an AOW


----------



## damemary (Mar 14, 2012)

Lkholcomb said:


> I remember in sociology class in college them discussing how one of the least accurate ways to do a study was by survey (particularly paper survey) because people had less qualms about lying to a paper. Ever since then I actually look at how the data is collected. Scientific research lays out in specifics how it was collected, so I'm spoiled now lol.


And paper surveys compared to Internet surveys?


----------



## damemary (Mar 14, 2012)

<<<<whispering....Maureen O'Wool's looks cleaner.>>>>>



Poor Purl said:


> That it is. They don't ever want to hear what we say (unless it's an apology), and who would want to be preached to the way they preach to us (and never apologize).
> 
> FYI, Maureen O'Sullivan played Jane in the Tarzan movies and was the mother of Mia Farrow.
> 
> ...


----------



## damemary (Mar 14, 2012)

You count as the voice of reason.



Lkholcomb said:


> In 2 pages I actually addressed the report the article was referencing, but I must have invisible posts, or I don't count as the "left".


----------



## damemary (Mar 14, 2012)

Isn't that because you discuss real information intelligently? Radical, for some, but not for all.



Lkholcomb said:


> Well I do make lengthy posts after all.


----------



## damemary (Mar 14, 2012)

Oh tedium.



west coast kitty said:


> In my reply to you I did express concern that black women overall had more high risk factors and that their needs did not seem to be addressed --- this is a partial quote of my previous post --
> "I agree that the declining abortion rate is very good news. I don't know enough about NY or it's people to understand these dynamics, but I find it disturbing that black women seem to have higher risk factors such as overweight or obesity, poor nutrition, lack of late term maternity care etc than any other group in the stats. IMO that is a flag that public health and social services are not reaching black women in a meaningful way or that some other factor is at play."
> 
> I also mentioned that the report indicated more details were available thru Vital Statistics so you could do more research if you choose. Since there was no "Other" category in the table the totals by race should add up to the total for the City, so you could do the math if those details are important to you


----------



## damemary (Mar 14, 2012)

Sometimes a girl's just got to have fun.



Poor Purl said:


> No but it adds to the fun. There has never been a "discussion" here, or at least not for several weeks. If Joey hadn't posted her own snarky comment, I wouldn't have done it.


----------



## damemary (Mar 14, 2012)

MarilynKnits said:


> I think Real Men knit anything they darn well please. And eat quiche if they feel like it. As do Real Women. Real People speak their minds and usually have minds to speak.


I'm with you Marilyn.

:thumbup: :thumbup: :thumbup: :thumbup: :thumbup: :thumbup: :thumbup: :thumbup: :thumbup: :thumbup: :thumbup: :thumbup:


----------



## damemary (Mar 14, 2012)

Huckleberry said:


> Just seemed to have seen Joeysomma's hair in the Westminster Dog Show. Did not come in first, a Terrier did.


 :XD: :XD: :XD: :XD: :XD: :XD: :XD: :XD: :XD:


----------



## damemary (Mar 14, 2012)

SQM said:


> As I wrote in another thread, maybe we should be more concerned about the Religious Freedom Act that is now on the desk of Arizona's governor or the anti-gay bill in Uganda rather than this sniping. Do we care about the war on gay women here?


 :thumbup: :thumbup: :thumbup: :thumbup: :thumbup:     :thumbup: :thumbup: :thumbup: :thumbup: :thumbup:


----------



## damemary (Mar 14, 2012)

Janet Cooke said:


> OK, I have started 3 times. I am getting sick of this.
> 
> The success of having marriage equality stand in so many states felt so good that it is really hard to regroup and think of how to take on more battles.
> You mention Uganda, the state has set out a mighty challenge there, are we going to go after Uganda because they are a weaker nation than Russia even though what Russia is doing is encouraging their citizenry to do the same as Uganda?
> Other than emailing Governor Brewer what influence is someone from NY or Mass going to have?


I'm here in Arizona bombarding Gov Brewer to no avail so for. I did hear that 3 GOP Reps who had voted for the bill have sent a letter asking her to veto it.


----------



## SQM (Jun 22, 2012)

Oh I forget our Dame is in that nasty state that houses my republican twin. Bravi to the 3 GOPers. 

I don't recognize your new avatar. Who is she?


----------



## susanmos2000 (May 10, 2011)

west coast kitty said:


> Do you also wonder about the meaning of life for older children or adults who can't hear, speak or sit up? Do you think that your wondering is what makes organizations supporting people with disabilities leery about legislation that uses that type of criteria in witholding care or active euthanasia?


Who said anything about euthanasia? The issue is fetal viability (currently about 22 weeks) and whether it's wise for researchers to keep trying to push it back without first learning more about the physical needs of extremely young preemies.


----------



## west coast kitty (May 26, 2012)

damemary said:


> Oh tedium.


oh hyprocrisy -- oh sanctimony -- oh pompousity -- oh ignorance.
Which to choose, they all fit so well


----------



## Lkholcomb (Aug 25, 2013)

joeysomma said:


> It was page 134. you were finding fault with how the data could be reported. No comment as to the original being correct.


I was not finding fault, I was wondering about the gathering of report, which is usually presented so others can very information. It's always present in science research and I have learned the importance of the gathering technique in reports. Questioning the gathering technique is not "finding fault" with the data, but I suppose if a person is not familiar with research one might not be fluent in the many different collecting methods that are in use and of many different pros and cons of each.

And since you missed it the first mention of the article (which is where I found the link to the report) was on page 130, the 11th post down:

SallyCar wrote


> http://www.infowars.com/nyc-more-black-babies-killed-by-abortion-than-born/


And you are correct (I apologize for my mistake in the page numbers) my post was on page 134:



Lkholcomb said:


> I looked also, I'm interested did you find the requirements regarding reporting? Like if they are required to report abortion statistics are they required to report the racial information as well or is that part optional. That could, and has in the past, skewed many a report. Not the fault of the reporting agency of course, but one reason why reporting methods are so important to report.
> 
> I was quite interested and excited to see that the overall abortion rate has been declining. That's good news, don't you agree?


But that was still not 10+ pages long. I have apologized for my page error, so perhaps you may as well?


----------



## Poor Purl (Apr 14, 2011)

lovethelake said:


> Because she is an AOW


What do I - or any of us - have to be angry about? The guy we supported is still President, for a second term. The ACA is law and is beginning to work. Roe v. Wade is also law, regardless of what you guys try to do to it. I'm pretty sanguine. It's you who haven't been able to get anything you want and feel the need to lash out at anyone who opposes you. Are you angry? I'd say you were enraged.

As for my being old, there are worse things that can happen to a person. But since you see it as something negative, I hope it never happens to you.


----------



## Lkholcomb (Aug 25, 2013)

west coast kitty said:


> In my reply to you I did express concern that black women overall had more high risk factors and that their needs did not seem to be addressed --- this is a partial quote of my previous post --
> "I agree that the declining abortion rate is very good news. I don't know enough about NY or it's people to understand these dynamics, but I find it disturbing that black women seem to have higher risk factors such as overweight or obesity, poor nutrition, lack of late term maternity care etc than any other group in the stats. IMO that is a flag that public health and social services are not reaching black women in a meaningful way or that some other factor is at play."
> 
> I also mentioned that the report indicated more details were available thru Vital Statistics so you could do more research if you choose. Since there was no "Other" category in the table the totals by race should add up to the total for the City, so you could do the math if those details are important to you


Yes, you did eventually respond with that, and I am so very glad we found a common belief on that!

I was referring to the original article and poster which had a noted priority of concern for the elective terminations and not over the spontaneous terminations.


----------



## Cindy S (Oct 20, 2013)

Poor Purl said:


> What do I - or any of us - have to be angry about? The guy we supported is still President, for a second term. The ACA is law and is beginning to work. Roe v. Wade is also law, regardless of what you guys try to do to it. I'm pretty sanguine. It's you who haven't been able to get anything you want and feel the need to lash out at anyone who opposes you. Are you angry? I'd say you were enraged.
> 
> As for my being old, there are worse things that can happen to a person. But since you see it as something negative, I hope it never happens to you.


Have no idea is LTL is old, don't really care, but her attitude seems to be beyond bitter.


----------



## damemary (Mar 14, 2012)

It's my dear friend Grace Kelly laughing at the goings-on.



SQM said:


> Oh I forget our Dame is in that nasty state that houses my republican twin. Bravi to the 3 GOPers.
> 
> I don't recognize your new avatar. Who is she?


----------



## Poor Purl (Apr 14, 2011)

Cindy S said:


> Have no idea is LTL is old, don't really care, but her attitude is beyond bitter.


I don't know her age, either - nor does she know mine, for that matter. But bitter is a mild way to describe her attitude.


----------



## damemary (Mar 14, 2012)

Don't hold your breath. Never happened previously.



Lkholcomb said:


> But that was still not 10+ pages long. I have apologized for my page error, so perhaps you may as well?


----------



## damemary (Mar 14, 2012)

Poor Purl said:


> What do I - or any of us - have to be angry about? The guy we supported is still President, for a second term. The ACA is law and is beginning to work. Roe v. Wade is also law, regardless of what you guys try to do to it. I'm pretty sanguine. It's you who haven't been able to get anything you want and feel the need to lash out at anyone who opposes you. Are you angry? I'd say you were enraged.
> 
> As for my being old, there are worse things that can happen to a person. But since you see it as something negative, I hope it never happens to you.


 :XD: :XD: :XD: :XD: :XD: :XD: That's my girl!


----------



## Lkholcomb (Aug 25, 2013)

joeysomma said:


> The last 10+ pages show that many do not read. You dismiss articles by their headlines or authors without making any effort to read what they say.
> 
> Maybe the headline is an attention getter, and the actual article says the opposite of what is said in the headline.
> 
> ...


If that was the case it was another agregious slam by McDonalds on their employees. That you for bringing this to awareness, perhaps it will help those who have also suffered injustices by McDonalds to speak up.

It is terrible that she should be fired for showing gratitude to firefights by paying for their meal herself (although I admit to not quite seeing your point that the title was opposite of what happened)


----------



## theyarnlady (Feb 25, 2011)

Hey No Name

What ya up too. You haven't been on a lot of late. I know it must be hard to chose which personalities of the two to chose.
you may want to add another one so as not to confuse yourself.

Miss your rants and we have become such good buddies. I have been busy myself reading a book I think you would enjoy.

"How to make everyone believe you really know what you are talking about even when you don't." You should pick up a copy good hints in there for you.

Well all for the night. Do hope you come on soon, do miss your thoughts when your brain is active.

Your buddy and Pal,

Schizoid Vagrant


----------



## Poor Purl (Apr 14, 2011)

Lkholcomb said:


> If that was the case it was another agregious slam by McDonalds on their employees. That you for bringing this to awareness, perhaps it will help those who have also suffered injustices by McDonalds to speak up.
> 
> It is terrible that she should be fired for showing gratitude to firefights by paying for their meal herself (although I admit to not quite seeing your point that the title was opposite of what happened)


Joey mistakenly thought the headline calling her a manager was incorrect. It turns out that she was manager on that shift.

Joey has nothing to say about the incident or the firing, but the headline may have been wrong. Always on the forefront of running backwards.


----------



## Lkholcomb (Aug 25, 2013)

joeysomma said:


> She was an employee not the manager.


I have read from other sources that she was a manager. A manager is an employee, no? Did you read something not posted that stated she was not a manager?


----------



## Lkholcomb (Aug 25, 2013)

Poor Purl said:


> Okay, the headline was a bit misleading, but the point of the story didn't depend on her job title. I guess if she were manager, it would have been the corporation that was to blame for her firing. Since she was only an employee, it was the manager who was to blame, maybe. But what is your response to the incident? Should anyone, employee or manager, be fired for doing what she did *with her own money*?


In macdonalds they have different managers and they don't all do the firing and can easily be fired or demoted by the senior or owners. I know someone personally who was a manager and has been demoted for idiotic reasons.


----------



## Lkholcomb (Aug 25, 2013)

Janet Cooke said:


> I agree with you in most cases, there are always exceptions, of course.
> Families often have a very difficult time accepting what might be the proper time to say it's over.
> I had a small bit of THIS coversation with my brother this morning. He related how difficult it was for his wife,an only child, to say "no more" in comparison to our family in the same circumstances for my mother. We were five siblings, all agreed. It made moving forward much easier.


I think also the concept of "brain death" is more abstract. It is a reading from a machine. But if the heart stops beating and they stop breathing it is a concrete thing you can see. I think the concept of the heart beating and breathing makes it hard to think of someone as "dead".

Btw just in case anybody is thinking I'm against pulling life support in certain case let me state that I am not. I think that keeping someone alive in certain cases is a crime against nature.


----------



## Cindy S (Oct 20, 2013)

theyarnlady said:


> Hey No Name
> 
> What ya up too. You haven't been on a lot of late. I know it must be hard to chose which personalities of the two to chose.
> you may want to add another one so as not to confuse yourself.
> ...


Having read some of your posts it sounds like you could be the author of that book you are recommending.


----------



## Cindy S (Oct 20, 2013)

Oops double post!


----------



## damemary (Mar 14, 2012)

My curiousity is piqued. Who are you talking to?



theyarnlady said:


> Hey No Name
> 
> What ya up too. You haven't been on a lot of late. I know it must be hard to chose which personalities of the two to chose.
> you may want to add another one so as not to confuse yourself.
> ...


----------



## Lkholcomb (Aug 25, 2013)

MaidInBedlam said:


> If someone is declared "brain dead" I would want to be as certain as possible that they were completely brain dead. I can see some potential for misuse of that criterium to prove death.
> 
> There have been a couple of cases in the news fairly recently where the question of what "dead" means. There was also a case of a 13 year old girl i the area where I live being declared brain dead and the family refusing to take her off life support. It was a truly tragic story from beginning to end. It seems to me that stopping the use of life supporting equipment would be very hard decision to make because the person seems to be alive in the sense that they are warm to the touch and respond to some stimuli.
> 
> ...


I've seen true horror stories that can happen in "saving" premature babies. Working the the NICU forced me to think of my ethics surrounding "saving" people and why there is a drastic difference in the measures taken in the younger when the outcome is the same as in older people (for instance they end up a vegetable the rest of their lives). That was actually a good thing I took away from that time, the conscious ability to examine my long held believes and to understand why I believe it.

ROP is not as common but still is not unusual. It has dropped drastically since they learned. In the NICU nurses and respiratory therapists had the power to alter the oxygen levels used to maintain the blood oxygen. In adults it is only by drs orders. But I allows for the lowest oxygen needed to maintain. There is also a surgery available to treat it (in people able to afford it).


----------



## Cindy S (Oct 20, 2013)

damemary said:


> My curiousity is piqued. Who are you talking to?


Herself, she signed it Schizoid


----------



## Lkholcomb (Aug 25, 2013)

damemary said:


> And paper surveys compared to Internet surveys?


I'm not sure about the paper vs Internet surveys. One day when I can't sleep I may just look that up


----------



## Lkholcomb (Aug 25, 2013)

damemary said:


> Isn't that because you discuss real information intelligently? Radical, for some, but not for all.


----------



## Poor Purl (Apr 14, 2011)

Cindy S said:


> Having read some of your posts it sounds like you could be the author of that book you are recommending.


 :XD: :XD: :XD: :XD: :XD:


----------



## damemary (Mar 14, 2012)

To me, the complications involved it these medical decisions always lead me to believe that these decisions should be decided by the patient, physician and family, if appropriate. No one else has skin in the game.



Lkholcomb said:


> I've seen true horror stories that can happen in "saving" premature babies. Working the the NICU forced me to think of my ethics surrounding "saving" people and why there is a drastic difference in the measures taken in the younger when the outcome is the same as in older people (for instance they end up a vegetable the rest of their lives). That was actually a good thing I took away from that time, the conscious ability to examine my long held believes and to understand why I believe it.
> 
> ROP is not as common but still is not unusual. It has dropped drastically since they learned. In the NICU nurses and respiratory therapists had the power to alter the oxygen levels used to maintain the blood oxygen. In adults it is only by drs orders. But I allows for the lowest oxygen needed to maintain. There is also a surgery available to treat it (in people able to afford it).


----------



## damemary (Mar 14, 2012)

I just think that the anonymity of the Internet encourages people to 'be all that they can be.' Anxious to hear what you find.



Lkholcomb said:


> I'm not sure about the paper vs Internet surveys. One day when I can't sleep I may just look that up


----------



## Lkholcomb (Aug 25, 2013)

damemary said:


> I'm here in Arizona bombarding Gov Brewer to no avail so for. I did hear that 3 GOP Reps who had voted for the bill have sent a letter asking her to veto it.


I'm curious how they would feel to those who passed the bill another were put forth that non Christians were allowed to refuse service to Christian based on religious reasons.


----------



## Lkholcomb (Aug 25, 2013)

damemary said:


> My curiousity is piqued. Who are you talking to?


I'm curious as well.


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## damemary (Mar 14, 2012)

No feedback on that. Maybe they can't imagine such a thing?



Lkholcomb said:


> I'm curious how they would feel to those who passed the bill another were put forth that non Christians were allowed to refuse service to Christian based on religious reasons.


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## Lkholcomb (Aug 25, 2013)

damemary said:


> To me, the complications involved it these medical decisions always lead me to believe that these decisions should be decided by the patient, physician and family, if appropriate. No one else has skin in the game.


It should be decided by the family, most definately. My issue with many neonatal doctors and staff is that they downplay or just don't talk about the problems that occur, much less the percentages. They would do tours for women who had been admitted for very premature labor so they were familiar with the NICU. The static they gave was a 50/50 for babies born at 25 weeks. No frank discussions of what was involved. I saw many a parents have a stark hit with reality when the babies were admitted and had problems because so many people glossed over it. I remember one time when they were giving report, which included the moms in premature labor, and they said the parents had decided in one round of drugs only and you could see most of the nurses nodding their heads in agreement.

Neonatal staff tend to just push the things on the parents, not really giving them the option, just telling them what they would do. Technically they have a choice but they aren't made aware of it.


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## damemary (Mar 14, 2012)

I'm not saying it would be easy for a layperson, but they have no choice. Leading remarks by medical staff should be dealt with harshly. If they can't tell the difference, they don't belong there. If you're ready for a child, you must be ready for responsibility.



Lkholcomb said:


> It should be decided by the family, most definately. My issue with many neonatal doctors and staff is that they downplay or just don't talk about the problems that occur, much less the percentages. They would do tours for women who had been admitted for very premature labor so they were familiar with the NICU. The static they gave was a 50/50 for babies born at 25 weeks. No frank discussions of what was involved. I saw many a parents have a stark hit with reality when the babies were admitted and had problems because so many people glossed over it. I remember one time when they were giving report, which included the moms in premature labor, and they said the parents had decided in one round of drugs only and you could see most of the nurses nodding their heads in agreement.
> 
> Neonatal staff tend to just push the things on the parents, not really giving them the option, just telling them what they would do. Technically they have a choice but they aren't made aware of it.


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## Lkholcomb (Aug 25, 2013)

west coast kitty said:


> In my reply to you I did express concern that black women overall had more high risk factors and that their needs did not seem to be addressed --- this is a partial quote of my previous post --
> "I agree that the declining abortion rate is very good news. I don't know enough about NY or it's people to understand these dynamics, but I find it disturbing that black women seem to have higher risk factors such as overweight or obesity, poor nutrition, lack of late term maternity care etc than any other group in the stats. IMO that is a flag that public health and social services are not reaching black women in a meaningful way or that some other factor is at play."
> 
> I also mentioned that the report indicated more details were available thru Vital Statistics so you could do more research if you choose. Since there was no "Other" category in the table the totals by race should add up to the total for the City, so you could do the math if those details are important to you


Thank you, I did come to that realization earlier today but hadn't the time to sit and add it at the moment. I have since. The numbers do not add up.

Live births total: 123,231

Hispanic: 36,642
Asian and pacific islander: 21,148
Non-Hispanic white: 39,112
Non Hispanic black: 24,758
Total count of ethnic groups: 121,661

That leaves 1,570 unaccounted for in ethnic group

Spontaneous termination total: 13,514

Hispanic: 2,951
Asian and pacific islander: 1,018
Non-Hispanic white: 3,049
Non Hispanic black: 3,446
Total count of ethnic groups: 10,464

That leaves 3,050 unaccounted for in ethnic group

Induced terminations total: 73,815

Hispanic: 22,917
Asian and pacific islander: 4,493
Non-Hispanic white: 9,704
Non Hispanic black: 31,328
Total count of ethnic groups: 68,442

That leaves 5,373 unaccounted for in ethnic group

So from this I can only conclude that their has either been an error made or that reporting of the ethnic groups wasn't mandatory. I tend to lean towards the conclusion that it wasn't mandatory.


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## Janet Cooke (Aug 14, 2013)

theyarnlady said:


> Hey No Name
> 
> What ya up too. You haven't been on a lot of late. I know it must be hard to chose which personalities of the two to chose.
> you may want to add another one so as not to confuse yourself.
> ...


Perhaps you should also try... how to develop compassion and empathy in the same way that you "borrow" ideas for threads. 
You couldn't read a book more complicated than "Chicken Little" if your life depended on it.


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## Janet Cooke (Aug 14, 2013)

damemary said:


> My curiousity is piqued. Who are you talking to?


Most likely herself.


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## SQM (Jun 22, 2012)

We all need LKholcomb when it comes to dividing up the check. She must have been the banker in Monopoly. Seems brainy.


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## Lkholcomb (Aug 25, 2013)

SQM said:


> We all need LKholcomb when it comes to dividing up the check. She must have been the banker in Monopoly. Seems brainy.


 :lol:


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## Poor Purl (Apr 14, 2011)

Lkholcomb said:


> I'm curious how they would feel to those who passed the bill another were put forth that non Christians were allowed to refuse service to Christian based on religious reasons.


That's an interesting idea. Sauce for the goose.


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## Janet Cooke (Aug 14, 2013)

Lkholcomb said:


> I've seen true horror stories that can happen in "saving" premature babies. Working the the NICU forced me to think of my ethics surrounding "saving" people and why there is a drastic difference in the measures taken in the younger when the outcome is the same as in older people (for instance they end up a vegetable the rest of their lives). That was actually a good thing I took away from that time, the conscious ability to examine my long held believes and to understand why I believe it.


People are hampered by not understanding what the outcome is when a child who is barely viable is born and saved through technology. These are children who 40 years ago would not have survived. You can probably set a time frame on that better than I, Lkholcomb.
The first time I was exposed to some of these successes was as a student doing my field placement in an early intervention center. As has been stated, there were children who were blind, hearing impaired, non-verbal, in various stages of immobility...everything from a total inability to hold a head up, to needing support to stand. 
These were the good cases, children who could leave the house in the morning to get out for therapies and training. 
There are so many more.

The problem is that no family is prepared in the immediacy of need when a child is born with complications of birth. How do you propare someone? You certainly can't do tours through NICUs and show off the children who are such tiny little beings hooked up to all of those machines.

How does a parent say "enough"? How do parents accept that this is what life is going to be like for the next 40,50,60 years and decide that they are not strong enough to cope? That their children who are at home waiting deserve more than they will ever get because this child will take so much time, so much energy, so much of the family resources?

An objective person might say to stop, how does a parent who has been anticipating this birth do that especially without the knowledge that life is forever altered? 
Those are the post birth abortions that conservatives scream about now. 
These are the babies whom nature caused to come too soon, or maybe that God caused to come too soon. 
These are the babies who half a century ago would not be babies.


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## Poor Purl (Apr 14, 2011)

SQM said:


> We all need LKholcomb when it comes to dividing up the check. She must have been the banker in Monopoly. Seems brainy.


When I was studying mathematics, we'd sometimes go out to lunch together, 8 or 10 of us, and everyone thought it was so funny to pass the check to the next person saying "You figure it out. You're the mathematician." Eight or ten times.


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## Janet Cooke (Aug 14, 2013)

Poor Purl said:


> When I was studying mathematics, we'd sometimes go out to lunch together, 8 or 10 of us, and everyone thought it was so funny to pass the check to the next person saying "You figure it out. You're the mathematician." Eight or ten times.


Who said mathematicians don't have senses of humor?


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## Poor Purl (Apr 14, 2011)

Janet Cooke said:


> People are hampered by not understanding what the outcome is when a child who is barely viable is born and saved through technology. These are children who 40 years ago would not have survived. You can probably set a time frame on that better than I, Lkholcomb.
> The first time I was exposed to some of these successes was as a student doing my field placement in an early intervention center. As has been stated, there were children who were blind, hearing impaired, non-verbal, in various stages of immobility...everything from a total inability to hold a head up, to needing support to stand.
> These were the good cases, children who could leave the house in the morning to get out for therapies and training.
> There are so many more.
> ...


This is an unanswerable question, a problem without a solution. It's so huge a problem, and so complex, yet parents are expected to make up their minds on the spur of the moment. How do other countries handle such things, countries where there's a real safety net?


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## SQM (Jun 22, 2012)

My precious was born 5 weeks early and actually the staff made all the decisions re: her care. I don't remember even being consulted - they just took care of things. She was in the neo natal icu for over a week. This was almost 31 years ago. Maybe parents are told more today. Thankfully she ultimately had no serious issues - just needed to gain weight.


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## Poor Purl (Apr 14, 2011)

Janet Cooke said:


> Who said mathematicians don't have senses of humor?


Not I (and I hope neither, you). The funniest people I've known were mathematicians, even if they sometimes stoop to silliness. They're especially good at puns and word play, but also at building fantastic (imaginary) structures that would get more and more complicated as time went on and as different people joined in. It takes a lot of intelligence to be really funny, and these people are, for the most part, highly intelligent.

On the other hand, the dullest people I've ever known were also mathematicians. You win some, you lose some.


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## Janet Cooke (Aug 14, 2013)

Poor Purl said:


> This is an unanswerable question, a problem without a solution. It's so huge a problem, and so complex, yet parents are expected to make up their minds on the spur of the moment. How do other countries handle such things, countries where there's a real safety net?


France seems to be the nation that provides the best postnatal care. 
The trouble is that this is for a lifetime. 
Just as with the babies being kept alive who would not have survived a few decades ago, the adults they become live longer and longer. There are folks in institutions and group homes today who are as old and sometimes older than we are.

Elderly parents afraid to die because they are so worried that care will go downhill after they pass. Quite an insult to the staff who has been keeping them alive for decades past their projected lifetime, but, what can you do?

We used to joke that they should have let staff know about the RFP process for the group homes they opened. 
In a house for four people, using four Section 8 certificates, the landlords could and did charge $5000. a month for rent. 
It was expensive to get it ready... handicapped bathrooms and all, but heck, think of the profits.


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## SQM (Jun 22, 2012)

Oh Joey - your tresses are lovely. Would you let me climb up them? Sloth.


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## susanmos2000 (May 10, 2011)

joeysomma said:


> FYI: The hair was all mine. It was blonde. It was braided and they were just taken out.
> 
> I wondered how much garbage the ones, on here, would say about it. You didn't disappoint. It shows where your mind is.
> 
> ...


Hmm...twins separated at birth? The resemblance is uncanny.


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## damemary (Mar 14, 2012)

And so that leaves us with no real information from the statistics.



Lkholcomb said:


> Thank you, I did come to that realization earlier today but hadn't the time to sit and add it at the moment. I have since. The numbers do not add up.
> 
> Live births total: 123,231
> 
> ...


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## Poor Purl (Apr 14, 2011)

joeysomma said:


> FYI: The hair was all mine. It was blonde. It was braided and they were just taken out.
> 
> I wondered how much garbage the ones, on here, would say about it. You didn't disappoint. It shows where your mind is.
> 
> ...


Sorry to disappoint, but now that you've identified the hair, I think it must have looked lovely. How old were you at the time?


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## damemary (Mar 14, 2012)

Poor Purl said:


> When I was studying mathematics, we'd sometimes go out to lunch together, 8 or 10 of us, and everyone thought it was so funny to pass the check to the next person saying "You figure it out. You're the mathematician." Eight or ten times.


 :XD: :XD: :XD: Love that math humor.


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## damemary (Mar 14, 2012)

You were very very fortunate.



SQM said:


> My precious was born 5 weeks early and actually the staff made all the decisions re: her care. I don't remember even being consulted - they just took care of things. She was in the neo natal icu for over a week. This was almost 31 years ago. Maybe parents are told more today. Thankfully she ultimately had no serious issues - just needed to gain weight.


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## Poor Purl (Apr 14, 2011)

susanmos2000 said:


> Hmm...twins separated at birth? The resemblance is uncanny.


Susan, we can always count on you to hit the bullseye. But you're so nice.


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## Lkholcomb (Aug 25, 2013)

Janet Cooke said:


> People are hampered by not understanding what the outcome is when a child who is barely viable is born and saved through technology. These are children who 40 years ago would not have survived. You can probably set a time frame on that better than I, Lkholcomb.
> The first time I was exposed to some of these successes was as a student doing my field placement in an early intervention center. As has been stated, there were children who were blind, hearing impaired, non-verbal, in various stages of immobility...everything from a total inability to hold a head up, to needing support to stand.
> These were the good cases, children who could leave the house in the morning to get out for therapies and training.
> There are so many more.
> ...


They do tours through the nicu and they can see those tiny ones hooked up. I think the problem is that when people discuss it they don't discuss the long term. The nurses and doctors have seen those babies leave the nicu with bad problems but no one talks to the parent about it. Personally I think it would be a good idea to have counselors, much like hospice counselors, who go in and instead of the focus being on the here and how of "saving" these little ones, they help prepare the parents for the longer term issues and present the idea that they have a choice. I think that would better help any parent than what they have now.


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## Lkholcomb (Aug 25, 2013)

Janet Cooke said:


> Who said mathematicians don't have senses of humor?


Not me! :lol:


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## Lkholcomb (Aug 25, 2013)

SQM said:


> My precious was born 5 weeks early and actually the staff made all the decisions re: her care. I don't remember even being consulted - they just took care of things. She was in the neo natal icu for over a week. This was almost 31 years ago. Maybe parents are told more today. Thankfully she ultimately had no serious issues - just needed to gain weight.


Not last time I knew. That was the way it was, the parents not discussed with or given options.


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## Lkholcomb (Aug 25, 2013)

damemary said:


> And so that leaves us with no real information from the statistics.


Well from the ethnic categorization at least. I wondered to myself if there could be more reporting in the black population because so many are still born into poverty and would be more likely to use planned parenthood and clinics of the like. Planned parenthood gets grants and such so they need to be very careful to fill out forms so the ethnicity may be always reported. Whereas a regular doctor's office is just reporting, not worried about grants and all the strict requirements, because it is mandatory and not worried about filling in the "optional" part. Just conjecture in this case. But I have seen a difference in paperwork between organizations relying on grants and private places.


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## Knitted by Nan (Aug 3, 2013)

SQM said:


> My precious was born 5 weeks early and actually the staff made all the decisions re: her care. I don't remember even being consulted - they just took care of things. She was in the neo natal icu for over a week. This was almost 31 years ago. Maybe parents are told more today. Thankfully she ultimately had no serious issues - just needed to gain weight.


I am very happy your daughter had no serious health problems and only needed to gain weight. My youngest son was born three weeks early, an elective Caesar as there were problems. The hospital did not tell me that there had been complications at the birth and he had not breathed for six minutes after he was born. It was only disclosed after he had been in hospital for over a week when he was four weeks old, he had been fitting very badly at that stage. Yes, he had brain damage but it could have been worse. My friend's youngest child is now 23 years old and he did not breathe until five minutes after birth. He has the mental age of a three year old child, is not toilet trained and cannot hold a conversation. He speech is limited to a few words, usually he just says "mum, mum, mum". He did not talk at all until he was 7 years old and did not walk before that age. In both instances the fathers failed to recognise the child and the child's needs so both boys were brought up by their mothers. My friend's husband shot through when the boy was five years old. My son has high function autism and temporal lobe epilepsy and is considered to be 'low level disadvantaged', my friend's son is considered 'high level disadvantaged'. I know from experience how difficult it is to bring up a child with any disability but unfortunately a lot of people do not have any understanding of the problems and these problems are many if the child is severely handicapped.

Many people see the small, helpless baby and think "I could love that child and rear it", forgetting that the baby grows into a child and then an adult. The problems increase as the baby matures into an adult, they do not go away. Some people do not understand the strain and pressure an ill child places on a family. All members of the family suffer. The other children are disadvantaged because the mother must give priority and special care to the sick child; the husband feels neglected because the wife's attention is needed by the child. The children do become teenagers and undergo the same hormone surges as do all teenager, they just cannot cope with these developments. They do not understand what is happening in many instances. As I said some people only see the small, helpless baby; they do not see the child as a teenager or an adult and do not understand the lifetime of care and commitment that is needed by that small, frail baby.


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## damemary (Mar 14, 2012)

Thanks for offering perspective.



EveMCooke said:


> I am very happy your daughter had no serious health problems and only needed to gain weight. My youngest son was born three weeks early, an elective Caesar as there were problems. The hospital did not tell me that there had been complications at the birth and he had not breathed for six minutes after he was born. It was only disclosed after he had been in hospital for over a week when he was four weeks old, he had been fitting very badly at that stage. Yes, he had brain damage but it could have been worse. My friend's youngest child is now 23 years old and he did not breathe until five minutes after birth. He has the mental age of a three year old child, is not toilet trained and cannot hold a conversation. He speech is limited to a few words, usually he just says "mum, mum, mum". He did not talk at all until he was 7 years old and did not walk before that age. In both instances the fathers failed to recognise the child and the child's needs so both boys were brought up by their mothers. My friend's husband shot through when the boy was five years old. My son has high function autism and temporal lobe epilepsy and is considered to be 'low level disadvantaged', my friend's son is considered 'high level disadvantaged'. I know from experience how difficult it is to bring up a child with any disability but unfortunately a lot of people do not have any understanding of the problems and these problems are many if the child is severely handicapped.
> 
> Many people see the small, helpless baby and think "I could love that child and rear it", forgetting that the baby grows into a child and then an adult. The problems increase as the baby matures into an adult, they do not go away. Some people do not understand the strain and pressure an ill child places on a family. All members of the family suffer. The other children are disadvantaged because the mother must give priority and special care to the sick child; the husband feels neglected because the wife's attention is needed by the child. The children do become teenagers and undergo the same hormone surges as do all teenager, they just cannot cope with these developments. They do not understand what is happening in many instances. As I said some people only see the small, helpless baby; they do not see the child as a teenager or an adult and do not understand the lifetime of care and commitment that is needed by that small, frail baby.


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## Janet Cooke (Aug 14, 2013)

joeysomma said:


> FYI: The hair was all mine. It was blonde. It was braided and they were just taken out.
> 
> I wondered how much garbage the ones, on here, would say about it. You didn't disappoint. It shows where your mind is.
> 
> ...


I don't know about anyone else, I didn't give you a thought all day. 
You have proven yourself to be unthinking and not worthy of attention. 
You need better lighting when you have pictures taken.


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## Janet Cooke (Aug 14, 2013)

joeysomma said:


> 9 or 10


So when you were 9 or 10 your parent(s) took you to a studio and had you pose nude for a shot in front of a forest type backdrop? or were you standing in your yard? or perhaps in front of a picture window? Was your mother a florist, perhaps?

Please tell us the whole story, joeysomma?


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## Janet Cooke (Aug 14, 2013)

EveMCooke said:


> I am very happy your daughter had no serious health problems and only needed to gain weight. My youngest son was born three weeks early, an elective Caesar as there were problems. The hospital did not tell me that there had been complications at the birth and he had not breathed for six minutes after he was born. It was only disclosed after he had been in hospital for over a week when he was four weeks old, he had been fitting very badly at that stage. Yes, he had brain damage but it could have been worse. My friend's youngest child is now 23 years old and he did not breathe until five minutes after birth. He has the mental age of a three year old child, is not toilet trained and cannot hold a conversation. He speech is limited to a few words, usually he just says "mum, mum, mum". He did not talk at all until he was 7 years old and did not walk before that age. In both instances the fathers failed to recognise the child and the child's needs so both boys were brought up by their mothers. My friend's husband shot through when the boy was five years old. My son has high function autism and temporal lobe epilepsy and is considered to be 'low level disadvantaged', my friend's son is considered 'high level disadvantaged'. I know from experience how difficult it is to bring up a child with any disability but unfortunately a lot of people do not have any understanding of the problems and these problems are many if the child is severely handicapped.
> 
> Many people see the small, helpless baby and think "I could love that child and rear it", forgetting that the baby grows into a child and then an adult. The problems increase as the baby matures into an adult, they do not go away. Some people do not understand the strain and pressure an ill child places on a family. All members of the family suffer. The other children are disadvantaged because the mother must give priority and special care to the sick child; the husband feels neglected because the wife's attention is needed by the child. The children do become teenagers and undergo the same hormone surges as do all teenager, they just cannot cope with these developments. They do not understand what is happening in many instances. As I said some people only see the small, helpless baby; they do not see the child as a teenager or an adult and do not understand the lifetime of care and commitment that is needed by that small, frail baby.


And luck is actually all it is, other than for drug addicts and alcoholics who are after all dealing with their own hell, I have seen so many parents wracked with guilt when there is no good reason for it, it is sheer luck. 
Keep plugging away, Eve.


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## Gerslay (Oct 4, 2011)

joeysomma said:


> I changed my mind!


Don't cast your pearls before swine, Joey!


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## MarilynKnits (Aug 30, 2011)

I have an innate suspicion of surveys. Perhaps statistics from the US Census or Eagleton Polls are reliable, but otherwise - - . A poll depends so much on what questions are asked and of whom. I have seen too many polls with questions that are so slanted, the replies inevitably conform to what the pollster wants to present to the public. And I have seen polls directed to a focus group that can be depended upon to give the answers the sponsor of the poll wants to hear.

Back at NYU in the 1950's there was a Social Studies professor, Dr. Durward Prudden, who taught his freshman lecture groups the touch points of propaganda and how to recognize propaganda and separate it from fact. He made wary cynics of all of us who paid attention. I may have sat in the back knitting a tennis sweater for my boy friend, but I paid attention. And it was not a "fatal" sweater, either; we married and are still together.

I truly do not trust polls that are heavily slanted in one direction or the other except if they ask about loving chocolate.


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## Janet Cooke (Aug 14, 2013)

Lkholcomb said:


> They do tours through the nicu and they can see those tiny ones hooked up. I think the problem is that when people discuss it they don't discuss the long term. The nurses and doctors have seen those babies leave the nicu with bad problems but no one talks to the parent about it. Personally I think it would be a good idea to have counselors, much like hospice counselors, who go in and instead of the focus being on the here and how of "saving" these little ones, they help prepare the parents for the longer term issues and present the idea that they have a choice. I think that would better help any parent than what they have now.


I don't remember my daughters mentioning tours, but then, they both know my views and probably didn't want to listen one more time. 
I am guessing that these days families are assigned a social worker to assist in making connections for therapies, equipment and the like. 
This is just too sad for early morning. Maybe later.


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## Janet Cooke (Aug 14, 2013)

joeysomma said:


> I changed my mind!


I am not surprised.


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## Gerslay (Oct 4, 2011)

Shame on you. Janet Cooke!

Your remarks towards those who have a difference of opinion with you are always cruel. You reveal so much about yourself.

Any objective person witnessing your posts would come to a similar conclusion: abusive, belittling, contemptuous, derisive, derogatory, disdainful, dismissive, insulting, offensive, and scathing remarks...and not a single one of them the truth about whom you speak. 

You are a pitiful person, indeed!


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## MarilynKnits (Aug 30, 2011)

When I see my friend "A" and her husband "B" with their young adult son "C", I feel so much compassion. They married late in life, and after at least 2 miscarriages, C was born almost three months early at under 2 lbs. He was in the NICU for months and came home at a bit over 5 lbs. His development was delayed and as an adult he has problems with his speech being understandable, with walking (he has a rolling gait) and with intellectual issues. He will never be able to live independently. He has the impulse control of a toddler, and unless you know the family, to have a tall sturdy young man come at you for a "huggy" can be terrifying. They adopted from then on, and have made preparations for the time A and B can no longer care for C at home so the two younger children do not have to be responsible for their brother's care. But they have the resources to do this. Not many people are able to set up a care trust fund. And the two younger ones, knowing that the parents have considered their best interests as well, are lovingly ready to make sure C is properly cared for when the parents are no longer around. He is such a sweet child, but his is a totally empty life. Imagine a life time of caring for a gargantuan toddler who you really love to pieces.


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## Janet Cooke (Aug 14, 2013)

Gerslay said:


> Shame on you. Janet Cooke!
> 
> Your remarks towards those who have a difference of opinion with you are always cruel. You reveal so much about yourself.
> 
> ...


Thanks for upping my standards, now up yours.


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## Janet Cooke (Aug 14, 2013)

MarilynKnits said:


> When I see my friend "A" and her husband "B" with their young adult son "C", I feel so much compassion. They married late in life, and after at least 2 miscarriages, C was born almost three months early at under 2 lbs. He was in the NICU for months and came home at a bit over 5 lbs. His development was delayed and as an adult he has problems with his speech being understandable, with walking (he has a rolling gait) and with intellectual issues. He will never be able to live independently. He has the impulse control of a toddler, and unless you know the family, to have a tall sturdy young man come at you for a "huggy" can be terrifying. They adopted from then on, and have made preparations for the time A and B can no longer care for C at home so the two younger children do not have to be responsible for their brother's care. But they have the resources to do this. Not many people are able to set up a care trust fund. And the two younger ones, knowing that the parents have considered their best interests as well, are lovingly ready to make sure C is properly cared for when the parents are no longer around. He is such a sweet child, but his is a totally empty life. Imagine a life time of caring for a gargantuan toddler who you really love to pieces.


Marilyn, Please make sure that they make as many political connections as possible if they have not already. Sad to say that sometimes that is the difference between a placement and not. Also, if they live in the same state as I do... strongly encourage them to insist on a state placement not a private non-profit.


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## Janet Cooke (Aug 14, 2013)

.


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## Gerslay (Oct 4, 2011)

Janet Cooke said:


> Thanks for upping my standards, now up yours.


Can't think of anything original to say?


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## susanmos2000 (May 10, 2011)

EveMCooke said:


> I am very happy your daughter had no serious health problems and only needed to gain weight. My youngest son was born three weeks early, an elective Caesar as there were problems. The hospital did not tell me that there had been complications at the birth and he had not breathed for six minutes after he was born. It was only disclosed after he had been in hospital for over a week when he was four weeks old, he had been fitting very badly at that stage. Yes, he had brain damage but it could have been worse. My friend's youngest child is now 23 years old and he did not breathe until five minutes after birth. He has the mental age of a three year old child, is not toilet trained and cannot hold a conversation. He speech is limited to a few words, usually he just says "mum, mum, mum". He did not talk at all until he was 7 years old and did not walk before that age. In both instances the fathers failed to recognise the child and the child's needs so both boys were brought up by their mothers. My friend's husband shot through when the boy was five years old. My son has high function autism and temporal lobe epilepsy and is considered to be 'low level disadvantaged', my friend's son is considered 'high level disadvantaged'. I know from experience how difficult it is to bring up a child with any disability but unfortunately a lot of people do not have any understanding of the problems and these problems are many if the child is severely handicapped.
> 
> Many people see the small, helpless baby and think "I could love that child and rear it", forgetting that the baby grows into a child and then an adult. The problems increase as the baby matures into an adult, they do not go away. Some people do not understand the strain and pressure an ill child places on a family. All members of the family suffer. The other children are disadvantaged because the mother must give priority and special care to the sick child; the husband feels neglected because the wife's attention is needed by the child. The children do become teenagers and undergo the same hormone surges as do all teenager, they just cannot cope with these developments. They do not understand what is happening in many instances. As I said some people only see the small, helpless baby; they do not see the child as a teenager or an adult and do not understand the lifetime of care and commitment that is needed by that small, frail baby.


Your story certainly strikes a chord, Eve. My late brother's SIL gave birth to a daughter with severe brain damage (her uterus ruptured during delivery)--literally, half the baby's brain cells died from oxygen deprivation. Stephanie is of more or less normal intelligence, but she has cerebral palsy, seizures, severe anxieties, and has to communicate through a touchtype device. When the girl was about eight Daddy-O couldn't stand it anymore and left, leaving the full burden of care to his ex. To her credit she's a saint--devoted body and soul to her daughter. She'll care for Stephanie to her dying day--but then what? The girl is now about twenty and needs round the clock care--when Mom isn't around any longer to provide that her daughter will probably end up in an institution of some kind. It's a very sad situation.


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## Wombatnomore (Dec 9, 2013)

Janet Cooke said:


> Thanks for upping my standards, now up yours.


Again with the back side reference! You got a fetish or something?

You are one contemptible piece of work. Just some old crow getting your rocks off by flinging insults around. I'd have some respect for you if your throw away lines were clever but they're just as foul as bin juice odour of which I am sure you are familiar.


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## Janet Cooke (Aug 14, 2013)

susanmos2000 said:


> Your story certainly strikes a chord, Eve. My late brother's SIL gave birth to a daughter with severe brain damage (her uterus ruptured during delivery)--literally, half the baby's brain cells died from oxygen deprivation. Stephanie is of more or less normal intelligence, but she has cerebral palsy, seizures, severe anxieties, and has to communicate through a touchtype device. When the girl was about eight Daddy-O couldn't stand it anymore and left, leaving the full burden of care to his ex. To her credit she's a saint--devoted body and soul to her daughter. She'll care for Stephanie to her dying day--but then what? The girl is now about twenty and needs round the clock care--when Mom isn't around any longer to provide that her daughter will probably end up in an institution of some kind. It's a very sad situation.


I know that I am prejudiced since the group home environment was where I devoted my working life, I think people make a huge mistake in keeping their adult children with them until they are too infirm to care for them. 
Adjustment to a group living situation is not going to get any easier as these adults (the children) age. 
If the care goes on "until her dying day" then the adult person with disabilities is adjusting to a new home, grieving, and doing that with staff who does not yet love them. 
I am also a firm believer that we all benefit from lives filled with as many loving people in it as possible. 
Of course, there is also the benefit to the parent that they just cannot seem to manage...a life.


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## Janet Cooke (Aug 14, 2013)

Wombatnomore said:


> Again with the back side reference! You got a fetish or something?
> 
> You are one contemptible piece of work. Just some old crow getting your rocks off by flinging insults around. I'd have some respect for you if your throw away lines were clever but they're just as foul as bin juice odour of which I am sure you are familiar.


What makes you think I was referring to the backside?
Have you never heard of the SweatHogs? 
Up your nose with a rubber hose.


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## Cindy S (Oct 20, 2013)

Wombatnomore said:


> Again with the back side reference! You got a fetish or something?
> 
> You are one contemptible piece of work. Just some old crow getting your rocks off by flinging insults around. I'd have some respect for you if your throw away lines were clever but they're just as foul as bin juice odour of which I am sure you are familiar.


Her statement can be taken in more than one way, your response just shows where YOUR mind went.


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## Janet Cooke (Aug 14, 2013)

Wombatnomore said:


> Again with the back side reference! You got a fetish or something?
> 
> You are one contemptible piece of work. Just some old crow getting your rocks off by flinging insults around. I'd have some respect for you if your throw away lines were clever but they're just as foul as bin juice odour of which I am sure you are familiar.


I have news, I am not looking to impress you regardless of which name you decide to post under at any given time.


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## Gerslay (Oct 4, 2011)

Cindy S said:


> Her statement can be taken in more than one way, your response just shows where YOUR mind went.


And your statement shows how willing you are to bend over and kiss hers!


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## Janet Cooke (Aug 14, 2013)

Gerslay said:


> And your statement shows how willing you are to bend over and kiss hers!


Now that is definitely original, I will have to emulate you and your genius.


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## Cindy S (Oct 20, 2013)

Gerslay said:


> And your statement shows how willing you are to bend over and kiss hers!


Such a Christian statement, I expect no less from you. Have a blessed day, a stop by your church should be on your agenda!


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## susanmos2000 (May 10, 2011)

Janet Cooke said:


> I know that I am prejudiced since the group home environment was where I devoted my working life, I think people make a huge mistake in keeping their adult children with them until they are too infirm to care for them.
> Adjustment to a group living situation is not going to get any easier as these adults (the children) age.
> If the care goes on "until her dying day" then the adult person with disabilities is adjusting to a new home, grieving, and doing that with staff who does not yet love them.
> I am also a firm believer that we all benefit from lives filled with as many loving people in it as possible.
> Of course, there is also the benefit to the parent that they just cannot seem to manage...a life.


It's an odd situation, Janet, and one in which it seems there will be no happy ending. Good Catholic that she is Mom had her uterus repaired after her first delivery and went on to conceive and give birth to an perfectly healthy second daughter. I think she thought that Child #2 would be step in and take over Stephanie's care at some point, but it hasn't worked out like that at all. The girl's only seventeen but has already left home--she's made it abundantly clear that she wants to live her own life and not let it be consumed by her older sister's needs. And who can fault her for that? But the guilt must be something fierce for everyone concerned--Mom, Stephanie, Little Sis, and yes, even Dad although he keeps his distance.


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## Gerslay (Oct 4, 2011)

Cindy S said:


> Such a Christian statement, I expect no less from you. Have a blessed day, a stop by your church should be on your agenda!


Christians don't pretend to be perfect...like some others do...we're just sinners who know it and are forgiven.


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## Janet Cooke (Aug 14, 2013)

susanmos2000 said:


> It's an odd situation, Janet, and one in which it seems there will be no happy ending. Good Catholic that she is Mom had her uterus repaired after her first delivery and went on to conceive and give birth to an perfectly healthy second daughter. I think she thought that Child #2 would be step in and take over Stephanie's care at some point, but it hasn't worked out like that at all. The girl's only seventeen but has already left home--she's made it abundantly clear that she wants to live her own life and not let it be consumed by her older sister's needs. And who can fault her for that? But the guilt must be something fierce for everyone concerned--Mom, Stephanie, Little Sis, and yes, even Dad although he keeps his distance.


It is sad. If Mom made rational decisions rather than emotional ones Lil Sis might be more interested.


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## Janet Cooke (Aug 14, 2013)

So which would you drop, Gerri?


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## Gerslay (Oct 4, 2011)

Janet Cooke said:


> So which would you drop, Gerri?


The petri dish, of course!


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## Janet Cooke (Aug 14, 2013)

Gerslay said:


> The petri dish, of course!


Thank you for your honesty.


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## Gerslay (Oct 4, 2011)

Janet Cooke said:


> Thank you for your honesty.


You probably don't believe it, but I'm always honest.


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## Country Bumpkins (Feb 18, 2011)

Gerslay said:


> Shame on you. Janet Cooke!
> 
> Your remarks towards those who have a difference of opinion with you are always cruel. You reveal so much about yourself.
> 
> ...


 :thumbup:


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## MaidInBedlam (Jul 24, 2012)

I tend to think there's an element of showing off in the medical profession that has led to the possibility of survival for such premature babies. You're right that there's a huge rate of disability in the babies that do survive, and sometimes this seems terribly cruel to me. At the same time I can understand the desire of parents and the challenge to doctors to save these premature babies. It's a tough question.


susanmos2000 said:


> So true, Maid. According to Wikipedia, almost half (46%) of children born between 22 and 25 weeks are severely disabled. I do wonder sometimes if life can hold any meaning for children who will never see, hear, speak, or even sit up.


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## damemary (Mar 14, 2012)

Janet, when I see a post of yours that is challenging, I don't see it as your being abusive, belittling, contemptuous etc, but rather as encouraging people to think. Thank you for trying to help.


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## damemary (Mar 14, 2012)

They are very special people.



MarilynKnits said:


> When I see my friend "A" and her husband "B" with their young adult son "C", I feel so much compassion. They married late in life, and after at least 2 miscarriages, C was born almost three months early at under 2 lbs. He was in the NICU for months and came home at a bit over 5 lbs. His development was delayed and as an adult he has problems with his speech being understandable, with walking (he has a rolling gait) and with intellectual issues. He will never be able to live independently. He has the impulse control of a toddler, and unless you know the family, to have a tall sturdy young man come at you for a "huggy" can be terrifying. They adopted from then on, and have made preparations for the time A and B can no longer care for C at home so the two younger children do not have to be responsible for their brother's care. But they have the resources to do this. Not many people are able to set up a care trust fund. And the two younger ones, knowing that the parents have considered their best interests as well, are lovingly ready to make sure C is properly cared for when the parents are no longer around. He is such a sweet child, but his is a totally empty life. Imagine a life time of caring for a gargantuan toddler who you really love to pieces.


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## damemary (Mar 14, 2012)

Janet Cooke said:


> Thanks for upping my standards, now up yours.


 :XD: :XD: :XD: :XD: :XD: :XD: :XD: :XD: :XD: Good go Janet.


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## damemary (Mar 14, 2012)

Ah, from the odor, I sense wombat's back.


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## knitpresentgifts (May 21, 2013)

Janet Cooke said:


> Thank you for your honesty.


What else did you expect from her or any Christian, if not honesty.

Just because it isn't your way; don't expect others to be like you.


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## Poor Purl (Apr 14, 2011)

MarilynKnits said:


> I have an innate suspicion of surveys. Perhaps statistics from the US Census or Eagleton Polls are reliable, but otherwise - - . A poll depends so much on what questions are asked and of whom. I have seen too many polls with questions that are so slanted, the replies inevitably conform to what the pollster wants to present to the public. And I have seen polls directed to a focus group that can be depended upon to give the answers the sponsor of the poll wants to hear.
> 
> Back at NYU in the 1950's there was a Social Studies professor, Dr. Durward Prudden, who taught his freshman lecture groups the touch points of propaganda and how to recognize propaganda and separate it from fact. He made wary cynics of all of us who paid attention. I may have sat in the back knitting a tennis sweater for my boy friend, but I paid attention. And it was not a "fatal" sweater, either; we married and are still together.
> 
> I truly do not trust polls that are heavily slanted in one direction or the other except if they ask about loving chocolate.


The survey in question here is from an annual study of vital statistics by the New York City Department of Health, not a poll, but as usual with anything that relies on input, what you end up with depends on the reliability of your sources.

I would guess that LK is right in suggesting that the poorer women depended most on publicly funded care, which had to report accurately, while wealthier women, with private care, did not have reported anything they didn't want known.

I would love to have taken the social studies course you had, but back then all I wanted was the things I was good at, which came down to math, English, and classics. There was a required political science course, but all I recall about it was that I knitted through the entire class (my older sister was pregnant) and the professor actually held up my sweater in front of everyone and said "Miss __________ has no interest in the discussion, but she's making something beautiful." That wasn't exactly fair - I never raised my hand, but I heard every word that was said. In fact, without the knitting I would have dozed off.


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## Poor Purl (Apr 14, 2011)

Janet Cooke said:


> And luck is actually all it is, other than for drug addicts and alcoholics who are after all dealing with their own hell, I have seen so many parents wracked with guilt when there is no good reason for it, it is sheer luck.
> Keep plugging away, Eve.


I was extremely lucky. My son came 3 weeks early, and it was a normal delivery, made easier by the fact that his head was smaller than a 9-month head would have been. The next day, my husband and I attended the Lamaze class we'd been taking.

Baby was jaundiced for a while and stayed in the hospital for a week; they let me stay for two extra days, but though I kept returning to the hospital to be able to nurse him, I would often be told that he'd been given formula already. So I'd sit and cry for three hours waiting for the next feeding.

Another of my usual name drops: Miles Davis's baby was in the nursery while my son was there. He got a lot of visitors.


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## Poor Purl (Apr 14, 2011)

Gerslay said:


> You probably don't believe it, but I'm always honest.


With other people, perhaps, but not with yourself.


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## Poor Purl (Apr 14, 2011)

Gerslay said:


> Shame on you. Janet Cooke!
> 
> Your remarks towards those who have a difference of opinion with you are always cruel. You reveal so much about yourself.
> 
> ...


Pot, meet kettle.


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## Poor Purl (Apr 14, 2011)

MarilynKnits said:


> When I see my friend "A" and her husband "B" with their young adult son "C", I feel so much compassion. They married late in life, and after at least 2 miscarriages, C was born almost three months early at under 2 lbs. He was in the NICU for months and came home at a bit over 5 lbs. His development was delayed and as an adult he has problems with his speech being understandable, with walking (he has a rolling gait) and with intellectual issues. He will never be able to live independently. He has the impulse control of a toddler, and unless you know the family, to have a tall sturdy young man come at you for a "huggy" can be terrifying. They adopted from then on, and have made preparations for the time A and B can no longer care for C at home so the two younger children do not have to be responsible for their brother's care. But they have the resources to do this. Not many people are able to set up a care trust fund. And the two younger ones, knowing that the parents have considered their best interests as well, are lovingly ready to make sure C is properly cared for when the parents are no longer around. He is such a sweet child, but his is a totally empty life. Imagine a life time of caring for a gargantuan toddler who you really love to pieces.


Thank goodness your friends have those necessary resources. I've know families that had to devote all their resources to caring for one child.


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## Poor Purl (Apr 14, 2011)

Janet Cooke said:


> .


Thanks for that. It's an interesting way of explaining the difference. Of course, I expect some people here will choose the petri dish because, after all, the baby's already been born and no longer needs their attention.


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## sallycarr (Nov 5, 2013)

Janet Cooke said:


> Interesting question, do you have documentation that shows that?
> BTW, did you know that babies are not aborted?


What is it if it is not a baby? What is it if it lives after it was aborted?

The picture if of an aborted baby. It sure looks like a baby to me. Maybe you would change your mind if you spent some time in an abortion clinic.

My posting sure caused a lot of activity, I will pop in once in a while when a good story comes on the internet.


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## Poor Purl (Apr 14, 2011)

susanmos2000 said:


> Your story certainly strikes a chord, Eve. My late brother's SIL gave birth to a daughter with severe brain damage (her uterus ruptured during delivery)--literally, half the baby's brain cells died from oxygen deprivation. Stephanie is of more or less normal intelligence, but she has cerebral palsy, seizures, severe anxieties, and has to communicate through a touchtype device. When the girl was about eight Daddy-O couldn't stand it anymore and left, leaving the full burden of care to his ex. To her credit she's a saint--devoted body and soul to her daughter. She'll care for Stephanie to her dying day--but then what? The girl is now about twenty and needs round the clock care--when Mom isn't around any longer to provide that her daughter will probably end up in an institution of some kind. It's a very sad situation.


This is especially sad bc you think you've passed the preemie hurdle and everything is safe, but you're wrong. I hope Stephanie can speak up for herself after Mom goes, because she'll need to be vigilant if she's in an institution. I also hope father rots in hell, if there is one. Does he at least contribute to *his* daughter's care financially?


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## Poor Purl (Apr 14, 2011)

Wombatnomore said:


> Again with the back side reference! You got a fetish or something?
> 
> You are one contemptible piece of work. Just some old crow getting your rocks off by flinging insults around. I'd have some respect for you if your throw away lines were clever but they're just as foul as bin juice odour of which I am sure you are familiar.


Interesting how this is the only thing you notice - a long exchange about birth defects goes right by you without comment, but all you see are backsides. You're the fetishist.

We had an expression when I was young (I haven't always been olde): Up your nose with a rubber hose. How do you know Janet wasn't referring to that?

Thanks for your input. Up your nose with a rubber hose.


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## SQM (Jun 22, 2012)

Gerslay said:


> Shame on you. Janet Cooke!
> 
> Your remarks towards those who have a difference of opinion with you are always cruel. You reveal so much about yourself.
> 
> ...


Wrong!

Cooke is humanistic, intelligent, funny, interesting, loyal, dedicated, involved, honest, supportive, concerned, creative, and helpful. Her biggest flaw is that she knits dish cloths albeit very creative ones.

By the way - Hi Sister G. Que passe?


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## Poor Purl (Apr 14, 2011)

Janet Cooke said:


> What makes you think I was referring to the backside?
> Have you never heard of the SweatHogs?
> Up your nose with a rubber hose.


Once again, you beat me to it. The wombat has a one-track mind.


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## Poor Purl (Apr 14, 2011)

Gerslay said:


> And your statement shows how willing you are to bend over and kiss hers!


An example you being honest? Or of you being Christian? You're as much a fetishist as the wombat. Remember the "joke" you made when you pretended to be the Jolly Green Giant and told someone you'd "piss" on them? How dare you criticize others?


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## Poor Purl (Apr 14, 2011)

Gerslay said:


> Christians don't pretend to be perfect...like some others do...we're just sinners who know it and are forgiven.


Or so you think. Don't forget, even Christians don't really _know_ the mind of God; they only pretend they do.


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## Poor Purl (Apr 14, 2011)

damemary said:


> Ah, from the odor, I sense wombat's back.


Yes, I'm sure the wombat's back has a foul odor.


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## SQM (Jun 22, 2012)

Sister G has other nom de plumes?

Please list them so I can be consistent in my contempt.


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## Poor Purl (Apr 14, 2011)

SQM said:


> Sister G has other nom de plumes?
> 
> Please list them so I can be consistent in my contempt.


They all do, so they think we do, also. For all you know, I may be you, or Huckleberry, or even the wombat (though I doubt that even the RWNs would suggest that one). In fact, at different times I've been told I was Huckle and Rocky, both of who I look up to but - sorry, can't emulate.


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## SQM (Jun 22, 2012)

Poor Purl said:


> They all do, so they think we do, also. For all you know, I may be you, or Huckleberry, or even the wombat (though I doubt that even the RWNs would suggest that one). In fact, at different times I've been told I was Huckle and Rocky, both of who I look up to but - sorry, can't emulate.


To what purpose? To swell their ranks because there are not enough people to think like them?


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## Gerslay (Oct 4, 2011)

Poor Purl said:


> Or so you think. Don't forget, even Christians don't really _know_ the mind of God; they only pretend they do.


Oh but we do know the mind of God, for He has revealed Himself to mankind in a variety of ways.

1. CREATION: "The heavens tell of the glory of God. The skies display His marvelous craftsmanship. Day after day they continue to speak; night after night they make Him known. They speak without a sound or a word; their voice is silent in the skies; yet their message has gone out to all the earth, and their words to all the world..."

2. POWERFUL: When one considers the vast oceans, the majestic mountain peaks, the enormity of the earth and the incomprehensible size of the stars and the billions of galaxies, it is easy to discern that God must be incredibly powerful.

B. INTELLIGENT: When one examines the intricate design and harmony all around us or the irreducibly complex interior of a cell or the code embedded in the DNA, it is easy to conclude that God must be incredibly intelligent.

C. CREATIVE: Think of the millions of kinds of animals, and reptiles, bugs, fish. There are at least 10 million species of insects (The U.S. Natural Museum).

D. PERSONAL: If we can communicate, if we can hear and see, then surely our Creator who made the ear and the eye can hear and see also.

E. KIND and GRACIOUS: Paul said that God..."...did not leave Himself without witness, in that He did good and gave you rains from heaven and fruitful seasons, satisfying your hearts with food and gladness."

F. RIGHTEOUS: Our conscience (which is something that Paul brings up in Romans 2) and the convicting work of the Holy Spirit, reveals to us that God is righteous. My conscience tells me that God is right, and I am guilty when I've sinned against His laws. The Holy Spirit convicts of sin, and righteousness, and judgment.

Secondly, God has revealed Himself, to some degree, through and in man's:

G. CONSCIENCE: God has programmed every individual to know that certain things are right and certain things are wrong regardless of whether the laws are put into legislation by human governments. The existence of these moral laws points man to a Moral Lawgiver that transcends (or is over and above) human governments and man made laws.

God has also revealed Himself to man through:

H. CHRIST: 
The Bible teaches that Jesus was God incarnate (e.g., John 1:1, 5:18, 8:58). 
"If you have seen me you have seen the Father." John 14:9

God has also, fourthly, revealed Himself to man through:

4. THE CANON OF SCRIPTURE: The word canon means "standard." By canon then I am referring to the standard collection of 66 books that make up the Bible, God's Holy Word. The Scriptures reveal to us that God exists, what He is like, what His will is for us, and even some of His dealings with people in the past.

John said, "But these are written that you may believe that Jesus is the Christ, the Son of God, and that believing you may have life in His name" (John 20:31).

He wants us to know Him...He is a personal God and wants to have a relationship with us...including you, Poor Purl.


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## Country Bumpkins (Feb 18, 2011)

Gerslay said:


> Oh but we do know the mind of God, for He has revealed Himself to mankind in a variety of ways.
> 
> 1. CREATION: "The heavens tell of the glory of God. The skies display His marvelous craftsmanship. Day after day they continue to speak; night after night they make Him known. They speak without a sound or a word; their voice is silent in the skies; yet their message has gone out to all the earth, and their words to all the world..."
> 
> ...


Thanks Sis!


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## Poor Purl (Apr 14, 2011)

SQM said:


> To what purpose? To swell their ranks because there are not enough people to think like them?


I couldn't say. The pathological mind is hard to read.


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## knitpresentgifts (May 21, 2013)

Gerslay said:


> Oh but we do know the mind of God, for He has revealed Himself to mankind in a variety of ways.
> 
> 1. CREATION: "The heavens tell of the glory of God. The skies display His marvelous craftsmanship. Day after day they continue to speak; night after night they make Him known. They speak without a sound or a word; their voice is silent in the skies; yet their message has gone out to all the earth, and their words to all the world..."
> 
> ...


Fantastic post, Sister! All God's children said, "Amen!"


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## Country Bumpkins (Feb 18, 2011)

knitpresentgifts said:


> Fantastic post, Sister! All God's children said, "Amen!"


Amen!


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## MaidInBedlam (Jul 24, 2012)

west coast kitty said:


> Do you also wonder about the meaning of life for older children or adults who can't hear, speak or sit up? Do you think that your wondering is what makes organizations supporting people with disabilities leery about legislation that uses that type of criteria in witholding care or active euthanasia?


What Susan is wondering about is something well worth considering. To tie this in to the abortion discussion, bringing a pregnancy to term isnt necessarily the most wonderful thing in the world. Pro-lifers seem to think that when a pregnancy results in the birth of a child their work is done. This attitude is neither rational nor constructive.

The sad fact is that not all disabled people live a long life, nor do they have access to what most of us consider an ordinary life for a variety of reasons, Many dont even have the chance to live the kind of life an ordinary person can and does. Others cant. The parents and families of some disabled babies have to think about how their child will be cared for after they are gone from the moment their child comes into the world.

What are you doing to see that disabled people can live normally in your community? And, no, knitting for charity doesnt count. It doesnt count if youre pro-life, either. You may jump on me for saying this, but not all lives are worth living. Miscarriage is one of the ways Nature deals with that problem. Sometimes even abortion is the best way to deal with the potential problem of quality of life for a disabled person.

Depending on how old you are, you may not know that the modern disabled rights movement started almost 50 years ago which isnt a very long time when you are talking about making very real changes to any aspect of human society A little organization called the Center for Independent Living was instrumental in the disabled rights movement. My oldest and closest friend is one of the founders of the Center for Independent Living. She was born totally blind and has accomplished more in her life, so far, than any dozen non-disabled people could hope to accomplish.

Here's some of what Wikipedia says about the first organization of, by, and for disabled people and one of the most well-known disabled rights activists, Ed Roberts:

In 1971, the first Center for Independent Living was founded by disability activists,. These Centers were created to offer peer support and role modeling, and are run and controlled by persons with disabilities. According to the IL approach, the example of a peer, somebody who has been in a similar situation, can be more powerful than a non-disabled professional's interventions in analyzing ones situation, in assuming responsibility for ones life and in developing coping strategies.

Ed Roberts contracted polio at the age of fourteen in 1953, two years before the Salk vaccine put an end to the epidemics. He spent eighteen months in hospitals and returned home paralyzed from the neck down except for two fingers on one hand and several toes. He slept in an iron lung at night and often rested there during the day. When out of the lung he survived by "frog breathing," a technique for swallowing air using facial and neck muscles.

He attended school by telephone hook-up until his mother Zona insisted that he go to school once a week for a few hours. At school he faced his deep fear of being stared at and transformed his sense of personal identity. He gave up thinking of himself as a "helpless cripple," and decided to think of himself as a "star." He credited his mother with teaching him by example how to fight for what he needed.

Ed Roberts is often called the father of the disability rights movement. His career as an advocate began when a high school administrator threatened to deny his diploma because he had not completed driver's education and physical education. After attending the College of San Mateo he was admitted to the University of California, Berkeley. He had to fight for the support he needed from the California Department of Vocational Rehabilitation to attend college because his rehabilitation counselor thought he was too severely disabled to ever get a job. On learning that Roberts had a severe disability, one of the UC Berkeley deans famously commented, "We've tried cripples before and it didn't work." Other Berkeley administrators supported his admission, and expressed the opinion that the University should be doing more.

Roberts matriculated in 1962, two years before the Free Speech Movement transformed Berkeley into a hotbed of student protest. When his search for housing met resistance in part because of the 800 pound iron lung that he slept in at night, the director of the campus health service offered him a room in an empty wing of the Cowell Hospital. Roberts accepted on the condition that the area where he lived be treated as dormitory space, not a medical facility. His admission broke the ice for other students with severe disabilities who joined him over the next few years at what evolved into the Cowell Residence Program.

The group developed a sense of identity and elan, and began to formulate a political analysis of disability. They began calling themselves the "Rolling Quads" to the surprise of some non-disabled observers who had never before heard a positive expression of disability identity. In 1968 when two of the Rolling Quads were threatened with eviction from the Cowell Residence Program by a Rehabilitation Counselor, the Rolling Quads organized a successful 'revolt' that led to the counselor's transfer.

Their success on campus inspired the group to begin advocating for curb cuts, opening access to the wider community, and to create the Physically Disabled Student's Program (PDSP) - the first student led disability services program in the country. Ed Roberts flew 3000 miles from California to Washington DC with no respiratory support in order to attend a conference at the start-up of the federal TRIO program through which the PDSP later secured funding. The PDSP provided services including attendant referral and wheelchair repair to students at the University, but it was soon taking calls from people with disabilities with the same concerns who were not students.

He earned B.A. (1964) and M.A. (1966) degrees from UC Berkeley in Political Science. He became an official Ph.D. candidate (C.Phil.) in political science at Berkeley in 1969, but did not complete his Ph.D.[2]

The need to serve the wider community led to the creation of the Berkeley Center for Independent Living (CIL), [the first independent living service and advocacy program run by and for people with disabilities. Contrary to common belief, he was not the founder of the Berkeley CIL, nor the CIL's first executive director. He was teaching political science at an "alternative college," but returned to Berkeley to assume leadership of the fledgling organization. He guided the CIL's rapid growth during a decisive time for the emerging disability rights movement. The CIL provided a model for a new kind of community organization designed to address the needs and concerns of people with a wide range of disabilities.

In 1976, newly elected Governor Jerry Brown appointed Ed Roberts Director of the California Department of Vocational Rehabilitation - the same agency that had once labeled him too severely disabled to work. He served in that post until 1983. When California politics again shifted to the right, he returned again to Berkeley where he co-founded the World Institute on Disability with Judy Heumann and Joan Leon.
Roberts died on March 14, 1995, at the age of 56.

There are hundreds of centers for independent living around the world based on his original model. There is a National Council on Independent Living, a national advocacy organization established by all the centers. They hold an annual meeting every spring in Washington. At the one that was held after his passing, on May 15, 1995, Ed's empty wheelchair was towed by a volunteer as it symbolically led more than 500 advocates from around the country for the last time, on a memorial march from Upper Senate Park to a vigil in his honor in a Senate office building. Speakers at this vigil included Senator Tom Harkin of Iowa, Representative Steny Hoyer, Judith Heumann, and Paul Hearne. Ed's wheelchair was then donated to the Smithsonian Institution.


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## knitpresentgifts (May 21, 2013)

SQM said:


> Sister G has other nom de plumes?
> 
> Please list them so I can be consistent in my contempt.


Only the looney Libs have multiple names. Here are two still in use today:

Cheeky Blighter = Vocal Lisa

Ingried = Huckleberry


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## Poor Purl (Apr 14, 2011)

My God has the kind of relationship with me that he wants. It has nothing to do with the misreadings and mistranslations of the Hebrew Bible that you (plural) insist on. Don't forget, English is not the original language of the Bible, nor is Greek.

Again, you only think you know the mind of God. What you actually "know" is what other people have told you is the mind of God. And other people are fallible. And many tell lies for their own advantage. So keep thinking you know what you can't, in fact, possibly know, and keep believing the thoughts of others, but please don't preach to me. I can read the Bible in its original language, so I know what it really says.


Gerslay said:


> Oh but we do know the mind of God, for He has revealed Himself to mankind in a variety of ways.
> 
> 1. CREATION: "The heavens tell of the glory of God. The skies display His marvelous craftsmanship. Day after day they continue to speak; night after night they make Him known. They speak without a sound or a word; their voice is silent in the skies; yet their message has gone out to all the earth, and their words to all the world..."
> 
> ...


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## Gerslay (Oct 4, 2011)

Poor Purl said:


> My God has the kind of relationship with me that he wants. It has nothing to do with the misreadings and mistranslations of the Hebrew Bible that you (plural) insist on. Don't forget, English is not the original language of the Bible, nor is Greek.
> 
> Again, you only think you know the mind of God. What you actually "know" is what other people have told you is the mind of God. And other people are fallible. And many tell lies for their own advantage. So keep thinking you know what you can't, in fact, possibly know, and keep believing the thoughts of others, but please don't preach to me. I can read the Bible in its original language, so I know what it really says.


Sorry Poor Purl, but you're wrong. To have a relationship with the Lord is to know Him. Now I'm not saying I know everything there is to know about Him for much remains a mystery (in this temporal plane we see through a glass darkly) but I can and do say that I know him in the same way I know my sister, my daughter, my friend. Someone who I know personally, that I have a relationship with...as opposed to someone who is at a distance and unknowable.


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## Poor Purl (Apr 14, 2011)

Gerslay said:


> Sorry Poor Purl, but you're wrong. To have a relationship with the Lord is to know Him. Now I'm not saying I know everything there is to know about Him for much remains a mystery (in this temporal plane we see through a glass darkly) but I can and do say that I know him in the same way I know my sister, my daughter, my friend. Someone who I know personally, that I have a relationship with...as opposed to someone who is at a distance and unknowable.


Well, isn't that special?


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## Gerslay (Oct 4, 2011)

Poor Purl, You can reject knowing Him, but that doesn't make Him unknowable. It's your choice.


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## Country Bumpkins (Feb 18, 2011)

It is not what you know but WHO you know pp.


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## cookiequeen (Jun 15, 2011)

knitpresentgifts said:


> Only the looney Libs have multiple names. Here's two still in use today:
> 
> Cheeky Blighter = Vocal Lisa
> 
> Ingried = Huckleberry


What is this obsession with finding out who everyone is? Many people have changed their screen names, and many people don't wish to divulge their true identities. You are dead wrong! If admin OK's a name change why should anyone else care?
We can guess at who you are, too. What purpose would that serve? Would you want your identity divulged? Why do you care who people are? Do I care if you had other screen names? No. (Actually your writing style, tone, behavior, and arrogance give you away under any name.)
And I see you're still indulging in name-calling.


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## knitpresentgifts (May 21, 2013)

Gerslay said:


> Sorry Poor Purl, but you're wrong. To have a relationship with the Lord is to know Him. Now I'm not saying I know everything there is to know about Him for much remains a mystery (in this temporal plane we see through a glass darkly) but I can and do say that I know him in the same way I know my sister, my daughter, my friend. Someone who I know personally, that I have a relationship with...as opposed to someone who is at a distance and unknowable.


Gerslay,

Poor Purl thinks she is able to understand more of The Bible than anyone else, whichever the heck Bible she believes in, if any, because she can read the original language. Big Whoop! Does she think she is the only one who can read the original languages or that Christian teachers, Priests, or Pastors or laypeople cannot read the languages?

Who is she kidding other than her miserable self. The knowledge isn't in the reading of the words on a page, it is in the understanding and how you live according to God's wishes.

What a fool she is.


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## knitpresentgifts (May 21, 2013)

Gerslay said:


> Poor Purl, You can reject knowing Him, but that doesn't make Him unknowable. It's your choice.


 :thumbup:


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## knitpresentgifts (May 21, 2013)

Country Bumpkins said:


> It is not what you know but WHO you know pp.


 :thumbup: :thumbup: :thumbup: :thumbup: :thumbup: :thumbup: :thumbup: :thumbup: :thumbup: :thumbup: :thumbup: :thumbup: :thumbup: :thumbup: :thumbup: :thumbup: :thumbup: :thumbup: :thumbup: :thumbup: :thumbup:


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## Gerslay (Oct 4, 2011)

Poor Purl said:


> Well, isn't that special?


Yes, church lady, it IS special!


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## Country Bumpkins (Feb 18, 2011)

PP you knew to take the lesson you have studied and put it in your heart. You will then see the Light of the world.
Here is a good song for you.http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=-DdgkvnsHjM


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## Gerslay (Oct 4, 2011)

knitpresentgifts said:


> Gerslay,
> 
> Poor Purl thinks she is able to understand more of The Bible than anyone else, whichever the heck Bible she believes in, if any, because she can read the original language. Big Whoop! Does she think she is the only one who can read the original languages or that Christian teachers, Priests, or Pastors or laypeople cannot read the languages?
> 
> ...


Its weak, but its just a diversion to bring up the language thing...God made all the languages anyway so what's the point of that excuse making?


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## rocky1991 (May 8, 2011)

Gerslay said:


> Oh but we do know the mind of God, for He has revealed Himself to mankind in a variety of ways.
> 
> 1. CREATION: "The heavens tell of the glory of God. The skies display His marvelous craftsmanship. Day after day they continue to speak; night after night they make Him known. They speak without a sound or a word; their voice is silent in the skies; yet their message has gone out to all the earth, and their words to all the world..."
> 
> ...


Garbage in, Garbage out.


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## Gerslay (Oct 4, 2011)

rocky1991 said:


> Garbage in, Garbage out.


If your mind is a garbage pail, then, yes, I would say that you're right!


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## rocky1991 (May 8, 2011)

knitpresentgifts said:


> Gerslay,
> 
> Poor Purl thinks she is able to understand more of The Bible than anyone else, whichever the heck Bible she believes in, if any, because she can read the original language. Big Whoop! Does she think she is the only one who can read the original languages or that Christian teachers, Priests, or Pastors or laypeople cannot read the languages?
> 
> ...


Takes a fool to know a fool.


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## SQM (Jun 22, 2012)

knitpresentgifts said:


> Only the looney Libs have multiple names. Here are two still in use today:
> 
> Cheeky Blighter = Vocal Lisa
> 
> Ingried = Huckleberry


Ingried???? There is an Ingried I have yet to meet? How bewitching. Please appear Ingried.

Cheeky and Lisa???? I do like her ever so much. So it is okay to replicate her.

Now KGB - deny you are Tough Wiener my new absolute favorite Righty.


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## rocky1991 (May 8, 2011)

Gerslay said:


> If your mind is a garbage pail, then, yes, I would say that you're right!


If the epithet "garbage pail" is supposed to up set me, get over it. All you spew is garbage...........garbage in, garbage out.


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## MaidInBedlam (Jul 24, 2012)

Where to begin? Well, *the Bible is the word of men who believed they were divinely inspired.* Belief and the source of any inspiration are awfully hard to prove. Christian teachers, priests, pastors and laypeople are believers, but belief is intangible and awfully hard to prove.

Then there are all the non-Christians who live in a way that sure looks like the way God supposedly wants all people to live. They claim to believe the tenets of a variety of religions. Can you prove their belief is meaningless or that God rejects them because they aren't Christians? We're talking about intangibles again, and they're still awfully hard to prove.

Then there's me. I live according to the teachings of the particular Christian sect I belong to. I believe what I've been taught by other human beings who are just as imperfect as I am. How can I prove to you the extent and validity of my beliefs? How can I prove to you that I have what I think of as a pretty deep relationship with God? Yet again, we're talking about intangibles and they're still awfully hard to prove.

You needn't tell me what the Bible says about any of the above because *the Bible is the word of men who believed they were divinely inspired.*


knitpresentgifts said:


> Gerslay,
> Poor Purl thinks she is able to understand more of The Bible than anyone else, whichever the heck Bible she believes in, if any, because she can read the original language. Big Whoop! Does she think she is the only one who can read the original languages or that Christian teachers, Priests, or Pastors or laypeople cannot read the languages?
> 
> Who is she kidding other than her miserable self. The knowledge isn't in the reading of the words on a page, it is in the understanding and how you live according to God's wishes.
> ...


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## knitpresentgifts (May 21, 2013)

SQM said:


> Now KGB - deny you are Tough Wiener my new absolute favorite Righty.


Hey, Sloth,

FYI: I am neither KGB nor TuffIvy.


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## knitpresentgifts (May 21, 2013)

rocky1991 said:


> Takes a fool to know a fool.


Well, then, I'm certainly glad you can recognize yourself in Poor Purl. Your call.

I don't know either of you nor wish to.


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## MaidInBedlam (Jul 24, 2012)

"KGB", now that's a good one. It certainly gave me a good chuckle. Thanks!


SQM said:


> Ingried???? There is an Ingried I have yet to meet? How bewitching. Please appear Ingried.
> 
> Cheeky and Lisa???? I do like her ever so much. So it is okay to replicate her.
> 
> Now KGB - deny you are Tough Wiener my new absolute favorite Righty.


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## Gerslay (Oct 4, 2011)

TuffIvy has my respect as well, SQM!


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## rocky1991 (May 8, 2011)

knitpresentgifts said:


> Well, then, I'm certainly glad you can recognize yourself in Poor Purl. Your call.
> 
> I don't know either of you nor wish to.[/quote
> 
> ...


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## Janet Cooke (Aug 14, 2013)

sallycarr said:


> What is it if it is not a baby? What is it if it lives after it was aborted?
> 
> The picture if of an aborted baby. It sure looks like a baby to me. Maybe you would change your mind if you spent some time in an abortion clinic.
> 
> My posting sure caused a lot of activity, I will pop in once in a while when a good story comes on the internet.


Please do, what happened to the dismemberment?


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## Janet Cooke (Aug 14, 2013)

Gerslay said:


> Oh but we do know the mind of God, for He has revealed Himself to mankind in a variety of ways.
> 
> 1. CREATION: "The heavens tell of the glory of God. The skies display His marvelous craftsmanship. Day after day they continue to speak; night after night they make Him known. They speak without a sound or a word; their voice is silent in the skies; yet their message has gone out to all the earth, and their words to all the world..."
> 
> ...


God wants people to worship in their own way, God wants people who don't understand the difference between fact and fiction to mind their own business.


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## Janet Cooke (Aug 14, 2013)

Poor Purl said:


> Well, isn't that special?


It seems to me that the undercurrent is that the worship is not truly about God but the Holy Bible. 
None of us knows for sure about God's requirements or preferences.


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## Janet Cooke (Aug 14, 2013)

knitpresentgifts said:


> Gerslay,
> 
> Poor Purl thinks she is able to understand more of The Bible than anyone else, whichever the heck Bible she believes in, if any, because she can read the original language. Big Whoop! Does she think she is the only one who can read the original languages or that Christian teachers, Priests, or Pastors or laypeople cannot read the languages?
> 
> ...


One original language, one.


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## Janet Cooke (Aug 14, 2013)

Gerslay said:


> Its weak, but its just a diversion to bring up the language thing...God made all the languages anyway so what's the point of that excuse making?


Man is lousy at translating, good at ordering misinterpretations in order to boost a hold on power, champion at manipulation in order to control les pissants.


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## Janet Cooke (Aug 14, 2013)

rocky1991 said:


> Garbage in, Garbage out.


 :thumbup: :thumbup: :thumbup: :thumbup: :thumbup: :thumbup: :thumbup:


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## Gerslay (Oct 4, 2011)

Janet Cooke said:


> God wants people to worship in their own way, God wants people who don't understand the difference between fact and fiction to mind their own business.


Entirely wrong, Janet! God does not want people to worship in their own way; that is Satan's ploy, he would have you believe that you can worship a god of your making. Its called idolatry and it is proscribed in the first commandment:

"And God spake all these words, saying, I am the Lord thy God, which have brought thee out of the land of Egypt, out of the house of bondage. Thou shalt have no other gods before me. "


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## Gerslay (Oct 4, 2011)

Janet Cooke said:


> One original language, one.


Yes, one original language until man decided to worship himself and God separated them by dividing their one language into many.


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## knitpresentgifts (May 21, 2013)

Janet Cooke said:


> One original language, one.


Wrong again Janet. The books/verses of The Bible were not all originally written in just one language; no one expects you to know any better. My statements are correct; yours is not.

BTW: took you long enough to come up with stuff to insult others that isn't even accurate.

Ask your Lib bud, Poor Purl, even she knows there was more than one language used in the original docs.


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## damemary (Mar 14, 2012)

Thank you for this valuable information.



MaidInBedlam said:


> What Susan is wondering about is something well worth considering. To tie this in to the abortion discussion, bringing a pregnancy to term isnt necessarily the most wonderful thing in the world. Pro-lifers seem to think that when a pregnancy results in the birth of a child their work is done. This attitude is neither rational nor constructive.
> 
> The sad fact is that not all disabled people live a long life, nor do they have access to what most of us consider an ordinary life for a variety of reasons, Many dont even have the chance to live the kind of life an ordinary person can and does. Others cant. The parents and families of some disabled babies have to think about how their child will be cared for after they are gone from the moment their child comes into the world.
> 
> ...


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## damemary (Mar 14, 2012)

Poor Purl said:


> Well, isn't that special?


 :XD: :XD: :XD: :XD: :XD: :XD: :XD: :XD: :XD: :XD: :XD:


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## Janet Cooke (Aug 14, 2013)

Buckle up, folks, it seems we are in for another chapter of the Holy Bible is historical fact... and we can prove it. 

Yet they never do.


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## damemary (Mar 14, 2012)

KPG KGP XYZ. Same sheitze different day.



MaidInBedlam said:


> "KGB", now that's a good one. It certainly gave me a good chuckle. Thanks!


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## damemary (Mar 14, 2012)

Janet Cooke said:


> God wants people to worship in their own way, God wants people who don't understand the difference between fact and fiction to mind their own business.


 :thumbup: :thumbup: :thumbup: :thumbup: :thumbup:


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## damemary (Mar 14, 2012)

Janet Cooke said:


> Man is lousy at translating, good at ordering misinterpretations in order to boost a hold on power, champion at manipulation in order to control les pissants.


 :XD: :XD: :XD: :XD: :XD: :XD:


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## damemary (Mar 14, 2012)

Yawn.



Janet Cooke said:


> Buckle up, folks, it seems we are in for another chapter of the Holy Bible is historical fact... and we can prove it.
> 
> Yet they never do.


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## MrsB (Jun 3, 2011)

Wow, this post has morphed into the George and Gracie Show.


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## soloweygirl (Jun 9, 2012)

MrsB said:


> Wow, this post has morphed into the George and Gracie Show.


That would be insulting to George and Gracie. They had talent and a sense of humor.


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## Lkholcomb (Aug 25, 2013)

EveMCooke said:


> I am very happy your daughter had no serious health problems and only needed to gain weight. My youngest son was born three weeks early, an elective Caesar as there were problems. The hospital did not tell me that there had been complications at the birth and he had not breathed for six minutes after he was born. It was only disclosed after he had been in hospital for over a week when he was four weeks old, he had been fitting very badly at that stage. Yes, he had brain damage but it could have been worse. My friend's youngest child is now 23 years old and he did not breathe until five minutes after birth. He has the mental age of a three year old child, is not toilet trained and cannot hold a conversation. He speech is limited to a few words, usually he just says "mum, mum, mum". He did not talk at all until he was 7 years old and did not walk before that age. In both instances the fathers failed to recognise the child and the child's needs so both boys were brought up by their mothers. My friend's husband shot through when the boy was five years old. My son has high function autism and temporal lobe epilepsy and is considered to be 'low level disadvantaged', my friend's son is considered 'high level disadvantaged'. I know from experience how difficult it is to bring up a child with any disability but unfortunately a lot of people do not have any understanding of the problems and these problems are many if the child is severely handicapped.
> 
> Many people see the small, helpless baby and think "I could love that child and rear it", forgetting that the baby grows into a child and then an adult. The problems increase as the baby matures into an adult, they do not go away. Some people do not understand the strain and pressure an ill child places on a family. All members of the family suffer. The other children are disadvantaged because the mother must give priority and special care to the sick child; the husband feels neglected because the wife's attention is needed by the child. The children do become teenagers and undergo the same hormone surges as do all teenager, they just cannot cope with these developments. They do not understand what is happening in many instances. As I said some people only see the small, helpless baby; they do not see the child as a teenager or an adult and do not understand the lifetime of care and commitment that is needed by that small, frail baby.


I am sorry for all that you have gone through. It is important to have the perspective of folks like you have have gone through it and are still going through it.


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## MarilynKnits (Aug 30, 2011)

Oh, darlin, or do they swell because they are so rank?



SQM said:


> To what purpose? To swell their ranks because there are not enough people to think like them?


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## MarilynKnits (Aug 30, 2011)

What extreme hubris to claim to "know" or "understand" G-d! 

If He/She exists, He/She is unknowable. Although it is reported in the Torah that He spoke to Moses, Moses was told "you can only see my back". That was interpreted by scholars to mean mortal humans can see the results of His works, but will never see a corporeal essence.

For all we know, what we think of as G-d is native to another planet in another solar system or another galaxy, and the inhabitants of this planet may have been put here fully human with all the scientific mysteries leading to the theory of evolution - as a failed experiment left to its own devices to prosper or destroy itself. Makes as much sense as some of the other stuff people believe.

All we can do is try to walk the high road, be kind to one another, try to do no harm to others, and be the best we can be. Some of these self righteous holier-than-thous need to take a good look at how they represent themselves to the world.


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## Lkholcomb (Aug 25, 2013)

Poor Purl said:


> My God has the kind of relationship with me that he wants. It has nothing to do with the misreadings and mistranslations of the Hebrew Bible that you (plural) insist on. Don't forget, English is not the original language of the Bible, nor is Greek.
> 
> Again, you only think you know the mind of God. What you actually "know" is what other people have told you is the mind of God. And other people are fallible. And many tell lies for their own advantage. So keep thinking you know what you can't, in fact, possibly know, and keep believing the thoughts of others, but please don't preach to me. I can read the Bible in its original language, so I know what it really says.


I have always been curious to read the Hebrew Bible in its original language. I've been told that reading it in that original language adds to the experience.


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## Gerslay (Oct 4, 2011)

MarilynKnits said:


> What extreme hubris to claim to "know" or "understand" G-d!
> 
> If He/She exists, He/She is unknowable. Although it is reported in the Torah that He spoke to Moses, Moses was told "you can only see my back". That was interpreted by scholars to mean mortal humans can see the results of His works, but will never see a corporeal essence.
> 
> ...


It matters not if you think it hubris or sacred, the Word has power unto itself and it will do its work.


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## Janet Cooke (Aug 14, 2013)

Lkholcomb said:


> I have always been curious to read the Hebrew Bible in its original language. I've been told that reading it in that original language adds to the experience.


I am thinking that learning Hebrew would add to any experience. Heck, I can't master Spanish.


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## MaidInBedlam (Jul 24, 2012)

Hubris does matter. Pride is one of the Seven Deadly Sins. Remember?


Gerslay said:


> It matters not if you think it hubris or sacred, the Word has power unto itself and it will do its work.


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## MarilynKnits (Aug 30, 2011)

There is some Hebrew and some Aramaic. The idioms of the times in which the texts were written are sometimes untranslatable.

If you want to give some of the prayers a try, check out www.kakatuv.com and just pick a psalm at random. You will find the Hebrew calligraphy, transliteration, and translation in a linear format. It is one of the less awkward study guides I have found.

Here is a link to a site with transliteration and translation, book by book that may be of interest.

http://www.headcoverings-by-devorah.com/HebEngTaNaKhIndex.html

May keep some of us out of mischief for a while.


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## Gerslay (Oct 4, 2011)

MaidInBedlam said:


> Hubris does matter. Pride is one of the Seven Deadly Sins. Remember?


You misread the statement...it matters not if you think label my position hubris...if you've been given the Word it, the Word, will do its work. It has nothing to do with me. There is no pride there.


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## SQM (Jun 22, 2012)

MarilynKnits said:


> Oh, darlin, or do they swell because they are so rank?


Laugh Laugh!

I hope you all visited the I want to make a hitler doll (knitler doll - so cute) that was on the digest under main. That sure got me revved up. I am sure our Sisters on the Far Right may find that offensive too.


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## SQM (Jun 22, 2012)

MarilynKnits said:


> What extreme hubris to claim to "know" or "understand" G-d!
> 
> If He/She exists, He/She is unknowable. Although it is reported in the Torah that He spoke to Moses, Moses was told "you can only see my back". That was interpreted by scholars to mean mortal humans can see the results of His works, but will never see a corporeal essence.
> 
> ...


I think god is some pimply adolescent and we are his science experiment in his basement. Good a theory as any and will explain why he did not want Moses to see his face.


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## SQM (Jun 22, 2012)

"Hubris does matter. Pride is one of the Seven Deadly Sins. Remember?"

So is slothfulness. Yay!

How can such a cute creature be considered a deadly sin?


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## Gerslay (Oct 4, 2011)

SQM said:


> I think god is some pimply adolescent and we are his science experiment in his basement. Good a theory as any and will explain why he did not want Moses to see his face.


Mighty bold for a person who can't guarantee her next breath!


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## SQM (Jun 22, 2012)

That is true, my breathing is still off due to this lingering cold.

Can you guarantee your next breath, Sister G?


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## Lkholcomb (Aug 25, 2013)

Gerslay said:


> Yes, one original language until man decided to worship himself and God separated them by dividing their one language into many.


It wasn't about man worshipping himself. It was about the hubris of man to try to build a structure to heaven.


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## Lkholcomb (Aug 25, 2013)

Janet Cooke said:


> I am thinking that learning Hebrew would add to any experience. Heck, I can't master Spanish.


Oh heavens, Spanish is about impossible for me. Something about the romance languages. Yet German came a lot easier (even though it supposed to be harder).


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## Lkholcomb (Aug 25, 2013)

MarilynKnits said:


> What extreme hubris to claim to "know" or "understand" G-d!
> 
> If He/She exists, He/She is unknowable. Although it is reported in the Torah that He spoke to Moses, Moses was told "you can only see my back". That was interpreted by scholars to mean mortal humans can see the results of His works, but will never see a corporeal essence.
> 
> ...


That was put forward on the show "ancient aliens". That show always give me a laugh, especially the one guy's hair that seems to have a life of its own, lol.


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## SQM (Jun 22, 2012)

Lkholcomb said:


> That was put forward on the show "ancient aliens". That show always give me a laugh, especially the one guy's hair that seems to have a life of its own, lol.


One of the few shows I will watch and fall asleep to. So soothing to think there is life superior to humans and right wing politics. And I do like that guy with the hair.


----------



## Cindy S (Oct 20, 2013)

Gerslay said:


> Mighty bold for a person who can't guarantee her next breath!


Can anyone guarantee their next breath?


----------



## knitpresentgifts (May 21, 2013)

Lkholcomb said:


> It wasn't about man worshipping himself. It was about the hubris of man to try to build a structure to heaven.


Read this post of yours; you are wrong in your understanding. I'm not surprised you don't believe the Bible is the Word of God and that you are not a Christian. Often in the posts of yours I do read about Christianity, you do not have a good or solid foundation of understanding; I'm sorry you had such poor teachers or for whatever reason you don't understand or grasp God's words, and the stories/parables/lessons/psalms in the Bible.

Babylon _was_ all about the people worshipping their own accomplishments and their pride (hubris) and idolatry.

The people were united in their purpose of bringing glory to themselves while attempting to prevent "their" city from being scattered. They were not building that structure (tower of Babel [confusion]) to honor or glorify God.

God was not pleased with their united actions, and He wanted every individual to give their heart to Him.

Therefore, God thwarted their plans, gave them many languages and scattered them all over the face of the earth.


----------



## Poor Purl (Apr 14, 2011)

rocky1991 said:


> Garbage in, Garbage out.


Thank you, Rocky. You get to the point so much faster than I do.


----------



## Poor Purl (Apr 14, 2011)

MaidInBedlam said:


> Where to begin? Well, *the Bible is the word of men who believed they were divinely inspired.* Belief and the source of any inspiration are awfully hard to prove. Christian teachers, priests, pastors and laypeople are believers, but belief is intangible and awfully hard to prove.
> 
> Then there are all the non-Christians who live in a way that sure looks like the way God supposedly wants all people to live. They claim to believe the tenets of a variety of religions. Can you prove their belief is meaningless or that God rejects them because they aren't Christians? We're talking about intangibles again, and they're still awfully hard to prove.
> 
> ...


Beautifully expressed, Maid, and so much better thought out than what you're responding to.


----------



## Janet Cooke (Aug 14, 2013)

MarilynKnits said:


> There is some Hebrew and some Aramaic. The idioms of the times in which the texts were written are sometimes untranslatable.
> 
> If you want to give some of the prayers a try, check out www.kakatuv.com and just pick a psalm at random. You will find the Hebrew calligraphy, transliteration, and translation in a linear format. It is one of the less awkward study guides I have found.
> 
> ...


Thanks for the link, you are correct of course. 
You have to wonder why, you don't * have* to, they did that small percentage in Aramaic. <shrug> 
Did anyone explain that at any point?


----------



## Poor Purl (Apr 14, 2011)

Janet Cooke said:


> God wants people to worship in their own way, God wants people who don't understand the difference between fact and fiction to mind their own business.


Wow. Finally, someone who really does know what God wants.


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## Janet Cooke (Aug 14, 2013)

MaidInBedlam said:


> Hubris does matter. Pride is one of the Seven Deadly Sins. Remember?


In many cases the Word may do its work and the people carrying the word may undo it.


----------



## Janet Cooke (Aug 14, 2013)

Poor Purl said:


> Wow. Finally, someone who really does know what God wants.


Well, who knows? It sounds better than the force feeding, though, doesn't it?


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## Poor Purl (Apr 14, 2011)

Janet Cooke said:


> One original language, one.


Did she really say, "The knowledge isn't in the reading of the words on a page, it is in the understanding and how you live according to God's wishes"? If she's an illustration of living according to God's wishes, then I'm the Flying Spaghetti Monster.


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## Poor Purl (Apr 14, 2011)

Janet Cooke said:


> Man is lousy at translating, good at ordering misinterpretations in order to boost a hold on power, champion at manipulation in order to control les pissants.


You must have gotten a good night's sleep. You are really in fine form today.


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## Poor Purl (Apr 14, 2011)

Janet Cooke said:


> Buckle up, folks, it seems we are in for another chapter of the Holy Bible is historical fact... and we can prove it.
> 
> Yet they never do.


I love this part. Q: How do you know that what the Bible says is true? A: It says so in the Bible.


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## Janet Cooke (Aug 14, 2013)

Poor Purl said:


> Did she really say, "The knowledge isn't in the reading of the words on a page, it is in the understanding and how you live according to God's wishes"? If she's an illustration of living according to God's wishes, then I'm the Flying Spaghetti Monster.


And tomorrow the pronouncements will be something new.


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## Country Bumpkins (Feb 18, 2011)

Poor Purl said:


> I love this part. Q: How do you know that what the Bible says is true? A: It says so in the Bible.


----------



## Gerslay (Oct 4, 2011)

Lkholcomb said:


> It wasn't about man worshipping himself. It was about the hubris of man to try to build a structure to heaven.


Exactly the same thing...they worshipped their own abilities and what they could do...reach to the heavens!


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## Gerslay (Oct 4, 2011)

sorry...dbl post!


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## Janet Cooke (Aug 14, 2013)

Poor Purl said:


> I love this part. Q: How do you know that what the Bible says is true? A: It says so in the Bible.


And yet *we* keep trying to have sensible conversations with them. So what's up with that?


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## Janet Cooke (Aug 14, 2013)

Poor Purl said:


> You must have gotten a good night's sleep. You are really in fine form today.


And how did you find Edith today? I watched the pre-school version of 1984.


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## Poor Purl (Apr 14, 2011)

Lkholcomb said:


> I have always been curious to read the Hebrew Bible in its original language. I've been told that reading it in that original language adds to the experience.


It certainly makes the experience very different, because in the attempt to prove that it foretells the coming of Jesus as the Messiah, many mistranslations were required.

There are good translations, literal translations, but there are bad ones as well, even published under Jewish auspices. If you want a recommendation, The Jerusalem Bible (also called the Koren Bible, after the publisher) is an authentic one with, as far as I know, no ax to grind. It's from the 1960's and is probably available in libraries or from used booksellers.

If, on the other hand, you want to learn biblical Hebrew, prepare yourself for a very bumpy ride.


----------



## Poor Purl (Apr 14, 2011)

Janet Cooke said:


> I am thinking that learning Hebrew would add to any experience. Heck, I can't master Spanish.


I haven't found that to be true. It's hardly ever useful in day-to-day conversation.


----------



## Poor Purl (Apr 14, 2011)

MarilynKnits said:


> There is some Hebrew and some Aramaic. The idioms of the times in which the texts were written are sometimes untranslatable.
> 
> If you want to give some of the prayers a try, check out www.kakatuv.com and just pick a psalm at random. You will find the Hebrew calligraphy, transliteration, and translation in a linear format. It is one of the less awkward study guides I have found.
> 
> ...


I've never heard of this. I'll check it out later. And check out the headcoverings, too.


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## Poor Purl (Apr 14, 2011)

SQM said:


> Laugh Laugh!
> 
> I hope you all visited the I want to make a hitler doll (knitler doll - so cute) that was on the digest under main. That sure got me revved up. I am sure our Sisters on the Far Right may find that offensive too.


I'm so glad to have you to let us know what's going on in Main, since I almost never have time to get there. This sounds like a hoot.


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## Poor Purl (Apr 14, 2011)

SQM said:


> I think god is some pimply adolescent and we are his science experiment in his basement. Good a theory as any and will explain why he did not want Moses to see his face.


 :XD: :XD: :XD: :XD: :XD:


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## Poor Purl (Apr 14, 2011)

SQM said:


> "Hubris does matter. Pride is one of the Seven Deadly Sins. Remember?"
> 
> So is slothfulness. Yay!
> 
> How can such a cute creature be considered a deadly sin?


Yay sloth. Good thing we don't have the 7 deadly sins, though we have 613 commandments.


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## Janet Cooke (Aug 14, 2013)

Poor Purl said:


> I haven't found that to be true. It's hardly ever useful in day-to-day conversation.


Maybe not, but then, I took 3 years of Latin...


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## Poor Purl (Apr 14, 2011)

Lkholcomb said:


> It wasn't about man worshipping himself. It was about the hubris of man to try to build a structure to heaven.


Yes. :thumbup: :thumbup: :thumbup: :thumbup: :thumbup:


----------



## Poor Purl (Apr 14, 2011)

Janet Cooke said:


> Thanks for the link, you are correct of course.
> You have to wonder why, you don't * have* to, they did that small percentage in Aramaic. <shrug>
> Did anyone explain that at any point?


I think it's simply that by the time that part was written, Aramaic was the language spoken by the writers. The Jews were moved around several times in their history and had to adapt to the new languages. It's very similar to Hebrew.


----------



## Poor Purl (Apr 14, 2011)

Janet Cooke said:


> In many cases the Word may do its work and the people carrying the word may undo it.


You see? Really on top of things!


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## Lkholcomb (Aug 25, 2013)

Janet Cooke said:


> In many cases the Word may do its work and the people carrying the word may undo it.


So true.


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## Lkholcomb (Aug 25, 2013)

Poor Purl said:


> It certainly makes the experience very different, because in the attempt to prove that it foretells the coming of Jesus as the Messiah, many mistranslations were required.
> 
> There are good translations, literal translations, but there are bad ones as well, even published under Jewish auspices. If you want a recommendation, The Jerusalem Bible (also called the Koren Bible, after the publisher) is an authentic one with, as far as I know, no ax to grind. It's from the 1960's and is probably available in libraries or from used booksellers.
> 
> If, on the other hand, you want to learn biblical Hebrew, prepare yourself for a very bumpy ride.


I'll have to look for The Jerusalem Bible. I think I'm putting learning Hebrew on my list of things to do if I have time (as in live to be 1,000 years old, lol). But you never know, the spirit may move me one day and I'll try, lol.


----------



## Poor Purl (Apr 14, 2011)

Janet Cooke said:


> And how did you find Edith today? I watched the pre-school version of 1984.
> 
> 
> 
> ...


----------



## Poor Purl (Apr 14, 2011)

Janet Cooke said:


> Maybe not, but then, I took 3 years of Latin...


And you have trouble with Spanish? I don't believe it.


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## Janet Cooke (Aug 14, 2013)

Poor Purl said:


> And you have trouble with Spanish? I don't believe it.


LOL, and eight stifling years of French, I think that may explain it.


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## Poor Purl (Apr 14, 2011)

Lkholcomb said:


> I'll have to look for The Jerusalem Bible. I think I'm putting learning Hebrew on my list of things to do if I have time (as in live to be 1,000 years old, lol). But you never know, the spirit may move me one day and I'll try, lol.


You're very ambitious. It's not easy to learn an unfamiliar alphabet. I sometimes think I'd like to learn Russian. Then I climb into bed and sleep until that desire is gone.


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## Poor Purl (Apr 14, 2011)

Janet Cooke said:


> LOL, and eight stifling years of French, I think that may explain it.


That certainly would explain it. What kind of school did you go to that you studied French for 8 years and Latin for 3?


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## Janet Cooke (Aug 14, 2013)

Poor Purl said:


> You see? Really on top of things!


Thank you for the kind observations, that is a pretty basic view of all religions, really. 
We are presented with thousands of ways to support each other in love and adoration of God and power hunger, know it all people spoil it.


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## Poor Purl (Apr 14, 2011)

Janet Cooke said:


> Thank you for the kind observations, that is a pretty basic view of all religions, really.
> We are presented with thousands of ways to support each other in love and adoration of God and power hunger, know it all people spoil it.


If they didn't hold on so rigidly to their faith, it would slip away. That's why they need to know it all, even though they can't possibly.

Anyway, I learned today that "Jesus is tenderly calling" - me, I suppose. I don't know which to do first, throw up or develop diabetes.


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## Lkholcomb (Aug 25, 2013)

Poor Purl said:


> You're very ambitious. It's not easy to learn an unfamiliar alphabet. I sometimes think I'd like to learn Russian. Then I climb into bed and sleep until that desire is gone.


Hahaha! I would probably be much less ambitious if I COULD sleep, lol.


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## susanmos2000 (May 10, 2011)

Poor Purl said:


> If they didn't hold on so rigidly to their faith, it would slip away. That's why they need to know it all, even though they can't possibly.
> 
> Anyway, I learned today that "Jesus is tenderly calling" - me, I suppose. I don't know which to do first, throw up or develop diabetes.


Who posted that? Sounds pre-Vatican Catholic to me. In her memoir Mary Gilligan Wong recorded this rather amazing little spiel, heard by her and her fellow nuns-in-training on Valentine's Day in the early 60s:

"Just as in the world a boy asks a girl for a date, in the same way Jesus, the Divine Lover, beckons you from His lonely tabernacle to come be His date. How He longs for you to come visit Him there, to whisper little words of love and offer little caresses of mortification..."

(Somehow this was supposed to get the young ladies' minds off the men :roll: )


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## SQM (Jun 22, 2012)

"Just as in the world a boy asks a girl for a date, in the same way Jesus, the Divine Lover, beckons you from His lonely tabernacle to come be His date. How He longs for you to come visit Him there, to whisper little words of love and offer little caresses of mortification..."

Perfect quote for the S & M crowd. I am almost tempted to learn needlepoint and make this into a precious little sampler.

Is this for real?


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## Country Bumpkins (Feb 18, 2011)

SQM said:


> "Just as in the world a boy asks a girl for a date, in the same way Jesus, the Divine Lover, beckons you from His lonely tabernacle to come be His date. How He longs for you to come visit Him there, to whisper little words of love and offer little caresses of mortification..."
> 
> Perfect quote for the S & M crowd. I am almost tempted to learn needlepoint and make this into a precious little sampler.
> 
> Is this for real?


You know they are making it up. All of you will reqret your blaspheme one day. Sad day too.


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## susanmos2000 (May 10, 2011)

SQM said:


> "Just as in the world a boy asks a girl for a date, in the same way Jesus, the Divine Lover, beckons you from His lonely tabernacle to come be His date. How He longs for you to come visit Him there, to whisper little words of love and offer little caresses of mortification..."
> 
> Perfect quote for the S & M crowd. I am almost tempted to learn needlepoint and make this into a precious little sampler.
> 
> Is this for real?


It is. _Nun_ is a fascinating personal account of the process by which American women were transformed into nuns in the 50s and early 60s. I've sometimes wished to have been a pre-Vatican II Catholic, but then I read stories like Wong's and know I never could have stood it. The formation process for nuns then was brutal--and the laity often didn't fare much better.


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## Knitted by Nan (Aug 3, 2013)

Poor Purl said:


> Once again, you beat me to it. The wombat has a one-track mind.


Please do not upset the wombat. They can be formidable animals. They have been known to escape into their burrows to escape a predator, but leaving their leather like butt exposed, in order to entice the predator to stick its head inside the burrow. When this happens the wombat stands up and crushes the predators head against the top of the tunnel. The butt of a wombat is almost armour plated. They also have very strong hind legs and kick like a donkey.
While it was once thought that wombats weren't very bright, it's now generally accepted that they are quite intelligent. They are, however, very stubborn and determined, and since they're so strong--built like a tank or bulldozer--they will often go through an obstacle rather than around it. They've been known to go through doors, walls, or anything else that stands in their way. That's probably one of the reasons why they were once considered simpleminded
Wombats seem to be solitary animals and not very social. There appears to be little contact between adults. When wombats meet on the surface, they try to avoid each other.


----------



## Poor Purl (Apr 14, 2011)

susanmos2000 said:


> Who posted that? Sounds pre-Vatican Catholic to me. In her memoir Mary Gilligan Wong recorded this rather amazing little spiel, heard by her and her fellow nuns-in-training on Valentine's Day in the early 60s:
> 
> "Just as in the world a boy asks a girl for a date, in the same way Jesus, the Divine Lover, beckons you from His lonely tabernacle to come be His date. How He longs for you to come visit Him there, to whisper little words of love and offer little caresses of mortification..."
> 
> (Somehow this was supposed to get the young ladies' minds off the men :roll: )


As I said to Country Bumpkins - because she was the one who said that to me - I hope she made it up because I find it incredibly creepy.

Your addition hasn't made it less so.


----------



## Knitted by Nan (Aug 3, 2013)

sallycarr said:


> What is it if it is not a baby? What is it if it lives after it was aborted?
> 
> The picture if of an aborted baby. It sure looks like a baby to me. Maybe you would change your mind if you spent some time in an abortion clinic.
> 
> My posting sure caused a lot of activity, I will pop in once in a while when a good story comes on the internet.


It may look like a baby but it is not a baby. The brain has not completely developed nor have the lungs. It will not be capable of life. It will not live after an abortion, it may exist but it will not live. You may change your mind if you spent some time in a hospital or institution that cares for individuals who are not capable of living in the outside world. You may have spent many hours, days, weeks or months inside an abortion clinic but I honestly doubt if you have spent any time caring for a severely handicapped individual.


----------



## Poor Purl (Apr 14, 2011)

Wait, I only just caught this:


susanmos2000 said:


> How He longs for you to come visit Him there, to whisper little words of love and offer little caresses of mortification..."
> 
> (Somehow this was supposed to get the young ladies' minds off the men :roll: )


Little caresses of mortification? What could that possibly mean?


----------



## susanmos2000 (May 10, 2011)

Poor Purl said:


> As I said to Country Bumpkins - because she was the one who said that to me - I hope she made it up because I find it incredibly creepy.
> 
> Your addition hasn't made it less so.


I imagine not--stuff like this is revolting. To me it seems like a weird blend of traditional Catholicism and the American 50s ideal of a woman's role as "wife and mother". Historically entering a convent was a way a woman could respectably bow out of the race to "catch a man" and avoid the back-breaking family obligations always thrust on spinsters, but by the 50s that didn't sit well with many Americans. ALL women had to marry or risk being labeled lesbians, frigid, or just plain weird. Nuns were portrayed a normal American women whose spouse just happened to be JC himself--hence the wedding gowns they wore on the day they took their vows, the syrupy-sweet imagery, the "mash notes" they were encouraged to write to their future spouse, and all the rest.


----------



## Poor Purl (Apr 14, 2011)

EveMCooke said:


> Please do not upset the wombat. They can be formidable animals. They have been known to escape into their burrows to escape a predator, but leaving their leather like butt exposed, in order to entice the predator to stick its head inside the burrow. When this happens the wombat stands up and crushes the predators head against the top of the tunnel. The butt of a wombat is almost armour plated. They also have very strong hind legs and kick like a donkey.
> While it was once thought that wombats weren't very bright, it's now generally accepted that they are quite intelligent. They are, however, very stubborn and determined, and since they're so strong--built like a tank or bulldozer--they will often go through an obstacle rather than around it. They've been known to go through doors, walls, or anything else that stands in their way. That's probably one of the reasons why they were once considered simpleminded
> Wombats seem to be solitary animals and not very social. There appears to be little contact between adults. When wombats meet on the surface, they try to avoid each other.


Ms. Eve, this is fascinating. They appear to be a combination of Superman and the Road Runner. The only thing about wombats I remember from my childhood is that they were able to kill snakes.

Luckily, the wombat we were talking about is a (probably) human being who comes onto KP, insults the lefties, and slips away. He/she/it is mildly irritating, but the part about crashing through walls and doors sounds right. Stubborn and determined, as you say.


----------



## SQM (Jun 22, 2012)

Country Bumpkins said:


> You know they are making it up. All of you will reqret your blaspheme one day. Sad day too.


Blaspheme against JC? He doesn't scare me. I am quite used to Jewish men and know how to deal with them. Anyway, isn't JC suppose to be about love, love all day? Is his ego so shrunken that he could not tolerate someone not believing in him? I think he is bigger than that.

And don't get me going on his father. Too bossy and grumpy and pissy when he does not get his way.


----------



## SQM (Jun 22, 2012)

Poor Purl said:


> Ms. Eve, this is fascinating. They appear to be a combination of Superman and the Road Runner. The only thing about wombats I remember from my childhood is that they were able to kill snakes.
> 
> Luckily, the wombat we were talking about is a (probably) human being who comes onto KP, insults the lefties, and slips away. He/she/it is mildly irritating, but the part about crashing through walls and doors sounds right. Stubborn and determined, as you say.


No comparison to the leathery ass with our wombat and the Australian one?


----------



## susanmos2000 (May 10, 2011)

Poor Purl said:


> Wait, I only just caught this:
> Little caresses of mortification? What could that possibly mean?


According to Wong nuns were expected to pursue spiritual perfection--knowing of course that it was impossible for them or anyone else to succeed 100%. Still they tried and mentally raked themselves over the coals for every indiscretion: an uncharitable thought, getting a drink of water without first asking permission, feeling blue. Very mortifying--especially when they had to get up in front of their fellow Sisters and confess all these same things.


----------



## Poor Purl (Apr 14, 2011)

susanmos2000 said:


> I imagine not--stuff like this is revolting. To me it seems like a weird blend of traditional Catholicism and the American 50s ideal of a woman's role as "wife and mother". Historically entering a convent was a way a woman could respectably bow out of the race to "catch a man" and avoid the back-breaking family obligations always thrust on spinsters, but by the 50s that didn't sit well with many Americans. ALL women had to marry or risk being labeled lesbians, frigid, or just plain weird. Nuns were portrayed a normal American women whose spouse just happened to be JC himself--hence the wedding gowns they wore on the day they took their vows, the syrupy-sweet imagery, the "mash notes" they were encouraged to write to their future spouse, and all the rest.


It was similar during the Middle Ages; women (even women in possibly unconsummated marriages) claimed to be married to JC and would speak of the bliss they experienced. There's a book about a woman named Christina of Markyate who vowed when young to remain a virgin and ran away from home when her parents tried to marry her to a mortal man. "Being the bride of Christ was not a metaphorical expression of her spiritual intimacy with her savior, rather it was *a contractual relationship involving mutual privileges and obligations which bound her to him--and him to her*."

The language they wrote in was a lot better than the teenage romance stuff in your last message, but it doesn't seem that they were any less deluded.

A side-note: One expert on this period is Ruth Mazo Karras, who's a great knitter; I met her a few times at Camp Stitches. She said she would knit through all her faculty meetings, and she made a prodigious number of garments.


----------



## Poor Purl (Apr 14, 2011)

susanmos2000 said:


> According to Wong nuns were expected to pursue spiritual perfection--knowing of course that it was impossible for them or anyone else to succeed 100%. Still they tried and mentally raked themselves over the coals for every indiscretion: an uncharitable thought, getting a drink of water without first asking permission, feeling blue. Very mortifying--especially when they had to get up in front of their fellow Sisters and confess all these same things.


Oh! My! God!


----------



## Poor Purl (Apr 14, 2011)

SQM said:


> No comparison to the leathery ass with our wombat and the Australian one?


I'm sure they look alike, they talk alike, sometimes they even walk alike.


----------



## Cheeky Blighter (Nov 20, 2011)

Poor Purl said:


> Oh! My! God!


I have come late to the party and just read a little bit to catch myself up. Sounds like another visit from the crazed wombat. I decided to google and I see why they are out of sorts as is this visitor. Lots of self abuse with slamming into things. Probably has a lot of aches and pains and doesn't know why. I wonder why the creature has decided it doesn't much care for the left? Maybe too many concussions?


----------



## Cheeky Blighter (Nov 20, 2011)

Now I will have to google Wong nuns.


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## Poor Purl (Apr 14, 2011)

Cheeky Blighter said:


> I have come late to the party and just read a little bit to catch myself up. Sounds like another visit from the crazed wombat. I decided to google and I see why they are out of sorts as is this visitor. Lots of self abuse with slamming into things. Probably has a lot of aches and pains and doesn't know why. I wonder why the creature has decided it doesn't much care for the left? Maybe too many concussions?


So glad to see you, Cheeky. You bring sense with you. So far no wombat, but I like your take on it. I really need to go. Give your cat a kiss from me - I assume it's your cat; it's the most contented-looking animal I've seen in a while. Good night.


----------



## susanmos2000 (May 10, 2011)

Poor Purl said:


> It was similar during the Middle Ages; women (even women in possibly unconsummated marriages) claimed to be married to JC and would speak of the bliss they experienced. There's a book about a woman named Christina of Markyate who vowed when young to remain a virgin and ran away from home when her parents tried to marry her to a mortal man. "Being the bride of Christ was not a metaphorical expression of her spiritual intimacy with her savior, rather it was *a contractual relationship involving mutual privileges and obligations which bound her to him--and him to her*."
> 
> The language they wrote in was a lot better than the teenage romance stuff in your last message, but it doesn't seem that they were any less deluded.


Deluded, perhaps--but I also see a certain rational to it all. In the days when women HAD to belong to a man, being married to Christ meant NOT becoming the property of an earthly, possibly brutal, spouse; not having one's health broken by multiple pregnancies; and perhaps gaining opportunities to further one's education and work outside the home by teaching or nursing. Women didn't have a lot of opportunities in those days--the fact that some did find life in the convent preferable despite the well-known horrors speaks volumes.


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## SQM (Jun 22, 2012)

Purl - What is Camp Stitches? I hope it leaves you in them.


----------



## Janet Cooke (Aug 14, 2013)

susanmos2000 said:


> According to Wong nuns were expected to pursue spiritual perfection--knowing of course that it was impossible for them or anyone else to succeed 100%. Still they tried and mentally raked themselves over the coals for every indiscretion: an uncharitable thought, getting a drink of water without first asking permission, feeling blue. Very mortifying--especially when they had to get up in front of their fellow Sisters and confess all these same things.


That happy part was the pain/pleasure part as they whipped their backs and masturbated while making the list for confession. All that self directed disgust? I don't believe for a minute they didn't use that for fun.


----------



## susanmos2000 (May 10, 2011)

Cheeky Blighter said:


> Now I will have to google Wong nuns.


_The Courage To Choose: An American Nun's Story_ by Mary Griffin is also an excellent book. Griffin went through the same formation process as Wong, but being older and having a college degree before she entered the convent made all the difference in the world. She wasn't ground down like Wong because she realized a lot of what she was being told to do and think was BS--to her it the formation process was like boot camp, just something to be endured and gotten through with as best one could.


----------



## Janet Cooke (Aug 14, 2013)

susanmos2000 said:


> Deluded, perhaps--but I also see a certain rational to it all. In the days when women HAD to belong to a man, being married to Christ meant NOT becoming the property of an earthly, possibly brutal, spouse; not having one's health broken by multiple pregnancies; and perhaps gaining opportunities to further one's education and work outside the home by teaching or nursing. Women didn't have a lot of opportunities in those days--the fact that some did find life in the convent preferable despite the well-known horrors speaks volumes.


Probably, I can't imagine that those 1 in 4 statistics have changed much through the ages. Being stuck at home as a spinster was not only humiliating but a great way to be stuck in an abusive incestuous relationship.


----------



## Janet Cooke (Aug 14, 2013)

susanmos2000 said:


> _The Courage To Choose: An American Nun's Story_ by Mary Griffin is also an excellent book. Griffin went through the same formation process as Wong, but being older and having a college degree before she entered the convent made all the difference in the world. She wasn't ground down like Wong because she realized a lot of what she was being told to do and think was BS--to her it the formation process was like boot camp, just something to be endured and gotten through with as best one could.


Could be, probably like priests pocketing the money from the Spiritual Bouquets and throwing the cards away was just a show to see if those in training had what it took to finally be a Cardinal with the ability to add a few bedrooms and a pool to the vacation mansion. (faulty memory on that recent story, you get the point.)


----------



## Cheeky Blighter (Nov 20, 2011)

susanmos2000 said:


> It is. _Nun_ is a fascinating personal account of the process by which American women were transformed into nuns in the 50s and early 60s. I've sometimes wished to have been a pre-Vatican II Catholic, but then I read stories like Wong's and know I never could have stood it. The formation process for nuns then was brutal--and the laity often didn't fare much better.


Susan I was a pre-Vatican II Catholic and as a little girl I wanted to be a nun. I was taken to St. Scholastica in Duluth and attended a Profession of Final Vows ceremony. Our neighbor was taking her final vows joining the Sisters of St. Benedict. It was one of the most beautiful ceremonies I have ever seen and to me still is. All the women entered as brides and took their final vows and were spiritually "married" to Christ or the church and were given their ring which is the ring of their order. They then left the church and came back in dressed in their habits. I have friends who are still nuns, ones who have left and one who just entered an order in her mid 50's. I thought that was for me. Now so many years later I see things very differently. If you would like to ask me any questions I would be happy to share my opinions and feelings on the matter.


----------



## Janet Cooke (Aug 14, 2013)

susanmos2000 said:


> Deluded, perhaps--but I also see a certain rational to it all. In the days when women HAD to belong to a man, being married to Christ meant NOT becoming the property of an earthly, possibly brutal, spouse; not having one's health broken by multiple pregnancies; and perhaps gaining opportunities to further one's education and work outside the home by teaching or nursing. Women didn't have a lot of opportunities in those days--the fact that some did find life in the convent preferable despite the well-known horrors speaks volumes.


You have probably researched this much better than I, but, the small amount that I do remember seems to me that any escape that they thought they were accomplishing was only because of the secrecy within the convents. 
Nuns had a pretty frustrating existence in more ways than one.


----------



## Cheeky Blighter (Nov 20, 2011)

susanmos2000 said:


> According to Wong nuns were expected to pursue spiritual perfection--knowing of course that it was impossible for them or anyone else to succeed 100%. Still they tried and mentally raked themselves over the coals for every indiscretion: an uncharitable thought, getting a drink of water without first asking permission, feeling blue. Very mortifying--especially when they had to get up in front of their fellow Sisters and confess all these same things.


Susan I wonder what order this woman joined. The nuns I know didn't go through any thing like that. I also lived with nuns and I can assure you they are just normal women. Yes, they do give up things but they also gain a way of life that for them is very meaningful. Their lives are dedicated to serving others and have a very rewarding life doing that. It isn't for everyone but for many it is a wonderful and fulfilling life.


----------



## Cheeky Blighter (Nov 20, 2011)

Janet Cooke said:


> You have probably researched this much better than I, but, the small amount that I do remember seems to me that any escape that they thought they were accomplishing was only because of the secrecy within the convents.
> Nuns had a pretty frustrating existence in more ways than one.


I am surprised to hear what you are saying. Is this first hand knowledge or from friends, reading?


----------



## Cheeky Blighter (Nov 20, 2011)

Janet Cooke said:


> You have probably researched this much better than I, but, the small amount that I do remember seems to me that any escape that they thought they were accomplishing was only because of the secrecy within the convents.
> Nuns had a pretty frustrating existence in more ways than one.


Is anyone going to answer me or have you all left the thread? Guess that's what happens when I show up late.


----------



## Janet Cooke (Aug 14, 2013)

Cheeky Blighter said:


> Susan I wonder what order this woman joined. The nuns I know didn't go through any thing like that. I also lived with nuns and I can assure you they are just normal women. Yes, they do give up things but they also gain a way of life that for them is very meaningful. Their lives are dedicated to serving others and have a very rewarding life doing that. It isn't for everyone but for many it is a wonderful and fulfilling life.


Just guessing this is it.

http://www.amazon.com/Nun-Memoir-Mary-Gilligan-Wong/dp/0060911883


----------



## Cheeky Blighter (Nov 20, 2011)

Poor Purl said:


> So glad to see you, Cheeky. You bring sense with you. So far no wombat, but I like your take on it. I really need to go. Give your cat a kiss from me - I assume it's your cat; it's the most contented-looking animal I've seen in a while. Good night.


That is Conan O'Keegan. He is a very contented and loving cat. I will give him a big kiss from you.


----------



## susanmos2000 (May 10, 2011)

Cheeky Blighter said:


> Susan I was a pre-Vatican II Catholic and as a little girl I wanted to be a nun. I was taken to St. Scholastica in Duluth and attended a Profession of Final Vows ceremony. Our neighbor was taking her final vows joining the Sisters of St. Benedict. It was one of the most beautiful ceremonies I have ever seen and to me still is. All the women entered as brides and took their final vows and were spiritually "married" to Christ or the church and were given their ring which is the ring of their order. They then left the church and came back in dressed in their habits. I have friends who are still nuns, ones who have left and one who just entered an order in her mid 50's. I thought that was for me. Now so many years later I see things very differently. If you would like to ask me any questions I would be happy to share my opinions and feelings on the matter.


So many questions--where to start? 

OK--did your nun friends ever speak of how well they got through their canonical year? I've heard that that could be very difficult--strict supervision, no contact with the outside world, and intense pursuit of spiritual perfection. After that things were generally easier, but that period of twelve months sounds like it was Waterloo for an awful lot of nuns. Make or break time, in other words.


----------



## Cheeky Blighter (Nov 20, 2011)

Janet Cooke said:


> Just guessing this is it.
> 
> http://www.amazon.com/Nun-Memoir-Mary-Gilligan-Wong/dp/0060911883


I did see this listed when I googled it but wondering what are your other sources that have caused you to form this opinion?


----------



## susanmos2000 (May 10, 2011)

Cheeky Blighter said:


> Susan I wonder what order this woman joined. The nuns I know didn't go through any thing like that. I also lived with nuns and I can assure you they are just normal women. Yes, they do give up things but they also gain a way of life that for them is very meaningful. Their lives are dedicated to serving others and have a very rewarding life doing that. It isn't for everyone but for many it is a wonderful and fulfilling life.


Wong said that her order was the Sisters of Blessing, founded in France in the early 1800s. The order sent missionary sisters to America about fifty years later, and they settled primarily in the Midwest.


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## Cheeky Blighter (Nov 20, 2011)

susanmos2000 said:


> So many questions--where to start?
> 
> OK--did your nun friends ever speak of how well they got through their canonical year? I've heard that that could be very difficult--strict supervision, no contact with the outside world, and intense pursuit of spiritual perfection. After that things were generally easier, but that period of twelve months sounds like it was Waterloo for an awful lot of nuns. Make or break time, in other words.


Yes, I know what you are talking about. Have you ever heard of the Catholic girl's group called Sodality? I was a member and if you were in Sodality it was kind of a primer for Catholic girls as to how they should conduct themselves as young Catholic women. It was also a way for the church to have girls learn about holy orders and find out if you would be interested in religious life. Nothing scary about it. I went much further than Sodality and lived with novices and then with nuns of two different orders. I know the life is very difficult, as you say, like boot camp but it is that way so you hopefully will find out that life is not for you and you leave. I know people my parents age who would be 90 years old or more were often sent away as young as 12 or 13 and had no choice. Many families believed they should send a son and a daughter to be a priest or nun. I knew priests and nuns who ended up staying and it worked out OK and others who hated religious life and finally left. It was in the '60's when there started to be more and more people leaving. I felt terrible for them but I don't think women were forced to go in the 50's and 60's. I have told my husband that if he precedes me in death I am going to do one of the few things I haven't done in my life, become a nun, a Buddhist nun.


----------



## Cheeky Blighter (Nov 20, 2011)

susanmos2000 said:


> Wong said that her order was the Sisters of Blessing, founded in France in the early 1800s. The order sent missionary sisters to America about fifty years later, and they settled primarily in the Midwest.


I googled that and can't find any by that name. Lots of Blessed this and that but not Blessing. Do you know if they are cloistered?


----------



## damemary (Mar 14, 2012)

Poor Purl said:


> I was extremely lucky. My son came 3 weeks early, and it was a normal delivery, made easier by the fact that his head was smaller than a 9-month head would have been. The next day, my husband and I attended the Lamaze class we'd been taking.
> 
> Baby was jaundiced for a while and stayed in the hospital for a week; they let me stay for two extra days, but though I kept returning to the hospital to be able to nurse him, I would often be told that he'd been given formula already. So I'd sit and cry for three hours waiting for the next feeding.
> 
> Another of my usual name drops: Miles Davis's baby was in the nursery while my son was there. He got a lot of visitors.


Another benefit of living in NYC....seeing celebrities up close and personal......problem you have to pretend like you don't notice. True or false?


----------



## Cheeky Blighter (Nov 20, 2011)

This is typical of any order. My friend who became a nun in her 50's said she could not have done it as a young woman but she is the happiest now she has ever been. Having known her for over 50 years I know this is true and she has finally found her true calling. Nuns are known to live very long and healthy lives too so I find that appealing too.

The canonical novitiate year includes:

living in the novitiate community
weekly meetings with the director of novices
studying Congregation history
service ministry
prayer life  art and spirituality
spiritual direction
solitude, reflection
Liturgy
retreats
community prayer
participation in Congregation activities


----------



## damemary (Mar 14, 2012)

SQM said:


> Wrong!
> 
> Cooke is humanistic, intelligent, funny, interesting, loyal, dedicated, involved, honest, supportive, concerned, creative, and helpful. Her biggest flaw is that she knits dish cloths albeit very creative ones.
> 
> By the way - Hi Sister G. Que passe?


 :thumbup: :thumbup: :thumbup: That's Janet. Always interesting.


----------



## damemary (Mar 14, 2012)

SQM said:


> To what purpose? To swell their ranks because there are not enough people to think like them?


You catch on quick. Very good.

I found a quote from George Bernard Shaw......I learned long ago, never wrestle with a pig. You get dirty, and besides, the pig likes it.


----------



## damemary (Mar 14, 2012)

Janet Cooke said:


> Man is lousy at translating, good at ordering misinterpretations in order to boost a hold on power, champion at manipulation in order to control les pissants.


 :thumbup: :thumbup: :thumbup: :thumbup: :thumbup: :thumbup: :thumbup:


----------



## damemary (Mar 14, 2012)

Your avatar is adorable, but I think we should all just go and watch old 'I Love Lucy's.



MrsB said:


> Wow, this post has morphed into the George and Gracie Show.


----------



## damemary (Mar 14, 2012)

MarilynKnits said:


> Oh, darlin, or do they swell because they are so rank?


 :XD: :XD: :XD: :XD: :XD: :XD: :XD:


----------



## damemary (Mar 14, 2012)

Poor Purl said:


> Thank you, Rocky. You get to the point so much faster than I do.


aka GIGO


----------



## damemary (Mar 14, 2012)

Poor Purl said:


> Wow. Finally, someone who really does know what God wants.


 :thumbup: :thumbup: :thumbup: :thumbup: :thumbup: :thumbup: :thumbup:


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## damemary (Mar 14, 2012)

The pig can squeal anything it wants. It's still the pig.



Poor Purl said:


> Did she really say, "The knowledge isn't in the reading of the words on a page, it is in the understanding and how you live according to God's wishes"? If she's an illustration of living according to God's wishes, then I'm the Flying Spaghetti Monster.


----------



## damemary (Mar 14, 2012)

Poor Purl said:


> I love this part. Q: How do you know that what the Bible says is true? A: It says so in the Bible.


 :XD: :XD: :XD: :XD: We're off to the races. And away we go.


----------



## damemary (Mar 14, 2012)

I like my GBS quote about the pig. I'm trying to relax.



Janet Cooke said:


> And yet *we* keep trying to have sensible conversations with them. So what's up with that?


----------



## damemary (Mar 14, 2012)

Yes indeed. I wish SQM would post a list for all of us.



Poor Purl said:


> I'm so glad to have you to let us know what's going on in Main, since I almost never have time to get there. This sounds like a hoot.


----------



## damemary (Mar 14, 2012)

I have 3 years of Latin and 4 years of French. Helps with vocabulary and that's about it if you don't use it all the time.



Janet Cooke said:


> Maybe not, but then, I took 3 years of Latin...


----------



## damemary (Mar 14, 2012)

Too cruel! Did they send you to boarding school?



Janet Cooke said:


> LOL, and eight stifling years of French, I think that may explain it.


----------



## damemary (Mar 14, 2012)

Poor Purl said:


> You're very ambitious. It's not easy to learn an unfamiliar alphabet. I sometimes think I'd like to learn Russian. Then I climb into bed and sleep until that desire is gone.


 :XD: :XD: :XD: :XD: :XD: :XD: :XD: Good approach.


----------



## damemary (Mar 14, 2012)

Poor Purl said:


> If they didn't hold on so rigidly to their faith, it would slip away. That's why they need to know it all, even though they can't possibly.
> 
> Anyway, I learned today that "Jesus is tenderly calling" - me, I suppose. I don't know which to do first, throw up or develop diabetes.


 :XD: :XD: :XD: :XD: :XD: :XD: :XD: :XD: :XD:


----------



## damemary (Mar 14, 2012)

susanmos2000 said:


> Who posted that? Sounds pre-Vatican Catholic to me. In her memoir Mary Gilligan Wong recorded this rather amazing little spiel, heard by her and her fellow nuns-in-training on Valentine's Day in the early 60s:
> 
> "Just as in the world a boy asks a girl for a date, in the same way Jesus, the Divine Lover, beckons you from His lonely tabernacle to come be His date. How He longs for you to come visit Him there, to whisper little words of love and offer little caresses of mortification..."
> 
> (Somehow this was supposed to get the young ladies' minds off the men :roll: )


Words so tender don't win a girl's heart anymore. 
You must send her somewhere where she's never been before. Mama Cass


----------



## damemary (Mar 14, 2012)

I like the Mama Cass version much more.



SQM said:


> "Just as in the world a boy asks a girl for a date, in the same way Jesus, the Divine Lover, beckons you from His lonely tabernacle to come be His date. How He longs for you to come visit Him there, to whisper little words of love and offer little caresses of mortification..."
> 
> Perfect quote for the S & M crowd. I am almost tempted to learn needlepoint and make this into a precious little sampler.
> 
> Is this for real?


----------



## damemary (Mar 14, 2012)

Thank you for the information. Sounds like our little tank chose her user name well.



EveMCooke said:


> Please do not upset the wombat. They can be formidable animals. They have been known to escape into their burrows to escape a predator, but leaving their leather like butt exposed, in order to entice the predator to stick its head inside the burrow. When this happens the wombat stands up and crushes the predators head against the top of the tunnel. The butt of a wombat is almost armour plated. They also have very strong hind legs and kick like a donkey.
> While it was once thought that wombats weren't very bright, it's now generally accepted that they are quite intelligent. They are, however, very stubborn and determined, and since they're so strong--built like a tank or bulldozer--they will often go through an obstacle rather than around it. They've been known to go through doors, walls, or anything else that stands in their way. That's probably one of the reasons why they were once considered simpleminded
> Wombats seem to be solitary animals and not very social. There appears to be little contact between adults. When wombats meet on the surface, they try to avoid each other.


----------



## damemary (Mar 14, 2012)

The Pre-Vatican ll Catholic Church would scare anyone silly.



Poor Purl said:


> As I said to Country Bumpkins - because she was the one who said that to me - I hope she made it up because I find it incredibly creepy.
> 
> Your addition hasn't made it less so.


----------



## damemary (Mar 14, 2012)

And they could be unbelievably cruel. No wonder there.



susanmos2000 said:


> According to Wong nuns were expected to pursue spiritual perfection--knowing of course that it was impossible for them or anyone else to succeed 100%. Still they tried and mentally raked themselves over the coals for every indiscretion: an uncharitable thought, getting a drink of water without first asking permission, feeling blue. Very mortifying--especially when they had to get up in front of their fellow Sisters and confess all these same things.


----------



## damemary (Mar 14, 2012)

Another common dream for women of the day was to remain celibate and take over the role of taking care of the family. It became a position of wealth and control, usually forbidden to women.



susanmos2000 said:


> Deluded, perhaps--but I also see a certain rational to it all. In the days when women HAD to belong to a man, being married to Christ meant NOT becoming the property of an earthly, possibly brutal, spouse; not having one's health broken by multiple pregnancies; and perhaps gaining opportunities to further one's education and work outside the home by teaching or nursing. Women didn't have a lot of opportunities in those days--the fact that some did find life in the convent preferable despite the well-known horrors speaks volumes.


----------



## MaidInBedlam (Jul 24, 2012)

Perhaps God was telling Moses "kiss my a$$". I'd like to think whatever God may or not be that at least he/She has a sense of humor.


SQM said:


> I think god is some pimply adolescent and we are his science experiment in his basement. Good a theory as any and will explain why he did not want Moses to see his face.


----------



## damemary (Mar 14, 2012)

I'm later than you. No nap for me tomorrow.



Cheeky Blighter said:


> Is anyone going to answer me or have you all left the thread? Guess that's what happens when I show up late.


----------



## MaidInBedlam (Jul 24, 2012)

SQM said:


> "Hubris does matter. Pride is one of the Seven Deadly Sins. Remember?"
> 
> So is slothfulness. Yay!
> 
> How can such a cute creature be considered a deadly sin?


It does sound like sleeping late on Saturday morning might be a sin when it's really a blessing. And, indeed, sloths are so cute.


----------



## damemary (Mar 14, 2012)

And Conan expects kind rubs and kisses....and he is so deserving.



Cheeky Blighter said:


> That is Conan O'Keegan. He is a very contented and loving cat. I will give him a big kiss from you.


----------



## damemary (Mar 14, 2012)

One of my bridesmaids was a Benedictine nun for many years. She's stayed in the convent. We eventually lost touch.



Cheeky Blighter said:


> This is typical of any order. My friend who became a nun in her 50's said she could not have done it as a young woman but she is the happiest now she has ever been. Having known her for over 50 years I know this is true and she has finally found her true calling. Nuns are known to live very long and healthy lives too so I find that appealing too.
> 
> The canonical novitiate year includes:
> 
> ...


----------



## MaidInBedlam (Jul 24, 2012)

Glad you liked what I said. I actually worked on that post.


Poor Purl said:


> Beautifully expressed, Maid, and so much better thought out than what you're responding to.


----------



## Knitted by Nan (Aug 3, 2013)

Country Bumpkins said:


> You know they are making it up. All of you will reqret your blaspheme one day. Sad day too.


You really do not have to worry about us, you cannot alter our chosen path. As long as you are happy in your beliefs please leave us alone to enjoy ours. If it is a sad day for us then it is a sad day for us, and it only concerns us, not you. Please worry about your own future and leave us alone to choose our own path and future.

Me, well I just read the words ascribed to the Buddha. I say ascribed because Buddha did not leave any written record, he said "when I am gone, I am gone", that is why the original statues of the Buddha were only the empty footprint - to show he is gone.

Buddha neither denied or agreed with the existence of God or Gods but said "_I am not a God, do not look to me for divine intervention. Do not take my word as gospel but question everything I say_."


----------



## damemary (Mar 14, 2012)

EveMCooke said:


> You really do not have to worry about us, you cannot alter our chosen path. As long as you are happy in your beliefs please leave us alone to enjoy ours. If it is a sad day for us then it is a sad day for us, and it only concerns us, not you. Please worry about your own future and leave us alone to choose our own path and future.
> 
> Me, well I just read the words ascribed to the Buddha. I say ascribed because Buddha did not leave any written record, he said "when I am gone, I am gone", that is why the original statues of the Buddha were only the empty footprint - to show he is gone.
> 
> Buddha neither denied or agreed with the existence of God or Gods but said "_I am not a God, do not look to me for divine intervention. Do not take my word as gospel but question everything I say_."


 :thumbup: :thumbup: :thumbup: :thumbup: :thumbup: :thumbup: :thumbup:


----------



## MaidInBedlam (Jul 24, 2012)

I'm with you on that.


Janet Cooke said:


> In many cases the Word may do its work and the people carrying the word may undo it.


----------



## Knitted by Nan (Aug 3, 2013)

Poor Purl said:


> Ms. Eve, this is fascinating. They appear to be a combination of Superman and the Road Runner. The only thing about wombats I remember from my childhood is that they were able to kill snakes.
> 
> Luckily, the wombat we were talking about is a (probably) human being who comes onto KP, insults the lefties, and slips away. He/she/it is mildly irritating, but the part about crashing through walls and doors sounds right. Stubborn and determined, as you say.


Unfortunately, Wombat is a fellow Aussie, but I do not admit that in public. She is an entirely different breed, she is an Eastern States person, not a Sandgroper like me.


----------



## damemary (Mar 14, 2012)

Eve, you're one of a kind anywhere. Glad to have you. You always give me something to think about.



EveMCooke said:


> Unfortunately, Wombat is a fellow Aussie, but I do not admit that in public. She is an entirely different breed, she is an Eastern States person, not a Sandgroper like me.


----------



## Lkholcomb (Aug 25, 2013)

MaidInBedlam said:


> Perhaps God was telling Moses "kiss my a$$". I'd like to think whatever God may or not be that at least he/She has a sense of humor.


Of course he or she has a sense of humor! Have you SEEN a platypus or hippo? Anything that could create THOSE has a wicked sense of humor!

Of course the silly names we can blame on Adam. I swear he was enjoy the grass in the garden too much when he named the animals. That was why God created women. To stop men from doing stupid stuff! (or so I tell my daughter ;-) )


----------



## Wombatnomore (Dec 9, 2013)

EveMCooke said:


> Unfortunately, Wombat is a fellow Aussie, but I do not admit that in public. She is an entirely different breed, she is an Eastern States person, not a Sandgroper like me.


Well, I'm still getting a mention 11 pages later (and in between I've noticed)! Must have blown another skirt up!

You've just admitted I'm a fellow Aussie in public. Anyone out there can view your posts - you don't have to be registered.

I haven't indicated in which part of Australia I am from so your assumption is a moot point.

Unlike yourself, I do not have a problem with people who live in any of our states and I think people like you who it seems do, posses that feral part in their thinking. Now, they have a name in this country...oh yes, BOGANS


----------



## knitpresentgifts (May 21, 2013)

Walmart is actually doing something on the real War on the Middle Class:

http://info.redstate.com/egl40/c2.php?=8Sel52bt1Se0JXak1yc0JXYt1CbhdXLld3by1SZrlWbtMXZvdWL0ZWZs9SNy8iMw8CNxAjMv02bj5SZ0FGdzRWZy5yd3d3LvoDc0RHavY1LO9CSvgDN5UDO5EzL5gTO1QTO4gjMx8iQQdUR

Walmart is using its *own* money to invest $250 *Billion* over the next ten years into American Manufacturing!

Mike Rowe has done an voice track ad for Walmart; so naturally, the Dems are going after Mike Rowe (have been after Walmart forever) because, he too, has done something for American workers.

The company and the man both care about putting Americans back to work in good jobs, with pay above minimum wages, to offer Americans the American Dream, to prosper, raise families and offer hope.

That's a lot better than anything the Dem Congress or Obama's policies of lies has done for the American people in the past ten years spending and wasting *our* money.


----------



## Janet Cooke (Aug 14, 2013)

Cheeky Blighter said:


> I am surprised to hear what you are saying. Is this first hand knowledge or from friends, reading?


From reading, and of course from listening to the stories of my friends who were locked in closets, beaten, and shamed in the classroom. Even discounting half of what the storytellers were, in some cases embellishing, I am not sure why you would be surprised. 
In many cases it was a very hard life, people of intelligence were locked into the politics of the Church. 
Most of my reading was from the 19th Century, but, take a look at the situations of places such as Sean Ross Abbey in Ireland and others all over Europe. 
What happy people treat other women that way?
What satisfied people treat children that way?

This is the first of your posts asking questions that I saw, I will check in reverse to see if there there others.


----------



## knitpresentgifts (May 21, 2013)

Poor Purl said:


> Give your cat a kiss from me - I assume it's your cat; it's the most contented-looking animal I've seen in a while. Good night.





Cheeky Blighter said:


> That is Conan O'Keegan. He is a very contented and loving cat. I will give him a big kiss from you.


Wow, Vocal Jody Blighter, do you get royalties every time "Conan" appears on the internet?

BTW: Who did the original painting? I've seen the painting on Pinterest of *your cat*, but credit to the artist isn't acknowledged.

Or is the fact, that the cat isn't yours at all, and only another of your lies?

Perhaps you could let us know, especially Poor Purl who asked, whose cat it *actually is* and who painted him.

Because, Conan's image is all over the WWW.

Here's a few sightings:

Your cat even made a Sri Lanka newspaper!

http://www.sundayobserver.lk/2013/08/18/jun05.asp

http://www.petcaregt.com/blog/page/76

http://937pets.com

http://dwellingintheword.wordpress.com/2010/07/16/315-judges-11/]

a painting on Pinterest:
http://www.pinterest.com/mad4jim5/cat-art-ii/


----------



## Knitted by Nan (Aug 3, 2013)

Wombatnomore said:


> Well, I'm still getting a mention 11 pages later (and in between I've noticed)! Must have blown another skirt up!
> 
> You've just admitted I'm a fellow Aussie in public. Anyone out there can view your posts - you don't have to be registered.
> 
> ...


Whatever.......

Yep, I am a bogan and mighty proud of it. I am from Bogan Central. A child of Bogans, hey even a grandchild of Bogans. Thanks for the nice comments there. As they say, you are some shelia. But I will let you in on a little secret. It is part of the Aussie culture to tease people who live in other parts of the country. We all know of the love between people from Sydney and the people from Brisbane or Melbourne. Then of course everyone loves the people from Adelaide, whilst people from Perth - well are they nice or are they, as you called me, Bogans. Lighten up and smell the roses. But I am really, really glad to know that you know what I have problems with. I really only have problem with people who are a pain in the bum.

Whoo hoo, you are still getting mentioned '11 pages later (and in between I've noticed)!', congratulations, definitely a PB here. I am not sure what you mean by 'Must have blown another skirt up!' but I reckon it can only mean something nasty.

But carry on, where ever in Australia you are from. I am just distancing myself from your nasty, snide remarks. But remember, if you dish it out it will come right back at you. Now, if you wish you can carry on this little episode with me by PM, you are welcome because I am sure that no one else on KP is in any way interested.


----------



## Knitted by Nan (Aug 3, 2013)

I was watching TV earlier this evening and I heard the term 'compassion junkie', meaning people who have compassion for asylum seekers and refugees. It was not meant as a nice, friendly term, but the exact opposite. OK, I am a compassion junkie and proud of it. Now for my question. Tongue firmly in cheek. Can I use the term 'bible junkie' on this site?


----------



## Lkholcomb (Aug 25, 2013)

EveMCooke said:


> Whatever.......
> 
> Yep, I am a bogan and mighty proud of it. I am from Bogan Central. A child of Bogans, hey even a grandchild of Bogans. Thanks for the nice comments there. As they say, you are some shelia. But I will let you in on a little secret. It is part of the Aussie culture to tease people who live in other parts of the country. We all know of the love between people from Sydney and the people from Brisbane or Melbourne. Then of course everyone loves the people from Adelaide, whilst people from Perth - well are they nice or are they, as you called me, Bogans. Lighten up and smell the roses. But I am really, really glad to know that you know what I have problems with. I really only have problem with people who are a pain in the bum.
> 
> ...


Am I remembering wrong or was she not the person who complained about bum references?


----------



## Gerslay (Oct 4, 2011)

knitpresentgifts said:


> Wow, Vocal Jody Blighter, do you get royalties every time "Conan" appears on the internet?
> 
> BTW: Who did the original painting? I've seen the painting on Pinterest of *your cat*, but credit to the artist isn't acknowledged.
> 
> ...


BAZINGA!!!!!

:thumbup: :thumbup: :thumbup:


----------



## Knitted by Nan (Aug 3, 2013)

Lkholcomb said:


> Am I remembering wrong or was she not the person who complained about bum references?


Yes, I think she is the person about whom you speak, but I am not going to check her past postings I have far more interesting things to do. Just back from my hour at the gym, no pool, sauna or spa tonight as I was feeling a little on the lazy side.


----------



## MarilynKnits (Aug 30, 2011)

I just took the plunge and purchased the Koren Bible and the Koren Siddur at the ABE Books web site. That is my first choice when looking for used books at a decent price. Got each one, including shipping for each, from different vendors using ABE as their clearing house, considerably less expensive than going direct to Koren Publishers for brand new.

It will be interesting to compare the translations to the Soncino Chumash I currently use and to the Birnmaum Daily Prayer Book I use at home and the Sim Sholom the local shul uses. Birnbaum is Orthodox and Sim Sholom is Conservative. DH is so used to the Birnbaum he can find his way very easily. I have had to put skinny sticky note tabs to index for myself.

As far as translating, we must remember the evolution of word meanings in American English over the past 50 years as a narrow example. Just check a thesaurus to see the varied meanings, including obsolete and archaic for many words. Then think of translations over hundreds of years of the Hebrew and Aramaic written thousands of years ago. The Rabbi mentioned one word in the parsha a couple of weeks ago, saying it could mean this, or this, or the other, nobody is quite sure because of the evolution of usage. Each translation had decidedly different nuance. No wonder scholars spend hours weekly poring over the texts trying to make sense of them.

Nothing as simple as "ben" meaning son. Kids learning Hebrew get a kick out of the language version of "Who's on First" - Joke - Moshie: I was wondering what the Hebrew for he is? Yoshi: Hu. ... Yoshi: Mee is who ( ), hu ( ) is he and hee ( ) is she.



Lkholcomb said:


> I'll have to look for The Jerusalem Bible. I think I'm putting learning Hebrew on my list of things to do if I have time (as in live to be 1,000 years old, lol). But you never know, the spirit may move me one day and I'll try, lol.


----------



## Gerslay (Oct 4, 2011)

Cheeky Blighter said:


> That is Conan O'Keegan. He is a very contented and loving cat. I will give him a big kiss from you.


Naughty naughty! Four pinocchios for you!


----------



## knitpresentgifts (May 21, 2013)

Gerslay said:


> Naughty naughty, (Cheeky Blighter)! Four pinocchios for you!


----------



## MarilynKnits (Aug 30, 2011)

You learn to respect people's privacy. When Lauren Bacall and her daughter were shoe shopping at Bonwit Teller same time as Mother and I were, we just went about our business, the clerks went about theirs, and Mrs. and Miss Bogart went about theirs.



damemary said:


> Another benefit of living in NYC....seeing celebrities up close and personal......problem you have to pretend like you don't notice. True or false?


----------



## Gerslay (Oct 4, 2011)

I think I like this version of "Conan O'Blighter" the best:


----------



## Janet Cooke (Aug 14, 2013)

Funny, only two of those images share the same ID. 
Would that mean that the little girl who wrote into the newspaper stole that image from the internet and labeled it as her cat, ya think?


----------



## susanmos2000 (May 10, 2011)

Cheeky Blighter said:


> Yes, I know what you are talking about. Have you ever heard of the Catholic girl's group called Sodality? I was a member and if you were in Sodality it was kind of a primer for Catholic girls as to how they should conduct themselves as young Catholic women. It was also a way for the church to have girls learn about holy orders and find out if you would be interested in religious life. Nothing scary about it. I went much further than Sodality and lived with novices and then with nuns of two different orders. I know the life is very difficult, as you say, like boot camp but it is that way so you hopefully will find out that life is not for you and you leave. I know people my parents age who would be 90 years old or more were often sent away as young as 12 or 13 and had no choice. Many families believed they should send a son and a daughter to be a priest or nun. I knew priests and nuns who ended up staying and it worked out OK and others who hated religious life and finally left. It was in the '60's when there started to be more and more people leaving. I felt terrible for them but I don't think women were forced to go in the 50's and 60's.


No, of course not--in fact, many nuns-to-be were subjected to considerable pressure by their families to leave (my old Baltimore catechism has a section on how girls with a Vocation should respond to parents who balk at the notion--you tell them you'll wait until you're eighteen and then go ahead no matter how much they object).

It's hard to criticize the words and actions of women in pre-Vatican days who genuinely found this way of life spiritually fulfilling and genuinely satisfying--and of course some convents (particularly the cloistered ones) were far more rigid than others. Still, it's hard to believe that the ground rules found in all orders--to give up one's name, shear off one's hair, hide one's body under layers and layers of clothing, dispense with all material possessions ("a Sister with a penny isn't worth a penny" ), cut contacts with family to an absolute minimum--were a healthy way for adult women to live. Nuns may cut less of a picturesque figure these days with their modern dress and ways, but they now have the opportunity to devote themselves more fully to doing God's work. Old-style nuns wasted a lot of time placating superiors, trying to keep their hair safely hidden beneath their headdresses, and making sure there were no more than a dozen pins and needles in their sewing boxes--silly inconsequential matters, in retrospect.


----------



## Wombatnomore (Dec 9, 2013)

EveMCooke said:


> But carry on, where ever in Australia you are from. I am just distancing myself from your nasty, snide remarks. But remember, if you dish it out it will come right back at you. Now, if you wish you can carry on this little episode with me by PM, you are welcome because I am sure that no one else on KP is in any way interested.


Hey, you want to distance yourself from me? You had a go at me initially, not the other way around.

Given your long and painful response, I'd say your skirt has been seriously blown up!


----------



## knitpresentgifts (May 21, 2013)

Gerslay said:


> I think I like this version of "Conan O'Blighter" the best:


Yes, Gerslay, I like that version too, but thought the Biblical verse would kinda ruin it for the non-believing Libs. Yet, I still posted that link. However, there are so many more places where "Conan" is posted and can be viewed on-line, but I didn't want to confuse Cheeks or show her up. I think Cheeks should promote her own cat, herself, don't you?

I still would like to know whose cat it is and who painted that fine artwork.

So embarrassing for Cheeks, huh, if she isn't getting the royalties and "her" cat the credits?


----------



## knitpresentgifts (May 21, 2013)

Wombatnomore said:


> Hey, you want to distance yourself from me? You had a go at me initially, not the other way around.
> 
> Given your long and painful response, I'd say your skirt has been seriously blown up!


I don't know if she even wears skirts, Wombat, but I still like the way you think and write!


----------



## knitpresentgifts (May 21, 2013)

Janet Cooke said:


> Funny, only two of those images share the same ID.
> Would that mean that the little girl who wrote into the newspaper stole that image from the internet and labeled it as her cat, ya think?


You mean like Vocal J. Blighter allegedly did? Ya think?

The author in the newspaper didn't claim the cat or name the cat as her/his own. Only Cheeks stole an image and claimed it as her own cat (if Cheeks lied-which it seems she did).


----------



## Gerslay (Oct 4, 2011)

knitpresentgifts said:


> Yes, Gerslay, I like that version too, but thought the Biblical verse would kinda ruin it for the non-believing Libs. Yet, I still posted that link. However, there are so many more places where "Conan" is posted and can be viewed on-line, but I didn't want to confuse Cheeks or show her up. I think Cheeks should promote her own cat, herself, don't you?
> 
> I still would like to know whose cat it is and who painted that fine artwork.
> 
> So embarrassing for Cheeks, huh, if she isn't getting the royalties and "her" cat the credits?


Totally agree.

And I do have to say that it is one very handsome cat. I wouldn't mind claiming it as my own either. Think Cheeky would give me permission also?


----------



## Poor Purl (Apr 14, 2011)

SQM said:


> Purl - What is Camp Stitches? I hope it leaves you in them.


Knitter's Magazine runs several events every year. The big ones are called Stitches - a long weekend of many many classes, a huge marketplace with many many vendors, and a few sitdown events (a dinner where they tell everyone how good the magazine is, another with a fashion show, I don't remember what else). These occur in various parts of the country.

Too much typing. Here. http://www.knittinguniverse.com/


----------



## damemary (Mar 14, 2012)

EveMCooke said:


> Whatever.......
> 
> Yep, I am a bogan and mighty proud of it. I am from Bogan Central. A child of Bogans, hey even a grandchild of Bogans. Thanks for the nice comments there. As they say, you are some shelia. But I will let you in on a little secret. It is part of the Aussie culture to tease people who live in other parts of the country. We all know of the love between people from Sydney and the people from Brisbane or Melbourne. Then of course everyone loves the people from Adelaide, whilst people from Perth - well are they nice or are they, as you called me, Bogans. Lighten up and smell the roses. But I am really, really glad to know that you know what I have problems with. I really only have problem with people who are a pain in the bum.
> 
> ...


 :XD: :XD: :XD: :XD: :XD: :XD: :XD: :XD: Way to go Eve.


----------



## Poor Purl (Apr 14, 2011)

damemary said:


> Another benefit of living in NYC....seeing celebrities up close and personal......problem you have to pretend like you don't notice. True or false?


Yes, there's that. When I passed Frank Langella a couple of weeks ago, we looked each other in the eye (we were the only people on the block on a snowy day) and kept going.

Miles Davis was not known to be welcoming to strangers who'd just walk up and say something like "big fan."

Sometimes I have no desire to say anything and get a greeting. I was once leaving a large dinner and hurrying to the coat-check and waving to my husband. As I passed, a short man, thinking I was waving at him, said a perfunctory "hello, how are you?" I rushed by, then turned around and saw it was Jackie Mason. They're not all Frank Langella and Miles Davis.


----------



## Janeway (Nov 22, 2011)

Gerslay said:


> Totally agree.
> 
> And I do have to say that it is one very handsome cat. I wouldn't mind claiming it as my own either. Think Cheeky would give me permission also?


Oh, wanna see my cat, Miss Molly, she was dumped by a slob & I brought her home to live with my DH & I. Isn't she pretty?


----------



## damemary (Mar 14, 2012)

I certainly have no objection. Everyone seems quite loose with slang around here. I rather like compassion junkie myself. Bible junkie doesn't fit me, but it seems quite apt for others around here. Any other thoughts?



EveMCooke said:


> I was watching TV earlier this evening and I heard the term 'compassion junkie', meaning people who have compassion for asylum seekers and refugees. It was not meant as a nice, friendly term, but the exact opposite. OK, I am a compassion junkie and proud of it. Now for my question. Tongue firmly in cheek. Can I use the term 'bible junkie' on this site?


----------



## Poor Purl (Apr 14, 2011)

damemary said:


> The pig can squeal anything it wants. It's still the pig.


I'll take your advice: no wrestling.


----------



## damemary (Mar 14, 2012)

My memory matches. Hypocrisy here at work?



Lkholcomb said:


> Am I remembering wrong or was she not the person who complained about bum references?


----------



## Gerslay (Oct 4, 2011)

Janeway said:


> Oh, wanna see my cat, Miss Molly, she was dumped by a slob & I brought her home to live with my DH & I. Isn't she pretty?


Good golly Miss Molly! She's beautiful, Janeway...so much poise!


----------



## Poor Purl (Apr 14, 2011)

MaidInBedlam said:


> Perhaps God was telling Moses "kiss my a$$". I'd like to think whatever God may or not be that at least he/She has a sense of humor.


I do, too. That's why I could never understand all those riots over the Muhammad cartoons. Is God so weak in their eyes that he can't take a little kidding?


----------



## damemary (Mar 14, 2012)

Now they are even picking on pets....big, strong, beautiful Conan for starts. Conan admits to many relatives with the same gorgeous orange coloring, but he's a unique kitty, and it's best not to ruffle his collar until he's had breakfast and a long cat nap.


----------



## Poor Purl (Apr 14, 2011)

damemary said:


> Words so tender don't win a girl's heart anymore.
> You must send her somewhere where she's never been before. Mama Cass


Love it.


----------



## damemary (Mar 14, 2012)

Please share your findings.



MarilynKnits said:


> I just took the plunge and purchased the Koren Bible and the Koren Siddur at the ABE Books web site. That is my first choice when looking for used books at a decent price. Got each one, including shipping for each, from different vendors using ABE as their clearing house, considerably less expensive than going direct to Koren Publishers for brand new.
> 
> It will be interesting to compare the translations to the Soncino Chumash I currently use and to the Birnmaum Daily Prayer Book I use at home and the Sim Sholom the local shul uses. Birnbaum is Orthodox and Sim Sholom is Conservative. DH is so used to the Birnbaum he can find his way very easily. I have had to put skinny sticky note tabs to index for myself.
> 
> ...


----------



## damemary (Mar 14, 2012)

Just as I expected. Manners.



MarilynKnits said:


> You learn to respect people's privacy. When Lauren Bacall and her daughter were shoe shopping at Bonwit Teller same time as Mother and I were, we just went about our business, the clerks went about theirs, and Mrs. and Miss Bogart went about theirs.


----------



## Poor Purl (Apr 14, 2011)

EveMCooke said:


> You really do not have to worry about us, you cannot alter our chosen path. As long as you are happy in your beliefs please leave us alone to enjoy ours. If it is a sad day for us then it is a sad day for us, and it only concerns us, not you. Please worry about your own future and leave us alone to choose our own path and future.
> 
> Me, well I just read the words ascribed to the Buddha. I say ascribed because Buddha did not leave any written record, he said "when I am gone, I am gone", that is why the original statues of the Buddha were only the empty footprint - to show he is gone.
> 
> Buddha neither denied or agreed with the existence of God or Gods but said "_I am not a God, do not look to me for divine intervention. Do not take my word as gospel but question everything I say_."


Amen.


----------



## Gerslay (Oct 4, 2011)

Please share your findings on another thread!



damemary said:


> Please share your findings.


MarilynKnits wrote:
I just took the plunge and purchased the Koren Bible and the Koren Siddur at the ABE Books web site. That is my first choice when looking for used books at a decent price. Got each one, including shipping for each, from different vendors using ABE as their clearing house, considerably less expensive than going direct to Koren Publishers for brand new.

It will be interesting to compare the translations to the Soncino Chumash I currently use and to the Birnmaum Daily Prayer Book I use at home and the Sim Sholom the local shul uses. Birnbaum is Orthodox and Sim Sholom is Conservative. DH is so used to the Birnbaum he can find his way very easily. I have had to put skinny sticky note tabs to index for myself.

As far as translating, we must remember the evolution of word meanings in American English over the past 50 years as a narrow example. Just check a thesaurus to see the varied meanings, including obsolete and archaic for many words. Then think of translations over hundreds of years of the Hebrew and Aramaic written thousands of years ago. The Rabbi mentioned one word in the parsha a couple of weeks ago, saying it could mean this, or this, or the other, nobody is quite sure because of the evolution of usage. Each translation had decidedly different nuance. No wonder scholars spend hours weekly poring over the texts trying to make sense of them.

Nothing as simple as "ben" meaning son. Kids learning Hebrew get a kick out of the language version of "Who's on First" - Joke - Moshie: I was wondering what the Hebrew for he is? Yoshi: Hu. ... Yoshi: Mee is who ( ), hu ( ) is he and hee ( ) is she.


----------



## Poor Purl (Apr 14, 2011)

EveMCooke said:


> Unfortunately, Wombat is a fellow Aussie, but I do not admit that in public. She is an entirely different breed, she is an Eastern States person, not a Sandgroper like me.


Australia is a very big place, but she'd be an entirely different breed even if she lived next door to you. She has yet to add anything substantive to a conversation, whereas you do it whenever you open your mouth - um, wiggle your fingers.


----------



## damemary (Mar 14, 2012)

There are many orange cats in a shelter near you. Save a life and make a friend.


----------



## Gerslay (Oct 4, 2011)

Amen and Amen!

The Buddha was searching for enlightenment...Jesus IS the ENLIGHTENMENT!



Poor Purl said:


> Amen.


EveMCooke wrote:
You really do not have to worry about us, you cannot alter our chosen path. As long as you are happy in your beliefs please leave us alone to enjoy ours. If it is a sad day for us then it is a sad day for us, and it only concerns us, not you. Please worry about your own future and leave us alone to choose our own path and future.

Me, well I just read the words ascribed to the Buddha. I say ascribed because Buddha did not leave any written record, he said "when I am gone, I am gone", that is why the original statues of the Buddha were only the empty footprint - to show he is gone.

Buddha neither denied or agreed with the existence of God or Gods but said "I am not a God, do not look to me for divine intervention. Do not take my word as gospel but question everything I say." Amen.


----------



## MaidInBedlam (Jul 24, 2012)

The platypus and hippo are pretty funny. So are the plants, like the pitcher plant that wait for bugs to fall into their deadly pitchers. Plants eating animals? Good one. And did you know that one translation of the word "rhinoceros" is "unicorn"? Adam had altogetherly too much fun naming things. Men continue to do stupid stuff, but I like to think that they'd do even stupider stuff if women weren't around. Reproduction would be an interesting process, too, however it would be accomplished.


Lkholcomb said:


> Of course he or she has a sense of humor! Have you SEEN a platypus or hippo? Anything that could create THOSE has a wicked sense of humor!
> 
> Of course the silly names we can blame on Adam. I swear he was enjoy the grass in the garden too much when he named the animals. That was why God created women. To stop men from doing stupid stuff! (or so I tell my daughter ;-) )


----------



## Poor Purl (Apr 14, 2011)

Lkholcomb said:


> Of course he or she has a sense of humor! Have you SEEN a platypus or hippo? Anything that could create THOSE has a wicked sense of humor!
> 
> Of course the silly names we can blame on Adam. I swear he was enjoy the grass in the garden too much when he named the animals. That was why God created women. To stop men from doing stupid stuff! (or so I tell my daughter ;-) )


 :XD: :XD: :XD: :XD: :XD: :XD: :XD: :XD:


----------



## damemary (Mar 14, 2012)

Glad SQM asked. I wasn't familiar either. Thanks Purl.



Poor Purl said:


> Knitter's Magazine runs several events every year. The big ones are called Stitches - a long weekend of many many classes, a huge marketplace with many many vendors, and a few sitdown events (a dinner where they tell everyone how good the magazine is, another with a fashion show, I don't remember what else). These occur in various parts of the country.
> 
> Too much typing. Here. http://www.knittinguniverse.com/


----------



## damemary (Mar 14, 2012)

We're all different. We're all the same. IMHO



Poor Purl said:


> Yes, there's that. When I passed Frank Langella a couple of weeks ago, we looked each other in the eye (we were the only people on the block on a snowy day) and kept going.
> 
> Miles Davis was not known to be welcoming to strangers who'd just walk up and say something like "big fan."
> 
> Sometimes I have no desire to say anything and get a greeting. I was once leaving a large dinner and hurrying to the coat-check and waving to my husband. As I passed, a short man, thinking I was waving at him, said a perfunctory "hello, how are you?" I rushed by, then turned around and saw it was Jackie Mason. They're not all Frank Langella and Miles Davis.


----------



## Janet Cooke (Aug 14, 2013)

Gerslay said:


> Please share your findings on another thread!
> 
> MarilynKnits wrote:
> I just took the plunge and purchased the Koren Bible and the Koren Siddur at the ABE Books web site. That is my first choice when looking for used books at a decent price. Got each one, including shipping for each, from different vendors using ABE as their clearing house, considerably less expensive than going direct to Koren Publishers for brand new.
> ...


What? You all made this a religion thread. Now those of us who are interested in broadening our horizons get to enjoy.


----------



## damemary (Mar 14, 2012)

It's George Bernard Shaw's quote but it fits us to a TEE.



Poor Purl said:


> I'll take your advice: no wrestling.


----------



## damemary (Mar 14, 2012)

Thank you. I've been hearing a torch song by Mama Cass all night.

Words of love, so soft and tender,
Won't win a girl's heart anymore.
If you love her, then you must send her
Somewhere where she's never been before.
Worn out phrases and longing gazes
Won't get you where you want to go. (No!)
Words of love, soft and tender,
Won't win her...

You oughta know by now (you oughta know by now).
You oughta know (you oughta know);
You oughta know by now--- (you oughta know by now)
Words of love, soft and tender,
Won't win her anymore.

You oughta know by now (you oughta know by now).
You oughta know (you oughta know);
You oughta know by now--- (you oughta know by now)
Words of love, soft and tender,
Won't win a girls heart anymore.

If you love her, then you must send her
Somewhere where she's never been before.
Worn out phrases and longing gazes
Won't get you where you want to go.
Words of love, soft and tender,
Won't win her anymore, anymore.



Poor Purl said:


> Love it.


----------



## damemary (Mar 14, 2012)

MaidInBedlam said:


> The platypus and hippo are pretty funny. So are the plants, like the pitcher plant that wait for bugs to fall into their deadly pitchers. Plants eating animals? Good one. And did you know that one translation of the word "rhinoceros" is "unicorn"? Adam had altogetherly too much fun naming things. Men continue to do stupid stuff, but I like to think that they'd do even stupider stuff if women weren't around. Reproduction would be an interesting process, too, however it would be accomplished.


 :XD: :XD: :XD: :XD: :XD: :XD: :XD: Thanks MIB.


----------



## Gerslay (Oct 4, 2011)

Janet Cooke said:


> What? You all made this a religion thread. Now those of us who are interested in broadening our horizons get to enjoy.


The study of the Koren Bible is interesting, indeed, and deserves a thread of its own. That way others can find out about it and broaden their horizons also.

Just sayin!


----------



## theyarnlady (Feb 25, 2011)

It seems that only one of you read Cheeky B'S post. I found it very intersting what she saw with Nun's. But all of you could not say enough about Nun's and bad mouthing them.

You all are so caught up in your own words that you can not see any thing other then your selfish selfs.

Then you bad mouth the right. When you don't even see what one of your own posted.

Thank you Cheeky for stateing what you know and have seem.
I hope the rest of you will go back and see what she wrote and get over yourselves.


----------



## damemary (Mar 14, 2012)

Janet Cooke said:


> What? You all made this a religion thread. Now those of us who are interested in broadening our horizons get to enjoy.


 :thumbup: :thumbup: :thumbup: :thumbup: :thumbup: :thumbup: :thumbup: :thumbup: :thumbup: :thumbup: :thumbup: :thumbup: :thumbup: :thumbup: :thumbup: :thumbup: :thumbup: :thumbup: :thumbup: :thumbup:


----------



## damemary (Mar 14, 2012)

Perhaps some PM's were exchanged.



theyarnlady said:


> It seems that only one of you read Cheeky B'S post. I found it very intersting what she saw with Nun's. But all of you could not say enough about Nun's and bad mouthing them.
> 
> You all are so caught up in your own words that you can not see any thing other then your selfish selfs.
> 
> ...


----------



## Janet Cooke (Aug 14, 2013)

knitpresentgifts said:


> You mean like Vocal J. Blighter allegedly did? Ya think?
> 
> The author in the newspaper didn't claim the cat or name the cat as her/his own. Only Cheeks stole an image and claimed it as her own cat (if Cheeks lied-which it seems she did).


I mean this one. The "author" DID claim the cat. 
You see that is the difference between only having enough interest in anything to see the surface and actually have interest in what is said and thought.

Winner:

The value of newspapers

We know what a newspaper is. It has many advantages. It is very useful in the modern world. Newspapers play an important role in our life. Some prefer to be without breakfast rather than miss the morning newspaper.

The word NEWS stands for North, East, West and South which gathers news from all four directions. Newspapers also publish marriage proposals, obituary notices, job vacancies and feature articles on various subjects.

They provide us with information of national interest, foreign, financial and sports news too. The newspaper brings us all these information for a low price.

Today we live in a global village. No nation or country can isolate themselves from the rest of the world. What happens in other countries affect our country. Newspapers help us to understand what is going on in different parts of the world.

In the field of education and art one can gain a vast knowledge by reading articles in newspapers. The reader can enjoy various literary creations that appear in them.

The Students too can learn much about various subjects from newspaper articles. Therefore, the newspaper is a source of knowledge and entertainment.

Abdul Majeed Sharofa Farweez, 
Ak/Addalaichenai MMV National School, 
Addalaichenai.

My pet cat

I got a pet cat a few years ago. He seems to think that he is in charge of me. 
He acts in strange ways. 
Sometimes I wonder whether he is really a pet. I think he is also confused at times. 
He does things which surprise me. He seems to think that elastic bands are creatures! 
He also seems to think that he is well-balanced. He never says, Miaow. 
I have no idea what he thinks about me. My pet cat is so cute that I like him a lot.

Ishini Jayanetti, 
Grade 8H, 
Lyceum International School, 
Wattala.

This is from the Sunday Observer link that you sent out. Too bad you didn't actually READ it.
Even if it were a stock photo why would the newspaper change the image number?


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## MrsB (Jun 3, 2011)

The appearance of a person or their lifestyle, is a way to fake being inferior in others eyes. Saving face for relatives, coworkers, creditors, etc. But it takes a toll in other ways. Scale back, it may just be a temporary setback. If nothing else, pray for guidance and peace of mind. It's amazing relief and doesn't cost a darn thing!


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## damemary (Mar 14, 2012)

Janet Cooke said:


> I mean this one. The "author" DID claim the cat.
> You see that is the difference between only having enough interest in anything to see the surface and actually have interest in what is said and thought.
> 
> Winner:
> ...


 :thumbup: :thumbup: :thumbup: :thumbup: :thumbup: :thumbup: :thumbup: Thank you Janet. Now we know the REST of the story.


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## Country Bumpkins (Feb 18, 2011)

Gerslay said:


> Naughty naughty! Four pinocchios for you!


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## Janet Cooke (Aug 14, 2013)

damemary said:


> Perhaps some PM's were exchanged.


I read ol' yarnface's posts once, I considered being nice to her because one of our own spoke up for her. 
Never again, she is a manipulator with the best and will not get any sympathy from me.


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## Country Bumpkins (Feb 18, 2011)

damemary said:


> Now they are even picking on pets....big, strong, beautiful Conan for starts. Conan admits to many relatives with the same gorgeous orange coloring, but he's a unique kitty, and it's best not to ruffle his collar until he's had breakfast and a long cat nap.


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## MaidInBedlam (Jul 24, 2012)

Good thing your rongue was in your cheek. It would be hard to say "bible junkie" that way. Fortunately we type what we have to say here. Since you've used the phrase already, I think you can use it some more. Some of us may gratefully borrow it from you, too. After all, imitation is the best form of flattery. :mrgreen: :mrgreen: :mrgreen:


EveMCooke said:


> I was watching TV earlier this evening and I heard the term 'compassion junkie', meaning people who have compassion for asylum seekers and refugees. It was not meant as a nice, friendly term, but the exact opposite. OK, I am a compassion junkie and proud of it. Now for my question. Tongue firmly in cheek. Can I use the term 'bible junkie' on this site?


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## MaidInBedlam (Jul 24, 2012)

I see it hasn't occurred to you that Conan might be hanging on Cheeky's wall and the silly, sweet things said about him are just that?


Gerslay said:


> I think I like this version of "Conan O'Blighter" the best:


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## Janet Cooke (Aug 14, 2013)

MrsB said:


> The appearance of a person or their lifestyle, is a way to fake being inferior in others eyes. Saving face for relatives, coworkers, creditors, etc. But it takes a toll in other ways. Scale back, it may just be a temporary setback. If nothing else, pray for guidance and peace of mind. It's amazing relief and doesn't cost a darn thing!


Here's hoping that those sweet animals are yours, all yours. No misrepresentations allowed here, even in fun. 
And no, that is not me in the avatar, and neither have any of the pics I have used.


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## Janet Cooke (Aug 14, 2013)

MaidInBedlam said:


> I see it hasn't occurred to you that Conan might be hanging on Cheeky's wall and the silly, sweet things said about him are just that?


Exactly, and who gives a care?
Does anyone think that Damemary owns that image in her avatar? 
Did KPG own that image that she used recently? 
There must be thousands of representations of that type of cat, isn't that the same variety of cat as used in Meow Mix or Fancy Cat ads?


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## Poor Purl (Apr 14, 2011)

Lkholcomb said:


> Am I remembering wrong or was she not the person who complained about bum references?


She/he/it did indeed so complain. And has used the skirt-blowing expression before, as well. Yawn.


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## rocky1991 (May 8, 2011)

Gerslay said:


> The study of the Koren Bible is interesting, indeed, and deserves a thread of its own. That way others can find out about it and broaden their horizons also.
> 
> Just sayin!


But the rest of us have to read all your bible beating, read all the nonsense quotes from the bible, as if they are "true". Reading something about the Koren needs it's own thread. Just shows how christians deal with other religions.


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## Janet Cooke (Aug 14, 2013)

I for one would LOVE to read more as related by KP members.


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## MaidInBedlam (Jul 24, 2012)

Miss Molly is lovely.I don't understand how people can dump animals.Good for you for rescuing her.


Janeway said:


> Oh, wanna see my cat, Miss Molly, she was dumped by a slob & I brought her home to live with my DH & I. Isn't she pretty?


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## SQM (Jun 22, 2012)

rocky1991 said:


> But the rest of us have to read all your bible beating, read all the nonsense quotes from the bible, as if they are "true". Reading something about the Koren needs it's own thread. Just shows how christians deal with other religions.


That was my feelings. Sister G was objecting to a Jewish reference on these pages. Plain and simple.


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## MaidInBedlam (Jul 24, 2012)

I have a pen and paper fetish. I make no secret of this and hang out with others who lean the same way. I like to shop for new pens and paper and have all sorts of stuff now. And it's really, really hard for me to throw away used up pens...


damemary said:


> I certainly have no objection. Everyone seems quite loose with slang around here. I rather like compassion junkie myself. Bible junkie doesn't fit me, but it seems quite apt for others around here. Any other thoughts?


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## MaidInBedlam (Jul 24, 2012)

How do you like my new avatar? That's my cat, Faro, who was moonlighting for an artist. (NOT!! :mrgreen: ) Maybe it's time for some more cat avatars. I really like yours, and have to ask who it is. I'll bet I should already know.


Janet Cooke said:


> Exactly, and who gives a care?
> Does anyone think that Damemary owns that image in her avatar?
> Did KPG own that image that she used recently?
> There must be thousands of representations of that type of cat, i. I should probably knowsn't that the same variety of cat as used in Meow Mix or Fancy Cat ads?


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## Gerslay (Oct 4, 2011)

SQM said:


> That was my feelings. Sister G was objecting to a Jewish reference on these pages. Plain and simple.


Not at all SQUIRM...I was just thinking that the readers on just this thread would be limited and perhaps Marilynknits would want to open it up to all of KP.

Plain and simple!


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## Gerslay (Oct 4, 2011)

Hoping y'all enjoy seeing my cat. I had his portrait done by a famous cat artist, Carol Lew. We call him "Grand Félin".


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## Poor Purl (Apr 14, 2011)

Wombatnomore said:


> Hey, you want to distance yourself from me? You had a go at me initially, not the other way around.
> 
> Given your long and painful response, I'd say your skirt has been seriously blown up!


Watch out, your fetish is showing.


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## Poor Purl (Apr 14, 2011)

Wombatnomore said:


> You've just admitted I'm a fellow Aussie in public. Anyone out there can view your posts - you don't have to be registered.


But you do have to recognize a joke.



> I haven't indicated in which part of Australia I am from so your assumption is a moot point.


 Please reread that sentence. It reads like something written by Hyacinth Beddoes Laffoon.



> Unlike yourself, I do not have a problem with people who live in any of our states and I think people like you who it seems do, posses that feral part in their thinking. Now, they have a name in this country...oh yes, BOGANS


I love the way you consistently refuse to say anything of worth, yet have no problem being critical of someone who only speaks sense.

You're getting tiresome, Wombat. I think a nap would do me a lot more good than spending time reading your square-shaped


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## Poor Purl (Apr 14, 2011)

EveMCooke said:


> Whatever.......
> 
> Yep, I am a bogan and mighty proud of it. I am from Bogan Central. A child of Bogans, hey even a grandchild of Bogans. Thanks for the nice comments there. As they say, you are some shelia. But I will let you in on a little secret. It is part of the Aussie culture to tease people who live in other parts of the country. We all know of the love between people from Sydney and the people from Brisbane or Melbourne. Then of course everyone loves the people from Adelaide, whilst people from Perth - well are they nice or are they, as you called me, Bogans. Lighten up and smell the roses. But I am really, really glad to know that you know what I have problems with. I really only have problem with people who are a pain in the bum.
> 
> ...


Not true, Ms. Eve. I use the Wombat to sharpen my claws on.

It keeps referring to skirts being blown up. That really does sound nasty, but it couldn't be because the Wombat scolds us for unladylike speech, and it wouldn't be hypocritical, would it? (I don't know what sex to ascribe to it - it writes like a man but on KP it's way more likely to be a woman.)

Could it be from Christchurch? There was an equally irritating Aussie who came from there but seems to have disappeared. That one also wrote like a man. ... No, I see that Christchurch is in NZ, not OZ. So we now have two masculine-seeming annoyances from down under. And you more than balance them out.


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## Poor Purl (Apr 14, 2011)

MarilynKnits said:


> I just took the plunge and purchased the Koren Bible and the Koren Siddur at the ABE Books web site. That is my first choice when looking for used books at a decent price. Got each one, including shipping for each, from different vendors using ABE as their clearing house, considerably less expensive than going direct to Koren Publishers for brand new.
> 
> It will be interesting to compare the translations to the Soncino Chumash I currently use and to the Birnmaum Daily Prayer Book I use at home and the Sim Sholom the local shul uses. Birnbaum is Orthodox and Sim Sholom is Conservative. DH is so used to the Birnbaum he can find his way very easily. I have had to put skinny sticky note tabs to index for myself.
> 
> ...


Yup, all six-year-olds love that humor. I know I did.

After I recommended Koren to Lk, I checked it at Bookfinder and was surprised to see how expensive it was at most booksellers. I'm glad you found cheaper ones (and who could be cheaper than Abe Books?) The Soncino is older, and the language a bit more dated, but it's the one I prefer, too, I think because I remember when it was the only decent translation.

My son always complains that the Birnbaum is being supplanted by the Artscroll, which is bowdlerized and gives some of the dumbest instructions on what you're supposed to do during prayer. Son is the one most interested in that, as well as cantillation. I don't know where that comes from; at home he only listens to Mozart, and I only listen to Sinatra.

Enough! I never thought when I got up this morning that I'd be discussing siddurim. Where have I gone wrong?


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## Poor Purl (Apr 14, 2011)

Janeway said:


> Oh, wanna see my cat, Miss Molly, she was dumped by a slob & I brought her home to live with my DH & I. Isn't she pretty?


Miss Molly is absolutely beautiful. You must love having her around.


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## Poor Purl (Apr 14, 2011)

damemary said:


> Thank you. I've been hearing a torch song by Mama Cass all night.
> 
> Words of love, so soft and tender,
> Won't win a girl's heart anymore.
> ...


I still love it. Mama Cass had such a huge talent that maybe she needed a large body just to encompass it. But she's sorely missed.


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## Poor Purl (Apr 14, 2011)

MrsB said:


> The appearance of a person or their lifestyle, is a way to fake being inferior in others eyes. Saving face for relatives, coworkers, creditors, etc. But it takes a toll in other ways. Scale back, it may just be a temporary setback. If nothing else, pray for guidance and peace of mind. It's amazing relief and doesn't cost a darn thing!


I have no idea why you wrote this, but the picture is really cute, as is the one in your avatar.


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## Janet Cooke (Aug 14, 2013)

Poor Purl said:


> I have no idea why you wrote this, but the picture is really cute, as is the one in your avatar.


It reads like a newspaper horoscope.


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## Poor Purl (Apr 14, 2011)

Janet Cooke said:


> I read ol' yarnface's posts once, I considered being nice to her because one of our own spoke up for her.
> Never again, she is a manipulator with the best and will not get any sympathy from me.


I'm Poor Purl and I'm a compassion junkie. I spoke up for her because she once cried that people were picking on her for the way she wrote and that was unfair because she suffered from seizures that had given her brain damage.

But she's gotten really nasty lately. I think that cured my addiction.


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## SQM (Jun 22, 2012)

Janet Cooke said:


> It reads like a newspaper horoscope.


More like a fortune cookie. But the idiocy is fun!


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## Poor Purl (Apr 14, 2011)

MaidInBedlam said:


> How do you like my new avatar? That's my cat, Faro, who was moonlighting for an artist. (NOT!! :mrgreen: ) Maybe it's time for some more cat avatars. I really like yours, and have to ask who it is. I'll bet I should already know.


Love it. Doesn't Hedy Lamarr as Delilah qualify as a cat?


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## Janet Cooke (Aug 14, 2013)

Poor Purl said:


> Love it. Doesn't Hedy Lamarr as Delilah qualify as a cat?


I think I have a kitty or two to share.


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## MarilynKnits (Aug 30, 2011)

Poor Purl said:


> - - - - - -My son always complains that the Birnbaum is being supplanted by the Artscroll, which is bowdlerized and gives some of the dumbest instructions on what you're supposed to do during prayer. - - -
> 
> The problem I have with Artscroll is the changing of points of font and the use of gray background. Really hard to see the dots in pay/fay and tov/sov. The edition with linear translation was a good text though when I had a study class a few years ago. The Birnbaum is legible, at least. I am eagerly awaiting the delivery of my Koren and hope I won't be disappointed.


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## knitpresentgifts (May 21, 2013)

Janeway said:


> Oh, wanna see my cat, Miss Molly, she was dumped by a slob & I brought her home to live with my DH & I. Isn't she pretty?


Molly is beautiful Jane! And, of course, yours!


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## knitpresentgifts (May 21, 2013)

Janet Cooke said:


> I mean this one. The "author" DID claim the cat.
> You see that is the difference between only having enough interest in anything to see the surface and actually have interest in what is said and thought.
> This is from the Sunday Observer link that you sent out. Too bad you didn't actually READ it.
> Even if it were a stock photo why would the newspaper change the image number?
> ...


Hey Dimwit; I *read* the news article in the Sri Lanka newspaper. I'm the one who posted the five links, remember? Re-read the article you posted which I've now placeds in italics for everyone.

The author, as I stated prior, *DID NOT* give the name of her/his pet nor claim the image of the cat as her/his OWN, LIKE CHEEKY did.

Too bad, *you* don't understand that and you went ahead and *lied* too.

No one even knows if the editor or the child selected the cat image used in the news story. The child spoke _generically_ about her pet cat she got a few years ago.

Cheeky *lied* by telling us the cat in the image was *hers = lie #1 * AND told us that "her" cat in her avatar was Conan O'Keegan *lie #2* and indicated she kiss it on behalf of Poor Purl which makes *lie #3* and told us about Conan's disposition as *lie #4*. All those lies were told by Cheeks in one simple paragraph - AMAZING!

Show me, exactly where the author or *anyone in any of the five linked stories * claims the cat as her/his own and tells the cat's name.

Hint: you * cannot* because *you, too, are lying.*

The only one who DID name/claim the cat is the *liar*, Cheeky Blighter d/b/a Vocal Lisa as well.


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## Janet Cooke (Aug 14, 2013)

knitpresentgifts said:


> Hey Dimwit; I *read* the news article in the Sri Lanka newspaper.
> 
> I posted the links, remember? Re-read the article you posted and I've now shown in italics for everyone.
> 
> ...


I hope you don't hyper extend with that spin.
Please note *who* feels it is necessary to do the name calling. What is that they say about not having a legitimate argument?


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## knitpresentgifts (May 21, 2013)

Janet Cooke said:


> I hope you don't hyper extend with that spin.


Ya, I hope you don't expire in your continual efforts to cover for a serial liar.

Why don't you go ahead and change the topic again like all your Lib buds do to cover Cheek's lie instead of lying yourself?


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## Poor Purl (Apr 14, 2011)

MarilynKnits said:


> Poor Purl said:
> 
> 
> > - - - - - -My son always complains that the Birnbaum is being supplanted by the Artscroll, which is bowdlerized and gives some of the dumbest instructions on what you're supposed to do during prayer. - - -
> ...


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## Poor Purl (Apr 14, 2011)

Janet Cooke said:


> I hope you don't hyper extend with that spin.
> Please note *who* feels it is necessary to do the name calling. What is that they say about not having a legitimate argument?


Why bother? Consider the source.


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## Janet Cooke (Aug 14, 2013)

Poor Purl said:


> Why bother? Consider the source.


You're right, I was just made excitable by the PM I received asking if KPG was the same person as Knit Crazy.


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## Janet Cooke (Aug 14, 2013)

knitpresentgifts said:


> Ya, I hope you don't expire in your continual efforts to cover for a serial liar.
> 
> Why don't you go ahead and change the topic again like all your Lib buds do to cover Cheek's lie instead of lying yourself?


Gee, could I be reading a post that says that regardless of what people do only you can do right?
If I pass on by then I am changing the subject rather than addressing it and if I talk about it I am covering for Cheeky?

It is a picture of a cat. With as many lies as you have been caught in here if that weren't her cat, it would fall someone about 999,999,999 in the list behind yours.


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## knitpresentgifts (May 21, 2013)

Janet Cooke said:


> Gee, could I be reading a post that says that regardless of what people do only you can do right?
> If I pass on by then I am changing the subject rather than addressing it and if I talk about it I am covering for Cheeky?
> 
> It is a picture of a cat. With as many lies as you have been caught in here if that weren't her cat, it would fall someone about 999,999,999 in the list behind yours.


Nope, but I don't lie. You and Vocal J. Blighter do though.

Just sayin'; don't get too excited because everyone reading this thread knows that is the case as do I.

You didn't acknowledge Cheek's lies. Instead; you attempted to deflect the subject to 1) the links being two with identical ID's (whatever the heck you think that means) and 2) placing the blame on the child author who you charged with "stealing" an image (she/he didn't) and 3) you lied in the process.

You cannot name one lie I've written *because I have not lied*.

Please keep on trying though to show once where I've lied; it just increases the number of _your_ lies for all to read.

Have a great day!

P.S. I assume it is someone's cat. However, it isn't Cheek's judging by all her buds CHB.


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## Janeway (Nov 22, 2011)

MaidInBedlam said:


> Miss Molly is lovely.I don't understand how people can dump animals.Good for you for rescuing her.


Well, are you finally being nice to me???? Me thinks the "sky" is falling!


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## knitpresentgifts (May 21, 2013)

Poor Purl said:


> Why bother? Consider the source.


True - Vocal J. Blighter is not a reliable or truthful source.


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## soloweygirl (Jun 9, 2012)

knitpresentgifts said:


> True - Vocal J. Blighter is not a reliable or truthful source.


She is a reliable liar.


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## susanmos2000 (May 10, 2011)

knitpresentgifts said:


> Nope, but I don't lie. You and Vocal J. Blighter do though.
> 
> Just sayin'; don't get too excited because everyone reading this thread knows that is the case as do I.
> 
> ...


Sounds like a challenge I simply can't let slip by...

How about this little gem (addressed to me on January 29):

KPG: You have already begged me to return multiple times; no reason for you to repeat yourself but you will anyway, or talk about it even though no one cares.


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## Janet Cooke (Aug 14, 2013)

susanmos2000 said:


> Sounds like a challenge I simply can't let slip by...
> 
> How about this little gem (addressed to me on January 29):
> 
> KPG: You have already begged me to return multiple times; no reason for you to repeat yourself but you will anyway, or talk about it even though no one cares.


That's a goodie, the wondrous Empress Purl is right, though. 
We know what she is.


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## susanmos2000 (May 10, 2011)

Janet Cooke said:


> That's a goodie, the wondrous Empress Purl is right, though.
> We know what she is.


So true, Janet. A skunk with its stripe painted over still reeks--there's simply no hiding it.


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## BrattyPatty (May 2, 2011)

susanmos2000 said:


> So true, Janet. A skunk with its stripe painted over still reeks--there's simply no hiding it.


And the odor is the same!


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## BrattyPatty (May 2, 2011)

susanmos2000 said:


> Sounds like a challenge I simply can't let slip by...
> 
> How about this little gem (addressed to me on January 29):
> 
> KPG: You have already begged me to return multiple times; no reason for you to repeat yourself but you will anyway, or talk about it even though no one cares.


She is pulling the 'Nixon" again. Of course she has lied. It should read "I have never spoken the truth".


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## MarilynKnits (Aug 30, 2011)

Folks, let's face it. KPG is an attention seeking mishugenah. With her rants, who can take anything she says seriously? But she is amusing, in a bizarre way, and makes all the rest of us look great.


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## BrattyPatty (May 2, 2011)

soloweygirl said:


> She is a reliable liar.


You are speaking of KPG, right, solow?
We all know that already. She trips herself up constantly.
Cheeky and Vocal the same person?
:XD: :XD: :XD: :XD: :XD: :XD: :XD: :XD: :XD: :XD:


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## BrattyPatty (May 2, 2011)

MarilynKnits said:


> Folks, let's face it. KPG is an attention seeking mishugenah. With her rants, who can take anything she says seriously? But she is amusing, in a bizarre way, and makes all the rest of us look great.


Yeah, they let her out of her padded cell once or twice a day for computer time. She really is a joke. That awful poo colored hair in her avatar is to hide that long Pinnichio nose of hers.


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## Poor Purl (Apr 14, 2011)

Janet Cooke said:


> I think I have a kitty or two to share.


I have the furry kind, but I really want to keep Delilah. At least for a while.


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## Gerslay (Oct 4, 2011)

knitpresentgifts said:


> Hey Dimwit; I *read* the news article in the Sri Lanka newspaper. I'm the one who posted the five links, remember? Re-read the article you posted which I've now placeds in italics for everyone.
> 
> The author, as I stated prior, *DID NOT* give the name of her/his pet nor claim the image of the cat as her/his OWN, LIKE CHEEKY did.
> 
> ...


I wonder if Cheeky Blighter will identify who did the painting of her cat. If she claims she doesn't know, I do!!

RSVP!


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## Poor Purl (Apr 14, 2011)

BrattyPatty said:


> She is pulling the 'Nixon" again. Of course she has lied. It should read "I have never spoken the truth".


Hey, Patty, Good to see you. But: I'm pretty sure she doesn't realize she's lying because she keeps changing her story and can't remember what she said the last time.

But who really cares? Just because she's always on the lookout for the slightest fib doesn't mean we have to do the same thing. In fact, why would anyone want to emulate her foolishness?


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## Poor Purl (Apr 14, 2011)

BrattyPatty said:


> You are speaking of KPG, right, solow?
> We all know that already. She trips herself up constantly.
> Cheeky and Vocal the same person?
> :XD: :XD: :XD: :XD: :XD: :XD: :XD: :XD: :XD: :XD:


It's unbelievable the way they hold on to that delusion, when it's clearly pathological.

But welcome back. Where are you now? - hot or cold?

I'm glad Vegas hasn't ruined you; you're as beautiful today as you were the day you left.


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## Gerslay (Oct 4, 2011)

soloweygirl said:


> She is a reliable liar.


I love that..."a reliable liar"!

:thumbup: :thumbup: :thumbup:


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## damemary (Mar 14, 2012)

I'm with you. Pity is not enough for me to like her. She always seemed like she used her 'handicaps' as excuses when she was caught. Too convenient for me.



Janet Cooke said:


> I read ol' yarnface's posts once, I considered being nice to her because one of our own spoke up for her.
> Never again, she is a manipulator with the best and will not get any sympathy from me.


----------



## damemary (Mar 14, 2012)

MaidInBedlam said:


> Good thing your rongue was in your cheek. It would be hard to say "bible junkie" that way. Fortunately we type what we have to say here. Since you've used the phrase already, I think you can use it some more. Some of us may gratefully borrow it from you, too. After all, imitation is the best form of flattery. :mrgreen: :mrgreen: :mrgreen:


Indeed.

:mrgreen: :mrgreen: :mrgreen: :mrgreen: :mrgreen: :mrgreen: :mrgreen: :mrgreen: :mrgreen: :mrgreen: :mrgreen:


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## damemary (Mar 14, 2012)

Janet Cooke said:


> Exactly, and who gives a care?
> Does anyone think that Damemary owns that image in her avatar?
> Did KPG own that image that she used recently?
> There must be thousands of representations of that type of cat, isn't that the same variety of cat as used in Meow Mix or Fancy Cat ads?


 :lol: :lol: :lol: :lol: :lol: :lol: :lol: :lol: :lol: :lol: :lol: Did anyone take an oath to be truthful? This is the Internet you know. Also style of writing varies. At least that's the way I see it.


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## damemary (Mar 14, 2012)

For me, it depends on the members, sorry to say. I'm finished banging my head against the wall because it feels so good when I quit.



Janet Cooke said:


> I for one would LOVE to read more as related by KP members.


----------



## Janet Cooke (Aug 14, 2013)

damemary said:


> :lol: :lol: :lol: :lol: :lol: :lol: :lol: :lol: :lol: :lol: :lol: Did anyone take an oath to be truthful? This is the Internet you know. Also style of writing varies. At least that's the way I see it.


A lot of the behavior here reminds me of those Meow Mix ads, too.


----------



## damemary (Mar 14, 2012)

I think rescuing animals is one of the most fulfilling things we can do.



MaidInBedlam said:


> Miss Molly is lovely.I don't understand how people can dump animals.Good for you for rescuing her.


----------



## Poor Purl (Apr 14, 2011)

damemary said:


> :lol: :lol: :lol: :lol: :lol: :lol: :lol: :lol: :lol: :lol: :lol: Did anyone take an oath to be truthful? This is the Internet you know. Also style of writing varies. At least that's the way I see it.


The problem is that lying about owning a cat is one thing; lying about the ACA is another. The first won't influence anyone to do anything; the second may influence someone who could use it to avoid it.


----------



## knitpresentgifts (May 21, 2013)

Hum, I wonder if the Libs will call these united black pastors racists for their beliefs (abortion, adoption and same-sex marriage discussed in the video).

http://www.breitbart.com/Big-Government/2014/02/25/Black-Pastors-Call-To-Impeach-Holder-A-Dangerous-Ideologue?utm_source=e_breitbart_com&utm_medium=email&utm_content=Breitbart+News+Roundup%2C+February+26%2C+2014&utm_campaign=20140226_m119349885_Breitbart+News+Roundup%2C+February+26%2C+2014&utm_term=More

BLACK PASTORS CALL TO IMPEACH 'DANGEROUS IDEOLOGUE' ERIC HOLDER

by DR. SUSAN BERRY 25 Feb 2014

The rising ire of a national coalition of black pastors reached a climax Tuesday as the organization announced a campaign to call for the impeachment of Attorney General Eric Holder on the basis that he has violated his oath of office by attempting to impose same-sex marriage throughout the nation
According to a press release, the Coalition of African American Pastors (CAAP) said it will launch a grassroots effort seeking to secure the signatures of one million people calling for Attorney General Eric Holder to be impeached.

The announcement comes on the same day that Holder invited state attorneys general to refuse to defend laws banning same-sex marriage.
Rev. Bill Owens, President of CAAP, said in the statement:
The Attorney General of the United States should be impeached over his repeated lawlessness in attempting to impose same-sex marriage throughout the nation. Its one thing to make a political argument that gay marriage should be the law, but its quite another to take actions that ignore federal law, Supreme Court rulings, and the constitutions of dozens of states that have specifically rejected the redefinition of marriage which the administration is trying to impose.
As much as President Obama and Attorney General Holder would like it to be otherwise, we live in a democracywith government of, by, and for the peoplenot a monarchy ruled by a king issuing decrees from on high. The citizens of several states who have voted overwhelmingly to preserve marriage have had their votes voided and thrown out by radical federal judges, and the Obama administrationin particular the Justice Departmenthas been shamefully complicit in this attack on the rights of those voters.

What we have in Attorney General Holder is a man so political in his zeal to redefine marriage that he is willing to run roughshod over the rulings of the Supreme Court, binding federal law, and the United States Constitution along with the constitutions of a majority of states, Owens added. Yet, our leaders in Washington are letting him get away with his illegal conduct and doing nothing meaningful to hold him accountable.

In a scathing address at the National Press Club on Tuesday announcing the petition, Owens said, In my lifetime, Ive never seen a president as bad as this president.

Owens stated that Obama deceived the American people by announcing that his position on same-sex marriage had evolved.

That is not true. He made the deal with the gay community to let him get elected  his second election  that he would take the issue up, Owens charged. But it was always there; he did not evolve. It was already there because of their commitments of very large sums of money and his relationship with them.
Eric Holder and Mr. Obama  I will respect his office, I dont respect him because hes a deceiver, hes not true, I have no respect for the president, but since he is the president, I will give the dignity of his office respect  they have deceived the people, Owens continued. They want their way like a little baby  our way or no way.

Owens continued:
If you go back to the civil rights movement, they had consensus from both sides of the aisle; they had Republicans and they had Democrats. I think people who really dont know what happened during that time dont realize that it was not just the Democrats, it was the Republicans; as a matter of fact, many southern Democrats were adamantly against the civil rights bill, and I believe the ship was able to reach across the aisle because it was the right thing to do. It was right to give black citizens the right to vote, the right to live the American dream. Now, we dont live the American dream, we live the American nightmare.

Owens said CAAPs campaign is intended to create a groundswell of support, giving Congressional leadership the encouragement necessary to remove this dangerous ideologue from public office.

States have historically defined marriage as the union of one man and one woman, and the majority of states continue to do so, CAAP observed. Thirty states have in fact enacted constitutional amendments to this effect. Furthermore, still binding federal law contained in Section II of the Defense of Marriage Act (DOMA) provides that no state shall be required to recognize same-sex marriages performed in other states.

Owens emphasized that his organization is inviting all citizens, regardless of race or creed to sign the petition, at www.HolderImpeachment.com.


----------



## knitpresentgifts (May 21, 2013)

soloweygirl said:


> She is a reliable liar.


She is that! :thumbup:


----------



## Janet Cooke (Aug 14, 2013)

knitpresentgifts said:


> Hum, I wonder if the Libs will call these united black pastors racists for their beliefs (abortion, adoption and same-sex marriage discussed in the video).
> 
> http://www.breitbart.com/Big-Government/2014/02/25/Black-Pastors-Call-To-Impeach-Holder-A-Dangerous-Ideologue?utm_source=e_breitbart_com&utm_medium=email&utm_content=Breitbart+News+Roundup%2C+February+26%2C+2014&utm_campaign=20140226_m119349885_Breitbart+News+Roundup%2C+February+26%2C+2014&utm_term=More
> 
> Who knows, considering the source the video (you did say it was a video?) would have to be vetted by a reliable outlet.


----------



## knitpresentgifts (May 21, 2013)

Gerslay said:


> I wonder if Cheeky Blighter will identify who did the painting of her cat. If she claims she doesn't know, I do!!
> 
> RSVP!


 :XD: :XD: :XD: :XD: :XD:

She'll tell us _she_ painted that cat!

Wait for it ...


----------



## damemary (Mar 14, 2012)

Yeah Sister. I adore stationery and fountain pens. Put me in a stationery store and I'm in heaven. Sound familiar?



MaidInBedlam said:


> I have a pen and paper fetish. I make no secret of this and hang out with others who lean the same way. I like to shop for new pens and paper and have all sorts of stuff now. And it's really, really hard for me to throw away used up pens...


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## damemary (Mar 14, 2012)

Faro is so cute. I don't have a picture of Ethel Mertz, but I'm checking pictures now. Here kitty kitty.



MaidInBedlam said:


> How do you like my new avatar? That's my cat, Faro, who was moonlighting for an artist. (NOT!! :mrgreen: ) Maybe it's time for some more cat avatars. I really like yours, and have to ask who it is. I'll bet I should already know.


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## knitpresentgifts (May 21, 2013)

damemary said:


> :lol: :lol: :lol: :lol: :lol: :lol: :lol: :lol: :lol: :lol: :lol: Did anyone take an oath to be truthful? This is the Internet you know. Also style of writing varies. At least that's the way I see it.


Nice to know you have no morales, integrity, ethical desires or pride of self.

I've made note of it before and now again since you've confirmed it about yourself while CYB and Cheek's too.

Despicable behavior but not surprising of you or your friends.


----------



## damemary (Mar 14, 2012)

Great voice.



Poor Purl said:


> I still love it. Mama Cass had such a huge talent that maybe she needed a large body just to encompass it. But she's sorely missed.


----------



## Janet Cooke (Aug 14, 2013)

knitpresentgifts said:


> Nice to know you have no morales, integrity, ethical desires or pride of self.
> 
> I've made note of it before and now again since you've confirmed it about yourself while CYB and Cheek's too.
> 
> Despicable behavior but not surprising of you of your friends.


Is that more of that "just trying to have a conversation" you were doing with your questions to me the other day?


----------



## damemary (Mar 14, 2012)

Hi. I'm damemary a compassion junkie. Maybe we should start regular meetings. hugs



Poor Purl said:


> I'm Poor Purl and I'm a compassion junkie. I spoke up for her because she once cried that people were picking on her for the way she wrote and that was unfair because she suffered from seizures that had given her brain damage.
> 
> But she's gotten really nasty lately. I think that cured my addiction.


----------



## Knitted by Nan (Aug 3, 2013)

damemary said:


> I think rescuing animals is one of the most fulfilling things we can do.


I guess you could call it rescuing a cat. I have been feeding my neighbours cat for over nine years now. A beautiful, gentle white cat. I call him Snowdrop but his real name is the Marori word for white man. it begins with p but I cannot spell it. I had him doctored because he was starting to fight with other cats. He is now so gentle with a very quiet meow. He is not an inside cat but will stay inside with my cats for a few hours. He gets on with my two and I know when he is at the door because my two run to the door and start talking to him. He comes night and morning for food and sometimes sleeps in the outside room or on the verandah. Sometimes he does not go home for several days. His owner is a druggie and is often out of his head and forgets to feed snowdrop. I take him to the vet for his shots every year. My daughter loves him and her boys wanted to take him home when he first started to visit but I knew who owned him and could not let them take him home. In hindsight maybe I should have let them, he would have had a better home. He deserves a better owner because he has such a beautiful nature. I could not let the boys take him home though, it would be stealing someone else's cat and that is not a good lesson to teach them.


----------



## damemary (Mar 14, 2012)

OK in small doses.



SQM said:


> More like a fortune cookie. But the idiocy is fun!


----------



## Janet Cooke (Aug 14, 2013)

Poor Purl wrote:
I'm Poor Purl and I'm a compassion junkie. I spoke up for her because she once cried that people were picking on her for the way she wrote and that was unfair because she suffered from seizures that had given her brain damage.

But she's gotten really nasty lately. I think that cured my addiction.



damemary said:


> Hi. I'm damemary a compassion junkie. Maybe we should start regular meetings. hugs


I think I am going to save most of my compassion for people IRL who I can see and read.


----------



## damemary (Mar 14, 2012)

Right as always Janet.



Janet Cooke said:


> I hope you don't hyper extend with that spin.
> Please note *who* feels it is necessary to do the name calling. What is that they say about not having a legitimate argument?


 :idea: :idea: :idea: :idea: :idea: :idea: :idea: :idea: :idea:


----------



## damemary (Mar 14, 2012)

The pig wants to wrestle again. I say, go fly pig.



Poor Purl said:


> Why bother? Consider the source.


----------



## damemary (Mar 14, 2012)

The affect is the same.



Janet Cooke said:


> You're right, I was just made excitable by the PM I received asking if KPG was the same person as Knit Crazy.


----------



## damemary (Mar 14, 2012)

And we don't care. If a pig does, go oink elsewhere.



Janet Cooke said:


> Gee, could I be reading a post that says that regardless of what people do only you can do right?
> If I pass on by then I am changing the subject rather than addressing it and if I talk about it I am covering for Cheeky?
> 
> It is a picture of a cat. With as many lies as you have been caught in here if that weren't her cat, it would fall someone about 999,999,999 in the list behind yours.


----------



## Janet Cooke (Aug 14, 2013)

EveMCooke said:


> I guess you could call it rescuing a cat. I have been feeding my neighbours cat for over nine years now. A beautiful, gentle white cat. I call him Snowdrop but his real name is the Marori word for white man. it begins with p but I cannot spell it. I had him doctored because he was starting to fight with other cats. He is now so gentle with a very quiet meow. He is not an inside cat but will stay inside with my cats for a few hours. He gets on with my two and I know when he is at the door because my two run to the door and start talking to him. He comes night and morning for food and sometimes sleeps in the outside room or on the verandah. Sometimes he does not go home for several days. His owner is a druggie and is often out of his head and forgets to feed snowdrop. I take him to the vet for his shots every year. My daughter loves him and her boys wanted to take him home when he first started to visit but I knew who owned him and could not let them take him home. In hindsight maybe I should have let them, he would have had a better home. He deserves a better owner because he has such a beautiful nature. I could not let the boys take him home though, it would be stealing someone else's cat and that is not a good lesson to teach them.


That counts in my book.


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## damemary (Mar 14, 2012)

Let's see. If someone states that they do not lie in bold, we are supposed to accept it. If they invent a convoluted idea about someone they don't like, we are supposed to accept it. 

No one does. It's rather amusing to see a pig twisting in the wind.


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## knitpresentgifts (May 21, 2013)

Janet Cooke said:


> Is that more of that "just trying to have a conversation" you were doing with your questions to me the other day?


I didn't ask Damemary anything, didn't you notice?

As far as conversing with you. I asked you questions, you refused to answer them.

You asked me questions, I answered or ask you for clarification of what you were asking as I didn't understand your ?. You never responded.

For example, you asked me a ? about the "league" I'm in (according to you). I asked you to clarify what you meant by that and never heard from you again.

I asked you on many occasions to prove me in "all the lies you claim I post," yet you have never once proved me to be a liar or respond at all.

I even ignore all the names you call me to my face or while responding to others.

Yet, you clam up and refuse to engage in any conversation.

All conversations end when you don't respond. Don't you know that?


----------



## damemary (Mar 14, 2012)

You shared Miss Molly's picture and didn't say anything else.



Janeway said:


> Well, are you finally being nice to me???? Me thinks the "sky" is falling!


----------



## damemary (Mar 14, 2012)

<<<<whispering....says the unreliable and non-truthful #1 source of all time.>>>>>>



knitpresentgifts said:


> True - Vocal J. Blighter is not a reliable or truthful source.


----------



## damemary (Mar 14, 2012)

susanmos2000 said:


> Sounds like a challenge I simply can't let slip by...
> 
> How about this little gem (addressed to me on January 29):
> 
> KPG: You have already begged me to return multiple times; no reason for you to repeat yourself but you will anyway, or talk about it even though no one cares.


 :XD: :XD: :XD: :XD: :XD: :XD: :XD: :XD: :XD: :XD: :XD: :XD: :XD: :XD: :XD: :XD: :XD: :XD: :XD: :XD: :XD: :XD: :XD: :XD: :XD: :XD: :XD: :XD: :XD: :XD:


----------



## damemary (Mar 14, 2012)

I thought it was the pig who wants to wrestle.



susanmos2000 said:


> So true, Janet. A skunk with its stripe painted over still reeks--there's simply no hiding it.


----------



## knitpresentgifts (May 21, 2013)

damemary said:


> <<<<whispering....says the unreliable and non-truthful #1 source of all time.>>>>>>


PROVE IT! Just because you repeat it, doesn't make it true.

Ask NJG, she'll tell you the same and that you are a hypocrite for your words.


----------



## Janet Cooke (Aug 14, 2013)

knitpresentgifts said:


> I didn't ask Damemary anything, didn't you notice?
> 
> As far as conversing with you. I asked you questions, you refused to answer them.
> 
> ...


Nice edit.


----------



## Janeway (Nov 22, 2011)

damemary said:


> :lol: :lol: :lol: :lol: :lol: :lol: :lol: :lol: :lol: :lol: :lol: Did anyone take an oath to be truthful? This is the Internet you know. Also style of writing varies. At least that's the way I see it.


Oh, yea!


----------



## damemary (Mar 14, 2012)

You got it Patty. "I am not a crook." Tricky Dick.



BrattyPatty said:


> She is pulling the 'Nixon" again. Of course she has lied. It should read "I have never spoken the truth".


----------



## knitpresentgifts (May 21, 2013)

Janet Cooke said:


> Nice edit.


Where?

Let's talk, Janet.


----------



## knitpresentgifts (May 21, 2013)

Janeway said:


> Oh, yea!


Brilliant!


----------



## knitpresentgifts (May 21, 2013)

Come on Janet, I don't have all day to wait for your response to continue a conversation.


----------



## Janeway (Nov 22, 2011)

damemary said:


> You shared Miss Molly's picture and didn't say anything else.


Here we go again, I wasn't speaking to you my dear--it was MIB or Seattle as she was once known.


----------



## damemary (Mar 14, 2012)

EXACTLY! And that nonsense, although amusing at times, keeps us from discussing real issues.

Thanks Purl.



Poor Purl said:


> The problem is that lying about owning a cat is one thing; lying about the ACA is another. The first won't influence anyone to do anything; the second may influence someone who could use it to avoid it.


----------



## damemary (Mar 14, 2012)

I painted Conan while we were visiting last year.


----------



## Janeway (Nov 22, 2011)

knitpresentgifts said:


> Brilliant!


Oh, I do love pictures as they say it all!


----------



## VocalLisa (Jan 4, 2014)

Gerslay said:


> Amen and Amen!
> 
> The Buddha was searching for enlightenment...Jesus IS the ENLIGHTENMENT!


This is the problem, when people who are so OBVIOUSLY unenlightened "speaks for Jesus" as The Enlightenment, it sort of screws over Jesus in the process.


----------



## damemary (Mar 14, 2012)

Janet, I don't think KPG likes me.



Janet Cooke said:


> Is that more of that "just trying to have a conversation" you were doing with your questions to me the other day?


----------



## knitpresentgifts (May 21, 2013)

Yep, Janet, just as I said.

You have no backbone to engage in a legitimate conversation.

You are on KP nearly 14/7 and on-line as I type this, yet while you say you want a conversation, you are a chicken and won't respond after ten minutes have gone by, and still you refuse to speak when I just agreed to talk to you.

I asked a simple ? - "what edit" and you cannot even answer that simpleton question.

You are here to insult folks whenever they are not available. Nothing more. 

Weak game and weak character trait, Janet.


----------



## Gerslay (Oct 4, 2011)

Someone is fishing but I aint' biting!


----------



## damemary (Mar 14, 2012)

EveMCooke said:


> I guess you could call it rescuing a cat. I have been feeding my neighbours cat for over nine years now. A beautiful, gentle white cat. I call him Snowdrop but his real name is the Marori word for white man. it begins with p but I cannot spell it. I had him doctored because he was starting to fight with other cats. He is now so gentle with a very quiet meow. He is not an inside cat but will stay inside with my cats for a few hours. He gets on with my two and I know when he is at the door because my two run to the door and start talking to him. He comes night and morning for food and sometimes sleeps in the outside room or on the verandah. Sometimes he does not go home for several days. His owner is a druggie and is often out of his head and forgets to feed snowdrop. I take him to the vet for his shots every year. My daughter loves him and her boys wanted to take him home when he first started to visit but I knew who owned him and could not let them take him home. In hindsight maybe I should have let them, he would have had a better home. He deserves a better owner because he has such a beautiful nature. I could not let the boys take him home though, it would be stealing someone else's cat and that is not a good lesson to teach them.


I'm not sure I agree Eve, but you do the best you can for him.


----------



## Janeway (Nov 22, 2011)

damemary said:


> I painted Conan while we were visiting last year.


I don't remember a visit from you, but here is what I made since I haven't been posting on any Lefties site--enjoy!


----------



## knitpresentgifts (May 21, 2013)

Gerslay said:


> Someone is fishing but I aint' biting!


They couldn't bait a hook if you paid them to!

Bluck, pluck, bluck, pluck, pluck!


----------



## knitpresentgifts (May 21, 2013)

Gerslay, Notice the persons who have nothing to say until and unless they can insult a non-Lib, particularly if the non-Lib isn't on-line?


----------



## VocalLisa (Jan 4, 2014)

knitpresentgifts said:


> True - Vocal J. Blighter is not a reliable or truthful source.


She was speaking of you. Once again, you either are lying and pretending you didn't know that, or you're just really that astoundingly stupid.


----------



## knitpresentgifts (May 21, 2013)

Time is up, chicken little. Ninteen minutes is too long for you to remain quiet. You don't want a conversation.

Can't say I didn't try; no one, including me, wants your blood pressure to go up any higher.

I'll log off so you can start insulting folks again.


----------



## VocalLisa (Jan 4, 2014)

KPG said:


> Wow, Vocal Jody ___, do you get royalties every time "Conan" appears on the internet?
> 
> BTW: Who did the original painting? I've seen the painting on Pinterest of your cat, but credit to the artist isn't acknowledged.
> 
> ...


I haven't visited this thread in a number of days, can someone please tell me what this Conan cat is?


----------



## Janeway (Nov 22, 2011)

EveMCooke said:


> I guess you could call it rescuing a cat. I have been feeding my neighbours cat for over nine years now. A beautiful, gentle white cat. I call him Snowdrop but his real name is the Marori word for white man. it begins with p but I cannot spell it. I had him doctored because he was starting to fight with other cats. He is now so gentle with a very quiet meow. He is not an inside cat but will stay inside with my cats for a few hours. He gets on with my two and I know when he is at the door because my two run to the door and start talking to him. He comes night and morning for food and sometimes sleeps in the outside room or on the verandah. Sometimes he does not go home for several days. His owner is a druggie and is often out of his head and forgets to feed snowdrop. I take him to the vet for his shots every year. My daughter loves him and her boys wanted to take him home when he first started to visit but I knew who owned him and could not let them take him home. In hindsight maybe I should have let them, he would have had a better home. He deserves a better owner because he has such a beautiful nature. I could not let the boys take him home though, it would be stealing someone else's cat and that is not a good lesson to teach them.


What a wonderful thing to do for the cat. Someone should tell the cops about the drug use by the neighbor as they might get dangerous when out of drugs!


----------



## Janeway (Nov 22, 2011)

EveMcooke, these are for you to enjoy.


----------



## Gerslay (Oct 4, 2011)

Janeway said:


> I don't remember a visit from you, but here is what I made since I haven't been posting on any Lefties site--enjoy!


Beautiful work Janeway!


----------



## Gerslay (Oct 4, 2011)

KNG...I'll have to check the roster and see who's missing.


----------



## Janet Cooke (Aug 14, 2013)

Good, what do you or have you not understood about me having absolutely no interest in you as a person?


----------



## Janeway (Nov 22, 2011)

Gerslay said:


> Beautiful work Janeway!


Thank you!


----------



## knitpresentgifts (May 21, 2013)

Gerslay said:


> KNG...I'll have to check the roster and see who's missing.


PM me, I'll fill you in.


----------



## Janet Cooke (Aug 14, 2013)

VocalLisa said:


> She was speaking of you. Once again, you either are lying and pretending you didn't know that, or you're just really that astoundingly stupid.


I didn't check to see if anyone answered you yet. 
Cheeky either did or did not use a cat (well, she did do that)as an avatar and said or did not say (that is the part I am not sure of) that the cat was actually hers. Conan is the cat's name. 
Anyway, the compulsive rightie dug up all of those links to show that Cheeky doesn't really own said cat in her avatar. 
And on and on goes the circus.

I hear there is a shortage of clowns in this country, can't tell me that is true.


----------



## Janet Cooke (Aug 14, 2013)

Chit, she just promised to go away, didn't she?


----------



## Gerslay (Oct 4, 2011)

Janet Cooke said:


> Good, what do you or have you not understood about me having absolutely no interest in you as a person?


Good timing JC...popped on just when the clock ran down.


----------



## knitpresentgifts (May 21, 2013)

Janet Cooke said:


> Good, what do you or have you not understood about me having absolutely no interest in you as a person?


Is this a question to me? Because you have repeatedly said you have no interest in me or my posts, yet you keep talking to or about me when I'm not on-line. Recently, you said you would like to engage in conversation, yet you won't.

Is this you trying to start a conversation only more than twenty minutes when I told you I'm logging off and did?

Here's a conversation starter for you, Janet.

How do you feel about covering for Cheeky Blighter, and yet, while both of you are on-line at the same time in the same thread, Cheeky didn't cover nor defend you? How do you feel about that?


----------



## knitpresentgifts (May 21, 2013)

VocalLisa said:


> She was speaking of you. Once again, you either are lying and pretending you didn't know that, or you're just really that astoundingly stupid.


Once again, you are lying or pretending you don't know who each of us were speaking of. You are not that stupid so drop the act because you are not good at acting either.


----------



## knitpresentgifts (May 21, 2013)

VocalLisa said:


> I haven't visited this thread in a number of days, can someone please tell me what this Conan cat is?


Look at your avatar file.


----------



## knitpresentgifts (May 21, 2013)

Janet Cooke said:


> Good, what do you or have you not understood about me having absolutely no interest in you as a person?


Twenty seven minutes later - chicken.


----------



## knitpresentgifts (May 21, 2013)

Janet Cooke said:


> Chit, she just promised to go away, didn't she?


Chicken Little, liar, vulgar - so conversational too!


----------



## knitpresentgifts (May 21, 2013)

Gerslay said:


> Good timing JC...popped on just when the clock ran down.


Can you believe her?

On 2nd thought, I can.


----------



## knitpresentgifts (May 21, 2013)

Gerslay - let's blow this joint  it's a den of thieves.


----------



## Gerslay (Oct 4, 2011)

Doin the ole skedaddle.....!


----------



## Janet Cooke (Aug 14, 2013)

3 minutes and counting


----------



## damemary (Mar 14, 2012)

Janet Cooke said:


> I didn't check to see if anyone answered you yet.
> Cheeky either did or did not use a cat (well, she did do that)as an avatar and said or did not say (that is the part I am not sure of) that the cat was actually hers. Conan is the cat's name.
> Anyway, the compulsive rightie dug up all of those links to show that Cheeky doesn't really own said cat in her avatar.
> And on and on goes the circus.
> ...


And what does it matter any whoooooo?


----------



## damemary (Mar 14, 2012)

Off to dinner. Bazinga.


----------



## Janet Cooke (Aug 14, 2013)

damemary said:


> And what does it matter any whoooooo?


Well no, of course not. VocalLisa asked so I answered. 
LOL, careful, some whackadoodles will storm in claiming we are tearing each other apart.


----------



## Poor Purl (Apr 14, 2011)

Janeway said:


> Oh, yea!


Janeway, you seem to have an unlimited collection of funny pictures.

You know the saying about monkeys typing Hamlet? Maybe that's what's going on in this picture.


----------



## Janet Cooke (Aug 14, 2013)

damemary said:


> Off to dinner. Bazinga.


Cute kitty.


----------



## cookiequeen (Jun 15, 2011)

This whole cat thing is so ridiculous. I have SEEN Conan, and he looks just like that picture.

On the other hand, I have never SEEN that mop of KPG.


----------



## Poor Purl (Apr 14, 2011)

VocalLisa said:


> This is the problem, when people who are so OBVIOUSLY unenlightened "speaks for Jesus" as The Enlightenment, it sort of screws over Jesus in the process.


That's certainly a problem. What would he be rolling over in after reading what Guernsey just wrote?


----------



## Janet Cooke (Aug 14, 2013)

alcameron said:


> This whole cat thing is so ridiculous. I have SEEN Coman, and he looks just like that picture.
> 
> On the other hand, I have never SEEN that mop of KPG.


Once upon a time we had a cat that looked very similar to that, it was six toed, though.


----------



## Poor Purl (Apr 14, 2011)

VocalLisa said:


> I haven't visited this thread in a number of days, can someone please tell me what this Conan cat is?


And while you're doing that for Lisa, could you please tell me where I asked whose cat that was and who painted it. Unless I've been overtaken by someone from the spirit world, that never happened.


----------



## knitpresentgifts (May 21, 2013)

damemary said:


> And what does it matter any whoooooo?


That's a good girl, cover your friend's lie.

Nice kitty...


----------



## cookiequeen (Jun 15, 2011)

Is anyone old enough to remember this? 

It's raining, it's pouring
The old man is snoring
He went to bed and bumped his head
And wouldn't get up in the morning

Maybe our hills will turn green. This is exciting! And they said we might even get thunder!


----------



## Poor Purl (Apr 14, 2011)

Janet Cooke said:


> I didn't check to see if anyone answered you yet.
> Cheeky either did or did not use a cat (well, she did do that)as an avatar and said or did not say (that is the part I am not sure of) that the cat was actually hers. Conan is the cat's name.
> Anyway, the compulsive rightie dug up all of those links to show that Cheeky doesn't really own said cat in her avatar.
> And on and on goes the circus.
> ...


Who gives a F..... F... whether Cheeky owns that cat or another one or none at all? Only the ladies of FF.


----------



## knitpresentgifts (May 21, 2013)

alcameron said:


> This whole cat thing is so ridiculous. I have SEEN Conan, and he looks just like that picture.
> 
> On the other hand, I have never SEEN that mop of KPG.


Probably, but that image was NOT of Conan, was NOT Cheeks cat and does NOT live in Cheeks house and Cheeks lied about the entire avatar.

Just a run of lies by Cheeks and YOU know it.

You only come on KP to defend your buds and insult me.

Hilarious!


----------



## cookiequeen (Jun 15, 2011)

knitpresentgifts said:


> That's a good girl, cover your friend's lie.
> 
> Nice kitty...


But nobody can cover the vile words that come out of your mouth, can they?


----------



## knitpresentgifts (May 21, 2013)

Poor Purl said:


> And while you're doing that for Lisa, could you please tell me where I asked whose cat that was and who painted it. Unless I've been overtaken by someone from the spirit world, that never happened.


No one said you did question those things; I think you're hearing things again.


----------



## Poor Purl (Apr 14, 2011)

Janet Cooke said:


> 3 minutes and counting


Shivering in your shoes, right?


----------



## Poor Purl (Apr 14, 2011)

damemary said:


> Off to dinner. Bazinga.


Enjoy your dinner.


----------



## knitpresentgifts (May 21, 2013)

Poor Purl said:


> Who gives a F..... F... whether Cheeky owns that cat or another one or none at all? Only the ladies of FF.


Why are you bringing up FF? I thought you say all the time you don't read my posts or that thread. How is it then, you can respond to that which I write and what is discussed in that thread.

Shall I expose your lies too?

Uh, the horrors.


----------



## knitpresentgifts (May 21, 2013)

Poor Purl said:


> Enjoy your dinner.


Thank you, I did while waiting for Chicken Little to converse.

Chicken & vegetable curry over rice - delish!


----------



## cookiequeen (Jun 15, 2011)

knitpresentgifts said:


> Probably, but that image was NOT of Conan, was NOT Cheeks cat and does NOT live in Cheeks house and Cheeks lied about the entire avatar.
> 
> Just a run of lies by Cheeks and YOU know it.
> 
> ...


You insult yourself AND your friends by your constant name-calling and obnoxious behavior. I haven't been here much, but every time I come onto KP there you are, with your same nasty tongue and officious manner. You wouldn't be insulted if you learned how to "speak" to people. You're such a child!


----------



## Gerslay (Oct 4, 2011)

alcameron said:


> But nobody can cover the vile words that come out of your mouth, can they?


Thems fightin words, alcameron,...nothing vile about them. There's a difference, doncha know?


----------



## Poor Purl (Apr 14, 2011)

Janet Cooke said:


> Once upon a time we had a cat that looked very similar to that, it was six toed, though.


Did you know that Ernest Hemingway collected hypertoed cats? He even left part of his estate to care for them.


----------



## susanmos2000 (May 10, 2011)

knitpresentgifts said:


> Why are you bringing up FF? I thought you say all the time you don't read my posts or that thread. How is it then, you can respond to that which I write and what is discussed in that thread.
> 
> Shall I expose your lies and identity too?
> 
> Uh, the horrors.


Are you threatening her, KPG?


----------



## Poor Purl (Apr 14, 2011)

alcameron said:


> Is anyone old enough to remember this?
> 
> It's raining, it's pouring
> The old man is snoring
> ...


It's really raining? Hope it keeps up for a couple of days.

How's your Gene Kelly imitation?


----------



## Janet Cooke (Aug 14, 2013)

Poor Purl said:


> And while you're doing that for Lisa, could you please tell me where I asked whose cat that was and who painted it. Unless I've been overtaken by someone from the spirit world, that never happened.


Sorry, no can do.


----------



## Janet Cooke (Aug 14, 2013)

Poor Purl said:


> Did you know that Ernest Hemingway collected hypertoed cats? He even left part of his estate to care for them.


Yup, been to the house... twice even. 
It is a nice little cottage with lots and lots of cats. 
Must be lots and lots of staff as well. It didn't have cat box odor.


----------



## cookiequeen (Jun 15, 2011)

Gerslay said:


> Thems fightin words, alcameron,...nothing vile about them. There's a difference, doncha know?


Anyone who runs around calling everyone who disagrees with her fool, loony, and other degrading terms and turns around and quotes the Bible is not a good example of anything Christian.
And, no, I'm not going back to quote all her actual sentences. They're all there for you and everyone else to see. 
Anyone who flaunts her Christianity all over the place should try to live up to his/her beliefs.


----------



## Poor Purl (Apr 14, 2011)

EveMCooke said:


> I guess you could call it rescuing a cat. I have been feeding my neighbours cat for over nine years now. A beautiful, gentle white cat. I call him Snowdrop but his real name is the Marori word for white man. it begins with p but I cannot spell it. I had him doctored because he was starting to fight with other cats. He is now so gentle with a very quiet meow. He is not an inside cat but will stay inside with my cats for a few hours. He gets on with my two and I know when he is at the door because my two run to the door and start talking to him. He comes night and morning for food and sometimes sleeps in the outside room or on the verandah. Sometimes he does not go home for several days. His owner is a druggie and is often out of his head and forgets to feed snowdrop. I take him to the vet for his shots every year. My daughter loves him and her boys wanted to take him home when he first started to visit but I knew who owned him and could not let them take him home. In hindsight maybe I should have let them, he would have had a better home. He deserves a better owner because he has such a beautiful nature. I could not let the boys take him home though, it would be stealing someone else's cat and that is not a good lesson to teach them.


I think you may have saved his life, probably more than once. I'd call that rescuing.


----------



## Janet Cooke (Aug 14, 2013)

alcameron said:


> Is anyone old enough to remember this?
> 
> It's raining, it's pouring
> The old man is snoring
> ...


Rain, Rain, Go awaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaayyyyyy, Come again another day!


----------



## cookiequeen (Jun 15, 2011)

Poor Purl said:


> It's really raining? Hope it keeps up for a couple of days.
> 
> How's your Gene Kelly imitation?


I'm standing at my patio door tapping and singing in the rain.


----------



## SQM (Jun 22, 2012)

knitpresentgifts said:


> Hey Dimwit; I *read* the news article in the Sri Lanka newspaper. I'm the one who posted the five links, remember? Re-read the article you posted which I've now placeds in italics for everyone.
> 
> The author, as I stated prior, *DID NOT* give the name of her/his pet nor claim the image of the cat as her/his OWN, LIKE CHEEKY did.
> 
> ...


if this is all that is on your mind, then I would suggest get a life. Who cares about someone's avatar? Please discuss something of relevance.


----------



## cookiequeen (Jun 15, 2011)

SQM said:


> if this is all that is on your mind, then I would suggest get a life. Who cares about someone's avatar? Please discuss something of relevance.


Oh, thank you for posting that.
"Dimwit." I forgot all the niceties she used..


----------



## Gerslay (Oct 4, 2011)

Wherefore art thou o`blighter?

C'mon out and play...tell us the story about Conan...again!


----------



## susanmos2000 (May 10, 2011)

Gerslay said:


> Wherefore art thou o`blighter?
> 
> C'mon out and play...tell us the story about Conan...again!


Best head back to the barn, Guernsey. I think it's milking time.


----------



## Janet Cooke (Aug 14, 2013)

Gerslay said:


> Wherefore art thou o`blighter?
> 
> C'mon out and play...tell us the story about Conan...again!


Yes, indeed, the time allotted for this diversion is almost over. What is the next plan to distract from that volume everyone who is openminded wanted to hear about and discuss?


----------



## Poor Purl (Apr 14, 2011)

susanmos2000 said:


> Are you threatening her, KPG?


Is that me you're asking about. I know I used the phrase F..... F... in a message. I hope I don't have to explain it. Then when I looked at it I noticed the coincidence, so I put in FF.

Do you think I'm dead to her, too? Like you?


----------



## Gerslay (Oct 4, 2011)

susanmos2000 said:


> Best head back to the barn, Guernsey. I think it's milking time.


Meoooow!


----------



## Poor Purl (Apr 14, 2011)

Janet Cooke said:


> Yup, been to the house... twice even.
> It is a nice little cottage with lots and lots of cats.
> Must be lots and lots of staff as well. It didn't have cat box odor.


Wow, I'm envious. I didn't know about it until the NYTimes had a piece on it. Where is it?


----------



## knitpresentgifts (May 21, 2013)

Gerslay said:


> Thems fightin words, alcameron,...nothing vile about them. There's a difference, doncha know?


She is just and only a bully. Read her posts, you'll be disgusted.


----------



## cookiequeen (Jun 15, 2011)

Poor Purl said:


> Wow, I'm envious. I didn't know about it until the NYTimes had a piece on it. Where is it?


I have to admit to being happily cat-deprived. Are cats with too many toes quite common?


----------



## cookiequeen (Jun 15, 2011)

knitpresentgifts said:


> She is just and only a bully. Read her posts, you'll be disgusted.


Gerslay, read HER posts. You'll be even more disgusted.


----------



## knitpresentgifts (May 21, 2013)

Gerslay said:


> Meoooow!


I've decided to start down a new road, Gerslay.

Changed my avatar too, to change my image.


----------



## cookiequeen (Jun 15, 2011)

The flowers in my avatar are my flowers.


----------



## susanmos2000 (May 10, 2011)

Poor Purl said:


> Is that me you're asking about. I know I used the phrase F..... F... in a message. I hope I don't have to explain it. Then when I looked at it I noticed the coincidence, so I put in FF.
> 
> Do you think I'm dead to her, too? Like you?


Actually it was you I was referring to. KPG asked if you wanted her to expose your "lies and identity", and I took that as a threat. As so often happens, she's about to take things too far and self-destruct. I'm awaitin'.


----------



## knitpresentgifts (May 21, 2013)

SQM said:


> if this is all that is on your mind, then I would suggest get a life. Who cares about someone's avatar? Please discuss something of relevance.


Not on my mind at all. It was on the mind of first, Poor Purl and then Cheeks.

You're correct; I just changed my avatar for a new outlook on the road of life.

P.S. I tried for nearly twenty-five minutes to converse with Janet, but she wouldn't have it, even though she said she was interested.


----------



## Janet Cooke (Aug 14, 2013)

Poor Purl said:


> Wow, I'm envious. I didn't know about it until the NYTimes had a piece on it. Where is it?


Key West, which despite all the drunks I just adore.


----------



## Janet Cooke (Aug 14, 2013)

knitpresentgifts said:


> Not on my mind at all. It was on the mind of first, Poor Purl and then Cheeks.
> 
> You're correct; I just changed my avatar for a new outlook on the road of life.
> 
> P.S. I tried for nearly twenty-five minutes to converse with Janet, but she wouldn't have it, even though she said she was interested.


I know that you are really good at those archives, you want to show me the passage that you think means I wanted to have a conversation, any conversation with you?


----------



## Poor Purl (Apr 14, 2011)

SQM said:


> if this is all that is on your mind, then I would suggest get a life. Who cares about someone's avatar? Please discuss something of relevance.


Did she really write that? I can't for the life of me figure out what difference it makes whose cat it is or whether Cheeky lied about owning it. It's a really nice-looking cat, and I'm sure Conan is, too.

A tale told by an idiot, full of sound and fury, signifying nothing.


----------



## knitpresentgifts (May 21, 2013)

Janet Cooke said:


> Yes, indeed, the time allotted for this diversion is almost over. What is the next plan to distract from that volume everyone who is openminded wanted to hear about and discuss?


You still interested in a discussion?

You start.


----------



## Janet Cooke (Aug 14, 2013)

alcameron said:


> The flowers in my avatar are my flowers.


Very good, I can do that.
Good bye, Mary Bethune.


----------



## SQM (Jun 22, 2012)

knitpresentgifts said:


> I've decided to start down a new road, Gerslay.
> 
> Changed my avatar too, to change my image.


But why would you boast about who you are when you are mostly irrational and unpleasant, KGB?


----------



## knitpresentgifts (May 21, 2013)

OK, already, my friends. Enough PMs!

I'll go back to "me" since you don't recognize me with my new avatar.

There, I'm back.


----------



## Poor Purl (Apr 14, 2011)

alcameron said:


> I have to admit to being happily cat-deprived. Are cats with too many toes quite common?


Not that I know of, but I think most cats are mutants, and that's one form of mutation. More common forms are mind-melding ability, flying, and using an alternate dimension to get out of a locked room.


----------



## Poor Purl (Apr 14, 2011)

susanmos2000 said:


> Actually it was you I was referring to. KPG asked if you wanted her to expose your "lies and identity", and I took that as a threat. As so often happens, she's about to take things too far and self-destruct. I'm awaitin'.


Expose my lies and identity? She thinks everything I've ever said is a lie. And if she's bothered to hunt down my identity, she really has too much free time.


----------



## Gerslay (Oct 4, 2011)

knitpresentgifts said:


> I've decided to start down a new road, Gerslay.
> 
> Changed my avatar too, to change my image.


Oh phooey...I went for dinner and missed it


----------



## Poor Purl (Apr 14, 2011)

Janet Cooke said:


> Key West, which despite all the drunks I just adore.


I've never been to Florida, despite the fact that I've been invited down many times. I can't imagine going to a place that's always too warm.

But you just made it sound nice.


----------



## SQM (Jun 22, 2012)

Gerslay said:


> Oh phooey...I went for dinner and missed it


Do you live in assisted living, Sister G? If so, I will be more respectful of an older woman with a probable rollator.


----------



## Poor Purl (Apr 14, 2011)

SQM said:


> But why would you boast about who you are when you are mostly irrational and unpleasant, KGB?


She must have gotten complaints about the fact that her temporary avatar used God's description of himself to Moses: God said to Moses, "I AM WHO I AM. This is what you are to say to the Israelites: 'I AM has sent me to you.'"

Narcissism run wild.


----------



## damemary (Mar 14, 2012)

The extra toe(s) cats are quite common in Key West Florida coming from a strain beloved by Ernest Hemingway.

Some people are definitely NOT cat people. Others are wild about them. Most people are probably in the middle somewhere.



Poor Purl said:


> Not that I know of, but I think most cats are mutants, and that's one form of mutation. More common forms are mind-melding ability, flying, and using an alternate dimension to get out of a locked room.


----------



## damemary (Mar 14, 2012)

I prefer AZ for the mountains but I've always wanted to see the Florida Keys.



Poor Purl said:


> I've never been to Florida, despite the fact that I've been invited down many times. I can't imagine going to a place that's always too warm.
> 
> But you just made it sound nice.


----------



## Poor Purl (Apr 14, 2011)

Gerslay said:


> Oh phooey...I went for dinner and missed it


Unfortunately, I didn't. I don't remember what the pictures were but the words were "I am who I am," just the way God referred to himself when Moses asked. Most people who think they're God are institutionalized, but you befriend them.


----------



## SQM (Jun 22, 2012)

So the Jewish god does koens. Interesting. She was the first jewbu.


----------



## Janet Cooke (Aug 14, 2013)

damemary said:


> The extra toe(s) cats are quite common in Key West Florida coming from a strain beloved by Ernest Hemingway.
> 
> Some people are definitely NOT cat people. Others are wild about them. Most people are probably in the middle somewhere.


And I prefer to think recessive gene instead of mutant. 
Mutant reminds me of comic books not Hemingway. 
Then again, Hemingway could have been a really nasty KP member.


----------



## Janet Cooke (Aug 14, 2013)

SQM said:


> So the Jewish god does koens. Interesting. She was the first jewbu.


Kegels?


----------



## Janet Cooke (Aug 14, 2013)

Poor Purl said:


> Unfortunately, I didn't. I don't remember what the pictures were but the words were "I am who I am," just the way God referred to himself when Moses asked. Most people who think they're God are institutionalized, but you befriend them.


It was quite a jarring image.


----------



## damemary (Mar 14, 2012)

Gov. Jan Brewer of AZ has just vetoed Bill 1060 regarding religious freedom balancing non-discrimination of LGTG. She decided that the bill was not addressing an existing problem in the state. The feeling is that RW lobby was trying to flex its power. Just my opinion.


----------



## Gerslay (Oct 4, 2011)

SQM said:


> Do you live in assisted living, Sister G? If so, I will be more respectful of an older woman with a probable rollator.


How thoughtful of you...if I need one may I borrow yours?


----------



## SQM (Jun 22, 2012)

I forget that my precious Cooke is not Jewish or Buddhist. A koen is a zen riddle. A Jewbu is a Jewish person who practices Buddhism.

A kugel is a Jewish food.

A kegel is what I should be doing, but don't since I have no reason to.


----------



## damemary (Mar 14, 2012)

Poor Purl said:


> Did she really write that? I can't for the life of me figure out what difference it makes whose cat it is or whether Cheeky lied about owning it. It's a really nice-looking cat, and I'm sure Conan is, too.
> 
> A tale told by an idiot, full of sound and fury, signifying nothing.


 :XD: :XD: :XD: :XD: :XD: To the point as always Purl.


----------



## theyarnlady (Feb 25, 2011)

No name
Oh woe is me and to think no name was every so kind to me and now I am not in her good graces. How sad I feel.

But must correct another of no name lies never cried no name we must have truth now must we not. 

I am so sad to think you are not my friend oh woe is me. Guess what am not crying.

you have a nice night now won't you.

Your Buddy and Pal,

Schizoid Vagrant/ Yarn Face.


----------



## damemary (Mar 14, 2012)

I know you don't mean to insult children.



alcameron said:


> You insult yourself AND your friends by your constant name-calling and obnoxious behavior. I haven't been here much, but every time I come onto KP there you are, with your same nasty tongue and officious manner. You wouldn't be insulted if you learned how to "speak" to people. You're such a child!


----------



## SQM (Jun 22, 2012)

damemary said:


> Gov. Jan Brewer of AZ has just vetoed Bill 1060 regarding religious freedom balancing non-discrimination of LGTG. She decided that the bill was not addressing an existing problem in the state. The feeling is that RW lobby was trying to flex its power. Just my opinion.


Thank Thor. Big business was putting great pressure on her. Thank Zeus that big business took the ethical stand.


----------



## damemary (Mar 14, 2012)

I'm singing. I'm singing in the rain. Get your bumbershoot ready. (Does anyone else use 'bumbershoot?')



Poor Purl said:


> It's really raining? Hope it keeps up for a couple of days.
> 
> How's your Gene Kelly imitation?


----------



## Janet Cooke (Aug 14, 2013)

damemary said:


> Gov. Jan Brewer of AZ has just vetoed Bill 1060 regarding religious freedom balancing non-discrimination of LGTG. She decided that the bill was not addressing an existing problem in the state. The feeling is that RW lobby was trying to flex its power. Just my opinion.


WOOHOO, I figured that she would veto. It is a relief that she did it now rather than waiting the week out.


----------



## SQM (Jun 22, 2012)

Gerslay said:


> How thoughtful of you...if I need one may I borrow yours?


Actually I can borrow my neighbor's who seems to have a wardrobe of them, if you should require one.

If you really are in need of one, get the genuine rollator and not the walker with tennis balls. I imagine you are too chic for that.


----------



## Janet Cooke (Aug 14, 2013)

theyarnlady said:


> No name
> Oh woe is me and to think no name was every so kind to me and now I am not in her good graces. How sad I feel.
> 
> But must correct another of no name lies never cried no name we must have truth now must we not.
> ...


 ;-)


----------



## Poor Purl (Apr 14, 2011)

SQM said:


> So the Jewish god does koens. Interesting. She was the first jewbu.


It took me a minute to figure this out. If you'd said "koans," I would have gotten it right off.

Very funny.


----------



## damemary (Mar 14, 2012)

I learned long ago, never wrestle with a pig. You get dirty and the pig likes it. George Bernard Shaw



alcameron said:


> Anyone who runs around calling everyone who disagrees with her fool, loony, and other degrading terms and turns around and quotes the Bible is not a good example of anything Christian.
> And, no, I'm not going back to quote all her actual sentences. They're all there for you and everyone else to see.
> Anyone who flaunts her Christianity all over the place should try to live up to his/her beliefs.


----------



## SQM (Jun 22, 2012)

woe is me

Should read Woe is I.

But that was the least idiotic part of your post.


----------



## damemary (Mar 14, 2012)

Or, just shut up. That will work even better.



SQM said:


> if this is all that is on your mind, then I would suggest get a life. Who cares about someone's avatar? Please discuss something of relevance.


----------



## SQM (Jun 22, 2012)

Poor Purl said:


> It took me a minute to figure this out. If you'd said "koans," I would have gotten it right off.
> 
> Very funny.


Did I spell it wrong? So sorry.


----------



## Janet Cooke (Aug 14, 2013)

Poor Purl said:


> I've never been to Florida, despite the fact that I've been invited down many times. I can't imagine going to a place that's always too warm.
> 
> But you just made it sound nice.


It is nice between October 1st and April 1st. 
Those are my guidelines. 
I am not likely to go back down, though, just as with Cali a few trips is enough.


----------



## Janet Cooke (Aug 14, 2013)

damemary said:


> Or, just shut up. That will work even better.


I tried doing relevent on another thread, I should check to see if anyone responded.


----------



## Poor Purl (Apr 14, 2011)

Janet Cooke said:


> And I prefer to think recessive gene instead of mutant.
> Mutant reminds me of comic books not Hemingway.
> Then again, Hemingway could have been a really nasty KP member.


I used "mutant" for exactly that reason. Their minds are engineered differently. I once read that scientists studying animals are told not to use cats or horses in their research; "they screw up your data." Horses seem like fun, too, but they're expensive, and hard to maintain in an apartment.

Was Hemingway nasty? He's never appealed to me. I was very surprised to learn he owned cats.


----------



## Poor Purl (Apr 14, 2011)

Janet Cooke said:


> Kegels?


Whoops.


----------



## Janet Cooke (Aug 14, 2013)

Poor Purl said:


> Whoops.


Sorry. I am definitely headed into goofy territory.


----------



## Poor Purl (Apr 14, 2011)

damemary said:


> Gov. Jan Brewer of AZ has just vetoed Bill 1060 regarding religious freedom balancing non-discrimination of LGTG. She decided that the bill was not addressing an existing problem in the state. The feeling is that RW lobby was trying to flex its power. Just my opinion.


So she's not entirely owned by the RWNs. Good!


----------



## Poor Purl (Apr 14, 2011)

damemary said:


> :XD: :XD: :XD: :XD: :XD: To the point as always Purl.


That was Shakespeare, not me.


----------



## MarilynKnits (Aug 30, 2011)

DH has a friend whose wife browbeat him into leaving the home he loved and life long friends and relocating in Florida. He calls it "G-d's waiting room". 

We used to go during President's week break to visit my parents in Charlotte County. It was nice to get out of winter coats in NC. Once they passed, we had no compelling reason to go back, and we spent enough time there to know we would never make it our home. We have central heating and a generator for power outages, PeaPod delivers, as does the pizza place and the Chinese restaurant. With a big enough yarn stash, winter is survivable in the northeast.


----------



## damemary (Mar 14, 2012)

Not another misogynist? He's not one of my favs but I like his ...cats.



Janet Cooke said:


> And I prefer to think recessive gene instead of mutant.
> Mutant reminds me of comic books not Hemingway.
> Then again, Hemingway could have been a really nasty KP member.


----------



## Poor Purl (Apr 14, 2011)

damemary said:


> I'm singing. I'm singing in the rain. Get your bumbershoot ready. (Does anyone else use 'bumbershoot?')


I thought of it a few days ago, but decided to go with umbrella. I love the word "bumbershoot." One day I may look up its derivation.


----------



## MarilynKnits (Aug 30, 2011)

Getting groggy. Does anyone really own cats? One can own a dog. Dogs wag their tails and act delighted to see their owners. I think cats see the humans they live with as the servants.


----------



## Janet Cooke (Aug 14, 2013)

Poor Purl said:


> I used "mutant" for exactly that reason. Their minds are engineered differently. I once read that scientists studying animals are told not to use cats or horses in their research; "they screw up your data." Horses seem like fun, too, but they're expensive, and hard to maintain in an apartment.
> 
> Was Hemingway nasty? He's never appealed to me. I was very surprised to learn he owned cats.


All that depression in males generally means angry outbursts, right?
I do think that I remember reading that he was abusive verbally if not physically.
Here is just a quicky of a bio.

http://www.imdb.com/name/nm0002133/bio


----------



## Poor Purl (Apr 14, 2011)

MarilynKnits said:


> DH has a friend whose wife browbeat him into leaving the home he loved and life long friends and relocating in Florida. He calls it "G-d's waiting room".
> 
> We used to go during President's week break to visit my parents in Charlotte County. It was nice to get out of winter coats in NC. Once they passed, we had no compelling reason to go back, and we spent enough time there to know we would never make it our home. We have central heating and a generator for power outages, PeaPod delivers, as does the pizza place and the Chinese restaurant. With a big enough yarn stash, winter is survivable in the northeast.


"G-d's waiting room." It would be funny if only it weren't true. I once read that most social engagements in Florida happen in doctor's waiting rooms. That's where a lot of people spend their days.


----------



## damemary (Mar 14, 2012)

I feel so much better to know I'm not the only one. German maybe?



Poor Purl said:


> I thought of it a few days ago, but decided to go with umbrella. I love the word "bumbershoot." One day I may look up its derivation.


----------



## damemary (Mar 14, 2012)

I've heard it said that dogs have owners. Cats have staff.



MarilynKnits said:


> Getting groggy. Does anyone really own cats? One can own a dog. Dogs wag their tails and act delighted to see their owners. I think cats see the humans they live with as the servants.


----------



## Poor Purl (Apr 14, 2011)

damemary said:


> Not another misogynist? He's not one of my favs but I like his ...cats.


I don't know whether he was a misogynist, but his female characters were unreal. Cats make him much more appealing.


----------



## Janet Cooke (Aug 14, 2013)

Poor Purl said:


> I don't know whether he was a misogynist, but his female characters were unreal. Cats make him much more appealing.


Four wives and alcoholism... self medicating, I suppose.
And yes, there is no denying that is where my prejudice lies.


----------



## Janet Cooke (Aug 14, 2013)

Did anyone bother to look at that link that the WonderChristian posted earlier?
When I saw this I figured there had to be a connection. That is the ATLAH ...


----------



## Poor Purl (Apr 14, 2011)

MarilynKnits said:


> Getting groggy. Does anyone really own cats? One can own a dog. Dogs wag their tails and act delighted to see their owners. I think cats see the humans they live with as the servants.


I've been told that cats think of people as big, dumb cats. I think you're right. You don't own a cat, though you can have one.


----------



## Poor Purl (Apr 14, 2011)

Janet Cooke said:


> All that depression in males generally means angry outbursts, right?
> I do think that I remember reading that he was abusive verbally if not physically.
> Here is just a quicky of a bio.
> 
> http://www.imdb.com/name/nm0002133/bio


It wouldn't surprise me.

Did you see Midnight in Paris? And your message didn't have that link. Funny - when you edit something, Quote Reply gives the pre-edited version.


----------



## Janet Cooke (Aug 14, 2013)

Poor Purl said:


> It wouldn't surprise me.
> 
> Did you see Midnight in Paris? And your message didn't have that link. Funny - when you edit something, Quote Reply gives the pre-edited version.


http://www.imdb.com/name/nm0002133/bio


----------



## Poor Purl (Apr 14, 2011)

Janet Cooke said:


> All that depression in males generally means angry outbursts, right?
> I do think that I remember reading that he was abusive verbally if not physically.
> Here is just a quicky of a bio.
> 
> http://www.imdb.com/name/nm0002133/bio


Now it has the link. So the first time I replied, it was to the pre-edited message?


----------



## damemary (Mar 14, 2012)

OMG. Are these people running around loose? Stand your ground.



Janet Cooke said:


> Did anyone bother to look at that link that the WonderChristian posted earlier?
> When I saw this I figured there had to be a connection. That is the ATLAH ...


----------



## Poor Purl (Apr 14, 2011)

damemary said:


> I feel so much better to know I'm not the only one. German maybe?


Could be. I haven't looked it up yet. Either German or some British regionalism. It couldn't be anything else.


----------



## Janet Cooke (Aug 14, 2013)

Poor Purl said:


> Now it has the link. So the first time I replied, it was to the pre-edited message?


LOL, don't know. I am glad you got to peek.


----------



## Janeway (Nov 22, 2011)

theyarnlady said:


> No name
> Oh woe is me and to think no name was every so kind to me and now I am not in her good graces. How sad I feel.
> 
> But must correct another of no name lies never cried no name we must have truth now must we not.
> ...


Why, Yarnie, what beautiful names you have these days! Sweet Lefties aren't they?

I'm posting pictures, but only one or two responded. Guess their eye site is bad.

I'm here for you sweet ladies on the "Right" with this picture.


----------



## Janet Cooke (Aug 14, 2013)

damemary said:


> OMG. Are these people running around loose? Stand your ground.


If that was what she wanted to hold up as some Christians standing against President Obama it's no wonder she went bonkers later in the day.


----------



## Poor Purl (Apr 14, 2011)

damemary said:


> I feel so much better to know I'm not the only one. German maybe?


American.

1. American in origin, it has become associated with British umbrellas, but has never been a Briticism.

2. BUMBERSHOOT: Etymology: bumber- (alter. of umbr- in umbrella) + -shoot (alteration of -chute in parachute) Date: circa 1896 [[but wait a second, were there really parachutes is 1896???  the airplane hadnt been invented yet!]]

3.Bumbershoot is a fanciful Americanism from the late 19th century


----------



## damemary (Mar 14, 2012)

Alliteration of UM BREL and chute as in parachute. Ta Da.



Poor Purl said:


> Could be. I haven't looked it up yet. Either German or some British regionalism. It couldn't be anything else.


----------



## damemary (Mar 14, 2012)

Love it regardless.



Poor Purl said:


> American.
> 
> 1. American in origin, it has become associated with British umbrellas, but has never been a Briticism.
> 
> ...


----------



## rocky1991 (May 8, 2011)

MarilynKnits said:


> DH has a friend whose wife browbeat him into leaving the home he loved and life long friends and relocating in Florida. He calls it "G-d's waiting room".
> 
> We used to go during President's week break to visit my parents in Charlotte County. It was nice to get out of winter coats in NC. Once they passed, we had no compelling reason to go back, and we spent enough time there to know we would never make it our home. We have central heating and a generator for power outages, PeaPod delivers, as does the pizza place and the Chinese restaurant. With a big enough yarn stash, winter is survivable in the northeast.


I lived in Florida from 1980 to 1996 then again from 2001-2013. Guess I didn't learn from my first experience in hell.


----------



## Poor Purl (Apr 14, 2011)

Janet Cooke said:


> Did anyone bother to look at that link that the WonderChristian posted earlier?
> When I saw this I figured there had to be a connection. That is the ATLAH ...


Do you know how long it's been since anyone's used the work "homo"? I missed the WonderChristian's message. Was this it?


----------



## rocky1991 (May 8, 2011)

MarilynKnits said:


> Getting groggy. Does anyone really own cats? One can own a dog. Dogs wag their tails and act delighted to see their owners. I think cats see the humans they live with as the servants.


The only cat I owned was a Siamese, she was more like a dog than a cat. Slept with me for 19 years. Loved that girl!!


----------



## rocky1991 (May 8, 2011)

Poor Purl said:


> "G-d's waiting room." It would be funny if only it weren't true. I once read that most social engagements in Florida happen in doctor's waiting rooms. That's where a lot of people spend their days.


I lived in the young part of Florida......Boca Raton. Surrounded by the elderly and the super nouveau riche.


----------



## Poor Purl (Apr 14, 2011)

damemary said:


> Alliteration of UM BREL and chute as in parachute. Ta Da.


----------



## Poor Purl (Apr 14, 2011)

rocky1991 said:


> I lived in Florida from 1980 to 1996 then again from 2001-2013. Guess I didn't learn from my first experience in hell.


You must have liked it - you did it on purpose. Were you being sarcastic?


----------



## Janet Cooke (Aug 14, 2013)

Poor Purl said:


> Do you know how long it's been since anyone's used the work "homo"? I missed the WonderChristian's message. Was this it?


Apparently today if you are a hater.

KBG posted a like that was supposed to be united black blah blah blah. I didn't read it. 
Hmmm, is it worth going through her BS to check? 
Yeah, why not.


----------



## Janeway (Nov 22, 2011)

Poor Purl said:


> "G-d's waiting room." It would be funny if only it weren't true. I once read that most social engagements in Florida happen in doctor's waiting rooms. That's where a lot of people spend their days.


Oh, poor Purl, you have missed the boat as where DH & are staying is a very busy place with several activities going on at the same time. For instance tonight, we had Roast Beef, carrots, real mashed potatoes, salad, iced tea or coffee, & a variety of homemade cakes/pies/cookies. The tickets were only $6.00.

Today, I went swimming, got in the hot tub then went to the above dinner & have the choice of playing several different types of cards, couples dance, playing shuffleboard, knitting, crocheting or quilting, Bible Study or Wed. church service, or a book club meeting.

Our temp is 78 degrees so eat your heart out I'm in Florida!


----------



## Poor Purl (Apr 14, 2011)

rocky1991 said:


> The only cat I owned was a Siamese, she was more like a dog than a cat. Slept with me for 19 years. Loved that girl!!


I love sleeping with cats. I think their sleep-hormones are catching.


----------



## Janeway (Nov 22, 2011)

rocky1991 said:


> I lived in the young part of Florida......Boca Raton. Surrounded by the elderly and the super nouveau riche.


No, no, my dear, the super rich are in Marco Island!


----------



## rocky1991 (May 8, 2011)

damemary said:


> I prefer AZ for the mountains but I've always wanted to see the Florida Keys.


To a Floridian going to Key West is the longest U turn imaginable. I love the Keys, but I went there to fish and scuba dive. The food is wonderful also.


----------



## Poor Purl (Apr 14, 2011)

Janeway said:


> Oh, poor Purl, you have missed the boat as where DH & are staying is a very busy place with several activities going on at the same time. For instance tonight, we had Roast Beef, carrots, real mashed potatoes, salad, iced tea or coffee, & a variety of homemade cakes/pies/cookies. The tickets were only $6.00.
> 
> Today, I went swimming, got in the hot tub then went to the above dinner & have the choice of playing several different types of cards, couples dance, playing shuffleboard, knitting, crocheting or quilting, Bible Study or Wed. church service, or a book club meeting.
> 
> Our temp is 78 degrees so eat your heart out I'm in Florida!


It sounds as though you're having a great time. Is this a vacation, or do you live there?

I'm glad you're having fun, but I won't eat my heart out. Seventy-eight is much too warm for me. I don't like summer. I'm warm-hearted enough without it. :roll: :roll: :roll:


----------



## Poor Purl (Apr 14, 2011)

Janeway said:


> No, no, my dear, the super rich are in Marco Island!


Yup, I can just see David Koch riding around in that car.


----------



## Janeway (Nov 22, 2011)

Poor Purl said:


> It sounds as though you're having a great time. Is this a vacation, or do you live there?
> 
> I'm glad you're having fun, but I won't eat my heart out. Seventy-eight is much too warm for me. I don't like summer. I'm warm-hearted enough without it. :roll: :roll: :roll:


We are here visiting friends, but rented a condo until April 1. We will leave before 3-30.


----------



## VocalLisa (Jan 4, 2014)

knitpresentgifts said:


> PROVE IT! Just because you repeat it, doesn't make it true.


Just because you repeat denials doesn't make it untrue.


----------



## VocalLisa (Jan 4, 2014)

knitpresentgifts said:


> Yep, Janet, just as I said.
> You have no backbone to engage in a legitimate conversation.


Not sure whether she has the backbone or not, but unlike you, she clearly has the intelligence to do so.

She seems to have plenty of backbone too.


----------



## VocalLisa (Jan 4, 2014)

Gerslay said:


> Someone is fishing but I aint' biting!


Someone is admiring she's no more evolved than a fish.


----------



## VocalLisa (Jan 4, 2014)

knitpresentgifts said:


> Time is up, chicken little. Ninteen minutes is too long for you to remain quiet. You don't want a conversation.
> 
> Can't say I didn't try; no one, including me, wants your blood pressure to go up any higher.
> 
> I'll log off so you can start insulting folks again.


WTH are you talking about? Are you seriously admitting to sitting around and waiting for 19 minutes for someone to talk to you?


----------



## Poor Purl (Apr 14, 2011)

Janeway said:


> We are here visiting friends, but rented a condo until April 1. We will leave before 3-30.


Isn't it nice to have all that time available? Keep on having a good time; I suspect you've earned it.


----------



## Janet Cooke (Aug 14, 2013)

Poor Purl said:


> Yup, I can just see David Koch riding around in that car.


LOL, the super rich put Xmas lights all over their cars and drive them in parades on Marco Island and go out to eat for $6.

Would have done better to stay at a Courtyard, cookies and coffee free at 4 PM.


----------



## VocalLisa (Jan 4, 2014)

Janet Cooke said:


> Cheeky either did or did not use a cat (well, she did do that)as an avatar and said or did not say (that is the part I am not sure of) that the cat was actually hers. Conan is the cat's name.
> Anyway, the compulsive rightie dug up all of those links to show that Cheeky doesn't really own said cat in her avatar.
> And on and on goes the circus.


This what I don't understand, why do they think that was Cheeky's cat? Just because she used it as an Avatar?

If so, that's pretty damn stupid.


----------



## Janet Cooke (Aug 14, 2013)

VocalLisa said:


> This what I don't understand, why do they think that was Cheeky's cat? Just because she used it as an Avatar?
> 
> If so, that's pretty damn stupid.


As I try to make known but, what the heck my posts are no more important than others, nobody really notices I miss probably 35% of postings. 
Most just aren't important enough to back track for, by the time I might find it the conversation has moved on. 
So I do remember someone (Purl?)saying give Connor a kiss. Cheeky may have said sure, implying that the cat belonged to her. 
So it is stupid regardless, and the flurry, I believe, is mainly to avoid any more discussion of that book that Empress Purl recommended. 
Apparently, the only discussion encouraged is about Chrisitanity despite all the deep and abiding R-E-S-P-E-C-T that this group has for the forebears of the Christian faith.


----------



## Poor Purl (Apr 14, 2011)

Janet Cooke said:


> LOL, the super rich put Xmas lights all over their cars and drive them in parades on Marco Island and go out to eat for $6.
> 
> Would have done better to stay at a Courtyard, cookies and coffee free at 4 PM.


 :XD: :XD: :XD: :XD: :XD:


----------



## Cheeky Blighter (Nov 20, 2011)

knitpresentgifts said:


> Wow, Vocal Jody Blighter, do you get royalties every time "Conan" appears on the internet?
> 
> BTW: Who did the original painting? I've seen the painting on Pinterest of *your cat*, but credit to the artist isn't acknowledged.
> 
> ...


That's my boy. He is such a love and yes that is a painting and not a photo. Your "hair" now that is a horse of a different color. That "thing" does look an awful lot like a horse's rear. So suiting for your charming personality. Make sure and keep the poo from accumulating under it. :lol:


----------



## Janet Cooke (Aug 14, 2013)

And you had to know this was coming...

http://www.bing.com/videos/search?q=respect&FORM=VIRE1#view=detail&mid=B933D7787217955E0CA6B933D7787217955E0CA6


----------



## Poor Purl (Apr 14, 2011)

Janet Cooke said:


> As I try to make known but, what the heck my posts are no more important than others, nobody really notices I miss probably 35% of postings.
> Most just aren't important enough to back track for, by the time I might find it the conversation has moved on.
> So I do remember someone (Purl?)saying give Connor a kiss. Cheeky may have said sure, implying that the cat belonged to her.
> So it is stupid regardless, and the flurry, I believe, is mainly to avoid any more discussion of that book that Empress Purl recommended.
> Apparently, the only discussion encouraged is about Chrisitanity despite all the deep and abiding R-E-S-P-E-C-T that this group has for the forebears of the Christian faith.


Is _that_ what you think it was about, the wanting to rid the thread of any discussion of the Hebrew Bible? That hadn't occurred to me. Cheeky did imply that was her cat, but I set her up to say that by telling her I assumed it was hers.

I have no desire to discuss the Bible with those whatevers around. I was only recommending what I thought was a faithful translation to someone who had asked for one. Come to think of it, the way Guernsey tried to push us out makes it possible you're right.


----------



## Poor Purl (Apr 14, 2011)

Cheeky Blighter said:


> That's my boy. He is such a love and yes that is a painting and not a photo. Your "hair" now that is a horse of a different color. That "thing" does look an awful lot like a horse's rear. So suiting for your charming personality. Make sure and keep the poo from accumulating under it. :lol:


You don't think she'll believe you, do you? Maybe if Lisa said it was hers . . .nah, even that wouldn't work.

There's something very sick about this search for meaningless lies about inconsequential things - not that Conan is inconsequential, but whether he's yours or the Sri Lankans is. This from someone who can lie about what she said two lines up in the same message.


----------



## Poor Purl (Apr 14, 2011)

Janet Cooke said:


> And you had to know this was coming...
> 
> http://www.bing.com/videos/search?q=respect&FORM=VIRE1#view=detail&mid=B933D7787217955E0CA6B933D7787217955E0CA6


A good way to end the day.


----------



## SQM (Jun 22, 2012)

despite all the deep and abiding R-E-S-P-E-C-T that this group has for the forebears of the Christian faith."

Please, we are not interested in taking any credit for christianity.


----------



## knitpresentgifts (May 21, 2013)

Janet Cooke said:


> Did anyone bother to look at that link that the WonderChristian posted earlier?
> When I saw this I figured there had to be a connection. That is the ATLAH ...


What the heck are you yapping about now? What's the matter; the links we provided weren't worthy of your perusal?

Yet, you play show and tell of your own? I'm still waiting for any Lib to tell me the black pastors are racists. Come on Libs, speak up.

:XD: :XD: :XD: :XD: :XD: :XD: :XD: :XD: :XD:

You didn't even click the link or listen to the video but you sure did get your insults in, didn't ya! You don't even know what you are talking about, but your talking just the same.

:-D :-D :-D :-D :-D :-D

You must have been dying to post that image and tried to blame me of it.

:-D :-D :-D :-D :-D :-D

So pathetic C. L.


----------



## Janet Cooke (Aug 14, 2013)

Poor Purl said:


> You don't think she'll believe you, do you? Maybe if Lisa said it was hers . . .nah, even that wouldn't work.
> 
> There's something very sick about this search for meaningless lies about inconsequential things - not that Conan is inconsequential, but whether he's yours or the Sri Lankans is. This from someone who can lie about what she said two lines up in the same message.


FGS, Conan... I thought Connor. 
Someone suggested meshuganah recently for that one.


----------



## knitpresentgifts (May 21, 2013)

Janeway said:


> We are here visiting friends, but rented a condo until April 1. We will leave before 3-30.


Enjoy your stay Jane. :thumbup:


----------



## Janet Cooke (Aug 14, 2013)

SQM said:


> despite all the deep and abiding R-E-S-P-E-C-T that this group has for the forebears of the Christian faith."
> 
> Please, we are not interested in taking any credit for christianity.


Perhaps not, but THEY need the Jewish and folks like me to fulfill their prophecies.


----------



## Janet Cooke (Aug 14, 2013)

knitpresentgifts said:


> What the heck are you yapping about now? What's the matter; the links we provided weren't worthy of your perusal?
> 
> Yet, you play show and tell of your own? I'm still waiting for any Lib to tell me the black pastors are racists. Come on Libs, speak up.
> 
> ...


We? Really? Is that the royal we? How many times was that posted by different people on this thread?
Whackadoodle, I tell ya.


----------



## knitpresentgifts (May 21, 2013)

VocalLisa said:


> This what I don't understand, why do they think that was Cheeky's cat? Just because she used it as an Avatar?
> 
> If so, that's pretty damn stupid.


Because Cheeky told us all it was her/your cat, its name, and also told us his disposition is why everyone thought it was as you said. It isn't even a painting of your cat!!!! :XD: :XD: :XD: :XD: :XD: :XD:

Yep, you used someone else's image for your avatar and were pretty darn stupid calling it your own. I'll agree with you on that.

Good thing Gerslay and I told you it was a painting so you didn't get in even deeper, huh? 

Why don't you tell us who painted that lovely painting? Without looking it up? :XD: :XD: :XD:

Are the royalties still rolling in?

You really ought to choose avatars of your own making and not steal others if you aren't willing to give credit for them while calling them your own. You can get in trouble for that you know.

I suggest you put up your publicity photo again; for all your user names. :XD: :XD: :XD:


----------



## VocalLisa (Jan 4, 2014)

Janet Cooke said:


> As I try to make known but, what the heck my posts are no more important than others, nobody really notices I miss probably 35% of postings.
> Most just aren't important enough to back track for, by the time I might find it the conversation has moved on.
> So I do remember someone (Purl?)saying give Connor a kiss. Cheeky may have said sure, implying that the cat belonged to her.
> So it is stupid regardless, and the flurry, I believe, is mainly to avoid any more discussion of that book that Empress Purl recommended.
> Apparently, the only discussion encouraged is about Chrisitanity despite all the deep and abiding R-E-S-P-E-C-T that this group has for the forebears of the Christian faith.


Ah, I should've known it was an effort to have to avoid intelligent discussion, it's their M.O.


----------



## Cheeky Blighter (Nov 20, 2011)

Janet Cooke said:


> From reading, and of course from listening to the stories of my friends who were locked in closets, beaten, and shamed in the classroom. Even discounting half of what the storytellers were, in some cases embellishing, I am not sure why you would be surprised.
> In many cases it was a very hard life, people of intelligence were locked into the politics of the Church.
> Most of my reading was from the 19th Century, but, take a look at the situations of places such as Sean Ross Abbey in Ireland and others all over Europe.
> What happy people treat other women that way?
> ...


Janet I am well aware of the atrocities of the Catholic church. Were your friends living in Catholic institutions or were they being treated this way in Catholic Schools? I am in no way an apologist for the church. I know about the Magdalene Laundries that were started by the Anglican church in 1758 and spread to Ireland and the Catholic church there. The last laundry was closed in 1996. I saw the movie Magdalene Laundries and just this year there is a movie out, Philomena with Judi Dentch about a girl who lived at one of the laundries and was forced to give up her child for adoption and then goes to search for him years later. What you have to ask is how did these girls end up in these places. Or in the case of your friends who allowed them to be subjected to this kind of treatment. The answer is, their families. When I was in Ireland I was appalled that the Post Offices have collection boxes in them for the Catholic Church. The Church and government are very cozy. As I said I was raised a Catholic, an Irish Catholic. Even here in the U.S. Catholics turned to the parish priest whenever there was a "problem" in the family including my own relatives. Families sent their daughters to these places. The church or the government didn't kidnap one of them and take them away but were happy to house these women for free for their families and let them work for their keep. When I saw the movie Magdalene Laundries I sobbed for those women and as a Catholic and Irish it made me sick. All the more reason for keeping church and government far apart. I could say much more but will save it for another time.
Have you seen the movie Oranges and Sunshine which involves the British government sending it's foster care children to Australia to work as slave labor for several large well known companies and also the Catholic church. Another discussion we can have.


----------



## Lkholcomb (Aug 25, 2013)

MarilynKnits said:


> I just took the plunge and purchased the Koren Bible and the Koren Siddur at the ABE Books web site. That is my first choice when looking for used books at a decent price. Got each one, including shipping for each, from different vendors using ABE as their clearing house, considerably less expensive than going direct to Koren Publishers for brand new.
> 
> It will be interesting to compare the translations to the Soncino Chumash I currently use and to the Birnmaum Daily Prayer Book I use at home and the Sim Sholom the local shul uses. Birnbaum is Orthodox and Sim Sholom is Conservative. DH is so used to the Birnbaum he can find his way very easily. I have had to put skinny sticky note tabs to index for myself.
> 
> ...


I remember reading a book years ago about the reason there are so man different translation of the bibles as this. It was quite interesting to think about.


----------



## knitpresentgifts (May 21, 2013)

Janet Cooke said:


> So I do remember someone (Purl?)saying give Connor a kiss. Cheeky may have said sure, implying that the cat belonged to her.
> So it is stupid regardless, and the flurry, I believe, is mainly to avoid any more discussion of that book that Empress Purl recommended.
> Apparently, the only discussion encouraged is about Chrisitanity despite all the deep and abiding R-E-S-P-E-C-T that this group has for the forebears of the Christian faith.


Cheeky didn't imply; she claimed and named that cat as hers.

HAHAHAHAHA! You actually think the Christians on this thread don't wish a discussion of the Hebrew Bible or another book on the Faith? We welcome it.

You really are nuts. Are you in a league of your own too?

Christians believe in the Bible and know the truth about their Lord and Savior. I can assure you no Christian cares about what Poor Purl thinks of what little she knows about a Faith she doesn't believe in. Why would any Christian care what books or works PP talks about when we are all secure and certain in our beliefs and eternal life.

Poor Purl (and many others) are the ones lost and searching for the truth, not the Christians on this thread.

HAHAHAHAHA! You think we care what she discusses! A bitter Jewish woman in her eighties who doesn't understand the Bible or the Christian Faith will not convert any Christian to her beliefs. You can count on it.


----------



## knitpresentgifts (May 21, 2013)

Cheeky Blighter said:


> That's my boy. He is such a love and yes that is a painting and not a photo. Your "hair" now that is a horse of a different color. That "thing" does look an awful lot like a horse's rear. So suiting for your charming personality. Make sure and keep the poo from accumulating under it. :lol:


Ya, sure. No worries, we all believe you Jody.

Sounds like envy and vanity is getting the best of you again. Get control of yourself.


----------



## VocalLisa (Jan 4, 2014)

Janet Cooke said:


> Perhaps not, but THEY need the Jewish and folks like me to fulfill their prophecies.


Yes, but Sarah Palin likes to wear a Star of David to show her "love and affection" for the State of Israel and it's people.

So, that must ease your mind a bit. :thumbup:


----------



## knitpresentgifts (May 21, 2013)

Poor Purl said:


> Is _that_ what you think it was about, the wanting to rid the thread of any discussion of the Hebrew Bible? That hadn't occurred to me. Cheeky did imply that was her cat, but I set her up to say that by telling her I assumed it was hers.
> 
> I have no desire to discuss the Bible with those whatevers around. I was only recommending what I thought was a faithful translation to someone who had asked for one. Come to think of it, the way Guernsey tried to push us out makes it possible you're right.


HAHAHAHAHA! Don't flatter yourself. We have no desire to take the discussion off something we love and believe in.

BTW: Cheeky didn't imply; she answered you emphatically and claimed the cat as her own. What's with your back pedaling and excuses? :XD: :XD: :XD:


----------



## MaidInBedlam (Jul 24, 2012)

Gone from this topic for a few hours and I come back to find I'm on page 70 and everyone else has gotten to page 88. It's absolutely pouring down rain here right now and it sounds wonderful--on the other side of a closed window!! The creek is up and running in its instant flash flood mode. As soon as we get a little rain our little creek gets going.


----------



## Lkholcomb (Aug 25, 2013)

Janet Cooke said:


> Exactly, and who gives a care?
> Does anyone think that Damemary owns that image in her avatar?
> Did KPG own that image that she used recently?
> There must be thousands of representations of that type of cat, isn't that the same variety of cat as used in Meow Mix or Fancy Cat ads?


I have two of those cats at one (one on the more orange side, one on the paler orange side). The orange tigers are so gorgeous! And it's more than a little fun when petting them to make a "Main" and take pictures too!


----------



## knitpresentgifts (May 21, 2013)

Poor Purl said:


> You don't think she'll believe you, do you? Maybe if Lisa said it was hers . . .nah, even that wouldn't work.
> 
> There's something very sick about this search for meaningless lies about inconsequential things - not that Conan is inconsequential, but whether he's yours or the Sri Lankans is. This from someone who can lie about what she said two lines up in the same message.


HAHAHAHAHA! Do you actually believe the PMs where Cheeky told you she is Lisa AND Jody? Believe her, not me.

I know that you do. :-D


----------



## VocalLisa (Jan 4, 2014)

knitpresentgifts said:


> Because Cheeky told us all it was her/your cat, its name, and also told us his disposition is why everyone thought it was as you said. It isn't even a painting of your cat!!!!


Of course it's not a painting of my cat - I used to have Siamese growing up, but my spouse is allergic and I haven't had a cat or a picture/painting Avatar of a cat in over 25 years.

Sorry, I missed the part where Cheeky said it was her cat... but that's why I was asking.

Perhaps you can provide a link to where she said it?


----------



## MaidInBedlam (Jul 24, 2012)

knitpresentgifts said:


> Ya, I hope you don't expire in your continual efforts to cover for a serial liar.
> 
> Why don't you go ahead and change the topic again like all your Lib buds do to cover Cheek's lie instead of lying yourself?


This is a really good example of the glass half full or half empty way of looking at things. Cheeky has an avatar of a cat and it obviously isn't a photo. She and a few others say some silly things about it. They chuckle a bit in print here. You read and run to let us all know about the terrible lies Cheeky told. This is about a picture of a *cat* for goodness sake.













































My current avatar is a drawing of a cat that happens to look like my very own silly black cat who is at this moment importuning me for an after-dinner snack. I copied the drawing from some website that had lots of cat photos and drawings.


----------



## knitpresentgifts (May 21, 2013)

Janet Cooke said:


> We? Really? Is that the royal we? How many times was that posted by different people on this thread?
> Whackadoodle, I tell ya.


Are you showing interest in my posts again and trying to start a conversation with me, Janet. Yes, I believe you are.

Unfortunately, I'm no longer interested.

Bye!


----------



## Lkholcomb (Aug 25, 2013)

Janet Cooke said:


> Gee, could I be reading a post that says that regardless of what people do only you can do right?
> If I pass on by then I am changing the subject rather than addressing it and if I talk about it I am covering for Cheeky?
> 
> It is a picture of a cat. With as many lies as you have been caught in here if that weren't her cat, it would fall someone about 999,999,999 in the list behind yours.


I'm just curious, how can a person prove that a thing (cat in this instance) is NOT someone's property, unless they know who the person is who belongs to the cat?

For instance:

Child 1: that toy isn't hers!

Child 2: yes it is!

Adult 1: how do you know it's not hers?

Child 1: because, because.... I KNOW!

You can't prove that an object has even been stolen until you can prove who it belongs to (or is rightfully in possession of it).

Must be my silly semantics coming in to play. I have no idea who the cat in the picture belongs to, and it doesn't greatly matter to me, but I just find the accusing someone of lying without backing it up with anything of more substance than an "because, I KNOW" a bit below adult rational thinking.


----------



## Janet Cooke (Aug 14, 2013)

Cheeky Blighter said:


> Janet I am well aware of the atrocities of the Catholic church. Were your friends living in Catholic institutions or were they being treated this way in Catholic Schools? I am in no way an apologist for the church. I know about the Magdalene Laundries that were started by the Anglican church in 1758 and spread to Ireland and the Catholic church there. The last laundry was closed in 1996. I saw the movie Magdalene Laundries and just this year there is a movie out, Philomena with Judi Dentch about a girl who lived at one of the laundries and was forced to give up her child for adoption and then goes to search for him years later. What you have to ask is how did these girls end up in these places. Or in the case of your friends who allowed them to be subjected to this kind of treatment. The answer is, their families. When I was in Ireland I was appalled that the Post Offices have collection boxes in them for the Catholic Church. The Church and government are very cozy. As I said I was raised a Catholic, an Irish Catholic. Even here in the U.S. Catholics turned to the parish priest whenever there was a "problem" in the family including my own relatives. Families sent their daughters to these places. The church or the government didn't kidnap one of them and take them away but were happy to house these women for free for their families and let them work for their keep. When I saw the movie Magdalene Laundries I sobbed for those women and as a Catholic and Irish it made me sick. All the more reason for keeping church and government far apart. I could say much more but will save it for another time.
> Have you seen the movie Oranges and Sunshine which involves the British government sending it's foster care children to Australia to work as slave labor for several large well known companies and also the Catholic church. Another discussion we can have.


...absolute power corrupts absolutely.

I didn't think that the discussion was about desperate families, however. I thought it was about the individuals who sought refuge in the Mother Church with deep idealism and became abusers on their journey. Why did that happen? 
I am reasonably sure that people who are happy in their choices and station don't do that. 
It wasn't isolated cases, it was systemic. 
Just as with the raping of little boys and the sanction of that by the church abuse was rampant. 
I think that all of the men, and it was men, who related those stories of abuse were day students. 
And yes, in the US as well as in Europe and, I will bet, currently in some parts of Africa and some Latin American regions there is still the fondly remembered "if you get spanked at school and I hear about it you will be spanked again at home". 
It is an interesting piece of many nostalgic postings right her on KP. 
Do we blame the terrorists or those who allow the terror to continue because they didn't understand how it was or how to fix it?

Don't feel you have to respond, it isn't necessary. When I was reading all that idyllic descriptions of the life it just brought up those sympathies.


----------



## knitpresentgifts (May 21, 2013)

Lkholcomb said:


> I have two of those cats at one (one on the more orange side, one on the paler orange side). The orange tigers are so gorgeous! And it's more than a little fun when petting them to make a "Main" and take pictures too!


Don't even tell me that avatar/image is your cat too.

It being Lisa's, Cheek's and Jody's cat and hundreds on the internet is enough.


----------



## BrattyPatty (May 2, 2011)

Poor Purl said:


> It's unbelievable the way they hold on to that delusion, when it's clearly pathological.
> 
> But welcome back. Where are you now? - hot or cold?
> 
> I'm glad Vegas hasn't ruined you; you're as beautiful today as you were the day you left.


Hi Empress Purl!
I am back in the "Polar Vortex" again. The weather in Vegas was perfect. 75 and sunny the whole time I was there. Today here, -30 windchills. Ugh!


----------



## Janet Cooke (Aug 14, 2013)

Lkholcomb said:


> I'm just curious, how can a person prove that a thing (cat in this instance) is NOT someone's property, unless they know who the person is who belongs to the cat?
> 
> For instance:
> 
> ...


I doubt that there is any intention of proving anything, it is about planting the seed of doubt in a relationship. 
Which is why it was good that Poor Purl put that reminder out so early that it really doesn't matter. 
It is just more Personality Disorder manipulation.


----------



## BrattyPatty (May 2, 2011)

knitpresentgifts said:


> Don't even tell me that avatar/image is your cat too.
> 
> It being Lisa's, Cheek's and Jody's cat is enough.


She's seeing triple while drinking doubles. :XD: :XD: :XD: :XD: :XD: :XD: :XD:


----------



## knitpresentgifts (May 21, 2013)

VocalLisa said:


> Of course it's not a painting of my cat - I used to have Siamese growing up, but my spouse is allergic and I haven't had a cat or a picture/painting Avatar of a cat in over 25 years.
> 
> Sorry, I missed the part where Cheeky said it was her cat... but that's why I was asking.
> 
> Perhaps you can provide a link to where she said it?


I'll do better than that and quote Cheek's, well, YOUR exact words:



Cheeky said:


> That's *my* boy. He is such a love and yes that is a painting and not a photo.
> 
> That *is* Conan O'Keegan. *He is* a very contented and loving cat. *I will give him* a big kiss from you.


----------



## Janet Cooke (Aug 14, 2013)

knitpresentgifts said:


> Are you showing interest in my posts again and trying to start a conversation with me, Janet. Yes, I believe you are.
> 
> Unfortunately, I'm no longer interested.
> 
> Bye!


Nothing unfortunate about it.


----------



## MaidInBedlam (Jul 24, 2012)

Janeway said:


> Well, are you finally being nice to me???? Me thinks the "sky" is falling!


Stay calm. All is well. you have a pretty cat and you did a good thing rescuing her and posting her picture. Even I can recognize those things.


----------



## knitpresentgifts (May 21, 2013)

Lkholcomb said:


> I'm just curious, how can a person prove that a thing (cat in this instance) is NOT someone's property, unless they know who the person is who belongs to the cat?


Ask Cheeky why "her" cat's image is all over the internet, posted by hundreds of different users, on advertisements, on blogs and as stock images in newsletters, is identified by another name by the painter of the original artwork, yet Cheeky claims the cat is "hers" and even told us its name.

Ya, uh huh.

BTW: I provided five unique links for you to view the exact same image. I stopped at five, there are hundreds. If you cannot recognize a lie, that's on you, not me. I don't go through life with my head in the sand, I suggest you might do the same.


----------



## Cheeky Blighter (Nov 20, 2011)

susanmos2000 said:


> No, of course not--in fact, many nuns-to-be were subjected to considerable pressure by their families to leave (my old Baltimore catechism has a section on how girls with a Vocation should respond to parents who balk at the notion--you tell them you'll wait until you're eighteen and then go ahead no matter how much they object).
> 
> It's hard to criticize the words and actions of women in pre-Vatican days who genuinely found this way of life spiritually fulfilling and genuinely satisfying--and of course some convents (particularly the cloistered ones) were far more rigid than others. Still, it's hard to believe that the ground rules found in all orders--to give up one's name, shear off one's hair, hide one's body under layers and layers of clothing, dispense with all material possessions ("a Sister with a penny isn't worth a penny" ), cut contacts with family to an absolute minimum--were a healthy way for adult women to live. Nuns may cut less of a picturesque figure these days with their modern dress and ways, but they now have the opportunity to devote themselves more fully to doing God's work. Old-style nuns wasted a lot of time placating superiors, trying to keep their hair safely hidden beneath their headdresses, and making sure there were no more than a dozen pins and needles in their sewing boxes--silly inconsequential matters, in retrospect.


All the nuns I knew were either teachers, nurses, P.T.'s, O.T.'s or social workers. I didn't know one that sat and sewed unless it was in her free time for her own amusement. They had full time jobs in the community. This was the habit worn by the Benedictine nuns. They run the College of St. Benedict's and St. Scholastica where many are professors and administrators. They also work for Catholic Social Services and teach at many Catholic schools. They are only one of many orders. You very seldom see nuns in habits any more. Also, they had regular vacations and went to family events just like everyone else I knew. Back in the 50's and 60's college bound women such as myself went to college to find a nice boy to marry who could support you and a family. If you happened to get an education and graduate along the way that was "nice". Women were to assist men by going into nursing, teaching, social work. We just weren't wearing habits and married to the church. Women still "knew their place". We still hadn't burned our bras, girdles and garter belts yet! Susan I must me ancient compared to you.


----------



## Janet Cooke (Aug 14, 2013)

Cheeky Blighter said:


> All the nuns I knew were either teachers, nurses, P.T.'s, O.T.'s or social workers. I didn't know one that sat and sewed unless it was in her free time for her own amusement. They had full time jobs in the community. This was the habit worn by the Benedictine nuns. They run the College of St. Benedicts and St. Scholastica where many are professors and administrators. They also work for Catholic Social Services and teach at many Catholic schools. They are only one of many orders.


There were many, though, who made exquisite lace, who made gorgeous tapestries, there were nuns who did every facet of chores that there are.
And then there are the nuns who take care of the retired nuns and priests, a task for anyone with a calling.


----------



## knitpresentgifts (May 21, 2013)

Janet Cooke said:


> It is just more Personality Disorder manipulation.


Ya, by the Lib liars for sure.


----------



## SQM (Jun 22, 2012)

Janet Cooke said:


> Perhaps not, but THEY need the Jewish and folks like me to fulfill their prophecies.


I forgot about about the second coming. But why you? Are you going to volunteer to build the third temple?


----------



## Janet Cooke (Aug 14, 2013)

SQM said:


> I forgot about about the second coming. But why you? Are you going to volunteer to build the third temple?


I am not a believer in the Trinity. I don't qualify to be saved.


----------



## MaidInBedlam (Jul 24, 2012)

I wonder why it's surprising that some African-American clergymen might be racists. It's an equal-opportunity position.


knitpresentgifts said:


> Hum, I wonder if the Libs will call these united black pastors racists for their beliefs (abortion, adoption and same-sex marriage discussed in the video).
> 
> http://www.breitbart.com/Big-Government/2014/02/25/Black-Pastors-Call-To-Impeach-Holder-A-Dangerous-Ideologue?utm_source=e_breitbart_com&utm_medium=email&utm_content=Breitbart+News+Roundup%2C+February+26%2C+2014&utm_campaign=20140226_m119349885_Breitbart+News+Roundup%2C+February+26%2C+2014&utm_term=More
> 
> ...


----------



## Poor Purl (Apr 14, 2011)

Janet Cooke said:


> FGS, Conan... I thought Connor.
> Someone suggested meshuganah recently for that one.


Correctly so.


----------



## BrattyPatty (May 2, 2011)

Cheeky Blighter said:


> All the nuns I knew were either teachers, nurses, P.T.'s, O.T.'s or social workers. I didn't know one that sat and sewed unless it was in her free time for her own amusement. They had full time jobs in the community. This was the habit worn by the Benedictine nuns. They run the College of St. Benedicts and St. Scholastica where many are professors and administrators. They also work for Catholic Social Services and teach at many Catholic schools. They are only one of many orders.


Hi Cheeky! I had nuns who were teachers and one was a tailor. She was too old to teach anymore so she made the habits for her convent.


----------



## Janet Cooke (Aug 14, 2013)

MaidInBedlam said:


> I wonder why it's surprising that some African-American clergymen might be racists. It's an equal-opportunity position.


It isn't about them being racists, though, it is about them being homophobes. 
It just happens that the people they blame for having a pro-gay agenda are both approximately half black.


----------



## SQM (Jun 22, 2012)

KGB - you are nasty, boring and rude. You add nothing to any conversation but vicious comments. Even if you feel goaded, try to take the high road for a change. Thanks.


----------



## Poor Purl (Apr 14, 2011)

VocalLisa said:


> Ah, I should've known it was an effort to have to avoid intelligent discussion, it's their M.O.


It's not to avoid intelligent discussion; it's to prevent it entirely. It's pathetic.


----------



## Janet Cooke (Aug 14, 2013)

SQM said:


> KGB - you are nasty, boring and rude. You add nothing to any conversation but vicious comments. Even if you feel goaded, try to take the high road for a change. Thanks.


Do you have some favorite flower(s), SQM?


----------



## Janet Cooke (Aug 14, 2013)

Poor Purl said:


> It's not to avoid intelligent discussion; it's to prevent it entirely. It's pathetic.


True,PPurl, so long as so many of us are wrapped up in playing with them it sucks all the oxygen from the room and dumbs us all down. 
Sorry. 
I will try to keep the volleys to a minimum.


----------



## damemary (Mar 14, 2012)

What came over you? Oh, I should talk. I've been in conservative AZ for 20 years. At least it's beautiful.



rocky1991 said:


> I lived in Florida from 1980 to 1996 then again from 2001-2013. Guess I didn't learn from my first experience in hell.


----------



## SQM (Jun 22, 2012)

BrattyPatty said:


> Hi Empress Purl!
> I am back in the "Polar Vortex" again. The weather in Vegas was perfect. 75 and sunny the whole time I was there. Today here, -30 windchills. Ugh!


Hey The Brat is back. My niece talks about the polar vortex. I can guess where you are from and where I may be heading. But it will be our secret here. Missed ya. Glad you got away and had a good time.


----------



## damemary (Mar 14, 2012)

Count me in. A cat purring on my shoulder on a cold night.



Poor Purl said:


> I love sleeping with cats. I think their sleep-hormones are catching.


----------



## damemary (Mar 14, 2012)

I'd rather see him dragged behind it.



Poor Purl said:


> Yup, I can just see David Koch riding around in that car.


----------



## BrattyPatty (May 2, 2011)

Poor Purl said:


> It's not to avoid intelligent discussion; it's to prevent it entirely. It's pathetic.


When one leaves this site for a week or so, it's all too clear to see upon return that there is not one intelligent one among them. Just repetoires of rhetoric and lies is all you see. Again and again and again.......


----------



## damemary (Mar 14, 2012)

VocalLisa said:


> Not sure whether she has the backbone or not, but unlike you, she clearly has the intelligence to do so.
> 
> She seems to have plenty of backbone too.


 :XD: :XD: :XD: :XD: :XD: :XD: :XD: :XD:


----------



## BrattyPatty (May 2, 2011)

damemary said:


> Count me in. A cat purring on my shoulder on a cold night.


I have 2. And believe me, it is a very cold night here, dame.
Thanks to the person who invented Cuddleduds!


----------



## Janet Cooke (Aug 14, 2013)

My balloons are all losing their air. My Whoopee Cushion won't expand. Quiet Time has arrived. 
Good night, my dears.


----------



## damemary (Mar 14, 2012)

VocalLisa said:


> WTH are you talking about? Are you seriously admitting to sitting around and waiting for 19 minutes for someone to talk to you?


 :XD: :XD: :XD: :XD: :XD: :XD: :XD: :XD: :XD: :XD: :XD: :XD: :XD: :XD: :XD: :XD: :XD: :XD: :XD: :XD: :XD: :XD: :XD: :XD: :XD: :XD: I think so.


----------



## SQM (Jun 22, 2012)

Janet Cooke said:


> I am not a believer in the Trinity. I don't qualify to be saved.


What jolly good news. So glad you saved yourself from all of that. Do protestants believe in the trinity or just the catholics?


----------



## BrattyPatty (May 2, 2011)

damemary said:


> I'd rather see him dragged behind it.


Or under it?


----------



## damemary (Mar 14, 2012)

VocalLisa said:


> This what I don't understand, why do they think that was Cheeky's cat? Just because she used it as an Avatar?
> 
> If so, that's pretty damn stupid.


 :XD: :XD: :XD: :XD: :XD: :XD: :XD: :XD: :XD: :XD: :XD: Now you're not surprised.......


----------



## MaidInBedlam (Jul 24, 2012)

Absolutely amazingly beautiful table cloth and neat kitty pictures, too. i have never made anything as intricate and beautiful as your table cloth ever and don't think I could ever match your skill. The little black kitten ready for planting looks just like my guy Faro did when he was a kitten (16 years ago...).


Janeway said:


> EveMcooke, these are for you to enjoy.


----------



## BrattyPatty (May 2, 2011)

SQM said:


> What jolly good news. So glad you saved yourself from all of that. Do protestants believe in the trinity or just the catholics?


Some protestants do. My Dh is Lutheran and his synod is almost identical to Catholicism. They don't serve the Eucharist every Sunday. Maybe once a month. Other than that, it did not seem much different to me.


----------



## SQM (Jun 22, 2012)

Janet Cooke said:


> Do you have some favorite flower(s), SQM?


Yeah the flowers that were prominent in my garden when I was a kid = phlox, peonies and lilly of the valleys. I love gardens but I don't like cut flowers.


----------



## BrattyPatty (May 2, 2011)

Janet Cooke said:


> My balloons are all losing their air. My Whoopee Cushion won't expand. Quiet Time has arrived.
> Good night, my dears.


Sweet dreams, Janet.


----------



## damemary (Mar 14, 2012)

It's the only place we're going to find RESPECT around here. Thanks.



Janet Cooke said:


> And you had to know this was coming...
> 
> http://www.bing.com/videos/search?q=respect&FORM=VIRE1#view=detail&mid=B933D7787217955E0CA6B933D7787217955E0CA6


----------



## damemary (Mar 14, 2012)

Poor Purl said:


> You don't think she'll believe you, do you? Maybe if Lisa said it was hers . . .nah, even that wouldn't work.
> 
> There's something very sick about this search for meaningless lies about inconsequential things - not that Conan is inconsequential, but whether he's yours or the Sri Lankans is. This from someone who can lie about what she said two lines up in the same message.


 :XD: :XD: :XD: :XD: :XD: On second thought.....


----------



## damemary (Mar 14, 2012)

With a little bit of R-E-S-P-E-C-T.



Poor Purl said:


> A good way to end the day.


----------



## damemary (Mar 14, 2012)

SQM said:


> despite all the deep and abiding R-E-S-P-E-C-T that this group has for the forebears of the Christian faith."
> 
> Please, we are not interested in taking any credit for christianity.


 :XD: :XD: :XD: :XD: :XD: :XD:


----------



## BrattyPatty (May 2, 2011)

SQM said:


> Yeah the flowers that were prominent in my garden when I was a kid = phlox, peonies and lilly of the valleys. I love gardens but I don't like cut flowers.


Hey, SQM, where is Roosevelt Island in New York?
Upstate? Long Island area?


----------



## damemary (Mar 14, 2012)

Hey Cheeky, if you told them to jump off the Golden Gate Bridge, would they do it?


----------



## BrattyPatty (May 2, 2011)

damemary said:


> Hey Cheeky, if you told them to jump off the Golden Gate Bridge, would they do it?


 :XD: :XD: :XD: :XD: :XD:
I waved at you, dame, while flying over your state.


----------



## Poor Purl (Apr 14, 2011)

Cheeky Blighter said:


> Janet I am well aware of the atrocities of the Catholic church. Were your friends living in Catholic institutions or were they being treated this way in Catholic Schools? I am in no way an apologist for the church. I know about the Magdalene Laundries that were started by the Anglican church in 1758 and spread to Ireland and the Catholic church there. The last laundry was closed in 1996. I saw the movie Magdalene Laundries and just this year there is a movie out, Philomena with Judi Dentch about a girl who lived at one of the laundries and was forced to give up her child for adoption and then goes to search for him years later. What you have to ask is how did these girls end up in these places. Or in the case of your friends who allowed them to be subjected to this kind of treatment. The answer is, their families. When I was in Ireland I was appalled that the Post Offices have collection boxes in them for the Catholic Church. The Church and government are very cozy. As I said I was raised a Catholic, an Irish Catholic. Even here in the U.S. Catholics turned to the parish priest whenever there was a "problem" in the family including my own relatives. Families sent their daughters to these places. The church or the government didn't kidnap one of them and take them away but were happy to house these women for free for their families and let them work for their keep. When I saw the movie Magdalene Laundries I sobbed for those women and as a Catholic and Irish it made me sick. All the more reason for keeping church and government far apart. I could say much more but will save it for another time.
> Have you seen the movie Oranges and Sunshine which involves the British government sending it's foster care children to Australia to work as slave labor for several large well known companies and also the Catholic church. Another discussion we can have.


I haven't seen the Magdalene Laundries, but I've seen the movie The Magdalene Sisters, which I think was fictional but was about teenage pregnant girls sent to live with the nuns and work in the laundries. The terrible things people do while pretending that it's for the victims' own good. No, not pretending; they may have believed it, especially since it was so to their advantage.


----------



## SQM (Jun 22, 2012)

BrattyPatty said:


> Hey, SQM, where is Roosevelt Island in New York?
> Upstate? Long Island area?


East River between the UN and about 90th Street going north. Behind Bloomingdales.


----------



## BrattyPatty (May 2, 2011)

SQM said:


> East River between the UN and about 90th Street going north. Behind Bloomingdales.


I passed you on a party boat after a Yankees game. Nice strip of land you live on!
It's been a pleasure ladies, but I have some unpacking to do while I have time. Brynn will be here bright and early tomorrow. Good night.


----------



## Poor Purl (Apr 14, 2011)

VocalLisa said:


> Of course it's not a painting of my cat - I used to have Siamese growing up, but my spouse is allergic and I haven't had a cat or a picture/painting Avatar of a cat in over 25 years.
> 
> Sorry, I missed the part where Cheeky said it was her cat... but that's why I was asking.
> 
> Perhaps you can provide a link to where she said it?


But Lisa, surely you remember saying it. Or has all the nonsense going on here addled your brain?


----------



## damemary (Mar 14, 2012)

True Cheeky. Families believed the Church much more than their children. Do you all begin to see how the abuse was hidden for so many years.

Mix this in with the 'irregularities' in the Vatican Bank, and you begin to see some of the problems in Pope Francis' lap.

I too say I see the immense good the Catholic Church has done and continues to do. It's one of those highly complex situations that defy solution. IMHO



Cheeky Blighter said:


> Janet I am well aware of the atrocities of the Catholic church. Were your friends living in Catholic institutions or were they being treated this way in Catholic Schools? I am in no way an apologist for the church. I know about the Magdalene Laundries that were started by the Anglican church in 1758 and spread to Ireland and the Catholic church there. The last laundry was closed in 1996. I saw the movie Magdalene Laundries and just this year there is a movie out, Philomena with Judi Dentch about a girl who lived at one of the laundries and was forced to give up her child for adoption and then goes to search for him years later. What you have to ask is how did these girls end up in these places. Or in the case of your friends who allowed them to be subjected to this kind of treatment. The answer is, their families. When I was in Ireland I was appalled that the Post Offices have collection boxes in them for the Catholic Church. The Church and government are very cozy. As I said I was raised a Catholic, an Irish Catholic. Even here in the U.S. Catholics turned to the parish priest whenever there was a "problem" in the family including my own relatives. Families sent their daughters to these places. The church or the government didn't kidnap one of them and take them away but were happy to house these women for free for their families and let them work for their keep. When I saw the movie Magdalene Laundries I sobbed for those women and as a Catholic and Irish it made me sick. All the more reason for keeping church and government far apart. I could say much more but will save it for another time.
> Have you seen the movie Oranges and Sunshine which involves the British government sending it's foster care children to Australia to work as slave labor for several large well known companies and also the Catholic church. Another discussion we can have.


----------



## MaidInBedlam (Jul 24, 2012)

I remember, I remember!! Maybe our hills WILL get green. This is the first time in my life when I haven't seen those emerald green coastal hills in December.


alcameron said:


> Is anyone old enough to remember this?
> 
> It's. raining, it's pouring
> The old man is snoring
> ...


----------



## SQM (Jun 22, 2012)

yeah. Cornell is coming to build a major techie grad school starting this year. I live off the river so I heard your party boat. The Brat lives well.


----------



## damemary (Mar 14, 2012)

Keep one eye open all night. Stay safe.



MaidInBedlam said:


> Gone from this topic for a few hours and I come back to find I'm on page 70 and everyone else has gotten to page 88. It's absolutely pouring down rain here right now and it sounds wonderful--on the other side of a closed window!! The creek is up and running in its instant flash flood mode. As soon as we get a little rain our little creek gets going.


----------



## BrattyPatty (May 2, 2011)

MaidInBedlam said:


> I remember, I remember!! Maybe our hills WILL get green. This is the first time in my life when I haven't seen those emerald green coastal hills in December.


MIB, I haven't seen anything green in Minnesota since......
Hmmm, it's been a long winter. I have 5 feet of snow in my yard. I hope you get that much needed rain. OOPs you posted before me. As Emily Latilla would say, "Never mind."


----------



## damemary (Mar 14, 2012)

In AZ groomers do a lion cut on long haired cats when it gets hot. They look just like miniature lions....in the case of Maine *****, not so miniature lions.



Lkholcomb said:


> I have two of those cats at one (one on the more orange side, one on the paler orange side). The orange tigers are so gorgeous! And it's more than a little fun when petting them to make a "Main" and take pictures too!


----------



## Poor Purl (Apr 14, 2011)

BrattyPatty said:


> Hi Empress Purl!
> I am back in the "Polar Vortex" again. The weather in Vegas was perfect. 75 and sunny the whole time I was there. Today here, -30 windchills. Ugh!


Poor Empress Patty. It sounds painful. But it's so nice to have you back.


----------



## BrattyPatty (May 2, 2011)

SQM said:


> yeah. Cornell is coming to build a major techie grad school starting this year. I live off the river so I heard your party boat. The Brat lives well.


I love your city. I was born in Brooklyn and once a New Yorker always a New Yorker. I have some fun cousins who live there and it is always a treat when I visit them.


----------



## damemary (Mar 14, 2012)

Don't buy into it. Not worth the effort.



VocalLisa said:


> Of course it's not a painting of my cat - I used to have Siamese growing up, but my spouse is allergic and I haven't had a cat or a picture/painting Avatar of a cat in over 25 years.
> 
> Sorry, I missed the part where Cheeky said it was her cat... but that's why I was asking.
> 
> Perhaps you can provide a link to where she said it?


----------



## BrattyPatty (May 2, 2011)

Poor Purl said:


> Poor Empress Patty. It sounds painful. But it's so nice to have you back.


Thanks, Purl. Nice to see you, too!


----------



## damemary (Mar 14, 2012)

The truth, the whole truth and nothing but the truth. Wonder what lies this will be translated into.



MaidInBedlam said:


> This is a really good example of the glass half full or half empty way of looking at things. Cheeky has an avatar of a cat and it obviously isn't a photo. She and a few others say some silly things about it. They chuckle a bit in print here. You read and run to let us all know about the terrible lies Cheeky told. This is about a picture of a *cat* for goodness sake.
> 
> 
> 
> ...


----------



## BrattyPatty (May 2, 2011)

damemary said:


> In AZ groomers do a lion cut on long haired cats when it gets hot. They look just like miniature lions....in the case of Maine *****, not so miniature lions.


My Maine ****/Tabby had a half lion cut. They left the mane around his neck only. They left his tail fur long. He looked like a dandy. Poor guy!


----------



## damemary (Mar 14, 2012)

Lkholcomb said:


> I'm just curious, how can a person prove that a thing (cat in this instance) is NOT someone's property, unless they know who the person is who belongs to the cat?
> 
> For instance:
> 
> ...


 :XD: :XD: :XD: :XD: :XD: :XD: :XD: :XD: :XD: :XD: :XD: No sirreeebob.


----------



## Poor Purl (Apr 14, 2011)

Lkholcomb said:


> I'm just curious, how can a person prove that a thing (cat in this instance) is NOT someone's property, unless they know who the person is who belongs to the cat?
> 
> For instance:
> 
> ...


Oh, Lk, Lk, why are you using logic when it's exactly what the morons here fear the most? Aside from the fact that IT DOESN'T MATTER TO ANYONE BUT KPG WHOSE CAT THAT IS, it will be impossible for her to follow what you say. She can't distinguish between proof and belief.


----------



## damemary (Mar 14, 2012)

I think we all have to be careful to avoid seeing everything as black or white. I try to, but it's not easy.



Janet Cooke said:


> ...absolute power corrupts absolutely.
> 
> I didn't think that the discussion was about desperate families, however. I thought it was about the individuals who sought refuge in the Mother Church with deep idealism and became abusers on their journey. Why did that happen?
> I am reasonably sure that people who are happy in their choices and station don't do that.
> ...


----------



## damemary (Mar 14, 2012)

Tell me Patty how you feel about the weather. Would you ever move?



BrattyPatty said:


> Hi Empress Purl!
> I am back in the "Polar Vortex" again. The weather in Vegas was perfect. 75 and sunny the whole time I was there. Today here, -30 windchills. Ugh!


----------



## damemary (Mar 14, 2012)

BrattyPatty said:


> She's seeing triple while drinking doubles. :XD: :XD: :XD: :XD: :XD: :XD: :XD:


 :XD: :XD: :XD: :XD: :XD: :XD: :XD: :XD:


----------



## damemary (Mar 14, 2012)

Cheeky Blighter said:


> All the nuns I knew were either teachers, nurses, P.T.'s, O.T.'s or social workers. I didn't know one that sat and sewed unless it was in her free time for her own amusement. They had full time jobs in the community. This was the habit worn by the Benedictine nuns. They run the College of St. Benedict's and St. Scholastica where many are professors and administrators. They also work for Catholic Social Services and teach at many Catholic schools. They are only one of many orders. You very seldom see nuns in habits any more. Also, they had regular vacations and went to family events just like everyone else I knew. Back in the 50's and 60's college bound women such as myself went to college to find a nice boy to marry who could support you and a family. If you happened to get an education and graduate along the way that was "nice". Women were to assist men by going into nursing, teaching, social work. We just weren't wearing habits and married to the church. Women still "knew their place". We still hadn't burned our bras, girdles and garter belts yet! Susan I must me ancient compared to you.


 :XD: :XD: :XD: :XD: :XD: :XD: I love the name. You are full of surprises.


----------



## MaidInBedlam (Jul 24, 2012)

MarilynKnits said:


> Getting groggy. Does anyone really own cats? One can own a dog. Dogs wag their tails and act delighted to see their owners. I think cats see the humans they live with as the servants.


I have been given to understand, in various homes and with various cats, that they can be owned. Or at least they can get really attached to their slaves. My cats have done a lot of whimpering at doors over the years when I'm away from home. I'm talking about 45 years worth of cats and several households...not to mention abscences of an hour or a week or so...
.


----------



## damemary (Mar 14, 2012)

That works too.



BrattyPatty said:


> Or under it?


----------



## damemary (Mar 14, 2012)

I love old fashioned flowers... violets, pansies, lily of the valley.



SQM said:


> Yeah the flowers that were prominent in my garden when I was a kid = phlox, peonies and lilly of the valleys. I love gardens but I don't like cut flowers.


----------



## Poor Purl (Apr 14, 2011)

SQM said:


> KGB - you are nasty, boring and rude. You add nothing to any conversation but vicious comments. Even if you feel goaded, try to take the high road for a change. Thanks.


She's not nasty, boring and rude. She's certifiable, probably doesn't realize that she speaks to people in ways that no sane, civilized person would use. Good luck with getting her onto the high road. It would take a crane to life her that far.


----------



## damemary (Mar 14, 2012)

That was you!!! Isn't it a pleasure to see the mountains with no cloud cover?



BrattyPatty said:


> :XD: :XD: :XD: :XD: :XD:
> I waved at you, dame, while flying over your state.


----------



## damemary (Mar 14, 2012)

Poor Purl said:


> Oh, Lk, Lk, why are you using logic when it's exactly what the morons here fear the most? Aside from the fact that IT DOESN'T MATTER TO ANYONE BUT KPG WHOSE CAT THAT IS, it will be impossible for her to follow what you say. She can't distinguish between proof and belief.


 :XD: :XD: :XD: :XD: :XD: :XD: :XD: :XD: :XD: :XD: :XD: I feel like I'm trapped in a mad house.


----------



## Poor Purl (Apr 14, 2011)

susanmos2000 said:


> Actually it was you I was referring to. KPG asked if you wanted her to expose your "lies and identity", and I took that as a threat. As so often happens, she's about to take things too far and self-destruct. I'm awaitin'.


I just found out what she thinks are my "lies and identity," and I can safely say she doesn't know the first thing about me. To her, I'm in my 80s and I want to convert all the Christians to my beliefs. So beware, Susan. Not only am I old enough to be your grandmother, but I'm going to make you eat potato latkes until they're coming out of your ears.


----------



## Poor Purl (Apr 14, 2011)

BrattyPatty said:


> When one leaves this site for a week or so, it's all too clear to see upon return that there is not one intelligent one among them. Just repetoires of rhetoric and lies is all you see. Again and again and again.......


And they get so worked up about it all, as if it had any meaning.


----------



## Poor Purl (Apr 14, 2011)

SQM said:


> East River between the UN and about 90th Street going north. Behind Bloomingdales.


You describe it in such an interesting way. Nobody would guess that it's smack in the river between Manhattan and Queens.


----------



## MaidInBedlam (Jul 24, 2012)

And my father and his two sisters and older brother "did time" in a combination Catholic children's home and boarding school in Sioux City, Iowa from 1929 to 1932. Sent their by their father. Their mother had an undiagnosed illness of some progressive type that now sounds a lot like MS. For those three years they really pursued a diagnosis and some kind of treatment. My dad and his siblings had an older married half-sister who wanted to take the kids, but father and grandmother turned to the Church. Hooray for the good old ways. I've heard the horror stories about the time my father and his siblings spent at Saint Anthony's and could take up a couple of thousand pages here relating them all.


Cheeky Blighter said:


> Janet I am well aware of the atrocities of the Catholic church. Were your friends living in Catholic institutions or were they being treated this way in Catholic Schools? I am in no way an apologist for the church. I know about the Magdalene Laundries that were started by the Anglican church in 1758 and spread to Ireland and the Catholic church there. The last laundry was closed in 1996. I saw the movie Magdalene Laundries and just this year there is a movie out, Philomena with Judi Dentch about a girl who lived at one of the laundries and was forced to give up her child for adoption and then goes to search for him years later. What you have to ask is how did these girls end up in these places. Or in the case of your friends who allowed them to be subjected to this kind of treatment. The answer is, their families. When I was in Ireland I was appalled that the Post Offices have collection boxes in them for the Catholic Church. The Church and government are very cozy. As I said I was raised a Catholic, an Irish Catholic. Even here in the U.S. Catholics turned to the parish priest whenever there was a "problem" in the family including my own relatives. Families sent their daughters to these places. The church or the government didn't kidnap one of them and take them away but were happy to house these women for free for their families and let them work for their keep. When I saw the movie Magdalene Laundries I sobbed for those women and as a Catholic and Irish it made me sick. All the more reason for keeping church and government far apart. I could say much more but will save it for another time.
> Have you seen the movie Oranges and Sunshine which involves the British government sending it's foster care children to Australia to work as slave labor for several large well known companies and also the Catholic church. Another discussion we can have.


----------



## damemary (Mar 14, 2012)

Sounds horrible. I'm so sorry.



MaidInBedlam said:


> And my father and his two sister and older brothers "did time" in a combination Catholic children's home and boarding school in Sioux City, Iowa from 1929 to 1932. Sent their by their father. Their mother had an undiagnosed illness of some progressive type that now sounds a lot like MS. For those three years they really pursued a diagnosis and some kind of treatment. My dad and his siblings had an older married half-sister who wanted to take the kids, but father and grandmother turned to the Church. Hooray for the good old ways. I've heard the horror stories about the time my father and his siblings spent at Saint Anthony's and could take up a couple of thousand pages here relating them all.


----------



## MaidInBedlam (Jul 24, 2012)

i cannot tell a lie. I didn't check out the link(s?), just went with the word "racist" used by the poster. Being a homophobe is probably a pretty equal-opportunity position, too.


Janet Cooke said:


> It isn't about them being racists, though, it is about them being homophobes.
> It just happens that the people they blame for having a pro-gay agenda are both approximately half black.


----------



## SQM (Jun 22, 2012)

BrattyPatty said:


> I love your city. I was born in Brooklyn and once a New Yorker always a New Yorker. I have some fun cousins who live there and it is always a treat when I visit them.


Super Cool! What neighborhood are you from? I thought you were referring to Chicago which is where I am from and might be returning for an easier retirement. But I see you are living in Minn. Yikes!


----------



## SQM (Jun 22, 2012)

Poor Purl said:


> You describe it in such an interesting way. Nobody would guess that it's smack in the river between Manhattan and Queens.


Interesting. You think East/West and I think North/South. Must be a Chicago thing since there was no east side when I was a kid - only the lake. Now they did some landfilling and there is a bit of an east side. We thought mostly in terms of North/South.


----------



## MaidInBedlam (Jul 24, 2012)

damemary said:


> The truth, the whole truth and nothing but the truth. Wonder what lies this will be translated into.


I'll probably find out that the truth I told was all lies. Damned if you do, and damned if you don't...


----------



## Cheeky Blighter (Nov 20, 2011)

Janet Cooke said:


> There were many, though, who made exquisite lace, who made gorgeous tapestries, there were nuns who did every facet of chores that there are.
> And then there are the nuns who take care of the retired nuns and priests, a task for anyone with a calling.


True, they do that too.


----------



## Cheeky Blighter (Nov 20, 2011)

Janet Cooke said:


> I am not a believer in the Trinity. I don't qualify to be saved.


Me either, Janet. But I will enjoy your company and that is fine with me.


----------



## Cheeky Blighter (Nov 20, 2011)

Janet Cooke said:


> My balloons are all losing their air. My Whoopee Cushion won't expand. Quiet Time has arrived.
> Good night, my dears.


Good night, Janet. Sleep well and see you tomorrow.


----------



## Cheeky Blighter (Nov 20, 2011)

SQM said:


> Yeah the flowers that were prominent in my garden when I was a kid = phlox, peonies and lilly of the valleys. I love gardens but I don't like cut flowers.


Sounds like my grandma's garden. Loved bleeding hearts and lilac bushes too. They are better left outdoors to enjoy.


----------



## Cheeky Blighter (Nov 20, 2011)

damemary said:


> It's the only place we're going to find RESPECT around here. Thanks.


Got to love the queen of soul! Thanks, Janet. I had this song at my wedding along with Natural Woman.


----------



## Cheeky Blighter (Nov 20, 2011)

damemary said:


> Hey Cheeky, if you told them to jump off the Golden Gate Bridge, would they do it?


I think they would, damemary. We certainly know how gullible they are.


----------



## Cheeky Blighter (Nov 20, 2011)

Poor Purl said:


> I haven't seen the Magdalene Laundries, but I've seen the movie The Magdalene Sisters, which I think was fictional but was about teenage pregnant girls sent to live with the nuns and work in the laundries. The terrible things people do while pretending that it's for the victims' own good. No, not pretending; they may have believed it, especially since it was so to their advantage.


Got that right Purl. It worked for the families who wanted to be rid of their problem and for the system that would gladly use them and what becomes of the victims?


----------



## damemary (Mar 14, 2012)

At least it gives johnnie one-note something to criticize. The creep.



MaidInBedlam said:


> I'll probably find out that the truth I told was all lies. Damned if you do, and damned if you don't...


----------



## damemary (Mar 14, 2012)

That's one thing about us Libs, we don't all have to believe exactly the same things. It's more a matter of critical thought and believing that all people are created equal. Funny, but I didn't used to think that was so unusual.



Cheeky Blighter said:


> Me either, Janet. But I will enjoy your company and that is fine with me.


----------



## damemary (Mar 14, 2012)

When lilacs last by the dooryard bloomed.....



Cheeky Blighter said:


> Sounds like my grandma's garden. Loved bleeding hearts and lilac bushes too. They are better left outdoors to enjoy.


----------



## Janet Cooke (Aug 14, 2013)

SQM said:


> What jolly good news. So glad you saved yourself from all of that. Do protestants believe in the trinity or just the catholics?


Yes, Protestants are Roman Catholic Lite, pretty much.


----------



## Janet Cooke (Aug 14, 2013)

Cheeky Blighter said:


> Got that right Purl. It worked for the families who wanted to be rid of their problem and for the system that would gladly use them and what becomes of the victims?


Yup, in my family there was a place run by Episcopal nuns in PA that I was threatened with.


----------



## Janet Cooke (Aug 14, 2013)

BrattyPatty said:


> Some protestants do. My Dh is Lutheran and his synod is almost identical to Catholicism. They don't serve the Eucharist every Sunday. Maybe once a month. Other than that, it did not seem much different to me.


Other than the Church of the Latter Day Saints, which I know next to nothing about, is there a Protestant who doesn't believe in the Father, the Son, and the Holy Spirit?

A short piece for SQM about the beginning of the Protestant/Roman Catholic split thanks to Martin Luther. 
In the *Spirituality and Anguish* section I believe they mean immorality and corruption not "immortality and corruption".
LOL, I left out the link.

http://www.biography.com/people/martin-luther-9389283


----------



## Janet Cooke (Aug 14, 2013)

MaidInBedlam said:


> And my father and his two sisters and older brother "did time" in a combination Catholic children's home and boarding school in Sioux City, Iowa from 1929 to 1932. Sent their by their father. Their mother had an undiagnosed illness of some progressive type that now sounds a lot like MS. For those three years they really pursued a diagnosis and some kind of treatment. My dad and his siblings had an older married half-sister who wanted to take the kids, but father and grandmother turned to the Church. Hooray for the good old ways. I've heard the horror stories about the time my father and his siblings spent at Saint Anthony's and could take up a couple of thousand pages here relating them all.


It wasn't just the Churches, though, it was the state, it was families, it was a different time. People didn't pretend to be over the top interested in child welfare then they were much more honest about other people's children being a burden. 
Kids who were adopted in the 1920s and 30s were brought into a family to work not to be loved and pampered.

Someone had to feel and clothe them, but that was pretty much it; sounds like the anti-choice folks of today.

You don't have the money in your acc't for this lunch that is already on a tray? Let's toss it in the garbage and nobody will have it!

Not much has changed.


----------



## damemary (Mar 14, 2012)

Janet Cooke said:


> It wasn't just the Churches, though, it was the state, it was families, it was a different time. People didn't pretend to be over the top interested in child welfare then they were much more honest about other people's children being a burden.
> Kids who were adopted in the 1920s and 30s were brought into a family to work not to be loved and pampered.
> 
> Someone had to feel and clothe them, but that was pretty much it; sounds like the anti-choice folks of today.
> ...


----------



## Janet Cooke (Aug 14, 2013)

damemary said:


>


Sad, but, true,isn't it?

What do we cut in the federal budget that we know can't possibly be picked up by charity? Food and housing. 
Must be God's plan.


----------



## MaidInBedlam (Jul 24, 2012)

Wikipedia says the following Protestants don't believe in the Trinity:
Christadelphians, Christian Scientists, The Church of Jesus Christ of Latter-day Saints, Dawn Bible Students, Friends General Conference, Iglesia ni Cristo, Jehovah's Witnesses, Living Church of God, Oneness Pentecostals, Members Church of God International, Unitarian Universalist Christians, The Way International, The Church of God, International and the United Church of God.


Janet Cooke said:


> Other than the Church of the Latter Day Saints, which I know next to nothing about, is there a Protestant who doesn't believe in the Father, the Son, and the Holy Spirit?
> 
> A short piece for SQM about the beginning of the Protestant/Roman Catholic split thanks to Martin Luther.
> In the *Spirituality and Anguish* section I believe they mean immorality and corruption not "immortality and corruption".
> ...


----------



## Gerslay (Oct 4, 2011)

Janet Cooke said:


> Sad, but, true,isn't it?
> 
> What do we cut in the federal budget that we know can't possibly be picked up by charity? Food and housing.
> Must be God's plan.


Don't forget the latest proposal to cut military spending which will further degrade the standard of living of not only our active military but also our veterans.

I doubt that's God plan...sounds like a big "D" to me!


----------



## Poor Purl (Apr 14, 2011)

Janet Cooke said:


> Other than the Church of the Latter Day Saints, which I know next to nothing about, is there a Protestant who doesn't believe in the Father, the Son, and the Holy Spirit?
> 
> A short piece for SQM about the beginning of the Protestant/Roman Catholic split thanks to Martin Luther.
> In the *Spirituality and Anguish* section I believe they mean immorality and corruption not "immortality and corruption".
> ...


Unitarians don't. That's what the "unit" means.


----------



## MaidInBedlam (Jul 24, 2012)

As I said in my father's cse, the family made the decision to send him and his siblings to a Catholic children's home even though there were other relatives in the family who would have taken the kids and nurtured the. In this case, religion played a big role. My grandfather and great-grandmother believed it was better to turn to the Church. One could say they were good Catholics. I vote for wrong and stupid a--holes. Different times don't necessarily make something right or good (two very different things sometimes).

The throw the lunch in the garbage story makes me want to rant and rave, but will spare everyone that. It's easy enough to imagine what a person who cares about human beings one little bit would say about that.


Janet Cooke said:


> It wasn't just the Churches, though, it was the state, it was families, it was a different time. People didn't pretend to be over the top interested in child welfare then they were much more honest about other people's children being a burden.
> Kids who were adopted in the 1920s and 30s were brought into a family to work not to be loved and pampered.
> 
> Someone had to feel and clothe them, but that was pretty much it; sounds like the anti-choice folks of today.
> ...


----------



## Poor Purl (Apr 14, 2011)

damemary said:


> That's one thing about us Libs, we don't all have to believe exactly the same things. It's more a matter of critical thought and believing that all people are created equal. Funny, but I didn't used to think that was so unusual.


 :thumbup: :thumbup: :thumbup: :thumbup: :thumbup:


----------



## MaidInBedlam (Jul 24, 2012)

OOps. Double post.


----------



## Poor Purl (Apr 14, 2011)

Gerslay said:


> Don't forget the latest proposal to cut military spending which will further degrade the standard of living of not only our active military but also our veterans.
> 
> I doubt that's God plan...sounds like a big "D" to me!


We don't have to cut salaries and the VA budget. But it's very probable that that's where the biggest cuts will go, rather than to the unnecessary and non-working weapons systems the DOD has been trying to fix since Reagan's day.


----------



## Gerslay (Oct 4, 2011)

Poor Purl said:


> We don't have to cut salaries and the VA budget. But it's very probable that that's where the biggest cuts will go, rather than to the unnecessary and non-working weapons systems the DOD has been trying to fix since Reagan's day.


Agreed...let's cut waste and fraud across the board, in all budgets. Will they do it? Lots of double-speak, but no action!


----------



## SQM (Jun 22, 2012)

Janet Cooke said:


> Other than the Church of the Latter Day Saints, which I know next to nothing about, is there a Protestant who doesn't believe in the Father, the Son, and the Holy Spirit?
> 
> A short piece for SQM about the beginning of the Protestant/Roman Catholic split thanks to Martin Luther.
> In the *Spirituality and Anguish* section I believe they mean immorality and corruption not "immortality and corruption".
> ...


Thanks for the reference. I know as much about Luther as I ever wish. Great anti-Semite. I guess the Unitarians don't believe in the trinity or they just squashed them into one. But they are a good protestant group. Progressive minded.


----------



## SQM (Jun 22, 2012)

MaidInBedlam said:


> Wikipedia says the following Protestants don't believe in the Trinity:
> Christadelphians, Christian Scientists, The Church of Jesus Christ of Latter-day Saints, Dawn Bible Students, Friends General Conference, Iglesia ni Cristo, Jehovah's Witnesses, Living Church of God, Oneness Pentecostals, Members Church of God International, Unitarian Universalist Christians, The Way International, The Church of God, International and the United Church of God.


Maid - thank you for your great research. I am relatively new to this site. So I am glad to meet you.


----------



## Poor Purl (Apr 14, 2011)

Gerslay said:


> Agreed...let's cut waste and fraud across the board, in all budgets. Will they do it? Lots of double-speak, but no action!


Thus has it ever been.


----------



## Janet Cooke (Aug 14, 2013)

Poor Purl said:


> Unitarians don't. That's what the "unit" means.


I am guessing that would be the reason more conventional Christians don't consider Universalist Unitarians Christian.


----------



## Janet Cooke (Aug 14, 2013)

SQM said:


> Thanks for the reference. I know as much about Luther as I ever wish. Great anti-Semite. I guess the Unitarians don't believe in the trinity or they just squashed them into one. But they are a good protestant group. Progressive minded.


Remember reference to the Spanish Inquisition?

Oh, and I was watching a little piece not so long ago about the NYT "burying" reference to the holocaust in the inside pages. 
In that piece they had this little quickie of a priest from MI, I think, screaming about the Jews. NBC was happily covering it, radio at that time, of course. 
Half the freaking world is anti-Semetic, they just hide it better.


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## Gerslay (Oct 4, 2011)

Janet Cooke said:


> I am guessing that would be the reason more conventional Christians don't consider Universalist Unitarians Christian.


If you don't profess that Jesus is divine, why would you want to call yourself a Christian?


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## Janet Cooke (Aug 14, 2013)

Gerslay said:


> If you don't profess that Jesus is divine, why would you want to call yourself a Christian?


I am the wrong person to ask about that.


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## rocky1991 (May 8, 2011)

Gerslay said:


> Don't forget the latest proposal to cut military spending which will further degrade the standard of living of not only our active military but also our veterans.
> 
> I doubt that's God plan...sounds like a big "D" to me!


Republicans demanded a cut in spending. the military budget is way out of line. Better to cut there than in "Entitlements". This opinion is coming from the spouse of a retired, disabled military veteran. Our military budget is more than all major military countries in the world combined. I do think they should cut elsewhere in the military budget, not from enlisted ranks.


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## rocky1991 (May 8, 2011)

Gerslay said:


> Agreed...let's cut waste and fraud across the board, in all budgets. Will they do it? Lots of double-speak, but no action!


That is a political fact, too much under the table money involved. No politician wants to give that up.


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## Gerslay (Oct 4, 2011)

rocky1991 said:


> That is a political fact, too much under the table money involved. No politician wants to give that up.


Agreed...follow the money...its on both sides of the aisle!


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## susanmos2000 (May 10, 2011)

Gerslay said:


> If you don't profess that Jesus is divine, why would you want to call yourself a Christian?


Individual Unitarians may or may not believe in the divinity of Christ, but their principles very much reflect His teachings. From Wiki:

We, the member congregations of the Unitarian Universalist Association, covenant to affirm and promote

The inherent worth and dignity of every person;
Justice, equity and compassion in human relations;
Acceptance of one another and encouragement to spiritual growth in our congregations;
A free and responsible search for truth and meaning;
The right of conscience and the use of the democratic process within our congregations and in society at large;
The goal of world community with peace, liberty and justice for all;
Respect for the interdependent web of all existence of which we are a part.


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## Gerslay (Oct 4, 2011)

susanmos2000 said:


> Individual Unitarians may or may not believe in the divinity of Christ, but their principles very much reflect His teachings. From Wiki:
> 
> We, the member congregations of the Unitarian Universalist Association, covenant to affirm and promote
> 
> ...


I've attended the UU churches over the years. Basically, the Universalists don't believe in God and are for the most part atheists. The Unitarians believe in God, but not Jesus as divine. The combination of them "UU" is slightly different from congregation to congregation as to which way they lean.

But that's my point...I think its absurd that they even want to be called Christian.


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## Janet Cooke (Aug 14, 2013)

Gerslay said:


> I've attended the UU churches over the years. Basically, the Universalists don't believe in God and are for the most part atheists. The Unitarians believe in God, but not Jesus as divine. The combination of them "UU" is slightly different from congregation to congregation as to which way they lean.
> 
> But that's my point...I think its absurd that they even want to be called Christian.


What is absurd is that anyone thinks that they get to determine what other people choose as a mode of worship and what they might decide to call it.


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## Knitted by Nan (Aug 3, 2013)

Janeway said:


> What a wonderful thing to do for the cat. Someone should tell the cops about the drug use by the neighbor as they might get dangerous when out of drugs!


They know him and he keeps to himself, everyone avoids him. He is not a dealer. He has been fined for using.

There is another guy living nearby who is a dealer. He lives a lot closer to me but I do not see him, to me he is invisible, he is not there. Much safer not to see him. He was busted again just recently but his youngest son, aged 23, took the rap this time. He has five adult boys who take the rap for the father, but this is difficult to prove. HE went down big time over ten years ago. The police were there at his property for over 24 hours removing stolen property, guns, drugs and money. Over $200,000 worth of stolen property. He is not the big man he is a foot soldier in the gang. He has bikie connections so we all stay well clear. I just do not see him, it is safer that way. There is also said to be a high ranking police officer involved, but it cannot be proven. The police are currently mounting an operation all over Perth to try to stamp out the drug trade but when they close one place down another open up.

This sounds like fantasy, I know, but it is true. Druggies are everywhere. I hate drugs. I was talking to a neighbour today and he asked if I had heard that R...o had been busted again. I had not heard so B.... Filled me in, so to speak. Unfortunately, when the drug squad conduct a raid they do not come in with a marching band playing The Star Spangled Banner and broadcast with a megaphone, inviting every to roll up and watch, so we do not see or hear them. They operate a bit quieter than the American Police.

I am more concerned with the fires. Half of Roe Highway was closed tonight. Police cars, fire engines everywhere, including the car park of the closed Chicken Treat outlet. They were also at the recreation centre where I had gone to use the pool. I asked one of the fireys what was wrong, I had feared a road train rollover, or a multiple big truck collision. Roe Highway is a Road train route and so many big rigs travel on it 24/7. He said some idiot had been going along Roe Highway lighting one fire after another. They had also lit a fire in the garden at the Chicken Treat and at the boarded up door of the building. Engines from six brigades in attendance. They were using the closed Chicken Treat as a command post and the vehicles were refilling their tanks from the stand pump at the rec centre. The Roe Highway is about 1.5 km from where I live. The bush and ground are tinder dry because of our heatwave, temperatures in the high 30Cs, no rain for nearly 90 days. All had been put out when I left the pool at 8.30 pm. I spent two hours in the walking pool, I cannot swim so I do not use the main pool, it is over 2 metres deep. The walking pool goes from .2 metre to 1.6 metres.

Too much going on, we seem surrounded by idiots and feral teenagers. :shock:


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## Knitted by Nan (Aug 3, 2013)

Janeway said:


> EveMcooke, these are for you to enjoy.


Thank you, I love pictures of cats.


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## Poor Purl (Apr 14, 2011)

Janet Cooke said:


> I am guessing that would be the reason more conventional Christians don't consider Universalist Unitarians Christian.


Do they not? Many Jews who convert to Christianity become Unitarians. I know a Unitarian minister who was once a Brooklyn Jewish woman.


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## Knitted by Nan (Aug 3, 2013)

Janeway said:


> I don't remember a visit from you, but here is what I made since I haven't been posting on any Lefties site--enjoy!


Lovely crochet work.


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## Janet Cooke (Aug 14, 2013)

EveMCooke said:


> They know him and he keeps to himself, everyone avoids him. He is not a dealer. He has been fined for using.
> 
> There is another guy living nearby who is a dealer. He lives a lot closer to me but I do not see him, to me he is invisible, he is not there. Much safer not to see him. He was busted again just recently but his youngest son, aged 23, took the rap this time. He has five adult boys who take the rap for the father, but this is difficult to prove. HE went down big time over ten years ago. The police were there at his property for over 24 hours removing stolen property, guns, drugs and money. Over $200,000 worth of stolen property. He is not the big man he is a foot soldier in the gang. He has bikie connections so we all stay well clear. I just do not see him, it is safer that way. There is also said to be a high ranking police officer involved, but it cannot be proven. The police are currently mounting an operation all over Perth to try to stamp out the drug trade but when they close one place down another open up.
> 
> ...


Stay safe, how does all of that uproar affect your son?


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## Lkholcomb (Aug 25, 2013)

knitpresentgifts said:


> Don't even tell me that avatar/image is your cat too.
> 
> It being Lisa's, Cheek's and Jody's cat and hundreds on the internet is enough.


I never said it was :roll:

I said I have two orange tigers at home. Don't try to shove me in your debacle of a "scandal".


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## knitpresentgifts (May 21, 2013)

Janet Cooke said:
 

> What is absurd is that anyone thinks that they get to determine what other people choose as a mode of worship and what they might decide to call it.


No, Janet, you are wrong. No one is choosing another's mode of worship or what they may be "called."

Words have meaning. _En Christo_, means "in Christ" and it is understood to mean in union with Christ. A _Christian_, the word, is a derivative of En Christo and is understood to mean or represent a believer and follower of Christ; one who seeks to be "in" Christ.

There is no logic or reason to wish to be called a Christian if one doesn't believe in and/or follow Christ. (your point about UUs)

Christians understand that, your posts show you don't.


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## Janet Cooke (Aug 14, 2013)

Poor Purl said:


> Do they not? Many Jews who convert to Christianity become Unitarians. I know a Unitarian minister who was once a Brooklyn Jewish woman.


I should probably refine that statement some as I seem to be surrounded by Roman Catholics who not only worship the Father, Son, and Holy Spirit, they often depend on Mary for intervention. 
I get a lot of my second hand Christian stuff from them.


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## Lkholcomb (Aug 25, 2013)

knitpresentgifts said:


> Ask Cheeky why "her" cat's image is all over the internet, posted by hundreds of different users, on advertisements, on blogs and as stock images in newsletters, is identified by another name by the painter of the original artwork, yet Cheeky claims the cat is "hers" and even told us its name.
> 
> Ya, uh huh.
> 
> BTW: I provided five unique links for you to view the exact same image. I stopped at five, there are hundreds. If you cannot recognize a lie, that's on you, not me. I don't go through life with my head in the sand, I suggest you might do the same.


Provide me with a link to who is the actual owner of the link. Images posted on the Internet (which are incredibly easy to save to your personal computer) only prove that there are images of a cat on the Internet, not the ownership of the cat.

Personally I have a better use for my time than trying to create a cat "scandal", thank you very much.


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## Lkholcomb (Aug 25, 2013)

BrattyPatty said:


> Hi Cheeky! I had nuns who were teachers and one was a tailor. She was too old to teach anymore so she made the habits for her convent.


I had a doctor who was a nun. I worked with that same doctor later when I became a nurse. Lovely woman.


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## susanmos2000 (May 10, 2011)

Gerslay said:


> I've attended the UU churches over the years. Basically, the Universalists don't believe in God and are for the most part atheists. The Unitarians believe in God, but not Jesus as divine. The combination of them "UU" is slightly different from congregation to congregation as to which way they lean.
> 
> But that's my point...I think its absurd that they even want to be called Christian.


I don't know about that--seems to me that people who believe in the divinity of Christ but conduct their lives in a way that make a mockery of His teachings cut a far more ridiculous figure.


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## Knitted by Nan (Aug 3, 2013)

Poor Purl said:


> It's really raining? Hope it keeps up for a couple of days.
> 
> How's your Gene Kelly imitation?


Excuse me but I think you are getting our rain. Nearly 90 days without rain and none in the forecast. The Eastern States have had rain, the north west has had rain, even the great southern has had rain, but Perth continues to endure the heat. After 2.00 am and still too hot to sleep. My electricity bill for the last two months was over $300 because of the air conditioners being on.


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## knitpresentgifts (May 21, 2013)

Lkholcomb said:


> I never said it was :roll:
> 
> I said I have two orange tigers at home. Don't try to shove me in your debacle of a "scandal".


Buy yourself a sense of humor. You said you speak sarcasm as a second language; obviously you don't.


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## Lkholcomb (Aug 25, 2013)

SQM said:


> What jolly good news. So glad you saved yourself from all of that. Do protestants believe in the trinity or just the catholics?


Protestants believe in it too. My daughter was terribly confused about the whole god sending his son Jesus, yet Jesus being part of the trinity and god. She gave me an exasperated sigh and told me that Jesus was God's SON not god (I think she may have throw a "duh" in there). I explained to her about the trinity, but it's a rather abstract concept for her age.


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## Gerslay (Oct 4, 2011)

susanmos2000 said:


> I don't know about that--seems to me that people who believe in the divinity of Christ but conduct their lives in a way that make a mockery of His teachings cut a far more ridiculous figure.


People who believe in the divinity of Christ but do not always comport themselves in His image, are known as 'sinners'.

Always striving, always failing...always forgiven!


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## Poor Purl (Apr 14, 2011)

EveMCooke said:


> They know him and he keeps to himself, everyone avoids him. He is not a dealer. He has been fined for using.
> 
> There is another guy living nearby who is a dealer. He lives a lot closer to me but I do not see him, to me he is invisible, he is not there. Much safer not to see him. He was busted again just recently but his youngest son, aged 23, took the rap this time. He has five adult boys who take the rap for the father, but this is difficult to prove. HE went down big time over ten years ago. The police were there at his property for over 24 hours removing stolen property, guns, drugs and money. Over $200,000 worth of stolen property. He is not the big man he is a foot soldier in the gang. He has bikie connections so we all stay well clear. I just do not see him, it is safer that way. There is also said to be a high ranking police officer involved, but it cannot be proven. The police are currently mounting an operation all over Perth to try to stamp out the drug trade but when they close one place down another open up.
> 
> ...


Many of us Americans have the idea that Australia is a beautiful place full of mountains full of sheep and green spaces full of cute funny animals, and of Aussies as throwing shrimp on the barbie and otherwise being pretty peaceful. (The ones who've seen Priscilla, Queen of the Desert see you a little differently, but still as peaceful.)

Your description is shocking, and it breaks down all misconceptions. Druggies? Feral teenagers, whose parents have lost control over them? Corrupt cops? Not the paradise I envisioned. It's much worse than New York, but if we had suffered through one drought after another, we might be as bad. Currently our reservoirs are overflowing, and we're all law-abiding citizens who are eager to help each other out - Not.


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## Janet Cooke (Aug 14, 2013)

Poor Purl said:


> Do they not? Many Jews who convert to Christianity become Unitarians. I know a Unitarian minister who was once a Brooklyn Jewish woman.


Interesting, maybe they just want to drop Kosher ;-)


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## knitpresentgifts (May 21, 2013)

Lkholcomb said:


> Provide me with a link to who is the actual owner of the link. Images posted on the Internet (which are incredibly easy to save to your personal computer) only prove that there are images of a cat on the Internet, not the ownership of the cat.
> 
> Personally I have a better use for my time than trying to create a cat "scandal", thank you very much.


Ask Cheeks; if the painting is hers and/or the cat hers, she could provide the ownership creed or evidence of proof.

Cheeks won't because she cannot as the entire avatar incident was another of her lies.

Enough said.


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## Lkholcomb (Aug 25, 2013)

damemary said:


> In AZ groomers do a lion cut on long haired cats when it gets hot. They look just like miniature lions....in the case of Maine *****, not so miniature lions.


 :thumbup:


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## Janet Cooke (Aug 14, 2013)

Enough said.

Thank you, God.


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## Poor Purl (Apr 14, 2011)

Janet Cooke said:


> Interesting, maybe they just want to drop Kosher ;-)


A very large majority of Jews have dropped kosher without becoming Protestant ministers.

Many still can't bring themselves to eat cheeseburgers, though they don't care what kind of meat they're consuming. The mixing of meat and milk seems to be more prohibited than pork.


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## Lkholcomb (Aug 25, 2013)

MaidInBedlam said:


> I have been given to understand, in various homes and with various cats, that they can be owned. Or at least they can get really attached to their slaves. My cats have done a lot of whimpering at doors over the years when I'm away from home. I'm talking about 45 years worth of cats and several households...not to mention abscences of an hour or a week or so...
> .


I'm usually always at the house, but one day I went out for the day. The "baby" cat had grown very attached to me (he was about a year at that point and we got him at 6 or 8 weeks). I could not go to the bathroom without him knocking on the door, all the while mewing pitifully as if I regularly went to the bathroom and never came out. Not the soft knocking but the BANGING with his paw. When that failed he literally would body slamm the door. He threw his body into the door to try to open it. Finally, after me yelling out to him to stop and that I was going to return, he would exhaust himself and then lay right in front of the door waiting for me. It was annoying in the "just let me have peace in the bathroom" way, but kinda sweet he loved me so much


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## Lkholcomb (Aug 25, 2013)

damemary said:


> :XD: :XD: :XD: :XD: :XD: :XD: :XD: :XD: :XD: :XD: :XD: I feel like I'm trapped in a mad house.


But without the funny mirrors, right?


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## Lkholcomb (Aug 25, 2013)

Poor Purl said:


> I just found out what she thinks are my "lies and identity," and I can safely say she doesn't know the first thing about me. To her, I'm in my 80s and I want to convert all the Christians to my beliefs. So beware, Susan. Not only am I old enough to be your grandmother, but I'm going to make you eat potato latkes until they're coming out of your ears.


From the Jewish folks I've known, they don't evangelize at all, and it's actually hard to be able to "convert" because of the turning away process. Could just be the folks I know, but that's what they told me.


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## Janet Cooke (Aug 14, 2013)

Poor Purl said:


> A very large majority of Jews have dropped kosher without becoming Protestant ministers.
> 
> Many still can't bring themselves to eat cheeseburgers, though they don't care what kind of meat they're consuming. The mixing of meat and milk seems to be more prohibited than pork.


I was joking, of course, but yeah. 
Just as with Christians I guess anyone of most any background who maintains some claim to religion picks and chooses just what to adhere to.
I can understand that cheeseburger thing, the thought turns my stomach.


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## Knitted by Nan (Aug 3, 2013)

SQM said:


> I forget that my precious Cooke is not Jewish or Buddhist. A koen is a zen riddle. A Jewbu is a Jewish person who practices Buddhism.
> 
> A kugel is a Jewish food.
> 
> A kegel is what I should be doing, but don't since I have no reason to.


I have not heard of Jewbu but it sounds interesting, I must look it up. Buddhist scholars did travel to the middle east very soon after the Buddha died, about 500 years BC, so there would have been an exchange of ideas both ways. Something my ex/late husband would not acknowledge. He agreed with the exchange of ideas from Buddhism to Judaism but not from Judaism to Buddhism. Despite what he thought, he was not always correct. He just had a speech impediment. He could not say the words, "I am sorry, I was wrong, I made a mistake, my thoughts and interpretations were incorrect." He was a Schauppenhower (sorry I cannot spell it) scholar.


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## Poor Purl (Apr 14, 2011)

damemary said:


>


A change of subject - an op-ed in the New York Times on Jan Brewer and AZ. http://www.nytimes.com/2014/02/27/opinion/collins-the-state-of-arizona.html?hp&rref=opinion&_r=0

Gail Collins is a very funny woman. Here's a short excerpt:

"Fear of being forced to bake for homosexuals is apparently so deep-seated that the Arizona lawmakers were able to ignore the fact that unlike New Mexico and Colorado, their state has no law barring discrimination against gays in public accommodations. Its already possible for a business to refuse to even sell them a Valentine."


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## Knitted by Nan (Aug 3, 2013)

Janet Cooke said:


> LOL, the super rich put Xmas lights all over their cars and drive them in parades on Marco Island and go out to eat for $6.
> 
> Would have done better to stay at a Courtyard, cookies and coffee free at 4 PM.


They would get a shock if they came to Perth. We had lunch at a cafe yesterday, nothing fancy. Steak, sauce, potatoes, pumpkin......cost $36 each. Coffee over $5 a cup and the cups were tiny, half sized. Two steaks, four coffees because we needed two each they were so small, came to $93, and that is about par for the course. post restaurants can be over $95 a head for lunch.


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## Knitted by Nan (Aug 3, 2013)

Janeway said:


> Why, Yarnie, what beautiful names you have these days! Sweet Lefties aren't they?
> 
> I'm posting pictures, but only one or two responded. Guess their eye site is bad.
> 
> I'm here for you sweet ladies on the "Right" with this picture.


I am 12 hours ahead of your time. Your daytime is my night time. Now 2.45 am here, what time is is there. THat is why I am late with replies.


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## Cindy S (Oct 20, 2013)

EveMCooke said:


> They would get a shock if they came to Perth. We had lunch at a cafe yesterday, nothing fancy. Steak, sauce, potatoes, pumpkin......cost $36 each. Coffee over $5 a cup and the cups were tiny, half sized. Two steaks, four coffees because we needed two each they were so small, came to $93, and that is about par for the course. post restaurants can be over $95 a head for lunch.


Yikes!!!


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## Knitted by Nan (Aug 3, 2013)

Janet Cooke said:


> Stay safe, how does all of that uproar affect your son?


With his headphones on he is oblivious to the rest of the world. iPod and a good set of noise cancelling earphones on his head equals peace. So many sirens lately we do tend to ignore them.


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## Cindy S (Oct 20, 2013)

Poor Purl said:


> Do they not? Many Jews who convert to Christianity become Unitarians. I know a Unitarian minister who was once a Brooklyn Jewish woman.


Ummm, is the Unitarian minister now a man??? That would make this so much more interesting!!! Just kidding! Chalk that one up to heavy pain meds, making a bit (!) loopy.


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## Knitted by Nan (Aug 3, 2013)

Poor Purl said:


> Many of us Americans have the idea that Australia is a beautiful place full of mountains full of sheep and green spaces full of cute funny animals, and of Aussies as throwing shrimp on the barbie and otherwise being pretty peaceful. (The ones who've seen Priscilla, Queen of the Desert see you a little differently, but still as peaceful.)
> 
> Your description is shocking, and it breaks down all misconceptions. Druggies? Feral teenagers, whose parents have lost control over them? Corrupt cops? Not the paradise I envisioned. It's much worse than New York, but if we had suffered through one drought after another, we might be as bad. Currently our reservoirs are overflowing, and we're all law-abiding citizens who are eager to help each other out - Not.


Australia is the driest continent on the planet. No real mountains. WA is dry, flat and brown, and then there is the Pilbara, red dust and plenty of it. Some of our rivers only run during the wet season. Some have been dry and have not had flowing water for years. Our dams in Perth are well below 50% full. We are drinking desalinated water and there is talk of using recycled sewerage pumped into the aquifers.

Corrupt cops, druggies, crooks live in every country.


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## Janet Cooke (Aug 14, 2013)

Poor Purl said:


> A change of subject - an op-ed in the New York Times on Jan Brewer and AZ. http://www.nytimes.com/2014/02/27/opinion/collins-the-state-of-arizona.html?hp&rref=opinion&_r=0
> 
> Gail Collins is a very funny woman. Here's a short excerpt:
> 
> "Fear of being forced to bake for homosexuals is apparently so deep-seated that the Arizona lawmakers were able to ignore the fact that unlike New Mexico and Colorado, their state has no law barring discrimination against gays in public accommodations. Its already possible for a business to refuse to even sell them a Valentine."


How do you like that, AZ lawmakers don't know what their laws are it seems. 
Are they PT, I wonder, like NH legislators?


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## Janet Cooke (Aug 14, 2013)

EveMCooke said:


> They would get a shock if they came to Perth. We had lunch at a cafe yesterday, nothing fancy. Steak, sauce, potatoes, pumpkin......cost $36 each. Coffee over $5 a cup and the cups were tiny, half sized. Two steaks, four coffees because we needed two each they were so small, came to $93, and that is about par for the course. post restaurants can be over $95 a head for lunch.


Post restaurant?

We have some fairly expensive places around here, nothing to compare to $95. for a lunch for us, the regular folk. 
I would never go out to eat, I am afraid if I had to pay those prices, just can't see it.


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## Knitted by Nan (Aug 3, 2013)

Janet Cooke said:


> Post restaurant?
> 
> We have some fairly expensive places around here, nothing to compare to $95. for a lunch for us, the regular folk.
> I would never go out to eat, I am afraid if I had to pay those prices, just can't see it.


We ate at Penny Lane in the Swan Valley. Victoria Station at the Crown Casinoand other restruants there are very pricey. Victoria Station charges $110 a head for Wagul steak.


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## VocalLisa (Jan 4, 2014)

Lkholcomb said:


> I'm just curious, how can a person prove that a thing (cat in this instance) is NOT someone's property, unless they know who the person is who belongs to the cat?
> 
> For instance:
> 
> ...


And how does KPG know that the OTHER person isn't lying about it being HER cat?


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## VocalLisa (Jan 4, 2014)

knitpresentgifts said:


> Don't even tell me that avatar/image is your cat too.
> 
> It being Lisa's, Cheek's and Jody's cat and hundreds on the internet is enough.


I never claimed it was my cat, and to my knowledge neither has Jody.

And to my knowledge there's only one other place that claimed that it was their cat. The other links you listed was just using the image. They didn't claim it was their cat.

So where are you getting this "hundreds" from?

If this is an example of your abilities to discern and use deductive reasoning, you are once again exhibiting you have SERIOUS intellectual handicaps.


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## VocalLisa (Jan 4, 2014)

I'll do better than that and quote Cheek's, well, YOUR exact words:



Cheeky said:


> That's my boy. He is such a love and yes that is a painting and not a photo.
> 
> That is Conan O'Keegan. He is a very contented and loving cat. I will give him a big kiss from you.


OK, thanks, (Although I would've preferred a link since you have a tendency to lie, but for the moment I'll take your word for it)

Now, can you tell me how or in what way you think you've proven it's NOT Cheeky's cat?

How do you know that the other page that claimed it was their cat wasn't Cheeky's daughter/granddaughter since the person claimed to be 8 years old? Or how do you know that THEY weren't borrowing "Conan's" picture and lying about it being THEIR cat?

And BTW, why aren't you aware that Admin can view both my and Cheeky's IP address and tell if we're the same person or not? If we were the same person don't you think Admin would've deleted one of our accounts by now?


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## admin (Jan 12, 2011)

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